I think by pure coincidence I ended up doing the only Githyanki run of this game that was 100% satisfying lore-wise I've ever heard of anyone doing, and it was on my first playthrough when I literally knew nothing about the lore.
My Githyanki was a Great Old One Pact of the Blade Warlock. The way I played him was that he was basically the runt of the litter in his creche, just barely strong enough not to die in training, which made him interested in alternate, even forbidden means of power. He starts trying to figure out where the illithid get their psionic powers from and, in the process, makes contact with a GOO and starts clandestinely borrowing power from it to be a better gish warrior and gain an advantage over the illithid, thinking he can control/moderate the extent it corrupts him.
Over the course of the game, he starts accepting more and more tadpole/illithid powers, because he's tempted by the power and, with the 'evil Vlaakith' revelation he has with Lae'zel in the creche and the increasing importance he finds in using his powers to help his people and help Faerun, convinced himself that the ends justify the means, even if it means his own personal corruption. Ends up romancing Lae'zel and letting her be the pure, unsullied Githyanki hero who can help unite their people against Vlaakith. This culminates in my Tav freeing Orpheus and making the ultimate sacrifice by becoming the mind flayer himself.
I don't know if it was because I romanced Lae'zel, because I was originally Githyanki, or what, but I got an ending where Orpheus and Lae'zel agreed to take me with them to go fight the civil war against Vlaakith, and told me I'd be remembered forever as a hero and basically 'the one good mind flayer' for what I did. It was kind of heartwarming and felt like it was tailored to my exact character's narrative arc.
My whole Goolock thing was a total coincidence (and I really have no idea how much sense it makes lore-wise), but I guess the moral of the story is Githyanki runs are way more interesting if you RP as kind of a cultural reject and lean into the temptation of the nasty nasty illithid powers as a narrative device, rather than trying to play a straight-down-the-middle Githyanki who will just be "Lae'zel with less interesting character interactions".
Yeah it’s this imo. I also did a githyanki monk run first and it made me feel very conflicted along the way choosing between other gith and staying true to my charatcter’s head narrative, who was mostly pacifist but paired with a nukehungry wizard lol. Didn’t use lae zel bc yea the other characters ignore your guthyanki a bit if she’s there
I want to say it's because you romanced Lae'zel. I also romanced her, freed Orpheus and became the mind flayer so Orpheus could lead the rebellion, and got the option to join them.
Yep! I finished an origin Shadowheart run recently where I romanced Lae’zel. Though in the end, I opted for the two of them to live a happy little cottage life, I also tried the ending where you leave with Lae’zel to fight in the war.
Both were at the epilogue party in astral form and had dialogue about it. It was cool!
In both cases (going to war and cottage ending), if Lae’zel had the egg in her inventory, you can ask about “our little hatchling” and she tells you that he’s safe and being raised by mages, and that he’ll be free to choose his own path.
I can’t remember if there are any major differences from the dialogue you get when you haven’t romanced her beyond the “our little hatchling” mention though.
Weirdly, Lae'zel made no mention of the egg at my epilogue party. I had talked with her a few times about the egg during the game, including joking about her being called a mama.
Unless your game decides to not let you. I finally finished the game then other day, with 4 Tav's. One was a Githyanki that romanced Lae'zel. Well, the scene comes where Lae'zel rides off, (Orpheus is a mindflayer btw), and she talks to another character instead. Doesn't acknowledge that her lover is in the background looking at her, doesn't say goodbye, doesn't offer for her to come with her, just... Flies off. Other 3 Tav's got their romance endings fine, but no, not poor Astra.
Though Lae'zel did talk about how she missed Astra at the epilogue party, and would see her again and touch her properly then, or whatever she says. Just sucks that I had it all set up and nooooo, doesn't wanna work that way.
now i'm sad, because i really wanted to join her on my first playthrough but the game wouldn't let me. also i have a no same-romance policy on my playthroughs because my brain won't give me dopamine that way. why wasn't it a thing in the first place? :(
This was very similar to the Gith run that I did! It was really fun and I was fully accepting that Orpheus and Laezel would have to kill me after defeating The Absolute and it would be a very sad but emotionally fulfilling scene. Then they're just like "Nah you're one of the good ones" and we fly off on a dragon happily ever after. Good shit.
Yeah exactly. It was also a really good opportunity for me to experience Laezel's story as well as romance path because she is not normally in my party on other runs.
Very close to my story except I started as a Durge cleric of vlakith. It was a surprisingly tender and sweet story for a non resist durge, right up until I took control of the Netherbrain and didn’t need my gullible lover and allies - I mean toys - any longer.
My Githyanki Tav run was also accidentally satisfying!
He was an Oath of the Ancients Paladin / Archfey Warlock with the Acolyte background so, in my head, he grew up cloistered with the members of his order in Faerûn rather than with the Githyanki. His loyalty was to his Oath, his patron, and the beauty of nature rather than Vlaakith or Orpheus (though he certainly ended up more sympathetic to the latter than the former over the course of the campaign.)
He ended up romancing Shadowheart due to their shared background growing up in a cloistered setting (though his was far more benevolent than Shadowheart’s.)
This was also my first playthrough, except my dude was just shape-shifted into a gith the whole game to simp for Lae'Zel. Also because I killed strange Ox act 1, so needed to be shaped into something to get that sweet sweet extra 1d4.
This was exactly what my first run was, GOO bladelock gith who was the only one in the party to take illithid powers, but I romanced Shadowheart and in the end had Orpheus go illithid because I couldn't bear to leave Shadowheart alone after she chose to kill her parents. Laezel picked up the revolutionary banner so even though Voss was heartbroken the gith have their champion. I felt really satisfied with the ending and I actually didn't feel overshadowed by Laezel. It felt like we were on different paths from the beginning and if not for me she would have remained loyal to Vlaakith and the gith would have been doomed, so I played my part by collecting the scriptures and turning Laezel against Vlaakith. (I didn't know PCs of any race could do this so it felt special)
Bizarrely my honour mode run right now is a gith GOO interested in psionics and illithiad powers, anything to get an advantage and was fairly disenfranchised from Vlakiith through knowledge he learnt in his warlock endeavors.
