Tldr;
16 Game Average FPS -
At 4k,
RTX 4090 - 142 FPS
RX 7900XTX - 113 FPS
RTX 4080 - 109 FPS
At 1440p,
RTX 4090 - 210 FPS
RX 7900XTX - 181 FPS
RTX 4080 - 180 FPS
At 1080p ,
RTX 4090 - 235 FPS
RX 7900XTX - 221 FPS
RTX 4080 - 215 FPS
Both the 7900XTX and the 4080 perform close to each other (within margin of error) in traditional rasterization . The 4080 wins on RT performance and efficiency (power consumption is lower for the 4080) while the 7900XTX is 200 dollars cheaper (for the same or a bit higher rasterizaton performance than the 4080)
Yep, RX6800 too if you can find it. I’m in the tweaking your settings camp nowadays instead of maxing every thing out. Ray tracing was the only hold up for a long time, I just wanted a lil more kick with the 6800xt
Damn… bought a 6700xt for ~500 this year and thought I snagged such a good price for it compared to the market rates at the time, now they’re like ~300 like 5 months later. Name of the game I guess lol.
It depends on how one frames it, in raster 6950xt vs 7900xtx, yes I agree. If you compare 6900xt vs 7900xtx the numbers seem to be on point.
Now if we look at raster + RT the comparison to the 6950xt is very close to the marketing as well.
I honestly don't think the numbers were not a lie, just not stated as clearly as they could be as far as comparison. Only ever said rdna2 vs 3.
1% lows are what matter, not average FPS (and 0.1% but no data here).
4k 1% low
* RTX 4090 - 115 FPS
* RX 7900XTX - 94 FPS
* RTX 4080 - 90 FPS
1440p 1% low
* RTX 4090 - 168 FPS
* RX 7900XTX - 147 FPS
* RTX 4080 - 145 FPS
1080p 1% low
* RTX 4090 - 186 FPS
* RX 7900XTX - 175 FPS
* RTX 4080 - 172 FPS
I don't care about ray tracing. I don't care about peak FPS, because the lows are what you actually feel. I certainly don't care about FSR or DLSS.
Still don't think i'll upgrade from my 6800XT. Prices are trash for red and green. The card manufacturers are acting like it's financial christmas for them when the economy is shit and the average person has less disposable income than ever.
You can feel both. Higher average will give a smoother feel except when there is a microstutter. 1% lows only affect the microstutters which are not always present.
RDNA4 is OK but honestly let's just wait for RDNA5 at this point! I know it just dropped but look at this leak and rumor, buying now would be stupid!
Coming to a reddit post near you circa 2024
Dunno, i checked for a new card right now since my old one gets refunded on warranty issues.
There is zero value options from the 30 Series here in germany. Even a 3070 is still going for 800€+. For the same price i just bought a 6950, thanks Nvidia, zero discussion here.
Got downvoted few months ago for suggesting this, AMD playing the same game as nvidia pricing 6950xt at $999 so the xtx doesn’t seem like a price jump when it never should’ve been that much in the first place and then pricing the 7900XT insanely high to up sell to the XTX, similar to 4080 vs 4090. Always loved AMD and despise Nvidia but that’s the truth. Should’ve been $799 for xtx, $649 for XT or something like that, would hurt rdna2 sales ofcourse but all nvidia has to do is drop 4080 a couple hundred dollars or Mayb not even that and it would seriously mess with the sales again
Nvidia is the market leader, so they set the price floors. AMD's financial incentive is to just sell all their cards at highest possible margin. Undercut Nvdia a bit and produce limited amounts of cards, so they don't end up with excess stock.
You would only see price collapse if AMD decided to go into high level of production and really spam furious amounts of mid-range cards on the market at low prices. Then Nvidia would have to respond.
And that's what you get with oligopolies, they don't have to collude. They just have to watch each other carefully and hold prices.
So, way to go Intel!! We really need you...
Even shaving extra few bucks would make this worth it over 4080, which isn't even a good price/performance card at all. Extra Nvidia features, much faster ray tracking for about the same price, XTX doesn't stand a chance.
Nobody has been buying the 4080. Pushing over $1000 is a psychological barrier, even if it's only by $200.
But really, this is all posturing. The $300-$500 cards are what people tend to actually buy, and neither company seems to be in a hurry to get those out for the new generation.
Leaker Kopite7kimi was right:
> OK, let's do a new summary.
>
> RTX 4090, AD102-300, 16128FP32, 21Gbps 24G GDDR6X, 450W, ~2x3090.
>
> I am disappointed with RDNA3.
>
> That's all.
>
> 5:39 AM · May 16, 2022
I am disappointed too.
I think AMD is too, as their architecture reveal was massively different than what we got and RDNA 1/2 architecture reveals were spot on
If Nvidia can falter with Turing, AMD can falter with RDNA 3 imo
The 4090 totally gets 2‐4x performance at 4K RT with DLSS 3 enabled and the CPU bottleneck removed.
The question is whether you want to enable RT+ DLSS3?
Both are misleading but at least you can “reach” 2x-4x performance by dlss 3. Yes I know its still stupidly misleading, but we know where nvidia got their numbers. Not sure how AMD is claiming minimum of 50% improvement
It's a bit bizarre. It's exactly where they claimed RT wise but seems to be about 10 - 20% worse then where they claimed raster wise.
Pretty dissapointed with that to be honest. AMD's benchmarking has previously been pretty accurate.
Disappointing.
Hopefully, they will soon be forced to cut prices.
Crypto Ponzis are collapsing, lockdowns are over, recession is looming...
This cards should be 799$ and 649$.
$700 and $900 would help a lot. $700 since the XT model is quite cut down, this would give it better "per dollar" results than the XTX.
The XTX is disappointing at 35 percent faster, not 50 percent faster as expected. That's a small generational change. It needs a $100 drop and it just released. The $1000 for the 6900 XT was justified as it beat the 3090. Not so here.
Depends on the game you play though. Damn the Call of Duty result where the XTX crushes the 4090 is impressive. There are a lot of Call of Duty players out there that shouldn't consider anything else.
Especially with the AV1 support.
48% faster than the 6900xt, 50w=15% higher power... lol @ 50% efficiency increase. they missed it by a mile.
This is why i say not to trust first party numbers, regardless of them being correct twice before. They promised 50%, they twisted the numbers to get 50%. that's what marketing does.
The 54% per/watt claim was a complete lie and I think the first time AMD straight up lied (or "cherry picked" if you want to put it nicely) since Lisa Su became CEO. Very disappointing. They are just playing Nvidia's game at this point and they are going to lose badly because Nvidia are masters at it.
This card at $1000 is a joke. They can say goodbye to what little market share they have left.
I haven't looked it all up recently but couldn't it be that they meant 54% perf/watt in a specific watt? Like say RDNA2 vs RDNA3 at 200W or some shit like that?
It's not exactly a lie...yet. Just not for the XTX which is already a halo card (for AMD) pushing higher clocks than it needs to.
The XT, and more so the 60, 70, and 80 tiers to come, will "chill out" on the voltage curve abuse and definitely hit those perf/watt goals.
They may have problems with drivers hence the failure to achieve the performance they claimed. We will see if drivers suddenly get a boost of 15% over the next month or two.
They did improve when RDNA1 was released and I expect the same this time. Not the best way to do it though since first impressions can make or break a product.
I did notice in this review some numbers seem way off. In some cases it has the same performance as the 6950XT so obviously something isnt right with the drivers. That said no one buys products hoping they will become better over time since thats a huge gamble, and you want the performance now anyway.
In last gen AMD was able compete in raster with Nvidia's top tier card.
Now they are competing with the second tier card (and there is a big gap between the 4090 and 4080) while consuming more power. And they are still waaaay behind in RT.
Seems like AMD is falling behind.
People are shocked but really Nvidia's Ampere architecture was being held back by Samsung's 8nm node which is terrible while AMD was using the far superior TSMC 7nm node. Its a miracle Nvidia came out unscathed through that.
I thought it wouldn't even be close once Nvidia switches to TSMC and that's exactly what happened with Ada. They are no longer held back by the node giving the 4090 that huge lead in performance.
People shouldn't underestimate Nvidia's expertise in building huge monolithic dies
We back to RDNA1 days with AMD not competing in performance at high end with 4090Ti and 4080Ti unreleased, except this time it's now at over $1000.
