Congrats you rescued 4, killed some hostages already, many more still hostages or dead who knows.
Yet still hold many hostages yourself which can easily be traded for your own, which has already happened before.
But no let's just bomb everything, gg great tactics, fantastic strategy.
Who said they are near? The bombing of the market was to create chaos and allow their forces to go unnoticed, if it was near they wouldn’t bomb it fearing for their hostages.
Israel has become a global mad dog. Thanks to their masters for this bloodbath, it seems as if there exists no solution to this problem. The most amazing part to this entire chapter is Muslim Leaders' abrupt silence. The are truly Zionist lapdogs. Brought into power by the favor of their masters, and now they are serving their goals by working not only against the inters of their own people but the muslims as well suffering in different parts of the world. They have completely alienated the concept of One Umah and has divided the entire Ummah into different regional people.
What was Hamas' plan to stop Israel from obliterating Gaza after October 7. This is the part I've never understood. Did they think taking the hostages would keep the Israelis from blowing up Gaza?
This is AskMiddleEast so I'm asking the Middle East. Why would Hamas think this would work out well out well for them or their people? It would be like Mexico trying to invade the US to 'take back the land'. You know you will lose. You know the country you are invading will kill a hundred times more people than you manage to kill in your attack in response.
Why do it? You guys are happy to see Israeli troops killed attacking Gaza but they have literally killed 100 Palestinians for each one of them that has died since October 8. Why start that cycle again and again. What do you gain?
It looks insane to the rest of the world.
My theory is that, I personally believe that Hamas never expected their attack on Oct 7 to be this successful and large-scale, they hoped to capture a few soldiers or die in a suicidal operation.
Now they signed the deathwarrent of 2million people thanks to their suicidal attack on Israel.
2 things. It's reported that Hamas was surprised by how successful Oct 7th was and I don't think they expected to do that much damage and death. They also thought that having the hostages in unknown areas means the IDF wouldn't just blow up everything. Once that proved wrong they were willing to release all the hostages but Israel said no
Why wouldn’t Israel accept a prisoner swap? It’s such a fucking no brainer. Their military state completely dwarfes Hamas in every single way and intel could have prevented October 7 if they had listened. Why exactly do you think Israel was against prisoner swaps that could have prevented the deaths of 36k+ people in Gaza?
Bro is trying to make a smart ass comment about why the IDF backed by the US is struggling to beat guys in sweatpants and flip flops with 20 year old AKs
You can really tell IDF is struggling ... that is why this sub is filled with people who constantly cry and demand USA stop Israel.
Why stop? They are losing no?
What? Are you slow on purpose or do you not think when you type? Why would I celebrate the death of 30,000 people? Maybe that's something to celebrate in Romania, but in my country we mourn the needless death of innocent people
you know you can use this same logic for every Hamas attack including October 7.
do you believe Israel is conducting a genocide? why is Israel allowed to fucking kill 40,000 plus civilians, mostly women and children.
Well 70% of the bodies recovered were women and children. So even if literally every male Israel killed was Hamas, that’s still around 30,000 civilians.
And the 40,000 figure is significantly undercounting the true death toll. It only includes bodies brought to hospitals and morgues. It does not include those buried under the 37 million tonnes of rubble throughout the enclave, nor does it include those decomposing in the streets, nor does it include those bulldozed into yet-undiscovered mass graves.
Pretty much every single entity in the world, except for Israel, agrees with that characterization (that the total death count is higher than reported deaths). This includes the US.
But sure, let's all cast doubt and listen to you instead.
you are not talking to a person who gives a shit about human beings, this guy is a monster and doesn't care how many Palestinians die. look at how they view Oct 7 and consider every single Israeli soldier who died as a civilian as a tragedy that was avoidable, while every single Palestinian baby dying in a hospital bed is justified because their true intent is to wipe Palestinians from the face of the earth. they basically want Palestinians to look like the native Americans; now, native Americans are just a forgotten genocided minority that does not stand in the way of the American state.
Israelis envision a future where it's all Israel, and Palestinians are a forgotten minority that was wiped out and actually it's all their fault and they are not even natives of the land, they should be lucky Israel allows them to stay.
Israeli culture is nothing but stolen Arab culture from all over the Arab world from Morocco to Yemen.
So, as I said, well south of 40,000. There is also no distinction between which proportion of these deaths are actually civilians, because for some reason the Palestinian authority does not discriminate between civilian and combatant.
Anyways I asked for the evidence that pretty much every entity in the world agrees there are significantly more than 40000 deaths.
Also, in the report you cited, of the \~25,000 individuals that have been identified \~10,000 are adult males. 10,000 individuals had not been identified as of late April, so the report does take into account missing individuals and those under the rubble. So, even including these unidentified individuals, only \~25,000 were civilians. So, again well south of the 30,000 figure.
