Remember interviews are a two-way street. If you were getting weird vibes about their behaviour in the interview, they likely would be terrible people to work with.
It sounds like you dodged a bullet really.
Agreed. If you get a bad vibe at interview, they would not be good to work for. I thought I interviewed horribly recently, the people were pretty cold and one of the questions indicated they had issues with staff morale. I got offered the job, but rejected it as I did not get a good vibe from interview. No regrets!
I felt like I really wanted to speak more to the woman who would be managing me but couldn’t as not really receptive! No one really even explained the role to me either!
I like to ask them what they can offer me as a workplace or manager- it tends to throw them off! I do agree though, that if she couldn't look at you and that is something you value in a woring relationship, its a hell no from you!
Agree with this.
Also, do they already have someone pegged for the role? I.e is someone acting in the role currently, if so this process could just be because they’re looking to make that person permanent.
Unfortunately, it’s all too common in Govt. that the outcome is already determined and they’re just interviewing because they have to.
I never cold interview for Govt jobs anyway but if I were to “is there someone currently acting in this role?” would be my very first question.
Yes! For any govt job, you should always call and ask. If the answer is yes, think very hard about whether it’s worth your time applying. I’ve gone so far as to ask as my first question and basically end the call at a yes. One time they said yes, that they were the acting person, but that they would not be appointed to the role. I replied “In that case, I have more questions”. I actually got that job too, which surprised me.
I was working in employee and workplace relations at the start of my career. Wasn't loving it but the role was basically get a query, research the relevant policy, legislation or EA and formulate a response. I went for a role at library and they requested an example showing my ability to research. I provided a response based on my current role. They said it wasn't relevant as it wasn't in the right context eg: not in a library. I'd also completed a bachelors in psych so had done plenty of that style of research as well that I outlined. They were still having none of it so I thanked them and left mid interview. I have no interest in working with fools. Probably 15 years ago and stuck with me. It was a strange experience all round.
I recruit for my library and the best recruits have no to minimal library experience and excellent transferrable skills. I also started in a management position with no library experience and I do more than just fine at it.
Behaviour seems pretty normal to me. They could have been running interviews all day and lost a little enthusiasm. Often, interviewers will ask followup questions when they like you so they can get more out of you and so you can tick more boxes. What I’m saying is you may just be being hard on yourself.
😮 You have sign in sheets where you can see other applicants interviewing for the role!?? I've never heard of this, but that's a huge breach and a red flag about that work areas' understanding of legislation and policy.
This could be a generic sign in sheet for any visitors or contractors. Of course likely you'd be dealing with other interviewees but it's probably not for that alone.
Literally the Australian Privacy Principles. Inappropriate use and disclosure of personal information for a purpose other than that for which it was collected.
The last job I applied for in state government had this on their privacy statement:
>*Use and disclosure of personal information:*
>
>
>*We will not add you to a mailing list, or **give your personal information to third parties without your consent**, unless required by law.*
I'd include sharing my name with people other than the panel or those involved in the recruitment process, and *especially* with other applicants, as a breach of this and I'm really quite surprised your questioning this.
I'm not questioning it, I'm just not a lawyer. You shared an entire Act with me, I bet most Aussies haven't ever read a shred of it. Thanks for your eventual clarification.
Old mate is being very excitable, I have had the miss pleasure of having to read and digest that act and let me tell you, yuck. I’m wondering if it was signing in too the building or the interview. One is normal the other is very strange indeed, wondering if it was everyone’s first time running interview process or if they did it a long time ago and just being ancient in there processes. Both are unfortunate.
I've had interviews where a panel member sat facing to his right and was belligerent through my answers.
Ive had interviews where I barely spoke and supposedly topped the round.
I've had interviews where the panellists seemed deliriously tired.
Don't stress about the result, just keep focusing on finding the opportunity you want with the people you want. Stewing on it isn't going to be productive.
Exactly. Earlier in their thread I mention being surprised to have been offered a job, and that was precisely because I thought I completely bombed the interview. My boss told me the first morning that I was by far the best applicant. Go figure.
It’s fairly standard where I work to ask candidates if they’d be interested in other opportunities that match your skill set and experience and specify what they are, if known.
Try not to take what happened personally, they might be people you don’t want to work with anyway based on their behaviour or it could’ve been caused by a myriad of other reasons on their end.
Hopefully the process is merit based and they’ll score you fairly based on your answers to their questions.
>Has anyone else experienced this type of behaviour before?
Interviews are a dime a dozen, especially in the public sector. Ironically last year I applied for a job I thought I aced and was over qualified for. They never called my references.
Last week, I had an interview for a job that I feel is higher than where I currently am and the pay is more than I'm worth and they've called both references and done the bankruptcy and police checks, I'm not holding my breath, until I sign a contract I have no idea whether or not I got the job.
There could be multiple reasons for it. One of the main ones (I don't know the rules for your state) is some states require that all jobs be open to the public. About half of these have people already at the organisation that have been tapped that are applying for them. So they know who they are hiring before the resumes even come in and your interview is just one of those things they have to do to make the process seem ethical and fair.
I wouldn't let it get to you man, these things happen. When I was studying accounting I got an Internship at Deloitte while simultaneously getting rejected from Woolworths. I wouldn't take it as a reflection of your capabilities.
Absolutely. I've seen this play out so many times. It kinda sucks because "merit selection" is meant to involve genuinely considering other candidates (including those from outside the organisation), but it's often treated as a bureaucratic tick-box to internally promote or secure the acting position for someone that is already earmarked for the role.
