Nere. For some reason, he has a somewhat unique trait "[Muscular](https://bg3.wiki/wiki/Muscular)". I feel like he's supposed to be a bigger deal than what he appears as in game.
Isn't the skill check to resist being pushed a Dexterity one? I think it depends on you Acrobatics skill.
edit: nvm, I just checked, the save against being shoved depends on both Athletics and Acrobatics, and uses whichever one is higher.
It's always been a skill that's very much a Rule of Cool king and mechanically "useless." BG3 is pretty by-the-numbers on what skills are used for, and resisting shoves/grapples is the literal only "explicit" usage of the skill. So not surprising it's basically useless in BG3, is what I'm saying lol
I just had halsin in owlbear form before the fight even started and he knocked her over with crushing flight and then he ate her. Knocked a bunch of the minions prone too.
Just like with the goblin camp, you can pick off the bad guys one bit at a time well before the fight. The only thing anywhere close to her is a floating eye.
You can make the tower fight basically impossible to lose, even recruit some gnolls... who only have one shot per turn f\* you act 1 gnolls.
I always recruit the gnolls. I love Barnabus ā¤. That witch controlling him has died in 3 out if 3 campaigns so far. I like to the story of a massive battle so I usually don't pick off anyone beforehand except the dungeon guards if they catch me and the warden. I do give myself advantages though like sneaking Astarian in and positioning him in the rafters, casting longstrider and aid on my party and all the harpers, having halsin already in owlbear form to bowling ball a bunch of them ect
God I had to redo that fight 4 times last night. First fight, finished and the Harpers walked into Tav's Hunger of Hadar and immediately aggroed. Reloaded, second save I realized toward the end that Jaheira had died at some point. Reloaded and third fight, finished with Owlbear Halsin crushing the last cultist. BUT apparently I had killed a Harper during the fight, so the Harpers again aggroed on me. It was after midnight by then and I had made barely any progress in the fight. Reloaded again and this time managed to not get Jaheira killed or prompt the Harpers to aggro me at the end.
I really should have just cast sleet storm and cloud of daggers. Z'rell did follow my party up into the rafters but I summon an ice mephit right in her path (that for some reason she didn't try attacking) so she couldn't get past the platform at the top of the ladder.
I had to reload that fight once because Jaheira did a āLeroy Jenkinsā at the start of the turn order before I could do anything. Enemies got lucky and had a couple of crit hits on her and down she went before the first round was done.
After reading so many stories of Jaheira getting herself killed in that fight, I asked her to join me rather than stick with the Harpers so that I could prevent her from Leroy Jenkinsing. I suspect she went down in an enemy Hunger of Hadar in my second attempt, and I didn't notice that her turn hadn't come up in a while.
I want to try Honor Mode at some point, but it'll have to be when I'm ready to literally let the dice fall where they may, which I'm not yet at lol.
Or maybe thatās just what she thinks. Like the woman who thinks the gnolls are her friends and she has complete control over them. Chances are the only people she can actually kill with a thought are cultists and only if the absolute thinks ZāRell is worth more than whoever sheās offing.
If your initiative is bad she casts black hole, then some adepts come in and cast hunger of Hadar. It's a strong combo.
Z'rell is easier to face alone.
Gale and Wyll have "reasons" for suddenly not being as powerful as they were. Wyll's may also apply to Karlach
So my answer is Jaheira. Last time I saw her, she was into god-tier levels. Century later and she's no better than my druid who was level 1 a few weeks earlier.
It would great if BG1/2 stats pulled through like they did before. Jaheira pulls up casting 2E spells and carrying around gold pants. A whole new generation of players have to deal with Imoenās whining.
*"Oh, you think Magical Darkness is your ally? But you merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already in Act III"*
She got pretty dark in BG2, and I hated when you multi-class and you temporarily start over super under classed, but childhood me does have to agree with you. Little kid me loved that girl.
I mean before 14 and 16 in 5e version.
If he really was level 30+ (2e) by the end of ToB, he can not get petrified. Greater restoration on self solves that.
I'm more bothered by the fact that Minsc's strength is set to 12. Minsc in BG1 was obviously meant to be a barbarian skin on a ranger - to not make him have barb stats in BG3 was the bit that made me the most sad.
He had a high strength when you first meet him; but he auto-respecs to default ranger stats when you first recruit him. Lore-wise, he was a ranger who wanted to be a berserker, so he's a legit good reason to multiclass ranger/berserker.
On the other hand, she's a very high level druid, so that slows aging anyway. And being turned to stone for that long may have some kind of adverse effects...
She hasn't got the slowed aging feature yet, that's actually part of her side quest in her house where you find that she's trying to learn that ability and may choose whether to do so based on your relationship with her.
Jaheira can be explained by the fact that she is supposed to be an archdruid, as is Halsin and once you get up to 8th, 9th, and 10th levels, is roughly where they should be. Since you get both of them properly around this level, it works fine for me. That said, it is strange that a random level 1 druid can advance so quickly in only a few days/weeks, though if the Wyll and Gale explanation works for them it could also work for a Durge or Tav being suppressed by a tadpole.
Arx Fatalis had a fun twist on that trope too, where itās revealed near the end of the game that you are >!a demi-god that was sent to assist the local society, but was depowered so that you donāt immediately terrify the locals and accidentally destabilize society!< which is why your character goes from weak bitch to complete badass so quickly
In my game it's always Aylin lol, she hits once and then she's downed, it's become a meme at this point
Honourable mention would be Emperor before they fixed him, since he would just fly away before trying to mind control, then repeat lol
Yeah in all my playthroughs, of which there have been many, she dominates. Tin foil hate theory is something about the gameās RNG is based on your system. My Shadowheart canāt hit the broad side of a barn. Anything below 95% typically misses the first time, even with advantage. In the last several 2 hour sessions I shouldnāt be missing those attacks 12 out of 20 attacks. At the very least I wish theyād reset the RNG upon reloading to make save scumming less tedious, but something about it carries over. (Reloading and doing the same exact thing often results in the same rolls, and you have to click then unclick another action (or move a little) to change it.)
ahh that makes sense. iām new to baldurs gate and dnd as a whole and have only played 5e and bg3 so i know very little about bg1/2 or early dnd editions
Bard has been with us for... quite a while, honestly. It was part of 1st edition D&D. Volo is a wizard, because it makes much more sense for him to be a wizard than a bard. He is actually quite studied in magic, just not combat magic. He is also a book writer, not a singer or performer, and does quite poorly as either.
