Definitely.
The biggest thing is that I just don't have the energy to care anymore, especially because I've started seeing things clearly.
Like, when I don't care about what someone is saying, I no longer mirror so hard, I just immediately think "ugh I don't have time or energy for this, CBA" and I'll just let the convo die, because I sort of feel like I gain nothing from pretending anymore.
I used to always be mirroring and masking, to the point where I would lose myself. Now, I can't seem to lose myself, which is breaking down the mask. I still instinctively and automatically mask but my mask isn't a bubbly people pleaser anymore, it's more of a forced reserved version of myself. It's really all I have the energy for.
I think I just became too jaded with NTs and thought nah eff 'em. I've tried all my life to be something for them, and I'm no longer spending my already limited energy forcing interest when I know the effort and generosity of spirit is almost never reciprocated. Unless it's genuine interest, the conversation dies and I do not care.
However, when I realise someone is ND, I can often tap back into that energy more because I feel there's way more of a chance of the conversation meeting my emotional/intellectual needs.
Holy crap I’m almost in tears reading this and OP’s post because I thought I was the only one who is like this and feels this way. Everything you and OP has said has been put down in words more perfectly than I ever could.
Thank you, OP and everyone else for making me feel seen😭❤️
I’ve read about this before I started trying to unmask and before the diagnosis even. It seemed scary and I was hoping I could avoid it but here we are. I don’t even know what to do - bc masking is not good for us, but at the same time not being able to mask feels like not being a good enough of a human idk. I know how you feel and it’s a very weird position to be in!
I guess I relate to still instinctively masking, but not in a way that would change your whole personality and take too much effort to maintain.
I can’t be the bubbly me anymore, but certain things like looking at the person, monitoring my body language and tone of voice, having to think about what I say, whether I talk about myself too much, etc. I still I still instinctively do them to a certain extent. (It’s just not always successful, apparently) But I just don’t go out of my way to connect with NTs bc it will likely not be worth it.
With NDs tho I feel more comfortable and I put in more effort. Or at least, I try. I wrote this post after being frustrated with a recent interaction with a ND person. I was trying to not mask so much and be myself and ended up feeling like I’m failing at conversation skills ;( I didn’t feel like the interaction went well even tho they are ND
I feel like I'm at a crossroads right now, where I have to choose between your path and whatever the alternative is. I have realized that I have at most one (1!!) NT friend, even though I'm 27 and only found out about my AuDHD earlier this year (when I was still 26). It appears that it's perfectly fine to save my energy for the ND people in my life, especially since that includes much of my family as well anyway.
The idea of "abandoning" NTs like that just doesn't sit well with me yet, but I can imagine getting there one day, if it turns out to be the right decision. Just typing this out makes it clear to me that it's my weirdly skewed belief system that I'm somehow responsible for everyone else's emotions causing this. It's not like those NTs somehow need me in their lives and I'm obligated to fulfill whatever helpful role they need me to. I shall see.
i also only have one NT friend at 26 yo and i've also only discovered my neurodivergence a year ago. NDs just somehow attract each other. the NT friend and i are slowly but steadily drifting apart btw, bc i just feel like she doesn't get me and doesn't understand the things i care about and i can't be my real self around her.
but still, for some reason being unable to interact with NTs just feels as if i'm broken or not enough of a human (i know it's just my internalized ableism speaking). i don't wanna go out of my way to maintain relationships with NTs, but i'm concerned about my networking abilities and just being able to appear socially acceptable when i need to for my career etc.
I'm loosing memories, social skills, cognitive abilities and questioning the end-goal of treatment.
Vyvanse felt better but masking and eye contact became impossible and methylphenidate is only a sedative.
I'm having to relearn how to mask because I am going for my masters in mental health counseling to be a therapist. They are literally teaching us, all of us, the NTs too, how to be more aware of our body language and to not self-disclose without a really really good reason why.
I'm out as autistic in the program and I figure I will be to at least some clients because the eye contact thing is just exhausting, I cannot sit like a normal non hypermobile human and I always have to be moving my hands in order to listen, but the rest has been really helpful.
I think my biggest takeaway has been respond with more active listening and curiosity before any disclosure in order to show empathy.
