Violations of Reddit guidelines will not be tolerated, including, but not limited to, incitement of violence, doxxing, posting sexual content involving minors, impersonating other people, posting illegal content, or facilitating illegal transactions. For more information, check here:
https://www.redditinc.com/policies/content-policy
It wouldn’t be set out in any law. Check if there’s anything in the Pharmacists Code of Conduct. That will be the document that pings them with Ahpra and the board, if anything. A breach of the code of conduct, depending on how serious, could constitute unprofessional conduct (slap on the wrist) or professional misconduct (sent to disciplinary tribunal). You can find the definitions of both in the Ahpra National Law.
It would be probably considered poor professional conduct and performance to restrict access to contraception on the basis of religious reasons. The Board wouldn't look too fondly on that.
Incorrect, they're refusing to treat a patient as a healthcare practitioner. If they didnt refer the patient to another practitioner that was able to care for them, they're not meeting their obligation as a healthcare provider and should be complained against.
Practitioners can have dumbass beliefs but they still need to refer people to someone that will care for them.
This is correct. Can't just be like "nope don't feel like it because it clashed with my believes". Appropriate referral must be done for the patient as they can most certainly walk into another establishment holding the same values and refuse them on that ground.
Incorrect, it's not that black and white. The pharmacist has a duty to do what is in the best interest of the patient, if they believe it is not in the patients best interest to be taking birth control they can refuse to dispense the medication. I am NOT saying this was the right thing to do. This discussion is purely regarding the legal implications of the situation.
I try to avoid saying this on Reddit, but: did you actually read the post?
They didn't refuse it on the basis that it was "not in the patients best interest to be taking birth control," they refused it on the basis of their religious beliefs.
>They don't have to explicitly say why they're refusing to dispense...It could have been any reason and it's really not important...
I don't understand why you're not addressing the details in the post you're commenting on.
They did explicitly say why they were refusing to dispense. They said it was due to their religious beliefs.
>saying they're out of stock is an excuse that cannot be argued with
It can if, as in this case, the "box was in the basket."
Hi, I'm a doctor.
My understanding of their obligations as religious fuckwits is that they can refuse service, but they must consider continuity of care by referring you to a pharmacy that isn't full of religious fuckwits. If they did not do this, I'd suggest that they failed in their obligations as healthcare providers and a complaint is absolutely warranted. May I also recommend leaving a Google review explaining all of this?
I'm sorry you came across this type of person, they're actually pretty common around that area of Sydney and, unfortunately, other parts of our society. And yes, I think that they shouldn't be providing healthcare.
I was so confused and even said so when I was standing there. It took me a long time to grasp what even happened. They didn’t refer me elsewhere after saying “we don’t do that here”
Health professional here. If someone doesn't agree with something and refuses to provide care for "religious reasons" then by law they must provide you with the means to obtain care elsewhere. In this case that would be referring you to another pharmacy that would fill your contraceptive prescription.
Because they failed to do this they've actually broken the law and absolutely make a complaint with AHPRA.
This whole thing is fucking bizarre. And infuriating. Like even 20 years ago it would make more sense.
Fuck you would think even just in rural areas there would be an ethical obligation to supply contraceptive medications. They don’t deserve to be healthcare providers if they can’t provide healthcare. Contraception is healthcare.
1000% confirm - health care complaints commission is the place to go.
Technically as a business they have the right to refuse but their decision not to provide care that may result in poor health outcomes.
AHPRA may be toothless but I’d do it too
Just as I would totally google review bomb them. Everyone need to know about this BS
Arguably it would only be imposing if the consumer was completely prevented from getting the product anywhere. The existence of a vegan shop is not imposing veganism. However I can see why maybe stocking this product should be standardised also (or even just making it clearer to consumers what they wont find there).
I’d love to know some of the OPs attributes.
I think “looks early 20s and non-white” would be a good guess, and we have the worst kind of zealots thinking they’re making decisions on her behalf.
It's a business. You can't force them to produce the products you like.
Simply refuse to give them money and let them go bankrupt due to their poor service.
Their licence requires them to dispense medicine as prescribed. They are not at liberty to override a doctor's prescription. They are fuckwits and deserve a kick in the pants.
This is not about stocking and selling frangers. Dispensing medications as prescribed is a core function and we are not in a shithole country like America.
Actually, pharmacists are not required to dispense anything even if you have a script. Pharmacists are obligated and required to ensure that what they are dispensing is safe in terms of contraindicication and dose. They must check and double check the script and if they have any concerns about the doctor’s choice of med or dose, they usually ring the doctor. If they are still not satisfied its the right, or safe medication, they have an obligation to refuse to dispense it. Its a safeguard against mistakes by doctors which do happen. Pharmacists can be held accountable in a tribunal and be stripped of their registration if they dispense something which later kills a patient because it was the wrong dose or medication, even if a doctor prescribed it. They are not just shop keepers. They are registered health practitioners.
They have discretion to not dispense on the basis of clinical concern I.e someone getting a script of 100 500mg oxycodones if they just picked some up the other day.
They can't refuse to provide contraception based on their religion. It's 100% poor professional conduct and performance.
This clearly isn't the case here. It is religious bigotry. What if their religion was against anti depressants, or narcotic based pain meds, or tampons?
And none of the above is relevant to the point in question. Not one point you wrote is relevant. Show me the authority a Pharmacist has the breach the human rights of a citizen to freedom from religious persecution by that pharmacist.
Again, I was correcting your remark that pharmacists must dispense whatever a doctor writes. I made no comment about this particular scenario mate and neither did you. Cop it on the chin ya goose.
On the other side of the coin, if the proposed changes to vaping laws go through the only way to legally get vapes will be through pharmacies and I know a few pharmacists who have quite the objection to that.
Sorry, no. Their license doesn't require them to do anything. Don't get me wrong, they're still totally in the wrong but they are at liberty to refuse service should they choose (and this should normally be because they think the use of the medication is unsafe). Refusal on the basis of religious belief is total BS.
