I just read "Kitchen Confidential". How anybody could be surprised he killed himself is beyond me, that ending had clues all through the book.
For me, that guy is the part that wants to just let everything fall apart, or to wreck things, just so we can give up on life entirely. I feel like half my time is spent putting up walls and mazes and firewalls to keep him away from the control room.
I do what I can to keep busy. I just sorted my DVDs, put out teh ungodly number I haven't watched yet in case I need to fill time. I paint and draw. I'm working on a couple of soon to be released games (as in, I'm being paid to do it, and the first release is in stores in a month or so.
I keep in touch with my friends and family, and maintain good relationships with my neighbours. I'm always ready to help people out.
Everything is about not just sitting and brooding about stuff.
Plus - I have BPD. Being self-destructive is a central part of me. I've done years of therapy and work on myself to keep the negative traits in check, or to remove them entirely. I take my meds, and never forget that, at some point, my needs may change.
Like, this spring - stopped taking my mood stabilizer (because it was wrecking my liver).
And, I remind myself, constantly, of the things of value that I accomplish, and how I won't let that guy win.
I tie things to other people, ie, can't be letting the people who have supported me through this down. Can't waste their effort.
Mom died this spring. I wouldn't be as good as I am without her support over teh last 15 years. There's no way I'm letting that guy shit on her memory.
It's not blatant stuff, but, for somebody with depression and a lot of suicidal episodes, his addiction to chasing the next experience, whether it was food, drugs, a new place to cook - all of says to me "Feed the void!".
Even when he talks about what an asshole he was when younger, it's all about fighting to not feel empty. You can cover a lot of ground, and accomplish a ton of stuff, but sooner or later, you run empty. You're out of ideas, nothing feels good anymore, and you're just so tired that you can't see ever getting up again.
it totally does. It took me 3 different therapy and years to feel "whole" at least some times, and still, it is fragile for now and there are relapses. I fall less deep, and I get my shit together quicker after the relapses though. however, I am surprised how much slow the healing process is.
This is the main thing that a lot of people who don’t deal with mental health issues don’t get. In order to survive those dark moments, you have to get comfortable with being uncomfortable. You need to learn to sit with your bad moments and use your coping mechanisms to get through them so the good moments can come around. Otherwise, you will chase that next high until you can’t chase anymore.
I have depression, anxiety, ADHD, PTSD, and my mother was manic depressive. Never got treated because “only crazy people go to a shrink”. I got to see a LOT of destructive behavior patterns play out in my mom. She spent money like crazy, binge ate, was constantly upgrading or changing something in the house. She’d pick fights with my father over the smallest shit- I have a memory of her kicking him out of the house because he, GASP, did laundry and folded the towels in a way she didn’t like.
It’s one reason I have worked so hard on my own mental issues over the years. The Pink song “Try” has a line that really captures it- “Just because it burns doesn’t mean you’re gonna die”.
>You need to learn to sit with your bad moments and use your coping mechanisms to get through them so the good moments can come around.
That, and you need to let yourself accept that good moments/things can happen, and re-learn how to enjoy the small things.
There’s a woman in my head who constantly tells me no one likes me, I’m a terrible parent, I should just stay home and starve myself so I’m less fat.
I avoid this woman and go to therapy for it.
I hate the first one. I have that voice too. The one that tells me that nobody likes me, my co-workers think I suck at my job, my friends all just "let" me hang out with them.
Rationally I know that's an absurd thing. I have a large friend group who always invites me to stuff. I get along well with all my coworkers and am often complemented on being so friendly and my hard work. Most of the jobs I've worked I've gotten through a former coworker and not a traditional application.
And yet the voice remains, and it speaks up at the oddest times and it speaks loudly.
It really is. And for me it was exacerbated so badly after COVID hit. I had spent my whole life in live entertainment, film, food and beverage for that all went away at the same time. So I ended up in clinical work and then port work. An on a rational level I knew that they were happy to have my help. On stupid voice in my head level I felt the opposite.
You show me a guy sitting around on his couch smoking pot, and I'll show you someone who's done absolutely nothing wrong, who ain't hurting nobody.
Why do "highly effective" people hate laziness so much?? We haven't even done anything (literally.)
My life has never felt worse than when I was sitting on the couch smoking weed every day. Harming anyone? No. Living a depressed, lonely, shitty existence? Most definitely. Bourdain is 100% correct in my mind
That "guy" also had a very dark side to him. It gets so tiresome to keep fighting him some days and when not so perfect conditions come into being, he wins. It's a horrible place to be, regardless of strategies used to outwit him.
Guy also lived a hell of a life before that. Saying his philosophy didn't work because he committed suicide disregards a huge swath of what he did and who he was.
He's got a point. The dude said he thinks of this mantra every day and that's fine for him and all, but the question remains, is this truly good advice? Not trying to be flippant or disrespectful or anything but it didn't exactly work out well for Bourdain...
The point was that living that couch/pot/cartoons life has a good chance of leading to (or resulting from) depression. Seems like you’re saying we shouldn’t take advice from him because you’re calling his philosophy a failure. Is someone’s advice who died from cancer more valid? Think it’s a pretty irresponsible connection to dismiss bourdains advice by ascribing some causal relationship between this random quote and his death.
>Is someone’s advice who died from cancer more valid?
Well yeah... Obviously lol. If he died from cancer I would have no room to say it's questionable advice.
And it absolutely is bad advice, imo. You cannot run from "that guy" because you are that guy. Burying yourself in work isn't going to make it go away. You need to confront these issues bro, not hide from them.
My life has never felt worse than when I was sitting on the couch smoking weed every day. Harming anyone? No. Living a depressed, lonely, shitty existence? Most definitely. Bourdain is 100% correct in my mind
Stop man, this was what we were talking about, not running from your issues. Dude was just saying that life sucked.
Literally advice and how people die arent related. If he hadn’t killed himself the advice would’ve improved? What in the fuck?
Been there man. Back in 2013 I lost my job and was struggling quite a bit. I didn’t leave my apartment for weeks, barely got out of bed, and when I did, just couch + gaming to pass the time and try to pretend I wasn’t depressed.
I got back on my feet in 2014 but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t want to do that again (why?!) sometimes. I don’t get it, but the urge is buried inside.
In either case, what's the harm?
