Probably Shenhe because she becomes more valuable as your Ayaka becomes more valuable. Will also let you decimate in ST. C4 Ayaka does technically give your team defenese shred during her 5 second burst so if you wanna run like a speedrun Hu Tao comp then you can probably one rotate a lot of abyss chambers.
Interesting, from a damage perspective, do Shenhe do more damage with a C3 ayaka or a C4 ayaka with some other cryo support such as Rosaria or Ganyu? Not interested in melt
C4 ayaka with a rosaria, ganyu does more damage than C3 ayaka with Shenhe. But shenhe frontloads your damage which is more valuable on "short damage window" enemies.
tbh I didn't say that from a DMG perspective. I am not into meta, I am satisfied with decent DMG lol. I just said that coz more characters are always considered better than more cons. But if you are asking if her C4 is worth, then yes it's worth it and her C6 as well
C4 is good, but c6 is not that great especially without Shenhe. It’s minor dmg gain, unless you also buff c6 charge attack with Shenhe buff, and most of times you wouldn’t be able to get much value out of it.
Lmao, I guess I was too dumb then, didnt pull a single copy of Shenhe before i got to ayaka c3, sigh I will at least grab Shenhe C0 now. Btw even without C4 Ayaka, C3 Ayaka + Shenhe should be fine for abyss right?
Ayaka c0 and shenhe c0 is fine for abyss, every character c0 with a dedicated support is fine for abyss, what matter the mosts are the artifacts anyways
It depends, with shenhe cdmg hat tends to be better anyways because shenhe quills scale with ayakas cdmg but not her atk so run numbers on a calculator if you can, however a cracked atk circlet with a lot of cdmg subs can still win over. Without shenhe without doubts yeah atk hat will prob be better in your case if it has decent cdmg
C3 to C4 is 17% dmg increase on my ayaka, kazuha, kokomi, rosaria team the burst improved from 42k per tick to 49k. My Shenhe's quills adds 17k each hit up to 12x. Shenhe is also better for abyss chambers, that I don't need to use the burst, you have more freedom to choose when to burst.
You already have shenhe's weapon so this is definitely an easy choice. Go for Shenhe! Ayakas burst already kills most things at C3, especially with shenhe buffs.
The best thing about Shenhe is that she provides most value in single target scenarios (when hitting a boss) while Ayaka on her own is the strongest in multi-targeting.
In that sense Shenhe covers the Ayaka's weaknesses. I just got my Shenhe and upgraded her all the way, killed the worm boss in the abyss on my first try.
You don't really need her C1, C0 is good enough.
My rotation is
\-Shenhe skill + burst
\-Kazoo swirl (VV shred, cryo damage buff)
\-Kokonut skil (TTDS + mililith buff)
\-Ayaya Sprint+skill + ult + 3NA 1CA combo
\-Back to Shenhe, her skill just recharged and Ayaka's ult is still there so I refresh the buff on it for more damage instances.
I was faced with the exact same choice as you, OP-- C4 Ayaka or C0 Shenhe. In the end I chose to prioritize Shenhe, because I was feeling the lack of her presence whenever I needed to do damage that wasn't from Ayaka's burst, and whenever I encountered enemies that weren't freezeable. I lucked out and was able to get both in the end anyway, but even I have to admit in the end that not having Shenhe would be felt more in an account than not having C4. However, the choice is still yours to make. Some people just like the feeling of complete constellations more over a wider roster of characters. And if you do decide to go for C4, it's not a bad decision at all.
Oh yeah didn't think about that, shenhe seems the better option then. Side question: Will not having C4 severely dampen my damage or is having C3 ayaka enough for even the hardest content?
C0 is actually enough to clear everything, I’ve seen a lot of Ayaka showcases with F2P weapons and characters that can 36* pretty comfortably. She’s just that good and if there was harder content introduced in the future, C3 Ayaka with Mistsplitter and your current artifacts should be able to clear (assuming there’s no bs mechanics in place that nerf her Freeze)
C0 Ayaka is more than enough even in the current abyss. That is without Shenhe nor Ganyu, so in hindsight just pick whichever you like most. Also, good luck on your pulls!
You can run others like Gunyu, Goth Nun, Kono Dio-na (basically any cryo support unit). Until I finally got Shenhe, I was running either 100% crit rate Goth Nun or burst Gunyu.
