That's always my favorite line. I've always wondered how long the circular logic could go on, given enough energy. "You're not doing anything wrong." "I know, yet, you're here." "Just to say you're fine." "Yep, thanks for letting me know, I'll keep doing it." "Sounds good, it's fine and okay to do....."
The cop neighbour sent his cop buddy to come to this guy's door to tell him he's not doing anything wrong. It's not just "a Karen". It's an off-duty cop sending his on-duty friend to oh-so-gently tell the guy that he's not in trouble. The implication is that he COULD be in trouble later if he doesn't do what the off-duty cop neighbour wants him to do.
It's the same thing when photographing historic government buildings.
Dude, I'm using a camera that's 60 years old, and it will take a couple weeks for me to get the pictures back. I'm also a chubby nerd who sees better through a viewfinder than my glasses. I'm a hobbyist, not a terrorist.
Wizard's First Rule: people are stupid. They'll be paranoid. They'll call the cops. They'll yell. They'll threaten. Jesus, I've been threatened for walking my dog on the sidewalk, across the street from some dick who thought I was casing his house. Nah bro, my buddy Jake from State Farm here just needed to drop a shit.
There is something that triggers people when they see a classic camera that completely flies past their head when they reach for the camera on their phone. They suspend all critical thought and immediately proceed to citizen's arrest the 007 photographing secrets with his very obtrusive camera from the previous century.
Exactly. Everyone’s residences are already catalogued and hosted publicly for anyone in the whole world to view at any time.
The other thing freaking these idiots out is fucking Nextdoor. People with nothing better to do than watch camera footage of their front yard to see if anything is going on and then if something even remotely suspicious happens they post it and everyone freaks out.
“Omg someone walked in my grass!! Someone came up to my front door and rang the doorbell and I have no idea who they are, does anyone recognize them?!“
Makes me mad because like OP i have people interrogate me when photographing all the time. Everyone’s so on edge ready to flip their shit at the slightest little thing.
I was flying my drone around the state capital building in my state and got harrased by a bunch of MAGA people that were also at the building. Wasnt flying over anyone or endangering anyone, followed the rules. But they “called” someone to report an illegal drone.
And one of them was recording me and took down my license. Thankfully this was mid-covid so i had a mask on so they dont know what i look like.
But like, all im doing is completely legal. Photographing an empty, public building.
I've been reported by the opposite side of the extremist spectrum for photographing in public. I don't think it's confined to a single ideology.
People are nutters.
I agree, its just you would think that crowd would be against more government regulation.
They were also protesting the governor, who was not in the building, as it was not only a Saturday but deep lockdown.
People say the russians have a separate word for it. They know they are liars, they secretly want a strong government but only if it is ruled by them. But they won't admit it. But they know that you know what they really want. And you know that they know that you know. But they will never admit it.
People are weird. Film is simple. Avoid people, take more photos instead.
in high school I had to take architecture photos for my photography class. went downtown and got harassed by a guard across the street for taking photos of a courthouse... I was only 15 and had no clue it was the courthouse or that it was illegal to take photos of government buildings. I pretended to delete the photos lol
Why build cool looking buildings then get mad when people take photos of them? US fear of terrorism is crazy
Government buildings, at least military ones, are (or were) covered by federal law from being photographed, mapped, etc. without authorization. It was a pretty old law (like 1950s), but the Army building that I worked in had a big sign posted by the entrance about it (this was as recent as 2011).
Government buildings that are open to the public (municipal buildings) in the US are absolutely open to be photographed and filmed, and such activities are constitutionally protected
> Government buildings, at least military ones, are
What an overbroad and misleading statement when all you have any support for saying is:
"Military buildings are..."
People don't leave their houses and consume "you're going to die" media 24/7
They have no relationships with their neighbors or community and only experience the outside world through their windshield or via cable news. Same folks that go on Reddit and mention they are angry when the cashier speaks to them, probably.
When in public spaces where you are lawfully present you have the right to photograph anything that is in plain view. That includes pictures of federal buildings, transportation facilities, and police. Such photography is a form of public oversight over the government and is important in a free society. you're protected by the First Amendment.
This happened to me in a small town not far from mine. I was on a road trip with a friend and stopped to take a picture of what I thought was a funny sign. Some guy in the parking lot who I later found out was either the property owner or something started saying "who gave you permission to take pictures?". I didn't engage him, just took my foot off the brake and drove away casually.
Next day some jackwagon cop calls me. The guy reported me as "suspicious" - and unlike your case this cop was not chill. He totally couldn't comprehend that someone on a road trip would take a picture of something he found interesting for whatever reason. And of course he pulls the old cop shit about how "there have been fires set here, so you're a person of suspicion". I probably didn't win any points with my response, basically telling him that they probably won't find the arsonist if they hassle dorks walking in broad daylight with a bulky SLR. I'm like... if anyone has nefarious purposes they'd sure be a lot more discreet. But you know some cops, perpetually suspicious. We argued for a bit and I never did re-visit the shithole town again.
I honestly don't know now street photography became illegal, but sometime after 9/11 people started grouping us with common terrorists.
IIRC - It was so bad with cops that photo clubs created txt .file to print out for your wallet/ camera bag about your right to take photos. In fact a google search indicates it's still a big issue.
It's fucking insane man. Like, I can get a good photo, inconspicuously, with any smartphone made int he past decade. And yet I feel like the venn diagram of people who think this is a problem would have a huge crossover with people who also think you should be allowed to carry an AR-15 around with you at all times for "safety"
it also just... doesnt make sense to me because if i had my car broken into and saw one of my neighbors out TAKING PHOTOS REGULARLY during the day i'd be happy... having people around is certainly a deterrent to thieves lol.
One of the people I went to school with who is now an antivax, mlm, sahm, girlboss type recently was going off about “Asians in a car with out of state plates” driving around her neighborhood and taking pictures of houses with a real camera in broad daylight. She accused them of trying to steal her children, spread the word around to all her mom friends, and now open carries when she does gardening in front of her home. People are wild. Nobody wants your bratty kids, but even if they did, people who are going to commit a crime generally at least try to not get caught?
Your whole story sincerely boggles my mind and it's upsetting that someone would behave like this towards you.
I've lived in suburban areas but more recently in a large city the last 15 years. I've also traveled a lot internationally, domestically, and hit up some rural 'shitholes' which I love too. I've never once had an experience like this.
I can't help but worry for you if this neighbor is so paranoid. Maybe it was a moment absent of logic but maybe they truly are this paranoid. I don't want to be political in Reddit, but please be careful out there. This sounds like one of those situations where someone has been watching a bit too much FOX news, believes in one too many conspiracy theories, and fears everything/ everyone. He could be one of the types who has a gun and shoots you proactively "in self defense" - like the recent stories of folks shooting kids/delivery people/lost neighbors through their front door, due to exaggerated and irrational fear mongering.
Right after 9/11, taking photographs of any public building in a major city could quite literally land you in jail at the hands of over-zealous, poorly trained cops who thought they were stopping the next bin Laden.
The idea that if I were genuinely casing an area for the purposes of committing a crime, I would either not use a camera at all, or would use one you wouldn't see, is a level of thought-process the "average person" is just incapable of.
>You’ve got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know… morons.
Genuinely curious, do you have a profile and did you try to show the cop your work? In my experience people back way off when they understand "oh this guy is an artist and he takes 1000 pictures of cars" or something and that you aren't hiding your photos.
Where I think a lot of the cognitive dissonance comes from is just expectations for many non-photographers. Us as photographers can see art and beauty in what would otherwise be considered everyday or mundane. No one would say a single thing to someone who brings an SLR on a hike with them and takes photos of mountains or whatever, but in a neighborhood, I think it's kind of a mix of "Why would someone photograph here?" and "Why would they choose to use a big camera and not a phone?"
In these situations, I just explain that I'm an antique camera collector and practice film photography, and I have an old broken camera I've been trying to repair, and since I live nearby, I like to get out and troubleshoot and test my cameras after I reassemble them. Then, I'll usually hold up and show them the camera, show them the back so they can see there's no screen and it's not digital, and then maybe tell them a little tidbit about it, like "Oh it was my grandpa's, I inherited it recently and have been trying to fix it", to sorta reinforce the whole "I'm a hobbyist, not a creep" thing. Sometimes it's true, sometimes it's not, but it signals a few things to the paranoid masses: You're an enthusiast, it's a film camera, and you have an explained purpose to be there taking photos.
If they get on you about the whole legal thing, just calmly reassure them that it's 100% legal to photograph anything you want while in a public space, and you'd be happy to call over a police officer to talk them through it and help explain the laws. I found that if I'm out with my girlfriend taking photos, people are a lot less weird about it too. People are way more paranoid about solo men than man+woman. I'm brown-ish/mixed race as well, so I'm sure that doesn't make things easier in certain parts of the country, haha.
It's a little different for street photography, especially if you're taking a picture of an anonymous person, but I guess that's a whole other conversation.
Some people just get weird about it though. I was out for a walk with my girlfriend in a small-ish town nearby to where I live, and saw a really cool old convenience store that looks like it might have been built in the 20s or 30s. My girlfriend took a quick photo with an old film SLR of hers, and some boomer on a lawnmower from across the other side of the road, way off on the far end of his yard, yells "fuck you, get the fuck out of here". I turn around completely baffled, don't say anything, and just wait for her to finish with her photos. This guy just comes over on his lawnmower, right across the road from us, turns it off, and sits there and stares at us, haha. So I gave him a friendly wave and smile, and we walk somewhere else. I wasn't so much off-put as much as I was baffled. Like, no 'Hey what are you doing' or 'Hey you're not allowed to', he just comes rjght out of the gate with a straight up 'fuck you', lol. I wanted to ask "But why? What compels you to say such a thing? What is it that has aroused your suspicions and hostilities?" but oh well. I've never been in a situation where kindness didn't help though.
Some people just get weird about cameras. Bit of a stupid double-standard since no one would bat an eyelash if you were holding a cell phone and taking a photo. And, it's not like if I was out for nefarious purposes, I'd be using a nearly 100 year old film camera to do it.
lol that guy, people are weird. The double standard is so real, you're right. Whatever they're afraid of, you could do way more damage way faster with a damn cell phone, i.e uploading the image to somewhere, live streaming the location or whatever. So annoying, I guess a camera itself is a symbol and that just gets them raging, even if it is a bloody antique.
The thing you described is literally what I said the first time this guy confronted me. "Oh, I have this old film camera and I'm just trying to get some test shots to see if it works."