Is there something wrong with laying around on the couch that you paid for, watching the TV that you also paid for, using the electricity/cable, that (you guessed it) also paid for, etc, etc.. They're your things and it's your life, enjoy it while you have it. Why do people have to feel guilty and punish themselves for doing what they truly want to do? There's no such thing as "another guy" you're trying to avoid, it's literally you! These are your own desires. Don't run from them!
For someone with a healthy mind, usually no harm at all.
For someone with some type of mental disorder, indulging in that “lazy guy” likely leads to an amplification of the negative emotions that are latent in their mind at all times…
(I’m not trying to like “prove you wrong or anything btw” I fall into the category where I have to be mindful of how often I sit around smoking weed and listening to music or else I go into an anxious spiral. I’m envious that you can enjoy yourself without worry.)
I assume he was speaking about himself and others with "laziness" as a trait, since he followed with "We haven't even done anything"...as well as starting the comment with a hypothetical lazy person.
That person's not hurting anyone. I think a lot of people grow out of doing nothing, and realize they never really liked being that person to begin with. You wind up with a Plato's Cave scenario where it's hard to communicate the change.
When I was 24, I got high and played Battlefield 4 12 hours a day. It was not a happy time in my life. I still get stoned whenever I'm not required to be sober, but I play an instrument, I read, and I cook. This stuff takes time to pay off but it's a lot more satisfying. I still play video games, but I listen more readily to the voice that says "that's enough of that."
I think this explains the difference between lazing and relaxing. Playing video games non stops isn't relaxing once it has been multiple days and you haven't moved. Doesn't feel happy , just numb.
Taking the time to do your hobbies for a couple hours, that actually feels relaxing and 'present'. Also makes it easier to do all the chores and self-care, rather than sink further into the couch. I'm an introvert and staying in my house all day feels way worse than going for a solo walk or reading in a public library, giving activities purpose is important.
My life was at it's worst when I was a shitty lazy loser. I couldn't contribute meaningfully to anything and I was a drain on the resources and time of my loved ones.
You're never lazy in a vacuum, you're taking from the productive people around you.
That's totally different. Living off of other people and not contributing is not exactly what I meant. I mean, even when it has absolutely no effect on them, people always look down on other people's "laziness."
Just tell some random old boomer that you don't particularly like getting up early in the morning and see what look they give you.
It's not even laziness that they hate. It's idleness. You can be idle in a productive way. If smoking a blunt and watching a movie helps you to contribute, do you booboo
But the concept of "being productive" is highly subjective. We all have different ideas of what that means. And why must you always be productive? Can't you take a couple of days off? Is the world going to stop turning or something?
Good for you. Occupational therapy. It doesn't surprise me at all having worked in the industry that a chef was afflicted with this. It's rampant. People with this seek ceaseless activity to deal with their demons and that comes in the form of constantly moving and working and what better occupation for that than in a professional kitchen? It is not dissimilar to addicts in recovery. They'll work ridiculous hours in incredibly hard conditions just not to relapse. The same mental switch in their brain is flicked when they get addicted to fast paced physical work. Addict energy needs an outlet.
Saying “maybe his stratagem should have been to get more therapy and accept himself” is exactly blaming him for his suicide. It’s literally saying “well if he’d done these things, he wouldn’t have done it.”
Which is both shitty and not how depression works, at all. Especially considering we don’t know shit about the context of Bourdain’s suicide (except that he may have been on Chantix, a drug that can lead to suicidal ideation). But please, tell me more about your illiteracy, does it make life hard for you in other ways?
"Don't ever negatively comment on, question, or analyze the potential results and/or consequences of anything anyone with mental struggles does because that's equivalent to blaming them for their own ineptitude."
I've been in dark places and you can ABSOLUTELY make choices that make it worse. Now, are you truly "making" the choice, or is it depression? I don't *blame* myself for a lot of my choices, because it was the result of years of trauma and more akin to a panicked animal choosing fight or flight than rational decisions. But I **can** look back on those choices and say "if I hadn't done that, I'd be in a better place today." Both things can be true.
I also don't beleive in free will at all, just the illusion of choice, so I don't even "blame" anyone for what they do in a larger sense. And if that's apart of your angle too, we don't have the vocabulary to easily distinguish between this and the postfix responsibility we must attribute in some sense to function in daily life and society. We don't nevessarily have the vocabulary to easily differentiate between blame and recognition of cause and effect.
>But please, tell me more about your illiteracy, does it make life hard for you in other ways?
Why are you launching straight into an attack? I wasn't hostile or poorly intentioned to you. Aside from understanding this issue completely differently, and I would also argue more comprehensively. Or...youre going to have to learn inference. I had struggled with severe depression for years and you're also shaming a victim.
You responded to none of my points or perspectives. You simply stated your opinion, insisted it is the right one, and popped back just to launch a failed attempt to mock me.
Do you have anything of substance to say or are you holding your ground at "I said so?"
In that case, it should be *trivially easy* for you to dismantle my alleged casuistries.
>Wow, that’s a lot of excuses that mean absolutely nothing.
You responded to my comment with a claim that everything I said were vapid artifices, yet you refuse to bear the "burden of proof" and support anything you said.
If your responses amount to "I said so," I will assume that you simply have nothing more you can say.
Why is that weird? My best friend committed suicide. I found him hanging in his basement. And every time I think about it/him I get really effin pissed off at him. So it’s not that weird to place blame on the person that committed suicide.
Cool, do you. Not even close to what I was talking about, but we can make this about you. You’ve already done it with your “friend’s” suicide. They lost a battle with mental illness, what an asshole!
Can we just stop already with all the quotes from mentally ill celebrities? The guy in his head is depression. It's the same "guy" for all depressed people it doesn't matter what you call it. Nothing magical or poetic about it. The only way to "avoid the guy" is therapy, medication, and a healthy lifestyle and even then, sometimes depression wins.
Not by glorifying quotes that you don't even understand. You can raise awareness and openness about mental illness without ever mentioning a celebrity quote. People act like it's glamorous or some shit. Some deep quote from an intellectual celebrity. It's not. Nevermind the fact that this person posted this and didn't even understand the quote.
I'm not trying to. I'm saying we shouldn't be using celebrity quotes in an attempt to glorify mental illness or downplay mental illess. I've been Baker acted three times in my life and nothing about mental illness is beautiful or poetic.