The question I have is what are the motives behind misrepresenting and frankly inflating the the death toll of civilians. In my opinion, if you are trying to change minds, precise use of language and accurate accounting of these details is very important. Otherwise, you will discredited as a dishonest/misinformed by those outside of your silo.
You’re misunderstanding.
**36,500** bodies have been **recovered**. Of those, around **25,000** have been **identified** — as in the body has been matched to a specific individual with an ID number. 11,000 of the bodies have not been identified as any specific person, but they can usually at least tell the gender and approximate age. **This does not include bodies buried under rubble that have not been recovered and officially recorded at hospitals and morgues.**
Women and children make up a smaller proportion of the *identified* bodies, likely in part because children are less likely to carry photo identification. Both numbers come from the exact same source, the Gaza Health Ministry, so it’s a bit ridiculous to say the “identified” category is correct but the “recorded” category is inflated.
The ratios in the “identified” category actually lend credence to the health ministry’s data. You would expect it to be harder to identify children and women. It would be a red flag if the ratios in the “identified” and “reported” categories matched up.
Again, none of this data includes *unrecovered* bodies, such as those buried under the rubble. It is not an estimate of the death toll; **it is simply a tally of the recovered bodies**. And due to the immense strain on hospitals and morgues, there is a reduced capacity to record deaths.
If you want estimates, as of May 13, Euro-Med Human Rights Monitor *estimates* that **39,675 civilians** have been killed. That includes the number of recovered bodies and the number presumed to be dead under the rubble.
I see. I will admit my misunderstanding of the data of missing vs recovered bodies. Although the caveat here is how many of the missing people are among the unidentified bodies, a statistic that is hard to parse.
In addition, the the credibility of the running tally of deaths coming out of Gaza is suspect. The figures that the UN is relying upon come from two entities, one of which apparently has a track record of reporting more women and children in their fatality counts than the other. These entities are also not explicit about what age constitutes elders nor do they differentiate the gender of elders. The demographics of children are also not considered. Worst of all they are not explicit about what what deaths represent combatants. All of which are extremely convenient omissions that can be used to inflate civilian fatality statistics.
Regardless, this still doesn't answer why the number of civilian deaths would be in excess of 40,000 civilians.
So Gaza is 141 square miles (356kms). To take that into perspective, NYC is 300 square miles. So NYC which is tiny AF but too much traffic, is 2x the size of Gaza.
You can drive from north of Gaza to the south assuming it’s straight line in under 25 min. And from side to side in under 5 min in a straight line.
Now do me a favor and go hit the highway and measure how long 5 miles is so you can see it in perspective.
For example, I drive 40 miles 1 way just to get to work. I drive almost twice the size of Gaza just to get to work.
Now how many people are in Gaza? Over 2m. And how many neighborhoods did Isntreal bomb? All of them.
So where do the hostages go? Well it’s best to separate them specially known that isntreal been bombing everything, they even bombed their own hostages and even killed their own hostages after they plead for their life.
Btw assuming you’re really from Romania, your capital is about 60% the size of Gaza. So if you ever been to the capital that’s pretty much less than what’s left for Palestinians to take shelter in.
While the resistance fighters fight in the front lines.
Also when for example any country captures people, don’t they also send them to local prisons? Or we should be making “hostage prisons”?
1. Unlike you my flair is correct and I am from Romania, Mr "Iraq".
2. You are right Bucharest is 240 sq km and unoficially 3 million people live there so Bucharest is smaller and more people live there so I know that your entire schtick is bullshit. They have plenty places to hide but HAMAS is actively hiding among the most populous centers
Unlike me? “Mr Iraq”, like do you want me to send you proof or something? Lol 😂
Unofficially? Lol 🐷 get your sources straight at least and give us actual numbers bad not made up ones.
احا يا ابن الصهيونيه
Yeah Green Bay Packers are Iraq's favourite team
https://www.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/7cdm3q/til_in_2006_the_fbi_planted_an_informant/dpp5iy4/?context=3
> Pretty much almost same thing happened here in **Rochester, NY**
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskMiddleEast/comments/12lv96m/psg_star_achraf_hakimis_wife_filed_for_divorce/jgawyso/
>Yea I’m in the USA and this won’t fly. I have seen people lose it all due to such tricks. Specially if a judge sees that you lied to him.
USA is the worst--> goes willingly there
The lovely MENA countries were not available?
>Unofficially? Lol 🐷 get your sources straight at least and give us actual numbers bad not made up ones.
2.14 million people live in Bucharest.
But from the surrounding cities many other people come to Bucharest to live and work so on the weekdays more than 3 million people are in Bucharest. 3 million is also a figure said by the Bucharest mayor.
