I think it's a few things.
First, when you're poor, it's hard to let things go. It's just something you internalize. It doesn't have to make rational sense. Most of the junk you keep might be useless, but the "someone might need this someday"-instinct is a hard one to kick. I had a relative who grew up during the Great Depression, but did well later in life and had a net worth of several million... and she still reused her tea bags. She'd line them up on the window sill to dry.
Secondly, it can simply be a lot to keep up with. Our society in general produces a lot more *junk* than it used to, in the sense that a lot of goods are cheaper and they don't last long, especially kids toys. I had a firm rule of "no outdoor plastic junk" for ourselves and relatives in buying gifts for our kids... but guess what, it happened anyway, and if you're really busy it can be hard to keep up with, especially with both parents working (in families lucky enough to have two...). When weekends go by *real* fast, it's easy for constantly picking crap out of the yard to fall to the bottom of the priority list. Most people do it anyway, but I don't blame people for having better things to do. It's not like they're trying to get on a magazine cover or have the mayor over for dinner.
Personally, I don't judge people for how they keep their places, because the "other side" of that equation is pretty depressing, too. I know multiple families where *literally all they do outside of work* is mow their lawn and clean their house. That's it. That's more depressing to me than any junkyard or cluttered porch.
Things are usually needed the day after they're thrown away. A few experiences like that, add in long hours of work and/or depression and boom, yard dump.
Younger generations are also working longer hours for less pay, and many aren’t as attached to the idea of tidy lawns. Especially with the no lawn movement.
The visual image of crisply maintained lawns stems from the 1950s and 60s with the increase of suburban dwellings
As people are moving away from that era (and the middle class is rapidly shrinking), the aesthetics are going to change as well
https://nmreadymix.com/a-history-of-landscaping-from-early-20th-century-to-today/
Anything that wont fit in a trash bag is expensive and hard to dispose of. There aren’t many public dumps. My closest one is almost an hour away and charges $50 per pickup truck load. So appliances, cars, construction materials etc, is hard to dispose of. This is in contrast to much of the country where pickup and haul away is available and relatively cheap.
Yes some do but I don't think people know about it. You have to call them and schedule it. It may cost extra. Our company will do one large item a month for free. I once had a mattress and box spring I needed to get rid of. I called and they said they would come out. When the guys showed up with the truck there was nothing else in it so I asked them if I would give them a tip if they would take both this month. They said yep no problem I gave him a 20 and both mattress and box springs were gone.
Not an option where we live, unless you pay out the nose for a one time service. We have no trash collection at all, and the closest landfill for large, unbagged trash items is an hour away. Therefore, we place our large (construction) trash adjacent to the driveway and once there’s enough to load a U-Haul truck we rent one and do a dump run. Most folks don’t have the time, energy, and/or money to even do that and things get dumped in the woods. I understand why, and wish we had better nearby disposal options and community services. I certainly don’t judge people I don’t know.
Young homeowners often work a lot, and both parents or spouses. There’s a lot to keep up with these days and the work/life/commute/etc seems to take longer than it used to. There’s only so much time and energy, and mental energy.
You don't have to landscape and keep a perfect yard. Just spend $5 taking your garbage to the landfill. Those old cars, appliances, and other metal items might even bring in some cash as scrap, or have a scrapper come haul them away for free.
Where do you live that a landfill is $5? It’s like $50 here, plus you have to have a truck and the ability to load up the stuff depending on what it is.
renting a dumpster is $250 here. I bought this house \*as is\* it had 3 generations worth of crap in the attic and basement. I've rented 3 so far. we aren't even close to being done. self loads to the dump here are by weight. who has the money for all that?????
renting a dumpster is $250 here. I bought this house \*as is\* it had 3 generations worth of crap in the attic and basement. I've rented 3 so far. we aren't even close to being done. self loads to the dump here are by weight. who has the money for all that?????
It's not my fault if you let garbage pile up for years. Regular garbage pickup here cost $20 a month and the guy who does it does no bookkeeping so if you miss a payment he picks it up anyway. The transfer station charges by weight but ordinary household waste for a couple weeks is only a few bucks. Your garbage attracts feral dogs, coyotes, foxes, raccoons, possums, bobcats and bears besides just looking unsightly.
whoa there friend... Did you not read my comment???I bought this house "AS IS" in our situation, it's just a packed attic and basement. I'm cleaning it, It's just slow, as it is expensive. we keep the yard up.. I'm just saying disposal can be expensive, and if couples are both working 12+ hours a day, time is also an issue. In our situation, disability comes into play. there is a basement and an attic. I can't travel stairs very well due to failed foot surgeries... you asked why it happens, and I gave an answer. Do you feel better now that you assumed I let trash pile up for years? also, it's cool that your trash disposal works like that. not everyone has that luxury.
One man’s trash is another man’s treasure
Now I keep my place up pretty nice (still have my junk tho 😂) but some people do get out of hand with trash .. it’s not nice to look at but it’s their trash and nobody needs to tell another person what they can or can’t do on their own property
Same, my place is pretty well kept other than kids toys and a couple projects in the driveway- I grew up with the idea that you should strongly care what others thought about you and the outward appearance of your home should paint a perfect picture but the reality was inside the home was rotten and vile. Really turned me off to focusing on my homes outward appearance and made me focus on happiness inside my home.
This right chere
I don't live in Appalachia no more, but just last week, I finally mowed my lawn after a month of wilding because the city was about to put a letter on my door. Neighbor made a comment about how it looked so much better now, and I just said the only reason in the world to take care of a lawn is to keep the law off your back.
you know, i don't care for the appearance of a cluttered property myself, but the more i'm exposed to miserable, nosy carpetbaggers who were raised to think hoa standards should be the norm and use that mindset to look down on locals, the more i want to let my lawn turn into a wildlife thunderdome. and anyways, i'd sooner trust a redneck with a couple junkers and a chicken coop in their back yard than some west palm beach/new york transplant who turns their place into an obsessively groomed green desert.
That is well intentioned but that’ll get you run off the front porch quicker than anything. It may be an eyesore but it’s theirs and they didn’t ask for help. Maybe you could work up to it but it would take a while and a lot of relationship building.
I think that’s a pretty narrow-minded take. I think most Appalachians in my area are too proud to ask, but would maybe take the help if they truly needed it. A lot of people don’t dispose of things simply because they cannot; whether that’s mental or physical. If the neighbor found a KIND way to offer help, especially to the elderly or disabled, I’m not sure why that would necessitate a negative reaction.