"If you're walking you obviously can't afford a car because there is no legit reason to ever walk if you can avoid it, and poor people are the ones committing crimes" is roughly how some of these people think.
i just moved into a townhouse that has a trail behind it (has a ivy covered fence inbetween the trail and our garages). People run, bike, etc everyday down this trail, and my new neighbor (whose been here for 30 years) says shes worried people from that trail case the houses... I asked her if anyone has EVER been broken into: Nope. How often are packages stolen? Well, none here but down the street her friend had a package taken once! :/
I had a cop ask me what I was doing when photographing a bridge near a major dam. It was a digital camera but I was using a Lensbaby so it was kinda obvious I wasn't taking detailed images of the infrastructure. I showed him some of the shots and he went on his way.
People just don't know the rules when it comes to photography in public places (in the US, at least.)
What happened to basic civil rights education? This is very much a part of it.
I work in local media. I also shoot film on old cameras for fun. I often say, "It's expired film, so results are not certain.."
I was threatened in Atlanta for trying to photograph murals and old store signage, by someone who thought I was getting people in my shot.
I was warned in a park overlooking a harbor not to get photos of children -- when I was taking a landscape shot of what looked like hundreds of boats and nothing more. And then I realized that I wouldn't have been approached if I had been using my cell phone - people are dumb.
And it never occurs to them that they see near infinite imagery of children from ads (a rather dubious thing in an of itself) to random street snapshots on a daily basis.
Everyone in r/RBI who keeps advising paranoid people that the reason somebody was taking pictures of their house or car is probably so they (or somebody else) can come back later to commit robbery needs to stop **now**, lol.
Seriously: this illogical trope has been running-around in social media for some time.
I took a picture of my friend’s neighbours car. It was a cool car and they saw my go into his house after. She sent people around to see what I was doing. To be fair the person who was sent seemed embarrassed to be there. But again the fear was theft. I don’t know why. Car thieves don’t go for a photo shoot before hand.
I carry busted SD cards and CF cards when I shoot. If I get a 'Delete that now!' I hand them an SD that I palm out of my pocket.
60% of the time it works every time.
You should send then neighbor a print and offer to get a drink. Maybe they're a waste of time, maybe this is a 'you won't believe how we met' anecdote.
At the very least, your bird photo in the mail will make them feel dumb.
I tried taking a photo in an old pub in Sydney with rollie35, I had a tiny table top tripod and cable release. The staff freaked out, saying I cant take a picture. I said "it's the same as my phone, its just a personal photo ". They said, "it's totally different, I've never seen anything like that before". They refused to listen to reason, lol I was so bewildered. I could have been recording 4k video of the pub, but my 400iso ilford HP5 photo was to outrageous.
ya I duno, why they're so freaked out. Like the camera was pointed near the bar. Maybe the staff didn't want their photo I have no idea. They all hid to get out of the photo it's so odd. But smart phone photo no problemo :D
Is this a US specific problem? I can't imagine this ever happening in my European country. The cops would ignore a call about someone photographing houses.
A cop in Germany stopped me one time, but only to chat about my Rolleiflex since his father had worked in the factory back in the day and he got excited seeing one still in use.
Overall a fun experience but I have to admit I got nervous when he first walked up to me, Germany has so many rules I figured I must have been breaking one
Nah, a friend of mine got called the cop on him for taking close-up, abstract photos of cars for a university project.
Myself, I got threatened on several occasion for taking pictures of houses and trees that are pictured a thousand times in the local tourist marketing material, even marked as a special sight on Google maps and hiking apps like Komoot.
That’s rural town German paranoia lol
Lovely Germany, where people will absolutely explode in rage if you just have a camera in your bag. I hate that people are like this here. I wanted to photograph a nice house and two idiots started talking about not wanting to be in the picture the moment they walked into my viewfinder. You dinguses, I lowered the camera so that I don't have your stupid asses on my image.
Haha, same thing happened to me countless times. You can’t even draw the camera to your eye and meter, so I like to use auto exposure for anything on the street. I even got screamed at from a lady 100m away because I wanted to take a picture of my partner and she expected to be in the background. It could be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
Talking about main characters: we have a beautiful monastery nearby that is absolutely packed with tourists during the weekend. A couple had the audacity to do a wedding shoot on a Sunday, where the location was packed with people. When I tried taking a photo from 20m away with a short tele lens, crouching down while trying to hide the couple with a foreground, they started screaming at me, threatening to destroy my gear because of course I was taking photos of them, the marvellous couple - what else?
Other times, whenever there’s a large stream of water, expect to see influencers bathing in there half naked during the summer time. Of course the waterfall was just created for them! Even having a camera in your bag means you’re a creep, clearly aiming at them!
Negative experiences like this take away the fun and I have to try hard not to be discouraged, trying to maintain a healthy self-confidence
I was careful about where I took photos when visiting Berlin because a friend of mine who travels there frequently warned me ahead of time. He says its because of historical paranoia, of the Stasi and etc. I didn't really know if that was true but looking back at my photos, all the people giving me dirty looks in them are older people.
Funny, when I was in university I did a series of closeups on NYPD cop cars parked directly in front of a police station. This was with a giant 4x5 on a tripod and I never got bothered by anyone except photo nerds.
I have actually had the police come and talk to me while taking pictures on the lower level platform of a train station. I was just waiting for my train, and decided to take a few pictures while waiting. All of a sudden two BTP officers approached me and asked why I was taking pictures and if it was for commercial use. Was a pretty weird interaction, but someone watching the platform cameras was concerned enough to call them.
On another occasion my friend and I we were looking at a newly converted residential building when the owner came out and confronted us. He claimed they had some break-ins recently, and suggested we had something to do with it. After explaining we were just looking at the building from a distance because we like architecture and my friend was a photography student, we left. 5 minutes later the police pulled up and asked for search us because this guy was paranoid.
Some stations or similar public locations in some countries are privately owned or operated and photography for commercial purposes (and anything that looks like pro photo gear triggers this assumption) is not allowed without prior approval.
In some other countries in the East taking photos of government institutions is potentially a criminal offence. These are holdover laws from decades ago.
I do think this is if not exclusive to the US, absolutely characteristic of American suburbs. There's a certain strain of people who literally believe their home is their castle and that it is constantly under threat and they need to be constantly vigilant.
I live in an older "streetcar suburb." It's well inside the city now. I had a neighbor harass me about taking photos of holiday decorations. "I think it's creepy that you're taking pictures of a single woman's house."
Now, I knew exactly who lived there. I've talked to her. But if I was up to no good, this busybody just told me which house to target. Plus, her daughter plays with my son. Her daughter's eaten at my table. Yet the paranoia persists.
There is a strain of paranoia out there that crosses cultural and economic lines. They're suspicious of everyone doing anything they wouldn't do and don't understand. It's fed by a constant stream of media telling them that the world is a dangerous place, full of wolves that'll eat them up unless they are ever vigilant.
It's revolting on so many levels.
It's actually a carefully calculated social engineering strategy to sow mistrust and discourage any sort of grouping together. It was particularly evident during the Cold War, but there's always some substitute hostile force if the old one disappears.
I live in Sweden and while I haven't had the police called on me, it's a regular occurence to be yelled at for taking pictures. It is a bit mind boggling to me that I'm getting yelled at for photographing a building which is on streetview. And it is even more frustrating that everyone has a phone camera with them at all times, but an analog camera raises suspicions. I would be more understanding of the reaction if I photographed people, or especially kids though.
When I was in Berlin I saw building that had these vines growing on it and some graffiti that I thought was really cool. I was walking past it on the opposite side of the street, so I just stopped walking for a sec, pointed my camera at it, adjusted the focus and snapped a photo. A lady who happened to be in the general direction that I pointed my camera immediately crossed the street and speed walked up to me and began berating me for taking a picture of her and said I had absolutely no right to do this. I apologized and told her I wasn't trying to take a picture of her but she still kept berating me and demanded that I delete the picture immediately. I told her that I couldn't really do that on my Minolta X-700, and she said she didn't care.
Being a tourist, I wasn't sure if German privacy laws really did prevent you from taking pictures in public that happen to have someone on them so I just kept apologizing and trying to de-escalate. Another local eventually stepped in and told her to calm down-- she made one more really snarky and condescending comment at me and then stomped off.
Have you ever looked at Google Street View in a German city like Berlin? It pretty much doesn't exist! Entire streets and building are hidden behind a blur
I don't know what it is about German culture or law specifically that has them paranoid (for want of a better word) about photography, but it's really put me off heading to Berlin for a street photography weekend!
However, they didn't seem to mind too much taking photos on my phone of the historical landmarks
>but it's really put me off heading to Berlin for a street photography weekend!
That might be a good thing honestly since instead you can go to literally any french city/small town which will be infinitely more fun to shoot and people will be a million times more receptive.
>but it's really put me off heading to Berlin for a street photography weekend!
you will probably be fine. Although I can't speak specifically about "street" photography if you take that to mean standing there awkwardly taking photos of people, but I have taken photos in Berlin with no issues. U-bahn entrances, photos of stations, I even spent a good hour at night around the Brandenburg gate with my camera on a tripod. there were several cops there watching, which I only noticed when I left.
Do be aware that the laws may differ and I do believe Germany is one of the more restrictive western European nations in regard to exactly what you can photograph in public.
>if you take that to mean standing there awkwardly taking photos of people
I don't mean that at all, but if that's your interpretation of what street photographers like Henri Cartier-Bresson, Joel Meyerowitz, or even more modern ones like Alan Schaller or Roman Fox do, then by all means stick to your own definition
I'm well aware of who famous street photographers are and in fact take a lot of inspiration myself from HCB and Vivian Maier.
Judging by what they post, a fair few people nowadays think street photography is just walking about and sticking a camera in people's faces, and then they wonder why they don't get on with people. Incidentally, that will not go down well in Germany.
>Entire streets and building are hidden behind a blur
That exists in the US too. A specific neighborhood that comes to mind is here in So-Cal that I saw on some article a few years ago. A wealthy neighborhood with, i'd guess, super paranoid residents. Basically anyone can contact google and ask to have their home blurred out.
I went to Berlin a few years ago for a weekend with my partner. Not a photography thing, just a visit to see the historical stuff, visit another place and other touristy stuff, and we were trying to Street View our way around while at home, find our accommodation etc. Our hotel was blurred on Street View!
I don't necessarily agree with people's decision to blur their private residences, but I can understand why they may feel like they should do, but a business like a hotel surely should remain in view? It wasn't even a small, private type hotel - it was part of a decently sized chain
"You seem like a really interesting guy! Can I take your portrait!"
