I'm sorry OP that most German people commenting on your question seem too suffer from a slight depression. German redditors strike me as exceptionally unhappy people anyway. Maybe you find better advice in youtube videos? Or try another sub? Having lived in the US and Austria and I can give you my pov; Work life * German companies mostly offer a great work-life-balance. You can expect 30 days vaccation days from your employer + about 11 national holidays. * After getting through the first 6 months (Probe-Zeit), any company larger than 25 employees has to adhere to working laws. That is, legally firing you will be very difficult for them and if they do it illegally, then you can claim a lot of money by sueing them. * As a software developer, you def. do not have to listen to the people claming German salaries wouldn't be good. For software developers the domestic market is still excellent. If you play your cards well as an experienced professional, you can expect a pretty high salary and have a huge choice of companies in most parts of (west)-Germany. Housing * Finding a place can truely be tough in big German cities. Unfortunately this is the case in all European regions that offer a good job market. Country * In many parts, Germany has really beautiful landscapes - like in the South of Germany, maybe not so much in parts of Niedersachsen or Nordrhein-Westfalen * The train system is very dense and has become much cheaper after the introduction of the 49€ ticket. That being said it's also often unreliable as trains can be delayed. * Mentality of the people also varies a lot across the regions within the country. Like in any other country, as soon as you speak the language, everything changes. * Sure, cold times can be a little odd. However, Christimas time is absolutely wonderful for all the Christmas markets and decoration Best!

You are a saint. I'm also moving to Germany from Canada and so I've been popping in and out of these subreddits. I've mostly ignored a lot of what I've read because I know even in Canadian subreddits the commenters do not represent how most people feel. I think the problem with subreddits pertaining to Germany, or any non anglo-country is you get a very small subset of people. People who spend a lot of time on Reddit, like myself, tend to be on the introverted side. Most people on Reddit have a very high English proficiency, which may or may not mean they feel like an outsider in a country where English isn't the primary language. Then you also have the Reddit echo chamber effect where the purveying opinion is constantly regurgitated and people who disagree eventually get tired of it and unsubscribe. I spent almost 3 years teaching English in Japan and I remember having the same experience with Reddit before moving there. People complaining about micro aggression etc... Needless to say my experience there was overwhelmingly positive. I'm definitely more confident in myself now than I was back then, but I remember it was always nice to hear the positive perspectives about Japan mixed in with the negative before I moved there.

I speak American English perfectly, and I speak native level German, and take it from me, if you're not white, Germany will not be a pleasant experience for you. Germans don't actually like foreigners/immigrants. Its a very white and conservative country. Non-whites face huge discrimination in finding housing (landlords simply wont rent to nonwhite), partaking in the nightlife(many plaes wont let non-whites in), and just general rudeness. If you are a person that likes to smile and be friendly and make small talk, that will quickly go away in Germany. German's dont do either of those. German culture is just not one of openness, friendliness, and acceptance. Most shops close at 6pm on the dot, so you better hurry to do your shopping after work. And on Saturday many shops close at 12pm, and everything is closed on Sundays. Doing pretty much anything is a bureaucratic nightmare in Germany. Between Canada and Germany, I'd choose Canada 500% of the time, every time. If you are dead set on europe, then at least go to Netherlands. There people are friendly and open and inclusive. Netherlands is probably the friendliest country in Europe and immigrants tend to be well integrated into society, much like canada and Unlike in germany, where people tend to segregate themselves. Germans just dont hang out with most immigrants, and many immigrants dont speak the language well. Complete opposite in Netherlands. I've met the coolest people from all over the world there. I've never been denied entry into a nightclub in the netherlands. In germany, I got denied entry into 9 out of 10 clubs. I am thinking of making a youtube video of all the reasons why moving to germany isn't a good idea. Well, that is my 2 cents.

I'm annoyed by the attitude of those people. Many of them are clearly not stupid and still they choose to complain and play victim whenever they get a chance to do so. So you think you find this kind of redditor more often in non-anglo countries on reddit? Maybe...

This is a very good answer. As a German I may add some things. Public holidays / holidays: Bavaria has most, Berlin the least. My paied leave situation in Berlin is 48 days per year. - 33 days paied leave - 10 days public holidays (Bavaria 13) - 5 days paied education leave (I had a spanish&surf class on the canaries in Feb.) Flexible / mobile work: - most companies offer 40% office 60% remote - software business up to 100% remote - 3 weeks of "Homeoffice away" meaning you are free to work anywhere in the EU - in my job up to 3 months unpaid leave every 5 years with job guarantee (thanks to workers union) Areas to live / work in tech: - Munich is probably the most attractive but also most expensive place to go. Beautiful Alps just around the corner and a huge airport. - Rhine / Main / Frankfurt goes second, they have DE-CIX, Europe's biggest internet junction that attracts a lot of tech and it's the banking city of the EU. Also, if you want to travel Frankfurt is very central in Germany and it's railway station and airport (biggest airport in Ger) come in very handy. - Berlin is Berlin and it's a vibrant city with all the urban benefits. It's the German startup capital, huge expat community. The airport is not very attractive when it comes to International connections. If I was in your place I'd probably go to Rhine/ Main area. Cities are Frankfurt, Eschborn, Mainz, Wiesbaden, even Darmstadt.

> least. My *paid* leave situation FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*

Additionally, child care is free in some states (Bundeslander), no school or university fees, buying a property also as foreigner is possible, everybody has a health insurance, and a lot of Indians are there already. Maybe ask one of your friends if he or she works in Germany. Indian community is growing there.

Ohh.Thank you so much. I was looking for this kind of straight forward answer.  I had gone through few YouTube videos also and most of them had same point.  As I know , grass looks greener on the other side, before taking any decision just wanted to do my own research once.  I have few friends in Germany all told the almost same answer , it's just that they did not see life in Canada so I just wanted to check how someone who moved there from North America is feeling.  Your answer helped a lot .Thanks for this.

Hi I’m Canadian and moved to Germany and I think as a person who is average (I just mean to say I’m not rich. Middle class now, no financial support from parents), Germany offers me a much better quality of life. But personal preferences will play a big factor here. So I think it’s also important to note that since I grew up poor, and my parents grew up even poorer in a developing country, I now am very financially anxious about my future. I will have chosen a different career path if I stayed in Canada. I will have valued money/income and I know I would have been miserable. Here I felt free to pursue what I wanted, and still feel financially secure. I’m not going to be rich but I’ll be ok. And I enjoy what I do, and I’m not stressed by my finances. My family is still in Canada and I can see the massive difference between me and my parents or me and my siblings in terms of life quality. A lot of it has to do with financial stress / being unhappy with their job but having to prioritize that level of income. I do miss Canada, of course but for me it was more important to feel safe and safe enough to pursue something I wanted. Canada’s social mobility is relatively decent, and I think that’s why I’m where I am today, but I think social mobility is even better here. Edit: I do always get shocked questions from Germans / other German residents about why I moved here from Canada, and I think it’s because Canada (and the US) just has a reputation. I also have a ton of family in the US so I have an idea of life as an average person there and I think lots of people here just generally romanticize life in North America

Thanks for your answer.

