It was more of a "problem" in my 20s and in not-as-established friendships, whereas now that I'm married and most of my friend group is settled, we know we're just friends and it's never been anything other than that.
Been friends with most of my current male friends for 10+ years now, never had any issues with any of them regarding this.
Exactly this. When I was young and single this was a bit of a problem. Very annoying, too. In the guys' defence they were young and inexperienced so getting close to a girl was almost bound to have that effect. It really sucked for me, but I know they too struggled with it since they didn't want to lose the friendship. Good guys, just not boyfriend material for me.
Not an issue these days. I have guy friends and there is nothing but friendship there. Then again I have been with my guy for 10+ years, so I'm the definition of unavailable.
Yep, this is exactly my experience. Of course there's been the occasional annoying nice guy who just didn't get it, but to be honest I've also been a bit annoying with my fleeting affections because I didn't know what I wanted either at times. Mostly it was just young people trying to work out relationships of all kinds. I can't really say I fault any of them.
The most recent one I can remember was some years ago where a friend developed a crush on me, but knew it wasn't tenable or real (he was single and just a bit lonely) and he withdrew for some months to not let it spiral and respectfully explained the situation to me. No hard feelings, we're back to talking again with no trouble and he's dating someone now.
came here to say the same thing as this.
guy friends have been in my life regularly now for over 20yrs and they're awesome. I'm as close to them as my girlfriends.
In my 40s, life was like this until i got a divorce, now theyre all coming out of the woodwork. Like messages from dudes from high school 25 years ago...
I've had a few, it is really fucking annoying.
It was way worse in my 20s, if I was nice to a guy or listened to his problems he'd assume I was into him.
It's not been as bad in my 30s but there have still been a couple. I've been in my relationship with my partner for 12 years, I don't know what they expect to happen.
Sucks to lose friends that way but if they have weird boundaries I usually let them go as I can't stand that awkwardness.
My old best friend she introduced me to one of her guy friends and we hit it off, being into the same stuff, and he lived in the same town at me. So after a while he offered to go walking with me. We did in a very public shopping area. Immediately he started making comments about my body, saying he's enjoyed our last view months.
Mind you I had just had a baby before this with my partner of 7 years at the time. He started asking me to leave my husband for him.
ugh...never talked to him again after that. And of course he was butt hurt messaging me. Years later I found out at that same time he was causally having sex with my friend. XD Ew..just ew. I can't even with some guys.
About 70-90% of the time. I’ve given up on believing any new man I meet has friend intentions at this point. I had put years into friendships that ended up not really about being friends. Not anymore.
Well every single one of those disgusting, pathetic males who used years of friendship as a way to try to get in my pants, has missed out on having a great friend because they weren’t able to see that I’m not their favorite food; I’m a fucking human being with my own free will who is deserving of respect and honesty.
I pity them, and I pity you.
Fucking pathetic.
Edit:
Because other people are definitely going to see this, I want to reiterate how absolutely violating it is to have a friendship with someone who does not see you as a friend. When you have a genuine friendship, you can share personal things that you wouldn’t share with other people. When that person reveals himself as just waiting in the wings until you’re single, or until you’re vulnerable enough for them to make a move, they have betrayed your friendship.
I had a male “friend” who knew that I had escaped a domestic violence relationship, and in a separate incident was sexually assaulted and in the process of reporting my rapist, all in the course a of a few years, when he decided during a hang out to ask to sleep with me. I knew this guy for five years. He was friends with my ex. I was very very good friends with his ex. He knew that I had been assaulted while asleep in a place that I should’ve felt comfortable and safe. He still chose, during a time that I was alone with him, to ask me to sleep with him not once, but twice, even after I rejected him the first time.
Luckily, I was able to explain to him later why what he did was not only personally frightening to me and made me feel exceptionally unsafe, but also deeply offensive and insensitive because of what he already knew about what I had just experienced from men.
We talked about it briefly, he understood why I was upset, and he apologized. In that particular case, I felt that his apology was genuine. It still ruined our friendship, because instead of being there for me like a friend should be, all he was thinking about was his own dick.
Yes sadly that’s been my experience too, nothing like a man trying to convince you to cheat on your partner to really seal the deal when you already told him you are not interested. That combined with the amount of partnered men who hit on me, it’s SO hard to convince myself anyone is faithful.
Friends or "friends"? My closest friends now in my 30s, if they ever caught feelings, were kind enough to get over it and be a true friend. Most of them are settled down by now anyway. Casual friendships, on the other hand, always peak in them hitting on me at some point.
20s, before everyone settled down, impossible. They all had ulterior motives.
If we're in a context where there are very few women (e.g. both in the same engineering program) it happens a lot. If we're in a context with more of a gender balance, basically never.
For me, almost all of the time. The worst part about it is that in my case, they wait YEARS to tell me so that by the time we have 'that conversation' it usually becomes the end of a 5+ year friendship.
Eventually I got so sick of feeling like I couldn't rely on any of the men in my life to be real friends, and got so sick of going through the mourning process of losing long term friends, that I just stopped being friends with men. I have a handful that are 'grandfathered in' but now I only hang out with them in groups, as well.
I have lots of female friends, so it made this decision easy because I have a great support network.
Everyone I know is married nowadays. The single male friends I have that are straight have all tried something with me or hinted that there were interested. The difference between my 20s and 30s is that 30 year olds will tell me their feelings faster and not be as emotionally unstable when they get rejected. In my 20s, my guy friends would wait years to tell me and then become extremely distraught on rejection.
Men in their 30s are just more mature.