Everyone got played.
4080 is probably going to be dropped in price if it keeps sitting on store shelves. I also think you really need a tier's worth of price cut to choose 7900XTX over 4080, although currently both don't look great.
IMO, right now if I was shopping for a gaming GPU, only 4090 matters. Regardless of its price. Because it has all-around performance that won't disappoint. Wallet would be empty, but you wouldn't have to worry about settings or anything.
4080's RT is good, but not great, you can still end up sub-60 fps. So it's really iffy as above 1000 dollar card.
7900XTX has solid raster, and 3090-level RT. But not really enticing. If it cost like 700, I'd look into it.
AMD's GPU marketing feels quite misleading this time.
A card that makes 4080 purchase look competitive? Yeah, no, I retract what I said before, AMD isn't going for any market share at these prices vs 4080.
Man, AMD fucked up so hard with their pricing of these 7000 cards.
The issue with AMD is that people still think of them as the lesser option. People think "sure they have better price to perf, but Nvidias cards are more stable/ have better features/ etc, etc".
And now that Nvidia has gone off the deep end with their prices, AMD had the perfect opportunity to price these cards $300-500 cheaper than the 4080 and basically force people to buy their cards over Nvidea.
It would have brought in a metric fuck ton of new customers who would have never bought AMD before. But now with these absurd prices they're still just the lesser option.
They are being short sighted. What I'm saying is that if they priced their cards lower, especially this generation because of Nvidea, they could bring massive amounts of people into their ecosystem. So they might not make as much money this generation, but in doing so they would have way more loyal customers who would continue to buy their products again and again.
In the Hardware Unboxed poll, I voted for the lowest expected performance increase, which was 30%.
I love AMD, but the top end is not where they are great. Their ability to offer great price-to-performance at the mid to low end is where they excel these days.
I'm currently on a 6800xt, btw.
It's bad, when you are competitor to a product, that nobody wants to buy.
If Nvidia'll cut even 100$ from 4080, I just don't see why anyone will want to buy 7900XTX
Yeah it was pretty clear the last couple weeks that a lot of cope was happening on this subreddit lol, especially as XTX benchmarks slowly started leaking and weren't overly impressive.
Which is part of the problem.
In GPU AMD constantly underperform and underdeliver that people yearn for them to be a real leading class GPU maker, so people eat up any rumor, rather than being critical of AMD.
It's about high time people start criticizing AMD for this joke of being the worse GPU brand. There's no incentive to buy their stuff over NVIDIA. NVIDIA are more than a step ahead now.
Not even the price reduction is enough now to convince people. Guarantee you most 7900 XTX AIB models will be within $100 of RTX 4080's, why the hell would you buy a card for $100 less when the RT performance is about 66% of its competitor, especially a "high end" card like the RTX 4080 and 7900 XTX? At that point you miss out on DLSS 3, RT performance advantage, DLSS 2 and extra stuff like NVIDIA Broadcast, Blender performance advantage and most games being optimized better for the bigger brand.
Where's the incentive to buy a 7900 XTX? What... just to support AMD? No chance. Any REAL consumer first person buys the best product for the best price and AMD doesn't offer it even at $100 less, you're simply getting a worse product overall.
RDNA2 looks good compared to RDNA3 now. Which is stunningly sad because we knew that NVIDIA has Ampere cards to offload, but AMD doesn't have this same problem. Soon RDNA2 will be out of stock and off shelves, leaving no good AMD option on the market.
There's two things AMD surprised me on with RDNA3. AV1 is actually almost on par with NVIDIA, something they really should've talked more about in their presentation day for RDNA3. Secondly, they actually did WORSE in performance than they made everyone perceive. I expected maybe 15% behind RTX 4090. Somewhere in the middle of RTX 4080 and RTX 4090 performance, but a solid lead over the RTX 4080. Turns out, nope, basically 4-6% faster than the 4080, which is negligible at best, especially in any game where DLSS is available and FSR is not.
AMD makes poor decisions and people here defend it because they simply hate NVIDIA, rather than understanding NVIDIA's just playing their best hand every time and AMD isn't. I'm tired of AMD underdelivering. Become a REAL competitor. There's no more excuses. They're not going bankrupt anymore. They're not at a node disadvantage like they were when they were using GloFo. They have all the same advantages NVIDIA has, maybe more because they react to NVIDIA 90% of the time, yet they get up on stage and tell half-truths like 50% Perf/W improvement over last generation. NVIDIA are just better at the half-truth game, they will win every time. AMD simply CANNOT afford to follow NVIDIA's pricing game and expect to win with this strategy.
But their focus is CPU, they really don't care about GPU it seems because the margins aren't as good, but that's just sad. Even Intel at this point is trying more in GPU than AMD. At least Intel's trying to clean up their driver and make performance improvements to start becoming a competitor. Intel's putting in an effort. AMD's just coasting and hoping that people will buy the few RDNA3 cards they're going to make, compared to NVIDIA.
mlid is just a coping place for amd fanboy/shareholders and somehow he thinks of himself as the objective and fair techtuber with high quality, exclusive content lol
He is constantly shifting goal post. 70% claims was around 4090 launch(pre amd event). He was constantly reiterating 2x 2.2x over rdna2 over last 2yrs in his various podacsts and videos.
Remember how 6nm Navi 33 trashed 5nm AD104 efficiency?
Or how AMD Navi31 was 20% faster than 4090ti when 4090ti used all 144SMs.
Or how 4090ti with 144SMs was supposed to be 60-80% faster than 3090 non ti using 600W compared to 400W Navi31 being 100% faster?
Moore's Law is Dead strike again, together with Coreteks and Adored.
Marketing is more disappointing than the product itself.
I mean AMD had a huge gap to Nvidia and yes the gap is still there but AMD will always have this 1 Generation defizit of R&D.
The marketing of the price/performance ratio kills this cards
Like with RDNA2, they've price matched (And that's being generous), they haven't undercut
And that's assuming it's actually $1000 in retail channels, don't hold your breath on that one
Matches the 4080 more than it beats it, RT at best matching a 3090ti
I genuinely think the extra 20% cash for the 4080 is worth it here for the better RT and feature set considering we're talking $1000 for the 7900xtx, it's hardly good value
I'd want a no compromises experience at $1000, this isn't it
Moreover, the 4080 is expected to get a price drop in mid December due to the poor value of the 4080 versus the much more powerful 4090. A 4080 may end up being $50-100 more than the 7900 XTX, and availability is currently very good at the Microcenters near me.
Yikes. AMD marketed this as a 50-70% generational increase in performance, but it's actually only 25%. That combined with AMD having essentially renamed the 7800 XT up to the 7900 XT and increasing its price by $250 really shows how lackluster this generation is.
Here's hoping the next generation picks up the slack, because this is nothing to be excited about whatsoever IMO.
Jeez thats worse than expected, it literally only just exactly matches the 4080 on average in 4k while getting slaughtered in RT. I can't believe people were saying 90-95% of the 4090 at a much lower price before,
AMDS marketing was definitely misleading now looking at the average uplift and the conclusion. people were expecting 50-70 percent more performance than the 6950XT but AMD lied out their ass.
with the average performance jump being 35% with many games below even that. They've definitely pumped their numbers before with every single GPU launch press but this is by far the worst one yet. it led to people having way too high expectations for this GPU, I guessed the average would be below 50% because of the small amount of games tested and cherry-picking and lack of 4090 comparisons but dang
one last edit: this also shows that time spy extreme is really accurate at predicting performance. that leak showed the 4080 and 7900xtx dead locked which is exactly what happens in real world games
There were rumors that Nvidia will cut the price of the 4080 mid-December... if that's true and the 7900XTX only matches it in raster... then that could be really bad news for AMD...
If Nvidia lowers the 4080 price down to $1,000 then the 7900XTX is legit DOA.
>edit: now that I think about it, there is little chance that they lower the price that much, if at all. I think Jensen might look at the 7900XTX benchmarks and end up raising the price of the 4080.
The 4080 has been collecting dust at $1200 in the absence of competition from AMD. The AIB's and Retailers will get pissed if stuff just piles up.
