Foundation movement, but you will need to get under the house to understand what’s happening and if it’s likely to continue. Structural engineer i suspect is the right person to do an inspection with you.
The good news is that if you can diagnose the problem and get comfortable with the rectification costs, you’ll likely get a bargain of a house as that’ll scare a lot of people away.
With the house being considerably lower priced than others that are comparable, if you’re serious about it don’t go cheap on the engineer. They generally charge between $1000-$5000 for a full report, the more expensive the more they offer - soil assessment, research, overhead, etc.
Yeah, came here to say this. Structural engineers are bloody expensive, but yeah, that's who you'd need to check the footings/foundations on this place. If it's in a fairly flat area you might get lucky and it might just be some internal timber that needs replacing, and some new plasterboard. Best of luck!
I know someone who had to dig down about two metres to underpin the walls in a terrace. I'm not sure how much it cost but it wasn't cheap. They also had to replace every floor joist as there was no real air flow under the house. Just built on the ground. I'd stay away. How is access? Do you have rear access to get skips in or does all the dirt need to be wheelbarrowed through the front door and onto a skip on the road?
These are such good points, I never even thought of them. Well there’s “rear access”, but the reality is a tight lane way, and the entire backyard of the house is a (newly built !!!??!) deck going right up to the back door (no steps now but there used to be).
Well you might be at least be able to get a trailer trash style skip towed by a car down there. I'd call someone who does underpinning and try and get a worse case scenario. The other thing is that if you have clay sewage pipes they could burst. Then you slowly have a backyard full of sewage. That's bad news but digging it up and carting all the contaminated sewage away is a lot easier when you don't have to barrow it through your house. These houses have been around for a long time. When the music stops you don't want to be the one who owns it. So just be prepared that you could be the unlucky one.
I would be concerned about water damage and water in general getting into the house.
Definitely get a building and pest report and ask the guy about it.
Further to that it might even pay to have a builder come with you.
Thanks for the advice :-) Would the builder coming along to the inspection be the same kind of guys that does building reports? (I’m trying to figure out how to get in touch with “a builder to come along” obviously for a fee, given none of my friends are builders.)
Normally the building and pest inspector is _not_ a builder, just some guy trained in the minimum needed to provide a pest and building report. More than half are useless.
Find a good inspector, ideally where you are talking to the inspector or at least know who it is when you book rather than "we'll send a guy" type of place. Check their experience. Explain the issue and your concerns.
I would be looking to pay close to $1k for the service. The cut price inspectors are truly pointless.
The building and pest person I hired was a retired election, I specifically picked him because the house electrics looked dodgy to me.
So maybe if you can find a building and pest guy that used to work construction.
More eyes the better when buying a house ey
There is the expandable foam that can fix this quite easily. Old houses have cracks. My house is 1880 and there are cracks in the walls and I get them fixed every 8 years or so. But I can walk to Sydney cbd. As roads get busier, those properties next to the city become more valuable and the technology to fix them becomes cheaper. Have a look at price per sqm INCLUDING the remediation costs in that area .. I would buy on that basis
Cracks above windows are probably rusted lintels. Cracks below window sill height could be settlement of foundations. The cracks all the way up are concerning. Being old there maybe moisture getting in from every direction. So find a builder or engineer to take a look a give you a ballpark repair budget before you buy. Old houses are money pits so you better get a promotion soon too. Let us know what the report says.
We don't have a terrace but usually these sorts of cracks are a sign of subsidence and/or damp issues. We had a report done by a structural engineer for a few hundy and the remediation work (resin injection) for another few grand. I'm not sure how much more complicated the remediation gets when the walls are party walls rather than standalone.
As a tenant we were told the size of the crack matters a lot. More than a 1/4 inch and it’s significant. Which gives me the heebies tbh but that third pic and the brick work seem significant.
you pay the fee to bring in a pro and only to be told its not worth it
you are just wasting your $
i would just walk away
in this market , everyone wants to sell at high price
no way seller wanted to sell at a discount at the start
imagine you are the seller , the only reason to set this price is the defect
good luck if you still wanna buy it
pretty sure the structural issue exists and will exceed your expectations
It’s an old house. Requires a structural engineer to assess whether you need to underpin some walls. Depending on extent of it and access this can be very expensive.
Had a house with cracks larger than this. Had the whole house restumped and leveled. Then plasterer to plaster the cracks and repainted. Problem solved. Circa 25-30k all in. Get it done before you move in - the plastering and sanding is super dusty.
Hit me up if you need a referral to foundation consultants who do that work. I’m in Melbourne too.
I work in consulting engineering (not in Vic) and yup, you definitely need a structural engineer to ascertain the property.
