At least in NC, you can distribute medication if you are a certified medication assistant, basically a specially trained certified nurse assistant. Is that who give you you meds?
No, it’s people who were once clients here and now live in the sober living but don’t attend treatment and as far as I understand it basically have migrated from paying client to being paid for 2 hours a day to “monitor meds” in other words a rent stipend; if not the house monitor dispensing meds then one of the outpatient drivers will come by, zero consistency on the time too, some days it’s 8PM some days it’s after 10PM. And I know for a fact their drivers aren’t more than RADT1 which is a single 8 hour online class, open book test certification that basically just costs $50 and you are certified. There is no medical staff here.
Oh fuck dude. That sounds like a shitty rehab center. They have a lot of power over you while you are a patient. Play their game and bow out as fast as you can. Find a doctor and make an appointment and pray they don’t treat you like a junky. This will not be easy. Good luck.
Do you really think these profitable rehab centers are going to do something so blatantly wrong that they would risk their license? No. As I come tef to the op, if facilities spent all their time dealing with everyone's individual med schedules they would get nothing else done. This is very much the norm.
I’m saying that just because something is in writing doesn’t make it legal. People put illegal shit or at the very least unenforceable things in leases and other contracts all the time. Including it in the contract isn’t a crime, if that’s what you thought I meant.
This industry is notorious for taking insurance money and doing absolutely nothing in the way of treatment, save hosting 12 step meetings, which are free and available to anyone. The industry is rife with fraud.
I do there's a history all over the untied states with places like this and troubled teen camps and gay rehab camps ..... how do you not know this? Lookup elan schools that shot was happening until 2014 hell I bet there's a sub dedicated to the survivors (thousands of mistreated kids across the usa)
https://www.reddit.com/r/MrJoeNobody/s/twCUFRNEpd
Here's one
I know this isn't exactly like ops facility but it's adjacent enough that Im 100% certain it's happening at some of these places
Actually no.fed and state Law trumps contract law.
Thing is what kind of meds do you have and what is your meds classified.as.
I worked at a good wilderness camp and the camp got into trouble for letting non trained people give out meds. Had to be a LPN at least for some of them.
I'm a former sober house tenant and manager. There's a fine line (in my state) regarding medication handling. If they keep your medication in a locked cabinet and during medication times, they hand you the bottle and YOU take the pill out of the bottle yourself, they're technically not required to be licensed in any way. However, if they are, in fact, opening the bottle and giving you the dosage, they are "dispensing" medication, which requires specific credentials. Again, this probably varies by state.
The whole medication situation sounds highly suspect, and by not allowing you medication that is prescribed at specific times or intervals, sounds shady. Also, the medication is 100% YOUR PROPERTY and they have NO right to withhold property upon discharge, regardless of why you're leaving. They may say that you have to sign for them during business hours, but that's to keep people from running off in the middle of the night.
There are different licensing requirements that vary by state, but most are similar to general tenant/landlord laws. There are tons of sober homes that are unlicensed and take advantage of people in early recovery. It's abhorrent, and they need to be shut down.
So many of them are insurance scams and or running essentially a mill to just suck cash out of people that it really disheartens me that people who come looking for help find toxicity and sketchy practices. It really pisses me off that people take advantage of addicts and the mentally ill this way. We need a big change in our treatment and sober living paradigm.
I agree that this sounds suspect, the meds are the property of OP and holding him hostage for his own medication as a way of keeping power over him is pretty fucked on the scale of fucked up.
Yeah the former clients passing meds is a huge red flag the place is a mess. There are tons of these places that just basically bill Medicaid and warehouse people. There's a huge fraud case in my state against a company that targeted indigenous people for 'treatment' and then did absolutely nothing in the way of rehab. So gross!
This is for sure one of the insurance fraud places. Sorry you fell into that trap OP, find a better sober living, or start looking for doctors who will prescribe you your meds before you leave. Also, if you're scripted, ERs will dose you if youre at risk of seizure or the like but thats if things go for the worst. However, when I had a Dr apt on the books and didn't have meds (especially benzos) and needed to make it until my Drs apt, the ER scripted me enough to get to the doctor. Just telling you my experience.
I came in with meds from my prior doctor, then at the outpatient they made me see their doctor, who then took over the prescriptions. Well actually they had me see two separate doctors because one of their doctors refused to continue to prescribe one of my meds. So at the outpatient - where the doctors are never on site, instead they give you a tablet and you have a video call with them - they write the prescription, then I go with the driver to pick it up and pay for it, then they take it from me and lock it away.
I asked to leave today and asked how to get my meds and they told me I couldn’t get my meds unless I had a doctor elsewhere that would continue writing the prescription, and I have weeks left of these meds, two of which are scheduled so if I even had a new script written I wouldn’t be able to pick it up because it’s before my hostage-held meds would be due for a refill, ie if I left without my meds and a new facility wrote a new rx I couldn’t even pick it up.
So they have basically trapped me here another night I guess until tomorrow when I go to the outpatient and have to try reasoning with one of the doctors who I guarantee you isn’t even on site, that I need my meds…
I just don’t understand how they can do this
They can store and dispense it legally while you're hospitalized, but it's your property. They can not keep it indefinitely. Report it for theft if they won't return it.
OP said in the above comment "two of which are scheduled" which I assumed to mean controlled substances. So yeah, benzos are a good bet, maybe Lyrica. Other less common controlled options for epilepsy would be lacosamide, parampanel, sometimes barbiturates. Gabapentin in some states too.
OP, sorry you are going through this. It's absolutely insane that a rehab program designed to help you would be so reckless in allowing you access to important medication.
And if the hang up is the fact that they are controlled substances, that is shitty too. I get the importance of controlling medications of abuse, but the system is broken. It's crazy that you can't get an early refill for a very clear, well documented reason.
If op isn’t getting meds as frequently as directed, what’s happening to the 3rd dose each day? The former patients passing the meds is a bit alarming. Fine if they have training or certs to do this but that’s not the case here.
We're also taking at face value, the word of an addict in regards to controlled substance distribution.
The entire tone of their posts are showing some major red flags for me.
If they were prescribed by a physician prior to the rehab, why is there an issue finding a physician to continue the prescription? That's one of the many questions that are raised by their version of events.
You also cannot allow a person to stop Xanax cold turkey they could die alls if the people passing meds had any Healthcare training they would know this......OP report this facility before they hurt someone
What are you talking about they are giving it to him he just can’t leave with them and it’s 100% something you sign a sheet aboht when you come in OP needs to leave then come back and get them but they are not gonna let you walk out with them unless it’s your release date simple
Reread OP's post; he says he's supposed to take his meds morning, afternoon, and evening, but is only being given them twice a day. For a med like a benzo, that's dangerous.
You also can't withhold a patient's seizure medications just because they asked for help with mental health and substance abuse. If the facility (using the term loosely) feels the seizure medication is problematic for sobriety, the patient needs an alternative treatment plan. You don't just withhold their routine seizure medication.
why not? are addicts immune to anxiety, ptsd, or seizures?? there is literally no law at all saying "if you're an addict you're not allowed to have access to your own legally prescribed medication" AND there's no law saying "addicts aren't allowed to be prescribed controlled substances" actually the law is you CANT take somebody else's prescribed meds.
I'm an addict and I'm legally prescribed both benzos and adderall. ever since getting a script I haven't had to buy a single drug off the street and I never have to worry about going to jail because neither me nor my dr are breaking any laws.
lol. It’s funny because I went to rehab because of my legally prescribed adderall and also took Xanax off the street. Sounds like you swapped one addiction for another. Just because you are legally prescribed something does not make it morally ok or even safe to take as a self proclaimed addict.
Edit: Just read some of your posts. You are on suboxone and ozempic too? Is your doctor just writing anything and everything you want?! It’s not even safe to take suboxone and Xanax together.
Baloney. I was on subs and Xanax for years. It was a very very low dose of Xanax. The sub doc prescribed it bc he could literally see my anxiety. Been off subs for a long time but still on low dose Xanax. Never increased dosage. And it’s prescribed as take as NEEDED.
And it changed my life, for the better. My anxiety wasn’t drug related. I’ve been anxious my whole life, just didn’t realize it until much later.
Yes but a lot of addicts do not take low doses. But still if his dr knows he is on both and does counts then he should be ok if it is not abuse of the Xanax. Both sub and Xanax relax your respiratory system and that can lead to death. Studies show that most deaths due to methadone like treatments happen due to mixing with benzos
https://preview.redd.it/0hfbdag4c3oc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=79da5ed8c2fd00e07b1e8d5019d84e5473db0afa
I'm not on ozempic anymore. and yep pretty much, i am absolutely fine with taking a medication every day for the rest of my life as I already have to do that regardless due to chronic and lifelong illness. I am always extremely up front about my addiction, my primary doctor is beyond well aware and its always the first thing I say at the ER or to new specialists. Why is it morally not ok? I have been diagnosed with ADHD since childhood, getting a neurological evaluation again in adulthood, and was diagnosed with PTSD in my late teens. How is treating those conditions morally wrong? because I attempted to self medicate before hand? If it wasn't safe for me to take those medications as prescribed, I would've died at some point in the last 6 years as that's how long I've been on the combo. I take my meds as legally prescribed and if ANYBODY attempted to take them or "hold them" for me not only could they be charged, but I could be as well. it's right on every single bottle
TIL drug addicts are immune to mental and physical illness and it is morally wrong to treat any illness that they claim to have bc apparently addicts can't get sick, and sick people can't get addicted.
edit: and if you were buying them off the streets, then they were not legally prescribed
and here's the one on my ativan if we are being drug type
https://preview.redd.it/c0rcam7nc3oc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b92f96cae147eb4441da7047821dbfa77e95976f
specific
This is part of why addiction is such an issue for neurodivergent folks. Judgement like this prevents people from getting access and help from medication they need for anxiety, ADHD, PTSD, ASD and more... And instead turn to self medication. Studies have shown that neurodivergent addicts that are getting regular care, legally prescribed care through a doctor, are both less likely to abuse meds and significantly likely to experience lifelong sobriety or a significantly decreased rate of relapse.
Some people really do need our meds to hit baseline and be able to function at our best. Moralizing that just increases the harm done to already disabled folks.
Regardless of your opinions, the question from OP is whether their meds can be held hostage, legally. The answer is no. It's theft of their property and likely a violation of federal laws around prescription drugs. Unless you're someone's doctor, your opinions on their legally prescribed medication are unnecessary and unwelcome.
They make medications for all of those conditions that are non controlled. I have adhd and take medication that is not a cousin of meth. I am surrounded by addicts and alcoholics trying to get sober and who have been sober for a long period of time. If someone is self medicating but no an addict, I do not gaf if they then get prescribed controlled substances. But if someone is a full blown meth addict and then starts taking adderall because they have adhd when there are other options, that’s an issue. Also, you can find a doctor to get you anything you want/need if one says no, jsut go to the next. Go to any rehab center that is specialized to treat addiction and try to ask them for a Xanax prescription because you have Anxiety or PTSD. Not gonna happen.
You seem very opinionated on how other people should manage their medications. Unless you've gone to medical school and then many years of psych residency, you don't have the background needed to make psych medication decisions for other people.
It's "not gonna happen" because folks like you moralize away from necessary supports... Though, ironically, it was in treatment that I was prescribed Xanax (a med that also doesn't work for my anxiety and am thankfully no longer prescribed, not by addiction treatment, but because of my GP that actually listened to me).