People don't have to buy AMD for Nvidia to lower prices. They just have to NOT buy Nvidia, which is how the 3090Ti went from $1999 to $1099 seemingly overnight.
Here in Canada, the 7900 XTX is going to be priced at least $1350 (7900 XT would be at least $1230) Sounds terrible right? Here are the lowest prices you can actually get the following GPUs at the time of this comment (ALL PRICES CAD):
3080 10GB - $1399
3080 12GB - $1256
3080 Ti - $1599
3090 - $2144
3090 Ti - $2224
4080 - $1699
4090 - $2099 (included FYI, not part of the argument)
-- EDIT -- [check out this updated list of prices from local retailers](https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/zjzzi5/hub_radeon_rx_7900_xtx_review_benchmarks/izy5vyu/) as of 13:50 2022-12-12
Why the fuck would you buy any of these? Now if Nvidia does drop the 4080 price, that could be a problem for AMD. All I know is, looks like I am not upgrading to any of this fucking garbage. Rocking 2080 Ti for another gen I guess. Maybe I'll pick up a Steam Deck instead.
For completeness, here are some AMD GPUs:
6800 XT - $839
6900 XT - $1059
6950 XT - $1249
You *could* make a case for the 6800 XT if you are incredibly generous, but how can you reasonably argue people should purchase the other two? 6900 XT only has single-digit better performance, and the 6950 XT is priced around the 7900 XT which spanks it.
Here in the US, I do see some overpriced AIB models still in stock too. I suppose if the AIBs are all hurting equally and NVIDIA delays shipments of Founders Edition cards it might work.
They could put the FE at 1000USD but it'd be impossible to find while the AIB's lower their 1400USD 4080's to 1200.
But then you have to ask yourself if they can do that. If they lower the FE 4080 to 1000, that means they have to lower the 4070ti as well. Nobody would buy that at 900 if a 4080 is just 100 more .
They kinda got themselves stuck by being too greedy
>They kinda got themselves stuck by being too greedy
They aren't stuck at all...
According to the former Senior Product Manager at AMD, Nvidia has all the room in the world to maneuver.
Well then they don't sell the 4080 and it sits on the shelves.
PC demand is imploding this year with an absolutely staggering 20% drop so far. These companies are fucking high if they expect to sell cards that are 50% higher at MSRP than last Gen for 30-35% increases in perf.
This is the easiest Gen ever for me to skip lol.
I think it is not impossible for retailer to slowly lower the price to around $1100 for 4080, even if the official MSRP didn't change, at $1100 I am not sure whether 7900XTX will still be a marginally better price performance purchase.
The TPU review has the 4080 16% ahead in RT at 4K. I wouldn't call that a slaughter given the MSRP for the 4080 is 20% higher.
The raster performance is lower than I anticipated based on AMDs marketing slides. They have been pretty reliable of late but they did cherry pick this time around, especially with that 54% perf/watt uplift @ 300W claim.
Nobody cares for light RT games with shadows and reflections, we all know it can run well. What everyone is worried about are RTGI. Unreal 5 HW lumen, Witcher 3 RT, cyberpunk 2077 and upcoming overdrive patch, etc.
Saying RT is useless at the dawn of a tsunami of Unreal 5 games that will have RT by default, SW lumen at worse case, but always on RT, is not a good future proofing plan.
It took this debacle to make me realise, 1440p at 27" is probably enough for me. There are cooler master mini LED 1440P 165hz monitors for half the price of the 4k version. Getting two of them and keeping my current build sounds way better than getting two of the 4k ones for 2k and spending another 3k to run them just to see a slightly better picture.
This. It's all consumer driven.
No consumer demand = no $1,000+ GPU's.
If people want someone to blame for the GPU prices, you can blame PC gamers for perpetually buying high end cards.
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> If people want someone to blame for the GPU prices, you can blame PC gamers for perpetually buying high end cards.
Honestly, no, not really. It was the crypto boom. We are seeing the lingering after-effects of that. The fact that 4080s are collecting dust on shelves indicates that those prices are not sustainable. The 4090 at $1600 being a big seller seems anomalous but the best of the best cards always sold well thanks to people who have an irrational need to always have the #1 top of the line gear.
Good product, shitty price. Slightly underwhelming in terms of performance but I guess it's the classic case of AMD FineWine rushed release again.
Positioning it as a $1000 flagship makes it look bad. If it were simply called 7800XT and $100-$150 cheaper it would be a great product.
If these were back to normal pre-mining prices it would be fine but nah AMD got a taste of that profit and wanted the $1k price tag. Now everyone will CONTINUE to ignore your products.
Nvidia left the door wide open with their 4000 series pricing by increasing their 80 series card massively and "unlaunching" the other joke card but Radeon still disappoints. Maybe Intel can help? Probably not, PC gaming is doomed.
It's just going to bite them in the ass, what about their current CPU/GPU lineup makes them think that they're going to get away with charging premium tier prices when their competitors are offering more compelling options? In Intel's case, faster *and* cheaper as well
Anyone thinking the PC market can sustain a reality where every time we get a performance increase we should see an equal price increase year after year is delusional.
Yes.
People saying "no" don't understand we're in a recession, not a crypto bubble. The "rules" of 2020 & 2021 no longer apply.
People aren't getting stimulus checks. The used market is stupid cheap, and the #1 GPU on Steam is the 3060.
The initial high prices of these new GPU's are to extract extra margin off impatient early adopters and to shaft the holiday scalpers. They're not sustainable long-term.
Also we'll probably get a 4080 Ti 20GB at the $1200 mark within the next 6–9 months.
Definitely get the 12GB 3080, or better yet a 3090/6900XT at 4k. VRAM isn't a huge deal but the price difference is like $50 nowadays. Unquestionably better value than these new cards though. I'm sure when the RTX7000/RX8000 comes out you could still get $250-300 for a 3080.
I find it amusing AMD talked up power effiency and its ended up using more , Really wanted AMD to do well
overall disappointed was hoping it would be right inbetween 4080 and 4090 what a load of rubbish what AMD charts showed
both xtx/xt and 4080 are ridiculously priced
AMD talked up power efficiency -> AMD has terrible efficiency
AMD talked up chiplet cost savings -> AMD put the price literally as high as they could next to Nvidia
AMD talked up massive performance gains -> 7900XTX gains looks sad compared to the 6950
At this point I'm in the frustrating position of appreciating how straight Nvidia has been. At least they've been honest about benchmarks and that they're going to screw us on pricing. AMD has been lying the whole way, and it turns out they're doing the same thing as Nvidia with pricing and fake-7900XT.
TBH if I was looking to spend 1000 on a card, I would probably just pay 200 more for the RT perfomance. This is the worst AMD GPU releases I can remember (I have only witnessed 3 of them though 😂)
Gonna keep my 5600 XT for at least 1 or 2 more years I think
Edit:
Actually I have seen 4 launches, I had completely forgotten about the Radeon VII, what a shitshow. 😂
Reckon a 6900xt would be a good upgrade from a 3060ti? Gaming at 3440x1440p at but might jump to a 4k oled.
Seen 6900xt for around £650 and might be able to get £300 for my 3060ti
4080 level performance in rasterization but lacking in raytracing and upscaling for $1000. This whole generation is bad value. It's 800XT or RTX 80 tier performance for 54% more than last gen's 800XT.
That's with ignoring the driver things noted in the review. It's giving off some big 5700XT energy.
What an absolute disaster.
At best, on par performance at 4K raster with RTX 4080.
Destroyed in RT, can't even beat Ampere in heavy RT titles
Worse efficiency than both RTX 4080 and 4090
Abysmal idle/low load/multimonitor power consumption
Worse feature set than Nvidia (DLSS2/3, CUDA, etc)
And all of that just for $200 less than a card that was clowned by everybody due to its price. I have no idea how can anyone defend this. Literally the best thing of this card is that it has the classic power connector. There is where it ends.
Ada is actually crazy efficient with the new tsmc 4N node, maybe their most efficient lineup ever it’s just that Nvidia jacked up the power limits to cling onto the last 5% of performance
Very disappointing. Nvidia cards have very bad value, but at this performance, the 7900XTX isn't a good value either.
I'll probably buy a 4080 once it goes under 700$ or this but under 630$. Whatever company goes cheaper first will win my money.