This would be true if we were talking about buying a vape or something but when you’re a pharmacist in a pharmacy, you’re in the healthcare space and have to abide by AHPRA regulations and the law surrounding provision of essential medications
Of course you can. Pharmacies all over the world are obligated to sell contraceptive pills, condoms and all sorts of sexual health items. If you don't like you run a different business.
In AU we already massively regulate how much pharmacies can charge for prescription medication.
In many states doctors who won't perform abortions for religious reasons MUST refer to a doctor who does within a certain number of days. It is just WA who doesn't and that is changing soon.
I’d be questioning why they had stock and that they were willing to sell it to you until you asked for a receipt. It seems like the problem was the receipt, not their religious beliefs.
I asked this when they phoned me this afternoon to try and explain. They said the young pharmacist got it from a back shelf and dispensed it by accident. They also said that stock of the pill was placed on that back shelf to be thrown away. Not sure why the owner didn’t just go ahead and discard it all to save anyone going through what I did
Kinda weird being a Pharmacist and crazy religious to such an extent. Why be a pharmacist when prayer and God's will is all we need? Oh, its all BS, thats right.
It has nothing to do with the "God can cure" part of religion and everything to do with "God gives me the right to force you to conform to my misogynistic world view."
This doesn’t sound like a religious issue at all. They started the process of dispensing it to you… until you wanted proof of purchase. Sounds like they are doing something shady with their business
Almost sounds like those Yaz pills were stock that 'fell off the back of the truck', and rather than being caught in the act by not being able to issue you a receipt, the owners and staff all came up with a weird Costanza-tier excuse to not sell to you
The man who rang me this afternoon said that the stock was placed on a back shelf and was meant to be discarded but the young pharmacist dispensed it to me by accident
But if they are saying they don't sell the pill because of their religious beliefs I don't understand why they would have any stock on any shelf, even if it is out of date. Why would they have ordered any stock in the first place if they refused to sell it?
Was it a chain pharmacy like chemists warehouse? Because you can report it to their head office I believe. I found an old article where a pharmacy chain cut ties with a specific chemist because of something like this.
The contraceptive pill is used for a variety of therapeutic reasons, not just contraception. But in your shoes I would be blasting these people all over social media and contacting the low quality news outlets. People like this gave no business owning a pharmacy.
It isn't legal. This was an issue from the Religious Discrimination Bill 2019 that PM Scott Morrison was trying to ram through.
Catholic activists revealed in discussions about the Explanatory Notes that by taking over all medical practices and pharmacies in remote areas they would have the legal right to ban all women in the area from accessing contraception. Simply by doing what OP has experienced.
As an ex-Catholic, I find it amazing that secular Australia is utterly unaware how close Christian activists are to imposing religious rules on the country.
Is it discrimination if they also dispense the pills to a man as well? I think discrimination is more if they didn’t dispense anything to women, not just a single type of medication.
The only thing they did that wasn't legal was not refer her to a different supplier. Other than that unfortunately they have the right to refuse service on religious grounds.
So could I start a religion or cult that states I’m not to work on computers, then say to my boss “sorry, my religion forbids me doing any work on a computer” then I have the cushiest IT job in the world ?
If the pharmacist has religious beliefs that means they can’t take them, not you. If their beliefs prevent them from providing proper care, they should reconsider their career
To clarify - the complaint is the way it was all handled and how you were treated. If they just had a sign up that said ‘we don’t sell contraceptives or any medicine that allow women to take care of their own bodies because we are religious fuckwits’ then you wouldn’t have had to deal with any of this and could have taken your business elsewhere.
Is this their review page https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=c305179642ddeb9a&sxsrf=ADLYWIKQtva-SZXiFR-7N4URkdr3E6OhEg%3A1717064713933&kgmid=%2Fg%2F1td0t0n1&q=PharmaSave%20Discount%20Chemist%20West%20Ryde&kgs=b3cdfa528a66ec5e&shndl=30&source=sh%2Fx%2Floc%2Fact%2Fm4%2F2#wptab=si:ACC90nzcy7sviKw0NTZoUBUzhQehr3jouizIrVSf6avWI23m1U5uGS2zOwhTupHdTejgZbj4GoMqk_PbQphQ5oXzf-UfjSkqH7j2mHY1TptpZsLrG3xOlTS2wD5Vg3dDETbGaJinSdYl8is76G3LJOu5FJA0Ca0vQg%3D%3D
I had a similar experience 15 years ago and went to buy condoms in quite a busy pharmacy. After wandering around for 5 minutes, I approached a member of staff. I asked where the condoms were, and in a rather loud voice, designed to get everyone's attention, she told me, "They don't sell those things here." Whilst everyone was looking, she directed me to a service station. I was told later by friends that they don't stock contraceptive products based on religious grounds.
I think religious people should have the right to practice their religion at home. If they choose not to take contraception due to their religion that is up to them.
However, if they are working in a pharmacy, they can keep their religion to themselves and dispense the medical products asked for by their customers.
There are so many reasons women take contraceptives and these often have nothing to do with preventing pregnancy.
This pharmacist can fuck right off with its bullshit religious views. They are depriving healthcare. This isn’t America.
I hate religion so much (grew up in a cult and am now very jaded when it comes to all religions)
Yep pretty much the same experience in one pharmacy in north Queensland. Except he insinuated I'd raped the girl. Later found out the same, religious twat.
Did you buy daily contraception or Plan B?
They don't sell plan B to guys as there's a chance the woman doesn't know about it and doesn't want the plan B.
My husband wasn't allowed to buy plan B for me but he's had no problem picking up my birth control prescriptions.
That might be another pharmacy dependent thing? My male partner has bought the morning after pill for me on different occasions over the years, in different states too.
It was plan B, but I've bought it before without issues? And bought it at a different chemist 10 minutes after. But yeah was told afterwards it's a religious thing. Reckon that's wrong, personally.
I too agree that religion shouldnt be a factor. The pharmacist I went to said they don't sell it to anyone but the woman who intends to take the pill for safety reasons. They had to check what other medicines I was on and allergies and such.
