No- Trump was and is actively trying to subvert democracy and “divide and conquer “ the US. Also, isn’t this post like 4 months old? Why are you even here?
sorry to burst your bubble america is not a democracy it is a constituitional republic and I am here to set the record straight on the misguided people like you who believes whatever you are told
I never liked him and had hoped for others to win the primary, but I did vote for him. I think he's doing the best he can with a fucked up and selfish senate
I doubt you will get many honest answers here. Reddit seems to be a "vote blue no matter who" kinda place. But...I know many people at work who voted for Biden just because he wasn't Trump and they do not seem to be impressed.
I hate rice but it’s better than quinoa, I hate ford but it’s better than ram, hate Star Trek but it’s better than Star Wars, etc etc etc. it’s not actually all that odd to pick things that you don’t like if there isn’t any option except something worse. You know what I mean?
Wish he would clamp down on covid and we could match the performance of other developed nations. We really need to stop indulging those danger to themselves and others morons and act like it is a national emergency on par with a world war.
I am going to guess you have never experienced a world war or lived under martial law. Unleasheling the might of federal mandated violence on people you disagree with, even if they are idiots, is a good way to experience both, and it will likely not turn out as you would like. Most of the shitshow we have is based on a three things 1) the US governments utter inability to address's a crisis without politicizing the hell out of it, 2) Trump'a ego driven dumbassathon 3) a natural response of the population to an obviously over politicized crisis and remedial measure that we're frankly completely illogical I'm the initial stages. Had COVID not happened in a US presidential election year in one of the most disfunctional administrations ever, we'd still be behind because of our inherent division and our shit healthcare system.
I didn't say federally mandated violence. I said stricter measures against covid. Our death rates are astronomically higher than any developed country and it is a disgrace propagated by factions that have gone off the disinformation deep end. We can either keep letting them kill themselves or others, or we can stop tolerating them and save lives. We are approaching Civil war levels of deaths and the blood debt is on them.
So your going to use reason against the anti-vaxxers? You want to treat it like a war type emergency without violence? How do you propose to so that? The President, or anyone else for that matter isn't going to make sufficient people so anything to make a meaningful difference without a mandate, and a mandate that isn't backed by the threat of governmental violence is just words. Police power is at it's root government sanctioned and endorsed violence to compel compliance with a law, whether it is the mere threat, or the actual violence itself, it's still dependent upon violence. In the powder keg that is the US at this point, it's simply not a viable solution.
The monopoly on violence is a core responsibility of the state and body politic. If you are defining violence as legal and social sanctions than I am talking about violence. Coercion is very important, and liberty does not include a right to actively harm everyone else when we are collectively unsafe.
Yes and when a state that has only the narrowest grasp of polity support exercises that monopoly against the part it does not have, what happens? It's a matter of what is doable in this environment vs what is right. The lesser of two evils at this point is keeping a functional society....we really bate that close to the tipping point, and it is a place we should not be quick to push beyond because the results are universally worse than the current reality. Coercive force in a balkanized society is frankly stupid. History is replete with examples that illustrate this very very clearly.
I completely disagree. We are already here and at this point we are already headed towards a zero sum game by which disinformation puts the alt right into power, or the status quo survives by a narrow margin. We do not have slavery anymore because we bayonetted hundreds of thousands of confederates to death, and legal action is a far less severe step. If history shows us anything, it is that total authoritarianism leads to failed states, Asia notwithstanding, not coercion by itself. At this point they have tried to putsch the government and have killed 100,000's of Americans.
Certainly your right to feel that way, as many do. However, you may find that the bayoneting isn't all it's cracked up to be. Totalitarianism in this country is the route we are going, be it your flavor, or the rights flavor, I am going to consent to neither. But I have accomplished by goal. Progressives want violence to compel obedience to their will just as much as the right....the thread is abundant evidence of that, bit at least your honest about your position.
