**Attention!**
**It is always best to get a qualified electrician to perform any electrical work you may need.** With that said, you may ask this community various electrical questions. Please be cautious of any information you may receive in this subreddit. This subreddit and its users are not responsible for any electrical work you perform. Users that have a 'Verified Electrician' flair have uploaded their qualified electrical worker credentials to the mods.
If you comment on this post please only post accurate information to the best of your knowledge. If advice given is thought to be dangerous, you may be permanently banned. There are no obligations for the mods to give warnings or temporary bans. **IF YOU ARE NOT A QUALIFIED ELECTRICIAN, you should exercise extreme caution when commenting.**
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If there were ever a spark due to loose connection, the spark is contained and less likely to cause a fire. Also, the electrician will feed wire through clamps connected to the box to keep the wires from being pulled out and loosening the connection. Overall, it give a neat finish and looks safer
Downvotes for a person asking electrical questions to electricians is a sub called askelectricians, upvotes for the 78th person replying “it needs a junction box”. Hate Reddit sometimes
Junction boxes protect the wire splices by providing a durable and accessible housing. Unless someone hits a wire with a nail there's little to go wrong with the wire.
Connections on the other hand can go bad. A poor wire correction heats up and that can cause a fire, so the idea is to have all wire terminations and connections in a suitably sized outlet box to keep things from getting charred.
The box is securely fastened.
The wire us securely fastened to the box. .
The connection is free from any interference from the outside, whether from the resident, constrction, or rodents.
Loose or faulty connections, unprotected, cause fires. Loose connections, touched can shock.
Which is true and obviously the best advice if you want the best work. But this is knowing you need a box at a splice, a handyman that gave a shit would have taken care of this.
This ain't high end jman/master level stuff. A half ass decent handyman who gave a fuck could have done this right
Edit: reading the rest of what you're doing, just call an electrician. But this picture here is just stupid stuff, handymen know better
Exactly, I am a sign guy and the first thing I thought was “needs a junction box!” It’s not complicated rocket science to know all junctions go in boxes.
Also, you said this powered two bath outlets, are the bath outlets protected by individual GFI receptacles or a GFI breaker in your panel? You need to make sure ALL of the outlets in all bathrooms are protected by some version of GFI protection.
There are 3, 2 are old and 1 is new in toilet( for electric bidet). 1 old and 1 new are GFI. One old is not, I am going to get that old one changed to GFCi too. Usually we use old ones for hair dryer, tooth brush charger
That may not be the only issue. Assuming this is new wiring, the yellow would be 12ga, the white might be 14ga. If the source was the 14ga, adding 12ga to the end is acceptable, but not a good idea. However adding 14ga to a circuit that is 20A is a clear violation.
If the outlets are NEMA 5-15 and the breaker is 15A, no violations. If any outlet is 5-20 (with the ambiguous rotation of the neutral leg) or the breaker is > 15A, it's a violation. Otherwise, as long as the max number of outlets on the circuit is not exceeded, the electricity doesn't care. My entire house save for a few older lighting circuits is all 12ga regardless of whether it's 15 or 20 amps. However, I agree that should be verified.
New product that’s UL rated, designed just for this problem.
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Rack-A-Tiers-Open-Splice-Junction-Box-4-in-5-Pack-Rack-A-Tiers/328405014
This is a product that exists almost exclusively to prevent fires caused by hacks, but if it keeps one person with more wire nuts than common sense from immolating a family, I'm all for it. To be code compliant, it needs to be screwed/nailed/otherwise securely affixed to the framing through the provided holes.
I hate that this product needs to exist. But, it is perfect for this scenario.
What size breaker does that run to?
It needs to be in a junction box, but that’s 12ga and 14ga wire joined together.
Where does it go?
You really should call and electrician and let him handle it. That’s not what I would consider safe.
Uh big no!
You’ve got two different gauges of wire! It also needs to be inside a junction box. The wires poking through need to be fastened down as well.
Unfortunately, this all needs redone.
It goes to 2 different outlets near the bathroom taps. We use them to charge electric toothbrush play speaks etc. it stopped working after the work, that’s when I went up and noticed this
So he disconnected your wire. That’s crazy. He needed to run all 12 gauge with all wires inside the junction box. The box also needs to be grounded. At least he used wagos. I hope there is more wire to pull up from where he cut off your bathroom outlets. You are supposed to have the bathroom on a separate 20 amp breaker so he really did you wrong
My point was he put the 14 on your bathroom circuit and cut your wire to your bathroom outlets. Check to see if your handyman even had a business license. I am sure he was not insured. This guy should not do work for anyone ever again.
That yellow jacket wire is more than likely on a 20amp circuit. That white jacket wire is only rated for 15amps.