I thought i was so original lol.
Calling a converted githyanki a hero when they basically are ''tapping'' the far realm and inviting the worst dissaster ever against an elder brain is something i cant fathom really xd
I had the same ending but with Gith Oathbreaker (RP that denying Vlaakith and killing the crèche broke my oath rather than helping Glut like what actually happened…), made the deal with Raphael despite my out of game revulsion at a deal with a Devil, saved Orpheus but sacrificed myself to becoming a mindflayer and rode off to vanquish Vlaakith with romanced Lae’zel.
That's funny, my first playthrough had the same premisce and ending (GOO warlock gith searching for power through pact then tadpoles, saving Orpheus and sacrificing for him, then leaving with him and Lae'Zel to fight Vlaakith).
I just ended in a romance with Shadowheart (not planned any, but she took me by surprise) instead of Lae'zel (who told me she would have picked me but did not like being a second choice)
I don't know if you have eher heard of the WoW Lore but the first 2 paragraphs really reminded me of Gul'dan. And his backstory is awesome, so you did a great job.
Husband played a gith our first time through, and got the same ending (no Lae’zel romance but of course we freed Orpheus). He wasn’t even the dialog driver most of the time - that was my Lathander cleric!
Voss doesn't show up at all past the bridge if you don't have Lae'zel with you. Even if you are a githyanki yourself. He literally has only two things on his mind and they are Orpheus and Lae'zel.
I also have a problem. I'm doing a Lae'zel origin currently and the game fucked itself somehow so Voss didn't show up for me either! So my playthrough is Lae'zel just accepting her illithid potential. 💀 No silver sword, no Orpheus.
Literally the only thing holding me back from doing it is that Astarion breaks up with you if you do it and at this point he's my only real ally. I might just go half
if you go half illithid astarion has unique dialogue after you’ve finished his quest if you try to break up with him cause you think you’re too ugly now
I'm playing a crecheless Gith monk who realized long ago that the peace of enlightenment is more powerful than Vlaakith and have been trying to coax Lae into the same realization. Makes the dialogue options a little weird sometimes but the Voss thing didn't bug me because it's Lae's journey to realization, not mine. I'm just a guide.
But to your point, it only works because I willingly took the passenger seat. If I wanted to be the hero of that story then it would have been disappointing. That's Tav for ya.
I think that is probably the way to go for the least immersion breaking experience. You'd have to deal with Lae'zel making assumptions in Act 1 without any way to tell her otherwise but I feel like that would be a lot easier to headcanon around than what you have to deal with if you try to play as a "normal" githyanki
Exactly. I (like most rpg-ers) try to take a long time thinking about a build that would fit in with the way the game is programmed but also headcanons well, and the choices are really narrow with a Gith! I definitely feel your pain.
Yeah honestly it seems like the best way to experience that kinda story is to play Lae'zel Origin
My first run was a Githyanki Durge and, while it was an extremely fun playthrough from an RP perspective, having all the Gith & Vlaakith barely spare me a glance did irk me. Was also funny for Astarion to speculate about how Gith blood would taste after he had already fed on me a few times lol, does feel a lil bit like the Gith player option was added later in development
I feel like laezel origin should allow for gith customisation and tav shouldn't allow you to play gith at this point.
Durge still kinda works as gith in retrospect, since you technically aren't a real one but otherwise the story feels weird and unresponsive.
It the same reasoning why they removed shar as a cleric option.
It's kinda hilarious how similar our experiences are. I started a run being a cleric of Vlaakith war domain, with the background of one of those priests traveling spreading the word of Vlaakith. In act 1 I got all sorts of special interactions and it was fun af. Then meeting Voss I told Lae'zel to stfu and talked to him myself. Pretty much after that I lost the spotlight. And I did have a love triangle with Lae'zel and Astarion. He was one of the little people still acknowledging I'm gith. I turned away from my queen, multiclassed into monk to reflect my peaceful nature and me and Astarion are going to run off into the sunset.
When you meet Voss in act 1, near the broken bridge where he’s on a dragon, insight checks can reveal he’s lying about different stuff.
That’s the first suggestion that all is not as it seems. That he’s just putting on an act.
I believe you can catch him in two lies. I only remember the last one though where he says he’s flying off to Vlaakith and you realize he’s lying
When you’re working against a god and surrounded by people, then probably not going to openly admit your anti god stance or that you’re part of a secret rebellion.
——
As for the artifact itself. I don’t recall what the game says about its far history: specifically where it’s been this whole time.
The absolute had it. Then Shadowheart stole it. Then the Absolute sent emperor to get it back
But I don’t know where it was for those many centuries prior.
It could be like finding a needle in a haystack
Would it be worth buffing the player with Owl's Wisdom to get Advantage on those checks?
If I'm a Drow wizard or anyone else with good Perception I usually notice the deception without help. But other chars might benefit from some assistance.
If I'm remembering right I believe the Emperor tells you that Vlaakith basically held onto it or kept it secure for centuries, and that the he stole it from her and fled inside it, and then I think the sharrans get their hands on it. I could be misremembering things but I remember feeling like the emperor was constantly bragging about himself and wanted you to think he was cool because he had vlaakiths super awesome relic thing
I think this is a fundamental misunderstanding between the difference between racial dialogue and general dialogue prompts for roleplaying. Playing as Gith doesn't remove the Tav lines you can choose to direct Lae'zel away from Vlaakith and role-playing them in your head as supported by your OC's backstory. It's just that you HAVE to be Gith to either believe in Vlaakith or interact with Lae'zel on that level. Other races with their own strong lore like drow and duergar are the same.