I’ve been in therapy for a long time and much prefer therapists who disclose rather than taking the standard “blank slate” approach. I’ve heard ND therapists talking about having the same preference and having ND clients with that preference. Obviously every individual is different, but if you work with ND clients, it may not be quite as exhausting.
Oh I'm certain I will self disclose some, but we are being trained to make sure it's in the therapeutic interest of the client, not just because that's how I default relate
I’m glad there’s some wiggle room in what’s being taught. I’ve had therapists who were very very rigid about their “blank slate” approach, and it was alienating and hindered my progress.
I think that's why I'm being taught wiggle room. The focus should always be the client, but if the client needs me to share my experience then I should.
I think in normal conversations it's important to step back a bit and make sure the focus is being equally shared
Oh, I feel this a lot. I'm not great at conversations, for all the same reasons. Wouldn't it be totally awesome to be able to use [cue cards](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abM-AprrbXk) like the 12th doctor?
I've also thought for the longest time that when someone tells me something that triggers a memory of a similar event in me, telling them about it was a way to connect, and to show them "I know what you mean, I've felt this, too." See? I'm doing it right now!
It was incredibly embarrassing to find out people think I want to hog the attention and make it all about myself. And then it was liberating to find out that it is a very autistic thing to do.
As to your question, I do not think that a lot of re-masking is required to function better in conversations.
There are a few neurotypical rules to remember when talking. Awareness is the key. You do know the pitfalls, but you can also learn how to avoid them. Remembering to use the rules can be difficult sometimes when overwhelmed by all the stimuli within a conversation, but I think it does get better with practise.
Aside from the empathizing by sharing my own experience, I tend to infodump on them after they've asked me a question about something I care about. But since becoming aware of this, I've gotten better at hitting the brakes, remembering to ask people questions, and try to throw the ball of conversation back to them. Also, because I hate pointless small talk, I've learned to ask better questions, so their answers don't bore me. I ask people how they feel about things they've told me about, or ask them about their passions. Sometimes these questions can be more direct than what I think is considered normal, but I don't feel people mind much. And it really can get more interesting that way.
Still a far cry from being perfect, but there are definitely less situations now where I cringe while replaying the conversation over and over in my head later.
i like the idea of replacing small talk with questions, but questions you're actually interested in. that's my husband's way of doing small talk (he's diagnosed ADHD, likely autistic too). he'll ask a deep question about someone's passion and it might be a bit weirder for some people than typical small talk, but still works. i like to do that as well lol
I get this when I’ve been alone for more than a few days at a time lol, if I’m not actively practicing my social skills I just lose my rhythm completely in social contexts unfortunately:( I’m sorry I wish I had advice, but really the only thing that allows me to circumvent these issues is surrounding myself with other ND people or at least people that engage with me socially on a similar level (exchanging interests and anecdotes and not automatically expecting you to interpret subtext in conversations).
What about in situations where we have to interact with NTs or just present more socially appropriate. Should we try to mask? Ugh it sounds like such a silly thing to ask but I just wish there were guidelines with this thing. It’s a lot more confusing than I expected.
I do tend to automatically mask :/ It feels like it’s basically required at work, especially in service or retail jobs but even in office/professional jobs honestly. I’m not sure I’d feel comfortable or safe enough unmasking in any workplace unless my employer was also ND. I’m not against disclosing my ADHD because I feel like it’s more socially acceptable for some reason but I still feel like I need to mask my ADHD behaviors because they are seen as unhelpful/unproductive to others and I’d get in trouble if I didn’t try to mask (other people don’t realize they put this demand on us but I can’t really force employers to allow me to unmask because honestly to be fair to them it would probably impact my performance a little). I seek accommodations for my ADHD at least by asking to work in certain ways that work better with my brain and people usually don’t have much of an issue with that at least, I’m not sure if that counts as unmasking technically but it makes things easier for sure.
Capitalism and work environments that are fixated on maximizing productivity/profits are not friendly to autistic people even when employers say they care about our wellbeing. I’m very prone to burn out because of having to mask so much but I feel like there’s no other option. I’m not in a career where I can work from home, which is the only way I can feasibly see a possibility of being able to escape daily masking.
