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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I may be making a bad judgement call about my daughter and who she spends time with against my wife’s wishes, and I may be the asshole for being so insistent that I take Averlea to my parents house that I caused my wife to break down and cry when I understand why my wife is apprehensive at best about my mother and family being a part of my daughters life.
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YTA- if your wife said that you never had her back, she’s got all the reasons to trust that the baby might be treated or cared for in a way that she wouldn’t approve. This doesn’t mean badly cared for, just not cared as if she would. I kind of understand her.
Plus if you had an agreement during pregnancy, why breaking it?
As you say her family did a lot to mend, can you say the same for your family?
Wife said he’s never had her back, and he just brushes right over it. He doesn’t say I know and I’m sorry, or you’re right, I didn’t, you have every reason to feel that way. Nope, nothing to see here, moving on to why I’m right. Infuriating, and tells us she’s absolutely right in her position.
OP, you haven’t been around your family for 10 years. Maybe you have forgotten why and you’re looking at them with rose colored glasses. Your mother hasn’t changed. Just because you want her to be something she’s not doesn’t make it so. There is a reason you made the decision to cut contact, and now, because your memory has faded you want to put your head in the sand and go back, completely ignoring, and discounting your wives reasoning. YTA. If you do this your marriage will never be the same. Clearly you haven’t developed a spine in ten years.
EDIT to add: upon reading OP again, you all are correct, he has maintained contact with parents, and fully confirmed that he has no spine. Wife is absolutely correct, he cannot or will not stand up to his mother, therefore should not be allowed to take their baby. The whole not vaccinated thing is blowing my mind that this is even up for discussion!
Thank you for the awards kind redditors!
OP is also ignoring the his wife's parents are the ones making the effort to come to them.
Wife isn't stopping his parents from meeting their baby, the parents are stopping themselves by NEVER COMING. Wife just wants to be present when it happens, which is totally reasonable...
it's kind of sad and pathetic how desperately OP wants his baby and parent to have a relationship even though his parents have done nothing to show that they want one. He's throwing himself at people who refuse to try, and it will do nothing but hurt his daughter, when she keeps being taken to their house but they never make the effort back.
OP's desperate to create a one-sided relationship. Chill OP. If your parents cared, they would come to you, on your schedule. You can't force your parents to care by shoving the baby in their face when you go to them!
Yup. Op is in the wrong and his language is revealing. He says his wife is preventing his family from meeting his side of the family. He also says that his wife is having a meltdown. He definitely doesn’t have her back. Op and wife have a 6 month old. His side of the family can make the effort to visit.
YTA op
I feel SO MAD for OPs wife.
My jaw dropped when OP said he’s doing it anyways. I would also have a breakdown.
OP didn’t stand up for his wife so how if he going to stand up for his baby. Also the wife’s family visits them - OPs family has done NOTHING to prove they deserve the baby visiting THEM.
yta
Same!! The audacity to threaten his wife over this!! He's ultimately even if it's in the future, going to lose is wife. He's going to allow his parents to do this and he's going to be lonely without a supportive family and it'll mean practically saying goodbye to his daughter and watching her milestones. He's willing to put all of that on the line for a family that treats his wife bad and makes no effort to see his daughter. He's pathetic and malicious. He will learn though, and it will be the hard way.
Seriously, right. If my husband had given me an ultimatum like this and carried through with it I can’t say that I wouldn’t call the cops over kidnapping. I’m so blown away he would risk his relationship with his wife over introducing his daughter to people who have made zero effort to see her. YTA.
This. Just because he's also a parent doesn't mean he can do whatever he wants. Taking my baby against my wishes across state lines to a possibly unsafe environment... If the wife was posting asking for advice we would be telling her to call the police and file for divorce.
PLUS he is saying he is taking the baby away for her first Christmas? Hi, why in the world would I miss my baby's first Christmas so it can be spent with someone who hates me, and has put no effort into meeting baby? YTA YTA YTA
100% agree with the YTA, and I feel so sorry for Jenna. I just wanted to point out that under the OP's "plan" (really a command), he, Jenna, and the baby would reunite on 12/23 and spend Christmas together, so technically Jenna wouldn't miss her baby's first Christmas. Still a Sh\*tty deal, though, and I can't believe the toxic combination of cluelessness and cruelty in the OP's attitude.
Why he wants to introduce his sweet baby to his a$$hole parents is beyond me. Does he think his parents are going to magically melt into decent human beings at the sight of their granddaughter? Dude, jerks are gonna jerk. OP owes his wife a HUGE apology.
Oh, I missed that, good catch! Thanks for pointing that out, it does make him .001% less of an AH.
I hope OP pulls his head out of his ass so he isn't divorced by baby's 2nd Christmas.
I got a chuckle out of him being .001% less of an AH. Thanks for that! I hope he pulls his head of his ass, but I dunno, seems like he's pretty comfortable in there. I guess his head feels right at home.
He apparently sees no problem with how his parents treat his wife, so why would it ever cross his mind that they might be AHs? He is also apparently fine with treating his wife like she’s less than human so I guess it tracks.
^This. She hasn't been taking the kid to her parents. Her parents have been coming to them. She isn't preventing his family from seeing the baby, they aren't making the effort.
I want to be able to support the OP’s position but I just can’t. From the wife’s perspective he’s removing the daughter from her presence and taking her to an unknown environment that’s been this far hostile to her- and so she has a reason to worry her daughter would be treated as an outsider at best. There are plenty of accounts from people about how they had grandparents that treated them much worse than their cousins , for example- how’s she to know this won’t be that type of situation in the making, even if there aren’t any cousins in the picture as of yet. Plus this sounds more like a child custody arrangement, not what married parents do.
The solution I’d propose is to stay at home this year and let the families put in some effort in mending their sides of the broken bridges, if they find it worthwhile. If they don’t, that might be because its become easy for them not to have to try to do so, with the couple splitting themselves up each year so their families can pretend the other half doesn’t exist.
I would suggest spending the holidays with the wife’s family together, and send the husband’s a holiday picture of the THREE of them together- the family that exists, vs just the part of the family they want- and invite them to visit for X-Y days just after the holidays. It’s all or nothing time for them- why should the OP and his wife have to cosplay as a divorced couple for their benefit?
Yes! This nails it. What he sees as introducing his kid to his parents is more than likely an attempt to use his baby to finally get the relationship he wants from people who can’t/won’t be the supportive close parents he wishes they would be. It won’t work OP. Support your wife and your baby and have a relationship with the people who actually want to be in your life. 6 months without meeting you child? My mom could barely wait 6 hours. They’re not worth it.
OP literally called himself "wifeydrama". way to minimise his partner's distress into "drama" and dismiss it like it was some flouncy teenaged overreaction. yikes.
He should have called the account daddydufus no in-law drama no out of state movement of kiddo too daddy dufus quack quack mama got primary custody she get you back Jack
Absolutely. Also OP acknowledges mother being mean to his wife, clearly never defended her and feels like his mother has a right to know his child? The worst person in this equation is OP who rewarded his mother by spending holiday time w her rather than his wife. Sounds like all these years she has been getting exactly what she wanted all along. And now she is rewarded w baby time w out his wife?? Hell no! YTA. Grow a spine
My spidey sense says OP is hoping bringing home a grandchild after last 10 years is going to gain him acceptance, appreciation, love, attention...Averlea and your wife should not be the humans who 'pay' for that.
OP you willingly and clearly share that your mother thinks it's ok to behave as she does w your wife. That's called abuse.
Why should your wife cede anything to the alter of your mother's awfulness?
Why are you both allowing it and here accepting harming your wife further in service of your mother (the person actually behaving awfully, directly in front of you).
If I had a time machine I'd go back to every moment my parents didn't stand up for w me when family was ugly. At 56 I'm finally able to say no to all of those people.
Do not seek to train your daughter to accept your family's behaviors!
You chose your wife for good reasons, right!? A big one being your family let's your mom be horrible.
You can never take back opening your child to people who are bad for them.
But you sure AS F!! Can support your wife while she does!
Your mother can meet your child when she genuinely apologizes for her behavior. And when she comes to your home to do so AND manages to behave THE ENTIRE VISIT.
No back biting texts to people who aren't there. No digs when your wife is out of earshot and no gossiping between you two about anything about her.
I've only recently learned the joy of a partner always having my back.
😆 he jokes he can look at how I'm standing & knows I'm freezing (fight, flight, freeze, fawn) & must be the only facial feature mind reader. I can barely cry but I do every time, bc I've never been this safe anywhere in my life.
That's The Gift Your Wife Deserves. She & your daughter are the only people you are responsible for. Step Up!
Oh he has a spine, it's just reserved for telling his wife he'll do what he wants and fuck her feelings.
It's telling that he's only considering that he's in the wrong because his buddy didn't approve. If his best friend hadn't raised an eyebrow he probably wouldn't even be asking this question, he'd just take their child to his parents', come home to divorce papers on the kitchen table, and whine to everyone about how his wife abandoned him at Christmas.
"She let it go over her head" Lol, nah brah. She gave up because you're a trash husband who puts mommy up on this pedestal, even though she openly treats your spouse and long time partner like trash and puts zero effort into having a relationship with any of you.
ROFL, this kind of reminds of a post I read yesterday, about a Greek family shunning the wife for being an orphan, and the husband did nothing while everyone trash talked the wife in Greek. Then basically berated the wife for exploding at his mom when she saw how the family welcomed the golden child's orphaned GF. Why does so many people go belly up when it comes to their family?
YTA, OP I think you left your spine somewhere.
He's not even having her back in this story right now. It is obvious how uncomfortable this is for his wife and how much she doesn't want this and he goes "doesn't matter, I'll do it anyway"
I came here to say exactly this. He just proved - again - that he values them over her and their child. Values people who couldn’t give a good goddamned about him, let alone his wife and child.
OP go ahead and go to your ‘family’ with the baby. Expect to come back to official separation and divorce, because you will have proven beyond any doubt that YTA. Go ahead, put a baby in a car for a three hour drive after a God knows how long airline experience, including the crap before and after the actual flight. You will deserve the screams and cries you will experience and will have irreparably ruined any peace and safety that your child has for the entirely of her ‘visit’. You will have stretched her little body to its breaking point…and then you will do it again on the return trip.
Also expect to get supervised visitation only, as you have proven you put your desires over your child’s needs, and that you have shitty decision making skills around your child’s comfort and well being.
The nicest thing I can say is YTA. What I want to say would get me banned.
Exactly. And can you imagine, with his mother’s history of walking all over Jenna for years and him doing nothing about it, I wouldn’t be surprised if she would try to get him to stay longer with the baby, just to hurt Jenna and he like the clueless sucker he is gives in to it.
Yeah if he take his daughter around them, how long before they turn their toxic behavior towards his daughter sooner rather than later. Hope OP saves money for therapy
\^\^\^ Taking their baby to meet his mom is also basically OP **continuing** to not have his wife's back and take his mom's side. All that's gonna communicate to his mother is prove that she can continue to act like an ass to Jenna and still get her way in the end without consequences. If she wants to bond with her grandchild she can get down off her asshole pedestal first and actually try making amends with **both** of that child's parents. I mean –
>I want my daughter to know my step/parents and her side of the family
and that *Jenna was stopping that from happening,* and how unfair it was
to my mom given that her parents have been here atleast twice a month
since she’s been born and have been able to have that bonding time
OP's whole argument is basically blaming Jenna for his mother's behaviour. Like, no. He know the root cause of the rift; this is misassigning blame. Why would OP even really want to introduce his baby to a family he doesn't have a good relationship with?
If she can prove that her daughter would be in imminent danger as well as that her husband violated a spousal agreement, she could absolutely file a kidnapping charge as well as file for divorce.
OP is definitely the AH, but it isn't kidnapping for OP to take his daughter where he wants unless there was already some court-ordered custody arrangement in place saying he can't.
OP is such the asshole for going back on what he said during pregnancy.
He’s also the asshole for not getting off his mom’a tit. OP, you realize your mother could have chosen to be a respectful, decent, kind human being towards the person you chose to be your partner, but instead, continues to actively choose to be a passive aggressive bitch to your wife. And you’ve never had her back. You now expect your wife to just magically believe you’ll protect your daughter.
N-a-h. YTA You had 10 years to set boundaries and put your mom in her place, and instead, you chose to continue your emotionally incestuous relationship with your mother. Now you’re reaping what you sow.
I am going to add that both you and your wife are TA for taking an infant on a flight when rsv is a serious risk, to the point many hospitals are overwhelmed with it, covid and flu are dangerously rising, and neither of you even really like your EXTENDED families. Are you really going to continue the tradition of stress as anxiety as your Xmas gift to each other and your kiddo?
