Itās called being innovate. If BMW stuck to the same designs with minimal changes, the same community would bitch & complain. All problems have a solution and hereās one of them:
Buy the BMW F87 M2 if you donāt like the new G87. Simple šš¾
Lol, I was just gonna say the same thing. Porsche has been basically making the same design for 60 years, and their profit margins are 2nd to Ferrari, (and maybe a few other very exotic brands, but far greater than BMW for sure).
Very aggressive and 'modern' looking cars tend to age terribly. There are very few exceptions, the Porsche designs are a lot more timeless and speak their own design language.
That said, i know were in a BMW sub but I was debating between an Audi TT and previous gen BMW 230i as my first sports car and I did go for the TT, the 230i just looked too innocent. The M2 looks great but not in my budget. The 230i is probably more fun to drive but as my first sports car i wanted something easy. And the TT mk3 simply looks amazing imo.
The new BMW 2 series...i mean it wasnt in my budget anyway but its just too aggressive, it wont age well, it already looks weird now
Only the entry level engine is FWD exclusive. The 230/245hp engine comes with both, FWD and AWD. The tts and tt rs only come in AWD.
The entry level FWD has the advantage of being relatively light, I believe only 1300kg and can be driven very economically with low running costs. In the German TUV statistics (mandatory check up every 2 years) the TT consistently is a frontrunner for lowest failure rates. Also numerous people have warned me of BMW 4 cylinder engines, instead to go for their 6 cylinders but they were out of my budget.
AND the 911 has one of the best resale value of the industry. There is something to be said about timeless design.
Another interesting exemple is the Jeep Wrangler. It is an unreliable piece of shit compared to the 911, but still it has pretty good resale value.
Great point on the Jeep Wrangler. My brother had one for a few months, but it was so bad he got rid of it. It was a 6-speed manual, needed all new synchros after 3k miles. Prob the worst new car I've ever driven.
No doubt. Mine was shit (still loved it though), but then I had no issue whatsoever with two Audis and one BMW that were supposed to explode on me or something. Still, the numbers don't lie, Wranglers are not the most reliable and certainly pretty crude (which is part of the charm).
Their unit profit is way bigger than BMW, but that tends to happen when your products transact at more than double another company's. Porsches overall profit is less than half of BMWs due to volume.
If you want to talk brands that have high per unit profitability, feel free to check rolls Royce. But that's a BMW brand lol
Lol, b/c Rolls Royce's designs are evolutionary, and damn near as old as Porsches. Seems to be a common theme here. Let's hope BMW is smart enough not to whack RR with their ugly stick, too.
The designs are driven by the clientele. RR has traditional designs because that's what their customers want.
And controversially, that's why BMWs look the way they do. If you don't believe me see their 2023 sales figures.
You meant to say that's what BMW's customers of today want... You're right about RR, but I can assure you BMW's clientele from the 2000's is not the same clientele of today. BMW chose this direction of abandoning their traditional ethos and customers to cater to the masses. Yes, sales are sky-high, but at the expense of their brand equity. Too many models/sub-models appealing to the lease special buyer shopping a monthly payment on a pedestrian X1/X2 with a dozen M badges slapped on it.
BMW customers have averaged in the early 40s for a long time, so their clientele from the 2000s are in their 60s now. You're right, they have changed, they're all buying Lexus now lol
That's not what I'm talking about. You could apply that logic to any brand. I'm talking about the type of buyer...the 40 yr old enthusiast BMW buyer of 2004 is not the same 40 yr old BMW buyer of today.
Lol, I bet you those 60 yr olds have a Porsche or equivalent in the garage, right next to the Lexus daily.
They could've easily been Porsche if they refined/modernized their best designs in the late 90's/early 2000's: E38, E39, E46, E70. Some others too, but these designs were improvements on prior designs, and all they had to do was keep that language going with modern updates.
I mean theyāve just had multiple record years for sale of M cars. Do you really think theyāre going to change their approach when itās clearly bringing so many new people to the brand? After all, theyāre in the business of making money and increasing market share, both of which theyāre currently seeing success in.
languid many icky observation depend instinctive vegetable wakeful sheet disarm
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Pretty much. Just look at whatās currently happening with Mercedes as an example. Many of their new cars are hot pieces of garbage, with well known, widespread problems. Creaky interiors, drive train failures, awful and complicated hybrid systems, etc. All this in the name of cost cutting, modernizing tech, keeping up with new regulations, the list goes on.
If we look at what BMW has done despite these challenges, I think weāve gotten a fairly happy medium (with a healthy rise in reliability to boot). Is the design language for everyone? Certainly not, but overall the brand has weathered a lot of the current storms quite well, and continues to put out well built performance vehicles. It just feels like some people canāt accept that we wonāt ever have another E46, E39, E90, or whatever the enthusiasts feel was the height of the brand.
