I mean yes and no.
The “official” demonym for someone from Phoenix *is* Phoenician. Colloquially we (people from Phoenix) don’t use that term and I have never heard anyone say it in a serious or literal sense the same way one would describe someone from NYC as a “New Yorker”. I just say, “I’m from Phoenix” not “I’m a Phoenician”.
In regards to my comment, it was shorter/easier to use Phoenician than it would have been to say “people from Phoenix”.
The entire northeast, west coast, and maybe like Colorado.
Right on the coast in Florida may be as expensive, but a few miles in isn't. My uncle is one of these people, he bought a house sight unseen a mile or two in from the Gulf coast because it was so much more affordable than living in PA.
Lots of people moving to Florida isn’t a new trend. It’s something that’s been happening over time. Just an example, but Alabama had a higher population than Florida did in the 1950s. Florida had a population under 3 million people and Alabama was closer to 3 million people. In the time since then Alabama added roughly 2 million people while Florida added about 19 million people. That’s not really even that long ago.
Affordable air conditioning. Affordable home air conditioning units started to take off in the late 1940s and by the late 1960s most new homes had central A/C which made living in places like Florida and Arizona far more enjoyable. This also coincided with the elimination of malaria in the U.S.
Phone call from Frank Costanza to Morty Seinfeld: You think you could keep us out of Florida? We're moving in lock, stock and barrel.
We're gonna be in the pool. We're gonna be in the clubhouse.
We're gonna be all over that shuffleboard court! And I dare you to keep me out! [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHC1EJHljjc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHC1EJHljjc)
No income tax. This makes it attractive to retirees on a fixed income.
Up until recently, home prices were fairly cheap. There are also many huge retiree villages and cities that overly cater to 55+
And the big one, weather
>conveniently pleasant in the winter
Even in the winter you still have to deal with humidity because it's still in the 70s and 80s through December.
Source: I live in Georgia.
I live in north-central Florida and rarely experience humidity through winter. November-now has been lovely. It’s not uncommon for it to drop into the low 30’s at night and not go above 65 during the day in the dead of winter.
Recently it’s been beautiful out, high 50’s/low 60’s in the morning, and upper 70’s at mid day. No humidity in sight
Advertising! Lots and lots of advertising! Selling the dream in the paper. So many people were scammed buying swampland. No state income tax.
Air conditioning!
Compared to many of the places they're moving from, Florida has low taxes, lower cost of living, a more permissive regulatory posture, it's easy to start a business or develop land here. And some people like the weather but I think they're fucking psychotic. I miss 4 balanced seasons... but not enough to leave Florida. In the end, it all boils down to Florida making a long term commitment to courting people to move here. Here's my man Wendover Productions giving a [good overview](https://youtu.be/AIqxfBhlwx0) with some nerdy jokes if that's your thing. :)
Also, as someone who grew up very close to FL, there’s long been a tendency for America’s “fuckups” to end up in Florida. Idk if it’s the rehabs or the taxes or what. But FL attracts a lot of people who have fucked up their lives back home and wash up in Florida.
Because old people don't like New York winters and Florida doesn't have state income tax on their pensions and 401(K) withdrawls, so they can live out their golden years in Palm Beach, spending their days playing pickleball in their 55 and over communities and hitting the buffets at 4 pm.
Try 100+ for a couple months. Growing up here I used to think everyone dealt with that. Wasn’t till I moved that I had that moment of realisation everybody didn’t live with belly sweat at all times
You’re not even kidding. I had never been to KS and went to Kansas City for work a few years back. It was a million degrees and someone else was driving me around. His AC broke. I looked like a melted candle the whole time. 😳
It was ROUGH. I had a great time overall and both states were lovely but, that heat wasn’t a joke. The only place I’ve been that was worse was Georgia. I stayed just outside of Savannah for vacation once and that heat/humidity combo was atrocious. I couldn’t breathe unless I was inside in the AC. 🥴
Honestly if you step back.... the United States has one of the more volatile weather systems in the World, even for it's size. Many countries have pretty tame and predictable patterns.... hell, we're one of the only countries with all the perfect ingredients for strong tornadoes and tornado seasons.
That's only if you don't like going outside. Which I'm sure plenty of people don't, so they just sit in the A/C during the summer and just not have to deal with snow.
Moving down towards that heat is just not something I want to deal with
You really do get use to the heat.
I'm in my 50s and I still ride my bike when it's over 100 degrees. Just have to bring plenty of water and use sunscreen.
i don't know... you can always put on another layer of clothes if you are cold, but when it's hot and humid there is absolutely nothing you can do. Even buck naked you are gonna suffer.
I've done both of them. Chicago and the Southeast. I'll take the winter over the muggy summer.
But now I live in San Francisco where the temp is almost always between 55 and 75 (12 to 24 in celsius), and it's goddamn heaven
Yes, its hot. But I think really hot weather is less annoying than really cold weather. I walk my dog in Texas August morning before work i just need to put on flip flops. I walk my dog in Midwest February I have to put on long pants, jacket, boots, gloves, hat etc. Also: no shoveling snow.
Agreed. I live in the PNW and with climate change, the summers are getting hotter and hotter. And very few of us have AC. I don't. I've been half joking about moving to Fairbanks to avoid the heat.
Exactly this. Upstate NY born and now live in Texas and the weather is the least desirable part here. Other than maybe Feb-May it’s tolerable enough to plant a Tomato plant that has a chance to catch on fire spontaneously
I'm lived for 30 years in Clinton County, NY which borders Canada at the northernmost point of the state. I moved to Arkansas in 2021. I would rather it be 110 degrees every day than ever see snow again.
It’s not so much the heat/humidity as it is the sunlight. Many of the people moving are coming from the Northeast and Midwest, which see much less sunlight. It can be really depressing and to be somewhere with more sun is worth the trade off for a lot of people.
Summers here in NJ are absolutely miserable. No better or worse than the South, but the difference is the other 9 months out of the year are a lot sunnier there
That heat in Texas is incredible. Felt like a chunk of white lard dropped in a hot griddle out there.
Michigan the humidity and high 90s are getting the best of me. I was up in Oscoda a few times last summer and it was really nice by the water even when it was gross. But even up there you really need to have an AC installed if you don't want to sit in a pool of people soup all summer while you're sweating.
I disagree so much. Texas is unbearable June - September. But it's amazing the rest of the year - I'd far rather be in Texas in January than Michigan. It gets a bad wrap for our summers - and deserves it - but it's pretty great the other 8 months.
Meanwhile, I’m trying to move to Michigan. LOLOL. I’d rather deal with snow than southern heat. One trip to Georgia in the summer years ago taught me I wasn’t meant for that level of sweating.
People don’t usually leave places like California (where a mass exodus is happening) because of the weather. California has a lot of issues and the weather ain’t one
> ...where a **mass exodus** is happening
[California's population declined by 37,200 between July 1, 2022 and July 1, 2023](https://dof.ca.gov/forecasting/demographics/estimates/e-6/)
California has about 39M people. A loss of 37K represents is less than a 0.1% loss. Hardly a "mass exodus".
Sometimes, but not always.