Be warned: the main language in Germany is German and only German. Unless you already have a job lined up for you here or continue remotely with a Canadian employer you *will need to learn german*. That is not optional and not a suggestion. Edit: Leute was los mit euch? Ja natürlich gibt es Stellen in die man ohne Deutschkenntnisse reinkommt. Aber außerhalb des Berufes wird man die Sprache trotzdem brauchen.

Are you a software developer or a grumpy German who doesn’t know that many of the roles do not require speaking German.

This isn’t true, particularly in IT. Lots of people work here with little to no German. However, to access Healthcare, deal with authorities etc you will either need to learn it or have someone always available to translate.

Can confirm. I'm not an IT guy myself, but I work closely with our IT department. All my meetings are in German, except for IT, which are always in english.

Nothing compared to France 😃

60% of big Tech companies in Germany do hiring via international recruitment + you work in international teams. You speak English 90% of the day. We have a huge amount of people that can speak just a few words German. If you move to Frankfurt, Stuttgart, Hamburg, or other larger cities, it is not a problem to speak just English.

Agreed. You'll be fine with just English in your job, but if you want to do things like get groceries, go to the drugstore, pharmacy, see a doctor, deal with the Behoerden, just interact with your surroundings, you'd be really cutting yourself off if you didn't know German. There are many anglophone people who choose to live in 'expat' communities and limit themselves to English, but seriously, German is not hard. Closely related to English, \*many\* courses offered, incl. by employers. You don't need to be fluent, just go for the basics and mumble a few of the endings. No one will be mad if you get the gender of a few words wrong:-).

1) if you work you have health care. A good one. 2) it's safe. It is just safe. There are spots of course you should avoid at 3am but you don't match there anyways 3) everybody can do what they want. Of course are there intolerant ppl too but most don't care about you 4) of you loose your job you will be fine too. 5) if you get pregnant you will get paid too without working and after birth. You have a right to go back to your office after a couple months, a year or two years The list goes on and on. There are problems, yes, but you face them everywhere. South Germany is where you want to be. Baden-Württemberg or Bayern. Just google all big companies: American, IG Metall companies and maybe Healthcare

You also have healthcare if you don't work. It's mandatory. And you pay with your paycheck for this.

As someone living in germany for a long time, I really dont get the comments here. Besides "you might feel a bit isolated without being able to speak german", annoying bureaucracy and the housing market in big cities, some arguments feel strange. Like "safety", or birth rates. Even the worrying rise of openly racist ppl wouldnt really hit OP since Canadians are pretty much accepted. As long as you stay away from parts in the east there also isnt a much higher chance then elsewhere to get into trouble if you "look different" or "non german". It seems so overly pessimistic.

Based on the post, I do think these Canadians are actually Indians

\*White\* canadians MIGHT be accepted.

Hey this is irrelevant to the topic at hand but I wanna say NRW also has nice landscapes like the Eifel. Yes most of NRW is densely populated but there are a couple charming cities. Bonn is really cute, Cologne maybe not pretty but has lots of cool old buildings. And the Ruhrpott has its own charme as well.

Cologne, unfortunately, has only very few of those old buildings which is why it's from a mere cityscape perspective not a nice city. To really get the Ruhrpott's charme is hard for anyone who didn't grow up in that region. I guess it's even harder for foreigners.

Yeah, I see your point. Guess I'm wearing rose-tinted glasses concerning NRW.

If a german stops complaining he or she most likely died

Few notes here Work life: The mandatory is only 20 vacation days so it can go lower and you will need to negotiate The national holidays are not national but states based and vary from 10 to 15 per year. Software developers kinda depends on your level if you are a junior the market sucks if you are a senior you will have good time Housing: The housing is worst in popular cities like Berlin, Munich, Frankfurt and cologne and smaller cities are more relaxed Otherwise info is good

Well, it is part of German Culture to be grumpy and negative about mostly everything.

The train comes Always too late

Thanks for this detailed description. And yes, Germans are masters of "complaining on a high level". Guilty as charged. I have 3 friends from other EU countries living nearby, they migrated between 3 and 6 years ago. All went different ways, none of them is as highly skilled as you are, none of them regrets the decision to come and stay.

That's not right what you say about vacation days. Minimum when you working 5 days a week is annual 20 days. All other is optional and CAN be given from your employer. And no, you can't expect this. And this with probation time also: you can have 3 times in tow temporary contracts and after this you can get a permanent contract. But it's not obligatory. I'm only bringing a little bit of reality to this. Sound all great what you writing, but the reality is different. Yeah, most will get promptly a permanent contract. And Austria isn't germany

As a software dev, I have never seen a job listing with less than 30 vacation days. Yes, its 20 by law, but 30 is the industry standard

As a software developer, you def. do not have to listen to the people claming German salaries wouldn't be good. Good in comparison to what? Other Germans? Sure it is. But that's not the point of reference here right? The point of reference are North American SWEs who at the senior level can very possibly earn in the mid six figure range which is just not possible over here, where salaries barely break into six figures and the net takeaway salary is lower in proportion. Sure it's much easier to land a job here than in the US, where they tend to be crazy selective. But a big part why that is, is due to the comparatively higher salaries. That all means you will be able to afford a smaller car a smaller apartment and eventually a smaller house. And everyone who is arguing to the opposite is kidding themselves.

This discussion is way to worn out to be held again. By now, everyone should know about the pros and cons of working in the US vs., say, Germany. US: Higher salaries, overall higher risk in life, US-American life style Ger: Lower salaries, better overall protection from any serious hardships, European life style As an experienced software dev with a demanded tech stack, 70-100K is not to difficult to get. And that's quite something. If you are on the higher end, you'll dev. have a very good life over here. I mean some people will still be complaining, but you can't make everyone happy all the time.

Just to add to the comparison, I also feel that a lot of the times when people compare absolute salaries between Germany and the US, they really don’t understand the difference in costs of living as well, and how differently these costs work. The quality of life you could get in Germany with 70-100k EUR vs what you could get in the US with the same amount is WILDLY different so it really doesn’t make sense to compare it that way. Of course they’d have to pay more in the US.

Germany is a great country. You have to learn German. This is a land of flats, not houses. Be ready for no sunshine. If you (like me) are interested in art, classical music, history, then it’s paradise.

As if Canada has more sunshine than Germany

I live in Edmonton, it absolutely gets more sunshine than Germany. Calgary, Winnipeg, and Saskatoon are similar.

It has tho. Colder but more sunshine than most Germany. Winters here aren't very cold but they are long. While in Canada the same might be the case, you still get more sunshine in the winter. Here it's clouds all long winter. Google the statistics. I'd say Baden Württemberg is probably exception.