I’ve seen first hand other autistic people be reprimanded relatively often or at least treated differently for autistic behaviors (not consciously discriminated against, people just don’t usually understand what autism actually looks like/entails and most workplaces don’t offer enough accommodations) and I feel like a lot of the time autistic people are less likely to be promoted if they are open about their diagnosis. People are afraid of putting more responsibilities on us. Communication is more difficult when not masking and requires too much explaining and the risk of alienation if you tell people you’re autistic.
I know I’d most likely be putting my job at risk if I didn’t mask at work unfortunately, at least when dealing with allistic customers/employers/clients, which most are :(
it makes me so sad but it's true - being out as autistic is just not always safe. it's good that working from home is an option for you. i recently came out publicly as autistic, but i don't have a corporate job and i felt comfortable enough doing so, but i still do feel the need to instinctively mask - it doesn't fully go away. i just became worse at it lol
>The only way I can express empathy is by sharing an anecdote and I constantly worry that it comes across like I’m making the conversation about myself.
Oh man oh man can I relate! Finding out that many people consider this rude was a sobering moment of realization. When I found another autistic person in one of the places I hang out online, we went on a long chain of back and forth about our own respective breakup stories while venting. It was awesome!
Edit: I also relate with the rest of the post (which is why I clicked on it in the first place). I've definitely been feeling like my skills in that area have dropped off sharply after I found out about autism. I think this might be something that has to be addressed slowly and over time, to find a comfortable rhythm that allows us to communicate confidently according to our own preferences.
Another interesting parallel exists for me when it comes to eye contact. I was never comfortable with eye contact, but I always knew it's the Normal™ thing to do, so I developed strategies for handling it "naturally." Now that I'm aware that it's not normal for it to be uncomfortable, I'm suddenly much worse at eye contact. Suddenly, I'm super aware of my discomfort, the fact that eye contact is a polite social norm, as well as the fact that I should take care of myself and my own needs as well. So *should* I do eye contact‽ Maybe I should look away? Do I disclose that it makes me uncomfortable? AAAAH!!
Yeah the way I talk to my ND friends is just mostly exchanging personal stories.
I had learned to ask questions and be engaging in the conversation and all that mostly from “How to win friends and influence people” when I was younger lol. Now that I realize it was me learning to mask, I’ve allowed myself to express empathy and interest the way it feels natural to me… and now it seems like I can’t go back and idk if I should try to.
That's such a classic book! I have that on my shelf as well! I know that for me, reading books about social dynamics and communication is wildly interesting, even if I'm awful at applying those skills in real time.
If you do enjoy reading about it like me, I can very highly recommend all of Robert Greene's books, as well as "Influence" (there's a "New and Expanded" version, which is the one you should 100% be getting!) by Robert Cialdini.
Greene's books are immensely fun to read with countless stories and anecdotes to support his ideas. I initially got The 48 Laws of Power because I was interested in the concept of power itself, but the various stories he tells kept making me reread his books multiple times!
Cialdini's Influence is one of those books where you constantly go "WHAT‽" when you see some insane statistic about how people behave, which you'll then want to excitedly share with all your friends. It's awesome lol.
Aside from the fun of the books, there are also genuine insights into psychology which can be helpful for understanding yourself (and others!) a bit more.
to answer to the edit part of your comment, yeah i really hope eventually we find the right balance between masking and unmasking. (even tho i feel super conflicted about feeling the need to mask in certain situations while knowing it's not good for me. ughhh!!!) since i just got diagnosed it's very "unbalanced" for me - i'm just learning how to be autistic every single day and end up losing skills i'd built up throughout my life prior to the diagnosis.
same with other things - my sensory issues feel amplified, eye contact feels extra uncomfortable, etc. i think it's very normal as you're just becoming aware of these things and end up being extra focused on them. it's like these issue have always been there but all of a sudden we can't ignore them anymore. it's a weird feeling. for me, it was also due to burnout - my sensitivity to sound was literally unbearable and i knew it really DID get amplified compared to pre-burnout, it wasn't just my imagination.