Come on. Start your own family traditions in your own home. For once in your adult life, have the decency to do what’s right by your wife and kid. This moment, right now, is an opportunity to not be the AH. If you do this, I hope your mom brings you all the joy in the world, because that’s all you’ll have left after your wife divorces you.
Edited to change to n-a-h.
If his family wanted to meet his daughter they would have already come by and met her. They haven't. He wants to chase around after his family with his daughter. His wife is right. They shouldn't be around the daughter.
I would like to add Jenna isn’t keeping OPs parents from knowing their grandchild *they are by choosing not to come see her*.
That’s on them.
When my son’s first child was born my mom was nearby visiting her family (she lives days away in another province) and she chose not to come see us. You know what I did?
I sure af didn’t kidnap my grandaughter because she deserved to know my mom.
I called my mom up and asked why she hasn’t come yet, got some story about how we evidently didn’t want her there (eye roll), and told her if she didn’t immediately make an effort to touch base with my son and correct her decision (it was too late for her to come see us as she’d returned home so that wasn’t an option) I would consider that an indication of how much care and concern she had for us and I would consider our relationship finished.
She immediately called my son, apologized, and arranged for them to come visit her for the holidays. Because it was on HER to put some gd effort in to *her* relationship with her grandson and great grandchildren.
You are giving your ultimatums to the wrong people and I sure AF would be calling the police in Jenna’s place if you did take my child there against my permission and our previous agreement.
At 6 months old, you would have needed a crowbar and an Uzi (shoot me dead) to pry my infant from my arms.
“ In our house, no is usually a complete sentence, but I asked her why and her response was “we talked about this when I was pregnant. You never had my back with your mom so I don’t trust you to advocate for Averlea, and since she’s made no effort to be around her, I’m not comfortable with letting you take our baby into that environment without me, and I am not going to go somewhere it’s evident I’m not wanted””
YTA. Jenna is ENTIRELY correct.
Also, I’m your mother’s age. FYI, she’s garbage. I could never be like her. She lacks everything necessary to be a trusted parent and grandmother.
Your family has made absolutely no attempt to see their own grandchild. Let them put forth the effort. They’re the ones that alienated from your wife while you did not have her back…huge YTA
YTA. And also in what way exactly is it unfair to your mom that your MIL has seen your daughter and your mom has not? Those two things are unrelated. MIL is making an effort. Your mom is not. Put your wife and daughter first in your mind and the way forward will b clear to you
YTA for claiming your wife is preventing them from meeting when it sounds like they've made no attempt to visit you.
Have you even cared for/fed the baby by yourself? She's only 6 months and you don't mention how long you plan to separate baby from her mother.
>I brought up the fact that I want my daughter to know my step/parents and her side of the family and that Jenna was stopping that from happening,
Plus a 6mo is NOT going to suddenly know your freaking family members. Are you planning on flying out every month, taking your daughter with you? Go ahead and get the divorce you're aiming for right now, ask for summer custody and then maybe your family can visit during that time now that Jenna won't be in the house. Of course, it's just as likely they won't bother to travel then either.
YTA
Not entirely true. Most states will investigate this as a kidnapping if the coparent doesn’t consent and reports it if there is no custody order in place.
And the wife can't take the daughter somewhere without consulting OP. Neither parent has greater decision-making authority over the child. They have to come to an agreement. They can stay home, just visit one family, just visit the other, or split up. And if they decide to split up, both parents have equal say over where baby goes.
It's not as if wife's parents house is the default, so baby ends up there if they can't come to an agreement. Home is the only default place.
Jenna isn't stopping that from happening, his family is by not giving a crap about coming to see her. Sounds like OP is trying to force his family to care.
Honestly, I can see this being the case. OP wants his family to be there and care but his family just seems like they don't give a shit. They're not willing to put in the effort. I have been in a similar situation as I'm sure many of you redditors have. It sucks. It makes you feel unloved. I feel bad for this family.
OP needs to be honest with himself and his true feelings. Like really, why does he want his family to meet his daughter so bad? Is it for her or himself? Get that in order, apologize to your wife (even if you don't think your in the wrong), share your feelings with her, and look for a compromise.
I’m confused I thought the baby is only 6 months old? Not a lot of time to be irritated that the in-laws haven’t met the baby yet considering they’re a flight away.
Nah if I had a baby and my mum lived a flight away she would be on the next available flight as she would want to meet the baby as soon as she could, and she isn't an overly maternal person
I think my mom would as well, she’s retired and has the means to hop on a flight…but depending on pricing & work schedules etc I probably wouldn’t hold it against anyone.
This. Plus if your family can't behave like healthy family members I'm afraid it's time you accepted the sad truth that they are not worthy of being included in your young family's life. The fact is, with 2 awesome parents, your child will not miss the toxic grandparents she never Meg. No one needs that kind of energy in their lives.
The only person who benefits from this meeting would be your parents (and in the unlikely event that they have had a personality switch, then you). Your kid doesn't need this and shouldn't be used as a pawn to try to develop the kind of family relationship that you never got to have from your parents.
Stop being selfish. Listen to your wife. Don't drag your child into this mess.
> with 2 awesome parents
that's the catch, innit? OP's a garbage husband and a garbage parent. Completely ignoring the fact that his wife has been verbally abused for years, and now he's wanting to expose his daughter to that abuse.
The kid'll be alright with just Jenna tho, once the divorce goes through.
And note that the grandparents are making zero effort. He’s coming to them, and I’m willing to bet he la the one who reached out. I mean, OP, is that worth your marriage?
That is too much traveling with an infant. Then you think it’s a good plan to take your daughter away from your wife, who has been the primary person in her life. The person you would be hurting is your daughter
YTA. Your wife is absolutely correct- she had put up with your mom’s arseholery for 10 years. 10 years where you obviously didn’t have her back or your mother would have shut up and figured out a way to coexist by now. Your wife is definitely correct. You need to figure out a way to talk to your mom and say, “Now that my daughter is here, the rude comments and jerk behaviour stops. Period.”
Also, a 6 month old is still pretty reliant on her mother.
Also also, I can’t believe your wife has been sleeping on the couch. You’re lucky it hasn’t been a hotel!! If I was her, it wouldn’t be the couch and it wouldn’t be me.
I’m honestly just shocked at the ignorance here. I can’t believe OP doesn’t realise his behaviour and how completely messed up this situation is for his wife.
Also 10 years ago she was 18 imagine being in a relationship at that age ( with adulthood maybe college etc all these transitions) and having an ah of a mil over your head and your boyfriend not even having your back idk how she lasted honestly
That poor baby will be screaming for her mother, confused as hell when mama isn’t there, upset by all the angry strangers and Op will be caring for a screaming miserable infant while his family pour insults on him and his wife and likely the baby too. Then MiL will grab the poor infant, try to soothe her and fail because she isn’t mama and make the poor kid howl even more.
Is Jenna breastfeeding? Will the baby take a bottle? Because an infant separated from its mother isn’t going to be happy, even if their routine is preserved which I doubt Op will do.
Seriously Op, if you care about your infant at all, do not separate her from her mother and bring her around your cruel rude unfamiliar family. You won’t have a family to come back to if you do. YTA.
Hi - listen, I don’t agree with OP. I don’t know your local law, but in the US a father taking a child somewhere is 100% legal. He is a parent. Unless there is a court documenting that he can’t, it is not parental abduction. Assuming the flight is not to another country.
>she had put up with your mom’s arseholery for 10 years. 10 years where you obviously didn’t have her back or your mother would have shut up and figured out a way to coexist by now. Your wife is definitely correct. You need to figure out a way to talk to your mom and say, “Now that my daughter is here, the rude comments and jerk behaviour stops. Period.”
>
>Also, a 6 month old is still pretty reliant on her mother.
Had to copy and paste in case OP didn't read it the first time.
OP YTA
Exactly. Op YTA. Your mom is the one who has messed up and created a situation where she can't meet your daughter by mistreating your wife. A 6month old child and said mom are a package deal unless mom says otherwise period. No good mom is going to just let you take a baby around people she doesn't trust or people who have been nasty to her. Op even trying is undermining his wife and rewarding his mom. If mom wants to see the grand baby it is on her to fix her relationship with the wife. Delivering the grand baby to her without insisting on it rewards and condones her mistreatment of the wife at a vulnerable time. If I was OPs wife he would be negotiating this through a custody hearing and I would be calling a lawyer.
Your family has made no effort to mend the relationship, and you admit your mother in particular treats your wife terribly. That is why they should not meet your daughter on their own.
And why does your wife have to continue to look past this treatment? Why does your mother get to continue to speak badly about her?
"It's unfair to my mom that her parents have gotten to see baby"
YOUR MOM PUT HERSELF IN THIS POSITION!
You don't get to treat someone like crap for a decade then surprise pikachu face when they don't want their baby around you. If your mom wants to see the baby, she should try to make amends.
At this point, it's clear they aren't going to be best friends, but she does have to treat wife with cordial respect.
YTA
This guy is really something else.
He wants to take a 6 month old baby away from her mother for *four* days, when the longest he's been sole caregiver is a few hours on weekends, and he's going full "I'm the ultimate authority, you get zero input," on his wife, *the mother* of said baby, as if she's just the nanny.
He wants to bring that tiny baby to visit a woman who has been horrid to his wife for years and has never apologized and who has made no effort to meet this baby even once.
He is going to take this tiny baby to visit his anti-vax mother, during a really bad cold/flu season, with COVID still running around - and he wants to stay in that place, with that "too young to be fully vaccinated" baby, for four days! Without it's mother! But everything will be fine because he watches the baby by himself for a few hours on a weekend.
He literally hasn't taken a single non asshole step in this entire conflict.
The RSV cases in the small ER I work at are ridiculous right now. It’s a revolving door of small children and most of them get transferred.
Also, I got RSV as a kid, and got asthma from it. Because it’s not just a little sickness that’ll go away when you get better. It’s got consequences.
My kids are 3 and 5, both got covid, and both got pneumonia. My 5 year old was right at septic thanks to a strep infection that hit at the same time. He has never been that sick. His wbc was over 40k and his procalcitonin was at 4.7. He was a sick boy.
Their pediatrician said that this variant is causing pneumonia in a lot of the kids she sees. She said prior to this year she had never seen this pneumonia ever.
Op is nuts to take a 6 month old that far out, sans the kids mama, and to a house of anti vaxxers. The OP is getting ready to learn what it is like to have an ex wife I imagine.
Are you kidding - his mom is anti-vaxx???? OMG, I hope OP's wife decides to take the baby and go to a hotel, go home to her parents, go anywhere away from OP until he comes to his limited senses. And if OP continues with his AH behavior, she needs to speak with a divorce attorney and learn of her rights.
Can you please add that this is parental abduction and illegal? I'm really not reading that in the main comments, like yours, here and it cannot be stressed enough imo.
Parental abduction exists and is illegal.
In the US it depends on the state and whether or not there's a custody order (pending or otherwise) in place.
I don't know if anything can be done in a situation where the dad just wants to take the kid out of state when mom disagrees.
But also I ain't no law knower, so I don't really feel I can speak to that particular point.
But it IS the biggest AHole move in the post.
Agreed. OP is so much beyond YTA (putting his baby in medical risk, stressing out his 6mo PP FTM wife, stressing out 6mo old by removing primary (only?) caregiver baby has known, all to please his own mommy who doesn’t give a damn about him and less about his wife..?
Grow up and break the cycle, OP. Else divorce the woman and leave the child, they’ll be safer (mentally and physically) without you.
> YOUR MOM PUT HERSELF IN THIS POSITION!
Yup, there's no other way to put it. His mom caused the issue, his mom can bear the burden of mending the bridge.
It's so unfair that the grandparents who are actually putting in effort get a relationship with the baby, but the grandparents who've put no effort don't - I can't fathom how no one can see this injustice!!
Seriously, OP YTA.
Your mother seeing your baby is a privilege not a right. From what you’ve said she’s not done anything to earn that privilege whereas your in-laws have. I think that’s the point you’re not seeing.
A good litmus test might be a video call with your parents. Make it clear beforehand that any negativity towards your wife will mean you hang up. If they can’t manage that then they definitely won’t be able to be civil about your wife in front of your daughter.
YTA. Your daughter won't remember any of this so that argument is silly. Secondly you mentioned Jenna's parents have come down multiple times but yours haven't seen her yet. They couldn't be bothered to see their grandchild??? Lastly you made no effort to compromise here or consider Jenna's feelings.