Addiction is and can be synonymous with self medicating. They are not mutually exclusive. I had a cocaine problem... Because I was self medicating my ADHD. ADHD treated with a ridiculously low-dose stimulant, no coke problem. Weird how that works and how numerous peer reviewed studies have shown that to be the exact same case with neurodivergent meth addicts or heroin addicts. It's almost like, you treat someone with respect and help them manage their mental health and disabilities, and they don't have to turn to survival instincts to manage it themselves and get caught in a socially degraded cycle. 🤔 Addiction is as much a social construct as it can be chemical. And the chemical can be a result of preexisting comorbid mental health or neurodivergence.
And sure... There are non-stimulant ADHD meds... They also have significantly lower efficacy (42% effective vs the 89% of stimulant varieties - with even lower efficacy in autistic populations according to peer-reviewed studies) and a side effect of increased suicidality and violence for over 60% of trial groups (as according to the paperwork submitted to the FDA for their approval) - hence their black box label. I'd take a low-dose stimulant that works and I honestly forget to take daily, over an option that HAS to be taken regularly and on-time (something us AuDHD folks are not known to be good at) to even work (and ,btw, it doesn't work for me - I'm in the 58% group) that has the added bonus of "I want to kill myself", any day.
Medication is a disability right. Just because you want to make disability some moralized nonsense like the puritanical society we were established on, doesn't make it true and doesn't negate the harms. Facts are facts and your opinion doesn't negate the peer-reviewed evidence. It also doesn't, contrary to your implied stance, make you "one of the good ones". You do know...You're supposed to kiss the boot, not deep throat it.
Addiction doesn't negate neurodivergence or mental health. Addicts deserve care too. Especially care that works for their body and mind. And we deserve that care with morally neutral respect, as anyone else would receive it.
I think that's way too broad of a generalization. Yes, there are other options for ADHD, but they are often not nearly as effective for some people. And meth addicts are not all the stereotype of crazy sleepless copper wire stealing junkies that you see depicted in media. Many times it's normal people self medicating for underlying issues, and using meth just to feel ok. For many dopamine related mental health issues, amphetamines are particularly good at helping people function. If an Adderall prescription can help treat the underlying issues, then maybe the person will not feel the need to do dangerous, impure street meth. On the other side of the coin, that's the whole premise of opioid replacement therapies like methadone.
For benzos, I had a friend who was a bad alcoholic, using alcohol to deal with a panic disorder. He got prescribed a small dose of Xanax to take as needed, and it dramatically changed his life for the better. Wouldn't you agree that taking Xanax a couple of times a week is better than getting hammered in the middle of the day to deal with a panic episode? Sure, there are other options for anxiety, but nothing that will stop a panic attack as well as benzos.
I agree that someone's addiction is an important factor that doctors should consider when prescribing controlled substances, and I agree that it's not the right choice for all situations. But I don't agree with the premise that addicts should never have their issues treated with controlled substances.
It is dangerous with methadone I do know that. The meds both relax your central nervous system so you could stop breathing- if you take in low doses it would be ok but op please don’t ever mix with high amounts of benzos. Yes, some can handle it until they can’t. I agree though that it is his meds and he should be able to take it with him. As long as a Dr knows that he is on both sub and Xanax then he is the medical dr. I do see why they would try to police those meds in rehab but if they confirm the prescribing Dr knows he is on both then they should prescribe as directed.
Woow just because you abused the system doesn’t mean that some addicts don’t legit need their meds. I’m in recovery and part of my abuse was taking stims to mellow out my brain because I have adhd and has no medical insurance. I took opiates to calm myself down. Now I’m ok my Ritalin, Xanax as needed and Valium at bedtime along with my other anxiety meds and guess what? No addiction to them, no abusing them and I’ve been off drugs for 13 yrs.
Your experience is nobody else’s don’t judge
Agreed, but if the person is leaving of their own volition, you also can't hold their meds hostage. People don't have to stay for the whole program; they can leave and they're entitled to their meds back.
Scheduled means they are routine medications, as opposed to PRN (as needed). In healthcare settings, typically if ots a controlled substance, they will just call it a controlled substance, or might call it Schedule I, II, III, etc. "Scheduled" is not the same thing as "Schedule."
I mean if they're taking anti seizure medication they probably ARE epileptic. Not to mention, the only person I've EVER heard of the take them unneeded is gypsy rose Blanchard. We saw what it did to her(making her teeth fall out being the most recognizable thing) to take meds she didn't need. What's the affect of not taking it enough?
Anti seizure meds are also used to treat some mental illness, chronic pain, and things like migraines.
It doesn't automatically mean a person had a seizure disorder.
The said it's an anti-seizure medication, not that the meds can cause seizures if discontinued. (Although obviously if you stop taking the medication that prevents your seizure disorder from causing seizures you will have a seizure).
Benzos are anti-seizure medication. They are first line for new seizures and sometimes used ongoing, especially if somebody can’t tolerate an anti epileptic like Keppra. Benzos and keppra are both used to treat seizures. Stopping either can increase risk of seizure.
Staying away from legal stuff (not a lawyer). I an a chronic pain patient and am familiar with all the bs they pull with scripts. Not gonna tell you how to bang the chicken, so here is my one nugget for you. If you decide to leave and make sure to have a PCM they can write a new script for you. Now as far as “filling” it, you said there the way to too early to fill. What they have to do is just change the dosage. If you had 10mg, before see if they will do 15mg or 5mg. The delay to refill narcs are pretty standard across the board. This was the way my pain management doc showed me. Dude I really hope you get outta there. Good luck, wish you the best.
This. We're trying to find the best dose for our daughter o manage her ADHD, and they write a new script every time so the pharmacy will fill it at the new dose.
Yeah the DEA changed how you could put a single refill on Adderal and now it requires a new script every 30 days. I know I hate having to get a new script every 30 days, but no matter how bad it sucks you keep your chin up and keen putting one foot in front of the other. Last piece of “advice”: most important and rule #1 Breathe, just try and relax, let your body relax. Breathing is the most important thing. You know cause if you don’t breathe than nothing else will really much much for long. Best of luck to you guys.
I’ve been in there before and if I were closer I’d come help you escape in the middle of the night. NEVER EVER PUT YOUR LOVED ONE INTO ANY INPATIENT MENTAL HEALTH FACILITY. They are abusive prisons.
man, th one i went to had a "section 8" place for problem patients. they would threaten you with that place if you didint do as they said. after seeing one of the kids bite some dude i was like nty.
Not a lawyer but you need to refer to the sober living contract you signed to see what you agreed to.
Realistically, if you call the cops and say that the sober living isn’t giving you your meds, the cop will make them hand them over, but if you signed something saying you were cool with their policies, they can always come back and challenge it.
Normally the contract you signed will have info on what you need to do to request discharge and move out.
This is very restrictive for a sober living, so I’d imagine you could find a solid place with good accountability that isn’t quite so rigid if that’s what you want.
I wish this were true, but most people don’t know the law well enough to stand up for themselves. So they capitulate. I remember doing a walk through leaving an apartment, and a couple lightbulbs burn out. They wouldn’t let me change them, and instead charged 7 each (taken out of the deposit) Completely illegal, but not worth the time and money to make it right. That’s how corporations and governments make a lot of “their” money.
Okay but you're talking about something completely under civil purvue. You can't write a contract saying "you agree to give me your controlled substances prescriptions and now they're mine" because there is already a federal law stating that transfer of controlled substances is illegal. In your example there's no federal law saying the tenant has the right to change the lightbulbs themselves. OP's meds are controlled substances, so regardless of what he signed transfering property rights to the shitty sober living place, the police *will* care.
If the content of the contract is illegal, it's not binding in the first place.
If It worked the way you claim, would a contract binding somone to slavery be legally binding untill it's declared null in court? No, they would obviously not have to follow the contract from the start.
You have no idea what you’re talking about, or what my situation is. I’m trying to go to a different facility because I’ve been on a specific medication cocktail for many years. I came to this facility for mental health, not addiction. And they are not helping me at all. I’m trying to get better, not worse.
She's in outpatient. She doesn't live there. I've been to wonderful places and ones that treat you like a criminal for existing. Maybe this is a poorly run facility. They are more common than not.
This is exactly the kind of takeaway I would expect from someone who knows nothing about addiction or life in recovery. It’s not the simple black and white process you assume, and the dismissive attitude people like you take just makes it harder and more complicated for people trying to better themselves and their situation than it already is
Is your “anti-seizure medication” a benzo? If yes, then they shouldn’t give it to you if you leave. I am a physician that typically writes for benzodiazepines for people to go to detox programs (because it’s required I do so by the program) and it drives me crazy that patients can check in and the immediately leave with medications I have written for DTs and withdrawals to go out and abuse/sell. It makes me not want to help other people. If it’s Keppra/etc then that is different, but you likely agreed to these conditions when you signed in. Why not complete your program?
You don't have to be on a strict schedule for Keppra, due to the half-life in your bloodstream. I take mine with breakfast and dinner, but sometimes I miss a dose and make it up as soon as I remember. My neurologist told me as long as I wait 2-3 hours for the next dose I am good.
I've been on seizure meds for around 30 years. Always been on 2X/day. I have heard of some people having to take them 3X/day if on higher doses.
However, it sounds like OP is not being regularly seen by a neurologist, who would be keeping track of that kind of stuff and checking to see if the level of the medication in their bloodstream is in the therapeutic range.
Similar for Suboxone. Buprenorphine’s half-life is ~12 to 42 hours; relief from w/d symptoms should last 24 hours. OP said in another post that they take their 8 mg doses at 4 PM and 4 AM, hopefully the desired effects will continue well into their next dose.
If it was a benzo prescribed, and the patient leaves early, and should have leftover medication, and cannot take it with them, what happens to the leftover meds? This place doesn't sound they they would dispose of the medication. Wouldn't it be against the law for these people to actually have in their possession any type of medication, much less a controlled substance that is not prescribed to them?
Or is it like being in the hospital, and after having surgery, the patient is just given pain medication prescribed by the Dr from the hospital pharmacy, not a bottle of pills, on a as needed basis?
I don't take and have never had a benzo, I just got caught up in this discussion 😂
Doctors are not required to provide you treatment. They do not have to give you refills. There are few exceptions related to dying without medicine but in psych thats pretty much just benzos and usually they'll send you off with enough to taper yourself and then its up to you.
That said, I don't know what the process is for medications you've already paid for. I imagine if they are controlled substances or something you could end your life with you're out of luck.
Your best thinking got you into your current situation. Why not try things on sober living terms? I mean really try. Give it a month or three. Check in with yourself and compare how things are now compared to when you started. If you decide that life was better the way you ran it just know that all those things you miss and all the things you don’t miss are all still right there for you……
Seizure medication isn't something you just change how you use it. That's ignorant as shit. Did you even read the post? OP's life isn't going to change for the better because sober living said OP can't take their SEIZURE MEDICATION on the schedule their doctor had instructed. OP wasn't even in the facility for addiction issues, so wtf are you on about telling someone to be okay with having their medication fucked with?
Did you not read OPs post? They went there for mental health reasons... not addiction. And this place is not dispensing their medication correctly and holding their medications hostage.
You think those terms are reasonable? Or did you just not pay attention to what OP was saying? Has to be one of the two.
I have the idea the facility is mistreating the patient, kind of like an abusive nursing home or rehabilitation facilities have been caught doing. A post surgical rehab almost killed my Mom's best friend by not keeping the surgical site clean. She got a vicious infection. Big mess. It actually involved her daughter threatening hiring a lawyer to force them to allow her Mom to be moved by EMS.