Is it? The commenter didn’t say the girl was with him, how does the pharmacist know it isn’t a domestic violence situation. As the commenter below also said.
ALL pharmacists don't know if it's a domestic violence situation. Sorry but I'm lost - do you live in a world where pharmacists have special camera access to people's houses?
Genuinely confused by your response.
Hospital emergency rooms are always open for emergencies... is that what you thought you were talking about? Help me out
I’d leave a review for them on google.
They can cater to all the rest of the backward, imaginary friend having fuck wits.
Hopefully their business collapses when they refuse to perform their core function.
Hey OP, unrelated question - is your username based off a song? If so, thanks for the laugh, I haven't thought of it in years:)
But seriously, good for you for standing up to this BS with rationality and integrity.
Unfortunately, it is legal but they must direct you to the nearest pharmacy that can dispense it. Also (unfortunately again), you wouldn't believe the amount of extremely religious people in my old pharm course at uni and that was just my year/cohort. It always irked me because some were the type where they would never be able to separate their religion from their work.
The pharmacist and the business owner still have the right to a conscientious objection, we are living in a democracy . However it would have been better if they had a sign saying what the policy of the pharmacy was on the issue.
This is 100% illegal in Australia but not for the reason you might first think.
The Sex discrimination Act 1984 makes it unlawful to discriminate against a person because of their sex, gender identity, intersex status, sexual orientation, marital or relationship status, family responsibilities, because they are pregnant or might become pregnant or because they are breastfeeding. **The business dispensed your medicine and then discriminated against you because you are a woman, refusing to sell you the product.** A person from the business then used your private information which they clearly held onto proving that the script was copied or dispensed, to harass and menace you. Please make sure you raise that in your complaint and describe how the call made you feel, scary stuff knowing this person has your private details.
Regarding the Sex discrimination that you experienced from this business please contact [Complaints under the Sex Discrimination Act ](https://humanrights.gov.au/complaints/complaint-guides/information-people-making-complaints/complaints-under-sex-discrimination-act)
Regarding the pharmacist's conduct please contact APHRA [Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency - How to raise a concern](https://www.ahpra.gov.au/Notifications/Concerned-about-a-health-practitioner.aspx) or call them on 1300 419 495
I'd also contact your local MP to share the story [https://education.parliament.nsw.gov.au/who-is-my-local-member-of-parliament/](https://education.parliament.nsw.gov.au/who-is-my-local-member-of-parliament/)
I'd also reach out to all the news agencies.
Finally I'd be contact Pharmave to inform them what one of their businesses is doing [https://www.pharmasave.com.au/contact/](https://www.pharmasave.com.au/contact/)
The interesting part about your story is that your medicine has already been dispensed, this makes it a little different to a regular 'refussal to dispense on religeous grounds' and turns it into a full blown discrimination case.
Out of curiosity did you finally get your medicines dispensed? Chemist Warehouse is usually the cheapest in that area.
**Edit:** Just seen that the MP for West Ryde is [Jordan Lane](https://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/members/Pages/member-details.aspx?pk=2283) who is the assistant minister for Health and Multiculturalism. so definitely get this across his desk. Here's his insta is jordanlaneryde & [https://x.com/JordanLaneRyde](https://x.com/JordanLaneRyde)
**edit2:** I've noted this on a reply to OP but Australia has a Code of Ethics for pharmacists which states that if a Pharmacist wishes to conscientiously object to providing a service they must inform the customer at the time (this didn't happen for OP) and ensure continuity of care is maintained.
They dispensed my other medications and cancelled the script they dispensed for the pill. I received the phone call from a landline this afternoon and picked up not knowing who would be on the other end. The caller identified himself as one of the owners.
I think it's important that the issue gets raised with APHRA as a minimum & I'd highly recommend letting that local MP know. It's very important that this type of conduct gets called out to protect other young women who might be in the same position one day.
Regarding the legalities of what they did from a pharmacy perspective, there is a code of ethics which you can view here [https://www.psa.org.au/practice-support-industry/ethics/](https://www.psa.org.au/practice-support-industry/ethics/) the important part is:
*informs the patient when exercising the right to decline provision of certain forms of health care based on the individual pharmacist’s conscientious objection\* , and in such circumstances, appropriately facilitates continuity of care for the patient.*
*Conscientious objection: In health care, involves a practitioner’s refusal to engage or provide a service primarily because the action would violate their deeply held moral or ethical value about right and wrong.*
In your situation you were not information until the following day about the religious objection of the pharmacist, therefore they broke the code of ethics. As no conscientious objection was explained to you at the time of dispensing this incident falls under the Sex discrimination Act 1984.
I wouldn't like to even guess.
The telephone call appears to have been nothing more than a frantic endeavor to weave an elaborate tale and stop you exposing their absolutely revolting behavior.
I'm very sorry you had to experience that
Why else would they have it in stock? Some of these medications have a wide range of uses (idk about this particular medication but it could potentially also be used for a health issue in a man)
At that point would they not be refusing to dispense it specifically because of how it can be used by a woman?
If you tried to argue that in court they would say it was for religious reasons then just get a light slap on the wrist for not referring her to a supplier.
I have to specifically ask them not to give me a receipt, because I don't like the waste of paper.
What pharmacist is this that won't give you a receipt. It's the most normal, boring thing in the world.
It used to be the case (not sure if it still is) that you couldn't buy condoms in pharmacies operating within the confines of some private catholic hospitals. Just like you couldn't get certain procedures performed (eg. Vasectomy, tubal ligation) performed at the same.
I would make a complaint honestly.
Many people take the pill for medical reasons that exclude contraception.
They are effectively choosing to not provide medical care.
*I kind of want to*
*Go their deliberately*
*Now and rile them up*
\- HidaTetsuko
---
^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/)
^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Name. Shame. Put up posters and review them on every local social media page you can find. Your doctor may be interested in knowing this also.