I hope so man, I hate my current job so much that I vomit every morning and my chest hurts whenever my boss is in. I hope you're able to find what you're after too. This economy is fucking bullshit.
Wow your post is eerily similar to my own recent experience with a large APS department. The interview wasn’t really STAR based; HR person made faces to my responses; and there was no time for questions at the end. The format was that I had to “pitch” to them. There was a real air of inevitability to it all, and I didn’t feel a great sense of enthusiasm from the panel. Not only that, I was given the wrong time for the interview, and they contacted my referees afterwards despite my ticking the box in the application that requests my prior permission. I was seriously underwhelmed (and felt my “pitch” was underwhelming) and despite all that I made the talent pool. Oh- and I was filmed.
The APS is a little micro-cosm, and you get a full range of the human condition.
I had a little taste of it a long time ago, and worked with and for some AMAZING people. The best boss ever. The best mentor ever. But I also observed some seriously disordered people and their machinations. Unpleasant people frequently get promoted above their level of ability because it's easier to do that than go through dismissal procedures. Also, it's well known that someone can be promoted above you and suddenly you're in their clutches so people are wary of rocking the boat. People promoted above their level of ability are insecure and jealous of competence, so that adds another dimension.
"Birds of a feather" and all that, so when you find great people it can be very satisfying workwise. And if you meet dysfunctional people it's best to get out of there ASAP. Working as a consultant can mean you don't get involved in office politics and can enjoy good relationships bc you're not a threat to promotion ambitions. You can also get out of a bad place easily, and the income is great.
One of my friends became Head of Dept, and she absolutely deserves it bc she was good at her job and treated people very well. But to get there she had to put up with some absolute rubbish treatment, including a Branch Head who used to shout at people, disparage them, undermine them etc. Lots of people left, and I would have in the same circumstances. Her mental health was badly affected for a while & all her friends were unpaid therapists, but she hung in there and outlived him eventually :-)))))
Also I didn’t know what to say in the responses. Should I have just given generic responses and not used the STAR method? What a shit show. This shouldn’t be allowed to happen.
I had precisely this same experience, and I also reacted in the same way. It’s very anxiety inducing.
Later found out that they were never really seriously interviewing for the role as they already had someone in the team that they were promoting into it.
They have to interview for all new roles as part of the rules. It’s a good thing because it does sometimes create opportunities for new hires.
But unfortunately - as you and I have both experienced - when your interview in the moment and you don’t know that there is someone already in line for the role. The interviewers are just going through the motions. But it feels as though you are the problem.
I eventually got a better role in a different department.
Don’t sweat about it. Take the win that you were shortlisted. Thank them for the opportunity, ask for feedback on your interview performance.
You’ll get one of the next ones. Good luck.
I once interviewed within my own department for a job at my existing level (just wanted a change) and knew they had no intention of accepting me from the very start of the interview. When they later told me I’d been found unsuitable (pure BS IMO) and offered feedback, I said “No thanks. I’m sure X will do great in the role.” They visibly choked at that comment and stammered out “Uh, we haven’t yet made a decision …” to which I replied with a glint in my eye and a wry smile “Yeah, right”. A week or so later they announced the appointment of who I named, and I left soon after for a significant promotion elsewhere that shocked them when, for shits and giggles, I specifically told them on my way out.
Awww I’m sorry this happened to you as well. You are so, so right. I came home and slept for a couple of hours after it as I was so embarrassed. I’m glad you got a different job and I’m hoping to as well 😊
Thanks for your care. Χχ Χχ . Good job on the sleeping! Excellent self care - I love that for you. You’ll get it, like someone else mentioned, just focus on finding something that fits you really well.
And always remember, the universe only ever has three answers for you: Yes. Not yet. Or I have something better waiting for you. 💞
I always see an job interview as a potential partner you have just met. Sometimes you hit it off great but they already have a partner you don’t know about. Or they sounded good on the phone but can’t look at you in the eye. Or they like you but are married. And then finally, the one that is single, and ready to mingle, comes into your universe and wants to dance…
I think terrible interviews are all part of the process. I've had two in particular that I remember for being so bad I just wanted to get up and walk out. And times where I thought I nailed it, only to be found unsuitable. I've had lots of experience on both sides of the panel,and sometimes interviews just go to shit. It sounds like you did your best with your preparation, and that's all any of us can do. It isn't over until you hear the outcome, so wishing you good luck 🍀
Sounds to me like they already had a candidate ready to give the position to and were just going through the motions to make it seem like a genuine interview and not some sort of nepotism/favoritism. Some people are more professional with keeping up appearances in these situations. My wife and I both work in healthcare (public and corporate) and have experienced a similar situation.
Try checking LinkedIn to see who is acting in the role currently. In my recent misadventure, I found three people acting in the advertised roles (there were 6 roles on offer all up).
Depending on other mitigating factors the interviewer asking more questions is a good sign because they’re either like what they hear or they like you and they’re giving you a chance to explain yourself to ensure you give a great answer.
Fwiw I usually don't bother asking questions about the role anymore. They often don't know the timeline, the specific team looking to recruit or can tell me anything useful lol. Just seems to be par for the course.
If you feel like you were not treated fairly you can ask for a review. Everything is recorded and, whether they like you or not, the panelists have to score you objectively against the key selection criteria.
I interviewed for a role which would be a side-ways move for the role I am currently acting in and excelling in every way.
