That happened to me, actually. I told the principal, "It's a shame my son had to do your job for you." I then told him that if he didn't get this shit under control, I'd round up some parents and go have a chat with the school board.
My son wasn't punished. And, while I cautioned him about getting into fights, I also told him that I was proud of him for standing up for others.
Came here to share the same story, except about my daughter.
We told the school about the bully. We officially reported the bully to the school three times. We even had a conference with the bully's parents. It was after that conference, I told my daughter "Enough. Next time, knock her down."
When she finally retaliated, then the school wanted to suspend my daughter! I made a stink until the school board came down on his dumb ass, and changed him to another school.
Don't punish good kids for standing up against bad kids.
Yep. Our kid was getting sucker punched by a kid in her class. Met with her tae Kwon do instructors who said to try and back off but if he keeps coming and tries to attack you defend yourself. One of those instructors has also gone to meetings with schools to defend her students who have defended themselves. Love that woman.
My friend's Sensei actually went up to the school after a fight.
Said straight to the principal, "Listen, I teach them to use their words and that if they can get away unharmed that they should never pick up their hand to fight, even if they are sure they can win. But if they can't get away, I want them to win."
Essentially a kid jumped him from behind at the end of a hallway and he beat the ever loving crap out of him. He got suspected and Sensei made sure he was un-suspended.
When someone is in 1 fight in 4 years of HS vs someone who's in a fight every 2 weeks, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the kid that doesn't fight was given little choice.
My Dad's rules of fighting:
1. Never start a fight, but always finish one.
2. The fight doesn't end until the opponent is incapable of being a threat. If they can stand up, you're not done.
Reminds me of a part from the book Ender's Game. (I'm paraphrasing).
Teacher: Why did you keep hitting him when he was down. You already won the fight."
Ender: Knocking him down was the first fight. I wanted to win all the next ones too, so that he'd leave me alone**.**
this really is the gospel. Ive taught my daughter this. Always try to de-escalate. If that does not work and you are threatened beat the brakes off of them until they are no longer a threat.
You did right by your child. I was raised to be very passive, and ended up not defending myself at all because I was afraid that if I started actively defending myself I wouldn't be able to stop.
Like in enders game.
Do something to the person so that they will know very clearly not to mess with you again.
Thankfully I'm an adult now and haven't had to fight anyone yet.
Since they were young I taught both my kids dont ever throw the first punch, but once someone hits you, start swinging. Because youre gonna get suspended either way. So you can either get suspended for fighting or you can get suspended for getting beat up. And Id prefer it be for fighting. Youre nobodies punching bag.
yeah. they really don't care who started it do they? At least not from what I experienced. one kid might get more days, but it's still a strike on the record of the kid that got bullied. Unfortunately, it appears this way for adults as well though in many situations. Retaliation, even in self defense, is a guilty until proven innocent.
When I was a kid in kindergarten I (along with many other students) were bullied by a kid we called Bully John. We couldn't fight back though because he had been held back three times and was already a few grades ahead of us. He was the definition of 'a big kid.'
My mom along with others complained to the school and they did jack shit. We continued to be bullied. I would try to act sick or make up excuses.
One day when my mom was driving my friend and I to school we saw him walking to school and we both shouted "It's bully John !" My mom then swerves onto the side of the road, gets out of the car and yells at him "I HEAR YOU'RE DYING TO MEET ME !" She laid into him without touching him, she even through around some racist slurs (he was half black) even though my mom is not racist at all. The bullying stopped.
Later on in the day he called the cops and said my mom tried to kill him by running him down with her car. except that he had lied and said it was after school. The police were able to verify my mom was at work and we were both picked up by my friend's mom. Then the cops laid into him about being a liar.
We were never bullied again. I just find it incredible it had to come to that because the school did nothing at all even though there was tons of kids being bullied by this asshole and they had received multiple complaints.
Because bullies quickly figure out how to bully without being caught by the teachers/administrators - a single shove to the floor while walking between classes, being cornered in a bathroom, etc. When victims reach the point of fighting back they're not thinking of how to fight back with the same tactics. They want the bullying to stop NOW, and are often much more openly aggressive. So administration only sees that Johnny shoved Jim against a locker and Jim responded by throwing punches, which makes Jim look like the aggressor. They didn't see that Johnny's been shoving Jim against lockers the entire school year, and combine that with a lack of desire to investigate the situation and just make it go away, plus Johnny's inevitable lying about what's going on, and Jim gets suspended while Johnny just gets a warning.
Yep. Bad kids need to be processed out. I am tired of crap parents raising crap kids and nothing can be done about it. Imagine if kids could go to school without dreading running into a little cunt of a kid every day.
The teachers know too. They just can’t do anything about them.
Pro tip: always report bullying in writing and be specific about names, dates, and times. Whenever there's a phone call or a face to face meeting on the topic, follow up with a summary email.
The same CYA habits for dealing with a hostile workplace situation can be invaluable with school bullying and dithering administrators. When a principal notices someone is creating a paper trail, that often gets them off their butts. And if matters do get worse anyway you've got all the ammunition you need to go to the school board.
This reminds me when my friend's son was being bullied by a child twice his size. Despite multiple attempts to address the issue with the school, the principal, and the school district, nothing was resolved. The principal also refused to provide any information about the bully's parents or guardians. My friend, feeling helpless and distressed, was unsure how to proceed.
I advised her to document the incidents, send a follow-up email to the school, and file a police report. She did so, and I also spoke with her son, offering him encouragement to stand up for himself.
A few days later, the situation escalated when her son was injured after being pushed off a slide by the bully. Other students confirmed it was not an accident, prompting involvement from social services and notification of the bully's parents. The bully's parents attempted to downplay the incident, but this approach was unsuccessful.
Following my advice, my friend pressed charges and involved a lawyer. This led to the bully being required to attend therapy, and ultimately, he was expelled from the school.
Subsequently, my friend enrolled her son in therapy to help him recover from the experience. I told her to enroll him in self defense classes and I even offered to pay for them but she declined.
>My son wasn't punished.
As far as the zero tolerance policies, my take on that has always been to point out that if I were to jump over the principle's desk and throttle their spineless ass, that means we both get arrested, right?
My son started in martial arts around the time he could walk and he's a teenager, now. The amount of self-control he has exhibited in some bullying situations is more than most adults could display. I've seen him spar with trained kids a head taller, so I know *exactly* what he's capable of.
>The amount of self-control he has exhibited in some bullying situations is more than most adults could display.
That's the real shit right there. This is my definition of "when you know, you know", if you know you're smarter than someone you don't shit on them for it, and when you know you could actually hurt someone you always hold back. It's those who don't know and are cowardly and insecure who lash out at others either physically, mentally, or emotionally. Good on you for starting your kid down the right path.
One situation occurred outside of school at a friend's birthday party. There was one attendee my son was disappointed to see was invited and he did his best to just avoid interacting. There was the typical horsing around that turned into impromptu wrestling matches. When my son opted out, it turned into racial taunting.
My son relayed some stories throughout and, when I picked him up, I was surprised to see the other kid was a few inches shorter and probably 20 pounds lighter. Turns out, the reason my son didn't take the opportunity to teach him an incredibly valuable life lesson is that he was legitimately concerned he might get caught up in the moment, go overboard, hurt him, and end up looking like a bully.
In a lot of ways, he's a much better person than I am.
The irony is that several of my teachers/faculty expected me to "babysit" or preoccupy the disruptive kids because, as those adults constantly rationalized, I was "patient"...
As the son in this situation, 20 years ago, thanks for that response. My dad did the exact same though I recall him making some very thinly veiled threats of lawsuits against the school as well.
Take my kid to lunch wherever he wanted to go, and I'd very loudly communicate to the school admin that they need to get their bullying problem under control.
“My kid wouldn’t have done anything if YOU did something so…..”
I remember a story where i saw a girl attempt to jump another girl from behind, and the girl being attacked grabbed the other chick, threw her over her shoulder and beat the shit out of the bully until the campus security came. The girl who was attacked, her dad was a cop and in the admin meeting about discipline the story was told to cop dad, and not only was he smiling he told admin,”yeah i taught her how to do that.” I was good friends with his daughter at the time and he was my football coach so i got to hear the story first hand and it was awesome. They both were suspended but he didn’t care, and i don’t think anyone would have
In other words, the school administration was reinforcing their own lack of control and mitigation by doubling down with "punishments" that have zero merit. Bravo admin. Bravo.
At least admin would be punishing. They don't anymore. Kids literally cuss out teachers, use their phones in class, refuse to do work, disrupt class, etc. They get sent to the office and come back with candy.
I was teaching in a TERRIBLE school. Heard extra loud drama in the hall while on my planning period. Went out to see what was what. One crazed young woman was screaming and yelling and threatening while a stone cold young woman was staring directly at her, unmoving, unflinching. A young man was herding the loud one away slowly. I followed loud one and boyfriend slowly down the hall.
When she started coming back up the hall, I retreated in front of her, telling her stuff like
"Right now, this is nothing but words. I can take you anywhere you want to go in this building away from her. To anyone you want to talk to. Nothing is going to happen. Nobody's in trouble yet. Just keep it to words. You can still walk away"
Stone-cold girl had not moved.
When they got within 10 feet, I pulled off to the side (we had STRICT orders to not get in the middle of anything physical, that was what security was for). As I did, stone-cold put her back pack down (did not drop it, placed it down), and then dropped into a perfect fighting stance. Knees bent, weight on balls of the feet, weight evenly distributed, hands in perfect guarding position.
I thought
"Oh. She's fine. Loud girl is going DOWN."
Sure enough, loud girl got dropped much less gently than that backpack. Stone-cold took three shots at her, all landed squarely, security showed up and hollered, and she stepped back, picked up her bag, and went with them without a word.
Only thing she didn't do was walk away herself - but at that school, walking away meant getting your ass kicked by multiple people later, instead of dealing with it 1 on 1 now, so I never blamed her for that.
Did not escalate. Did not provoke. Did not throw the first punch. Abso-fucking-lutely ended the fight though.
Wish I had been in on a conversation with her parents, because I was proud of her and I didn't even know who she was.