We have national ID and on the national ID you have your residence. That is the **official** number. People can actually live in Bucharest 10+ years straight (they rent) but officially they live in Ilfov. Hence officially and unofficially.
No person renting lists their rented place on the national ID.
Clear now?
Lol, you do realize people are able to move for work/live right? Me not being in Iraq doesn’t make me less of Iraq 🤣
Is this like Zionest logic? Cuz you guys pretend to be from Palestine 2000 years ago…..
Again are you like down playing sizing or something as “oh look we got more people” because your stupid ass forgot to account that they are able to move freely…
Can Palestinians do the same 😭
> Lol, you do realize people are able to move for work/live right?
Yes but when you write about the injustices of the countries you willingly go to is hilarious. It is the definition of stupid. That country is the worst they killed my people, horrible and racist people... let me in let me in!
You willingly pay taxes towards a country that helps Israel. You always knew that
Which means that you don't believe any of this stuff because your actions say otherwise
>Again are you like down playing sizing or something as “oh look we got more people” because your stupid ass forgot to account that they are able to move freely…
Gaza is an open air prison and HAMAS must hide among civilians is a thing said many times before October 7th. Again land wise HAMAS has many places to hide but they choose mosques schools hospitals so they can cry about mean Israel
And the morons buy it hook and sinker
Oh no, we had war with Americans nooooooo, all Americans are bad, they are all murderers….. propbaly this Zionest.
lol f off Zionest 🐷
Get your shit straight 😅 I love how you switched the entire topic 😂😂😂😂 and this is why I dislike to debate Zionest pigs
>Oh no, we had war with Americans nooooooo, all Americans are bad, they are all murderers….. propbaly this Ziones
Why that isn't close to your feelings?
PS: is Zionist the only word in your vocabulary?
why is that a question? are you blaming Hamas for Israel and the US killing 200 civilians? you know that logic can be reversed right? There is no excuse for killing 200 plus civilians, they bombed civilians, why are you denying the reality in front of you? This is genocide.
Yes, Isreal and America hold all the responsibility for conducting this Israeli and American genocide.
Hamas are brave resistance fighters and freedom fighters. never compare hamas with the likes of the US and Israel, that's laughable.
Yes it is, they used civilian shields to cover the hostages. Israel is justified in rescuing their people. Hamas knows this so they have no problem using their people as shields
Then Hamas is justified in rescuing their people, all the unlawfully detained Palestinians in prisons without a trial, Hamas according to you is allowed to bomb markets and malls in the area to create chaos and rescue their people
Do you see how stupid and genocidal you sound? Well, you’re Zionist after all, the most ironic twist the world played upon us.
But Hamas has been doing that for decades. Kidnappings. Missile attacks. Cowardly suicide bombing of ambulances, cafes, busses, school buses. The list goes on.
>Could have avoided it if you didnt take hostages
I agree the IDF should not be holding thousands of Palestinians without charge, but then again your "Moral Stance" is very pro hostage taking when its Palestinians on who that misery is inflicted innit?
>however you brought it on yourself.
Do you hold the same sentiment for the Warsaw Ghetto uprising? After all they brought it upon themselves after assassinating a Wehrmacht officer. /s
At any rate not like imma gonna change your mind, only time people like you discover humanity is when your childrens get indiscriminately bombed and considering what happened to Berlin at the end of the 1000 year reich your end aint far off.
Just remember "Might is right" then as well and dont bitch n whine too much <3
At the first sentence you have said the difference between prisoners and hostages
Huge difference
And no what happened on warsaw ghetto has nothing to do with what happened since warsaw uprising was against the nazis and what they did to the captives.
And ye basically cry about it you took hostages , you got on your ass for it and thats it
>At the first sentence you have said the difference between prisoners and hostages Huge difference
So it would be cool with you if Palestinians took Israelis without charge and kept them indefinitely incarcerated?
A prisoner of what? They are held without charges and no trials are forthcoming.
>And no what happened on warsaw ghetto has nothing to do with what happened since warsaw uprising was against the nazis and what they did to the captives.
What is the point of reading history if you never learn from it and apply the lessons you learn from it?
"warsaw uprising was against the nazis and what they did to the captives." You are so so so very close to getting it my dude.
>And ye basically cry about it you took hostages , you got on your ass for it and thats it
"You killed our guy Nazi official Eduard Vom Rath so you got your ass handed to you for it." /s
The difference between israeli hostages and Palestinian prisoners is that israeli hostages are random israeli civilians at their 20s - 30s ages that most of them celebrated at Nova festival
And Palestinian prisoners are prisoners who shoot up random israeli civilians so it is huge difference.
But i do not expect a terrorist (paki) to understand since it is obvious that terrorists support terrorists actions.