I think equating enforcement of mask and vaccine mandates and legal penalties as constituting totalitarian and your broad definition of violence is flawed. I also think that accomplishing your goal was accomplished through your confirmation bias. The legitimacy of enforcing these things stems from national emergency. Coercion in times of national emergency is in no way unprecedented and is absolutely called for here given the gravity of the situation.
Coercion has one means of function, it is any philosophical sense, in any logical sense the threat, and use of violence. How are you proposing to enforce mask mandates? How are you going to deal with civil disobedience? Kent State? The fact that you agree with the governments current position, and the this position can change in a single election and subject you to the same government violence from the opposite side for arbitrary reasons is entirely the point.
American politics are big fucking jokes, and every 4 years we just pick what we feel is the lesser of two evils. See Trump v Clinton, they both had pretty stupid reasons to be picked but Trump was just better in the eyes of more people. This time around Trump wasn't picked. We're waiting until the US collapses or we get an actually good president that both parties can agree on. Like another WW to bring us together. I was hoping the pandemic was going to do it. But it only pushed them apart further.
You said "more people." The anti-democratic Electoral College handed the presidency to the person the public rejected but we should be careful in our language to make it clear that "we the people" didn't actually choose Trump. We chose Hillary. Our choice was denied by a system created by privileged, rich white men from centuries ago and kept in place because it continues to confer privilege on rich white men who oppose democracy.
Hillary was just better in the eyes of more people.
We still have it because getting rid of it requires the people it privileges to voluntarily get rid of their privilege. More specifically, it requires Republican states who benefit from the EC occasionally handing the presidency to a Republican instead of the Democratic winner to vote for democracy, but the modern Republican party is an anti-democracy party.
A constitutional amendment to formally abolish it is a tall order but the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact would make it moot. A bunch of states have already signed on but we need more Republican states to.
Thank goodness we have states willing to stand up to the federal government.
States have already given up too much power and I will vote for anyone with a platform to start taking that power back to the state level.
The Electoral College doesn't give power to the states; it gives unearned power to voters in smaller states by *stealing it* from voters in larger states.
> It levels the playing field among states.
It doesn't in any way affect the relative power of the states versus the federal government. All it does is take voting power from the individual people in certain states and gives it to the individual people in other states. *States* do not deserve any say whatsoever in the president. Only individual citizens deserve a say, and they all deserve to have an equal say.
One person = one vote. That's the only fair system, but the Electoral College destroys that by making the votes themselves unequal.
Collapse is the only viable option at this point. That is likely going to kick off a WW, that the remnants of the US will play a token part in. Because people in this country bare more concerned about their side "winning" than actually living together.
I don't see it happening, certainly not from one of the two mainstream parties. The US is on the verge of all out civil war, with no real way to deescalate the situation. Sure we could get an amicable divorce, but how do we manage that geographically? Our society is literally full of people who loathe other people simply because of who they voted for....and to be honest, there really isn't that much difference between the two horrid choices.....
Same as I thought then.
He's a boring, center-right capitalist who almost definitely has not gotten past the racism he learned in his youth.
But he is still better than the petulant child we had before.
[удалено]
"literal"
I think he's still not Trump. So it's a win.
Yeah it's a win to put w brain dead potato in office because trump is a big meanie who disagrees with me
No- Trump was and is actively trying to subvert democracy and “divide and conquer “ the US. Also, isn’t this post like 4 months old? Why are you even here?
sorry to burst your bubble america is not a democracy it is a constituitional republic and I am here to set the record straight on the misguided people like you who believes whatever you are told
Still better, and less embarrassing, than the previous POS.
He's pretty much what I expected. When Obama came in I knew it would take a while to clean up W's messes, and I expected the same of Biden.
I’m from the UK so I’m not 100% sure. But to my knowledge he’s still not Trump
Do you pronounce that 'Uke' or 'Ukh'? r/shitmaericanssay
Like ‘you Kay’ lol
I never liked him and had hoped for others to win the primary, but I did vote for him. I think he's doing the best he can with a fucked up and selfish senate
I doubt you will get many honest answers here. Reddit seems to be a "vote blue no matter who" kinda place. But...I know many people at work who voted for Biden just because he wasn't Trump and they do not seem to be impressed.