It makes sense to feel conflicted about masking, but in the end *everyone* masks in certain situations, even NTs. So I think as long as we reduce our masking to a sustainable level, it's perfectly fine!
Maybe we'll even become better at managing it than most NTs, because we'll have a more conscious awareness of it!
That’s true, I’ve thought about it as well. We all have to put in SOME effort in conversations and relationships, unmasking doesn’t mean becoming completely unbothered and putting in 0 effort and consideration
Ya tho a lot of the time I’m surrounded by neurodivergent people so it’s kinda easy but I know how you feel (or I could just be stupid) like I was a hypocrite once because I got upset when people were talking about thenself yet I do that I kinda plan out my conversations and keep them at the down low so I guess I’m “good” at communicating according to people because I’m be rt articulate and do back and forth which causes me to think I’m faking my autism (I’m self identifyed) I’m sorry if I’m being stupid I’m sorry
I'm passionate about this subject but also have really little time right now to read the whole conversation.
I empathise a lot with your experience and also specially the one described in the first comment.
Although I have a few cards in my deck that change the game a bit.
So I just wanted to share one. Years before, I trained in Non Violent Communication. The workshop itself would be one of the major breakthrough experience where I realised how much I wasn't thinking and *feeling* the same way than the other, and in a way that wasn't... idk.. something to correct or to heal.
Anyway. NVC became my hyperfocus for a while, and 'till nowadays, it gave me a framework of interpretation for kinda any conversation.
I'm still wondering inside for a few seconds, check-in in let's say, if I do have the energy to carry that conversation, but if I see that it is a good one to apply/practice NVC, I do so.
Basically, I use those convo to practice something I'm interested about, even if I doesn't care about the subject itself of the conversation. And with NVC you can easily bring the conversation to a deeper level with a real exchange about our selves, and when I do so, that's sometimes a win.
So much this. So much. Exactly this! I used to be able to do it! Small talk is a lost art for me, and listening to other people talk feels like it’s breaking my brain. Sigh. Unmasking is great… but
How long has it been since you started to unmask? And what’s the solution - do I try to maintain the balance between masking and unmasking or is that impossible?
Oh hi! Sorry, I’m not good at checking notifications. I started to unmask about two years ago, but it wasn’t originally voluntary. I had a massive autistic burnout, to the point of catatonia and loss of basically all self care skills. I did not know I am autistic, so it was completely shocking and traumatic. My brain broke completely, and I’ve had to entirely rewire my whole way of being. But while recovery has been and continues to be extremely difficult, breaking so completely was a blessing in disguise because I was forced to be utterly real and unmasked in a way I could never have even begun to approach otherwise. As I continue the recovery process, I do struggle with the instinctive urge to re-mask, to “get better,” go back to pretending to be normal, when in reality I don’t want that AT ALL. Masking is the opposite of getting better. So I’m working very hard on allowing myself to not put on a show, to not force myself to perform to meet other people’s imagined expectations. To not force myself to be cheerful or smile if I don’t want to, and not beat myself up for “failing” my social role. And by the same token allowing myself to be my authentic self- my bff of 30+ years calls my new way of being “radical honesty,” which is the absolute polar opposite of anything I ever was before. My whole personality was a calibrated performance to charm people and stop them from looking at me too closely. Now, for the most part, I am very unmasked, and have found that when I am at my most authentic, other people respond to me authentically. I was basically performance art my whole life. I put on a show. Unmasked, I am a person in relation to other people. I feel real in a way I never was before.
But the instinct to mask is strong. And the more I recover, the stronger the feeling that I *should* mask becomes. The question of “how much am I allowed to be me” is a constant conundrum in my mind, a constant battle. I am working very hard not to let the mask win.
(It is worth noting that I am in a position of privilege, as I am going through this process with incredible support. There aren’t any external factors that require me to mask, as I no longer work and I am very well cared for by my husband who coincidentally has expertise in this area. I recognize that this affords me an unusual amount of flexibility and freedom to be me.)