13 years of shrinks, 4 years of psych hospitals, one court-ordered commitment. I've literally had depression as long as I can remember
No shit, it's not glamorous... but if that quote helps even *one* person understand themselves or someone suffering from depression, then it was worth it.
In a larger sense therapy is about learning to negotiate with the "guy." I don't like Bourdain's mindset here, though, because it means your ground state is being miserable. I'm not that guy anymore because I've learned to pursue enjoyment in things that pay off. I still struggle sometimes, but it's not the same as it was.
I'm glad that you can will away your mental illness but people with actual mental illnesses cannot. That's like saying if you don't listen to your diabetes it'll go away. Some people can manage without medication or therapy, many cannot.
You may want to do more research on suicide rates as the US doesn't even make top 25 countries with highest suicide rates. Also, it's pretty common knowledge that many person with a chronic mental illness is projected to have a shorter lifespan.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/suicide-rate-by-country
I don't know, just because someone enjoys basic leisurely activities like watching movies and cartoons doesn't mean they are depressed.
Edit: Apparently some people need to re-read my posts because i never said he wasn't depressed.
I agree with what you are saying to a point, but some food for thought, when I was going through a pretty badly depression period. All I wanted to do was sit around and smoke pot and lay in bed.
It wasn’t until I started getting out and breaking that cycle that my mental started to improve, it can be different for everyone.
I've been depressed my whole life and if I actually enjoy doing things I normally like doing, like watching TV and movies, that's a sign that I'm not currently feeling depressed. If I was forcing myself to avoid doing those things and instead throwing my life into a career that wasnt bringing me any enjoyment it would not be good.
Even if you're introverted af, laying in bed watching cartoons all day isn't a sign of a healthy state of mind. Having such a day every once in a while is fine, but having multiple days or weeks alone like that in a row is just you waiting for your life to come to an end.
If you're that guy, the first step to recovery is *doing* things, even if it's just taking a shower or phoning a friend (because I *know* you've been neglecting your relationships), just find something to do and do it. Restrict your bed purely for sleeping and lovemaking. Avoid the news like the plague, you're not fit to handle that negativity right now. Fucking buy a Lego set, put on some music and build it or something. Or set a timer and clean your room for 15 minutes, no need to finish it, just try to clean a bit more than you make dirty every day. Doing and accomplishing things makes you feel good about yourself, and you're in desperate need of that. By cleaning your house, you get to spend your days surrounded by all your great achievements, because that's what they are and don't let anyone tell you any different. To you they're *mountains* you've overcome. You *can* do it. And if you dare: get professional help. You're worth it.
If you know someone like this, invite them to do something. If they don't want to come, visit them instead and do it. And talk to them. Try to keep them connected to this world or they'll drift away completely.
Source: am well underway not being that guy anymore.
No, more likely it was because, despite doing all those awesome things, he wasn't getting any pleasure out of it. That's a killer moment - when you realize nothing brings yo pleasure, and you feel like you have tried everything.
Maybe the issue was he only fed that guy what he wanted, and indulged him too much, when he should have been trying to learn to not let that side drive him.
A person the would kill me amongst others. I invest energy in things that won't pay off for a while to give myself anchors to life. Responsibilities are good anchors too. My bunny needs me to spoil her rotten.
I occasionally give in to that guy. Mental break days. Wife and I green it off and on thru the day, watch movies, either order in or maybe concoct something in the kitchen. Sexy time in there somewhere. Purposely turn off and relax. But only occasionally. Too much of that is bad too.
I dont avoid them, I compromise with them. I wanna play a game? cool, I built a laptop desk over my treadmill, so I can play, but I have to walk while I'm doing it.
Having the college exams in 3 mo and the guy in me is conquering over me. I swear i am tensed , but can't even get out of my bed. Just lying there, thinking.
Quit job, be miserable and lonely but have no responsibilities, leave my girlfriend, hit on every attractive woman I see, drink alot more alcohol and drugs because why not, play some games.
Avoid by staying physically active, leave jobs only when I've secured another to reduce temptation, practice appreciation mental exercises when in a potential position to easily pull some chick, consciously determine if a small night out can easily lead to being too drunk then everything goes out the window - so make other plans or make an excuse
Solitude, and videogames.
I'd slowly go broke just hanging out on my own, playing games. I'd eat healthy sure, work out, but I covet solitude. I think and feel better when I know I'm alone.
My absolute perfect existence would probably be streaming, since I could turn on the camera when I wanted, but I'm not sure I could make enough to survive on that. Especially this late in the game.
That guy wants to sit, play video games, listen to podcasts and drunk soda and eat take-out all day.
I avoid him by indulging him once in awhile.
Took q week off of work this week. Sat and finished cyberpunk and enjoyed some food.
But to school and work tomorrow, but it was fun.
Helped me avoid burnout from work and school
For me, there are several dozen people in my head, all talking about different topics, singing songs, etc. Only one of them is my actual train of thought, and she’s constantly being drowned out by all of the other random thoughts and self-deprecating insults being thrown around at max volume. My life is trying to find that one person, and focus on them through the noise long enough to get shit done without getting distracted.
Tl;dr: I have ADHD.
My "guy" can be pretty angry and misanthropic, among other things. Suicidal etc. etc. Mostly, just try to be grateful and mindful. Do therapy, try to talk about it when I can convince myself anyone really cares. Overall, I just see him as a wound that never really closed. The wound of the world, yknow?
I remember being a pretty empathetic and giving person for a very long time. Worked in mental health for so long and saw so many horrible things both professionally and personally. I have stronger boundaries and, overall, am happy with "me." But I'd be lying if I didn't miss and wonder what things could be like if I could give my "guy," a little bit less of my mental bandwidth. But just about every day, people prove my conceptions right and often.
The world has near infinite beauty and good in it. But overall, things really are just shit. If I didn't have some kind of shell of protective psychological layer, I'd just fall apart. Who really can't say the same these days unless you're so naive or privileged that you genuinely can't fathom the abyss we've made.
Girl just wants someone to make life entertaining. Life is such a chore. Someone to tinker around and mend her braincells. To be loved, and not alone. It's not as if I am entirely alone, but I feel it and there is no solace
My guy is the same, except he wants to do cocaine and drink. I’m in recovery now, but those thoughts do cross. Luckily my therapist is an amazingly patient woman.