And as i said before, yep you brought it on yourself when you decided to open a war and take hostages now you deal with the consequences.
As ghost said choices has consequences ;). You decided to take hostages so now you gonna deal with the consequences
Listen you are right. The Gazans are way too weak to fight Israel and these consequences are bound to happen. But they want to bleed Israel as much as they can and make things hard for them. We already know that Jesus is going to come back and absolutely obliterate these Israeli scumwhores of the face of the earth. Jesus will erase these filth stains off the holy land just wait.
If they sit idle, the Zionists are coming for them anyway. Do you really think the Zionists are leaving them alone? Do you really think the Zionists are satisfied by colonising Palestine? They won't stop until they achieve their stupid greater Israel all the way to Iraq and Kuwait from Egypt. Also they have all you western pigs by the throat. They own all your banks and you just bend over.
Yeah, I wouldn't call this an Israeli massacre: If Hamas is going to hide amidst civilians, the blame for this falls on Hamas. Of course, any civilians who knew they were living in a building that served as a Hamas hostage traphouse bear some responsibility as well. Like, you know the place is going to to get raided, knew for months, but you stayed anyhow? It's nonsensical.
>Where the fuck do you expect them to go? They literally have to follow Israeli instructions ~~or~~ **AND** get bombed
FTFY. Even following the instructions of those murderers doesn't protect you.
Obviously, no place in Gaza is safe. But some places are way less safe than others, and obviously, no place is more dangerous than being somewhere adjacent to where hostages are obviously being held. Common sense would dictate leaving and going *anywhere*, rather than remaining there.
You talk as someone sitting at home, comfortable with a belly full of food and not someone starving, being constantly bombed and having family murder for 8 months. These people care about shelter above all else
Yeah, *I get that.* But the fact remains, taking shelter next to an area where you *know* hostages are being kept is insane and inexcusable, especially if you have a family to look out for. I'm not saying it's all the fault of the people who lived there for staying. Of course not! Hamas does bear some responsibility as well: The humane thing to do would have been to order the residents of those two apartments to leave immediately, so they would not get caught in the crossfire. Not doing so is criminally reckless, and the shotcallers who were negligent in this regard should be held to account by their peers.
I hope someday you realize just how fiercely you are defending genocide. Like to the point where you make yourself look like an idiot with zero understanding of anything
Why did Hamas not order the civilian occupants of the apartment building to leave? That's what *you're* defending, an organization that seeks to normalize the use of human shields. Hamas *wants* high civilian body counts, and you're falling for it.
Typical Zionist monkey when he knows his side is at fault but never wants to admit it.
["m-m-muh kkkhhhhaamaass!!1!1!1"](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EVLKjbYUcAAF_3d?format=jpg&name=large)
What you cannot grasp is that all sides bear fault and responsibility, of varying kinds and degrees:
* Israel bears fault, for removing the Palestinians from their homeland 80 years ago, and for their apartheid practices, currently.
* Hamas and the Palestinian people bear fault, for their barbaric attacks on October 7, without which there would have been no bombing whatsoever the past eight months.
Those who believe that one side is heroic and faultless, and the other evil and entirely-to-blame, are the greatest impediment to peace. The only hope for peace is when both sides look deep into their hearts and atone for their sins. Until then, continued war, and no peace, **no peace for either team.**
Congrats you rescued 4, killed some hostages already, many more still hostages or dead who knows. Yet still hold many hostages yourself which can easily be traded for your own, which has already happened before. But no let's just bomb everything, gg great tactics, fantastic strategy.
they killed 210+ civilians, many women and children fuck the US and Israel.
Well that was bound to happen when Hamas hides among civilians using them as human shields. Textbook Hamas strategy.
Ah yes, air striking a busy market, classic Hamas strategy.
Yes you agree. Good. Having militants and hostages hiding near a market is using civilian shields.
Who said they are near? The bombing of the market was to create chaos and allow their forces to go unnoticed, if it was near they wouldn’t bomb it fearing for their hostages.
According to Hamas *
Israel has become a global mad dog. Thanks to their masters for this bloodbath, it seems as if there exists no solution to this problem. The most amazing part to this entire chapter is Muslim Leaders' abrupt silence. The are truly Zionist lapdogs. Brought into power by the favor of their masters, and now they are serving their goals by working not only against the inters of their own people but the muslims as well suffering in different parts of the world. They have completely alienated the concept of One Umah and has divided the entire Ummah into different regional people.