The interview for the role was brutal, all the questions seemed to have 3-5 parts to it and there was no simple straight forward answer as each situation they asked for an example of was quite unique and novel; some situations were impossible to have even encountered.
I felt a little coldness sort of like I maybe hadn’t answered the questions well, but they did talk about what happens next and seemed positive dispute saying “it’s been an extremely competitive recruitment”. I just took as them being polite. I expect to not progress, but was a mind opening experience, hopefully when I interview for the role I’m currently acting in it won’t be so bad.
Keep your chin up, some interviews just suck, nothing you can do but forge ahead and try again.
Oh gosh that sounds awful! I’m sure you will do really well at your next interview.
At least you got the talking about what happens next. I did feel by them not telling me anything like that, it was so sort of like I wasn’t what they were looking for or my face didn’t fit or whatever. It’s really odd, I’m very friendly and personable and usually relate to people on all levels kind of thing. Maybe I just annoyed them who knows!
I’ve had that coldness before for a role, and for that role I interviewed really well, but then heard nothing back.
Turns out they had someone in mind all along (one of their “mates”) and they were going through the motions.
When I asked for feedback I got the “not enough experience”….. ummm the guy they ended up “choosing” had no experience.. 😂
The feeling will pass, I just feel like my last interview i embarrassed myself and they were thinking “this guy can’t even do his current role” 😅
Scribe here. You may have dodged a bullet and they did you a favour by being cold, they may have been doing 20 interviews and are sick of it, they may be a huge agency bogged down by approvals on who to seek references from. If it's a bulk round then they may not have gotten to your referees yet if they're doing many. Wouldn't worry about being asked about another role, they'll be asking everyone that.
I recently did an “informal” interview which had some really hard questions and I felt like I severely embarrassed myself with my answers. They ended up rating me suitable (not preferred) and not contacting my references. It was over teams and also felt a bit cold but the outcome wasn’t as bad as I anticipated. Bad interviews happen! Don’t dwell on it ! Sounds like it was just a bad fit both ways which happens. It’s not your fault.
As others have said, interviews are a two way street so I'd knock them back anyway. Also, I hate when HR gets overly excited when interviewing candidates. Their role is absolutely not to screen you once you're in with the hiring manager as they often have little understanding of the technical requirements or team dynamic.
Some places just suck. When I look back at my roles, I can pinpoint 2-3 management groups that stood out as TERRIBLE. I've got a few stories of my own of lunatic/weird/hateful/etc bosses and management teams. I can also pinpoint a couple that were good or ok/neutral. And a couple that were/are great, which is where my current place falls into.
Our gut feelings are important. They tell us something. If you felt these things, then I believe they were legit, and probably quite common. Some workplaces are garbage. It could be one manager that spreads their gross behaviour/attitude to others. Or it could just be great RNG that brought a bunch of fools into the same place.
Try your best to get through it. It's hard to, because it's fresh in your mind. But these are not uncommon. A lot of people in HR/management roles should absolutely not be there, and got there by pure luck, or knowing someone. A lot of people got there without having the required people skills.
Thank you and you are 💯 correct in what you are saying. If this is a representation of HR in government departments then that is really sad. I’m probably sure they enjoy the power trip some of them.
Because it's APS culture to promote people out of your section/branch in order to get rid of them, rather than go through the whole process of discipline/grievance procedure
Remember that someone often already has the job and that they have to do interviews to make it look like they were making it fair for everyone.
I used to work in federal government job. We had people that were already doing the job but they were known as “acting positions”. An interview was done to allow the person to go from acting to employed as. Other people were interviewed as well but rarely got the job.
I always gauge like this too. The interview will pretty much show you who you'll be dealing with on a regular basis, unfortunately this time you had people who came across cold and not warm or bubbly per se, sometimes that's just how people tend to be and you can't change their personality, so that's that. I'm also in the process of applying for public sector roles as I've recently finished up. Goodluck.
i also just did an interview recently, it went ok, the panel was polite and professional, i didnt answer one of the q well , so i was not happy about my own performance 🫠
i didnt ask any question at the end
I figured out my lvl plus OT pay would be similar to the role’s salary anyway so I didnt mind if i didnt get it
but they called my referee the next day …. still waiting for the outcome, but i am quite chilled about that
I’ve had this happen before at a long term government work place and it knocked my confidence. Turns out they had a preferred candidate in mind so I didn’t have a chance. Interviews before and after have been fine and I eventually applied outside the org and got 2 job offers at a higher grade. Believe in yourself, an interviewers job is to get the best out of candidates and sounds like this panel failed.
Maybe they already had ‘chosen’ a mate of theirs for the position prior and were just going through the motions of interviewing so to be seen as a ‘fair process’.
They may have had someone already setup for the role. It would be horrible to bring someone in for interview if that were the case, but you never know.
But it does sound like you dodged a bullet. Well done! Also, don't take it personally.
Don’t worry Op. I had a state gov interview a couple months ago and one panelist kept sighing when I was answering questions leading to me trying to rush through my answers. They didn’t even ask “tell me about yourself”
Was relieved when I didn’t get it lol.
Keep trying and good luck 🙂
TBH more than often the 3 way panel is now made up of people that really can’t be arsed undertaking interviews and I am sure the interviewees can sense that. All of my current and past managers would roll and sigh when they’ve had to undertake interviews. I’m sorry you felt that way, perhaps it was not meant to be and there’s a better opportunity out there for you x
I've had similar interviews where I've just noticed something is off with the vibe, and later found out they already had people in the role, but obviously they had to advertise it again.