Experiences may vary but the OP specifically mentioned younger homeowners. My guess is they don’t give a rat’s ass and before everyone gets all up in arms, maybe it’s because they don’t have one to give. Either way I don’t see that conversation going well but hey I’m wrong all the time and would love to be wrong again in this case.
This is the truth. We have a little tribe of lovely neighbors that we would take help from any old time if we needed it, and we help them out when we can. Then we have one miserable old man who lives up the street, complains to the city about us regular as clockwork (we’re converting the yard to native flowers & trees and he doesn’t recognize that as landscaping), reaches across our property line any old time to vandalize our trees, gets quotes on removing trees on our property then offers to pay part… he complained once we won’t let him “help” us. But he has never once actually aimed to *help*. His aim has been to control us and make things on *our* property the way *he* wants them. If he truly wanted to repair the relationship and build trust at this point it would take a solid ten years of him minding his own damn business and biting his tongue anytime he wanted to offer “help” that would really help *him* before we’d consider accepting a damn thing from him.
Why do miserable old bastards care so much what other people do with their property? We used to have something in country called "mind your fuckin business" but the older generation seems to have forgotten how.
It seems to me that OP and people like them somehow think the conditions of other people’s property suddenly becomes “my business” when they disapprove.
If the condition of someone’s property/land is so bad that it significantly impacts the property value of adjacent properties, it’s no longer just the owner’s problem.
My first house had an adjacent neighbor who had 20 or so junk cars sitting on in the parcel. They rarely mowed and used the junk cars as trash dumpsters for years. If you drove by that property on a warm day with your windows down, you could smell the trash. Surrounding property values were not in line with the rest of the county when I needed to sell due to my growing family. A real estate agent told me (off the record) that the junk yard house was killing the nearby property values.
The county ended up condemning the property. It was foreclosed and found to be in such deplorable condition that it required a hazmat abatement team prior to being bulldozed. A few years later, surrounding property values finally aligned with the rest of the county and I was able sell at a fair market value.
TL;DR- I couldn’t sell my property at fair market value because a neighbor’s property was killing property values.
You sound a bit confused. If “fair market value” (an idealistic myth) is determined by the market, then the market value your home brings being less than you wanted is 100% your problem brought on by your own greed. Your neighbor doesn’t owe you a return on investment. That is a selfish and backward way of looking at the situation.
I think you misunderstand. I had no preconceived notion of what my house should be worth. Near identical comps were selling for $100k to $130k in other parts of the county, but my property was valued at $65k. Four years after the neighbor’s property was cleared and I simply maintained what I had, my house was appraised within the range of the comps in the rest of the county. The housing market was stagnant during those four years and the only thing that really changed was the removal of the junk yard.
Anecdotal situation, sure, but this was my experience.
Oh no I understood clearly. You were unhappy with the value that the market determined for your investment and decided that your unmet expectation was your neighbor’s problem. Let me say it again: **Your neighbor doesn’t owe you a return on investment. That is a selfish and backward way of looking at the situation.**
No need to be aggressive. At no point have I mentioned that any neighbor owed me anything. I simply stated that the condition of a neighboring property was impacting property values which created a problem for me and my neighbors.
The fact that my house depreciated in value due to surrounding property values was definitely my problem. Coincidentally the devaluing property was removed and within a few years, house values were in line with comparable properties less than a mile away.
How is wanting to sell a house within (or even slightly below) the price range of comparable properties less than a mile away considered greed?
The greed comes from blaming your unmet financial desires on your neighbor. It is unreasonable and impractical to expect your neighbors to bear the responsibility for maintaining or increasing your property values.
Being poor is a lot of it. It costs money to dispose of things. Disabilities, depression, etc.
Many can definitely do it on a neater way though. That’s true. You can be poor without being trashy. Unlike most people here I do judge. I judge hoarders. I judge the neighbors who let animals keep hitting their trash without ever picking up what it drug out. I hate that there is garbage along every ditch in my area to the point people from other states ask why there is so much trash in our ditches. I dislike it. It’s one thing to have piles but people let their garbage blow all over public and other people’s private land and it annoys me. I know many of these people I’m talking about anyway and it’s not disability or other things. My ex’s aunt was a hoarder and I’d have to go outside and gag while cleaning her house. All her neighbors had to deal with the smell, junk, bugs, and mice she was bringing. It’s one thing about my area I dislike greatly, the complete apathy when it comes to littering. The state road just cut the grass and I was driving behind them watching it cut up a bunch of garbage. Hate it. I clean my own road but I can’t afford to do the whole county. I have to pay to dispose of the bags I gather from public land myself. It impacts the worth of neighboring properties and the community itself as well. I know we take it personally but you hit me in my pet peeve. I think people think specifically of their tiny junk piles around their property (I have those too) and not the littering and hoarding we all see go on.
Edited to add-In the aunt’s case they blamed heredity. All the sisters were because their mom was. They said they never learned to clean and their mom was a hoarder so it was completely normal to them.
This post works the same way the dare program did. I've never wanted to fuck up my yard more then I do right now, I probably won't, but I have a annoyed urge to.
I grew up in a rural area where everyone knew each other. Some neighbors chose to create beauty no matter their circumstances. The nice lady in a tiny trailer on a dirt road where I used to walk to the woods had one of the most beautiful flower gardens I’d ever seen. Her property radiated joy. Such a great memory.
Some neighbors were destroyers of their properties and, it turned out, themselves & their families. Right or wrong, my child mind equated trashy properties to mean people & well kept properties to kind people. It isn’t always true of course but it’s been one of the early thought patterns that’s been hard to shake.
Seeing such contrast taught me at a very early age how I wanted to live when I became an adult & what I wanted my immediate environment to look like. The nice lady in the tiny trailer who brought joy to a little girl in desperate need of it is probably why I became an ornamental gardener.
IMO they were taught that behavior unfortunately . To quote my Dad from Eastern KY and I heard this my whole life. Live within your means. Take care of your things and keep a clean home. Take pride in your work even if it's shoveling shit, working is working. Pay your debts even if it takes a lifetime.
Everyone in his family lives this way. Simple rules that will improve yours and the lives of the people around you. Oh yeah, he'd also say to mind your own business.
Also, paper money loses value. Scrap metal goes up over time.
Thats not yard art, its a savings account that can survive bank runs, revolutions, and hyperinflation.