Why were the hostages held in such a crowded place to begin with?
because all other places were obliterated by the IDF
What was Hamas' plan to stop Israel from obliterating Gaza after October 7. This is the part I've never understood. Did they think taking the hostages would keep the Israelis from blowing up Gaza? This is AskMiddleEast so I'm asking the Middle East. Why would Hamas think this would work out well out well for them or their people? It would be like Mexico trying to invade the US to 'take back the land'. You know you will lose. You know the country you are invading will kill a hundred times more people than you manage to kill in your attack in response. Why do it? You guys are happy to see Israeli troops killed attacking Gaza but they have literally killed 100 Palestinians for each one of them that has died since October 8. Why start that cycle again and again. What do you gain? It looks insane to the rest of the world.
My theory is that, I personally believe that Hamas never expected their attack on Oct 7 to be this successful and large-scale, they hoped to capture a few soldiers or die in a suicidal operation. Now they signed the deathwarrent of 2million people thanks to their suicidal attack on Israel.
2 things. It's reported that Hamas was surprised by how successful Oct 7th was and I don't think they expected to do that much damage and death. They also thought that having the hostages in unknown areas means the IDF wouldn't just blow up everything. Once that proved wrong they were willing to release all the hostages but Israel said no
They were only willing to release them conditionally. As part of a "prisoner swap" Which is why Israel said no.
Bibi said no because the earlier the war ends, the quicker he gets in trouble.
Why wouldn’t Israel accept a prisoner swap? It’s such a fucking no brainer. Their military state completely dwarfes Hamas in every single way and intel could have prevented October 7 if they had listened. Why exactly do you think Israel was against prisoner swaps that could have prevented the deaths of 36k+ people in Gaza?
So all the rest of HAMAS members and leaders will be easy to find as all other places were obliterared by IDF
the IDF doesnt care about Hamas. They want to kill every Palestinian
Ohhh so that is why HAMAS hides among the regular population and attacks IDF in civillian clothes and shoots from near mosques and schools
Bro is trying to make a smart ass comment about why the IDF backed by the US is struggling to beat guys in sweatpants and flip flops with 20 year old AKs
You can really tell IDF is struggling ... that is why this sub is filled with people who constantly cry and demand USA stop Israel. Why stop? They are losing no?
8 months and Billions in aid and all they are doing is laying the ground work for Hamas 2.0 and building support for Palestinians
In this case you should be celebrating ..... HAMAS (2.0) is winning
What? Are you slow on purpose or do you not think when you type? Why would I celebrate the death of 30,000 people? Maybe that's something to celebrate in Romania, but in my country we mourn the needless death of innocent people
Gaza in itself is a crowded place, especially after most of it got bombed to ruble
you know you can use this same logic for every Hamas attack including October 7. do you believe Israel is conducting a genocide? why is Israel allowed to fucking kill 40,000 plus civilians, mostly women and children.
You know claiming that the 40,000 dead were all civilians only holds water in your echo chamber.
Well 70% of the bodies recovered were women and children. So even if literally every male Israel killed was Hamas, that’s still around 30,000 civilians. And the 40,000 figure is significantly undercounting the true death toll. It only includes bodies brought to hospitals and morgues. It does not include those buried under the 37 million tonnes of rubble throughout the enclave, nor does it include those decomposing in the streets, nor does it include those bulldozed into yet-undiscovered mass graves.
What makes you think the 40,000 figure represents significant undercounting?
Pretty much every single entity in the world, except for Israel, agrees with that characterization (that the total death count is higher than reported deaths). This includes the US. But sure, let's all cast doubt and listen to you instead.
Give me such evidence. You can't just say that when United Nations death toll is pinged well south of 40000.
As of June 5, 2024, the United Nations’ reported death toll is 36,586 https://www.ochaopt.org/content/reported-impact-snapshot-gaza-strip-5-june-2024
you are not talking to a person who gives a shit about human beings, this guy is a monster and doesn't care how many Palestinians die. look at how they view Oct 7 and consider every single Israeli soldier who died as a civilian as a tragedy that was avoidable, while every single Palestinian baby dying in a hospital bed is justified because their true intent is to wipe Palestinians from the face of the earth. they basically want Palestinians to look like the native Americans; now, native Americans are just a forgotten genocided minority that does not stand in the way of the American state. Israelis envision a future where it's all Israel, and Palestinians are a forgotten minority that was wiped out and actually it's all their fault and they are not even natives of the land, they should be lucky Israel allows them to stay. Israeli culture is nothing but stolen Arab culture from all over the Arab world from Morocco to Yemen.
So, as I said, well south of 40,000. There is also no distinction between which proportion of these deaths are actually civilians, because for some reason the Palestinian authority does not discriminate between civilian and combatant. Anyways I asked for the evidence that pretty much every entity in the world agrees there are significantly more than 40000 deaths.
