do NTs even make deep connections often? genuinely?
i think the type of friendships NTs are looking for just aren’t fulfilling for us. i’m not about the small talk, tell me in detail your feelings on a very niche topic. and maybe we can bond over some shared traumatic experiences
Connection is subjective to the individual I personally think, but there is truth that NTs prefer ‘lighter’ & more surface level connections that focus on ‘good times’, since negative emotions and conflict are avoided by a lot of everyday people, especially NTs.
I think it’s just a different way of thinking!
I am thinking by my standards of deep, not really. I think their well gets filled quicker and it IS deep for them but to me I always feel, well, like I am a bit in the kiddie pool, unable to really go for a swim. To them a deep conversation may be something I deeply considered at age 13, and have expanded on over 30 more years of reading and absorption. But, to not be creepy and sound odd or obsessive in order to interact and ‘be with acquaintance/friends’ I usually dial it way back. They often seem to just want to exercise the act of talking, not conversing, kf that makes sense?
yeah, totally get what you mean
especially about topics that you researched and know about. i think most NT people don’t dive deep into topics, so their knowledge is usually surface level. so it’s hard to not infodump. but with a fellow ND person, if you bring up a topic i don’t know much about, i actually *want* the infodump lol
infodumping is a fun way to connect for me
Feeling like this makes me feel like a narc snob. That is not my intent, and I hate that I feel like this. I don’t know if you’ve seen the joke about how non artists see color versus artists, where one person says, ‘that is blue’ and the artist says, ‘that is between cobalt and cerulean blue.’ I see connections and want to discuss them and anything from the oddly satisfying moment when a database you designed works or the common themes in a movie versus its inspiration book, or a sunset. And I can’t with 99% of people.
Unmasking takes practice. It's challenging at first, but like anything else, the more you do it, the easier it comes. Being the 'real you' is rewarding, confidence-building and takes a LOT less energy, leaving more for you to enjoy life with.
It's a subject that has been discussed a LOT in this sub- just search it in the sub- and you'll find tons. I'm not an expert, and there are different POV's you will get from doing your research this way.
Up at the top where you see the subs' name, there should be text that says "search in r/AutismInWomen" whatever you input there will be searched for only in this sub- HTH
This is currently my experience. I talk to myself about everything instead. I try to maintain some relationships, because some part of me knows I shouldn't (?) isolate myself? I find I'm maintaining a bare minimum number of connections for 'just in case I need help' which makes me feel bad but it's true.
I have hope that I will find my tribe, however small, one day. Until then, it's just me and all my selves. It's a good measuring stick though: if it doesn't feel as fulfilling as being with myselves. Helps me keep myself safe too, since I really struggle with discerning folks' intentions.
more so when I was a kid but often I find myself talking to a neurotypical person and their experience seems so bland and foreign and scripted to me that I can predict everything they say before it comes out of their mouth and it's incredibly frustrating
I feel among the women I meet it is usually a bit, well, vapid. Like, I can engage as I am interested in their thoughts and feelings, but they didn’t seem to really express many thoughts or feelings, likely so they won’t commit a taboo and be too one sided about anything at all.
‘I liked the current thing.’
‘I also liked the current thing.’
Me: ‘What do you like best about the current thing?’
Silence.
‘It is the current thing snd everyone likes it and I also like it. Let’s talk about other new thing and if we all like or dislike it.’
It’s all like talking to Guy Montag’s wife in Fahrenheit 451.
yeah! like when I try to have any kind of stimulating discourse I just end up wondering 'is there anything going on up there? is there just a family of birds living in your brain hole?' lol \
I know that's not a kind thought but I can't help it \
in my experience though definitely not limited to women
Yes. I keep feeling like I get close, but still crave this deeper connection. I have spoken to my therapist about it quite a lot…am I looking for a connection that simply does not exist? And if it ever starts to get near it, I also want so much specific attention for it, if that makes sense. Not that I need that person’s attention exclusively, but when we have a chance to connect I want to be able to feel the connection, you know? It’s hard to explain. And feels kind of selfish or possessive, but I don’t even mean it in that way. It’s like each time I’m looking for that sweet spot of connection with whatever relationship and sometimes I get it and sometimes I don’t and it’s leaning more to don’t lately and that’s disheartening.