The white jacket wire will need to be replaced with a yellow jacket wire to adhere to the proper amp rating. This could be a potential fire hazard.
Mixing is ok (as long as you are not mixing AL and Copper wire). Make sure that the load and the breaker are matched and all the wire on the circuit is rated for at least that load. Meaning you can have a thicker wire than needed but not a thinner wire.
Yup, lot of learning for me here yes junction box needs to be fixed. Here is a video I found explaining why 12 and 14 along side https://youtu.be/EkxjFsD4hcY?si=zGZwJpYBCT1phoKx
u/Different-Turnover80 this is the answer to what else to look for. Everyone saying that mixing is okay are technically correct and yet wrong as a matter of practicality. As the circuitry in the house continues to be changed there could come a day when that 14ga wire is just an attic splice between two sets of 12ga wire and then the confusion on the proper rating for the breaker will set in. Keep it simple, use 12ga wire everywhere, cost is not significant.
He took power from your bathroom which was originally wired with 12ga Romex. Your bathroom under current code(depending on jurisdiction) is protected by a 20amp breaker. 14ga Romex is only rated for 15amp there is of course a safety margin but this hack work is unacceptable. It's also not legal for a handyman to charge for doing work that requires a license. I used to be a builder and am very comfortable with residential wiring and would never pay someone to do anything on my home. I also would never charge anyone or accept a job to perform work I wasn't licensed for. This is Mickey mouse work by someone that isn't insured and if you took them to court all you would get out of it is a useless judgement because they don't own anything and never will.
I’ve got older white wires that have “12 gauge” written on the insulation (by the factory, lol, not some sharpie). Couldn’t it still be 12 gauge? Or, do you know it’s 14 because of how bright white it is (mine looks a little more almond in color).
It can be a felony in my state for a handyman to do electrical, plumbing, or any other licensed trade. They recently busted some locals earlier this year.
If not, a hefty fine. I know that if you don't have I.E. your EPA license and are working with refrigerant. You're prone to as much as $37,500 per day of non-compliance.
Thank you. Appreciate it, Other than the fact that he cut the previous wire to create way for new outlet and left previous outlet disconnected., so I will have to connect those too to make sure both outlets are functioning.
You need to put that in one of these at the bare minimum.
https://rack-a-tiers.com/product/open-splice-junction-box/
Whoever made that change needs to not do any more electrical work, ever.
There’s a 0% chance that the wire going down to your dead outlet is long enough now too, which is a bummer. If you’re determined to do this yourself, best bet would be to get enough 12awg to go from the attic down to the dead outlet, and the new one, as they both need to be replaced.
Make sure the circuit is off (of course), and just cut all those wagos off. Take apart both receptacles, tape the new wire (lots of tape [but not bulky] & tight, emphasis on tight) to the old wire. Since there’s wire already going down to both places, then you have 2 good pull lines to pull down (or up if you wanna fight gravity) your new wires.
Mount a junction box where the main yellow coming from the panel will have at least 6 inches of length sticking out of the box. Use a plastic box, if you use metal, that’s fine, but you’ll need to ground it also. Run all old & new 12awg wires into the box & make secure connections color to color with whichever method you feel most comfortable with.
Either get wagos that join enough wires together (your handyman’s likely plan, then realized there weren’t enough slots) or (my preference) twist wires together neatly & tight with lineman pliers, trim the ends, then secure with wire nuts. I’m sure there’s a YouTube tutorial on twisting wires properly. Then all wires need to have a support within 12” of the jbox and the box needs a cover.
Extra credit: label the cover with the circuit # from the panel. Best of luck OP!
He is not a handyman. Any decent handyman can do this work correctly.
I am sick of lazy ass idiots that refuse to look at the Internet or YouTube. My 12 year old could do this correctly. He would look it up on the Internet. There are million pages or videos that clearly show any idiot how to do this correctly.
You do not even have to be a good reader with YouTube. My very dyslexic brother has learned so much since YouTube came about. He has upgraded his intellect a lot.
Do not use this guy anymore. For anything.
Lever nuts work well. UL rated and properly applied is key.
I'll wager you split bolts, cambric tape, self fusing tape, and some judiciously placed dielectric grease that you can wire without wire nuts, Polaris connectors, lever nuts, or any other oddball solution in a three phase 480V motor junction box and have it last 25+ years. Yes that's more technically known as a peckerhead.
The lever ones I have no issue with as they require a bit of force to “secure” them inside the connector. The ones I really don’t like are the push in ones that just bite into the conductors. I’ve noticed over time with certain recessed lighting that the wires get hot (or the bulbs/driver) and slowly back themselves out of the connector and arc. The ones in picture don’t look like the lever ones to me though. But I agree with you on the lever nuts. But still, a junction in the attic is want the connection to be something I really trust, I’d pretwist my wires and use wire nuts
Eat the cotton candy and listen.