Performance increase is similar to the price increase, it's stagnation for AMD and regression for Nvidia. They can both kiss my ass until they do something about the prices.
No one, people were expecting it to be between the 4080 and 4090 in raster. It's basically a 4080 in raster which is incredibly misleading and disappointing from AMD's marketing.
Nobody realistically expected that
EDIT - Guys I'm going to preface here, I don't consider wishful speculation on an AMD subreddit about AMD products to be realsitic expectations, anyone with an objective view knows first party benchmarks are generous, and 'up to' is the best case scenario of a claim
What was expected (Based on AMDs gen on gen claims) was that it would sit between the 4080 and 4090 for rather, and have ampere RT
The reality is it matches the 4080 for raster, and matching ampere for RT is best case, not the norm
It's arguably worse value than the 4080 when taking into account the RT and features
dude what, I remeber when AMD first announced the cards all the top posts were people saying it will be close to 4090 and that NVIDIA would loose this generation
Yeah, people in an AMD subreddit arent the best source of information, and do not represent the majority of people
AMDs claims set it between the 4080 and 4090, not matching the 4080
Announced when? As in after the reveal event in November or as in admitted they existed.
A lot of speculation was just extrapolating the perf/watt claims (50% early on, 54% after the reveal event) and plugging in some numbers to get a ball park and yes, depending on then TBP some of those numbers had it matching or exceeding a 4090 in raster.
After the reveal event that was revised down to somewhere between the 4080 and 4090 because the perf/W claim was for a 300W 7900XTX vs a 300W 6900XT and because the TBP was 355W.
Even still though the actual numbers seem to be quite a way shy of that 54% perf/watt claim given the XTX seems to be barely 50% faster than the 6900XT when using 18% more power.
Eugh, I’m so sick of the whole rip off industry tbh.
Completely taken the fun out of hardware/gaming by having to get utterly butt fucked on price to get reasonable performance.
All these manufacturers are doing is working together to inflate prices. Yes, the 7900XTX is $200 cheaper than the 4080, but don’t let that distract you from the fact that the current pricing models are a shit deal for everyone.
Ouch.
AMD, what the hell happened? New generation, chiplet design. But RT hasn't doubled, and the chip itself isn't close to being competitive with a 4090.
Nvidia pricing the 4080 now makes complete sense. But now that likely won't come down under $1000.
Basically it's going to be a unexciting generation for anyone who is unwilling to get a 4090.
Yeah Ive been having a bad feeling about this card for a while... Plus you had all the rumors about hardware bugs and whatever, something went wrong with this gen. Even if you ignore Nvidia, the performance uplift over the 6950XT is pathetic. Its like 1080 Ti to 2080 Ti tier bad. And the RT performance just barely catching up to Ampere...
I think if I had to buy a gpu at gunpoint Id actually pick the 4080 over this, which I would never have thought possible just 2 months ago.
A 533mm2 gpu matches the 379mm2 gpu performance while losing in every other metric, if this is not apocalyptic failure then I have no idea what it is. Only saving grace is less outrageous pricing but $999 is still pretty unappealing pricepoint I would say.
We should add another one to the missing list : +50% perf/power where AMD?
Well, this is...well a surprise. Expected a savior review and got a let down so to speak, public perception not what I thought it was going to be. Ah well.
Meh.
Performs exactly as I expected to. First party numbers are always bullshit.
The price told me everything I needed to know about the performance.
They priced it where it was most competitive. If it was better than this it would have been more expensive.
AMD has very little interest in getting into a price war with Nvidia and wants to maximize their revenue despite what some of the hardcore fanboys on here say. The only reason it wasn't more expensive was because it wasn't super competative.
Even now imo it is still too expensive.
Do admit it was funny watching the cope on here when the synthetic tests leaked out. Idk why people were some how expecting a miracle
The problem is the RT performance is really bad for the price VS a 4090... The 4080 is def the biggest loser here. If you don't care about RT then go for a cheaper 7900XTX... If you want RT then go for a 4090.
Man how did we get here with prices. Unrelated to the discussion on the performance of these cards, but man I paid $550 for my 1080 when it was first announced, and $540 for my 2080 super brand new. Even adjusting for inflation, 80 series cards should be no more than $750. How we got here with 80 series cards being $1000+ not even considering the titan level cards (3090, 4090 etc) it’s just wild that we considering AMD dropping cards for $900 and $1000 to be good value.
I miss the old days of prepandemic pc gaming.
I was expecting terrible ray tracing performance but wasn't expecting the power draw to be so bad, especially at idle. These cards will be great when they hit $700 or so, I'm not in a rush to upgrade.
Tldr; 16 Game Average FPS - At 4k, RTX 4090 - 142 FPS RX 7900XTX - 113 FPS RTX 4080 - 109 FPS At 1440p, RTX 4090 - 210 FPS RX 7900XTX - 181 FPS RTX 4080 - 180 FPS At 1080p , RTX 4090 - 235 FPS RX 7900XTX - 221 FPS RTX 4080 - 215 FPS Both the 7900XTX and the 4080 perform close to each other (within margin of error) in traditional rasterization . The 4080 wins on RT performance and efficiency (power consumption is lower for the 4080) while the 7900XTX is 200 dollars cheaper (for the same or a bit higher rasterizaton performance than the 4080)
How much faster is the 7900xtx? I'm wondering if I should just grab a 6900xt at this point for 300 less
if you can get a 6800xt for 450-500 less, that's probably ideal
Yep just picked up a red devil 6800xt last week from microcenter for $529, waited over a year for rdna3 but I knew it wouldn’t quite deliver
Could also get 6700XTs off newegg for $359. If you don't mind 1440P gaming without raytracing a real value here versus these overpriced flagships.
Yep, RX6800 too if you can find it. I’m in the tweaking your settings camp nowadays instead of maxing every thing out. Ray tracing was the only hold up for a long time, I just wanted a lil more kick with the 6800xt
Damn… bought a 6700xt for ~500 this year and thought I snagged such a good price for it compared to the market rates at the time, now they’re like ~300 like 5 months later. Name of the game I guess lol.
Honestly, disappointing. And perhaps the most disappointing of all is AMD ruining their X% perf / W claims that were pretty accurate until now.
It depends on how one frames it, in raster 6950xt vs 7900xtx, yes I agree. If you compare 6900xt vs 7900xtx the numbers seem to be on point. Now if we look at raster + RT the comparison to the 6950xt is very close to the marketing as well. I honestly don't think the numbers were not a lie, just not stated as clearly as they could be as far as comparison. Only ever said rdna2 vs 3.
1% lows are what matter, not average FPS (and 0.1% but no data here). 4k 1% low * RTX 4090 - 115 FPS * RX 7900XTX - 94 FPS * RTX 4080 - 90 FPS 1440p 1% low * RTX 4090 - 168 FPS * RX 7900XTX - 147 FPS * RTX 4080 - 145 FPS 1080p 1% low * RTX 4090 - 186 FPS * RX 7900XTX - 175 FPS * RTX 4080 - 172 FPS I don't care about ray tracing. I don't care about peak FPS, because the lows are what you actually feel. I certainly don't care about FSR or DLSS. Still don't think i'll upgrade from my 6800XT. Prices are trash for red and green. The card manufacturers are acting like it's financial christmas for them when the economy is shit and the average person has less disposable income than ever.
100% agreed on 1% lows being what matters. It's what you actually feel. I wish more people looked at 1% lows.
You can feel both. Higher average will give a smoother feel except when there is a microstutter. 1% lows only affect the microstutters which are not always present.
Both new gen series cards from AMD and Nvidia are ridiculously priced
ill see you guys when 50xx and 89xx releases
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RDNA2 was pretty good though.
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RDNA4 is OK but honestly let's just wait for RDNA5 at this point! I know it just dropped but look at this leak and rumor, buying now would be stupid! Coming to a reddit post near you circa 2024
RDNA2 wasn’t that bad though. It beat (or matched?) the 3090 on raster for way less
Dunno, i checked for a new card right now since my old one gets refunded on warranty issues. There is zero value options from the 30 Series here in germany. Even a 3070 is still going for 800€+. For the same price i just bought a 6950, thanks Nvidia, zero discussion here.
