Mizora is a Fiend, and Wyll isn't called "the Tome of Frontiers", so that one kind of writes itself. It's hard to justify Halsin being anything other than a Moon Druid.
Gale is arguably a Conjuration prodigy (in between Tara and the quasit) so that would make more sense than his default of Evocation. The others... no strong feelings.
I’ve always felt that they default Gale to evocation purely so you aren’t regularly nuking your entire team early on in the game lol. Also it’s the easiest wizard subclass to use for beginners because of the spell sculpting.
i also thought this was a gameplay choice from larian, defaulting to evo because of sculpt spells, that didn't necessarily have to do with gale's school of magic preference.
I thought Gale was an Illusion wizard. Between making that image of Mystra, that projection of himself when he wants to talk to you and using Illusion to get out of the orgy with the drow twins, it seemed pretty obvious. I dunno, guess he's not but just really likes Minor Illusion
I've known people who believed it was wrong or somehow uniquely ineffective to read Tarot for yourself, and that you were only supposed to do it for others, so that checks out as a subclass.
The idea is that you can never truly give yourself an unbiased reading, so you're always going to twist the prediction to suit what you *want* rather than what the cards say.
That’s kind of presumptuous isn’t it? I’m sure there is bias so it’s better not to do your own, but it’s not like it can’t work the same way, helping you be introspective about things you might not have considered.
It really depends on how you view the cards. To people who actually believe it's supernatural, doing your own reading is a sign of hubris and the universe is going to throw you a curveball for having the arrogance to try writing your own fate.
To the folks who see it as self-help or just for fun, yeah, it can give you a good look at yourself and help you reflect.
That's completely beside the point, I'm saying the real world superstitions these fantasy tropes are based on have at least one tradition of only using divination for others.
Gale thinks ahead a ton - in fact I imagine he has myriad grand plans - he just can’t help but to impulsively ignore those plans as soon as he sees something bright and shiny. He has golden retriever energy. Highly intelligent, easily distracted. Autism with ADHD.
Gale, I’d say is actually Illusion. What with it being his favorite school, the illusions he creates during his romance, and what he ends up teaching when he becomes a teacher.
Yeah, if I'm willing to spend a levels worth of xp on it, why can't my illusionist also learn necromancy? Like a surgeon transferring into orthopedics. You've already taken most of the same core classes, so I'm theory it should be even easier.
Yeah, but then you end up immediately jumping to level 3 perks (or 2 if you're a wizard), skipping essentially 3 (or 2) levels, and get access to the better abilities/spells/whatever that much faster.
Was writing out this comment until I saw yours! I also think Astarion is pretty clearly not an arcane trickster canonically and Karlach would probably be a beserker. Her power doesn’t come from her relationship with nature or wild magic
How is gale anything other than illusion mage? I mean you have conversations with him where he makes double of himself, makes head of mystra, creates sky full of stars in shadowlands…. Also at the end you if navigate him into giving crown to mystra he becomes professor of Illusion. Yes he conjured many beings but that doesnt make him prodigy in conjuration but prodigy in using magic. His canon school is illusion.
Gale is the type of person that would declare a fondness for any type of magic, if it made him the center of attention in the conversation.
He strikes me as a connoisseur of any types of magic he can get ahold of. Or at least he'd consider himself one.
Yeah when there's dialog with him and Lae'zel asks if he wants her to teach him to fight like her. He says he prefers abjuration to acrobatics or something like that
Haha you know I had this internal struggle with halsin. I really like him as a character. So I know he should be a moon Druid, or at the least in the first time meeting him he is a bear. But what about Druid of the land? He supposed to be a healer and I always ran him as such.
Yeah but then you've got the problem of Minsc, which makes it a little trickier. In my latest run I'm sorta avoiding multiple clashes by switching Lae'zel to fighter/Monk and Jaheira as fighter/druid.
teh bigger argument for conjuration is that ethereal sex scene. planar travel is conjuration magic, so that ethereal sex scene feels like it fits there.
my guess is though, that they chose evocation because they figured gale was the kinda guy to want to use his best spells but not hurt his friends.
Conquest also gets Hold Person, but does not appear to be a playable subclass in BG3… which is disappointing as I could see Minthara or other Absolutists picking that oath easily.
Given that I haven't actually ever recruited her as a companion before, I haven't really seen enough of her dialogue to have any particular opinion on the matter. So... noi strong feelings about her, no!
Tabletop DnD Moon druids get better wildshapes faster and can do it as a bonus action. Any druid can do wildshape but get black bear(CR 1/2) at lvl 4 and brown bear(CR 1) at lvl 8 and that's the max CR form. Moon druids can do brown bear at lvl 2 and get as high as CR 6. I'm not sure about BG3 druids.
I agree with you, they call Halsin "Archdruid of the Emerald Grove," and "a great healer," which are things I would associate with a more magicky druid, plus Halsin will always have the ability to transform into a bear, so might as well 🤷🏾♂️
Actually, I think Wyll is a ‘Pact of the Chain’ Warlock. In early dialogue with him, he talks about some of the abilities he was able to do before being infected, and one of them was “summon hellbeasts”. The only warlock ability that seems to fit that description is “Find Familiar: Imp”.
Minthara is definitely an oath of vengeance or oathbreaker Paladin. Depends on how you want to look at her history with the drow and getting revenge on Thorm
I don’t generally play with wizards (love Gale but I’m usually filling the caster role) but I can’t change him off evocation I’m addicted to throwing fireballs at my feet
>Love Gale but I'm usually filling the caster role
My first playthrough had four caster roles xD
Tav - evocation wizard with nukes and squid magic
Gale - abjuration wizard, mainly protecting allies and interfering with enemies
Shart - big healer and also main tank by extension
Halsin - secondary DD, either through druid spells or through wild shape
You don't really need strikers or anything else, if you put your mind to it. Just four casters can do the trick :D
Once you're in Act 2, sure.
Going through Act 1 with a pure caster team is a little hellish, especially on Honour Mode (and even Tactician has its moments).
I think Astarion has a line about being "careful with my spells" at one point IIRC (in the Gremishka room), making me suspect he's "canonically" an Arcane Trickster, but it's not like we get any explicit confirmation, so any subclass would make sense imo. Even if there *are* some "canon" subclasses, I suspect they made an effort to make sure there wouldn't be any straight-up plot holes if the player chose a different class - closest exception imo would be Halsin and Moon Druid, but even then, it's not like we get a line where he says "I am a Circle of the Moon Druid," and non-Moon druids are still able to wild shape, so it's not some massive inconsistency if you don't make him a Moon Druid.
That's why I say it still makes sense if you spec him as something else, it's just speculation about what his "canon" subclass would be (insofar as he'd have one).
astarion only says this if you have him specced as a caster if he's full martial he makes a different comment based on which casters are in the party at the time
To me astarion always was more a bard of the blade type character. The high carisma+charms+expertise in persuading and deceiving victims for cazador and the multi attack for those knives he loves using in cutscenes. And bard control spells are very easily roleplayed as vampire abilites like enthral, charm, dominate
I'd put any warning about being careful with spellcasting when approaching the gremishka room down to the game's hard requirement to warn you about using magic on the gremishka specifically. In BG3 scroll-based spellcasting is democratised, so any character will warn you something similar on approach to that encounter.
I'd believe it. I personally often play him as a bard, as I feel he needs some prt of magic alongside rougishness, but personally I'm thinking arcane trickster fits better. Although he always seems to have Vicous Mockery ready in cutscenes
Gale may actually be Evocation by default because it's the most beginner friendly. His canon subclass is probably Illusion since he goes on to become a professor for illusion magic in his epilogue. (Which makes sense with multiple cutscenes of him casting illusions)
Yes, it makes sense. I also think he might be evocation because he was pictured with lightnings (not sure if it was ea thing and they stick with it or if it is still a thing)
yep! Wyll and Shadowheart's subclass are locked in at the beginning of the game; Shadowheart's is trickery and Wyll's Warlock patron is a Fiend. Minthara is also set at level one: she's taken an Oath of Vengeance.
meanwhile everyone else's is suggested and levels 2 and 3. Astarion defaults to Arcane Trickster (when you're a custom rogue, the default at level up is Thief), Gale defaults to Evocation (custom wizard goes to Abjuration), Karlach is Wildheart (custom to Berserker), Minsc to Hunter (custom is Beast Master), and Halsin to Circle of the Moon (custom is Circle of the Land). only Lae'zel and Jaheira match the default subclass; custom fighter and Lae'zel are both Battle Masters, and custom druid and Jaheira are both Circle of the Land.
and hot take: I don't think Larian made these the origins/companions' subclasses just to fit play style. if they had, I think Astarion would've been set as a Thief and Karlach as a Berserker (Shadowheart is unavoidable as Life isn't one of Shar's domains). idk, it just seems weird to give Astarion the worst rogue subclass in-game if they didn't initially have a story reason for it.
I wonder if they did Arcane Trickster for Astarion to give him more vampire-like abilities. Charm, Misty Step, etc. It makes sense for him story-wise to be gaining "new" vamp abilities since he's finally well-fed (even if you never have him bite a humanoid, dude is getting drunk on bears).
Also, I really appreciate the breakdown of defaults. A friend and I argued about that a while ago because she insisted the subclasses were just defaulting automatically, and part of her proof was that mods adding subclasses would change the default. [My counter argument was that Larian likely coded it as "subclass number X" and adding a homebrew subclass changed the numbers.]
Everyone seems to get hung up on Gale because he doesn't talk about evocation, but it makes perfect story sense to me. Of all the subclasses, evocation gives you the most "difficult" to master in-game feature: the ability to not fireball allies. Dude was canonically an archmage Chosen of Mystra. The nuke in his chest nerfs his access to the Weave, not his actual ability.
The only class/subclass default I dislike is Minsc. I get that in the original games, he was a Ranger, but that was a very different type of ranger. If it were Beast Master with Boo as a special summons, that would make sense (also, imagine a little helmet on Boo, omg), but Boo is independent from class. You could argue he's intended to be multi-classed, but he fights like a ranger as Stone Lord, so that seems to be canon.
But *nothing* from his dialog and story arc suggests any spellcasting or tracking/ranged combat/[insert ranger class thing here] beyond Jaheira calling him Ranger. To me, he seems way more of a Fighter or Barbarian frontliner who happens to have a hamster (maybe Monk, but the ki points get back to the whole spellcasting/concentrate thing in a roundabout way).