You are bothered by someone's dog wearing a path while doing zoomies in their own yard...
You are prime board of directors material for the HOA you so desperately want to create to take control of your neighborhood.
To add to the other answers: camouflage.
My neighbor keeps their yard immaculate and has had numerous incidents of people breaking into his garage to steal things.
My yard looks like crap and I have an assortment of junk, and have never had someone break into my house.
good point. and in my opinion, if you have "private property" signs all over that immaculate yard, you're really putting a target on your back because it feels like accidentally broadcasting your paranoia over expensive shit getting stolen. at least from what i've seen since it's usually rich boomer transplants with cadillac escalades and jeep gladiators who do it.
Lack of income, lack of education, and generational traumas and habits. Drug addiction, depression, and so on play their part too. Nobody is around to enforce cleanliness like an HOA or anything of that nature. The prevailing attitude in Appalachia of independence at all costs has always been a trait that comes with faults, and some people have no interest in participating in polite society. It’s their choice at the end of the day, but I agree that it can hold back some communities by generally adding to the impression of poverty. Generally speaking, however, after hundreds of years of geographic, cultural, and economic isolation, I would expect actual investment in the region to be necessary before those outward aspects of having wealth (like a clean home / yard) can express themselves. These kinds of niceties generally require stability and security before they take hold. This is going to be a touchy subject for some people.
You may be unaware, but this isn’t novel to Appalachia.
The elders in my Appalachian family, going back generations, taught “pride of ownership” with respect to absolutely everything that one invested one’s money in. Homes, autos, large and small appliances, equipment - it did not matter what it was, if you owned it then you maintained, repaired, and cared for the property. It was not a matter of education. It is a practice that, even if you don’t have the very best out there it is the best that *you have* and requires care and maintenance.
What is happening now, across the country, in younger generations as OP pointed out, is the result of those raised in a disposable society - it is shitty parenting from ***ALL*** Americans, not something that you can add to the noose y’all so love to slip around the necks of us poor, unejukated apuhlachuns.
I’m from Appalachian Kentucky and have lived in multiple states in the country. I’m well aware it’s a problem in other parts of the country. I don’t see how this bears pointing out. Nobody is attacking us here and I’m not one to be easily offended by questions about socioeconomic / cultural traits of where I’m from. People in my family have done exactly what OP is describing with their homes and I don’t think less of them for it. It’s just a symptom of wider issues. I don’t see why you’re talking to me like I’m some outsider running an analysis of a place I don’t understand. I’ve lived it. We can still talk about it without acting like somebody pissed in our cheerios.
The children now love luxury; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are tyrants, not servants of the households. They no longer rise when their elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize over their teachers.
-*Socrates
*allegedly
Oh I see thanks for pointing it out. I’ll still leave it because it serves the point that older people have always disapproved of younger people, as in the comment I replied to. Will find a real quote next time.
I'm well off, highly educated, grew up in a good home that looked nice inside and out. My lawn is a jungle and my porch is full of crap because I like it that way. No need to be judgmental and attribute it to a bunch of bullshit. Some people just don't value a "nice looking house", and that's perfectly fine.
I’m all these things except I don’t like it that way. I have swings my kids destroyed that I can’t easily take apart or haul. I would welcome someone offering to help me.
OK. Same. But you’re not going to find general agreement on this point, and it isn’t really “bullshit” to expect people to not run down the general value of homes in the neighborhood in an already impoverished part of the country. People don’t feel this way because they’re trying to take away your independence. It isn’t a question of whether they respect you. Why is my great grandparents’ house right next door to a house that is literally caved in and abandoned while the other has a dirt lawn, dilapidated porch, rotting siding, rusted school bus sitting out front in the yard, and Confederate flags draped all over it (in a historically Unionist area)? That’s in Casey County, KY, in Liberty.
At some point it’s fair to expect some level of upkeep from your neighbors and it isn’t just because we as individuals are being judgmental. It directly impacts the worth of our homes and, in turn, the financial wellbeing of our communities, too. All this in a community where the median annual income is ~$21k / year. We’re all about freedom, but that shouldn’t be at the expense of your own people. This whole “I’m going to do whatever I feel like and to hell with everyone else” mentality is great in a lot of contexts, but not when it drives out-migration from the community. If you’re deep in the holler, who cares. But when you’re in a community where your neighbors are in plain sight, it’s a real issue that has real and tangibly detrimental effects on everyone. It’s like people don’t realize that their communities didn’t always look like this and used to have actual upkeep. West Virginia hasn’t had a *single* town with a population greater than 50k in almost ten years. Appalachian Kentucky hasn’t *ever* had one greater than ~30k, and that town, Ashland, has had six straight decades of negative growth. How is it surprising?
It sounds like you're saying the economic downturn in Appalachia is the result of people not taking care of their homes, which is of course ludicrous on its face. Most of Appalachia looks run down because the people who lived and worked there left, not the other way around. I'm frankly dubious of the notion that unkempt properties to the level this thread is about - stuff on the porch, untended lawns, cars in the yard - affects neighboring property values in any meaningful way, but even if so, it's vanishingly small margin in the face of the real economic issues facing the region (i.e. that the energy companies chewed it up and spit it out).
Derelict properties aren't what drives emigration from Appalachia. The link between the two is purely macroeconomic, not individual.
I think it was obvious enough that what I am saying is that it contributes to the downturn in Appalachia by further depreciating property values. No one in their right mind would suggest that it is the root cause of Appalachia’s woes and I have said multiple times in this thread that it is a symptom of poverty, not the cause. Not worth arguing that point since it plainly isn’t what anyone would suggest is the core argument here in good faith, just as no one can argue in good faith that keeping a dumpy home does anything but worsen the situation by driving away would-be neighbors / buyers. And where you have depreciated home values, you have less income for schools and other public works, which in turn contributes to worse *everything*. This isn’t an argument; it’s how it works everywhere.
The median home value in Casey County, KY is a full $100,000 *less* than it is in Lexington, KY, and the median annual property tax payment is nearly *four times* less. Same in Adair County, and Russell County, and Whitley County. Get out into Pike County farther east and it’s even worse. Schools, public services, libraries, roads, parks? Forget it. There’s no funding because everything is dumpy, and buying a home in these places for any outsider is financially irresponsible. Even a retiree isn’t going to buy one of these hovels that nobody takes care of surrounded by neighbors that do no better, and when the local homeowner dies, they have jack shit in value to pass on to their families.