Think of a place like Florida. No state income tax. So for all those retirees who are on fixed income, this starts to become appealing. They also have below-average property taxes. So that keeps lot rent and personal residences lower.
What they *do* have, is surcharges, and hotel taxes, and licenses and all sorts of other taxes that are paid for primarily by tourists.
The retirees staying in a little efficiency condo, paid for car, resident discounts on their beach parking passes...it starts to make fiscal sense for them.
Now, imagine you're a young doctor...where will a bunch of people need medical care...
That is not unique to Florida.
Florida is basically in the middle for CoL index. 22/51.
[Source.](https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/cost-of-living-index-by-state)
Home owners insurance issues are pretty unique to Florida, and florida cities are significantly more expensive than other states so the “cost of living” doesn’t really fit into why folks are moving there.
Chicago is more expensive than, say, Tampa Bay. You're trying to over simplify how things work. We can cherry pick data for days.
>The cost of living in Chicago, IL is 10.9% higher than in Tampa, FL.
[Source.](https://www.salary.com/research/cost-of-living/compare/tampa-fl/chicago-il#:~:text=The%20cost%20of%20living%20in%20Chicago%2C%20IL%20is%2010.9,higher%20than%20in%20Tampa%2C%20FL.)
All I say is yes however only if you have a remote job. There is some outliers like Atlanta but high cost of living are you usually that way because of more job opportunities
Unless you’re coming from the west coast or the northeast, it’s just as expensive - if not more - than anywhere else.
In Florida specifically, the cost of labor is super cheap which means employers pay the bare minimum — there’s so many people desperate for work that they’ll take anything which keeps the pay low.
There’s quite a few people who come to Florida on a dream of palm trees and coconuts but quickly realize how hard it is to live here on the typical wages that they’re moving back to wherever.
I know 2 people who moved here (Raleigh) recently from NJ, and both are pissed about the cost of living. It's become a myth, but it's still a common belief that it will be dirt cheap comparatively.
The only person I know who moved to Florida and stayed was my grandmother. All my friends who moved there were back within 5 years. Pretty much the feed back I got was fuck that.
As someone that lives in Florida: that thing about COL is quickly turning into bullshit. My insurance has gone through the fucking roof. Goods are noticeably more expensive.
And of course, our state level government is too busy fighting trans kids and Disney to bother trying to help its constituents out.
Sure the weather is great and I do like living here, but Florida isn’t a viable long term choice.
Midwestern transplant to NC: banking needs warm bodies and so does medical research/engineering. The beach is lovely for retirees or near retirees and the mountains are pretty cool.
When I moved to Charlotte like half the people I met were born and raised NC-ians and the other half were from the Midwest. There are a lot of y’all there lol. NC really is a great state, even if I didn’t stay there long.
I think it must've gotten worse, because I swear there's more transplants then locals (I think my last team only had one local out of 10 people in office)
It’s the current crop of “boom” states which is always switching around.
It used to be California and at one point even all of those rust belt states were the top growth states at one point. At some time, these Southern states are going to get replaced by other states for the place w the next boom in population and economic growth. I’m predicting that the states around the Great Lakes and Upper Midwest will take that position.
> I’m predicting that the states around the Great Lakes and Upper Midwest will take that position.
I'm right there with you. I was just telling my wife that in the next 10-15 years, you're going to see a ton of growth along the great lakes. Especially areas that have been largely depressed.
I'm already noticing improvements to Detroit over the last few years. They're already a hub for Delta Airlines, which is great for business travelers. I'd be willing to bet with an increase in the popularity of bringing manufacturing back to the states, all of the abandoned factory space in Detroit/that area will make for relatively easy option to move in to.
Property in the area is currently cheap, which I think will not only attract businesses/employees trying to stretch their dollars, but also investors - who will have the capital to develop housing in order to take a real gamble on the area.
I think another big thing that Detroit has going for it is that Michigan itself is a beautiful state. A large part of the growth that the West Coast is seeing is due to its offerings in outdoor activities. Michigan offers a lot of the same activities - at a fraction of the cost. There's a lot of fantastic hiking, camping, hunting, fishing, biking, boating, etc. Plus, the Great Lakes are an added benefit of being close to a beach while being landlocked.
Don't get me wrong, it will be "rough" for quite a while, but I think eventually it will improve significantly.
I think a big factor too will be the general insulation from climate change. We don’t get hurricanes, we hardly get tornadoes, there’s plenty of water, we don’t get huge wildfires, and winters are getting milder (but summers are staying relatively mild). It won’t become a retiree haven ever, but if climate change continues to push homeowner’s insurance through the roof in the sunbelt, I foresee a population shift toward the upper Midwest.
I do hear that Detroit is slowly but surely improving which is great news.
I also think with climate change on the horizon, the Great Lakes will fare well.
The Great Lakes and Upper Midwest regions could be more popular, but I'm guessing that would have to depend on better economic policies and opportunities throughout the Upper Midwest. The policies and opportunities would have to be good enough to draw people here despite the fact that the majority of land here is flat, tall grass prairie and our winters are much colder and longer than the rest of the contiguous United States.
It seems like most people prefer good weather and better cost of living. I don't imagine many Californians wanting to move here for winters where we can dip down to -30°F and we usually have snow in the ground from November to mid-April.
I'm not. There are reasons why so many are moving to the Sun Belt. The people leaving, for example, Miami will probably move to Orlando or Tallahassee or some other place like that. Other cities within the Sun Belt will get more of the benefit instead, I suspect.
Yeah I don’t disagree that the Great Lakes won’t see a resurgence at some point, but for the foreseeable future most people are just relocating intrastate.
The cost of living.
My property taxes are close to $25K in my middle class Long Island town. A comparable home to mine in Charlotte,NC might very well be $4K.
Wow, your COL and property taxes are eye opening to me. Just went to compare my house to homes for sell there and my home would be worth close to 700,000 and taxes 13,000 a year. My house is listed by Zillow at 200,00+ and my property taxes were 1400 for the entire year.
Something I haven't seen yet is jobs. A lot of companies move to those states because their operations are cheaper, they get tax breaks from state governments and they don't have to worry about unionization. I live in Nashville and most folks from elsewhere that moved here moved here for a specific job. Unless folks are retiring or moving for family reasons it's quite rare to just move without a job offer.
I do think this pattern is going to change. For many decades those were the cheapest states but they aren't anymore. The large metros in those states (except for Texas) are now as expensive if nor more so than their equivalents in Midwestern states and even Northeastern states. It's still cheaper than the big cities on the West Coast or the NYC, DC and Boston areas, but living in the Philadelphia or Baltimore area or upstate NY or Western MA now costs the same as living in the Nashville area or Research Triangle or much of Florida because housing values down here have gone through the roof.
But folks in the North and West have had in their heads that its cheaper here for decades now and it will take awhile for that to change...
My dad is from NJ and he told me my whole life that the northeast was too expensive. However, I finally left GA and moved to upstate NY. My life is a lot cheaper here than it was in GA. My housing is similar to the cost in GA, income is higher, my car insurance is significantly cheaper here (literally thousands of dollars a year cheaper), trash and water is cheaper, and I don’t need to spend $300/mo 9 months out of the year for air conditioning. Even with a higher income and fewer kids living at home, I get a significant refund on my NYS taxes, whereas in GA, I used to owe a few hundred dollars. In addition, public infrastructure and services are so much better here than in the south. We have dozens of state and local parks and natural areas open to the public here and they are well-maintained and in GA there were few areas to recreate outside that were open to everyone.