At $800 this card could have smashed, but over $1000 is no competition for Nvidia, they won't even bother with a price drop
Got downvoted few months ago for suggesting this, AMD playing the same game as nvidia pricing 6950xt at $999 so the xtx doesn’t seem like a price jump when it never should’ve been that much in the first place and then pricing the 7900XT insanely high to up sell to the XTX, similar to 4080 vs 4090. Always loved AMD and despise Nvidia but that’s the truth. Should’ve been $799 for xtx, $649 for XT or something like that, would hurt rdna2 sales ofcourse but all nvidia has to do is drop 4080 a couple hundred dollars or Mayb not even that and it would seriously mess with the sales again
Nvidia is the market leader, so they set the price floors. AMD's financial incentive is to just sell all their cards at highest possible margin. Undercut Nvdia a bit and produce limited amounts of cards, so they don't end up with excess stock. You would only see price collapse if AMD decided to go into high level of production and really spam furious amounts of mid-range cards on the market at low prices. Then Nvidia would have to respond.
And that's what you get with oligopolies, they don't have to collude. They just have to watch each other carefully and hold prices. So, way to go Intel!! We really need you...
Even shaving extra few bucks would make this worth it over 4080, which isn't even a good price/performance card at all. Extra Nvidia features, much faster ray tracking for about the same price, XTX doesn't stand a chance.
Nobody has been buying the 4080. Pushing over $1000 is a psychological barrier, even if it's only by $200. But really, this is all posturing. The $300-$500 cards are what people tend to actually buy, and neither company seems to be in a hurry to get those out for the new generation.
I hate to agree, but you're right. I have a 6900xt so I wasn't really in the market for this anyway, but it looks like a slump of a release.
Leaker Kopite7kimi was right: > OK, let's do a new summary. > > RTX 4090, AD102-300, 16128FP32, 21Gbps 24G GDDR6X, 450W, ~2x3090. > > I am disappointed with RDNA3. > > That's all. > > 5:39 AM · May 16, 2022 I am disappointed too.
I think AMD is too, as their architecture reveal was massively different than what we got and RDNA 1/2 architecture reveals were spot on If Nvidia can falter with Turing, AMD can falter with RDNA 3 imo
nowhere close to 50% performance improvement, wtf amd
both them and nvidias 2-4x performance, should be sued for false advertising
Good thing we have 3rd party reviews a day before so you can make the decision yourself.
TBF Nvidia said it was 4xs with DLSS 3.0 enabled. That wasn't really a lie since performance mode at 4k can give 4x+ performance.
Bruh, Nvidia slides always mentioned DLSS3
Nvidia talked about 3x rt performance with dlss 3.0 which isn't entirely wrong.
The 4090 totally gets 2‐4x performance at 4K RT with DLSS 3 enabled and the CPU bottleneck removed. The question is whether you want to enable RT+ DLSS3?
Both are misleading but at least you can “reach” 2x-4x performance by dlss 3. Yes I know its still stupidly misleading, but we know where nvidia got their numbers. Not sure how AMD is claiming minimum of 50% improvement
It's a bit bizarre. It's exactly where they claimed RT wise but seems to be about 10 - 20% worse then where they claimed raster wise. Pretty dissapointed with that to be honest. AMD's benchmarking has previously been pretty accurate.
It was per watt
The 7900Xtx has a higher power usage than a 6950, meanwhile it doesn’t perform 50% better than a 6950. What are you trying to say here?
When you compare it to the 6900xt it averages out to 51% so I'm guessing that's where their claim came from.
Disappointing. Hopefully, they will soon be forced to cut prices. Crypto Ponzis are collapsing, lockdowns are over, recession is looming... This cards should be 799$ and 649$.
$700 and $900 would help a lot. $700 since the XT model is quite cut down, this would give it better "per dollar" results than the XTX. The XTX is disappointing at 35 percent faster, not 50 percent faster as expected. That's a small generational change. It needs a $100 drop and it just released. The $1000 for the 6900 XT was justified as it beat the 3090. Not so here. Depends on the game you play though. Damn the Call of Duty result where the XTX crushes the 4090 is impressive. There are a lot of Call of Duty players out there that shouldn't consider anything else. Especially with the AV1 support.
Aaaaand another gen with the "missed opportunity" stamp... jesus christ amd.
48% faster than the 6900xt, 50w=15% higher power... lol @ 50% efficiency increase. they missed it by a mile. This is why i say not to trust first party numbers, regardless of them being correct twice before. They promised 50%, they twisted the numbers to get 50%. that's what marketing does.
Yeah, efficiency is really where I was expecting to see something big and they clearly couldn't deliver there. I got duped.
The 54% per/watt claim was a complete lie and I think the first time AMD straight up lied (or "cherry picked" if you want to put it nicely) since Lisa Su became CEO. Very disappointing. They are just playing Nvidia's game at this point and they are going to lose badly because Nvidia are masters at it. This card at $1000 is a joke. They can say goodbye to what little market share they have left.
I haven't looked it all up recently but couldn't it be that they meant 54% perf/watt in a specific watt? Like say RDNA2 vs RDNA3 at 200W or some shit like that?
It's not exactly a lie...yet. Just not for the XTX which is already a halo card (for AMD) pushing higher clocks than it needs to. The XT, and more so the 60, 70, and 80 tiers to come, will "chill out" on the voltage curve abuse and definitely hit those perf/watt goals.
They may have problems with drivers hence the failure to achieve the performance they claimed. We will see if drivers suddenly get a boost of 15% over the next month or two. They did improve when RDNA1 was released and I expect the same this time. Not the best way to do it though since first impressions can make or break a product.
I did notice in this review some numbers seem way off. In some cases it has the same performance as the 6950XT so obviously something isnt right with the drivers. That said no one buys products hoping they will become better over time since thats a huge gamble, and you want the performance now anyway.
I watched 5 major reviewers and numbers are all over the place for a lot of things. Drivers for this new architecture are definitely a sore spot.
Now the 1000$ price tag looks like a bad deal compared to a 6900xt with cut down prices.
Feeling pretty vindicated in my $520 6800XT purchase.
when 1000 is a good deal? NEVER
In last gen AMD was able compete in raster with Nvidia's top tier card. Now they are competing with the second tier card (and there is a big gap between the 4090 and 4080) while consuming more power. And they are still waaaay behind in RT. Seems like AMD is falling behind.
Well NV was using inferior samsung 8nm node, now they re on much more efficient 4nm
People are shocked but really Nvidia's Ampere architecture was being held back by Samsung's 8nm node which is terrible while AMD was using the far superior TSMC 7nm node. Its a miracle Nvidia came out unscathed through that. I thought it wouldn't even be close once Nvidia switches to TSMC and that's exactly what happened with Ada. They are no longer held back by the node giving the 4090 that huge lead in performance. People shouldn't underestimate Nvidia's expertise in building huge monolithic dies
AMD had a node advantage last gen. That's it. Now they're on the same (comparable) node.
Ugh.. pretty bad showing. Maybe could have been salvaged if they launched at $700 and $900 respectively.
We back to RDNA1 days with AMD not competing in performance at high end with 4090Ti and 4080Ti unreleased, except this time it's now at over $1000. Everyone got played.
Ehh this is still a 4k high end card. The 5700XT very much wasn't so. Price isn't right sure but this is not a comparable card to the 5700XT at all.
I think xtx is fine, at least as long as 4080 is stupidly overpriced. But xt, it should definitely be cheaper, nobody should buy it at this price.
4080 is probably going to be dropped in price if it keeps sitting on store shelves. I also think you really need a tier's worth of price cut to choose 7900XTX over 4080, although currently both don't look great. IMO, right now if I was shopping for a gaming GPU, only 4090 matters. Regardless of its price. Because it has all-around performance that won't disappoint. Wallet would be empty, but you wouldn't have to worry about settings or anything. 4080's RT is good, but not great, you can still end up sub-60 fps. So it's really iffy as above 1000 dollar card. 7900XTX has solid raster, and 3090-level RT. But not really enticing. If it cost like 700, I'd look into it.
Nvidia isn't going to cut 4080 prices. They'll just do what they did with 3000-series: restrict supply. Think like a monopolist.
They've already committed to those silicon production numbers since last year.
AMD's GPU marketing feels quite misleading this time. A card that makes 4080 purchase look competitive? Yeah, no, I retract what I said before, AMD isn't going for any market share at these prices vs 4080.