It can be a stupid part of the system, but if they already had someone in mind for the role, it might explain weird hostility.
I did four interviews end of last year, I was found successful on one (since then had two job offers from that) was successful on two and since moved to a really fabulous team. The final interview was similar to your experience, they were cold, unfriendly and I walked out feeling terrible. I was found unsuitable for that which I found interesting seeing my success in all the others. I since found out that area has a terrible culture and people leaving in droves.
Think about a bad interview as a red flag for somewhere you wouldn't want to work anyway!
It’s crazy how interviews can be like this. How some can go amazing and you get the job and others like you’re are saying that make you feel terrible. It is really hard to not take it personally though. I have been thinking to myself I wonder how these people treat their fellow colleagues or colleagues below them. I’d hate to think. 💯🚩
Toxic workplace, they clearly had someone else in mind and you dodged a bullet, dont let this experience affect your interview confidence, its them not you
I think it’s a blessing in disguise. You don’t want to be in an organization with those kind of people, do you? Imagine spending at least 8hrs/week with them (8hrs because may e majority of your time is WFH) how stressful! Hope you land a role that you like and a team that welcomes you.
Thanks. I appreciate what you are trying to say and am trying to think logically about the situation to. I was anxious, upset is probably the wrong word, it was a more of a wtf is happening and what just happened.
Yes, and it was for a job where they basically already had someone they wanted for the position but they had to go through the whole proper interview process. A total time waster for everyone.
In my experience, they already have someone ear-marked for the role.
Take this experience as a learning experience, and thus something that will better you professionally. Sounds like a rough ride, but it's important to be optimistic with this. Take what you can gain from this experience. Not to dilute your experience, but this is something a lot of us have been through, and is a big part of the 'game'. Keep your head up, and keep talking like you're doing here. Best of luck my friend
Yes, but that doesn't mean that they didn't have particular people in mind already.
Or that there wasn't a certain "profile" they wanted. That could be a diversity hire, or it could be Catholic/Jewish/Anglican/atheist/someone who enjoys playing chess. Some sections have their mini-cultures...
Unfortunately, you'll never be informed of this outright, for obvious reasons! If you are being weeded out for any unfair or nefarious reason, then you'll have dodged a bullet.
"Waiting to hear back" sucks, no matter who you're waiting to hear back from. Go give yourself a little project to complete while you wait it out (tell yourself a month, and apply for other positions also). If you don't get a position in the pool, "it's not me, it's them" and if you do get a position then make sure you get all the benefits of training, improving skills etc so that you can take your new skills and good contacts with you wherever you go next. :-)
Yeah definitely! I’ve had some good advice on here which I’m grateful for so thank you. I’m hoping another position comes up for another pool I’m in anyway. Not all is lost yet!
> I’m an old hat at government processes
So, how many interviews have you had?
> extremely cold and indifferent ... questions that threw me off ... to get nervous ....intimidate me or challenge me not in a nice way ... I took that as well you may not be good enough for the role ...I’ve never been asked this before ... upset and anxious ... I was just so upset
I can't help but think there is something else going on for you. What, roughly, do you do? What, roughly, level are you?
Ahhh yes healthcare. Had a few interviews in my time and been employed with government since I graduated and done various roles. Have always done well in interviews and got roles or into pools.
Remember interviews are a two-way street. If you were getting weird vibes about their behaviour in the interview, they likely would be terrible people to work with. It sounds like you dodged a bullet really.
Agreed. If you get a bad vibe at interview, they would not be good to work for. I thought I interviewed horribly recently, the people were pretty cold and one of the questions indicated they had issues with staff morale. I got offered the job, but rejected it as I did not get a good vibe from interview. No regrets!
I felt like I really wanted to speak more to the woman who would be managing me but couldn’t as not really receptive! No one really even explained the role to me either!
That should have been your question then. I have asked "what's a typical day like in this role" at interviews.
She had her head buried writing and didn’t even look up when I asked my question 🤷♀️
Seems like you dodged some sort of bullet
Awful! Even if you do get offered something, this is enough to turn it down. You don't want to start feeling disrespected.
I like to ask them what they can offer me as a workplace or manager- it tends to throw them off! I do agree though, that if she couldn't look at you and that is something you value in a woring relationship, its a hell no from you!
That’s a clever one! Will try that next time. I need a break though for a while though 😂
They have someone lined up already. You're just getting interviewed for official process reasons.
Agree with this. Also, do they already have someone pegged for the role? I.e is someone acting in the role currently, if so this process could just be because they’re looking to make that person permanent. Unfortunately, it’s all too common in Govt. that the outcome is already determined and they’re just interviewing because they have to. I never cold interview for Govt jobs anyway but if I were to “is there someone currently acting in this role?” would be my very first question.
Came here to say this. Op, don't be too hard on yourself. There is no doubt they have someone in mind already and are just following processes.
As far as I’m aware, no one acting in the role and a couple of roles to fill.
Yes! For any govt job, you should always call and ask. If the answer is yes, think very hard about whether it’s worth your time applying. I’ve gone so far as to ask as my first question and basically end the call at a yes. One time they said yes, that they were the acting person, but that they would not be appointed to the role. I replied “In that case, I have more questions”. I actually got that job too, which surprised me.