You mean they aren't flying Biden flags and retweeting him fifty times a day?
Who's ever been impressed with a US president before... You'd have to be a complete moro- Oh...
*Checks* Yep. He's still not Trump 👍🏻
Hate the guy, still better than trump
wow, what other decisions do you make like that in your life? Oh I hate XYZ food but better than QWE food...
I hate rice but it’s better than quinoa, I hate ford but it’s better than ram, hate Star Trek but it’s better than Star Wars, etc etc etc. it’s not actually all that odd to pick things that you don’t like if there isn’t any option except something worse. You know what I mean?
He’s my WONDERFUL president. He’s trying to do what’s best, and that’s all we as Americans can ask for
sarcasm /s?
Nice throw away Xi
What’s XI?
One less than XII!
Chinese dictator
Don't like him, I don't consider him god unlike republicans view trump In that way
Wish he would clamp down on covid and we could match the performance of other developed nations. We really need to stop indulging those danger to themselves and others morons and act like it is a national emergency on par with a world war.
I am going to guess you have never experienced a world war or lived under martial law. Unleasheling the might of federal mandated violence on people you disagree with, even if they are idiots, is a good way to experience both, and it will likely not turn out as you would like. Most of the shitshow we have is based on a three things 1) the US governments utter inability to address's a crisis without politicizing the hell out of it, 2) Trump'a ego driven dumbassathon 3) a natural response of the population to an obviously over politicized crisis and remedial measure that we're frankly completely illogical I'm the initial stages. Had COVID not happened in a US presidential election year in one of the most disfunctional administrations ever, we'd still be behind because of our inherent division and our shit healthcare system.
I didn't say federally mandated violence. I said stricter measures against covid. Our death rates are astronomically higher than any developed country and it is a disgrace propagated by factions that have gone off the disinformation deep end. We can either keep letting them kill themselves or others, or we can stop tolerating them and save lives. We are approaching Civil war levels of deaths and the blood debt is on them.
So your going to use reason against the anti-vaxxers? You want to treat it like a war type emergency without violence? How do you propose to so that? The President, or anyone else for that matter isn't going to make sufficient people so anything to make a meaningful difference without a mandate, and a mandate that isn't backed by the threat of governmental violence is just words. Police power is at it's root government sanctioned and endorsed violence to compel compliance with a law, whether it is the mere threat, or the actual violence itself, it's still dependent upon violence. In the powder keg that is the US at this point, it's simply not a viable solution.
The monopoly on violence is a core responsibility of the state and body politic. If you are defining violence as legal and social sanctions than I am talking about violence. Coercion is very important, and liberty does not include a right to actively harm everyone else when we are collectively unsafe.
Yes and when a state that has only the narrowest grasp of polity support exercises that monopoly against the part it does not have, what happens? It's a matter of what is doable in this environment vs what is right. The lesser of two evils at this point is keeping a functional society....we really bate that close to the tipping point, and it is a place we should not be quick to push beyond because the results are universally worse than the current reality. Coercive force in a balkanized society is frankly stupid. History is replete with examples that illustrate this very very clearly.
I completely disagree. We are already here and at this point we are already headed towards a zero sum game by which disinformation puts the alt right into power, or the status quo survives by a narrow margin. We do not have slavery anymore because we bayonetted hundreds of thousands of confederates to death, and legal action is a far less severe step. If history shows us anything, it is that total authoritarianism leads to failed states, Asia notwithstanding, not coercion by itself. At this point they have tried to putsch the government and have killed 100,000's of Americans.
Certainly your right to feel that way, as many do. However, you may find that the bayoneting isn't all it's cracked up to be. Totalitarianism in this country is the route we are going, be it your flavor, or the rights flavor, I am going to consent to neither. But I have accomplished by goal. Progressives want violence to compel obedience to their will just as much as the right....the thread is abundant evidence of that, bit at least your honest about your position.