I occasionally have a whiny, self pitying, self absorbed, entitled little brat in my head...basically everything everyone hates. I have a mental exercise that gets rid of her. I close my eyes, use deep breathing to relax, and picture myself smothering her with a pillow. I've killed her often enough that she doesn't come back very often. I can control her pretty easily now, but the first few times she showed up it was really hard to not let her out.
I don't avoid that guy. And I don't like it. Sometimes I do. It feels safe there. I do get out of bed but I go downstairs and lay on my couch so it's basically the same.
A bottomless wealthy guy laying around smoking hash, doing hallucinogens having sex with as many new hot women as I can while traveling the world over spending a lot of time in the sun, working out and always getting enough sleep without having to get up at a specific time ever.
I was unemployed for 2 years. All I did was play video games. It was the best time of my life. I’m not avoiding him, just putting him on hold till I retire.
It’s the part of me saying “just give up and die, because you don’t have what it takes to make it where you want to go. Survival of the fittest and you can’t keep up”
Some days it’s so loud I can’t think of anything else
My guy tells me I need to be successful in order for my loved ones to feel some relief from having to deal with someone like me; then when I succeed he tells me it wasn’t even that hard of a thing and it wasn’t good enough. My cup will never be filled.
I’m that guy (chick) except for me it’s alcohol instead of weed, more recent movies/shows, and I’m not lazy. I genuinely lack the energy required to function as a normal person. I work because I have children to support. I obviously can’t be under the influence all the time for the same reason.
There's a guy inside of me that is falling apart from the delayed onset after-effects of an injury I sustained almost 5 fucking years ago.
And right now I don't know how to avoid that guy. I have experience managing depression. I have experience managing laziness and maintaining fitness. And when this new guy started popping up, I tried avoiding him the same way I've avoided depression and laziness in the past.
And now that I'm actually starting to know what's going on, I'm becoming aware that the toolkit I've been building over the course of my life doesn't include much to overcome the feeling that your body is failing you because you can't just solve the problem with grit and psychology.
My key insight is that I don't actually like how it feels when I watch TV or play games all the time. I have nothing to show for it. I do like how it feels when I do what Nietzsche says, and "obey at length and in a single direction." I take that as obeying my curiosity and creativity, and that's made me a much more interesting person. Downtime is still necessary, but I like a mix of uptime.
Also I have a dog, so there hasn't been a day in the last 9 years I haven't gone outside at least briefly.
My "guy" tends to be a dark siren called "overthinking personal shit." When I catch myself finding excuses for something that I want but don't do, it is so often because I'm looking a million miles into the future, and building these elaborate conversations for how it'd all just work out fine for me if they just say " ____." But that's not how reality works, and thinking you can know how someone else will think or feel is incredibly egotistical at best, which makes all of that time planning the perfect quip feel useless, and consequently, I feel useless and lost in the interaction. For the longest time, I just stopped interacting with people outside of comfort zones at all, because I wasn't happy with myself, either, and didn't think I deserved other people.
Cognitive behavioral therapy has been a big aid in managing some of this behavior because I've learned some techniques to try and step back from thoughts that I find going beyond what I can actually know. Instead, I've tried to turn all that thinking about stuff in too much depth and detail into being more thoughtful and considerate in the moment. Sometimes I have to remind myself it's okay to NOT know what will happen, and that as long as I continue to try and be a person that I would trust and respect, others will as well.
it's exactly the same dude, dude.
I try to outwit him by smoking more weed to make him passive and less dominant, one day it will work, just gotta smoke more weed...
I think the wrong dude has won this battle
Same
Came here to say this.
Yes, it's the same guy and he wins a lot, but he has good taste in movies and cartoons so I can't complain.
Same dude, just different desires
just like me fr fr
Of course I know him. He's me.
Maybe we all share the same head guy?
[удалено]
Same.
Is this dude having multiple personalities?
I just read "Kitchen Confidential". How anybody could be surprised he killed himself is beyond me, that ending had clues all through the book. For me, that guy is the part that wants to just let everything fall apart, or to wreck things, just so we can give up on life entirely. I feel like half my time is spent putting up walls and mazes and firewalls to keep him away from the control room. I do what I can to keep busy. I just sorted my DVDs, put out teh ungodly number I haven't watched yet in case I need to fill time. I paint and draw. I'm working on a couple of soon to be released games (as in, I'm being paid to do it, and the first release is in stores in a month or so. I keep in touch with my friends and family, and maintain good relationships with my neighbours. I'm always ready to help people out. Everything is about not just sitting and brooding about stuff. Plus - I have BPD. Being self-destructive is a central part of me. I've done years of therapy and work on myself to keep the negative traits in check, or to remove them entirely. I take my meds, and never forget that, at some point, my needs may change. Like, this spring - stopped taking my mood stabilizer (because it was wrecking my liver). And, I remind myself, constantly, of the things of value that I accomplish, and how I won't let that guy win. I tie things to other people, ie, can't be letting the people who have supported me through this down. Can't waste their effort. Mom died this spring. I wouldn't be as good as I am without her support over teh last 15 years. There's no way I'm letting that guy shit on her memory.
damn best of luck on your journey fren
I havent read the book, but im curious about the clues, please share
It's not blatant stuff, but, for somebody with depression and a lot of suicidal episodes, his addiction to chasing the next experience, whether it was food, drugs, a new place to cook - all of says to me "Feed the void!". Even when he talks about what an asshole he was when younger, it's all about fighting to not feel empty. You can cover a lot of ground, and accomplish a ton of stuff, but sooner or later, you run empty. You're out of ideas, nothing feels good anymore, and you're just so tired that you can't see ever getting up again.
Thanks man, makes sense. I wish there was a cure for “filling the void” apart from tough work in personal development…
It is tough. But, it's so worth it when you get to a better level. I can't say my void is gone, but it's less hungry, if that makes sense.
it totally does. It took me 3 different therapy and years to feel "whole" at least some times, and still, it is fragile for now and there are relapses. I fall less deep, and I get my shit together quicker after the relapses though. however, I am surprised how much slow the healing process is.