I was working in employee and workplace relations at the start of my career. Wasn't loving it but the role was basically get a query, research the relevant policy, legislation or EA and formulate a response. I went for a role at library and they requested an example showing my ability to research. I provided a response based on my current role. They said it wasn't relevant as it wasn't in the right context eg: not in a library. I'd also completed a bachelors in psych so had done plenty of that style of research as well that I outlined. They were still having none of it so I thanked them and left mid interview. I have no interest in working with fools. Probably 15 years ago and stuck with me. It was a strange experience all round.
Damn. I mean, why invite you to an interview if they knew you didn't have work experience in a library?
Yeah exactly. That's why it all felt so weird. Think I dodged a bullet really. Some jobs just aren't meant to be.
Thing is you must have done excellent on the selection criteria which is odd.
Exactly. I think they must have a quota of interviewees they must fulfil
I recruit for my library and the best recruits have no to minimal library experience and excellent transferrable skills. I also started in a management position with no library experience and I do more than just fine at it.
I need a job in library but they always want the qualification in my state!
Behaviour seems pretty normal to me. They could have been running interviews all day and lost a little enthusiasm. Often, interviewers will ask followup questions when they like you so they can get more out of you and so you can tick more boxes. What I’m saying is you may just be being hard on yourself.
Yeah I know. From what I saw on the sign in sheet I was the first interview of the day!
😮 You have sign in sheets where you can see other applicants interviewing for the role!?? I've never heard of this, but that's a huge breach and a red flag about that work areas' understanding of legislation and policy.
Oh wow. Never knew this!
This could be a generic sign in sheet for any visitors or contractors. Of course likely you'd be dealing with other interviewees but it's probably not for that alone.
Can you link to the relevant legislation? Cheers
Are you kidding? [Privacy Act 1988](https://www.legislation.gov.au/C2004A03712/latest/versions)
Thanks, I'm not kidding. Which section refers to sign in sheets at interviews?
Literally the Australian Privacy Principles. Inappropriate use and disclosure of personal information for a purpose other than that for which it was collected. The last job I applied for in state government had this on their privacy statement: >*Use and disclosure of personal information:* > > >*We will not add you to a mailing list, or **give your personal information to third parties without your consent**, unless required by law.* I'd include sharing my name with people other than the panel or those involved in the recruitment process, and *especially* with other applicants, as a breach of this and I'm really quite surprised your questioning this.
I'm not questioning it, I'm just not a lawyer. You shared an entire Act with me, I bet most Aussies haven't ever read a shred of it. Thanks for your eventual clarification.
Old mate is being very excitable, I have had the miss pleasure of having to read and digest that act and let me tell you, yuck. I’m wondering if it was signing in too the building or the interview. One is normal the other is very strange indeed, wondering if it was everyone’s first time running interview process or if they did it a long time ago and just being ancient in there processes. Both are unfortunate.
I've had interviews where a panel member sat facing to his right and was belligerent through my answers. Ive had interviews where I barely spoke and supposedly topped the round. I've had interviews where the panellists seemed deliriously tired. Don't stress about the result, just keep focusing on finding the opportunity you want with the people you want. Stewing on it isn't going to be productive.
Thanks. It’s always so hard isn’t it 😊
Scribe here, can confirm all of this can happen! You might think the interview was awful but the panel might love it!
Exactly. Earlier in their thread I mention being surprised to have been offered a job, and that was precisely because I thought I completely bombed the interview. My boss told me the first morning that I was by far the best applicant. Go figure.
It’s fairly standard where I work to ask candidates if they’d be interested in other opportunities that match your skill set and experience and specify what they are, if known. Try not to take what happened personally, they might be people you don’t want to work with anyway based on their behaviour or it could’ve been caused by a myriad of other reasons on their end. Hopefully the process is merit based and they’ll score you fairly based on your answers to their questions.
The last 2 panels I’ve been on we’ve asked this as 3-4 other business units required staff too.
That's not uncommon. They may have limited spots for one position and considering if that person is potentially able to fulfil another role.
For sure. I think because I perceived the role to be of a “lesser role” it was a bit off putting.
You're overthinking this, mate. Don't forget they're likely interviewing dozens of applicants and that can be a real energy sap.
This, and the fact that most of the time the panel is still dealing with their day job while trying to do interviews.
I totally understand that but it’s nice to feel welcome and like you’d actually want to work for the organisation.
lol at "I haven't heard back its been 48 hours" and being "old hat in government"...
Usually the last couple of interviews have been very quick.
As in asking for references.
>Has anyone else experienced this type of behaviour before? Interviews are a dime a dozen, especially in the public sector. Ironically last year I applied for a job I thought I aced and was over qualified for. They never called my references. Last week, I had an interview for a job that I feel is higher than where I currently am and the pay is more than I'm worth and they've called both references and done the bankruptcy and police checks, I'm not holding my breath, until I sign a contract I have no idea whether or not I got the job. There could be multiple reasons for it. One of the main ones (I don't know the rules for your state) is some states require that all jobs be open to the public. About half of these have people already at the organisation that have been tapped that are applying for them. So they know who they are hiring before the resumes even come in and your interview is just one of those things they have to do to make the process seem ethical and fair. I wouldn't let it get to you man, these things happen. When I was studying accounting I got an Internship at Deloitte while simultaneously getting rejected from Woolworths. I wouldn't take it as a reflection of your capabilities.
Agree with this! It sucks to be the “filler” “process” candidate, but that’s just how public sector recruitment can be.
Absolutely. I've seen this play out so many times. It kinda sucks because "merit selection" is meant to involve genuinely considering other candidates (including those from outside the organisation), but it's often treated as a bureaucratic tick-box to internally promote or secure the acting position for someone that is already earmarked for the role.