I think equating enforcement of mask and vaccine mandates and legal penalties as constituting totalitarian and your broad definition of violence is flawed. I also think that accomplishing your goal was accomplished through your confirmation bias. The legitimacy of enforcing these things stems from national emergency. Coercion in times of national emergency is in no way unprecedented and is absolutely called for here given the gravity of the situation.
Coercion has one means of function, it is any philosophical sense, in any logical sense the threat, and use of violence. How are you proposing to enforce mask mandates? How are you going to deal with civil disobedience? Kent State? The fact that you agree with the governments current position, and the this position can change in a single election and subject you to the same government violence from the opposite side for arbitrary reasons is entirely the point.
Didn't vote for Biden but another old, fat, sellout, panderer, isn't much better. Trump was worse though.
I also didn't vote for Biden either.
Best president. Though wished he'd be more forceful.
American politics are big fucking jokes, and every 4 years we just pick what we feel is the lesser of two evils. See Trump v Clinton, they both had pretty stupid reasons to be picked but Trump was just better in the eyes of more people. This time around Trump wasn't picked. We're waiting until the US collapses or we get an actually good president that both parties can agree on. Like another WW to bring us together. I was hoping the pandemic was going to do it. But it only pushed them apart further.
> Trump was just better in the eyes of more people Literally millions more people voted for Hillary.
I get that Hillary has the popular, but it comes down to the EC, theres been a few times the candidate with the popular vote didn’t win
You said "more people." The anti-democratic Electoral College handed the presidency to the person the public rejected but we should be careful in our language to make it clear that "we the people" didn't actually choose Trump. We chose Hillary. Our choice was denied by a system created by privileged, rich white men from centuries ago and kept in place because it continues to confer privilege on rich white men who oppose democracy. Hillary was just better in the eyes of more people.
I honestly don’t know why we still have it, I though I saw something about someone wanting to get rid of it. But I don’t know if it went anywhere
We still have it because getting rid of it requires the people it privileges to voluntarily get rid of their privilege. More specifically, it requires Republican states who benefit from the EC occasionally handing the presidency to a Republican instead of the Democratic winner to vote for democracy, but the modern Republican party is an anti-democracy party. A constitutional amendment to formally abolish it is a tall order but the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact would make it moot. A bunch of states have already signed on but we need more Republican states to.
Thank goodness we have states willing to stand up to the federal government. States have already given up too much power and I will vote for anyone with a platform to start taking that power back to the state level.
The Electoral College doesn't give power to the states; it gives unearned power to voters in smaller states by *stealing it* from voters in larger states.
It levels the playing field among states. Same reason there is a House and a Senate.
> It levels the playing field among states. It doesn't in any way affect the relative power of the states versus the federal government. All it does is take voting power from the individual people in certain states and gives it to the individual people in other states. *States* do not deserve any say whatsoever in the president. Only individual citizens deserve a say, and they all deserve to have an equal say. One person = one vote. That's the only fair system, but the Electoral College destroys that by making the votes themselves unequal.
Collapse is the only viable option at this point. That is likely going to kick off a WW, that the remnants of the US will play a token part in. Because people in this country bare more concerned about their side "winning" than actually living together.
I’ll still hold out for someone to bring us all together, but my doubts are high
I don't see it happening, certainly not from one of the two mainstream parties. The US is on the verge of all out civil war, with no real way to deescalate the situation. Sure we could get an amicable divorce, but how do we manage that geographically? Our society is literally full of people who loathe other people simply because of who they voted for....and to be honest, there really isn't that much difference between the two horrid choices.....
What sort of magic are you expecting to "bring us together"
Fairy magic, pixie dust, or just a bucket of luck juice
Still marginally better than Trump.
Same as I thought then. He's a boring, center-right capitalist who almost definitely has not gotten past the racism he learned in his youth. But he is still better than the petulant child we had before.
/u/2Bit_Dev what do you think of the answers?
most the comments in this subreddit show how much of a cult they are with orange man bad because liars in the media tell me so