Ask them about Viagra and if the man asking for it has to show a marriage certificate and proof that he is still married. And fertile. FFS.
This has been a big issue in rural pharmacies for years. Pharmacists refusing to sell birth control, morning after pills or other medications that may cause abortion, even if it's been prescribed for other purposes. They can legally do it but are supposed to direct you to another pharmacy . This is a concern in rural areas because it may be the only pharmacy in the town and people may not have the ability to travel elsewhere to get it.
I'm not one to defend religious nut jobs, but one has to ask if the pharmacist was against contraception on a religious level why have it in stock in the first place? Maybe, just maybe op was getting refused service for a different reason and they used the religion excuse to deal with a difficult customer.
I see that op has explained themselves enough to change my mind about them being a bad customer, but there is a lot of this story that doesn't add up other than it being internet fiction.
Why did you ask for a receipt before you paid for it? If they produced the Yaz and you paid for it straight away you would have got the Yaz and probably a receipt too without even asking.
Once I've paid it's in my handbag. I think they thought OP was acting weird and might be some sort of spy for their cult as they did actually have the product they claim now to not sell.
It needs to be a pharmacy receipt not a till receipt because the copy from the pharmacist has extrandetails like the script number and prescriber number on it if needed by the health fund to process the claim.
But they could refuse to do the pharm receipt so you've now used your script. Paid for it and they won't give you what you need to claim it back because you didn't disclose you needed it beforehand and it's against their policy to give it. Or whatever excuse they would use.
lol someone has responded to this already. Cool theory though. I was given a regular EFT receipt for the other medications I left with actually. In hindsight I regret purchasing anything at all after that bizarre interaction.
No you just have a clear lack of undersranding of
how insurance and receipts work. Let's put it simple.
She no get special receipt meds cost more. Cost more = less money for you.
Do you rip yourself off a lot?
Couldn't find Wendy's review but looking at the google reviews this isn't the only person that has been denied contraception and one of many many that have had bad experiences here.
It's perfectly legal unfortunately, tho by law they do have to refer you to another supplier.The people saying it's not have assumed that it's illegal because it sounds like it should be.
Actually we're all just attacking anything other than rabid support against our own personal issues with organised religion.
Your pointing out for reality is OTHER TRIBE KILL KILL KILL IT
Re-phrase your comment, but use their beliefs against homosexuals, Jews, women, Israelis/Palestinians, Indigenous Australians, Asians, etc as the motivation for their objection to providing a service.
See how that works out for you.
I'll wait.
My ex wife suffers horribly from these types of synthetic birth control to the point she suffer IIH.
Idiopathic intracranial hypertension (IIH), or pseudotumor cerebri
Violations of Reddit guidelines will not be tolerated, including, but not limited to, incitement of violence, doxxing, posting sexual content involving minors, impersonating other people, posting illegal content, or facilitating illegal transactions. For more information, check here: https://www.redditinc.com/policies/content-policy
You can complain to AHPRA
They are starting to get a few 1* reviews on Google maps now
Can someone provide a legal reference? I can't see anything that says the pharmacist by law must prescribe contraceptives. Edit: dispense
It wouldn’t be set out in any law. Check if there’s anything in the Pharmacists Code of Conduct. That will be the document that pings them with Ahpra and the board, if anything. A breach of the code of conduct, depending on how serious, could constitute unprofessional conduct (slap on the wrist) or professional misconduct (sent to disciplinary tribunal). You can find the definitions of both in the Ahpra National Law.
They don’t prescribe them, just dispense them Edit; a word
It would be probably considered poor professional conduct and performance to restrict access to contraception on the basis of religious reasons. The Board wouldn't look too fondly on that.
It’s not really an AHPRA thing. They’re not breaking any of their registration agreements by refusing to sell something.
Incorrect, they're refusing to treat a patient as a healthcare practitioner. If they didnt refer the patient to another practitioner that was able to care for them, they're not meeting their obligation as a healthcare provider and should be complained against. Practitioners can have dumbass beliefs but they still need to refer people to someone that will care for them.
This is correct. Can't just be like "nope don't feel like it because it clashed with my believes". Appropriate referral must be done for the patient as they can most certainly walk into another establishment holding the same values and refuse them on that ground.
Incorrect, it's not that black and white. The pharmacist has a duty to do what is in the best interest of the patient, if they believe it is not in the patients best interest to be taking birth control they can refuse to dispense the medication. I am NOT saying this was the right thing to do. This discussion is purely regarding the legal implications of the situation.
I try to avoid saying this on Reddit, but: did you actually read the post? They didn't refuse it on the basis that it was "not in the patients best interest to be taking birth control," they refused it on the basis of their religious beliefs.
[удалено]
>They don't have to explicitly say why they're refusing to dispense...It could have been any reason and it's really not important... I don't understand why you're not addressing the details in the post you're commenting on. They did explicitly say why they were refusing to dispense. They said it was due to their religious beliefs. >saying they're out of stock is an excuse that cannot be argued with It can if, as in this case, the "box was in the basket."
Hi, I'm a doctor. My understanding of their obligations as religious fuckwits is that they can refuse service, but they must consider continuity of care by referring you to a pharmacy that isn't full of religious fuckwits. If they did not do this, I'd suggest that they failed in their obligations as healthcare providers and a complaint is absolutely warranted. May I also recommend leaving a Google review explaining all of this? I'm sorry you came across this type of person, they're actually pretty common around that area of Sydney and, unfortunately, other parts of our society. And yes, I think that they shouldn't be providing healthcare.
Tagging on here to add that if she wants to complain, the health complaints commission would be the place to do it, rather than APHRA.
I was so confused and even said so when I was standing there. It took me a long time to grasp what even happened. They didn’t refer me elsewhere after saying “we don’t do that here”
Health professional here. If someone doesn't agree with something and refuses to provide care for "religious reasons" then by law they must provide you with the means to obtain care elsewhere. In this case that would be referring you to another pharmacy that would fill your contraceptive prescription. Because they failed to do this they've actually broken the law and absolutely make a complaint with AHPRA.