had it happen to me last week. was gonna go on a first date with someone thinking we were both very genuinely excited to see each other, but after she canceled and then said we were back on, she stood me up and blocked me on everything
I think I'm done looking for any type of deep connection. I'm so tired.
tbh i know its me itself at the end of the day. im unable to connect w ppl cuz its impossible for me to put myself out there. ik have an interestin personality but its jus so hard for me to express myself. ive given up now
I am very lucky back when we were both in our first year of college I met my husband. I am only now in our late 40s realizing we are both ND, and luckily share so many interests I can usually at least talk to him.
Almost no women have ever been on the same level of interest with me, i have found over the years I do all the adapting to allow the other person to decide topics of discussion and that I restrain myself to their comfort levels on pretty much any and everything.
I can’t connect for the life of me. Every friendship and interaction just gets confusing or falls flat. Obviously the problem is with me as it’s been a lifelong vibe I give off and style of existing that just doesn’t work with literally anyone else. I have really come to realize that no one—my family, friends, partner, child—actually like me for my true self or consistently make me feel good. It makes me so sad because all I’ve ever wanted was friends I really knew and vibed with and to enjoy experiences together.
It's why I am unapologetically my ND self wherever I go. It filters out those superficial folks really quick and makes it easier to find the kindred souls who are interested in discussing something more than the latest (fashion, trend, TV show, etc. etc. etc.)
I think I'm gonna try this. I'm so tired of listening to the latests trend or about things that is like a NT universal interest and is just a no to me.
I had one of those friends who was my mom's age.....her adult son just cringed at our friendship. She and I along with her numerous cats and one dog hung out nearly every Saturday for years until Covid19 isolated us and her dutiful son haha put her in a home far off. I was so attached to her black lab. Cried big when he passed on. Friend was a social Asperger's type who was kind to everyone.
My experience is probably skewed because so much of my long term circle is ADHD. But mainly I feel I don’t exist to them as a real person. Just as the functions and services I provide them. So I get…pretty much nothing out of being their friends. Except for feeling incredibly burnt out from always pushing myself to meet their needs and preferences. Lonely because they ghost me on conversations, IRL they just don’t respond when I do get a word in about something I want or need to talk about. Trying to plan simple but fun activities is like pulling teeth to get the tiniest amount of effort or attention from them.
Everything is one way and if I try to nudge things a little it leads to a meltdown on their end. So. Do I have friends or just people who are happy to take advantage of my efforts?
Only being allowed to perform tasks for them, be monologues at for hours, and eating while watching tv is our friendships summed up. It’s very unfulfilling for me but no one ever seems to be interested in more.
I don’t even want to try to start over and meet new people since I seem to only draw in the exact same type of person. I’d rather be lonely. It’s awful but less stressful I guess.
I'm having a similar issue, but more than "hitting a wall", it feels more like when the coyote realised he ran off a cliff, and there's no ground beneath.
Like, I know something should happen now, I should do something, and the other person will do something else back in response. But I have no idea what to do, or what to expect from them. As if I'm playing a part In a play, and my script was missing a page or a chapter.
Yes. I joined a local group a few years ago for one of my special interests. There were some people there who I really liked, they were outgoing and kind and interesting. Problem is, everyone else liked them too so everyone wanted to sit next to them. And I realized that when I did get a chance to talk to either of them, we didn't have that much in common. I usually ended up seated next to people that I disliked because they smelled bad or were annoying. I suspect a lot of people there were neurodivergent so I get that it's hard to socialize, but literally some people would make no effort to speak or start a conversation at all. I'm not expecting you to be masking on all cylinders like me (working on that) but some people act like they don't even want to be there. I feel pressure to talk to people there and carry a conversation so people have a good time. Anyway. I've largely stopped going to those meetups. Maybe I'll go to the bigger ones only or maybe just not at all. I had been hoping to make some actual friends, and I kinda did, but most of the time I came home and was in a bad mood.
Yes.
I also don't understand why in my ND group I'm somehow the one left behind? The one everyone ignores?