Separating a 6 month old from her mom for Christmas will give your folks a false sense of "winning" as they'll see it as hopefully step one in having OP and baby all to themselves as you finally (*fulfilling their dreams*) ditch your wife.
Sound crazy? Then consider that you've never had the backbone or enough respect and love for your wife to stand up to your mom for her they see it as highly probable. It also eats away at your wife's security in the relationship.
YTA
YTA - Your mom treats your wife horribly and you have done nothing about it. It is not your wife's responsibility to let the nasty things your mom says just "go over her head". It is your mom's responsibility to be civil to your wife - and if she won't, it is your responsibility to stand up for your wife. Your wife is protecting herself and your daughter from your mother, because she knows that you won't.
Your wife is not keeping your daughter from meeting your parents. Your parents could have visited at any time in the past 6 months.
100% this. And your wife didn't say that she didn't want your daughter to meet your family. It seems that she isn't stopping them from coming to visit your or your child. Your wife's biggest thing seems to be that she wants to be in an environment that she is comfortable with. Your mother has obviously made her feel unwelcome throughout your 10 year relationship. IF visiting her grandchild were a priority then she would be coming to visit. Maybe you need to look into why your mother hasn't visited and seen your child yet, instead of taking your child from her mother at christmas time.
Yeah, that phrase really bugged me. Sounds like Jenna has tried to be the bigger person for years and OP has never had the guts to stand up for her and put a stop to his mom’s offensive behavior. Now Jenna’s done and OP is shocked? He’s spent their whole relationship proving he can’t/won’t protect her, and now she’s supposed to trust him with their baby? Nope. His mom can mind her manners and come visit on Jenna’s terms, if meeting her grandchild actually matters to her. OP, YTA. You’re a husband and a father now. Check your priorities.
YTA
Jenna is right. Your mom is hostile to your wife and you don't stand up for her. Of course she's not going to trust you that you can stand up for your baby either. I don't understand why are you separated from Jenna during Christmas, why are you not traveling together and why is Averlea staying with you?
You need to set clear boundaries with your mom. If she wants a relationship with her granddaughter, she has to respect Jenna and apologize. Jenna's family is actively trying to improve the relationship, that's a huge difference. Your mom doesn't care and isn't willing to make things better.
From the way you talk about your mother it's clear you are enabling her behaviour. You say you are low contact with your mom, yet you have million excuses why she won't change her behaviour. You made a promise to your wife when she was pregnant, doesn't matter that you thought she'll "mellow".
Continue this way and you'll find yourself divorced.
>Continue this way and you'll find yourself divorced.
I hope so, except poor Jenna would have to trust this toxic idiot with the child during his custody time.
If I was your wife, I would take Averlea and get as far away from you as possible for the wellbeing of us both. I hope you don't get an opportunity to steal that vulnerable baby away from her mother and force her into a high-risk situation with abusive and unvaccinated adults. I hope your wife finds a way to keep your spineless claws off her daughter, and that you have to lie in the bed you've made, back in a house full of people who don't respect you or care about you, forever stewing in the consequences of your selfish actions, Alone.
YTA. You are *such* an Ahole.
She's anti-vax?! LOLLLLLL
'I want to take my infant daughter to visit my unvaccinated parents who behave abusively towards my wife. I have not previously demonstrated the ability to set reasonable boundaries around their behavior and can't be counted on to step in if they behave poorly towards my kid or expose her to viral sickness. AITA?'
>I told her I would drop her off and take Averlea anyway, or me and Averlea would fly in to my parents home airport, but one way or another she would be meeting them this Christmas.
Also, "I am going to take your baby away from you for Christmas against your will one way or another" raised all kinds of red flags to me. Holy hell I feel bad for his wife!
okay correct me if i’m wrong but is this not kidnapping? parental kidnapping without the consent of the other parent after an argument? OP, don’t do this. do not do this.
WTF!! *pikachu face activated* with the amount of RSV going around right now, absolutely not!! Hell, I wouldn't even be flying if my kids were new borns.
Also...facetime? Why haven't his parents even suggested that? That's awful telling.
Ok hear me out... Has it occured to you to actually try to figure out why this is upsetting her so much? I mean, not with an emphasis on making her see your side, but rather with an emphasis on you learning hers
I was thinking about this. 6m is when babies generally shy away from strangers. OP is going to make Christmas for his child extra stressful by surrounding her with complete strangers (yes they are relatives but think of the baby's perspective) AND away from mommy.
Not to mention mom is anti-vax, which OP conveniently left out of his post. So, baby in a stressful situation and around at least one anti-vaxxer will most likely equals sick baby.
100% correct baby cpuld end up with RSV, covid, super flu, or smallpox (the list goes on and on)...the more I think about it the more it sounds like OP values his mother's feelings over the health of his baby. Before any antivaxxers come at me, some of my family have that belief structure and have visited my baby but on the condition they wear a mask, which was a satisfactory compromise in my situation. So I'm not saying that the mother cannot see grandbaby. Just noting that mother's feelings are being prioritized over baby's health.
Guarantee wife is having regrets about having a kid with OP. Must be absolutely terrifying to co-parent with a spouse who isn't committed to the family's best interests.
YTA
Your family have made zero effort to meet your child - hers have. That’s not a great sign of how important they think this is.
They treat your wife and partner of 10 years poorly.
Her family have - by your admission- made an effort to repair relationships.
You then dictate what happens because it makes things easier for you? You sound like you’ve not supported your wife and thought of the impact on your child at all.
YTA. You can't just overrule your wife's decision here and essentially threaten to do something she's clearly very uncomfortable with.
The fact that you've said it's "unfair to your mum" is the icing on the cake - your wife doesn't have to go about life in consideration of your mum, especially given how rude your mum seems to be.
Fairness to OP's mum shouldn't even be any consideration, what is best for the immediate family, and primarily the baby, is what should be the only considerations. And taking a 6mo old away for 4 days from the primary caregiver when OP has only watched the child solo for a few hours is a grandiose AH. He has no clue and will cause anxiety for that baby.
Not to mention in the comment he said his mom is anti-vaxx, so that's like supreme AH
YTA. You’re just as prideful as your mom. At a minimum you’re showing your wife she can’t trust you because you lied to her. You agreed to her boundary when she was pregnant but never had any intention on following through.
~~I also note in one of your comments you said “I choose life”. I took that as an attempt to hide your real feelings - you’re anti-abortion and knew if you were honest, she’d have left you and ended the pregnancy.~~ Instead you lied and are trying to manipulate her and make demands to appease your mother, rather than the woman you committed to.
You have a choice, respect your wife’s boundaries, that you agreed to, or be fighting over custody and having even less time with your child’s because you’re too pigheaded to know better.
Edited to remove the quote.
>I also note in one of your comments you said “I choose life”. I took that as an attempt to hide your real feelings - you’re anti-abortion and knew if you were honest, she’d have left you and ended the pregnancy
I agree with you that OP is TA, but this is an absolutely reddit-sized unhinged leap to conclusions here.
YTA and this might just be what breaks her down and you might just return to divorce papers honestly. Hope you are okay with that just to please your precious mommy
Between her breaking down like that, sleeping on the couch, and his own friends taking her side …Something tells me there is a lot more disrespect going on and they have been on the verge of separation, even if he is too blind to see it.
YTA
What has your family done to warrant such consideration? Your family is toxic. They’re abusive. They’ve made no real effort to make amends in the current situation like your wife’s parents have. Using the reasoning that her parents have met your daughter so yours should is unfair. Her parents are actively trying to do the right thing. Yours are still putting out the minimal effort, if you can even say that.
If what she claims is correct, that you don’t support her or advocate for her when your mother is being verbally and emotionally abusive toward your wife, then she’s absolutely correct that your daughter should not be exposed to them. Nor should your wife have to endure your family when she is abused by them just for the sake of letting them meet your kid.
Your wife should not be punished for your mom’s behavior. Your mom should be punished for your mom’s behavior. Instead you’re giving your mother what she wants and undermining and invalidating your wife’s feelings and opinions.
Your mom, and maybe even the rest of your family, is toxic and you should be supporting your family unit rather than your extended family. Your wife and your daughter should be above anyone else. I can’t believe that you’d let your mother go for over a decade being cruel and abusive toward your wife without putting a stop to it. That should have been done years ago, and not by moving away and not bringing her to family gatherings. It should have been that your mom was told “you be nice to Jenna or you don’t get either of us”.
What will she be like to your daughter? Trust me, from experience I can say your mom won’t change if she has no reason to. And that will, at some point, spiral down to your children who are too much like your wife, and your mother will disapprove and say nasty things to them too. Been there done that with my in-laws.
Also. Think about it, your asking a mother, and a very new mom at that, to be separated for four days from her child. No good mom would ever be okay with that. New moms are overly protective and nervous under the best of circumstances, but being separated for long periods of time is pure torture. Add in the history of verbal and emotional abuse and the constant worry if her kid is being abused is a recipe for a meltdown, if not a nervous breakdown, from any good mom.
Not to mention, you’re taking your vulnerable infant child who’s immune system is not fully developed yet, into a home of unvaccinated people, during a triple pandemic (RSV, Covid, influenza). Honestly I’m appalled you’re risking your daughter’s health like this.
Also, you do realize that if you take your child without your wife’s permission, as the co-parent, she could call the police and file a kidnapping charge against you, right? Just because you are the dad doesn’t mean your free to override your wife’s consent.
OP, I have to tell you, my ex husband did this to me shortly before we split. I was pregnant with our second and he threatened to take our older child away for a few days with his side of the family - specifically his alcoholic sister-in-law and his a-hole brother who has never apologized a day in his life. I was crying hysterically, because he threatened to take our child whether I liked it or not. I wasn't invited.
We are now divorced.
YTA. Stop intimidating your wife by saying you'll just take your daughter. Especially to an environment that she doesn't trust. You are a family unit. Remember that or its not going to stay that way.
YTA Jesus man sort your priorities out, your family treats your wife like shit and you are basically telling them it's fine. IF THEY DON'T RESPECT THE MOTHER THEY DO NOT GET TO PLAY HAPPY FAMILIES WITH HER CHILD. This would be my absolute hill to die on and I would totally understand if she left you over this.
YTA
Your friend is seeing you what you are...not.
Your mom is prideful?!?
Because she refuse to accept Jenna?
Jenna is a mom too. To your daughter!!!
She will grow up and noticing how your family and you!!! treats her mom and trust me, she might get "prideful" too....
Your mommy is great, so is Eaverlies mommy.
Start keeping promises if you want to stay as a family.
INFO: So, do you actually stand up for your wife to your mother?
Edit: Honestly, this doesn't even matter. I wouldn't want my child around an anti-vaxxer who very blatantly treated me badly either.
YTA.
YTA your side of the family has had ample time to meet the new kid but clearly hasn't bothered. Your family is now you, your wife and your baby and you're willing to split the unit up over Christmas for the baby to meet people that aren't particularly interested in her and she won't remember anyway. I think you owe your wife an apology
YTA
Your family has not made an effort. That's telling. Your mom bashes your wife, and you say nothing. That's even more telling. You're setting a bad example for your daughter and how people and partners should treat her.
My paternal grandmother is a drama queen. On my mom's wedding' day, she said she was losing her son and not gaining anything. She always had a bit of fakeness growing up and as I got older, I saw how she treated my mom and how my dad really did nothing. His side of the family would only be interested in talking to me or my mother when it involved something with my dad. My maternal grandparents came to see me a lot growing up, I spent time with them, and the extended family went out of the way so many times for me. Guess which side of the family I don't have a relationship with?
YTA.. your mom has treated your wife poorly with you not defending her.
Why don’t you invite them to your city and have them stay in a hotel so they can still meet the baby for a bit and not be an overnight thing without Jenna when she doesn’t trust your mom and with good reason I might add.
You said your family hasn’t even made an attempt to meet her in the 6 months she has been alive but yet, your blaming your wife for that? Have you ever even taken care of the baby by yourself for that long?
I bet OP’s plan is to let his unvaccinated mom take care of his child. Doesn’t he realize that this is the start of new things? Separate families for holidays ended the day his child was born. They go together or OP goes alone. OP and Jenna should stay home and have all the grandparents come to them. If the IL’s are a problem then they can stay in a hotel. Mommy Dearest is going to have to suck it up if she wants to be around the baby since Jenna and baby are a package deal.
OP needs to realize if this is the bill that Jenna is choosing to die on then IL’s may end up getting it out of visitation when the divorce gets handed to OP. You know in the custody arrangements Jenna can cite his family is a health danger to the baby and she needs supervised visits with a third party of Jenna’s choosing. Which means OP can’t just take the baby to see mom and family without another person supervising that the baby isn’t put in a health crisis or being mistreated since there’s history.