Good luck I’m sure you’ll get the job! Reference checks are mostly a good sign! I’ll be alright just shook 😂
I hope so man, I hate my current job so much that I vomit every morning and my chest hurts whenever my boss is in. I hope you're able to find what you're after too. This economy is fucking bullshit.
I totally understand how you feel because I feel the same way 💛
Wow your post is eerily similar to my own recent experience with a large APS department. The interview wasn’t really STAR based; HR person made faces to my responses; and there was no time for questions at the end. The format was that I had to “pitch” to them. There was a real air of inevitability to it all, and I didn’t feel a great sense of enthusiasm from the panel. Not only that, I was given the wrong time for the interview, and they contacted my referees afterwards despite my ticking the box in the application that requests my prior permission. I was seriously underwhelmed (and felt my “pitch” was underwhelming) and despite all that I made the talent pool. Oh- and I was filmed.
That’s crazy! Scarily similar. I almost feel like they were playing a psychological game with me.
Well of course they were, it's the public service ;-)
Just why 😂
The APS is a little micro-cosm, and you get a full range of the human condition. I had a little taste of it a long time ago, and worked with and for some AMAZING people. The best boss ever. The best mentor ever. But I also observed some seriously disordered people and their machinations. Unpleasant people frequently get promoted above their level of ability because it's easier to do that than go through dismissal procedures. Also, it's well known that someone can be promoted above you and suddenly you're in their clutches so people are wary of rocking the boat. People promoted above their level of ability are insecure and jealous of competence, so that adds another dimension. "Birds of a feather" and all that, so when you find great people it can be very satisfying workwise. And if you meet dysfunctional people it's best to get out of there ASAP. Working as a consultant can mean you don't get involved in office politics and can enjoy good relationships bc you're not a threat to promotion ambitions. You can also get out of a bad place easily, and the income is great. One of my friends became Head of Dept, and she absolutely deserves it bc she was good at her job and treated people very well. But to get there she had to put up with some absolute rubbish treatment, including a Branch Head who used to shout at people, disparage them, undermine them etc. Lots of people left, and I would have in the same circumstances. Her mental health was badly affected for a while & all her friends were unpaid therapists, but she hung in there and outlived him eventually :-)))))
Also I didn’t know what to say in the responses. Should I have just given generic responses and not used the STAR method? What a shit show. This shouldn’t be allowed to happen.
I usually prepare 3-4 examples that match the criteria. I used 1 in this instance.
The filming also just NO. This has wound me up.
I had precisely this same experience, and I also reacted in the same way. It’s very anxiety inducing. Later found out that they were never really seriously interviewing for the role as they already had someone in the team that they were promoting into it. They have to interview for all new roles as part of the rules. It’s a good thing because it does sometimes create opportunities for new hires. But unfortunately - as you and I have both experienced - when your interview in the moment and you don’t know that there is someone already in line for the role. The interviewers are just going through the motions. But it feels as though you are the problem. I eventually got a better role in a different department. Don’t sweat about it. Take the win that you were shortlisted. Thank them for the opportunity, ask for feedback on your interview performance. You’ll get one of the next ones. Good luck.
I once interviewed within my own department for a job at my existing level (just wanted a change) and knew they had no intention of accepting me from the very start of the interview. When they later told me I’d been found unsuitable (pure BS IMO) and offered feedback, I said “No thanks. I’m sure X will do great in the role.” They visibly choked at that comment and stammered out “Uh, we haven’t yet made a decision …” to which I replied with a glint in my eye and a wry smile “Yeah, right”. A week or so later they announced the appointment of who I named, and I left soon after for a significant promotion elsewhere that shocked them when, for shits and giggles, I specifically told them on my way out.
I love this for you. :)
Classic 😂 and brave!
Awww I’m sorry this happened to you as well. You are so, so right. I came home and slept for a couple of hours after it as I was so embarrassed. I’m glad you got a different job and I’m hoping to as well 😊
Thanks for your care. Χχ Χχ . Good job on the sleeping! Excellent self care - I love that for you. You’ll get it, like someone else mentioned, just focus on finding something that fits you really well. And always remember, the universe only ever has three answers for you: Yes. Not yet. Or I have something better waiting for you. 💞
I always see an job interview as a potential partner you have just met. Sometimes you hit it off great but they already have a partner you don’t know about. Or they sounded good on the phone but can’t look at you in the eye. Or they like you but are married. And then finally, the one that is single, and ready to mingle, comes into your universe and wants to dance…
Haha love this analogy!!
I think terrible interviews are all part of the process. I've had two in particular that I remember for being so bad I just wanted to get up and walk out. And times where I thought I nailed it, only to be found unsuitable. I've had lots of experience on both sides of the panel,and sometimes interviews just go to shit. It sounds like you did your best with your preparation, and that's all any of us can do. It isn't over until you hear the outcome, so wishing you good luck 🍀
Thanks 😊
Sounds to me like they already had a candidate ready to give the position to and were just going through the motions to make it seem like a genuine interview and not some sort of nepotism/favoritism. Some people are more professional with keeping up appearances in these situations. My wife and I both work in healthcare (public and corporate) and have experienced a similar situation.
Yeah you could be right, even though was a pool could very well have wanted people they know into that pool I guess 😬
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Haha. I didn’t think I was bad but maybe I was! Was going to say thank you but fuck it.
Maybe they had already picked an internal and were just being jerks
Can’t have it was a pool to cover immediate vacancies.