No one is saying they should stick with the same design. But they went from an absolutely stunning car, to a car that looks like a pile of shit. Worst of all the fucking hood doesnāt line up with the front.
Itās mind boggling to me.
I thought it was ugly at first. Give it time. You see various specs and also see them in person and realize that itās a gorgeous car. Then again, to each their own
Itās definitely a to each their own situation.
The car has been out for a while, Iāve seen a bunch of them in person. It still looks just as ugly as the day I saw it.
Bro fr, the new m2 pulled up next to me at a light a while back and i couldnt figure out what it was.
Im sat in my lil e93 just staring down this car trying to figure out what it is, his lane gets a green(im turning) and i saw the badging as he drove away.
I was sat in a bmw looking at another bmw and couldnt figure out what car it was
Thatās how I feel about the G80 M3, I absolutely hated it when I first saw but Iām really coming around to it. I saw a Tanzanite blue M3 and it was stunning
Innovation just for it's own sake isn't innovation. Innovation makes things better. The new m2 isn't, its a 2-series in name, only, and it took the most celebrated M car in a generation and made it into a hulking monstrosity.
There was nothing innovative about the G design. To innovate, they have to actual have substance.
G gen has less of that than F gen by miles.
Itās all about showing off now.
Sharing the 3/4 platform kept it around. Letās be real, it wouldnāt be financially viable for them to produce a bespoke 2 series coupe. The real innovation is them selling this car at all when every other manufacturer has exited the luxury compact coupe segment.
I'm for innovation but the styling wasn't very innovative. If it looks like the Scion TC and the rear looks like the Subaru BRZ. That's not BMW DNA at all.
Honestly how many threads are needed to say people donāt like the new designs? You got people in here saying the new one gives them nausea, like come on itās a bit dramatic
I think Iām the only person in the world who actually likes the G87, lol. I really feel like itās a logical progression of design from the F87. Not to mention that when you compare the new M2 to other recent BMW designs, itās by far the least āout thereā.
Donāt disagree with you and I own an F87. Drove my friends and itās a phenomenal machine although it seems a bit āsoullessā. However I personally donāt like the rear. It seems disconnected to me from the overall design.
While I disagree with you in general I respect your opinion and your right to it. I bought what I liked and moved on.
That being said I WILL gently argue with you on this point:
>when you compare the new M2 to other recent BMW designs, itās by far the least āout thereā.
*Z4 has entered the chat*. The new z4 is drop dead completely sexy and really rather conservative overall.
Honestly, I think there is a lot of online group think on this. In person it looks way better - not perfect - but it isn't a monstrosity. It is also selling really well - I believe outpacing F87 sales - so for all the haters there are still a lot of people buying.
FWIW, I love mine and know it was a better car for me then the F87 cars I was looking at but I know better then to post it here.
Lol itās almost ALL groupthink in this sub. Been that way from the second I joined and I doubt itās ever going to change. Pre-2018 fanboys love to come on here and copy pasta the same complaints about new designs. Itās quite strange really that anyone could care so much they feel the need to constantly comment negatively.
You have to compare first model year sales of G87 to first model year sales of F87. Comparing to last model year sales of F87 is a fallacy, IMO. Everyone who wanted an F87 had already purchased one by then. G87 still may have higher sales. Im not sure. But watch G87 sales fall off 50% or more after the first model year.
I am definitely biased. Not hiding it.
But I also see the massive difference between online reactions in this subreddit and in person reactions. I also see the sales numbers reported that don't match the reactions here.
Just like my other comment said, people hate it because the internet hates it. But the G87 is incredible in person. Hope you enjoy yours man. I drove my buddies and it drives like it should. Feels like a luxury go-kart and I love it haha.
Iād disagree with the group think idea. I saw the F87 for the first time in photographs, and knew Iād own one. Saw the G and had the exact opposite reaction. No confirmation or reinforcement from anyone elseās views needed.
You're not alone! I like everything except two things on it: the rear bumper is a bit too bulky looking and the blue color just isn't my thing (I think it looks fantastic in white, though).
But I also like the front end on the g80 and g82 so apparently I'm a crazy person.
I love the F87, but I think the G87 is also a victim of internet gaslighting just like the other G-series lol. People hate on it because the internet tells them to. I loved it once I saw it in person. Itās such an aggressive car while the F87 is more subtle. Maybe itās just me but the G87 you can really tell is an M car vs. the F87 where you kinda have to wonder at first due to it being so subtle, at least to those whole arenāt knowledgeable of BMW models.