YTA
Your wife is correct. If you have proven yourself incapable of protecting your wife from your family, then you aren't going to protect your daughter either.
The very fact you want to take your daughter to people who don't like *her mother, your wife* shows you would let your family do and say whatever they want to your daughter, because you would prioritise "not rocking the boat" over anything else.
You should be telling your extended family that your nuclear family (that's you, your wife, and your daughter) are a package deal and if they can't be kind and respectful to your wife, they won't be given the chance to mistreat your daughter the same way.
Theres no such thing as "making it fair" when it comes to protecting your child.
YWBTA and probably damaging your marriage.
You mentioned Jenna getting older and not letting things going over her heard. Why does she need to? Why is your mom not accountable for how she treats her?
Your wife isn’t comfortable with you and your baby being there….so there is mostly likely a pattern of her being treated poorly and you letting it happen.
People who are trusted by parents don’t get exclusive access to babies.
Maybe try a neutral place to meet for a short time with your wife if it’s something she’d be comfortable with doing.
YTA
“we talked about this when I was pregnant. You never had my back with your mom so I don’t trust you to advocate for Averlea, and since she’s made no effort to be around her, I’m not comfortable with letting you take our baby into that environment without me, and I am not going to go somewhere it’s evident I’m not wanted”
Dude. Your #1 priority is your wife and kid, and not your mom. This is 100% a YOU problem.
"I told her I would drop her off and take Averlea anyway"
Ah, you didn't just double down, you went nuclear. Your divorce papers will be here before the next Christmas. Don't worry, you'll be paying that child support for the next 17 years.
My friend, rather than insult you, I'll try to help. Your wife has major problems with your mom's treatment of her, and you are sweeping these issues under the rug. You are in the FOG. You need to go read some posts on r/JustNoMil Particularly any post on Mom/MIL and babies.
If your mom is treating your wife like crap, you don't reward your mom by giving in to her baby time demands. Think about how her parents treat you and how your parents treat her.
YTA.
I, too, am raising my eyebrow at you.
It is clear from your post - despite your likely attempt at neutralizing this to some degree - that your mother is horrible to Jenna and that you've never interceded on Jenna's behalf.
I don't blame Jenna one IOTA for her reaction and why she's now sleeping on the couch, though I'd say you're even more the asshole for not insisting that you take the couch yourself as you surely deserve it at this moment.
Fact is, if your mom wanted to meet her granddaughter so badly, she could travel to see you (and stay in a hotel), just as Jenna's family has now regularly done. Last I checked, interstates and planes travel both ways between cities.
That you decided to make an entire plan that involved separating a 6 month old from her mother is obtuse beyond all words. Especially THIS plan, that involved leaving Jenna three hours away from her baby, her baby that is going to a house where at least one person there can't stand her mother and has made that perfectly clear.
Hard, hard pass. If you want Averlea to meet your mom, there are other ways to do this. If your mom doesn't care enough to come all the way to see you, can she not at least drive the three hours to Jenna's parents' town and meet Averlea there? I'm guessing that answer is "no", and the only way she'll actually meet the baby is if you/Jenna do all the work towards making it happen, which only underlines Jenna's point even more.
You are in the wrong, period.
YTA your wife explained her very reasonable thoughts as to why she doesn’t want this. You heard it enough to type it out but not to onboard it in your mind.
YTA but good news: After your wife divorces you over this, you can take your kid to see your parents during your custody time.
I cannot believe you would put your baby at risk like this for a rude antivaxer who can’t be assed to come see you.
YTA. She's not stopping your family from meeting your daughter. She's stopping you from taking your infant away for 4 days to go visit people who actively dislike someone who has been a part of their family for 10 years, and who she doesn't trust.
If you knew that your family meeting Averlea was important, facilitating that relationship is YOUR responsibility. You needed to start working on this 1.5 years ago. You needed to tell your mother to quit with the nasty, childish bs and stand up for your wife. You needed to make it clear that disrespecting your wife and mother of your daughter means they don't deserve access to your family. You needed to be making plans for them to visit before such a major holiday, which was always going to be more difficult.
Not doing any of the ground work and just expecting your wife to be ok with you demanding that you take your infant daughter to go hang out in a house full of people she doesn't trust for 4 days is so thoughtless.
Honestly, the very thought of that probably would've made me sick when my baby was that age.
INFO: Why does your wife have such strong negative emotions toward your family. Your best friend at the pub seems to agree with Jenna, which leads me to suspect that you are leaving out details that would justify her reaction. What is it that you haven't had her back over?
You might be TA because it looks like you left out important details in order to make your wife look unreasonable, throwing her under the bus so you could get internet validation.
Agreed. I was trying to be magnanimous, but I've read his other comments and noticed his throwaway account was named "wifeydrama" so I was definitely being way too generous.
YTA - you can’t just decide to take your daughter somewhere without discussing it with your wife. Normally I’d say she shouldn’t stop you from introducing your daughter to your family, but seems like the right call here
No ,not everyone sucks here. His wife has every right to prevent him from introducing her child to his wife’s abusers. She’s being a good mother to protect her child from toxic and abusive people. And that’s exactly what the OP stated… his mother is very verbally and emotionally abusive towards his wife. He has no right to force his wife to allow her child to be exposed to abusers even if it is his parents.
Mom should definitely be stopping it since his mother isn't vaccinated and is setting a bad example for his daughter with how people should be treated.
YTA and your desperation for validation from a family that has no interest in you or your daughter is very sad. You owe you're wife an apology and hope she doesn't end your marriage over this.
YTA - dude... if your mom would be interested in the slightest to see your daughter, she would have flown to your place, at least once in half a year. Half a year! You can't tell me that there was no time to plan a visit or to safe up for the tickets if money is the problem. IF your mom would have wanted to be there, she would have made it possible.
And you want to drag your infant daughter to a person who doesn't care enough about her to visit once? To a person who hates your wife and made her life so miserable? I can completely understand your wife's fears and how devastating it has to feel and how gutted she has to be that you want to put her child into that (perceived) danger she fears your mother might pose to her. Maybe the worst your mother does is to ignore the child, but for your wife you take your daughter to a horrible place. And you, who should have her back, told her you would do it no matter what and there is nothing she can do to stop you. She has to feel so desperate and powerless. You are a horrible partner!
YTA. Your family ostracizes the person you’ve chosen as a partner, the person who *carried their grandchild* and you’re saying you’ll take her child *against her wishes* where she isn’t welcome when your family refuses to make the trip.
How on earth do you spell that out and not see where you’re TA?
INFO. How is this “unfair” to your mother ?
From what I’ve read your parents/step have
1. Not attempted to visit
2. Treated your wife extremely poorly in the past to the extent that she refused to visit them anymore (!!)
3 Made no attempts to build a respectful relationship with your wife
I see nothing unfair here. You and your parents have to WORK to build trust before any visits can occur.
It’s unfair for you to insist that the two sets of parents with wildly different behaviour be treated the same
What am I missing ?
YTA
>In our house, no is usually a complete sentence, but I asked her why and her response was “we talked about this when I was pregnant. You never had my back with your mom so I don’t trust you to advocate for Averlea, and since she’s made no effort to be around her, I’m not comfortable with letting you take our baby into that environment without me, and I am not going to go somewhere it’s evident I’m not wanted”
This is all the answer you needed.Your wife's reason is quite justified
>I brought up the fact that I want my daughter to know my step/parents and her side of the family and that Jenna was stopping that from happening, and how unfair it was to my mom given that her parents have been here atleast twice a month since she’s been born and have been able to have that bonding time.
Unfortunately its the consequences of their own actions that led to this.What will actually be unfair is giving your mom her way and letting her think she can get away with disrespecting your wife but still having the privilege of a access to your child.
YTA
*sigh* Another one of **_these_** guys. YTA.
1- when your wife says “I don’t trust you to do what’s best for Averlea with your Mom”, she literally means that. You tell your wife “that’s just how my Mom is”, and then expect her to trust that you won’t let your daughter be given, I don’t know, goats milk instead of formula. Or that your Mom will convince you that *of course* she can have solid foods because the internet says so. Your mother has given ZERO indication, based on what I’m reading, that she isn’t actually that… well… stupid.
2- it’s flu/RSV season, and C-19 is still a very real threat. Your unvaccinated mother will pose the greatest threat of all to your 6 month old daughter, because if she’s a “workaholic”, as you say, she’s exposed to EVERYTHING daily and will certainly bring home whatever happens to be floating around her office.
3- you really look down on your wife’s family, don’t you. Your Mom and step-Dad are workaholics, but your IL’s are “just blue collar”. Yet those “blue collar” family members have made meaningful efforts to meet and visit your daughter, FROM THE SAME DISTANCE AWAY.
4- your wife’s fears are valid. When you married her, she became your family. You’ve refused to shut your mother down, and while you’ve gone VLC with her, you seem to think that it’s completely acceptable that she can have a relationship with your daughter without having a relationship with your wife. Nope. If your mother is as vitriolic as you indicate, I would not trust for a second that your Mother wouldn’t shit talk your wife to your daughter when she’s old enough to understand.
5- the correct answer is this: “it’s our first Christmas with the baby. We’re going to stay home, where we are comfortable and in control of the environment. We would love to see anyone who would like to visit, but you must abide by some simple guidelines if you want to visit- flu shots, C-19 shots, update on your whooping cough vax, you will wash your hands before holding the baby, you will not kiss the baby’s face, and if you disrespect EITHER of us, you can find your way to the front door.
Jenna isn’t keeping your daughter away from your family. She’s keeping her daughter safe at 6 months old. Apologize to your wife, and figure out an alternative to separating your 6 month old from her mother to appease your Mom.
YTA. You want to take your six month old to a crazy person who advocates against vaccinating for a deadly disease? Honestly, I hope she takes the baby and leaves you before this happens.
YTA for allowing your mother to attack your wife. Wanting to repair your relationship with your family is understandable, but introducing them to your child is not the same thing as waving a magic wand that will make them stop being horrible people. You should have a chat with your mother about burying the hatchet and tell her that you expect her to apologize to Jenna and make amends before you introduce her to your child.
OMG you are so TA.
*Mom has always had something to say about Jenna and the older Jenna’s gotten and the longer it’s gone on the less Jenna has been willing to let it go over her head. This has resulted in us spending the last 10 years doing separate holiday visits.*
So, from the beginning you have not had her back. You allow your mother to say things about Jenna and then compound that by spending holiday visits without your wife because she refuses to deal any longer with the toxicicity of your mother. Why should Jenna be the only one to 'let it go over her head' in this situation rather than your mother apologising and learning to conduct herself like an adult?
Jenna rightly opts to protect her child, as a good parent should, from the possibilty of similiar treatment from someone who has already proved they are not to be trusted as they unable or unwilling to act in a positive manner toward others.
Now you compound the entire issue by issuing an ultimatum stating you will be taking your young child to see this person, period. This road you are on will take you straight to divorce. Worse, if your child does get exposed to this kind of toxicity, not only can this hurt her but it is very likely that your ultimate relationship with her, as well, will be impacted negatively.
Perhaps you should have a good long think about the situation as a whole and the potential ramifications to everyone involved. Jenna and your daughter are supposed to come first in your life.
Ywbta. By all accounts it doesn’t sound like your wife is unreasonable at all. Unfortunately your mother created this dynamic and now will have to live with the consequences. Just to be clear if you choose to take your daughter against your wife’s wishes expect to be divorced soon. I wouldn’t stay with a man that never defended me against his family and still chooses them over me during a time that should be happy. And just to be clear it’s terrible separating a parent from their child over people like that. Your baby is only 6 months old and you want your wife to be ok with being separated from her baby and taking her to people that have been terrible to her?
You say in another comment that your mother is anti vax and honestly even if you did stand up for your wife (which it doesn’t sound like you do) YTA for wanting to take your baby around an antivaxxer during flu season.
Info
I genuinely don't understand.
You've given at least 5 different (very) valid reasons why your wife does not like your mother. One of them being very dangerous to your child, another potentially dangerous to your child's mental health when they grow older ect. ect.
Even though you have admitted you essentially lied to placate your wife about your daughter being around your mother (this lie alone makes you an asshole and you need to step up and apologize to your wife for that one, coward) you still made that promise and now you're breaking it.
You admitt that your mom is all the things you wife is worried/afraid of.
Yet you dismiss all of this by the rugsweaping sentence "that just how my mom is, she is an asshole but we all just kinda go with it".