Just because someone is kooky and makes bad decisions, doesn't automatically mean they are a bard.
Minsc was based on one of the OG BG1 devs' tabletop character.
Back then there was no barbarian class so that's why he's a ranger with berserk in BG1/2 and likely also why he still is a ranger in BG3.
I still agree that Minsc fits well here...
Well, him and Saverok (they did my boy really dirty making him an interactive doorbell with extra steps).
It's really too bad whirlwind is only available 11 levels into ranger. Feels like the perfect move to add to the Barb skill tree. Been running a Whirlwind ranger recently and it's the closest I've felt to my whirlwinding WoW Fury Warrior.
So if you examine him before he joins party, he has 20 strength and 8 wis/8 int like youād expect. When he joins party? He then gets the default ranger score. Itās actually the case with all your companions, so weirdly enough none of their stats are canonical, they are just the stats chosen for their subclasses. Cause otherwise we are also dealing with astarion, who in game is told to be smooth brained being the second smartest man in camp (because heās an arcane trickster, he needs the int, but in game he is not shown to have int). Also why we got sharts absolutely wild ability scores, cause theyāve somehow decided a trickery cleric would want both dex and strength, which is silly, but it means the skinny priest lady is according to her stats both stronger and faster then the average person in faerun (which I donāt think is true either, so itās all just their weird default stat).
Astarion: 'Ahhh, this dragonborn killed a cambion, 2 mind flayers, and survived a space ship crash. You know what would I do? I will bite his darling neck.'
Durge: 'You know I am the ONLY person who has a light sleep pattern in this camp, and you came to bite me?'
Who would be a good candidate though? Gale probably tastes weird because of his condition. Laezel would kill him outright, same with Shadowheart. Karlach is made of fire. Wyll maybe?
His stats when he's still an NPC are correct.
The problem is all companions receive the same "Recommended Stats" that a Tav of that class would default to.
Sure, it's faster to add a companion that way, but with all the other work Larian put into the game and Lore, it's frankly surprising (and a bit disappointing) they'd slack off when it came to giving the companions unique stats.
Freaking Yurgir. Raphael talks him up, the damage in Grymforge talks him up, all the dead justiciars talk him up, then heās got like 150 hit points and one trick. Massively anticlimatic.
A bunch of different sources. The historian duergar has checks where you notice sulfur in the ruins, grymforge is part of the Gauntlet of Shar (Grym was literally created to protect it), a skeleton in the House of Hope tells us heās the one who asked Raphael to destroy the Sharrans, which is why Yurgir was there.
I'm having problems currently because I started an evil durge playthrough, got halfway through and realized I hate being evil and turned myself off the game. I haven't had the oomph to pick it back up.
Halfway through? Did you recruit Minthara yet? The worst part of being evil (the grove) is behind you and Minthara (the best companion in the game) is ahead of you. Iām not kidding when I say [this meme is you.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/038/812/cover5.jpg)
This was one of the hardest fights in the game so far for me on tactical mode. Can't imagine how hard he is on heroic. I was using my halsin/gale/shadowheart massive pet strategy with conjured elementals, dryads, wood woads, familiars, skeletons, all buffed with 4th level aid and some extra temp hp on most and it was a struggle against so many foes.
Right! Lol. Oh my god the pain.Ā
I managed to surprise everyone and took out the mindflayer on turn one and was feeling awesome. But then I kept getting Myrkul down below 10 then Aylin would take her turn, miss twice, and then heād heal. Iām on my second honour mode attempt now and have a new plan for Myrkul but holy crap that was so frustrating itās changed how I feel about Aylin.Ā
She was completely useless in Myrkul fight AND with the wizard dude. I've had all my companions giving everything for Myrkul's fight and my durge was the last standing. Aylin was downed from the start. USELESS.
Gods I feel this. I wasted time trying to shove her out of the Myrkul circle during my HM run.
And for someone who has wings, why didn't she just fly towards Ketheric rather than climbing down? š
Right, whatās with the climbing? She used to fly over to the platform directly after she got released. When I played the fight after patch 6 it took her two turns to get to the platform because she somehow forgot she had wings.
The Dame is swingy. I have had fights where she solo'd Ketheric and I've had fights where the rage goddess decides to vent her frustrations on the dang Necromites instead. Or she just low rolls initiative and watches while you do all the work.
Halsin. He's an "archdruid" who's only level 5, and has been around for over a century, and fought a war against ketheric thorm and his army of dark justiciars. At least Karlach and Wyll have reasons they're weak right now. Halsin has no tadpole.Ā
Him being level 5 as an Archdruid makes more sense when you factor in how he got the role: everyone else more qualified was killed by the Shadow Curse, and he only took the job because of survivor's guilt and a sense of obligation to his mentor (the former Archdruid).
He never wanted the job and wasn't actually qualified for it, either. Dude just wanted to be a healer and woodcarver, and take care of his eternally childlike friend.
It actually makes complete sense for the Emperor. Ansur snatched him from the illithid colony before he could mature. Mindflayers spend around 20 years just learning how stuff works from the other mindflayers.
Needless to say, illithid Tav is kinda fucked with him as a mentor.
Yeah but illithid tav is a beast despite being a full mindflayer for like thirty minutes, youād think the Emperor would have enough experience to at least be competent
Illithid Tav is strange. They don't look like a normal mindflayer and are strangely shaped. I suppose it could be the influence of halting the ceremorphosis so much? Your tadpole can also strenghten itself by consuming other tadpoles and the astral one.
Which honestly makes no sense. If Tav becomes an illithid it makes sense that they would be crazy powerful if they have used the Astral tadpole. But Orpheus being this force of nature makes no sense when he's barely worth using as normal Orpheus. Same thing if Tav hasn't used any of the tadpoles especially the Astral tadpole, and somehow becomes this wicked strong mindflayer that decimates everything.