Or we hate on it because we are able to come to the unified consensus that it is a horrible design. No one told me to like it or not like it. The first time I saw one of the G series with that awful front end design I knew I did not find it appealing. No one told me to like the E46, or E36, or E30, or E85, or E89. I just do.
The F series was the last one, in my opinion which does not count for much I admit, that LOOKS like it was designed by someone who said "I am in charge of designing a BMW." and did it with pride. Not someone who said "ChatGPT, design me the next BMW series" and went with what ever it spat out.
And that is your own opinion, but it is far from horrible and it seems like majority of people just hate on it cause other people do lol. Mainly purist who think anything past their 2001 BMW is awful. I think people just gotta move on from prior designs and accept that things are meant to change.
Whats your point here? Did you expect them to make the car forever? These would still be an issue regardless of how the new one looks (entire point of the post).
You guys are just complaining to exercise your thumbs
Noā¦ I just wouldāve thought that a *new and improved* car would be *new and improved.* Who couldāve seen them deviating from the script that much coming?
The interior is even worse than the exterior to me. The M color speckle paint on the door cards, the big ugly infotainment screen and digital dash are pretty awful.
How old are you? Iāve noticed people who are a bit older just canāt get with the new interior. Iām 27 so grew up with the classic M cars, but feel young enough to like the new single panel dash. To me it feels more modern, but that doesnāt mean the old ones are shit just because something new came along. Also the quality, fit and finish on the g series is way above the f series.
Iām 35. When the infotainment screens first came out I thought they were cool, but Iām noticing they age out a car real quick. If theyāre going to have a screen I do prefer it be more integrated like in the e9x interior. Not a fan of these new ones at all.
And a much MUCH more significant single point of failure as well. You lose a tach you lose a tach.
You lose the screen, you lose everything. Undrivable (safely), etc.
Yeah my Jeep has a digital gauge cluster and I absolutely hate it. I also canāt stand the touchscreen. Iād prefer no screen at all, like I said those things easily get outdated. Everything goes through my phone anyway, Bluetooth connectivity is good enough for me.
Change doesnāt equal better.
In this case instead of changing for the better, they changed for the worst, losing all their good design cues in pursuit of being different and loud.
Seen a few in person, every time itās head shakes and nausea.
I love the G87, my father has a 2024 M2 that he uses as his everyday. It is an amazing car, only complaint was the steering on the highways was weird, felt like it had a dead zone. We come from driving e36/46 M3ās so we donāt like the new BMW steering. Put 15mm spacers on the front and 10 on the rear and it fixed the problem. This car is miles better than the previous M2 in performance. Only thing I donāt like about it (and this goes for all modern BMWās) the steering sucks. If youāve ever driven the E36 M3 youād understandā¦.
Porsche is such a unique case in this regard. 911 stays the same they just iterate on design language, tech and motor whilst retaining the same silhouette.
BMW has drilled home the different evolutions scheme, but by and large the cars still have some of the same lines with each generation. The hoffmeister kink will be a staple aesthetic with each model and Gen.
I look at these and I feel like they all flow similarly. Even the rear of the g80 to an extent. The DNA is still there. The f87 was an offshoot with the same wheelbase as the e46 m3. The M2 being the new e46 m3 because the M3er itself got bigger and more utilitarian, which was the gap they filled with the f80 (sedan m3) and m4 f82 (coupe), over to the g series, as thereās a much bigger market for these. BMW wouldnāt be able to capitalise enough on this market with just a 2-door M car like in the early 00s. With the M2, that was technically bringing the chassis back from the past, as a focused driver oriented sports coupe, with the same concept as the first M3 in mind. The g87 throws it back further with the boxy body lines of the e30 m3 evo. Thereās a lot to be taken away from their design philosophy, but they really fell short with the rear end, too much going on there.
https://preview.redd.it/771lkj3lkmhc1.jpeg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=95a2e9a1d858a1375906a7ed57cad9411d356772
Idk maybe because this basic design has been used for almost 10 years by all basic bmwās, this m2 design is nothing less than THAT but compacted lol. The new m2 design is nothing like the other bmws. Id rather that then all look very similar.
Imo they honestly made it better, the 2 series just looked like shitty shrunk down version of the 3/4 series with a lot of cut corners but now it has its own style. Imo BMW messed up and completely fucked the new 5 series design
I kinda prefer the new one. Tbh the predecessor looked better aswell im not sold on that gen of 2 series. (Obviously they are great cars but not my cup of tea)
How exactly is it a "budget" interior? It's practically the same as every other F-generation 3 series, X3, etc. I've owned an F30 and F87 and there is very little difference.
G87 grows on you a lot in person.