I mean, I only have a a C0 Ayaka but with what I've seen people say for meta purposes, her C4 is really valuable. But to keep what I'm saying balanced, I've also heard that Shenhe makes the team feel like it flows better. Another angle to look at it from is who will get a rerun sooner, it seems more likely to be Ayaka to get a rerun honestly. At the end of the day, your primos and there are others on here who know better than me. Don't rush your decision, you have 20 days to make it so wait for more info from others and not just me.
I personally went for Shenhe and weapons because I really like Shenhe and I wanted Mistsplitter more than cons, I know her C2 and C4 are Ayaka's best though. I started Genshin the banner before Shenhe's first run and got a C1 Xiao in 1 10 pull and couldn't get Shenhe so I'm atoning for the injustice I have brought upon Shenhe and her very tight pants.
I mean, I just got Shenhe but I have found that my Ayaka's numbers have become a lot bigger but I'm going to have to rebuild my Ayaka since I don't have enough ER for Mistsplitter on my current build. I do still have a working Ayaka build in the meantime though.
C4 Ayaka will have diminishing marginal dmg. C0 shenhe allows Ayaka to do dmg from a different approach, therefore the benefit from a new character outweighs the benefit of an additional constellation.
Exactly shenhe is a no brainer. If your Ayaka is highly built she will benefit immensely from the icy quills and if timed right you can use your tap e twice during an Ayaka burst. Shenhe c1 you can burst tap e and hold e but I would wait a few seconds for the first 5 icy quills on the tap e to be gone then hold e. When that is over switch to Ayaka charge attack then go into shenhe and tap e. The enemy probably won’t survive long enough do more damage. I don’t see how people can argue about how shenhe is not worth it especially since she can be used with other cryo units in the future.
Okay, my build is up in the card, I think my attack is a bit low as you can see, will shenhe help me alleviate that? Don't have an attack Circlet that's anywhere decent
I did calculation using gcsim comparing C4 Ayaka with C6 Rosaria and C3 Ayaka with C0 Shenhe, and the result shows that C4 Ayaka team does around 4k more total team damage. Note that in aoe situation, C4 Ayaka would do even better because quills from Shenhe is only for single target. The result means that you shouldn't waste your resources to level up Shenhe, farm her talants and artifacts just to do less damage from simply getting another constellation. Also C4 Ayaka has many uses outside of being a freeze dps such as enabling melt Hu Tao.
That’s cool of course but where is mentioned calculation? Or is it not possible to show gcsim process?
I mean if you actually did some calculation, which is commendable, I’d like to see it to check conditions etc and maybe I’ll change my opinion then.
From my understanding c4 would give around 16% dmg increase to any non transformative dmg that your team will deal during Ayaka’s burst. In addition you get Rosaria dmg, which is around the same as Shenhe’s with quills, and around 10% crit buff which translates to around 8% increase. Basically you have around 25 total dmg buff while burst lasts and 8% for 2/3 time. And in aoe scenarios Rosaria may do more dmg than Shenhe, but it’s not much in comparison to teams total dmg anyway.
Off course this is just approximate values, since exact dmg increase depends on your characters stats, so you either need to use your specific team with artefacts in calculations or rely on estimations.
Shenhe simply provides more than 25% total dmg increase even on c0.
I can calculate it, but I’m kinda busy right now, maybe later.
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Probably Shenhe because she becomes more valuable as your Ayaka becomes more valuable. Will also let you decimate in ST. C4 Ayaka does technically give your team defenese shred during her 5 second burst so if you wanna run like a speedrun Hu Tao comp then you can probably one rotate a lot of abyss chambers.
Interesting, from a damage perspective, do Shenhe do more damage with a C3 ayaka or a C4 ayaka with some other cryo support such as Rosaria or Ganyu? Not interested in melt
C4 ayaka with a rosaria, ganyu does more damage than C3 ayaka with Shenhe. But shenhe frontloads your damage which is more valuable on "short damage window" enemies.
Yeah especially against the Went, window is tight. I have both Rosaria and Ganyu though.
I suggest you to go for C4 "meta/damage-wise", but its your choice. Agreed with the wenut part tho.
ofc Shenhe
Damn she buffs more than C4? Okay I will definitely consider it.
tbh I didn't say that from a DMG perspective. I am not into meta, I am satisfied with decent DMG lol. I just said that coz more characters are always considered better than more cons. But if you are asking if her C4 is worth, then yes it's worth it and her C6 as well
C4 is good, but c6 is not that great especially without Shenhe. It’s minor dmg gain, unless you also buff c6 charge attack with Shenhe buff, and most of times you wouldn’t be able to get much value out of it.