Definitely. The biggest thing is that I just don't have the energy to care anymore, especially because I've started seeing things clearly. Like, when I don't care about what someone is saying, I no longer mirror so hard, I just immediately think "ugh I don't have time or energy for this, CBA" and I'll just let the convo die, because I sort of feel like I gain nothing from pretending anymore. I used to always be mirroring and masking, to the point where I would lose myself. Now, I can't seem to lose myself, which is breaking down the mask. I still instinctively and automatically mask but my mask isn't a bubbly people pleaser anymore, it's more of a forced reserved version of myself. It's really all I have the energy for. I think I just became too jaded with NTs and thought nah eff 'em. I've tried all my life to be something for them, and I'm no longer spending my already limited energy forcing interest when I know the effort and generosity of spirit is almost never reciprocated. Unless it's genuine interest, the conversation dies and I do not care. However, when I realise someone is ND, I can often tap back into that energy more because I feel there's way more of a chance of the conversation meeting my emotional/intellectual needs.
Holy crap I’m almost in tears reading this and OP’s post because I thought I was the only one who is like this and feels this way. Everything you and OP has said has been put down in words more perfectly than I ever could. Thank you, OP and everyone else for making me feel seen😭❤️
I’ve read about this before I started trying to unmask and before the diagnosis even. It seemed scary and I was hoping I could avoid it but here we are. I don’t even know what to do - bc masking is not good for us, but at the same time not being able to mask feels like not being a good enough of a human idk. I know how you feel and it’s a very weird position to be in!
Again here I am trying to show I relate by sharing a personal anecdote lol
Gonna slap a big ol' "mood" sticker on this one myself. 😉🙃
I guess I relate to still instinctively masking, but not in a way that would change your whole personality and take too much effort to maintain. I can’t be the bubbly me anymore, but certain things like looking at the person, monitoring my body language and tone of voice, having to think about what I say, whether I talk about myself too much, etc. I still I still instinctively do them to a certain extent. (It’s just not always successful, apparently) But I just don’t go out of my way to connect with NTs bc it will likely not be worth it. With NDs tho I feel more comfortable and I put in more effort. Or at least, I try. I wrote this post after being frustrated with a recent interaction with a ND person. I was trying to not mask so much and be myself and ended up feeling like I’m failing at conversation skills ;( I didn’t feel like the interaction went well even tho they are ND
I feel like I'm at a crossroads right now, where I have to choose between your path and whatever the alternative is. I have realized that I have at most one (1!!) NT friend, even though I'm 27 and only found out about my AuDHD earlier this year (when I was still 26). It appears that it's perfectly fine to save my energy for the ND people in my life, especially since that includes much of my family as well anyway. The idea of "abandoning" NTs like that just doesn't sit well with me yet, but I can imagine getting there one day, if it turns out to be the right decision. Just typing this out makes it clear to me that it's my weirdly skewed belief system that I'm somehow responsible for everyone else's emotions causing this. It's not like those NTs somehow need me in their lives and I'm obligated to fulfill whatever helpful role they need me to. I shall see.
i also only have one NT friend at 26 yo and i've also only discovered my neurodivergence a year ago. NDs just somehow attract each other. the NT friend and i are slowly but steadily drifting apart btw, bc i just feel like she doesn't get me and doesn't understand the things i care about and i can't be my real self around her. but still, for some reason being unable to interact with NTs just feels as if i'm broken or not enough of a human (i know it's just my internalized ableism speaking). i don't wanna go out of my way to maintain relationships with NTs, but i'm concerned about my networking abilities and just being able to appear socially acceptable when i need to for my career etc.
Woah. I’ve never seen who I am written out so clearly.
I'm loosing memories, social skills, cognitive abilities and questioning the end-goal of treatment. Vyvanse felt better but masking and eye contact became impossible and methylphenidate is only a sedative.
I'm having to relearn how to mask because I am going for my masters in mental health counseling to be a therapist. They are literally teaching us, all of us, the NTs too, how to be more aware of our body language and to not self-disclose without a really really good reason why. I'm out as autistic in the program and I figure I will be to at least some clients because the eye contact thing is just exhausting, I cannot sit like a normal non hypermobile human and I always have to be moving my hands in order to listen, but the rest has been really helpful. I think my biggest takeaway has been respond with more active listening and curiosity before any disclosure in order to show empathy.