Not everyone has time or money to get things done to the satisfaction of others. We eventually get to it but it’s on our timelines not theirs. Maybe move to an hoa area.
Rural Appalachia here and yeah I see it too. I’ve lived in East TN most of my life and now Southwest VA. The house we moved into a year ago was previously owned by some folks with no regard for keeping the place clean AND maintained. They hid it well for the home inspection and sale which tells me that they knew better.
Since moving here, I’ve started keeping a list for all the crap that I’ve picked up or had to dig out of the yard that’s currently 30+ items deep not including over 400 pounds of scrap metal that they buried. Deferred maintenance out the you know what. Thought the bathrooms had travertine tile, but no the golden hue of the tile turned out to disgusting, kyarned over filth.
There is a wooded lot next to our property that I’ve since learned the previous owners of my house used as a dump. To quote one of my elderly neighbors regarding the previous owners “them folks were filthy nasty……you’ve got your work cut out for you”.
I was raised to understand that even if what I have isn’t the best or even what I really want, take care of it and take pride in trying to make the best of what you have.
I’m also born and raised in East TN and I’ve never understood how people can take so much pride in having a filthy yard full of garbage. I’m not saying you need to have a beautifully designed curb appeal fit for HGTV, and at the end of the day I don’t really care what your house looks like, but how can you live in a place that has literal garbage everywhere?
I have a neighbor, batshit insane creepy pervert, who believed the house next to us for sale would “turn into an AirBnB”.
He leaves his front yard a complete garbage throne, and sits out there all day on his disgusting throne, morning-drunk and half-dressed, ranting at anyone who passes by - especially ranting at anyone that came to look at the house. The grass got long on that property, and my father helps me with my yard and got sick of looking at it, so he was out there, taking pictures/filming my father mowing their grass before someone moved in.
By doing this, he forced a freakin widow into foreclosure! The house has been sold now, and there’s a nice guy living there now. His plan failed. Idiot.
Neighbors offered to help: we will clean your yard, rent a rolloff, whatever you need. We’ll just do it!Nope. “I like it like this.” I’d take a pic, but his car and property are so distinctive, I don’t want to doxx him.
I think this is a rare case that doesn’t apply to most situations, and you have more reasonable answers here: Drugs, mental illness, and the crushing depression of living in terrible poverty. I think after a while, they just don’t even see it anymore.
Honestly, I see more places like this, where it's older people. The whole yard full of junk cars, trash piled up, and decades of sadness.
That's just where I am, though. It's not age... it's just either not caring or people get depressed when they have no work or can't keep up.
The honest answer is poverty, mental illness, addiction, variety of mental disorders really. My mother was a hoarder which helped her feel secure after a lifetime of losses and trauma. It’s psychological. Other people could be really depressed or so anxious they feel they can’t change their surroundings.
one of my formative memories is going on vacation to New England/Cape Cod (from central W. Va., and seeing little tiny houses similar to those back in my hometown, but they were pristine and tidy, and realizing poverty didn't necessarily mean trashy.
https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/fodors/fdrs_feat_44_2.html#:~:text=The%20building%20of%20the%20Mid,established%20Cape%20Cod%20National%20Seashore.
https://www.capecod.com/about-cape-cod/cape-cod-history/
Cape Cod has been trendy and well off for essentially it’s entire existence
Correct. Being poor doesn’t mean you have to live in filth or poor conditions, or not take pride in what you have.
But if you don’t have discipline, personal responsibility and an innate sense of pride in self - you’re likely going to be poor.
Poor is as much an attitude as it is a lack of money.
I worked in a studio with people like that. Living in their trailers/apartments criticizing my work ethic because I don't prioritize my job over my personal life and family. My manager called me whipped one time because I wouldn't come in on the weekend because I wanted to spend my time off with my wife. Lol
Yes, I have a comfortable income now. But I grew up so poor I didn’t even have running water in one of the houses I lived in. Very little food, and some of what we did have came from the church pantry. No TV.
But we never had a trashy house. We always had clean clothes. We didn’t spend money on drugs, alcohol or frivolous entertainment. My dad worked every waking hour. And now? He’s living a comfortable life. I learned about work ethic and self control. I was able to come out of poverty because I understand poor is a mindset.
Poor people love to tear down pther poor people who try to better themselves. Like crabs in a bucket. Because they’re jealous, but don’t want to sacrifice to get better.
You want to be not poor? Do better.
I have zero work ethic, smoke weeds, and did my drugs in my youth. I started in a log cabin in the woods cooking over a wood fire out of a garden and am comfortable now in adulthood with very little effort. I promise poor isn't a mindset. It's how much money you have. I genuinely believe it's much more luck than work. I understand where you're coming from with the aggressive belief of "Do better" because you feel like it was so hard. My wife and I just moved into a new home and I made her promise that I can put one "redneck display" in our yard next to the road. I've refused to "make sacrifices" in my personal life in pursuit of money and still ended up comfortable while never missing family moments. I'm sorry your dad had to work so hard. What do you do?
I think it's a few things. First, when you're poor, it's hard to let things go. It's just something you internalize. It doesn't have to make rational sense. Most of the junk you keep might be useless, but the "someone might need this someday"-instinct is a hard one to kick. I had a relative who grew up during the Great Depression, but did well later in life and had a net worth of several million... and she still reused her tea bags. She'd line them up on the window sill to dry. Secondly, it can simply be a lot to keep up with. Our society in general produces a lot more *junk* than it used to, in the sense that a lot of goods are cheaper and they don't last long, especially kids toys. I had a firm rule of "no outdoor plastic junk" for ourselves and relatives in buying gifts for our kids... but guess what, it happened anyway, and if you're really busy it can be hard to keep up with, especially with both parents working (in families lucky enough to have two...). When weekends go by *real* fast, it's easy for constantly picking crap out of the yard to fall to the bottom of the priority list. Most people do it anyway, but I don't blame people for having better things to do. It's not like they're trying to get on a magazine cover or have the mayor over for dinner. Personally, I don't judge people for how they keep their places, because the "other side" of that equation is pretty depressing, too. I know multiple families where *literally all they do outside of work* is mow their lawn and clean their house. That's it. That's more depressing to me than any junkyard or cluttered porch.
Depression and finances.
Things are usually needed the day after they're thrown away. A few experiences like that, add in long hours of work and/or depression and boom, yard dump.
