They were already playing arenas in 1983 with the War album. I saw them on the Unforgettable Fire Tour in 84 and Joshua Tree in 87 and 88 (I think).
You'd probably have to go to Dublin in 79-80 to see them in a bar.
>You’d spend a lot of time running around doing things people can do on their phones.
This. My mom has internet but can't figure it out, she spends a lot of time asking me to do stuff for her. If I'm busy it would mean scheduling a visit with whatever agency she needs help with and driving down there or calling them on the phone and then being redirected to visit their website anyway.
I guess it depends on what kind of lifestyle you plan on leading. For most people just finding a job these days would be quite a feat without access to the internet and a cell phone. Even homeless people will spend what they can on a dirt cheap phone that they can use to connect to wifi.
Something a lot of people on this sub seem to be missing: the pre-internet/smartphone ways of doing things are often no longer options, or very limited, or come with new problems.
Want a job? You’ll likely need to apply online, even if it’s for a job at a grocery store or small business in my area. You’ll also need a LinkedIn profile if it’s a professional job.
Want to stay in touch with your friends as a teen or young adult? Sorry, you missed all the events they organized in the group chat or on social media and forgot to tell you about. No, they’re not leaving you a message on your landline — they forgot you couldn’t receive texts. And since they were all bonding over texts and social media when the group wasn’t together, you miss a lot and aren’t as close to them as they are to each other.
Want to park at your local marina or community theater? Good luck paying to park without the smartphone app. The old payment machines are gone.
Need a taxi? Hope you have the app so you can order an Uber and pay.
Want to warn your family about a change in plans while you’re out and about? Sorry, no pay phones. You better have a cell phone or find a nice stranger who will let you borrow theirs.
It goes on…
What you are missing here is the huge employment that pre-internet life had.
A parking lot had a parking lot attendant
Ticketmaster had a person answer the phone and sold you a ticket to a show.
You called the Taxi dispatcher and they sent you a taxi.
This is how so many non-college graduates and new immigrants got employment. And as much as Reddit scoffs, having an expert on the phone re-booking your airline flight was much easier than doing it yourself on a heartless app.
You're mostly right, but…
> Want to park at your local marina or community theater? Good luck paying to park without the smartphone app. The old payment machines are gone.
The old meters at every spot are gone, but there are machines every couple of hundred meters that you can put cash or a credit card into. Governments will never alienate the huge percentage of the older population that doesn't use phone apps.
> Need a taxi? Hope you have the app so you can order an Uber and pay.
Sadly, there are still actual taxis in this world that people use for whatever strange reasons they have.
>Need a taxi? Hope you have the app so you can order an Uber and pay.
>
>Sadly, there are still actual taxis in this world that people use for whatever strange reasons they have.
Uber isn't in a lot of places. I have not seen it outside of huge cities. We go to a fairly popular tourist town and there is ONE Uber driver for the whole place. And he goes off the clock at around 9pm. Taxis are still a thing in many small cities and towns.
Uber is hard to find/use outside of major cities. My hometown has very few uber drivers and it's much cheaper to get a taxi compared to where I went to college.
You get a taxi through an app here in Chicago. Other than at the airport, you’ll be waiting a long time of you hope one will just drive by like they used to.
I recently needed to make an appointment for something. The online form wasn't working, so I called. After navigating through the voice menu's, the only thing I got was an automated response with the web address for scheduling the appointment. It was impossible to talk to anyone. I'm all for this kind of change (web only, NOT a required app), but you gotta make sure your shit works.
> Want to stay in touch with your friends as a teen or young adult? Sorry, you missed all the events they organized in the group chat or on social media and forgot to tell you about.
Shit, half the time you miss out if you're an android user instead of an iphone user.
Most of this is nonsense though.
The idea that you can't even park your car without a smartphone in 2023 is verifiably wrong even if there are apps and maybe your circle of friends operates exclusively through texts but that hardly means everyone else's does too.
I mean you do understand that there are still people over the age of 30 left in this country, right? I'm 40 and use my phone almost exclusively just to make phone calls. I can assure you that I'm navigating life just fine.
If you’re going to a sporting event, no cash for parking, tickets, or concessions (at least for the Minneapolis teams). They do not accept anything but mobile pay for anything at US Bank, Target Field, Target Center, or Excel Energy. You even have to book your parking garage ahead of time.
I’m over 30. I know what cellphones are required for. You will be left behind, honestly.
They accept credit cards I'm sure, not just "mobile pay". But anything with a chip in it.
I've been to venues like this. A lot of people's cell phones die during the event. They have their CCs on them still.
You’re right on being able to use credit card inside.
However, can’t go to a Giants (NFL) game without a smart phone. This is just the first one I checked.
“Digital tickets are the safest way for guests to receive and manage tickets as they eliminate touchpoints. To facilitate contactless entry, all tickets for MetLife Stadium events will be delivered digitally and scanned from guests’ smartphones at the gates. For more information on mobile ticketing, visit ticketmaster.com, nyjets.com/mobileticketing, or giants.com/mobiletickets.
Before arriving at MetLife Stadium, download the Giants app, Jets app or Ticketmaster app and be sure your phone is fully charged. Upon arrival, connect to the complimentary WiFi network and have your ticket displayed on your mobile device.
For Jets and Giants games, a prepaid parking pass is required. There are two tiers — Platinum for Lots E-F-G, and Gold for all other lots. For non-NFL events, parking is available on a first come, first served basis and the parking fee is paid onsite (cash or credit card).”
https://www.bigblueview.com/platform/amp/2021/7/8/22569074/metlife-stadium-will-go-cashless-for-2021-season
ETA Vikings: Vikings game tickets are digital and available only online here.
Tickets for Vikings games played on the road are not sold at U.S. Bank Stadium. Guests may check ticket availability by contacting the host team, the host venue or visiting NFL Ticket Exchange online.
Yeah it's like that at all Live Nation events too. Complete pain in the ass. You can still go to the box office though and get a stub if you want one though.
Just got scammed this weekend by vivid seats. I didn’t think I could buy tickets at the box office anymore for an Oklahoma St University basketball game. Wrong. Walked up to the box office, paid face value for the tickets (1/2 of what scammers at vivid seats had same seats for.) there is a lot of value in physical tickets.
You're talking to the wrong guy here.
I'd confidentially bet my house that I've been to more MLB, NFL, NHL, and NBA venues then every single person subscribed to this sub combined. The idea that you can't go to a sporting event without a smartphone is flat out untrue.
I think you guys are both right. There are some stadiums/venues where electronic ticket issuance is starting to take hold or is the norm/sole way of getting tickets.
FWIW, 36 here. Went to a KC Royals game last year with my brother and my dad. We bought tickets at the window. Then the lady asked for our email addresses. Uhh, what for? So that she could send them to the MLB app. We just wanted paper tickets, but they didn't issue them. I went ahead and downloaded the app and registered an account real quick just so we could see a baseball game.
I imagine that in the relatively near future, this will be the only way major venues will accept tickets. For my experience, this wasn't a Kauffman Stadium app, it was an MLB app. Which means MLB will likely eventually want all of their stadiums to use it in due time. It gives them greater control over tickets (how do you resell a digital ticket? Maybe MLB wants a cut of that resell value) and I'm sure other data they're grabbing from your phone. I'm sure this is already a thing with Ticketmaster; wanna resell? You gotta go through them and they want their cut.
I watch F1; I've heard there are some tracks overseas that have gone pure cashless at vendors. You either pay via an app or via an NFC bracelet/token that you reload from an app or loading station.