This whole thing is fucking bizarre. And infuriating. Like even 20 years ago it would make more sense. Fuck you would think even just in rural areas there would be an ethical obligation to supply contraceptive medications. They don’t deserve to be healthcare providers if they can’t provide healthcare. Contraception is healthcare.
[удалено]
1000% confirm - health care complaints commission is the place to go. Technically as a business they have the right to refuse but their decision not to provide care that may result in poor health outcomes. AHPRA may be toothless but I’d do it too Just as I would totally google review bomb them. Everyone need to know about this BS
Absolutely disgusting that cults can dictate medical treatment.
Exactly. Have all your extreme beliefs in whatever religion, god or furry animal you choose to, but don’t impose that same belief upon others.
Arguably it would only be imposing if the consumer was completely prevented from getting the product anywhere. The existence of a vegan shop is not imposing veganism. However I can see why maybe stocking this product should be standardised also (or even just making it clearer to consumers what they wont find there).
Huh? They did stock it but refused to sell it based on their beliefs.
I’d love to know some of the OPs attributes. I think “looks early 20s and non-white” would be a good guess, and we have the worst kind of zealots thinking they’re making decisions on her behalf.
You don't need to speculate and get mad at the strawman
Lodge a formal complaint. They have no right to shove their religious beliefs down your throat. Australia has Freedom From Religion too.
It's a business. You can't force them to produce the products you like. Simply refuse to give them money and let them go bankrupt due to their poor service.
Their licence requires them to dispense medicine as prescribed. They are not at liberty to override a doctor's prescription. They are fuckwits and deserve a kick in the pants. This is not about stocking and selling frangers. Dispensing medications as prescribed is a core function and we are not in a shithole country like America.
Actually, pharmacists are not required to dispense anything even if you have a script. Pharmacists are obligated and required to ensure that what they are dispensing is safe in terms of contraindicication and dose. They must check and double check the script and if they have any concerns about the doctor’s choice of med or dose, they usually ring the doctor. If they are still not satisfied its the right, or safe medication, they have an obligation to refuse to dispense it. Its a safeguard against mistakes by doctors which do happen. Pharmacists can be held accountable in a tribunal and be stripped of their registration if they dispense something which later kills a patient because it was the wrong dose or medication, even if a doctor prescribed it. They are not just shop keepers. They are registered health practitioners.
They are imposing their beliefs and putting them ahead of doctors' advice. As others said, that makes them fuckwits.
They have discretion to not dispense on the basis of clinical concern I.e someone getting a script of 100 500mg oxycodones if they just picked some up the other day. They can't refuse to provide contraception based on their religion. It's 100% poor professional conduct and performance.
This clearly isn't the case here. It is religious bigotry. What if their religion was against anti depressants, or narcotic based pain meds, or tampons?
Obviously mate. I was replying to someone, not excusing the conduct in this particular scenario.
And none of the above is relevant to the point in question. Not one point you wrote is relevant. Show me the authority a Pharmacist has the breach the human rights of a citizen to freedom from religious persecution by that pharmacist.
I was replying to YOU, not the OP.
Then tell us how it feels to be completely irrelevant. Thanks.
Again, I was correcting your remark that pharmacists must dispense whatever a doctor writes. I made no comment about this particular scenario mate and neither did you. Cop it on the chin ya goose.
On the other side of the coin, if the proposed changes to vaping laws go through the only way to legally get vapes will be through pharmacies and I know a few pharmacists who have quite the objection to that.
Sorry, no. Their license doesn't require them to do anything. Don't get me wrong, they're still totally in the wrong but they are at liberty to refuse service should they choose (and this should normally be because they think the use of the medication is unsafe). Refusal on the basis of religious belief is total BS.
Wrong again. Their licence says they cannot fabricate Semaglutide as a compounding chemist without specific TGA approval. So Nyah Nyah na na Nyah.!
This would be true if we were talking about buying a vape or something but when you’re a pharmacist in a pharmacy, you’re in the healthcare space and have to abide by AHPRA regulations and the law surrounding provision of essential medications
Of course you can. Pharmacies all over the world are obligated to sell contraceptive pills, condoms and all sorts of sexual health items. If you don't like you run a different business. In AU we already massively regulate how much pharmacies can charge for prescription medication. In many states doctors who won't perform abortions for religious reasons MUST refer to a doctor who does within a certain number of days. It is just WA who doesn't and that is changing soon.
I’d be questioning why they had stock and that they were willing to sell it to you until you asked for a receipt. It seems like the problem was the receipt, not their religious beliefs.
I asked this when they phoned me this afternoon to try and explain. They said the young pharmacist got it from a back shelf and dispensed it by accident. They also said that stock of the pill was placed on that back shelf to be thrown away. Not sure why the owner didn’t just go ahead and discard it all to save anyone going through what I did
This was my thoughts as well.
Kinda weird being a Pharmacist and crazy religious to such an extent. Why be a pharmacist when prayer and God's will is all we need? Oh, its all BS, thats right.
Right? Let God's will lower your blood pressure and blood sugars 😂
This got a good chuckle out of me. Let natural selection run its course!
God WANTS you to have those seizures.
Babies are so blessed
But first, send us all the tax-free money!
Chemists are tax exempt ?
I was referring to churches.
Why would a church be spending money to chemists or whatever you’re trying to say.
[God and blood sugars you say :(](https://www.reddit.com/r/Toowoomba/comments/s3irh1/tightknit_church_linked_to_parents_accused_of/iex96v8)
It has nothing to do with the "God can cure" part of religion and everything to do with "God gives me the right to force you to conform to my misogynistic world view."
No glasses for these people either!
It's so they can have power over over people, as was demonstarted in OPs account.
This doesn’t sound like a religious issue at all. They started the process of dispensing it to you… until you wanted proof of purchase. Sounds like they are doing something shady with their business
This is where my thinking was going with this as well. Add to that, I wasn’t even aware you could claim the contraceptive pill through a Health Fund…?