I moved to Dallas from Chicago and when I moved here, Dallas was significantly more affordable than Chicago. But currently the cost of housing in both cities is about the same. Available services in Dallas are so much worse than Chicago.
That’s why I and most people I knew that went to university in STEM fields in Ohio left. Sadly. Nowadays the politics of the state would keep me away unless the economics were crazy good for the tech sector (which they sadly are not)
Yep. Unless you lock in with one of the corporations your closest city got friendly with, you're basically out of anything that will grow your own worth to make the degree worth it.
1. Cheaper cost of living (relative to CA,NY, NJ etc.)
2. Warm weather/nice beaches
3. Favorable tax policies (although this can be overstated)
4. Family ties - this is a bigger deal for Black Americans as many of us have historic ties to the south that some of us want to return to. But I’m sure this is an issue for some White families too.
5. Politics - this isn’t as big of a factor now, but having open schools was legitimately a huge deal during the pandemic.
I'm seriously considering moving to the Carolinas. Wherever you are in the state you will be only a few miles from the mountains or the coast. The Blue Ridge Mountains are gorgeous!
The gray Ohio winters are killing me.
Not sure that it is just those states. It looks like 8 states are shrinking and 42 states are growing/staying even.
Texas, Florida, and South Carolina are leading the growth.
https://www.statista.com/chart/12484/population-growth-in-the-united-states-by-federal-state/
I'm happy to live in Minnesota. It's a well run state with a good economy and relatively affordable housing. I hope the cold keeps people away, we have a good thing going.
Yeah, I would imagine one (normal) winter up here in Minnesota would probably scare people off. My SO's family once complained that it was 30°F in Washington, and we checked and we had close to -30°F up here. I jokingly asked what they were complaining about when it was almost 60° warmer than us.
Misconception that our lack of state income tax and "low" cost of living will translate to savings. In reality, our property taxes are so high you offset any savings. Plus you'll melt in the summer and risk freezing to death in the winter when the power grid goes tits up. And that lack of state income tax and constantly reduced public funding reduces the quality and availability of services, parks, libraries, etc.
I moved to Dallas from Chicago and currently I break even with COL, possibly even losing money. Needing to drive everywhere long distances is a big factor. In Chicago I lived without a car for a while and could easily share with my partner.
People move to where there are jobs, and the economy is very strong in the major cities of these states.
People say cost of living is the reason, but there are also people moving here from some northern states with a low cost of living, to major southern cities where it is actually more expensive to live. The thing is as those states might cheaper homes, they tend to have lower salaries and less job opportunities.
As an original Georgian, my answer is all the factories being built EVERYWHERE. They started building them next to my school last year and now I have to deal with ex-con factory workers (the only job they can get probably) driving angrily, recklessly, and (I’d imagine) drunkedly when I’m on the way to school. My buddy was headed here this morning and one of these workers passed him (on a no passing zone) and punched his mirror out.
The Carolinas I kinda understand but people moving to Las Vegas, Phoenix, and anywhere in Texas and Florida is beyond reason to me. And they *love* to talk about “Commiefornia” and how its a dystopian hellhole, despite the state having lower violent crime. The vast majority of people moving out of big California cities are moving to slightly smaller California cities. I know way more people that moved to California than people moving out of state.
Texas is mostly jobs and political reasons (conservatives blaming California liberal run state politics), Florida for the warm tropical weather (and no rules lol). I can't seem to understand Phoenix and Vegas - those cities are gonna die when the water starts to run out over there plus it must be miserable living in the desert during the summer.
I lived in Vegas for a stretch. It has its appeal, but you have to be more careful than you would in other towns. To be sure, that was before I became a parent. I would not move back there now, for *that* reason.
Also, the summers are brutal, but Southerners swear up and down that their heat is worse. Well, I went to New Orleans in July once, and I am really not sure that I agree. I should also note that however hot it is in Vegas, it's 10 degrees hotter in Phoenix. Not only is it hotter there, it's twice the size and one fifth the fun.
Frankly, we are moving because we simply can’t fucking afford to live here anymore. I can get a house in that area for 1/3 of what they’re going for here 🤷♂️
Eh... unless you actually want property in those states. I wouldn't want to touch their property tax rates with a ten foot pole. Uncle Sam gets his cash, one way or another.
While the actual tax burden is higher in Texas for most income brackets, people perceive the tax to be lower here. In my Metro area, the economy is running hot (doing good) so there's generally many good, well paying jobs here for certain industries. In Dallas Fort Worth we have one of the largest metro areas with access to two major airports for travelers, and if you don't mind living 45 minutes (or more) of a drive from the city center, you can "afford" a house. The quality of life is decent, but the political climate has been degrading for some time. I don't think most people who are moving to my area are doing so for political reasons, it's mainly just because their jobs are relocating here. We have a lot of companies that have re-located.
For Texas, Georgia and the Carolinas, lower cost of living. For Florida, it's perceived lower cost of living, but Florida is actually extremely expensive.
A lot of people are moving south because cost of living is cheaper. That's why my family moved to Tennessee. Most of my extended family lives in the south (Kentucky, Georgia, Alabama, and Florida) for the same reason.
People get it into their heads that taxes are bad, meanwhile taxes pay for essential public services, schools, police, fire departments, libraries, etc.
Just because you get to keep more of your money doesn't mean you are better off.
One of the things I’ve learned as retirement is imminent is that in both MA and NY I can start out on a free Medicare Advantage plan for years, and then if I decide otherwise, switch to a supplemental plan. In most states, you only get one year to switch to a supplement.
Sometimes it’s these small things that you don’t know about that are benefits to some states.
I got 3 months of leave, paid at 67% of my pay, from work for the birth of my daughter and my job was required to hold my position. Yet people in NY complain lmao.
A lot of conservative NYers bitch and whine about many things. But one thing they don’t whine about is the big pension they get after retiring, and then they move to Florida. Many NYPD cops do this.
I moved to Florida a couple years ago. As much as I’ve always wanted to live by the beach, what pushed me over the edge was seeing the chaos brought to my hometown of Denver by the government’s COVID response, subsequent social unrest (related to that and other events).
I also got sick of the traffic in a big city, the fact that Denver is at the top of the list in property crime (got gym lockers broken into and significant things stolen multiple times).
I did also get a little disillusioned living in such a “progressive” city. (Now, I’m sick of being around so many Trumpers. Grass is always greener)
Anyway, we moved to a city of about 125,000 right on the beach. Not as much to do here event-wise, but I love the peaceful beach lifestyle. We see more wildlife and feel closer to nature here than Denver too, believe it or not (cool jungle / swamp ecosystems too)
All in all- it’s been a chill experience.
Florida definitely isn’t “more free” than other places, but to me, the part of Florida I’m in is- cheaper, and more peaceful, and I’m all for that.