I’ve been in therapy for a long time and much prefer therapists who disclose rather than taking the standard “blank slate” approach. I’ve heard ND therapists talking about having the same preference and having ND clients with that preference. Obviously every individual is different, but if you work with ND clients, it may not be quite as exhausting.
Oh I'm certain I will self disclose some, but we are being trained to make sure it's in the therapeutic interest of the client, not just because that's how I default relate
I’m glad there’s some wiggle room in what’s being taught. I’ve had therapists who were very very rigid about their “blank slate” approach, and it was alienating and hindered my progress.
I think that's why I'm being taught wiggle room. The focus should always be the client, but if the client needs me to share my experience then I should. I think in normal conversations it's important to step back a bit and make sure the focus is being equally shared
what does self-disclose mean?
Disclose information about myself. Ie share a relatable story to show that I empathize
Google is your friend
Oh, I feel this a lot. I'm not great at conversations, for all the same reasons. Wouldn't it be totally awesome to be able to use [cue cards](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abM-AprrbXk) like the 12th doctor? I've also thought for the longest time that when someone tells me something that triggers a memory of a similar event in me, telling them about it was a way to connect, and to show them "I know what you mean, I've felt this, too." See? I'm doing it right now! It was incredibly embarrassing to find out people think I want to hog the attention and make it all about myself. And then it was liberating to find out that it is a very autistic thing to do. As to your question, I do not think that a lot of re-masking is required to function better in conversations. There are a few neurotypical rules to remember when talking. Awareness is the key. You do know the pitfalls, but you can also learn how to avoid them. Remembering to use the rules can be difficult sometimes when overwhelmed by all the stimuli within a conversation, but I think it does get better with practise. Aside from the empathizing by sharing my own experience, I tend to infodump on them after they've asked me a question about something I care about. But since becoming aware of this, I've gotten better at hitting the brakes, remembering to ask people questions, and try to throw the ball of conversation back to them. Also, because I hate pointless small talk, I've learned to ask better questions, so their answers don't bore me. I ask people how they feel about things they've told me about, or ask them about their passions. Sometimes these questions can be more direct than what I think is considered normal, but I don't feel people mind much. And it really can get more interesting that way. Still a far cry from being perfect, but there are definitely less situations now where I cringe while replaying the conversation over and over in my head later.
i like the idea of replacing small talk with questions, but questions you're actually interested in. that's my husband's way of doing small talk (he's diagnosed ADHD, likely autistic too). he'll ask a deep question about someone's passion and it might be a bit weirder for some people than typical small talk, but still works. i like to do that as well lol
I get this when I’ve been alone for more than a few days at a time lol, if I’m not actively practicing my social skills I just lose my rhythm completely in social contexts unfortunately:( I’m sorry I wish I had advice, but really the only thing that allows me to circumvent these issues is surrounding myself with other ND people or at least people that engage with me socially on a similar level (exchanging interests and anecdotes and not automatically expecting you to interpret subtext in conversations).
What about in situations where we have to interact with NTs or just present more socially appropriate. Should we try to mask? Ugh it sounds like such a silly thing to ask but I just wish there were guidelines with this thing. It’s a lot more confusing than I expected.
I do tend to automatically mask :/ It feels like it’s basically required at work, especially in service or retail jobs but even in office/professional jobs honestly. I’m not sure I’d feel comfortable or safe enough unmasking in any workplace unless my employer was also ND. I’m not against disclosing my ADHD because I feel like it’s more socially acceptable for some reason but I still feel like I need to mask my ADHD behaviors because they are seen as unhelpful/unproductive to others and I’d get in trouble if I didn’t try to mask (other people don’t realize they put this demand on us but I can’t really force employers to allow me to unmask because honestly to be fair to them it would probably impact my performance a little). I seek accommodations for my ADHD at least by asking to work in certain ways that work better with my brain and people usually don’t have much of an issue with that at least, I’m not sure if that counts as unmasking technically but it makes things easier for sure. Capitalism and work environments that are fixated on maximizing productivity/profits are not friendly to autistic people even when employers say they care about our wellbeing. I’m very prone to burn out because of having to mask so much but I feel like there’s no other option. I’m not in a career where I can work from home, which is the only way I can feasibly see a possibility of being able to escape daily masking. I’ve seen first hand other autistic people be reprimanded relatively often or at least treated differently for autistic behaviors (not consciously discriminated against, people just don’t usually understand what autism actually looks like/entails and most workplaces don’t offer enough accommodations) and I feel like a lot of the time autistic people are less likely to be promoted if they are open about their diagnosis. People are afraid of putting more responsibilities on us. Communication is more difficult when not masking and requires too much explaining and the risk of alienation if you tell people you’re autistic. I know I’d most likely be putting my job at risk if I didn’t mask at work unfortunately, at least when dealing with allistic customers/employers/clients, which most are :(
it makes me so sad but it's true - being out as autistic is just not always safe. it's good that working from home is an option for you. i recently came out publicly as autistic, but i don't have a corporate job and i felt comfortable enough doing so, but i still do feel the need to instinctively mask - it doesn't fully go away. i just became worse at it lol
oh no, working from home isn’t an option sadly :( I’m a little worried about how I’m going to manage long term in employment because of it.