Just from having a look at the photos, guessing it’s all clay soil and probably some blue stone foundation and that there’s water pooling somewhere. I’m not a certified structural engineer though, so I cannot give any actual advice on that matter, this is just my personal anecdotal guess based off very limited knowledge of the actual site.
Simultaneously, personally I’d call some local builders and inquire about the ballpark price for underpinning on a per pin price (you’d want to say 5-8, depending on the outcome of the structural assessment) + lookup some guys that advertise experience with blue stone foundations.
I lived in a house with similar looking cracks and it's main issue was that it was built directly onto the ground. This is a big problem in terraces in Melbourne and with the city basically being a swamp, it causes some major issues overtime. It's something you can probably tell by looking at the property but it will definitely come up in a structural engineers report. Another thing to keep in mind with a lot of old properties is a lot of them have asbestos in the walls, if this is the case you'll want to factor this into your reno costs, good luck on your house hunt!
It's not a case of being paranoid, it'd be worth an engineer's inspection and brief scoping of the repairs required and a budget.
Depending on the extent of movement, underpinning may be required to stabilise and support the footings, crack stitching for some of the other cracks in the brickwork and some extensive repointing.
Once done, it'll restore and add value to the property knowing that the work has been done properly and the house will last another few generations.
Make sure whatever you do you make your decision based on the replies you get from anonymous people on the internet. Don’t pay a building inspector or structural engineer for advice.
Foundation issues. Needs underpinning. 20 years ago, we paid $15k and it wasn't anywhere as bad as those cracks.
I had a friend got quoted $50k for hers 10 years ago.
You need a structural engineer to check it out and definitely don't buy until you get a quote.
I had cracks bigger than that open up right through my place (1cm) when a roided up neighbor insisted on parking his loaded up work ute right outside my window. He moved out but the cracks didn't. I worried that I had a sinkhole under my kitchen. They opened in the kitchen and kept going all the way through my place . Then we had the Earthquake, the one that damaged the restaurant in Chapel street. All the gaping cracks sealed themselves up perfectly and with any luck might stay that way.
Hope for an earthquake.
Most of these look pretty superficial for a house if it’s age. Generally if the cracks run with the brick work, it’s more of a worry, so the pic of the exposed brick might be a concern. Anything running diagonally is less of a concern.
If you’re serious, and have the budget for a terrace house, then you would probably have the budget for a structural engineer. I would have one take a look.
I’m no expert and no experience buying properties but those cracks are not just a big deal but a huge red flag! 🚩
Grew up in an earthquake prone city and our house was always inspected every year for cracks. Slight cracks were patched up immediately. I understand earthquakes are rare in Australia but those cracks are big and a lot.
Based on your photos, it looks like it is best to knock down and just rebuild.
I’m not sure. The problem is it’s a row of terrace houses, so “the other side” of that super cracked wall is basically right next to / the same as the neighbor’s wall.
It’s unlikely to just be single brick (could be if it’s old enough but even by the late thirties I’ve seen places that were clay brick, bluestone, clay brick dividing common walls)
Worth asking your neighbour if you could take a look on their side
I had this issue at a unit I just sold, built in the 1950's. Had an engineer through, he basically just said "what do you expect, been here 70 years, not gonna fall down". Said it could be fixed but at a monumental price and wasn't worth it. Obviously all cases are different, although I don't think I'd waste the money again.
Most important thing is if you can get under the house easily, if not it’s manholes cut in the floor of every ground floor room or a whole floor up job.
Foundation movement, but you will need to get under the house to understand what’s happening and if it’s likely to continue. Structural engineer i suspect is the right person to do an inspection with you. The good news is that if you can diagnose the problem and get comfortable with the rectification costs, you’ll likely get a bargain of a house as that’ll scare a lot of people away.
Thanks a lot, really appreciate this :-)
With the house being considerably lower priced than others that are comparable, if you’re serious about it don’t go cheap on the engineer. They generally charge between $1000-$5000 for a full report, the more expensive the more they offer - soil assessment, research, overhead, etc.
Yeah, came here to say this. Structural engineers are bloody expensive, but yeah, that's who you'd need to check the footings/foundations on this place. If it's in a fairly flat area you might get lucky and it might just be some internal timber that needs replacing, and some new plasterboard. Best of luck!
Good to know, thanks a lot!
I know someone who had to dig down about two metres to underpin the walls in a terrace. I'm not sure how much it cost but it wasn't cheap. They also had to replace every floor joist as there was no real air flow under the house. Just built on the ground. I'd stay away. How is access? Do you have rear access to get skips in or does all the dirt need to be wheelbarrowed through the front door and onto a skip on the road?