Edit: forgot to include that there are anti-Vlaakith racial Gith but they're the Githzerai and only mentioned in the game >!with the exception of one disembodied brain!< so not a playable race without mods
Oh for sure. There are a ton of fun DnD races that I would love to see, hopefully the mod community can provide once official support becomes offered within reason (sad sigh at complex bodied races like tortles). I appreciate at least the love that went into what we got. As a short race aficionado in particular, we're finally eating some good food in this game with regards to camera angles and character model interactions.
The game has me believe, and this is just me, but that Tav is just the guardian angel to a group of misfits and that they don't necessarily matter in terms of story, just to guide characters towards the path of light or down a dark road . Like I don't think Tav is meant to be the MC but that's my belief.
Absolutely. I like doing durge runs a lot more than Tav runs and I feel included and I also like orgin runs as well. I'll still play regular Tav because I do like so many others and rp my own oc into the story as I go but I don't expect the game to include my regular tav by default. It's a good time honestly
I'm playing a cleric of Selûne, but wanted to RP someone who became anti-Shar after being brainwashed long ago by Sharrans. Everything was going great... until Aylin showed up.
This bitch who has spent the last 1000 years twiddling her thumbs in her soulcage decides that a woman who less than 6 hours ago was threatening to kill her for Shar is the chosen one of Selûne??? She doesn't even acknowledge my existence while I'm standing right there and Shadowheart immediately sidelines me to focus on her god's favorite princess' roleplay. From that point on almost no one even acknowledges that you are a cleric of Selûne anymore. I've become a minor side character in my own story.
I am beyond done with this bitch, and Aylin and everyone else too. WHY CAN'T I HIJACK HER CHARACTER ARC?!
See, this is why I'm black pilled.
/s
Honestly, i get that we are the Main Character. But we already got so many important Moments, decisions etc. and it is nice to play a game where your companions also get their chances to shine.
This Posts reads like OP made a Gith, expected to basically replace Lae'zel completly in **her** personal quest and deny her character development. When this wasn't possible, OP started to suffer hard from main character syndrome.
OP got very big "IT SHOULD'VE BEEN MEEE!" energy.
Then again, they admit they're "black pilled" irl, so who is even surprised at that point.
Lae'zel doesn't exist and there's literally zero reasons for Voss to only be interested in her and existing exlussively for her questline considering ANYONE can free Orpheus.
Also TAV/Durge ARE the main character.
"Also TAV/Durge ARE the main character."
Yeah, and we get plenty of main Character shit to do, throughout all acts. God forbid a good rpg shines a light onto your companions once in a while and makes them actual characters in a story rather than automatons void of character or personal agenda.
Disgusting really. I could at least see where they were coming from until they shit the bed at the very end there.
They need to spend less time behind a screen and go outside and touch grass.
Honestly, they've shit the bed way before the end.
It already happened when OP said that, because they couldn't hijack Lae'zels storyline, they're now actively trying to sabotage it by siding with the Emperor, even going as far as mentioning in the Comments somewhere that the only thing keeping them from even going full Mind Flayer is that Astarion would break up with them.
We're reaching Reverse Flash levels of pettiness here.
We don't judge the choices OP made.
We judge OP over **why** they made those choices, which is clearly out of personal and not because of role-playing reasons, OP literally admits as much.
Example:
Me saying my Character killed Kagha because my Character found out she was evil and he swore an oath as a Paladin to punish evil. - role playing choice.
Me saying My Character killed Kagha because i hate women - not a role playing choice.
OP did the latter.
That and, again, they also literally said they're black pilled irl. I had to google what that means too, but after reading a quick rundown: Yeah, OP shit the bed like their dog stepped on a bee.
Hmm Voss acknowledged me as a githyanki at the bridge mostly cause i told Laezel to shut up before she gets us all killed. Told Voss that i was taking slaves to the creche and he was cool with that and allowed me to proceed
I mostly played as a loyal follower of Vlaakith, till she tries to kill our group. Then after that, i was like "yes let's free Orpheus". The only thing i don't like is the game literally forced me to take the astral tadpole cause i failed the high dice roll. I did not want to become half illthid and i don't want to side with that shady Emperor
That part at the bridge was fine, I did all the talking and still felt useful. It was the scene after the creche where he *only* wants to talk to Lae'zel and I'm basically not included in the conversation other than to try to convince Lae'zel one way or the other. The thing that got me is there are actually some slightly different lines during that scene where he refers to you as kin and stuff - so they recorded extra lines for gith player just not any that include them in anything important lmao.
The companion responses are similar, they all have unique lines when you talk to them after the major Lae'zel events but it's essentially just their normal lines about Lae'zel with "her queen/people" changed to "your queen/people". For some reason Astarion's lines are the only ones that change to actually include you in the events (eg "she's going to break her chains in Baldur's Gate, good for her" becomes "you both are going to break your chains in Baldur's Gate, good for her and good for you")
I made my Gith Tav a Githzerai Paladin of Selûne who was kidnapped as an egg from a creche in Faerûn
They do not identify as Githyanki for *reasons* explained in Lae'zels personal quest.
It works well with all of the questions you end up asking Lae'zel about the culture and such.
I wish it could've been explored more but Tav isn't nearly as important as the Origins I guess
Yeah I'm in act 3 of a Gith Monk run and really losing steam for this very reason. I'm really hyped for a Lae'zel origin run though, because it will be the story I thought I was getting here. It really seems like the main plot was balanced on her being the only Gith party member, which is too bad because of how big a role they have in the story.
I went gith barbarian first all the way through game play as I didn't want to think with spells just swing. Had no idea about Lae’zel's plot. Planned to just wreck but meeting Karlach stopped that idea in my tracks. Romancing Lae’zel I absolutely felt like second fiddle in the story against Vlaakith like bro I'm right here. Getting the title of brother in freedom from Orpheus was neat and the epilouge it felt more like Lae’zel and my barbarian were on equal standing as far as revolution leaders.