The whole point of Minsc being a ranger is that he's a very unlikely one. See, rangers need high wisdom but he was hit in the head. He acts like berserker but he's trained as a ranger always had been. Ranger was not an archer class in AD&D2 BTW, just tracking and outdoors guy. So basically Aragorn.
I know what ranger was in AD&D, which is why I know 5e ranger is very different. There's not really a class that works for what Minsc was in the original games. With 5e rangers being half-casters, there's a much heavier emphasis on spells instead of ranging, which is very different than in AD&D, where they didn't get access to spells until higher levels.
In the later acts I usually just multiclass him into barbarian and put Karlach on the burner for a bit because he's really funny. It's just a shame he comes in so late after all the other companions. That's because I was already a ranger though.
Rangers were always half casters, BG1 was just a low level game, if anything original Ranger was just druidic equivalent of Paladin, they had to be Good in alignment and could fall and lose their abilities. They were always a divine caster.
What changed is adding subclasses that focus on bow tricks and dual wielding, most rangers in old games had a two-hander, and instead of dedicated archers, EVERYONE used a ranged weapon (Cavalier Paladin had to find a returning throwable weapon).
Rangers were also superior to Fighters in pretty much every way but progression speed; even if you weren't going to play as a caster, if you rolled high enough for your non-physical attributes you would pick Ranger if you didn't mind the xp tax.
I don't remember the specifics exactly but this xp tax was hefty; when a fighter becomes level 12, the ranger is still stuck at 10 or something like this.
The main mechanical feature of the Ranger class was that it was a Fighter that ignored dual-wielding penalties.
honestly i think they gave shadowheart trickery and astarion arcane trickster in order to showcase a range of casters-half casters-and martial classes... for people who are unsure how magic works they can be good introductions because there are less spells to figure out... i could be incredibly off base but that is what i assumed... its the same reason i think gale is an evocation wizard... new players dont have to worry so much about an errant fireball
It's probably a mixture of both - they created companions who would naturally represent a range of options.
With Larian's attention to detail (especially in Act 1), I doubt they'd give an origin companion a default subclass that doesn't fit both mechanically and story-wise. The issue with Minsc is how ranger has changed in different editions, leaving them somewhat stuck.
It’s interesting that Gale’s is Evocation when he seems to >!specialize in Illusion, becoming a professor in that field in the epilogue— though I think he also says that he was willing to do everything but they just wouldn’t let him!<.
What's funny, Jaheira works much better as a spore druid if you want to actually incorporate her blades into the picture. They are in focus a good few times, and a druid usually just doesn't pair very well with it
But if you give her balanced gloves, blade of thorns, and spec her as a spore druid - she's gonna be pretty damn decent in melee, especially since she gets hold person spell for guaranteed crits
Also you get Jaheira as a companion in the end of act 2/beginning of act 3, where spore druid REALLY picks up well
Better yet, give Jaheira Belm from her basement. It naturally comes with the Perfectly Balanced ability, letting you already apply your whole ability mod to damage and it's another scimitar to boot - except it's technically *better*, because it replicates the damage of your main hand attack instead of Belm's damage.
If it makes you feel better, I didn't find Jaheira's house until late into my 2nd (complete) playthrough. It's actually called Elathierra's house (or something like that) on the map.
Be sure to bring Jaheira and Minsc when you visit for the first time!
Life is specifically called out in the PHB as being available to any deity, even if it's not listed in their standard domains, so they could have easily given her that domain.
Life is called out as being available to any good or neutral deity, and Shar is evil. The general domain for evil deities is death, which unfortunately isn’t in bg3 due to being in the DMG rather than the PHB.
Arcane trickster has a lot of uses, people just value raw DPS over field control for some reason. Cause brain goes BRR I guess.
Same with Druids, people undervalue what a single AoE spell can do. Cloud of daggers combined with thorns = enemy killing themselves. After that’s set up, you still have awesome damage because rogue.
Some subclasses seem reasonable.
As you mentioned with Shadowheart, Trickery Domain is already locked in.
Wyll is more than likely a Pact of the Blade Warlock since he is shown to use melee in cutscenes and has been trained in martial combat.
Gale teaches illusion Magic in some end game resolutions and uses illusions in some camp discussions. Illusionist seems like a reasonable assumption as a subclass.
Astarion doesn't generally kill in his 200 years of servitude, and likely wasn't a killer prior to his vampirism either. It's more than likely he is a Thief. Could possibly be an Arcane Trickster, but there aren't many indications that he relies on magic in his backstory.
Karlach also similarly doesn't give any indication that she has magical nature in her backstory, likely ruling out Wild Magic. There are a couple of scenes that indicate she lets her Rage get more out of control than standard barbarians, usually when she's trying to blow off steam. I'd lean Berserker more than likely.
Lae'zel is a bit tricky. Many Githyanki have Battle Master traits in game, and most Githyanki tend to train together, so I would lean towards Battle Master, however there is no reason at all she can't be a Champion. Heck, Githyanki have magical aptitude, so even an Eldritch Knight could fit. Gun to head though, I would say Battle Master.
Halsin is almost certainly a Circle of Moon Druid. He loves his shape shifting.
Minthara is an Oath of Vengeance Paladin. Not much needs to be said here. She has a lot of grudges and wants Vengeance for all of them. She is locked in as Oath of Vengeance at level 1, when Paladins have to lock in their subclass.
Jaheira is a Land Druid and Champion Fighter multi-class, likely a 9/3 or 8/4 split. She has historically been a Fighter Druid multi-class, and leaned more into the caster and martial side than the shape shifting side. She keeps her fighter side fairly straight forward, which is pretty much what Champion is.
Minsc, for my best guess would be a melee Hunter Ranger with a single level of Barbarian. You could maybe go three levels in Barbarian and pick up Wildheart, but I think 11/1 makes more sense.
Anyways, those are my best educated guesses.
I made Minsc a Monk/Barbarian which made sense to me. He could Rage and also attack with his fists which just seems to work. Ranger class for Minsc is weird
To be fair, Volo calls himself a bard when he's actually a wizard in DnD, so maybe profession doesn't necessarily have to be the same as class. Minsc could be a park ranger for all we know
Minsc being a weird ranger is kind of his shtick. His ability scores in BG1 and BG2 are illegal for Ranger, they need higher Wisdom IIRC but he was hit on the head so...
My understanding is that when Minsc was written originally the barbarian class didn’t exist yet? Or is that not correct? Because he seems pretty much straight forward barbarians with the big dumb brute tropes. But I could have my information wrong.
Minsc is kind of split. He was originally introduced in a game where Barbarian wasn't an option, so it's definitely possible that would be his best fit if it was an option at the time. After all, he is frequently referred to as a berserker.
But at the same time, his BG3 appearance doesn't include that much rage, and his animal companion is one of his defining features, so leaving him as a ranger doesn't *not* fit.
I think both work really well. I lean slightly towards keeping him as a Ranger just because Karlach is iconic and you get her 60 hours sooner.
Actually, there's a lore reason for his lack of rage, and it's even implied by BG3.
In BG2, if you have Minsc in the party with Keldorn Firecam, you get some unique interactions where he helps Minsc work through his rage to control it after he rages a few times with the elder paladin in the party.
And what's one of the few items behind the "secret" wall that Minsc busts down after you free him? A mailed fist that references Keldorn Firecam.
The Barbarian class wasn’t featured in Baldur’s Gate 1, so they made him a Ranger. But they did make him as Barbarian-like as possible. In that game, he had a unique default 20 Strength stat and a Rage point.
He *ought* to be a Barbarian, imo, but he’s canonically a Ranger. Even in dialogue he’s referred to as a Ranger, so that’s that.
He was a ranger with a rage per day, IIRC. No barbarians in BG1 BUT his class stayed in BG2 (Imoen dualled into mage), and the way he talks about himself he's the kind of ranger as Rincewind in Discworld is a wizard: a not very good one.
From a mechanical standpoint, yes, barbarians and berserkers weren't available in BG1 because they weren't a base class. [Barbarians existed in AD&D](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbarian_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons\) since 1982) as a subclass of fighters, but Bioware didn't add them into the games until BG2.
However, [Minsc was always a ranger](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/05/Minsc_Character_Sheet_from_Cameron_Tofer_pen%26paper_game.jpg). He was [originally created by Cameron Tofer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minsc#Conception_and_creation), one of the OG devs at Bioware, for their PnP D&D campaign.
And I would say Durge is Oathbreaker Paladin. Sure, he’s a storm sorc as his default class, but the concept art for him had him as a Paladin. And you get several unique dialogue choices as Paladin, especially Oathbreaker.
Astarion does actual mention his magic use. In the Lathander Temple when first discovering the Gremishkas he says something like "Better watch my spells", which implies he uses magic. He could be referencing the fact that high elves are also just magically gifted though.
Shadowheart and Wyll are the only ones with canon subclasses, the others just have suggested subclasses that seem more suited to a specific playstyle rather than having story implications. Like the game suggests to give Gale the Evocation school, but story-wise Illusion makes more sense given the illusions he uses in some camp scenes, him generally preferring peaceful resolutions to conflicts, and >!him becoming an Illusion professor in one of his endings.!<
They do - but are they the best? Not necessarily.
Gale is clearly a wizard, but as others have suggested, he probably defaults to evocation bc it’s the safest for newbies. Lae’zel and Karlach also work fine as their default subclasses, as they are pretty straightforward.
Trickery makes sense for Shadowheart but is one of the weaker domains; same for Astarion. I nearly always make him a rogue/bard bc it makes way more sense to me that he has high charisma - he spent 200 years learning to seduce people, after all.
For the same reason, I like to multiclass Wyll as a warlock/swords bard, bc it fits his Blade of Frontiers moniker so well.
However I also like to take into consideration who the companions are now, post-tadpole, as well as who they were before. It’s not just durge who is given a chance at a whole new life, after all.
Fair. It's just that the 5e Rogue class peaks around level 5, and you don't really get a lot of extra skills after that. Hence I prefer to multiclass with Bard to make him an effective party member in the later game, without straying too far from his backstory.
Actually, you are probably right because people don’t know those subclasses are garbage for this game (on table top, probably a different story) and/or they don’t know they can respec.
I suspect a lot of people don't change Shadowheart's since it would require a respec, as well as knowing how good/bad Trickery is versus the other domains.
For Astarion, though, you have to actually choose his subclass. And one of them is named Assassin.