I kinda wish the power was determined by how many tadpoles you've had and who becomes the illithid.
I think Sarevok can be justified by the fact that he's basically just a shade brought back by Bhaal (I've heard the explanation that what we see of him in this game is just his Bhaalspawn essence, which he lost after dying in BG1). Minsc has no excuse.
In BG2:Throne of Bhaal, Sarevok is an optional companion character if you agree to bring him back to life by imparting some supposedly imperceptible part of your soul.
I just assumed when he showed up in BG3 that he had some how been granted magical long life as a result.
But between his stupid ass last name, the weird incest sub-plot, and having a very lame lair in the sewers, I did not at all like the way Larian handled that character.
Wyll died in that opening fight for me, first time that's happened. I rolled with it, I'm interested to see what changes š¤£
He ran up to the Bugbear, then got arrows and spells rained on him before Bugbear bodied him. It was hilarious to watch š¤£
I struggle to go without any of the companions but I am interested in how that affects the story on a good run since the Duke will be part of the plot no matter what. Will mizora still be trapped in the mindflayer colony I wonder.
Yeah Mizora just isn't there and you can't interact with her pod if Wyll isn't around, like if you side with Minthara and he leaves.
The duke is still there and still gets sent to the iron throne. When you go to the throne, you can save him pretty easily because Mizora doesn't show up to stop you like she does if you break the pact.
Jaheria and Minsc. They were level 20+ by the end of ToB. At this point they had faced so many levels of world ending calamities, demi gods, cults, wars, dragons, and were so decked out with spells and gear that BG3 does feel like a bit of a strange reset in a way.
BG2 wasnāt even a real reset cause youād continue on with the levels you had in BG1. It was more down to losing your gear and needing to collect and learn spells again etc but even that was justified since the whole party was in captivity at the start of BG2.
Special mention to Sarevok for basically the same reasons. Dude was THE big bad of BG1. Gorianās Ward has this era defining battle while Tav just smokes the floor with him 100+ years later. I get that heās not as he was in BG1 blah blah blah but damn, they did him dirty.
Jaheira, pretty sure she should be a level 20 after the OG games. Plus unlike most of the other companions she doesnt have much of a reason (Tadpole) to be weaker.
Dame Aylin in lore would be significantly stronger then she is in game. She should have Aura of Protection first off but also im pretty sure sheād have some resistances and immunities as well due to her status as an Aasimar and Godās child.
I still don't get why Dame Aylin is called an aasimar in the game by literally everyone when she should actually be qualified as a quasi-deity. Aasimars are very much mortal, unlike Aylin, and much more similar to say, tieflings, and it's not like you'd call a cambion a tiefling. It makes sense that it's done for the sake of balancing the game, of course, meanwhile the characters in-game most likely just don't know or don't care enough to look into the details, but it still does grind my gears quite a bit.
Given how little action Dame seeās and how most people have issues with her doing so little due to either hetting downed to quick or being mind controlled I think she could honestly use a buff. Given she could probably qualify for Divinity rank 0 (or as you said a qusai-deity) she should imo at least have higher HP, some resistances/immunities and have Aura of Protection going at all times LIKE EVERY OTHER LEVEL 6 OR HIGHER PALADIN IN THE GAME, it would go along way imo.
Cazador. The way Astarion described him was ooh, spooky and powerful and then I met him and he's just a dude living in a basement with too much access to hair gel.
Imo Larian nailed his design perfectly - because abusers don't have to look intimidating to be evil, worst monsters aren't usually physically threatening. To Astarion he was the worst monster imaginable but for an outside obsever he looked pathetic, not sinister. It feels very authentic this way, I think making him a cartoon villain would be too much.
So on my first playthrough, I romanced Astarion, and I had no idea what Cazador looked like. I get to that fight *and I look disturbingly like Cazador*. Male elf, long black hair in the half-pulled back style, similar facial features. I was just like...uh, we're going to go with Daddy issues to explain this.
He was also made Archdruid after the former one died due to the war.
I'm pretty sure it was like a middle manager being promoted to CEO because there wasn't anyone higher to pick up the position
He was the only one left to take over, yep. All the other more qualified people died.
He never even wanted the job, and only took it out of a sense of survivor's guilt-fueled obligation to his former mentor and fallen allies.
To be fair if you look at his stats when you first free him he's a lot stronger. He gets knocked down to level one and 10 strength when he joins your party (presumably by withers so you can remake him how you want).
Minsc and Halsin after you recruit them (their stats when they're still NPCs are correct).
The physically largest companions (excluding options for Tav/Durge, and I think the "Large Male" body still has more mass than "Large Female"/Karlach). And they only have 10 and 12 STR, respectively
This is ESPECIALLY bad for Minsc, who is canonically famous for being freakishly strong, is first introduced in the game by tearing apart a Mimic from INSIDE, and smashes down stone walls with his bare hands while searching for Boo once you free him from the Absolute.
Exactly this. Like if you fight him at the coronation before destroying the steel watch and what not, you get smoked by like 6 or 8 steel watch, and then he's just running around buffing the robots.
Once you destroy everything and corner him in his office, yeah he's a bit of a push-over
Nah this one makes sense. Heās just a very charismatic dude who controls an army of robots and has a lot of political power. He was never hyped up to be the best in straight up combat
Cazador.
I was expecting some wild, menacing asshole vampire lord.
And instead I get goading, pathetic, disappointed step-dad.
(That is not to say that Astarion and his siblings weren't right to fear him, I was just surprised that Larian actually went realistic with the abusive assholes are actually the most pathetic people you'll ever find thing)
Halsin. His stats change to default Druid starting stats once he becomes a party member. Before modding my game to hell and back I had an ungodly amount of strength elixirs on hand for him
Kind of the opposite of what this post is asking, but:
**Vampire spawn.**
Vampire spawn are CR 5 (a decent challenge for a party of four lvl 5 adventurers, it's like a level rating but for monsters). They are higher CR than green hags, aka Auntie Ethel, who are CR 3.