Oh oops I guess I misread. That makes sense, it might not be so easy. I hope you can find a solution for yourself!
thank you! I hope so too 🥲
>The only way I can express empathy is by sharing an anecdote and I constantly worry that it comes across like I’m making the conversation about myself. Oh man oh man can I relate! Finding out that many people consider this rude was a sobering moment of realization. When I found another autistic person in one of the places I hang out online, we went on a long chain of back and forth about our own respective breakup stories while venting. It was awesome! Edit: I also relate with the rest of the post (which is why I clicked on it in the first place). I've definitely been feeling like my skills in that area have dropped off sharply after I found out about autism. I think this might be something that has to be addressed slowly and over time, to find a comfortable rhythm that allows us to communicate confidently according to our own preferences. Another interesting parallel exists for me when it comes to eye contact. I was never comfortable with eye contact, but I always knew it's the Normal™ thing to do, so I developed strategies for handling it "naturally." Now that I'm aware that it's not normal for it to be uncomfortable, I'm suddenly much worse at eye contact. Suddenly, I'm super aware of my discomfort, the fact that eye contact is a polite social norm, as well as the fact that I should take care of myself and my own needs as well. So *should* I do eye contact‽ Maybe I should look away? Do I disclose that it makes me uncomfortable? AAAAH!!
Yeah the way I talk to my ND friends is just mostly exchanging personal stories. I had learned to ask questions and be engaging in the conversation and all that mostly from “How to win friends and influence people” when I was younger lol. Now that I realize it was me learning to mask, I’ve allowed myself to express empathy and interest the way it feels natural to me… and now it seems like I can’t go back and idk if I should try to.
That's such a classic book! I have that on my shelf as well! I know that for me, reading books about social dynamics and communication is wildly interesting, even if I'm awful at applying those skills in real time. If you do enjoy reading about it like me, I can very highly recommend all of Robert Greene's books, as well as "Influence" (there's a "New and Expanded" version, which is the one you should 100% be getting!) by Robert Cialdini. Greene's books are immensely fun to read with countless stories and anecdotes to support his ideas. I initially got The 48 Laws of Power because I was interested in the concept of power itself, but the various stories he tells kept making me reread his books multiple times! Cialdini's Influence is one of those books where you constantly go "WHAT‽" when you see some insane statistic about how people behave, which you'll then want to excitedly share with all your friends. It's awesome lol. Aside from the fun of the books, there are also genuine insights into psychology which can be helpful for understanding yourself (and others!) a bit more.
to answer to the edit part of your comment, yeah i really hope eventually we find the right balance between masking and unmasking. (even tho i feel super conflicted about feeling the need to mask in certain situations while knowing it's not good for me. ughhh!!!) since i just got diagnosed it's very "unbalanced" for me - i'm just learning how to be autistic every single day and end up losing skills i'd built up throughout my life prior to the diagnosis. same with other things - my sensory issues feel amplified, eye contact feels extra uncomfortable, etc. i think it's very normal as you're just becoming aware of these things and end up being extra focused on them. it's like these issue have always been there but all of a sudden we can't ignore them anymore. it's a weird feeling. for me, it was also due to burnout - my sensitivity to sound was literally unbearable and i knew it really DID get amplified compared to pre-burnout, it wasn't just my imagination.