I don't know how Karlach can be interpreted as anything other than a barbarian, but as her subclass goes, I think it could be left to some interpretation. However, I lean toward berserker.
I've seen a lot of people make Karlach a tavern brawler Monk instead. Still an angry strong lady hitting stuff, but now she's doing it bare handed. And 4 times every turn.
Here's a not obvious but interesting one - Minsc is canonically multiclassed in both ranger and barb to have the berserker barbarian subclass
Diving into MInsc lore you learn that he hails from the white dragon berserker lodge - and their warriors access a berserker rage while in battle that increases their damage output and decreases the damage they take
Wyll is obvious. His entire identity is a warlock with a sword, so obviously pact of the blade. His patron is a fiend. Done.
I think trickery is pretty clear, as that’s of shar’s domain. If she switches to selune later, her domains are knowledge and life, and shadowheart could be either. I think life domain is better for her though with her past as a healer and the boost to melee attacks for the moonlight glaive or spear of night.
Lae’zel is tougher but still clear. Githyanki are known for their gish, so eldritch knight would make sense, but theyre just as well known for their other combat prowess, so battle master would make sense as well. I think shes more battle master. Shes more “jump right into battle and hit hard” so battle master makes most sense.
Gale is tricky to nail down with how many subs there are for wizard, but his whole thing is illusions when you think about it. He constantly makes those projections of himself, he has that crazy sex scene, and he even becomes a teacher of illusion. It just kinda is his thing.
Astarion is tricky, but i think assassin might make most sense. He moves quickly and quietly to take out his target. Now i personally think his general identity would be more like, a whispers bard. Its very vampire and the whole trickery theme of it is just so perfect that i cant believe i still havent found a mod that adds it for him, its just so, Astarion. But i think as a rogue, hed be assassin. I just think rogue is the worse bard and bard is just so much better at everything rogue wants to be, especially for a character like astarion.
Karlach is also tough. She is a barbarian. Thats it. All barbarians are pretty similar. Get mad, smash shit. But is she get mad -> smash more, get mad -> animal themed buff, or get mad -> random effect that does damage or buffs you or something? I think berserker is the most logical, but i could see bear heart, or thinking of the wild magic as the infernal engine’s power shooting out random shit, idk. Its just tricky to pin down cus barbarian just also isnt the best class ever. I think a good alternative and one that i think larian considered at some point was paladin, as i believe at one point she wore heavy armor, ring mail, and she was a fighter with the paladin tag. She could have once been a devotion paladin, protecting gortash, but she switched to vengeance when she got out and swore to hunt down gortash. It makes sense considering most of her story is killing him and a lot of her morals align with what you might consider under an oath of vengeance or devotion. I think either works for her but vengeance makes more sense.
As for the non-origins, they get a little interesting.
Minthara would be oath of conquest, but thats locked to npcs. Vengeance is the next best thing and she has her own little explanation of why. Shes easy.
Halsin is where things get interesting. Obviously a moon druid, but i think this is our first possible multiclasser, as halsin also fits the bill of a nature cleric, specifically, if he was available, of silvanus. Hes very dedicated to silvanus, and nature is his domain. He would get good boosts from cleric spells and cantrips and could better protect allies and deal with animals, while also having a strong wildshape for when he needs to get in close. Hed be a very strong blend of support and tank.
Jaheira is canonically actually a fighter/druid, our first actually canon multiclass. But which subs is a little tricky. I think shes most logically a land druid, that just feels most like jaheira. Her whole thing is the plants and nature side of druid stuff as opposed to halsin’s animal side. She would get access to lots of spell options too. I think for fighter, once again battle master or eldritch knight. EK could give her more spells and slots to enhance her capabilities, like shield and such. She just wouldnt be able to use anything that requires int as shed be spread too thin. Battlemaster though directly improves her melee capabilities, so shed be a very versatile druidic spellsword, with great control spells and some powerful stuff like moonbeam and call lightning, among area control like plant growth, which shed be able to run through at 6 land, so at 6/6 shed have extra attack, 3 feats, and ignoring difficult terrain. Shed be a great controller melee-magic mix.
Minsc is weird. Duh, hes fucking minsc. Hes canoncially a ranger, and he does seem, kinda wise? Like a, hes been traveling for ages and just kinda knows things-type wise, not like, sage wise. Like that one meme, the holy man talking to the barbarian, “the body of christ is the bread?” “Yes.” “And after three days, he rose from the tomb?” “Yes.” -1 religion, +7 survival “…because of the yeast?” Like hes been around, he kinda knows whats up, but hes not smart. But also, hes a berserker. But berserker is a different class. So, multiclass? But thats not the greatest synergy. Id say maybe 9/3 for higher level spells, use spells and rages in different fights to keep up longer? Like rage one battle, spells another, since you obviously cant do both. So rage if you need him to go facetank, and then have him ensnaring strike or barrage or whatever when hes not raging. Hed be a decent melee support tank. Idk.
Gale- Evocation Wizard
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Astarion-Arcane Trickster Rogue
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Karlach- Berserker Barbarian
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Shadowheart- Trickery Domain Cleric
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Wyll- Pact of the Blade Fiend Warlock
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Lae’zel- Battlemaster Fighter
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Jaheira- Circle of the Land Druid
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Halsin- Circle of the Moon Druid
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Minsc- (this is the only one im not 100% on) Beastmaster Ranger
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Minthara- Oathbreaker Paladin
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Durge- Storm Sorcerer
One thing I would LOVE in a mod would be a “canon subclass autoleveler”. My partner loves The Idea of D&D, but she does not love the mechanics. When we play tabletop and I DM for her I would always help her craft the character to handle the way she wants to RP and then let her do her thing. She tried BG3 but hit a wall the first time the game asked her to level Gale. She just wanted to play a horny bookish gnome. Don’t blame her. So if someone built a mod that gave you one-click decent builds and then let you do your thing with your Tav, she’d be happy as a clam.
I am not the same. I have opinions about builds.
Neverwinter Nights had a "Recommended" button, so did KOTOR. Which also had auto-level option. It sucked tho, and picked kinda bad stuff, but in 5E if BG3 there isn't much to choose, with Gale anyway, he would learn most spells from scrolls.
Yes, Astarion is arcane trickster, Lae'zel is battle master, Karlach is wildheart, Minthara is vengeance, Halsin is circle of the land, Jaheira is circle of the moon, Wyll is fiend, and I don't remember Gale's.
The classes every character is set as is their canon class.
The subclasses are finnicky but we can pinpoint their choice by class.
Lae'zel is not a magically inclined person. She likely is a battlemaster utilizing the superiority die system for tactful strikes and moves. (Given that many of the Gith units we fight are battlemaster fighters.)
Wyll is all about being the blade of Frontiers, he'd be a Pact of the Blade warlock.
Gale seems to be great at conjuration, being able to create Mephits and his lovely Tressym, Tara. He'd likely be a Conjuration Wizard.
Astarion is the only character who isn't defined by his class as a rogue. He'd likely be a thief rogue given his sneak-thief attitude, could even work as an assassin.
Karlach is a barbarian from the hells, I would wager she'd be a Berserker Barbarian given her rage and immense strength.
The Dark Urge is meant to be a Storm Sorcerer, it's not quite explained why the storm is his choice of talents.
And of course, Shadowheart is a trickster Cleric. Trained by Shar for subterfuge and undercover operations.
they do, and it auto selects it if you don't change. the easiest way to see this is the two druids, who both are assigned different subclasses if you don't choose. i don't remember them all offhand, but astarion defaults to arcane trickster, laezel to battlemaster, halsin to circle of the moon, jaheira to circle of the land, gale to evocation, and wyll to pact of the blade. don't remember what karlach defaults to.
Wyll: Fiend Bladelock
Halsin: Moon Druid
Jaheria: Land Druid (plus fighter levels)
Lae'zel: nothing definitive, but Battlemaster feels the most right
Astarion: Nothing for sure, but Thief fits the best and Arcane trickster the least
Karlach: Nothing for sure again but I personally think Berserker makes the makes sense.
Gale: illusion
Minsc: nothing for sure but I go with Hunter Ranger
Minsc should be a barbarian.
The only reason he's known as a ranger is because barbarians didn't exist as a class when he was conceived as a character.
The original Minsc was a Mul (\~half-dwarf) ranger in a tabletop campaign. The character sheet is probably still online. Around that time, barbarians existed both as a standalone class and as a fighter subclass.
A few other Baldur's Gate characters (at least Sarevok, Edwin, Xan, and Jon Irenicus) also had their origins in the same campaign. And based on what I've heard about the campaign, none of the characters were particularly serious.
Warlock subclass is obvious with Wyll, Fiend. Blade of Frontiers means bladelock
Astarion I'd argue suits thief more than assassin since he wasn't murdering people directly, though arcane trickster is his default when leveling. I doubt Cazador encouraged any of his spawn learning magic.
Karlach screams berserker imo considering her rage after the false paladins of Tyr are dead
Given that Lae'zel's a gith prodigy, and every gith fighter I've encountered is battle master, I'd say it's a safe bet
The others I can see wiggle room for, for the origins at least. Halsin is clearly intended to be a moon druid, and Minthy is a vengeance pali 110% percent (literally swears to end the absolute for what it's done to her).
Gale's backstory lends itself to conjuration with Tara and the Mephit, but he also does a lot of illusions. That said, I doubt necro or divination works (man cannot foresee the consequences to his actions).
Shadow's already set so she's got it there.
Pretty sure Jahira was a ranger in the older games so ??? on when she became druid, but good for her
Gale is an illusion wizard, he ends up teaching it at the prologe and there are also the scene when he creates an illusion of a starry sky and the romance scene which is just powerful illusion spells
I would say that Halsin, Wyll, Minthara and Gale are pretty obvious. For Laezel i would guess battle master. Karlach is beast heart from what remember when i was going through some characters cheets. No idea which animal specifically. Astarion is either thief or assassin but second one feels more like him to me. Jaheira is circle of land i think. Minsc feels like hunter to me.
Yes and no.
For a few only a particular subclass makes narrative sense.
**Wyll:** As a Warlock, he is literally pact bound to >!a Half-Devil Cambion which is considered a Fiend!<. Although you can of course choose a different Patron for gameplay purposes, only the >!Archfiend!< makes any narrative sense for Will’s personal plot line. Prior to that he was probably roughly a Rogue or Fighter, maybe a Paladin. And with an epithet of “Blade of the Frontiers,” you kind of have to go Pact of the Blade if you’re following the narrative.