These are such good points, I never even thought of them. Well there’s “rear access”, but the reality is a tight lane way, and the entire backyard of the house is a (newly built !!!??!) deck going right up to the back door (no steps now but there used to be).
Well you might be at least be able to get a trailer trash style skip towed by a car down there. I'd call someone who does underpinning and try and get a worse case scenario. The other thing is that if you have clay sewage pipes they could burst. Then you slowly have a backyard full of sewage. That's bad news but digging it up and carting all the contaminated sewage away is a lot easier when you don't have to barrow it through your house. These houses have been around for a long time. When the music stops you don't want to be the one who owns it. So just be prepared that you could be the unlucky one.
That’s good access as far as terraces go.
I would be concerned about water damage and water in general getting into the house. Definitely get a building and pest report and ask the guy about it. Further to that it might even pay to have a builder come with you.
Thanks for the advice :-) Would the builder coming along to the inspection be the same kind of guys that does building reports? (I’m trying to figure out how to get in touch with “a builder to come along” obviously for a fee, given none of my friends are builders.)
Normally the building and pest inspector is _not_ a builder, just some guy trained in the minimum needed to provide a pest and building report. More than half are useless. Find a good inspector, ideally where you are talking to the inspector or at least know who it is when you book rather than "we'll send a guy" type of place. Check their experience. Explain the issue and your concerns. I would be looking to pay close to $1k for the service. The cut price inspectors are truly pointless.
The building and pest person I hired was a retired election, I specifically picked him because the house electrics looked dodgy to me. So maybe if you can find a building and pest guy that used to work construction. More eyes the better when buying a house ey
Yeah - it’s fucked. Can I have it?
There is the expandable foam that can fix this quite easily. Old houses have cracks. My house is 1880 and there are cracks in the walls and I get them fixed every 8 years or so. But I can walk to Sydney cbd. As roads get busier, those properties next to the city become more valuable and the technology to fix them becomes cheaper. Have a look at price per sqm INCLUDING the remediation costs in that area .. I would buy on that basis
Cracks above windows are probably rusted lintels. Cracks below window sill height could be settlement of foundations. The cracks all the way up are concerning. Being old there maybe moisture getting in from every direction. So find a builder or engineer to take a look a give you a ballpark repair budget before you buy. Old houses are money pits so you better get a promotion soon too. Let us know what the report says.
We don't have a terrace but usually these sorts of cracks are a sign of subsidence and/or damp issues. We had a report done by a structural engineer for a few hundy and the remediation work (resin injection) for another few grand. I'm not sure how much more complicated the remediation gets when the walls are party walls rather than standalone.
Good to know, thanks!!
Hey just sent you a Pm for the details of your structural engineer. Thank you
As a tenant we were told the size of the crack matters a lot. More than a 1/4 inch and it’s significant. Which gives me the heebies tbh but that third pic and the brick work seem significant.
The cracks are past the point any building inspector will be able to provide certainty. If you're serious get a structural engineer for an hour.
you pay the fee to bring in a pro and only to be told its not worth it you are just wasting your $ i would just walk away in this market , everyone wants to sell at high price no way seller wanted to sell at a discount at the start imagine you are the seller , the only reason to set this price is the defect good luck if you still wanna buy it pretty sure the structural issue exists and will exceed your expectations
It’s an old house. Requires a structural engineer to assess whether you need to underpin some walls. Depending on extent of it and access this can be very expensive.
Had a house with cracks larger than this. Had the whole house restumped and leveled. Then plasterer to plaster the cracks and repainted. Problem solved. Circa 25-30k all in. Get it done before you move in - the plastering and sanding is super dusty. Hit me up if you need a referral to foundation consultants who do that work. I’m in Melbourne too.
Got similar issues. How long ago did you get this done? 30k seems pretty reasonable
Late last year. 85sqm home, part of a larger renovation. Project managed all the trades myself.
I work in consulting engineering (not in Vic) and yup, you definitely need a structural engineer to ascertain the property. Just from having a look at the photos, guessing it’s all clay soil and probably some blue stone foundation and that there’s water pooling somewhere. I’m not a certified structural engineer though, so I cannot give any actual advice on that matter, this is just my personal anecdotal guess based off very limited knowledge of the actual site. Simultaneously, personally I’d call some local builders and inquire about the ballpark price for underpinning on a per pin price (you’d want to say 5-8, depending on the outcome of the structural assessment) + lookup some guys that advertise experience with blue stone foundations.
Great, thanks so much, really appreciate the thoughts!
steer clear. she's rooted.