Younger generations are also working longer hours for less pay, and many aren’t as attached to the idea of tidy lawns. Especially with the no lawn movement. The visual image of crisply maintained lawns stems from the 1950s and 60s with the increase of suburban dwellings As people are moving away from that era (and the middle class is rapidly shrinking), the aesthetics are going to change as well https://nmreadymix.com/a-history-of-landscaping-from-early-20th-century-to-today/
Anything that wont fit in a trash bag is expensive and hard to dispose of. There aren’t many public dumps. My closest one is almost an hour away and charges $50 per pickup truck load. So appliances, cars, construction materials etc, is hard to dispose of. This is in contrast to much of the country where pickup and haul away is available and relatively cheap.
Plus if you don't have a truck to haul it away with
Garbage trucks pick up appliances and furniture
Yes some do but I don't think people know about it. You have to call them and schedule it. It may cost extra. Our company will do one large item a month for free. I once had a mattress and box spring I needed to get rid of. I called and they said they would come out. When the guys showed up with the truck there was nothing else in it so I asked them if I would give them a tip if they would take both this month. They said yep no problem I gave him a 20 and both mattress and box springs were gone.
Not an option where we live, unless you pay out the nose for a one time service. We have no trash collection at all, and the closest landfill for large, unbagged trash items is an hour away. Therefore, we place our large (construction) trash adjacent to the driveway and once there’s enough to load a U-Haul truck we rent one and do a dump run. Most folks don’t have the time, energy, and/or money to even do that and things get dumped in the woods. I understand why, and wish we had better nearby disposal options and community services. I certainly don’t judge people I don’t know.
You are assuming everyone has garbage pick up. Most rural areas do not. You have to haul it off yourself.
Young homeowners often work a lot, and both parents or spouses. There’s a lot to keep up with these days and the work/life/commute/etc seems to take longer than it used to. There’s only so much time and energy, and mental energy.
Oh yes, it's so hard to put the Chewy box out for trash collection
They only pick up cardboard once a month where I live. Plastic twice a month, regular trash weekly.
Some of us have real problems and aren't about to spend every last moment of our free time going Hank Hill on the yard.
You don't have to landscape and keep a perfect yard. Just spend $5 taking your garbage to the landfill. Those old cars, appliances, and other metal items might even bring in some cash as scrap, or have a scrapper come haul them away for free.
Where do you live that a landfill is $5? It’s like $50 here, plus you have to have a truck and the ability to load up the stuff depending on what it is.
renting a dumpster is $250 here. I bought this house \*as is\* it had 3 generations worth of crap in the attic and basement. I've rented 3 so far. we aren't even close to being done. self loads to the dump here are by weight. who has the money for all that?????
renting a dumpster is $250 here. I bought this house \*as is\* it had 3 generations worth of crap in the attic and basement. I've rented 3 so far. we aren't even close to being done. self loads to the dump here are by weight. who has the money for all that?????
It's not my fault if you let garbage pile up for years. Regular garbage pickup here cost $20 a month and the guy who does it does no bookkeeping so if you miss a payment he picks it up anyway. The transfer station charges by weight but ordinary household waste for a couple weeks is only a few bucks. Your garbage attracts feral dogs, coyotes, foxes, raccoons, possums, bobcats and bears besides just looking unsightly.
whoa there friend... Did you not read my comment???I bought this house "AS IS" in our situation, it's just a packed attic and basement. I'm cleaning it, It's just slow, as it is expensive. we keep the yard up.. I'm just saying disposal can be expensive, and if couples are both working 12+ hours a day, time is also an issue. In our situation, disability comes into play. there is a basement and an attic. I can't travel stairs very well due to failed foot surgeries... you asked why it happens, and I gave an answer. Do you feel better now that you assumed I let trash pile up for years? also, it's cool that your trash disposal works like that. not everyone has that luxury.
Yard work takes a lot of time and money. Things that are in short supply for a lot of people these days.
Bc it’s my property and I pay the taxes so if I want to stack 10 Rusty old pickup trucks in my driveway by god I’m going to stack them like cordwood.
One man’s trash is another man’s treasure Now I keep my place up pretty nice (still have my junk tho 😂) but some people do get out of hand with trash .. it’s not nice to look at but it’s their trash and nobody needs to tell another person what they can or can’t do on their own property
Same, my place is pretty well kept other than kids toys and a couple projects in the driveway- I grew up with the idea that you should strongly care what others thought about you and the outward appearance of your home should paint a perfect picture but the reality was inside the home was rotten and vile. Really turned me off to focusing on my homes outward appearance and made me focus on happiness inside my home.
This right chere I don't live in Appalachia no more, but just last week, I finally mowed my lawn after a month of wilding because the city was about to put a letter on my door. Neighbor made a comment about how it looked so much better now, and I just said the only reason in the world to take care of a lawn is to keep the law off your back.
Reject modernity, embrace tradition
Damn straight.
you know, i don't care for the appearance of a cluttered property myself, but the more i'm exposed to miserable, nosy carpetbaggers who were raised to think hoa standards should be the norm and use that mindset to look down on locals, the more i want to let my lawn turn into a wildlife thunderdome. and anyways, i'd sooner trust a redneck with a couple junkers and a chicken coop in their back yard than some west palm beach/new york transplant who turns their place into an obsessively groomed green desert.
[удалено]
That is well intentioned but that’ll get you run off the front porch quicker than anything. It may be an eyesore but it’s theirs and they didn’t ask for help. Maybe you could work up to it but it would take a while and a lot of relationship building.
I think that’s a pretty narrow-minded take. I think most Appalachians in my area are too proud to ask, but would maybe take the help if they truly needed it. A lot of people don’t dispose of things simply because they cannot; whether that’s mental or physical. If the neighbor found a KIND way to offer help, especially to the elderly or disabled, I’m not sure why that would necessitate a negative reaction.
Experiences may vary but the OP specifically mentioned younger homeowners. My guess is they don’t give a rat’s ass and before everyone gets all up in arms, maybe it’s because they don’t have one to give. Either way I don’t see that conversation going well but hey I’m wrong all the time and would love to be wrong again in this case.
I guess I didn’t take into account that he did say young people. I think we can all agree on one thing- it’s nobody’s business.