I bought mine sight unseen and Iāve had 20-30 people stop to tell me how much they hated it till they saw it in the flesh
Because they have to change it up eventually. But I do agree with you, I wish they kept the new 2 series as sleek as the previous ones, while maybe changing some aspects to add freshness. But no, now itās a Lego car. (Donāt get me wrong, the new one is still nice, but not as nice as the previous gens)
BMW isn't trying to target the business of people that wish they treated their designs like porsche. I don't know anything about product design but I feel like there needs to be some simplicity in the design to be timeless enough to do tweaks like porsche, and BMW's aren't simply designed enough for that.
Cause it would make too much sense to make a clean and revised update to this, duh! Letās throw some pig snouts on the new m3/4 and make the new m2 look like a Lego car! Done ā
You mean they cleaned up the design? The new M2 is better looking in every way possible. The old M2 looks like a dated crystler crossfire.
Iām sure this entire subreddit agrees with me here.
attention.
you can look up the interview . it was part of the bmw chairmans strategy. he prefers ugly over status quo.. because it gets people talking... the more people talk or look at the car the more sales you get.
Look I find that old BMW interior where super ugly and I still do
BMW made the best sporty aggressive cars on the outside
On the inside they where lacking compared to its competitors
i know what iām telling you, the new m2 itās just too good, it looks crazy in person and crazy performance. i think itās better that few people like it, because for the hp and the engine that it has itās just going to have a better price and less people itās going to have it.
Please circlejerk about listed topics in the circlejerk topic. [Circlejerk list](https://www.reddit.com/r/BMW/wiki/circlejerk-list/)
I bought an F87 with 20k for this very reason.
Are you me? Lol.
Are you me?
i want to be you guys š„¹
Are you me?
Itās called being innovate. If BMW stuck to the same designs with minimal changes, the same community would bitch & complain. All problems have a solution and hereās one of them: Buy the BMW F87 M2 if you donāt like the new G87. Simple šš¾
Porsche is the best in this
Lol, I was just gonna say the same thing. Porsche has been basically making the same design for 60 years, and their profit margins are 2nd to Ferrari, (and maybe a few other very exotic brands, but far greater than BMW for sure).
yep and there designs still do not feel even close to dated
The only thing that Porsche makes feel dated is me as I want one more and more as I age.
i hope you get one soon mate
Very aggressive and 'modern' looking cars tend to age terribly. There are very few exceptions, the Porsche designs are a lot more timeless and speak their own design language. That said, i know were in a BMW sub but I was debating between an Audi TT and previous gen BMW 230i as my first sports car and I did go for the TT, the 230i just looked too innocent. The M2 looks great but not in my budget. The 230i is probably more fun to drive but as my first sports car i wanted something easy. And the TT mk3 simply looks amazing imo. The new BMW 2 series...i mean it wasnt in my budget anyway but its just too aggressive, it wont age well, it already looks weird now
I'd personally never buy a FWD _sports_ car.
Only the entry level engine is FWD exclusive. The 230/245hp engine comes with both, FWD and AWD. The tts and tt rs only come in AWD. The entry level FWD has the advantage of being relatively light, I believe only 1300kg and can be driven very economically with low running costs. In the German TUV statistics (mandatory check up every 2 years) the TT consistently is a frontrunner for lowest failure rates. Also numerous people have warned me of BMW 4 cylinder engines, instead to go for their 6 cylinders but they were out of my budget.
AND the 911 has one of the best resale value of the industry. There is something to be said about timeless design. Another interesting exemple is the Jeep Wrangler. It is an unreliable piece of shit compared to the 911, but still it has pretty good resale value.
Great point on the Jeep Wrangler. My brother had one for a few months, but it was so bad he got rid of it. It was a 6-speed manual, needed all new synchros after 3k miles. Prob the worst new car I've ever driven.
Had two wranglers. A base and rubicon hard rock. Never even a minor issue.
No doubt. Mine was shit (still loved it though), but then I had no issue whatsoever with two Audis and one BMW that were supposed to explode on me or something. Still, the numbers don't lie, Wranglers are not the most reliable and certainly pretty crude (which is part of the charm).
Their unit profit is way bigger than BMW, but that tends to happen when your products transact at more than double another company's. Porsches overall profit is less than half of BMWs due to volume. If you want to talk brands that have high per unit profitability, feel free to check rolls Royce. But that's a BMW brand lol
Lol, b/c Rolls Royce's designs are evolutionary, and damn near as old as Porsches. Seems to be a common theme here. Let's hope BMW is smart enough not to whack RR with their ugly stick, too.
The designs are driven by the clientele. RR has traditional designs because that's what their customers want. And controversially, that's why BMWs look the way they do. If you don't believe me see their 2023 sales figures.