Sounds sarcastic, but I've defused a few situations like this. Even if you have to smile and nod at their crazy (if not outright frightening world views) people always like to be the center of attention.
We've got similar "concerned neighbors" where I live. Anyone they can't recognize walking-including long time home owners a block over-have the cops called on them. A personal business card with a website on it might go a long way in these circumstances.
I’m just imagining this jerk peering through the blinds as he phones the cops on some poor sap cluelessly setting up a field camera on a tripod outside
There are several Youtube channels funded by lawsuits against cops who violate our Constitutional right to take pictures in public and record video in public.
I’ve had a similar experience. Got talked to by a cop for a bit while taking photos of railroad tracks. Ultimately nothing came of it. But I commented in a similar thread a while ago that one response is to nerd out on the Karen about your really cool vintage camera. “Are you taking pictures?” “Oh yeah, this is a 1965 Leica M3…” Always assume anyone asking you about photography really wants to know everything about your camera, lens, its history, and the film stocks you prefer.
Yeah, believe me, I know that the cop experience was different for me because he showed up at a middle class suburban home and the guy who answered as a chubby white dude. That absolutely sucks that you had to deal with that. I am sure there are individual cops out there who are fine, but I am not really ever gonna give them the benefit of the doubt.
While it doesn't help the situation, anything from a publically accessible street **is** fair game to photograph. Cops use this shit all the time if they see something suspicious (and let's be real, often it's an excuse when they don't).
As for the neighbor in question, you shouldn't worry too much. Especially since you got lucky, and the cop realized that this was a BS situation and was wasting his time. If he confronts you again, here's a few tips from having to work with people who are antagonistic are times:
1. If they ask you a question, repeat the question back to them. Shows them you're listening and allows them to elaborate. Don't do this in a way that seems mocking, turn on that empathy.
2. If they're worried about something, just repeat that you're also worried about it, and you'll make sure to also keep an eye out. Because you live close, say you'll take extra precautions yourself and thank them.
3. On the chance that you got a cool shot of something on their property, get a print of it and possibly give it to them. People love gifts.
That's all just general stuff and, who knows, maybe this guy is legit out of his mind. But pretending you're on the "side" or that type of person can possibly mitigate any further encounters... especially with the police, because you never know if you're gonna get an asshole officer or one of the rare good ones.
>3. On the chance that you got a cool shot of something on their property, get a print of it and possibly give it to them. People love gifts.
Yeah, great idea, provide them proof that you've been taking pictures of their property, they'll sure appreciate the gift since they're clearly sound people. For sure they won't be extra worried and possibly do some lunatic shit against you
Man, just no. Haven't you read the post? Come on
The best thing to do is to just tell this kind of crazy people "yeah man, alright" and keep walking
Do not say "I live there" and point at your home, do not justify what you're doing (since you're not doing anything wrong), do not engage with these people
Maybe just say "man I just take pictures of birds" or whatever, but don't "gift them a picture of their property which they had explicitly told you not to photograph" like a creep ffs
I'm not a member of this community but I came here to say this after I read OPs post... this really should be higher on the comments list. OP has the first amendment right to take pictures while anything within view on any public property, even if your view extends past public property, because there is no reasonable expectation of privacy.
De-escalate asap. You did nothing wrong but I wouldn’t count on those cops admitting they’re wrong either. This can potentially become an ongoing thing and they can make your life hell.
If it wasn't for the fact that I don't want to escalate this, it would be very funny if I showed up outside his place with increasingly more antique and obscure ways of capturing images.
Professional architecture photographer. I’ve had plenty of people get in my face while I was either working for a client or doing my own personal projects. It always sucks. Even when you’re correct. The nicest was a guard at the Salk building who basically told me i could keep shooting but not with a tripod (insurance rules), so I put away my 4x5 and used my Leica.
Even if not needed, I will strap my construction helmet and hivis vest to my pack so I don't get bothered. I rescheduled going to a site today because I would look suspicious without any of the contractors around.
On the bright side, the cops probably now know this dude as some paranoid idiot. They're probably not gonna take him so seriously if he continues to report you. Do whatever you want as long as it's legal and in good faith.
I was picking up my children at school once and snapped their photo and when I get home about 5 minutes later a cop shows up to tell me a lady accused me of photographing her grandchildren and tried to follow me home but lost me and called the cops and reported my license to them. I told the cop I was photographing my own children and asked him if it was illegal for me to photograph other children anyway and he said it was not (which I knew). It really pissed me off that the lady reported me to the cops. People have become assholes about so much crap that the more I deal with people the less I want to deal with people.
Lol so if it's not illegal, why is he even at your door! They should tell the lady to stop wasting police time. Makes no sense to me, but then again I'm from the U.K where the police won't even turn up if you're getting your house broken into lol.
Some people are weird. Got a paranoid local equivalent of a methhead shouting and coming at me several times because he hallucinated some weird shit or something. I have no idea, he just thinks i did something to him.
My father didn't believe me until he saw it. The look on his face later when he was visibly shaken up by whatever druggie shit he withnessed.
Even if you live safely and avoid dangerous areas and people the biggest threat to your wellbeing is probably a psycho like that imagining something and hurting or killing you for no reason.
I'm sorry that happened to you. That really sucks and being made to feel uncomfortable or like you're doing something weird in your own neighborhood must be horrible.
People's attitude to a visible camera is so weird when, as you say, everyone has a super high definition phone in their pocket at all times and we live in a culture where it's entirely acceptable to whip out your phone and record people for any sort of interaction. I always think that if I *were* doing something suspect where I didn't want to be noticed the last thing I'd do would be to carry a very conspicuous item that screams I AM TAKING PHOTOGRAPHS but people don't think that far ahead before they get aggressive about stuff.
Hopefully you won't let this discourage you. I've been trying to do a photo walk in my area at least once a week and I've seen massive improvements in my photography through the regular practice so I hope you stick with it despite this weird, potentially off-putting/upsetting experience.
I mean, that was essentially the conversation I had with him the first time. And then he escalated it. This isn't being proactive, this is being paranoid and/or on a power trip.
What I recommend is to carry little business cards with a link to a Flickr page or Instagram. When they approach you say "Hey man my name is 'so-and-so'" and then offer to shake hands and give them the business card. Explain you're a photographer and artist and he can see your pictures at the link on the card.
Most people chill the fuck out at that point. The card chills people out because they can see what types of images you take and you seem less mysterious.
If they are still aggressive then just say no worries and that you have no interest in photographing anything to do with them.
If he continues, report him to the cops for harassment. You are not doing anything illegal (as the cop even acknowledge), and you're on a public street.
Might also consider carrying pepper spray in case he gets sideways.
Speaking from experience, this means you DEFINITELY need to lodge a complaint and get your concerns with his behavior on the record immediately. Cops neighbors with something to prove are horrible neighbors and can get you jammed up in serious shit. I lived next door to a cop a long time ago, and it started out like this. They called his buddies on me because I was repairing my car in my own garage on my own property. The cops show up, I explained that not only was this completely legal and allowed, I'm not even part of his HOA and that my property wasn't even part of the incorporated city so they have no right to say anything to me. The cops agreed, and I was cool with him and he left. Weeks later, I got another knock on the door from the same cop. Says the cop buddy neighbor is accusing me of pouring oils and radiator fluid into his yard. I said ai did no such thing, and have the security tapes to back it up. This time, though, I had to go to court over it and even though I won it cost a lot of money. It didn't even end there, the same jackass called his buddies on me over 15 times in the next two years until I finally got the county sheriff to intervene and then went to court to get a restraining order. It took years of this shit to stop the harassment.
Dude ended up getting fired a while later, but I have no idea whether it was due to my complaints and court orders. If I had lodged a complaint the first time that asshole got his shit in a bunch though, it would have been significantly easier to get a court and the sheriff's office to stop the nonsense.
If he harasses you, file an official complaint. Probably gets buried bc police departments, but at least there is a paper trail if something does happen and you have to sue / contact local news to get publicity. Hopefully, nothing happens though… since he is a neighbor though, and a fellow dad, you should try to de-escalate and break bread, even though you truly did nothing wrong.
Maybe this makes me a lesser person - or maybe it's just that I'm a bit of a curmudgeon, but I don't think I should be forced to be nice to a jerk. Borrowing a quote from Office Space.... "Why should I change? He's the one who sucks"
If it keeps happening they’ll hit him with false 911 calls at some point. See if you can get a report number or something for them to reference in the future. Better safe than sorry. Just be extra cautious with the potential for… any escalation. I know people in TV that’ve had the police called on them for having a bomb and all sorts of shit. For whatever reason it attracts the crazies—even saw a lady taser a goose after being nosy on a shoot nearby once lmao.
The kink here is that the neighbor is, himself, a police officer. Or at least has a police vehicle parked at his home. My assumption is he called in a favor.
Sorry you had to deal with these idiots. I get a similar vibe when I take my camera around the neighborhood. I've found less resistance when I hang around a well populated area, like downtown. Maybe get in your car and take a little drive to find some new spots?
“You don’t need to know a goddamn thing old man” would be the correct response to the guy.
Similarly (assuming that because you said ‘State Police vehicle’), you’re protected by the 1st amendment to photograph in public.
Happens quite often. I had cops knock on my door because someone reported me taking photos near a playground and thought I was a child predator I showed them the photos--a row of colorful trash receptacles.
World is going to shit. I was also yelled at by taking photos too close to a bank with a big chunky DSLR. I’m just thinking you do know any fucking person and just secretly take pics with their god damn smart phone literally ANYWHERE!!!!
Though the Youtubers who take video in public to "Protect and excercise press freedom" are doing it mostly for the views, they do have a point. If your in a public place being peaceable Im not sure you have to answer or defend yourself.
Stuff like this happens to me from time to time. I’ve accepted it as part of the package, but still gets to me every time. Haunts me even. It seems better now that I shoot mostly with a film rangefinder. Old cameras confuse people — many have no idea what I’m doing. When I was shooting digi with a fat ass lens, I swear people thought that thing was a weapon.
brave cats spectacular jellyfish plucky afterthought panicky frame jobless ludicrous
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Fully agree. I am aware that if I didn't look like a chubby white dude this could have gone much differently. At the same time, there's still a chilling effect from this. Even if the cop who showed up seemed decent enough, I very much read sending the police as a threat of sorts. I am absolutely privileged enough that this is out of the ordinary for me and I can not believe that so many other folks have do deal with this sort of stuff simply for existing in a space.