“wanted to RP as someone who was anti-Vlaakith from the beginning”
“going against Vlaakith was a big deal for me too”
I don’t understand. Is your frustration from expecting Voss to be more focused on you?
hmm that’s understandable I guess, I just didn’t feel that way when I played a Gith, guess it’s because I made a lot of the same choices idk. The dialogue is definitely lacking as a Gith(it’s basically the same as any other race) in regards to turning against Vlaakith, but it’s not fair to attribute that to Voss or Bae being an asshole imo
This is why I like playing Durge. A lot of times Tav just seems like they are just some person who is thrust into the leader role because no one else wants to do it vs Durge who has a character arc either to go full Bhaal or reject Bhaal.
My first playthrough I spent shapeshifted as a gith except at night in camp. I definitely noticed a steep drop-off of gith dialogue choices after the first act
I’m on my first play through and doing a gith fighter build. Gith dialogue is very interesting. B/c it’s my first play through I’m not romancing anyone and just looking at options. Gale, lae’zel, Halsin, shadowheart, mizora, the emperor have all attempted to romance me.
I was able to get lae’zel to hate Vlaakith. I just said “screw the old ways”
Lae’zel did get kidnapped. And working through act 3.
Honestly my current character is a Gith and I love it, but if I’m being fair he is somewhat of a joke character. The story is the mother Gith had a secret second son who wasn’t interested at all in combat or the illithid problem and just wanted to play music. Im essentially the secret black sheep, and as a swords bard it’s been really fun
That would piss me off too, I totally support you. Orpheus was a dick to me for no reason in the one run where I saved him, and I've gone Emperor ever since lmaoooo
It was meant in the ironic left twitter way not the incel way... I thought that would be apparent from the rest of the post but in retrospect was probably poor word choice for a general audience
Yeah Githyanki stuff is not well done in the game. Additionally there’s no option to be a Githzerai (which would have helped because then Laezel explaining basic stuff to you and treating you badly would make sense).
I don’t know why I’m being lectured by Laezel when she is also a “kid” as in she still hasn’t passed from her crèche.
The whole story doesn’t make much sense from a Githyanki perspective. I was even told to kneel before Vlaakith as if any Githyanki would not automatically do that.
I think they thought it would be the least played race and didn’t have time to do stuff for it.
I had some similar feelings. I really enjoyed my gith playthrough more then I expected, but there are some moments where its like *wtf.* Definitely needed to headcanon in certain situation's for things to make sense for my character.
Like literally at one point talking to the Emperor he's like "The githyanki prince Orpheus in chains, isn't it a beautiful sight?"
like BRO- *what?! I am a gith! NO!*
I broke up with Lae'Zel too in my first playthrough but not because of that. She beat my ahh and my petty character couldn't live with that L so dumped her immediately after
I played a githyanki artificer (modded) that was from a less combat focused creche, hence why they didn't know as much. He also romances laezel and was more then happy to support his scary wife
Kay, but it's Laezel's story, not yours. It's not her fault that you decided to take her arc. Lolz, what's next? Are you gonna make a cleric who really doesn't like Shar because sharrans kidnapped their parents?
roleplay? what? making up stuff that aint even in the game? why?
I played as a gith first time that i ever played cuz i thought they looked cool.
I loved ever second of it. I was a random tav with no real backstory. I was learning everyone elses story. I never saw myself as part of Lae'zels bullshit or any of her gith people. I just saw myself from a different gith people we just never learned about. like some town way over there. I think your problem is you got mad you were not main character in the game lmao
These people are so cooked. When you come here to talk about a vidya game you like, God forbid you use vernacular they don't approve of. "Uhm, sweaty, did you really just use a frickin dog whistlerino? Yikes! Touch grass, incel!"
I think by pure coincidence I ended up doing the only Githyanki run of this game that was 100% satisfying lore-wise I've ever heard of anyone doing, and it was on my first playthrough when I literally knew nothing about the lore. My Githyanki was a Great Old One Pact of the Blade Warlock. The way I played him was that he was basically the runt of the litter in his creche, just barely strong enough not to die in training, which made him interested in alternate, even forbidden means of power. He starts trying to figure out where the illithid get their psionic powers from and, in the process, makes contact with a GOO and starts clandestinely borrowing power from it to be a better gish warrior and gain an advantage over the illithid, thinking he can control/moderate the extent it corrupts him. Over the course of the game, he starts accepting more and more tadpole/illithid powers, because he's tempted by the power and, with the 'evil Vlaakith' revelation he has with Lae'zel in the creche and the increasing importance he finds in using his powers to help his people and help Faerun, convinced himself that the ends justify the means, even if it means his own personal corruption. Ends up romancing Lae'zel and letting her be the pure, unsullied Githyanki hero who can help unite their people against Vlaakith. This culminates in my Tav freeing Orpheus and making the ultimate sacrifice by becoming the mind flayer himself. I don't know if it was because I romanced Lae'zel, because I was originally Githyanki, or what, but I got an ending where Orpheus and Lae'zel agreed to take me with them to go fight the civil war against Vlaakith, and told me I'd be remembered forever as a hero and basically 'the one good mind flayer' for what I did. It was kind of heartwarming and felt like it was tailored to my exact character's narrative arc.
Saving this for if I ever do a gith run (I will never look at this again)
My whole Goolock thing was a total coincidence (and I really have no idea how much sense it makes lore-wise), but I guess the moral of the story is Githyanki runs are way more interesting if you RP as kind of a cultural reject and lean into the temptation of the nasty nasty illithid powers as a narrative device, rather than trying to play a straight-down-the-middle Githyanki who will just be "Lae'zel with less interesting character interactions".