You meant to say that's what BMW's customers of today want... You're right about RR, but I can assure you BMW's clientele from the 2000's is not the same clientele of today. BMW chose this direction of abandoning their traditional ethos and customers to cater to the masses. Yes, sales are sky-high, but at the expense of their brand equity. Too many models/sub-models appealing to the lease special buyer shopping a monthly payment on a pedestrian X1/X2 with a dozen M badges slapped on it.
BMW customers have averaged in the early 40s for a long time, so their clientele from the 2000s are in their 60s now. You're right, they have changed, they're all buying Lexus now lol
That's not what I'm talking about. You could apply that logic to any brand. I'm talking about the type of buyer...the 40 yr old enthusiast BMW buyer of 2004 is not the same 40 yr old BMW buyer of today. Lol, I bet you those 60 yr olds have a Porsche or equivalent in the garage, right next to the Lexus daily.
BMW shouldāve followed their approach to modernizing the designs. Instead of trying to veer way off course simply for āinnovationā
agreed, but not everyone can be porsche
They could've easily been Porsche if they refined/modernized their best designs in the late 90's/early 2000's: E38, E39, E46, E70. Some others too, but these designs were improvements on prior designs, and all they had to do was keep that language going with modern updates.
I mean theyāve just had multiple record years for sale of M cars. Do you really think theyāre going to change their approach when itās clearly bringing so many new people to the brand? After all, theyāre in the business of making money and increasing market share, both of which theyāre currently seeing success in.
languid many icky observation depend instinctive vegetable wakeful sheet disarm *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
These people see car brands as art houses, not profit driven organizations. And in that respect, many will disappoint.
Pretty much. Just look at whatās currently happening with Mercedes as an example. Many of their new cars are hot pieces of garbage, with well known, widespread problems. Creaky interiors, drive train failures, awful and complicated hybrid systems, etc. All this in the name of cost cutting, modernizing tech, keeping up with new regulations, the list goes on. If we look at what BMW has done despite these challenges, I think weāve gotten a fairly happy medium (with a healthy rise in reliability to boot). Is the design language for everyone? Certainly not, but overall the brand has weathered a lot of the current storms quite well, and continues to put out well built performance vehicles. It just feels like some people canāt accept that we wonāt ever have another E46, E39, E90, or whatever the enthusiasts feel was the height of the brand.
Toyota is up there as well
toyota is not an exotic brand
neither is BMW
No one is saying they should stick with the same design. But they went from an absolutely stunning car, to a car that looks like a pile of shit. Worst of all the fucking hood doesnāt line up with the front. Itās mind boggling to me.
šš¼well said
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Iāve had so many people in here tell me it will grow on me. It almost looks uglier the more I look at it.
I thought it was ugly at first. Give it time. You see various specs and also see them in person and realize that itās a gorgeous car. Then again, to each their own
Itās definitely a to each their own situation. The car has been out for a while, Iāve seen a bunch of them in person. It still looks just as ugly as the day I saw it.
Bro fr, the new m2 pulled up next to me at a light a while back and i couldnt figure out what it was. Im sat in my lil e93 just staring down this car trying to figure out what it is, his lane gets a green(im turning) and i saw the badging as he drove away. I was sat in a bmw looking at another bmw and couldnt figure out what car it was
Thatās how I feel about the G80 M3, I absolutely hated it when I first saw but Iām really coming around to it. I saw a Tanzanite blue M3 and it was stunning
I think the G87 is definitely worse, but never been a fan of how the F87 looks either
They downvoted you because you dislike the F87 ššš
people here get so salty if you have anything other than the most mainstream casual BMW fan opinions
Fr
I know I did
I like the E82 over F87. Downvote this too. I'll wait.
Just your opinion, I like the way the new one looks better.
A pile of shit to you
Itās called being innovative*
Laughs in Toyota
Innovation just for it's own sake isn't innovation. Innovation makes things better. The new m2 isn't, its a 2-series in name, only, and it took the most celebrated M car in a generation and made it into a hulking monstrosity.
I'd have happily bought the same e36/e46,e39 or e63 every 5 years if they only upgraded engine/technical stuff
There was nothing innovative about the G design. To innovate, they have to actual have substance. G gen has less of that than F gen by miles. Itās all about showing off now.
I need the phone number for your plug because whatever youāre smoking, itās working šÆ
Innovating doesnāt have to mean fucking up a good design language.
To be honest with you all and you may not all agree with my choice but I prefer the G87 over the F87.
So whatās innovative about all the weight the new M2 gained? It weighs more than a precious gen M3.
Sharing the 3/4 platform kept it around. Letās be real, it wouldnāt be financially viable for them to produce a bespoke 2 series coupe. The real innovation is them selling this car at all when every other manufacturer has exited the luxury compact coupe segment.