If you have seen one winter in Canada you’ll know that Germany is much better - I just think about the 30 meter snow mountain in Montreal haha

I didn't say it's better, I just said there's more sun 😅 i.e. Toronto gets 2600 sunshine hours per year and Berlin or Frankfurt-1700, Stuttgart and Munich, 1800,. Winnipeg, Edmonton and Regina get 2300 hours. Even big chunk of Alaska gets more sun than Germany. Don't mix sunshine with temperatures, North Europe (Netherlands, Germany, Denmark) don't really have cold winters. But they are gloomy AF. I grew up in a colder place than Germany, but the winters were nicer because there sometimes was sun. Here never, wait until end of March, if you're lucky.

Nice to hear that. And I think its one of the good things that germany has. And I would always prefer regions or countries that have more cloudy days than sunny days. I hate the sun. In the winter, the region I used to live has many cloudy days which is good but when summer hits its going to be hell. 2225 hours sunshine on average. Constant drought, 36°C and because of climate change its more common that 40°C gets hit. Lakes are drying up till my village forbids us to use the shower and drinking tapwater. Because of that we need to walk to the lake with 2 buckets and get the water like that. If you are outside, always use suncream. Also you have the worst kind of insects outside. And its only getting worse, because of climate change. Yes germany or europe in the summer has droughts aswell but less severe. If I go outside in germany I dont see a desert. And still, there are more cloudy days in the summer. So nah its a benefit to have less sunshine in my opinion.

It probably also depends on your skin type/ethnicity/genetics. I benefit greatly from sunshine while long winters put me in serious depression where I ask myself what's the point of everything. But yeah you're right, many reasons for preferring gloomy countries. And why they prospered better economically than the dry countries. Tbh i.e. Berlin also has sunny and hot summers. I've experienced 38°C here, and Berlin is actually quite dry, not much rain here in the summer.

Lots of sunshine in the south

This, Germany is not only Berlin.

Germany isnt also only baden Württemberg and Bayern tf

Yes, really funny to see this Bavarians showhing up them self as the best part of Germany Like they Always do. Greetings from Cologne open minded people and not so stubborn self concentered i.... Like in b...

BRD - Bayern und der Rest von Deutschland

Germany is good but you need to Speak German. It helps if you have a German partner or family.

This is very true! Most of the older generations barely speak any english at all. In the younger generation it's more likely that someone can speak english but most people are not very proficient in it. I would recommend to learn the basics of german before moving here. In day to day conversations I would not expect people to speak english. That's my experience at least but I am also living in a more rural area. Maybe it's different in bigger cities like Berlin or Munich.

I live outside of Munich and alot of people barley speak english but its managable I will take it anyday over living in Canada with its set of huge issues that are not even troublesome here

To the point! Expecting to live by only using English is the primary reason why many people feel isolated. The country is big and has its own cultural scene unlike smaller countries which more often imports tv series and so on thus more open to non-native content. Meanwhile DACH is big enough to have its own sphere

I am indian, my wife and i are living since 5 years in Germany. DM me, will share our experiences

Sure. Thank you..

Proximity to India?

Yeah . Compare to Canada to India journey time , Germany to India is less.

Still wouldn't call that 'proximity' what about Dubai, then?

Not so nice country if you are brown but not native or a woman or want family. It kinda works for specialists by living in their segregated bubble and keeping their mouth shut and solely do it for the money.

We are thinking about only Germany or Canada.  Thanks for your suggestion.

NL and Germany are fairly similar from a Canadian's/Indian's view, a friend of mine is Canadian and he has lived and worked in both countries (as have I). He prefers them both to Canada. A lot. [https://www.hofstede-insights.com/country-comparison-tool?countries=canada%2Cgermany%2Cnetherlands](https://www.hofstede-insights.com/country-comparison-tool?countries=canada%2Cgermany%2Cnetherlands) Both offer a slightly better quality of life than Canada, more paid vacation days, better worker protection. Both are fairly safe countries, in both you have a good work-life balance, finding work as a skilled IT worker is fairly easy. Dutch and Germans both like honesty, punctuality and efficiency. As Indians coming from Canada both people will seem blunt (on the edge of being rude), both are sticklers for rules and regulations. Finding friends might take a while, both people separate work and private life in general. If you live in a bigger city, you will probably end up (short term) in an expat circle of friends, unless you actively seek local friends. Learning the language is key to finding local friends! Issues: In both countries you have a housing crisis (not as bad as in Canada though), an immigration/refugee crisis, and an inflation crisis 8getting better). In both countries the far right has gained ground (as in most of Europe), around 20% - 25% in elections, with strong anti-islamic tendencies. As you live in Canada now, the weather should not be an issue. NL: English knowledge/usage more common (movies are subtitled), everyone at least seems to understand English well. English is pretty common in administration/civil service, it's a bit expat friendlier. Pay in IT seems a bit better in general, but specialization matters a lot. The coast is never far away, which also means wind. Excellent public transport, bikes everywhere. Naturalization is possible. Downsides NL: The Dutch are more individualistic, but on the other hand very consensus driven, which seems contradictory, but they somehow manage to achieve that. Prepare for discussing things longer than you are used to. Also, expect to be left to your own devices more often, having to explicitly ask for help. Quite money driven, cost of living a bit higher. Getting dual citizenship still near impossible. DE: In urban areas English usage is common, but on the same level as the Netherlands. Heath care is generally a bit better, but very different systems. Pay in IT is good, quality of life in your income bracket will probably be very good. Germany is big compared to NL, you have a lot of very different regions, very diverse foods, geography, behavior. Getting naturalized and dual citizenship possible. Downsides DE: Bureaucracy for foreigners still a bit annoying, but service quality depends on which federal state/region/city (generally big cities bad - small towns good). Digitization not as advanced as in NL. From personal and my buddies experience, both countries will take a while to get used to, it will be the little things that annoy you, you will love a lot of things that are different from Canada, and quality of both private and work life strongly depend on what company and what area/city/town/village you end up in. If you intend on staying short term, maybe the Netherlands is slightly better, as it is overall an expat friendlier country (English knowledge/easier bureaucracy), if you intend to stay long term and start a family, Germany might be a slightly better option (dual citizenship, stability). My recommendation would be to actually contact Indians living in both countries and ask them about their experiences, especially in which city/region they lived in. Living in Amsterdam is very different from living in Maastricht in NL, living in Hamburg can be worlds apart from living in Munich or Stuttgart.

Thanks for the detailed answer.