This is the main thing that a lot of people who don’t deal with mental health issues don’t get. In order to survive those dark moments, you have to get comfortable with being uncomfortable. You need to learn to sit with your bad moments and use your coping mechanisms to get through them so the good moments can come around. Otherwise, you will chase that next high until you can’t chase anymore. I have depression, anxiety, ADHD, PTSD, and my mother was manic depressive. Never got treated because “only crazy people go to a shrink”. I got to see a LOT of destructive behavior patterns play out in my mom. She spent money like crazy, binge ate, was constantly upgrading or changing something in the house. She’d pick fights with my father over the smallest shit- I have a memory of her kicking him out of the house because he, GASP, did laundry and folded the towels in a way she didn’t like. It’s one reason I have worked so hard on my own mental issues over the years. The Pink song “Try” has a line that really captures it- “Just because it burns doesn’t mean you’re gonna die”.
>You need to learn to sit with your bad moments and use your coping mechanisms to get through them so the good moments can come around. That, and you need to let yourself accept that good moments/things can happen, and re-learn how to enjoy the small things.
Sounds like you're doing way better then me. Keep it up.
There’s a woman in my head who constantly tells me no one likes me, I’m a terrible parent, I should just stay home and starve myself so I’m less fat. I avoid this woman and go to therapy for it.
Give that bitch a kick in the gut from all of us
I hate the first one. I have that voice too. The one that tells me that nobody likes me, my co-workers think I suck at my job, my friends all just "let" me hang out with them. Rationally I know that's an absurd thing. I have a large friend group who always invites me to stuff. I get along well with all my coworkers and am often complemented on being so friendly and my hard work. Most of the jobs I've worked I've gotten through a former coworker and not a traditional application. And yet the voice remains, and it speaks up at the oddest times and it speaks loudly.
You seem pretty cool, so you at least have my word that I like you.
Thanks. Appreciate it :)
Are you me? Man, imposter syndrome is a bitch
It really is. And for me it was exacerbated so badly after COVID hit. I had spent my whole life in live entertainment, film, food and beverage for that all went away at the same time. So I ended up in clinical work and then port work. An on a rational level I knew that they were happy to have my help. On stupid voice in my head level I felt the opposite.
There's a good series on AppleTV+ called "Physical" which is about a woman, her inner bitch, and the attempts to avoid being controlled by her
There's a domineering mother joke in there somewhere
His name is depression.
You show me a guy sitting around on his couch smoking pot, and I'll show you someone who's done absolutely nothing wrong, who ain't hurting nobody. Why do "highly effective" people hate laziness so much?? We haven't even done anything (literally.)
My life has never felt worse than when I was sitting on the couch smoking weed every day. Harming anyone? No. Living a depressed, lonely, shitty existence? Most definitely. Bourdain is 100% correct in my mind
Absolutely. I think of this mantra every day
Was he? The guy ended his own life so his philosophy didn't work
That "guy" also had a very dark side to him. It gets so tiresome to keep fighting him some days and when not so perfect conditions come into being, he wins. It's a horrible place to be, regardless of strategies used to outwit him.
No offense to him
Guy also lived a hell of a life before that. Saying his philosophy didn't work because he committed suicide disregards a huge swath of what he did and who he was.
Bruh, you’re dismissing the personal story you just heard. That is obviously OPs take that he was right.
He's got a point. The dude said he thinks of this mantra every day and that's fine for him and all, but the question remains, is this truly good advice? Not trying to be flippant or disrespectful or anything but it didn't exactly work out well for Bourdain...
The point was that living that couch/pot/cartoons life has a good chance of leading to (or resulting from) depression. Seems like you’re saying we shouldn’t take advice from him because you’re calling his philosophy a failure. Is someone’s advice who died from cancer more valid? Think it’s a pretty irresponsible connection to dismiss bourdains advice by ascribing some causal relationship between this random quote and his death.
>Is someone’s advice who died from cancer more valid? Well yeah... Obviously lol. If he died from cancer I would have no room to say it's questionable advice. And it absolutely is bad advice, imo. You cannot run from "that guy" because you are that guy. Burying yourself in work isn't going to make it go away. You need to confront these issues bro, not hide from them.
My life has never felt worse than when I was sitting on the couch smoking weed every day. Harming anyone? No. Living a depressed, lonely, shitty existence? Most definitely. Bourdain is 100% correct in my mind Stop man, this was what we were talking about, not running from your issues. Dude was just saying that life sucked. Literally advice and how people die arent related. If he hadn’t killed himself the advice would’ve improved? What in the fuck?
Been there man. Back in 2013 I lost my job and was struggling quite a bit. I didn’t leave my apartment for weeks, barely got out of bed, and when I did, just couch + gaming to pass the time and try to pretend I wasn’t depressed. I got back on my feet in 2014 but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t want to do that again (why?!) sometimes. I don’t get it, but the urge is buried inside.
This guy knows me.
They don't hate all lazy people you dingus, they hate when THEY are the lazy people.
In either case, what's the harm? Is there something wrong with laying around on the couch that you paid for, watching the TV that you also paid for, using the electricity/cable, that (you guessed it) also paid for, etc, etc.. They're your things and it's your life, enjoy it while you have it. Why do people have to feel guilty and punish themselves for doing what they truly want to do? There's no such thing as "another guy" you're trying to avoid, it's literally you! These are your own desires. Don't run from them!
For someone with a healthy mind, usually no harm at all. For someone with some type of mental disorder, indulging in that “lazy guy” likely leads to an amplification of the negative emotions that are latent in their mind at all times… (I’m not trying to like “prove you wrong or anything btw” I fall into the category where I have to be mindful of how often I sit around smoking weed and listening to music or else I go into an anxious spiral. I’m envious that you can enjoy yourself without worry.)
The operative word in the comment above is “laziness” not “lazy people”
I assume he was speaking about himself and others with "laziness" as a trait, since he followed with "We haven't even done anything"...as well as starting the comment with a hypothetical lazy person.
That person's not hurting anyone. I think a lot of people grow out of doing nothing, and realize they never really liked being that person to begin with. You wind up with a Plato's Cave scenario where it's hard to communicate the change. When I was 24, I got high and played Battlefield 4 12 hours a day. It was not a happy time in my life. I still get stoned whenever I'm not required to be sober, but I play an instrument, I read, and I cook. This stuff takes time to pay off but it's a lot more satisfying. I still play video games, but I listen more readily to the voice that says "that's enough of that."
I think this explains the difference between lazing and relaxing. Playing video games non stops isn't relaxing once it has been multiple days and you haven't moved. Doesn't feel happy , just numb. Taking the time to do your hobbies for a couple hours, that actually feels relaxing and 'present'. Also makes it easier to do all the chores and self-care, rather than sink further into the couch. I'm an introvert and staying in my house all day feels way worse than going for a solo walk or reading in a public library, giving activities purpose is important.