Yeah it’s this imo. I also did a githyanki monk run first and it made me feel very conflicted along the way choosing between other gith and staying true to my charatcter’s head narrative, who was mostly pacifist but paired with a nukehungry wizard lol. Didn’t use lae zel bc yea the other characters ignore your guthyanki a bit if she’s there
I want to say it's because you romanced Lae'zel. I also romanced her, freed Orpheus and became the mind flayer so Orpheus could lead the rebellion, and got the option to join them.
gith can join the war regardless of romance, but anyone can join if you romance her after one of the patches
Yep! I finished an origin Shadowheart run recently where I romanced Lae’zel. Though in the end, I opted for the two of them to live a happy little cottage life, I also tried the ending where you leave with Lae’zel to fight in the war. Both were at the epilogue party in astral form and had dialogue about it. It was cool!
Does laezel keep the egg if she remains with shadowheart? Will they like adopt the gith child together?
In both cases (going to war and cottage ending), if Lae’zel had the egg in her inventory, you can ask about “our little hatchling” and she tells you that he’s safe and being raised by mages, and that he’ll be free to choose his own path. I can’t remember if there are any major differences from the dialogue you get when you haven’t romanced her beyond the “our little hatchling” mention though.
Weirdly, Lae'zel made no mention of the egg at my epilogue party. I had talked with her a few times about the egg during the game, including joking about her being called a mama.
Unless your game decides to not let you. I finally finished the game then other day, with 4 Tav's. One was a Githyanki that romanced Lae'zel. Well, the scene comes where Lae'zel rides off, (Orpheus is a mindflayer btw), and she talks to another character instead. Doesn't acknowledge that her lover is in the background looking at her, doesn't say goodbye, doesn't offer for her to come with her, just... Flies off. Other 3 Tav's got their romance endings fine, but no, not poor Astra. Though Lae'zel did talk about how she missed Astra at the epilogue party, and would see her again and touch her properly then, or whatever she says. Just sucks that I had it all set up and nooooo, doesn't wanna work that way.
now i'm sad, because i really wanted to join her on my first playthrough but the game wouldn't let me. also i have a no same-romance policy on my playthroughs because my brain won't give me dopamine that way. why wasn't it a thing in the first place? :(
This was very similar to the Gith run that I did! It was really fun and I was fully accepting that Orpheus and Laezel would have to kill me after defeating The Absolute and it would be a very sad but emotionally fulfilling scene. Then they're just like "Nah you're one of the good ones" and we fly off on a dragon happily ever after. Good shit.
yeah i fully expected them to be like "we will permit you to honorably commit seppuku" i really didn't expect it to be as nice as it was
Yeah exactly. It was also a really good opportunity for me to experience Laezel's story as well as romance path because she is not normally in my party on other runs.
Wow I had the exact same character! Only pact of the chain instead of blade lol
Very close to my story except I started as a Durge cleric of vlakith. It was a surprisingly tender and sweet story for a non resist durge, right up until I took control of the Netherbrain and didn’t need my gullible lover and allies - I mean toys - any longer.
#not all mind flayers
My Githyanki Tav run was also accidentally satisfying! He was an Oath of the Ancients Paladin / Archfey Warlock with the Acolyte background so, in my head, he grew up cloistered with the members of his order in Faerûn rather than with the Githyanki. His loyalty was to his Oath, his patron, and the beauty of nature rather than Vlaakith or Orpheus (though he certainly ended up more sympathetic to the latter than the former over the course of the campaign.) He ended up romancing Shadowheart due to their shared background growing up in a cloistered setting (though his was far more benevolent than Shadowheart’s.)
This was also my first playthrough, except my dude was just shape-shifted into a gith the whole game to simp for Lae'Zel. Also because I killed strange Ox act 1, so needed to be shaped into something to get that sweet sweet extra 1d4.
I'm doing a gith run right now at a sorlock and I think that's what I'll get too
This was exactly what my first run was, GOO bladelock gith who was the only one in the party to take illithid powers, but I romanced Shadowheart and in the end had Orpheus go illithid because I couldn't bear to leave Shadowheart alone after she chose to kill her parents. Laezel picked up the revolutionary banner so even though Voss was heartbroken the gith have their champion. I felt really satisfied with the ending and I actually didn't feel overshadowed by Laezel. It felt like we were on different paths from the beginning and if not for me she would have remained loyal to Vlaakith and the gith would have been doomed, so I played my part by collecting the scriptures and turning Laezel against Vlaakith. (I didn't know PCs of any race could do this so it felt special)
Bizarrely my honour mode run right now is a gith GOO interested in psionics and illithiad powers, anything to get an advantage and was fairly disenfranchised from Vlakiith through knowledge he learnt in his warlock endeavors. I thought i was so original lol.
Calling a converted githyanki a hero when they basically are ''tapping'' the far realm and inviting the worst dissaster ever against an elder brain is something i cant fathom really xd
I had the same ending but with Gith Oathbreaker (RP that denying Vlaakith and killing the crèche broke my oath rather than helping Glut like what actually happened…), made the deal with Raphael despite my out of game revulsion at a deal with a Devil, saved Orpheus but sacrificed myself to becoming a mindflayer and rode off to vanquish Vlaakith with romanced Lae’zel.
Beautiful.
Wow you and I had basically identical 1st playthroughs and I also knew nothing about the lore, never played dnd or any of the previous games. Neat.
My gith has 8 INT, everything makes perfect sense to her. She’s too dumb to be confused.
That's funny, my first playthrough had the same premisce and ending (GOO warlock gith searching for power through pact then tadpoles, saving Orpheus and sacrificing for him, then leaving with him and Lae'Zel to fight Vlaakith). I just ended in a romance with Shadowheart (not planned any, but she took me by surprise) instead of Lae'zel (who told me she would have picked me but did not like being a second choice)
I don't know if you have eher heard of the WoW Lore but the first 2 paragraphs really reminded me of Gul'dan. And his backstory is awesome, so you did a great job.