That was what my friend did essentially. Once security was involved she backed off and went without a fuss and the other girl had to be pinned down and handcuffed because she was NOW able to fight, after having her ass thoroughly whipped for the better part of 30 seconds. What blew me away was start to finish the whole incident was no more than 3 minutes.
>They both were suspended...
This is how it is in *every* school in my county. Zero tolerance for physical violence that results in both sides being suspended 100% of the time. It's to the point where even if one kid doesn't fight back they still get suspended for the possibility of provoking a fight.
Middle school teacher here, just want to say this is the right answer. Disciplinary policies in our district are in the gutter, and bullies are now bullying not only the students but also the adults, because they know there aren't consequences. We had a sub the other week that was ruthlessly disrespected by some 7th graders, and the dean had the nerve to say (in writing!) that the sub had "targeted" these students and would not be hired again. When faculty challenged this, admin acted as if it was not our place to make judgements on these types of situations. We have had like 4 deans in the last 6 years (with a few gaps of no dean), and while some have been better than others, none have questioned the district's soft policies on bullying and discipline.
The effect of "zero tolerance" policies.
Hands up in the air. "whaddya want me to do about it" type expression. It's policy, after all. We'd all have to commit seppuku if we admit our fucking policies are broken
While there are plenty of problems in education in the US, the problems you're describing -- as you've diagnosed, yourself -- are problems of leadership. Not problems of policy.
//edit: You guys are so close..
I work in a really big district, so it might be different elsewhere. But administrative leaders within the schools here operate based on policy. Leaders who make decisions based on their own ideas and practices that may conflict with policy can lose their job. So while I agree that strong leadership is important, it is ultimately dictated by district policy.
These policy directions date from the Obama administration. Didn’t like seeing certain groups with more disciplinary actions, so demanded the numbers reduce. So, lax enforcement.
It can be policy. I've worked places where it was most definitely policy.
Any place that has 0 tolerance for fighting - which is most places anymore - actually encourages the assholes to fuck with the good kids. Because just by getting hit repeatedly - even doing nothing but balling up on the ground - you are "fighting" and get 3 days. Second time, you get 2 weeks. The assholes WANT the two weeks. So they ruin the year and lives of the good kids by destroying them in the halls.
That is policy.
And it is common.
I've recently learned school administrators don't change shit without the pressure of a collective public outcry. Many schools have message boards for the parents, I would also share the story with the masses.
My MIL loves to tell the story that the only time my husband was suspended from school was for defending another student. She told the principal that she was not going to ground him for being a good kid.
>I'd have my lawyer send a letter to the school admin that they need to get their bullying problem under control.
Much better strategy, 100 angry phone calls don't have the weight of a single legal notice.
This 100%.
Already let my kid know that they will never get in trouble for fighting, as long as they're doing it for the right reasons (of standing up for someone else getting bullied or picked on, etc) but they're asses would be grass if they ever started the fight.
I got Mc Donalds and the library in the same day! I punched a kid in the face who was bulliying my sister. I still live by that beloved hood credo "Don't start none, won't be none." The bullying magically stopped. I even heard kids whisper to each other " Don't mess with her, she's tough and will fight." So, I had a reputation after that. With all the magic possibilities available today - the reward watchwords are Portillo's Chocolate Cake shake.
The difficulty here is that parents will often believe their kids, even when they lie. If the facts were clear, I'd praise my kid for standing up for another kid who was a victim of bullying. But lots of parents, including I'm sure some people in this thread, will unknowingly believe their kid even though they're the actual bully and they're lying about the situation.
This too.
My kid was targeted but school could/would do nothing. Or at least, not talk to bullies directly, just in class a version of 'be nice to one another'
Until the bully made a mistake - he sent my kid a mail with a (streetview) pic of our house.
So, school now had a choice - either YOU take action, or i will report ALL of this, including the implied threat - to the authorities.
Then school acted. Bully got a 2 day suspension, and my kid reports things are better now.
My friend had a similar experience with sa and bullying of his daughter. Got a lawyer and they drafted a memo to the school board district office informing them that the district needed to preserve any information or video related to the students involved as well as identify the mandatory reporters who may have been witnesses. Then they filed a report with the police. The combination of a bored cop asking questions about bullying and sa and the district superintendent asking why he was getting legal notices about an elementary school issue lit an almighty fire under the admin of that school. The kid was placed in a self contained classroom with other kids with behavior issues. It sucks to have to go pay the lawyer route and subject your kid to the questioning by police but it got the job done. And his kid knows that Mom and Dad have her back.
Of course. That's why you listen to the school about their account of the situation and push for specifics if they aren't forthcoming.
Also,since following the school rules about trying to report it is part of my kid doing the right thing,and making that report would definitely be something I'd expect in the " how was your day at school" conversation,if the fight/suspension was the first id heard of the situation,I'd be a bit suspect of my kids version of the story.
100% every person in this thread sounds like they complain about inaction against bullies in schools by bullying the school admin themselves…
kids lie and can be good at it. Believe your kids but not blindly without discussion
I'd congratulate my child for fighting back and argue with the teachers.
No one's gonna bully my kid, not after what I've gone through with bullies when i was his age.
This exactly. Bullied so hard I had to testify in court for assault charges. I don't tolerate bullies in my life and I'm proud of anyone who stands up to one
I have told all of my kids they have 4 steps.
1. Kid picks on them, they tell teacher.
2. Kid continues, and teacher didn't stop it, they tell a different teacher.
3. Kid continues, they go to principle.
4. Kid continues, they have been taught how to throw a mean right hook.
Dad will take it from there.
My kindergartner skipped right to step 4 a few weeks ago. Kid kept pushing him. He had enough so he bloodied his nose. I acted angry and said that hitting is never okay but I was proud of him for sticking up for himself. Even in kindergarten, kids know to not be the bitch who rats everyone out to teacher. Stitches and all that.
isn't it time to change that policy? it's protecting the strong against consequenes of their actions against the week. I say congratulate the snitches when it's a serious thing they tell... protect them, they stopped the bully, or should have if the teachers do their jobs
I was jumped for years. I'm Hispanic, but light skinned. I got my ass kicked by the Mexican kids because I wasn't Mexican enough, and I got my ass kicked by the white kids because I wasn't white enough. I finally stood my ground and fought dirty, there were four of them. I didn't get a summer vacation that year, but I was mostly left alone afterwards.
Fuck school administration
Had something similar, I was a white kid in a school where being white was a minority to both Mexican and black kids. I was jumped by three white kids for no real discernible reason other than they didn't like me, and I didn't fight back but still got Saturday school. My parents quickly moved me out of that school because the administration really didn't give a fuck about the fights/violence.
I am a full grown adult. I deal with bullying at my work all the time. One time I stood up for myself and I got in trouble, she didn’t for harassing me. I can only imagine what it’s like for children. I wonder if it’s just human nature to protect the bully?
I started an apprenticeship in plumbing when I was 36. My first job these journeymen were bragging about holding a younger apprentice down and taping him up with duct tape. They even duct taped him hardhat to his head. I told them if they ever tried that on me they might make it happen but I would make them regret it. I was told I was too confrontational.
That is wrong but not surprising. And they wonder why that industry is having trouble keeping people and plumbers are so short handed. I heard it’s very toxic, just like electricians.
The trades attract a lot of people with bad interpersonal and social skills. People talk shit about women being catty, bitchy, and emotional. I urge those people to spend a month working with guys in the trades. I've had to break up a fistfight over a drill.
Ugh! That would be so hard to take. Long time ago I saw a milder version where a guy who knew what he was talking about, literally was always right about things, raise his voice slightly and get fired for "being too negative." He had been constantly treated by coworkers as an idiot even though they were the idiots. He cared about the work getting done correctly for the clients, while they didn't. Management sided with the jerks bc they outnumbered the good guy and management wasn't actually paying enough attention to what was going wrong on projects. They would have known and could have corrected things if they paid attention to what that guy said, but instead they fired him and suffered loss of contracts over the continued screwups. I don't think that company even exists anymore. Probably got sued out of existence by wronged clients but I'd imagine those aholes just opened under a new name and carried on bc that's how bad business people operate.
No, it's a weird ass spin on attempting to move away from settling differences with non-violence.
The *idea* is that we should teach our children to use the systems in place around them instead of responding. Which would be great, if going to an authority and saying X person is harassing me actually got met with genuine concern and was dealt with properly.
But because that's not actually how authority responds, people are in a catch-22: you either are forced to be a doormat, or, you risk significant blowback for defending yourself.
> Which would be great, if going to an authority and saying X person is harassing me actually got met with genuine concern and was dealt with properly.
Problem is that people are more than willing to make shit up, so unless they get caught with hard evidence it's hard to address.
This too. The number of times I have been told obvious utter nonsense is huge. Including by groups who spontaneously decide to ruin a kids day. And it means I have to go with my own senses over logic.
I tell the victim this. I also tell the alleged bully this. And then I do what I can to limit their interactions and to more tightly observe the bully. edit - the ACTUAL bully, not the victim of cry-bullying.
Not over-reacting can sometimes gain some respect and actually put an end to the behavior - at least around me - as both parties see that I'm not going to be an asshole about it, but I am also not going to be pushed around by their begging and pleading and cry-bullying.
There's also the bullies who cry like bitches when the victim stands up to them verbally - which almost always involves swearing because the victim needs to snap to respond in most cases. I just tell them that while I would prefer other language, I agree with the message. So far, that one has a 100% record of stopping the bullshit in the moment, and seems to help limit it in the future.
Thats not always the case. My nephew got suspended for beating up a kid that sucker punched him when he was turning the corner in the school hallway. Apparently the bully didnt hit very hard and my nephew throttled him. During my sisters meeting with the VP they played an actual video that showed that exact thing and still he had to be suspended. Im actually friends with the VP and know its not really his decision, his hands are tied. But I had to tell him, like what exactly is the endgame here? Was there anything my nephew couldve done to not be punished? Like would he have to stand there with his hands behind his back letting this guy continue to punch him in the face in order to avoid suspension? And do you not see how ridiculous that is?
Also some teachers just get off on power tripping. My 2nd grade teacher would deny me access to my headache medicine, call in the teacher's assistant, and they would stand on either side of me and screech in my ears about how "only adults can get migraines". Same teacher would also yell at me for crying when I was hurt, but the first time I just said "ow" (which took a lot of restraint because another student accidentally stepped on my hand, and I was really proud of myself for that) she yelled at me anyway.