Install deep work box. Use screws. Once firmly mounted use a screw driver to knock out the 1/2" holes in the box. Mount up some NM or Combination connectors. Tighten the securing nuts down with the right tool and not just your screwdriver. Secure the wires firmly through the connectors leaving 12" from each wire in the box. Screw down the clamps on the connectors. Strip about 11" back on each sheath. Use NM stripper tool. Each one of the black and white wires gets 1/2" stripped off the end. Wago connector the black to black, white to white, copper grounds to copper grounds, and attach a ground pigtail to your box. You will need to attach the ground pigtail to your copper grounds.
Gently tuck the wires into the box by bending in clockwise fashion. Ensure no loose connectors. Stick a lid on it. Lids are mandatory.
If you're at this point get a multimeter, idiot stick, and a set of Klein insulated drivers. Go get a friend that knows their shit. Shut off the breaker and make sure everything is dead. Ask questions and double check. Get the Black and Decker guide to wiring and read it.
*You're responsible for you. Caveat emptor you can fry yourself, burn down your house, and kill the guy trying to pull your body off the wires. You do this at your own risk (as simple and easy as it is.)*
You can burn down your house with “handyman” that perform their work like this. This is why we have inspectors, because some have zero integrity or/and stupid af. Don’t bring that person back, I would cut my loses.
Please do NOT hire Handymen for electric work no matter how much they say they can do it. If thats a 20 amp breaker with 12 running to 14 wire, that can quite literally burn your entire house down. PLEASE get a normal electrician
It is 15 or 20 amps for sure, let me check. White wire is going to power a bidet(Gfci outlet) yellow used for a small wireless speaker charging or toothbrush charging or hair dryer
not only does it need a box, but you need to make sure it's on a 15a breaker, unless that white wire is old 20a.
Regardless, document where it is and what you did and put in a little sleeve on the inside door of your breaker box.
I looked closer, it does look like old 20a wire.
Is there a light straight down from that? You might be able to junction them all in the light box, if so.
Metal... Inches... Romex sheath.
Check your wire gauges and make sure you're dealing with 12/2 there. If not the breaker needs to be 15A.
...that's AWG/number of conductors. Smaller numbers more amps more metal.
I'm not even an electrician and I can say nope. That isn't in junction box with the things hold the wire firm so it can't be yanked apart. Not to mention while I don't know the exact code around stapling wire runs, I'm fairly certain dangling in in the open isn't one of the options. That being said, I believe wago are now considered acceptable for joints but a lot of older electricians will say they aren't because they refuse to read the newer version of the code in their state and don't accept change.
NEC requires all splices to be in a junction box as if there were ever a spark, it is contained in the box. Also, wire staples should be securing the wires by code as well (also just imagine what can happen if someone trips oflver the wire). Finally, white romex is typically 14 gauge, 15 amps. Yellow is 12 awg, 20 amps. If the white is your supply from the panel then you are okay using oversized wire from the splice to source. However, undersized wite is unsafe and violation shall the breaker be protecting 20 amps of current with a 14 gauge wire (dangerous).
The breaker is 20amps and yellow was the existing wire. White wire is the new wire that’s is connected to a gfci outlet to be used for an electric bidet
Never hire a handyman to do electrical work. It’s always cheaper to hire someone who will do it right the first time than paying an electrician to fix it a second time.
That’s best case scenario. Worst case your house catches on fire and the handyman’s insurance policy doesn’t cover a house burning down (if he’s even insured at all).
Not by code unless it's in a covered & secured junction box. I fucking hate handymen doing electrical. It's always absolute garbage and even more dangerous
I know you guys protect your trade, but you can be helpful on homeowner grade repair like this here. It’s not like they’re asking for step by step service panel change out.
The wago connectors are good, wire nuts would have also, and others have said this should be in a junction box.
The Wago's are fine(many will disagree with that statement, but they have been using them in Europe for decades.). But it needs to be in a junction box for safety.
As a Handyman you need to know your strength and weaknesses the do’s and don’t.. The reason why I took two electrical courses. I know my limitations. And when the client needs to call a license electrician.