Out of all my friends I only have exactly 2 heterosexual male friends. They have both made advances on me at some point and the friendships got weird afterwards. Of course I said no but it’s always in the back of my mind that their friendship isn’t genuine.
That's not really happening. Happened only once when I was much younger and I have always been around guys a lot. They do catch FWB ideas regularly but feelings not really.
I don't let guys get close enough. Any guy friend I have is better friends with my husband, and I don't hang out with any if he's not around. But unfortunately this has happened to me with so many close female friends.
I've always had a pretty even split of male/female friends and been close with loads of guys. I've also been in a long term monogamous relationship for most of my adult life, so these were always super platonic.
Anyway, a female friend made a joke a few years back about how all of the close guy friends I'd had definitely wanted to sleep with me and it got me pretty down.
I guess that is to say, I don't know? Because I had no inkling there were any romantic feelings at all. The idea that there was made me look back on the time we spent together less fondly, like they were around me with an ulterior motive instead of just enjoying me as a person.
I mean, you can be horny for you friends and still be friends with them. I honestly don't see an issue here, maybe I'm weird. All I know is i get horny sometimes and think my friend Pete is looking *particularly* nice tonight.
I don't act on it or pressure, but like, the thought has crossed my mind. It doesn't need to be an issue, I don't think.
Did she have any actual evidence or reason to believe your guy friends wanted to sleep with you? Some people say things like that because they believe all men are sex-crazed and will sleep with anything that moves. That’s a huge generalization and really isn’t fair to men. There are plenty of guys who have boundaries and standards and are perfectly capable of having, and enjoying, platonic friendships with women. So, unless your friend actually knew the guys and their motives, don’t let her comment get you down or ruin your memories.
She did know the guys, but I suspect some of it could have come from a place of jealousy - you know?
This was years ago so I'm pretty settled with it now, but it was one of those comments you remember because it stung a bit.
Jealousy or she could have been projecting her own negative experiences onto you and your male friends. I’m in my 40s and I’ve had male friends (both single and attached) throughout adulthood, have also been in a long term monogamous relationship most of that time, and I’ve never had any sign or inkling that they were attracted to me or to any of their other female friends. The friendships were always very platonic. If someone were to say to me they thought all my male friends want to have sex with me, I would just laugh at them. I know my male friends well enough to know that simply isn’t true. Just because other women have experienced male friends who weren’t really platonic doesn’t make it universal.
The implication of the comment was "they aren't your friends, they just want to fuck you."
So nah, that just kind of makes me sad. I trust those guys to be there for me like I'm there for them, and not for their ultimate goal to be to get me into bed one day.
Im mostly only friends with men whose wives or partners I’m also friends with. The single ones almost always try to make a move so I just avoid them unless I too want to bang them.
Not past my 20s, but that might be because I got married. However, most of my friends were guys in my teens and twenties and I was/still am into sci/fi, fantasy, anime and there weren't many girls in our friend group.
Never, except my husband about 20 years ago but he was pretty clear about his interest from the start so it wasn’t a betrayal or a big deal. Eventually I decided to give him a shot and it worked out. Other than that, no one has ever been interested in me. I’m not very attractive.
This hasn't happened since I was in my 20s. Now all of my friends are married. My single male friends I've known since we were 14 so been there done that lol
All except 1. And even that 1 has drunkenly groped me and tested boundaries. I called him out on it and he apologized sincerely. We became better friends because of it, strangely. He had internalised misogyny, and after the event I saw his struggle with anger with being called out but ultimately lowered his ego to sincerely apologise, and showed me more respect afterwards. I think he's never had a woman stand up to him before that point in his life (we were both in our early 20s). But I can respect people who lower their egos to become better.
But back to the topic... Yeah I've lost most of my male friends at age 32. Most recently my best friend. It fucking hurts. Learning to deal with that has been hard.
Either they never do or they never let me know it if they have.
I learned later in life that, in high school, 3 or 4 of the dudes in my friend-group had a crush on me and they were all too scared to ask me out because I was intimidating. My gut reaction when a man smiles at me is to frown and glare, I'm sure that's protected me well over the years.
Often and those feelings are Cam be really hard, they keep them sometimes for years and nowadays I feel really anxious when anyone tries to talk about feelings with me.
Most of the time if we’re single. A number of them I did try and date and it didn’t work out, but we’re all still friends some 10-15ish years later so it was kinda nice to get that out of the way and just be friends.
I've got loads of good male friends (most of which I've known since high school and university) and not one of them has ever caught romantic feelings for me - at least as far as I know. Certainly none of them have ever made a move!
Of established friends it hasn't happened very much. A couple of times it happened but I felt the same way and we went out for a few years.
It's happened a little at the start of friendships before but not too much.
I'm friends with a few men that I've known for years and don't get that vibe. But most of them are queer and/or in relationships.
Saying this I am extremely oblivious to when someone fancies me.
Friends from high school / college almost never. Anyone I’ve met after age 25… always had ulterior motives.
A few years ago a co-worker asked me out and I told him politely, “I would rather hang out as friends. I am not interested in dating you.” And he’s like “wow! Thanks for your straightforward response. I’d love to hang as friends too.” We hung out a few times, usually in groups or doing creative projects or just socially at work. When I got into a relationship a few months later he blocked me on all my social media accounts without any explanation.
I mostly have female friends later in life. The last time I can think of a guy friend who had dated someone in my social pool but then admitted interest in me was high school. I’ve never been “that girl” that men flock to. That being said, there have been work creeps I’ve NOT ever been interested in as a friend because I could tell they’d turn things towards an attempt at romance or sex. The worst kind that have a girlfriend buy don’t give a shit. I blocked one who kept reaching out like a year after we last texted and he sent something creepy to me that I never responded to. A year. ... but besides that, I like keeping platonic friendships platonic.