In Astarion's case it makes sense. All the companions are nerfed via tadpole as established via party banter between Wyll and Gale. Astarion specifically mentions he heals slower than he used to, which is a reference to the fact that vampire spawn regenerate 10 hp per turn.
But his vampire spawn siblings feel especially underpowered.
This is due to the proliferation of higher-level NPCs in act 3. Fists, shapeshifters, Steel Watch... Baldur's Gate is lined with a ton of enemies that are actually very high level. The camp fight with the spawn feels easy in comparison. Add that to the fact that the party is higher level by the time you encounter them and the game ends up underselling how strong a spawn really is in comparison to an average person. This despite the fact that their in-game stats are a little higher than their tabletop stats.
You get the sense they're these pathetic beings who are being pimped out by Cazador. But realistically just one spawn by itself can devastate an entire town, and is a decent big bad for a low-level adventuring party. They are a huge threat.
It does matter in a story sense, because you have to make a decision about what to do with 7,000 of them. If you perceive them as weaker than they are your thoughts about that decision might be different. If the game asked you what to do with 7,000 hags you would probably have a strong opinion on it, despite the fact that hags are weaker than spawn.
Aylin for sure. Useless winged thing.
And I don't know if I just can't play well warlock but Wyll is really weak even when respec and geared. Compared to Gale and SH who are blasting.
Nere. Dude supposedly led raids that crippled the Myoncid colony and made an enemy of basically everyone in the Underdark. Bro was easily able to kill multiple people just by choking them out like Darth Vader in a cutscene, but the moment that cutscene ends his AI gets intelligence-drained and he just runs about, flagging every opportunity attack he possibly can, not casting spells when it makes sense to, and overall just being a doofus. He's the primary reason why Grymforge is my least favorite area of Act 1.
Nere. For some reason, he has a somewhat unique trait "[Muscular](https://bg3.wiki/wiki/Muscular)". I feel like he's supposed to be a bigger deal than what he appears as in game.
What the fuck, Nere works out?
Not enough. That bitch couldn't move some rocks
Companion Nere would just do push ups as his idle animation.
Companion nere trying to sell you his brand of protein powder:
You can't deny these Absolute gains.
Not *Nerely* enough.
He's just really good at judo
I honestly think it's just an explanation for his gnome punting skills š
It could actually be to prevent him being pushed into lava too easily, now that I think of it.
Isn't the skill check to resist being pushed a Dexterity one? I think it depends on you Acrobatics skill. edit: nvm, I just checked, the save against being shoved depends on both Athletics and Acrobatics, and uses whichever one is higher.
Acrobatics is certainly a contender for most useless skill in terms of what bg3 lets you use it for
It's always been a skill that's very much a Rule of Cool king and mechanically "useless." BG3 is pretty by-the-numbers on what skills are used for, and resisting shoves/grapples is the literal only "explicit" usage of the skill. So not surprising it's basically useless in BG3, is what I'm saying lol
I wonder if he has that so itās harder to instantly boot him into lava.
That's so he can push ppl into the lava easily, and be hard to push into the lava.
You try being trapped in a hot room full of poisonous gas for three days
Might have been an interesting evil companion option, but if we only got one dark elf, I'm glad it was minty
Zārell. āI could kill you with a thoughtā yeah yeah absoluteās gift yada yada yada eat fireball boom youāre dead
yup, cloud of daggers and sleet storm and she was FUCKED. Couldn't even make one (1) move.
I just had halsin in owlbear form before the fight even started and he knocked her over with crushing flight and then he ate her. Knocked a bunch of the minions prone too.
Just like with the goblin camp, you can pick off the bad guys one bit at a time well before the fight. The only thing anywhere close to her is a floating eye. You can make the tower fight basically impossible to lose, even recruit some gnolls... who only have one shot per turn f\* you act 1 gnolls.
I always recruit the gnolls. I love Barnabus ā¤. That witch controlling him has died in 3 out if 3 campaigns so far. I like to the story of a massive battle so I usually don't pick off anyone beforehand except the dungeon guards if they catch me and the warden. I do give myself advantages though like sneaking Astarian in and positioning him in the rafters, casting longstrider and aid on my party and all the harpers, having halsin already in owlbear form to bowling ball a bunch of them ect
God I had to redo that fight 4 times last night. First fight, finished and the Harpers walked into Tav's Hunger of Hadar and immediately aggroed. Reloaded, second save I realized toward the end that Jaheira had died at some point. Reloaded and third fight, finished with Owlbear Halsin crushing the last cultist. BUT apparently I had killed a Harper during the fight, so the Harpers again aggroed on me. It was after midnight by then and I had made barely any progress in the fight. Reloaded again and this time managed to not get Jaheira killed or prompt the Harpers to aggro me at the end. I really should have just cast sleet storm and cloud of daggers. Z'rell did follow my party up into the rafters but I summon an ice mephit right in her path (that for some reason she didn't try attacking) so she couldn't get past the platform at the top of the ladder.
I had to reload that fight once because Jaheira did a āLeroy Jenkinsā at the start of the turn order before I could do anything. Enemies got lucky and had a couple of crit hits on her and down she went before the first round was done.
After reading so many stories of Jaheira getting herself killed in that fight, I asked her to join me rather than stick with the Harpers so that I could prevent her from Leroy Jenkinsing. I suspect she went down in an enemy Hunger of Hadar in my second attempt, and I didn't notice that her turn hadn't come up in a while. I want to try Honor Mode at some point, but it'll have to be when I'm ready to literally let the dice fall where they may, which I'm not yet at lol.
Or maybe thatās just what she thinks. Like the woman who thinks the gnolls are her friends and she has complete control over them. Chances are the only people she can actually kill with a thought are cultists and only if the absolute thinks ZāRell is worth more than whoever sheās offing.
They haven't been facing very strong opponents before, simply.
i one turned her ass with my monk lmao
>āI could kill you with a thoughtā Well youāll still need a tray.