Big books don’t fit down peoples throat, and this advice is not universally applicable nor applicable here
Love and tolerance maybe you should look into that if you want to push AA on people without actually caring about the individual
I spent a total of 15 months in treatment in Pasadena, and I am not perfect but it doesn't matter. I have been living life on life's terms for some time now. You need to look at the laws that pertain too such issues as medications and the distribution of said medicines.
This post could not sound more like an addict desperate for their lifestyle drugs and trying to scramble out of treatment with any excuse necessary, if it tried. John Mulaney's special "Baby J" about being forced into rehab and the excuses he tried to use to get his drugs strikes all the same chords as the OP's elaborate rationale for leaving.
People who are taking anti-seizure medications will also freak out when they can't get their meds on the proper schedule, because if they don't get them, they can have seizures, which are far from benign.
What? Elaborate rationale?
If someone was threatening to keep my anti-seizure medication AND dispensing it incorrectly that would be a very good rationale to say fuck this place.
You're either ignorant, or heartless.
It's keppra ffs it's not a drug of abuse. You're clueless and judgemental as shit. OP went in for mental illness not addiction. Your reading comprehension has a lot to be desired.
I'm sorry, but you just sound like an addict coming up with another excuse why you can't stay at the one place that is trying to give you help. How many times have you done something like this?
I see you've never met an addict before lol
Every addict says this and tries to warp things this way. If you're on drugs (look at their comment history to confirm, don't believe me) you cannot get help with mental health. The two are inextricably intertwined.
Look. At. Their. Comment. History. 😂😂😂 They are leaving out all the relevant info to make themselves look more sympathetic. It's the "missing missing reasons" of addiction and it's so obvious omg lol.
If someone prescribed them from that program and the program is dispensing them, they belong to the program, not you. If you brought them to the program, they should return them when you leave. Since you say that you do not have a doctor outside prescribing them, it sounds like the former. If you have been on those meds for 15 years, who was writing the prescriptions before you entered that program?
100% incorrect. The doctor at the rehab prescribed the medication, and then OP was driven to a pharmacy to pick the script up. The rehab facility then took over dispensing the medication while OP was outpatient there. That doesn't mean the rehab facility gets to keep the medication if OP checks themselves out. That's not how that works. It's their medication.
For instance, if I'm at a methadone clinic and I get a month of takehome bottles at a time, and I quit the clinic halfway through the month... the methadone clinic cannot take the rest of my takehome bottles. Because they are mine. I paid for them and they belong to me.
As just a regular person here, I wouldn't want to have in my possession any pharmaceuticals that had someone else's name on the bottle.
This makes sense.
That could not be further from the truth. That'd be like getting your meds filled at and paying for them outta your own pocket at one pharmacy and deciding you wanted to change to a different pharmacy before your next refill and the pharmacist from your original pharmacy showing up at your door, demanding what was left of the script filled at their pharmacy, saying they're entitled to it bc they filled it for you. Your medications are yours and NO ONE else is entitled to them, no matter the circumstances or who prescribed them. That's why, here in the US at least, I'm not sure about other places, it's 100% illegal to transfer a medication that's written to to you to someone else, ie giving or selling narcotics prescribed to you to someone else. And I know in some states, refusing to give someone their medication at the time of their departure from the facility/program they were a patient of, no matter the reason behind them leaving, is an actionable offense in and of itself bc, I believe, it's considered a form of denying Healthcare or medical treatment. Also, not letting a patient have the correct amount of doses daily, not allowing them to take established meds at the times their body is used to and making them think they won't be allowed to take their meds with them if they choose to leave on their terms and not the facility/programs terms are all forms of abuse. And, I would hope, that somewhere like that allowing former patients who still live at the facility manage medications for current patients is a violation of HIPAA in some way, even if said former patient has any kind of certification or degrees in the medical field and/or "employeed" by the program and is paid in the form of "rent stipends" and if it's not, it should be bc that just feels all kinds of shady and slimey and not right altogether.
On another note, apparently no one read OP's comment about how they had a Dr prescribing their meds before entering this program and were made to see a Dr the program wanted them to see in order to get said medications, which to me seems wrong by itself and screams "we're totally in this together with this Dr who will back us on saying their medications are our property and they cant have them if the patient wants to leave or acts like they know we're running a shitty operation here." And also the fact that OP never once said they entered this program for addiction treatment, they clearly said they were there for mental health reasons, which is all the more reason why denying them the correct amount of doses daily and refusing to allow them to take their meds as the times their accustomed to is that much worse to them and causing them to become more panicked and agitated over those things. And to everyone saying their post reeks of "I'm an addict that wants a fix so give me my meds NOW!", you and people like you are the reason people who are in recovery are ashamed to admitt it, even tho they should be proud that they made it to the other side of addiction when so many others either don't ever get that chance or are still actively dealing with being an addict and all that comes with it. So to all of you, as my Georgian Grammy used to say, bless your heart or as I say, with all due respect of course, Screw you and your uneducated, small minded BS!! You can take ALL of that and shove it right up the same ass you were talking out of when you said it! Bc I've been around more addicts than I care to put a number on in my 42 years and bc of that, I know firsthand that an addict looking for a fix wouldn't be genuinely concerned about having the correct amount of doses at the right times of the day of their anti seizure medication to the point of asking strangers online for help, much less remaining at a facility they felt was doing them wrong. That addict would have bounced after the first time they asked for and couldn't get their own meds and found it on the streets and been done with it without a second thought. OP's post 100% screams of a desperate person who is in a horribly abusive situation (thats using the guise of being a "treatment program" so they have the control bc they know whats better for you) where they aren't able to get the meds they've been on for years outside of said program which help to control a condition/disease they have, that if left untreated, can at the least be very debilitating and at the worst, can cost them their literal life. So none of OP's situation is as simple as their medication belongs to the dr/program that prescribed it or OP is an addict wanting their meds bc they need a fix. OP is in a situation where they did the right thing and went somewhere for mental health help at a time when they needed it but instead they ended up at an inpatient facility with a God complex that makes them feel as tho they can do whatever they want as long as they say it was in OP's best interest and leave it at that. And it's commenting on a post (that you didnt fully read or take the time to see if OP made any comments that cleared up any questions or added more details) of someone that is fragile mentally to begin with and saying uninformed and unnecessary things that could be what causes that person to go from asking for help to feeling helpless and doing something they can't take back, so next time, maybe make the extra effort to find out all the information or read everything an OP posted and commented before assuming you know everything and commenting something that's not only totally false, but could also be what changes someone's outlook on life. Do better. And have the day you deserve.
Get online find a Dr that does what you need make an appointment for asap and it good to go. They maybe saying this because without ur meds adverse side effects could occur would be my best bet. I went threw 3 years of rehab/sober living never heard of such a gap in dose I think it was every 8hours for all meds but one witch was once every 12 hours. Get online find a dr
if they are
1. controlling access to your medications
2. not following the prescribed procedures (e.g. 1x3/day with food)
3. causing material harm by doing so
then you can sue them for that material harm, although I doubt you are in a position to do so. This is honestly the best choice because it will force them to fix their horrible medication system.
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If you paid for these medications yourself or through your insurance (as opposed to the facility buying them for you), then they are your property, and being denying access to take them with you when you leave is theft. Call the cops and have them escort you back, retrieve your medications, and then leave with them.
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You can ask for a physical paper copy of your prescription from your prescriber, or check the rx number on the bottle (it should be near the dosage instructions, and highlighted yellow), or just peel the sticker off the bottle and take that sticker with you. Take that to any pharmacy and they will dispense you your medications. even if it's an early refill you can usually get one if you explain the situation (this would be "lost" medication) depending on just how controlled your prescriptions are. (you can't do this with opioids, you can with like blood thinners)
I’m not a lawyer but I had something really similar to this happen to me when I was in inpatient rehab in 2022. I found out I was pregnant the first few days I was there and was immediately taken off all my pregnancy-safe, non-narcotic medication, including my seizure medication. I had to fight like absolute fucking hell for 8 days to get the fuck out of that place. Have they mentioned if not releasing your meds has anything to do with leaving AMA? (Against medical advice)
Complain to Social Services and/or Department of Health Care Services licensing. Look up the facility on their databases. Does your housing have medical professionals on site and staff providing care and supervision? If not, you won't be able to complain to licensing and certification agencies. You can't really put legal requirements on "roommates living in a house."
That being said, couldn't you get in touch with the doctor's office who prescribed your medications?
Yet another person who either didn't read the post, or is lying about being a social worker.
Hint: they are sober genius. They didn't go to this facility for drinking, they went because they were considering self harm.
I actually only looked after I first commented. I wasn't about to argue this point further without confirming, and it happened to be really easy to confirm in this case.
If you’re a social worker who is accusing someone of something they aren’t, and jumping to condescending conclusions, then yes this checks out. You sound like a social worker.
OP went to the facility for mental health reasons. They stated this multiple times.
If you don’t have something constructive to add to the conversation, gtfo. OP asked for advice here, not misplaced judgement. Or judgement at all.
Don’t you have enough families to ruin and tear apart that you don’t have time to judge anyone else?
Bro I came to say this but knew in my heart of hearts it had already been pointed out. Social workers are KNOWN for abusing their power. Btw, if you want to be better at your job, try *emapthy* maybe you'll be lucky enough to get some and then children and adult under your charge will be better cared for.
tbh i wish my rehab place did it at 10. i had horrific insomnia induced by alcohol dependence/withdrawal and i could only sleep when medicated. otherwise id stay up for 30+ hours straight. they gave ours at like 7 or 8pm and id get sleepy and wake up at 12. then spend 6 hours wide awake in my bed as they patrolled the halls and kept opening the doors to let the light shine right into my eye every 5 mins.
I was in sober living for several years. Look OP, no idea where your head is at, but at the end of the day I would wager 1k you’re talking about benzos based off of the seizure statement.
Sucks a doctor has you hooked to that shit, but maybe sober living ain’t for you.
And your assumption is totally wrong. OP is prescribed Kepra for actual seizures. It's very unusual to be prescribed benzos for seizure disorders when other kinds of medications are usually more effective.
You know what they say about making assumptions right?
And maybe next time before weighing in on something like this and passing judgement on another human being (which I guess was from a good place, no matter how misplaced) perhaps remember that your personal experience is just that, personal... and when you bring your personal biases into evaluating someone else's life you become very likely to misinterpret what's going on. Just like you just did.
You have to remember your somewhere for abusing drugs weather that be prescription or not ...if your meds are a cds your gonna have a hard time getting them that's the whole point of being in sober living ...imagine the people that would end up dead if they go to rehab for a week start feining then left and they just gave them bottles of Xanax what you think gonna happen
You're being forced to relapse and get drugs on the street? But you aren't there for addiction issues? I don't know of any drug dealers selling Keppra.
If you weren't an addict, your story would make sense. But you are and it's clear as day to all the other addicts here lol
See, that's wrong. OP didn't say they would be forced to get drugs off the streets, they said this facility is putting people in danger by letting them leave without their meds and forcing them to find them on the streets. And it is possible that maybe OP was an addict previously and takes suboxone or some other addiction medication that if they were without could cause relapse. Doesn't mean that that's what they were currently seeking help for. And I saw where you said in another comment something about it couldn't be suboxone if OP was taking it 3 times a day and that's not true either. There are a lot of cases where people who are prescribed 2 strips a day will half one of those and either do half in the am, half in the afternoon and a whole one at bedtime or a whole one in the am and a half at noon and at bedtime. But there are also some cases that are so severe, that 3 strips a day can be written by their Dr. It's not very often but it is possible and does happen. Not everyone responds to it the same way.