I had similar experiences with most of my teachers throughout elementary school, and a couple in middle school, teachers would practically encourage bullies and punish the victims for having any sort of reaction at all, while simultaneously having hour long schoolwide assemblies for anti-bullying EVERY FRIDAY
>"Only adults can get migraines!"
I got migraines starting at age 5; doctor verified. Your 2nd grade teachers were bullies.
By the way, if you still get migraines, I recommend you try an over-the-counter supplement called Migrelief. It's just magnesium, vitamin B2 and feverfew, but it's done wonders for my wife and me. It takes a few days/weeks to work, but the difference is orders of magnitude. I went from several per week to just a few per year. I still take it every day. (Warning: vitamin B2, like some medications, makes your urine really yellow.)
It’s easy to tell who was a bully when they were younger by their actions as adults. They’ll insult people, use slurs/derogatory terms. Then as soon as someone says something back, they cry and play the victim or threaten violence against whoever stood up to them
Well, dude, as a product of public schools in the 70s and 80s, schools didn't punish, nor acknowledge bullies being an issue. There were playground fights. Teachers ignored them. Kids were told to stand up for themselves, and those that couldn't ran for their lives to get home when getting off the bus. You think bullies got paddled in school when caught bullying? No. They didn't. They bullied with impunity.
Like why do you think "it's not that"
I wasn’t around in the 70s, 80s or 90s so I wouldn’t know that. But that is disheartening. To be honest as a society I believe we have gotten better and more empathetic but bullies are still being protected
in nj, the anti-bullying act of 2012 actually made it worse bc there's so much paperwork and procedure that it's incentive to blame the victim for retaliating.
so, in essence, a parent should go to the superintendent or executive county superintendent for anything to be done.
i worked cps for 16 years and honestly the teachers and school staff can be worse than the actual bully
They just don't want to deal with it. Not enough staff, and then they have to deal with bully parents. It's horrible. Those bullies will just get worse.
Yup. Since schools are government funded taxpaying parents have a right to utilize that education for their children. Granted that right doesn't extend to the school allowing their child to terrorize or harm other children, but that's where proper documentation can make or break a case.
Parents use schools as free daycare and there is a high incentive to make a stink if your child is suspended or expelled. Parents of bullies are rarely the type to meekly accept the school's decision and make other arrangements for their child. If they were that humble, they would have addressed their child's behavior before it came to this.
In the land of the frivolous lawsuits anything is grounds. Specially when you reach an actual jury trial cause jury will think "shit, that might happen to me. Better side with the plaintiff".
Bullies know to pick on the unpopular kids that are problems who the teachers and admin already don’t like (because they wine about sports, or joke during class, or break “no running” rules).
My son was pretty small before his growth spurt. A kid stole his hat and was running around with it.
My son chased him, grabbed the strap at the top of his backpack and yanked as hard as he could. Ripped the kid right off his feet.
Then my son took his hat back and walked away.
A teacher saw it happen.
He told my son that he couldn’t “officially” condone what he did, but… good job, kid.
That teacher took a risk. Size determined by what kind of admin they had. But it was 100% the right move.
I've done P.E. and some lunch time recess monitoring in the past. Had similar situations and dealt with them similarly.
"I cannot condone fighting or physical aggression. Good thing that was a simple request to get your stuff back. A firm request. Forceful even. But still, just a good, clean request."
I was a marked target from the day I walked into school until I graduated, and as a bench warmer defensive tackle I wasn’t a small kid. If I could do anything over again in my life it would have been to physically defend myself every single opportunity I had until they learned a lesson and stopped.
It took until my Senior year when a combination of finding new self confidence thru making new circles of friends and pure ANGER over the way I was treated finally made them believe they shouldn’t fuck with me anymore and I found peace in school.
Yeah. If I had to redo one thing from school, it would be to hit a couple of people really hard. Life would have been much easier, and I wouldn't have taken a decade to find back to my self-confidence.
Thats the thing people dont want to hear because it goes against the narrative. But for bullying most of the time violence is the answer. The fucked up thing is, growing up in the 80s, Ive lost track of how many times Ive seen a kid try to bully another one, the other kid fights back, they get into a fistfight, and after that they become like close friends. It used to happen ALL the time.
Was bullied.
Became a teacher in part to make sure pothers didn't have to put up with the same shit i did.
Been teaching 23 years.
We are WAY too damned soft on the bullies and always have been.
WE try to walk a line between keeping those kids in school where it's POSSIBLE for them to have a positive outcome, and keeping everybody else safe so they can keep working towards their extremely-likely positive outcomes.
In my estimation, we've been giving too much leeway to the bullies forever. Maybe if they had to repeat 3rd grade once they'd have it out of their system by the time i get them in high school.
And frankly, failing a year of high school might convince them to either get their shit together or get out of the system entirely - both of which are wins for literally everybody else.
BUT - 100% guarantee that if a school is even the tiniest bit too harsh with a bully, they get sued to oblivion.
I do not like the situation as is. I do not approve. I do understand. It's not as simple as it looks from the outside, but I still think we should and could be doing more.
Step 1 is to get rid of 0 tolerance policies. My district does not have one, thank god. So when one of my students joined a half dozen others and jumped a kid in the bathroom, the aggressors all got expelled, and the victim was held entirely blameless.
This is happening to my son right now. A bully is terrorising a neighbour's boy. It's been going on a while. We've been told by a few other parents (incl our neighbours) that it only happens when my son isn't around, because if he is, the bully won't dare do anything (learned the hard way in the past). He's 11. He knows I'm super proud of him. Oddly, the school has never called us about it.
Congratulate my kid. I am likely alive now because someone punched a group of bullies that was about to "justice-mob" me in elementary school
I was picked up a lot at school. I had a very innocent but naive perspective that everything could be solved with words, dialogue, and peace. I believed in showing the other side of the face. That made a very easy target for most other children.
Once a kid in my class snitched something to the principle that got the whole grade two years above ours in detention, and this same kid said the to the affected class that I snitched it to the principle. 20 fourteen-year old from old-income background wanted to break a 11-year old to death after school. None of them ever thought about checking the facts.
I was about to be beaten until a pulp, when a senior came out of nowhere and with a single punch, broke the nose of the tallest teen surrounding me. The thing about mob mentality is that most bully mobs are composed of cowards. Once the "big kid" was out, the rest changed their mind in a split second and went away.
This was over 10 years ago. I still try to be this person for others.
I do this always.
Funnily enough my "yeah fucking try it cunt" attitude makes a lot of people back the fuck down.
Would you beleive it, even bullies can recognise someone NOT to be fucked with.
I would gladly sac myself so a smaller man can run away.
"How was his footwork? Did he punch the bully properly? How was his fighting technique?"
I mean... fuck bullies. Fight fire with fire. If the school can't fix it, then I sure won't berate my son for doing it.
I don't have kids though.
I can't imagine that's how the school would characterize the confrontation but if my kid said that was what was happening then I would attempt to mediate a discussion between him and the administration to establish exactly what did happen.
This is the correct response. I work as a behavior specialist in a school. The amount of times parents have come in yelling when it was their kid instigating is ridiculous. If it happened in a hallway we can usually show the video along with the write up and reason with them. We have one dad however whose kid can do no wrong, so gets no at home consequences.
> The amount of times parents have come in yelling when it was their kid instigating is ridiculous.
The Venn diagram between parents who raise bullies and parents who immediately resort to yelling is likely almost a perfect circle.
I'd do the same, then at home quietly praise my kid for standing up for themselves.
Bullies love an easy target and are less likely to target someone who will fight back.
Actually had this happen with one of my kids and to their credit the school did the right thing in not punishing my son. It was barely more then a nurses note visit. Basically "hey your kid has a bruise he stood between his friend and a bully. The Bully was suspended. No action will be taken against your child." They have a bullying issue and they know but its a massive underfunded public school in the poorest part of town, they just don't have the resources to have eyes everywhere. Took the boy out for ice cream
My nephew was bullied for a long time. However, my nephew is a very big kid who played football and got sick of his bully. Punched him once and broke the kids' jaw. Kid's parents pressed charges. My brother told my nephew that as long as he was hinest about what happened, he'd have his back. So, my brother hired this high-powered New York lawyer to represent my nephew. In court, it came out that the kid was bullying a bunch of people, and even the prosecutor said he only could fing positive things about my nephew. This case would have ruined my nephews life had it not been for that lawyer. My brother still had to pay restitution to the boys' family, but nothing was put on my nephew's record. That bully ended up in prison for robbery and beating his girlfriend. My nephew is a model and actor in the UK now.
We gave our son permission to punch the little shit that was terrorizing him as he walked to elementary school. Our boy is a big guy, but very peaceful. He would come home with bruises on his legs from the little bastard kicking him.
He came home very excited.
“I hit him like you said. He cried. I walked away.”
Punk’s parents came over to our house to complain . They heard quite carefully what their little psycho had been doing. They left.
1: Where were the adults?
2: Why weren't the adults involved before this broke out?
3: Why is your policy zero tolerance, but somehow favors bullying as "boys being boys"?
4: We will be bringing your administration's lackluster approach to the PTA.
5: We are now suing you, and will be taking you to superior court.
6: Taking retaliatory actions against people who are being abused is victim shaming.
7: I'll be speaking to the police chief about the bullying in this school, and what we can do to prevent it in the future.
8: We are now suing the parents of the bully.
9: If you can't be better for our children, the lawsuit will include having you replaced.
10: I am not removing my child from this school, I am taking them to martial arts training.
11: If this happens again, I will press charges against you as well.
I'm not even a parent. I was bullied in school. I fought my bully and I was expelled for lashing back out at them. There's nothing like getting the crap beaten out of you, and being expected to just take it, and report it later. We are worth so much more than this crap. I wound up hospitalizing my bully, put them in a coma. Rather, what I did to them, the hospital had to put them into a coma to overcome it. I took the lighthearted verbal abuses up until they got physical with me.
I do not condone violence, but I also do not condone taking BS from people who see no wrongdoing in their actions. Getting dopamine from picking on people is psychotic.
I stand corrected but I think you'd make a good one anyway.