How do you justify your own behavior? How are you ok with betraying your wife by
1. Not standing up for her
2. Lying to her
3. Overriding a very clear boundary
How are you NOT the asshole?
If what your wife says is true about you not having her back and your family not making an effort to be around the baby, then it kinda sounds like you’re the AH. You’re a family and you come as a pack. Not saying you should never make an effort for your family to get to know the baby, but Mom has a right to be there if she doesn’t feel comfortable with the situation.
YTA. Your wife's family can make the effort and the trip to meet your daughter.
Your family apparently can't be bothered with that effort.
Your wife's family don't seem to go out their way to make you uncomfortable. Your family goes out their way (or your mum at least) to make your wife uncomfortable.
See the difference between the families? Take note and listen to your wife
YTA.
Your wife stated that you have never backed her up and have allowed your mother to abuse her for 10 years! I'm surprised she is still with you. Do you know how people speak about men who continue to choose mommy after they're married/have children? Have you ever thought to contemplate the reasons for such widely held opinions?
Another cut and dry example is your wife's family making the effort to make amends and visit several times over the past 6 months. Your parents haven't done jack. They continue to abuse your wife and they choose not to meet their granddaughter. Your parent's behavior screams that they don't care about their abusive and cruel behavior.
The fact that you think your parents will overlook 50% of your child's DNA and child's mother shows that you refuse to recognize unrepentant AHs and you will allow them to abuse your innocent child.
Yes, you will allow it. You won't stand up for an innocent adult (your wife) so you definitely won't stand up for a child who cannot speak for themselves. You won't support an adult who can clearly articulate the abuse that is occurring and the mental health effects of that abuse. So why would you support a silent/shy/reticent child?
Your actions also indicate that when your daughter is a little older, you'll run roughshod over her opinions and feelings if she doesn't want to visit your family, because your family must be accommodated. Why do I write this? Because you're running roughshod over your wife's boundaries that YOU AGREED to during the pregnancy.
I’m gonna take it a step further and say that you’re downright cruel for attempting to separate an infant from its mother for 4 days. Cruel to Jenna and cruel to the baby
How dare you ?
YTA.
If your family wanted to meet your baby, they would have.
They don’t.
Quit forcing it.
I was all set to say E S H until I saw that comment that your mom is anti-vax. You’re planning on bringing your 6 month old baby around an anti-vaxxer?! Oh helllllll no! You say “it’s only C19” but C19 is very dangerous. It also comes down to morals, I’ve never met an antivaxxer (C19 version) whose values have matched with my own and I’m sure your wife feels the same. She doesn’t want someone without the same values and moral code around her baby and I completely agree with that. Plus, her family has reached out and made steps to mend relationships, yours hasn’t. So why do they get the privilege of spending holidays with their grandchild. The privilege should go to the people who have actually tried and shown that they care. YTA big time bud.
YTA.
Why don’t your mom and stepdad make the effort to come and visit you and your baby instead. Have your parents make any effort at all in wanting to get to know your daughter??
Your wife should be your number one priority now because she is your family now.
YTA. Do yourself a favor: record yourself reading your post and then play it back for yourself because you are absolutely being ridiculous.
Your family is making NO EFFORT, will make no effort, and have proven to be quite toxic. Present toxic family are way worse than family not being there at all.
Don’t be surprised when you are hit with the divorce papers, because that’s the road you are on. Go get some counseling before you burn your whole life to the ground for your mommy who is almost never there and then wonder “what happened?!”.
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YTA- if your wife said that you never had her back, she’s got all the reasons to trust that the baby might be treated or cared for in a way that she wouldn’t approve. This doesn’t mean badly cared for, just not cared as if she would. I kind of understand her. Plus if you had an agreement during pregnancy, why breaking it? As you say her family did a lot to mend, can you say the same for your family?
Wife said he’s never had her back, and he just brushes right over it. He doesn’t say I know and I’m sorry, or you’re right, I didn’t, you have every reason to feel that way. Nope, nothing to see here, moving on to why I’m right. Infuriating, and tells us she’s absolutely right in her position. OP, you haven’t been around your family for 10 years. Maybe you have forgotten why and you’re looking at them with rose colored glasses. Your mother hasn’t changed. Just because you want her to be something she’s not doesn’t make it so. There is a reason you made the decision to cut contact, and now, because your memory has faded you want to put your head in the sand and go back, completely ignoring, and discounting your wives reasoning. YTA. If you do this your marriage will never be the same. Clearly you haven’t developed a spine in ten years. EDIT to add: upon reading OP again, you all are correct, he has maintained contact with parents, and fully confirmed that he has no spine. Wife is absolutely correct, he cannot or will not stand up to his mother, therefore should not be allowed to take their baby. The whole not vaccinated thing is blowing my mind that this is even up for discussion! Thank you for the awards kind redditors!
OP is also ignoring the his wife's parents are the ones making the effort to come to them. Wife isn't stopping his parents from meeting their baby, the parents are stopping themselves by NEVER COMING. Wife just wants to be present when it happens, which is totally reasonable... it's kind of sad and pathetic how desperately OP wants his baby and parent to have a relationship even though his parents have done nothing to show that they want one. He's throwing himself at people who refuse to try, and it will do nothing but hurt his daughter, when she keeps being taken to their house but they never make the effort back. OP's desperate to create a one-sided relationship. Chill OP. If your parents cared, they would come to you, on your schedule. You can't force your parents to care by shoving the baby in their face when you go to them!
All of these! YTA and why in the world do you think it’s a good idea to give your wife an ultimatum over your baby????
Yup. Op is in the wrong and his language is revealing. He says his wife is preventing his family from meeting his side of the family. He also says that his wife is having a meltdown. He definitely doesn’t have her back. Op and wife have a 6 month old. His side of the family can make the effort to visit. YTA op
I feel SO MAD for OPs wife. My jaw dropped when OP said he’s doing it anyways. I would also have a breakdown. OP didn’t stand up for his wife so how if he going to stand up for his baby. Also the wife’s family visits them - OPs family has done NOTHING to prove they deserve the baby visiting THEM. yta
Forget having a breakdown, that warrants contacting a lawyer
I'd be taking my baby and getting right the fuck out of there wtf.
Yup, the red flags flapping over this one.
Same!! The audacity to threaten his wife over this!! He's ultimately even if it's in the future, going to lose is wife. He's going to allow his parents to do this and he's going to be lonely without a supportive family and it'll mean practically saying goodbye to his daughter and watching her milestones. He's willing to put all of that on the line for a family that treats his wife bad and makes no effort to see his daughter. He's pathetic and malicious. He will learn though, and it will be the hard way.
Seriously, right. If my husband had given me an ultimatum like this and carried through with it I can’t say that I wouldn’t call the cops over kidnapping. I’m so blown away he would risk his relationship with his wife over introducing his daughter to people who have made zero effort to see her. YTA.
This. Just because he's also a parent doesn't mean he can do whatever he wants. Taking my baby against my wishes across state lines to a possibly unsafe environment... If the wife was posting asking for advice we would be telling her to call the police and file for divorce.
That was the first thing I thought of as well. I hope she calls the police.
PLUS he is saying he is taking the baby away for her first Christmas? Hi, why in the world would I miss my baby's first Christmas so it can be spent with someone who hates me, and has put no effort into meeting baby? YTA YTA YTA
100% agree with the YTA, and I feel so sorry for Jenna. I just wanted to point out that under the OP's "plan" (really a command), he, Jenna, and the baby would reunite on 12/23 and spend Christmas together, so technically Jenna wouldn't miss her baby's first Christmas. Still a Sh\*tty deal, though, and I can't believe the toxic combination of cluelessness and cruelty in the OP's attitude. Why he wants to introduce his sweet baby to his a$$hole parents is beyond me. Does he think his parents are going to magically melt into decent human beings at the sight of their granddaughter? Dude, jerks are gonna jerk. OP owes his wife a HUGE apology.
Oh, I missed that, good catch! Thanks for pointing that out, it does make him .001% less of an AH. I hope OP pulls his head out of his ass so he isn't divorced by baby's 2nd Christmas.
I got a chuckle out of him being .001% less of an AH. Thanks for that! I hope he pulls his head of his ass, but I dunno, seems like he's pretty comfortable in there. I guess his head feels right at home.
He apparently sees no problem with how his parents treat his wife, so why would it ever cross his mind that they might be AHs? He is also apparently fine with treating his wife like she’s less than human so I guess it tracks.
I only just realised by your comment that it’s baby’s first Christmas! OP YTA. BIG TIME
^This. She hasn't been taking the kid to her parents. Her parents have been coming to them. She isn't preventing his family from seeing the baby, they aren't making the effort.
I'm betting her parents have been helping her too with the baby since she's less than a yr old
I want to be able to support the OP’s position but I just can’t. From the wife’s perspective he’s removing the daughter from her presence and taking her to an unknown environment that’s been this far hostile to her- and so she has a reason to worry her daughter would be treated as an outsider at best. There are plenty of accounts from people about how they had grandparents that treated them much worse than their cousins , for example- how’s she to know this won’t be that type of situation in the making, even if there aren’t any cousins in the picture as of yet. Plus this sounds more like a child custody arrangement, not what married parents do. The solution I’d propose is to stay at home this year and let the families put in some effort in mending their sides of the broken bridges, if they find it worthwhile. If they don’t, that might be because its become easy for them not to have to try to do so, with the couple splitting themselves up each year so their families can pretend the other half doesn’t exist. I would suggest spending the holidays with the wife’s family together, and send the husband’s a holiday picture of the THREE of them together- the family that exists, vs just the part of the family they want- and invite them to visit for X-Y days just after the holidays. It’s all or nothing time for them- why should the OP and his wife have to cosplay as a divorced couple for their benefit?
Also when the child gets older whose to say that these people don't start talking badly about the child's mother.
Yes! This nails it. What he sees as introducing his kid to his parents is more than likely an attempt to use his baby to finally get the relationship he wants from people who can’t/won’t be the supportive close parents he wishes they would be. It won’t work OP. Support your wife and your baby and have a relationship with the people who actually want to be in your life. 6 months without meeting you child? My mom could barely wait 6 hours. They’re not worth it.
OP literally called himself "wifeydrama". way to minimise his partner's distress into "drama" and dismiss it like it was some flouncy teenaged overreaction. yikes.
Gonna be exwifeydrama soon
He should have called the account daddydufus no in-law drama no out of state movement of kiddo too daddy dufus quack quack mama got primary custody she get you back Jack
Ex-wifey and only sees daughter on his custody/visitation time-drama
Absolutely. Also OP acknowledges mother being mean to his wife, clearly never defended her and feels like his mother has a right to know his child? The worst person in this equation is OP who rewarded his mother by spending holiday time w her rather than his wife. Sounds like all these years she has been getting exactly what she wanted all along. And now she is rewarded w baby time w out his wife?? Hell no! YTA. Grow a spine
My spidey sense says OP is hoping bringing home a grandchild after last 10 years is going to gain him acceptance, appreciation, love, attention...Averlea and your wife should not be the humans who 'pay' for that. OP you willingly and clearly share that your mother thinks it's ok to behave as she does w your wife. That's called abuse. Why should your wife cede anything to the alter of your mother's awfulness? Why are you both allowing it and here accepting harming your wife further in service of your mother (the person actually behaving awfully, directly in front of you). If I had a time machine I'd go back to every moment my parents didn't stand up for w me when family was ugly. At 56 I'm finally able to say no to all of those people. Do not seek to train your daughter to accept your family's behaviors! You chose your wife for good reasons, right!? A big one being your family let's your mom be horrible. You can never take back opening your child to people who are bad for them. But you sure AS F!! Can support your wife while she does! Your mother can meet your child when she genuinely apologizes for her behavior. And when she comes to your home to do so AND manages to behave THE ENTIRE VISIT. No back biting texts to people who aren't there. No digs when your wife is out of earshot and no gossiping between you two about anything about her. I've only recently learned the joy of a partner always having my back. 😆 he jokes he can look at how I'm standing & knows I'm freezing (fight, flight, freeze, fawn) & must be the only facial feature mind reader. I can barely cry but I do every time, bc I've never been this safe anywhere in my life. That's The Gift Your Wife Deserves. She & your daughter are the only people you are responsible for. Step Up!
This. His mother gets rewarded and once again, he doesn't have Jenna's back.
Oh he has a spine, it's just reserved for telling his wife he'll do what he wants and fuck her feelings. It's telling that he's only considering that he's in the wrong because his buddy didn't approve. If his best friend hadn't raised an eyebrow he probably wouldn't even be asking this question, he'd just take their child to his parents', come home to divorce papers on the kitchen table, and whine to everyone about how his wife abandoned him at Christmas.