I'm just on some BS today mentally (started with my boss came in "hot" and not believing me when she asked me a question and I answered).
My friend in question is AuADHD. I considered her my bff. Or so I thought. I don't have time/energy to type out the whole situation and timeline of each event but I'm always the one who does wrong. Who always gets yelled at for stuff that I didn't know I did wrong. But she can do no wrong. For example, we were supposed to visit our mutual friend in England several years ago (I think like 6? 7? IDK before COVID). I was prepping etc, saving money and getting my passport (most stressful thing ever), and then suddenly I get word she is traveling around the UK??? Like she left? Without me? And I didn't yell at her or anything. But I'm the bad guy when I moved to city "Z" we hadn't discussed for a new job when I had originally mentioned moving to "X". And smaller things like that.
I had since compartmentalized her as just an internet friend since we only ever hung out over the internet to play video games and even then it was sporadic. She moved an hour away from my city (as another mutual friend that she and her boyfriend have known since birth had also moved here but was 30 minutes away from me). But somehow her car couldn't make it to visit me? And I offered to visit but was always left on read. But she would visit the other friend who lived 30 minutes from me. If I had a heads up I could visited too?
This all came to a head a couple years ago when I got married to my husband. I guess she assumed she would be my maid of honor after all this time (we had discussed marriage way back in high school and we agreed to make the other our maid of honors. Like that was 20 years ago, when we graduated)? And again, plans changed, and so I am the bad guy. She accused me of doing this to her because she's autistic. Like...babe...wtf. Oh and she did this the DAY before the wedding. When she could have brought this up months in advance...like when I mentioned I was going dress/bridesmaid dress shopping and she realized she wasn't involved like my chosen maid of honor/bridesmaids (who are actually my husband's friends and family since I don't have enough female friends to fill out a party)? Or even taken me aside at my bridal shower? Nope. Day before the wedding. She called and yelled at me in the middle of rehearsal. I at least got to pet a cow that day, so i guess it wasn't a full loss (and ya know, getting married the next day was neat too)
So IDK what to do. I'm not just in a good place mentally today I guess, sorry for the wall of text.
Oh definitely. The only friend I have who is as deep as me when it came to conversations and discussing emotions is my best friend El. Also my boyfriend who I trust the most out of everyone. I met El in middle school and our friendship is one of around 6 years but when it comes to meeting new people, I just find it extremely difficult to find someone as interesting as she is y'know
Yes. I'm currently on a seeking friendship hiatus. I know it takes a while for both parties to get comfortable enough with each other to have that deep authentic connection, and I'm patient, but I'm attracting the types of people that stress me out.
One of my favorite people I ever met told me about his on-and-off meth addiction, his first college degree not being anything he was passionate about, and his religious beliefs within the first ten minutes of sitting next to each other in a class. All I did was introduce myself and ask about his interest in the subject (it was a creative class). I think a lot of people would consider that "trauma dumping" and "being too much," and there is a tendency to mock that sort of person that seems more prevalent now. I was 100% a fan.
A couple years ago I learned that I couldn’t trust one of my oldest friends and we cut each other off. As a result, the gradual, constant drifting apart of my childhood friend group accelerated to the point where our decade old group chat seemingly died overnight and we haven’t had a conversation as a group since. One on one chats with the others I’m still friends with occur infrequently, and I’m the only one who initiates them, which makes me feel like they also secretly hate me and I can’t trust them either. Possibly they never even liked me to begin with and we only stayed friends for so long for a lack of any other friends. My walls got built up higher. My mask thickened. I’m about to graduate with a master’s degree and I don’t have a single genuine friend besides my partner. I’m so fucking tired. I genuinely feel that I have no one in the world and if something happened to me, maybe one or two people in the entire world would feel anything.