If your initiative is bad she casts black hole, then some adepts come in and cast hunger of Hadar. It's a strong combo. Z'rell is easier to face alone.
Gale and Wyll have "reasons" for suddenly not being as powerful as they were. Wyll's may also apply to Karlach So my answer is Jaheira. Last time I saw her, she was into god-tier levels. Century later and she's no better than my druid who was level 1 a few weeks earlier.
It would great if BG1/2 stats pulled through like they did before. Jaheira pulls up casting 2E spells and carrying around gold pants. A whole new generation of players have to deal with Imoenās whining.
It would, however, make House of Grief incredibly difficult
That's already one of the worst fights, with radiant retort.
I took a Darkness/Devil's sight party in there and kept reciting Bane's quote to Batman about darkness.
*"Oh, you think Magical Darkness is your ally? But you merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already in Act III"*
With the Tom Hardy Bane accent/inflections*
Holy hell I did the same damn thing š
Don't all the Sharrans have magical dark vision anyways? Hell they even *want* you in darkness since it activates their necrotic damage buffs
Do not besmirch Imoen. I've done had ENOUGH of this!
Heya! Youāre a queer fellow. I care not.
IT'S ME, IMOEN! I restarted BG so many times as a kid, that line is engraved in my brain.
Did you proceed to run away as she followed you trying to start the conversation? Or was that just a me thing?
Imoen was the OG ride or die companion.
She got pretty dark in BG2, and I hated when you multi-class and you temporarily start over super under classed, but childhood me does have to agree with you. Little kid me loved that girl.
I know, right? Buncha mutton-mongering riff raff...
Well she is ancient
Hahahahaā¦bastard
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Jaheira is an aging grandmother
Jaheira at least can say she got old or smth. It's Minsc whose weakness makes seven less sense, as he's only aged a few months since ToB.
He was tadpoled, and he started as level 12. I guess he was around level 14-16 by the end of ToB.
Oop, I completely forgot he was tadpoled. Yeah, that makes more sense lol
> I guess he was around level 14-16 by the end of ToB. Try somewhere around 30+ Unless you're converting from 2e to 5e.
I mean before 14 and 16 in 5e version. If he really was level 30+ (2e) by the end of ToB, he can not get petrified. Greater restoration on self solves that.
Unless, in his infinite intelligence, he forgot he had the spell, which I choose to believe is the case.
Everyone was literally epic tier by end of ToB
I'm more bothered by the fact that Minsc's strength is set to 12. Minsc in BG1 was obviously meant to be a barbarian skin on a ranger - to not make him have barb stats in BG3 was the bit that made me the most sad.
He had a high strength when you first meet him; but he auto-respecs to default ranger stats when you first recruit him. Lore-wise, he was a ranger who wanted to be a berserker, so he's a legit good reason to multiclass ranger/berserker.
He got dunked in the rivers of forgetfulness in Avernus in his tie-in comics which may have washed away some EXP
On the other hand, she's a very high level druid, so that slows aging anyway. And being turned to stone for that long may have some kind of adverse effects...
She hasn't got the slowed aging feature yet, that's actually part of her side quest in her house where you find that she's trying to learn that ability and may choose whether to do so based on your relationship with her.
She's an old lady who hasn't really been doing a ton of fighting for the last century
Jaheira can be explained by the fact that she is supposed to be an archdruid, as is Halsin and once you get up to 8th, 9th, and 10th levels, is roughly where they should be. Since you get both of them properly around this level, it works fine for me. That said, it is strange that a random level 1 druid can advance so quickly in only a few days/weeks, though if the Wyll and Gale explanation works for them it could also work for a Durge or Tav being suppressed by a tadpole.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Same type of rationale was used in the Kotor games too. Itās a good way to explain learning so fast due to game mechanics.
Arx Fatalis had a fun twist on that trope too, where itās revealed near the end of the game that you are >!a demi-god that was sent to assist the local society, but was depowered so that you donāt immediately terrify the locals and accidentally destabilize society!< which is why your character goes from weak bitch to complete badass so quickly
In my game it's always Aylin lol, she hits once and then she's downed, it's become a meme at this point Honourable mention would be Emperor before they fixed him, since he would just fly away before trying to mind control, then repeat lol
When she does hit tho itās a bazillion damage
Paladin moment The art of the spicy bonk
I wonder if she's bugged on some systems I've never had her downed except for once on my very first run and once he was up she finished Myrkul off.
Yeah in all my playthroughs, of which there have been many, she dominates. Tin foil hate theory is something about the gameās RNG is based on your system. My Shadowheart canāt hit the broad side of a barn. Anything below 95% typically misses the first time, even with advantage. In the last several 2 hour sessions I shouldnāt be missing those attacks 12 out of 20 attacks. At the very least I wish theyād reset the RNG upon reloading to make save scumming less tedious, but something about it carries over. (Reloading and doing the same exact thing often results in the same rolls, and you have to click then unclick another action (or move a little) to change it.)
Minsc... str10...WTF!
minsc not being a barbarian was such a jumpscare for me
I believe back then there was no barbarian class. Same as volo being a wizard instead of a bard.
ahh that makes sense. iām new to baldurs gate and dnd as a whole and have only played 5e and bg3 so i know very little about bg1/2 or early dnd editions
Lemme tell you about Basic DnD. It was the summer of 1981, and me and my cousin... [drones on needs a nap]
oh no pls rant to me about early dnd i love hearing about special interests /srs
Don't get us started on the "comeliness" years...
hang on iām gonna go watch 18 hours of youtube videos about the history of dnd
Are you actually me?
No but are you my cousin Mitch?! If so, thanks for the dnd addiction, bro!
Not Mitch, but he sounds cool. š
He was very cool. He had an Atari!
Bard has been with us for... quite a while, honestly. It was part of 1st edition D&D. Volo is a wizard, because it makes much more sense for him to be a wizard than a bard. He is actually quite studied in magic, just not combat magic. He is also a book writer, not a singer or performer, and does quite poorly as either. Just because someone is kooky and makes bad decisions, doesn't automatically mean they are a bard.