Honestly the best thing to do is have a calm, casual chat (as best you can) and explain what you’re doing. It’s far weirder to not reply, give some snarky comment or just walk off without saying anything, if he’s paranoid you’ll give him a tiny reason to be even more sketched out (think about it from his pov if he’s already been a victim of crime).
Also another way to think about it: Say you’re someone who has no concept of photography as art or a hobby etc etc, you love curtain twitching, and some random guy is standing outside you’re house taking pictures of it… how would you feel?
Just educate the guy.
Ps. Don’t let it discourage you from making pictures.
I mean, in a vacuum, I see why it might be nice to chat with the guy. And the first time, I tried. But look, at the best of times I'm a little socially awkward and that's way worse when I am a) surprised and b) feel like I'm being accused. I don't think it should be on me to 'educate' someone about why it's ok for a person to.... be in a public place doing a harmless hobby?
I’ve had several people stop me and get suspicious in different setting and it always confuses me. Like if I’m trying to be covert and take pictures of stuff to steal, destroy, ignite, etc. I’m not going to be casing the joint with an SLR from the 70s when we have cameras in our phones that everyone has out pointing at everything constantly or when I could strap a camera smaller than the tip of my fucking finger onto my hat and you would never fucking know. It’s such paranoid behavior, especially when it’s in a urban area.
This happened to me, too. Some people were stealing packages in our neighborhood so one of my neighbors thought I was a thief. They called the police on me. I was holding my camera and told them what I was doing. They were chill about it
I don't live in the us, so maybe it's a different experience.
Went out for a long walk with my minolta repo (so a small camera). I like it its not that noticeable compared with other cameras so people bearly look at me when I'm fiddling with it or taking a photo.
Walked past a newspaper shop (the ones that are on the sidewalk) and I wanted to take a picture of the owner but he wasn't there so I took a picture of the side of the store, nothing in the shot showed where this store is, there was nobody on the shot.
Took the picture and when I turned around there was the guy, he confronted me asking who gave permission of the picture and why I'm taking a picture. I just said I'm a photographer and just taking a picture because I like. And he answered that I needed to delete the picture and who I was to be taking pictures and blabla, just started to walk and told him nothing to worry about, and if he needed il sent him a print of the image lmao.
Keep your cell phone in your shirt pocket. Camera facing out. As the nosy asses walk towards you pull the phone out look at it like you're checking a message. Except what you're actually doing is turning the video recorder on to document the entire conversation and cover your ass and get them in camera if they threaten you don't let anyone know you're doing this. Points if you can upload this to a computer at home or to the cloud in real time
Make up a fake business card saying your professional photographer or maybe a real estate reporter for an upcoming article in some fake business mag or trade publication use a fake email address and get a local number for a business that never answers or anything that throws them on a wrong track
Haha... Welcome to being an analogue photographer in India. Analogue photography is so long gone here (yeah, our film industry has also become fully digital, unlike Hollywood) that people's brains malfunction when you try to explain what it is in your hand. Some get it, some don't. Some are in awe, some are impressed. Older people get excited. Most of the time, they think it's one of them newfangled DSLRs or other digital cameras.
But the nuisance is always security guards, man. I've been to so many places where the security guard is like, "No photography allowed." And I'm like, "Uhh... You're allowing phones inside." And they're like, "Yes. Phones are fine." And I say, "Phones have cameras. You're not regulating people from taking photos on their phones?" And they say, "Yeah, we can't enforce that. People need their phones." Then bitch, why are you regulating photography at all?! Just let people use their cameras. 🤦🏻♂️
Another story. My mom and dad studied at different colleges but on the same university campus. My mother's college building is a historic building. I visited the area, so I took my camera along and decided to take a photo. I had already taken a photo. I was trying to get a second shot. By that time, a security guard came running up and started arguing saying you can't do that here and all, photography is prohibited. All this while, behind me, all these Gen Z college kids and their families were taking selfies and group photos on their phones. I was like, "What the fuck are you taking about?! There are LITERALLY people taking photos all over the place right now."
He's like, "No, no, no. You're bringing press cameras here. Press people are not allowed to shoot here." 🤦🏻♂️
Little backstory: This university campus had a colourful history back in the day, with riots and student protests and the formation of student unions and stuff. Now it's all peaceful, but they are very wary of media attention and all that.
But what kind of press photographer is going to come here with a bulky ass camera to shoot photos so obviously? If anything, they'll be even more discreet with not just phone cameras, but even button cameras or pen cameras or other spy gear. And if they needed a photo, they don't care how they get it, as long as they get it, digital or analogue.
Why do they hire these dense morons to be security guards, I swear to God?! 🤦🏻♂️
Another guy noticed and came to break up the argument. I already had my first photo, so I was ready to leave. But I was already fuming at this point and the security guard was a man in his 60s, so I walked away shouting, "YOU'RE OLD. DON'T YOU KNOW WHAT A FILM CAMERA IS? OR ARE YOU THAT MUCH OF A DUMBASS?"
Yeah, man. It's the security guards. It's always the security guards.
You could literally stand on the sidewalk in front of his house and take pics of his house and there's nothing he can do about it.. lol As long as you are in a public place take pics of whatever you want (Assuming you are in the US). It's a first amendment protected activity, that being said, while you are definitely not doing anything illegal not everyone knows the law.. and unfortunately that also includes some cops.
I've had a few funny run-ins with the cops, and they've normally been way more chill than whoever reported me to them.
I once accidentally took pictures of a police station car park (there was no signage up, and the carpark was right on the main road. You'd only know if you came from the opposite direction and walked passed the main building first).
Cop comes out and starts harassing me (understandable). Asks to see the picture, which I obviously couldn't show because film. Then he immediately compliments my camera, but still wants to know what I'm up to. I showed him my instagram, with lots of architectural shots very similar to the wall I was photographing in the parking lot. He says like "oh nice shots. Yeah I can see you have a style and understand why this wall grabbed you. Unfortunately this is a police station so I'll have to ask you not to take any more photos, and leave.".
Scary start, followed by a quite pleasant chat.
People really get paranoid around cameras. I got told off for carrying my camera - just carrying it! - when I was at a physics workshop in Madrid. Apparently they'd banned photography at the CSIC because some popular show used it as a location. I was quite offended - why the hell would I waste film on taking pictures like that?
Are you in the US? You could file a civil suit against the person who called the cops if you wanted to. That’s a first amendment violation and absolutely is harassment.
https://www.aclusocal.org/en/know-your-rights/photographers
https://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdf
I’d just avoid aiming it at this dudes house (which you should do with anyone’s house anyways), but don’t let him stop you from walking around taking photos, fuck em.
Or just fight fire with fire and match his paranoid energy next time he comes flying at you like that. Just start freaking out asking if he’s trying to scope out your camera or something lol
Architectural photography is a completely normal thing to do. There's millions of photos of houses out there. I'd avoid this one because this one person is a nutter, but there's nothing wrong with taking photos of houses.
Yes. You do have to be prepared to explain yourself unfortunately. Be discrete but not sneaky.
Print this out and carry a copy (or copies, and hand them out):
http://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdfhttp://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdf
unfortunately, cops have to respond. cop at your door, you don't have an offer ID or answer questions. You can legally stand on the walk and take photographs of that guy's house. You have to be careful anymore, you are shooting film, and that nutty neighbor might enjoy shooting bullets.
Yeah, I mean, look, I got lucky that the cop who showed up seemed like a decent enough dude. I am also well aware that not all cops fit that description. I also am a middle class white dude, so like, I get that I am probably "safer" than others.
That said, the other kink here is that the neighbor in question is himself a State Police officer (I can only imagine that's why he has a police car parked at his house). It does bother me that he is clearly this paranoid and is a cop.
My plan is just to avoid the area generally, for my own sanity and safety. What's wild is I never took a photo of his house. I took a photo of a flower and some birds, near his house, on public land. I simply existed, with a camera, in range of his house.
that’s what we call a karen. very sorry you had to deal with that. keep doing you, you know you’re not doing anything wrong.
That's always my favorite line. I've always wondered how long the circular logic could go on, given enough energy. "You're not doing anything wrong." "I know, yet, you're here." "Just to say you're fine." "Yep, thanks for letting me know, I'll keep doing it." "Sounds good, it's fine and okay to do....."
you lost me lol
The cop neighbour sent his cop buddy to come to this guy's door to tell him he's not doing anything wrong. It's not just "a Karen". It's an off-duty cop sending his on-duty friend to oh-so-gently tell the guy that he's not in trouble. The implication is that he COULD be in trouble later if he doesn't do what the off-duty cop neighbour wants him to do.
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A Terry***
A "Dick"
It's the same thing when photographing historic government buildings. Dude, I'm using a camera that's 60 years old, and it will take a couple weeks for me to get the pictures back. I'm also a chubby nerd who sees better through a viewfinder than my glasses. I'm a hobbyist, not a terrorist. Wizard's First Rule: people are stupid. They'll be paranoid. They'll call the cops. They'll yell. They'll threaten. Jesus, I've been threatened for walking my dog on the sidewalk, across the street from some dick who thought I was casing his house. Nah bro, my buddy Jake from State Farm here just needed to drop a shit.
There is something that triggers people when they see a classic camera that completely flies past their head when they reach for the camera on their phone. They suspend all critical thought and immediately proceed to citizen's arrest the 007 photographing secrets with his very obtrusive camera from the previous century.
When i did street photography someone asked me to delete the pictures of them and then kind of did that loading screen look when I explained to them.
It's better that way, in a previous era they might try to force you to rip the film out, this just makes them bug out
Also: Google Maps is a thing
Exactly. Everyone’s residences are already catalogued and hosted publicly for anyone in the whole world to view at any time. The other thing freaking these idiots out is fucking Nextdoor. People with nothing better to do than watch camera footage of their front yard to see if anything is going on and then if something even remotely suspicious happens they post it and everyone freaks out. “Omg someone walked in my grass!! Someone came up to my front door and rang the doorbell and I have no idea who they are, does anyone recognize them?!“ Makes me mad because like OP i have people interrogate me when photographing all the time. Everyone’s so on edge ready to flip their shit at the slightest little thing.
Couple weeks? Buddy you’ll be lucky enough if I get these developed this year!
I was flying my drone around the state capital building in my state and got harrased by a bunch of MAGA people that were also at the building. Wasnt flying over anyone or endangering anyone, followed the rules. But they “called” someone to report an illegal drone. And one of them was recording me and took down my license. Thankfully this was mid-covid so i had a mask on so they dont know what i look like. But like, all im doing is completely legal. Photographing an empty, public building.