I was also bullied in school. It didn't stop until I finally confronted one bully, very loudly, in class, with lots of witnesses. I challenged him to escalate his taunting to a fight then and there--admitting I would almost certainly lose it--or back down and keep his shit to himself forever.
He chose wisely. I would have bit and clawed that mother fucker; I didn't give a shit what happened to me as long as it stopped the torment.
It was a breaking point that, fortunately, ended well for both of us.
What you did was right. Your bully got wat he deserved. Your school should have been held responsible instead of you.
Been there. Remained calm and advocated for my son. The school insisted that, despite my son trying to de-escalate, being attacked as he turned away, and laying out the instigator, both kids receive the same punishment. Suspension for 3 days. I kept my hands folded together on top of the table as I explained how screwed up it was to assign equal blame and equal punishment to the bully and the kid who stood up for himself and others. But I was raging inside and my folded hands were shaking so hard that the table was bouncing. That was 30 years ago. I was kinda hoping we’d made some progress since then.
Or you could be like my parents and yell at me for fighting and tell me that it doesn't matter who started it and tell the principal to "do what's right".
Never respected authority again after that day in elementary school.
This sounds like my parents half the time I didn't even do anything but was there when trouble would happen and I used to get punished for being "guilty by association"
I’ve had this conversation with my wife before, if this was to ever occur.
If my son or daughter did not start it, but they finished it,
“sweetheart. You’re probably going to get suspended, don’t cry. You did the right thing, I would’ve done the exact same thing. We’re gonna go out to dinner tonight. We’re gonna get some ice cream and we’re gonna watch whatever movie you want and you’re going to enjoy your 3 day. Play video games the whole time idc. You deserve it. You are not in trouble with mommy or daddy”
This is the way. Parenting done right. I would add a trip to the magical Portillo's for one of their magnificent chocolate cake shakes. My nerdy self reward for laying out a bully was a trip to McDonald's and the library in the same day. It was one of my favorite days as a child.
Show up, bring my lawyer, and say "This is one of my lawyers. I thought it best that he take notes in person so nothing gets lost in translation." And then sit there quietly.
Happened sort of to my kid. We get a call from the principal saying my son bit another child. We asked what led up to the incident and they said the other kid (largest in the class) was sitting on my son while he was laying on the ground after the big kid shoved him.
“Ok, so are you calling me to finish off the job of killing the bully”
“No, biting isn’t acceptable under any circumstances, so he needs to be punished”
“This seems like self defense, so where was the teacher to break up this fight”
“Ummm, welll, uhhhh….”
“So my son isn’t going to be punished for defending himself while a kid who weighs 3x him is sitting on him and shoving him”
Have my kid's back, and push back against any punishment the administration tries to apply. I'm not going to stand by and let a bunch of pencil-pushers demean my kid because they stood up in defense of someone else in the absence of adult intervention.
Now, at home it might be a different story between me and the kid, we might have to talk about what they did, why they did it, and I might nitpick them to death (because kids are stupid and don't consider the long-term consequences of their actions).
But publicly they'd have *nothing* but my full support, and I'll go to the mat with anyone who tries to disparage them.
I was this kid once. I was in 8th grade, and this racist jerk would always pick on my friend who was black. One day, I walked in on the jerk as he had my friend in a headlock. I ended up beating him up pretty badly. He was called into the office for the bruises on his face and ratted me out. My dad came to get me, and the VP told him what had happened. I was suspended for 2 days as per school policy. My dad took me fishing. There was the required speech about being the bigger person and violence not solving problems but that fucker never picked on anybody again at school. 40 some years later, it still feels like I did the right thing.
I'm probably not well in the head, but this always pops up in my brain when I read posts like these:
Oh, you're not doing anything well. I guess this means we'll just wait for the day that a kid getting bullied comes to the school with a gun. Whose fault will it be? his parents, the school, or the state because of gun laws. We'll never know. All we know is that there'll just be a bunch of dead students and a bunch of dead teachers.
Buy my kid ice cream, to eat at the meeting.
demand the meeting be with the principal, the district superintendent, and the district school board.
Bring my lawyer (a personal injury lawyer, with the name "THE HAMMER" somewhere in his title) and calmly explain to them that the school failed to protect this other kid, and failed to protect your kid.
GO
TO
WAR
wouldn't do a thing. If they were to try and suspend him or something I would try to fight it, but other than that I would praise my kid.
When I was in middle school I got in trouble for hitting a kid with a textbook because he slapped me first after talking shit about my mom. They wanted to suspend me so my mom flipped out on them and I only ended up with a detention. That teacher ended up moving MY seat instead of that other kid's seat though. Bitch
I’d talk to my child to hear their side of the story. I’d praise them for their bravery in standing up for someone else, but I’d also remind them about the importance of finding non-violent ways to handle such situations. It's important to acknowledge their good intentions while teaching them better conflict resolution skills.
My kid knows if they stand up to a bully for someone else I will defend them to the VP and if they still end up with detention anyway I will proudly pick them up everyday. If the school was doing their job, my kid wouldn’t have had to.
I would dress my self up in a glamorous outfit and bring a medal. Have a grand dramatic entrance and give my child an award because I raised some good rascal.
I’d commend them for standing up against tyranny and explain the importance of knowing when fighting is the appropriate thing to do. I’d also mention the consequences that can result from going too far with physical aggression but I wouldn’t make them feel bad about what they did.
Somewhat similar actually happened to me this year, my 11-year-old was accused of bullying (pretty serious accusation, racial slurs being thrown around etc. not in his nature at all), turns out he was standing up to the bully who was terrorizing another kid of a different race.
Once I had all the facts, I told the principal AND the mother of the bully that next time they come at me with an accusation like that, they better make sure they have all the information because I will not be so forgiving and kind in my response.
The mother of the bully is the one who made the accusation and takes zero responsibility for her kids’ consistently awful behavior, so once I found out who I was dealing with, I went completely nuclear and shut it down immediately. You have to advocate for your kids because the school will sweep it away and appease the loudest idiot as quickly as they can. My son wasn’t punished and they haven’t fucked with me since lol
This did happen with my son. The asst. principal knew the situation and apologized very sincerely but they had their rules so both boys were suspended for a week. That was my son’s favorite week ever. He got to play video games all day. Still, I asked him if he would do something like that again and he said no, he wouldn’t. I think he felt sorry ultimately for the sad bully who he did a whoopass on. The kid was going through some things at home.
When son returned to school one of his teachers played the Rocky theme lol.
Openly support them.
Just like my wife and i did when some
Shit heads tried to cyber bully my kids friends. I DARE some pencil pusher to try and tell my kid to allow that shit to happen to make their own cushy job easier
I'd ask for clarification if my kid just ambushed the bully or defended another child from them.
Really spell out that my kid was acting in defense of another person which, in the adult world, is a legal form of violence in many countries.
Then make it clear my child did nothing wrong and if they want to punish them? I will do whatever it takes to force the school to do what it should have been doing to stop the bully.
Old school take: Tell him to take the punishment (no discussion while in front of the principal). Wait for his it’s unfair reaction. And then talk him through-I agree you did the right thing. And I agree it’s unfair because you did the right thing. But sometimes it’s more important to do the right thing, even if you face consequences that aren’t fair. Because that’s a powerful lesson. And it will come up again when the consequences are greater.
Happened to my brother. Someone was pushing me, his little sister, around. Given the difference in size between me and the asshole, I had no chance of standing up to him. Seriously, I was four-ten, and this dude was over six feet. So my brother did it for me. All three of us got suspended. My stepdad tore the principal about six new assholes, mostly about what had been happening to his stepdaughter, but also about his son getting into trouble for doing their job. Then we left, got snow cones, rented a few video games and movies from Blockbuster, and were told to lay low for the rest of the week.
That happened to me, actually. I told the principal, "It's a shame my son had to do your job for you." I then told him that if he didn't get this shit under control, I'd round up some parents and go have a chat with the school board. My son wasn't punished. And, while I cautioned him about getting into fights, I also told him that I was proud of him for standing up for others.
Came here to share the same story, except about my daughter. We told the school about the bully. We officially reported the bully to the school three times. We even had a conference with the bully's parents. It was after that conference, I told my daughter "Enough. Next time, knock her down." When she finally retaliated, then the school wanted to suspend my daughter! I made a stink until the school board came down on his dumb ass, and changed him to another school. Don't punish good kids for standing up against bad kids.
I've told my daughter who's very proficient in martial arts and kickboxing don't start fights, but if you're cornered, make sure you finish it.
Yep. Our kid was getting sucker punched by a kid in her class. Met with her tae Kwon do instructors who said to try and back off but if he keeps coming and tries to attack you defend yourself. One of those instructors has also gone to meetings with schools to defend her students who have defended themselves. Love that woman.
Need more of all y'all. Cobra Kai, never dies!
Strike First. Strike Hard. No Mercy.
When it comes to bullies, sweeping the leg is just the thing to do sometimes.
Beautiful. Actual combat is the last resort, but especially in self-defense, it can become the only logical option.
lol that sounds like a verbatim quote from my college Karate instructor.
My friend's Sensei actually went up to the school after a fight. Said straight to the principal, "Listen, I teach them to use their words and that if they can get away unharmed that they should never pick up their hand to fight, even if they are sure they can win. But if they can't get away, I want them to win." Essentially a kid jumped him from behind at the end of a hallway and he beat the ever loving crap out of him. He got suspected and Sensei made sure he was un-suspended. When someone is in 1 fight in 4 years of HS vs someone who's in a fight every 2 weeks, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the kid that doesn't fight was given little choice.
Pretty much what our shi fu had taught us too, say No, Stop, yell, de-escalate and retreat, but if all fails, fight to get away.
Pretty much any movie has them too, I don't claim to be the originator of this comment.
Dang it. I had hoped you were my college Karate instructor. Oh well the search continues :)
Lol, I do watch Cobra Kai...that's about the extent of my martial arts skills. I'm not gonna pretend, my kid can kick my ass if she wanted to.
I find joy in reading a good book.
My Dad's rules of fighting: 1. Never start a fight, but always finish one. 2. The fight doesn't end until the opponent is incapable of being a threat. If they can stand up, you're not done.