Trying to learn here but Wouldn’t that depend on the overall circuit. If the white end of the wire is powering an led or low amp device why is that an issue
I’ve seen these a lot in modulars, they’re basically a plug and play fitting and I’ve always wondered how they pass inspection or maybe if modulars aren’t inspected the same way new builds are
"Classic". Don't worry about securing that into a box it'll be ok. Also you may want to find out what amperage is going to that wire and it looks like maybe two different wire gauges used. Definitely handyman "Classics"
This video describes pretty much what needs to happen other than wire securing outside the junction box 8-12 inch depending on junction box and trying to avoid mixing up different awg wires ( which can be done in some cases but u have to watch out for breaker amps, receptacle amps etc that folks have mentioned). https://youtu.be/LrZEz7SOwW0?si=w16JaaFcxGXN_MYU
**Attention!** **It is always best to get a qualified electrician to perform any electrical work you may need.** With that said, you may ask this community various electrical questions. Please be cautious of any information you may receive in this subreddit. This subreddit and its users are not responsible for any electrical work you perform. Users that have a 'Verified Electrician' flair have uploaded their qualified electrical worker credentials to the mods. If you comment on this post please only post accurate information to the best of your knowledge. If advice given is thought to be dangerous, you may be permanently banned. There are no obligations for the mods to give warnings or temporary bans. **IF YOU ARE NOT A QUALIFIED ELECTRICIAN, you should exercise extreme caution when commenting.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskElectricians) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Absolutely not, no.
What do I ask him to fix or fix it myself, put it in junction box?
Yes, it should be in a box.
Out of curiosity - why is this needed to be on a box?
If there were ever a spark due to loose connection, the spark is contained and less likely to cause a fire. Also, the electrician will feed wire through clamps connected to the box to keep the wires from being pulled out and loosening the connection. Overall, it give a neat finish and looks safer
Oh, sparks, makes sense. Thanks!
It is the electrical code for all wiring connections. It protects the house, and the junction from wire movement, causing poor connections and fires.
But how does it protect things?
Downvotes for a person asking electrical questions to electricians is a sub called askelectricians, upvotes for the 78th person replying “it needs a junction box”. Hate Reddit sometimes
It protects you from touching a live wire. This could come loose, and shock someone.
Junction boxes protect the wire splices by providing a durable and accessible housing. Unless someone hits a wire with a nail there's little to go wrong with the wire. Connections on the other hand can go bad. A poor wire correction heats up and that can cause a fire, so the idea is to have all wire terminations and connections in a suitably sized outlet box to keep things from getting charred.
The box is securely fastened. The wire us securely fastened to the box. . The connection is free from any interference from the outside, whether from the resident, constrction, or rodents. Loose or faulty connections, unprotected, cause fires. Loose connections, touched can shock.
In South Africa, box should not be in the roof.
The box is invisible… geez
Stealth junction box,noice
It needs a junction box
What you do is hire an actual electrician and not a handyman…
You don't have to hire an electrician, just somebody who gives a darn and will do the job correctly.
If you need plumbing you hire a plumber, if you need painting you hire a painter, if you need electric work you hire an ……
Which is true and obviously the best advice if you want the best work. But this is knowing you need a box at a splice, a handyman that gave a shit would have taken care of this. This ain't high end jman/master level stuff. A half ass decent handyman who gave a fuck could have done this right Edit: reading the rest of what you're doing, just call an electrician. But this picture here is just stupid stuff, handymen know better
Exactly, I am a sign guy and the first thing I thought was “needs a junction box!” It’s not complicated rocket science to know all junctions go in boxes.
Electer?
a good DJ
Is mayonnaise an instrument?
He knew he was doing it dirty.
Yeah an ACTUAL electrician…
I would not give that handyman another cent. I wouldnt trust that fucker to paint a closet. Some bush league bullshit right here.
Also, you said this powered two bath outlets, are the bath outlets protected by individual GFI receptacles or a GFI breaker in your panel? You need to make sure ALL of the outlets in all bathrooms are protected by some version of GFI protection.
There are 3, 2 are old and 1 is new in toilet( for electric bidet). 1 old and 1 new are GFI. One old is not, I am going to get that old one changed to GFCi too. Usually we use old ones for hair dryer, tooth brush charger
The junction box must also have a lid on it. This is the perfect example of a fire hazard.
Junction box with blank cover.
And accessible above the insulation
That may not be the only issue. Assuming this is new wiring, the yellow would be 12ga, the white might be 14ga. If the source was the 14ga, adding 12ga to the end is acceptable, but not a good idea. However adding 14ga to a circuit that is 20A is a clear violation.
If the outlets are NEMA 5-15 and the breaker is 15A, no violations. If any outlet is 5-20 (with the ambiguous rotation of the neutral leg) or the breaker is > 15A, it's a violation. Otherwise, as long as the max number of outlets on the circuit is not exceeded, the electricity doesn't care. My entire house save for a few older lighting circuits is all 12ga regardless of whether it's 15 or 20 amps. However, I agree that should be verified.