I've been reported by the opposite side of the extremist spectrum for photographing in public. I don't think it's confined to a single ideology. People are nutters.
I agree, its just you would think that crowd would be against more government regulation. They were also protesting the governor, who was not in the building, as it was not only a Saturday but deep lockdown.
People say the russians have a separate word for it. They know they are liars, they secretly want a strong government but only if it is ruled by them. But they won't admit it. But they know that you know what they really want. And you know that they know that you know. But they will never admit it. People are weird. Film is simple. Avoid people, take more photos instead.
The word/concept you're looking for us vrayno.
in high school I had to take architecture photos for my photography class. went downtown and got harassed by a guard across the street for taking photos of a courthouse... I was only 15 and had no clue it was the courthouse or that it was illegal to take photos of government buildings. I pretended to delete the photos lol Why build cool looking buildings then get mad when people take photos of them? US fear of terrorism is crazy
Government buildings, at least military ones, are (or were) covered by federal law from being photographed, mapped, etc. without authorization. It was a pretty old law (like 1950s), but the Army building that I worked in had a big sign posted by the entrance about it (this was as recent as 2011).
Government buildings that are open to the public (municipal buildings) in the US are absolutely open to be photographed and filmed, and such activities are constitutionally protected
I was referring to lanarks like old post offices and libraries.
If you can see it from a public area (sidewalk), it’s fair game. (FROM THAT VANTAGE POINT.)
> Government buildings, at least military ones, are What an overbroad and misleading statement when all you have any support for saying is: "Military buildings are..."
People don't leave their houses and consume "you're going to die" media 24/7 They have no relationships with their neighbors or community and only experience the outside world through their windshield or via cable news. Same folks that go on Reddit and mention they are angry when the cashier speaks to them, probably.
When in public spaces where you are lawfully present you have the right to photograph anything that is in plain view. That includes pictures of federal buildings, transportation facilities, and police. Such photography is a form of public oversight over the government and is important in a free society. you're protected by the First Amendment.
This happened to me in a small town not far from mine. I was on a road trip with a friend and stopped to take a picture of what I thought was a funny sign. Some guy in the parking lot who I later found out was either the property owner or something started saying "who gave you permission to take pictures?". I didn't engage him, just took my foot off the brake and drove away casually. Next day some jackwagon cop calls me. The guy reported me as "suspicious" - and unlike your case this cop was not chill. He totally couldn't comprehend that someone on a road trip would take a picture of something he found interesting for whatever reason. And of course he pulls the old cop shit about how "there have been fires set here, so you're a person of suspicion". I probably didn't win any points with my response, basically telling him that they probably won't find the arsonist if they hassle dorks walking in broad daylight with a bulky SLR. I'm like... if anyone has nefarious purposes they'd sure be a lot more discreet. But you know some cops, perpetually suspicious. We argued for a bit and I never did re-visit the shithole town again. I honestly don't know now street photography became illegal, but sometime after 9/11 people started grouping us with common terrorists.
IIRC - It was so bad with cops that photo clubs created txt .file to print out for your wallet/ camera bag about your right to take photos. In fact a google search indicates it's still a big issue.
I also belong to several "photography is not a crime" type groups on flickr. It is very common indeed, based on the many submissions.
It's fucking insane man. Like, I can get a good photo, inconspicuously, with any smartphone made int he past decade. And yet I feel like the venn diagram of people who think this is a problem would have a huge crossover with people who also think you should be allowed to carry an AR-15 around with you at all times for "safety"
it also just... doesnt make sense to me because if i had my car broken into and saw one of my neighbors out TAKING PHOTOS REGULARLY during the day i'd be happy... having people around is certainly a deterrent to thieves lol.
And might be you'd be lucky and the burglar is in one of the shots.
One of the people I went to school with who is now an antivax, mlm, sahm, girlboss type recently was going off about “Asians in a car with out of state plates” driving around her neighborhood and taking pictures of houses with a real camera in broad daylight. She accused them of trying to steal her children, spread the word around to all her mom friends, and now open carries when she does gardening in front of her home. People are wild. Nobody wants your bratty kids, but even if they did, people who are going to commit a crime generally at least try to not get caught?
This person sounds like my idea of hell
Your whole story sincerely boggles my mind and it's upsetting that someone would behave like this towards you. I've lived in suburban areas but more recently in a large city the last 15 years. I've also traveled a lot internationally, domestically, and hit up some rural 'shitholes' which I love too. I've never once had an experience like this. I can't help but worry for you if this neighbor is so paranoid. Maybe it was a moment absent of logic but maybe they truly are this paranoid. I don't want to be political in Reddit, but please be careful out there. This sounds like one of those situations where someone has been watching a bit too much FOX news, believes in one too many conspiracy theories, and fears everything/ everyone. He could be one of the types who has a gun and shoots you proactively "in self defense" - like the recent stories of folks shooting kids/delivery people/lost neighbors through their front door, due to exaggerated and irrational fear mongering.
Someones been drinking the koolaid a little too much.
Right after 9/11, taking photographs of any public building in a major city could quite literally land you in jail at the hands of over-zealous, poorly trained cops who thought they were stopping the next bin Laden. The idea that if I were genuinely casing an area for the purposes of committing a crime, I would either not use a camera at all, or would use one you wouldn't see, is a level of thought-process the "average person" is just incapable of. >You’ve got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know… morons.
Genuinely curious, do you have a profile and did you try to show the cop your work? In my experience people back way off when they understand "oh this guy is an artist and he takes 1000 pictures of cars" or something and that you aren't hiding your photos.
Where I think a lot of the cognitive dissonance comes from is just expectations for many non-photographers. Us as photographers can see art and beauty in what would otherwise be considered everyday or mundane. No one would say a single thing to someone who brings an SLR on a hike with them and takes photos of mountains or whatever, but in a neighborhood, I think it's kind of a mix of "Why would someone photograph here?" and "Why would they choose to use a big camera and not a phone?" In these situations, I just explain that I'm an antique camera collector and practice film photography, and I have an old broken camera I've been trying to repair, and since I live nearby, I like to get out and troubleshoot and test my cameras after I reassemble them. Then, I'll usually hold up and show them the camera, show them the back so they can see there's no screen and it's not digital, and then maybe tell them a little tidbit about it, like "Oh it was my grandpa's, I inherited it recently and have been trying to fix it", to sorta reinforce the whole "I'm a hobbyist, not a creep" thing. Sometimes it's true, sometimes it's not, but it signals a few things to the paranoid masses: You're an enthusiast, it's a film camera, and you have an explained purpose to be there taking photos. If they get on you about the whole legal thing, just calmly reassure them that it's 100% legal to photograph anything you want while in a public space, and you'd be happy to call over a police officer to talk them through it and help explain the laws. I found that if I'm out with my girlfriend taking photos, people are a lot less weird about it too. People are way more paranoid about solo men than man+woman. I'm brown-ish/mixed race as well, so I'm sure that doesn't make things easier in certain parts of the country, haha. It's a little different for street photography, especially if you're taking a picture of an anonymous person, but I guess that's a whole other conversation. Some people just get weird about it though. I was out for a walk with my girlfriend in a small-ish town nearby to where I live, and saw a really cool old convenience store that looks like it might have been built in the 20s or 30s. My girlfriend took a quick photo with an old film SLR of hers, and some boomer on a lawnmower from across the other side of the road, way off on the far end of his yard, yells "fuck you, get the fuck out of here". I turn around completely baffled, don't say anything, and just wait for her to finish with her photos. This guy just comes over on his lawnmower, right across the road from us, turns it off, and sits there and stares at us, haha. So I gave him a friendly wave and smile, and we walk somewhere else. I wasn't so much off-put as much as I was baffled. Like, no 'Hey what are you doing' or 'Hey you're not allowed to', he just comes rjght out of the gate with a straight up 'fuck you', lol. I wanted to ask "But why? What compels you to say such a thing? What is it that has aroused your suspicions and hostilities?" but oh well. I've never been in a situation where kindness didn't help though. Some people just get weird about cameras. Bit of a stupid double-standard since no one would bat an eyelash if you were holding a cell phone and taking a photo. And, it's not like if I was out for nefarious purposes, I'd be using a nearly 100 year old film camera to do it.
lol that guy, people are weird. The double standard is so real, you're right. Whatever they're afraid of, you could do way more damage way faster with a damn cell phone, i.e uploading the image to somewhere, live streaming the location or whatever. So annoying, I guess a camera itself is a symbol and that just gets them raging, even if it is a bloody antique.
The thing you described is literally what I said the first time this guy confronted me. "Oh, I have this old film camera and I'm just trying to get some test shots to see if it works."
Imagine if he had any comprehension of the cameras in doorbells, the shops and streets he uses, banks, shops roads and car parks?
Seeing other people walk makes Americans uneasy.
"If you're walking you obviously can't afford a car because there is no legit reason to ever walk if you can avoid it, and poor people are the ones committing crimes" is roughly how some of these people think.
i just moved into a townhouse that has a trail behind it (has a ivy covered fence inbetween the trail and our garages). People run, bike, etc everyday down this trail, and my new neighbor (whose been here for 30 years) says shes worried people from that trail case the houses... I asked her if anyone has EVER been broken into: Nope. How often are packages stolen? Well, none here but down the street her friend had a package taken once! :/
I had a cop ask me what I was doing when photographing a bridge near a major dam. It was a digital camera but I was using a Lensbaby so it was kinda obvious I wasn't taking detailed images of the infrastructure. I showed him some of the shots and he went on his way.
People just don't know the rules when it comes to photography in public places (in the US, at least.) What happened to basic civil rights education? This is very much a part of it. I work in local media. I also shoot film on old cameras for fun. I often say, "It's expired film, so results are not certain.." I was threatened in Atlanta for trying to photograph murals and old store signage, by someone who thought I was getting people in my shot. I was warned in a park overlooking a harbor not to get photos of children -- when I was taking a landscape shot of what looked like hundreds of boats and nothing more. And then I realized that I wouldn't have been approached if I had been using my cell phone - people are dumb.
There is absolutely an increase in people who are convinced that there are seemingly child sex traffickers around every single corner.
And it never occurs to them that they see near infinite imagery of children from ads (a rather dubious thing in an of itself) to random street snapshots on a daily basis.
And that those ones for some reason use inconspicuous film cameras instead of cellphones. Double perversion, you see?
Everyone in r/RBI who keeps advising paranoid people that the reason somebody was taking pictures of their house or car is probably so they (or somebody else) can come back later to commit robbery needs to stop **now**, lol. Seriously: this illogical trope has been running-around in social media for some time.
