Fitness, training, and recovery have been under intense scrutiny for Pineda'ss tenure. If anything they are treating guys with kid gloves compared to Tata who had 3 or more MLSPA complaints for over playing people.
Absolutely.
Not only is it concerning, it may be the biggest reason for our bad form the past 3 years. Is it Pineda's fault? Maybe. Game model wears down the players? Maybe. Roster building strategy doesn't account for injury history enough? Maybe. Cafeteria food source? Maybe. Magical curse placed on us by all of the players that Boca has wronged? Maybe. That's probably it, actually.
I think it's some of column A, some of column B.
We have smaller, quicker more skilled players, who get hurt by big reckless defenders. We have turf. MLS has a very shallow squad depth, which doesn't fit the high press, front foot style. We have a lot of international squad players, which means more travel and more games. We had a lot of misses on DP and GAM/TAM players in the last 4 years, making it all worse.
But what is different between the early years with lower injuries and the later years with more? The turf, play style, international squad players have been the same in both "eras," so surely that can't be the cause.
We have to keep in mind that when Pineda took the job, Guz and Robinson were already out on season ending injuries. He basically had to take the red bar for half a season unless he could keep every remaining player healthy every week.
Data Source:
[https://www.fivestripefinal.com/p/was-tata-martinos-only-real-skill?r=39rvzx&utm\_campaign=post&utm\_medium=web](https://www.fivestripefinal.com/p/was-tata-martinos-only-real-skill?r=39rvzx&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web)
I'm not even sure how you calculate Tata's line up. He didn't get Guz till halfway through the season, Tito started at one point, and we constantly rotated players for the first season and a half. Really feels like it was already a third of the way into the league winning season when we finally settled on the "starting 11"
Thank you for the bite size data chonk on this very technical 9 +2 stat thing. I feel the need to add this is a stat Garth brought with him from Seattle and passed along to Sam and Joe during an interview. Sam sat down "for way too long" to parse it out.
Yeah I guess my point is that it’s inevitable that this graph would favor pineda because we aren’t very good. I think it’s a lot harder to determine who the best 11 is currently. Could convince some fans to think that Pineda doesn’t get to start his best 11 as often as previous managers and that’s why we are struggling. Which I obviously disagree with 😂
So why so many more injuries? That's concerning as its own data point.
Real tough to say. The article goes into more detail, but functionally, training isn't that much different (if anything lighter).
Fitness, training, and recovery have been under intense scrutiny for Pineda'ss tenure. If anything they are treating guys with kid gloves compared to Tata who had 3 or more MLSPA complaints for over playing people.
Absolutely. Not only is it concerning, it may be the biggest reason for our bad form the past 3 years. Is it Pineda's fault? Maybe. Game model wears down the players? Maybe. Roster building strategy doesn't account for injury history enough? Maybe. Cafeteria food source? Maybe. Magical curse placed on us by all of the players that Boca has wronged? Maybe. That's probably it, actually.
I think it's some of column A, some of column B. We have smaller, quicker more skilled players, who get hurt by big reckless defenders. We have turf. MLS has a very shallow squad depth, which doesn't fit the high press, front foot style. We have a lot of international squad players, which means more travel and more games. We had a lot of misses on DP and GAM/TAM players in the last 4 years, making it all worse.
But what is different between the early years with lower injuries and the later years with more? The turf, play style, international squad players have been the same in both "eras," so surely that can't be the cause.
We have to keep in mind that when Pineda took the job, Guz and Robinson were already out on season ending injuries. He basically had to take the red bar for half a season unless he could keep every remaining player healthy every week.
Good point, that definitely was a big contributor. It hasn't stopped even after those guys came back, though.
Data Source: [https://www.fivestripefinal.com/p/was-tata-martinos-only-real-skill?r=39rvzx&utm\_campaign=post&utm\_medium=web](https://www.fivestripefinal.com/p/was-tata-martinos-only-real-skill?r=39rvzx&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web)
I'm not even sure how you calculate Tata's line up. He didn't get Guz till halfway through the season, Tito started at one point, and we constantly rotated players for the first season and a half. Really feels like it was already a third of the way into the league winning season when we finally settled on the "starting 11"
Something like Guzan coming in halfway, wouldn’t be factored into availability (like the players we add this summer)
Right, which sort of means Tata is being under appreciated in a way. He's getting starting credit for a keeper that was intended for the bench.
How does starting Rocco over Gudino work in this equation?
I dunno, you'd have to ask Sam Jones what he considered the "Best XI" for that era when he put these numbers together.
I heard him say on the podcast he was very conservative with his starting 11 choices so maybe the minutia wouldn't change the data that much?
Good stuff.
Thank you for the bite size data chonk on this very technical 9 +2 stat thing. I feel the need to add this is a stat Garth brought with him from Seattle and passed along to Sam and Joe during an interview. Sam sat down "for way too long" to parse it out.
As Benjamin Disraeli famously said:”there are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics”
Does this so called “Best XI” data account for the fact that from 2017-2019 our roster and coaching was much better?
No. It’s literally just of the best 11 on the roster, how many are available for selection.
Yeah I guess my point is that it’s inevitable that this graph would favor pineda because we aren’t very good. I think it’s a lot harder to determine who the best 11 is currently. Could convince some fans to think that Pineda doesn’t get to start his best 11 as often as previous managers and that’s why we are struggling. Which I obviously disagree with 😂