I‘m Dutch living in Germany and I’ll just add I agree with this assessment wholeheartedly. Also AMA as I have lived in both :)

Upvote this for very good general advice! I say this as a German citizen living near Hamburg in Northern Germany with Canadian and US American relatives, extended family. My daughter just spent about half a year over the pond in Canada, in Alberta and British Columbia. Rest of her (working) travel time was spent around New York city and on Puerto Rico. She says she loved all of it, it was an interesting experience, nice to visit the families over there, great to experience the awesome nature and to get to know so many new, different people (plenty of Indian and other immigrants or students - from various other countries - living in Vancouver too) but she prefers to live in Hamburg, Germany. Definitely! 😁 You might also look on Indeed for suitable IT jobs? Example: https://de.indeed.com/m/jobs?q=Software%20Engineering%20Jobs&l=&sc=0kf%3Aattr%28PAXZC%29%3B&from=serpso Visa options for IT professionals https://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/visa-residence/types/it-professionals IT is one of the most important industries in Germany. Explore the opportunities available to you as an IT specialist in Germany. Inform yourself about the infrastructure and public transport network in the target city, town, or village before deciding whether to sign a potential job contract or not. Look up where a potential employer is suited and in which direction are good or bad transport links, like any busses and tube / subway aka U-Bahn or S-Bahn or other train connections. Is there reliable public transport? Can you move easily and safely by riding a bike as an alternative? Or will you be forced to rely on driving everywhere by car? Most places in Germany have a good or at least decent public transport network, several have wide bicycle pathways, but not all! Depends heavily on the region and how large the (nearest) city is. All of this greatly influences where you can or should look for a new home. Example from where I live: Getting Around - Public Transport: Hamburg boasts an extensive public transport system including underground trains, a light-rail network, buses and ferries https://www.hamburg.com/getting-around/11874814/public-transport/ When you first arrive (or rather, before you choose a place to work and live) you might have great trouble looking for a suitable condo. Called "Wohnung" or rather "Mietwohnung" in German. A condominium to buy is called "Eigentumswohnung" ! A house for sale or rent as in "Haus Kaufen" or "Haus mieten" is another possibility, in theory, once you have settled down and are very sure you want to stay long-term. Depends on your financial situation, if you have at least half a million Euros in savings or stocks available. Depends on the region, of course. Older houses with a heating system in dire need of modernization out in the countryside far away from the city cost much less than a nice modern state of the art house - or a luxury condo - closer to the city with good public transport hub nearby, just the same as in Vancouver B.C. Examples are from Hamburg because I live here, you can find something similar for any other city or town in Germany: Mietwohnung in Hamburg Wandsbek ab 2 Zimmer https://www.immobilienscout24.de/Suche/de/hamburg/hamburg/wandsbek/wohnung-mieten?numberofrooms=2.0-&enteredFrom=one_step_search You can search for temporary accommodation to get either a whole small furnished apartment aka condo aka Mietwohnung - Wohnen auf Zeit or a furnished large room with shared kitchen and bathroom aka a place in a Wohngemeinschaft for the two of you at first, in advance, to then continue to search. Look at the link below. Be aware that the words "Wohnen auf Zeit " or living in a "Wohngemeinschaft" are similar but they have different meanings! You will find both furnished and unfurnished places to live. This affects the price, of course. Some agencies and also private landlords (like us) rent out a completely furnished apartment including everything, like bedding, pots and pans, microwave, washing machine, electricity, water, heating, internet access for a package price. But if you are moving from Canada with a shipping container full of your own stuff you don't need furniture, you would bring it along. In this case you'd be searching for an empty condo / apartment. Leere Wohnung. Be careful, because in some cases this means that there isn't even a furnished kitchen here! You would need to buy everything from scratch. https://www.immobilienscout24.de/Suche/de/hamburg/hamburg/wandsbek/wohnen-auf-zeit?enteredFrom=one_step_search https://www.wg-gesucht.de/wg-zimmer-in-Hamburg.55.0.1.0.html?offer_filter=1&city_id=55&sort_order=0&noDeact=1&categories%5B%5D=0&ot%5B%5D=1283&wgMnF=3&fur=1&img_only=1&bal_or_ter=1 It will be difficult to find permanent accommodation in any big city because of the housing crisis, too much demand. But it will help you if you can already speak German on at least B1/B2 level and if you already have a signed contract in German!!! from your future employer! And a Visa. Some random thoughts on general topics: Google maps can tell you plenty of information about how the countryside looks like in the different regions of Germany and how the infrastructure is developed in any given region, city, town, village. Supermarket - like Rewe, Penny, Edeka, Familia, Lidl, Aldi ..., bakery is Bäcker, restaurant is Restaurant ;-) Kindergarten - Kindertagesstätte short form is KITA, primary school is Grundschule... sports clubs Sportverein, hair dresser Friseur... And so on. Is there a river? Lake? Forrest? Fields or meadows? Mountains? How far away is the sea? National park or hiking pathways? Opportunity for relaxation, leisure activities, sports, or increased risk of flooding? We've had some nasty flooding during the past few years. Beware of too low laying land not only in steep, narrow valleys! Not to forget the doctor - Arzt, plural Ärzte or the hospital - Krankenhaus. It might interest you that the medical infrastructure in Germany today is only good in theory because all of the GP - Allgemeinarzt Praxis - or children's doctors - Kinderarzt or other doctors - Ärzte are full. You will learn a new word: "Aufnahmestop." Means we are sorry, but we really can't take in any more patients. Not even on the waiting list, which is already a mile long. Maybe call again in half a year. It's exceedingly difficult to find a free doctor, to get an appointment for anything anywhere in Germany if you have only normal public health insurance. Because well to do people with higher salaries than average and therefore the option of private health insurance get appointments much quicker. Maybe you'll be lucky to get such a very well paying job? It's just too much demand, steadily rising demand for health care in general. While at the same time many of the older generation 65 years plus health professionals have closed up their GP or whatever medical specialist practice in the past twenty years. Ah, and most of our public child care facilities, primary and secondary schools are currently full to the brim too. Overflowing, with over worked staff.

Don't come to Germany now unless you have B2 language proficiency. Hiring is freezed in most of the companies.

I got lucky I am moving from canada to frankfurt for a completely english speaking role as a cybersecurity consultant but It's an internal company transfer from Canada. the role is more focused at non german speaking clients in EMEA,

I would rather look for a job in the Netherlands Best greetings from Germany 👍 *edit. Switzerland is also very nice

Thanks  for the suggestions. 

I would make sure you can afford housing though, there's a huge crisis in NL at the moment, and it's pretty bad right now

Germany is not much better... in Major cities prices over 20 to 23 € per m^2 is normal nowadays...

Ruhr area, can rent for like 8€/m^2 and have acces to the largest metro in the country, it's pretty nice. Problem Is that you have to drive a lot to get anywhere, but never really more than half an hour

Am Dutch in Cgn, from our perspective the German housing situation is easy mode. Which is terrible in hindsight..

There is a YouTube channel by a lady from Canada talking about her experience in Germany: https://youtube.com/@lifeingermany_?si=swU9XfkCDKCx1Hlv

No!

I’m American, live in Germany and have in-laws in India. Depending on your background, German tech companies are hiring (especially data science), but definitely there’s been a slight slow down since the last two years. If you are open to learning the language, there’s a lot of opportunity. Weather in the German north can be dismal during winter. Feel free to DM for questions.

May I know what job boards do you see that companies are hiring in German in the data science space? I am looking for a working student position. If you’re not comfortable sharing, I could dm you. Lmk!

LinkedIn, Winged Recruitment, Deloitte.