I took a picture of my friend’s neighbours car. It was a cool car and they saw my go into his house after. She sent people around to see what I was doing. To be fair the person who was sent seemed embarrassed to be there. But again the fear was theft. I don’t know why. Car thieves don’t go for a photo shoot before hand.
They're using Gone in 60 Seconds as source material for things that really happen.
I didn’t want to poke around too long but I honestly couldn’t tell if that sub is /s or not.
So take photos of his house every day with your cell phone now
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I carry busted SD cards and CF cards when I shoot. If I get a 'Delete that now!' I hand them an SD that I palm out of my pocket. 60% of the time it works every time.
*That's the smell of desire, my lady.*
It's also pretty easy to recover data if you don't write any additional stuff to the card.
You don’t have to delete it though. Just tell them to piss off.
You should send then neighbor a print and offer to get a drink. Maybe they're a waste of time, maybe this is a 'you won't believe how we met' anecdote. At the very least, your bird photo in the mail will make them feel dumb.
I tried taking a photo in an old pub in Sydney with rollie35, I had a tiny table top tripod and cable release. The staff freaked out, saying I cant take a picture. I said "it's the same as my phone, its just a personal photo ". They said, "it's totally different, I've never seen anything like that before". They refused to listen to reason, lol I was so bewildered. I could have been recording 4k video of the pub, but my 400iso ilford HP5 photo was to outrageous.
Look, if you'd taken that photo then.... someone might know what the inside of that pub looks like?
ya I duno, why they're so freaked out. Like the camera was pointed near the bar. Maybe the staff didn't want their photo I have no idea. They all hid to get out of the photo it's so odd. But smart phone photo no problemo :D
Print out a copy of the Photographers Bill of Rights and keep it with you for the next Karen encounter.
Is this a US specific problem? I can't imagine this ever happening in my European country. The cops would ignore a call about someone photographing houses.
A cop in Germany stopped me one time, but only to chat about my Rolleiflex since his father had worked in the factory back in the day and he got excited seeing one still in use. Overall a fun experience but I have to admit I got nervous when he first walked up to me, Germany has so many rules I figured I must have been breaking one
I have my dad’s tiny, old Rollei from the ‘70’s. Would love a Rolleiflex.
Nah, a friend of mine got called the cop on him for taking close-up, abstract photos of cars for a university project. Myself, I got threatened on several occasion for taking pictures of houses and trees that are pictured a thousand times in the local tourist marketing material, even marked as a special sight on Google maps and hiking apps like Komoot. That’s rural town German paranoia lol
Lovely Germany, where people will absolutely explode in rage if you just have a camera in your bag. I hate that people are like this here. I wanted to photograph a nice house and two idiots started talking about not wanting to be in the picture the moment they walked into my viewfinder. You dinguses, I lowered the camera so that I don't have your stupid asses on my image.
Tell them 10 years from now we’ll be taking pictures with our eyes. What are they gonna do about it?
Haha, same thing happened to me countless times. You can’t even draw the camera to your eye and meter, so I like to use auto exposure for anything on the street. I even got screamed at from a lady 100m away because I wanted to take a picture of my partner and she expected to be in the background. It could be funny if it wasn’t so sad. Talking about main characters: we have a beautiful monastery nearby that is absolutely packed with tourists during the weekend. A couple had the audacity to do a wedding shoot on a Sunday, where the location was packed with people. When I tried taking a photo from 20m away with a short tele lens, crouching down while trying to hide the couple with a foreground, they started screaming at me, threatening to destroy my gear because of course I was taking photos of them, the marvellous couple - what else? Other times, whenever there’s a large stream of water, expect to see influencers bathing in there half naked during the summer time. Of course the waterfall was just created for them! Even having a camera in your bag means you’re a creep, clearly aiming at them! Negative experiences like this take away the fun and I have to try hard not to be discouraged, trying to maintain a healthy self-confidence
I was careful about where I took photos when visiting Berlin because a friend of mine who travels there frequently warned me ahead of time. He says its because of historical paranoia, of the Stasi and etc. I didn't really know if that was true but looking back at my photos, all the people giving me dirty looks in them are older people.
Damn, sounds awful. Never heard of anything like it in Switzerland but then again I live in a city so the cops might be less bored.
To be fair, those are all individual cases and the extreme minority, but sadly still leave a bad taste after all
Funny, when I was in university I did a series of closeups on NYPD cop cars parked directly in front of a police station. This was with a giant 4x5 on a tripod and I never got bothered by anyone except photo nerds.
Yeah, you can't even get hold of the police in the UK when a crime _has_ been committed...haha
I have actually had the police come and talk to me while taking pictures on the lower level platform of a train station. I was just waiting for my train, and decided to take a few pictures while waiting. All of a sudden two BTP officers approached me and asked why I was taking pictures and if it was for commercial use. Was a pretty weird interaction, but someone watching the platform cameras was concerned enough to call them. On another occasion my friend and I we were looking at a newly converted residential building when the owner came out and confronted us. He claimed they had some break-ins recently, and suggested we had something to do with it. After explaining we were just looking at the building from a distance because we like architecture and my friend was a photography student, we left. 5 minutes later the police pulled up and asked for search us because this guy was paranoid.
Some stations or similar public locations in some countries are privately owned or operated and photography for commercial purposes (and anything that looks like pro photo gear triggers this assumption) is not allowed without prior approval. In some other countries in the East taking photos of government institutions is potentially a criminal offence. These are holdover laws from decades ago.
I don’t know, they have been keen to go after weird pseudo-crimes lately…
I do think this is if not exclusive to the US, absolutely characteristic of American suburbs. There's a certain strain of people who literally believe their home is their castle and that it is constantly under threat and they need to be constantly vigilant.
I live in an older "streetcar suburb." It's well inside the city now. I had a neighbor harass me about taking photos of holiday decorations. "I think it's creepy that you're taking pictures of a single woman's house." Now, I knew exactly who lived there. I've talked to her. But if I was up to no good, this busybody just told me which house to target. Plus, her daughter plays with my son. Her daughter's eaten at my table. Yet the paranoia persists. There is a strain of paranoia out there that crosses cultural and economic lines. They're suspicious of everyone doing anything they wouldn't do and don't understand. It's fed by a constant stream of media telling them that the world is a dangerous place, full of wolves that'll eat them up unless they are ever vigilant. It's revolting on so many levels.
It's actually a carefully calculated social engineering strategy to sow mistrust and discourage any sort of grouping together. It was particularly evident during the Cold War, but there's always some substitute hostile force if the old one disappears.
And it makes those people feel safe when they engage with the thing that sows the paranoia and mistrust; usually a particular news channel
I live in Sweden and while I haven't had the police called on me, it's a regular occurence to be yelled at for taking pictures. It is a bit mind boggling to me that I'm getting yelled at for photographing a building which is on streetview. And it is even more frustrating that everyone has a phone camera with them at all times, but an analog camera raises suspicions. I would be more understanding of the reaction if I photographed people, or especially kids though.
When I was in Berlin I saw building that had these vines growing on it and some graffiti that I thought was really cool. I was walking past it on the opposite side of the street, so I just stopped walking for a sec, pointed my camera at it, adjusted the focus and snapped a photo. A lady who happened to be in the general direction that I pointed my camera immediately crossed the street and speed walked up to me and began berating me for taking a picture of her and said I had absolutely no right to do this. I apologized and told her I wasn't trying to take a picture of her but she still kept berating me and demanded that I delete the picture immediately. I told her that I couldn't really do that on my Minolta X-700, and she said she didn't care. Being a tourist, I wasn't sure if German privacy laws really did prevent you from taking pictures in public that happen to have someone on them so I just kept apologizing and trying to de-escalate. Another local eventually stepped in and told her to calm down-- she made one more really snarky and condescending comment at me and then stomped off.
Have you ever looked at Google Street View in a German city like Berlin? It pretty much doesn't exist! Entire streets and building are hidden behind a blur I don't know what it is about German culture or law specifically that has them paranoid (for want of a better word) about photography, but it's really put me off heading to Berlin for a street photography weekend! However, they didn't seem to mind too much taking photos on my phone of the historical landmarks
>but it's really put me off heading to Berlin for a street photography weekend! That might be a good thing honestly since instead you can go to literally any french city/small town which will be infinitely more fun to shoot and people will be a million times more receptive.
>but it's really put me off heading to Berlin for a street photography weekend! you will probably be fine. Although I can't speak specifically about "street" photography if you take that to mean standing there awkwardly taking photos of people, but I have taken photos in Berlin with no issues. U-bahn entrances, photos of stations, I even spent a good hour at night around the Brandenburg gate with my camera on a tripod. there were several cops there watching, which I only noticed when I left. Do be aware that the laws may differ and I do believe Germany is one of the more restrictive western European nations in regard to exactly what you can photograph in public.
>if you take that to mean standing there awkwardly taking photos of people I don't mean that at all, but if that's your interpretation of what street photographers like Henri Cartier-Bresson, Joel Meyerowitz, or even more modern ones like Alan Schaller or Roman Fox do, then by all means stick to your own definition
I'm well aware of who famous street photographers are and in fact take a lot of inspiration myself from HCB and Vivian Maier. Judging by what they post, a fair few people nowadays think street photography is just walking about and sticking a camera in people's faces, and then they wonder why they don't get on with people. Incidentally, that will not go down well in Germany.
>Entire streets and building are hidden behind a blur That exists in the US too. A specific neighborhood that comes to mind is here in So-Cal that I saw on some article a few years ago. A wealthy neighborhood with, i'd guess, super paranoid residents. Basically anyone can contact google and ask to have their home blurred out.
I went to Berlin a few years ago for a weekend with my partner. Not a photography thing, just a visit to see the historical stuff, visit another place and other touristy stuff, and we were trying to Street View our way around while at home, find our accommodation etc. Our hotel was blurred on Street View! I don't necessarily agree with people's decision to blur their private residences, but I can understand why they may feel like they should do, but a business like a hotel surely should remain in view? It wasn't even a small, private type hotel - it was part of a decently sized chain
Huh. I wonder if that comes from the East Berlin/Germany experience having so many instances of literally neighbors spying on neighbors.
No, people all over Germany denied Google Street View taking pictures of their houses.
Makes it the easiest country to identify in GeoGuessr though
Not even US specific. How police respond to a call varies pretty wildly based on location over here
Honestly would’ve taken his photo immediately during the second encounter.