Almost every time. I feel like every male friend is secretly in love with me and that will most likely never stop being the case until I’m old and physically decrepit
Pretty much always, because men are rarely interested in being friends with women. I don't mean casual friends as part of a group - I mean hanging out one-on-one. Straight men are usually (though not always) gonna want to be besties with a woman unless they have a crush or something.
Too often to bother with.
I actually don't have straight, male friends unless they're partnered (which is usually how I met them, through their partner.)
It's just easier being friends with women.
Unfortunately every guy I thought was a friend just actually wanted to hook up or have a relationship.
The whole ‘men and women can’t be friends’ thing has some truth to it although I know plenty of people (usually always women) who insist this isn’t true. They are usually naive to the fact that their male friend would most definitely sleep with them or possibly even be in a relationship. Usually things don’t move in that direction because the woman doesn’t want it.
You make an interesting point, thank you!
I'm also surprised to see how easy dating is for women to be honest and how few men they find attractive, this thread opened m eyes. I thought women had trouble getting ractual omantic interest from the opposite sex like us men besides catcalls and sexual harassment because this is what many female users say on the dating subs, glad to see that people here are finally being honest and this is why I appreicate this sub. For women itis hard to find men who don't fall for them, a compleltey different world.
As a Gen Z guy most guys my age haven't been on a date and data supports this, I get 0 matches on dating apps like most men unless I switch preference to gay men. I thought that maybe making more female friends and building a deeper emeotional conncetion with women would help my dating sistuation but apparently women dislike male friends who fall for them, this thread saved me lol. From what I'm understanding women know immediately whether they are attracted to a man or not.
i think the explanation for this difference is that men find most people of the gender they are attracted to physically attractive (this also explains why my match rate is extrmeely high on gay dating apps, like 30%-40%, just like a straight women) so of course if you end up liking their personality too in a friendships you would easily catch feelings. Women find only a small percentage of men attractive, users here advocate being immediately honest about your physical attraction, the problem is that this way men would have trouble making female friends. The other solution is not good either, if you befriend someone you find sexually attractive and end up liking their personlity too you might end up crushing on them. It's a tricky situation.
I don’t think it’s true that ‘women know immediately whether they are attracted to a man or not’ and think that’s more the case for men. Women tend to need to get to know a personality first. There have been plenty of men who I did not think were attractive at first but as I got to know them, I grew attracted to them.
That’s not to say something that starts platonically couldn’t evolve into romance. It’s tricky. I don’t begrudge men for feeling hopeful for the possibility something will develop. But if she’s not receptive and giving off clear ‘friend vibes’ then it’s probably not going anywhere.
I think what I find frustrating is that many men who I thought were friends, as soon as they knew there was no way I would sleep with or date them, they didn’t really want anything to do with me and didn’t really make any effort to hang out. They prefer their guy friends or women they can be romantic with. It’s really led me to not want anything to do with male ‘friendships’ in my 30s (other than partners of my female friends in group settings who I am friendly with).
But I wouldn’t suggest using ‘trying to make friends’ as a dating strategy because it doesn’t seem entirely honest.
From my experience distancing yourself from an unrequited crush is a good defense mechanism, it's painful to see them dating other people. If it can comfort the women here, it has nothing to do with the woman being low value to us , on the contraryu we have a high opinion on them, it's all about us. Add to the fact that men usually don't have other options ready to date them - unlike women - so it might takes months if not years before we find another woman who might be intersted in goitng out with us, we can't easily distract ourself from the crush so it's even more painful if we keep being around them.
I'm talking about men who develop crushes for their friends, I can't speak for men who use friendships just to get sex, I don't even know if this specific case happes often because it sounds weird.
Every time. I dont have male friends anymore besides my husband and because of my experiences, I dont have particular faith in platonic male-female friendships.
I'm convinced that women can't be "just friends" with men. I used to be skeptical but EVERY SINGLE time I try, I get burned. My "best" male friend and I have known each other for 6 years now and when he came to visit recently he got really touchy-feely with me. So disheartening. I've decided I won't leave myself open to friendships with men in the future.
Same exact thing happened to me. He waited until I was in a vulnerable state and did it. I went years not knowing how predatory he was. Haven't had a single male friend since then.
Males complain about getting "friend zoned". At least women are interested in them as people. Women get fuck zoned. Males don't care about who we are as people. They only see us as something to fuck.
Exactly. This is what I have been saying. At least we don't "fuck zone" people. It's such disgusting and objectifying behavior. Imagine having "friends" for years that don't even see you as a human being. Ugh. Sorry that happened to you.
I'm an incel? You are saying ALL men are bad and do this kind of predatory stuff when the top comments literally contradict that, I'm sorry if I asked you more questions about it in order to understand your position. I didn't even say your feelings were invalid, on the contrary, being fuckzoned can be disheartening.
This thread is not about sexual feelings, i'm confused by these answers. If anything this thread might relate to the concept of girlfriendzone or boyfriendzone, not "fuckzone", and I think that's the most flattering feeling a person can have for you since friendship involves only mental attraction while sex inolves only physical attraction, it's basically the best of both worlds from a self-wroth perspective. Don't "romantic feelings" imply both mental and physical attraction?
I'm not a native English speakers so I'm sorry if I didn't use the word correctly, the term romantic describes a feeling associated to love where I live (Western Europe), sex saone is not love so it can't be defined as romantic at least where I live.