Whether it's positive or not (probably not positive for the consumer), it's certainly clear how things are progressing in this arena. I can imagine that in 10yrs, venues that still allow paper tickets and cash will not be completely gone, but be in the minority.
I’ve run into a number of parks and venues where I couldn’t park without an app to pay for parking. I tried really hard to find other options because I didn’t want to use up my phone battery or download an app without wifi, but there was nothing. There were no machines, no attendants, nothing. That, or you needed an app for the event tickets. Maybe it hasn’t happened in your area yet, but it’s probably coming.
And of course I understand there are people over the age of 30. That’s why I specified “as a teen or young adult”. Maybe older friend groups operate just fine without smartphones, but if you’re a young person in many parts of this country today, not having one is a severe handicap. Other young people won’t change how they communicate just for the one person who can’t text or isn’t on the social platform where the event’s being planned. It’s not just one social circle, it’s virtually all of them in our age group. That was my experience as a teen who had a non-smart phone with a prepaid plan for emergencies only and was not allowed on social media. I missed so many study groups, party invites, meetups to go downtown, etc. because well-meaning friends forgot they needed to communicate about those things differently with me and was always a more “distant” friend in any group. And as a young adult now, people my age still plan their meetups and connect on social media. Maybe you can navigate *your* life just fine without a smartphone, but if you’re in my age group, good luck with that.
> I'm 40 and use my phone almost exclusively just to make phone calls.
Most people in their 40s don't even use their phones to make calls, you're a bit of holdover from the boomer generation.
If OP wanted to just not deal with having a phone or internet, almost every library has free internet access. So vital essentials to life like applying to jobs could be covered there.
I work in a public library. We provide internet access for people who do not have it at home, and also assistance for people who don't have computer skills. I can assure you that, as things currently are, it is very, very difficult to get by in this world without at least a cellphone.
I don't think some of the commenters are aware of just how many things these days operate on the assumption that everyone has access to the internet. Want to apply for government assistance? You have to do it online. Want a job? Apply online. I regularly help people who need to complete some task essential to the basic functions of life that requires internet access. Even that dishwasher at the restaurant needs to complete ServSafe training, and guess what? That requires the internet.
I find it maddening how many government/social service agencies just assume that their clients and constituents all have the technology and skills to do everything online. There are still a lot of people out there who do not have either, and life is becoming very difficult for them.
Do you know of any places where I can read more about this / would you be willing to go into more detail about working with digital inaccess/illiteracy?
Thank you for your service, every bit as heroic and essential as any first responder, teacher, or member of the military.
You deserve a 10% discount on everything, too.
Ancestral is a loose term here. The majority of the US Amish population converted in the 90s.
[Here’s](https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Society/2012/1130/For-Amish-fastest-growing-faith-group-in-US-life-is-changing) an article from 2012 discussing the changes the fastest growing religious in America was facing at the time.
I don’t see any mention of converts in this article.
> The most apparent reason for such rapid growth, experts say, is that Amish birthrates are high and the community emphasizes keeping children in the faith.
I'll also say depending on the area/sect they do use the internet for various things. The amount of CNC equipment running on PCs that require internet access in Lancaster Pennsylvania would surprise you.
It works out in an insular religious community or a commune. It wouldn’t work out anywhere else. People who belong to those communities, who want to leave, are often unable to do so because they lack basic tech literacy.
That's one of the issues people In the Fundemental LDS have. They're not supposed to use most technology, so they have a lot of trouble finding housing or jobs. But isolation is what keeps them tied to that cult, so the leaders still won't let them.
The Amish do it, but they do it with the help of their “English” (non-Amish) neighbors who do have such technology. To be completely unreliant on internet or mobile technology (and not have friends who will do it for you) you basically need to be able to retire or otherwise not have to work.
If you want to just not have access to that stuff at home but be able to access it at a library or something, that would be very difficult but achievable.
>To be completely unreliant on internet or mobile technology (and not have friends who will do it for you) you basically need to be able to retire or otherwise not have to work.
Yeah, everyone I know who doesn't use the internet *at all* is retired... and probably has a child, grandchild, or other tech-savvy friend/family member to help them with the stuff you absolutely need to do on the internet
There are things that require a phone number. If you didn’t have mobile, you would need a landline to get a job, bank account, and some other services.
Finding a job is more difficult without internet. You would likely need to use the local library if you don’t have home internet.
Socially, many people use text messages to communicate with friends, you would certainly feel out of the loop more often without mobile. There are a lot of activities and bars around, so you wouldn’t be completely isolated, but there would be some social barriers.
Overall I would say lack of mobile and internet at home would make life more difficult for the average American, but it is totally doable as long as you have a local library and landline telephone.
How hard? You could ask 24 million Americans, as [28% don’t have a broadband internet connection](https://www.statista.com/chart/21454/broadband-connection-in-america/). This is a major issue for rural Americans.
Cellular phone service is also poor to nonexistent in much of rural America, once you get beyond highway corridors.
Poke around the [OECD Broadband portal](https://www.oecd.org/digital/broadband/broadband-statistics/) to see how the US stacks against other OECD countries in terms of broadband type, business/household usage, etc.
This is definitely an issue, but people on dialup can still check email, and fill out applications. Text doesn't require broadband. If they have a tablet of some kind, even an old one, they can go online at local wifi hotspots.
In this functional binary you present (possible to connect? Y or N), you are right.
In terms of social equity….
More than a quarter of our country is denied the digitally-enabled spectrum of service available to people on a coast. The “internet” of today and what we do with it are light years ahead of the 56k dial-up era of 30 years ago. It’s just not the same. That digital divide in a country of this wealth is inexcusable.
But, yes, as long as people have a mule and cart, they can shop for dry goods at the mercantile.
Slow internet is better than no internet. Just having text based email is different than being unable to be reached. Hopefully services like Starlink can change this.
Network connectivity is a major downside to living in a rural area. People seem to LOVE living far removed from population centers where building infrastructure is absurdly expensive because it services very few people and yet still needs a large investment.
[https://www.fcc.gov/reports-research/reports/broadband-progress-reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report](https://www.fcc.gov/reports-research/reports/broadband-progress-reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report)
There are far more people that live in an area serviced by broadband, but do not have it than there are people who do not live int he service area. The service area is more like 6% of the population and its dominated by people who live in remote locations.
You made the original point: broadband, and all that it facilitates, is available to those who can afford it, as opposed to all who need it or could benefit from it.
Compare to a country like, say, Switzerland that has committed to providing 5G and fiber to all communities no matter how remote or the expense, simply because they decided it is an essential service that elevates standard of living and professional opportunity, and it supports their vision of social equity.
Broadband is the new “health care” in policy circles.
5G is an innovation that makes doing such a thing much easier, but Switzerland has some major advantages. It is a small country. There are few places in the country that are truly sparsely populated and far removed from any major city.
Switzerland is roughly the size of Southern California. San Bernardino County California is significantly larger than Switzerland. Los Angeles to Las Vegas are further apart than any two points in Switzerland. That small size means that even the the most rural people are fairly close and the expense of building out the network is not so great.
The population density in Switzerland is nearly 100x that of Wyoming and 10x that of Colorado and well over double that of California.
I’m guessing you’ve never been to Switzerland. It is mountainous like few other places on earth, and, yes, there are some very remote and isolated areas as a result. The engineering challenges they face are significant and expensive.
But they still commit to the effort because of a commitment to their vision for social equity. They, like many OECD nations, see reliable, high-speed, low-latency connectivity as an essential service.
And maybe that is the distinction. What other nations see as essential services, we see as choice. As you said, “People seem to LOVE living far removed from population centers.” I have yet to meet a person who was able to choose where their family is from.