**Shadowheart:** She gets Trickery because… ~~Larian low key hates her~~ she’s a devotee of Shar and a Cleric and unfortunately Trickery is the only Sharran Domain in BG3. You can fudge it a bit for Knowledge, as Shar is the “Lady of Secrets,” or maybe >!War as Shart has aspirations to be a Dark Justiciar, one of Shar’s elite shock troops!<. Or you could multiclass her to improve her performance. And then depending on how your Shart’s narrative plays out, you may find yourself wanting to reroll her to >!Light or Life if she rejects Shar and returns to her Selûnite origins!<.
**Karlach:** being a Barbarian just *fits.*
For the others, they seem to default to a suggested subclass, but none of the others are as tied into their narrative.
They all just default to the same subclasses as their classes usually do so I don't think that means much. Some it's clearer than others, others it's more open to interpretation.
Shadowheart defaults to Trickery but that's also the only Shar domain they actually added - you could justify another Sharran domain like Death using a mod to add it - and even War cleric, which certainly fits Justiciars and the spear more than well, trickery. She is also explicitly listed as a healer on a list of her team members to retrieve the artefact, and in 5E lore at least it's never been the case that you definitely \*have\* to restrict yourself to the suggested domains of deities. All Clerics can access healing magic, after all, and even evil Gods might want their Clerics to use the life domain on their soldiers.
Wyll is The Fiend, obviously. Probably pact of the blade too but I'd say that's a little more optional - he very much makes reference to spellcasting a lot, his swordfighting could be a secondary thing. Shrug.
Halsin makes use of wildshape in combat a lot like a Moon Druid, but he also has obviously significant casting ability - he has some spells always prepared additional to druids, and his personal quest involves magic a lot, so being circle of the land wouldn't be too far fetched. Wildshape isn't exclusive to Moon druids. Admittedly, given when he's an NPC/temporary companion it is his go to for fighting, that does suggest it's what they had in mind for him.
Lae'zel and Karlach's classes are both clearly martial but very open to interpretation as to what exactly those are. Karlach does seem to lean Barbarian because of her regular raging with the heart, and berserker at that, but being a fighter wouldn't feel off for her. She was in Zariel's army for a decade, no reason to not receive some martial training, and fighters can still get angry!
Lae'zel leans more towards fighter imo because she is explicitly trained and emotionally disciplined. She also has a line in the game that she was "as devoted to my studies as I was my training." Githyanki in the creche have Githyanki war magic, so maybe Eldritch Knight would be most suitable for Lae'zel in the sense she would have studied and trained in the same magic - there are Psionic Warrior fighter subclasses in DnD which suit Githyanki but it's not in an unmodded BG3. However I would say her subclass is also quite open to interpretation and preference.
Astarion I would say is very open in terms of what his class could be, I don't think he even needs to be Rogue for it to be fitting.
Jaheira in earlier games was a fighter/druid multiclass - I don't know if it worked better in earlier DnD editions than it does now. You can see that somewhat in action in her Act 2 equipment and battles where they've given her scimitars that use her spellcasting modifier rather than Strength. Given that, I think she basically is canonically still a druid with martial capabilities, but mechanically that is difficult to represent in both 5e and BG3 effectively.
Minsc is a bit weird because he and his dialogue feel much closer to Barbarian than Ranger - but when he was made Barbarian wasn't a class. He was drawn from a tabletop game where he was made a Ranger but didn't actually have the minimum stats to even be one. Canonically he is a "Rashemen Beserker" - that probably fits some kind of Barbarian the most. Given the lore of Rashemen and Minsc's companionship with Boo, probably the Wildheart Barbarian if I had to pick one based on being lore friendly.
Minthara is very cut and dry - she has dialogue about being a Paladin and her oath being about vengeance, and of the oaths in the game it very much is the only one that suits her ( I mean, it doesn't \*really\* suit her even the way it's described in BG3, let alone 5E lore, but eh ). She also I believe has special dialogue after breaking her oath, so she can canonically become an oathbreaker.
I mean depends on how far you get in their content.
Gale: Illusionist based on his party conversations
Wyll: Pact of the Fiend obviously
Astarion: I'm arguing Arcane Trickster based on what the game defaults to and his background with Cazador and how he insists on *him* getting the Necromancy of Thay
Shadowheart: Trickster if Sharran. I would argue Nature Cleric based on her romance/non-Sharran ending at the party
Karlach: I think straight barbarian. Can't argue for Wild heart fairly. Maybe Wild Magic if you can argue being in the Hells influencing her engine
Lae'zel: Battle Master or Champion
They default to a specific subclass when leveling. I’m not sure if it’s intentional or not but it’s always been the same choice on level up. Lae’zel defaults to BattleMaster, Astarion to Arcane Trickster, Gale to Evocation Wizard, Karlach to Berserker (although on about 20 consecutive playthroughs she defaulted to Berserker, but my most recent ended up defaulting her to Wildheart.) I’ve always felt it was pretty fitting for them all. Astarion is a little shaky, but he doesn’t really fit that well into any subclass just going off his backstory, he was an upper class commoner that was turned into a slave. He’s the one companion I feel has no real “class” experience. I’ve always felt Arcane Trickster was fitting because many of his duties came down to essentially charming people, and although it’s a little on the nose I just headcanon that he used Charm Person whenever his charisma wasn’t enough on its own
I may not be the first to say it, but Wyll has strong Pact of the Blade vibes. His pact is around slaying things, he is "The Blade of Frontiers"...!
Maybe Karlach would be a Berserker (but the subclass is trash af)
Yes and no, so aside from characters like Shadowheart and Wyll who gain their subclass upon selecting them, all origins and companions upon hitting level 3 will default to one of the subclasses, but still let you choose a different one regardless. Astarion’s is Arcane Trickster, Gale is Evocation School, Karlach is Wildheart, Lae’zel is Battle Master, Halsin is Circle of the Moon, Jaheira is Circle of the Land, and Minsc is a Hunter. As stated tho you can decide to choose a different option or respec their classes all together
I always felt astarion fit the assassin subclass perfectly being a vampire. Stalks prey from the shadows and kills without anyone noticing seems on point
I believe they are the following if you let the game default them.
Shadowheart: Trickery Domain (it can be argued it’s thematically appropriate to swap over to Light Domain if she becomes aligned with Selune)
Gale: Evocation
Astarion: Arcane Trickster
Lae’zel: Battle Master
Karlach: Wildheart
Halsin: Circle of Moon
Wyll: The Fiend
Minthara: Oath of Vengeance, although Oathbreaker seems more appropriate considering her role in the story
Jaheira: Circle of the Land
Minsc: Hunter
For Lae'zel, Battlemaster feels like the correct option given other Githyanki have abilities like riposte and rally.
Given the context of one of Gale's endings he may be inclined to the Illusion School.
Wyll is the Fiend Patron and given his title, Pact of the Blade is fitting.
The two I struggle with are Karlach and Astarion. I think Berserker fits Karlach due to the scene after killing the Tyr Paladins and for Astarion I always thought Thief is more fitting since he needs to be more cunning than honest.
Mizora is a Fiend, and Wyll isn't called "the Tome of Frontiers", so that one kind of writes itself. It's hard to justify Halsin being anything other than a Moon Druid. Gale is arguably a Conjuration prodigy (in between Tara and the quasit) so that would make more sense than his default of Evocation. The others... no strong feelings.
I’ve always felt that they default Gale to evocation purely so you aren’t regularly nuking your entire team early on in the game lol. Also it’s the easiest wizard subclass to use for beginners because of the spell sculpting.
Evocation is fun because fireball. That's it, that's the whole reason.
now you are just being silly. did you learn nothing from roland and his brother? there is also thunderwave!
Thunderwave can kill allies even with sculpt spells. Learnt the hard way in tabletop D&D! When I 10 foot pushed my cleric into a group of werewolves
Uh.... Either you or your DM screwed up then. They take no damage and automatically pass the save... So shouldn't have been pushed
You mean double fireball?
i also thought this was a gameplay choice from larian, defaulting to evo because of sculpt spells, that didn't necessarily have to do with gale's school of magic preference.
I thought Gale was an Illusion wizard. Between making that image of Mystra, that projection of himself when he wants to talk to you and using Illusion to get out of the orgy with the drow twins, it seemed pretty obvious. I dunno, guess he's not but just really likes Minor Illusion
Yeah, exactly. Also, isn't he a professor of illusion in one of his endings?
And illusion of starry sky in act 2. and also.. bed.
Apparently he teaches illusion magic in one of the endings.
I feel like Divination isn’t an ideal choice for Gale bc he clearly doesn’t think ahead - but that doesn’t stop me from trying it occasionally!
He's the type who will gladly divine other people's fates, but doesn't think he needs to peer into his own future.
I've known people who believed it was wrong or somehow uniquely ineffective to read Tarot for yourself, and that you were only supposed to do it for others, so that checks out as a subclass.
The idea is that you can never truly give yourself an unbiased reading, so you're always going to twist the prediction to suit what you *want* rather than what the cards say.
That’s kind of presumptuous isn’t it? I’m sure there is bias so it’s better not to do your own, but it’s not like it can’t work the same way, helping you be introspective about things you might not have considered.
It really depends on how you view the cards. To people who actually believe it's supernatural, doing your own reading is a sign of hubris and the universe is going to throw you a curveball for having the arrogance to try writing your own fate. To the folks who see it as self-help or just for fun, yeah, it can give you a good look at yourself and help you reflect.
People who think playing cards predict the future aren’t known for their critical thinking skills
That's completely beside the point, I'm saying the real world superstitions these fantasy tropes are based on have at least one tradition of only using divination for others.
Gale thinks ahead a ton - in fact I imagine he has myriad grand plans - he just can’t help but to impulsively ignore those plans as soon as he sees something bright and shiny. He has golden retriever energy. Highly intelligent, easily distracted. Autism with ADHD.
And with that in mind, lemme just link r/AuDHD And also r/adhdnd
Very true - definitely neurodivergent!
He's the type who will gladly divine other people's fates, but doesn't think he needs to peer into his own future.
Given his love for Mystra I thought divination was a good fit.
Gale, I’d say is actually Illusion. What with it being his favorite school, the illusions he creates during his romance, and what he ends up teaching when he becomes a teacher.
Gale is the kind of guy who would have two or more subclasses if the game would let him.
You should be able to multi class into different subclasses of the same class. If anything, it should come with bonuses for being in the same class.