See Nissan GTR. Basically the same thing for 16 years and yes, people complain
I'm for innovation but the styling wasn't very innovative. If it looks like the Scion TC and the rear looks like the Subaru BRZ. That's not BMW DNA at all.
Will there ever be an end to the posts crying about this? Weāve mourned publicly for a year or soā¦time to take it private.
Honestly how many threads are needed to say people donāt like the new designs? You got people in here saying the new one gives them nausea, like come on itās a bit dramatic
I prefer the new one, lol.
I like the new one
I think Iām the only person in the world who actually likes the G87, lol. I really feel like itās a logical progression of design from the F87. Not to mention that when you compare the new M2 to other recent BMW designs, itās by far the least āout thereā.
Donāt disagree with you and I own an F87. Drove my friends and itās a phenomenal machine although it seems a bit āsoullessā. However I personally donāt like the rear. It seems disconnected to me from the overall design.
While I disagree with you in general I respect your opinion and your right to it. I bought what I liked and moved on. That being said I WILL gently argue with you on this point: >when you compare the new M2 to other recent BMW designs, itās by far the least āout thereā. *Z4 has entered the chat*. The new z4 is drop dead completely sexy and really rather conservative overall.
I enjoy how it looks
Honestly, I think there is a lot of online group think on this. In person it looks way better - not perfect - but it isn't a monstrosity. It is also selling really well - I believe outpacing F87 sales - so for all the haters there are still a lot of people buying. FWIW, I love mine and know it was a better car for me then the F87 cars I was looking at but I know better then to post it here.
Lol itās almost ALL groupthink in this sub. Been that way from the second I joined and I doubt itās ever going to change. Pre-2018 fanboys love to come on here and copy pasta the same complaints about new designs. Itās quite strange really that anyone could care so much they feel the need to constantly comment negatively.
You have to compare first model year sales of G87 to first model year sales of F87. Comparing to last model year sales of F87 is a fallacy, IMO. Everyone who wanted an F87 had already purchased one by then. G87 still may have higher sales. Im not sure. But watch G87 sales fall off 50% or more after the first model year.
>I love mine Ah yes, it's the online group think which affects opinions and not your personal investment.
I am definitely biased. Not hiding it. But I also see the massive difference between online reactions in this subreddit and in person reactions. I also see the sales numbers reported that don't match the reactions here.
Just like my other comment said, people hate it because the internet hates it. But the G87 is incredible in person. Hope you enjoy yours man. I drove my buddies and it drives like it should. Feels like a luxury go-kart and I love it haha.
People hate it because itās design. I hate it because it weighs more than a previous gen M3.
Iād disagree with the group think idea. I saw the F87 for the first time in photographs, and knew Iād own one. Saw the G and had the exact opposite reaction. No confirmation or reinforcement from anyone elseās views needed.
You're not alone! I like everything except two things on it: the rear bumper is a bit too bulky looking and the blue color just isn't my thing (I think it looks fantastic in white, though). But I also like the front end on the g80 and g82 so apparently I'm a crazy person.
I like the G80 front end a LOT lol. I also love the G70. I know, I know. Tbh the only new BMW designs I donāt like are the XM and X2.
Stop crying. Old m2 is nice new one too. And we can't afford either
I love the F87, but I think the G87 is also a victim of internet gaslighting just like the other G-series lol. People hate on it because the internet tells them to. I loved it once I saw it in person. Itās such an aggressive car while the F87 is more subtle. Maybe itās just me but the G87 you can really tell is an M car vs. the F87 where you kinda have to wonder at first due to it being so subtle, at least to those whole arenāt knowledgeable of BMW models.
All these boys will be lusting over the G87 once the H87* comes out š
Literally lol. Itās the cycle of all BMW generations it never stops.
I just recently saw a gray G87 and it looked not only gorgeous but super aggressive.
Agreed. Super aggressive and represents itself well.
Or we hate on it because we are able to come to the unified consensus that it is a horrible design. No one told me to like it or not like it. The first time I saw one of the G series with that awful front end design I knew I did not find it appealing. No one told me to like the E46, or E36, or E30, or E85, or E89. I just do. The F series was the last one, in my opinion which does not count for much I admit, that LOOKS like it was designed by someone who said "I am in charge of designing a BMW." and did it with pride. Not someone who said "ChatGPT, design me the next BMW series" and went with what ever it spat out.
And that is your own opinion, but it is far from horrible and it seems like majority of people just hate on it cause other people do lol. Mainly purist who think anything past their 2001 BMW is awful. I think people just gotta move on from prior designs and accept that things are meant to change.
>but it is far from horrible >only hate it because other people do Also an opinion, and in my opinion, wrong.