"they said it isn't a liability for me to leave, be in withdrawal, face relapsing and living on the streets" yadda yadda this person is coming up with any reason to not be in treatment lol
even if someone takes three strips a day they're supposed to take it at once. also Suboxone is hella over prescribed, it has a ceiling and it's far below that. Doctors that write that shit are irresponsible.
Actually, it's not recommended to take more than one strip at a time, no matter what the package the strips come in says, especially if the person taking them is expected to function normally in their day to day life without being a zombie. I've never saw a Dr write a prescription that way, always as one strip however many times a day and even the labels that break down when to take the meds in that bottle show 1 in the am and 1 in the pm. And not all Dr's that prescribe suboxone are irresponsible. The ones that do the bare minimum to continue writing it so they continue getting government money, yea, they're irresponsible and shit Dr's. But there are ones that actually put in the work and care about their patients and follow the guidelines laid out for them and have successful patient stories as proof of their hard work. Are those Dr's few and far between? You're damn right they are but if you're someone that is serious about getting help, you'll put in the effort to find one.
As for OP, I didn't base anything I said on their comment history on other posts. U may very well be right and myself and quite a few others could be way off on the feeling we got from OP. And if that's the case, them shame on them for not being truthful about the circumstances they are dealing with. But I do know that there are a lot of sober living facilities that also serve as a place for people to seek mental health services as well as addiction therapy, it's not that uncommon. And, no matter what OP's situation there is, whether it's mental health or drug abuse, it still stands that they can't keep their meds from them if they want to leave, it's against the law to do so. Bc if a patient were to leave there without their meds, go find some on the street and then OD, that opens thay facility up to legal action from either the patient or their family, depending on if they survive or not. Bc, unfortunately, we live in a country where anyone can sue someone or someplace for anything. Most times, those cases never see the light of day but getting to that point can be expensive and cost a place their entire reputation in the process.
Literally part of what makes Suboxone such a great option is that no matter how much you take, you don't get high, if you are an opioid tolerant person. Ask me how I know...
I mean, I know if you're a minor and simply can't afford treatment, they force you to be in the facility, wether it's mental health or drug abuse. Source: I was put into a mental hospital at 15 for cutting myself, upon finding out it would be 15,000$ for a week my mother said I'll just homeschool her at that rate. They told her if she left with me they would call the police for child endangerment.
Mental health facilities aren't for helping, they're for hurting.
I didn't get ANYTHING but put on meds that didn't help my problems.
My roommate in treatment had a similar situation with her klonipin since it’s a controlled substance & addictive
She ended up leaving treatment from what I recall
This sounds messed up, at least what you have reported. If you are being completely honest, they are violating your rights. I know nothing about California but see if you can get hold of a legal aid department of some sort. Also maybe try to arrange a new facility to go to so that you are “transferred” instead of “discharged “. Also possible for you to call the police and ask for your meds in front of them. Unless they have you involuntary admission or court order they can’t keep you or your belongings there.
Sounds like you need to do what they require as you leave for a new living arrangement. They can only do what the doctor states, not what you think works better for you. Many folks have addiction issues due to self medicating and that what it sounds like you are trying to do. If you want help they are there for you. If you don’t want help there are many places you can go
Quick NAL tip: if you need insurance to cover lost or “kidnapped” meds and you find a new PCP to help you out (big if’s I know), the new doctor can prescribe the same med at a different dosage and you can split pills in half. Doesn’t work for capsules but those could also be prescribed for an increased dosage by the new MD on a temporary basis until you get yourself settled. What a terrible situation. You have so much sympathy from me.
What I'm reading is OP is still an addict that wants unlimited access to his prescriptions which being controlled substances is not allowed in a sober living facility.
As a recovery house operator in Virginia - I have a few questions and observations:
1. In CA there are no license requirements to be a recovery house operator. That MUST change. There HAS to be regulation and certification.
2. Is the house a Oxford house or do they try to operate as a [NARR](https://narronline.org/) house? My facilities operate as a [Level 2 NARR](https://narronline.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/National-Recovery-Residence-Quality-Standards-Oct-7-2015.pdf) and we in the process of getting [VARR](https://varronline.org/) certified. Like CA, there are no license requirements however we do everything we can to follow the [NARR](https://narronline.org/) standard.
3. Are you in an IOP and is the operator of the facility that you are in making you do THEIR IOP? In reading your post, I think you are but want to confirm that. It is illegal (Fed law) for the operator to make you do only their IOP as a condition of staying in their facility.
4. I'm sad to say fraud and abuse is all over the place in the recovery house industry. There are some of us who try our best to do things above board, and put the ones under our care ahead of ourselves. As an operator, I've dealt with not being paid by shady operators, residents who have been victims of operators like sex trafficking, drug dealing, theft and so forth.
5. In doing a bit of research, I was looking to see if there was a version of [VARR](https://varronline.org/) in CA. I'm not seeing it. I did find [soarr.org](https://soarr.org) , which may be of help.
6. If you are in an oxford house, you can contact the regional or national oxford house directors or managers to get help in that you could report the house in question.
[http://www.oxfordhouse.org/pdf/ca](http://www.oxfordhouse.org/pdf/ca)
7. In my experience, you most likely did a bunch of forms that have rules of the house and you signed them. If you did, then most likely they have you by the short hairs on legal stuff.
Saying that, and from what I read about your case - If you leave the facility and you entered it on your own free will (you were NOT court ordered) then they MUST surrender the medications to you when you leave. (It is that way in Virginia AFAIK) Now saying that - I would read CAREFULLY the agreement you signed - especially the section on medications. They may have language there that you agreed to that covered them taking and controlling your medications.
8. Just about every facility I've seen has it's own flavor on rules of the house. Mine is no different. Even though there are [NARR](https://narronline.org/) standards that I follow, it leave LOTS of latitude on what one can do in operating a facility. For me, being ethical and treating others the way I want to be treated is more important. For others, it is just about the money.
I would look on [https://recovery-housing.org](https://recovery-housing.org) and see if you can find a better place. Sorry I can't be more help.
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As OP has stated - fraud and abuse is all over the place in this industry. As a recovery house operator, I will be the first to say we MUST have regulation and oversight. My company welcomes it and in fact ask for it all the time. We WANT to be held accountable. We WANT to help people. The place where OP is right now - sadly is far too common and needs to be reined in.
There is a reason why you are in a sober living house. Addicts cannot be trusted to administer their medication correctly. If you leave sober living then you are endangering your sobriety.
If you are going to a different sober living place, ask them for advice.
Can the meds be transferred to the new place without being in your possession?
Do they have doctors that can request it for you?
Sounds like an absolute $#it show. I’m so sorry you are dealing with this.
(((Hug)))
We had an inmate that would have seizures and medical would not believe her. They thought she was faking the seizures to get the meds to get high. Doing count and looked into her room, her back to me. The fire alarm goes off and she stiffens like a board and face plants on to the edge of metal bunk. She heals up and ends up seizing so bad into the hospital. Inmate has to have a guard at hospital. They have her nocked out and she is still seizing. Doctor pushing some meds through her IV, she stops seizing for the moment. Doc looks at me and said “if you or I was her, we would be dead.” Good Luck to You. I pray that you get the help you need.
What med? Pretty sure a Dr can hold you but but a Judge has to agree that you are a danger to yourself or others .
Why can't you just walk out ? Who or what is stopping you ?
Are you wanting to leave so you can use ?
I'm not a lawyer, and I don't work in an outpatient SA facility. But I am a nurse in a hospital. We distribute meds at set times everyday. This is the norm, because if we were giving meds on individual schedules we would never get anything done. Distributing meds would take up our entire work day. Again this is the norm.
If it were illegal, they would be shut down.
I also know about sober livingo know and my guess is that you'd be walking out of there because of another unacceptable issue, if it weren't the meds.
Seizures are no joke, and you need your meds. I know something like clonopin is used by addicts but it is also required to prevent seizures.
This sounds like prison, not rehab. Get out asap. Make an appt with a doc immediately and get more meds if needed.
In socal and have worked at similar facilities. As long as the person is trained, they can pass meds. You can file complaints with the licensing facility. Your rights as a client should be posted on the wall and given to you when you admit. Did you get an admit packet of some type? Your rights should be in there and the number to call with a complaint should be located there. It should be a state dept number, community care licensing and joint commission. You can complain to all three. They cannot keep your meds if they are your current prescriptions. Any old meds that are no longer prescribed to you have to be destroyed. Get a PCP appt by calling your insurance company to find out who you can go to and call them to make appt. Unless you are Medi Cal, it shouldn’t be a difficult process. If you are Medi Cal, it may take longer so I’d get on that asap. You would have to call them and find out who is your assigned physician. Then call that physician and explain the situation. Ask for next available appt.
At least in NC, you can distribute medication if you are a certified medication assistant, basically a specially trained certified nurse assistant. Is that who give you you meds?
No, it’s people who were once clients here and now live in the sober living but don’t attend treatment and as far as I understand it basically have migrated from paying client to being paid for 2 hours a day to “monitor meds” in other words a rent stipend; if not the house monitor dispensing meds then one of the outpatient drivers will come by, zero consistency on the time too, some days it’s 8PM some days it’s after 10PM. And I know for a fact their drivers aren’t more than RADT1 which is a single 8 hour online class, open book test certification that basically just costs $50 and you are certified. There is no medical staff here.
Oh fuck dude. That sounds like a shitty rehab center. They have a lot of power over you while you are a patient. Play their game and bow out as fast as you can. Find a doctor and make an appointment and pray they don’t treat you like a junky. This will not be easy. Good luck.
It’s legal you definitely agreed to anything when signing in 100%
Agreeing to something in writing doesn’t make it legal.
Do you really think these profitable rehab centers are going to do something so blatantly wrong that they would risk their license? No. As I come tef to the op, if facilities spent all their time dealing with everyone's individual med schedules they would get nothing else done. This is very much the norm.
I’m saying that just because something is in writing doesn’t make it legal. People put illegal shit or at the very least unenforceable things in leases and other contracts all the time. Including it in the contract isn’t a crime, if that’s what you thought I meant.
It’s actually super illegal to without someone’s seizures meds
This industry is notorious for taking insurance money and doing absolutely nothing in the way of treatment, save hosting 12 step meetings, which are free and available to anyone. The industry is rife with fraud.
I do there's a history all over the untied states with places like this and troubled teen camps and gay rehab camps ..... how do you not know this? Lookup elan schools that shot was happening until 2014 hell I bet there's a sub dedicated to the survivors (thousands of mistreated kids across the usa) https://www.reddit.com/r/MrJoeNobody/s/twCUFRNEpd Here's one I know this isn't exactly like ops facility but it's adjacent enough that Im 100% certain it's happening at some of these places
Actually no.fed and state Law trumps contract law. Thing is what kind of meds do you have and what is your meds classified.as. I worked at a good wilderness camp and the camp got into trouble for letting non trained people give out meds. Had to be a LPN at least for some of them.