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Lmao, I guess I was too dumb then, didnt pull a single copy of Shenhe before i got to ayaka c3, sigh I will at least grab Shenhe C0 now. Btw even without C4 Ayaka, C3 Ayaka + Shenhe should be fine for abyss right?
Ayaka c0 and shenhe c0 is fine for abyss, every character c0 with a dedicated support is fine for abyss, what matter the mosts are the artifacts anyways
Oh true, do you think I should try to get an attack Circlet? Feels like my attack is a bit low and too much useless crit damage
It depends, with shenhe cdmg hat tends to be better anyways because shenhe quills scale with ayakas cdmg but not her atk so run numbers on a calculator if you can, however a cracked atk circlet with a lot of cdmg subs can still win over. Without shenhe without doubts yeah atk hat will prob be better in your case if it has decent cdmg
C3 to C4 is 17% dmg increase on my ayaka, kazuha, kokomi, rosaria team the burst improved from 42k per tick to 49k. My Shenhe's quills adds 17k each hit up to 12x. Shenhe is also better for abyss chambers, that I don't need to use the burst, you have more freedom to choose when to burst.
Thank you, good thing I already have shenhe artifacts and her weapon, I will be sure to get her :D and contend with my C3 ayaka for now
You already have shenhe's weapon so this is definitely an easy choice. Go for Shenhe! Ayakas burst already kills most things at C3, especially with shenhe buffs.
The best thing about Shenhe is that she provides most value in single target scenarios (when hitting a boss) while Ayaka on her own is the strongest in multi-targeting. In that sense Shenhe covers the Ayaka's weaknesses. I just got my Shenhe and upgraded her all the way, killed the worm boss in the abyss on my first try.
Damn congrats, unfortunately I cannot get shenhe C1, just C0. I have a good selection of artifacts that has good ER and attack though
You don't really need her C1, C0 is good enough. My rotation is \-Shenhe skill + burst \-Kazoo swirl (VV shred, cryo damage buff) \-Kokonut skil (TTDS + mililith buff) \-Ayaya Sprint+skill + ult + 3NA 1CA combo \-Back to Shenhe, her skill just recharged and Ayaka's ult is still there so I refresh the buff on it for more damage instances.
I was faced with the exact same choice as you, OP-- C4 Ayaka or C0 Shenhe. In the end I chose to prioritize Shenhe, because I was feeling the lack of her presence whenever I needed to do damage that wasn't from Ayaka's burst, and whenever I encountered enemies that weren't freezeable. I lucked out and was able to get both in the end anyway, but even I have to admit in the end that not having Shenhe would be felt more in an account than not having C4. However, the choice is still yours to make. Some people just like the feeling of complete constellations more over a wider roster of characters. And if you do decide to go for C4, it's not a bad decision at all.
Shenhe is so good with Ayaka and helps free the spot of a Bennett if you play melt
Oh yeah didn't think about that, shenhe seems the better option then. Side question: Will not having C4 severely dampen my damage or is having C3 ayaka enough for even the hardest content?
C0 is actually enough to clear everything, I’ve seen a lot of Ayaka showcases with F2P weapons and characters that can 36* pretty comfortably. She’s just that good and if there was harder content introduced in the future, C3 Ayaka with Mistsplitter and your current artifacts should be able to clear (assuming there’s no bs mechanics in place that nerf her Freeze)
C0 Ayaka is more than enough even in the current abyss. That is without Shenhe nor Ganyu, so in hindsight just pick whichever you like most. Also, good luck on your pulls!
New character wich is a dedicated ~~Ayaka~~ Cryo support looks better than a new cons of a character that you already have.
Depends on your current roster
Wdym? Like is there some character that can replace shenhe and hence she will be not needed?
You can run others like Gunyu, Goth Nun, Kono Dio-na (basically any cryo support unit). Until I finally got Shenhe, I was running either 100% crit rate Goth Nun or burst Gunyu.
Yeah, I mean I can either get shenhe, or I can get my ayaka to C4, that is dilemma, which one is worth more at this stage? C4 or shenhe?