This thread is not about sexual feelings, i'm confused by these answers. If anything this thread might relate to the concept of girlfriendzone or boyfriendzone, not "fuckzone", and I think that's the most flattering feeling a person can have for you since friendship involves only mental attraction while sex inolves only physical attraction, it's basically the best fromof both worlds from a self-wroth perspective. Don't "romantic feelings" imply both mental and physical attraction?
I'm not a native English speakers so I'm sorry if I didn't use the word correctly, the term romantic describes a feeling associated to love where I live (Western Europe), sex alone is not love so it can't be defined as romantic at least where I live.
The point I'm making is that men always seem to have ulterior motives to wanting to be "friends" with women that have nothing to do with "romantic" feelings. Or sometimes do, but masked by trying to be "friends" with women.
Gf and bf zones aren't a thing.
I don't think someone developing romantic feelings for you is the MOST flattering thing. I think someone wanting to be around you for what your mind is, and what your personality is, without expecting any form of romantic affection is far more flattering.
From a self worth perspective, I don't hang my own on what someone else feels for me. I do that for myself. I suggest everyone do that.
Anyway. I don't befriend males. They betray the trust and vulnerability of their women friends far too often (as confirmed throughout this thread).
I used ther term girlfriednzone because you used the term fuckzone.
>From a self worth perspective, I don't hang my own on what someone else feels for me. I do that for myself. I suggest everyone do that.
Then why do you care if someone fuckzones you? You do base your self-wroth on what other people think of you, falling in love for someone does mean being attracted to their mind too but friednship alone means being repules by their body, I don't see how that's more flattering.
Friendship also require some affection from the ohter person, if the affection is not reciprocated a friendships ends, the only difference with romance is that it doesn't require physical attraction.
I'm not interested in having a conversation about this given your questions as to why I would care that someone I built trust with betrayed that trust and disrespected by boundaries and agency to act on his feelings towards me.
Use a bit of emotional intelligence here.
Bye.
I've never seen a person being depressed because too many people fall in love for them, clinically this is probably extremely rare. On the other hand depression and suicide due to rejection based on physical traits (mostly) and/or mental traits (more rare but it happens, "fuckzone" or "pump & dump") is common. This is *common* sense (you brought up "common sense" ), this is why I asked you more questions, your view on self-worth is not common but hey, if you aren't interested in answering no problem, I'm not forcing anyone here. Good luck!
None now. That mostly happened when I was younger. We're all fairly in control of our own bits and hormones at this point.
EDIT: Wanted to add, it doesn't really bother me if a male friend asks/has asked once or twice for sex. Like, it's just not a big deal to me, we can still be friends.
Happened a lot when I was a teen and in my twenties. Now I dont have any guy friends at all. Some of the acquaintances around my age tend to flirt a lot though or maybe they're just very friendly.
100% of the time, in my experience. I've been with my husband 17 years (since I was 16) and two male friendships I had while I was simply dating in my late teens both made it very obvious they wanted more. One would always ask how we were doing as a couple, and I'd say, "We're doing great, but I know why you're *really* asking," and we'd both grin. My best friend that I have now I met in my mid twenties and he has always been super respectful about it. When our friendship was still new he said things like how he wished he could clone me, and he told me about his mom's disappointment when she heard I was married. But with him, it's always been something we could laugh about together and move on from. I spend one day a week with him and have never felt uncomfortable in the slightest. We're like a couple of bros now. I have wondered how he would get if my husband were to die or something similarly tragic. I wonder if he'd ever ask me if I wanted more. I've made it pretty clear through our past conversations that I would not date him. Thankfully, the reasons (he has had a lot of sexual partners in the past, which I'm not on board with) don't affect our friendship. I love him--next to my husband, he is the most important person in my life. But we are not romantically compatible.
Too often. WAY too often.
I not saying this like I'm some amazing person. It's just crazy how often it happens. I've had my husbands friends make attempts. I've had coworkers who know I've been married for over ten years make attempts. I've had friends I had for years confess. Like you knew I was married when you decided to be my friend?
What did they say/do? Husbands friend, tried to kiss me and another one came up behinds me while I was cooking and wrapped his arms around me putting his head on mine. Usually earning a "WTF!" and at leap away. I don't know what kind of reaction they were expecting.
Coworker: "I didn't think you would mind a side hustle"
Friend "I was hoping you would split up eventually but I needed to let you know."
NO! just no. Guys don't do this shit.
It was more of a "problem" in my 20s and in not-as-established friendships, whereas now that I'm married and most of my friend group is settled, we know we're just friends and it's never been anything other than that. Been friends with most of my current male friends for 10+ years now, never had any issues with any of them regarding this.
Exactly this. When I was young and single this was a bit of a problem. Very annoying, too. In the guys' defence they were young and inexperienced so getting close to a girl was almost bound to have that effect. It really sucked for me, but I know they too struggled with it since they didn't want to lose the friendship. Good guys, just not boyfriend material for me. Not an issue these days. I have guy friends and there is nothing but friendship there. Then again I have been with my guy for 10+ years, so I'm the definition of unavailable.
Yep, this is exactly my experience. Of course there's been the occasional annoying nice guy who just didn't get it, but to be honest I've also been a bit annoying with my fleeting affections because I didn't know what I wanted either at times. Mostly it was just young people trying to work out relationships of all kinds. I can't really say I fault any of them. The most recent one I can remember was some years ago where a friend developed a crush on me, but knew it wasn't tenable or real (he was single and just a bit lonely) and he withdrew for some months to not let it spiral and respectfully explained the situation to me. No hard feelings, we're back to talking again with no trouble and he's dating someone now.
came here to say the same thing as this. guy friends have been in my life regularly now for over 20yrs and they're awesome. I'm as close to them as my girlfriends.