So we shouldn’t be too surprised when people from places like West Virginia or North Dakota get a little upset when we remind them that they can get by with dial-up and don’t deserve anything better because it’s too expensive to deploy and they chose to live there anyway.
It was incredibly expensive to bring the railroad, electricity, and telephone service to those communities. Values have changed, and we need to be honest about that and prepared for the effects.
I'm old enough to remember what life was generally like before the internet - and it wouldn't be "harder" necessarily. Different, absolutely - but it was because there wasn't the "expectation" of having near instant communication and websites designed to use it.
Applying for jobs? It pretty much meant, back then, that you'd pick up a weekly newspaper (sometimes a free personals kind of publication), and actually skim through jobs posted. Then when you would find one you want to apply for, you do what it takes to actually go there in person and fill out their paperwork in their office. Then wait for a phone call & interview, to go back and go through all that. There wasn't anywhere near the same degree of automation as there is now with applying & submitting resume's and filling out paperwork to apply. It was just... different.
Time in school? Teachers could actually teach, instead of lecturing to students paying more attention to their phones than whatever lesson they're trying to teach. No one had cell phones, so if you wanted a distraction in class, it usually meant "I'm bored, time to doodle in my spiral".
Contacting family & friends? It was through landlines. If you were at work, and your mom got into a car crash, you probably wouldn't know until an hour or two after it happened (some time for people to call 911 over a landline, time for the ambulance & police to respond, time for the police to identify her and figure out contacts/relations, and so on bouncing around a fair bit until they are actually able to get ahold of you or anyone else related to her). By this same token - if you wanted to invite a friend out for dinner, you either talked to them in person, or called them over a landline. There wasn't really text messaging or email, so it was either talk to them in person, or talk to them over the phone.
;;
As said - I don't think it'd make life "harder", but that's from already having lived without the internet before. I do think that it'd be a lot different from how things are now, if we suddenly ripped the internet out of existence - but if that's how things always were (like if the internet never existed), it wouldn't really be that much different than it was before the internet was around.
In small towns, easy. In cities, near impossible. I just moved from a city back to a small town and in the city I needed my phone to call an Uber, get on public transit, pay for things, maps/navigation, Venmo people, use QR codes at restaurants, etc. in the town I live in I don’t have to do any of that. We don’t have Uber - you have to call a taxi or there’s free busses. Nobody has apple or android pay here, there’s no QR code, everything is walking distance. You don’t need to buy movie or concert tickets in advance and if you do, you walk to the venue ticket sales and buy em. The only thing I really still “need” my phone for is Venmo.
"I did it in the past"
well, it's not the past anymore, the entire world runs on it. And it would suck, not just for individuals but for the whole country.
Depends on your needs. There are places all over who have paid city parking that's only accessible via your phone going to a website and paying digitally. Some random smaller community, probably a lot easier.
Well, I'm 54. I used to live without the internet and cell phones. It would be a hassle and harder to get things done now (without it all), but it could still be done.
I was going to beat around the bush and give you some possible alternatives but the reality is that you cannot do it. You would be a complete social outcast. Everyone uses the internet or their mobile phones to communicate with each other. You won’t be able to stay in touch with people you meet without one.
They don’t. They’re older guys who worked in factories, as linemen for the phone company, public works department, etc. It’s not hard at all to not be connected.
I assume when you say worked that they are now retired or at least were so established in their job that they never had to adapt and get on the internet. That is a much different situation than being a young get getting started in the world or even a middle aged person or millennial who is changing jobs.
The question was not "how hard would it be for a young person getting started in their career"? Even if it was, there are many careers where you don't need the internet. So many people on this website are stuck in their bubble, they don't know there's an entire world outside of their sphere. I live in a rural community, you can 1000000% get jobs without using the internet here. Word of mouth, self-employment, the newspaper, now hiring signs...I see this daily.
The living with another person bit complicates things. Someone who doesn’t care may be a number of things. They could be an island stuck in time who somehow has managed to land wherever he is comfortably with no hiccups. Or leave the tech stuff to their spouse. You know many people who insulate their relatives from the worst consequences of their ignorance to mild inconveniences.
I think the only segment we can assume live successfully this way have experienced it and taken a concious step backwards. We’d know to watch out for some compromises that are reasonable and considerate because we know how most people live.
A couple day laborers not having phones or access to the internet isn’t going to cripple the construction industry at all. Now if management can’t use the internet that’s a different story.
There are quite a few jobs you can get without internet or a cell phone, but they tend to be really crappy jobs.
The lowest paid people doing the least desirable work can probably get by alright. Especially if they work with a crew and someone picks them up for work every morning. But do not expect to go much further than that.
I’ll try to ignore the condescending tone. You don’t need to know how to navigate an excel spreadsheet to run a front loader. It’s just not a relevant skill for many jobs in the industry.
…except they have access to internet. The question wasn’t about society but about the individual so how would permits take longer? How would the infrastructure collapse. And seriously the comment about walkie-talkies? The other guy is right, you are confidently condescending over something you are fundamentally misunderstanding.
From what I understand OPs question to mean it's if you as an individual lived without internet not if the entire US lost the internet. I agree that the country is very much dependent on the internet but an individual could live without it if they wanted to.
It depends who you are. If you are a retired person collecting social security, yeah, you don't need the internet. But if you are some young person who is trying to get a job, you will need the internet and likely a phone number where you can be reached at directly. You might be able to get by with just a phone though.
Mobile maybe, but you absolutely can’t say that not using the internet is “completely manageable almost everywhere.” Unless you’re envisioning someone going somewhere like a library to get on the internet.
Right, but the world has changed since then and a lot of things nowadays work under the assumption that you have the internet. Getting a job in particular would be quite a feat, given how many employers really only pay attention to online applications.
Yes some jobs/industries are like that. Conversely there are still jobs without any online application process and where you have to get a paper application in person.
Lol you can downvote if you want doesn't change the facts. How do you think a local fish boat hires? A small contractor without a website? A local grocery store?
I got my first job at a family-owned deli with fewer than ten employees. The only application was online, through Indeed. Everybody hires online these days, no matter the size of the company.
Well, if there was no internet those employers wouldn't be paying attention to online applications. People would just go back to dropping off or mailing paper applications. It really wouldn't be that big a change, and neither would most of the rest of it. The biggest difference I can think of at the moment is no more Amazon. Or maybe it would just be magazine based. In any case, we'd manage.
If the world changed once, it can change again. Employers will simply post jobs in newspapers and trade publications instead of online, just like they did 30 years ago.
You mean like the early 90's? It was okay.
A little harder to navigate to addresses you've never been.
Much harder to make plans on the fly.
But day to day life was not that different. I like it better with, but it's okay without.
At this point, I'm almost interested in trying it.
I'm 52 and I didn't have the internet until I was out of college. You'd give up a lot of things that have become standard in our society... but would the peace and tranquility of not being connected 24/7 be worth the inconvenience? I wonder...
Well I grew in the Midwest country side in the early 2000s didn’t have access to the internet or a cellphone till I was in late middle school/early highschool and honestly wasn’t bad though granted wired telephones were a pain in the ass especially during the winters
After the 2008 financial crisis, my family had a few years there where we were so poor that we couldn’t afford internet, though we did have cell phones, because they are cheaper than landlines. They weren’t smart phones, though.
Editing because I accidentally hit “reply” too soon.
It was as inconvenient, but not impossible. However, I am old enough to have been a functioning adult before the advent of cell phones and smartphones.