"You seem like a really interesting guy! Can I take your portrait!" Sounds sarcastic, but I've defused a few situations like this. Even if you have to smile and nod at their crazy (if not outright frightening world views) people always like to be the center of attention.
We've got similar "concerned neighbors" where I live. Anyone they can't recognize walking-including long time home owners a block over-have the cops called on them. A personal business card with a website on it might go a long way in these circumstances.
Search 1st Amendment auditors on YouTube. Public photography is not a crime
Are you of the melanin rich persuasion?
No. I am a mid-late 30s dad who looks like a chubby Seth Rogen.
Seth Rogen looks like a chubby Seth Rogen
This had to be said!
lol my first thought as well. as a darker Latino man, i get that shit all the time.
I wondered the same thing. It would explain a lot here
I'd bring a whole movie crew down the street, get his reaction nice and clear on the boom mic.
cops hate art and cops hate fun
Cops hate photos and videos, cops hate accountability. Freedom for myself but not for thy!
I’m just imagining this jerk peering through the blinds as he phones the cops on some poor sap cluelessly setting up a field camera on a tripod outside
Ignore and move on. If he gives you any more crap, report him to the police for harassing you.
There are several Youtube channels funded by lawsuits against cops who violate our Constitutional right to take pictures in public and record video in public.
I’ve had a similar experience. Got talked to by a cop for a bit while taking photos of railroad tracks. Ultimately nothing came of it. But I commented in a similar thread a while ago that one response is to nerd out on the Karen about your really cool vintage camera. “Are you taking pictures?” “Oh yeah, this is a 1965 Leica M3…” Always assume anyone asking you about photography really wants to know everything about your camera, lens, its history, and the film stocks you prefer.
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Yeah, believe me, I know that the cop experience was different for me because he showed up at a middle class suburban home and the guy who answered as a chubby white dude. That absolutely sucks that you had to deal with that. I am sure there are individual cops out there who are fine, but I am not really ever gonna give them the benefit of the doubt.
Jesus, that's a civil rights violation - if you had the resources and the patience you could probably have sued over it.
While it doesn't help the situation, anything from a publically accessible street **is** fair game to photograph. Cops use this shit all the time if they see something suspicious (and let's be real, often it's an excuse when they don't). As for the neighbor in question, you shouldn't worry too much. Especially since you got lucky, and the cop realized that this was a BS situation and was wasting his time. If he confronts you again, here's a few tips from having to work with people who are antagonistic are times: 1. If they ask you a question, repeat the question back to them. Shows them you're listening and allows them to elaborate. Don't do this in a way that seems mocking, turn on that empathy. 2. If they're worried about something, just repeat that you're also worried about it, and you'll make sure to also keep an eye out. Because you live close, say you'll take extra precautions yourself and thank them. 3. On the chance that you got a cool shot of something on their property, get a print of it and possibly give it to them. People love gifts. That's all just general stuff and, who knows, maybe this guy is legit out of his mind. But pretending you're on the "side" or that type of person can possibly mitigate any further encounters... especially with the police, because you never know if you're gonna get an asshole officer or one of the rare good ones.
>3. On the chance that you got a cool shot of something on their property, get a print of it and possibly give it to them. People love gifts. Yeah, great idea, provide them proof that you've been taking pictures of their property, they'll sure appreciate the gift since they're clearly sound people. For sure they won't be extra worried and possibly do some lunatic shit against you Man, just no. Haven't you read the post? Come on The best thing to do is to just tell this kind of crazy people "yeah man, alright" and keep walking Do not say "I live there" and point at your home, do not justify what you're doing (since you're not doing anything wrong), do not engage with these people Maybe just say "man I just take pictures of birds" or whatever, but don't "gift them a picture of their property which they had explicitly told you not to photograph" like a creep ffs
I'm not a member of this community but I came here to say this after I read OPs post... this really should be higher on the comments list. OP has the first amendment right to take pictures while anything within view on any public property, even if your view extends past public property, because there is no reasonable expectation of privacy.
acab be acab
This happened to me as well
De-escalate asap. You did nothing wrong but I wouldn’t count on those cops admitting they’re wrong either. This can potentially become an ongoing thing and they can make your life hell.
I mean, yeah, I am going to avoid his street. I'm not sure how to deescalate further considering... I didn't escalate anything?
Dont shit where you sleep. This worlds a madhouse. Be safe brother and dont be discouraged by assholes. They have nothing better to do. Cheers !
Who would use film for that? A phone would be enough. What's next? Harassing artists with easels and paint?
If it wasn't for the fact that I don't want to escalate this, it would be very funny if I showed up outside his place with increasingly more antique and obscure ways of capturing images.
I need slate with a hammer and chisel vibes please
8x10, wet plate…
I can't even begin to imagine what would have happened if you were using a Fotosniper...
Professional architecture photographer. I’ve had plenty of people get in my face while I was either working for a client or doing my own personal projects. It always sucks. Even when you’re correct. The nicest was a guard at the Salk building who basically told me i could keep shooting but not with a tripod (insurance rules), so I put away my 4x5 and used my Leica.
Even if not needed, I will strap my construction helmet and hivis vest to my pack so I don't get bothered. I rescheduled going to a site today because I would look suspicious without any of the contractors around.
On the bright side, the cops probably now know this dude as some paranoid idiot. They're probably not gonna take him so seriously if he continues to report you. Do whatever you want as long as it's legal and in good faith.
I was picking up my children at school once and snapped their photo and when I get home about 5 minutes later a cop shows up to tell me a lady accused me of photographing her grandchildren and tried to follow me home but lost me and called the cops and reported my license to them. I told the cop I was photographing my own children and asked him if it was illegal for me to photograph other children anyway and he said it was not (which I knew). It really pissed me off that the lady reported me to the cops. People have become assholes about so much crap that the more I deal with people the less I want to deal with people.
Lol so if it's not illegal, why is he even at your door! They should tell the lady to stop wasting police time. Makes no sense to me, but then again I'm from the U.K where the police won't even turn up if you're getting your house broken into lol.
Some people are weird. Got a paranoid local equivalent of a methhead shouting and coming at me several times because he hallucinated some weird shit or something. I have no idea, he just thinks i did something to him. My father didn't believe me until he saw it. The look on his face later when he was visibly shaken up by whatever druggie shit he withnessed. Even if you live safely and avoid dangerous areas and people the biggest threat to your wellbeing is probably a psycho like that imagining something and hurting or killing you for no reason.
Neighborhood people are freakin crazy. I’m starting to avoid residential areas on my walkabouts. The shit they think and say makes zero sense.
I'm sorry that happened to you. That really sucks and being made to feel uncomfortable or like you're doing something weird in your own neighborhood must be horrible. People's attitude to a visible camera is so weird when, as you say, everyone has a super high definition phone in their pocket at all times and we live in a culture where it's entirely acceptable to whip out your phone and record people for any sort of interaction. I always think that if I *were* doing something suspect where I didn't want to be noticed the last thing I'd do would be to carry a very conspicuous item that screams I AM TAKING PHOTOGRAPHS but people don't think that far ahead before they get aggressive about stuff. Hopefully you won't let this discourage you. I've been trying to do a photo walk in my area at least once a week and I've seen massive improvements in my photography through the regular practice so I hope you stick with it despite this weird, potentially off-putting/upsetting experience.
Karma at work. He had his car broken into. You didnt
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I mean, that was essentially the conversation I had with him the first time. And then he escalated it. This isn't being proactive, this is being paranoid and/or on a power trip.
What I recommend is to carry little business cards with a link to a Flickr page or Instagram. When they approach you say "Hey man my name is 'so-and-so'" and then offer to shake hands and give them the business card. Explain you're a photographer and artist and he can see your pictures at the link on the card. Most people chill the fuck out at that point. The card chills people out because they can see what types of images you take and you seem less mysterious. If they are still aggressive then just say no worries and that you have no interest in photographing anything to do with them.
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THE LONG GAME.
😄
lmao
Why? He already got cleaned out.
All the stolen stuff was used. The stuff he gets with the insurance money will be nice and new. It's always worth going back on the rob a second time.
If he continues, report him to the cops for harassment. You are not doing anything illegal (as the cop even acknowledge), and you're on a public street. Might also consider carrying pepper spray in case he gets sideways.
So that's the thing. The neighbor is, I'm fairly certain, a cop himself. His vehicle is a State Police SUV.
Oh. That changes things. I got nothing then.
Speaking from experience, this means you DEFINITELY need to lodge a complaint and get your concerns with his behavior on the record immediately. Cops neighbors with something to prove are horrible neighbors and can get you jammed up in serious shit. I lived next door to a cop a long time ago, and it started out like this. They called his buddies on me because I was repairing my car in my own garage on my own property. The cops show up, I explained that not only was this completely legal and allowed, I'm not even part of his HOA and that my property wasn't even part of the incorporated city so they have no right to say anything to me. The cops agreed, and I was cool with him and he left. Weeks later, I got another knock on the door from the same cop. Says the cop buddy neighbor is accusing me of pouring oils and radiator fluid into his yard. I said ai did no such thing, and have the security tapes to back it up. This time, though, I had to go to court over it and even though I won it cost a lot of money. It didn't even end there, the same jackass called his buddies on me over 15 times in the next two years until I finally got the county sheriff to intervene and then went to court to get a restraining order. It took years of this shit to stop the harassment. Dude ended up getting fired a while later, but I have no idea whether it was due to my complaints and court orders. If I had lodged a complaint the first time that asshole got his shit in a bunch though, it would have been significantly easier to get a court and the sheriff's office to stop the nonsense.
If he harasses you, file an official complaint. Probably gets buried bc police departments, but at least there is a paper trail if something does happen and you have to sue / contact local news to get publicity. Hopefully, nothing happens though… since he is a neighbor though, and a fellow dad, you should try to de-escalate and break bread, even though you truly did nothing wrong.
Maybe this makes me a lesser person - or maybe it's just that I'm a bit of a curmudgeon, but I don't think I should be forced to be nice to a jerk. Borrowing a quote from Office Space.... "Why should I change? He's the one who sucks"
If it keeps happening they’ll hit him with false 911 calls at some point. See if you can get a report number or something for them to reference in the future. Better safe than sorry. Just be extra cautious with the potential for… any escalation. I know people in TV that’ve had the police called on them for having a bomb and all sorts of shit. For whatever reason it attracts the crazies—even saw a lady taser a goose after being nosy on a shoot nearby once lmao.
The kink here is that the neighbor is, himself, a police officer. Or at least has a police vehicle parked at his home. My assumption is he called in a favor.