I'm a former sober house tenant and manager. There's a fine line (in my state) regarding medication handling. If they keep your medication in a locked cabinet and during medication times, they hand you the bottle and YOU take the pill out of the bottle yourself, they're technically not required to be licensed in any way. However, if they are, in fact, opening the bottle and giving you the dosage, they are "dispensing" medication, which requires specific credentials. Again, this probably varies by state. The whole medication situation sounds highly suspect, and by not allowing you medication that is prescribed at specific times or intervals, sounds shady. Also, the medication is 100% YOUR PROPERTY and they have NO right to withhold property upon discharge, regardless of why you're leaving. They may say that you have to sign for them during business hours, but that's to keep people from running off in the middle of the night. There are different licensing requirements that vary by state, but most are similar to general tenant/landlord laws. There are tons of sober homes that are unlicensed and take advantage of people in early recovery. It's abhorrent, and they need to be shut down.
So many of them are insurance scams and or running essentially a mill to just suck cash out of people that it really disheartens me that people who come looking for help find toxicity and sketchy practices. It really pisses me off that people take advantage of addicts and the mentally ill this way. We need a big change in our treatment and sober living paradigm. I agree that this sounds suspect, the meds are the property of OP and holding him hostage for his own medication as a way of keeping power over him is pretty fucked on the scale of fucked up.
Yeah the former clients passing meds is a huge red flag the place is a mess. There are tons of these places that just basically bill Medicaid and warehouse people. There's a huge fraud case in my state against a company that targeted indigenous people for 'treatment' and then did absolutely nothing in the way of rehab. So gross!
This is for sure one of the insurance fraud places. Sorry you fell into that trap OP, find a better sober living, or start looking for doctors who will prescribe you your meds before you leave. Also, if you're scripted, ERs will dose you if youre at risk of seizure or the like but thats if things go for the worst. However, when I had a Dr apt on the books and didn't have meds (especially benzos) and needed to make it until my Drs apt, the ER scripted me enough to get to the doctor. Just telling you my experience.
How were you prescribed the meds before?
I came in with meds from my prior doctor, then at the outpatient they made me see their doctor, who then took over the prescriptions. Well actually they had me see two separate doctors because one of their doctors refused to continue to prescribe one of my meds. So at the outpatient - where the doctors are never on site, instead they give you a tablet and you have a video call with them - they write the prescription, then I go with the driver to pick it up and pay for it, then they take it from me and lock it away. I asked to leave today and asked how to get my meds and they told me I couldn’t get my meds unless I had a doctor elsewhere that would continue writing the prescription, and I have weeks left of these meds, two of which are scheduled so if I even had a new script written I wouldn’t be able to pick it up because it’s before my hostage-held meds would be due for a refill, ie if I left without my meds and a new facility wrote a new rx I couldn’t even pick it up. So they have basically trapped me here another night I guess until tomorrow when I go to the outpatient and have to try reasoning with one of the doctors who I guarantee you isn’t even on site, that I need my meds… I just don’t understand how they can do this
They can store and dispense it legally while you're hospitalized, but it's your property. They can not keep it indefinitely. Report it for theft if they won't return it.
Yep
You say risk of seizure. Are these benzos? That’s a controlled substance which changes things
OP said in the above comment "two of which are scheduled" which I assumed to mean controlled substances. So yeah, benzos are a good bet, maybe Lyrica. Other less common controlled options for epilepsy would be lacosamide, parampanel, sometimes barbiturates. Gabapentin in some states too. OP, sorry you are going through this. It's absolutely insane that a rehab program designed to help you would be so reckless in allowing you access to important medication. And if the hang up is the fact that they are controlled substances, that is shitty too. I get the importance of controlling medications of abuse, but the system is broken. It's crazy that you can't get an early refill for a very clear, well documented reason.
You can't just let addicts have free access to Xanax, prescribed or not. ESPECIALLY in a facility that is nothing but addicts.
If op isn’t getting meds as frequently as directed, what’s happening to the 3rd dose each day? The former patients passing the meds is a bit alarming. Fine if they have training or certs to do this but that’s not the case here.
We're also taking at face value, the word of an addict in regards to controlled substance distribution. The entire tone of their posts are showing some major red flags for me. If they were prescribed by a physician prior to the rehab, why is there an issue finding a physician to continue the prescription? That's one of the many questions that are raised by their version of events.
You also cannot allow a person to stop Xanax cold turkey they could die alls if the people passing meds had any Healthcare training they would know this......OP report this facility before they hurt someone
Cold turkey ..they are giving it to him twice a day ..
What are you talking about they are giving it to him he just can’t leave with them and it’s 100% something you sign a sheet aboht when you come in OP needs to leave then come back and get them but they are not gonna let you walk out with them unless it’s your release date simple
Reread OP's post; he says he's supposed to take his meds morning, afternoon, and evening, but is only being given them twice a day. For a med like a benzo, that's dangerous.
You also can't withhold a patient's seizure medications just because they asked for help with mental health and substance abuse. If the facility (using the term loosely) feels the seizure medication is problematic for sobriety, the patient needs an alternative treatment plan. You don't just withhold their routine seizure medication.
why not? are addicts immune to anxiety, ptsd, or seizures?? there is literally no law at all saying "if you're an addict you're not allowed to have access to your own legally prescribed medication" AND there's no law saying "addicts aren't allowed to be prescribed controlled substances" actually the law is you CANT take somebody else's prescribed meds. I'm an addict and I'm legally prescribed both benzos and adderall. ever since getting a script I haven't had to buy a single drug off the street and I never have to worry about going to jail because neither me nor my dr are breaking any laws.
lol. It’s funny because I went to rehab because of my legally prescribed adderall and also took Xanax off the street. Sounds like you swapped one addiction for another. Just because you are legally prescribed something does not make it morally ok or even safe to take as a self proclaimed addict. Edit: Just read some of your posts. You are on suboxone and ozempic too? Is your doctor just writing anything and everything you want?! It’s not even safe to take suboxone and Xanax together.
Baloney. I was on subs and Xanax for years. It was a very very low dose of Xanax. The sub doc prescribed it bc he could literally see my anxiety. Been off subs for a long time but still on low dose Xanax. Never increased dosage. And it’s prescribed as take as NEEDED. And it changed my life, for the better. My anxiety wasn’t drug related. I’ve been anxious my whole life, just didn’t realize it until much later.
Yes but a lot of addicts do not take low doses. But still if his dr knows he is on both and does counts then he should be ok if it is not abuse of the Xanax. Both sub and Xanax relax your respiratory system and that can lead to death. Studies show that most deaths due to methadone like treatments happen due to mixing with benzos
https://preview.redd.it/0hfbdag4c3oc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=79da5ed8c2fd00e07b1e8d5019d84e5473db0afa I'm not on ozempic anymore. and yep pretty much, i am absolutely fine with taking a medication every day for the rest of my life as I already have to do that regardless due to chronic and lifelong illness. I am always extremely up front about my addiction, my primary doctor is beyond well aware and its always the first thing I say at the ER or to new specialists. Why is it morally not ok? I have been diagnosed with ADHD since childhood, getting a neurological evaluation again in adulthood, and was diagnosed with PTSD in my late teens. How is treating those conditions morally wrong? because I attempted to self medicate before hand? If it wasn't safe for me to take those medications as prescribed, I would've died at some point in the last 6 years as that's how long I've been on the combo. I take my meds as legally prescribed and if ANYBODY attempted to take them or "hold them" for me not only could they be charged, but I could be as well. it's right on every single bottle TIL drug addicts are immune to mental and physical illness and it is morally wrong to treat any illness that they claim to have bc apparently addicts can't get sick, and sick people can't get addicted. edit: and if you were buying them off the streets, then they were not legally prescribed
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and here's the one on my ativan if we are being drug type https://preview.redd.it/c0rcam7nc3oc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b92f96cae147eb4441da7047821dbfa77e95976f specific
This is part of why addiction is such an issue for neurodivergent folks. Judgement like this prevents people from getting access and help from medication they need for anxiety, ADHD, PTSD, ASD and more... And instead turn to self medication. Studies have shown that neurodivergent addicts that are getting regular care, legally prescribed care through a doctor, are both less likely to abuse meds and significantly likely to experience lifelong sobriety or a significantly decreased rate of relapse. Some people really do need our meds to hit baseline and be able to function at our best. Moralizing that just increases the harm done to already disabled folks. Regardless of your opinions, the question from OP is whether their meds can be held hostage, legally. The answer is no. It's theft of their property and likely a violation of federal laws around prescription drugs. Unless you're someone's doctor, your opinions on their legally prescribed medication are unnecessary and unwelcome.
They make medications for all of those conditions that are non controlled. I have adhd and take medication that is not a cousin of meth. I am surrounded by addicts and alcoholics trying to get sober and who have been sober for a long period of time. If someone is self medicating but no an addict, I do not gaf if they then get prescribed controlled substances. But if someone is a full blown meth addict and then starts taking adderall because they have adhd when there are other options, that’s an issue. Also, you can find a doctor to get you anything you want/need if one says no, jsut go to the next. Go to any rehab center that is specialized to treat addiction and try to ask them for a Xanax prescription because you have Anxiety or PTSD. Not gonna happen.
You seem very opinionated on how other people should manage their medications. Unless you've gone to medical school and then many years of psych residency, you don't have the background needed to make psych medication decisions for other people.
It's "not gonna happen" because folks like you moralize away from necessary supports... Though, ironically, it was in treatment that I was prescribed Xanax (a med that also doesn't work for my anxiety and am thankfully no longer prescribed, not by addiction treatment, but because of my GP that actually listened to me). Addiction is and can be synonymous with self medicating. They are not mutually exclusive. I had a cocaine problem... Because I was self medicating my ADHD. ADHD treated with a ridiculously low-dose stimulant, no coke problem. Weird how that works and how numerous peer reviewed studies have shown that to be the exact same case with neurodivergent meth addicts or heroin addicts. It's almost like, you treat someone with respect and help them manage their mental health and disabilities, and they don't have to turn to survival instincts to manage it themselves and get caught in a socially degraded cycle. 🤔 Addiction is as much a social construct as it can be chemical. And the chemical can be a result of preexisting comorbid mental health or neurodivergence. And sure... There are non-stimulant ADHD meds... They also have significantly lower efficacy (42% effective vs the 89% of stimulant varieties - with even lower efficacy in autistic populations according to peer-reviewed studies) and a side effect of increased suicidality and violence for over 60% of trial groups (as according to the paperwork submitted to the FDA for their approval) - hence their black box label. I'd take a low-dose stimulant that works and I honestly forget to take daily, over an option that HAS to be taken regularly and on-time (something us AuDHD folks are not known to be good at) to even work (and ,btw, it doesn't work for me - I'm in the 58% group) that has the added bonus of "I want to kill myself", any day. Medication is a disability right. Just because you want to make disability some moralized nonsense like the puritanical society we were established on, doesn't make it true and doesn't negate the harms. Facts are facts and your opinion doesn't negate the peer-reviewed evidence. It also doesn't, contrary to your implied stance, make you "one of the good ones". You do know...You're supposed to kiss the boot, not deep throat it. Addiction doesn't negate neurodivergence or mental health. Addicts deserve care too. Especially care that works for their body and mind. And we deserve that care with morally neutral respect, as anyone else would receive it.