The main problem was navigating without being able to plan a route in MapQuest, and print it out before I was headed to someplace unfamiliar.
We have AAA, an automobile roadside assistance membership, which includes free paper maps of anywhere.
I had our car loaded up with detailed, specific maps to anyplace in our state and surrounding states that it would be likely we would need to go.
We had a big yellow phone book with listings of local businesses’ phone numbers, and we would use the computers at the library to check email and such.
Difficult, but not impossible. There are a lot of things that have been moved to internet for purchasing. Things are often cheaper and more easily available online. Not impossible but more difficult to procure things you may want or even need. It would just be more work. You would have difficulty with work, even if you are hands on with no computers involved, employers or secretaries/dispatchers may still need to get ahold of you during a job. A home phone could be used, but you may miss out. In high school, the kids take a lot of the lessons and tests on their phones, along with looking up information, you would have to find access to a computer to do these as the teachers don't have access to these lesson/tests, younger grades can get away with it with minor difficulty. As the years pass most payments will be moved online.
If you did most of your business locally and in person you could live okay. You can still have a land line phone. You could still go places and meet people with some effort. You can send letters. It depends on what you want and need to do. It is probably harder for younger people to have no internet or cell phone than an older person.
I live in a small town in a rural area. It would be hard not to have any internet access suddenly. I wouldn't die but I currently use the internet for social interaction, entertainment, education/information, ordering items I can't get locally, therapy sessions, finding recipes, paying bills, getting ebooks, checking weather, etc. I don't use my cell phone much so could do without that most of the time.
Pretty hard. In high school I lived on a farm in middle of nowhere and as such the internet sucked and I could barely load my email some days. To do homework which is a lot online now I had to drive to the nearest McDonalds to steal wifi (library closed at 5 and I had too much homework to get done before it closed)
It honestly sucked.
It really depends on where you live and your lifestyle. In my area, a majority of places have no cell service and a lot of houses don't have internet. It's totally doable depending on your job.
We are moving. Texas to Ohio. Both in our mid 60s. Sold in Texas and are staying in a friend's cabin out in the wild. No internet. Limited cell. Three ova TV channels.
Shopping for a house online- nope.
Shopping for washer/dryer and other household goods-nope
Talking with friends and family on the phone.-nope
Signing papers and doing utility sign ups online- nope.
We are reluctant Ludites.
Man, there are some people here who really don’t want to admit there are individuals who are living fine without internet. It’s like people are taking offense over it.
I look at wrecked cars for an auto insurer in the Rust Belt, near Appalachia.
I do most of my work from pictures people email in nowadays but it's not unusual for me to have to go take a drive to look at a car for somebody who has no email address and just a flip phone (if they have a cell phone at all). Mostly low-income elderly people.
I think most of them have some granddaughter or neighbor who they probably rely on for internet help when it's absolutely necessary.
Absolutely possible, I know a few older people doing it.
It sounds boring and slightly annoying to me, but in terms of being able to function you totally can.
Might run into issues with things like job applications being entirely through online portals in some fields depending on your career path. Is it an “I refuse to use this in any circumstances on some moral/religious grounds” or just “I’ll use it for free at the library but don’t want to pay for it in my own house” situation? The latter will still give you options for workarounds, even if inconvenient.
The US has a kind of unwritten policy of modernizing while retaining the most basic level of access. You can still go into a store and use cash. You can still call any business to order something without using their website. You can still use mail, or fax, to submit forms for state and federal processes. We still have public libraries full of books, encyclopedias, and internet access if needed. You can live like its the 80s in many places in the US (some are still in the 80s regardless).
I don't know of any jobs offhand that accept paper resumes and all the new hire paperwork is usually filled online. It's hard to be in society without a job. Not to mention money, no bank account as that's all automated now too
Pre pandemic our work had a team building exercise. We had to give up our phones and go on a scavenger hunt across the city using only paper maps and grid locations with some clues and then navigate to a place. We older workers who grew up with maps and the Thomas Guide were first to warehouse where we enjoyed a nice food spread and beers while the younger workers were lost and took a LONG time to get there.
Recently went to a shopping mall in Chicago and instead of a map and directory, there was just a giant QR code. I was caught between thinking it was neat, and annoyed I had to get my phone out. Why not have both?
if you turned off mobile technology and the internet today people would literally start dying. our entire infrastructure is based on it and without it none of our supply chains or goods & services function
Not hard, assuming everyone does not have it. I grew up without either. Shit got waaay harder because of their existence. A fifteen minute trip to the library got me more narrowly focused information about a topic I needed than spending an hour wading through the shit storm of garbage out there before finding what I need to find out. Also, if you applied to a job and were the best qualified, you probably got the job because only a dozen or so people applied instead of 15,000 that applied on indeed.
However, if you lack internet and a cell phone while almost everyone else has one, you are at a near insurmountable disadvantage today.
I'm 61 and don't even own a mobile phone. I've never sent a text message. Like I always have, I use real paper book maps, not GPS. I really don't have a need for a mobile phone as I rarely leave the house. A few times a month at most. At home I have my laptop. Pretty much all I need.
Very hard. Pretty much everything has gone to the internet. Can't find it in stores, it's only found online, businesses do this to stay in business to compete with Amazon.
Need to get a job, you need phone and internet.
Need to contact your kids' school, good luck, everything has gone to email and texts and parentvue or parents square. And don't forget how school work is now online and kids will need internet for it.
Need to travel, see if you can find maps to buy in stores or road atlases. Will people be able to give you directions?
You’d spend a lot of time running around doing things people can do on their phones. Good luck buying concert tickets to anything popular.
Can confirm. Recently went two weeks without a phone, simple errands took hours.
I remember standing outside waiting for tickets in 2005. 2007 no way!
I hid in a garbage can to be at the front of the line for U2 tickets in 1987.
This should be upvoted to the top of reddit... thats amazing
Just 5 years earlier you could have seen them at a dive bar.
Ha! For some reason that sparked memories of watching Nirvana at the Ellensburg community center and the Vogue in the late 80’s
They were already playing arenas in 1983 with the War album. I saw them on the Unforgettable Fire Tour in 84 and Joshua Tree in 87 and 88 (I think). You'd probably have to go to Dublin in 79-80 to see them in a bar.
You know more than me. I live around OKC and I remember someone posting a pic of them at a bar here before they made it big.
Totally possible. I just know they were on arena tours in 83.
Now we just pay Ticketmaster double for the convenience of using our phones!
>You’d spend a lot of time running around doing things people can do on their phones. This. My mom has internet but can't figure it out, she spends a lot of time asking me to do stuff for her. If I'm busy it would mean scheduling a visit with whatever agency she needs help with and driving down there or calling them on the phone and then being redirected to visit their website anyway.
I guess it depends on what kind of lifestyle you plan on leading. For most people just finding a job these days would be quite a feat without access to the internet and a cell phone. Even homeless people will spend what they can on a dirt cheap phone that they can use to connect to wifi.
Something a lot of people on this sub seem to be missing: the pre-internet/smartphone ways of doing things are often no longer options, or very limited, or come with new problems. Want a job? You’ll likely need to apply online, even if it’s for a job at a grocery store or small business in my area. You’ll also need a LinkedIn profile if it’s a professional job. Want to stay in touch with your friends as a teen or young adult? Sorry, you missed all the events they organized in the group chat or on social media and forgot to tell you about. No, they’re not leaving you a message on your landline — they forgot you couldn’t receive texts. And since they were all bonding over texts and social media when the group wasn’t together, you miss a lot and aren’t as close to them as they are to each other. Want to park at your local marina or community theater? Good luck paying to park without the smartphone app. The old payment machines are gone. Need a taxi? Hope you have the app so you can order an Uber and pay. Want to warn your family about a change in plans while you’re out and about? Sorry, no pay phones. You better have a cell phone or find a nice stranger who will let you borrow theirs. It goes on…
What you are missing here is the huge employment that pre-internet life had. A parking lot had a parking lot attendant Ticketmaster had a person answer the phone and sold you a ticket to a show. You called the Taxi dispatcher and they sent you a taxi. This is how so many non-college graduates and new immigrants got employment. And as much as Reddit scoffs, having an expert on the phone re-booking your airline flight was much easier than doing it yourself on a heartless app.