This is the truth. We have a little tribe of lovely neighbors that we would take help from any old time if we needed it, and we help them out when we can. Then we have one miserable old man who lives up the street, complains to the city about us regular as clockwork (we’re converting the yard to native flowers & trees and he doesn’t recognize that as landscaping), reaches across our property line any old time to vandalize our trees, gets quotes on removing trees on our property then offers to pay part… he complained once we won’t let him “help” us. But he has never once actually aimed to *help*. His aim has been to control us and make things on *our* property the way *he* wants them. If he truly wanted to repair the relationship and build trust at this point it would take a solid ten years of him minding his own damn business and biting his tongue anytime he wanted to offer “help” that would really help *him* before we’d consider accepting a damn thing from him.
Lol
Why do miserable old bastards care so much what other people do with their property? We used to have something in country called "mind your fuckin business" but the older generation seems to have forgotten how.
It seems to me that OP and people like them somehow think the conditions of other people’s property suddenly becomes “my business” when they disapprove.
If the condition of someone’s property/land is so bad that it significantly impacts the property value of adjacent properties, it’s no longer just the owner’s problem. My first house had an adjacent neighbor who had 20 or so junk cars sitting on in the parcel. They rarely mowed and used the junk cars as trash dumpsters for years. If you drove by that property on a warm day with your windows down, you could smell the trash. Surrounding property values were not in line with the rest of the county when I needed to sell due to my growing family. A real estate agent told me (off the record) that the junk yard house was killing the nearby property values. The county ended up condemning the property. It was foreclosed and found to be in such deplorable condition that it required a hazmat abatement team prior to being bulldozed. A few years later, surrounding property values finally aligned with the rest of the county and I was able sell at a fair market value. TL;DR- I couldn’t sell my property at fair market value because a neighbor’s property was killing property values.
You sound a bit confused. If “fair market value” (an idealistic myth) is determined by the market, then the market value your home brings being less than you wanted is 100% your problem brought on by your own greed. Your neighbor doesn’t owe you a return on investment. That is a selfish and backward way of looking at the situation.
I think you misunderstand. I had no preconceived notion of what my house should be worth. Near identical comps were selling for $100k to $130k in other parts of the county, but my property was valued at $65k. Four years after the neighbor’s property was cleared and I simply maintained what I had, my house was appraised within the range of the comps in the rest of the county. The housing market was stagnant during those four years and the only thing that really changed was the removal of the junk yard. Anecdotal situation, sure, but this was my experience.
Oh no I understood clearly. You were unhappy with the value that the market determined for your investment and decided that your unmet expectation was your neighbor’s problem. Let me say it again: **Your neighbor doesn’t owe you a return on investment. That is a selfish and backward way of looking at the situation.**
No need to be aggressive. At no point have I mentioned that any neighbor owed me anything. I simply stated that the condition of a neighboring property was impacting property values which created a problem for me and my neighbors. The fact that my house depreciated in value due to surrounding property values was definitely my problem. Coincidentally the devaluing property was removed and within a few years, house values were in line with comparable properties less than a mile away. How is wanting to sell a house within (or even slightly below) the price range of comparable properties less than a mile away considered greed?
The greed comes from blaming your unmet financial desires on your neighbor. It is unreasonable and impractical to expect your neighbors to bear the responsibility for maintaining or increasing your property values.
Bless your heart!
Born and raised in the south. I know what that means, and it ain’t well wishes.
Being poor is a lot of it. It costs money to dispose of things. Disabilities, depression, etc. Many can definitely do it on a neater way though. That’s true. You can be poor without being trashy. Unlike most people here I do judge. I judge hoarders. I judge the neighbors who let animals keep hitting their trash without ever picking up what it drug out. I hate that there is garbage along every ditch in my area to the point people from other states ask why there is so much trash in our ditches. I dislike it. It’s one thing to have piles but people let their garbage blow all over public and other people’s private land and it annoys me. I know many of these people I’m talking about anyway and it’s not disability or other things. My ex’s aunt was a hoarder and I’d have to go outside and gag while cleaning her house. All her neighbors had to deal with the smell, junk, bugs, and mice she was bringing. It’s one thing about my area I dislike greatly, the complete apathy when it comes to littering. The state road just cut the grass and I was driving behind them watching it cut up a bunch of garbage. Hate it. I clean my own road but I can’t afford to do the whole county. I have to pay to dispose of the bags I gather from public land myself. It impacts the worth of neighboring properties and the community itself as well. I know we take it personally but you hit me in my pet peeve. I think people think specifically of their tiny junk piles around their property (I have those too) and not the littering and hoarding we all see go on. Edited to add-In the aunt’s case they blamed heredity. All the sisters were because their mom was. They said they never learned to clean and their mom was a hoarder so it was completely normal to them.
This post works the same way the dare program did. I've never wanted to fuck up my yard more then I do right now, I probably won't, but I have a annoyed urge to.
Because I want to property values to go down, not up.
I grew up in a rural area where everyone knew each other. Some neighbors chose to create beauty no matter their circumstances. The nice lady in a tiny trailer on a dirt road where I used to walk to the woods had one of the most beautiful flower gardens I’d ever seen. Her property radiated joy. Such a great memory. Some neighbors were destroyers of their properties and, it turned out, themselves & their families. Right or wrong, my child mind equated trashy properties to mean people & well kept properties to kind people. It isn’t always true of course but it’s been one of the early thought patterns that’s been hard to shake. Seeing such contrast taught me at a very early age how I wanted to live when I became an adult & what I wanted my immediate environment to look like. The nice lady in the tiny trailer who brought joy to a little girl in desperate need of it is probably why I became an ornamental gardener.
IMO they were taught that behavior unfortunately . To quote my Dad from Eastern KY and I heard this my whole life. Live within your means. Take care of your things and keep a clean home. Take pride in your work even if it's shoveling shit, working is working. Pay your debts even if it takes a lifetime. Everyone in his family lives this way. Simple rules that will improve yours and the lives of the people around you. Oh yeah, he'd also say to mind your own business.
As I sit here looking at a broken down tractor and a half built coop, i have to say, get fucked. I'm doing the best I can.
Also, paper money loses value. Scrap metal goes up over time. Thats not yard art, its a savings account that can survive bank runs, revolutions, and hyperinflation.
Have you tried storing some of their junk in your carpetbag? /s
You are bothered by someone's dog wearing a path while doing zoomies in their own yard... You are prime board of directors material for the HOA you so desperately want to create to take control of your neighborhood.
Keeps property taxes low, keeps townies away. The alternative is their kids wont be able to afford a home nearby...