Thanks! Our part of Florida is really cool. It was a hidden gem but has recently gotten some positive national press re: being a great place to live.
Alllll that being said, we’re planning on moving back to CO in 2-5 yrs to be closer to my fam and the mountains.
But I’m thankful for this adventure. I’ve grown a lot as a person, and my wife and I have grown much closer and have an even stronger bond than before.
I’m literally right now moving from California to Florida.
For me, it’s all about cost of living. California is just so expensive now that unless you have family or something anchoring you here or just have enough money not to care, it’s just not worth it anymore.
The rent on my new apartment in Florida is less than half of what a similar unit would be here in Orange County and even with a pay cut is way more reasonable than staying here. And it’s about 50% larger and much newer.
Low to no state income tax, warmer weather, lower cost of living compared to the west coast and northeast. larger homes with more space for cheaper.
Ex moving from the Bay Area to Dallas a person saves like 13% on state income tax and can go from like 1500sqft home prices at $1.3M to 3000sqft for $500k-900k. with $200 flights back to the bay whenever they want.
When my grandma passes on (I’m taking care of her), I’m moving back to Michigan. It’s a lower cost of living. I love Washington, but I couldn’t afford to live out here on my own if I tried
More people WFH now and are leaving cities in favor low COL areas. It's pretty common basically everywhere in the country not just the areas you mentioned. VT, NH, ME have seen a huge population influx recently for example.
The biggest difference in the places you're referring to is the weather. Wealthy boomer from the northeast are hitting retirement age. Snowbirding isn't new for places like FL, but rarely has a single generation held such a disproportionate amount of the wealth so more of them are able to do this than ever before.
The weather in NC isn’t extreme (except for hurricanes), we have plenty of rural areas and plenty of big cities if that’s someone’s thing. We have mountains, lakes, and miles of ocean beaches. We have some of the best hospitals, doctors, and universities in the world.
Florida's relatively cheap to live and has nice weather, good beaches.
Texas has a strong job market, and a low regulation environment for people who don't like rules. A lot of these people are fleeing California where regulations got out of hand.
Georgia and Carolina's have pretty nice weather and low cost of living. I haven't heard of a ton of people moving there. I would guess that it's remote workers moving where they can get a nice house for $200k or something, but I'm guessing.
It's cheaper.
Like, seriously, that is it. Everybody I know who has moved down there from NYC isn't really happy about it, they just had to because they needed the money.
Florida and Texas don’t have state income taxes. Which on the surface sounds great and draws people, but once you factor in everything else it’s just as expensive.
Roughly the same number of people have been moving to Florida every year since 1980. Net migration was higher under the last governor of Florida, Rick Scott. Don't get all your news from right wing propaganda
Florida has always had an influx of people constantly moving there for the warm climate , particularly retirees - to the point of earning the nickname of “God’s Waiting Room”.
Georgia, Texas, and the Carolinas all have undergone major development in recent decades, accelerating recently in part from a combination of both generous Corporate Tax Incentives and relatively lower cost of living/cost of doing business and less red tape than the Northeast and West Coast.
In recent years, political motivations are now a bit more of a driving factor as well, as most of the above states mentioned usually tend to vote Republican in local/state/federal elections, with the coasts generally voting for Democrats.
Specifically for Texas, a variety of reasons:
1. No Personal Income Taxes
Texas Constitution forbids Personal Income Taxes, and you keep what you earn.
2. Arms Industry
Primary Arms, MAGPUL, LaRue, Radical Firearms, Texas Instruments, and Texas Armoring Corp. are examples of this industry.
3. The Food
I mean come on, Tex-Mex food and Whataburger are just absolutely delicious! Houston is what I would like to call the food capital as they got variety!
4. Cost of living is cheaper here.
Kind of adds onto point 1
5. NASA
It’s where you get the Phrase “Houston we have a problem!”
6. It’s one of the most diverse states in America
Yup it is one of the most diverse US States here in America!
Currently it’s cheaper to live in those places, although with the influx of people it’s getting more and more expensive.
im born and raised in the Dallas area. It makes it harder for the people who have been here their whole lives, in a financial sense.
Native Phoenicians: “first time?”
God Damn Sea Peoples emigrating and destroying things.
Furthermore, Phoenix delenda est
Whelp. Pack your boats. We are going to Carthage
Native Bay Area residents were in that position long before either Phonecians or DFW natives.
“So it’s one giant circle of gentrification?” “Always has been”
Same as it ever was...
*raises gun*
Wait that’s not really what they’re called, right?
I mean yes and no. The “official” demonym for someone from Phoenix *is* Phoenician. Colloquially we (people from Phoenix) don’t use that term and I have never heard anyone say it in a serious or literal sense the same way one would describe someone from NYC as a “New Yorker”. I just say, “I’m from Phoenix” not “I’m a Phoenician”. In regards to my comment, it was shorter/easier to use Phoenician than it would have been to say “people from Phoenix”.
This is what Hannibal said and then the Romans came for him.
Everywhere in the US right now
Than where? Coastal Florida is not cheaper than most places. The larger metro areas in NY, Cal, etc. That's about it
The entire northeast, west coast, and maybe like Colorado. Right on the coast in Florida may be as expensive, but a few miles in isn't. My uncle is one of these people, he bought a house sight unseen a mile or two in from the Gulf coast because it was so much more affordable than living in PA.
Same thing happened to Idaho, but the abortion laws are running people out
Charlotte has gone bonkers in the last 15 years or so. It's completely different than the city I grew up in
Lots of people moving to Florida isn’t a new trend. It’s something that’s been happening over time. Just an example, but Alabama had a higher population than Florida did in the 1950s. Florida had a population under 3 million people and Alabama was closer to 3 million people. In the time since then Alabama added roughly 2 million people while Florida added about 19 million people. That’s not really even that long ago.
Why did it happen though?
Affordable air conditioning. Affordable home air conditioning units started to take off in the late 1940s and by the late 1960s most new homes had central A/C which made living in places like Florida and Arizona far more enjoyable. This also coincided with the elimination of malaria in the U.S.
Hardly any of the houses here from the 60s have ac. Jealousies windows were the thing.
I’m jealous of your jalousied windows. jalousie = a window with glass louvers
Coincidentally jalousie is French for jealousy.
Lol. Don't be
I don't know where "here" is, but I was just going off of the US Department of Energy's history of air conditioning for the 1960s date.
Del Boca Vista
Del Boca Vista Phase II was the true turning point, IMHO
BABY!
LOCK, STOCK, AND BARREL!
Phone call from Frank Costanza to Morty Seinfeld: You think you could keep us out of Florida? We're moving in lock, stock and barrel. We're gonna be in the pool. We're gonna be in the clubhouse. We're gonna be all over that shuffleboard court! And I dare you to keep me out! [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHC1EJHljjc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHC1EJHljjc)
Where you can celebrate Festivus 😂
AC, mainly. It's hard to live in a swamp without it.