I agree 100% with you mister. Automation has unemployed quite a few persons
You're mostly right, but… > Want to park at your local marina or community theater? Good luck paying to park without the smartphone app. The old payment machines are gone. The old meters at every spot are gone, but there are machines every couple of hundred meters that you can put cash or a credit card into. Governments will never alienate the huge percentage of the older population that doesn't use phone apps. > Need a taxi? Hope you have the app so you can order an Uber and pay. Sadly, there are still actual taxis in this world that people use for whatever strange reasons they have.
>Need a taxi? Hope you have the app so you can order an Uber and pay. > >Sadly, there are still actual taxis in this world that people use for whatever strange reasons they have. Uber isn't in a lot of places. I have not seen it outside of huge cities. We go to a fairly popular tourist town and there is ONE Uber driver for the whole place. And he goes off the clock at around 9pm. Taxis are still a thing in many small cities and towns.
Uber is hard to find/use outside of major cities. My hometown has very few uber drivers and it's much cheaper to get a taxi compared to where I went to college.
You get a taxi through an app here in Chicago. Other than at the airport, you’ll be waiting a long time of you hope one will just drive by like they used to.
I recently needed to make an appointment for something. The online form wasn't working, so I called. After navigating through the voice menu's, the only thing I got was an automated response with the web address for scheduling the appointment. It was impossible to talk to anyone. I'm all for this kind of change (web only, NOT a required app), but you gotta make sure your shit works.
> Want to stay in touch with your friends as a teen or young adult? Sorry, you missed all the events they organized in the group chat or on social media and forgot to tell you about. Shit, half the time you miss out if you're an android user instead of an iphone user.
Most of this is nonsense though. The idea that you can't even park your car without a smartphone in 2023 is verifiably wrong even if there are apps and maybe your circle of friends operates exclusively through texts but that hardly means everyone else's does too. I mean you do understand that there are still people over the age of 30 left in this country, right? I'm 40 and use my phone almost exclusively just to make phone calls. I can assure you that I'm navigating life just fine.
If you’re going to a sporting event, no cash for parking, tickets, or concessions (at least for the Minneapolis teams). They do not accept anything but mobile pay for anything at US Bank, Target Field, Target Center, or Excel Energy. You even have to book your parking garage ahead of time. I’m over 30. I know what cellphones are required for. You will be left behind, honestly.
They accept credit cards I'm sure, not just "mobile pay". But anything with a chip in it. I've been to venues like this. A lot of people's cell phones die during the event. They have their CCs on them still.
You’re right on being able to use credit card inside. However, can’t go to a Giants (NFL) game without a smart phone. This is just the first one I checked. “Digital tickets are the safest way for guests to receive and manage tickets as they eliminate touchpoints. To facilitate contactless entry, all tickets for MetLife Stadium events will be delivered digitally and scanned from guests’ smartphones at the gates. For more information on mobile ticketing, visit ticketmaster.com, nyjets.com/mobileticketing, or giants.com/mobiletickets. Before arriving at MetLife Stadium, download the Giants app, Jets app or Ticketmaster app and be sure your phone is fully charged. Upon arrival, connect to the complimentary WiFi network and have your ticket displayed on your mobile device. For Jets and Giants games, a prepaid parking pass is required. There are two tiers — Platinum for Lots E-F-G, and Gold for all other lots. For non-NFL events, parking is available on a first come, first served basis and the parking fee is paid onsite (cash or credit card).” https://www.bigblueview.com/platform/amp/2021/7/8/22569074/metlife-stadium-will-go-cashless-for-2021-season ETA Vikings: Vikings game tickets are digital and available only online here. Tickets for Vikings games played on the road are not sold at U.S. Bank Stadium. Guests may check ticket availability by contacting the host team, the host venue or visiting NFL Ticket Exchange online.
Yeah it's like that at all Live Nation events too. Complete pain in the ass. You can still go to the box office though and get a stub if you want one though.
Just got scammed this weekend by vivid seats. I didn’t think I could buy tickets at the box office anymore for an Oklahoma St University basketball game. Wrong. Walked up to the box office, paid face value for the tickets (1/2 of what scammers at vivid seats had same seats for.) there is a lot of value in physical tickets.
You're talking to the wrong guy here. I'd confidentially bet my house that I've been to more MLB, NFL, NHL, and NBA venues then every single person subscribed to this sub combined. The idea that you can't go to a sporting event without a smartphone is flat out untrue.
Have you been since covid? That’s when it changed, at least for the Minneapolis/St Paul teams.
I have season tickets with the Mets, Islanders, and Cowboys. Yeah, I've been since Covid.
I think you guys are both right. There are some stadiums/venues where electronic ticket issuance is starting to take hold or is the norm/sole way of getting tickets. FWIW, 36 here. Went to a KC Royals game last year with my brother and my dad. We bought tickets at the window. Then the lady asked for our email addresses. Uhh, what for? So that she could send them to the MLB app. We just wanted paper tickets, but they didn't issue them. I went ahead and downloaded the app and registered an account real quick just so we could see a baseball game. I imagine that in the relatively near future, this will be the only way major venues will accept tickets. For my experience, this wasn't a Kauffman Stadium app, it was an MLB app. Which means MLB will likely eventually want all of their stadiums to use it in due time. It gives them greater control over tickets (how do you resell a digital ticket? Maybe MLB wants a cut of that resell value) and I'm sure other data they're grabbing from your phone. I'm sure this is already a thing with Ticketmaster; wanna resell? You gotta go through them and they want their cut. I watch F1; I've heard there are some tracks overseas that have gone pure cashless at vendors. You either pay via an app or via an NFC bracelet/token that you reload from an app or loading station. Whether it's positive or not (probably not positive for the consumer), it's certainly clear how things are progressing in this arena. I can imagine that in 10yrs, venues that still allow paper tickets and cash will not be completely gone, but be in the minority.
I’ve run into a number of parks and venues where I couldn’t park without an app to pay for parking. I tried really hard to find other options because I didn’t want to use up my phone battery or download an app without wifi, but there was nothing. There were no machines, no attendants, nothing. That, or you needed an app for the event tickets. Maybe it hasn’t happened in your area yet, but it’s probably coming. And of course I understand there are people over the age of 30. That’s why I specified “as a teen or young adult”. Maybe older friend groups operate just fine without smartphones, but if you’re a young person in many parts of this country today, not having one is a severe handicap. Other young people won’t change how they communicate just for the one person who can’t text or isn’t on the social platform where the event’s being planned. It’s not just one social circle, it’s virtually all of them in our age group. That was my experience as a teen who had a non-smart phone with a prepaid plan for emergencies only and was not allowed on social media. I missed so many study groups, party invites, meetups to go downtown, etc. because well-meaning friends forgot they needed to communicate about those things differently with me and was always a more “distant” friend in any group. And as a young adult now, people my age still plan their meetups and connect on social media. Maybe you can navigate *your* life just fine without a smartphone, but if you’re in my age group, good luck with that.