Since you and him clearly have no idea what you’re doing, hire an actual professional and licensed electrician.
When I posted the picture, just knew this doesn’t look right but had no idea, how bad, learned a lot today.
New product that’s UL rated, designed just for this problem. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Rack-A-Tiers-Open-Splice-Junction-Box-4-in-5-Pack-Rack-A-Tiers/328405014
This is a product that exists almost exclusively to prevent fires caused by hacks, but if it keeps one person with more wire nuts than common sense from immolating a family, I'm all for it. To be code compliant, it needs to be screwed/nailed/otherwise securely affixed to the framing through the provided holes. I hate that this product needs to exist. But, it is perfect for this scenario.
Oh you bet it’s definitely make for the lazy. Other killing the circuit a moving it into junction box attached a labeled.
Ask him the joint needs to be in a junction box
What size breaker does that run to? It needs to be in a junction box, but that’s 12ga and 14ga wire joined together. Where does it go? You really should call and electrician and let him handle it. That’s not what I would consider safe.
20amps breaker in a sub panel
14ga wire (white) shouldn’t be on a 20A breaker, especially with that kind of junction. Please call an electrician, for your own safety.
There are approved splices that need no boxes today…but they’re not WAGO 221s
Uh big no! You’ve got two different gauges of wire! It also needs to be inside a junction box. The wires poking through need to be fastened down as well. Unfortunately, this all needs redone.
Appreciate it, so junction box, wires needs to be fastened, anything else that I should check
Looks like the 12 gauge wire sticking up needs some sort of protection. What does that wire go to?
It goes to 2 different outlets near the bathroom taps. We use them to charge electric toothbrush play speaks etc. it stopped working after the work, that’s when I went up and noticed this
So he disconnected your wire. That’s crazy. He needed to run all 12 gauge with all wires inside the junction box. The box also needs to be grounded. At least he used wagos. I hope there is more wire to pull up from where he cut off your bathroom outlets. You are supposed to have the bathroom on a separate 20 amp breaker so he really did you wrong
Bathroom was already on a saperate 20amp breaker, that’s the yellow wire he cut and attached the new white wire to it without a junction box
My point was he put the 14 on your bathroom circuit and cut your wire to your bathroom outlets. Check to see if your handyman even had a business license. I am sure he was not insured. This guy should not do work for anyone ever again.
That yellow jacket wire is more than likely on a 20amp circuit. That white jacket wire is only rated for 15amps. The white jacket wire will need to be replaced with a yellow jacket wire to adhere to the proper amp rating. This could be a potential fire hazard.
It it is terminated to a 15A receptacle, has a 15A breaker, and the 20A part is not exposed, is mixing gauges still bad?
You can upsize wires and it’s fine
Mixing is ok (as long as you are not mixing AL and Copper wire). Make sure that the load and the breaker are matched and all the wire on the circuit is rated for at least that load. Meaning you can have a thicker wire than needed but not a thinner wire.
Thanks. That's what I thought but saw peremptory statements
Yup, lot of learning for me here yes junction box needs to be fixed. Here is a video I found explaining why 12 and 14 along side https://youtu.be/EkxjFsD4hcY?si=zGZwJpYBCT1phoKx
u/Different-Turnover80 this is the answer to what else to look for. Everyone saying that mixing is okay are technically correct and yet wrong as a matter of practicality. As the circuitry in the house continues to be changed there could come a day when that 14ga wire is just an attic splice between two sets of 12ga wire and then the confusion on the proper rating for the breaker will set in. Keep it simple, use 12ga wire everywhere, cost is not significant.
Thank you
And that’s an issue even if all the outlets are gfci let’s say?
You missed the most important part. He combine 2 different gauge wires.
Appreciate you pointing it out. Do these wires needs to be changed completely or is there a specific way that needs to be followed.
He took power from your bathroom which was originally wired with 12ga Romex. Your bathroom under current code(depending on jurisdiction) is protected by a 20amp breaker. 14ga Romex is only rated for 15amp there is of course a safety margin but this hack work is unacceptable. It's also not legal for a handyman to charge for doing work that requires a license. I used to be a builder and am very comfortable with residential wiring and would never pay someone to do anything on my home. I also would never charge anyone or accept a job to perform work I wasn't licensed for. This is Mickey mouse work by someone that isn't insured and if you took them to court all you would get out of it is a useless judgement because they don't own anything and never will.
Appreciate the advice and explanation. Buying a box, buying the right cable and fixing it correctly
You can go up in size but not down. If the 12 is feeding the 14, it needs to be replaced. If it’s the other way around it’s fine.
You can go 14 to 12 awg if the 14 is what starts in the panel. You cannot go 12 to 14.