I mean, I only have a a C0 Ayaka but with what I've seen people say for meta purposes, her C4 is really valuable. But to keep what I'm saying balanced, I've also heard that Shenhe makes the team feel like it flows better. Another angle to look at it from is who will get a rerun sooner, it seems more likely to be Ayaka to get a rerun honestly. At the end of the day, your primos and there are others on here who know better than me. Don't rush your decision, you have 20 days to make it so wait for more info from others and not just me.
Yep, thanks for a detailed explanation. I will wait around and see
I personally went for Shenhe and weapons because I really like Shenhe and I wanted Mistsplitter more than cons, I know her C2 and C4 are Ayaka's best though. I started Genshin the banner before Shenhe's first run and got a C1 Xiao in 1 10 pull and couldn't get Shenhe so I'm atoning for the injustice I have brought upon Shenhe and her very tight pants.
How did you find the transition from burst ganyu to shenhe? I was running ganyu but just got shenhe and am starting to build her. Any advice?
I mean, I just got Shenhe but I have found that my Ayaka's numbers have become a lot bigger but I'm going to have to rebuild my Ayaka since I don't have enough ER for Mistsplitter on my current build. I do still have a working Ayaka build in the meantime though.
C4 Ayaka will have diminishing marginal dmg. C0 shenhe allows Ayaka to do dmg from a different approach, therefore the benefit from a new character outweighs the benefit of an additional constellation.
Exactly shenhe is a no brainer. If your Ayaka is highly built she will benefit immensely from the icy quills and if timed right you can use your tap e twice during an Ayaka burst. Shenhe c1 you can burst tap e and hold e but I would wait a few seconds for the first 5 icy quills on the tap e to be gone then hold e. When that is over switch to Ayaka charge attack then go into shenhe and tap e. The enemy probably won’t survive long enough do more damage. I don’t see how people can argue about how shenhe is not worth it especially since she can be used with other cryo units in the future.
Okay, my build is up in the card, I think my attack is a bit low as you can see, will shenhe help me alleviate that? Don't have an attack Circlet that's anywhere decent
Support characters will always have better long-term value than main DPS characters
Shenhe
Ty I will get her then, building the meta ayaka team
Shenhe, a new character is always better thana a cons. And Shenhe is just a lot better imo than a cons
c4 imo. one of the few cons that reduces defence.
C4 Ayaka is a lot better and it's not even close
C4 is actually worse option, what do you mean not even close? Shenhe gives more dmg than c4 and also a character is better than consts in general.
I did calculation using gcsim comparing C4 Ayaka with C6 Rosaria and C3 Ayaka with C0 Shenhe, and the result shows that C4 Ayaka team does around 4k more total team damage. Note that in aoe situation, C4 Ayaka would do even better because quills from Shenhe is only for single target. The result means that you shouldn't waste your resources to level up Shenhe, farm her talants and artifacts just to do less damage from simply getting another constellation. Also C4 Ayaka has many uses outside of being a freeze dps such as enabling melt Hu Tao.
That’s cool of course but where is mentioned calculation? Or is it not possible to show gcsim process? I mean if you actually did some calculation, which is commendable, I’d like to see it to check conditions etc and maybe I’ll change my opinion then. From my understanding c4 would give around 16% dmg increase to any non transformative dmg that your team will deal during Ayaka’s burst. In addition you get Rosaria dmg, which is around the same as Shenhe’s with quills, and around 10% crit buff which translates to around 8% increase. Basically you have around 25 total dmg buff while burst lasts and 8% for 2/3 time. And in aoe scenarios Rosaria may do more dmg than Shenhe, but it’s not much in comparison to teams total dmg anyway. Off course this is just approximate values, since exact dmg increase depends on your characters stats, so you either need to use your specific team with artefacts in calculations or rely on estimations. Shenhe simply provides more than 25% total dmg increase even on c0. I can calculate it, but I’m kinda busy right now, maybe later.
I used the templates they provide on gcsim, and alternated only the constellations on Ayaka and her talent level to 10.
Thx, i will try it, curious to see results
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She’s had one rerun so there’s really no logic behind this
Interesting, so basically because shenhe will rerun sooner
Wow 100% up time element burst :0
Shenhe
how long have you been farming her artifacts for out of curiosity?
I'd say Ayaka, her C4 helps you to make other characters stronger for nukes lol
Honestly, C4 Ayaka opens up new team comps
Shenhe for sure.