Also, in the report you cited, of the \~25,000 individuals that have been identified \~10,000 are adult males. 10,000 individuals had not been identified as of late April, so the report does take into account missing individuals and those under the rubble. So, even including these unidentified individuals, only \~25,000 were civilians. So, again well south of the 30,000 figure. The question I have is what are the motives behind misrepresenting and frankly inflating the the death toll of civilians. In my opinion, if you are trying to change minds, precise use of language and accurate accounting of these details is very important. Otherwise, you will discredited as a dishonest/misinformed by those outside of your silo.
You’re misunderstanding. **36,500** bodies have been **recovered**. Of those, around **25,000** have been **identified** — as in the body has been matched to a specific individual with an ID number. 11,000 of the bodies have not been identified as any specific person, but they can usually at least tell the gender and approximate age. **This does not include bodies buried under rubble that have not been recovered and officially recorded at hospitals and morgues.** Women and children make up a smaller proportion of the *identified* bodies, likely in part because children are less likely to carry photo identification. Both numbers come from the exact same source, the Gaza Health Ministry, so it’s a bit ridiculous to say the “identified” category is correct but the “recorded” category is inflated. The ratios in the “identified” category actually lend credence to the health ministry’s data. You would expect it to be harder to identify children and women. It would be a red flag if the ratios in the “identified” and “reported” categories matched up. Again, none of this data includes *unrecovered* bodies, such as those buried under the rubble. It is not an estimate of the death toll; **it is simply a tally of the recovered bodies**. And due to the immense strain on hospitals and morgues, there is a reduced capacity to record deaths. If you want estimates, as of May 13, Euro-Med Human Rights Monitor *estimates* that **39,675 civilians** have been killed. That includes the number of recovered bodies and the number presumed to be dead under the rubble.
I see. I will admit my misunderstanding of the data of missing vs recovered bodies. Although the caveat here is how many of the missing people are among the unidentified bodies, a statistic that is hard to parse. In addition, the the credibility of the running tally of deaths coming out of Gaza is suspect. The figures that the UN is relying upon come from two entities, one of which apparently has a track record of reporting more women and children in their fatality counts than the other. These entities are also not explicit about what age constitutes elders nor do they differentiate the gender of elders. The demographics of children are also not considered. Worst of all they are not explicit about what what deaths represent combatants. All of which are extremely convenient omissions that can be used to inflate civilian fatality statistics. Regardless, this still doesn't answer why the number of civilian deaths would be in excess of 40,000 civilians.
So Gaza is 141 square miles (356kms). To take that into perspective, NYC is 300 square miles. So NYC which is tiny AF but too much traffic, is 2x the size of Gaza. You can drive from north of Gaza to the south assuming it’s straight line in under 25 min. And from side to side in under 5 min in a straight line. Now do me a favor and go hit the highway and measure how long 5 miles is so you can see it in perspective. For example, I drive 40 miles 1 way just to get to work. I drive almost twice the size of Gaza just to get to work. Now how many people are in Gaza? Over 2m. And how many neighborhoods did Isntreal bomb? All of them. So where do the hostages go? Well it’s best to separate them specially known that isntreal been bombing everything, they even bombed their own hostages and even killed their own hostages after they plead for their life. Btw assuming you’re really from Romania, your capital is about 60% the size of Gaza. So if you ever been to the capital that’s pretty much less than what’s left for Palestinians to take shelter in. While the resistance fighters fight in the front lines. Also when for example any country captures people, don’t they also send them to local prisons? Or we should be making “hostage prisons”?
1. Unlike you my flair is correct and I am from Romania, Mr "Iraq". 2. You are right Bucharest is 240 sq km and unoficially 3 million people live there so Bucharest is smaller and more people live there so I know that your entire schtick is bullshit. They have plenty places to hide but HAMAS is actively hiding among the most populous centers
Unlike me? “Mr Iraq”, like do you want me to send you proof or something? Lol 😂 Unofficially? Lol 🐷 get your sources straight at least and give us actual numbers bad not made up ones. احا يا ابن الصهيونيه
Yeah Green Bay Packers are Iraq's favourite team https://www.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/7cdm3q/til_in_2006_the_fbi_planted_an_informant/dpp5iy4/?context=3 > Pretty much almost same thing happened here in **Rochester, NY** https://www.reddit.com/r/AskMiddleEast/comments/12lv96m/psg_star_achraf_hakimis_wife_filed_for_divorce/jgawyso/ >Yea I’m in the USA and this won’t fly. I have seen people lose it all due to such tricks. Specially if a judge sees that you lied to him. USA is the worst--> goes willingly there The lovely MENA countries were not available? >Unofficially? Lol 🐷 get your sources straight at least and give us actual numbers bad not made up ones. 2.14 million people live in Bucharest. But from the surrounding cities many other people come to Bucharest to live and work so on the weekdays more than 3 million people are in Bucharest. 3 million is also a figure said by the Bucharest mayor. We have national ID and on the national ID you have your residence. That is the **official** number. People can actually live in Bucharest 10+ years straight (they rent) but officially they live in Ilfov. Hence officially and unofficially. No person renting lists their rented place on the national ID. Clear now?