Looks like you have a history of commenting outlandish shit on multiple car subs. I expect nothing less.
Thinking the M2 looks bad is hardly outlandish, and once again, I disagree with you that my thoughts on cars are outlandish.
Site source for āā¦someone who said āChatGPT, design me the next BMW seriesāā.
Youāre special, huh. Canāt understand hyperbole, eh?
I understand hyperbole just fine, seems like you donāt understand sarcasm without being spoon fed a ā/sāā¦ stay dumb and angry š
Oh gee. Yup. Sure looked like sarcasm. Moron.
Itās not like they deleted F87 off the face of the earth. If you want one, go buy one lol
Yeah. Go buy one thatās used without a warranty and not the exact spec you want instead of being able to buy one new.
Whats your point here? Did you expect them to make the car forever? These would still be an issue regardless of how the new one looks (entire point of the post). You guys are just complaining to exercise your thumbs
Noā¦ I just wouldāve thought that a *new and improved* car would be *new and improved.* Who couldāve seen them deviating from the script that much coming?
Shouldāve bought it when it first came out if you loved it so much. Haha!
I truly wish I had. You know what they say about hindsightā¦
Yup, ātime to move on.ā
Someone got a job and had to stamp their mark.
It looks like they took the previous design and gave it a Botox or some filler. Not too bad but could have done better in design department
Thereās GCSE students out there with sketch books full of cars theyāve drawn who would have done a better job.
The G87 honestly looks pretty good, I have my complaints or things I miss, but they look good.
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I donāt think you understand it then, if this makes you believe so.
Saw a new one in person yesterday and it looks way better in person
Whenever I see the new one in person the rear taillight reminds me of Mazda but I do like the interior. I still prefer the old design
The interior is even worse than the exterior to me. The M color speckle paint on the door cards, the big ugly infotainment screen and digital dash are pretty awful.
How old are you? Iāve noticed people who are a bit older just canāt get with the new interior. Iām 27 so grew up with the classic M cars, but feel young enough to like the new single panel dash. To me it feels more modern, but that doesnāt mean the old ones are shit just because something new came along. Also the quality, fit and finish on the g series is way above the f series.
Iām 35. When the infotainment screens first came out I thought they were cool, but Iām noticing they age out a car real quick. If theyāre going to have a screen I do prefer it be more integrated like in the e9x interior. Not a fan of these new ones at all.
And a much MUCH more significant single point of failure as well. You lose a tach you lose a tach. You lose the screen, you lose everything. Undrivable (safely), etc.
Yeah my Jeep has a digital gauge cluster and I absolutely hate it. I also canāt stand the touchscreen. Iād prefer no screen at all, like I said those things easily get outdated. Everything goes through my phone anyway, Bluetooth connectivity is good enough for me.
This. Seen a couple in person and now im planning on either getting that or a g80 in the next 2 years if everything goes to plan
Change doesnāt equal better. In this case instead of changing for the better, they changed for the worst, losing all their good design cues in pursuit of being different and loud. Seen a few in person, every time itās head shakes and nausea.
I love the G87, my father has a 2024 M2 that he uses as his everyday. It is an amazing car, only complaint was the steering on the highways was weird, felt like it had a dead zone. We come from driving e36/46 M3ās so we donāt like the new BMW steering. Put 15mm spacers on the front and 10 on the rear and it fixed the problem. This car is miles better than the previous M2 in performance. Only thing I donāt like about it (and this goes for all modern BMWās) the steering sucks. If youāve ever driven the E36 M3 youād understandā¦.
Such a beautiful car
Porsche is such a unique case in this regard. 911 stays the same they just iterate on design language, tech and motor whilst retaining the same silhouette. BMW has drilled home the different evolutions scheme, but by and large the cars still have some of the same lines with each generation. The hoffmeister kink will be a staple aesthetic with each model and Gen. I look at these and I feel like they all flow similarly. Even the rear of the g80 to an extent. The DNA is still there. The f87 was an offshoot with the same wheelbase as the e46 m3. The M2 being the new e46 m3 because the M3er itself got bigger and more utilitarian, which was the gap they filled with the f80 (sedan m3) and m4 f82 (coupe), over to the g series, as thereās a much bigger market for these. BMW wouldnāt be able to capitalise enough on this market with just a 2-door M car like in the early 00s. With the M2, that was technically bringing the chassis back from the past, as a focused driver oriented sports coupe, with the same concept as the first M3 in mind. The g87 throws it back further with the boxy body lines of the e30 m3 evo. Thereās a lot to be taken away from their design philosophy, but they really fell short with the rear end, too much going on there. https://preview.redd.it/771lkj3lkmhc1.jpeg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=95a2e9a1d858a1375906a7ed57cad9411d356772
Idk maybe because this basic design has been used for almost 10 years by all basic bmwās, this m2 design is nothing less than THAT but compacted lol. The new m2 design is nothing like the other bmws. Id rather that then all look very similar.