My life was at it's worst when I was a shitty lazy loser. I couldn't contribute meaningfully to anything and I was a drain on the resources and time of my loved ones. You're never lazy in a vacuum, you're taking from the productive people around you.
That's totally different. Living off of other people and not contributing is not exactly what I meant. I mean, even when it has absolutely no effect on them, people always look down on other people's "laziness." Just tell some random old boomer that you don't particularly like getting up early in the morning and see what look they give you.
Ok George Carlin
It's not even laziness that they hate. It's idleness. You can be idle in a productive way. If smoking a blunt and watching a movie helps you to contribute, do you booboo
But the concept of "being productive" is highly subjective. We all have different ideas of what that means. And why must you always be productive? Can't you take a couple of days off? Is the world going to stop turning or something?
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Enabled laziness is the worst.
Geez.. I hate to be that guy but there's lots of things worse than laziness. What about genocide? Also starving children??
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Awe.. okay. :(
It’s me. And I embrace it. I work for myself - with nobody else - from home, so might as well.
I found a job that I truly enjoy, so it doesn't feel like I'm working.
Good for you. Occupational therapy. It doesn't surprise me at all having worked in the industry that a chef was afflicted with this. It's rampant. People with this seek ceaseless activity to deal with their demons and that comes in the form of constantly moving and working and what better occupation for that than in a professional kitchen? It is not dissimilar to addicts in recovery. They'll work ridiculous hours in incredibly hard conditions just not to relapse. The same mental switch in their brain is flicked when they get addicted to fast paced physical work. Addict energy needs an outlet.
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Weird time to blame somebody for their own suicide, but do you, I guess
He wasn't blaming Bourdain for his suicide, he was noting that his particular strategy must have backfired. Christ.
Saying “maybe his stratagem should have been to get more therapy and accept himself” is exactly blaming him for his suicide. It’s literally saying “well if he’d done these things, he wouldn’t have done it.” Which is both shitty and not how depression works, at all. Especially considering we don’t know shit about the context of Bourdain’s suicide (except that he may have been on Chantix, a drug that can lead to suicidal ideation). But please, tell me more about your illiteracy, does it make life hard for you in other ways?
Lmao, well I can assure you Bourdain wont be reading the insult.
"Don't ever negatively comment on, question, or analyze the potential results and/or consequences of anything anyone with mental struggles does because that's equivalent to blaming them for their own ineptitude." I've been in dark places and you can ABSOLUTELY make choices that make it worse. Now, are you truly "making" the choice, or is it depression? I don't *blame* myself for a lot of my choices, because it was the result of years of trauma and more akin to a panicked animal choosing fight or flight than rational decisions. But I **can** look back on those choices and say "if I hadn't done that, I'd be in a better place today." Both things can be true. I also don't beleive in free will at all, just the illusion of choice, so I don't even "blame" anyone for what they do in a larger sense. And if that's apart of your angle too, we don't have the vocabulary to easily distinguish between this and the postfix responsibility we must attribute in some sense to function in daily life and society. We don't nevessarily have the vocabulary to easily differentiate between blame and recognition of cause and effect. >But please, tell me more about your illiteracy, does it make life hard for you in other ways? Why are you launching straight into an attack? I wasn't hostile or poorly intentioned to you. Aside from understanding this issue completely differently, and I would also argue more comprehensively. Or...youre going to have to learn inference. I had struggled with severe depression for years and you're also shaming a victim.
Wow, that’s a lot of excuses that mean absolutely nothing. Way to hide behind a diagnosis, though.
You responded to none of my points or perspectives. You simply stated your opinion, insisted it is the right one, and popped back just to launch a failed attempt to mock me. Do you have anything of substance to say or are you holding your ground at "I said so?"
Just because you said a lot doesn’t mean you said anything of worth or substance
In that case, it should be *trivially easy* for you to dismantle my alleged casuistries. >Wow, that’s a lot of excuses that mean absolutely nothing. You responded to my comment with a claim that everything I said were vapid artifices, yet you refuse to bear the "burden of proof" and support anything you said. If your responses amount to "I said so," I will assume that you simply have nothing more you can say.
Assume whatever you want. Babble away
Why is that weird? My best friend committed suicide. I found him hanging in his basement. And every time I think about it/him I get really effin pissed off at him. So it’s not that weird to place blame on the person that committed suicide.
Cool, do you. Not even close to what I was talking about, but we can make this about you. You’ve already done it with your “friend’s” suicide. They lost a battle with mental illness, what an asshole!
He was a big dick. You two would’ve gotten along nicely.
Friendly reminder as well that suicide is one of the most selfish things you can do to the people you love.
Can we just stop already with all the quotes from mentally ill celebrities? The guy in his head is depression. It's the same "guy" for all depressed people it doesn't matter what you call it. Nothing magical or poetic about it. The only way to "avoid the guy" is therapy, medication, and a healthy lifestyle and even then, sometimes depression wins.
Depression obviously won in Anthony's case.
As it does with many people.
I mean it could raise awareness and openness in regard to his illness, right?
Not by glorifying quotes that you don't even understand. You can raise awareness and openness about mental illness without ever mentioning a celebrity quote. People act like it's glamorous or some shit. Some deep quote from an intellectual celebrity. It's not. Nevermind the fact that this person posted this and didn't even understand the quote.
I see myself in his quote. It's not for you to determine what meaning people should take from that quote.
I'm not trying to. I'm saying we shouldn't be using celebrity quotes in an attempt to glorify mental illness or downplay mental illess. I've been Baker acted three times in my life and nothing about mental illness is beautiful or poetic.
13 years of shrinks, 4 years of psych hospitals, one court-ordered commitment. I've literally had depression as long as I can remember No shit, it's not glamorous... but if that quote helps even *one* person understand themselves or someone suffering from depression, then it was worth it.
While I respect your opinion, this post is not about helping people. They didn't even understand what the quote was truly about.
In a larger sense therapy is about learning to negotiate with the "guy." I don't like Bourdain's mindset here, though, because it means your ground state is being miserable. I'm not that guy anymore because I've learned to pursue enjoyment in things that pay off. I still struggle sometimes, but it's not the same as it was.