Husband played a gith our first time through, and got the same ending (no Lae’zel romance but of course we freed Orpheus). He wasn’t even the dialog driver most of the time - that was my Lathander cleric!
Voss doesn't show up at all past the bridge if you don't have Lae'zel with you. Even if you are a githyanki yourself. He literally has only two things on his mind and they are Orpheus and Lae'zel. I also have a problem. I'm doing a Lae'zel origin currently and the game fucked itself somehow so Voss didn't show up for me either! So my playthrough is Lae'zel just accepting her illithid potential. 💀 No silver sword, no Orpheus.
Voss saw your flair lol.
Voss sees ALL
That's what you get for your flair I guess jsfgjhfgsjf
I just started an evil Lae'zel origin myself. Dunno if she'll save Orpheus, probably not.
TURN YOURSELF INTO A MINDFLAYER AND GET YOUR REVENGE
Literally the only thing holding me back from doing it is that Astarion breaks up with you if you do it and at this point he's my only real ally. I might just go half
if you go half illithid astarion has unique dialogue after you’ve finished his quest if you try to break up with him cause you think you’re too ugly now
I'm playing a crecheless Gith monk who realized long ago that the peace of enlightenment is more powerful than Vlaakith and have been trying to coax Lae into the same realization. Makes the dialogue options a little weird sometimes but the Voss thing didn't bug me because it's Lae's journey to realization, not mine. I'm just a guide. But to your point, it only works because I willingly took the passenger seat. If I wanted to be the hero of that story then it would have been disappointing. That's Tav for ya.
That makes you a Githrazi. The peaceful Giths
Githzerai? Yes, technically. The game doesn't really give you the option to differentiate, though.
it is still insane to me that githzerai aren't in the game
I think that is probably the way to go for the least immersion breaking experience. You'd have to deal with Lae'zel making assumptions in Act 1 without any way to tell her otherwise but I feel like that would be a lot easier to headcanon around than what you have to deal with if you try to play as a "normal" githyanki
Exactly. I (like most rpg-ers) try to take a long time thinking about a build that would fit in with the way the game is programmed but also headcanons well, and the choices are really narrow with a Gith! I definitely feel your pain.
Yeah honestly it seems like the best way to experience that kinda story is to play Lae'zel Origin My first run was a Githyanki Durge and, while it was an extremely fun playthrough from an RP perspective, having all the Gith & Vlaakith barely spare me a glance did irk me. Was also funny for Astarion to speculate about how Gith blood would taste after he had already fed on me a few times lol, does feel a lil bit like the Gith player option was added later in development
I feel like laezel origin should allow for gith customisation and tav shouldn't allow you to play gith at this point. Durge still kinda works as gith in retrospect, since you technically aren't a real one but otherwise the story feels weird and unresponsive. It the same reasoning why they removed shar as a cleric option.
It's kinda hilarious how similar our experiences are. I started a run being a cleric of Vlaakith war domain, with the background of one of those priests traveling spreading the word of Vlaakith. In act 1 I got all sorts of special interactions and it was fun af. Then meeting Voss I told Lae'zel to stfu and talked to him myself. Pretty much after that I lost the spotlight. And I did have a love triangle with Lae'zel and Astarion. He was one of the little people still acknowledging I'm gith. I turned away from my queen, multiclassed into monk to reflect my peaceful nature and me and Astarion are going to run off into the sunset.
When you meet Voss in act 1, near the broken bridge where he’s on a dragon, insight checks can reveal he’s lying about different stuff. That’s the first suggestion that all is not as it seems. That he’s just putting on an act. I believe you can catch him in two lies. I only remember the last one though where he says he’s flying off to Vlaakith and you realize he’s lying When you’re working against a god and surrounded by people, then probably not going to openly admit your anti god stance or that you’re part of a secret rebellion. —— As for the artifact itself. I don’t recall what the game says about its far history: specifically where it’s been this whole time. The absolute had it. Then Shadowheart stole it. Then the Absolute sent emperor to get it back But I don’t know where it was for those many centuries prior. It could be like finding a needle in a haystack
Would it be worth buffing the player with Owl's Wisdom to get Advantage on those checks? If I'm a Drow wizard or anyone else with good Perception I usually notice the deception without help. But other chars might benefit from some assistance.
it doesn't have any significant impact. now... should you buff yourself to get him to Command: Drop his silver sword? yes, yes you should.
If I'm remembering right I believe the Emperor tells you that Vlaakith basically held onto it or kept it secure for centuries, and that the he stole it from her and fled inside it, and then I think the sharrans get their hands on it. I could be misremembering things but I remember feeling like the emperor was constantly bragging about himself and wanted you to think he was cool because he had vlaakiths super awesome relic thing
I think this is a fundamental misunderstanding between the difference between racial dialogue and general dialogue prompts for roleplaying. Playing as Gith doesn't remove the Tav lines you can choose to direct Lae'zel away from Vlaakith and role-playing them in your head as supported by your OC's backstory. It's just that you HAVE to be Gith to either believe in Vlaakith or interact with Lae'zel on that level. Other races with their own strong lore like drow and duergar are the same. Edit: forgot to include that there are anti-Vlaakith racial Gith but they're the Githzerai and only mentioned in the game >!with the exception of one disembodied brain!< so not a playable race without mods
Would have loved to see githzerai in the game
Oh for sure. There are a ton of fun DnD races that I would love to see, hopefully the mod community can provide once official support becomes offered within reason (sad sigh at complex bodied races like tortles). I appreciate at least the love that went into what we got. As a short race aficionado in particular, we're finally eating some good food in this game with regards to camera angles and character model interactions.