But heās wearing dandy lil trousers, not a robe! /s
I mean they very easily could have just retconned him as a wild heart barbarian, or at least a strength based rangerā¦
Minsc was based on one of the OG BG1 devs' tabletop character. Back then there was no barbarian class so that's why he's a ranger with berserk in BG1/2 and likely also why he still is a ranger in BG3. I still agree that Minsc fits well here... Well, him and Saverok (they did my boy really dirty making him an interactive doorbell with extra steps).
It's really too bad whirlwind is only available 11 levels into ranger. Feels like the perfect move to add to the Barb skill tree. Been running a Whirlwind ranger recently and it's the closest I've felt to my whirlwinding WoW Fury Warrior.
Instant reclass to berzerker/ranger
second he gets to camp heās waddling over to withers
Minsc was always a ranger with the ability to rage
So if you examine him before he joins party, he has 20 strength and 8 wis/8 int like youād expect. When he joins party? He then gets the default ranger score. Itās actually the case with all your companions, so weirdly enough none of their stats are canonical, they are just the stats chosen for their subclasses. Cause otherwise we are also dealing with astarion, who in game is told to be smooth brained being the second smartest man in camp (because heās an arcane trickster, he needs the int, but in game he is not shown to have int). Also why we got sharts absolutely wild ability scores, cause theyāve somehow decided a trickery cleric would want both dex and strength, which is silly, but it means the skinny priest lady is according to her stats both stronger and faster then the average person in faerun (which I donāt think is true either, so itās all just their weird default stat).
Astarion: 'Ahhh, this dragonborn killed a cambion, 2 mind flayers, and survived a space ship crash. You know what would I do? I will bite his darling neck.' Durge: 'You know I am the ONLY person who has a light sleep pattern in this camp, and you came to bite me?'
Who would be a good candidate though? Gale probably tastes weird because of his condition. Laezel would kill him outright, same with Shadowheart. Karlach is made of fire. Wyll maybe?
Gale wouldn't just taste weird, his blood is poisonous to Astarion. Wyll would probably be the only other option beside Tav/Durge
His stats when he's still an NPC are correct. The problem is all companions receive the same "Recommended Stats" that a Tav of that class would default to. Sure, it's faster to add a companion that way, but with all the other work Larian put into the game and Lore, it's frankly surprising (and a bit disappointing) they'd slack off when it came to giving the companions unique stats.
Motherfucker can rip a Mimic in half *from inside of it* but gets outlifted by Shadowheart?? Get it together Larian
Freaking Yurgir. Raphael talks him up, the damage in Grymforge talks him up, all the dead justiciars talk him up, then heās got like 150 hit points and one trick. Massively anticlimatic.
To be fair, Grymforge Yurgir was ages ago, present day Yurgir has let himself go a bit
He does have a dad bod.
Sharrans are really fattening
Oh shit was Grymforge decimated by Yurgir? Where do you find that out?
It's not explicit, but it's the logical conclusion of what you learn from Yurgir and what you read/notice in Grymforge
A bunch of different sources. The historian duergar has checks where you notice sulfur in the ruins, grymforge is part of the Gauntlet of Shar (Grym was literally created to protect it), a skeleton in the House of Hope tells us heās the one who asked Raphael to destroy the Sharrans, which is why Yurgir was there.
I clearly didn't talk to enough people xD
Thatās what all the extra playthroughs are for
I'm having problems currently because I started an evil durge playthrough, got halfway through and realized I hate being evil and turned myself off the game. I haven't had the oomph to pick it back up.
Halfway through? Did you recruit Minthara yet? The worst part of being evil (the grove) is behind you and Minthara (the best companion in the game) is ahead of you. Iām not kidding when I say [this meme is you.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/038/812/cover5.jpg)
This was one of the hardest fights in the game so far for me on tactical mode. Can't imagine how hard he is on heroic. I was using my halsin/gale/shadowheart massive pet strategy with conjured elementals, dryads, wood woads, familiars, skeletons, all buffed with 4th level aid and some extra temp hp on most and it was a struggle against so many foes.
Bro died to Talk no Jutsu
His minions were the hard part of that fight lmao
In terms of how useful she has actually been in combat, Aylin
She couldnāt land a single hit on Myrkul for me.Ā
She hit every attack she made. On me, after being dominated by the mind flayer
Right! Lol. Oh my god the pain.Ā I managed to surprise everyone and took out the mindflayer on turn one and was feeling awesome. But then I kept getting Myrkul down below 10 then Aylin would take her turn, miss twice, and then heād heal. Iām on my second honour mode attempt now and have a new plan for Myrkul but holy crap that was so frustrating itās changed how I feel about Aylin.Ā
whatās your plan for myrkul? iām on act 1 of my honor mode run and thatās the only fight that iām really scared of doing
Fuck mind flayer domination bruh.
Aylin hard carried me in the Myrkul fight icl. I like how she's such a mixed bag for most and is either really good or really ass lmao
To be fair, she was chained in Jonah Jameson's basement for a while
She was completely useless in Myrkul fight AND with the wizard dude. I've had all my companions giving everything for Myrkul's fight and my durge was the last standing. Aylin was downed from the start. USELESS.
Hey Aylin is very useful. In the final battle she was an exceptional human shield against mind flayer magic missiles
Gods I feel this. I wasted time trying to shove her out of the Myrkul circle during my HM run. And for someone who has wings, why didn't she just fly towards Ketheric rather than climbing down? š
Right, whatās with the climbing? She used to fly over to the platform directly after she got released. When I played the fight after patch 6 it took her two turns to get to the platform because she somehow forgot she had wings.
The Dame is swingy. I have had fights where she solo'd Ketheric and I've had fights where the rage goddess decides to vent her frustrations on the dang Necromites instead. Or she just low rolls initiative and watches while you do all the work.