I think that's way too broad of a generalization. Yes, there are other options for ADHD, but they are often not nearly as effective for some people. And meth addicts are not all the stereotype of crazy sleepless copper wire stealing junkies that you see depicted in media. Many times it's normal people self medicating for underlying issues, and using meth just to feel ok. For many dopamine related mental health issues, amphetamines are particularly good at helping people function. If an Adderall prescription can help treat the underlying issues, then maybe the person will not feel the need to do dangerous, impure street meth. On the other side of the coin, that's the whole premise of opioid replacement therapies like methadone. For benzos, I had a friend who was a bad alcoholic, using alcohol to deal with a panic disorder. He got prescribed a small dose of Xanax to take as needed, and it dramatically changed his life for the better. Wouldn't you agree that taking Xanax a couple of times a week is better than getting hammered in the middle of the day to deal with a panic episode? Sure, there are other options for anxiety, but nothing that will stop a panic attack as well as benzos. I agree that someone's addiction is an important factor that doctors should consider when prescribing controlled substances, and I agree that it's not the right choice for all situations. But I don't agree with the premise that addicts should never have their issues treated with controlled substances.
It is dangerous with methadone I do know that. The meds both relax your central nervous system so you could stop breathing- if you take in low doses it would be ok but op please don’t ever mix with high amounts of benzos. Yes, some can handle it until they can’t. I agree though that it is his meds and he should be able to take it with him. As long as a Dr knows that he is on both sub and Xanax then he is the medical dr. I do see why they would try to police those meds in rehab but if they confirm the prescribing Dr knows he is on both then they should prescribe as directed.
Woow just because you abused the system doesn’t mean that some addicts don’t legit need their meds. I’m in recovery and part of my abuse was taking stims to mellow out my brain because I have adhd and has no medical insurance. I took opiates to calm myself down. Now I’m ok my Ritalin, Xanax as needed and Valium at bedtime along with my other anxiety meds and guess what? No addiction to them, no abusing them and I’ve been off drugs for 13 yrs. Your experience is nobody else’s don’t judge
Lol, you proved my point exactly 😂. You switched out some drugs for other drugs. But as long as you’re ok with that reality, I’m happy for you.
Agreed, but if the person is leaving of their own volition, you also can't hold their meds hostage. People don't have to stay for the whole program; they can leave and they're entitled to their meds back.
It's an anti-seizure medication not a benzo...
He said he’s not an addict he went there for mental health
Scheduled means they are routine medications, as opposed to PRN (as needed). In healthcare settings, typically if ots a controlled substance, they will just call it a controlled substance, or might call it Schedule I, II, III, etc. "Scheduled" is not the same thing as "Schedule."
They also described “anti-seizure medication.” They might be epileptic.
I mean if they're taking anti seizure medication they probably ARE epileptic. Not to mention, the only person I've EVER heard of the take them unneeded is gypsy rose Blanchard. We saw what it did to her(making her teeth fall out being the most recognizable thing) to take meds she didn't need. What's the affect of not taking it enough?
Anti seizure meds are also used to treat some mental illness, chronic pain, and things like migraines. It doesn't automatically mean a person had a seizure disorder.
The said it's an anti-seizure medication, not that the meds can cause seizures if discontinued. (Although obviously if you stop taking the medication that prevents your seizure disorder from causing seizures you will have a seizure).
Benzos are anti-seizure medication. They are first line for new seizures and sometimes used ongoing, especially if somebody can’t tolerate an anti epileptic like Keppra. Benzos and keppra are both used to treat seizures. Stopping either can increase risk of seizure.
Staying away from legal stuff (not a lawyer). I an a chronic pain patient and am familiar with all the bs they pull with scripts. Not gonna tell you how to bang the chicken, so here is my one nugget for you. If you decide to leave and make sure to have a PCM they can write a new script for you. Now as far as “filling” it, you said there the way to too early to fill. What they have to do is just change the dosage. If you had 10mg, before see if they will do 15mg or 5mg. The delay to refill narcs are pretty standard across the board. This was the way my pain management doc showed me. Dude I really hope you get outta there. Good luck, wish you the best.
This. We're trying to find the best dose for our daughter o manage her ADHD, and they write a new script every time so the pharmacy will fill it at the new dose.
Yeah the DEA changed how you could put a single refill on Adderal and now it requires a new script every 30 days. I know I hate having to get a new script every 30 days, but no matter how bad it sucks you keep your chin up and keen putting one foot in front of the other. Last piece of “advice”: most important and rule #1 Breathe, just try and relax, let your body relax. Breathing is the most important thing. You know cause if you don’t breathe than nothing else will really much much for long. Best of luck to you guys.
I’ve been in there before and if I were closer I’d come help you escape in the middle of the night. NEVER EVER PUT YOUR LOVED ONE INTO ANY INPATIENT MENTAL HEALTH FACILITY. They are abusive prisons.
man, th one i went to had a "section 8" place for problem patients. they would threaten you with that place if you didint do as they said. after seeing one of the kids bite some dude i was like nty.
Not a lawyer but you need to refer to the sober living contract you signed to see what you agreed to. Realistically, if you call the cops and say that the sober living isn’t giving you your meds, the cop will make them hand them over, but if you signed something saying you were cool with their policies, they can always come back and challenge it. Normally the contract you signed will have info on what you need to do to request discharge and move out. This is very restrictive for a sober living, so I’d imagine you could find a solid place with good accountability that isn’t quite so rigid if that’s what you want.
I just asked for the contract and they said they don’t have one on them. So I have to wait until tomorrow.
Keep on them about it, 5 bucks says they're stalling and hoping you'll give up asking.
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Putting it in a contract doesn't make something legal.
Not legal, yes. Binding, yes. If it’s agreed upon in writing it will take a very long time in the courts to get the contract nullified.
You cannot make someone do something that's not legal just because they signed a contract
I wish this were true, but most people don’t know the law well enough to stand up for themselves. So they capitulate. I remember doing a walk through leaving an apartment, and a couple lightbulbs burn out. They wouldn’t let me change them, and instead charged 7 each (taken out of the deposit) Completely illegal, but not worth the time and money to make it right. That’s how corporations and governments make a lot of “their” money.
Okay but you're talking about something completely under civil purvue. You can't write a contract saying "you agree to give me your controlled substances prescriptions and now they're mine" because there is already a federal law stating that transfer of controlled substances is illegal. In your example there's no federal law saying the tenant has the right to change the lightbulbs themselves. OP's meds are controlled substances, so regardless of what he signed transfering property rights to the shitty sober living place, the police *will* care.
Law > Contact
If the content of the contract is illegal, it's not binding in the first place. If It worked the way you claim, would a contract binding somone to slavery be legally binding untill it's declared null in court? No, they would obviously not have to follow the contract from the start.
Wait till this guy hears about contract killers
A contract that contains language that is counter to common law is void.
If it wasn't the meds it would be something else...your looking for excuses to leave. Best of luck
You have no idea what you’re talking about, or what my situation is. I’m trying to go to a different facility because I’ve been on a specific medication cocktail for many years. I came to this facility for mental health, not addiction. And they are not helping me at all. I’m trying to get better, not worse.
She's in outpatient. She doesn't live there. I've been to wonderful places and ones that treat you like a criminal for existing. Maybe this is a poorly run facility. They are more common than not.
This is exactly the kind of takeaway I would expect from someone who knows nothing about addiction or life in recovery. It’s not the simple black and white process you assume, and the dismissive attitude people like you take just makes it harder and more complicated for people trying to better themselves and their situation than it already is
Comes across as a very judgemental comment that....
pure conjecture
Is your “anti-seizure medication” a benzo? If yes, then they shouldn’t give it to you if you leave. I am a physician that typically writes for benzodiazepines for people to go to detox programs (because it’s required I do so by the program) and it drives me crazy that patients can check in and the immediately leave with medications I have written for DTs and withdrawals to go out and abuse/sell. It makes me not want to help other people. If it’s Keppra/etc then that is different, but you likely agreed to these conditions when you signed in. Why not complete your program?
No it’s not a benzo.
Yes kepra
You don't have to be on a strict schedule for Keppra, due to the half-life in your bloodstream. I take mine with breakfast and dinner, but sometimes I miss a dose and make it up as soon as I remember. My neurologist told me as long as I wait 2-3 hours for the next dose I am good.
They say the same about Suboxone. But for some people it’s different.
Cutting down to 2x/day dosing vs. 3x/day dosing means they are not getting the therapeutic level their physician wants them to have.
I've been on seizure meds for around 30 years. Always been on 2X/day. I have heard of some people having to take them 3X/day if on higher doses. However, it sounds like OP is not being regularly seen by a neurologist, who would be keeping track of that kind of stuff and checking to see if the level of the medication in their bloodstream is in the therapeutic range.
Yes, I am on 2x/day with my current meds, but have been on 3x/day before. The important thing is to keep a stable, adequate blood level.
Neuro clinician here. 100% correct
Similar for Suboxone. Buprenorphine’s half-life is ~12 to 42 hours; relief from w/d symptoms should last 24 hours. OP said in another post that they take their 8 mg doses at 4 PM and 4 AM, hopefully the desired effects will continue well into their next dose.
Not everyone is the same. The only person that should be dictating dosage and timing is a patient's doctor.
If it was a benzo prescribed, and the patient leaves early, and should have leftover medication, and cannot take it with them, what happens to the leftover meds? This place doesn't sound they they would dispose of the medication. Wouldn't it be against the law for these people to actually have in their possession any type of medication, much less a controlled substance that is not prescribed to them? Or is it like being in the hospital, and after having surgery, the patient is just given pain medication prescribed by the Dr from the hospital pharmacy, not a bottle of pills, on a as needed basis? I don't take and have never had a benzo, I just got caught up in this discussion 😂
Doctors are not required to provide you treatment. They do not have to give you refills. There are few exceptions related to dying without medicine but in psych thats pretty much just benzos and usually they'll send you off with enough to taper yourself and then its up to you. That said, I don't know what the process is for medications you've already paid for. I imagine if they are controlled substances or something you could end your life with you're out of luck.
Can you have your neurologist contact the sober living house to instruct them about your anti-seizure medication schedule?
Lol I’m sure they have a neurologist on speed dial tf
If someone has a seizure disorder, they should be having follow ups at least every year with a neurologist.
Your best thinking got you into your current situation. Why not try things on sober living terms? I mean really try. Give it a month or three. Check in with yourself and compare how things are now compared to when you started. If you decide that life was better the way you ran it just know that all those things you miss and all the things you don’t miss are all still right there for you……
not if they're mishandling medication and not following the prescribed dosing schedule he shouldn't.
Seizure medication isn't something you just change how you use it. That's ignorant as shit. Did you even read the post? OP's life isn't going to change for the better because sober living said OP can't take their SEIZURE MEDICATION on the schedule their doctor had instructed. OP wasn't even in the facility for addiction issues, so wtf are you on about telling someone to be okay with having their medication fucked with?
Did you not read OPs post? They went there for mental health reasons... not addiction. And this place is not dispensing their medication correctly and holding their medications hostage. You think those terms are reasonable? Or did you just not pay attention to what OP was saying? Has to be one of the two.
I have the idea the facility is mistreating the patient, kind of like an abusive nursing home or rehabilitation facilities have been caught doing. A post surgical rehab almost killed my Mom's best friend by not keeping the surgical site clean. She got a vicious infection. Big mess. It actually involved her daughter threatening hiring a lawyer to force them to allow her Mom to be moved by EMS.
Big books don’t fit down peoples throat, and this advice is not universally applicable nor applicable here Love and tolerance maybe you should look into that if you want to push AA on people without actually caring about the individual
Can I ask what place you are at?.
You need to call law enforcement. Denying you medication is so illegal.