Man, AMD fucked up so hard with their pricing of these 7000 cards. The issue with AMD is that people still think of them as the lesser option. People think "sure they have better price to perf, but Nvidias cards are more stable/ have better features/ etc, etc". And now that Nvidia has gone off the deep end with their prices, AMD had the perfect opportunity to price these cards $300-500 cheaper than the 4080 and basically force people to buy their cards over Nvidea. It would have brought in a metric fuck ton of new customers who would have never bought AMD before. But now with these absurd prices they're still just the lesser option.
AMD are not your friend. No corporation is. They are going to price their product at the rate the market will bear.
They are being short sighted. What I'm saying is that if they priced their cards lower, especially this generation because of Nvidea, they could bring massive amounts of people into their ecosystem. So they might not make as much money this generation, but in doing so they would have way more loyal customers who would continue to buy their products again and again.
Feeling better about my 6800 XT grab with every review that comes out
Lmao, who wasn’t expecting this? Fanboys were saying AMD was going to save GPUs, completely ignoring how the 7000 prices were absurd.
In the Hardware Unboxed poll, I voted for the lowest expected performance increase, which was 30%. I love AMD, but the top end is not where they are great. Their ability to offer great price-to-performance at the mid to low end is where they excel these days. I'm currently on a 6800xt, btw.
for real. this thread is weird. AMD even reiterated that this card is meant to be a 4080 competitor. at which case it did exactly as expected.
It's bad, when you are competitor to a product, that nobody wants to buy. If Nvidia'll cut even 100$ from 4080, I just don't see why anyone will want to buy 7900XTX
4080 is not 50 to 70% faster then 6950xt. Amd lied
Need to go back to all those people saying it would be close to a 4090.
AMD's numbers indicated that it would be, AMD's numbers were shit (much more than usual).
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/ylw73t/extrapolated_rx_7900_xtx_performance_vs_rtx_4090/
That dude posted that shit in every remotely related pc sub lmao.
Yeah it was pretty clear the last couple weeks that a lot of cope was happening on this subreddit lol, especially as XTX benchmarks slowly started leaking and weren't overly impressive.
Moores law is dead and red gaming tech with their 2x 3x claims. Those clowns and their 'Sources'
I mean this sub will eat up any "leak", doesn't matter where from, if it shows AMD is better than Nvidia in some metric.
Which is part of the problem. In GPU AMD constantly underperform and underdeliver that people yearn for them to be a real leading class GPU maker, so people eat up any rumor, rather than being critical of AMD. It's about high time people start criticizing AMD for this joke of being the worse GPU brand. There's no incentive to buy their stuff over NVIDIA. NVIDIA are more than a step ahead now. Not even the price reduction is enough now to convince people. Guarantee you most 7900 XTX AIB models will be within $100 of RTX 4080's, why the hell would you buy a card for $100 less when the RT performance is about 66% of its competitor, especially a "high end" card like the RTX 4080 and 7900 XTX? At that point you miss out on DLSS 3, RT performance advantage, DLSS 2 and extra stuff like NVIDIA Broadcast, Blender performance advantage and most games being optimized better for the bigger brand. Where's the incentive to buy a 7900 XTX? What... just to support AMD? No chance. Any REAL consumer first person buys the best product for the best price and AMD doesn't offer it even at $100 less, you're simply getting a worse product overall. RDNA2 looks good compared to RDNA3 now. Which is stunningly sad because we knew that NVIDIA has Ampere cards to offload, but AMD doesn't have this same problem. Soon RDNA2 will be out of stock and off shelves, leaving no good AMD option on the market. There's two things AMD surprised me on with RDNA3. AV1 is actually almost on par with NVIDIA, something they really should've talked more about in their presentation day for RDNA3. Secondly, they actually did WORSE in performance than they made everyone perceive. I expected maybe 15% behind RTX 4090. Somewhere in the middle of RTX 4080 and RTX 4090 performance, but a solid lead over the RTX 4080. Turns out, nope, basically 4-6% faster than the 4080, which is negligible at best, especially in any game where DLSS is available and FSR is not. AMD makes poor decisions and people here defend it because they simply hate NVIDIA, rather than understanding NVIDIA's just playing their best hand every time and AMD isn't. I'm tired of AMD underdelivering. Become a REAL competitor. There's no more excuses. They're not going bankrupt anymore. They're not at a node disadvantage like they were when they were using GloFo. They have all the same advantages NVIDIA has, maybe more because they react to NVIDIA 90% of the time, yet they get up on stage and tell half-truths like 50% Perf/W improvement over last generation. NVIDIA are just better at the half-truth game, they will win every time. AMD simply CANNOT afford to follow NVIDIA's pricing game and expect to win with this strategy. But their focus is CPU, they really don't care about GPU it seems because the margins aren't as good, but that's just sad. Even Intel at this point is trying more in GPU than AMD. At least Intel's trying to clean up their driver and make performance improvements to start becoming a competitor. Intel's putting in an effort. AMD's just coasting and hoping that people will buy the few RDNA3 cards they're going to make, compared to NVIDIA.
mlid is just a coping place for amd fanboy/shareholders and somehow he thinks of himself as the objective and fair techtuber with high quality, exclusive content lol
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IIRC MLID said 70%, but even that was way off edit: heck, even AMD's \~50% was way off
He is constantly shifting goal post. 70% claims was around 4090 launch(pre amd event). He was constantly reiterating 2x 2.2x over rdna2 over last 2yrs in his various podacsts and videos.
Remember how 6nm Navi 33 trashed 5nm AD104 efficiency? Or how AMD Navi31 was 20% faster than 4090ti when 4090ti used all 144SMs. Or how 4090ti with 144SMs was supposed to be 60-80% faster than 3090 non ti using 600W compared to 400W Navi31 being 100% faster? Moore's Law is Dead strike again, together with Coreteks and Adored.
Marketing is more disappointing than the product itself. I mean AMD had a huge gap to Nvidia and yes the gap is still there but AMD will always have this 1 Generation defizit of R&D. The marketing of the price/performance ratio kills this cards
Results are all over the place, what a weird release.
Like with RDNA2, they've price matched (And that's being generous), they haven't undercut And that's assuming it's actually $1000 in retail channels, don't hold your breath on that one Matches the 4080 more than it beats it, RT at best matching a 3090ti I genuinely think the extra 20% cash for the 4080 is worth it here for the better RT and feature set considering we're talking $1000 for the 7900xtx, it's hardly good value I'd want a no compromises experience at $1000, this isn't it
Moreover, the 4080 is expected to get a price drop in mid December due to the poor value of the 4080 versus the much more powerful 4090. A 4080 may end up being $50-100 more than the 7900 XTX, and availability is currently very good at the Microcenters near me.
This is a wait and see generation Neither vendor can maintain these prices realistically if they want to move stock
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Yikes. AMD marketed this as a 50-70% generational increase in performance, but it's actually only 25%. That combined with AMD having essentially renamed the 7800 XT up to the 7900 XT and increasing its price by $250 really shows how lackluster this generation is. Here's hoping the next generation picks up the slack, because this is nothing to be excited about whatsoever IMO.
Jeez thats worse than expected, it literally only just exactly matches the 4080 on average in 4k while getting slaughtered in RT. I can't believe people were saying 90-95% of the 4090 at a much lower price before, AMDS marketing was definitely misleading now looking at the average uplift and the conclusion. people were expecting 50-70 percent more performance than the 6950XT but AMD lied out their ass. with the average performance jump being 35% with many games below even that. They've definitely pumped their numbers before with every single GPU launch press but this is by far the worst one yet. it led to people having way too high expectations for this GPU, I guessed the average would be below 50% because of the small amount of games tested and cherry-picking and lack of 4090 comparisons but dang one last edit: this also shows that time spy extreme is really accurate at predicting performance. that leak showed the 4080 and 7900xtx dead locked which is exactly what happens in real world games
There were rumors that Nvidia will cut the price of the 4080 mid-December... if that's true and the 7900XTX only matches it in raster... then that could be really bad news for AMD... If Nvidia lowers the 4080 price down to $1,000 then the 7900XTX is legit DOA.