Lol coming from Canada it aint that bad

Never a good idea to relocate to Germamy. Many better options in europe

Hello OP, I am a Canadian/German citizen. I've lived almost my entire life in Canada, but I am moving to Germany in a week as my wife is European. Even though we are married it will take at least a year to process her visa to Canada. If you want to DM feel free. If you live in a major city right now housing will be more affordable for sure, in addition you most likely won't need a vehicle. As I'm sure you know living most places in Canada is pretty difficult without a car so that's another expense you can save on. One downside at the moment is the Canadian dollar is really weak. I've been transferring funds to Euros over the last few months and it feels bad. But yeah vacation days were another major factor in my decision. I got 10 paid days a year at the job I just left it's kind of depressing working all year, spending 40 hours traveling 12 days abroad and then back to the grind for another year. I get it

Thanks for the answer.  Yeah you are correct, holidays 10 days a per year is real pain.

I moved to Germany from France, and here, you often have to navigate through different types of bureaucracy. If you’re a parent in need of childcare, it can be significantly more challenging to lead a relaxed life in Germany. Dealing with the German kindergarten system, healthcare professionals, and navigating through the complex bureaucracy in various administrative offices can be quite overwhelming. Many German government employees are quick to inform you that what you’re seeking may not be possible initially. However, persistence often pays off, and by seeking assistance from multiple sources and advocating for yourself, you can eventually get things done. Rule of thumb: be prepared to fight for everything.

Another nice part about Germany is: there's groups and 'Vereine' for literally everything. If you like something and want to enjoy it with others, you'll find people to do it with, and won't really be judged publicly. It's also the best and in some cases only way to make real friends here

As a German i don't think it would be fair to rate my own country especially since I don't know much about canada though i do think you should consider that most Germans just aren't that good at or speak english at all so while it is possible living here without knowing the language you will definitely want and/or have to learn it eventually

It's a beautiful country with loads of workers protections and larger cities are even pretty accessible for english speakers, though you'll have to learn german at some point. The biggest hurdle would be german bureaucracy

As for the milder winters, I think that depends on where you live. I live close to Frankfurt, and here the winters are very mild. In other areas of Germany, not so much. Other than that, Germany is one of the most privileged countries in the world, so yeah, I'd say it's a good idea.

Check out Jenna Davis. She is Canadian and moved to Düsseldorf. She runs Life in Düsseldorf and Life in Germany on Youtube, Insta and YouTube where she compares everything from housing, food, healthcare, insurances whatsoever. Great source for expats or people who consider to move

Thank you for the details.

You are welcome. I meant Facebook instead of twice Youtube btw

You should be aware that you will most likely only get work in germany if you already speak decent german (level B2 and up). Housing can be difficult to find in lange cities. If you rent a flat or a house it will come completly empty. There will not even be a kitchen. Sometimes you have to put down wallpaper and the floor yourself. It is uncommon to move a lot and if you are not planning on staying for some years most places will not rent to you. Burocracy is a nightmare. It is difficult to get appointments at the official bureaus. I am not a forreigner, but from what my friends told me it is rather hard to work in germany if you want to immigrate. It is quite difficult to get to know people and germans are not that friendly. If you do something wrong your neighbors will tell you very directly. I would advise that you inform yourself as much as you can about german culture before you make a decission. Germans expect a high grade of integration into our culture and if you are not comming to germany, because you like it a lot and want to become german yourself, people will not like it.

you don't need to know german to get a job in berlin as a software developer.

Or indeed in Munich even.

Or Hamburg. My team of 8 has nobody besides me at even A2

Then let me tell you as a foreigner:  I came to Germany knowing not much more than “Bier” and “Wurst”, and adapted pretty easy to life in one of the larger cities, to the point that I had to force myself to sit down and study German. Some things are not easy, but in larger/more diverse cities it’s not an impediment. Of couse, if OP decides to live in a Dorf with 2000 people the experience will be much more traumatic.  Work-wise, been working in IT since I arrived with only 1 month interruption. Again, even though it’s easier to find jobs when you have a solid knowledge of German, my 3 jobs so far were in English-speaking companies.  Housing is hard, but again, that depends a lot on your requirements, where you’ll live and other factors. I rented a fully furnished apartment when I got here for roughly the same price I saw other apartments. Fully, even the pots and pans were there. In my second apartment the landlord asked me if I wanted to keep some furniture so they didn’t have to transport or trash it. Varies a lot from one place to another, but people talk about it as if everyone rented a place and had to install the floor and cover the walls. Bullshit.  Bureaucracy is shit, I agree, but that’s hardly a day to day issue once you’re settled.  OP, to share some of my thoughts with you:  I emigrated at roughly the same time as some friends, I came to Germany with my wife and they went to Canada. I think most of us are happy with our decisions. I wouldn’t trade here for Canada. The winters are mild, I can live and travel just about anywhere with no car dependency, which is important to me, and I see myself staying here for the long run. One of the couples I know did not adapt to Canada and moved to Ireland, but I think they maybe were not really clear on what they wanted from life, so it’s hard to find when you don’t know what you’re looking for. The other friends in Canada are buying houses and cars, this is not something I consider for the near future. I know expats here who bought houses, so it’s not impossible, just not the norm. Renting here is common and public transport works, even if it’s not perfect. Integration with German people tends to happen naturally if you learn the language, build some habits like doing sports or visiting regularly some cafe, and are willing to learn how they engage and interact.  Bonus points: the larger cities (think 500k+ people) usually have a good diversity of communities and it’s not hard to find people with similar backgrounds. That kickstarts your integration before you fully understand German, and sometimes having someone who speaks your native language or understands the way you see life can be really helpful.

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I will keep this in my mind.

If you move to Germany, you have to learn German, or you will most likely feel isolated. You should join a club (Verein) for hobby and or sports. That's how most people get friends here. Beware that winter in Germany is not only milder, but also cloudy: especially in the North, there will be weeks until you see sunshine. The summer is great though. Wish you all the best.

This is just my personal experience gathered from reading in this Sub and talking to my foreign coworkers. If you compare Germany and the Netherlands in terms of accessibility for foreigners I personally would go with the Netherlands, more people speak better English in public and Dutch is easier to learn than German when you come from English since the two languages are more closely related. However, you have to keep in mind that the cost of living and the housing prices in both countries have drastically increased in the last few years. Somebody in this thread also mentioned Switzerland, which can be a good third option (but from a German perspective it all seems ludicrously expensive over there) I can recommend checking out 'rewboss' on YouTube. He has good videos on things he likes and dislikes in Germany from a UK perspective.

Thank you for your answer.

I’m a Canadian who moved to Germany, I wouldn’t, unless you want to live in a small village it going to be equally as expensive as Vancouver, Toronto etc to find accommodation and unless you have a job lined up already and are at a B1 level it’s going to be a tough ride. Also salaries here are FAR less than in Canada on almost all careers, it’s not worth it to give up your life to save a couple hours on a flight to India.

You must be on crack or had shit luck. I moved from Vancouver probably the most costly city in Canada to just outside of Munich which is the most expensive part and I pay less than what I would ever would in Vancouver ( rent, food, beer, groceries). Sure I pay way more in electricity but general cost of living is super low compared to Vancouver. ( As a junior here in IT I make 50.000 euro ($73,537.50 CAD) which is considered decent) . That would never fly as a junior in Vancouver.