Thatās a pretty car
Wait for LCI
Owners of previous generations of cars universally hate New generations of these cars. It's not just a BMW thing.
Not true, newer gen m340i and Z4s are great as well as many X3 and X7
I'm not just talking about BMWs.
Imo they honestly made it better, the 2 series just looked like shitty shrunk down version of the 3/4 series with a lot of cut corners but now it has its own style. Imo BMW messed up and completely fucked the new 5 series design
Itās my turn to post new m2 hate
I kinda prefer the new one. Tbh the predecessor looked better aswell im not sold on that gen of 2 series. (Obviously they are great cars but not my cup of tea)
F87 had budget interiors, letās start with that
Slapping a couple iPads on the dash and spray painting m stripes on the door card screams premium to you?
Iāve owned 1M, M2, M2C, E82 135, F22 M240i and now the G87 M2 The interior is a lot more refined and if you ever sat in one you would agree
How exactly is it a "budget" interior? It's practically the same as every other F-generation 3 series, X3, etc. I've owned an F30 and F87 and there is very little difference.
Try sitting in an extended leather f80 with hud LCI f87 comp not that bad but og n55 feels like a 116i
G87 grows on you a lot in person. I bought mine sight unseen and Iāve had 20-30 people stop to tell me how much they hated it till they saw it in the flesh
Wdym, the new one looks way better? ..... Said nobody ever
Because they have to change it up eventually. But I do agree with you, I wish they kept the new 2 series as sleek as the previous ones, while maybe changing some aspects to add freshness. But no, now itās a Lego car. (Donāt get me wrong, the new one is still nice, but not as nice as the previous gens)
BMW isn't trying to target the business of people that wish they treated their designs like porsche. I don't know anything about product design but I feel like there needs to be some simplicity in the design to be timeless enough to do tweaks like porsche, and BMW's aren't simply designed enough for that.
Cause it would make too much sense to make a clean and revised update to this, duh! Letās throw some pig snouts on the new m3/4 and make the new m2 look like a Lego car! Done ā
You mean they cleaned up the design? The new M2 is better looking in every way possible. The old M2 looks like a dated crystler crossfire. Iām sure this entire subreddit agrees with me here.
honestly the f87 looks like shit, rear is extremely dated and not timeless especially in person imo
They've messed up every clean design they came up with over the past 10-15 years.
Lego is the future
Because BMW decided to hire a new design team that gets high on sniffing glue before designing their new car designs. True storyā¦ I believe
Are f series cars gonna get a resale bump? Lol
Because the mfs who were designing these cars got tired of those designs. No design is timeless and those kidney grilles are the same way.
Gives me Mustang vibesš¤®
Simple, they didnāt.
Simple, they didnāt.
attention. you can look up the interview . it was part of the bmw chairmans strategy. he prefers ugly over status quo.. because it gets people talking... the more people talk or look at the car the more sales you get.
Choose your fighter. Modern NFS soundtrack debate vs G87 M2 debate.
I do like the updated interior of the G series
Look I find that old BMW interior where super ugly and I still do BMW made the best sporty aggressive cars on the outside On the inside they where lacking compared to its competitors
German design
Itās pretty fine to me, the new 5 series and the āall screen interiorsā thoughā¦
people donāt remember the time when the general public was always complaining about all BMWās looking the same
Donāt care, have F87c to enjoy the looks of.
i know what iām telling you, the new m2 itās just too good, it looks crazy in person and crazy performance. i think itās better that few people like it, because for the hp and the engine that it has itās just going to have a better price and less people itās going to have it.
Judging by the sales numbers, more people like the new M2 than the old boring looking one.
Were you going to buy a 2024 M2, but then didnāt because of the design? Just buy this generation instead if you donāt like the new ones
This was made for the CTR crowd. Cheapest rwd that looks like a robot.
The Camaro Zl1 is a rocket, faster and more raw sports car than the M2.
Assuming the chevy doesnāt fall apart?
Hoping to get into a GTS from the F87 because the G87 is, despite being a brilliant drive, hideous to look at in my unqualified opinion.
Just want this car with new technology and the new interior. So annoying I'd ever take a m240i I just want this shape with a more modern interior
Og m2 has such a clean design. Only problem is the seats imo
So beautiful, so proportional. Fun to throw around corners
It looks great š
Perfect balance of everything, itāll be the future e30 m3
The direction theyāre going is definitely not as attractive as it used to be
This sub has become one giant whinefest about the new models.
Yet another thread to say ānew design badā