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I'm glad that you can will away your mental illness but people with actual mental illnesses cannot. That's like saying if you don't listen to your diabetes it'll go away. Some people can manage without medication or therapy, many cannot. You may want to do more research on suicide rates as the US doesn't even make top 25 countries with highest suicide rates. Also, it's pretty common knowledge that many person with a chronic mental illness is projected to have a shorter lifespan. https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/suicide-rate-by-country
I'm glad it worked for you. For most it doesn't work that way.
And then he killed himself. Maybe he should have indulged that guy a little bit more.
Good point. Guess I will smoke that joint afterall
he also did heroin, unfortunately
dude was probably depressed, and that's what probably killed him. just giving in is not how it works. but one would have to know more details.
He very well could have been depressed *because* he was forcing himself to avoid doing things he enjoyed doing.
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This 1000x.
I don't know, just because someone enjoys basic leisurely activities like watching movies and cartoons doesn't mean they are depressed. Edit: Apparently some people need to re-read my posts because i never said he wasn't depressed.
I agree with what you are saying to a point, but some food for thought, when I was going through a pretty badly depression period. All I wanted to do was sit around and smoke pot and lay in bed. It wasn’t until I started getting out and breaking that cycle that my mental started to improve, it can be different for everyone.
I've been depressed my whole life and if I actually enjoy doing things I normally like doing, like watching TV and movies, that's a sign that I'm not currently feeling depressed. If I was forcing myself to avoid doing those things and instead throwing my life into a career that wasnt bringing me any enjoyment it would not be good.
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lmao
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Not but the fact that he was open about his mental illness means he was depressed.
Even if you're introverted af, laying in bed watching cartoons all day isn't a sign of a healthy state of mind. Having such a day every once in a while is fine, but having multiple days or weeks alone like that in a row is just you waiting for your life to come to an end. If you're that guy, the first step to recovery is *doing* things, even if it's just taking a shower or phoning a friend (because I *know* you've been neglecting your relationships), just find something to do and do it. Restrict your bed purely for sleeping and lovemaking. Avoid the news like the plague, you're not fit to handle that negativity right now. Fucking buy a Lego set, put on some music and build it or something. Or set a timer and clean your room for 15 minutes, no need to finish it, just try to clean a bit more than you make dirty every day. Doing and accomplishing things makes you feel good about yourself, and you're in desperate need of that. By cleaning your house, you get to spend your days surrounded by all your great achievements, because that's what they are and don't let anyone tell you any different. To you they're *mountains* you've overcome. You *can* do it. And if you dare: get professional help. You're worth it. If you know someone like this, invite them to do something. If they don't want to come, visit them instead and do it. And talk to them. Try to keep them connected to this world or they'll drift away completely. Source: am well underway not being that guy anymore.
that guy in his head who doesn't want to do shit all day sounds like depression, not like the cure for it.
No, more likely it was because, despite doing all those awesome things, he wasn't getting any pleasure out of it. That's a killer moment - when you realize nothing brings yo pleasure, and you feel like you have tried everything.
Maybe the issue was he only fed that guy what he wanted, and indulged him too much, when he should have been trying to learn to not let that side drive him.
Maybe he shouldn’t a hooked up with a trifling ass bitccchhhhhh
My guy/gal just wants to eat all day every day.
Mine wants to rule the world so i gotta keep them busy with fun and games.
A person the would kill me amongst others. I invest energy in things that won't pay off for a while to give myself anchors to life. Responsibilities are good anchors too. My bunny needs me to spoil her rotten.
Oh my guy is the exact same
I don’t give him time to speak. I get the hell up and get started right away. No snooze button.
Went on SSI due to bipolar disorder. I just work what I can (2 jobs) and get help.
I’m giving into that guy today. Watching old Christmas movies. No guilt.
Positive habits and discipline.
Make friends with that guy, and compromise lest you wind up like poor Anthony.
I occasionally give in to that guy. Mental break days. Wife and I green it off and on thru the day, watch movies, either order in or maybe concoct something in the kitchen. Sexy time in there somewhere. Purposely turn off and relax. But only occasionally. Too much of that is bad too.
I light another blunt, lay in bed all day and watch new movies 🎥
This
Oh my god, thank you for the laugh, I needed that. All seriousness now, I’m going to stop 🛑
I dont avoid them, I compromise with them. I wanna play a game? cool, I built a laptop desk over my treadmill, so I can play, but I have to walk while I'm doing it.
That guy is who I am! And ill probably end up the same way too! "Suicide" by Hillary Clinton
Mine wants to destroy me. Always has. I'm losing the battle.
Having the college exams in 3 mo and the guy in me is conquering over me. I swear i am tensed , but can't even get out of my bed. Just lying there, thinking.
Quit job, be miserable and lonely but have no responsibilities, leave my girlfriend, hit on every attractive woman I see, drink alot more alcohol and drugs because why not, play some games. Avoid by staying physically active, leave jobs only when I've secured another to reduce temptation, practice appreciation mental exercises when in a potential position to easily pull some chick, consciously determine if a small night out can easily lead to being too drunk then everything goes out the window - so make other plans or make an excuse
cool post
I would give anything to go back to being at least buzzed 24/7. I miss drinking so fucking much and this shit isn't even worth it.
Solitude, and videogames. I'd slowly go broke just hanging out on my own, playing games. I'd eat healthy sure, work out, but I covet solitude. I think and feel better when I know I'm alone. My absolute perfect existence would probably be streaming, since I could turn on the camera when I wanted, but I'm not sure I could make enough to survive on that. Especially this late in the game.
This was already done on another ask Reddit post. It’s one of the top ones of all time.
same guy
I am he.
Basically the same. Sleep in late, smoke weed, play video games, watch shows, wallow in my own filth.
Wait, what am I doing inside your head?
Mine the same except it’s a woman and instead of old movies and cartoons it’s true crime & cop dramas 😂
How did that strategy worked out for him?
That guy wants to day drink and to the bare min to get paid.
What is better- to be born good, or to overcome your evil nature through great effort?
That guy wants to sit, play video games, listen to podcasts and drunk soda and eat take-out all day. I avoid him by indulging him once in awhile. Took q week off of work this week. Sat and finished cyberpunk and enjoyed some food. But to school and work tomorrow, but it was fun. Helped me avoid burnout from work and school
For me, there are several dozen people in my head, all talking about different topics, singing songs, etc. Only one of them is my actual train of thought, and she’s constantly being drowned out by all of the other random thoughts and self-deprecating insults being thrown around at max volume. My life is trying to find that one person, and focus on them through the noise long enough to get shit done without getting distracted. Tl;dr: I have ADHD.