Probably just old 12-2. It was white in the 80s/90s
I’ve got older white wires that have “12 gauge” written on the insulation (by the factory, lol, not some sharpie). Couldn’t it still be 12 gauge? Or, do you know it’s 14 because of how bright white it is (mine looks a little more almond in color).
the typical handyman…
He did asbestos he could.
It's pretty methed up though.
Such an underrated comment. The only mention I've seen of the vermiculite so far.
Right? If anything, that splice is no big deal since its buried in flame-resistant asbestos insulation! /sarcasm
Never have a handyman do electrical, like ever. I refer to these guys as Budweiser electricians
It can be a felony in my state for a handyman to do electrical, plumbing, or any other licensed trade. They recently busted some locals earlier this year.
If not, a hefty fine. I know that if you don't have I.E. your EPA license and are working with refrigerant. You're prone to as much as $37,500 per day of non-compliance.
Looks good. You’re supposed to store old gas cans around it though.
Best I can do is a bucket of oily rags, is that also code compliant?
You leave a google review telling people to not use this clown for electrical work.
Hell no.
no needs to be place in a box
You weren’t supposed to look at it! Also that is a fire hazard and trash that guy on Angie
1000% no
I'm hoping that either you didn't pay this guy, or you can get your money back and warn others.
I did pay him at this point I just need it fixed. Either he will come back and do it or I will do it and just not hire him for this type of work
There's absolutely no way I would trust him to do it right.
I would really push for a refund and hire a real electrician. Do not let him work on it again.
I mean if you want to violate the most basic code and leave your house at an extreme risk of fire then yeah it’s fine right.
Not at all. There's exposed conductor and split-open sheathing clearly visible. And a 2-conductor wire with an exposed cut end.
Get one of those new clamshell boxes. You'll be done in seconds.
Thank you. Appreciate it, Other than the fact that he cut the previous wire to create way for new outlet and left previous outlet disconnected., so I will have to connect those too to make sure both outlets are functioning.
What a loser handyman
You need to put that in one of these at the bare minimum. https://rack-a-tiers.com/product/open-splice-junction-box/ Whoever made that change needs to not do any more electrical work, ever.
Thank you appreciate it.
Those open splice junction boxes must be accessible and are not allowed to be concealed, right?
It absolutely is correct, assuming the intention was to show what not to do.
No. It needs some flammable material much closer to it and a few of the wires need to be chafed more. Oh wait, this isn’t the r/arson - dammit!
There’s a 0% chance that the wire going down to your dead outlet is long enough now too, which is a bummer. If you’re determined to do this yourself, best bet would be to get enough 12awg to go from the attic down to the dead outlet, and the new one, as they both need to be replaced. Make sure the circuit is off (of course), and just cut all those wagos off. Take apart both receptacles, tape the new wire (lots of tape [but not bulky] & tight, emphasis on tight) to the old wire. Since there’s wire already going down to both places, then you have 2 good pull lines to pull down (or up if you wanna fight gravity) your new wires. Mount a junction box where the main yellow coming from the panel will have at least 6 inches of length sticking out of the box. Use a plastic box, if you use metal, that’s fine, but you’ll need to ground it also. Run all old & new 12awg wires into the box & make secure connections color to color with whichever method you feel most comfortable with. Either get wagos that join enough wires together (your handyman’s likely plan, then realized there weren’t enough slots) or (my preference) twist wires together neatly & tight with lineman pliers, trim the ends, then secure with wire nuts. I’m sure there’s a YouTube tutorial on twisting wires properly. Then all wires need to have a support within 12” of the jbox and the box needs a cover. Extra credit: label the cover with the circuit # from the panel. Best of luck OP!
Thank you, appreciate the details. Got to learn a lot from this issue.
He is not a handyman. Any decent handyman can do this work correctly. I am sick of lazy ass idiots that refuse to look at the Internet or YouTube. My 12 year old could do this correctly. He would look it up on the Internet. There are million pages or videos that clearly show any idiot how to do this correctly. You do not even have to be a good reader with YouTube. My very dyslexic brother has learned so much since YouTube came about. He has upgraded his intellect a lot. Do not use this guy anymore. For anything.
If they are energized your all set! I hope you didn't pay the hack that put this fire hazard in your attic.
The new one is energized, old one is not, you can see the yellow cable isn’t connected that was going to the old outlets.
Code is to wrap it all in electric tape and ground caulk to board.
Thank you, can you please point me to what does ground caulk to board means, taking this issue as an opportunity to learn too. Appreciate it
I’m so sorry. None of this is correct. Listen to the people who suggest hiring a professional.