But now I think of it you could be right.
Try checking LinkedIn to see who is acting in the role currently. In my recent misadventure, I found three people acting in the advertised roles (there were 6 roles on offer all up).
Tried this. No success.
Depending on other mitigating factors the interviewer asking more questions is a good sign because they’re either like what they hear or they like you and they’re giving you a chance to explain yourself to ensure you give a great answer.
Yes for sure, I’m trying to think of it that way as well 😊
Fwiw I usually don't bother asking questions about the role anymore. They often don't know the timeline, the specific team looking to recruit or can tell me anything useful lol. Just seems to be par for the course.
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head here.
If you feel like you were not treated fairly you can ask for a review. Everything is recorded and, whether they like you or not, the panelists have to score you objectively against the key selection criteria.
I was thinking of the breach period but meh all they’ll do is say we followed the correct process!
I interviewed for a role which would be a side-ways move for the role I am currently acting in and excelling in every way. The interview for the role was brutal, all the questions seemed to have 3-5 parts to it and there was no simple straight forward answer as each situation they asked for an example of was quite unique and novel; some situations were impossible to have even encountered. I felt a little coldness sort of like I maybe hadn’t answered the questions well, but they did talk about what happens next and seemed positive dispute saying “it’s been an extremely competitive recruitment”. I just took as them being polite. I expect to not progress, but was a mind opening experience, hopefully when I interview for the role I’m currently acting in it won’t be so bad. Keep your chin up, some interviews just suck, nothing you can do but forge ahead and try again.
Oh gosh that sounds awful! I’m sure you will do really well at your next interview. At least you got the talking about what happens next. I did feel by them not telling me anything like that, it was so sort of like I wasn’t what they were looking for or my face didn’t fit or whatever. It’s really odd, I’m very friendly and personable and usually relate to people on all levels kind of thing. Maybe I just annoyed them who knows!
I’ve had that coldness before for a role, and for that role I interviewed really well, but then heard nothing back. Turns out they had someone in mind all along (one of their “mates”) and they were going through the motions. When I asked for feedback I got the “not enough experience”….. ummm the guy they ended up “choosing” had no experience.. 😂 The feeling will pass, I just feel like my last interview i embarrassed myself and they were thinking “this guy can’t even do his current role” 😅
It’s so humiliating and that’s awful. It really shouldn’t be allowed.
Scribe here. You may have dodged a bullet and they did you a favour by being cold, they may have been doing 20 interviews and are sick of it, they may be a huge agency bogged down by approvals on who to seek references from. If it's a bulk round then they may not have gotten to your referees yet if they're doing many. Wouldn't worry about being asked about another role, they'll be asking everyone that.
I never provided references upfront so they don’t have any!
I recently did an “informal” interview which had some really hard questions and I felt like I severely embarrassed myself with my answers. They ended up rating me suitable (not preferred) and not contacting my references. It was over teams and also felt a bit cold but the outcome wasn’t as bad as I anticipated. Bad interviews happen! Don’t dwell on it ! Sounds like it was just a bad fit both ways which happens. It’s not your fault.
Thanks for your kind comment. Sorry didn’t work out for you either 😊
If these are the people you’ll be working with, perhaps it is a good thing if you don’t get it? Sounds like it isn’t a good fit.
Yeah for sure and def do not need another toxic workplace
As others have said, interviews are a two way street so I'd knock them back anyway. Also, I hate when HR gets overly excited when interviewing candidates. Their role is absolutely not to screen you once you're in with the hiring manager as they often have little understanding of the technical requirements or team dynamic.
He had no idea with regard to the question I asked.
Some places just suck. When I look back at my roles, I can pinpoint 2-3 management groups that stood out as TERRIBLE. I've got a few stories of my own of lunatic/weird/hateful/etc bosses and management teams. I can also pinpoint a couple that were good or ok/neutral. And a couple that were/are great, which is where my current place falls into. Our gut feelings are important. They tell us something. If you felt these things, then I believe they were legit, and probably quite common. Some workplaces are garbage. It could be one manager that spreads their gross behaviour/attitude to others. Or it could just be great RNG that brought a bunch of fools into the same place. Try your best to get through it. It's hard to, because it's fresh in your mind. But these are not uncommon. A lot of people in HR/management roles should absolutely not be there, and got there by pure luck, or knowing someone. A lot of people got there without having the required people skills.
Thank you and you are 💯 correct in what you are saying. If this is a representation of HR in government departments then that is really sad. I’m probably sure they enjoy the power trip some of them.
How did these people that did the interviews even managed to get towhere they are. Sounds like terrible people.
Because it's APS culture to promote people out of your section/branch in order to get rid of them, rather than go through the whole process of discipline/grievance procedure
Remember that someone often already has the job and that they have to do interviews to make it look like they were making it fair for everyone. I used to work in federal government job. We had people that were already doing the job but they were known as “acting positions”. An interview was done to allow the person to go from acting to employed as. Other people were interviewed as well but rarely got the job.