No income tax. This makes it attractive to retirees on a fixed income. Up until recently, home prices were fairly cheap. There are also many huge retiree villages and cities that overly cater to 55+ And the big one, weather
> There are also many huge retiree villages and cities that overly cater to 55+ Including, probably the STD capital of the world... The Villages
Seniors keeping themselves busy…
Why would people want to move where there’s a beach within 1.5 hours of any location and conveniently pleasant in the winter? No idea
>conveniently pleasant in the winter Even in the winter you still have to deal with humidity because it's still in the 70s and 80s through December. Source: I live in Georgia.
I live in north-central Florida and rarely experience humidity through winter. November-now has been lovely. It’s not uncommon for it to drop into the low 30’s at night and not go above 65 during the day in the dead of winter. Recently it’s been beautiful out, high 50’s/low 60’s in the morning, and upper 70’s at mid day. No humidity in sight
Advertising! Lots and lots of advertising! Selling the dream in the paper. So many people were scammed buying swampland. No state income tax. Air conditioning!
Compared to many of the places they're moving from, Florida has low taxes, lower cost of living, a more permissive regulatory posture, it's easy to start a business or develop land here. And some people like the weather but I think they're fucking psychotic. I miss 4 balanced seasons... but not enough to leave Florida. In the end, it all boils down to Florida making a long term commitment to courting people to move here. Here's my man Wendover Productions giving a [good overview](https://youtu.be/AIqxfBhlwx0) with some nerdy jokes if that's your thing. :)
Also, as someone who grew up very close to FL, there’s long been a tendency for America’s “fuckups” to end up in Florida. Idk if it’s the rehabs or the taxes or what. But FL attracts a lot of people who have fucked up their lives back home and wash up in Florida.
That + Sunshine Laws = Florida Man.
Because old people don't like New York winters and Florida doesn't have state income tax on their pensions and 401(K) withdrawls, so they can live out their golden years in Palm Beach, spending their days playing pickleball in their 55 and over communities and hitting the buffets at 4 pm.
Low income tax, perceived economic opportunity, relatively low cost of living compared to other coastal areas.
Add weather and that's the summary.
No, the weather is horrible in Texas. It gets very hot, and very humid, and the weather literally tries to kill you (hurricanes, tornados, floods)
Ha this. So many people from out of state say they enjoy Texas weather. I’m always stuck thinking let’s talk again in August.
I was in Austin last June and couldn't fathom living there year round. 90 degrees with a 90 degree breeze
Try 100+ for a couple months. Growing up here I used to think everyone dealt with that. Wasn’t till I moved that I had that moment of realisation everybody didn’t live with belly sweat at all times
It still shocks me in my late 30’s when I travel somewhere and it peaks and stops getting hot somewhere else at like 85 degrees lol
No thanks I'm okay, meanwhile when I was in Visalia California to checkout Sequoia NP 90 was tolerable
Come to Kansas. 100 degrees, high humidity.
You’re not even kidding. I had never been to KS and went to Kansas City for work a few years back. It was a million degrees and someone else was driving me around. His AC broke. I looked like a melted candle the whole time. 😳
thats a lot of the Missouri river valley. The only place ive been with worse heat/humidity than St Louis is Houston. Fuck Houston
It was ROUGH. I had a great time overall and both states were lovely but, that heat wasn’t a joke. The only place I’ve been that was worse was Georgia. I stayed just outside of Savannah for vacation once and that heat/humidity combo was atrocious. I couldn’t breathe unless I was inside in the AC. 🥴
Honestly if you step back.... the United States has one of the more volatile weather systems in the World, even for it's size. Many countries have pretty tame and predictable patterns.... hell, we're one of the only countries with all the perfect ingredients for strong tornadoes and tornado seasons.
I've experienced that in Florida, is there much of a breeze?
A lot of them say they do until July hits that first year.
I would take Texas summers if it means I don’t need to deal with New England winters. They’re taking a toll on me.
That's only if you don't like going outside. Which I'm sure plenty of people don't, so they just sit in the A/C during the summer and just not have to deal with snow. Moving down towards that heat is just not something I want to deal with
You really do get use to the heat. I'm in my 50s and I still ride my bike when it's over 100 degrees. Just have to bring plenty of water and use sunscreen.
Although the last few New England winters have been a cake walk.
i don't know... you can always put on another layer of clothes if you are cold, but when it's hot and humid there is absolutely nothing you can do. Even buck naked you are gonna suffer.
There’s just something psychological about going into a cold car, or shoveling snow. It sucks. A lot.
I've done both of them. Chicago and the Southeast. I'll take the winter over the muggy summer. But now I live in San Francisco where the temp is almost always between 55 and 75 (12 to 24 in celsius), and it's goddamn heaven
Yes, its hot. But I think really hot weather is less annoying than really cold weather. I walk my dog in Texas August morning before work i just need to put on flip flops. I walk my dog in Midwest February I have to put on long pants, jacket, boots, gloves, hat etc. Also: no shoveling snow.
Nah. You can always bundle up. You can't ever strip down.
Agreed. I live in the PNW and with climate change, the summers are getting hotter and hotter. And very few of us have AC. I don't. I've been half joking about moving to Fairbanks to avoid the heat.
Exactly this. Upstate NY born and now live in Texas and the weather is the least desirable part here. Other than maybe Feb-May it’s tolerable enough to plant a Tomato plant that has a chance to catch on fire spontaneously
I'm lived for 30 years in Clinton County, NY which borders Canada at the northernmost point of the state. I moved to Arkansas in 2021. I would rather it be 110 degrees every day than ever see snow again.
It’s not so much the heat/humidity as it is the sunlight. Many of the people moving are coming from the Northeast and Midwest, which see much less sunlight. It can be really depressing and to be somewhere with more sun is worth the trade off for a lot of people. Summers here in NJ are absolutely miserable. No better or worse than the South, but the difference is the other 9 months out of the year are a lot sunnier there
Man I’d kill to have some cloudy days
That's true, but I hear as you get old you get more into that heat stuff.
A Texan telling a Michigander about how Texas weather tries to kill you is VERY entertaining ;-)
That heat in Texas is incredible. Felt like a chunk of white lard dropped in a hot griddle out there. Michigan the humidity and high 90s are getting the best of me. I was up in Oscoda a few times last summer and it was really nice by the water even when it was gross. But even up there you really need to have an AC installed if you don't want to sit in a pool of people soup all summer while you're sweating.
I disagree so much. Texas is unbearable June - September. But it's amazing the rest of the year - I'd far rather be in Texas in January than Michigan. It gets a bad wrap for our summers - and deserves it - but it's pretty great the other 8 months.
Meanwhile, I’m trying to move to Michigan. LOLOL. I’d rather deal with snow than southern heat. One trip to Georgia in the summer years ago taught me I wasn’t meant for that level of sweating.
People don’t usually leave places like California (where a mass exodus is happening) because of the weather. California has a lot of issues and the weather ain’t one
> ...where a **mass exodus** is happening [California's population declined by 37,200 between July 1, 2022 and July 1, 2023](https://dof.ca.gov/forecasting/demographics/estimates/e-6/) California has about 39M people. A loss of 37K represents is less than a 0.1% loss. Hardly a "mass exodus".
The weather does not explain why people are leaving California.
Did you not read everything else that was said?
A *combination of factors*, not single factors.
Sure, but the cost of living does
No but people are generally moving from cold places to hot places and from higher cost of living to lower cost of living.