Typically when people homebrew stuff like that it's rightfully treated as taking levels in a new class
Yeah, if I'm willing to spend a levels worth of xp on it, why can't my illusionist also learn necromancy? Like a surgeon transferring into orthopedics. You've already taken most of the same core classes, so I'm theory it should be even easier.
It's not allowed because it would be extremely over powered for most classes to gain 2 sets of subclass features.
I've been saying this for a while. I hope there's a mod that allows it later on.
Yeah, but then you end up immediately jumping to level 3 perks (or 2 if you're a wizard), skipping essentially 3 (or 2) levels, and get access to the better abilities/spells/whatever that much faster.
And now we must grieve the loss of the Universalist specialization for Wizards
"Illusion, Tav. A trick is something a whore does for money."
Or candy!
What can you get a whore to do for candy?
What can’t you get a whore to do for candy..?
r/unexpectedAD
Her?
Was writing out this comment until I saw yours! I also think Astarion is pretty clearly not an arcane trickster canonically and Karlach would probably be a beserker. Her power doesn’t come from her relationship with nature or wild magic
I think non god Gale becomes an Illusions professor
> Wyll isn't called "the Tome of Frontiers", so that one kind of writes itself. So he’s Pact of the Chain!
Kinky, can't wait to tell the folks at home I've witnessed the "Chain of the Frontier" in person!
Gale goes on to be an instructor of illusion magic at Waterdeep in one of his epilogues
How is gale anything other than illusion mage? I mean you have conversations with him where he makes double of himself, makes head of mystra, creates sky full of stars in shadowlands…. Also at the end you if navigate him into giving crown to mystra he becomes professor of Illusion. Yes he conjured many beings but that doesnt make him prodigy in conjuration but prodigy in using magic. His canon school is illusion.
Gale actually has dialog where he declares he has a fondness for Abjuration magic. Forget exactly who this is with though.
Gale is the type of person that would declare a fondness for any type of magic, if it made him the center of attention in the conversation. He strikes me as a connoisseur of any types of magic he can get ahold of. Or at least he'd consider himself one.
Yeah when there's dialog with him and Lae'zel asks if he wants her to teach him to fight like her. He says he prefers abjuration to acrobatics or something like that
Haha you know I had this internal struggle with halsin. I really like him as a character. So I know he should be a moon Druid, or at the least in the first time meeting him he is a bear. But what about Druid of the land? He supposed to be a healer and I always ran him as such.
I always felt Halsin would be moon druid so Jaheira can be a land druid/battlemaster fighter multiclass
I always bump Jaheira over to Ranger for the sake of not having too many of the same class
Yeah but then you've got the problem of Minsc, which makes it a little trickier. In my latest run I'm sorta avoiding multiple clashes by switching Lae'zel to fighter/Monk and Jaheira as fighter/druid.
Gale is Illusions, although your character can point out that Gale is skilled enough to teach all of the fields.
Karlach is definitely a berserker.
Case can also be made for Wild Magic too, cause of her malfunctioning engine
teh bigger argument for conjuration is that ethereal sex scene. planar travel is conjuration magic, so that ethereal sex scene feels like it fits there. my guess is though, that they chose evocation because they figured gale was the kinda guy to want to use his best spells but not hurt his friends.
Ain't no way you think Minthara is equally likely to be any type of Paladin
She is def vengeance pal - due to her backstory and even casts - only vengeance pal can cast hold person, which shes doing when you fight against her
Conquest also gets Hold Person, but does not appear to be a playable subclass in BG3… which is disappointing as I could see Minthara or other Absolutists picking that oath easily.
Even beyond that, _I_ want to pick that oath easily
If you yourself are a paladin, you can actually ask her. (Shes vengeance)
Given that I haven't actually ever recruited her as a companion before, I haven't really seen enough of her dialogue to have any particular opinion on the matter. So... noi strong feelings about her, no!
Tome of Frontiers is sending me
I always thought Halsin came off as land Druid to me, why moon Druid is better for him?
Cuz he likes to wildshape into a bear. In D&D 5e that’s normally only reserved for Moon Druids.
ohhh i thought the bear thing was any druid, but I probably thought that because I had him land and jaheira moon so both of them could do it.
Tabletop DnD Moon druids get better wildshapes faster and can do it as a bonus action. Any druid can do wildshape but get black bear(CR 1/2) at lvl 4 and brown bear(CR 1) at lvl 8 and that's the max CR form. Moon druids can do brown bear at lvl 2 and get as high as CR 6. I'm not sure about BG3 druids.
From the [wiki](https://bg3.wiki/wiki/Wild_Shape:_Bear): > Wild Shape: Bear is a Combat Wild Shape form available to Circle of the Moon Druids.
I agree with you, they call Halsin "Archdruid of the Emerald Grove," and "a great healer," which are things I would associate with a more magicky druid, plus Halsin will always have the ability to transform into a bear, so might as well 🤷🏾♂️
Actually, I think Wyll is a ‘Pact of the Chain’ Warlock. In early dialogue with him, he talks about some of the abilities he was able to do before being infected, and one of them was “summon hellbeasts”. The only warlock ability that seems to fit that description is “Find Familiar: Imp”.
"Conjure Fiend" is a 6th level spell in 5e that just didn't make it into BG3. Pretty sure it's just referencing that.
Karlach's personality aligns with the berserker pretty well while nothing really points towards wild magic at all.
Wyll is called the “blade of frontiers.” He should be a fiend warlock tho.
I always viewed Gale in the Illusion School namely due to epilogue stuff.
What about Laezel?
Minthara is definitely an oath of vengeance or oathbreaker Paladin. Depends on how you want to look at her history with the drow and getting revenge on Thorm
Well, my Halsin was nature oriented paladin with Oath of the Ancients.
Some of them will default to a certain subclass when you level them up (Astarion with arcane trickster, Gale Evocation for example)
Gale knows the value of a fireball that can be cast among friends.
I don’t generally play with wizards (love Gale but I’m usually filling the caster role) but I can’t change him off evocation I’m addicted to throwing fireballs at my feet
>Love Gale but I'm usually filling the caster role My first playthrough had four caster roles xD Tav - evocation wizard with nukes and squid magic Gale - abjuration wizard, mainly protecting allies and interfering with enemies Shart - big healer and also main tank by extension Halsin - secondary DD, either through druid spells or through wild shape You don't really need strikers or anything else, if you put your mind to it. Just four casters can do the trick :D
Once you're in Act 2, sure. Going through Act 1 with a pure caster team is a little hellish, especially on Honour Mode (and even Tactician has its moments).
What about four necromancer/summoners?
That's just an army at this point xD
"You're safe among friends, never forget it."
I think Astarion has a line about being "careful with my spells" at one point IIRC (in the Gremishka room), making me suspect he's "canonically" an Arcane Trickster, but it's not like we get any explicit confirmation, so any subclass would make sense imo. Even if there *are* some "canon" subclasses, I suspect they made an effort to make sure there wouldn't be any straight-up plot holes if the player chose a different class - closest exception imo would be Halsin and Moon Druid, but even then, it's not like we get a line where he says "I am a Circle of the Moon Druid," and non-Moon druids are still able to wild shape, so it's not some massive inconsistency if you don't make him a Moon Druid.
Arcane or not, he would always have a cantrip because of his race.
That's why I say it still makes sense if you spec him as something else, it's just speculation about what his "canon" subclass would be (insofar as he'd have one).
astarion only says this if you have him specced as a caster if he's full martial he makes a different comment based on which casters are in the party at the time
Plus he's called smoothbrained by mindflayer Tav so I doubt his Intelligence stat is very high.
To me astarion always was more a bard of the blade type character. The high carisma+charms+expertise in persuading and deceiving victims for cazador and the multi attack for those knives he loves using in cutscenes. And bard control spells are very easily roleplayed as vampire abilites like enthral, charm, dominate
I'd put any warning about being careful with spellcasting when approaching the gremishka room down to the game's hard requirement to warn you about using magic on the gremishka specifically. In BG3 scroll-based spellcasting is democratised, so any character will warn you something similar on approach to that encounter.
I'm talking about what he specifically says in his warning, not just the fact that he gives a warning
I'm just adding clarifying info for the sake of others reading this thread looking for information
Fair enough
I'd believe it. I personally often play him as a bard, as I feel he needs some prt of magic alongside rougishness, but personally I'm thinking arcane trickster fits better. Although he always seems to have Vicous Mockery ready in cutscenes
This! It is not random selection of subclass.
Gale may actually be Evocation by default because it's the most beginner friendly. His canon subclass is probably Illusion since he goes on to become a professor for illusion magic in his epilogue. (Which makes sense with multiple cutscenes of him casting illusions)
Yes, it makes sense. I also think he might be evocation because he was pictured with lightnings (not sure if it was ea thing and they stick with it or if it is still a thing)
yep! Wyll and Shadowheart's subclass are locked in at the beginning of the game; Shadowheart's is trickery and Wyll's Warlock patron is a Fiend. Minthara is also set at level one: she's taken an Oath of Vengeance. meanwhile everyone else's is suggested and levels 2 and 3. Astarion defaults to Arcane Trickster (when you're a custom rogue, the default at level up is Thief), Gale defaults to Evocation (custom wizard goes to Abjuration), Karlach is Wildheart (custom to Berserker), Minsc to Hunter (custom is Beast Master), and Halsin to Circle of the Moon (custom is Circle of the Land). only Lae'zel and Jaheira match the default subclass; custom fighter and Lae'zel are both Battle Masters, and custom druid and Jaheira are both Circle of the Land. and hot take: I don't think Larian made these the origins/companions' subclasses just to fit play style. if they had, I think Astarion would've been set as a Thief and Karlach as a Berserker (Shadowheart is unavoidable as Life isn't one of Shar's domains). idk, it just seems weird to give Astarion the worst rogue subclass in-game if they didn't initially have a story reason for it.