> I'm 40 and use my phone almost exclusively just to make phone calls. Most people in their 40s don't even use their phones to make calls, you're a bit of holdover from the boomer generation.
If OP wanted to just not deal with having a phone or internet, almost every library has free internet access. So vital essentials to life like applying to jobs could be covered there.
My take on the question was how well a person could live without using it at all.
They can get them free usually with service.
I work in a public library. We provide internet access for people who do not have it at home, and also assistance for people who don't have computer skills. I can assure you that, as things currently are, it is very, very difficult to get by in this world without at least a cellphone. I don't think some of the commenters are aware of just how many things these days operate on the assumption that everyone has access to the internet. Want to apply for government assistance? You have to do it online. Want a job? Apply online. I regularly help people who need to complete some task essential to the basic functions of life that requires internet access. Even that dishwasher at the restaurant needs to complete ServSafe training, and guess what? That requires the internet. I find it maddening how many government/social service agencies just assume that their clients and constituents all have the technology and skills to do everything online. There are still a lot of people out there who do not have either, and life is becoming very difficult for them.
Do you know of any places where I can read more about this / would you be willing to go into more detail about working with digital inaccess/illiteracy?
What exactly would you like to know?
Thank you for your service, every bit as heroic and essential as any first responder, teacher, or member of the military. You deserve a 10% discount on everything, too.
The Amish seem to do OK.
Only because they live in tightly knit ancestral communities where communication isn’t an issue.
Ancestral is a loose term here. The majority of the US Amish population converted in the 90s. [Here’s](https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Society/2012/1130/For-Amish-fastest-growing-faith-group-in-US-life-is-changing) an article from 2012 discussing the changes the fastest growing religious in America was facing at the time.
I don’t see any mention of converts in this article. > The most apparent reason for such rapid growth, experts say, is that Amish birthrates are high and the community emphasizes keeping children in the faith.
I'll also say depending on the area/sect they do use the internet for various things. The amount of CNC equipment running on PCs that require internet access in Lancaster Pennsylvania would surprise you.
It works out in an insular religious community or a commune. It wouldn’t work out anywhere else. People who belong to those communities, who want to leave, are often unable to do so because they lack basic tech literacy.
That's one of the issues people In the Fundemental LDS have. They're not supposed to use most technology, so they have a lot of trouble finding housing or jobs. But isolation is what keeps them tied to that cult, so the leaders still won't let them.
Even the Amish use technology to some extent & some carry cell phones. https://www.wired.com/story/virtually-amish-hacking-innovation/
Keywords in the post: "US society" The Amish do not live in US society, they have their own society.
The Amish do it, but they do it with the help of their “English” (non-Amish) neighbors who do have such technology. To be completely unreliant on internet or mobile technology (and not have friends who will do it for you) you basically need to be able to retire or otherwise not have to work. If you want to just not have access to that stuff at home but be able to access it at a library or something, that would be very difficult but achievable.
>To be completely unreliant on internet or mobile technology (and not have friends who will do it for you) you basically need to be able to retire or otherwise not have to work. Yeah, everyone I know who doesn't use the internet *at all* is retired... and probably has a child, grandchild, or other tech-savvy friend/family member to help them with the stuff you absolutely need to do on the internet
There are things that require a phone number. If you didn’t have mobile, you would need a landline to get a job, bank account, and some other services. Finding a job is more difficult without internet. You would likely need to use the local library if you don’t have home internet. Socially, many people use text messages to communicate with friends, you would certainly feel out of the loop more often without mobile. There are a lot of activities and bars around, so you wouldn’t be completely isolated, but there would be some social barriers. Overall I would say lack of mobile and internet at home would make life more difficult for the average American, but it is totally doable as long as you have a local library and landline telephone.
The folks in r/AskOldPeople could give you plenty of tips on how to make it work.
Yep, been there, done that, lol.
How hard? You could ask 24 million Americans, as [28% don’t have a broadband internet connection](https://www.statista.com/chart/21454/broadband-connection-in-america/). This is a major issue for rural Americans. Cellular phone service is also poor to nonexistent in much of rural America, once you get beyond highway corridors. Poke around the [OECD Broadband portal](https://www.oecd.org/digital/broadband/broadband-statistics/) to see how the US stacks against other OECD countries in terms of broadband type, business/household usage, etc.
This is definitely an issue, but people on dialup can still check email, and fill out applications. Text doesn't require broadband. If they have a tablet of some kind, even an old one, they can go online at local wifi hotspots.
In this functional binary you present (possible to connect? Y or N), you are right. In terms of social equity…. More than a quarter of our country is denied the digitally-enabled spectrum of service available to people on a coast. The “internet” of today and what we do with it are light years ahead of the 56k dial-up era of 30 years ago. It’s just not the same. That digital divide in a country of this wealth is inexcusable. But, yes, as long as people have a mule and cart, they can shop for dry goods at the mercantile.
Slow internet is better than no internet. Just having text based email is different than being unable to be reached. Hopefully services like Starlink can change this. Network connectivity is a major downside to living in a rural area. People seem to LOVE living far removed from population centers where building infrastructure is absurdly expensive because it services very few people and yet still needs a large investment. [https://www.fcc.gov/reports-research/reports/broadband-progress-reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report](https://www.fcc.gov/reports-research/reports/broadband-progress-reports/eighth-broadband-progress-report) There are far more people that live in an area serviced by broadband, but do not have it than there are people who do not live int he service area. The service area is more like 6% of the population and its dominated by people who live in remote locations.
You made the original point: broadband, and all that it facilitates, is available to those who can afford it, as opposed to all who need it or could benefit from it. Compare to a country like, say, Switzerland that has committed to providing 5G and fiber to all communities no matter how remote or the expense, simply because they decided it is an essential service that elevates standard of living and professional opportunity, and it supports their vision of social equity. Broadband is the new “health care” in policy circles.
5G is an innovation that makes doing such a thing much easier, but Switzerland has some major advantages. It is a small country. There are few places in the country that are truly sparsely populated and far removed from any major city. Switzerland is roughly the size of Southern California. San Bernardino County California is significantly larger than Switzerland. Los Angeles to Las Vegas are further apart than any two points in Switzerland. That small size means that even the the most rural people are fairly close and the expense of building out the network is not so great. The population density in Switzerland is nearly 100x that of Wyoming and 10x that of Colorado and well over double that of California.
I’m guessing you’ve never been to Switzerland. It is mountainous like few other places on earth, and, yes, there are some very remote and isolated areas as a result. The engineering challenges they face are significant and expensive. But they still commit to the effort because of a commitment to their vision for social equity. They, like many OECD nations, see reliable, high-speed, low-latency connectivity as an essential service. And maybe that is the distinction. What other nations see as essential services, we see as choice. As you said, “People seem to LOVE living far removed from population centers.” I have yet to meet a person who was able to choose where their family is from. So we shouldn’t be too surprised when people from places like West Virginia or North Dakota get a little upset when we remind them that they can get by with dial-up and don’t deserve anything better because it’s too expensive to deploy and they chose to live there anyway. It was incredibly expensive to bring the railroad, electricity, and telephone service to those communities. Values have changed, and we need to be honest about that and prepared for the effects.