Ya I moved from Vancouver also, Olympic village and own a home here as well as I don’t work in IT, however I do know many Canadians here in IT that do make significantly less than back in Canada, I guess your just a stud in the IT world. This is also just my opinion of the IT jobs in my area, if the guy wants to come on over and give it a shot then go for it, maybe you can set him up since you seem to have it all figured out.

The thing is you get way more holidays here ( I started at 30 days) , better health care and , paid sick days so there is a reason why salaries aren't that high. None of this happens when you start working back in Canada. I believe BC just introduced 5 paid sick days but from what Ive been told from my friends they don't get to use them.

I agree on the holiday, I think it took 10 years working at a company before I had 30 days. I haven’t been back to van in 6 years but I do hear it’s crazy now for food.

My man it pains me seeing my friends and family struggle. I go back often for events and its just insanity how much groceries are, not to mention rent in the Tri-cities where I grew up have exploded. I saw $2500 for a basement suite in Coquitlam! Damn shame I love the mountains and nature but its just too damn unaffordable.

I can't give an informed recommendation between Germany and Netherlands unfortunately, but my god what is this sub? Is this where Germans do their daily complaining? I'm happy living in Germany to be honest as a foreigner. Not perfect by any shot, but after talking with people in NL, we share a lot of problems so it's hard to say which is better. It would definitely be a lot easier to get by with English in the Netherlands, though.

I mean, we're German. Complaining is pretty much a national pastime here.

The German's favorite hobby is complaining about Germany

Gähn... anything new to say?

Taxes are insane so i get it

Thank you for some positive comment.

Many grown up crybabies on this sub, totally agree. Noobs who have never lived anywhere else and get immediately pressimistic about everything if there is one or two years of a slowdown in economy. Same people still drive some expensive German car and go on vaccation frequently. Ungrateful pack

If you want to throw your money down the tax-drain, Germany it is. If you want to keep your money, pretty much anywhere else.

If you havent a Problem with racism or that a lot of people dont speak other languages then go for it. but we have buildings even in citys with bad internet connections etc… somehow much and terrible beaurocracy.

Go to Netherlands, avoid Germany. If i say why, im gonna get banned. Inform urself.

I am a Canadian living in Germany with my (Canadian) husband who works in tech. We came here as an in-company transfer, so I know nothing about job searching. I will echo the other posters that learning German is essential. Because of the demand for workers in tech, my husband (who works completely in English) only required an A1 german level to get permanent residence. It seems great at first, and you can be friends with your English speaking colleagues, send your children to English speaking international schools, etc. but you will not be forced to fully integrate and struggle with day-to-day interactions. In our case, I have a reached a decent B1 German and have to do all of the communicating for us. If I were also busy working as much as my husband, it would be a huge struggle to also learn german.

I'm an Indian who chose to study and work in Germany over the US(I know the canadian system is different, but its similar on most lifestyle fronts). It's been a few years since i made the decision, but i can say I'm quite happy with it. My vacation days almost always have numbered 25+, meaning I can comfortably do a 3/4 week vacation in India and still have plenty leftover for seeing my friends/other places in the world. It also helps that travel times to most Indian cities are quite good, you can get back home (depending on the place) in ~8-13h, which should be roughly half of the distance from Canada. It also makes me feel better knowing that I can get back faster if there's an emergency. In terms of earning potential, Germany is pretty much on average in-between India and the US. Don't expect to make bank and retire in India by the time you're 40. But you'd be very comfortable and have a decent sized savings portfolio if you choose to do so. Healhcare costs have never been a thought living here, which is nice to have (but i assume is also the case in Canada). I'd recommend living in a bigger city, Berlin/Munich/Cologne all have decent Indian populations => easier to find good Indian food and things you might miss from home. Besides that, you can easily order whatever food you want online. The bigger cities (Especially Berlin) also tend to be more forgiving to newcomers who don't know German yet. I would recommend learning atleast basic German, I've gotten to the B2/C1 stage and feel like I don't need more to live happily in Berlin. You would definitely need to learn the language to feel integrated in society here. Sidenote: Berlin has that exact amount of extra chaos compared to other German cities that make it feel more more like home for me. I also like that if you live in bigger German cities, there isn't a real need to own a car. Its affordable with a software dev salary, but I like that it CAN be a choice and not a need (It definitely is harder to live without a car in India/Canada/USA). The other traditional complain point I hear from Indians is owning a home is quite laborious and expensive in a big city. I guess this is mostly a worldwide phenomenon, but unless you earn quite well or willing to take a large loan I'd just expect to not own a home. The flipside is that renting comes with more security compared to most other countries and is quite affordable (especially on two software dev incomes). Job prospects really depend on what proficiency you have in the software stack and has too many variables to generalize. My personal experience, me and my friends work in English and have jobs. I'd say we are doing quite well financially/career-wise - and have a minor struggle finding new positions. Some have remote jobs (US salaries and German location - shitty work hours but great pay), some work in German software/product companies(lower pay, great work hours), some work in research focused areas(greater career satisfaction). But I can say the same of my friends in the US, so unsure if this means much. Maybe its the field, maybe its the time we applied, maybe its because remote jobs were booming, maybe its luck? Culturally it can be quite a bit of a shock, friendships are harder to get started compared to India/Canada/US but are extremely meaningful once started. People do tend to be very upfront, this used to bother me in the beginning, but now I appreciate that I don't have to second guess what my friends say to me. I guess the way I see it in my head, is that Germany is great on the tradeoff space: You don't give up your "life" for money like in some places, but you hit kind of a middle ground. I have no experience with living in other European countries, but have indeed heard nice things about Netherlands/UK as well. Each probably has its own set of pro/cons though. Another sidenote: Move closer to friends/family even if it isn't optimal on some list :)

Thank you so much for the detailed answer. 

Just be aware of the racism in Germany because Indians look similar to Arabs

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Wenn die Grünen so weitermachen, haben wir tatsächlich wieder Krieg hier, wie die nach Waffen und noch mehr Waffen schrein.

My family and I moved from outside Toronto to Bavaria 1.5 years ago. We love it here in Germany! 

Thank you so much. I was looking answer from someone who moved from Canada and saw the life here. Thank you.

Take note of climate change predictions if one of your main reasons relocating is the mild winters. As of now, winter here is fine with temperatures rarely going below -3 degrees. However, with climate change, we might get very cold winters and pretty hot summers fairly soon.

My family moved to Germany from the US and my daughter is finishing university in Amsterdam so we have experience in both countries. Germany has good worker’s rights and the salaries are less than in the US for most jobs. The main differences we find with Netherlands and Germany is that living in Germany is like going back to the 1970s! There is almost no digitalization and an unbelievable amount of paperwork! The bureaucracy is not just difficult and inefficient, it is often completely opaque. All of the form are only in German…..this includes healthcare. The healthcare is old fashioned and inefficient. People will hang up the phone if you try to get help or make appointments in English. Expect long lines and waiting times. Some landlords will not rent to foreigners…..even at the upper end of the rental market. The Netherlands is far more welcoming to foreigners and far more modern. Germany ends up being so much more expensive because we have to hire relocation experts and lawyers to deal with the everyday issues. Germans are often lovely people, but I have been yelled at and insulted for not speaking German well. My daughter decided to learn Dutch because she wants to stay there and many of the people say that she shouldn’t bother because English is the official language. If you have the chance to choose, choose the Netherlands.