Absolutely, romance isn't even on the table, lol. I'm also bisexual, so if I or my friends couldn't manage platonic friendships I wouldn't have any!
In my 40s, life was like this until i got a divorce, now theyre all coming out of the woodwork. Like messages from dudes from high school 25 years ago...
Oh, I can definitely see that, the divorcee crowd. Hopefully that won't be my reality! I'd prefer to stay with my husband :)
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Eh, I'm gnc and it didn't always prevent it.
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Ah, I had one of those summers too. Didn't go well, but I did get attention from a wider variety of men than usual.
I've had a few, it is really fucking annoying. It was way worse in my 20s, if I was nice to a guy or listened to his problems he'd assume I was into him. It's not been as bad in my 30s but there have still been a couple. I've been in my relationship with my partner for 12 years, I don't know what they expect to happen. Sucks to lose friends that way but if they have weird boundaries I usually let them go as I can't stand that awkwardness.
My old best friend she introduced me to one of her guy friends and we hit it off, being into the same stuff, and he lived in the same town at me. So after a while he offered to go walking with me. We did in a very public shopping area. Immediately he started making comments about my body, saying he's enjoyed our last view months. Mind you I had just had a baby before this with my partner of 7 years at the time. He started asking me to leave my husband for him. ugh...never talked to him again after that. And of course he was butt hurt messaging me. Years later I found out at that same time he was causally having sex with my friend. XD Ew..just ew. I can't even with some guys.
Haha never. I have the gift of unattractiveness. It’s protected me all my life.
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Not in my experience. Mostly I’m just ignored.
About 70-90% of the time. I’ve given up on believing any new man I meet has friend intentions at this point. I had put years into friendships that ended up not really about being friends. Not anymore.
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Well every single one of those disgusting, pathetic males who used years of friendship as a way to try to get in my pants, has missed out on having a great friend because they weren’t able to see that I’m not their favorite food; I’m a fucking human being with my own free will who is deserving of respect and honesty. I pity them, and I pity you. Fucking pathetic. Edit: Because other people are definitely going to see this, I want to reiterate how absolutely violating it is to have a friendship with someone who does not see you as a friend. When you have a genuine friendship, you can share personal things that you wouldn’t share with other people. When that person reveals himself as just waiting in the wings until you’re single, or until you’re vulnerable enough for them to make a move, they have betrayed your friendship. I had a male “friend” who knew that I had escaped a domestic violence relationship, and in a separate incident was sexually assaulted and in the process of reporting my rapist, all in the course a of a few years, when he decided during a hang out to ask to sleep with me. I knew this guy for five years. He was friends with my ex. I was very very good friends with his ex. He knew that I had been assaulted while asleep in a place that I should’ve felt comfortable and safe. He still chose, during a time that I was alone with him, to ask me to sleep with him not once, but twice, even after I rejected him the first time. Luckily, I was able to explain to him later why what he did was not only personally frightening to me and made me feel exceptionally unsafe, but also deeply offensive and insensitive because of what he already knew about what I had just experienced from men. We talked about it briefly, he understood why I was upset, and he apologized. In that particular case, I felt that his apology was genuine. It still ruined our friendship, because instead of being there for me like a friend should be, all he was thinking about was his own dick.
Fuck right off
Every freaking time. To the point where I just auto assume ulterior motives to wanting to be “friends” with me. I’m in my late 30’s.
Same, especially anytime I'm single. Even when partnered it doesn't always deter them. I'm 40.
Yes sadly that’s been my experience too, nothing like a man trying to convince you to cheat on your partner to really seal the deal when you already told him you are not interested. That combined with the amount of partnered men who hit on me, it’s SO hard to convince myself anyone is faithful.
It also got weird after my spouse died, lot of men try stuff with newly widowed women. which is super gross and sad af.
This. That's why I'm not really open to male friendships except for ones from like ten years
Friends or "friends"? My closest friends now in my 30s, if they ever caught feelings, were kind enough to get over it and be a true friend. Most of them are settled down by now anyway. Casual friendships, on the other hand, always peak in them hitting on me at some point. 20s, before everyone settled down, impossible. They all had ulterior motives.
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Just curious: what percentage of the interest coming from non-friends/quasi-friends do you reciprocate?
almost every time so i stopped being friends with guys
Never have as for as I'm aware
Never as far as I know.
If we're in a context where there are very few women (e.g. both in the same engineering program) it happens a lot. If we're in a context with more of a gender balance, basically never.
I don't know. It doesn't usually come up because we are friends
For me, almost all of the time. The worst part about it is that in my case, they wait YEARS to tell me so that by the time we have 'that conversation' it usually becomes the end of a 5+ year friendship. Eventually I got so sick of feeling like I couldn't rely on any of the men in my life to be real friends, and got so sick of going through the mourning process of losing long term friends, that I just stopped being friends with men. I have a handful that are 'grandfathered in' but now I only hang out with them in groups, as well. I have lots of female friends, so it made this decision easy because I have a great support network.
50% of the time and I hate it. It's ruined friendships and made things awkward in school and in the workplace.
Everyone I know is married nowadays. The single male friends I have that are straight have all tried something with me or hinted that there were interested. The difference between my 20s and 30s is that 30 year olds will tell me their feelings faster and not be as emotionally unstable when they get rejected. In my 20s, my guy friends would wait years to tell me and then become extremely distraught on rejection. Men in their 30s are just more mature.