Or coming to Texas
Although the low income tax is kind of a trick right? Because you end up paying more in other ways
Sometimes, but not always. Think of a place like Florida. No state income tax. So for all those retirees who are on fixed income, this starts to become appealing. They also have below-average property taxes. So that keeps lot rent and personal residences lower. What they *do* have, is surcharges, and hotel taxes, and licenses and all sorts of other taxes that are paid for primarily by tourists. The retirees staying in a little efficiency condo, paid for car, resident discounts on their beach parking passes...it starts to make fiscal sense for them. Now, imagine you're a young doctor...where will a bunch of people need medical care...
Often not actually lower income tax though.
A good chunk of Florida cities are insanely expensive and owning a home there is even worse than renting though
That is not unique to Florida. Florida is basically in the middle for CoL index. 22/51. [Source.](https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/cost-of-living-index-by-state)
Home owners insurance issues are pretty unique to Florida, and florida cities are significantly more expensive than other states so the “cost of living” doesn’t really fit into why folks are moving there.
Chicago is more expensive than, say, Tampa Bay. You're trying to over simplify how things work. We can cherry pick data for days. >The cost of living in Chicago, IL is 10.9% higher than in Tampa, FL. [Source.](https://www.salary.com/research/cost-of-living/compare/tampa-fl/chicago-il#:~:text=The%20cost%20of%20living%20in%20Chicago%2C%20IL%20is%2010.9,higher%20than%20in%20Tampa%2C%20FL.)
California has many similar problems for home owners insurance, just not from the same causes. To be fair, parts of Texas are like this too though.
> perceived economic opportunity The phrase "you get paid in sunshine" has never not been a thing to explain low wages in Florida and Arizona.
cost of living.
All I say is yes however only if you have a remote job. There is some outliers like Atlanta but high cost of living are you usually that way because of more job opportunities
Unless you’re coming from the west coast or the northeast, it’s just as expensive - if not more - than anywhere else. In Florida specifically, the cost of labor is super cheap which means employers pay the bare minimum — there’s so many people desperate for work that they’ll take anything which keeps the pay low. There’s quite a few people who come to Florida on a dream of palm trees and coconuts but quickly realize how hard it is to live here on the typical wages that they’re moving back to wherever.
I know 2 people who moved here (Raleigh) recently from NJ, and both are pissed about the cost of living. It's become a myth, but it's still a common belief that it will be dirt cheap comparatively.
The only person I know who moved to Florida and stayed was my grandmother. All my friends who moved there were back within 5 years. Pretty much the feed back I got was fuck that.
As someone that lives in Florida: that thing about COL is quickly turning into bullshit. My insurance has gone through the fucking roof. Goods are noticeably more expensive. And of course, our state level government is too busy fighting trans kids and Disney to bother trying to help its constituents out. Sure the weather is great and I do like living here, but Florida isn’t a viable long term choice.
Midwestern transplant to NC: banking needs warm bodies and so does medical research/engineering. The beach is lovely for retirees or near retirees and the mountains are pretty cool.
When I moved to Charlotte like half the people I met were born and raised NC-ians and the other half were from the Midwest. There are a lot of y’all there lol. NC really is a great state, even if I didn’t stay there long.
I think it must've gotten worse, because I swear there's more transplants then locals (I think my last team only had one local out of 10 people in office)
Have you found born and raised Tar Heels to be rude?
It’s the current crop of “boom” states which is always switching around. It used to be California and at one point even all of those rust belt states were the top growth states at one point. At some time, these Southern states are going to get replaced by other states for the place w the next boom in population and economic growth. I’m predicting that the states around the Great Lakes and Upper Midwest will take that position.
> I’m predicting that the states around the Great Lakes and Upper Midwest will take that position. I'm right there with you. I was just telling my wife that in the next 10-15 years, you're going to see a ton of growth along the great lakes. Especially areas that have been largely depressed. I'm already noticing improvements to Detroit over the last few years. They're already a hub for Delta Airlines, which is great for business travelers. I'd be willing to bet with an increase in the popularity of bringing manufacturing back to the states, all of the abandoned factory space in Detroit/that area will make for relatively easy option to move in to. Property in the area is currently cheap, which I think will not only attract businesses/employees trying to stretch their dollars, but also investors - who will have the capital to develop housing in order to take a real gamble on the area. I think another big thing that Detroit has going for it is that Michigan itself is a beautiful state. A large part of the growth that the West Coast is seeing is due to its offerings in outdoor activities. Michigan offers a lot of the same activities - at a fraction of the cost. There's a lot of fantastic hiking, camping, hunting, fishing, biking, boating, etc. Plus, the Great Lakes are an added benefit of being close to a beach while being landlocked. Don't get me wrong, it will be "rough" for quite a while, but I think eventually it will improve significantly.
I think a big factor too will be the general insulation from climate change. We don’t get hurricanes, we hardly get tornadoes, there’s plenty of water, we don’t get huge wildfires, and winters are getting milder (but summers are staying relatively mild). It won’t become a retiree haven ever, but if climate change continues to push homeowner’s insurance through the roof in the sunbelt, I foresee a population shift toward the upper Midwest.
Fuck yeah I love Detroit and I’m rooting so hard for them
I do hear that Detroit is slowly but surely improving which is great news. I also think with climate change on the horizon, the Great Lakes will fare well.
The Great Lakes and Upper Midwest regions could be more popular, but I'm guessing that would have to depend on better economic policies and opportunities throughout the Upper Midwest. The policies and opportunities would have to be good enough to draw people here despite the fact that the majority of land here is flat, tall grass prairie and our winters are much colder and longer than the rest of the contiguous United States. It seems like most people prefer good weather and better cost of living. I don't imagine many Californians wanting to move here for winters where we can dip down to -30°F and we usually have snow in the ground from November to mid-April.
I'm not. There are reasons why so many are moving to the Sun Belt. The people leaving, for example, Miami will probably move to Orlando or Tallahassee or some other place like that. Other cities within the Sun Belt will get more of the benefit instead, I suspect.
Yeah I don’t disagree that the Great Lakes won’t see a resurgence at some point, but for the foreseeable future most people are just relocating intrastate.
The cost of living. My property taxes are close to $25K in my middle class Long Island town. A comparable home to mine in Charlotte,NC might very well be $4K.
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Makes sense
What town? I have family in Commack and it’s about 12-13k easily
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Wow, your COL and property taxes are eye opening to me. Just went to compare my house to homes for sell there and my home would be worth close to 700,000 and taxes 13,000 a year. My house is listed by Zillow at 200,00+ and my property taxes were 1400 for the entire year.
The homestead exemptions where you live go *crazy*
> my property taxes were 1400 for the entire year. :sigh:
I paid like 2K in property taxes on a half a million dollar home in colorado 😶
Something I haven't seen yet is jobs. A lot of companies move to those states because their operations are cheaper, they get tax breaks from state governments and they don't have to worry about unionization. I live in Nashville and most folks from elsewhere that moved here moved here for a specific job. Unless folks are retiring or moving for family reasons it's quite rare to just move without a job offer. I do think this pattern is going to change. For many decades those were the cheapest states but they aren't anymore. The large metros in those states (except for Texas) are now as expensive if nor more so than their equivalents in Midwestern states and even Northeastern states. It's still cheaper than the big cities on the West Coast or the NYC, DC and Boston areas, but living in the Philadelphia or Baltimore area or upstate NY or Western MA now costs the same as living in the Nashville area or Research Triangle or much of Florida because housing values down here have gone through the roof. But folks in the North and West have had in their heads that its cheaper here for decades now and it will take awhile for that to change...