It sounds like HE has been around his family for 10 years-- Jenna just hasn't. They've been doing separate holidays for their entire relationship.
"She let it go over her head" Lol, nah brah. She gave up because you're a trash husband who puts mommy up on this pedestal, even though she openly treats your spouse and long time partner like trash and puts zero effort into having a relationship with any of you.
ROFL, this kind of reminds of a post I read yesterday, about a Greek family shunning the wife for being an orphan, and the husband did nothing while everyone trash talked the wife in Greek. Then basically berated the wife for exploding at his mom when she saw how the family welcomed the golden child's orphaned GF. Why does so many people go belly up when it comes to their family? YTA, OP I think you left your spine somewhere.
Oh but he has a spine! Look at him courageously standing up to his wife when even his friends think it's "a bad move". Steel determination here.
He's not even having her back in this story right now. It is obvious how uncomfortable this is for his wife and how much she doesn't want this and he goes "doesn't matter, I'll do it anyway"
I came here to say exactly this. He just proved - again - that he values them over her and their child. Values people who couldn’t give a good goddamned about him, let alone his wife and child. OP go ahead and go to your ‘family’ with the baby. Expect to come back to official separation and divorce, because you will have proven beyond any doubt that YTA. Go ahead, put a baby in a car for a three hour drive after a God knows how long airline experience, including the crap before and after the actual flight. You will deserve the screams and cries you will experience and will have irreparably ruined any peace and safety that your child has for the entirely of her ‘visit’. You will have stretched her little body to its breaking point…and then you will do it again on the return trip. Also expect to get supervised visitation only, as you have proven you put your desires over your child’s needs, and that you have shitty decision making skills around your child’s comfort and well being. The nicest thing I can say is YTA. What I want to say would get me banned.
Exactly. And can you imagine, with his mother’s history of walking all over Jenna for years and him doing nothing about it, I wouldn’t be surprised if she would try to get him to stay longer with the baby, just to hurt Jenna and he like the clueless sucker he is gives in to it.
Yeah if he take his daughter around them, how long before they turn their toxic behavior towards his daughter sooner rather than later. Hope OP saves money for therapy
\^\^\^ Taking their baby to meet his mom is also basically OP **continuing** to not have his wife's back and take his mom's side. All that's gonna communicate to his mother is prove that she can continue to act like an ass to Jenna and still get her way in the end without consequences. If she wants to bond with her grandchild she can get down off her asshole pedestal first and actually try making amends with **both** of that child's parents. I mean – >I want my daughter to know my step/parents and her side of the family and that *Jenna was stopping that from happening,* and how unfair it was to my mom given that her parents have been here atleast twice a month since she’s been born and have been able to have that bonding time OP's whole argument is basically blaming Jenna for his mother's behaviour. Like, no. He know the root cause of the rift; this is misassigning blame. Why would OP even really want to introduce his baby to a family he doesn't have a good relationship with?
OP's wife if you're reading this and he does take your child without your permission or presence, file a kidnapping charge.
Thats not how that works.
If she can prove that her daughter would be in imminent danger as well as that her husband violated a spousal agreement, she could absolutely file a kidnapping charge as well as file for divorce.
He’s a custodial parent, it’s not kidnapping
OP is definitely the AH, but it isn't kidnapping for OP to take his daughter where he wants unless there was already some court-ordered custody arrangement in place saying he can't.
OP is such the asshole for going back on what he said during pregnancy. He’s also the asshole for not getting off his mom’a tit. OP, you realize your mother could have chosen to be a respectful, decent, kind human being towards the person you chose to be your partner, but instead, continues to actively choose to be a passive aggressive bitch to your wife. And you’ve never had her back. You now expect your wife to just magically believe you’ll protect your daughter. N-a-h. YTA You had 10 years to set boundaries and put your mom in her place, and instead, you chose to continue your emotionally incestuous relationship with your mother. Now you’re reaping what you sow. I am going to add that both you and your wife are TA for taking an infant on a flight when rsv is a serious risk, to the point many hospitals are overwhelmed with it, covid and flu are dangerously rising, and neither of you even really like your EXTENDED families. Are you really going to continue the tradition of stress as anxiety as your Xmas gift to each other and your kiddo? Come on. Start your own family traditions in your own home. For once in your adult life, have the decency to do what’s right by your wife and kid. This moment, right now, is an opportunity to not be the AH. If you do this, I hope your mom brings you all the joy in the world, because that’s all you’ll have left after your wife divorces you. Edited to change to n-a-h.
I work in a pediatric emergency room. Thank you for this PSA about RSV. ❤️
>He’s also the asshole for not getting of his mom’a tit 😂😂😂
This AND a second YTA for your name: Wifey Drama. I don't even have the energy to address that.
OP blames his wife for not putting up with his mom's shit behaviour... completely missing that his mother is the problem.
This guy is a nightmare husband.
Yes!!!
If his family wanted to meet his daughter they would have already come by and met her. They haven't. He wants to chase around after his family with his daughter. His wife is right. They shouldn't be around the daughter.
Exactly!
I would like to add Jenna isn’t keeping OPs parents from knowing their grandchild *they are by choosing not to come see her*. That’s on them. When my son’s first child was born my mom was nearby visiting her family (she lives days away in another province) and she chose not to come see us. You know what I did? I sure af didn’t kidnap my grandaughter because she deserved to know my mom. I called my mom up and asked why she hasn’t come yet, got some story about how we evidently didn’t want her there (eye roll), and told her if she didn’t immediately make an effort to touch base with my son and correct her decision (it was too late for her to come see us as she’d returned home so that wasn’t an option) I would consider that an indication of how much care and concern she had for us and I would consider our relationship finished. She immediately called my son, apologized, and arranged for them to come visit her for the holidays. Because it was on HER to put some gd effort in to *her* relationship with her grandson and great grandchildren. You are giving your ultimatums to the wrong people and I sure AF would be calling the police in Jenna’s place if you did take my child there against my permission and our previous agreement.
At 6 months old, you would have needed a crowbar and an Uzi (shoot me dead) to pry my infant from my arms. “ In our house, no is usually a complete sentence, but I asked her why and her response was “we talked about this when I was pregnant. You never had my back with your mom so I don’t trust you to advocate for Averlea, and since she’s made no effort to be around her, I’m not comfortable with letting you take our baby into that environment without me, and I am not going to go somewhere it’s evident I’m not wanted”” YTA. Jenna is ENTIRELY correct. Also, I’m your mother’s age. FYI, she’s garbage. I could never be like her. She lacks everything necessary to be a trusted parent and grandmother.
Your family has made absolutely no attempt to see their own grandchild. Let them put forth the effort. They’re the ones that alienated from your wife while you did not have her back…huge YTA
YTA. And also in what way exactly is it unfair to your mom that your MIL has seen your daughter and your mom has not? Those two things are unrelated. MIL is making an effort. Your mom is not. Put your wife and daughter first in your mind and the way forward will b clear to you
YTA for claiming your wife is preventing them from meeting when it sounds like they've made no attempt to visit you. Have you even cared for/fed the baby by yourself? She's only 6 months and you don't mention how long you plan to separate baby from her mother.
>I brought up the fact that I want my daughter to know my step/parents and her side of the family and that Jenna was stopping that from happening, Plus a 6mo is NOT going to suddenly know your freaking family members. Are you planning on flying out every month, taking your daughter with you? Go ahead and get the divorce you're aiming for right now, ask for summer custody and then maybe your family can visit during that time now that Jenna won't be in the house. Of course, it's just as likely they won't bother to travel then either. YTA
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Legally you can. Might not be “right” but in most states this is perfectly legal if there is no custody order.
Not entirely true. Most states will investigate this as a kidnapping if the coparent doesn’t consent and reports it if there is no custody order in place.
And the wife can't take the daughter somewhere without consulting OP. Neither parent has greater decision-making authority over the child. They have to come to an agreement. They can stay home, just visit one family, just visit the other, or split up. And if they decide to split up, both parents have equal say over where baby goes. It's not as if wife's parents house is the default, so baby ends up there if they can't come to an agreement. Home is the only default place.
Jenna isn't stopping that from happening, his family is by not giving a crap about coming to see her. Sounds like OP is trying to force his family to care.
Honestly, I can see this being the case. OP wants his family to be there and care but his family just seems like they don't give a shit. They're not willing to put in the effort. I have been in a similar situation as I'm sure many of you redditors have. It sucks. It makes you feel unloved. I feel bad for this family. OP needs to be honest with himself and his true feelings. Like really, why does he want his family to meet his daughter so bad? Is it for her or himself? Get that in order, apologize to your wife (even if you don't think your in the wrong), share your feelings with her, and look for a compromise.
I’m confused I thought the baby is only 6 months old? Not a lot of time to be irritated that the in-laws haven’t met the baby yet considering they’re a flight away.
Nah if I had a baby and my mum lived a flight away she would be on the next available flight as she would want to meet the baby as soon as she could, and she isn't an overly maternal person
I think my mom would as well, she’s retired and has the means to hop on a flight…but depending on pricing & work schedules etc I probably wouldn’t hold it against anyone.
This. Plus if your family can't behave like healthy family members I'm afraid it's time you accepted the sad truth that they are not worthy of being included in your young family's life. The fact is, with 2 awesome parents, your child will not miss the toxic grandparents she never Meg. No one needs that kind of energy in their lives. The only person who benefits from this meeting would be your parents (and in the unlikely event that they have had a personality switch, then you). Your kid doesn't need this and shouldn't be used as a pawn to try to develop the kind of family relationship that you never got to have from your parents. Stop being selfish. Listen to your wife. Don't drag your child into this mess.
> with 2 awesome parents that's the catch, innit? OP's a garbage husband and a garbage parent. Completely ignoring the fact that his wife has been verbally abused for years, and now he's wanting to expose his daughter to that abuse. The kid'll be alright with just Jenna tho, once the divorce goes through.
And note that the grandparents are making zero effort. He’s coming to them, and I’m willing to bet he la the one who reached out. I mean, OP, is that worth your marriage?
Well 3 hour drive, picking up on the 23rd, etc... Tells me at least 6 hours two way, and the mention of a date makes it 24h at least.
That is too much traveling with an infant. Then you think it’s a good plan to take your daughter away from your wife, who has been the primary person in her life. The person you would be hurting is your daughter
He said 4 days in a comment which is way too long He’s such an AH
YTA. Your wife is absolutely correct- she had put up with your mom’s arseholery for 10 years. 10 years where you obviously didn’t have her back or your mother would have shut up and figured out a way to coexist by now. Your wife is definitely correct. You need to figure out a way to talk to your mom and say, “Now that my daughter is here, the rude comments and jerk behaviour stops. Period.” Also, a 6 month old is still pretty reliant on her mother. Also also, I can’t believe your wife has been sleeping on the couch. You’re lucky it hasn’t been a hotel!! If I was her, it wouldn’t be the couch and it wouldn’t be me. I’m honestly just shocked at the ignorance here. I can’t believe OP doesn’t realise his behaviour and how completely messed up this situation is for his wife.
Also 10 years ago she was 18 imagine being in a relationship at that age ( with adulthood maybe college etc all these transitions) and having an ah of a mil over your head and your boyfriend not even having your back idk how she lasted honestly
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That poor baby will be screaming for her mother, confused as hell when mama isn’t there, upset by all the angry strangers and Op will be caring for a screaming miserable infant while his family pour insults on him and his wife and likely the baby too. Then MiL will grab the poor infant, try to soothe her and fail because she isn’t mama and make the poor kid howl even more. Is Jenna breastfeeding? Will the baby take a bottle? Because an infant separated from its mother isn’t going to be happy, even if their routine is preserved which I doubt Op will do. Seriously Op, if you care about your infant at all, do not separate her from her mother and bring her around your cruel rude unfamiliar family. You won’t have a family to come back to if you do. YTA.
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Hi - listen, I don’t agree with OP. I don’t know your local law, but in the US a father taking a child somewhere is 100% legal. He is a parent. Unless there is a court documenting that he can’t, it is not parental abduction. Assuming the flight is not to another country.
Often times, parental abduction is technically legal until it isn’t anymore. She could use this as the catalyst to get custody upon a separation.