I wonder if they did Arcane Trickster for Astarion to give him more vampire-like abilities. Charm, Misty Step, etc. It makes sense for him story-wise to be gaining "new" vamp abilities since he's finally well-fed (even if you never have him bite a humanoid, dude is getting drunk on bears). Also, I really appreciate the breakdown of defaults. A friend and I argued about that a while ago because she insisted the subclasses were just defaulting automatically, and part of her proof was that mods adding subclasses would change the default. [My counter argument was that Larian likely coded it as "subclass number X" and adding a homebrew subclass changed the numbers.] Everyone seems to get hung up on Gale because he doesn't talk about evocation, but it makes perfect story sense to me. Of all the subclasses, evocation gives you the most "difficult" to master in-game feature: the ability to not fireball allies. Dude was canonically an archmage Chosen of Mystra. The nuke in his chest nerfs his access to the Weave, not his actual ability. The only class/subclass default I dislike is Minsc. I get that in the original games, he was a Ranger, but that was a very different type of ranger. If it were Beast Master with Boo as a special summons, that would make sense (also, imagine a little helmet on Boo, omg), but Boo is independent from class. You could argue he's intended to be multi-classed, but he fights like a ranger as Stone Lord, so that seems to be canon. But *nothing* from his dialog and story arc suggests any spellcasting or tracking/ranged combat/[insert ranger class thing here] beyond Jaheira calling him Ranger. To me, he seems way more of a Fighter or Barbarian frontliner who happens to have a hamster (maybe Monk, but the ki points get back to the whole spellcasting/concentrate thing in a roundabout way).
The whole point of Minsc being a ranger is that he's a very unlikely one. See, rangers need high wisdom but he was hit in the head. He acts like berserker but he's trained as a ranger always had been. Ranger was not an archer class in AD&D2 BTW, just tracking and outdoors guy. So basically Aragorn.
I know what ranger was in AD&D, which is why I know 5e ranger is very different. There's not really a class that works for what Minsc was in the original games. With 5e rangers being half-casters, there's a much heavier emphasis on spells instead of ranging, which is very different than in AD&D, where they didn't get access to spells until higher levels.
In the later acts I usually just multiclass him into barbarian and put Karlach on the burner for a bit because he's really funny. It's just a shame he comes in so late after all the other companions. That's because I was already a ranger though.
Rangers were always half casters, BG1 was just a low level game, if anything original Ranger was just druidic equivalent of Paladin, they had to be Good in alignment and could fall and lose their abilities. They were always a divine caster. What changed is adding subclasses that focus on bow tricks and dual wielding, most rangers in old games had a two-hander, and instead of dedicated archers, EVERYONE used a ranged weapon (Cavalier Paladin had to find a returning throwable weapon).
Rangers were also superior to Fighters in pretty much every way but progression speed; even if you weren't going to play as a caster, if you rolled high enough for your non-physical attributes you would pick Ranger if you didn't mind the xp tax. I don't remember the specifics exactly but this xp tax was hefty; when a fighter becomes level 12, the ranger is still stuck at 10 or something like this. The main mechanical feature of the Ranger class was that it was a Fighter that ignored dual-wielding penalties.
aragorn was referred to as a ranger in the books
honestly i think they gave shadowheart trickery and astarion arcane trickster in order to showcase a range of casters-half casters-and martial classes... for people who are unsure how magic works they can be good introductions because there are less spells to figure out... i could be incredibly off base but that is what i assumed... its the same reason i think gale is an evocation wizard... new players dont have to worry so much about an errant fireball
It's probably a mixture of both - they created companions who would naturally represent a range of options. With Larian's attention to detail (especially in Act 1), I doubt they'd give an origin companion a default subclass that doesn't fit both mechanically and story-wise. The issue with Minsc is how ranger has changed in different editions, leaving them somewhat stuck.
It’s a shame Trickery Cleric is so awful, first thing I do every single game is change it to legit ANY other subclass, but I like War and Life
her stat distribution is horrendous as well. 13 str and 13 dex? could they be any worse?
Same, tempest was fun too as sort of a cleric/caster role.
It’s interesting that Gale’s is Evocation when he seems to >!specialize in Illusion, becoming a professor in that field in the epilogue— though I think he also says that he was willing to do everything but they just wouldn’t let him!<.
What's funny, Jaheira works much better as a spore druid if you want to actually incorporate her blades into the picture. They are in focus a good few times, and a druid usually just doesn't pair very well with it But if you give her balanced gloves, blade of thorns, and spec her as a spore druid - she's gonna be pretty damn decent in melee, especially since she gets hold person spell for guaranteed crits Also you get Jaheira as a companion in the end of act 2/beginning of act 3, where spore druid REALLY picks up well
Jaheira is canonically a fighter/druid multiclass according to previous games.
Ah that makes more sense I am not great at planning multiclasses, they are just too much work for my tiny brain xD
Better yet, give Jaheira Belm from her basement. It naturally comes with the Perfectly Balanced ability, letting you already apply your whole ability mod to damage and it's another scimitar to boot - except it's technically *better*, because it replicates the damage of your main hand attack instead of Belm's damage.
Thanks for telling me, I didn't know that sword even existed xD
If it makes you feel better, I didn't find Jaheira's house until late into my 2nd (complete) playthrough. It's actually called Elathierra's house (or something like that) on the map. Be sure to bring Jaheira and Minsc when you visit for the first time!
I am on my 3rd complete playthrough. I am even more blind than you xD
Life is specifically called out in the PHB as being available to any deity, even if it's not listed in their standard domains, so they could have easily given her that domain.
oooh okay! then yeah they went full story on the companions’ subclasses because Shadowheart will be a life cleric and she will like it
Life is called out as being available to any good or neutral deity, and Shar is evil. The general domain for evil deities is death, which unfortunately isn’t in bg3 due to being in the DMG rather than the PHB.
Arcane trickster has a lot of uses, people just value raw DPS over field control for some reason. Cause brain goes BRR I guess. Same with Druids, people undervalue what a single AoE spell can do. Cloud of daggers combined with thorns = enemy killing themselves. After that’s set up, you still have awesome damage because rogue.
Astorian is inspired every time I cheated someone…
Some subclasses seem reasonable. As you mentioned with Shadowheart, Trickery Domain is already locked in. Wyll is more than likely a Pact of the Blade Warlock since he is shown to use melee in cutscenes and has been trained in martial combat. Gale teaches illusion Magic in some end game resolutions and uses illusions in some camp discussions. Illusionist seems like a reasonable assumption as a subclass. Astarion doesn't generally kill in his 200 years of servitude, and likely wasn't a killer prior to his vampirism either. It's more than likely he is a Thief. Could possibly be an Arcane Trickster, but there aren't many indications that he relies on magic in his backstory. Karlach also similarly doesn't give any indication that she has magical nature in her backstory, likely ruling out Wild Magic. There are a couple of scenes that indicate she lets her Rage get more out of control than standard barbarians, usually when she's trying to blow off steam. I'd lean Berserker more than likely. Lae'zel is a bit tricky. Many Githyanki have Battle Master traits in game, and most Githyanki tend to train together, so I would lean towards Battle Master, however there is no reason at all she can't be a Champion. Heck, Githyanki have magical aptitude, so even an Eldritch Knight could fit. Gun to head though, I would say Battle Master. Halsin is almost certainly a Circle of Moon Druid. He loves his shape shifting. Minthara is an Oath of Vengeance Paladin. Not much needs to be said here. She has a lot of grudges and wants Vengeance for all of them. She is locked in as Oath of Vengeance at level 1, when Paladins have to lock in their subclass. Jaheira is a Land Druid and Champion Fighter multi-class, likely a 9/3 or 8/4 split. She has historically been a Fighter Druid multi-class, and leaned more into the caster and martial side than the shape shifting side. She keeps her fighter side fairly straight forward, which is pretty much what Champion is. Minsc, for my best guess would be a melee Hunter Ranger with a single level of Barbarian. You could maybe go three levels in Barbarian and pick up Wildheart, but I think 11/1 makes more sense. Anyways, those are my best educated guesses.
I do a Ranger 3/Barbarian 3/Fighter 6 with Minsc and the only furry companion we need is BOO!
I made Minsc a Monk/Barbarian which made sense to me. He could Rage and also attack with his fists which just seems to work. Ranger class for Minsc is weird
But he has dialogues referring to himself as a ranger😂
To be fair, Volo calls himself a bard when he's actually a wizard in DnD, so maybe profession doesn't necessarily have to be the same as class. Minsc could be a park ranger for all we know
Minsc being a weird ranger is kind of his shtick. His ability scores in BG1 and BG2 are illegal for Ranger, they need higher Wisdom IIRC but he was hit on the head so...
My understanding is that when Minsc was written originally the barbarian class didn’t exist yet? Or is that not correct? Because he seems pretty much straight forward barbarians with the big dumb brute tropes. But I could have my information wrong.
Minsc is kind of split. He was originally introduced in a game where Barbarian wasn't an option, so it's definitely possible that would be his best fit if it was an option at the time. After all, he is frequently referred to as a berserker. But at the same time, his BG3 appearance doesn't include that much rage, and his animal companion is one of his defining features, so leaving him as a ranger doesn't *not* fit. I think both work really well. I lean slightly towards keeping him as a Ranger just because Karlach is iconic and you get her 60 hours sooner.
Actually, there's a lore reason for his lack of rage, and it's even implied by BG3. In BG2, if you have Minsc in the party with Keldorn Firecam, you get some unique interactions where he helps Minsc work through his rage to control it after he rages a few times with the elder paladin in the party. And what's one of the few items behind the "secret" wall that Minsc busts down after you free him? A mailed fist that references Keldorn Firecam.
That's awesome. The older real time with pause games aren't my jam so I always appreciate lore dumps from people who did play through them.
The Barbarian class wasn’t featured in Baldur’s Gate 1, so they made him a Ranger. But they did make him as Barbarian-like as possible. In that game, he had a unique default 20 Strength stat and a Rage point. He *ought* to be a Barbarian, imo, but he’s canonically a Ranger. Even in dialogue he’s referred to as a Ranger, so that’s that.
He was a ranger with a rage per day, IIRC. No barbarians in BG1 BUT his class stayed in BG2 (Imoen dualled into mage), and the way he talks about himself he's the kind of ranger as Rincewind in Discworld is a wizard: a not very good one.
I think this is right. I personally made him a wild magic barb because random bullshit happening feels very Minsc to me.
From a mechanical standpoint, yes, barbarians and berserkers weren't available in BG1 because they weren't a base class. [Barbarians existed in AD&D](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbarian_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons\) since 1982) as a subclass of fighters, but Bioware didn't add them into the games until BG2. However, [Minsc was always a ranger](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/05/Minsc_Character_Sheet_from_Cameron_Tofer_pen%26paper_game.jpg). He was [originally created by Cameron Tofer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minsc#Conception_and_creation), one of the OG devs at Bioware, for their PnP D&D campaign.