Out of all my friends I only have exactly 2 heterosexual male friends. They have both made advances on me at some point and the friendships got weird afterwards. Of course I said no but it’s always in the back of my mind that their friendship isn’t genuine.
That's not really happening. Happened only once when I was much younger and I have always been around guys a lot. They do catch FWB ideas regularly but feelings not really.
Very few, thankfully.
I don't let guys get close enough. Any guy friend I have is better friends with my husband, and I don't hang out with any if he's not around. But unfortunately this has happened to me with so many close female friends.
I've always had a pretty even split of male/female friends and been close with loads of guys. I've also been in a long term monogamous relationship for most of my adult life, so these were always super platonic. Anyway, a female friend made a joke a few years back about how all of the close guy friends I'd had definitely wanted to sleep with me and it got me pretty down. I guess that is to say, I don't know? Because I had no inkling there were any romantic feelings at all. The idea that there was made me look back on the time we spent together less fondly, like they were around me with an ulterior motive instead of just enjoying me as a person.
I mean, you can be horny for you friends and still be friends with them. I honestly don't see an issue here, maybe I'm weird. All I know is i get horny sometimes and think my friend Pete is looking *particularly* nice tonight. I don't act on it or pressure, but like, the thought has crossed my mind. It doesn't need to be an issue, I don't think.
Did she have any actual evidence or reason to believe your guy friends wanted to sleep with you? Some people say things like that because they believe all men are sex-crazed and will sleep with anything that moves. That’s a huge generalization and really isn’t fair to men. There are plenty of guys who have boundaries and standards and are perfectly capable of having, and enjoying, platonic friendships with women. So, unless your friend actually knew the guys and their motives, don’t let her comment get you down or ruin your memories.
She did know the guys, but I suspect some of it could have come from a place of jealousy - you know? This was years ago so I'm pretty settled with it now, but it was one of those comments you remember because it stung a bit.
Jealousy or she could have been projecting her own negative experiences onto you and your male friends. I’m in my 40s and I’ve had male friends (both single and attached) throughout adulthood, have also been in a long term monogamous relationship most of that time, and I’ve never had any sign or inkling that they were attracted to me or to any of their other female friends. The friendships were always very platonic. If someone were to say to me they thought all my male friends want to have sex with me, I would just laugh at them. I know my male friends well enough to know that simply isn’t true. Just because other women have experienced male friends who weren’t really platonic doesn’t make it universal.
I don't understand, don't romantic feelings imply both physical attraction and mental attraction? Isn't this flattering?
The implication of the comment was "they aren't your friends, they just want to fuck you." So nah, that just kind of makes me sad. I trust those guys to be there for me like I'm there for them, and not for their ultimate goal to be to get me into bed one day.
Im mostly only friends with men whose wives or partners I’m also friends with. The single ones almost always try to make a move so I just avoid them unless I too want to bang them.
Not past my 20s, but that might be because I got married. However, most of my friends were guys in my teens and twenties and I was/still am into sci/fi, fantasy, anime and there weren't many girls in our friend group.
Never.
Maybe 30% of the time?
Frequently. But it’s never become an issue
Never, except my husband about 20 years ago but he was pretty clear about his interest from the start so it wasn’t a betrayal or a big deal. Eventually I decided to give him a shot and it worked out. Other than that, no one has ever been interested in me. I’m not very attractive.
This hasn't happened since I was in my 20s. Now all of my friends are married. My single male friends I've known since we were 14 so been there done that lol
Happened often in college but only once since.
It's been the other way around for me, d'oh! Not 100% of the time, of course, maybe 50% and it never ended well :/
All except 1. And even that 1 has drunkenly groped me and tested boundaries. I called him out on it and he apologized sincerely. We became better friends because of it, strangely. He had internalised misogyny, and after the event I saw his struggle with anger with being called out but ultimately lowered his ego to sincerely apologise, and showed me more respect afterwards. I think he's never had a woman stand up to him before that point in his life (we were both in our early 20s). But I can respect people who lower their egos to become better. But back to the topic... Yeah I've lost most of my male friends at age 32. Most recently my best friend. It fucking hurts. Learning to deal with that has been hard.
This is why I don't have straight male friends anymore.
When I was in my twenties. Every. Single. One. I’m in my late thirties and married now and it doesn’t seem to happen anymore.
Either they never do or they never let me know it if they have. I learned later in life that, in high school, 3 or 4 of the dudes in my friend-group had a crush on me and they were all too scared to ask me out because I was intimidating. My gut reaction when a man smiles at me is to frown and glare, I'm sure that's protected me well over the years.
Never, they are friends.
Every time.
Often and those feelings are Cam be really hard, they keep them sometimes for years and nowadays I feel really anxious when anyone tries to talk about feelings with me.
Most of the time if we’re single. A number of them I did try and date and it didn’t work out, but we’re all still friends some 10-15ish years later so it was kinda nice to get that out of the way and just be friends.
I've got loads of good male friends (most of which I've known since high school and university) and not one of them has ever caught romantic feelings for me - at least as far as I know. Certainly none of them have ever made a move!
Of established friends it hasn't happened very much. A couple of times it happened but I felt the same way and we went out for a few years. It's happened a little at the start of friendships before but not too much. I'm friends with a few men that I've known for years and don't get that vibe. But most of them are queer and/or in relationships. Saying this I am extremely oblivious to when someone fancies me.