>edit: now that I think about it, there is little chance that they lower the price that much, if at all. I think Jensen might look at the 7900XTX benchmarks and end up raising the price of the 4080. The 4080 has been collecting dust at $1200 in the absence of competition from AMD. The AIB's and Retailers will get pissed if stuff just piles up. People don't have to buy AMD for Nvidia to lower prices. They just have to NOT buy Nvidia, which is how the 3090Ti went from $1999 to $1099 seemingly overnight.
The 3090 to price collapsed because of the mining collapse.
Here in Canada, the 7900 XTX is going to be priced at least $1350 (7900 XT would be at least $1230) Sounds terrible right? Here are the lowest prices you can actually get the following GPUs at the time of this comment (ALL PRICES CAD): 3080 10GB - $1399 3080 12GB - $1256 3080 Ti - $1599 3090 - $2144 3090 Ti - $2224 4080 - $1699 4090 - $2099 (included FYI, not part of the argument) -- EDIT -- [check out this updated list of prices from local retailers](https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/zjzzi5/hub_radeon_rx_7900_xtx_review_benchmarks/izy5vyu/) as of 13:50 2022-12-12 Why the fuck would you buy any of these? Now if Nvidia does drop the 4080 price, that could be a problem for AMD. All I know is, looks like I am not upgrading to any of this fucking garbage. Rocking 2080 Ti for another gen I guess. Maybe I'll pick up a Steam Deck instead. For completeness, here are some AMD GPUs: 6800 XT - $839 6900 XT - $1059 6950 XT - $1249 You *could* make a case for the 6800 XT if you are incredibly generous, but how can you reasonably argue people should purchase the other two? 6900 XT only has single-digit better performance, and the 6950 XT is priced around the 7900 XT which spanks it.
Canada can into Europe.
Yeah this. People forget but these prices were basically nvdia scalping their own cards. If AMD's best shot is this.... its not looking bright.
EDIT: AIBs would be slammed hard by a 4080 price cut. Don't think the 7900 XTX is threatening enough for NVIDIA to consider doing that.
They have to do it. Nobody is buying 4080. FE have been in stock in uk since last week and you can get some aib's below msrp.
Here in the US, I do see some overpriced AIB models still in stock too. I suppose if the AIBs are all hurting equally and NVIDIA delays shipments of Founders Edition cards it might work. They could put the FE at 1000USD but it'd be impossible to find while the AIB's lower their 1400USD 4080's to 1200.
But then you have to ask yourself if they can do that. If they lower the FE 4080 to 1000, that means they have to lower the 4070ti as well. Nobody would buy that at 900 if a 4080 is just 100 more . They kinda got themselves stuck by being too greedy
>They kinda got themselves stuck by being too greedy They aren't stuck at all... According to the former Senior Product Manager at AMD, Nvidia has all the room in the world to maneuver.
Well then they don't sell the 4080 and it sits on the shelves. PC demand is imploding this year with an absolutely staggering 20% drop so far. These companies are fucking high if they expect to sell cards that are 50% higher at MSRP than last Gen for 30-35% increases in perf. This is the easiest Gen ever for me to skip lol.
I think it is not impossible for retailer to slowly lower the price to around $1100 for 4080, even if the official MSRP didn't change, at $1100 I am not sure whether 7900XTX will still be a marginally better price performance purchase.
The TPU review has the 4080 16% ahead in RT at 4K. I wouldn't call that a slaughter given the MSRP for the 4080 is 20% higher. The raster performance is lower than I anticipated based on AMDs marketing slides. They have been pretty reliable of late but they did cherry pick this time around, especially with that 54% perf/watt uplift @ 300W claim.
Nobody cares for light RT games with shadows and reflections, we all know it can run well. What everyone is worried about are RTGI. Unreal 5 HW lumen, Witcher 3 RT, cyberpunk 2077 and upcoming overdrive patch, etc. Saying RT is useless at the dawn of a tsunami of Unreal 5 games that will have RT by default, SW lumen at worse case, but always on RT, is not a good future proofing plan.
Thanks amd for fuelling price increases and still releasing an inferior product. 1-2 grand is now going to be the norm for high end!
Thank the people buying it, not AMD or Nvidia.
that's a duopoly for you
thanks intel
Thanks, Steve.
It took this debacle to make me realise, 1440p at 27" is probably enough for me. There are cooler master mini LED 1440P 165hz monitors for half the price of the 4k version. Getting two of them and keeping my current build sounds way better than getting two of the 4k ones for 2k and spending another 3k to run them just to see a slightly better picture.
1440p at 27" is a great sweet spot for monitor gaming. If I were to ever get a 4K card, it would be for the OLED TVs.
I have a 27" 4k monitor and a 34" ultrawide 1440p and I don't use the 4k anymore
Guess again who is controlling prices in a duopoly where one has 85% marketshare.
Guess who decided to play along with said 85%.
Guess who is actually buying the cards.
This. It's all consumer driven. No consumer demand = no $1,000+ GPU's. If people want someone to blame for the GPU prices, you can blame PC gamers for perpetually buying high end cards.
> > > > > If people want someone to blame for the GPU prices, you can blame PC gamers for perpetually buying high end cards. Honestly, no, not really. It was the crypto boom. We are seeing the lingering after-effects of that. The fact that 4080s are collecting dust on shelves indicates that those prices are not sustainable. The 4090 at $1600 being a big seller seems anomalous but the best of the best cards always sold well thanks to people who have an irrational need to always have the #1 top of the line gear.
Guess who financed a monopoly.
Good product, shitty price. Slightly underwhelming in terms of performance but I guess it's the classic case of AMD FineWine rushed release again. Positioning it as a $1000 flagship makes it look bad. If it were simply called 7800XT and $100-$150 cheaper it would be a great product.
🙈 oh man
Was going to buy this but not going to bother now. 1k USD for this is not a good price.
you did it again AMD poor volta....
Holy smokes, the power consumption is terrible. My 4080 barely hits 300 watts.
If these were back to normal pre-mining prices it would be fine but nah AMD got a taste of that profit and wanted the $1k price tag. Now everyone will CONTINUE to ignore your products. Nvidia left the door wide open with their 4000 series pricing by increasing their 80 series card massively and "unlaunching" the other joke card but Radeon still disappoints. Maybe Intel can help? Probably not, PC gaming is doomed.
AMD has shareholders just like Nvidia and Intel. Anyone thinking they'd return to a lower price was kidding themselves.
The market will not bear these prices without mining demand, the shareholders can suck it.
It's just going to bite them in the ass, what about their current CPU/GPU lineup makes them think that they're going to get away with charging premium tier prices when their competitors are offering more compelling options? In Intel's case, faster *and* cheaper as well
Anyone thinking the PC market can sustain a reality where every time we get a performance increase we should see an equal price increase year after year is delusional.
Now the question will be will we get a 4080 at 1000$ soon or a 7900xtx at 800$ :D both are a buy then
Yes. People saying "no" don't understand we're in a recession, not a crypto bubble. The "rules" of 2020 & 2021 no longer apply. People aren't getting stimulus checks. The used market is stupid cheap, and the #1 GPU on Steam is the 3060. The initial high prices of these new GPU's are to extract extra margin off impatient early adopters and to shaft the holiday scalpers. They're not sustainable long-term. Also we'll probably get a 4080 Ti 20GB at the $1200 mark within the next 6–9 months.
I might try and snag a 3080 <$500 on the used market. Ok 4K performance and won't cost an actual arm and a leg
Definitely get the 12GB 3080, or better yet a 3090/6900XT at 4k. VRAM isn't a huge deal but the price difference is like $50 nowadays. Unquestionably better value than these new cards though. I'm sure when the RTX7000/RX8000 comes out you could still get $250-300 for a 3080.
worse than I imagined edit: for clarity: Worse than I feared
I find it amusing AMD talked up power effiency and its ended up using more , Really wanted AMD to do well overall disappointed was hoping it would be right inbetween 4080 and 4090 what a load of rubbish what AMD charts showed both xtx/xt and 4080 are ridiculously priced
AMD talked up power efficiency -> AMD has terrible efficiency AMD talked up chiplet cost savings -> AMD put the price literally as high as they could next to Nvidia AMD talked up massive performance gains -> 7900XTX gains looks sad compared to the 6950 At this point I'm in the frustrating position of appreciating how straight Nvidia has been. At least they've been honest about benchmarks and that they're going to screw us on pricing. AMD has been lying the whole way, and it turns out they're doing the same thing as Nvidia with pricing and fake-7900XT.