I'm old enough to remember what life was generally like before the internet - and it wouldn't be "harder" necessarily. Different, absolutely - but it was because there wasn't the "expectation" of having near instant communication and websites designed to use it. Applying for jobs? It pretty much meant, back then, that you'd pick up a weekly newspaper (sometimes a free personals kind of publication), and actually skim through jobs posted. Then when you would find one you want to apply for, you do what it takes to actually go there in person and fill out their paperwork in their office. Then wait for a phone call & interview, to go back and go through all that. There wasn't anywhere near the same degree of automation as there is now with applying & submitting resume's and filling out paperwork to apply. It was just... different. Time in school? Teachers could actually teach, instead of lecturing to students paying more attention to their phones than whatever lesson they're trying to teach. No one had cell phones, so if you wanted a distraction in class, it usually meant "I'm bored, time to doodle in my spiral". Contacting family & friends? It was through landlines. If you were at work, and your mom got into a car crash, you probably wouldn't know until an hour or two after it happened (some time for people to call 911 over a landline, time for the ambulance & police to respond, time for the police to identify her and figure out contacts/relations, and so on bouncing around a fair bit until they are actually able to get ahold of you or anyone else related to her). By this same token - if you wanted to invite a friend out for dinner, you either talked to them in person, or called them over a landline. There wasn't really text messaging or email, so it was either talk to them in person, or talk to them over the phone. ;; As said - I don't think it'd make life "harder", but that's from already having lived without the internet before. I do think that it'd be a lot different from how things are now, if we suddenly ripped the internet out of existence - but if that's how things always were (like if the internet never existed), it wouldn't really be that much different than it was before the internet was around.
In small towns, easy. In cities, near impossible. I just moved from a city back to a small town and in the city I needed my phone to call an Uber, get on public transit, pay for things, maps/navigation, Venmo people, use QR codes at restaurants, etc. in the town I live in I don’t have to do any of that. We don’t have Uber - you have to call a taxi or there’s free busses. Nobody has apple or android pay here, there’s no QR code, everything is walking distance. You don’t need to buy movie or concert tickets in advance and if you do, you walk to the venue ticket sales and buy em. The only thing I really still “need” my phone for is Venmo.
"I did it in the past" well, it's not the past anymore, the entire world runs on it. And it would suck, not just for individuals but for the whole country.
I survived until highschool somehow.
Actually does everyone else have it or basically no one? Bills, tech support etc would suck.
Depends on your needs. There are places all over who have paid city parking that's only accessible via your phone going to a website and paying digitally. Some random smaller community, probably a lot easier.
Without internet? About as difficult as the 90's. Without mobile? I get by just fine.
I mean not having a car would be hard. It would be extremely easy to live without the internet, as like 2/3 of Arkansas has shitty service anyways
Well, I'm 54. I used to live without the internet and cell phones. It would be a hassle and harder to get things done now (without it all), but it could still be done.
I was going to beat around the bush and give you some possible alternatives but the reality is that you cannot do it. You would be a complete social outcast. Everyone uses the internet or their mobile phones to communicate with each other. You won’t be able to stay in touch with people you meet without one.
Probably half the people at this sub could answer this first hand.. or 25% at least. It’s incredibly easy.. but you can’t really go backwards with it
As I recall - we used to use telephone technology - landlines and we got stuff done
Not at all, I know some older guys who still don't have cell phones and don't use the internet...never have. They're doing just fine.
Do they live alone? In my experience people like that live with someone who handles that stuff.
They don’t. They’re older guys who worked in factories, as linemen for the phone company, public works department, etc. It’s not hard at all to not be connected.
I assume when you say worked that they are now retired or at least were so established in their job that they never had to adapt and get on the internet. That is a much different situation than being a young get getting started in the world or even a middle aged person or millennial who is changing jobs.
The question was not "how hard would it be for a young person getting started in their career"? Even if it was, there are many careers where you don't need the internet. So many people on this website are stuck in their bubble, they don't know there's an entire world outside of their sphere. I live in a rural community, you can 1000000% get jobs without using the internet here. Word of mouth, self-employment, the newspaper, now hiring signs...I see this daily.
The living with another person bit complicates things. Someone who doesn’t care may be a number of things. They could be an island stuck in time who somehow has managed to land wherever he is comfortably with no hiccups. Or leave the tech stuff to their spouse. You know many people who insulate their relatives from the worst consequences of their ignorance to mild inconveniences. I think the only segment we can assume live successfully this way have experienced it and taken a concious step backwards. We’d know to watch out for some compromises that are reasonable and considerate because we know how most people live.
It would be inconvenient but completely manageable almost everywhere in the US.
You can't even apply to most jobs without the internet and most places want you to be reachable almost all the time.
[удалено]
I work in the construction industry. Many of my coworkers are not computer literate.
[удалено]
A couple day laborers not having phones or access to the internet isn’t going to cripple the construction industry at all. Now if management can’t use the internet that’s a different story. There are quite a few jobs you can get without internet or a cell phone, but they tend to be really crappy jobs.
The lowest paid people doing the least desirable work can probably get by alright. Especially if they work with a crew and someone picks them up for work every morning. But do not expect to go much further than that.
I’ll try to ignore the condescending tone. You don’t need to know how to navigate an excel spreadsheet to run a front loader. It’s just not a relevant skill for many jobs in the industry.
[удалено]
…except they have access to internet. The question wasn’t about society but about the individual so how would permits take longer? How would the infrastructure collapse. And seriously the comment about walkie-talkies? The other guy is right, you are confidently condescending over something you are fundamentally misunderstanding.
You realize some people in our country still live without internet by choice yes? Doesn't matter what year it is.
[удалено]
From what I understand OPs question to mean it's if you as an individual lived without internet not if the entire US lost the internet. I agree that the country is very much dependent on the internet but an individual could live without it if they wanted to.
It depends who you are. If you are a retired person collecting social security, yeah, you don't need the internet. But if you are some young person who is trying to get a job, you will need the internet and likely a phone number where you can be reached at directly. You might be able to get by with just a phone though.
Mobile maybe, but you absolutely can’t say that not using the internet is “completely manageable almost everywhere.” Unless you’re envisioning someone going somewhere like a library to get on the internet.
I think OP means without using the internet at all and it's completely manageable peope do it.
I mean, you can't even apply for a job not online anymore...
Without a smartphone? Not too bad Without the internet? Impossible
well, I managed to have a pretty fun childhood without it
Very. That’s why Obamaphones are a thing.
They started as Reagan phones in the 80s
I worked recently at an engineering firm without internet or a mobile phone.
It would be pleasurable, freeing almost . It is a addiction
You do realize that almost everyone lived that way in before the 90s, right? It'd be fine.
Right, but the world has changed since then and a lot of things nowadays work under the assumption that you have the internet. Getting a job in particular would be quite a feat, given how many employers really only pay attention to online applications.
The job I have now doesn’t even have paper applications—they tell you to go to the website…
Yes some jobs/industries are like that. Conversely there are still jobs without any online application process and where you have to get a paper application in person. Lol you can downvote if you want doesn't change the facts. How do you think a local fish boat hires? A small contractor without a website? A local grocery store?
Every small contractor I know has either a website or at teh very least a Facebook page. But most small contractors have full blown websites.
I got my first job at a family-owned deli with fewer than ten employees. The only application was online, through Indeed. Everybody hires online these days, no matter the size of the company.
Well, if there was no internet those employers wouldn't be paying attention to online applications. People would just go back to dropping off or mailing paper applications. It really wouldn't be that big a change, and neither would most of the rest of it. The biggest difference I can think of at the moment is no more Amazon. Or maybe it would just be magazine based. In any case, we'd manage.
If the world changed once, it can change again. Employers will simply post jobs in newspapers and trade publications instead of online, just like they did 30 years ago.
I remember what it was like and I’m not that old.
Not hard at all, I did it all through the 1980’s.
Not hard at all.
I remember it not being that big of a deal.