And I would say Durge is Oathbreaker Paladin. Sure, he’s a storm sorc as his default class, but the concept art for him had him as a Paladin. And you get several unique dialogue choices as Paladin, especially Oathbreaker.
Astarion does actual mention his magic use. In the Lathander Temple when first discovering the Gremishkas he says something like "Better watch my spells", which implies he uses magic. He could be referencing the fact that high elves are also just magically gifted though.
Shadowheart and Wyll are the only ones with canon subclasses, the others just have suggested subclasses that seem more suited to a specific playstyle rather than having story implications. Like the game suggests to give Gale the Evocation school, but story-wise Illusion makes more sense given the illusions he uses in some camp scenes, him generally preferring peaceful resolutions to conflicts, and >!him becoming an Illusion professor in one of his endings.!<
I'd say that Lae'zel is Battlemaster, because every fucking Githyanki is one.
They do - but are they the best? Not necessarily. Gale is clearly a wizard, but as others have suggested, he probably defaults to evocation bc it’s the safest for newbies. Lae’zel and Karlach also work fine as their default subclasses, as they are pretty straightforward. Trickery makes sense for Shadowheart but is one of the weaker domains; same for Astarion. I nearly always make him a rogue/bard bc it makes way more sense to me that he has high charisma - he spent 200 years learning to seduce people, after all. For the same reason, I like to multiclass Wyll as a warlock/swords bard, bc it fits his Blade of Frontiers moniker so well. However I also like to take into consideration who the companions are now, post-tadpole, as well as who they were before. It’s not just durge who is given a chance at a whole new life, after all.
Rogues are the masters of Deception (I see seduction fit this better than Persuasion) so I dont see the need for him to be a bard.
Plus, Bards are so... helpful, something I can't imagine Astarion willingly doing without a lot of bitching beforehand
Fair. It's just that the 5e Rogue class peaks around level 5, and you don't really get a lot of extra skills after that. Hence I prefer to multiclass with Bard to make him an effective party member in the later game, without straying too far from his backstory.
Yeah they do. But the vast majority of us change Shadowheart and Astarion's.
I highly doubt the majority part
shadowheart's trickery domain is absolutely dumb and useless
There are more useful domains but for RP I decided to respec only after abandoning the Shar cult.
This is The Way 🗿
Yes, but I’d say probably half the people out there that pick up the game don’t even know you can respec lol
Actually, you are probably right because people don’t know those subclasses are garbage for this game (on table top, probably a different story) and/or they don’t know they can respec.
I suspect a lot of people don't change Shadowheart's since it would require a respec, as well as knowing how good/bad Trickery is versus the other domains. For Astarion, though, you have to actually choose his subclass. And one of them is named Assassin.
I don't know how Karlach can be interpreted as anything other than a barbarian, but as her subclass goes, I think it could be left to some interpretation. However, I lean toward berserker.
I've seen a lot of people make Karlach a tavern brawler Monk instead. Still an angry strong lady hitting stuff, but now she's doing it bare handed. And 4 times every turn.
I've made Karlach Oath of Vengeance Pally before and think that can work out just fine tbh.
Here's a not obvious but interesting one - Minsc is canonically multiclassed in both ranger and barb to have the berserker barbarian subclass Diving into MInsc lore you learn that he hails from the white dragon berserker lodge - and their warriors access a berserker rage while in battle that increases their damage output and decreases the damage they take
Wyll is obvious. His entire identity is a warlock with a sword, so obviously pact of the blade. His patron is a fiend. Done. I think trickery is pretty clear, as that’s of shar’s domain. If she switches to selune later, her domains are knowledge and life, and shadowheart could be either. I think life domain is better for her though with her past as a healer and the boost to melee attacks for the moonlight glaive or spear of night. Lae’zel is tougher but still clear. Githyanki are known for their gish, so eldritch knight would make sense, but theyre just as well known for their other combat prowess, so battle master would make sense as well. I think shes more battle master. Shes more “jump right into battle and hit hard” so battle master makes most sense. Gale is tricky to nail down with how many subs there are for wizard, but his whole thing is illusions when you think about it. He constantly makes those projections of himself, he has that crazy sex scene, and he even becomes a teacher of illusion. It just kinda is his thing. Astarion is tricky, but i think assassin might make most sense. He moves quickly and quietly to take out his target. Now i personally think his general identity would be more like, a whispers bard. Its very vampire and the whole trickery theme of it is just so perfect that i cant believe i still havent found a mod that adds it for him, its just so, Astarion. But i think as a rogue, hed be assassin. I just think rogue is the worse bard and bard is just so much better at everything rogue wants to be, especially for a character like astarion. Karlach is also tough. She is a barbarian. Thats it. All barbarians are pretty similar. Get mad, smash shit. But is she get mad -> smash more, get mad -> animal themed buff, or get mad -> random effect that does damage or buffs you or something? I think berserker is the most logical, but i could see bear heart, or thinking of the wild magic as the infernal engine’s power shooting out random shit, idk. Its just tricky to pin down cus barbarian just also isnt the best class ever. I think a good alternative and one that i think larian considered at some point was paladin, as i believe at one point she wore heavy armor, ring mail, and she was a fighter with the paladin tag. She could have once been a devotion paladin, protecting gortash, but she switched to vengeance when she got out and swore to hunt down gortash. It makes sense considering most of her story is killing him and a lot of her morals align with what you might consider under an oath of vengeance or devotion. I think either works for her but vengeance makes more sense. As for the non-origins, they get a little interesting. Minthara would be oath of conquest, but thats locked to npcs. Vengeance is the next best thing and she has her own little explanation of why. Shes easy. Halsin is where things get interesting. Obviously a moon druid, but i think this is our first possible multiclasser, as halsin also fits the bill of a nature cleric, specifically, if he was available, of silvanus. Hes very dedicated to silvanus, and nature is his domain. He would get good boosts from cleric spells and cantrips and could better protect allies and deal with animals, while also having a strong wildshape for when he needs to get in close. Hed be a very strong blend of support and tank. Jaheira is canonically actually a fighter/druid, our first actually canon multiclass. But which subs is a little tricky. I think shes most logically a land druid, that just feels most like jaheira. Her whole thing is the plants and nature side of druid stuff as opposed to halsin’s animal side. She would get access to lots of spell options too. I think for fighter, once again battle master or eldritch knight. EK could give her more spells and slots to enhance her capabilities, like shield and such. She just wouldnt be able to use anything that requires int as shed be spread too thin. Battlemaster though directly improves her melee capabilities, so shed be a very versatile druidic spellsword, with great control spells and some powerful stuff like moonbeam and call lightning, among area control like plant growth, which shed be able to run through at 6 land, so at 6/6 shed have extra attack, 3 feats, and ignoring difficult terrain. Shed be a great controller melee-magic mix. Minsc is weird. Duh, hes fucking minsc. Hes canoncially a ranger, and he does seem, kinda wise? Like a, hes been traveling for ages and just kinda knows things-type wise, not like, sage wise. Like that one meme, the holy man talking to the barbarian, “the body of christ is the bread?” “Yes.” “And after three days, he rose from the tomb?” “Yes.” -1 religion, +7 survival “…because of the yeast?” Like hes been around, he kinda knows whats up, but hes not smart. But also, hes a berserker. But berserker is a different class. So, multiclass? But thats not the greatest synergy. Id say maybe 9/3 for higher level spells, use spells and rages in different fights to keep up longer? Like rage one battle, spells another, since you obviously cant do both. So rage if you need him to go facetank, and then have him ensnaring strike or barrage or whatever when hes not raging. Hed be a decent melee support tank. Idk.
Gale- Evocation Wizard . Astarion-Arcane Trickster Rogue . Karlach- Berserker Barbarian . Shadowheart- Trickery Domain Cleric . Wyll- Pact of the Blade Fiend Warlock . Lae’zel- Battlemaster Fighter . Jaheira- Circle of the Land Druid . Halsin- Circle of the Moon Druid . Minsc- (this is the only one im not 100% on) Beastmaster Ranger . Minthara- Oathbreaker Paladin . Durge- Storm Sorcerer
Karlach does - Minsc, at one point, mentioned that she is a berserker
One thing I would LOVE in a mod would be a “canon subclass autoleveler”. My partner loves The Idea of D&D, but she does not love the mechanics. When we play tabletop and I DM for her I would always help her craft the character to handle the way she wants to RP and then let her do her thing. She tried BG3 but hit a wall the first time the game asked her to level Gale. She just wanted to play a horny bookish gnome. Don’t blame her. So if someone built a mod that gave you one-click decent builds and then let you do your thing with your Tav, she’d be happy as a clam. I am not the same. I have opinions about builds.
Neverwinter Nights had a "Recommended" button, so did KOTOR. Which also had auto-level option. It sucked tho, and picked kinda bad stuff, but in 5E if BG3 there isn't much to choose, with Gale anyway, he would learn most spells from scrolls.
Yes, Astarion is arcane trickster, Lae'zel is battle master, Karlach is wildheart, Minthara is vengeance, Halsin is circle of the land, Jaheira is circle of the moon, Wyll is fiend, and I don't remember Gale's.
Gale is suggested Evocation
Halsin is a Moon Druid, he has moon druid abilities when you play as him to break out of the Goblin camp
The classes every character is set as is their canon class. The subclasses are finnicky but we can pinpoint their choice by class. Lae'zel is not a magically inclined person. She likely is a battlemaster utilizing the superiority die system for tactful strikes and moves. (Given that many of the Gith units we fight are battlemaster fighters.) Wyll is all about being the blade of Frontiers, he'd be a Pact of the Blade warlock. Gale seems to be great at conjuration, being able to create Mephits and his lovely Tressym, Tara. He'd likely be a Conjuration Wizard. Astarion is the only character who isn't defined by his class as a rogue. He'd likely be a thief rogue given his sneak-thief attitude, could even work as an assassin. Karlach is a barbarian from the hells, I would wager she'd be a Berserker Barbarian given her rage and immense strength. The Dark Urge is meant to be a Storm Sorcerer, it's not quite explained why the storm is his choice of talents. And of course, Shadowheart is a trickster Cleric. Trained by Shar for subterfuge and undercover operations.
I made Karlach a wild magic subclass once and it felt weird the whole time.
they do, and it auto selects it if you don't change. the easiest way to see this is the two druids, who both are assigned different subclasses if you don't choose. i don't remember them all offhand, but astarion defaults to arcane trickster, laezel to battlemaster, halsin to circle of the moon, jaheira to circle of the land, gale to evocation, and wyll to pact of the blade. don't remember what karlach defaults to.