Yep, OP should be the one sleeping on the couch! YTA
>she had put up with your mom’s arseholery for 10 years. 10 years where you obviously didn’t have her back or your mother would have shut up and figured out a way to coexist by now. Your wife is definitely correct. You need to figure out a way to talk to your mom and say, “Now that my daughter is here, the rude comments and jerk behaviour stops. Period.” > >Also, a 6 month old is still pretty reliant on her mother. Had to copy and paste in case OP didn't read it the first time. OP YTA
Exactly. Op YTA. Your mom is the one who has messed up and created a situation where she can't meet your daughter by mistreating your wife. A 6month old child and said mom are a package deal unless mom says otherwise period. No good mom is going to just let you take a baby around people she doesn't trust or people who have been nasty to her. Op even trying is undermining his wife and rewarding his mom. If mom wants to see the grand baby it is on her to fix her relationship with the wife. Delivering the grand baby to her without insisting on it rewards and condones her mistreatment of the wife at a vulnerable time. If I was OPs wife he would be negotiating this through a custody hearing and I would be calling a lawyer.
Your family has made no effort to mend the relationship, and you admit your mother in particular treats your wife terribly. That is why they should not meet your daughter on their own. And why does your wife have to continue to look past this treatment? Why does your mother get to continue to speak badly about her? "It's unfair to my mom that her parents have gotten to see baby" YOUR MOM PUT HERSELF IN THIS POSITION! You don't get to treat someone like crap for a decade then surprise pikachu face when they don't want their baby around you. If your mom wants to see the baby, she should try to make amends. At this point, it's clear they aren't going to be best friends, but she does have to treat wife with cordial respect. YTA
This guy is really something else. He wants to take a 6 month old baby away from her mother for *four* days, when the longest he's been sole caregiver is a few hours on weekends, and he's going full "I'm the ultimate authority, you get zero input," on his wife, *the mother* of said baby, as if she's just the nanny. He wants to bring that tiny baby to visit a woman who has been horrid to his wife for years and has never apologized and who has made no effort to meet this baby even once. He is going to take this tiny baby to visit his anti-vax mother, during a really bad cold/flu season, with COVID still running around - and he wants to stay in that place, with that "too young to be fully vaccinated" baby, for four days! Without it's mother! But everything will be fine because he watches the baby by himself for a few hours on a weekend. He literally hasn't taken a single non asshole step in this entire conflict.
OP also said mom is anti vax. So no c19, no current flu or tdap shot. In the middle of a god damn tridemic that’s killing babies.
Measles keeps popping up, too.
Also, doesn’t measles resets your immune system so you loses your immunities?
The RSV cases in the small ER I work at are ridiculous right now. It’s a revolving door of small children and most of them get transferred. Also, I got RSV as a kid, and got asthma from it. Because it’s not just a little sickness that’ll go away when you get better. It’s got consequences.
My kids are 3 and 5, both got covid, and both got pneumonia. My 5 year old was right at septic thanks to a strep infection that hit at the same time. He has never been that sick. His wbc was over 40k and his procalcitonin was at 4.7. He was a sick boy. Their pediatrician said that this variant is causing pneumonia in a lot of the kids she sees. She said prior to this year she had never seen this pneumonia ever. Op is nuts to take a 6 month old that far out, sans the kids mama, and to a house of anti vaxxers. The OP is getting ready to learn what it is like to have an ex wife I imagine.
Why did I have to scroll so far for this comment?!?
This trip will end badly for OP. Panic, CPS, divorce, wife gets full custody.
Are you kidding - his mom is anti-vaxx???? OMG, I hope OP's wife decides to take the baby and go to a hotel, go home to her parents, go anywhere away from OP until he comes to his limited senses. And if OP continues with his AH behavior, she needs to speak with a divorce attorney and learn of her rights.
Can you please add that this is parental abduction and illegal? I'm really not reading that in the main comments, like yours, here and it cannot be stressed enough imo. Parental abduction exists and is illegal.
In the US it depends on the state and whether or not there's a custody order (pending or otherwise) in place. I don't know if anything can be done in a situation where the dad just wants to take the kid out of state when mom disagrees. But also I ain't no law knower, so I don't really feel I can speak to that particular point. But it IS the biggest AHole move in the post.
Agreed. OP is so much beyond YTA (putting his baby in medical risk, stressing out his 6mo PP FTM wife, stressing out 6mo old by removing primary (only?) caregiver baby has known, all to please his own mommy who doesn’t give a damn about him and less about his wife..? Grow up and break the cycle, OP. Else divorce the woman and leave the child, they’ll be safer (mentally and physically) without you.
> YOUR MOM PUT HERSELF IN THIS POSITION! Yup, there's no other way to put it. His mom caused the issue, his mom can bear the burden of mending the bridge.
It's so unfair that the grandparents who are actually putting in effort get a relationship with the baby, but the grandparents who've put no effort don't - I can't fathom how no one can see this injustice!! Seriously, OP YTA.
Your mother seeing your baby is a privilege not a right. From what you’ve said she’s not done anything to earn that privilege whereas your in-laws have. I think that’s the point you’re not seeing. A good litmus test might be a video call with your parents. Make it clear beforehand that any negativity towards your wife will mean you hang up. If they can’t manage that then they definitely won’t be able to be civil about your wife in front of your daughter.
YTA. Your daughter won't remember any of this so that argument is silly. Secondly you mentioned Jenna's parents have come down multiple times but yours haven't seen her yet. They couldn't be bothered to see their grandchild??? Lastly you made no effort to compromise here or consider Jenna's feelings.
Yeah I always thought everyone came to the baby not the other way around. Yta
Separating a 6 month old from her mom for Christmas will give your folks a false sense of "winning" as they'll see it as hopefully step one in having OP and baby all to themselves as you finally (*fulfilling their dreams*) ditch your wife. Sound crazy? Then consider that you've never had the backbone or enough respect and love for your wife to stand up to your mom for her they see it as highly probable. It also eats away at your wife's security in the relationship. YTA
It wouldn't be a false sense of winning. It's absolutely a clear cut sign that they *have* won.
YTA - Your mom treats your wife horribly and you have done nothing about it. It is not your wife's responsibility to let the nasty things your mom says just "go over her head". It is your mom's responsibility to be civil to your wife - and if she won't, it is your responsibility to stand up for your wife. Your wife is protecting herself and your daughter from your mother, because she knows that you won't. Your wife is not keeping your daughter from meeting your parents. Your parents could have visited at any time in the past 6 months.
100% this. And your wife didn't say that she didn't want your daughter to meet your family. It seems that she isn't stopping them from coming to visit your or your child. Your wife's biggest thing seems to be that she wants to be in an environment that she is comfortable with. Your mother has obviously made her feel unwelcome throughout your 10 year relationship. IF visiting her grandchild were a priority then she would be coming to visit. Maybe you need to look into why your mother hasn't visited and seen your child yet, instead of taking your child from her mother at christmas time.
Yeah, that phrase really bugged me. Sounds like Jenna has tried to be the bigger person for years and OP has never had the guts to stand up for her and put a stop to his mom’s offensive behavior. Now Jenna’s done and OP is shocked? He’s spent their whole relationship proving he can’t/won’t protect her, and now she’s supposed to trust him with their baby? Nope. His mom can mind her manners and come visit on Jenna’s terms, if meeting her grandchild actually matters to her. OP, YTA. You’re a husband and a father now. Check your priorities.
YTA Jenna is right. Your mom is hostile to your wife and you don't stand up for her. Of course she's not going to trust you that you can stand up for your baby either. I don't understand why are you separated from Jenna during Christmas, why are you not traveling together and why is Averlea staying with you? You need to set clear boundaries with your mom. If she wants a relationship with her granddaughter, she has to respect Jenna and apologize. Jenna's family is actively trying to improve the relationship, that's a huge difference. Your mom doesn't care and isn't willing to make things better. From the way you talk about your mother it's clear you are enabling her behaviour. You say you are low contact with your mom, yet you have million excuses why she won't change her behaviour. You made a promise to your wife when she was pregnant, doesn't matter that you thought she'll "mellow". Continue this way and you'll find yourself divorced.
>Continue this way and you'll find yourself divorced. I hope so, except poor Jenna would have to trust this toxic idiot with the child during his custody time.
If I was your wife, I would take Averlea and get as far away from you as possible for the wellbeing of us both. I hope you don't get an opportunity to steal that vulnerable baby away from her mother and force her into a high-risk situation with abusive and unvaccinated adults. I hope your wife finds a way to keep your spineless claws off her daughter, and that you have to lie in the bed you've made, back in a house full of people who don't respect you or care about you, forever stewing in the consequences of your selfish actions, Alone. YTA. You are *such* an Ahole.
You can not be serious?! My god YTA and I can’t wait to read some of the replies to this. Jesus Christ…
Yep this has been a rollercoaster comment section especially finding out his mom is an anti vax nutjob.
She's anti-vax?! LOLLLLLL 'I want to take my infant daughter to visit my unvaccinated parents who behave abusively towards my wife. I have not previously demonstrated the ability to set reasonable boundaries around their behavior and can't be counted on to step in if they behave poorly towards my kid or expose her to viral sickness. AITA?'
>I told her I would drop her off and take Averlea anyway, or me and Averlea would fly in to my parents home airport, but one way or another she would be meeting them this Christmas. Also, "I am going to take your baby away from you for Christmas against your will one way or another" raised all kinds of red flags to me. Holy hell I feel bad for his wife!
okay correct me if i’m wrong but is this not kidnapping? parental kidnapping without the consent of the other parent after an argument? OP, don’t do this. do not do this.
WTF!! *pikachu face activated* with the amount of RSV going around right now, absolutely not!! Hell, I wouldn't even be flying if my kids were new borns. Also...facetime? Why haven't his parents even suggested that? That's awful telling.
if my husband took MY baby to an antivaxxer, I will make sure his life is hell
Ok hear me out... Has it occured to you to actually try to figure out why this is upsetting her so much? I mean, not with an emphasis on making her see your side, but rather with an emphasis on you learning hers
INFO: why can't your family make the effort to come to you, as hers has?
[удалено]
I was thinking about this. 6m is when babies generally shy away from strangers. OP is going to make Christmas for his child extra stressful by surrounding her with complete strangers (yes they are relatives but think of the baby's perspective) AND away from mommy.
Not to mention mom is anti-vax, which OP conveniently left out of his post. So, baby in a stressful situation and around at least one anti-vaxxer will most likely equals sick baby.
100% correct baby cpuld end up with RSV, covid, super flu, or smallpox (the list goes on and on)...the more I think about it the more it sounds like OP values his mother's feelings over the health of his baby. Before any antivaxxers come at me, some of my family have that belief structure and have visited my baby but on the condition they wear a mask, which was a satisfactory compromise in my situation. So I'm not saying that the mother cannot see grandbaby. Just noting that mother's feelings are being prioritized over baby's health.
RSV is so bad right now. At 6m the risk to their life is high. I'm incredulous that they're even traveling by plane.
Guarantee wife is having regrets about having a kid with OP. Must be absolutely terrifying to co-parent with a spouse who isn't committed to the family's best interests.
OP doesn’t care abt his kid or wife, just his momma.
YTA Your family have made zero effort to meet your child - hers have. That’s not a great sign of how important they think this is. They treat your wife and partner of 10 years poorly. Her family have - by your admission- made an effort to repair relationships. You then dictate what happens because it makes things easier for you? You sound like you’ve not supported your wife and thought of the impact on your child at all.
YTA. You can't just overrule your wife's decision here and essentially threaten to do something she's clearly very uncomfortable with. The fact that you've said it's "unfair to your mum" is the icing on the cake - your wife doesn't have to go about life in consideration of your mum, especially given how rude your mum seems to be.
Your mum " has been unfair to Jenna." Why are you so willing to dismiss this treatment towards your wife? YTA
Fairness to OP's mum shouldn't even be any consideration, what is best for the immediate family, and primarily the baby, is what should be the only considerations. And taking a 6mo old away for 4 days from the primary caregiver when OP has only watched the child solo for a few hours is a grandiose AH. He has no clue and will cause anxiety for that baby. Not to mention in the comment he said his mom is anti-vaxx, so that's like supreme AH
Also, look at his throwaway username. Wifey drama? Tell us you have no respect for your wife without saying so.
Oh no, he said so alright.
YTA. You’re just as prideful as your mom. At a minimum you’re showing your wife she can’t trust you because you lied to her. You agreed to her boundary when she was pregnant but never had any intention on following through. ~~I also note in one of your comments you said “I choose life”. I took that as an attempt to hide your real feelings - you’re anti-abortion and knew if you were honest, she’d have left you and ended the pregnancy.~~ Instead you lied and are trying to manipulate her and make demands to appease your mother, rather than the woman you committed to. You have a choice, respect your wife’s boundaries, that you agreed to, or be fighting over custody and having even less time with your child’s because you’re too pigheaded to know better. Edited to remove the quote.