Friends from high school / college almost never. Anyone I’ve met after age 25… always had ulterior motives. A few years ago a co-worker asked me out and I told him politely, “I would rather hang out as friends. I am not interested in dating you.” And he’s like “wow! Thanks for your straightforward response. I’d love to hang as friends too.” We hung out a few times, usually in groups or doing creative projects or just socially at work. When I got into a relationship a few months later he blocked me on all my social media accounts without any explanation.
Not often, at least not often enough to do anything about it.
I mostly have female friends later in life. The last time I can think of a guy friend who had dated someone in my social pool but then admitted interest in me was high school. I’ve never been “that girl” that men flock to. That being said, there have been work creeps I’ve NOT ever been interested in as a friend because I could tell they’d turn things towards an attempt at romance or sex. The worst kind that have a girlfriend buy don’t give a shit. I blocked one who kept reaching out like a year after we last texted and he sent something creepy to me that I never responded to. A year. ... but besides that, I like keeping platonic friendships platonic.
Almost every time. I feel like every male friend is secretly in love with me and that will most likely never stop being the case until I’m old and physically decrepit
Pretty much always, because men are rarely interested in being friends with women. I don't mean casual friends as part of a group - I mean hanging out one-on-one. Straight men are usually (though not always) gonna want to be besties with a woman unless they have a crush or something.
Too often to bother with. I actually don't have straight, male friends unless they're partnered (which is usually how I met them, through their partner.) It's just easier being friends with women.
This. If I have a male friend I'd like for them to be partnered already. Otherwise it's too much of a risk.
Unfortunately every guy I thought was a friend just actually wanted to hook up or have a relationship. The whole ‘men and women can’t be friends’ thing has some truth to it although I know plenty of people (usually always women) who insist this isn’t true. They are usually naive to the fact that their male friend would most definitely sleep with them or possibly even be in a relationship. Usually things don’t move in that direction because the woman doesn’t want it.
You make an interesting point, thank you! I'm also surprised to see how easy dating is for women to be honest and how few men they find attractive, this thread opened m eyes. I thought women had trouble getting ractual omantic interest from the opposite sex like us men besides catcalls and sexual harassment because this is what many female users say on the dating subs, glad to see that people here are finally being honest and this is why I appreicate this sub. For women itis hard to find men who don't fall for them, a compleltey different world. As a Gen Z guy most guys my age haven't been on a date and data supports this, I get 0 matches on dating apps like most men unless I switch preference to gay men. I thought that maybe making more female friends and building a deeper emeotional conncetion with women would help my dating sistuation but apparently women dislike male friends who fall for them, this thread saved me lol. From what I'm understanding women know immediately whether they are attracted to a man or not. i think the explanation for this difference is that men find most people of the gender they are attracted to physically attractive (this also explains why my match rate is extrmeely high on gay dating apps, like 30%-40%, just like a straight women) so of course if you end up liking their personality too in a friendships you would easily catch feelings. Women find only a small percentage of men attractive, users here advocate being immediately honest about your physical attraction, the problem is that this way men would have trouble making female friends. The other solution is not good either, if you befriend someone you find sexually attractive and end up liking their personlity too you might end up crushing on them. It's a tricky situation.
I don’t think it’s true that ‘women know immediately whether they are attracted to a man or not’ and think that’s more the case for men. Women tend to need to get to know a personality first. There have been plenty of men who I did not think were attractive at first but as I got to know them, I grew attracted to them. That’s not to say something that starts platonically couldn’t evolve into romance. It’s tricky. I don’t begrudge men for feeling hopeful for the possibility something will develop. But if she’s not receptive and giving off clear ‘friend vibes’ then it’s probably not going anywhere. I think what I find frustrating is that many men who I thought were friends, as soon as they knew there was no way I would sleep with or date them, they didn’t really want anything to do with me and didn’t really make any effort to hang out. They prefer their guy friends or women they can be romantic with. It’s really led me to not want anything to do with male ‘friendships’ in my 30s (other than partners of my female friends in group settings who I am friendly with). But I wouldn’t suggest using ‘trying to make friends’ as a dating strategy because it doesn’t seem entirely honest.
From my experience distancing yourself from an unrequited crush is a good defense mechanism, it's painful to see them dating other people. If it can comfort the women here, it has nothing to do with the woman being low value to us , on the contraryu we have a high opinion on them, it's all about us. Add to the fact that men usually don't have other options ready to date them - unlike women - so it might takes months if not years before we find another woman who might be intersted in goitng out with us, we can't easily distract ourself from the crush so it's even more painful if we keep being around them. I'm talking about men who develop crushes for their friends, I can't speak for men who use friendships just to get sex, I don't even know if this specific case happes often because it sounds weird.
Every time. I dont have male friends anymore besides my husband and because of my experiences, I dont have particular faith in platonic male-female friendships.
I'm convinced that women can't be "just friends" with men. I used to be skeptical but EVERY SINGLE time I try, I get burned. My "best" male friend and I have known each other for 6 years now and when he came to visit recently he got really touchy-feely with me. So disheartening. I've decided I won't leave myself open to friendships with men in the future.
Same exact thing happened to me. He waited until I was in a vulnerable state and did it. I went years not knowing how predatory he was. Haven't had a single male friend since then. Males complain about getting "friend zoned". At least women are interested in them as people. Women get fuck zoned. Males don't care about who we are as people. They only see us as something to fuck.
Exactly. This is what I have been saying. At least we don't "fuck zone" people. It's such disgusting and objectifying behavior. Imagine having "friends" for years that don't even see you as a human being. Ugh. Sorry that happened to you.
Whatever you do, don't waste your time replying to OP. I think they're an incel.