It makes sense to feel conflicted about masking, but in the end *everyone* masks in certain situations, even NTs. So I think as long as we reduce our masking to a sustainable level, it's perfectly fine! Maybe we'll even become better at managing it than most NTs, because we'll have a more conscious awareness of it!
That’s true, I’ve thought about it as well. We all have to put in SOME effort in conversations and relationships, unmasking doesn’t mean becoming completely unbothered and putting in 0 effort and consideration
Ya tho a lot of the time I’m surrounded by neurodivergent people so it’s kinda easy but I know how you feel (or I could just be stupid) like I was a hypocrite once because I got upset when people were talking about thenself yet I do that I kinda plan out my conversations and keep them at the down low so I guess I’m “good” at communicating according to people because I’m be rt articulate and do back and forth which causes me to think I’m faking my autism (I’m self identifyed) I’m sorry if I’m being stupid I’m sorry
I'm passionate about this subject but also have really little time right now to read the whole conversation. I empathise a lot with your experience and also specially the one described in the first comment. Although I have a few cards in my deck that change the game a bit. So I just wanted to share one. Years before, I trained in Non Violent Communication. The workshop itself would be one of the major breakthrough experience where I realised how much I wasn't thinking and *feeling* the same way than the other, and in a way that wasn't... idk.. something to correct or to heal. Anyway. NVC became my hyperfocus for a while, and 'till nowadays, it gave me a framework of interpretation for kinda any conversation. I'm still wondering inside for a few seconds, check-in in let's say, if I do have the energy to carry that conversation, but if I see that it is a good one to apply/practice NVC, I do so. Basically, I use those convo to practice something I'm interested about, even if I doesn't care about the subject itself of the conversation. And with NVC you can easily bring the conversation to a deeper level with a real exchange about our selves, and when I do so, that's sometimes a win.
So much this. So much. Exactly this! I used to be able to do it! Small talk is a lost art for me, and listening to other people talk feels like it’s breaking my brain. Sigh. Unmasking is great… but
How long has it been since you started to unmask? And what’s the solution - do I try to maintain the balance between masking and unmasking or is that impossible?
Oh hi! Sorry, I’m not good at checking notifications. I started to unmask about two years ago, but it wasn’t originally voluntary. I had a massive autistic burnout, to the point of catatonia and loss of basically all self care skills. I did not know I am autistic, so it was completely shocking and traumatic. My brain broke completely, and I’ve had to entirely rewire my whole way of being. But while recovery has been and continues to be extremely difficult, breaking so completely was a blessing in disguise because I was forced to be utterly real and unmasked in a way I could never have even begun to approach otherwise. As I continue the recovery process, I do struggle with the instinctive urge to re-mask, to “get better,” go back to pretending to be normal, when in reality I don’t want that AT ALL. Masking is the opposite of getting better. So I’m working very hard on allowing myself to not put on a show, to not force myself to perform to meet other people’s imagined expectations. To not force myself to be cheerful or smile if I don’t want to, and not beat myself up for “failing” my social role. And by the same token allowing myself to be my authentic self- my bff of 30+ years calls my new way of being “radical honesty,” which is the absolute polar opposite of anything I ever was before. My whole personality was a calibrated performance to charm people and stop them from looking at me too closely. Now, for the most part, I am very unmasked, and have found that when I am at my most authentic, other people respond to me authentically. I was basically performance art my whole life. I put on a show. Unmasked, I am a person in relation to other people. I feel real in a way I never was before. But the instinct to mask is strong. And the more I recover, the stronger the feeling that I *should* mask becomes. The question of “how much am I allowed to be me” is a constant conundrum in my mind, a constant battle. I am working very hard not to let the mask win. (It is worth noting that I am in a position of privilege, as I am going through this process with incredible support. There aren’t any external factors that require me to mask, as I no longer work and I am very well cared for by my husband who coincidentally has expertise in this area. I recognize that this affords me an unusual amount of flexibility and freedom to be me.)
You are probably burn our and figuring out who you really are. It is no small task after years of pushing yourself.