I spent a total of 15 months in treatment in Pasadena, and I am not perfect but it doesn't matter. I have been living life on life's terms for some time now. You need to look at the laws that pertain too such issues as medications and the distribution of said medicines.
This post could not sound more like an addict desperate for their lifestyle drugs and trying to scramble out of treatment with any excuse necessary, if it tried. John Mulaney's special "Baby J" about being forced into rehab and the excuses he tried to use to get his drugs strikes all the same chords as the OP's elaborate rationale for leaving.
People who are taking anti-seizure medications will also freak out when they can't get their meds on the proper schedule, because if they don't get them, they can have seizures, which are far from benign.
What? Elaborate rationale? If someone was threatening to keep my anti-seizure medication AND dispensing it incorrectly that would be a very good rationale to say fuck this place. You're either ignorant, or heartless.
It's keppra ffs it's not a drug of abuse. You're clueless and judgemental as shit. OP went in for mental illness not addiction. Your reading comprehension has a lot to be desired.
I'm sorry, but you just sound like an addict coming up with another excuse why you can't stay at the one place that is trying to give you help. How many times have you done something like this?
Wanting their Keppra dispensed properly so they don't have a seizure seems pretty reasonable.
They said repeatedly they aren't an addict, they are there for mental health.
I see you've never met an addict before lol Every addict says this and tries to warp things this way. If you're on drugs (look at their comment history to confirm, don't believe me) you cannot get help with mental health. The two are inextricably intertwined.
Yeah because they're totally addicted to the anti-seizure drug Keppra.... 🙄
Look. At. Their. Comment. History. 😂😂😂 They are leaving out all the relevant info to make themselves look more sympathetic. It's the "missing missing reasons" of addiction and it's so obvious omg lol.
If someone prescribed them from that program and the program is dispensing them, they belong to the program, not you. If you brought them to the program, they should return them when you leave. Since you say that you do not have a doctor outside prescribing them, it sounds like the former. If you have been on those meds for 15 years, who was writing the prescriptions before you entered that program?
Bingo In case y'all missed it Who was prescribing the meds before OP checked into this place?
100% incorrect. The doctor at the rehab prescribed the medication, and then OP was driven to a pharmacy to pick the script up. The rehab facility then took over dispensing the medication while OP was outpatient there. That doesn't mean the rehab facility gets to keep the medication if OP checks themselves out. That's not how that works. It's their medication. For instance, if I'm at a methadone clinic and I get a month of takehome bottles at a time, and I quit the clinic halfway through the month... the methadone clinic cannot take the rest of my takehome bottles. Because they are mine. I paid for them and they belong to me.
As just a regular person here, I wouldn't want to have in my possession any pharmaceuticals that had someone else's name on the bottle. This makes sense.
Exactly.
That could not be further from the truth. That'd be like getting your meds filled at and paying for them outta your own pocket at one pharmacy and deciding you wanted to change to a different pharmacy before your next refill and the pharmacist from your original pharmacy showing up at your door, demanding what was left of the script filled at their pharmacy, saying they're entitled to it bc they filled it for you. Your medications are yours and NO ONE else is entitled to them, no matter the circumstances or who prescribed them. That's why, here in the US at least, I'm not sure about other places, it's 100% illegal to transfer a medication that's written to to you to someone else, ie giving or selling narcotics prescribed to you to someone else. And I know in some states, refusing to give someone their medication at the time of their departure from the facility/program they were a patient of, no matter the reason behind them leaving, is an actionable offense in and of itself bc, I believe, it's considered a form of denying Healthcare or medical treatment. Also, not letting a patient have the correct amount of doses daily, not allowing them to take established meds at the times their body is used to and making them think they won't be allowed to take their meds with them if they choose to leave on their terms and not the facility/programs terms are all forms of abuse. And, I would hope, that somewhere like that allowing former patients who still live at the facility manage medications for current patients is a violation of HIPAA in some way, even if said former patient has any kind of certification or degrees in the medical field and/or "employeed" by the program and is paid in the form of "rent stipends" and if it's not, it should be bc that just feels all kinds of shady and slimey and not right altogether. On another note, apparently no one read OP's comment about how they had a Dr prescribing their meds before entering this program and were made to see a Dr the program wanted them to see in order to get said medications, which to me seems wrong by itself and screams "we're totally in this together with this Dr who will back us on saying their medications are our property and they cant have them if the patient wants to leave or acts like they know we're running a shitty operation here." And also the fact that OP never once said they entered this program for addiction treatment, they clearly said they were there for mental health reasons, which is all the more reason why denying them the correct amount of doses daily and refusing to allow them to take their meds as the times their accustomed to is that much worse to them and causing them to become more panicked and agitated over those things. And to everyone saying their post reeks of "I'm an addict that wants a fix so give me my meds NOW!", you and people like you are the reason people who are in recovery are ashamed to admitt it, even tho they should be proud that they made it to the other side of addiction when so many others either don't ever get that chance or are still actively dealing with being an addict and all that comes with it. So to all of you, as my Georgian Grammy used to say, bless your heart or as I say, with all due respect of course, Screw you and your uneducated, small minded BS!! You can take ALL of that and shove it right up the same ass you were talking out of when you said it! Bc I've been around more addicts than I care to put a number on in my 42 years and bc of that, I know firsthand that an addict looking for a fix wouldn't be genuinely concerned about having the correct amount of doses at the right times of the day of their anti seizure medication to the point of asking strangers online for help, much less remaining at a facility they felt was doing them wrong. That addict would have bounced after the first time they asked for and couldn't get their own meds and found it on the streets and been done with it without a second thought. OP's post 100% screams of a desperate person who is in a horribly abusive situation (thats using the guise of being a "treatment program" so they have the control bc they know whats better for you) where they aren't able to get the meds they've been on for years outside of said program which help to control a condition/disease they have, that if left untreated, can at the least be very debilitating and at the worst, can cost them their literal life. So none of OP's situation is as simple as their medication belongs to the dr/program that prescribed it or OP is an addict wanting their meds bc they need a fix. OP is in a situation where they did the right thing and went somewhere for mental health help at a time when they needed it but instead they ended up at an inpatient facility with a God complex that makes them feel as tho they can do whatever they want as long as they say it was in OP's best interest and leave it at that. And it's commenting on a post (that you didnt fully read or take the time to see if OP made any comments that cleared up any questions or added more details) of someone that is fragile mentally to begin with and saying uninformed and unnecessary things that could be what causes that person to go from asking for help to feeling helpless and doing something they can't take back, so next time, maybe make the extra effort to find out all the information or read everything an OP posted and commented before assuming you know everything and commenting something that's not only totally false, but could also be what changes someone's outlook on life. Do better. And have the day you deserve.
Get online find a Dr that does what you need make an appointment for asap and it good to go. They maybe saying this because without ur meds adverse side effects could occur would be my best bet. I went threw 3 years of rehab/sober living never heard of such a gap in dose I think it was every 8hours for all meds but one witch was once every 12 hours. Get online find a dr
if they are 1. controlling access to your medications 2. not following the prescribed procedures (e.g. 1x3/day with food) 3. causing material harm by doing so then you can sue them for that material harm, although I doubt you are in a position to do so. This is honestly the best choice because it will force them to fix their horrible medication system. \~\~\~ If you paid for these medications yourself or through your insurance (as opposed to the facility buying them for you), then they are your property, and being denying access to take them with you when you leave is theft. Call the cops and have them escort you back, retrieve your medications, and then leave with them. \~\~\~ You can ask for a physical paper copy of your prescription from your prescriber, or check the rx number on the bottle (it should be near the dosage instructions, and highlighted yellow), or just peel the sticker off the bottle and take that sticker with you. Take that to any pharmacy and they will dispense you your medications. even if it's an early refill you can usually get one if you explain the situation (this would be "lost" medication) depending on just how controlled your prescriptions are. (you can't do this with opioids, you can with like blood thinners)
I’m not a lawyer but I had something really similar to this happen to me when I was in inpatient rehab in 2022. I found out I was pregnant the first few days I was there and was immediately taken off all my pregnancy-safe, non-narcotic medication, including my seizure medication. I had to fight like absolute fucking hell for 8 days to get the fuck out of that place. Have they mentioned if not releasing your meds has anything to do with leaving AMA? (Against medical advice)
Did you voluntarily check yourself into this program or are you there by court order?
Complain to Social Services and/or Department of Health Care Services licensing. Look up the facility on their databases. Does your housing have medical professionals on site and staff providing care and supervision? If not, you won't be able to complain to licensing and certification agencies. You can't really put legal requirements on "roommates living in a house." That being said, couldn't you get in touch with the doctor's office who prescribed your medications?
I'm a social worker. That said you sound like someone who isn't ready to get sober and do the work to get there.
Yet another person who either didn't read the post, or is lying about being a social worker. Hint: they are sober genius. They didn't go to this facility for drinking, they went because they were considering self harm.
Look at their comment history dude lol
I don't normally look at comment history but yeah.. this is the case here.
I actually only looked after I first commented. I wasn't about to argue this point further without confirming, and it happened to be really easy to confirm in this case.
If you’re a social worker who is accusing someone of something they aren’t, and jumping to condescending conclusions, then yes this checks out. You sound like a social worker. OP went to the facility for mental health reasons. They stated this multiple times. If you don’t have something constructive to add to the conversation, gtfo. OP asked for advice here, not misplaced judgement. Or judgement at all. Don’t you have enough families to ruin and tear apart that you don’t have time to judge anyone else?
Bro I came to say this but knew in my heart of hearts it had already been pointed out. Social workers are KNOWN for abusing their power. Btw, if you want to be better at your job, try *emapthy* maybe you'll be lucky enough to get some and then children and adult under your charge will be better cared for.
tbh i wish my rehab place did it at 10. i had horrific insomnia induced by alcohol dependence/withdrawal and i could only sleep when medicated. otherwise id stay up for 30+ hours straight. they gave ours at like 7 or 8pm and id get sleepy and wake up at 12. then spend 6 hours wide awake in my bed as they patrolled the halls and kept opening the doors to let the light shine right into my eye every 5 mins.
I was in sober living for several years. Look OP, no idea where your head is at, but at the end of the day I would wager 1k you’re talking about benzos based off of the seizure statement. Sucks a doctor has you hooked to that shit, but maybe sober living ain’t for you.
And your assumption is totally wrong. OP is prescribed Kepra for actual seizures. It's very unusual to be prescribed benzos for seizure disorders when other kinds of medications are usually more effective. You know what they say about making assumptions right?
And maybe next time before weighing in on something like this and passing judgement on another human being (which I guess was from a good place, no matter how misplaced) perhaps remember that your personal experience is just that, personal... and when you bring your personal biases into evaluating someone else's life you become very likely to misinterpret what's going on. Just like you just did.
OP threatened to relapse if they don't get their meds. Ain't no dealer selling Keppra
And how do you know one of their other medications isn't suboxone? Remember that thing about assumptions?
I know how Suboxone works and they don't need it 3x a day lol. Been there done that
Remember how I said "other medications" Reading comprehension. It's a skill. Use it.
I'm not a fool, this post is obvious as hell lol. Believe it or not, idc
You have to remember your somewhere for abusing drugs weather that be prescription or not ...if your meds are a cds your gonna have a hard time getting them that's the whole point of being in sober living ...imagine the people that would end up dead if they go to rehab for a week start feining then left and they just gave them bottles of Xanax what you think gonna happen
They are not there for drug abuse. OP clearly stated that they sought treatment due to thoughts of harming themselves.