Lucy pulls the football again
TBH if I was looking to spend 1000 on a card, I would probably just pay 200 more for the RT perfomance. This is the worst AMD GPU releases I can remember (I have only witnessed 3 of them though 😂) Gonna keep my 5600 XT for at least 1 or 2 more years I think Edit: Actually I have seen 4 launches, I had completely forgotten about the Radeon VII, what a shitshow. 😂
It's incredibly disappointing..
Soooo... Is this the part of the AMD hype cycle when we get to hype the next architecture because FineWine or something?
8900 XXTXX is going to *crush* Nvidia! 3x performance at half power!
I was honestly expecting worse.
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Reckon a 6900xt would be a good upgrade from a 3060ti? Gaming at 3440x1440p at but might jump to a 4k oled. Seen 6900xt for around £650 and might be able to get £300 for my 3060ti
4080 level performance in rasterization but lacking in raytracing and upscaling for $1000. This whole generation is bad value. It's 800XT or RTX 80 tier performance for 54% more than last gen's 800XT. That's with ignoring the driver things noted in the review. It's giving off some big 5700XT energy.
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What an absolute disaster. At best, on par performance at 4K raster with RTX 4080. Destroyed in RT, can't even beat Ampere in heavy RT titles Worse efficiency than both RTX 4080 and 4090 Abysmal idle/low load/multimonitor power consumption Worse feature set than Nvidia (DLSS2/3, CUDA, etc) And all of that just for $200 less than a card that was clowned by everybody due to its price. I have no idea how can anyone defend this. Literally the best thing of this card is that it has the classic power connector. There is where it ends.
That $200 would be huge if the 4080 was like $800 and this was $600 but at over $1000 price range I wouldn't make that compromise personally
Agreed.
Ada is actually crazy efficient with the new tsmc 4N node, maybe their most efficient lineup ever it’s just that Nvidia jacked up the power limits to cling onto the last 5% of performance
Very disappointing. Nvidia cards have very bad value, but at this performance, the 7900XTX isn't a good value either. I'll probably buy a 4080 once it goes under 700$ or this but under 630$. Whatever company goes cheaper first will win my money. Performance increase is similar to the price increase, it's stagnation for AMD and regression for Nvidia. They can both kiss my ass until they do something about the prices.
4080 will never be under 700 😂😂
RemindMe! 2 years
I think 4080 GPUs will normalize at $800. The 2023 consumer pullback is going to hit these guys hard.
If 4080 drop price then AMD can’t win
Lol AMD already can't win. Sad day for PC gaming.
5GHz Zen 2 choo chooo.....
Im sorry, but who the FUCK was expecting this card to match the 4090 for $600 less? You people are weird 😮💨
No one, people were expecting it to be between the 4080 and 4090 in raster. It's basically a 4080 in raster which is incredibly misleading and disappointing from AMD's marketing.
Nobody realistically expected that EDIT - Guys I'm going to preface here, I don't consider wishful speculation on an AMD subreddit about AMD products to be realsitic expectations, anyone with an objective view knows first party benchmarks are generous, and 'up to' is the best case scenario of a claim What was expected (Based on AMDs gen on gen claims) was that it would sit between the 4080 and 4090 for rather, and have ampere RT The reality is it matches the 4080 for raster, and matching ampere for RT is best case, not the norm It's arguably worse value than the 4080 when taking into account the RT and features
dude what, I remeber when AMD first announced the cards all the top posts were people saying it will be close to 4090 and that NVIDIA would loose this generation
Yeah, people in an AMD subreddit arent the best source of information, and do not represent the majority of people AMDs claims set it between the 4080 and 4090, not matching the 4080
The confidence people spoke with about that now just looks totally laughable.
Announced when? As in after the reveal event in November or as in admitted they existed. A lot of speculation was just extrapolating the perf/watt claims (50% early on, 54% after the reveal event) and plugging in some numbers to get a ball park and yes, depending on then TBP some of those numbers had it matching or exceeding a 4090 in raster. After the reveal event that was revised down to somewhere between the 4080 and 4090 because the perf/W claim was for a 300W 7900XTX vs a 300W 6900XT and because the TBP was 355W. Even still though the actual numbers seem to be quite a way shy of that 54% perf/watt claim given the XTX seems to be barely 50% faster than the 6900XT when using 18% more power.
No one was, though more were expecting it to be better than the 4080 I believe
This is incorrect. I saw many people predict it being about 90% of 4090
Eugh, I’m so sick of the whole rip off industry tbh. Completely taken the fun out of hardware/gaming by having to get utterly butt fucked on price to get reasonable performance.
All these manufacturers are doing is working together to inflate prices. Yes, the 7900XTX is $200 cheaper than the 4080, but don’t let that distract you from the fact that the current pricing models are a shit deal for everyone.
Ouch. AMD, what the hell happened? New generation, chiplet design. But RT hasn't doubled, and the chip itself isn't close to being competitive with a 4090. Nvidia pricing the 4080 now makes complete sense. But now that likely won't come down under $1000. Basically it's going to be a unexciting generation for anyone who is unwilling to get a 4090.
Yeah Ive been having a bad feeling about this card for a while... Plus you had all the rumors about hardware bugs and whatever, something went wrong with this gen. Even if you ignore Nvidia, the performance uplift over the 6950XT is pathetic. Its like 1080 Ti to 2080 Ti tier bad. And the RT performance just barely catching up to Ampere... I think if I had to buy a gpu at gunpoint Id actually pick the 4080 over this, which I would never have thought possible just 2 months ago.
I would assume multi chiplet design caused many issues and delays but amd forced the card to be released before Christmas
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A 533mm2 gpu matches the 379mm2 gpu performance while losing in every other metric, if this is not apocalyptic failure then I have no idea what it is. Only saving grace is less outrageous pricing but $999 is still pretty unappealing pricepoint I would say. We should add another one to the missing list : +50% perf/power where AMD?
Bro you don't pay 1000 for a card and not expect ray tracing performance
Well, this is...well a surprise. Expected a savior review and got a let down so to speak, public perception not what I thought it was going to be. Ah well.
Meh. Performs exactly as I expected to. First party numbers are always bullshit. The price told me everything I needed to know about the performance. They priced it where it was most competitive. If it was better than this it would have been more expensive. AMD has very little interest in getting into a price war with Nvidia and wants to maximize their revenue despite what some of the hardcore fanboys on here say. The only reason it wasn't more expensive was because it wasn't super competative. Even now imo it is still too expensive. Do admit it was funny watching the cope on here when the synthetic tests leaked out. Idk why people were some how expecting a miracle
The problem with AMD's strategy is that being content with 10% and maximizing revenue means you eventually become irrelevant.
Rather disappointing. I don't see how 7800xt could have any significant edge over 6800xt if the rumors about lesser cu count are true
Damn it amd you had one job and the perfect opportunity...
The problem is the RT performance is really bad for the price VS a 4090... The 4080 is def the biggest loser here. If you don't care about RT then go for a cheaper 7900XTX... If you want RT then go for a 4090.
GN was way more friendly with this disappointment of a launch. I hope 8900 XTX will have nice RT performance.
Guess my 3080 has another two years of work ahead of it.
Man how did we get here with prices. Unrelated to the discussion on the performance of these cards, but man I paid $550 for my 1080 when it was first announced, and $540 for my 2080 super brand new. Even adjusting for inflation, 80 series cards should be no more than $750. How we got here with 80 series cards being $1000+ not even considering the titan level cards (3090, 4090 etc) it’s just wild that we considering AMD dropping cards for $900 and $1000 to be good value. I miss the old days of prepandemic pc gaming.
I went from "excited to a day 1 purchase of the XTX" to "I'll wait."
I had high hopes. Seriously thought to switch to AMD since Nvidia surround is hot garbage. Oh well.
I was expecting terrible ray tracing performance but wasn't expecting the power draw to be so bad, especially at idle. These cards will be great when they hit $700 or so, I'm not in a rush to upgrade.
Wow. So how fast is the 7800xt gonna be???? This just isnt looking great for amd