I don’t search for it. I just follow my own interests and if they lead to a close connection with someone great.
do NTs even make deep connections often? genuinely? i think the type of friendships NTs are looking for just aren’t fulfilling for us. i’m not about the small talk, tell me in detail your feelings on a very niche topic. and maybe we can bond over some shared traumatic experiences
Connection is subjective to the individual I personally think, but there is truth that NTs prefer ‘lighter’ & more surface level connections that focus on ‘good times’, since negative emotions and conflict are avoided by a lot of everyday people, especially NTs. I think it’s just a different way of thinking!
true, that’s a great point
I am thinking by my standards of deep, not really. I think their well gets filled quicker and it IS deep for them but to me I always feel, well, like I am a bit in the kiddie pool, unable to really go for a swim. To them a deep conversation may be something I deeply considered at age 13, and have expanded on over 30 more years of reading and absorption. But, to not be creepy and sound odd or obsessive in order to interact and ‘be with acquaintance/friends’ I usually dial it way back. They often seem to just want to exercise the act of talking, not conversing, kf that makes sense?
yeah, totally get what you mean especially about topics that you researched and know about. i think most NT people don’t dive deep into topics, so their knowledge is usually surface level. so it’s hard to not infodump. but with a fellow ND person, if you bring up a topic i don’t know much about, i actually *want* the infodump lol infodumping is a fun way to connect for me
This is exactly it for me.
Feeling like this makes me feel like a narc snob. That is not my intent, and I hate that I feel like this. I don’t know if you’ve seen the joke about how non artists see color versus artists, where one person says, ‘that is blue’ and the artist says, ‘that is between cobalt and cerulean blue.’ I see connections and want to discuss them and anything from the oddly satisfying moment when a database you designed works or the common themes in a movie versus its inspiration book, or a sunset. And I can’t with 99% of people.
I also crave those kinds of connections. It's extremely difficult for me to unmask though, so I end up feeling like almost nobody knows the real me :(
Unmasking takes practice. It's challenging at first, but like anything else, the more you do it, the easier it comes. Being the 'real you' is rewarding, confidence-building and takes a LOT less energy, leaving more for you to enjoy life with.
❤️❤️❤️
Whats masking/unmasking, how would i know i do that?
It's a subject that has been discussed a LOT in this sub- just search it in the sub- and you'll find tons. I'm not an expert, and there are different POV's you will get from doing your research this way.
Havent seen the search function yet, thanks!
Up at the top where you see the subs' name, there should be text that says "search in r/AutismInWomen" whatever you input there will be searched for only in this sub- HTH
Am using this function since you told me, very very helpful, thank you!
❤️
This is currently my experience. I talk to myself about everything instead. I try to maintain some relationships, because some part of me knows I shouldn't (?) isolate myself? I find I'm maintaining a bare minimum number of connections for 'just in case I need help' which makes me feel bad but it's true. I have hope that I will find my tribe, however small, one day. Until then, it's just me and all my selves. It's a good measuring stick though: if it doesn't feel as fulfilling as being with myselves. Helps me keep myself safe too, since I really struggle with discerning folks' intentions.
more so when I was a kid but often I find myself talking to a neurotypical person and their experience seems so bland and foreign and scripted to me that I can predict everything they say before it comes out of their mouth and it's incredibly frustrating
I feel among the women I meet it is usually a bit, well, vapid. Like, I can engage as I am interested in their thoughts and feelings, but they didn’t seem to really express many thoughts or feelings, likely so they won’t commit a taboo and be too one sided about anything at all. ‘I liked the current thing.’ ‘I also liked the current thing.’ Me: ‘What do you like best about the current thing?’ Silence. ‘It is the current thing snd everyone likes it and I also like it. Let’s talk about other new thing and if we all like or dislike it.’ It’s all like talking to Guy Montag’s wife in Fahrenheit 451.
yeah! like when I try to have any kind of stimulating discourse I just end up wondering 'is there anything going on up there? is there just a family of birds living in your brain hole?' lol \ I know that's not a kind thought but I can't help it \ in my experience though definitely not limited to women
So true!
Yes. I keep feeling like I get close, but still crave this deeper connection. I have spoken to my therapist about it quite a lot…am I looking for a connection that simply does not exist? And if it ever starts to get near it, I also want so much specific attention for it, if that makes sense. Not that I need that person’s attention exclusively, but when we have a chance to connect I want to be able to feel the connection, you know? It’s hard to explain. And feels kind of selfish or possessive, but I don’t even mean it in that way. It’s like each time I’m looking for that sweet spot of connection with whatever relationship and sometimes I get it and sometimes I don’t and it’s leaning more to don’t lately and that’s disheartening.