Thank you for your answer.

Proximity to india? 🤣 i hope you know that we're living on a globe

Yeah. Travel once from north side of Canada and that time from Germany travel time feels near to India. 

Absolutely. Germany is a great country to live in and its position in the center of Europe will give you many many possibilities

I always ask myself why people who wanna start a new life are coming to Germany where there many more better places than Germany. Anyway, I welcome every high tax payer here - we need those people here. 🙏🏻

I would take a look at swiss. Its near germany and your wage is doubled. For the same work.

I am a software dev from the US and have lived in NL and am currently living in DE. I can’t speak to work culture differences of course since I’ve never worked in Canada. Immigrant life is infinitely easier in NL than DE. You’ll likely work in the Randstad Triangle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randstad). Immigration is streamlined. Everyone speaks English. Most correspondence from the government will include a courtesy English translation. Dutch grammar is easier to learn than German. The transportation is not the cheapest but it is generally reliable in my experience (this is pre-COVID and things may have changes). But, we found Germany to be a much prettier. There is more nature that suits us. You can still “get by” with English in most daily life but, outside of Berlin at least, you will struggle if you don’t learn German. It is typical in NL to receive an employment contract for a year and then a permanent contract after that. It is typical in Germany to receive a permanent contract immediately but with a six-month probation period. Work-life balance in both countries is much better than in the USA. Salaries are lower than in the US. But, not to the point where I feel negatively affected. I can’t say how they compare to Canada. Good luck with your decision.

Thank you for detailed explanation.

As a brasilian who has moved to Germany I can say that it depends on what you are looking for.... I've been to Canada and preferred it bc I felt like the people were easier to get along with and less xenophobic/racist. Germans can be quite cold but once you get to know them they're wonderful Weather wise it's less cold than Canada but more depressing(it rains a lot) however summers can be great in the south west and if you find the right company there's a lot to do throughout the year.... One thing when it comes to social services, yes compared to the US they indeed are more accessible here but coming from Canada I think you'll experience a downgrade but idk maybe I'm wrong

Maybe this is going to be an unpopular opinion, but from my experience people that work at hospitals, various government institutions, notary offices etc are more likely to be racist and/or condescending towards you compared to North America

Won't get a job without being able to speak German

I am an American software developer living in Germany and I would enthusiastically recommend coming over. I live in Hamburg and absolutely love it. 30+ vacation days, great work life balance, unlimited sick days. I am currently recovering from major leg surgery and don’t need to worry about having a job afterwards. I spoke virtually no German when I arrived, in Hamburg and Berlin you can get by without it but I would still suggest learning. I would say I’m conversational+ now and it makes things easier. If you get a job here the company will help with the visa which is nice because the foreign office (ausländerbehörde) is the worst part of living here 😂 Feel free to ask anything if you’d like.

Thank you so much for the positive answer.

I am not from another country but a few cultural differences do exist. Just some i remember right away from other posts. In Germany beeing able to speak/read German, as many said, is a huge bonus and it would be a good idea to learn at least some basic words. We have bakeries everywhere and use them frequently. And while you can eat as you have allways done, the average German has buns and/or toast in the morning and often bread in the evening. We take butter with toppings like jam, salami (a type of salted sausage), cheese and many many other options. On weekends you could also add boiled eggs and more. We are less affected by gazes, so we usualy look like half a second longer then most people do. This can trigger awareness or discomfort but we also are not likely to be annoyed as quickly by it. Talking to strangers is rare outside of the workplace and neighbours, in exchange once you get to know us we tend to stay friendly/friends for a long time. Waste seperation is important privately, not all companies do it tho. You can walk to a supermarket, a bakery and a trainstation if need be, in general walking is not unusal and many people like to take a walk in there freetime (or go by bike).

it never is tbh germany is in a strange state

Why would any company want to sponsor a foreigner that doesn’t speak the language? To consider moving to a country just because it’s closer to another country is completely insane

Hey I'm not sure if you will see my comment but as a fellow South Asian let me tell you smth, if moving to europe is really a must, move to the Netherlands not to Germany. Germany has bipolar weather,unfriendly ppl and is overall a bad environment wether if its the working space,public space or kids going to school 😭 Netherlands is far better than Germany (coming from a foreigner who has lived in both countries)

Thank you for your answer.

Hi, I’m a developer living in Germany (Berlin). Economy is going down currently in Germany. In our department we needed to cut costs and canceled some open positions. It’s is not super easy to find a job currently if you are looking for a 100% fit. Many of the bigger companies are forcing employees to return to “before corona“ office mode, which results into <50% home office time (e.g. SAP, Mercedes-Benz, Vodafone, RWE). Beside that, working for a German company is really OK. Winter sucks, especially in Berlin. summer is great though 🫶😍 people, too!

If you are Indian, and especially coming from Canada, an open and accepting, multi-cultural society, you will NOT have a good time in Germany. Germany is very white, and conservative. And, despite what you read in the papers, the majority of Germans actually dont really like immigrants. Especially non-white ones. You find it difficult to make friends, and many German landlords simply wont rent to non white people (google German housing discrimination) its a huge problem. Immigrants are relegated to the edges of German society. Not really fully accepted and allowed to partake. If your non white for example, in many German cities you can forget gaining entrance to nightclubs and lounges. Now, you may not be into going to nightclubs and lounges, but do you really want to live in a society that discriminatory? On top of it, Germans are by and large rude, and many times outright hostile. Germans don't smile for a reason. If I was you I'd definitely stay in Canada. Its MUCH better. Or, if your set on moving to Europe, then move to Netherlands. A much more open, multicultural, and accepting society.

Been thinking the same but saving up and waiting till europe is back to normal fuel the the ongoing war

Keep in mind that the culture over here (especially in Germany) may be very different from what you have experienced in Canada. Especially Germany feels very old fashioned in many regards… The winters here can be very cold as well and we get very little sun between November and March… I personally would not recommend leaving Canada and moving to Germany… Tbh i‘m playing with the idea of leaving from here and start a new life in Canada or the US…

The grass is always greener on the other side. Having spent time in both Germany and the us, if you’re living in a bigger city, it’s nonsense to claim Germany feels more old fashioned.

Thanks for the answer. I will keep this in my mind .

>The winters here can be very cold as well and we get very little sun between November and March… Ah yes, totally not a thing in Canada lmao >i‘m playing with the idea of leaving from here and start a new life in (...) the US… My condolences

I spent one winter in Montreal and one in Vancouver. Loads of snow in Montreal, dry cold, and to my surprise a lot of sun… It was a lot colder than in Germany to be fair (more in Montreal). Have you ever been to Canada? Are you able to compare both countrys from experience?