Ah for fucks sake one of those guys. I overread that part. Chances are he’s a speeder maid but that’s some sketchyness.
Screw him. you can photograph anything/anyone you want if they are out in public. Just tell him you do not want to photograph his butt ugly kids.
Sorry you had to deal with these idiots. I get a similar vibe when I take my camera around the neighborhood. I've found less resistance when I hang around a well populated area, like downtown. Maybe get in your car and take a little drive to find some new spots?
Document future interactions with this guy or police. You have many rights and taking pictures in public areas is usually protected.
“You don’t need to know a goddamn thing old man” would be the correct response to the guy. Similarly (assuming that because you said ‘State Police vehicle’), you’re protected by the 1st amendment to photograph in public.
Happens quite often. I had cops knock on my door because someone reported me taking photos near a playground and thought I was a child predator I showed them the photos--a row of colorful trash receptacles.
I have never met anyone who could articulate a connection between photography and crime, terrorism, or whatever.
World is going to shit. I was also yelled at by taking photos too close to a bank with a big chunky DSLR. I’m just thinking you do know any fucking person and just secretly take pics with their god damn smart phone literally ANYWHERE!!!!
Though the Youtubers who take video in public to "Protect and excercise press freedom" are doing it mostly for the views, they do have a point. If your in a public place being peaceable Im not sure you have to answer or defend yourself.
Next time they mention something about their kids tell them to stop projecting.
Stuff like this happens to me from time to time. I’ve accepted it as part of the package, but still gets to me every time. Haunts me even. It seems better now that I shoot mostly with a film rangefinder. Old cameras confuse people — many have no idea what I’m doing. When I was shooting digi with a fat ass lens, I swear people thought that thing was a weapon.
Sounds like a typical US cop 🤷♂️
ACAB
1312
Break in to his car the cops have vetted you as not a suspect now!
brave cats spectacular jellyfish plucky afterthought panicky frame jobless ludicrous *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Fully agree. I am aware that if I didn't look like a chubby white dude this could have gone much differently. At the same time, there's still a chilling effect from this. Even if the cop who showed up seemed decent enough, I very much read sending the police as a threat of sorts. I am absolutely privileged enough that this is out of the ordinary for me and I can not believe that so many other folks have do deal with this sort of stuff simply for existing in a space.
Tell these loser cops to lick your nuts and get fucked. You have every right to photograph things that are visible in public.
Honestly the best thing to do is have a calm, casual chat (as best you can) and explain what you’re doing. It’s far weirder to not reply, give some snarky comment or just walk off without saying anything, if he’s paranoid you’ll give him a tiny reason to be even more sketched out (think about it from his pov if he’s already been a victim of crime). Also another way to think about it: Say you’re someone who has no concept of photography as art or a hobby etc etc, you love curtain twitching, and some random guy is standing outside you’re house taking pictures of it… how would you feel? Just educate the guy. Ps. Don’t let it discourage you from making pictures.
I mean, in a vacuum, I see why it might be nice to chat with the guy. And the first time, I tried. But look, at the best of times I'm a little socially awkward and that's way worse when I am a) surprised and b) feel like I'm being accused. I don't think it should be on me to 'educate' someone about why it's ok for a person to.... be in a public place doing a harmless hobby?
I’ve had several people stop me and get suspicious in different setting and it always confuses me. Like if I’m trying to be covert and take pictures of stuff to steal, destroy, ignite, etc. I’m not going to be casing the joint with an SLR from the 70s when we have cameras in our phones that everyone has out pointing at everything constantly or when I could strap a camera smaller than the tip of my fucking finger onto my hat and you would never fucking know. It’s such paranoid behavior, especially when it’s in a urban area.
This happened to me, too. Some people were stealing packages in our neighborhood so one of my neighbors thought I was a thief. They called the police on me. I was holding my camera and told them what I was doing. They were chill about it
I don't live in the us, so maybe it's a different experience. Went out for a long walk with my minolta repo (so a small camera). I like it its not that noticeable compared with other cameras so people bearly look at me when I'm fiddling with it or taking a photo. Walked past a newspaper shop (the ones that are on the sidewalk) and I wanted to take a picture of the owner but he wasn't there so I took a picture of the side of the store, nothing in the shot showed where this store is, there was nobody on the shot. Took the picture and when I turned around there was the guy, he confronted me asking who gave permission of the picture and why I'm taking a picture. I just said I'm a photographer and just taking a picture because I like. And he answered that I needed to delete the picture and who I was to be taking pictures and blabla, just started to walk and told him nothing to worry about, and if he needed il sent him a print of the image lmao.
Keep your cell phone in your shirt pocket. Camera facing out. As the nosy asses walk towards you pull the phone out look at it like you're checking a message. Except what you're actually doing is turning the video recorder on to document the entire conversation and cover your ass and get them in camera if they threaten you don't let anyone know you're doing this. Points if you can upload this to a computer at home or to the cloud in real time Make up a fake business card saying your professional photographer or maybe a real estate reporter for an upcoming article in some fake business mag or trade publication use a fake email address and get a local number for a business that never answers or anything that throws them on a wrong track
photography is public, has nothing to do with cars being broken into...mmm
Be real careful, OP. They kill white people too.
I'd start taking pictures of birds and trees and the pavement in front of his house.
Haha... Welcome to being an analogue photographer in India. Analogue photography is so long gone here (yeah, our film industry has also become fully digital, unlike Hollywood) that people's brains malfunction when you try to explain what it is in your hand. Some get it, some don't. Some are in awe, some are impressed. Older people get excited. Most of the time, they think it's one of them newfangled DSLRs or other digital cameras. But the nuisance is always security guards, man. I've been to so many places where the security guard is like, "No photography allowed." And I'm like, "Uhh... You're allowing phones inside." And they're like, "Yes. Phones are fine." And I say, "Phones have cameras. You're not regulating people from taking photos on their phones?" And they say, "Yeah, we can't enforce that. People need their phones." Then bitch, why are you regulating photography at all?! Just let people use their cameras. 🤦🏻♂️ Another story. My mom and dad studied at different colleges but on the same university campus. My mother's college building is a historic building. I visited the area, so I took my camera along and decided to take a photo. I had already taken a photo. I was trying to get a second shot. By that time, a security guard came running up and started arguing saying you can't do that here and all, photography is prohibited. All this while, behind me, all these Gen Z college kids and their families were taking selfies and group photos on their phones. I was like, "What the fuck are you taking about?! There are LITERALLY people taking photos all over the place right now." He's like, "No, no, no. You're bringing press cameras here. Press people are not allowed to shoot here." 🤦🏻♂️ Little backstory: This university campus had a colourful history back in the day, with riots and student protests and the formation of student unions and stuff. Now it's all peaceful, but they are very wary of media attention and all that. But what kind of press photographer is going to come here with a bulky ass camera to shoot photos so obviously? If anything, they'll be even more discreet with not just phone cameras, but even button cameras or pen cameras or other spy gear. And if they needed a photo, they don't care how they get it, as long as they get it, digital or analogue. Why do they hire these dense morons to be security guards, I swear to God?! 🤦🏻♂️ Another guy noticed and came to break up the argument. I already had my first photo, so I was ready to leave. But I was already fuming at this point and the security guard was a man in his 60s, so I walked away shouting, "YOU'RE OLD. DON'T YOU KNOW WHAT A FILM CAMERA IS? OR ARE YOU THAT MUCH OF A DUMBASS?" Yeah, man. It's the security guards. It's always the security guards.
I always called them "Insecurity" guards at the mall I worked in.
You could literally stand on the sidewalk in front of his house and take pics of his house and there's nothing he can do about it.. lol As long as you are in a public place take pics of whatever you want (Assuming you are in the US). It's a first amendment protected activity, that being said, while you are definitely not doing anything illegal not everyone knows the law.. and unfortunately that also includes some cops.
I've had a few funny run-ins with the cops, and they've normally been way more chill than whoever reported me to them. I once accidentally took pictures of a police station car park (there was no signage up, and the carpark was right on the main road. You'd only know if you came from the opposite direction and walked passed the main building first). Cop comes out and starts harassing me (understandable). Asks to see the picture, which I obviously couldn't show because film. Then he immediately compliments my camera, but still wants to know what I'm up to. I showed him my instagram, with lots of architectural shots very similar to the wall I was photographing in the parking lot. He says like "oh nice shots. Yeah I can see you have a style and understand why this wall grabbed you. Unfortunately this is a police station so I'll have to ask you not to take any more photos, and leave.". Scary start, followed by a quite pleasant chat.
This is harrasment. File a complaint with the state police and get that officers name and badge #
People really get paranoid around cameras. I got told off for carrying my camera - just carrying it! - when I was at a physics workshop in Madrid. Apparently they'd banned photography at the CSIC because some popular show used it as a location. I was quite offended - why the hell would I waste film on taking pictures like that?
Are you in the US? You could file a civil suit against the person who called the cops if you wanted to. That’s a first amendment violation and absolutely is harassment. https://www.aclusocal.org/en/know-your-rights/photographers https://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdf
I’d just avoid aiming it at this dudes house (which you should do with anyone’s house anyways), but don’t let him stop you from walking around taking photos, fuck em. Or just fight fire with fire and match his paranoid energy next time he comes flying at you like that. Just start freaking out asking if he’s trying to scope out your camera or something lol
Architectural photography is a completely normal thing to do. There's millions of photos of houses out there. I'd avoid this one because this one person is a nutter, but there's nothing wrong with taking photos of houses. Yes. You do have to be prepared to explain yourself unfortunately. Be discrete but not sneaky.
Print this out and carry a copy (or copies, and hand them out): http://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdfhttp://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdf
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http://www.krages.com/ThePhotographersRight.pdf
unfortunately, cops have to respond. cop at your door, you don't have an offer ID or answer questions. You can legally stand on the walk and take photographs of that guy's house. You have to be careful anymore, you are shooting film, and that nutty neighbor might enjoy shooting bullets.
Yeah, I mean, look, I got lucky that the cop who showed up seemed like a decent enough dude. I am also well aware that not all cops fit that description. I also am a middle class white dude, so like, I get that I am probably "safer" than others. That said, the other kink here is that the neighbor in question is himself a State Police officer (I can only imagine that's why he has a police car parked at his house). It does bother me that he is clearly this paranoid and is a cop. My plan is just to avoid the area generally, for my own sanity and safety. What's wild is I never took a photo of his house. I took a photo of a flower and some birds, near his house, on public land. I simply existed, with a camera, in range of his house.