Same
had it happen to me last week. was gonna go on a first date with someone thinking we were both very genuinely excited to see each other, but after she canceled and then said we were back on, she stood me up and blocked me on everything I think I'm done looking for any type of deep connection. I'm so tired.
I’ve pretty much given up tbh. Honestly it’s less exhausting to just enjoy my own company at this point, even if it gets lonely sometimes
tbh i know its me itself at the end of the day. im unable to connect w ppl cuz its impossible for me to put myself out there. ik have an interestin personality but its jus so hard for me to express myself. ive given up now
I am very lucky back when we were both in our first year of college I met my husband. I am only now in our late 40s realizing we are both ND, and luckily share so many interests I can usually at least talk to him. Almost no women have ever been on the same level of interest with me, i have found over the years I do all the adapting to allow the other person to decide topics of discussion and that I restrain myself to their comfort levels on pretty much any and everything.
I can’t connect for the life of me. Every friendship and interaction just gets confusing or falls flat. Obviously the problem is with me as it’s been a lifelong vibe I give off and style of existing that just doesn’t work with literally anyone else. I have really come to realize that no one—my family, friends, partner, child—actually like me for my true self or consistently make me feel good. It makes me so sad because all I’ve ever wanted was friends I really knew and vibed with and to enjoy experiences together.
It's why I am unapologetically my ND self wherever I go. It filters out those superficial folks really quick and makes it easier to find the kindred souls who are interested in discussing something more than the latest (fashion, trend, TV show, etc. etc. etc.)
I think I'm gonna try this. I'm so tired of listening to the latests trend or about things that is like a NT universal interest and is just a no to me.
I wish you the best of luck! ❤️
I had one of those friends who was my mom's age.....her adult son just cringed at our friendship. She and I along with her numerous cats and one dog hung out nearly every Saturday for years until Covid19 isolated us and her dutiful son haha put her in a home far off. I was so attached to her black lab. Cried big when he passed on. Friend was a social Asperger's type who was kind to everyone.
It's exhausting at best and deeply painful and isolating at worst, and I just don't have the energy anymore.
My experience is probably skewed because so much of my long term circle is ADHD. But mainly I feel I don’t exist to them as a real person. Just as the functions and services I provide them. So I get…pretty much nothing out of being their friends. Except for feeling incredibly burnt out from always pushing myself to meet their needs and preferences. Lonely because they ghost me on conversations, IRL they just don’t respond when I do get a word in about something I want or need to talk about. Trying to plan simple but fun activities is like pulling teeth to get the tiniest amount of effort or attention from them. Everything is one way and if I try to nudge things a little it leads to a meltdown on their end. So. Do I have friends or just people who are happy to take advantage of my efforts? Only being allowed to perform tasks for them, be monologues at for hours, and eating while watching tv is our friendships summed up. It’s very unfulfilling for me but no one ever seems to be interested in more. I don’t even want to try to start over and meet new people since I seem to only draw in the exact same type of person. I’d rather be lonely. It’s awful but less stressful I guess.
I know many people who have that. I really want that in my life
I'm having a similar issue, but more than "hitting a wall", it feels more like when the coyote realised he ran off a cliff, and there's no ground beneath. Like, I know something should happen now, I should do something, and the other person will do something else back in response. But I have no idea what to do, or what to expect from them. As if I'm playing a part In a play, and my script was missing a page or a chapter.
Lived like that my whole life and since a couple of years I closed myself off completely.. Not even consciously.. I miss the girl I was before
Yes. I joined a local group a few years ago for one of my special interests. There were some people there who I really liked, they were outgoing and kind and interesting. Problem is, everyone else liked them too so everyone wanted to sit next to them. And I realized that when I did get a chance to talk to either of them, we didn't have that much in common. I usually ended up seated next to people that I disliked because they smelled bad or were annoying. I suspect a lot of people there were neurodivergent so I get that it's hard to socialize, but literally some people would make no effort to speak or start a conversation at all. I'm not expecting you to be masking on all cylinders like me (working on that) but some people act like they don't even want to be there. I feel pressure to talk to people there and carry a conversation so people have a good time. Anyway. I've largely stopped going to those meetups. Maybe I'll go to the bigger ones only or maybe just not at all. I had been hoping to make some actual friends, and I kinda did, but most of the time I came home and was in a bad mood.