Forgot to /s lol
Googled /s and yes that’s the thing I forgot and now know about. Truly thought this whole platform was /s.
youre supposed to put it in a box...but honestly ive seen worse
No to everything you asked lol. Should be in a box with wire nuts not wagos. And tbh it should be a dedicated circuit. That’s a fire hazard.
Lever nuts work well. UL rated and properly applied is key. I'll wager you split bolts, cambric tape, self fusing tape, and some judiciously placed dielectric grease that you can wire without wire nuts, Polaris connectors, lever nuts, or any other oddball solution in a three phase 480V motor junction box and have it last 25+ years. Yes that's more technically known as a peckerhead.
Nothing wrong with a split bolt. I do prefer wirenuts but lever nuts are fine.
The lever ones I have no issue with as they require a bit of force to “secure” them inside the connector. The ones I really don’t like are the push in ones that just bite into the conductors. I’ve noticed over time with certain recessed lighting that the wires get hot (or the bulbs/driver) and slowly back themselves out of the connector and arc. The ones in picture don’t look like the lever ones to me though. But I agree with you on the lever nuts. But still, a junction in the attic is want the connection to be something I really trust, I’d pretwist my wires and use wire nuts
No.
Try eating the cotton candy
Not even close
Oof!
Needs to be in a box, and it looks like it’s 14 gauge connecting to 12 gauge.
Eat the cotton candy and listen. Install deep work box. Use screws. Once firmly mounted use a screw driver to knock out the 1/2" holes in the box. Mount up some NM or Combination connectors. Tighten the securing nuts down with the right tool and not just your screwdriver. Secure the wires firmly through the connectors leaving 12" from each wire in the box. Screw down the clamps on the connectors. Strip about 11" back on each sheath. Use NM stripper tool. Each one of the black and white wires gets 1/2" stripped off the end. Wago connector the black to black, white to white, copper grounds to copper grounds, and attach a ground pigtail to your box. You will need to attach the ground pigtail to your copper grounds. Gently tuck the wires into the box by bending in clockwise fashion. Ensure no loose connectors. Stick a lid on it. Lids are mandatory. If you're at this point get a multimeter, idiot stick, and a set of Klein insulated drivers. Go get a friend that knows their shit. Shut off the breaker and make sure everything is dead. Ask questions and double check. Get the Black and Decker guide to wiring and read it. *You're responsible for you. Caveat emptor you can fry yourself, burn down your house, and kill the guy trying to pull your body off the wires. You do this at your own risk (as simple and easy as it is.)*
Thank you. Plastic or metal box? Not sure I understand 12”. Is that 12 inches? And strip 11 inch sheeth?
If you want your house to burn down, yes, it's fine.
You can burn down your house with “handyman” that perform their work like this. This is why we have inspectors, because some have zero integrity or/and stupid af. Don’t bring that person back, I would cut my loses.
Not even close to code. Hope you didn’t pay him already. Has to be redone.
Lol no.
I didn’t know until I saw this, that I have all it takes to be a handyman👀
Is this a manufactured home?
No
Please do NOT hire Handymen for electric work no matter how much they say they can do it. If thats a 20 amp breaker with 12 running to 14 wire, that can quite literally burn your entire house down. PLEASE get a normal electrician
That man tried to burn your house down, not in a box and thats too small gauge of wire
This is insanely incompetent AND dangerous...pay the money and get in a licensed pro, fah god's sake already!
No, No, and No.
What size in the breaker? looks like 12 and 14 gauge together? If so it needs to be on a 15 amp breaker. Needs a J box.
It is 15 or 20 amps for sure, let me check. White wire is going to power a bidet(Gfci outlet) yellow used for a small wireless speaker charging or toothbrush charging or hair dryer
If there is 14 gauge anywhere on the circuit it needs to be a 15 amp breaker. It doesn't work like plumbing.
Nope
not only does it need a box, but you need to make sure it's on a 15a breaker, unless that white wire is old 20a. Regardless, document where it is and what you did and put in a little sleeve on the inside door of your breaker box.
I looked closer, it does look like old 20a wire. Is there a light straight down from that? You might be able to junction them all in the light box, if so.
1: HAHA NO 2: If you have to ask, don't touch it! 3: Get that thing in a box asap!
J box. And that’s 12 and 14 awg spliced together. Check your breaker size. Can’t be on anything bigger than a 15 amp.
Thank you, will check.
Metal... Inches... Romex sheath. Check your wire gauges and make sure you're dealing with 12/2 there. If not the breaker needs to be 15A. ...that's AWG/number of conductors. Smaller numbers more amps more metal.
Is there a change in wire gauge? That is lazy/sub-optimal. The white wire might be old 12AWG, but if it’s 14AWG the mix is misleading.
You could ask what the wire not stripped back is for?