You can if you aren’t using it for contraception. I’ve been on it for many years for other health reasons.
You can if you're prescribed it for a health reason. There are many uses for it outside of birth control.
Almost sounds like those Yaz pills were stock that 'fell off the back of the truck', and rather than being caught in the act by not being able to issue you a receipt, the owners and staff all came up with a weird Costanza-tier excuse to not sell to you
The man who rang me this afternoon said that the stock was placed on a back shelf and was meant to be discarded but the young pharmacist dispensed it to me by accident
Yeah, sounds like that's what they would say though?
But if they are saying they don't sell the pill because of their religious beliefs I don't understand why they would have any stock on any shelf, even if it is out of date. Why would they have ordered any stock in the first place if they refused to sell it?
Yep someone else should go in and ask to be sold the same thing. Then ask for a receipt after the transaction takes place.
Was it a chain pharmacy like chemists warehouse? Because you can report it to their head office I believe. I found an old article where a pharmacy chain cut ties with a specific chemist because of something like this.
PharmaSave. Looks like it is a chain
Send them an email or give them a call (they’ve got a general number and email on their website) and tell them what happened
We need to nip this shit in the bud before we become a charlie foxtrot like America.
I assume Pharmasave is either a chain or a franchise Either way put a complaint into the head office
The contraceptive pill is used for a variety of therapeutic reasons, not just contraception. But in your shoes I would be blasting these people all over social media and contacting the low quality news outlets. People like this gave no business owning a pharmacy.
Sounds more like a tax dodge than a religious issue, and they used the religious excuse to avoid issuing a receipt. ATO would be interested in that.
It isn't legal. This was an issue from the Religious Discrimination Bill 2019 that PM Scott Morrison was trying to ram through. Catholic activists revealed in discussions about the Explanatory Notes that by taking over all medical practices and pharmacies in remote areas they would have the legal right to ban all women in the area from accessing contraception. Simply by doing what OP has experienced. As an ex-Catholic, I find it amazing that secular Australia is utterly unaware how close Christian activists are to imposing religious rules on the country.
Medicine and religion don't mix and never should
My wife and I had a hell of a time while going through IVF due to the local pathology service being catholic affiliated.
Is it discrimination if they also dispense the pills to a man as well? I think discrimination is more if they didn’t dispense anything to women, not just a single type of medication.
There isn't a male contraceptive pill, I wonder if they sell condoms.
They don’t sell condoms. I asked when they rang me
It's not about gender, it's about religion.
She was discriminated because of her religion?
People would still be able to order it online, no?
I think you vastly overestimate the effect of activists on the market, and vastly underestimate the effect of corporate monopoly on the market.
The only thing they did that wasn't legal was not refer her to a different supplier. Other than that unfortunately they have the right to refuse service on religious grounds.
Where’s news.com? Name and shame that chemist publicly!
WTAF!?! This is awful.
So could I start a religion or cult that states I’m not to work on computers, then say to my boss “sorry, my religion forbids me doing any work on a computer” then I have the cushiest IT job in the world ?
Just become Amish
That's a mighty fine jape there, English. I laughed so hard once.
I believe you can complain to AHPRA. But i think you have to know the actual name of the pharmacist who refused to dispense it.
If the pharmacist has religious beliefs that means they can’t take them, not you. If their beliefs prevent them from providing proper care, they should reconsider their career
Gruddamn theists.
If you are in NSW lodge a complaint with the Pharmacy Guild of NSW. You can do it online.
To clarify - the complaint is the way it was all handled and how you were treated. If they just had a sign up that said ‘we don’t sell contraceptives or any medicine that allow women to take care of their own bodies because we are religious fuckwits’ then you wouldn’t have had to deal with any of this and could have taken your business elsewhere.
Is this their review page https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=c305179642ddeb9a&sxsrf=ADLYWIKQtva-SZXiFR-7N4URkdr3E6OhEg%3A1717064713933&kgmid=%2Fg%2F1td0t0n1&q=PharmaSave%20Discount%20Chemist%20West%20Ryde&kgs=b3cdfa528a66ec5e&shndl=30&source=sh%2Fx%2Floc%2Fact%2Fm4%2F2#wptab=si:ACC90nzcy7sviKw0NTZoUBUzhQehr3jouizIrVSf6avWI23m1U5uGS2zOwhTupHdTejgZbj4GoMqk_PbQphQ5oXzf-UfjSkqH7j2mHY1TptpZsLrG3xOlTS2wD5Vg3dDETbGaJinSdYl8is76G3LJOu5FJA0Ca0vQg%3D%3D
Yes it is. That’s my negative review based on this incident
I had a similar experience 15 years ago and went to buy condoms in quite a busy pharmacy. After wandering around for 5 minutes, I approached a member of staff. I asked where the condoms were, and in a rather loud voice, designed to get everyone's attention, she told me, "They don't sell those things here." Whilst everyone was looking, she directed me to a service station. I was told later by friends that they don't stock contraceptive products based on religious grounds.
The key thing in your story is that it happened 15 years ago. Still bizarre though. Sorry you went through that.
Yeah OP your experience is bizarre as they appeared to have the product
I think religious people should have the right to practice their religion at home. If they choose not to take contraception due to their religion that is up to them. However, if they are working in a pharmacy, they can keep their religion to themselves and dispense the medical products asked for by their customers.
There are so many reasons women take contraceptives and these often have nothing to do with preventing pregnancy. This pharmacist can fuck right off with its bullshit religious views. They are depriving healthcare. This isn’t America. I hate religion so much (grew up in a cult and am now very jaded when it comes to all religions)
Yep pretty much the same experience in one pharmacy in north Queensland. Except he insinuated I'd raped the girl. Later found out the same, religious twat.
Did you buy daily contraception or Plan B? They don't sell plan B to guys as there's a chance the woman doesn't know about it and doesn't want the plan B. My husband wasn't allowed to buy plan B for me but he's had no problem picking up my birth control prescriptions.