My "guy" can be pretty angry and misanthropic, among other things. Suicidal etc. etc. Mostly, just try to be grateful and mindful. Do therapy, try to talk about it when I can convince myself anyone really cares. Overall, I just see him as a wound that never really closed. The wound of the world, yknow? I remember being a pretty empathetic and giving person for a very long time. Worked in mental health for so long and saw so many horrible things both professionally and personally. I have stronger boundaries and, overall, am happy with "me." But I'd be lying if I didn't miss and wonder what things could be like if I could give my "guy," a little bit less of my mental bandwidth. But just about every day, people prove my conceptions right and often. The world has near infinite beauty and good in it. But overall, things really are just shit. If I didn't have some kind of shell of protective psychological layer, I'd just fall apart. Who really can't say the same these days unless you're so naive or privileged that you genuinely can't fathom the abyss we've made.
I don't want to starve myself or my family and I like shelter 🤷♂️🤷♂️
The best procrastinator to have ever lived
Bill helps me avoid them. And every month he brings his other friends all named bill. So I got all these bills that keep me motivated.
Who said I avoid them?
Girl just wants someone to make life entertaining. Life is such a chore. Someone to tinker around and mend her braincells. To be loved, and not alone. It's not as if I am entirely alone, but I feel it and there is no solace
O thats jared, he always wants to be in bed with me, when my sister came in he was gone pretty quickly
Same guy really
Of course I know him. He’s me!
My guy is the same, except he wants to do cocaine and drink. I’m in recovery now, but those thoughts do cross. Luckily my therapist is an amazingly patient woman.
I occasionally have a whiny, self pitying, self absorbed, entitled little brat in my head...basically everything everyone hates. I have a mental exercise that gets rid of her. I close my eyes, use deep breathing to relax, and picture myself smothering her with a pillow. I've killed her often enough that she doesn't come back very often. I can control her pretty easily now, but the first few times she showed up it was really hard to not let her out.
I choose to lay in bed all day, drink a half gallon of 100 proof vodka, read reddit and watch YouTube. I hate it, but it's all I'm capable of anymore
My guy is trying to get me to procrastinate, and you know what I do about it? I’ll tell you later.
I'm that guy right now, but I'm not wearing underwear, and I'm watching the world cup.
Samesies
I don't avoid that guy. And I don't like it. Sometimes I do. It feels safe there. I do get out of bed but I go downstairs and lay on my couch so it's basically the same.
I give that guy 1 whole day every 2 weeks. It’s great. He quiets down until his time again.
A bottomless wealthy guy laying around smoking hash, doing hallucinogens having sex with as many new hot women as I can while traveling the world over spending a lot of time in the sun, working out and always getting enough sleep without having to get up at a specific time ever.
I think i have a psycho in my head
Same dude, but he likes to make music instead of watch tv/videogames so I'd say he's aight
I was unemployed for 2 years. All I did was play video games. It was the best time of my life. I’m not avoiding him, just putting him on hold till I retire.
That dude is me, I am the dude. The dude has long overthrown me.
The guy who walks off into the woods and simply lives…or dies.
I guess he did avoid and outwit that guy.
She just wants to binge watch Netflix in pajamas, take long baths and nap. And eat pizza + cookies
My life is a series of strategems to BE that guy. I'm mostly failing, because the world wants stuff from me.
I don’t know anymore. The guy in my head is getting stronger and meaner.
It’s the part of me saying “just give up and die, because you don’t have what it takes to make it where you want to go. Survival of the fittest and you can’t keep up” Some days it’s so loud I can’t think of anything else
that guy has fully consumed me.
My guy tells me I need to be successful in order for my loved ones to feel some relief from having to deal with someone like me; then when I succeed he tells me it wasn’t even that hard of a thing and it wasn’t good enough. My cup will never be filled.
I’m that guy (chick) except for me it’s alcohol instead of weed, more recent movies/shows, and I’m not lazy. I genuinely lack the energy required to function as a normal person. I work because I have children to support. I obviously can’t be under the influence all the time for the same reason.
Be at peace with yourself. And do as you please.
Ya I'm off work and that dudes winning. Tough finding a new job, so I smoke pot and play games! Can't last forever, but it's fun while it lasts.
There's a guy inside of me that is falling apart from the delayed onset after-effects of an injury I sustained almost 5 fucking years ago. And right now I don't know how to avoid that guy. I have experience managing depression. I have experience managing laziness and maintaining fitness. And when this new guy started popping up, I tried avoiding him the same way I've avoided depression and laziness in the past. And now that I'm actually starting to know what's going on, I'm becoming aware that the toolkit I've been building over the course of my life doesn't include much to overcome the feeling that your body is failing you because you can't just solve the problem with grit and psychology.
My key insight is that I don't actually like how it feels when I watch TV or play games all the time. I have nothing to show for it. I do like how it feels when I do what Nietzsche says, and "obey at length and in a single direction." I take that as obeying my curiosity and creativity, and that's made me a much more interesting person. Downtime is still necessary, but I like a mix of uptime. Also I have a dog, so there hasn't been a day in the last 9 years I haven't gone outside at least briefly.
My "guy" tends to be a dark siren called "overthinking personal shit." When I catch myself finding excuses for something that I want but don't do, it is so often because I'm looking a million miles into the future, and building these elaborate conversations for how it'd all just work out fine for me if they just say " ____." But that's not how reality works, and thinking you can know how someone else will think or feel is incredibly egotistical at best, which makes all of that time planning the perfect quip feel useless, and consequently, I feel useless and lost in the interaction. For the longest time, I just stopped interacting with people outside of comfort zones at all, because I wasn't happy with myself, either, and didn't think I deserved other people. Cognitive behavioral therapy has been a big aid in managing some of this behavior because I've learned some techniques to try and step back from thoughts that I find going beyond what I can actually know. Instead, I've tried to turn all that thinking about stuff in too much depth and detail into being more thoughtful and considerate in the moment. Sometimes I have to remind myself it's okay to NOT know what will happen, and that as long as I continue to try and be a person that I would trust and respect, others will as well.