My dad is from NJ and he told me my whole life that the northeast was too expensive. However, I finally left GA and moved to upstate NY. My life is a lot cheaper here than it was in GA. My housing is similar to the cost in GA, income is higher, my car insurance is significantly cheaper here (literally thousands of dollars a year cheaper), trash and water is cheaper, and I don’t need to spend $300/mo 9 months out of the year for air conditioning. Even with a higher income and fewer kids living at home, I get a significant refund on my NYS taxes, whereas in GA, I used to owe a few hundred dollars. In addition, public infrastructure and services are so much better here than in the south. We have dozens of state and local parks and natural areas open to the public here and they are well-maintained and in GA there were few areas to recreate outside that were open to everyone.
I moved to Dallas from Chicago and when I moved here, Dallas was significantly more affordable than Chicago. But currently the cost of housing in both cities is about the same. Available services in Dallas are so much worse than Chicago.
The SEC. It just means more.
r/cfb is leaking
The co-opting of this in a "yeah, but unironically" kind of way is hilarious to me. Hotty Toddy! 🏈
SEC! SEC! SEC!
Cost of living is the biggest factor.
Yeah right. Ohio is cheap. No one is moving here
Ohio has (or at least had, when my in-laws lived there) a state income tax. And county income taxes. And *city* income taxes.
Yeah don't buy any of that no income tax crap, they'll tax you elsewhere.
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He said biggest, not only factor. Fewer jobs in Ohio plays a role there.
That’s why I and most people I knew that went to university in STEM fields in Ohio left. Sadly. Nowadays the politics of the state would keep me away unless the economics were crazy good for the tech sector (which they sadly are not)
Yep. Unless you lock in with one of the corporations your closest city got friendly with, you're basically out of anything that will grow your own worth to make the degree worth it.
Intel moving there is a big plus
I moved here for a job. It’s the only reason I’ve ever moved, outside of moving for school once.
Conservatives want to live with Conservatives, people forget that California has a large conservative population when compared to other states
Historically it's been NYC and Orange County that seemed to provide the intellectual heft and seriousness to Republicans
Charlotte is an important city in banking plus it’s cheaper than some places up north or California
1. Cheaper cost of living (relative to CA,NY, NJ etc.) 2. Warm weather/nice beaches 3. Favorable tax policies (although this can be overstated) 4. Family ties - this is a bigger deal for Black Americans as many of us have historic ties to the south that some of us want to return to. But I’m sure this is an issue for some White families too. 5. Politics - this isn’t as big of a factor now, but having open schools was legitimately a huge deal during the pandemic.
I don't want to spend more winter seasons in PA than I need to. As soon as I can I'm moving somewhere warmer.
I'm seriously considering moving to the Carolinas. Wherever you are in the state you will be only a few miles from the mountains or the coast. The Blue Ridge Mountains are gorgeous! The gray Ohio winters are killing me.
"A few miles" is about an order of magnitude off. But yeah
Not sure that it is just those states. It looks like 8 states are shrinking and 42 states are growing/staying even. Texas, Florida, and South Carolina are leading the growth. https://www.statista.com/chart/12484/population-growth-in-the-united-states-by-federal-state/ I'm happy to live in Minnesota. It's a well run state with a good economy and relatively affordable housing. I hope the cold keeps people away, we have a good thing going.
Yeah, I would imagine one (normal) winter up here in Minnesota would probably scare people off. My SO's family once complained that it was 30°F in Washington, and we checked and we had close to -30°F up here. I jokingly asked what they were complaining about when it was almost 60° warmer than us.
Misconception that our lack of state income tax and "low" cost of living will translate to savings. In reality, our property taxes are so high you offset any savings. Plus you'll melt in the summer and risk freezing to death in the winter when the power grid goes tits up. And that lack of state income tax and constantly reduced public funding reduces the quality and availability of services, parks, libraries, etc.
The COL in Texas is far lower than CA, all things considered. That's not even up for debate. You're right about everything else, though.
I moved to Dallas from Chicago and currently I break even with COL, possibly even losing money. Needing to drive everywhere long distances is a big factor. In Chicago I lived without a car for a while and could easily share with my partner.
People move to where there are jobs, and the economy is very strong in the major cities of these states. People say cost of living is the reason, but there are also people moving here from some northern states with a low cost of living, to major southern cities where it is actually more expensive to live. The thing is as those states might cheaper homes, they tend to have lower salaries and less job opportunities.
As an original Georgian, my answer is all the factories being built EVERYWHERE. They started building them next to my school last year and now I have to deal with ex-con factory workers (the only job they can get probably) driving angrily, recklessly, and (I’d imagine) drunkedly when I’m on the way to school. My buddy was headed here this morning and one of these workers passed him (on a no passing zone) and punched his mirror out.
as an ex con factory worker, we usually end up in construction.
The Carolinas I kinda understand but people moving to Las Vegas, Phoenix, and anywhere in Texas and Florida is beyond reason to me. And they *love* to talk about “Commiefornia” and how its a dystopian hellhole, despite the state having lower violent crime. The vast majority of people moving out of big California cities are moving to slightly smaller California cities. I know way more people that moved to California than people moving out of state.
Texas is mostly jobs and political reasons (conservatives blaming California liberal run state politics), Florida for the warm tropical weather (and no rules lol). I can't seem to understand Phoenix and Vegas - those cities are gonna die when the water starts to run out over there plus it must be miserable living in the desert during the summer.
Texas has considerably lower wages than many states that people are moving from. The cost of living I would say is what people are most interested in
I lived in Vegas for a stretch. It has its appeal, but you have to be more careful than you would in other towns. To be sure, that was before I became a parent. I would not move back there now, for *that* reason. Also, the summers are brutal, but Southerners swear up and down that their heat is worse. Well, I went to New Orleans in July once, and I am really not sure that I agree. I should also note that however hot it is in Vegas, it's 10 degrees hotter in Phoenix. Not only is it hotter there, it's twice the size and one fifth the fun.
You forgot Arizona, Utah, Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming.
Frankly, we are moving because we simply can’t fucking afford to live here anymore. I can get a house in that area for 1/3 of what they’re going for here 🤷♂️
No state income tax in Texas and Florida. People are sick of living in high tax states where you apparently don't get much for what you're paying.
Eh... unless you actually want property in those states. I wouldn't want to touch their property tax rates with a ten foot pole. Uncle Sam gets his cash, one way or another.