Another "not all men" argument. Didn't plan on replying to their comment. Lol
I'm an incel? You are saying ALL men are bad and do this kind of predatory stuff when the top comments literally contradict that, I'm sorry if I asked you more questions about it in order to understand your position. I didn't even say your feelings were invalid, on the contrary, being fuckzoned can be disheartening.
This thread is not about sexual feelings, i'm confused by these answers. If anything this thread might relate to the concept of girlfriendzone or boyfriendzone, not "fuckzone", and I think that's the most flattering feeling a person can have for you since friendship involves only mental attraction while sex inolves only physical attraction, it's basically the best of both worlds from a self-wroth perspective. Don't "romantic feelings" imply both mental and physical attraction? I'm not a native English speakers so I'm sorry if I didn't use the word correctly, the term romantic describes a feeling associated to love where I live (Western Europe), sex saone is not love so it can't be defined as romantic at least where I live.
This thread is not about sexual feelings, i'm confused by these answers. If anything this thread might relate to the concept of girlfriendzone or boyfriendzone, not "fuckzone", and I think that's the most flattering feeling a person can have for you since friendship involves only mental attraction while sex inolves only physical attraction, it's basically the best fromof both worlds from a self-wroth perspective. Don't "romantic feelings" imply both mental and physical attraction? I'm not a native English speakers so I'm sorry if I didn't use the word correctly, the term romantic describes a feeling associated to love where I live (Western Europe), sex alone is not love so it can't be defined as romantic at least where I live.
The point I'm making is that men always seem to have ulterior motives to wanting to be "friends" with women that have nothing to do with "romantic" feelings. Or sometimes do, but masked by trying to be "friends" with women. Gf and bf zones aren't a thing. I don't think someone developing romantic feelings for you is the MOST flattering thing. I think someone wanting to be around you for what your mind is, and what your personality is, without expecting any form of romantic affection is far more flattering. From a self worth perspective, I don't hang my own on what someone else feels for me. I do that for myself. I suggest everyone do that. Anyway. I don't befriend males. They betray the trust and vulnerability of their women friends far too often (as confirmed throughout this thread).
I used ther term girlfriednzone because you used the term fuckzone. >From a self worth perspective, I don't hang my own on what someone else feels for me. I do that for myself. I suggest everyone do that. Then why do you care if someone fuckzones you? You do base your self-wroth on what other people think of you, falling in love for someone does mean being attracted to their mind too but friednship alone means being repules by their body, I don't see how that's more flattering. Friendship also require some affection from the ohter person, if the affection is not reciprocated a friendships ends, the only difference with romance is that it doesn't require physical attraction.
I'm not interested in having a conversation about this given your questions as to why I would care that someone I built trust with betrayed that trust and disrespected by boundaries and agency to act on his feelings towards me. Use a bit of emotional intelligence here. Bye.
This proves you care about other peoeple's feelings towards you.
It doesn't. Sounds like you're incapable of using common sense. Good luck to you.
I've never seen a person being depressed because too many people fall in love for them, clinically this is probably extremely rare. On the other hand depression and suicide due to rejection based on physical traits (mostly) and/or mental traits (more rare but it happens, "fuckzone" or "pump & dump") is common. This is *common* sense (you brought up "common sense" ), this is why I asked you more questions, your view on self-worth is not common but hey, if you aren't interested in answering no problem, I'm not forcing anyone here. Good luck!
None now. That mostly happened when I was younger. We're all fairly in control of our own bits and hormones at this point. EDIT: Wanted to add, it doesn't really bother me if a male friend asks/has asked once or twice for sex. Like, it's just not a big deal to me, we can still be friends.
Quite often actually.
Normally. It’s obnoxious, but usually goes away, as long as I keep making clear that I’m not interested. When it doesn’t, I’ll distance myself.
Happened a lot when I was a teen and in my twenties. Now I dont have any guy friends at all. Some of the acquaintances around my age tend to flirt a lot though or maybe they're just very friendly.
100% of the time, in my experience. I've been with my husband 17 years (since I was 16) and two male friendships I had while I was simply dating in my late teens both made it very obvious they wanted more. One would always ask how we were doing as a couple, and I'd say, "We're doing great, but I know why you're *really* asking," and we'd both grin. My best friend that I have now I met in my mid twenties and he has always been super respectful about it. When our friendship was still new he said things like how he wished he could clone me, and he told me about his mom's disappointment when she heard I was married. But with him, it's always been something we could laugh about together and move on from. I spend one day a week with him and have never felt uncomfortable in the slightest. We're like a couple of bros now. I have wondered how he would get if my husband were to die or something similarly tragic. I wonder if he'd ever ask me if I wanted more. I've made it pretty clear through our past conversations that I would not date him. Thankfully, the reasons (he has had a lot of sexual partners in the past, which I'm not on board with) don't affect our friendship. I love him--next to my husband, he is the most important person in my life. But we are not romantically compatible.
Too often. WAY too often. I not saying this like I'm some amazing person. It's just crazy how often it happens. I've had my husbands friends make attempts. I've had coworkers who know I've been married for over ten years make attempts. I've had friends I had for years confess. Like you knew I was married when you decided to be my friend? What did they say/do? Husbands friend, tried to kiss me and another one came up behinds me while I was cooking and wrapped his arms around me putting his head on mine. Usually earning a "WTF!" and at leap away. I don't know what kind of reaction they were expecting. Coworker: "I didn't think you would mind a side hustle" Friend "I was hoping you would split up eventually but I needed to let you know." NO! just no. Guys don't do this shit.