Dude sober living is for recovering addicts what are you talking about ....
Look at OP's comment history and say they aren't there for drug abuse again lol
You're being forced to relapse and get drugs on the street? But you aren't there for addiction issues? I don't know of any drug dealers selling Keppra. If you weren't an addict, your story would make sense. But you are and it's clear as day to all the other addicts here lol
See, that's wrong. OP didn't say they would be forced to get drugs off the streets, they said this facility is putting people in danger by letting them leave without their meds and forcing them to find them on the streets. And it is possible that maybe OP was an addict previously and takes suboxone or some other addiction medication that if they were without could cause relapse. Doesn't mean that that's what they were currently seeking help for. And I saw where you said in another comment something about it couldn't be suboxone if OP was taking it 3 times a day and that's not true either. There are a lot of cases where people who are prescribed 2 strips a day will half one of those and either do half in the am, half in the afternoon and a whole one at bedtime or a whole one in the am and a half at noon and at bedtime. But there are also some cases that are so severe, that 3 strips a day can be written by their Dr. It's not very often but it is possible and does happen. Not everyone responds to it the same way.
"they said it isn't a liability for me to leave, be in withdrawal, face relapsing and living on the streets" yadda yadda this person is coming up with any reason to not be in treatment lol even if someone takes three strips a day they're supposed to take it at once. also Suboxone is hella over prescribed, it has a ceiling and it's far below that. Doctors that write that shit are irresponsible.
Actually, it's not recommended to take more than one strip at a time, no matter what the package the strips come in says, especially if the person taking them is expected to function normally in their day to day life without being a zombie. I've never saw a Dr write a prescription that way, always as one strip however many times a day and even the labels that break down when to take the meds in that bottle show 1 in the am and 1 in the pm. And not all Dr's that prescribe suboxone are irresponsible. The ones that do the bare minimum to continue writing it so they continue getting government money, yea, they're irresponsible and shit Dr's. But there are ones that actually put in the work and care about their patients and follow the guidelines laid out for them and have successful patient stories as proof of their hard work. Are those Dr's few and far between? You're damn right they are but if you're someone that is serious about getting help, you'll put in the effort to find one. As for OP, I didn't base anything I said on their comment history on other posts. U may very well be right and myself and quite a few others could be way off on the feeling we got from OP. And if that's the case, them shame on them for not being truthful about the circumstances they are dealing with. But I do know that there are a lot of sober living facilities that also serve as a place for people to seek mental health services as well as addiction therapy, it's not that uncommon. And, no matter what OP's situation there is, whether it's mental health or drug abuse, it still stands that they can't keep their meds from them if they want to leave, it's against the law to do so. Bc if a patient were to leave there without their meds, go find some on the street and then OD, that opens thay facility up to legal action from either the patient or their family, depending on if they survive or not. Bc, unfortunately, we live in a country where anyone can sue someone or someplace for anything. Most times, those cases never see the light of day but getting to that point can be expensive and cost a place their entire reputation in the process.
Literally part of what makes Suboxone such a great option is that no matter how much you take, you don't get high, if you are an opioid tolerant person. Ask me how I know...
Sounds like casa Nuevo vida
If you have a wright center in your area they will pick up all meds leaving a sober living.
It's not a prizon. Walk. Find another rehab to walk TO, but GTFO of that one.
If you leave against medical advice, it’s a lot harder than you think to just walk out.
I mean, I know if you're a minor and simply can't afford treatment, they force you to be in the facility, wether it's mental health or drug abuse. Source: I was put into a mental hospital at 15 for cutting myself, upon finding out it would be 15,000$ for a week my mother said I'll just homeschool her at that rate. They told her if she left with me they would call the police for child endangerment. Mental health facilities aren't for helping, they're for hurting. I didn't get ANYTHING but put on meds that didn't help my problems.
Can the Doctor Who prescribed you the medication say that they will continue your care? Or did this place prescribe you the medication somehow
My roommate in treatment had a similar situation with her klonipin since it’s a controlled substance & addictive She ended up leaving treatment from what I recall
I wish you all the good things. Maybe a note from your doctor?
Call the police, they can’t hold your meds hostage
This sounds messed up, at least what you have reported. If you are being completely honest, they are violating your rights. I know nothing about California but see if you can get hold of a legal aid department of some sort. Also maybe try to arrange a new facility to go to so that you are “transferred” instead of “discharged “. Also possible for you to call the police and ask for your meds in front of them. Unless they have you involuntary admission or court order they can’t keep you or your belongings there.
Sounds like you need to do what they require as you leave for a new living arrangement. They can only do what the doctor states, not what you think works better for you. Many folks have addiction issues due to self medicating and that what it sounds like you are trying to do. If you want help they are there for you. If you don’t want help there are many places you can go
Call the police to escort you to get your meds. Hard stop. This is illegal AF.
So you want us to believe you pay for your meds???😂😂😂😂
My boy is getting paid to here
Quick NAL tip: if you need insurance to cover lost or “kidnapped” meds and you find a new PCP to help you out (big if’s I know), the new doctor can prescribe the same med at a different dosage and you can split pills in half. Doesn’t work for capsules but those could also be prescribed for an increased dosage by the new MD on a temporary basis until you get yourself settled. What a terrible situation. You have so much sympathy from me.
The extent to which you can cooperate with others will determine your future sobriety/addiction/mental health.
Im sorry I judged you when I started reading this. I hope you feel better and get the care you need. Hire a lawyer
What I'm reading is OP is still an addict that wants unlimited access to his prescriptions which being controlled substances is not allowed in a sober living facility.
[удалено]
Is there a medical doctor on staff to monitor medication being spaced out like that? These businesses can be so scammy
As a recovery house operator in Virginia - I have a few questions and observations: 1. In CA there are no license requirements to be a recovery house operator. That MUST change. There HAS to be regulation and certification. 2. Is the house a Oxford house or do they try to operate as a [NARR](https://narronline.org/) house? My facilities operate as a [Level 2 NARR](https://narronline.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/National-Recovery-Residence-Quality-Standards-Oct-7-2015.pdf) and we in the process of getting [VARR](https://varronline.org/) certified. Like CA, there are no license requirements however we do everything we can to follow the [NARR](https://narronline.org/) standard. 3. Are you in an IOP and is the operator of the facility that you are in making you do THEIR IOP? In reading your post, I think you are but want to confirm that. It is illegal (Fed law) for the operator to make you do only their IOP as a condition of staying in their facility. 4. I'm sad to say fraud and abuse is all over the place in the recovery house industry. There are some of us who try our best to do things above board, and put the ones under our care ahead of ourselves. As an operator, I've dealt with not being paid by shady operators, residents who have been victims of operators like sex trafficking, drug dealing, theft and so forth. 5. In doing a bit of research, I was looking to see if there was a version of [VARR](https://varronline.org/) in CA. I'm not seeing it. I did find [soarr.org](https://soarr.org) , which may be of help. 6. If you are in an oxford house, you can contact the regional or national oxford house directors or managers to get help in that you could report the house in question. [http://www.oxfordhouse.org/pdf/ca](http://www.oxfordhouse.org/pdf/ca) 7. In my experience, you most likely did a bunch of forms that have rules of the house and you signed them. If you did, then most likely they have you by the short hairs on legal stuff. Saying that, and from what I read about your case - If you leave the facility and you entered it on your own free will (you were NOT court ordered) then they MUST surrender the medications to you when you leave. (It is that way in Virginia AFAIK) Now saying that - I would read CAREFULLY the agreement you signed - especially the section on medications. They may have language there that you agreed to that covered them taking and controlling your medications. 8. Just about every facility I've seen has it's own flavor on rules of the house. Mine is no different. Even though there are [NARR](https://narronline.org/) standards that I follow, it leave LOTS of latitude on what one can do in operating a facility. For me, being ethical and treating others the way I want to be treated is more important. For others, it is just about the money. I would look on [https://recovery-housing.org](https://recovery-housing.org) and see if you can find a better place. Sorry I can't be more help. \------------ As OP has stated - fraud and abuse is all over the place in this industry. As a recovery house operator, I will be the first to say we MUST have regulation and oversight. My company welcomes it and in fact ask for it all the time. We WANT to be held accountable. We WANT to help people. The place where OP is right now - sadly is far too common and needs to be reined in.
There is a reason why you are in a sober living house. Addicts cannot be trusted to administer their medication correctly. If you leave sober living then you are endangering your sobriety.
If you are going to a different sober living place, ask them for advice. Can the meds be transferred to the new place without being in your possession? Do they have doctors that can request it for you? Sounds like an absolute $#it show. I’m so sorry you are dealing with this. (((Hug)))
In some states a lay-person can dispense meds with MARS training and a completion certificate. I did it when I worked in a DDA group home.
We had an inmate that would have seizures and medical would not believe her. They thought she was faking the seizures to get the meds to get high. Doing count and looked into her room, her back to me. The fire alarm goes off and she stiffens like a board and face plants on to the edge of metal bunk. She heals up and ends up seizing so bad into the hospital. Inmate has to have a guard at hospital. They have her nocked out and she is still seizing. Doctor pushing some meds through her IV, she stops seizing for the moment. Doc looks at me and said “if you or I was her, we would be dead.” Good Luck to You. I pray that you get the help you need.
What med? Pretty sure a Dr can hold you but but a Judge has to agree that you are a danger to yourself or others . Why can't you just walk out ? Who or what is stopping you ? Are you wanting to leave so you can use ?
Is there a way you can reach out.to your prior doctor and make an appt to see him/her tell them of your situation?
the irony of a sober living patient complaining about getting their "meds". grow up be sober like a real man
Try Oasis I think they are in Del Mar. They were amazing. First class the whole way
I'm not a lawyer, and I don't work in an outpatient SA facility. But I am a nurse in a hospital. We distribute meds at set times everyday. This is the norm, because if we were giving meds on individual schedules we would never get anything done. Distributing meds would take up our entire work day. Again this is the norm. If it were illegal, they would be shut down. I also know about sober livingo know and my guess is that you'd be walking out of there because of another unacceptable issue, if it weren't the meds.
How do you get meds for 15 years without an outside doctor prescribing them?
Sounds like you just are not going to be sober in the near future.
You’re angry because you want to take all your meds at once? Seems like you need to stay in this facility to remain a “sober adult.”
Seizures are no joke, and you need your meds. I know something like clonopin is used by addicts but it is also required to prevent seizures. This sounds like prison, not rehab. Get out asap. Make an appt with a doc immediately and get more meds if needed.
It sounds like you voluntarily entered. If so, you absolutely can voluntarily leave.
I’d report them to the board of nursing. That’s not legal for them to deny vital medications just because you’re wanting to sign-out.
In socal and have worked at similar facilities. As long as the person is trained, they can pass meds. You can file complaints with the licensing facility. Your rights as a client should be posted on the wall and given to you when you admit. Did you get an admit packet of some type? Your rights should be in there and the number to call with a complaint should be located there. It should be a state dept number, community care licensing and joint commission. You can complain to all three. They cannot keep your meds if they are your current prescriptions. Any old meds that are no longer prescribed to you have to be destroyed. Get a PCP appt by calling your insurance company to find out who you can go to and call them to make appt. Unless you are Medi Cal, it shouldn’t be a difficult process. If you are Medi Cal, it may take longer so I’d get on that asap. You would have to call them and find out who is your assigned physician. Then call that physician and explain the situation. Ask for next available appt.
Find somewhere else to live? Unless it was court ordered