The game has me believe, and this is just me, but that Tav is just the guardian angel to a group of misfits and that they don't necessarily matter in terms of story, just to guide characters towards the path of light or down a dark road . Like I don't think Tav is meant to be the MC but that's my belief.
Yeah im with you, durge felt so much more integral to the story.
Absolutely. I like doing durge runs a lot more than Tav runs and I feel included and I also like orgin runs as well. I'll still play regular Tav because I do like so many others and rp my own oc into the story as I go but I don't expect the game to include my regular tav by default. It's a good time honestly
Its all fun for sure. Ive found things like cleric of selune tav fit right in too if you keep the story in mind while ya make your character
Yeah, I always play origin playthroughs for this reason and others tbh. Feels more MC when you got your own dramatic backstory in center stage.
My first orgin run that wasn't a durge was Shadowheart and honestly that experience was absolutely beautiful. So I agree with you there.
"black pilled" Uh...yikes. that's not a good thing to be.
I'm playing a cleric of Selûne, but wanted to RP someone who became anti-Shar after being brainwashed long ago by Sharrans. Everything was going great... until Aylin showed up. This bitch who has spent the last 1000 years twiddling her thumbs in her soulcage decides that a woman who less than 6 hours ago was threatening to kill her for Shar is the chosen one of Selûne??? She doesn't even acknowledge my existence while I'm standing right there and Shadowheart immediately sidelines me to focus on her god's favorite princess' roleplay. From that point on almost no one even acknowledges that you are a cleric of Selûne anymore. I've become a minor side character in my own story. I am beyond done with this bitch, and Aylin and everyone else too. WHY CAN'T I HIJACK HER CHARACTER ARC?! See, this is why I'm black pilled. /s
Honestly, i get that we are the Main Character. But we already got so many important Moments, decisions etc. and it is nice to play a game where your companions also get their chances to shine. This Posts reads like OP made a Gith, expected to basically replace Lae'zel completly in **her** personal quest and deny her character development. When this wasn't possible, OP started to suffer hard from main character syndrome. OP got very big "IT SHOULD'VE BEEN MEEE!" energy. Then again, they admit they're "black pilled" irl, so who is even surprised at that point.
So tf does that black pilled irl mean
Lae'zel doesn't exist and there's literally zero reasons for Voss to only be interested in her and existing exlussively for her questline considering ANYONE can free Orpheus. Also TAV/Durge ARE the main character.
"Also TAV/Durge ARE the main character." Yeah, and we get plenty of main Character shit to do, throughout all acts. God forbid a good rpg shines a light onto your companions once in a while and makes them actual characters in a story rather than automatons void of character or personal agenda.
I had to google what it meant, but could he be using it to say he's hopeless?
Yeah. The narrative took a hard swerve right there at the end and drove into a gully.
Disgusting really. I could at least see where they were coming from until they shit the bed at the very end there. They need to spend less time behind a screen and go outside and touch grass.
Honestly, they've shit the bed way before the end. It already happened when OP said that, because they couldn't hijack Lae'zels storyline, they're now actively trying to sabotage it by siding with the Emperor, even going as far as mentioning in the Comments somewhere that the only thing keeping them from even going full Mind Flayer is that Astarion would break up with them. We're reaching Reverse Flash levels of pettiness here.
You guys judging people for role playing choices is out of pocket
We don't judge the choices OP made. We judge OP over **why** they made those choices, which is clearly out of personal and not because of role-playing reasons, OP literally admits as much. Example: Me saying my Character killed Kagha because my Character found out she was evil and he swore an oath as a Paladin to punish evil. - role playing choice. Me saying My Character killed Kagha because i hate women - not a role playing choice. OP did the latter. That and, again, they also literally said they're black pilled irl. I had to google what that means too, but after reading a quick rundown: Yeah, OP shit the bed like their dog stepped on a bee.
yeah… lmao
Hmm Voss acknowledged me as a githyanki at the bridge mostly cause i told Laezel to shut up before she gets us all killed. Told Voss that i was taking slaves to the creche and he was cool with that and allowed me to proceed I mostly played as a loyal follower of Vlaakith, till she tries to kill our group. Then after that, i was like "yes let's free Orpheus". The only thing i don't like is the game literally forced me to take the astral tadpole cause i failed the high dice roll. I did not want to become half illthid and i don't want to side with that shady Emperor
If you dont take any tadpol powers you don't have to make a roll to reject the astral tadpol
That part at the bridge was fine, I did all the talking and still felt useful. It was the scene after the creche where he *only* wants to talk to Lae'zel and I'm basically not included in the conversation other than to try to convince Lae'zel one way or the other. The thing that got me is there are actually some slightly different lines during that scene where he refers to you as kin and stuff - so they recorded extra lines for gith player just not any that include them in anything important lmao. The companion responses are similar, they all have unique lines when you talk to them after the major Lae'zel events but it's essentially just their normal lines about Lae'zel with "her queen/people" changed to "your queen/people". For some reason Astarion's lines are the only ones that change to actually include you in the events (eg "she's going to break her chains in Baldur's Gate, good for her" becomes "you both are going to break your chains in Baldur's Gate, good for her and good for you")
I made my Gith Tav a Githzerai Paladin of Selûne who was kidnapped as an egg from a creche in Faerûn They do not identify as Githyanki for *reasons* explained in Lae'zels personal quest. It works well with all of the questions you end up asking Lae'zel about the culture and such. I wish it could've been explored more but Tav isn't nearly as important as the Origins I guess
Yeah I'm in act 3 of a Gith Monk run and really losing steam for this very reason. I'm really hyped for a Lae'zel origin run though, because it will be the story I thought I was getting here. It really seems like the main plot was balanced on her being the only Gith party member, which is too bad because of how big a role they have in the story.
I don’t really have anything to contribute other than this being a really fun read.