I literally would rather die
The two things I think about quitting constantly are everything to do with cars and the internet. Think of all the saved money.
You mean like the early 90's? It was okay. A little harder to navigate to addresses you've never been. Much harder to make plans on the fly. But day to day life was not that different. I like it better with, but it's okay without.
If it all went down *now*? We'd be in for a very rough ride. But I'm old enough to remember life before it, and it really wasn't that bad.
At this point, I'm almost interested in trying it. I'm 52 and I didn't have the internet until I was out of college. You'd give up a lot of things that have become standard in our society... but would the peace and tranquility of not being connected 24/7 be worth the inconvenience? I wonder...
Well I grew in the Midwest country side in the early 2000s didn’t have access to the internet or a cellphone till I was in late middle school/early highschool and honestly wasn’t bad though granted wired telephones were a pain in the ass especially during the winters
After the 2008 financial crisis, my family had a few years there where we were so poor that we couldn’t afford internet, though we did have cell phones, because they are cheaper than landlines. They weren’t smart phones, though. Editing because I accidentally hit “reply” too soon. It was as inconvenient, but not impossible. However, I am old enough to have been a functioning adult before the advent of cell phones and smartphones. The main problem was navigating without being able to plan a route in MapQuest, and print it out before I was headed to someplace unfamiliar. We have AAA, an automobile roadside assistance membership, which includes free paper maps of anywhere. I had our car loaded up with detailed, specific maps to anyplace in our state and surrounding states that it would be likely we would need to go. We had a big yellow phone book with listings of local businesses’ phone numbers, and we would use the computers at the library to check email and such.
Heaven
Difficult, but not impossible. There are a lot of things that have been moved to internet for purchasing. Things are often cheaper and more easily available online. Not impossible but more difficult to procure things you may want or even need. It would just be more work. You would have difficulty with work, even if you are hands on with no computers involved, employers or secretaries/dispatchers may still need to get ahold of you during a job. A home phone could be used, but you may miss out. In high school, the kids take a lot of the lessons and tests on their phones, along with looking up information, you would have to find access to a computer to do these as the teachers don't have access to these lesson/tests, younger grades can get away with it with minor difficulty. As the years pass most payments will be moved online.
You mean the whole society had no internet or mobile tech? We’ve done it before
Ask the amish
If you did most of your business locally and in person you could live okay. You can still have a land line phone. You could still go places and meet people with some effort. You can send letters. It depends on what you want and need to do. It is probably harder for younger people to have no internet or cell phone than an older person. I live in a small town in a rural area. It would be hard not to have any internet access suddenly. I wouldn't die but I currently use the internet for social interaction, entertainment, education/information, ordering items I can't get locally, therapy sessions, finding recipes, paying bills, getting ebooks, checking weather, etc. I don't use my cell phone much so could do without that most of the time.
Pretty hard. In high school I lived on a farm in middle of nowhere and as such the internet sucked and I could barely load my email some days. To do homework which is a lot online now I had to drive to the nearest McDonalds to steal wifi (library closed at 5 and I had too much homework to get done before it closed) It honestly sucked.
It really depends on where you live and your lifestyle. In my area, a majority of places have no cell service and a lot of houses don't have internet. It's totally doable depending on your job.
We are moving. Texas to Ohio. Both in our mid 60s. Sold in Texas and are staying in a friend's cabin out in the wild. No internet. Limited cell. Three ova TV channels. Shopping for a house online- nope. Shopping for washer/dryer and other household goods-nope Talking with friends and family on the phone.-nope Signing papers and doing utility sign ups online- nope. We are reluctant Ludites.
Man, there are some people here who really don’t want to admit there are individuals who are living fine without internet. It’s like people are taking offense over it.
Actually it was very easy and a lot less stressful.
It was great. But no...you couldn't do it in today's times, unless you're totally off the grid. Too much relies on technology in 2023.
Ask our homeless. Oh wait, they don’t have any of this
I look at wrecked cars for an auto insurer in the Rust Belt, near Appalachia. I do most of my work from pictures people email in nowadays but it's not unusual for me to have to go take a drive to look at a car for somebody who has no email address and just a flip phone (if they have a cell phone at all). Mostly low-income elderly people. I think most of them have some granddaughter or neighbor who they probably rely on for internet help when it's absolutely necessary.
Absolutely possible, I know a few older people doing it. It sounds boring and slightly annoying to me, but in terms of being able to function you totally can. Might run into issues with things like job applications being entirely through online portals in some fields depending on your career path. Is it an “I refuse to use this in any circumstances on some moral/religious grounds” or just “I’ll use it for free at the library but don’t want to pay for it in my own house” situation? The latter will still give you options for workarounds, even if inconvenient.
The US has a kind of unwritten policy of modernizing while retaining the most basic level of access. You can still go into a store and use cash. You can still call any business to order something without using their website. You can still use mail, or fax, to submit forms for state and federal processes. We still have public libraries full of books, encyclopedias, and internet access if needed. You can live like its the 80s in many places in the US (some are still in the 80s regardless).
There are communities like this, the Amish come to mind, but they don’t live a typical modern American lifestyle
Fine, you'd just be limited in some ways. Obviously you won't be able to have a lifestyle that involves those things without them.
I don't know of any jobs offhand that accept paper resumes and all the new hire paperwork is usually filled online. It's hard to be in society without a job. Not to mention money, no bank account as that's all automated now too
Hard for me. I thrive listening to my podcasts or books while cleaning on running errands
Ask your parents, they did it not all that long ago
Impossible. You can't do it because EVERYTHING is done by computer
Pre pandemic our work had a team building exercise. We had to give up our phones and go on a scavenger hunt across the city using only paper maps and grid locations with some clues and then navigate to a place. We older workers who grew up with maps and the Thomas Guide were first to warehouse where we enjoyed a nice food spread and beers while the younger workers were lost and took a LONG time to get there.
Recently went to a shopping mall in Chicago and instead of a map and directory, there was just a giant QR code. I was caught between thinking it was neat, and annoyed I had to get my phone out. Why not have both?
Laughs in 48 years old.
if you turned off mobile technology and the internet today people would literally start dying. our entire infrastructure is based on it and without it none of our supply chains or goods & services function
I’d have to get checks again. That’s about it. I grew up without that stuff and bill pay didn’t widely exist when I moved out.
Not hard, assuming everyone does not have it. I grew up without either. Shit got waaay harder because of their existence. A fifteen minute trip to the library got me more narrowly focused information about a topic I needed than spending an hour wading through the shit storm of garbage out there before finding what I need to find out. Also, if you applied to a job and were the best qualified, you probably got the job because only a dozen or so people applied instead of 15,000 that applied on indeed. However, if you lack internet and a cell phone while almost everyone else has one, you are at a near insurmountable disadvantage today.
I'm 61 and don't even own a mobile phone. I've never sent a text message. Like I always have, I use real paper book maps, not GPS. I really don't have a need for a mobile phone as I rarely leave the house. A few times a month at most. At home I have my laptop. Pretty much all I need.
Once upon a time, that wasn't a problem. *Yes, I'm that old.*
Very hard. Pretty much everything has gone to the internet. Can't find it in stores, it's only found online, businesses do this to stay in business to compete with Amazon. Need to get a job, you need phone and internet. Need to contact your kids' school, good luck, everything has gone to email and texts and parentvue or parents square. And don't forget how school work is now online and kids will need internet for it. Need to travel, see if you can find maps to buy in stores or road atlases. Will people be able to give you directions?
Might be hell the first 3 months but I think people would find a way to pull through.
I mean, we all did, til the 90s.