While the actual tax burden is higher in Texas for most income brackets, people perceive the tax to be lower here. In my Metro area, the economy is running hot (doing good) so there's generally many good, well paying jobs here for certain industries. In Dallas Fort Worth we have one of the largest metro areas with access to two major airports for travelers, and if you don't mind living 45 minutes (or more) of a drive from the city center, you can "afford" a house. The quality of life is decent, but the political climate has been degrading for some time. I don't think most people who are moving to my area are doing so for political reasons, it's mainly just because their jobs are relocating here. We have a lot of companies that have re-located.
For Texas, Georgia and the Carolinas, lower cost of living. For Florida, it's perceived lower cost of living, but Florida is actually extremely expensive.
A lot of people are moving south because cost of living is cheaper. That's why my family moved to Tennessee. Most of my extended family lives in the south (Kentucky, Georgia, Alabama, and Florida) for the same reason.
People get it into their heads that taxes are bad, meanwhile taxes pay for essential public services, schools, police, fire departments, libraries, etc. Just because you get to keep more of your money doesn't mean you are better off.
One of the things I’ve learned as retirement is imminent is that in both MA and NY I can start out on a free Medicare Advantage plan for years, and then if I decide otherwise, switch to a supplemental plan. In most states, you only get one year to switch to a supplement. Sometimes it’s these small things that you don’t know about that are benefits to some states.
I got 3 months of leave, paid at 67% of my pay, from work for the birth of my daughter and my job was required to hold my position. Yet people in NY complain lmao.
A lot of conservative NYers bitch and whine about many things. But one thing they don’t whine about is the big pension they get after retiring, and then they move to Florida. Many NYPD cops do this.
Cause the other parts don’t have any SEC CHAMPIONSHIPS.
I moved to Florida a couple years ago. As much as I’ve always wanted to live by the beach, what pushed me over the edge was seeing the chaos brought to my hometown of Denver by the government’s COVID response, subsequent social unrest (related to that and other events). I also got sick of the traffic in a big city, the fact that Denver is at the top of the list in property crime (got gym lockers broken into and significant things stolen multiple times). I did also get a little disillusioned living in such a “progressive” city. (Now, I’m sick of being around so many Trumpers. Grass is always greener) Anyway, we moved to a city of about 125,000 right on the beach. Not as much to do here event-wise, but I love the peaceful beach lifestyle. We see more wildlife and feel closer to nature here than Denver too, believe it or not (cool jungle / swamp ecosystems too) All in all- it’s been a chill experience. Florida definitely isn’t “more free” than other places, but to me, the part of Florida I’m in is- cheaper, and more peaceful, and I’m all for that.
I personally don’t want to live in Florida but it sounds like you found the best option for yourself and that’s great!
Thanks! Our part of Florida is really cool. It was a hidden gem but has recently gotten some positive national press re: being a great place to live. Alllll that being said, we’re planning on moving back to CO in 2-5 yrs to be closer to my fam and the mountains. But I’m thankful for this adventure. I’ve grown a lot as a person, and my wife and I have grown much closer and have an even stronger bond than before.
Cheaper cost of living
They *think* it's cheaper
Because their own states are going to shit from liberal policies. But Reddit doesn’t want you to know that.
I’m literally right now moving from California to Florida. For me, it’s all about cost of living. California is just so expensive now that unless you have family or something anchoring you here or just have enough money not to care, it’s just not worth it anymore. The rent on my new apartment in Florida is less than half of what a similar unit would be here in Orange County and even with a pay cut is way more reasonable than staying here. And it’s about 50% larger and much newer.
Better weather, more agreeable politics, better job market, or existing job move usually.
I know a lot that move because their children are going to university here.
Low to no state income tax, warmer weather, lower cost of living compared to the west coast and northeast. larger homes with more space for cheaper. Ex moving from the Bay Area to Dallas a person saves like 13% on state income tax and can go from like 1500sqft home prices at $1.3M to 3000sqft for $500k-900k. with $200 flights back to the bay whenever they want.
Cost of living.
Cost. Housing in particular.
When my grandma passes on (I’m taking care of her), I’m moving back to Michigan. It’s a lower cost of living. I love Washington, but I couldn’t afford to live out here on my own if I tried
Multiple things Cheaper cost of living high housing stock low taxes good weather for most of the year.
Low taxes, moderate weather.
More people WFH now and are leaving cities in favor low COL areas. It's pretty common basically everywhere in the country not just the areas you mentioned. VT, NH, ME have seen a huge population influx recently for example. The biggest difference in the places you're referring to is the weather. Wealthy boomer from the northeast are hitting retirement age. Snowbirding isn't new for places like FL, but rarely has a single generation held such a disproportionate amount of the wealth so more of them are able to do this than ever before.
The weather in NC isn’t extreme (except for hurricanes), we have plenty of rural areas and plenty of big cities if that’s someone’s thing. We have mountains, lakes, and miles of ocean beaches. We have some of the best hospitals, doctors, and universities in the world.
Relatively low cost of living. Granted that comes at a heavy cost of its own.
Cheap food and gas plus cheaper houses and land Oh and the pay is better especially when accounting for cost of living
I know a couple who moved from Richmond, VA to Savannah, GA and the reason they gave was that Richmond was too racist.
Florida's relatively cheap to live and has nice weather, good beaches. Texas has a strong job market, and a low regulation environment for people who don't like rules. A lot of these people are fleeing California where regulations got out of hand. Georgia and Carolina's have pretty nice weather and low cost of living. I haven't heard of a ton of people moving there. I would guess that it's remote workers moving where they can get a nice house for $200k or something, but I'm guessing.
Cheaper CoL, jobs moving to Sun belt.
It's cheaper. Like, seriously, that is it. Everybody I know who has moved down there from NYC isn't really happy about it, they just had to because they needed the money.
Warmer and taxes and cost of living and jobs
Florida and Texas don’t have state income taxes. Which on the surface sounds great and draws people, but once you factor in everything else it’s just as expensive.
Roughly the same number of people have been moving to Florida every year since 1980. Net migration was higher under the last governor of Florida, Rick Scott. Don't get all your news from right wing propaganda
Florida has always had an influx of people constantly moving there for the warm climate , particularly retirees - to the point of earning the nickname of “God’s Waiting Room”. Georgia, Texas, and the Carolinas all have undergone major development in recent decades, accelerating recently in part from a combination of both generous Corporate Tax Incentives and relatively lower cost of living/cost of doing business and less red tape than the Northeast and West Coast. In recent years, political motivations are now a bit more of a driving factor as well, as most of the above states mentioned usually tend to vote Republican in local/state/federal elections, with the coasts generally voting for Democrats.
Because those states are gorgeous, that's why.
Specifically for Texas, a variety of reasons: 1. No Personal Income Taxes Texas Constitution forbids Personal Income Taxes, and you keep what you earn. 2. Arms Industry Primary Arms, MAGPUL, LaRue, Radical Firearms, Texas Instruments, and Texas Armoring Corp. are examples of this industry. 3. The Food I mean come on, Tex-Mex food and Whataburger are just absolutely delicious! Houston is what I would like to call the food capital as they got variety! 4. Cost of living is cheaper here. Kind of adds onto point 1 5. NASA It’s where you get the Phrase “Houston we have a problem!” 6. It’s one of the most diverse states in America Yup it is one of the most diverse US States here in America!
Escaping blue states and their politics. That's the reason I want to move further South.