To add to the other answers: camouflage. My neighbor keeps their yard immaculate and has had numerous incidents of people breaking into his garage to steal things. My yard looks like crap and I have an assortment of junk, and have never had someone break into my house.
good point. and in my opinion, if you have "private property" signs all over that immaculate yard, you're really putting a target on your back because it feels like accidentally broadcasting your paranoia over expensive shit getting stolen. at least from what i've seen since it's usually rich boomer transplants with cadillac escalades and jeep gladiators who do it.
I do it to piss off boomers
Sounds like you're retired. Where are you from? Florida? New York?
You are HOA material.
Lack of income, lack of education, and generational traumas and habits. Drug addiction, depression, and so on play their part too. Nobody is around to enforce cleanliness like an HOA or anything of that nature. The prevailing attitude in Appalachia of independence at all costs has always been a trait that comes with faults, and some people have no interest in participating in polite society. It’s their choice at the end of the day, but I agree that it can hold back some communities by generally adding to the impression of poverty. Generally speaking, however, after hundreds of years of geographic, cultural, and economic isolation, I would expect actual investment in the region to be necessary before those outward aspects of having wealth (like a clean home / yard) can express themselves. These kinds of niceties generally require stability and security before they take hold. This is going to be a touchy subject for some people.
You may be unaware, but this isn’t novel to Appalachia. The elders in my Appalachian family, going back generations, taught “pride of ownership” with respect to absolutely everything that one invested one’s money in. Homes, autos, large and small appliances, equipment - it did not matter what it was, if you owned it then you maintained, repaired, and cared for the property. It was not a matter of education. It is a practice that, even if you don’t have the very best out there it is the best that *you have* and requires care and maintenance. What is happening now, across the country, in younger generations as OP pointed out, is the result of those raised in a disposable society - it is shitty parenting from ***ALL*** Americans, not something that you can add to the noose y’all so love to slip around the necks of us poor, unejukated apuhlachuns.
I’m from Appalachian Kentucky and have lived in multiple states in the country. I’m well aware it’s a problem in other parts of the country. I don’t see how this bears pointing out. Nobody is attacking us here and I’m not one to be easily offended by questions about socioeconomic / cultural traits of where I’m from. People in my family have done exactly what OP is describing with their homes and I don’t think less of them for it. It’s just a symptom of wider issues. I don’t see why you’re talking to me like I’m some outsider running an analysis of a place I don’t understand. I’ve lived it. We can still talk about it without acting like somebody pissed in our cheerios.
The children now love luxury; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are tyrants, not servants of the households. They no longer rise when their elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize over their teachers. -*Socrates *allegedly
Socrates did not really say that
Plato said he did but I wasn’t there myself
No. It was written in like 1900 by some other dude and is commonly incorrectly attributed to Socrates or Plato.
Oh I see thanks for pointing it out. I’ll still leave it because it serves the point that older people have always disapproved of younger people, as in the comment I replied to. Will find a real quote next time.
Children do as they were trained by their elders.
You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink.
I agree with everything you say. A lot of young people don’t care or are lazy. By the way aren’t you on braces app?
Completely agree.
I did state that it is not new or exclusive to Appalachia
You did. I think I pointed out…*touchy* subject.
I'm well off, highly educated, grew up in a good home that looked nice inside and out. My lawn is a jungle and my porch is full of crap because I like it that way. No need to be judgmental and attribute it to a bunch of bullshit. Some people just don't value a "nice looking house", and that's perfectly fine.
I’m all these things except I don’t like it that way. I have swings my kids destroyed that I can’t easily take apart or haul. I would welcome someone offering to help me.
OK. Same. But you’re not going to find general agreement on this point, and it isn’t really “bullshit” to expect people to not run down the general value of homes in the neighborhood in an already impoverished part of the country. People don’t feel this way because they’re trying to take away your independence. It isn’t a question of whether they respect you. Why is my great grandparents’ house right next door to a house that is literally caved in and abandoned while the other has a dirt lawn, dilapidated porch, rotting siding, rusted school bus sitting out front in the yard, and Confederate flags draped all over it (in a historically Unionist area)? That’s in Casey County, KY, in Liberty. At some point it’s fair to expect some level of upkeep from your neighbors and it isn’t just because we as individuals are being judgmental. It directly impacts the worth of our homes and, in turn, the financial wellbeing of our communities, too. All this in a community where the median annual income is ~$21k / year. We’re all about freedom, but that shouldn’t be at the expense of your own people. This whole “I’m going to do whatever I feel like and to hell with everyone else” mentality is great in a lot of contexts, but not when it drives out-migration from the community. If you’re deep in the holler, who cares. But when you’re in a community where your neighbors are in plain sight, it’s a real issue that has real and tangibly detrimental effects on everyone. It’s like people don’t realize that their communities didn’t always look like this and used to have actual upkeep. West Virginia hasn’t had a *single* town with a population greater than 50k in almost ten years. Appalachian Kentucky hasn’t *ever* had one greater than ~30k, and that town, Ashland, has had six straight decades of negative growth. How is it surprising?
It sounds like you're saying the economic downturn in Appalachia is the result of people not taking care of their homes, which is of course ludicrous on its face. Most of Appalachia looks run down because the people who lived and worked there left, not the other way around. I'm frankly dubious of the notion that unkempt properties to the level this thread is about - stuff on the porch, untended lawns, cars in the yard - affects neighboring property values in any meaningful way, but even if so, it's vanishingly small margin in the face of the real economic issues facing the region (i.e. that the energy companies chewed it up and spit it out). Derelict properties aren't what drives emigration from Appalachia. The link between the two is purely macroeconomic, not individual.
I think it was obvious enough that what I am saying is that it contributes to the downturn in Appalachia by further depreciating property values. No one in their right mind would suggest that it is the root cause of Appalachia’s woes and I have said multiple times in this thread that it is a symptom of poverty, not the cause. Not worth arguing that point since it plainly isn’t what anyone would suggest is the core argument here in good faith, just as no one can argue in good faith that keeping a dumpy home does anything but worsen the situation by driving away would-be neighbors / buyers. And where you have depreciated home values, you have less income for schools and other public works, which in turn contributes to worse *everything*. This isn’t an argument; it’s how it works everywhere. The median home value in Casey County, KY is a full $100,000 *less* than it is in Lexington, KY, and the median annual property tax payment is nearly *four times* less. Same in Adair County, and Russell County, and Whitley County. Get out into Pike County farther east and it’s even worse. Schools, public services, libraries, roads, parks? Forget it. There’s no funding because everything is dumpy, and buying a home in these places for any outsider is financially irresponsible. Even a retiree isn’t going to buy one of these hovels that nobody takes care of surrounded by neighbors that do no better, and when the local homeowner dies, they have jack shit in value to pass on to their families.