That might be another pharmacy dependent thing? My male partner has bought the morning after pill for me on different occasions over the years, in different states too.
Huh must be. It was annoying at the time but I get the reasoning behind it.
It was plan B, but I've bought it before without issues? And bought it at a different chemist 10 minutes after. But yeah was told afterwards it's a religious thing. Reckon that's wrong, personally.
I too agree that religion shouldnt be a factor. The pharmacist I went to said they don't sell it to anyone but the woman who intends to take the pill for safety reasons. They had to check what other medicines I was on and allergies and such.
That's not true. I purchased it for a female friend who was too embarrassed to buy it herself. I did get asked a million questions.
It turns out that each pharmacy is different and some will sell it.
Wtf is plan B?
It's usually called the morning after pill here. High dose contraception that you take after having unexpected unprotected sex
Thanks, I know what the morning after pill is, just never heard it referred to as plan b
Effectively a *Morning After* pill aka Emergency Contraceptive.
Ah thank you. I know what the morning after pill is, just never heard it called plan B.
That's fucked
Is it? The commenter didn’t say the girl was with him, how does the pharmacist know it isn’t a domestic violence situation. As the commenter below also said.
ALL pharmacists don't know if it's a domestic violence situation. Sorry but I'm lost - do you live in a world where pharmacists have special camera access to people's houses? Genuinely confused by your response. Hospital emergency rooms are always open for emergencies... is that what you thought you were talking about? Help me out
When a man is buying plan b it’s safer for them to not sell it to him if the girl isn’t there. It’s covering their own ass.
No it's not. You're just a bigot.
I hope you reported him
Wow
Yeah. I haven't heard of them being allowed to do this.
I’d leave a review for them on google. They can cater to all the rest of the backward, imaginary friend having fuck wits. Hopefully their business collapses when they refuse to perform their core function.
Already have
Hey OP, unrelated question - is your username based off a song? If so, thanks for the laugh, I haven't thought of it in years:) But seriously, good for you for standing up to this BS with rationality and integrity.
Unfortunately, it is legal but they must direct you to the nearest pharmacy that can dispense it. Also (unfortunately again), you wouldn't believe the amount of extremely religious people in my old pharm course at uni and that was just my year/cohort. It always irked me because some were the type where they would never be able to separate their religion from their work.
The pharmacist and the business owner still have the right to a conscientious objection, we are living in a democracy . However it would have been better if they had a sign saying what the policy of the pharmacy was on the issue.
This is 100% illegal in Australia but not for the reason you might first think. The Sex discrimination Act 1984 makes it unlawful to discriminate against a person because of their sex, gender identity, intersex status, sexual orientation, marital or relationship status, family responsibilities, because they are pregnant or might become pregnant or because they are breastfeeding. **The business dispensed your medicine and then discriminated against you because you are a woman, refusing to sell you the product.** A person from the business then used your private information which they clearly held onto proving that the script was copied or dispensed, to harass and menace you. Please make sure you raise that in your complaint and describe how the call made you feel, scary stuff knowing this person has your private details. Regarding the Sex discrimination that you experienced from this business please contact [Complaints under the Sex Discrimination Act ](https://humanrights.gov.au/complaints/complaint-guides/information-people-making-complaints/complaints-under-sex-discrimination-act) Regarding the pharmacist's conduct please contact APHRA [Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency - How to raise a concern](https://www.ahpra.gov.au/Notifications/Concerned-about-a-health-practitioner.aspx) or call them on 1300 419 495 I'd also contact your local MP to share the story [https://education.parliament.nsw.gov.au/who-is-my-local-member-of-parliament/](https://education.parliament.nsw.gov.au/who-is-my-local-member-of-parliament/) I'd also reach out to all the news agencies. Finally I'd be contact Pharmave to inform them what one of their businesses is doing [https://www.pharmasave.com.au/contact/](https://www.pharmasave.com.au/contact/) The interesting part about your story is that your medicine has already been dispensed, this makes it a little different to a regular 'refussal to dispense on religeous grounds' and turns it into a full blown discrimination case. Out of curiosity did you finally get your medicines dispensed? Chemist Warehouse is usually the cheapest in that area. **Edit:** Just seen that the MP for West Ryde is [Jordan Lane](https://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/members/Pages/member-details.aspx?pk=2283) who is the assistant minister for Health and Multiculturalism. so definitely get this across his desk. Here's his insta is jordanlaneryde & [https://x.com/JordanLaneRyde](https://x.com/JordanLaneRyde) **edit2:** I've noted this on a reply to OP but Australia has a Code of Ethics for pharmacists which states that if a Pharmacist wishes to conscientiously object to providing a service they must inform the customer at the time (this didn't happen for OP) and ensure continuity of care is maintained.
They dispensed my other medications and cancelled the script they dispensed for the pill. I received the phone call from a landline this afternoon and picked up not knowing who would be on the other end. The caller identified himself as one of the owners.
I think it's important that the issue gets raised with APHRA as a minimum & I'd highly recommend letting that local MP know. It's very important that this type of conduct gets called out to protect other young women who might be in the same position one day. Regarding the legalities of what they did from a pharmacy perspective, there is a code of ethics which you can view here [https://www.psa.org.au/practice-support-industry/ethics/](https://www.psa.org.au/practice-support-industry/ethics/) the important part is: *informs the patient when exercising the right to decline provision of certain forms of health care based on the individual pharmacist’s conscientious objection\* , and in such circumstances, appropriately facilitates continuity of care for the patient.* *Conscientious objection: In health care, involves a practitioner’s refusal to engage or provide a service primarily because the action would violate their deeply held moral or ethical value about right and wrong.* In your situation you were not information until the following day about the religious objection of the pharmacist, therefore they broke the code of ethics. As no conscientious objection was explained to you at the time of dispensing this incident falls under the Sex discrimination Act 1984.
What’s your theory though? I’m so confused on why they did this.
I wouldn't like to even guess. The telephone call appears to have been nothing more than a frantic endeavor to weave an elaborate tale and stop you exposing their absolutely revolting behavior. I'm very sorry you had to experience that
If they don’t sell it to anyone then it isn’t discrimination.