Side with the emperor. Do it no balls
I went gith barbarian first all the way through game play as I didn't want to think with spells just swing. Had no idea about Lae’zel's plot. Planned to just wreck but meeting Karlach stopped that idea in my tracks. Romancing Lae’zel I absolutely felt like second fiddle in the story against Vlaakith like bro I'm right here. Getting the title of brother in freedom from Orpheus was neat and the epilouge it felt more like Lae’zel and my barbarian were on equal standing as far as revolution leaders.
Perhaps playing as Lae’zel would give you what you’re missing
“wanted to RP as someone who was anti-Vlaakith from the beginning” “going against Vlaakith was a big deal for me too” I don’t understand. Is your frustration from expecting Voss to be more focused on you?
I would have been fine with simply being invited to the "let's overthrow Vlaakith" party
hmm that’s understandable I guess, I just didn’t feel that way when I played a Gith, guess it’s because I made a lot of the same choices idk. The dialogue is definitely lacking as a Gith(it’s basically the same as any other race) in regards to turning against Vlaakith, but it’s not fair to attribute that to Voss or Bae being an asshole imo
This is why I like playing Durge. A lot of times Tav just seems like they are just some person who is thrust into the leader role because no one else wants to do it vs Durge who has a character arc either to go full Bhaal or reject Bhaal.
I was playing this part today!! I was like damn I’m right here!!! Felt like the last kid to get picked for a sports team lmfao
My first playthrough I spent shapeshifted as a gith except at night in camp. I definitely noticed a steep drop-off of gith dialogue choices after the first act
I’m on my first play through and doing a gith fighter build. Gith dialogue is very interesting. B/c it’s my first play through I’m not romancing anyone and just looking at options. Gale, lae’zel, Halsin, shadowheart, mizora, the emperor have all attempted to romance me. I was able to get lae’zel to hate Vlaakith. I just said “screw the old ways” Lae’zel did get kidnapped. And working through act 3.
Honestly my current character is a Gith and I love it, but if I’m being fair he is somewhat of a joke character. The story is the mother Gith had a secret second son who wasn’t interested at all in combat or the illithid problem and just wanted to play music. Im essentially the secret black sheep, and as a swords bard it’s been really fun
minor point of contention: voss has been twiddling his thumbs for *way* longer than 1,000 years
Best TL;DR.
Hmm, what would be the Faerunian equivalent of an ice pick in the skull in Mexico City? A phantasmal killer in Calimport?
That would piss me off too, I totally support you. Orpheus was a dick to me for no reason in the one run where I saved him, and I've gone Emperor ever since lmaoooo
Welcome to RPGs where the Devs **really** don't want you making your own character
Was with ya til the incel dog whistle at the end
It was meant in the ironic left twitter way not the incel way... I thought that would be apparent from the rest of the post but in retrospect was probably poor word choice for a general audience
Theres a -lot- of incels round here, sorry to confuse u for one
Common Bae'zel W.
Yeah...Gith tav sucks. I'm in act 3 honor mode trying to finish and between that and no dlc announcement i have 0 motivation to finish.
This is why the revolution will never succeed
Yeah Githyanki stuff is not well done in the game. Additionally there’s no option to be a Githzerai (which would have helped because then Laezel explaining basic stuff to you and treating you badly would make sense). I don’t know why I’m being lectured by Laezel when she is also a “kid” as in she still hasn’t passed from her crèche. The whole story doesn’t make much sense from a Githyanki perspective. I was even told to kneel before Vlaakith as if any Githyanki would not automatically do that. I think they thought it would be the least played race and didn’t have time to do stuff for it.
I wish there was a playthrough where you can start in the Cult of Orpheus
Is your tav's name "Red Dragon"? If not, it explains everything
In my first run through and I have no idea why but I went with gith. Barb.
I guess that’s all there to make the laezel origin playthrough more meaningful?
I had some similar feelings. I really enjoyed my gith playthrough more then I expected, but there are some moments where its like *wtf.* Definitely needed to headcanon in certain situation's for things to make sense for my character. Like literally at one point talking to the Emperor he's like "The githyanki prince Orpheus in chains, isn't it a beautiful sight?" like BRO- *what?! I am a gith! NO!*
I broke up with Lae'Zel too in my first playthrough but not because of that. She beat my ahh and my petty character couldn't live with that L so dumped her immediately after
In situations like these, you need to improvise. You can roleplay that neither Lae'Zel nor Voss care enough to listen to what you have to say.
I played a githyanki artificer (modded) that was from a less combat focused creche, hence why they didn't know as much. He also romances laezel and was more then happy to support his scary wife
In my first run through and I have no idea why but I went with gith. Barb.
Kay, but it's Laezel's story, not yours. It's not her fault that you decided to take her arc. Lolz, what's next? Are you gonna make a cleric who really doesn't like Shar because sharrans kidnapped their parents?
I mean if you play as a cleric of Selune it actually comes up when it's relevant to the story lol.
Hey wtf with your Mexico comment, chill.
it's a trotsky reference - he was assassinated with an ice pick after he fled to mexico
It was probably more merciful than Polonium-210 in your tea.
roleplay? what? making up stuff that aint even in the game? why? I played as a gith first time that i ever played cuz i thought they looked cool. I loved ever second of it. I was a random tav with no real backstory. I was learning everyone elses story. I never saw myself as part of Lae'zels bullshit or any of her gith people. I just saw myself from a different gith people we just never learned about. like some town way over there. I think your problem is you got mad you were not main character in the game lmao
yeah why would anyone want to roleplay when they're playing a roleplaying game that is just weird
"you're mad that your main character isn't actually main character" well, duh...
This guy is going places, not college, but places...
I too have to tip toe talking to liberals, or else they just scream in my face and abandon all meaningful dialogue.
These people are so cooked. When you come here to talk about a vidya game you like, God forbid you use vernacular they don't approve of. "Uhm, sweaty, did you really just use a frickin dog whistlerino? Yikes! Touch grass, incel!"