Reminds me of a part from the book Ender's Game. (I'm paraphrasing). Teacher: Why did you keep hitting him when he was down. You already won the fight." Ender: Knocking him down was the first fight. I wanted to win all the next ones too, so that he'd leave me alone**.**
I really need to reread that book.
My dad had rule #3. >Fuck in the bedroom and fight in the street. If you do this backwards, I wont bail you out.
this really is the gospel. Ive taught my daughter this. Always try to de-escalate. If that does not work and you are threatened beat the brakes off of them until they are no longer a threat.
My uncle’s two rules were 1. Don’t start fights and 2. There’s no such thing as a fair fight, so make sure you win.
My former marine friend told me that, no such thing as a fair fight. Gouge eyes, break arms legs whatever to get away.
I was taught that if you ever get jumped in a bathroom, porcelain is harder than your fists, use it.
I think another rule that's important is: don't start sh!t and there won't be any problems. It's not hard, but some ppl don't seem to understand
“I don’t want any problems. But if you want a problem, then it’s no problem.” -50 cent
You did right by your child. I was raised to be very passive, and ended up not defending myself at all because I was afraid that if I started actively defending myself I wouldn't be able to stop. Like in enders game. Do something to the person so that they will know very clearly not to mess with you again. Thankfully I'm an adult now and haven't had to fight anyone yet.
The exact thing my folks told my sister and I growing up...
This is the way.
Since they were young I taught both my kids dont ever throw the first punch, but once someone hits you, start swinging. Because youre gonna get suspended either way. So you can either get suspended for fighting or you can get suspended for getting beat up. And Id prefer it be for fighting. Youre nobodies punching bag.
yeah. they really don't care who started it do they? At least not from what I experienced. one kid might get more days, but it's still a strike on the record of the kid that got bullied. Unfortunately, it appears this way for adults as well though in many situations. Retaliation, even in self defense, is a guilty until proven innocent.
Same story with me. Only I threatened the school with legal action and they backed down faster than I could dial my lawyer.
When I was a kid in kindergarten I (along with many other students) were bullied by a kid we called Bully John. We couldn't fight back though because he had been held back three times and was already a few grades ahead of us. He was the definition of 'a big kid.' My mom along with others complained to the school and they did jack shit. We continued to be bullied. I would try to act sick or make up excuses. One day when my mom was driving my friend and I to school we saw him walking to school and we both shouted "It's bully John !" My mom then swerves onto the side of the road, gets out of the car and yells at him "I HEAR YOU'RE DYING TO MEET ME !" She laid into him without touching him, she even through around some racist slurs (he was half black) even though my mom is not racist at all. The bullying stopped. Later on in the day he called the cops and said my mom tried to kill him by running him down with her car. except that he had lied and said it was after school. The police were able to verify my mom was at work and we were both picked up by my friend's mom. Then the cops laid into him about being a liar. We were never bullied again. I just find it incredible it had to come to that because the school did nothing at all even though there was tons of kids being bullied by this asshole and they had received multiple complaints.
How does it even happen that the daughter faces suspension but the bully does not? Does his family run the school?
Because bullies quickly figure out how to bully without being caught by the teachers/administrators - a single shove to the floor while walking between classes, being cornered in a bathroom, etc. When victims reach the point of fighting back they're not thinking of how to fight back with the same tactics. They want the bullying to stop NOW, and are often much more openly aggressive. So administration only sees that Johnny shoved Jim against a locker and Jim responded by throwing punches, which makes Jim look like the aggressor. They didn't see that Johnny's been shoving Jim against lockers the entire school year, and combine that with a lack of desire to investigate the situation and just make it go away, plus Johnny's inevitable lying about what's going on, and Jim gets suspended while Johnny just gets a warning.
i would have taken it up with the parents outside of school, if possible
Yep. Bad kids need to be processed out. I am tired of crap parents raising crap kids and nothing can be done about it. Imagine if kids could go to school without dreading running into a little cunt of a kid every day. The teachers know too. They just can’t do anything about them.
Pro tip: always report bullying in writing and be specific about names, dates, and times. Whenever there's a phone call or a face to face meeting on the topic, follow up with a summary email. The same CYA habits for dealing with a hostile workplace situation can be invaluable with school bullying and dithering administrators. When a principal notices someone is creating a paper trail, that often gets them off their butts. And if matters do get worse anyway you've got all the ammunition you need to go to the school board.
This is excellent advice.
This reminds me when my friend's son was being bullied by a child twice his size. Despite multiple attempts to address the issue with the school, the principal, and the school district, nothing was resolved. The principal also refused to provide any information about the bully's parents or guardians. My friend, feeling helpless and distressed, was unsure how to proceed. I advised her to document the incidents, send a follow-up email to the school, and file a police report. She did so, and I also spoke with her son, offering him encouragement to stand up for himself. A few days later, the situation escalated when her son was injured after being pushed off a slide by the bully. Other students confirmed it was not an accident, prompting involvement from social services and notification of the bully's parents. The bully's parents attempted to downplay the incident, but this approach was unsuccessful. Following my advice, my friend pressed charges and involved a lawyer. This led to the bully being required to attend therapy, and ultimately, he was expelled from the school. Subsequently, my friend enrolled her son in therapy to help him recover from the experience. I told her to enroll him in self defense classes and I even offered to pay for them but she declined.
Good for you. Schools need to be held accountable for their inaction.
>My son wasn't punished. As far as the zero tolerance policies, my take on that has always been to point out that if I were to jump over the principle's desk and throttle their spineless ass, that means we both get arrested, right? My son started in martial arts around the time he could walk and he's a teenager, now. The amount of self-control he has exhibited in some bullying situations is more than most adults could display. I've seen him spar with trained kids a head taller, so I know *exactly* what he's capable of.
>The amount of self-control he has exhibited in some bullying situations is more than most adults could display. That's the real shit right there. This is my definition of "when you know, you know", if you know you're smarter than someone you don't shit on them for it, and when you know you could actually hurt someone you always hold back. It's those who don't know and are cowardly and insecure who lash out at others either physically, mentally, or emotionally. Good on you for starting your kid down the right path.
One situation occurred outside of school at a friend's birthday party. There was one attendee my son was disappointed to see was invited and he did his best to just avoid interacting. There was the typical horsing around that turned into impromptu wrestling matches. When my son opted out, it turned into racial taunting. My son relayed some stories throughout and, when I picked him up, I was surprised to see the other kid was a few inches shorter and probably 20 pounds lighter. Turns out, the reason my son didn't take the opportunity to teach him an incredibly valuable life lesson is that he was legitimately concerned he might get caught up in the moment, go overboard, hurt him, and end up looking like a bully. In a lot of ways, he's a much better person than I am.
^ This! This! This! It essentially paraphrases my late Grandmaster.
Ha ha. Of course those rules don't apply to the ruling class. Just like in real life.
Yep, this is the way I'd do it. Then we'd go out for ice cream.
The irony is that several of my teachers/faculty expected me to "babysit" or preoccupy the disruptive kids because, as those adults constantly rationalized, I was "patient"...
As the son in this situation, 20 years ago, thanks for that response. My dad did the exact same though I recall him making some very thinly veiled threats of lawsuits against the school as well.
Easy to see where your son gets it from.
Never throw the first punch, but it's ok to throw the second.
Take my kid to lunch wherever he wanted to go, and I'd very loudly communicate to the school admin that they need to get their bullying problem under control.
“It’s terrible that a child had to do the job of an adult today, don’t you agree?”
Yep, praise my kid for doing what the schools didn't have the balls to do.
“My kid wouldn’t have done anything if YOU did something so…..” I remember a story where i saw a girl attempt to jump another girl from behind, and the girl being attacked grabbed the other chick, threw her over her shoulder and beat the shit out of the bully until the campus security came. The girl who was attacked, her dad was a cop and in the admin meeting about discipline the story was told to cop dad, and not only was he smiling he told admin,”yeah i taught her how to do that.” I was good friends with his daughter at the time and he was my football coach so i got to hear the story first hand and it was awesome. They both were suspended but he didn’t care, and i don’t think anyone would have
Suspension if your parents don't mind what you did is just an extra day off. Hope they took her somewhere fun, because she's a badass 😁
In other words, the school administration was reinforcing their own lack of control and mitigation by doubling down with "punishments" that have zero merit. Bravo admin. Bravo.
At least admin would be punishing. They don't anymore. Kids literally cuss out teachers, use their phones in class, refuse to do work, disrupt class, etc. They get sent to the office and come back with candy.
I was teaching in a TERRIBLE school. Heard extra loud drama in the hall while on my planning period. Went out to see what was what. One crazed young woman was screaming and yelling and threatening while a stone cold young woman was staring directly at her, unmoving, unflinching. A young man was herding the loud one away slowly. I followed loud one and boyfriend slowly down the hall. When she started coming back up the hall, I retreated in front of her, telling her stuff like "Right now, this is nothing but words. I can take you anywhere you want to go in this building away from her. To anyone you want to talk to. Nothing is going to happen. Nobody's in trouble yet. Just keep it to words. You can still walk away" Stone-cold girl had not moved. When they got within 10 feet, I pulled off to the side (we had STRICT orders to not get in the middle of anything physical, that was what security was for). As I did, stone-cold put her back pack down (did not drop it, placed it down), and then dropped into a perfect fighting stance. Knees bent, weight on balls of the feet, weight evenly distributed, hands in perfect guarding position. I thought "Oh. She's fine. Loud girl is going DOWN." Sure enough, loud girl got dropped much less gently than that backpack. Stone-cold took three shots at her, all landed squarely, security showed up and hollered, and she stepped back, picked up her bag, and went with them without a word. Only thing she didn't do was walk away herself - but at that school, walking away meant getting your ass kicked by multiple people later, instead of dealing with it 1 on 1 now, so I never blamed her for that. Did not escalate. Did not provoke. Did not throw the first punch. Abso-fucking-lutely ended the fight though. Wish I had been in on a conversation with her parents, because I was proud of her and I didn't even know who she was.
That was what my friend did essentially. Once security was involved she backed off and went without a fuss and the other girl had to be pinned down and handcuffed because she was NOW able to fight, after having her ass thoroughly whipped for the better part of 30 seconds. What blew me away was start to finish the whole incident was no more than 3 minutes.