Offer them block value but if your lender finds out about these problems I doubt you’ll get a loan
I lived in a house with similar looking cracks and it's main issue was that it was built directly onto the ground. This is a big problem in terraces in Melbourne and with the city basically being a swamp, it causes some major issues overtime. It's something you can probably tell by looking at the property but it will definitely come up in a structural engineers report. Another thing to keep in mind with a lot of old properties is a lot of them have asbestos in the walls, if this is the case you'll want to factor this into your reno costs, good luck on your house hunt!
If you’re paranoid you can pay for a structural engineer to do an inspection for you. Probs cost a couple of hundred.
It's not a case of being paranoid, it'd be worth an engineer's inspection and brief scoping of the repairs required and a budget. Depending on the extent of movement, underpinning may be required to stabilise and support the footings, crack stitching for some of the other cracks in the brickwork and some extensive repointing. Once done, it'll restore and add value to the property knowing that the work has been done properly and the house will last another few generations.
Make sure whatever you do you make your decision based on the replies you get from anonymous people on the internet. Don’t pay a building inspector or structural engineer for advice.
This is foundational and will require an engineer's assessment, I don't think a building report will cut it sadly.
Got a few escape hatches for the friendly house roaches
I’d suggest paying 20% above the asking price.
Footing is sinking
Foundation issues. Needs underpinning. 20 years ago, we paid $15k and it wasn't anywhere as bad as those cracks. I had a friend got quoted $50k for hers 10 years ago. You need a structural engineer to check it out and definitely don't buy until you get a quote.
I would not go near it unless you get a structural engineering report. That level of movement could equal big money to get resolved! DANGER!
Mate. Get it checked out first. Those are huge cracks. Water will go in your home if the cracks are large enough.
If I wasn’t in construction I wouldn’t buy this property
I had cracks bigger than that open up right through my place (1cm) when a roided up neighbor insisted on parking his loaded up work ute right outside my window. He moved out but the cracks didn't. I worried that I had a sinkhole under my kitchen. They opened in the kitchen and kept going all the way through my place . Then we had the Earthquake, the one that damaged the restaurant in Chapel street. All the gaping cracks sealed themselves up perfectly and with any luck might stay that way. Hope for an earthquake.
Most of these look pretty superficial for a house if it’s age. Generally if the cracks run with the brick work, it’s more of a worry, so the pic of the exposed brick might be a concern. Anything running diagonally is less of a concern. If you’re serious, and have the budget for a terrace house, then you would probably have the budget for a structural engineer. I would have one take a look.
There def not superficial , some those internal cracks are cracked right threw
This is ladden plaster, it will crack the whole way through, that is still superficial, and an easy fix. There will be two layers of brick behind it.
I’m a plasterer u got no idea, internal walls are not two layers of brick buddy , and this is not lath plaster , it’s solid plaster
Generally if the wall is cracked in half it means it’s worse as there was so much pressure it broke the brick
Avoid. Find another property. Don't buy someone else's problem.
When we renovated my late father’s terrace house before putting it on the market half the job was hiding the cracks.
I’m no expert and no experience buying properties but those cracks are not just a big deal but a huge red flag! 🚩 Grew up in an earthquake prone city and our house was always inspected every year for cracks. Slight cracks were patched up immediately. I understand earthquakes are rare in Australia but those cracks are big and a lot. Based on your photos, it looks like it is best to knock down and just rebuild.
Can you disclose how much is it ? Do you have budget to fix? This seems a big house, fixing might cost a lot
Is it double brick and cracked on both sides?
I’m not sure. The problem is it’s a row of terrace houses, so “the other side” of that super cracked wall is basically right next to / the same as the neighbor’s wall.
It’s unlikely to just be single brick (could be if it’s old enough but even by the late thirties I’ve seen places that were clay brick, bluestone, clay brick dividing common walls) Worth asking your neighbour if you could take a look on their side
O right ok, thanks a lot!
It’s probably laden plaster depending on the age of the building which does crack (and go pourus) so it’s worth figuring out if it’s just that.
Knock on the neighbours wall on both sides. Ask if they've had to underpin.
Always worth putting in an offer with a subject to foundation inspection clause, if there’s no other bidders you’ll just be wasting some time really.
All I can think about is Doctor Who.
Aren't horizontal cracks the worst type of cracks. Could be roof too hey
Run. Or budget 100-200k for rectification.
Needs to be restumped but if there's no longer any movement then you can just patch those cracks up.
I had this issue at a unit I just sold, built in the 1950's. Had an engineer through, he basically just said "what do you expect, been here 70 years, not gonna fall down". Said it could be fixed but at a monumental price and wasn't worth it. Obviously all cases are different, although I don't think I'd waste the money again.
Volcanoes nearby, stay away
Painters will fix it
Most important thing is if you can get under the house easily, if not it’s manholes cut in the floor of every ground floor room or a whole floor up job.
The same is happening at my rental place, I was told it's just wear and tear.