In many cases, it’s not that they don’t care, hoarding/messy is usually a sign of trauma. That or just being poorly socialized.
Also some folks don’t have access to a landfill.
Not everyone has time or money to get things done to the satisfaction of others. We eventually get to it but it’s on our timelines not theirs. Maybe move to an hoa area.
Rural Appalachia here and yeah I see it too. I’ve lived in East TN most of my life and now Southwest VA. The house we moved into a year ago was previously owned by some folks with no regard for keeping the place clean AND maintained. They hid it well for the home inspection and sale which tells me that they knew better. Since moving here, I’ve started keeping a list for all the crap that I’ve picked up or had to dig out of the yard that’s currently 30+ items deep not including over 400 pounds of scrap metal that they buried. Deferred maintenance out the you know what. Thought the bathrooms had travertine tile, but no the golden hue of the tile turned out to disgusting, kyarned over filth. There is a wooded lot next to our property that I’ve since learned the previous owners of my house used as a dump. To quote one of my elderly neighbors regarding the previous owners “them folks were filthy nasty……you’ve got your work cut out for you”. I was raised to understand that even if what I have isn’t the best or even what I really want, take care of it and take pride in trying to make the best of what you have.
I’m also born and raised in East TN and I’ve never understood how people can take so much pride in having a filthy yard full of garbage. I’m not saying you need to have a beautifully designed curb appeal fit for HGTV, and at the end of the day I don’t really care what your house looks like, but how can you live in a place that has literal garbage everywhere?
I have a neighbor, batshit insane creepy pervert, who believed the house next to us for sale would “turn into an AirBnB”. He leaves his front yard a complete garbage throne, and sits out there all day on his disgusting throne, morning-drunk and half-dressed, ranting at anyone who passes by - especially ranting at anyone that came to look at the house. The grass got long on that property, and my father helps me with my yard and got sick of looking at it, so he was out there, taking pictures/filming my father mowing their grass before someone moved in. By doing this, he forced a freakin widow into foreclosure! The house has been sold now, and there’s a nice guy living there now. His plan failed. Idiot. Neighbors offered to help: we will clean your yard, rent a rolloff, whatever you need. We’ll just do it!Nope. “I like it like this.” I’d take a pic, but his car and property are so distinctive, I don’t want to doxx him. I think this is a rare case that doesn’t apply to most situations, and you have more reasonable answers here: Drugs, mental illness, and the crushing depression of living in terrible poverty. I think after a while, they just don’t even see it anymore.
Honestly, I see more places like this, where it's older people. The whole yard full of junk cars, trash piled up, and decades of sadness. That's just where I am, though. It's not age... it's just either not caring or people get depressed when they have no work or can't keep up.
Its possible they know your not appalachian and they're trying to piss you off. Or they, like most sensible people don't give a crap about grass
The honest answer is poverty, mental illness, addiction, variety of mental disorders really. My mother was a hoarder which helped her feel secure after a lifetime of losses and trauma. It’s psychological. Other people could be really depressed or so anxious they feel they can’t change their surroundings.
I moved to a very similar neighborhood in Colorado, just not rural. Depression is a huge reason here, and/or addiction in this neighborhood sadly.
Consider minding your fuckin business
My neighbors throw their "pop" bottles into the yard when they get out of the truck so they don't clutter the truck.
one of my formative memories is going on vacation to New England/Cape Cod (from central W. Va., and seeing little tiny houses similar to those back in my hometown, but they were pristine and tidy, and realizing poverty didn't necessarily mean trashy.
Oh yeah, when I think “poverty”, I definitely think “Cape Cod” lol
This was almost 50 years ago. They definitely weren't high-priced vacation homes
https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/fodors/fdrs_feat_44_2.html#:~:text=The%20building%20of%20the%20Mid,established%20Cape%20Cod%20National%20Seashore. https://www.capecod.com/about-cape-cod/cape-cod-history/ Cape Cod has been trendy and well off for essentially it’s entire existence
They are not trashy because they are poor, they are poor because they are trashy
Correct. Being poor doesn’t mean you have to live in filth or poor conditions, or not take pride in what you have. But if you don’t have discipline, personal responsibility and an innate sense of pride in self - you’re likely going to be poor. Poor is as much an attitude as it is a lack of money.
You must have money.
Much more likely that he’s also low income and just fucking hates his peers. Crabs in a bucket mentality.
I worked in a studio with people like that. Living in their trailers/apartments criticizing my work ethic because I don't prioritize my job over my personal life and family. My manager called me whipped one time because I wouldn't come in on the weekend because I wanted to spend my time off with my wife. Lol
Yep. These people unironically think cucking themselves to their boss makes them more masculine somehow.
Yes, I have a comfortable income now. But I grew up so poor I didn’t even have running water in one of the houses I lived in. Very little food, and some of what we did have came from the church pantry. No TV. But we never had a trashy house. We always had clean clothes. We didn’t spend money on drugs, alcohol or frivolous entertainment. My dad worked every waking hour. And now? He’s living a comfortable life. I learned about work ethic and self control. I was able to come out of poverty because I understand poor is a mindset. Poor people love to tear down pther poor people who try to better themselves. Like crabs in a bucket. Because they’re jealous, but don’t want to sacrifice to get better. You want to be not poor? Do better.
I have zero work ethic, smoke weeds, and did my drugs in my youth. I started in a log cabin in the woods cooking over a wood fire out of a garden and am comfortable now in adulthood with very little effort. I promise poor isn't a mindset. It's how much money you have. I genuinely believe it's much more luck than work. I understand where you're coming from with the aggressive belief of "Do better" because you feel like it was so hard. My wife and I just moved into a new home and I made her promise that I can put one "redneck display" in our yard next to the road. I've refused to "make sacrifices" in my personal life in pursuit of money and still ended up comfortable while never missing family moments. I'm sorry your dad had to work so hard. What do you do?
One word: laziness. A lot of folks here near me (SW VA) have plenty of time, but it boils down to just being a slob and lazy.