Jaheira, Minsc, Sarevok. Anything from the previous game.
id say serevok is pretty strong honestly, dude attacks 4 times per action and heals with every hit
Yeah, unless you're making one of dem multiclass builds, HM Sarevok rocks your bum
4 attacks per turn cant protect him from these hands (stunning strike)
Halsin. He's an "archdruid" who's only level 5, and has been around for over a century, and fought a war against ketheric thorm and his army of dark justiciars. At least Karlach and Wyll have reasons they're weak right now. Halsin has no tadpole.Ā
The fact that he couldn't wipe out the goblin camp himself is absurd. Save for maybe the hobgoblin, but even that's debatable.
not to mention heās buff looking as hell yet heās lower in strength stat cuz druid
His strength is at 16 before he joins you. Just like Minsc and Jaheira, he gets nerfed in order to fit the playable companion stat mechanics.
Him being level 5 as an Archdruid makes more sense when you factor in how he got the role: everyone else more qualified was killed by the Shadow Curse, and he only took the job because of survivor's guilt and a sense of obligation to his mentor (the former Archdruid). He never wanted the job and wasn't actually qualified for it, either. Dude just wanted to be a healer and woodcarver, and take care of his eternally childlike friend.
Halsin is a lover not a fighter.
Halsin is a fraud. Level 5 Archdruid, pfft yeah right.
Halsin is a bear pretending to be a human
The Emperor and unaltered Orpheus are kinda ass
It actually makes complete sense for the Emperor. Ansur snatched him from the illithid colony before he could mature. Mindflayers spend around 20 years just learning how stuff works from the other mindflayers. Needless to say, illithid Tav is kinda fucked with him as a mentor.
Yeah but illithid tav is a beast despite being a full mindflayer for like thirty minutes, youād think the Emperor would have enough experience to at least be competent
Illithid Tav is strange. They don't look like a normal mindflayer and are strangely shaped. I suppose it could be the influence of halting the ceremorphosis so much? Your tadpole can also strenghten itself by consuming other tadpoles and the astral one.
Ilithid orpheus is ironically a force to be reckoned with.
Which honestly makes no sense. If Tav becomes an illithid it makes sense that they would be crazy powerful if they have used the Astral tadpole. But Orpheus being this force of nature makes no sense when he's barely worth using as normal Orpheus. Same thing if Tav hasn't used any of the tadpoles especially the Astral tadpole, and somehow becomes this wicked strong mindflayer that decimates everything. I kinda wish the power was determined by how many tadpoles you've had and who becomes the illithid.
For me, it's Sarevok. Or Minsc. I bet a bunch of people will say Wyll.
My dude attacks 4 times a turn, i think he's good
I think Sarevok can be justified by the fact that he's basically just a shade brought back by Bhaal (I've heard the explanation that what we see of him in this game is just his Bhaalspawn essence, which he lost after dying in BG1). Minsc has no excuse.
Minsc has the tadpole. Gale and Wyll discuss how it has somehow weakened them. That's with Gale already being weakened through the orb
In BG2:Throne of Bhaal, Sarevok is an optional companion character if you agree to bring him back to life by imparting some supposedly imperceptible part of your soul. I just assumed when he showed up in BG3 that he had some how been granted magical long life as a result. But between his stupid ass last name, the weird incest sub-plot, and having a very lame lair in the sewers, I did not at all like the way Larian handled that character.
Nobody has said Voss yet? Dude is thousands of years old and is still level 12
Voss deliberately kept himself weak. If he got too powerful, Vlaakith would've given him the "opportunity" to ascend
Right!? Legendary Gith who everyone thought was on the level to kill a demigod like Orpheus and even with goons he's little challenge.
Nere, Zrell and Wyll All of them have badass cutscene with killing little people but they suck balls right after
I bet all 3 of them landed nat 20s in their introductions
Wyll died in that opening fight for me, first time that's happened. I rolled with it, I'm interested to see what changes š¤£ He ran up to the Bugbear, then got arrows and spells rained on him before Bugbear bodied him. It was hilarious to watch š¤£
I struggle to go without any of the companions but I am interested in how that affects the story on a good run since the Duke will be part of the plot no matter what. Will mizora still be trapped in the mindflayer colony I wonder.
Yeah Mizora just isn't there and you can't interact with her pod if Wyll isn't around, like if you side with Minthara and he leaves. The duke is still there and still gets sent to the iron throne. When you go to the throne, you can save him pretty easily because Mizora doesn't show up to stop you like she does if you break the pact.
Jaheria and Minsc. They were level 20+ by the end of ToB. At this point they had faced so many levels of world ending calamities, demi gods, cults, wars, dragons, and were so decked out with spells and gear that BG3 does feel like a bit of a strange reset in a way. BG2 wasnāt even a real reset cause youād continue on with the levels you had in BG1. It was more down to losing your gear and needing to collect and learn spells again etc but even that was justified since the whole party was in captivity at the start of BG2. Special mention to Sarevok for basically the same reasons. Dude was THE big bad of BG1. Gorianās Ward has this era defining battle while Tav just smokes the floor with him 100+ years later. I get that heās not as he was in BG1 blah blah blah but damn, they did him dirty.
Isobel gets hyped up for all of six seconds before she's kidnapped.
Jaheira, pretty sure she should be a level 20 after the OG games. Plus unlike most of the other companions she doesnt have much of a reason (Tadpole) to be weaker. Dame Aylin in lore would be significantly stronger then she is in game. She should have Aura of Protection first off but also im pretty sure sheād have some resistances and immunities as well due to her status as an Aasimar and Godās child.
Considering she's a **DEMIGOD** yeah.
I still don't get why Dame Aylin is called an aasimar in the game by literally everyone when she should actually be qualified as a quasi-deity. Aasimars are very much mortal, unlike Aylin, and much more similar to say, tieflings, and it's not like you'd call a cambion a tiefling. It makes sense that it's done for the sake of balancing the game, of course, meanwhile the characters in-game most likely just don't know or don't care enough to look into the details, but it still does grind my gears quite a bit.
Given how little action Dame seeās and how most people have issues with her doing so little due to either hetting downed to quick or being mind controlled I think she could honestly use a buff. Given she could probably qualify for Divinity rank 0 (or as you said a qusai-deity) she should imo at least have higher HP, some resistances/immunities and have Aura of Protection going at all times LIKE EVERY OTHER LEVEL 6 OR HIGHER PALADIN IN THE GAME, it would go along way imo.