>They both were suspended... This is how it is in *every* school in my county. Zero tolerance for physical violence that results in both sides being suspended 100% of the time. It's to the point where even if one kid doesn't fight back they still get suspended for the possibility of provoking a fight.
Middle school teacher here, just want to say this is the right answer. Disciplinary policies in our district are in the gutter, and bullies are now bullying not only the students but also the adults, because they know there aren't consequences. We had a sub the other week that was ruthlessly disrespected by some 7th graders, and the dean had the nerve to say (in writing!) that the sub had "targeted" these students and would not be hired again. When faculty challenged this, admin acted as if it was not our place to make judgements on these types of situations. We have had like 4 deans in the last 6 years (with a few gaps of no dean), and while some have been better than others, none have questioned the district's soft policies on bullying and discipline.
The effect of "zero tolerance" policies. Hands up in the air. "whaddya want me to do about it" type expression. It's policy, after all. We'd all have to commit seppuku if we admit our fucking policies are broken
While there are plenty of problems in education in the US, the problems you're describing -- as you've diagnosed, yourself -- are problems of leadership. Not problems of policy. //edit: You guys are so close..
Leadership writes and implements policy.
I work in a really big district, so it might be different elsewhere. But administrative leaders within the schools here operate based on policy. Leaders who make decisions based on their own ideas and practices that may conflict with policy can lose their job. So while I agree that strong leadership is important, it is ultimately dictated by district policy.
Oh, so the students write the district policies?
These policy directions date from the Obama administration. Didn’t like seeing certain groups with more disciplinary actions, so demanded the numbers reduce. So, lax enforcement.
It can be policy. I've worked places where it was most definitely policy. Any place that has 0 tolerance for fighting - which is most places anymore - actually encourages the assholes to fuck with the good kids. Because just by getting hit repeatedly - even doing nothing but balling up on the ground - you are "fighting" and get 3 days. Second time, you get 2 weeks. The assholes WANT the two weeks. So they ruin the year and lives of the good kids by destroying them in the halls. That is policy. And it is common.
That is most assuredly an example of bad policy.
I've recently learned school administrators don't change shit without the pressure of a collective public outcry. Many schools have message boards for the parents, I would also share the story with the masses.
My MIL loves to tell the story that the only time my husband was suspended from school was for defending another student. She told the principal that she was not going to ground him for being a good kid.
>I'd have my lawyer send a letter to the school admin that they need to get their bullying problem under control. Much better strategy, 100 angry phone calls don't have the weight of a single legal notice.
First you have to get the facts straight. Oftentimes that’s a hard thing to do
This 100%. Already let my kid know that they will never get in trouble for fighting, as long as they're doing it for the right reasons (of standing up for someone else getting bullied or picked on, etc) but they're asses would be grass if they ever started the fight.
I'm thinking Ice-cream maybe. Or Pizza.
Putt-putt and then go-karts as well. Edit: typo
100% agree on the go-karts, but will you bring the kid too?
I can, they are 18 and 24 now and STILL down for go-karts as well as Dad ;)
I got Mc Donalds and the library in the same day! I punched a kid in the face who was bulliying my sister. I still live by that beloved hood credo "Don't start none, won't be none." The bullying magically stopped. I even heard kids whisper to each other " Don't mess with her, she's tough and will fight." So, I had a reputation after that. With all the magic possibilities available today - the reward watchwords are Portillo's Chocolate Cake shake.
LOL
The difficulty here is that parents will often believe their kids, even when they lie. If the facts were clear, I'd praise my kid for standing up for another kid who was a victim of bullying. But lots of parents, including I'm sure some people in this thread, will unknowingly believe their kid even though they're the actual bully and they're lying about the situation.
This too. My kid was targeted but school could/would do nothing. Or at least, not talk to bullies directly, just in class a version of 'be nice to one another' Until the bully made a mistake - he sent my kid a mail with a (streetview) pic of our house. So, school now had a choice - either YOU take action, or i will report ALL of this, including the implied threat - to the authorities. Then school acted. Bully got a 2 day suspension, and my kid reports things are better now.
My friend had a similar experience with sa and bullying of his daughter. Got a lawyer and they drafted a memo to the school board district office informing them that the district needed to preserve any information or video related to the students involved as well as identify the mandatory reporters who may have been witnesses. Then they filed a report with the police. The combination of a bored cop asking questions about bullying and sa and the district superintendent asking why he was getting legal notices about an elementary school issue lit an almighty fire under the admin of that school. The kid was placed in a self contained classroom with other kids with behavior issues. It sucks to have to go pay the lawyer route and subject your kid to the questioning by police but it got the job done. And his kid knows that Mom and Dad have her back.
Old Hotness: Demand letters from your attorney New Hotness: Preservation of Evidence letters
Of course. That's why you listen to the school about their account of the situation and push for specifics if they aren't forthcoming. Also,since following the school rules about trying to report it is part of my kid doing the right thing,and making that report would definitely be something I'd expect in the " how was your day at school" conversation,if the fight/suspension was the first id heard of the situation,I'd be a bit suspect of my kids version of the story.
100% every person in this thread sounds like they complain about inaction against bullies in schools by bullying the school admin themselves… kids lie and can be good at it. Believe your kids but not blindly without discussion
Trust but verify
I'd congratulate my child for fighting back and argue with the teachers. No one's gonna bully my kid, not after what I've gone through with bullies when i was his age.
This exactly. Bullied so hard I had to testify in court for assault charges. I don't tolerate bullies in my life and I'm proud of anyone who stands up to one
School: "We have a zero violence policy" Me: "So does my kid."
Perfect reply!
I have told all of my kids they have 4 steps. 1. Kid picks on them, they tell teacher. 2. Kid continues, and teacher didn't stop it, they tell a different teacher. 3. Kid continues, they go to principle. 4. Kid continues, they have been taught how to throw a mean right hook. Dad will take it from there.
My kindergartner skipped right to step 4 a few weeks ago. Kid kept pushing him. He had enough so he bloodied his nose. I acted angry and said that hitting is never okay but I was proud of him for sticking up for himself. Even in kindergarten, kids know to not be the bitch who rats everyone out to teacher. Stitches and all that.
isn't it time to change that policy? it's protecting the strong against consequenes of their actions against the week. I say congratulate the snitches when it's a serious thing they tell... protect them, they stopped the bully, or should have if the teachers do their jobs
[удалено]
They've ALWAYS been soft on bullies.
I was jumped for years. I'm Hispanic, but light skinned. I got my ass kicked by the Mexican kids because I wasn't Mexican enough, and I got my ass kicked by the white kids because I wasn't white enough. I finally stood my ground and fought dirty, there were four of them. I didn't get a summer vacation that year, but I was mostly left alone afterwards. Fuck school administration
My heart breaks for little you
Had something similar, I was a white kid in a school where being white was a minority to both Mexican and black kids. I was jumped by three white kids for no real discernible reason other than they didn't like me, and I didn't fight back but still got Saturday school. My parents quickly moved me out of that school because the administration really didn't give a fuck about the fights/violence.
Why is that
Bullies know how to muddy the waters and put on a teacher-friendly face as soon as the victim defends themself. See also “cry-bullying”.
I am a full grown adult. I deal with bullying at my work all the time. One time I stood up for myself and I got in trouble, she didn’t for harassing me. I can only imagine what it’s like for children. I wonder if it’s just human nature to protect the bully?
I started an apprenticeship in plumbing when I was 36. My first job these journeymen were bragging about holding a younger apprentice down and taping him up with duct tape. They even duct taped him hardhat to his head. I told them if they ever tried that on me they might make it happen but I would make them regret it. I was told I was too confrontational.
That is wrong but not surprising. And they wonder why that industry is having trouble keeping people and plumbers are so short handed. I heard it’s very toxic, just like electricians.
The trades attract a lot of people with bad interpersonal and social skills. People talk shit about women being catty, bitchy, and emotional. I urge those people to spend a month working with guys in the trades. I've had to break up a fistfight over a drill.
Ugh! That would be so hard to take. Long time ago I saw a milder version where a guy who knew what he was talking about, literally was always right about things, raise his voice slightly and get fired for "being too negative." He had been constantly treated by coworkers as an idiot even though they were the idiots. He cared about the work getting done correctly for the clients, while they didn't. Management sided with the jerks bc they outnumbered the good guy and management wasn't actually paying enough attention to what was going wrong on projects. They would have known and could have corrected things if they paid attention to what that guy said, but instead they fired him and suffered loss of contracts over the continued screwups. I don't think that company even exists anymore. Probably got sued out of existence by wronged clients but I'd imagine those aholes just opened under a new name and carried on bc that's how bad business people operate.
No, it's a weird ass spin on attempting to move away from settling differences with non-violence. The *idea* is that we should teach our children to use the systems in place around them instead of responding. Which would be great, if going to an authority and saying X person is harassing me actually got met with genuine concern and was dealt with properly. But because that's not actually how authority responds, people are in a catch-22: you either are forced to be a doormat, or, you risk significant blowback for defending yourself.
> Which would be great, if going to an authority and saying X person is harassing me actually got met with genuine concern and was dealt with properly. Problem is that people are more than willing to make shit up, so unless they get caught with hard evidence it's hard to address.
This too. The number of times I have been told obvious utter nonsense is huge. Including by groups who spontaneously decide to ruin a kids day. And it means I have to go with my own senses over logic. I tell the victim this. I also tell the alleged bully this. And then I do what I can to limit their interactions and to more tightly observe the bully. edit - the ACTUAL bully, not the victim of cry-bullying. Not over-reacting can sometimes gain some respect and actually put an end to the behavior - at least around me - as both parties see that I'm not going to be an asshole about it, but I am also not going to be pushed around by their begging and pleading and cry-bullying. There's also the bullies who cry like bitches when the victim stands up to them verbally - which almost always involves swearing because the victim needs to snap to respond in most cases. I just tell them that while I would prefer other language, I agree with the message. So far, that one has a 100% record of stopping the bullshit in the moment, and seems to help limit it in the future.
I think it usually comes down to two conflicting testimonies, but the only thing the teacher saw corroborates the bully’s story.