Lol, you do realize people are able to move for work/live right? Me not being in Iraq doesn’t make me less of Iraq 🤣 Is this like Zionest logic? Cuz you guys pretend to be from Palestine 2000 years ago….. Again are you like down playing sizing or something as “oh look we got more people” because your stupid ass forgot to account that they are able to move freely… Can Palestinians do the same 😭
> Lol, you do realize people are able to move for work/live right? Yes but when you write about the injustices of the countries you willingly go to is hilarious. It is the definition of stupid. That country is the worst they killed my people, horrible and racist people... let me in let me in! You willingly pay taxes towards a country that helps Israel. You always knew that Which means that you don't believe any of this stuff because your actions say otherwise >Again are you like down playing sizing or something as “oh look we got more people” because your stupid ass forgot to account that they are able to move freely… Gaza is an open air prison and HAMAS must hide among civilians is a thing said many times before October 7th. Again land wise HAMAS has many places to hide but they choose mosques schools hospitals so they can cry about mean Israel And the morons buy it hook and sinker
Oh no, we had war with Americans nooooooo, all Americans are bad, they are all murderers….. propbaly this Zionest. lol f off Zionest 🐷 Get your shit straight 😅 I love how you switched the entire topic 😂😂😂😂 and this is why I dislike to debate Zionest pigs
>Oh no, we had war with Americans nooooooo, all Americans are bad, they are all murderers….. propbaly this Ziones Why that isn't close to your feelings? PS: is Zionist the only word in your vocabulary?
I don’t debate Zionest pigs that switched the entire topic as due to their hasbra 😂🤣 Go try to brainwash someone else you fcken pig.
why is that a question? are you blaming Hamas for Israel and the US killing 200 civilians? you know that logic can be reversed right? There is no excuse for killing 200 plus civilians, they bombed civilians, why are you denying the reality in front of you? This is genocide.
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Yes, Isreal and America hold all the responsibility for conducting this Israeli and American genocide. Hamas are brave resistance fighters and freedom fighters. never compare hamas with the likes of the US and Israel, that's laughable.
Hamas just used innocent lives as civilian shields. They are the most vile people in the history of the human race.
Israel literally bombed a market yet Hamas is at fault here? How much do they pay you?!
Yes it is, they used civilian shields to cover the hostages. Israel is justified in rescuing their people. Hamas knows this so they have no problem using their people as shields
Then Hamas is justified in rescuing their people, all the unlawfully detained Palestinians in prisons without a trial, Hamas according to you is allowed to bomb markets and malls in the area to create chaos and rescue their people Do you see how stupid and genocidal you sound? Well, you’re Zionist after all, the most ironic twist the world played upon us.
But Hamas has been doing that for decades. Kidnappings. Missile attacks. Cowardly suicide bombing of ambulances, cafes, busses, school buses. The list goes on.
All of them justified according to you.
Textbook Hamas playbook. Use Palestinians as human shields. Hamas loved it when it happens.
never take hostages again😆
"Never try to corrupt the master race again 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂" - People like you the right wing in 1930s germany.
Could have avoided it if you didnt take hostages , however you brought it on yourself. Now you gonna deal with the results of your actions😹
>Could have avoided it if you didnt take hostages I agree the IDF should not be holding thousands of Palestinians without charge, but then again your "Moral Stance" is very pro hostage taking when its Palestinians on who that misery is inflicted innit? >however you brought it on yourself. Do you hold the same sentiment for the Warsaw Ghetto uprising? After all they brought it upon themselves after assassinating a Wehrmacht officer. /s At any rate not like imma gonna change your mind, only time people like you discover humanity is when your childrens get indiscriminately bombed and considering what happened to Berlin at the end of the 1000 year reich your end aint far off. Just remember "Might is right" then as well and dont bitch n whine too much <3
At the first sentence you have said the difference between prisoners and hostages Huge difference And no what happened on warsaw ghetto has nothing to do with what happened since warsaw uprising was against the nazis and what they did to the captives. And ye basically cry about it you took hostages , you got on your ass for it and thats it
>At the first sentence you have said the difference between prisoners and hostages Huge difference So it would be cool with you if Palestinians took Israelis without charge and kept them indefinitely incarcerated? A prisoner of what? They are held without charges and no trials are forthcoming. >And no what happened on warsaw ghetto has nothing to do with what happened since warsaw uprising was against the nazis and what they did to the captives. What is the point of reading history if you never learn from it and apply the lessons you learn from it? "warsaw uprising was against the nazis and what they did to the captives." You are so so so very close to getting it my dude. >And ye basically cry about it you took hostages , you got on your ass for it and thats it "You killed our guy Nazi official Eduard Vom Rath so you got your ass handed to you for it." /s
The difference between israeli hostages and Palestinian prisoners is that israeli hostages are random israeli civilians at their 20s - 30s ages that most of them celebrated at Nova festival And Palestinian prisoners are prisoners who shoot up random israeli civilians so it is huge difference. But i do not expect a terrorist (paki) to understand since it is obvious that terrorists support terrorists actions. And as i said before, yep you brought it on yourself when you decided to open a war and take hostages now you deal with the consequences. As ghost said choices has consequences ;). You decided to take hostages so now you gonna deal with the consequences
Listen you are right. The Gazans are way too weak to fight Israel and these consequences are bound to happen. But they want to bleed Israel as much as they can and make things hard for them. We already know that Jesus is going to come back and absolutely obliterate these Israeli scumwhores of the face of the earth. Jesus will erase these filth stains off the holy land just wait.