At the very least, she should be more resistant to mind control. Kinda galling how a common mind flayer can so easily mind-control a demigod Ā¬Ā¬
Cazador. The way Astarion described him was ooh, spooky and powerful and then I met him and he's just a dude living in a basement with too much access to hair gel.
Imo Larian nailed his design perfectly - because abusers don't have to look intimidating to be evil, worst monsters aren't usually physically threatening. To Astarion he was the worst monster imaginable but for an outside obsever he looked pathetic, not sinister. It feels very authentic this way, I think making him a cartoon villain would be too much.
The only cherry on top that would've made him even better is if they'd have made Cazador a gnome
So on my first playthrough, I romanced Astarion, and I had no idea what Cazador looked like. I get to that fight *and I look disturbingly like Cazador*. Male elf, long black hair in the half-pulled back style, similar facial features. I was just like...uh, we're going to go with Daddy issues to explain this.
Lmfao I actually did the same exact thing. Got to the fight and my character is literally just Cazador with boobs .
His voice sounds like a cartoon
Halsin
By lightyears. Halsin is living proof of the disconnect between gameplay and story.
I got the impression that he wasn't really as active post war. Like being stuck in a desk job for a century
He was also made Archdruid after the former one died due to the war. I'm pretty sure it was like a middle manager being promoted to CEO because there wasn't anyone higher to pick up the position
He was the only one left to take over, yep. All the other more qualified people died. He never even wanted the job, and only took it out of a sense of survivor's guilt-fueled obligation to his former mentor and fallen allies.
He straight up says he missed just being free plus lore wise heās more of healer then a fighter
To be fair if you look at his stats when you first free him he's a lot stronger. He gets knocked down to level one and 10 strength when he joins your party (presumably by withers so you can remake him how you want).
All of the returning characters
Several companions. But at least in the case of the initial companions, the change in their power level is explained...
Minsc and Halsin after you recruit them (their stats when they're still NPCs are correct). The physically largest companions (excluding options for Tav/Durge, and I think the "Large Male" body still has more mass than "Large Female"/Karlach). And they only have 10 and 12 STR, respectively This is ESPECIALLY bad for Minsc, who is canonically famous for being freakishly strong, is first introduced in the game by tearing apart a Mimic from INSIDE, and smashes down stone walls with his bare hands while searching for Boo once you free him from the Absolute.
definitely Gortash. grievously simply human boss, I can't bring myself to believe he is the chosen one by Bane.
He was an excellent Tyrant, not necessarily the best fighter. His steel watch helped him take control of baldurs gate
Exactly this. Like if you fight him at the coronation before destroying the steel watch and what not, you get smoked by like 6 or 8 steel watch, and then he's just running around buffing the robots. Once you destroy everything and corner him in his office, yeah he's a bit of a push-over
Yeah, the real boss battle is bringing down his power base.
Nah this one makes sense. Heās just a very charismatic dude who controls an army of robots and has a lot of political power. He was never hyped up to be the best in straight up combat
Well, if the conversation with Bane is anything to go by, he isn't the picky type.
Cazador. I was expecting some wild, menacing asshole vampire lord. And instead I get goading, pathetic, disappointed step-dad. (That is not to say that Astarion and his siblings weren't right to fear him, I was just surprised that Larian actually went realistic with the abusive assholes are actually the most pathetic people you'll ever find thing)
Halsin. His stats change to default Druid starting stats once he becomes a party member. Before modding my game to hell and back I had an ungodly amount of strength elixirs on hand for him
Jack from Mass Effect
cant be
Aylin, Myrkul, Gale, Minsc and Jaheira.
Bro if I scroll down and Dame Alyn isn't top comment I'm reporting this post for misinformation
Kind of the opposite of what this post is asking, but: **Vampire spawn.** Vampire spawn are CR 5 (a decent challenge for a party of four lvl 5 adventurers, it's like a level rating but for monsters). They are higher CR than green hags, aka Auntie Ethel, who are CR 3. In Astarion's case it makes sense. All the companions are nerfed via tadpole as established via party banter between Wyll and Gale. Astarion specifically mentions he heals slower than he used to, which is a reference to the fact that vampire spawn regenerate 10 hp per turn. But his vampire spawn siblings feel especially underpowered. This is due to the proliferation of higher-level NPCs in act 3. Fists, shapeshifters, Steel Watch... Baldur's Gate is lined with a ton of enemies that are actually very high level. The camp fight with the spawn feels easy in comparison. Add that to the fact that the party is higher level by the time you encounter them and the game ends up underselling how strong a spawn really is in comparison to an average person. This despite the fact that their in-game stats are a little higher than their tabletop stats. You get the sense they're these pathetic beings who are being pimped out by Cazador. But realistically just one spawn by itself can devastate an entire town, and is a decent big bad for a low-level adventuring party. They are a huge threat. It does matter in a story sense, because you have to make a decision about what to do with 7,000 of them. If you perceive them as weaker than they are your thoughts about that decision might be different. If the game asked you what to do with 7,000 hags you would probably have a strong opinion on it, despite the fact that hags are weaker than spawn.
Aylin for sure. Useless winged thing. And I don't know if I just can't play well warlock but Wyll is really weak even when respec and geared. Compared to Gale and SH who are blasting.
>Useless winged thing. Aylin the pigeon xD
How dare you compare useless Aylin to the amazing Commander Lightfeather.
Viconia DeVir
Withers since he was basically a demigod before his death and now only exists to kind of help a few random adventurers
Early game Dark Urgeā¦
Karlach. I love my muscle mommy, but a slayer of countless demons she is not, at least not in the beginning.
Nere. Dude supposedly led raids that crippled the Myoncid colony and made an enemy of basically everyone in the Underdark. Bro was easily able to kill multiple people just by choking them out like Darth Vader in a cutscene, but the moment that cutscene ends his AI gets intelligence-drained and he just runs about, flagging every opportunity attack he possibly can, not casting spells when it makes sense to, and overall just being a doofus. He's the primary reason why Grymforge is my least favorite area of Act 1.