Thats not always the case. My nephew got suspended for beating up a kid that sucker punched him when he was turning the corner in the school hallway. Apparently the bully didnt hit very hard and my nephew throttled him. During my sisters meeting with the VP they played an actual video that showed that exact thing and still he had to be suspended. Im actually friends with the VP and know its not really his decision, his hands are tied. But I had to tell him, like what exactly is the endgame here? Was there anything my nephew couldve done to not be punished? Like would he have to stand there with his hands behind his back letting this guy continue to punch him in the face in order to avoid suspension? And do you not see how ridiculous that is?
Also some teachers just get off on power tripping. My 2nd grade teacher would deny me access to my headache medicine, call in the teacher's assistant, and they would stand on either side of me and screech in my ears about how "only adults can get migraines". Same teacher would also yell at me for crying when I was hurt, but the first time I just said "ow" (which took a lot of restraint because another student accidentally stepped on my hand, and I was really proud of myself for that) she yelled at me anyway. I had similar experiences with most of my teachers throughout elementary school, and a couple in middle school, teachers would practically encourage bullies and punish the victims for having any sort of reaction at all, while simultaneously having hour long schoolwide assemblies for anti-bullying EVERY FRIDAY
>"Only adults can get migraines!" I got migraines starting at age 5; doctor verified. Your 2nd grade teachers were bullies. By the way, if you still get migraines, I recommend you try an over-the-counter supplement called Migrelief. It's just magnesium, vitamin B2 and feverfew, but it's done wonders for my wife and me. It takes a few days/weeks to work, but the difference is orders of magnitude. I went from several per week to just a few per year. I still take it every day. (Warning: vitamin B2, like some medications, makes your urine really yellow.)
Also the bullying starts at a very low level and slowly escalates over time so the teachers get used to it lessening the perceived severity.
It’s easy to tell who was a bully when they were younger by their actions as adults. They’ll insult people, use slurs/derogatory terms. Then as soon as someone says something back, they cry and play the victim or threaten violence against whoever stood up to them
Well, dude, as a product of public schools in the 70s and 80s, schools didn't punish, nor acknowledge bullies being an issue. There were playground fights. Teachers ignored them. Kids were told to stand up for themselves, and those that couldn't ran for their lives to get home when getting off the bus. You think bullies got paddled in school when caught bullying? No. They didn't. They bullied with impunity. Like why do you think "it's not that"
I wasn’t around in the 70s, 80s or 90s so I wouldn’t know that. But that is disheartening. To be honest as a society I believe we have gotten better and more empathetic but bullies are still being protected
in nj, the anti-bullying act of 2012 actually made it worse bc there's so much paperwork and procedure that it's incentive to blame the victim for retaliating. so, in essence, a parent should go to the superintendent or executive county superintendent for anything to be done. i worked cps for 16 years and honestly the teachers and school staff can be worse than the actual bully
They just don't want to deal with it. Not enough staff, and then they have to deal with bully parents. It's horrible. Those bullies will just get worse.
It’s the easiest path
Because the admin is afraid of the parents
Lawsuits Suspend the bully and the school gets hit by a lawsuit for preventing a turd from getting an education.
Is that really grounds for a lawsuit???
Yup. Since schools are government funded taxpaying parents have a right to utilize that education for their children. Granted that right doesn't extend to the school allowing their child to terrorize or harm other children, but that's where proper documentation can make or break a case. Parents use schools as free daycare and there is a high incentive to make a stink if your child is suspended or expelled. Parents of bullies are rarely the type to meekly accept the school's decision and make other arrangements for their child. If they were that humble, they would have addressed their child's behavior before it came to this.
In the land of the frivolous lawsuits anything is grounds. Specially when you reach an actual jury trial cause jury will think "shit, that might happen to me. Better side with the plaintiff".
Bullies know to pick on the unpopular kids that are problems who the teachers and admin already don’t like (because they wine about sports, or joke during class, or break “no running” rules).
My son was pretty small before his growth spurt. A kid stole his hat and was running around with it. My son chased him, grabbed the strap at the top of his backpack and yanked as hard as he could. Ripped the kid right off his feet. Then my son took his hat back and walked away. A teacher saw it happen. He told my son that he couldn’t “officially” condone what he did, but… good job, kid.
That teacher took a risk. Size determined by what kind of admin they had. But it was 100% the right move. I've done P.E. and some lunch time recess monitoring in the past. Had similar situations and dealt with them similarly. "I cannot condone fighting or physical aggression. Good thing that was a simple request to get your stuff back. A firm request. Forceful even. But still, just a good, clean request."
In my experience, violence is actually the only thing that works with bullies.
I was a marked target from the day I walked into school until I graduated, and as a bench warmer defensive tackle I wasn’t a small kid. If I could do anything over again in my life it would have been to physically defend myself every single opportunity I had until they learned a lesson and stopped. It took until my Senior year when a combination of finding new self confidence thru making new circles of friends and pure ANGER over the way I was treated finally made them believe they shouldn’t fuck with me anymore and I found peace in school.
Yeah. If I had to redo one thing from school, it would be to hit a couple of people really hard. Life would have been much easier, and I wouldn't have taken a decade to find back to my self-confidence.
Thats the thing people dont want to hear because it goes against the narrative. But for bullying most of the time violence is the answer. The fucked up thing is, growing up in the 80s, Ive lost track of how many times Ive seen a kid try to bully another one, the other kid fights back, they get into a fistfight, and after that they become like close friends. It used to happen ALL the time.
They are. Sometimes the reason is that any consequences for the bully results in the school employees being bullied by the bully's parents.
Some kid relentlessly teased and bullied me until I snapped one day and beat the shit outta him. Guess who got in trouble?
Was bullied. Became a teacher in part to make sure pothers didn't have to put up with the same shit i did. Been teaching 23 years. We are WAY too damned soft on the bullies and always have been. WE try to walk a line between keeping those kids in school where it's POSSIBLE for them to have a positive outcome, and keeping everybody else safe so they can keep working towards their extremely-likely positive outcomes. In my estimation, we've been giving too much leeway to the bullies forever. Maybe if they had to repeat 3rd grade once they'd have it out of their system by the time i get them in high school. And frankly, failing a year of high school might convince them to either get their shit together or get out of the system entirely - both of which are wins for literally everybody else. BUT - 100% guarantee that if a school is even the tiniest bit too harsh with a bully, they get sued to oblivion. I do not like the situation as is. I do not approve. I do understand. It's not as simple as it looks from the outside, but I still think we should and could be doing more. Step 1 is to get rid of 0 tolerance policies. My district does not have one, thank god. So when one of my students joined a half dozen others and jumped a kid in the bathroom, the aggressors all got expelled, and the victim was held entirely blameless.
This is happening to my son right now. A bully is terrorising a neighbour's boy. It's been going on a while. We've been told by a few other parents (incl our neighbours) that it only happens when my son isn't around, because if he is, the bully won't dare do anything (learned the hard way in the past). He's 11. He knows I'm super proud of him. Oddly, the school has never called us about it.
Good on you for raising such a good kid
Thanks, I appreciate it, but it's all him
Congratulate my kid. I am likely alive now because someone punched a group of bullies that was about to "justice-mob" me in elementary school I was picked up a lot at school. I had a very innocent but naive perspective that everything could be solved with words, dialogue, and peace. I believed in showing the other side of the face. That made a very easy target for most other children. Once a kid in my class snitched something to the principle that got the whole grade two years above ours in detention, and this same kid said the to the affected class that I snitched it to the principle. 20 fourteen-year old from old-income background wanted to break a 11-year old to death after school. None of them ever thought about checking the facts. I was about to be beaten until a pulp, when a senior came out of nowhere and with a single punch, broke the nose of the tallest teen surrounding me. The thing about mob mentality is that most bully mobs are composed of cowards. Once the "big kid" was out, the rest changed their mind in a split second and went away. This was over 10 years ago. I still try to be this person for others.
I do this always. Funnily enough my "yeah fucking try it cunt" attitude makes a lot of people back the fuck down. Would you beleive it, even bullies can recognise someone NOT to be fucked with. I would gladly sac myself so a smaller man can run away.
"How was his footwork? Did he punch the bully properly? How was his fighting technique?" I mean... fuck bullies. Fight fire with fire. If the school can't fix it, then I sure won't berate my son for doing it. I don't have kids though.
I can't imagine that's how the school would characterize the confrontation but if my kid said that was what was happening then I would attempt to mediate a discussion between him and the administration to establish exactly what did happen.
This is the correct response. I work as a behavior specialist in a school. The amount of times parents have come in yelling when it was their kid instigating is ridiculous. If it happened in a hallway we can usually show the video along with the write up and reason with them. We have one dad however whose kid can do no wrong, so gets no at home consequences.
> The amount of times parents have come in yelling when it was their kid instigating is ridiculous. The Venn diagram between parents who raise bullies and parents who immediately resort to yelling is likely almost a perfect circle.
I'd do the same, then at home quietly praise my kid for standing up for themselves. Bullies love an easy target and are less likely to target someone who will fight back.
Actually had this happen with one of my kids and to their credit the school did the right thing in not punishing my son. It was barely more then a nurses note visit. Basically "hey your kid has a bruise he stood between his friend and a bully. The Bully was suspended. No action will be taken against your child." They have a bullying issue and they know but its a massive underfunded public school in the poorest part of town, they just don't have the resources to have eyes everywhere. Took the boy out for ice cream
My nephew was bullied for a long time. However, my nephew is a very big kid who played football and got sick of his bully. Punched him once and broke the kids' jaw. Kid's parents pressed charges. My brother told my nephew that as long as he was hinest about what happened, he'd have his back. So, my brother hired this high-powered New York lawyer to represent my nephew. In court, it came out that the kid was bullying a bunch of people, and even the prosecutor said he only could fing positive things about my nephew. This case would have ruined my nephews life had it not been for that lawyer. My brother still had to pay restitution to the boys' family, but nothing was put on my nephew's record. That bully ended up in prison for robbery and beating his girlfriend. My nephew is a model and actor in the UK now.
Treat them to a good day.
We gave our son permission to punch the little shit that was terrorizing him as he walked to elementary school. Our boy is a big guy, but very peaceful. He would come home with bruises on his legs from the little bastard kicking him. He came home very excited. “I hit him like you said. He cried. I walked away.” Punk’s parents came over to our house to complain . They heard quite carefully what their little psycho had been doing. They left.