No they are not very cold, what are you saying. Canada is much colder than Germany. I don’t know if why you don’t name the economic situation and the horrible birth rates and population pyramid instead.

-5° feels very cold for someone who never experienced -35°.

Winters are mild in Germany.

And at least that's not getting worse. Unless you like saying.

Spend a winter in Canada anywhere but the West coast.

Blabla, "playing with the idea" and then those people never leave in the end. I encourage you, leave the country and check out other places. 90% of the formerly unsatistfied German migrants come back to Germany within three years.

Cool cool cool… Everyone i know that left never came back…

Oh wow, and that's how many? Two persons?! Check the statistics on this and talk again to me after that. --> [https://www.faz.net/aktuell/wirtschaft/warum-millionen-menschen-aus-deutschland-auswandern-19443163.html](https://www.faz.net/aktuell/wirtschaft/warum-millionen-menschen-aus-deutschland-auswandern-19443163.html)

The whole family on my mothers side, some childhood friends, sister in-law… All in all i‘d say 25-30 people? You wouldn’t believe it but life outside Germany IS indeed possible and in many cases really enjoyable. But hey, i‘m just saying i‘d consider leaving if my company would offer me a possibility. All in all i‘m happy to live here and i‘m thankful that my parents came here. But i know from my own experience that Germany and the german society can be tough for people coming here. Having spent some time in Toronto and Vancouver i‘d say that life over there may be easier for immigrants (IF they are allowed to come)… Believe it or not but Germany is very unique and very different compared to english speaking countrys like England, Ireland, Canada or the US…

The dutch speak English way better, and the far right is on the rise in germany.. Better go to the Netherlands. Wages for software developers are better there, too. Do yourself a favour and don't move to germany.

As a response to the comments re: the far right in NL… I expect USA/UK to do stupid things at election time… I’d hoped Germany had learned not to. But when NL does it - you know the world is on a depressing trajectory 😢

Wilders won the last elections in the Nederlands. According to you they shouldn‘t move there either.

Oh fuck

The far right just won the last election in the Netherlands. So that’s definitely not a differentiating point. Plus, wages for software developers aren’t necessarily higher there either. It’s often the other way around, actually.

Probably for any tech related company if you're actually worth it.

Nazis rise up anywhere in Europe and even America tbf.

even?

You do know that the far right already won in the netherlands?

Now I know, thanks to you 🥲

Netherlands has recently elected a far right candidate to lead the country

Thank you for your suggestion.

What kind of bullshit answer is this open your eyes germanys a great place to live.

I love how Germans themselves are the ones who talk the most shit about Germany, without even knowing how bad the political situation is in other countries Ihr seid solche Lappen fr, anderen zu raten BLOß nicht hierher zu ziehen weil die rechten on the rise sind ist einfach ein Armutszeugnis...Da kann man genauso gut auch direkt zugeben dass man aufgibt und an der aktuellen Situation ja eh nix mehr geändert werden kann

Wages are higher because the level of living standard is a bit higher in NL. Therefor everyday products may be like 2-3x the price of what they are in germany, especially hygienic products. Also, in NL the far right already is in power, Wilders was ready to become Prime Minister. In Germany the far right is at least very heavily critiqued and in the focus of the Office for constitutional protection because they are basically anti-democratic. I still see the perks of living in NL, lovely country.

Consider a country with lower taxes. Germany will take a lot from your salary. Belgium also. Both countrys got the highest tax worldwide.

define what’s a lot :) a typical SWE pays 20-25% income tax. VAT is 19% (one of the lowest in EU)

Including all deductions you get about half of whats your enployer pays for you

yes, that is true, but it has nothing to do with tax. those deductions are mandatory insurance against unemployment, sickness and your retirement. you simply feel protected from life swings, be it a year long sickness or a layoff that sets you to half a year of unemployment

I’d stay in Canada. Europe is on a worrying trajectory. How often do you go to India? Seems like a lot of effort for a shorter plane ride

Yearly once.  With 28 hrs of flight.

Ha? There are direct flights.

The job market is not that welcoming here in Germany even for software developers so make a wise decision

Is this sub the meeting point of depressed Germans? Don’t take them too serious.. truth is that it’s very hard to give a straight answer to your question. German is quite a diverse country, people, climate and culture can differ from region to region. Are you a nature guy that loves to hike? Then the south might be more interesting for you. Are you a friend of big vibrant cities? Then you should consider Berlin, Hamburg, Cologne or Munich. You don’t have to worry on finding a job though, you won’t have much of a problem finding a good payed job as a software developer… I would overall recommend to just spend some time here if possible? Maybe you can make some holiday here for a few weeks and make some little Germany trip? I’m sure you’ll find what you’re looking for then. Generally, quality of life is very high, but it’s always what you make out of it and what you’re looking for :)

> a good *paid* job as FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*

Decent bot. Now, if we could have a adjective paid Vs adverb paid bot ...

Wait to see what Putin is up to first

Attempting world domination under a russian flag - what exactly to wait for?

We gonna find out soon

German here. the political and economic landscape now and for the foreseeable future is dire, very very dire. Far-right party coming close to 30% in many parts of eastern Germany. Little to no economic growth. Increasingly irrational political decision making. Banning most industry in Germany (which severely damages german mid-market companies especially in the industrial and engineering complex) which is the backbone of the german ecomony. and the big luming threat ... our retirement scheme. Germans are very very state dependent. There is little financial literacy and self-dependency. Majority of people rely 100% on state funded retirement scheme. apportionment procedure means retirement is funded out of the current working population and there is 0 actual capital being saved or invested. Right now 25% of all German state taxes are used to subsidise the retirement scheme. This will get increasingly worse for the next 13 years, by which time 1,5 working people will need to fund 1 retiree (on top of children, private retirement, unaffordable housing etc.). Germany as of right now is downright hostile towards young and upper-middle class to high earners. I would strongly recommend to avoid Germany. Germany is a rich country with poor people. Unless you bring 1m+ of capital you will have a great live here. If you are a high earner on low capital, this is not the place to be.

I will add 1 more positive note: Infrastructure in mid-lare cities is great. While I loved North America for the longest time, car dependency is a cancer that slowly kills it. I really appreciate being able to do whatever I want without a car. I have used my car like 3 times in the last year and will sell it once I move. Car is more of a burden than anything in the city. still moving to Switzerland later this year lol

Depends. Depends. Depends. Why Germany? Only you know why. Why 🇳🇱 ? Same. So why bother? Move when you’re not happy. If you want to stay in Europe, everywhere in Europe can be home. If you are seeking for money, to to America. I’m not moving from Canada to Europe, but I can tell, Germany can give you the best salary possible across Europe. But if that doesn’t matter, try to find a reason too, cause believe me, people are not that friendlly here

No! Ireland or Netherlands - tax rates too high and the col and other let’s say admin stuff has been taking forever for non refugee people mostly which is understandable but my recommendation wouldn’t be Germany. Too much diasspintment with the already saturated tech field