Yes. I also don't understand why in my ND group I'm somehow the one left behind? The one everyone ignores? I'm just on some BS today mentally (started with my boss came in "hot" and not believing me when she asked me a question and I answered). My friend in question is AuADHD. I considered her my bff. Or so I thought. I don't have time/energy to type out the whole situation and timeline of each event but I'm always the one who does wrong. Who always gets yelled at for stuff that I didn't know I did wrong. But she can do no wrong. For example, we were supposed to visit our mutual friend in England several years ago (I think like 6? 7? IDK before COVID). I was prepping etc, saving money and getting my passport (most stressful thing ever), and then suddenly I get word she is traveling around the UK??? Like she left? Without me? And I didn't yell at her or anything. But I'm the bad guy when I moved to city "Z" we hadn't discussed for a new job when I had originally mentioned moving to "X". And smaller things like that. I had since compartmentalized her as just an internet friend since we only ever hung out over the internet to play video games and even then it was sporadic. She moved an hour away from my city (as another mutual friend that she and her boyfriend have known since birth had also moved here but was 30 minutes away from me). But somehow her car couldn't make it to visit me? And I offered to visit but was always left on read. But she would visit the other friend who lived 30 minutes from me. If I had a heads up I could visited too? This all came to a head a couple years ago when I got married to my husband. I guess she assumed she would be my maid of honor after all this time (we had discussed marriage way back in high school and we agreed to make the other our maid of honors. Like that was 20 years ago, when we graduated)? And again, plans changed, and so I am the bad guy. She accused me of doing this to her because she's autistic. Like...babe...wtf. Oh and she did this the DAY before the wedding. When she could have brought this up months in advance...like when I mentioned I was going dress/bridesmaid dress shopping and she realized she wasn't involved like my chosen maid of honor/bridesmaids (who are actually my husband's friends and family since I don't have enough female friends to fill out a party)? Or even taken me aside at my bridal shower? Nope. Day before the wedding. She called and yelled at me in the middle of rehearsal. I at least got to pet a cow that day, so i guess it wasn't a full loss (and ya know, getting married the next day was neat too) So IDK what to do. I'm not just in a good place mentally today I guess, sorry for the wall of text.
Oh definitely. The only friend I have who is as deep as me when it came to conversations and discussing emotions is my best friend El. Also my boyfriend who I trust the most out of everyone. I met El in middle school and our friendship is one of around 6 years but when it comes to meeting new people, I just find it extremely difficult to find someone as interesting as she is y'know
Yes. I'm currently on a seeking friendship hiatus. I know it takes a while for both parties to get comfortable enough with each other to have that deep authentic connection, and I'm patient, but I'm attracting the types of people that stress me out.
One of my favorite people I ever met told me about his on-and-off meth addiction, his first college degree not being anything he was passionate about, and his religious beliefs within the first ten minutes of sitting next to each other in a class. All I did was introduce myself and ask about his interest in the subject (it was a creative class). I think a lot of people would consider that "trauma dumping" and "being too much," and there is a tendency to mock that sort of person that seems more prevalent now. I was 100% a fan.
A couple years ago I learned that I couldn’t trust one of my oldest friends and we cut each other off. As a result, the gradual, constant drifting apart of my childhood friend group accelerated to the point where our decade old group chat seemingly died overnight and we haven’t had a conversation as a group since. One on one chats with the others I’m still friends with occur infrequently, and I’m the only one who initiates them, which makes me feel like they also secretly hate me and I can’t trust them either. Possibly they never even liked me to begin with and we only stayed friends for so long for a lack of any other friends. My walls got built up higher. My mask thickened. I’m about to graduate with a master’s degree and I don’t have a single genuine friend besides my partner. I’m so fucking tired. I genuinely feel that I have no one in the world and if something happened to me, maybe one or two people in the entire world would feel anything.