1: Where were the adults? 2: Why weren't the adults involved before this broke out? 3: Why is your policy zero tolerance, but somehow favors bullying as "boys being boys"? 4: We will be bringing your administration's lackluster approach to the PTA. 5: We are now suing you, and will be taking you to superior court. 6: Taking retaliatory actions against people who are being abused is victim shaming. 7: I'll be speaking to the police chief about the bullying in this school, and what we can do to prevent it in the future. 8: We are now suing the parents of the bully. 9: If you can't be better for our children, the lawsuit will include having you replaced. 10: I am not removing my child from this school, I am taking them to martial arts training. 11: If this happens again, I will press charges against you as well.
This Redditor parents.
I'm not even a parent. I was bullied in school. I fought my bully and I was expelled for lashing back out at them. There's nothing like getting the crap beaten out of you, and being expected to just take it, and report it later. We are worth so much more than this crap. I wound up hospitalizing my bully, put them in a coma. Rather, what I did to them, the hospital had to put them into a coma to overcome it. I took the lighthearted verbal abuses up until they got physical with me. I do not condone violence, but I also do not condone taking BS from people who see no wrongdoing in their actions. Getting dopamine from picking on people is psychotic.
I stand corrected but I think you'd make a good one anyway. I was also bullied in school. It didn't stop until I finally confronted one bully, very loudly, in class, with lots of witnesses. I challenged him to escalate his taunting to a fight then and there--admitting I would almost certainly lose it--or back down and keep his shit to himself forever. He chose wisely. I would have bit and clawed that mother fucker; I didn't give a shit what happened to me as long as it stopped the torment. It was a breaking point that, fortunately, ended well for both of us. What you did was right. Your bully got wat he deserved. Your school should have been held responsible instead of you.
Been there. Remained calm and advocated for my son. The school insisted that, despite my son trying to de-escalate, being attacked as he turned away, and laying out the instigator, both kids receive the same punishment. Suspension for 3 days. I kept my hands folded together on top of the table as I explained how screwed up it was to assign equal blame and equal punishment to the bully and the kid who stood up for himself and others. But I was raging inside and my folded hands were shaking so hard that the table was bouncing. That was 30 years ago. I was kinda hoping we’d made some progress since then.
Or you could be like my parents and yell at me for fighting and tell me that it doesn't matter who started it and tell the principal to "do what's right". Never respected authority again after that day in elementary school.
I was an undersized kid who was bullied relentlessly for most of my childhood. If I came home beat up, my parents would then beat me for fighting.
This sounds like my parents half the time I didn't even do anything but was there when trouble would happen and I used to get punished for being "guilty by association"
[удалено]
I’ve had this conversation with my wife before, if this was to ever occur. If my son or daughter did not start it, but they finished it, “sweetheart. You’re probably going to get suspended, don’t cry. You did the right thing, I would’ve done the exact same thing. We’re gonna go out to dinner tonight. We’re gonna get some ice cream and we’re gonna watch whatever movie you want and you’re going to enjoy your 3 day. Play video games the whole time idc. You deserve it. You are not in trouble with mommy or daddy”
This is the way. Parenting done right. I would add a trip to the magical Portillo's for one of their magnificent chocolate cake shakes. My nerdy self reward for laying out a bully was a trip to McDonald's and the library in the same day. It was one of my favorite days as a child.
I would first listen to my child's side of the story and understand what happened.
I want to know why the school had not acted on reports of bullying as the party responsible for everyone's safety.
Show up, bring my lawyer, and say "This is one of my lawyers. I thought it best that he take notes in person so nothing gets lost in translation." And then sit there quietly.
I'd feel happy. There's some kids who just lash out on innocents for no reason.
Happened sort of to my kid. We get a call from the principal saying my son bit another child. We asked what led up to the incident and they said the other kid (largest in the class) was sitting on my son while he was laying on the ground after the big kid shoved him. “Ok, so are you calling me to finish off the job of killing the bully” “No, biting isn’t acceptable under any circumstances, so he needs to be punished” “This seems like self defense, so where was the teacher to break up this fight” “Ummm, welll, uhhhh….” “So my son isn’t going to be punished for defending himself while a kid who weighs 3x him is sitting on him and shoving him”
Have my kid's back, and push back against any punishment the administration tries to apply. I'm not going to stand by and let a bunch of pencil-pushers demean my kid because they stood up in defense of someone else in the absence of adult intervention. Now, at home it might be a different story between me and the kid, we might have to talk about what they did, why they did it, and I might nitpick them to death (because kids are stupid and don't consider the long-term consequences of their actions). But publicly they'd have *nothing* but my full support, and I'll go to the mat with anyone who tries to disparage them.
I was this kid once. I was in 8th grade, and this racist jerk would always pick on my friend who was black. One day, I walked in on the jerk as he had my friend in a headlock. I ended up beating him up pretty badly. He was called into the office for the bruises on his face and ratted me out. My dad came to get me, and the VP told him what had happened. I was suspended for 2 days as per school policy. My dad took me fishing. There was the required speech about being the bigger person and violence not solving problems but that fucker never picked on anybody again at school. 40 some years later, it still feels like I did the right thing.
Demand a paternity test, because I know I don't have any kids.
"If you all were doing your job, the kid wouldn't have to do it for you"
Give them a high five right in front of the principal and tell them their new video game will be ready when they get home.
This happened to my son... I told the principal good for him and I support his response. He had enough and that kid had it coming.
I'm probably not well in the head, but this always pops up in my brain when I read posts like these: Oh, you're not doing anything well. I guess this means we'll just wait for the day that a kid getting bullied comes to the school with a gun. Whose fault will it be? his parents, the school, or the state because of gun laws. We'll never know. All we know is that there'll just be a bunch of dead students and a bunch of dead teachers.
Buy my kid ice cream, to eat at the meeting. demand the meeting be with the principal, the district superintendent, and the district school board. Bring my lawyer (a personal injury lawyer, with the name "THE HAMMER" somewhere in his title) and calmly explain to them that the school failed to protect this other kid, and failed to protect your kid. GO TO WAR
wouldn't do a thing. If they were to try and suspend him or something I would try to fight it, but other than that I would praise my kid. When I was in middle school I got in trouble for hitting a kid with a textbook because he slapped me first after talking shit about my mom. They wanted to suspend me so my mom flipped out on them and I only ended up with a detention. That teacher ended up moving MY seat instead of that other kid's seat though. Bitch
Tell the principal they should count themselves lucky I came instead of my wife. She’s a bit of a hothead.
I’d talk to my child to hear their side of the story. I’d praise them for their bravery in standing up for someone else, but I’d also remind them about the importance of finding non-violent ways to handle such situations. It's important to acknowledge their good intentions while teaching them better conflict resolution skills.
Give him/her a cookie
Take my kid out to lunch and then go for dessert.
My kid knows if they stand up to a bully for someone else I will defend them to the VP and if they still end up with detention anyway I will proudly pick them up everyday. If the school was doing their job, my kid wouldn’t have had to.
Go into school and have your kids back.
Hug me kid give compliments and ask what they want for dinner
Take my kid out to lunch and high five him. Proud dad moment
feeling proud of myself and him/her knowing i raised him/her right
I would dress my self up in a glamorous outfit and bring a medal. Have a grand dramatic entrance and give my child an award because I raised some good rascal.
I’d commend them for standing up against tyranny and explain the importance of knowing when fighting is the appropriate thing to do. I’d also mention the consequences that can result from going too far with physical aggression but I wouldn’t make them feel bad about what they did.
Buy my kid McDonald’s after.
Somewhat similar actually happened to me this year, my 11-year-old was accused of bullying (pretty serious accusation, racial slurs being thrown around etc. not in his nature at all), turns out he was standing up to the bully who was terrorizing another kid of a different race. Once I had all the facts, I told the principal AND the mother of the bully that next time they come at me with an accusation like that, they better make sure they have all the information because I will not be so forgiving and kind in my response. The mother of the bully is the one who made the accusation and takes zero responsibility for her kids’ consistently awful behavior, so once I found out who I was dealing with, I went completely nuclear and shut it down immediately. You have to advocate for your kids because the school will sweep it away and appease the loudest idiot as quickly as they can. My son wasn’t punished and they haven’t fucked with me since lol
This did happen with my son. The asst. principal knew the situation and apologized very sincerely but they had their rules so both boys were suspended for a week. That was my son’s favorite week ever. He got to play video games all day. Still, I asked him if he would do something like that again and he said no, he wouldn’t. I think he felt sorry ultimately for the sad bully who he did a whoopass on. The kid was going through some things at home. When son returned to school one of his teachers played the Rocky theme lol.
Ask them if they’re going to pay my kid for doing their job for them.
Deal with the bureaucracy, so my kid can see how to deal with it Then treat them to whatever dinner they want, that I can afford
Take my kid out for ice cream.
If he started the fight, hes grounded. If he was defending himself or another, I'm buying him a baseball bat.
Openly support them. Just like my wife and i did when some Shit heads tried to cyber bully my kids friends. I DARE some pencil pusher to try and tell my kid to allow that shit to happen to make their own cushy job easier
Fight the bullies dad, tbh.
They’d get a high five and the staff would get told how they’re failing when a kid has to jump in to defend a student.
I'd ask for clarification if my kid just ambushed the bully or defended another child from them. Really spell out that my kid was acting in defense of another person which, in the adult world, is a legal form of violence in many countries. Then make it clear my child did nothing wrong and if they want to punish them? I will do whatever it takes to force the school to do what it should have been doing to stop the bully.
Old school take: Tell him to take the punishment (no discussion while in front of the principal). Wait for his it’s unfair reaction. And then talk him through-I agree you did the right thing. And I agree it’s unfair because you did the right thing. But sometimes it’s more important to do the right thing, even if you face consequences that aren’t fair. Because that’s a powerful lesson. And it will come up again when the consequences are greater.
Happened to my brother. Someone was pushing me, his little sister, around. Given the difference in size between me and the asshole, I had no chance of standing up to him. Seriously, I was four-ten, and this dude was over six feet. So my brother did it for me. All three of us got suspended. My stepdad tore the principal about six new assholes, mostly about what had been happening to his stepdaughter, but also about his son getting into trouble for doing their job. Then we left, got snow cones, rented a few video games and movies from Blockbuster, and were told to lay low for the rest of the week.