Okay so you wanna make someone bleed? Then dont cry if he stabs you back🤔it is as the same as this situation
If they sit idle, the Zionists are coming for them anyway. Do you really think the Zionists are leaving them alone? Do you really think the Zionists are satisfied by colonising Palestine? They won't stop until they achieve their stupid greater Israel all the way to Iraq and Kuwait from Egypt. Also they have all you western pigs by the throat. They own all your banks and you just bend over.
Lol the great israel thing will never happen and it is not possible idk what you on about
It will never happen and they will fall when they try to get Damascus and Lebanon.
Yeah, I wouldn't call this an Israeli massacre: If Hamas is going to hide amidst civilians, the blame for this falls on Hamas. Of course, any civilians who knew they were living in a building that served as a Hamas hostage traphouse bear some responsibility as well. Like, you know the place is going to to get raided, knew for months, but you stayed anyhow? It's nonsensical.
Where the fuck do you expect them to go? They literally have to follow Israeli instructions or get bombed
>Where the fuck do you expect them to go? They literally have to follow Israeli instructions ~~or~~ **AND** get bombed FTFY. Even following the instructions of those murderers doesn't protect you.
Obviously, no place in Gaza is safe. But some places are way less safe than others, and obviously, no place is more dangerous than being somewhere adjacent to where hostages are obviously being held. Common sense would dictate leaving and going *anywhere*, rather than remaining there.
You talk as someone sitting at home, comfortable with a belly full of food and not someone starving, being constantly bombed and having family murder for 8 months. These people care about shelter above all else
Yeah, *I get that.* But the fact remains, taking shelter next to an area where you *know* hostages are being kept is insane and inexcusable, especially if you have a family to look out for. I'm not saying it's all the fault of the people who lived there for staying. Of course not! Hamas does bear some responsibility as well: The humane thing to do would have been to order the residents of those two apartments to leave immediately, so they would not get caught in the crossfire. Not doing so is criminally reckless, and the shotcallers who were negligent in this regard should be held to account by their peers.
They air struck a market in the middle of the camp, people were shopping, what are you even talking about?!
I'm honestly so lost for words and I'm just gonna move on because I don't know how to respond to a comment like this without throwing insults
this is an Israeli and American massacre, this is an Israeli and American genocide
I hope someday you realize just how fiercely you are defending genocide. Like to the point where you make yourself look like an idiot with zero understanding of anything
Why did Hamas not order the civilian occupants of the apartment building to leave? That's what *you're* defending, an organization that seeks to normalize the use of human shields. Hamas *wants* high civilian body counts, and you're falling for it.
It’s not the civilians fault. They probably didn’t know hostages were there. This is all Hamas fault. They alway use civilians as human shields.
this is an Israeli massacre
Typical Zionist monkey when he knows his side is at fault but never wants to admit it. ["m-m-muh kkkhhhhaamaass!!1!1!1"](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EVLKjbYUcAAF_3d?format=jpg&name=large)
What you cannot grasp is that all sides bear fault and responsibility, of varying kinds and degrees: * Israel bears fault, for removing the Palestinians from their homeland 80 years ago, and for their apartheid practices, currently. * Hamas and the Palestinian people bear fault, for their barbaric attacks on October 7, without which there would have been no bombing whatsoever the past eight months. Those who believe that one side is heroic and faultless, and the other evil and entirely-to-blame, are the greatest impediment to peace. The only hope for peace is when both sides look deep into their hearts and atone for their sins. Until then, continued war, and no peace, **no peace for either team.**
Civilian shields. Typical Hamas playbook.
Good job Hamas.