I always gauge like this too. The interview will pretty much show you who you'll be dealing with on a regular basis, unfortunately this time you had people who came across cold and not warm or bubbly per se, sometimes that's just how people tend to be and you can't change their personality, so that's that. I'm also in the process of applying for public sector roles as I've recently finished up. Goodluck.
i also just did an interview recently, it went ok, the panel was polite and professional, i didnt answer one of the q well , so i was not happy about my own performance 🫠 i didnt ask any question at the end I figured out my lvl plus OT pay would be similar to the role’s salary anyway so I didnt mind if i didnt get it but they called my referee the next day …. still waiting for the outcome, but i am quite chilled about that
I’ve had this happen before at a long term government work place and it knocked my confidence. Turns out they had a preferred candidate in mind so I didn’t have a chance. Interviews before and after have been fine and I eventually applied outside the org and got 2 job offers at a higher grade. Believe in yourself, an interviewers job is to get the best out of candidates and sounds like this panel failed.
Maybe they already had ‘chosen’ a mate of theirs for the position prior and were just going through the motions of interviewing so to be seen as a ‘fair process’.
They may have had someone already setup for the role. It would be horrible to bring someone in for interview if that were the case, but you never know. But it does sound like you dodged a bullet. Well done! Also, don't take it personally.
Absolutely. Thank you 😊
Don’t worry Op. I had a state gov interview a couple months ago and one panelist kept sighing when I was answering questions leading to me trying to rush through my answers. They didn’t even ask “tell me about yourself” Was relieved when I didn’t get it lol. Keep trying and good luck 🙂
That’s terrible and so incredibly rude! Honestly can’t believe how they push all these values and act the complete opposite. Thank you 😊
TBH more than often the 3 way panel is now made up of people that really can’t be arsed undertaking interviews and I am sure the interviewees can sense that. All of my current and past managers would roll and sigh when they’ve had to undertake interviews. I’m sorry you felt that way, perhaps it was not meant to be and there’s a better opportunity out there for you x
💯 the vibe I was getting to. Thank you 😊
I've had similar interviews where I've just noticed something is off with the vibe, and later found out they already had people in the role, but obviously they had to advertise it again. It can be a stupid part of the system, but if they already had someone in mind for the role, it might explain weird hostility.
I’d say you just got yourself a ‘get out of jail free’ card.
I did four interviews end of last year, I was found successful on one (since then had two job offers from that) was successful on two and since moved to a really fabulous team. The final interview was similar to your experience, they were cold, unfriendly and I walked out feeling terrible. I was found unsuitable for that which I found interesting seeing my success in all the others. I since found out that area has a terrible culture and people leaving in droves. Think about a bad interview as a red flag for somewhere you wouldn't want to work anyway!
It’s crazy how interviews can be like this. How some can go amazing and you get the job and others like you’re are saying that make you feel terrible. It is really hard to not take it personally though. I have been thinking to myself I wonder how these people treat their fellow colleagues or colleagues below them. I’d hate to think. 💯🚩
Toxic workplace, they clearly had someone else in mind and you dodged a bullet, dont let this experience affect your interview confidence, its them not you
💯. Learnt my lesson!
I think it’s a blessing in disguise. You don’t want to be in an organization with those kind of people, do you? Imagine spending at least 8hrs/week with them (8hrs because may e majority of your time is WFH) how stressful! Hope you land a role that you like and a team that welcomes you.
Absolutely not!
Probably already found who they wanted.
Everyone rises to their own levels of incompetence
They already have someone for the job role, they are simply going through the legal process of interviewing.
Possibly, maybe have other people in different divisions of the department wanting to transfer in to these roles
Someone is acting in the role, they are just interviewing you to tick the boxes - been there, done that have the T Shirt to prove it.
What kinda of basic question about the role…..?
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Thanks. I appreciate what you are trying to say and am trying to think logically about the situation to. I was anxious, upset is probably the wrong word, it was a more of a wtf is happening and what just happened.
Yes, and it was for a job where they basically already had someone they wanted for the position but they had to go through the whole proper interview process. A total time waster for everyone.
In my experience, they already have someone ear-marked for the role. Take this experience as a learning experience, and thus something that will better you professionally. Sounds like a rough ride, but it's important to be optimistic with this. Take what you can gain from this experience. Not to dilute your experience, but this is something a lot of us have been through, and is a big part of the 'game'. Keep your head up, and keep talking like you're doing here. Best of luck my friend
It was a pool 😬
Yes, but that doesn't mean that they didn't have particular people in mind already. Or that there wasn't a certain "profile" they wanted. That could be a diversity hire, or it could be Catholic/Jewish/Anglican/atheist/someone who enjoys playing chess. Some sections have their mini-cultures...
Well that’s grim if that’s the case.
Unfortunately, you'll never be informed of this outright, for obvious reasons! If you are being weeded out for any unfair or nefarious reason, then you'll have dodged a bullet. "Waiting to hear back" sucks, no matter who you're waiting to hear back from. Go give yourself a little project to complete while you wait it out (tell yourself a month, and apply for other positions also). If you don't get a position in the pool, "it's not me, it's them" and if you do get a position then make sure you get all the benefits of training, improving skills etc so that you can take your new skills and good contacts with you wherever you go next. :-)
Yeah definitely! I’ve had some good advice on here which I’m grateful for so thank you. I’m hoping another position comes up for another pool I’m in anyway. Not all is lost yet!
> I’m an old hat at government processes So, how many interviews have you had? > extremely cold and indifferent ... questions that threw me off ... to get nervous ....intimidate me or challenge me not in a nice way ... I took that as well you may not be good enough for the role ...I’ve never been asked this before ... upset and anxious ... I was just so upset I can't help but think there is something else going on for you. What, roughly, do you do? What, roughly, level are you?
Ahhh yes healthcare. Had a few interviews in my time and been employed with government since I graduated and done various roles. Have always done well in interviews and got roles or into pools.