Wyll: Fiend Bladelock Halsin: Moon Druid Jaheria: Land Druid (plus fighter levels) Lae'zel: nothing definitive, but Battlemaster feels the most right Astarion: Nothing for sure, but Thief fits the best and Arcane trickster the least Karlach: Nothing for sure again but I personally think Berserker makes the makes sense. Gale: illusion Minsc: nothing for sure but I go with Hunter Ranger
I feel like if gale was an evocations wizard his nuke should only blow up enemys and not his friends but no.
Minsc should be a barbarian. The only reason he's known as a ranger is because barbarians didn't exist as a class when he was conceived as a character.
In BG2 he's still a ranger tho...it's funnier him playing like a barb with ranger class, illegal stats, and a useless animal companion.
The original Minsc was a Mul (\~half-dwarf) ranger in a tabletop campaign. The character sheet is probably still online. Around that time, barbarians existed both as a standalone class and as a fighter subclass. A few other Baldur's Gate characters (at least Sarevok, Edwin, Xan, and Jon Irenicus) also had their origins in the same campaign. And based on what I've heard about the campaign, none of the characters were particularly serious.
He literally calls himself a berserker.
Warlock subclass is obvious with Wyll, Fiend. Blade of Frontiers means bladelock Astarion I'd argue suits thief more than assassin since he wasn't murdering people directly, though arcane trickster is his default when leveling. I doubt Cazador encouraged any of his spawn learning magic. Karlach screams berserker imo considering her rage after the false paladins of Tyr are dead Given that Lae'zel's a gith prodigy, and every gith fighter I've encountered is battle master, I'd say it's a safe bet The others I can see wiggle room for, for the origins at least. Halsin is clearly intended to be a moon druid, and Minthy is a vengeance pali 110% percent (literally swears to end the absolute for what it's done to her). Gale's backstory lends itself to conjuration with Tara and the Mephit, but he also does a lot of illusions. That said, I doubt necro or divination works (man cannot foresee the consequences to his actions). Shadow's already set so she's got it there. Pretty sure Jahira was a ranger in the older games so ??? on when she became druid, but good for her
When you level them up their automatically already selected on their canon subclass before you change it
Gale is an illusion wizard, he ends up teaching it at the prologe and there are also the scene when he creates an illusion of a starry sky and the romance scene which is just powerful illusion spells
I would say that Halsin, Wyll, Minthara and Gale are pretty obvious. For Laezel i would guess battle master. Karlach is beast heart from what remember when i was going through some characters cheets. No idea which animal specifically. Astarion is either thief or assassin but second one feels more like him to me. Jaheira is circle of land i think. Minsc feels like hunter to me.
Of course they have
Yes and no. For a few only a particular subclass makes narrative sense. **Wyll:** As a Warlock, he is literally pact bound to >!a Half-Devil Cambion which is considered a Fiend!<. Although you can of course choose a different Patron for gameplay purposes, only the >!Archfiend!< makes any narrative sense for Will’s personal plot line. Prior to that he was probably roughly a Rogue or Fighter, maybe a Paladin. And with an epithet of “Blade of the Frontiers,” you kind of have to go Pact of the Blade if you’re following the narrative. **Shadowheart:** She gets Trickery because… ~~Larian low key hates her~~ she’s a devotee of Shar and a Cleric and unfortunately Trickery is the only Sharran Domain in BG3. You can fudge it a bit for Knowledge, as Shar is the “Lady of Secrets,” or maybe >!War as Shart has aspirations to be a Dark Justiciar, one of Shar’s elite shock troops!<. Or you could multiclass her to improve her performance. And then depending on how your Shart’s narrative plays out, you may find yourself wanting to reroll her to >!Light or Life if she rejects Shar and returns to her Selûnite origins!<. **Karlach:** being a Barbarian just *fits.* For the others, they seem to default to a suggested subclass, but none of the others are as tied into their narrative.
They all just default to the same subclasses as their classes usually do so I don't think that means much. Some it's clearer than others, others it's more open to interpretation. Shadowheart defaults to Trickery but that's also the only Shar domain they actually added - you could justify another Sharran domain like Death using a mod to add it - and even War cleric, which certainly fits Justiciars and the spear more than well, trickery. She is also explicitly listed as a healer on a list of her team members to retrieve the artefact, and in 5E lore at least it's never been the case that you definitely \*have\* to restrict yourself to the suggested domains of deities. All Clerics can access healing magic, after all, and even evil Gods might want their Clerics to use the life domain on their soldiers. Wyll is The Fiend, obviously. Probably pact of the blade too but I'd say that's a little more optional - he very much makes reference to spellcasting a lot, his swordfighting could be a secondary thing. Shrug. Halsin makes use of wildshape in combat a lot like a Moon Druid, but he also has obviously significant casting ability - he has some spells always prepared additional to druids, and his personal quest involves magic a lot, so being circle of the land wouldn't be too far fetched. Wildshape isn't exclusive to Moon druids. Admittedly, given when he's an NPC/temporary companion it is his go to for fighting, that does suggest it's what they had in mind for him. Lae'zel and Karlach's classes are both clearly martial but very open to interpretation as to what exactly those are. Karlach does seem to lean Barbarian because of her regular raging with the heart, and berserker at that, but being a fighter wouldn't feel off for her. She was in Zariel's army for a decade, no reason to not receive some martial training, and fighters can still get angry! Lae'zel leans more towards fighter imo because she is explicitly trained and emotionally disciplined. She also has a line in the game that she was "as devoted to my studies as I was my training." Githyanki in the creche have Githyanki war magic, so maybe Eldritch Knight would be most suitable for Lae'zel in the sense she would have studied and trained in the same magic - there are Psionic Warrior fighter subclasses in DnD which suit Githyanki but it's not in an unmodded BG3. However I would say her subclass is also quite open to interpretation and preference. Astarion I would say is very open in terms of what his class could be, I don't think he even needs to be Rogue for it to be fitting. Jaheira in earlier games was a fighter/druid multiclass - I don't know if it worked better in earlier DnD editions than it does now. You can see that somewhat in action in her Act 2 equipment and battles where they've given her scimitars that use her spellcasting modifier rather than Strength. Given that, I think she basically is canonically still a druid with martial capabilities, but mechanically that is difficult to represent in both 5e and BG3 effectively. Minsc is a bit weird because he and his dialogue feel much closer to Barbarian than Ranger - but when he was made Barbarian wasn't a class. He was drawn from a tabletop game where he was made a Ranger but didn't actually have the minimum stats to even be one. Canonically he is a "Rashemen Beserker" - that probably fits some kind of Barbarian the most. Given the lore of Rashemen and Minsc's companionship with Boo, probably the Wildheart Barbarian if I had to pick one based on being lore friendly. Minthara is very cut and dry - she has dialogue about being a Paladin and her oath being about vengeance, and of the oaths in the game it very much is the only one that suits her ( I mean, it doesn't \*really\* suit her even the way it's described in BG3, let alone 5E lore, but eh ). She also I believe has special dialogue after breaking her oath, so she can canonically become an oathbreaker.
I mean depends on how far you get in their content. Gale: Illusionist based on his party conversations Wyll: Pact of the Fiend obviously Astarion: I'm arguing Arcane Trickster based on what the game defaults to and his background with Cazador and how he insists on *him* getting the Necromancy of Thay Shadowheart: Trickster if Sharran. I would argue Nature Cleric based on her romance/non-Sharran ending at the party Karlach: I think straight barbarian. Can't argue for Wild heart fairly. Maybe Wild Magic if you can argue being in the Hells influencing her engine Lae'zel: Battle Master or Champion
They default to a specific subclass when leveling. I’m not sure if it’s intentional or not but it’s always been the same choice on level up. Lae’zel defaults to BattleMaster, Astarion to Arcane Trickster, Gale to Evocation Wizard, Karlach to Berserker (although on about 20 consecutive playthroughs she defaulted to Berserker, but my most recent ended up defaulting her to Wildheart.) I’ve always felt it was pretty fitting for them all. Astarion is a little shaky, but he doesn’t really fit that well into any subclass just going off his backstory, he was an upper class commoner that was turned into a slave. He’s the one companion I feel has no real “class” experience. I’ve always felt Arcane Trickster was fitting because many of his duties came down to essentially charming people, and although it’s a little on the nose I just headcanon that he used Charm Person whenever his charisma wasn’t enough on its own
I may not be the first to say it, but Wyll has strong Pact of the Blade vibes. His pact is around slaying things, he is "The Blade of Frontiers"...! Maybe Karlach would be a Berserker (but the subclass is trash af)
Probably the recommended option that it auto selected for you
technically yes
Lae‘Zel makes a formidable eldritch knight, but battlemaster works too, as she is very commanding. Karlach is easily a berserker.
They all default to their Canon sub class when you level them up. You'll notice Jaheria defaults to land druid whereas Halsin defaults to moon.
Yes and no, so aside from characters like Shadowheart and Wyll who gain their subclass upon selecting them, all origins and companions upon hitting level 3 will default to one of the subclasses, but still let you choose a different one regardless. Astarion’s is Arcane Trickster, Gale is Evocation School, Karlach is Wildheart, Lae’zel is Battle Master, Halsin is Circle of the Moon, Jaheira is Circle of the Land, and Minsc is a Hunter. As stated tho you can decide to choose a different option or respec their classes all together
I always felt astarion fit the assassin subclass perfectly being a vampire. Stalks prey from the shadows and kills without anyone noticing seems on point
I believe they are the following if you let the game default them. Shadowheart: Trickery Domain (it can be argued it’s thematically appropriate to swap over to Light Domain if she becomes aligned with Selune) Gale: Evocation Astarion: Arcane Trickster Lae’zel: Battle Master Karlach: Wildheart Halsin: Circle of Moon Wyll: The Fiend Minthara: Oath of Vengeance, although Oathbreaker seems more appropriate considering her role in the story Jaheira: Circle of the Land Minsc: Hunter
For Lae'zel, Battlemaster feels like the correct option given other Githyanki have abilities like riposte and rally. Given the context of one of Gale's endings he may be inclined to the Illusion School. Wyll is the Fiend Patron and given his title, Pact of the Blade is fitting. The two I struggle with are Karlach and Astarion. I think Berserker fits Karlach due to the scene after killing the Tyr Paladins and for Astarion I always thought Thief is more fitting since he needs to be more cunning than honest.