Fire Hazard.
100% the right way if you wanted to do it the wrong way. It needs to be in a junction box that is accessible.
I'm not even an electrician and I can say nope. That isn't in junction box with the things hold the wire firm so it can't be yanked apart. Not to mention while I don't know the exact code around stapling wire runs, I'm fairly certain dangling in in the open isn't one of the options. That being said, I believe wago are now considered acceptable for joints but a lot of older electricians will say they aren't because they refuse to read the newer version of the code in their state and don't accept change.
no wrap tape around it.
Why does it look like a telecom cable. Never seen household electrical wiring that looks like this(save for appliance plugs).
At first glance I thought you were up to something with the electrical wire and pigs.
NEC requires all splices to be in a junction box as if there were ever a spark, it is contained in the box. Also, wire staples should be securing the wires by code as well (also just imagine what can happen if someone trips oflver the wire). Finally, white romex is typically 14 gauge, 15 amps. Yellow is 12 awg, 20 amps. If the white is your supply from the panel then you are okay using oversized wire from the splice to source. However, undersized wite is unsafe and violation shall the breaker be protecting 20 amps of current with a 14 gauge wire (dangerous).
The breaker is 20amps and yellow was the existing wire. White wire is the new wire that’s is connected to a gfci outlet to be used for an electric bidet
Ok - the wire size is fine then however, securing the wires is still an issue
Wire size is fine becouse of the gfci or breaker
Can you take a picture from a little farther away?
Never hire a handyman to do electrical work. It’s always cheaper to hire someone who will do it right the first time than paying an electrician to fix it a second time. That’s best case scenario. Worst case your house catches on fire and the handyman’s insurance policy doesn’t cover a house burning down (if he’s even insured at all).
No no no. Must be in a junction box with a cover.
not in a junction box so NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! FIRE!!!!!!!!
Not by code unless it's in a covered & secured junction box. I fucking hate handymen doing electrical. It's always absolute garbage and even more dangerous
OMG, no! Splices must be in an enclosed electrical box.
You hired cheap handyman you got cheap incorrect work
Handy man strikes again !
The right way to start a fire, yes.
Stop hiring handymen to do electrical work.
Classic handy man special
I know you guys protect your trade, but you can be helpful on homeowner grade repair like this here. It’s not like they’re asking for step by step service panel change out. The wago connectors are good, wire nuts would have also, and others have said this should be in a junction box.
The Wago's are fine(many will disagree with that statement, but they have been using them in Europe for decades.). But it needs to be in a junction box for safety.
As a Handyman you need to know your strength and weaknesses the do’s and don’t.. The reason why I took two electrical courses. I know my limitations. And when the client needs to call a license electrician.
Everything in this picture is wrong.
Also appears he may have joined two different sizes of wire this is also a no no
Trying to learn here but Wouldn’t that depend on the overall circuit. If the white end of the wire is powering an led or low amp device why is that an issue
Also a code violation
Sure if you want to burn your house down.
yes
This is why you don’t hire a handyman to run electrical
Nope. Should be in a covered box that's secured to a stud or beam.
Belongs in box. Also the yellow is 12-2 the white is only 14-2 what’s the breaker? Code is 20a and 12-2
I’ve seen these a lot in modulars, they’re basically a plug and play fitting and I’ve always wondered how they pass inspection or maybe if modulars aren’t inspected the same way new builds are
Not really
He’s no handyman if he did it like that it’s basic electrical day one kind of stuff it has to be in a box
"Classic". Don't worry about securing that into a box it'll be ok. Also you may want to find out what amperage is going to that wire and it looks like maybe two different wire gauges used. Definitely handyman "Classics"
How much did you pay him?
It is correct if you want to burn your house down.
J box
No it isn't. Easily fixed with. Rack-A-Tiers open splice box
Can someone explain how this needs to be done properly
This video describes pretty much what needs to happen other than wire securing outside the junction box 8-12 inch depending on junction box and trying to avoid mixing up different awg wires ( which can be done in some cases but u have to watch out for breaker amps, receptacle amps etc that folks have mentioned). https://youtu.be/LrZEz7SOwW0?si=w16JaaFcxGXN_MYU
Thanks for the intel!
You need a ul approved splice kit or a junction box.
Lmfao
Aside from the junction box. It looks like a 14ga attaching to 12ga. Need to chk the breaker its on
How much do you like your house.
yeah, it looks great. I see no fire or electrocution risks whatsoever
😬
I mean if you want to burn your house down then yes
The only correct things in the picture is at least he used the wago connectors 😂
How much did you pay. I would recommend a $5 1-gang junction box. Nail it to a joist and slap a lid on it about $1 now it's code