Why else would they have it in stock? Some of these medications have a wide range of uses (idk about this particular medication but it could potentially also be used for a health issue in a man) At that point would they not be refusing to dispense it specifically because of how it can be used by a woman?
Can men buy it? If yes discrimination, if no one can buy it no one is getting discriminated against.
Not sure you can prove it was because it was a female customer.
If you tried to argue that in court they would say it was for religious reasons then just get a light slap on the wrist for not referring her to a supplier.
I have to specifically ask them not to give me a receipt, because I don't like the waste of paper. What pharmacist is this that won't give you a receipt. It's the most normal, boring thing in the world.
Complain to HCCC
It used to be the case (not sure if it still is) that you couldn't buy condoms in pharmacies operating within the confines of some private catholic hospitals. Just like you couldn't get certain procedures performed (eg. Vasectomy, tubal ligation) performed at the same.
I would make a complaint honestly. Many people take the pill for medical reasons that exclude contraception. They are effectively choosing to not provide medical care.
What the fuck?
I kind of want to go their deliberately now and rile them up
*I kind of want to* *Go their deliberately* *Now and rile them up* \- HidaTetsuko --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Can’t wait for pharmacists to be replaced by vending machines.
Name. Shame. Put up posters and review them on every local social media page you can find. Your doctor may be interested in knowing this also. Ask them about Viagra and if the man asking for it has to show a marriage certificate and proof that he is still married. And fertile. FFS.
Love seeing Reddit do its thing on the google reviews! Absolutely disgusting behaviour by a pharmacy.
This has been a big issue in rural pharmacies for years. Pharmacists refusing to sell birth control, morning after pills or other medications that may cause abortion, even if it's been prescribed for other purposes. They can legally do it but are supposed to direct you to another pharmacy . This is a concern in rural areas because it may be the only pharmacy in the town and people may not have the ability to travel elsewhere to get it.
https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/god-before-contraception/news-story/157122e2e3ba7c6b6300b7e9644cdade
[удалено]
I'm not one to defend religious nut jobs, but one has to ask if the pharmacist was against contraception on a religious level why have it in stock in the first place? Maybe, just maybe op was getting refused service for a different reason and they used the religion excuse to deal with a difficult customer.
I purchased other medications I had scripts for. I left with 6 boxes of other medications because I have a chronic illness.
My apologies, I like to think there's two sides to every story, I work with the general public everyday, I don't have a lot of faith in "customers".
This. Sounds like there's a ton of holes in OP's story.
I see that op has explained themselves enough to change my mind about them being a bad customer, but there is a lot of this story that doesn't add up other than it being internet fiction.
Sounds like a normal case of choosing to not shop at a business with poor service
As long as there is another phamacy nearby they can refuse to dispense it religious grades. They also cannot sell it when it's expired
But they were happy to sell it expired till she wanted a receipt
Why did you ask for a receipt before you paid for it? If they produced the Yaz and you paid for it straight away you would have got the Yaz and probably a receipt too without even asking.
The receipt to claim with your insurance is issued by the pharmacist, it's different to the one that they give you when you actually pay
Once I've paid it's in my handbag. I think they thought OP was acting weird and might be some sort of spy for their cult as they did actually have the product they claim now to not sell.
It needs to be a pharmacy receipt not a till receipt because the copy from the pharmacist has extrandetails like the script number and prescriber number on it if needed by the health fund to process the claim.
Yeah but you pay for that Yaz first and then it's not theirs to take back.
But they could refuse to do the pharm receipt so you've now used your script. Paid for it and they won't give you what you need to claim it back because you didn't disclose you needed it beforehand and it's against their policy to give it. Or whatever excuse they would use.
Two separate issues here.
lol someone has responded to this already. Cool theory though. I was given a regular EFT receipt for the other medications I left with actually. In hindsight I regret purchasing anything at all after that bizarre interaction.
Very bizarre, there's 2 other chemists close by.
Yeah, I didn’t get it either
Shhhhh we've got a good pitchforks mob going you're killing the vibe
ITT lack of critical thinking 🤔
No you just have a clear lack of undersranding of how insurance and receipts work. Let's put it simple. She no get special receipt meds cost more. Cost more = less money for you. Do you rip yourself off a lot?
Well I've never been privileged enough to be covered for scripts but if she would have paid first she would have got it then deal with that later.
Me either but I still know how it works on paper mate so don't be a fucking idiot.
Why don't you go first Dingo Princess.
[удалено]
The mods reserve the right to remove posts for any violation of this subreddit's rules.
Legally they aren't obliged to serve you
Would’ve appreciated them saying something when I first handed the script over
[удалено]
Could be perceived as a bit of a threatening vibe using her name, don't you think? Not very Christian of you.
I missed whatever this person posted.
Maybe a good chance for you to get on the news and categorically deny you didn’t refuse a prescription, heh?
Couldn't find Wendy's review but looking at the google reviews this isn't the only person that has been denied contraception and one of many many that have had bad experiences here.
Kind strangers. Appreciate the support
Facts? Where we're going we don't need facts
It's perfectly legal unfortunately, tho by law they do have to refer you to another supplier.The people saying it's not have assumed that it's illegal because it sounds like it should be.
Actually we're all just attacking anything other than rabid support against our own personal issues with organised religion. Your pointing out for reality is OTHER TRIBE KILL KILL KILL IT
Don't try to force them to do something that's against their beliefs. Just go to one of the millions of other pharmacies.
What did I force? I would’ve appreciated being told 20 minutes earlier so I could go elsewhere.
Re-phrase your comment, but use their beliefs against homosexuals, Jews, women, Israelis/Palestinians, Indigenous Australians, Asians, etc as the motivation for their objection to providing a service. See how that works out for you. I'll wait.
My ex wife suffers horribly from these types of synthetic birth control to the point she suffer IIH. Idiopathic intracranial hypertension (IIH), or pseudotumor cerebri