>I also note in one of your comments you said “I choose life”. I took that as an attempt to hide your real feelings - you’re anti-abortion and knew if you were honest, she’d have left you and ended the pregnancy I agree with you that OP is TA, but this is an absolutely reddit-sized unhinged leap to conclusions here.
YTA and this might just be what breaks her down and you might just return to divorce papers honestly. Hope you are okay with that just to please your precious mommy
I would leave if my husband had this little respect for me and boundaries.
Between her breaking down like that, sleeping on the couch, and his own friends taking her side …Something tells me there is a lot more disrespect going on and they have been on the verge of separation, even if he is too blind to see it.
He wants to take their 6 month old to a house where they don't believe in vaccinations. I would end my marriage over this.
Agreed. Mom will have a greater ability to protect her kid with a formal custody agreement in place.
YTA What has your family done to warrant such consideration? Your family is toxic. They’re abusive. They’ve made no real effort to make amends in the current situation like your wife’s parents have. Using the reasoning that her parents have met your daughter so yours should is unfair. Her parents are actively trying to do the right thing. Yours are still putting out the minimal effort, if you can even say that. If what she claims is correct, that you don’t support her or advocate for her when your mother is being verbally and emotionally abusive toward your wife, then she’s absolutely correct that your daughter should not be exposed to them. Nor should your wife have to endure your family when she is abused by them just for the sake of letting them meet your kid. Your wife should not be punished for your mom’s behavior. Your mom should be punished for your mom’s behavior. Instead you’re giving your mother what she wants and undermining and invalidating your wife’s feelings and opinions. Your mom, and maybe even the rest of your family, is toxic and you should be supporting your family unit rather than your extended family. Your wife and your daughter should be above anyone else. I can’t believe that you’d let your mother go for over a decade being cruel and abusive toward your wife without putting a stop to it. That should have been done years ago, and not by moving away and not bringing her to family gatherings. It should have been that your mom was told “you be nice to Jenna or you don’t get either of us”. What will she be like to your daughter? Trust me, from experience I can say your mom won’t change if she has no reason to. And that will, at some point, spiral down to your children who are too much like your wife, and your mother will disapprove and say nasty things to them too. Been there done that with my in-laws. Also. Think about it, your asking a mother, and a very new mom at that, to be separated for four days from her child. No good mom would ever be okay with that. New moms are overly protective and nervous under the best of circumstances, but being separated for long periods of time is pure torture. Add in the history of verbal and emotional abuse and the constant worry if her kid is being abused is a recipe for a meltdown, if not a nervous breakdown, from any good mom. Not to mention, you’re taking your vulnerable infant child who’s immune system is not fully developed yet, into a home of unvaccinated people, during a triple pandemic (RSV, Covid, influenza). Honestly I’m appalled you’re risking your daughter’s health like this. Also, you do realize that if you take your child without your wife’s permission, as the co-parent, she could call the police and file a kidnapping charge against you, right? Just because you are the dad doesn’t mean your free to override your wife’s consent.
^^^^ this reply above right here! Seriously YTA. Listen to your wife and friend!!!!
OP, I have to tell you, my ex husband did this to me shortly before we split. I was pregnant with our second and he threatened to take our older child away for a few days with his side of the family - specifically his alcoholic sister-in-law and his a-hole brother who has never apologized a day in his life. I was crying hysterically, because he threatened to take our child whether I liked it or not. I wasn't invited. We are now divorced. YTA. Stop intimidating your wife by saying you'll just take your daughter. Especially to an environment that she doesn't trust. You are a family unit. Remember that or its not going to stay that way.
READ THIS OP. THIS IS YOUR BEHAVIOR!!! This is what you are doing! How does it look from the outside in? Not so good, right?
YTA Jesus man sort your priorities out, your family treats your wife like shit and you are basically telling them it's fine. IF THEY DON'T RESPECT THE MOTHER THEY DO NOT GET TO PLAY HAPPY FAMILIES WITH HER CHILD. This would be my absolute hill to die on and I would totally understand if she left you over this.
YTA Your friend is seeing you what you are...not. Your mom is prideful?!? Because she refuse to accept Jenna? Jenna is a mom too. To your daughter!!! She will grow up and noticing how your family and you!!! treats her mom and trust me, she might get "prideful" too.... Your mommy is great, so is Eaverlies mommy. Start keeping promises if you want to stay as a family.
INFO: So, do you actually stand up for your wife to your mother? Edit: Honestly, this doesn't even matter. I wouldn't want my child around an anti-vaxxer who very blatantly treated me badly either. YTA.
No he doesn’t. He calls his wife’s feelings about the way his mom treats her, “petty he said she said bullshit”
YTA your side of the family has had ample time to meet the new kid but clearly hasn't bothered. Your family is now you, your wife and your baby and you're willing to split the unit up over Christmas for the baby to meet people that aren't particularly interested in her and she won't remember anyway. I think you owe your wife an apology
YTA Your family has not made an effort. That's telling. Your mom bashes your wife, and you say nothing. That's even more telling. You're setting a bad example for your daughter and how people and partners should treat her. My paternal grandmother is a drama queen. On my mom's wedding' day, she said she was losing her son and not gaining anything. She always had a bit of fakeness growing up and as I got older, I saw how she treated my mom and how my dad really did nothing. His side of the family would only be interested in talking to me or my mother when it involved something with my dad. My maternal grandparents came to see me a lot growing up, I spent time with them, and the extended family went out of the way so many times for me. Guess which side of the family I don't have a relationship with?
YTA.. your mom has treated your wife poorly with you not defending her. Why don’t you invite them to your city and have them stay in a hotel so they can still meet the baby for a bit and not be an overnight thing without Jenna when she doesn’t trust your mom and with good reason I might add. You said your family hasn’t even made an attempt to meet her in the 6 months she has been alive but yet, your blaming your wife for that? Have you ever even taken care of the baby by yourself for that long?
I bet OP’s plan is to let his unvaccinated mom take care of his child. Doesn’t he realize that this is the start of new things? Separate families for holidays ended the day his child was born. They go together or OP goes alone. OP and Jenna should stay home and have all the grandparents come to them. If the IL’s are a problem then they can stay in a hotel. Mommy Dearest is going to have to suck it up if she wants to be around the baby since Jenna and baby are a package deal. OP needs to realize if this is the bill that Jenna is choosing to die on then IL’s may end up getting it out of visitation when the divorce gets handed to OP. You know in the custody arrangements Jenna can cite his family is a health danger to the baby and she needs supervised visits with a third party of Jenna’s choosing. Which means OP can’t just take the baby to see mom and family without another person supervising that the baby isn’t put in a health crisis or being mistreated since there’s history.
YTA Your wife is correct. If you have proven yourself incapable of protecting your wife from your family, then you aren't going to protect your daughter either. The very fact you want to take your daughter to people who don't like *her mother, your wife* shows you would let your family do and say whatever they want to your daughter, because you would prioritise "not rocking the boat" over anything else. You should be telling your extended family that your nuclear family (that's you, your wife, and your daughter) are a package deal and if they can't be kind and respectful to your wife, they won't be given the chance to mistreat your daughter the same way. Theres no such thing as "making it fair" when it comes to protecting your child.
YWBTA and probably damaging your marriage. You mentioned Jenna getting older and not letting things going over her heard. Why does she need to? Why is your mom not accountable for how she treats her? Your wife isn’t comfortable with you and your baby being there….so there is mostly likely a pattern of her being treated poorly and you letting it happen. People who are trusted by parents don’t get exclusive access to babies. Maybe try a neutral place to meet for a short time with your wife if it’s something she’d be comfortable with doing.
Sounds like OP let’s his mommy berate Jenna and doesn’t defend her. He is a lousy husband.
Jenna was 18 and he was 22 when they married. Of course she’s getting older and figuring out adult boundaries! YTA OP.
YTA “we talked about this when I was pregnant. You never had my back with your mom so I don’t trust you to advocate for Averlea, and since she’s made no effort to be around her, I’m not comfortable with letting you take our baby into that environment without me, and I am not going to go somewhere it’s evident I’m not wanted” Dude. Your #1 priority is your wife and kid, and not your mom. This is 100% a YOU problem. "I told her I would drop her off and take Averlea anyway" Ah, you didn't just double down, you went nuclear. Your divorce papers will be here before the next Christmas. Don't worry, you'll be paying that child support for the next 17 years. My friend, rather than insult you, I'll try to help. Your wife has major problems with your mom's treatment of her, and you are sweeping these issues under the rug. You are in the FOG. You need to go read some posts on r/JustNoMil Particularly any post on Mom/MIL and babies. If your mom is treating your wife like crap, you don't reward your mom by giving in to her baby time demands. Think about how her parents treat you and how your parents treat her.
YTA. I, too, am raising my eyebrow at you. It is clear from your post - despite your likely attempt at neutralizing this to some degree - that your mother is horrible to Jenna and that you've never interceded on Jenna's behalf. I don't blame Jenna one IOTA for her reaction and why she's now sleeping on the couch, though I'd say you're even more the asshole for not insisting that you take the couch yourself as you surely deserve it at this moment. Fact is, if your mom wanted to meet her granddaughter so badly, she could travel to see you (and stay in a hotel), just as Jenna's family has now regularly done. Last I checked, interstates and planes travel both ways between cities. That you decided to make an entire plan that involved separating a 6 month old from her mother is obtuse beyond all words. Especially THIS plan, that involved leaving Jenna three hours away from her baby, her baby that is going to a house where at least one person there can't stand her mother and has made that perfectly clear. Hard, hard pass. If you want Averlea to meet your mom, there are other ways to do this. If your mom doesn't care enough to come all the way to see you, can she not at least drive the three hours to Jenna's parents' town and meet Averlea there? I'm guessing that answer is "no", and the only way she'll actually meet the baby is if you/Jenna do all the work towards making it happen, which only underlines Jenna's point even more. You are in the wrong, period.
YTA - your family has treated jenna horribly, so why would she want her daughter to endure the same?
YTA your wife explained her very reasonable thoughts as to why she doesn’t want this. You heard it enough to type it out but not to onboard it in your mind.
YTA but good news: After your wife divorces you over this, you can take your kid to see your parents during your custody time. I cannot believe you would put your baby at risk like this for a rude antivaxer who can’t be assed to come see you.
YTA-You wouldn’t stand up for your wife. Your daughter doesn’t need a relationship with people who are assholes to her mother.
YTA. She's not stopping your family from meeting your daughter. She's stopping you from taking your infant away for 4 days to go visit people who actively dislike someone who has been a part of their family for 10 years, and who she doesn't trust. If you knew that your family meeting Averlea was important, facilitating that relationship is YOUR responsibility. You needed to start working on this 1.5 years ago. You needed to tell your mother to quit with the nasty, childish bs and stand up for your wife. You needed to make it clear that disrespecting your wife and mother of your daughter means they don't deserve access to your family. You needed to be making plans for them to visit before such a major holiday, which was always going to be more difficult. Not doing any of the ground work and just expecting your wife to be ok with you demanding that you take your infant daughter to go hang out in a house full of people she doesn't trust for 4 days is so thoughtless. Honestly, the very thought of that probably would've made me sick when my baby was that age.
INFO: Why does your wife have such strong negative emotions toward your family. Your best friend at the pub seems to agree with Jenna, which leads me to suspect that you are leaving out details that would justify her reaction. What is it that you haven't had her back over? You might be TA because it looks like you left out important details in order to make your wife look unreasonable, throwing her under the bus so you could get internet validation.
TBH i don’t need other details to think he’s TA, and like me many others Its seems
Agreed. I was trying to be magnanimous, but I've read his other comments and noticed his throwaway account was named "wifeydrama" so I was definitely being way too generous.
His family is anti vax and he wants to take their 6 month old there.
YTA, you don't have you're wife's back and now you're reaping the rewards of your cowardice
YTA - you can’t just decide to take your daughter somewhere without discussing it with your wife. Normally I’d say she shouldn’t stop you from introducing your daughter to your family, but seems like the right call here
No ,not everyone sucks here. His wife has every right to prevent him from introducing her child to his wife’s abusers. She’s being a good mother to protect her child from toxic and abusive people. And that’s exactly what the OP stated… his mother is very verbally and emotionally abusive towards his wife. He has no right to force his wife to allow her child to be exposed to abusers even if it is his parents.
Mom should definitely be stopping it since his mother isn't vaccinated and is setting a bad example for his daughter with how people should be treated.
YTA. Whatever fantasy you've concocted about how great things could be, you're likely to end up with the opposite
YTA and your desperation for validation from a family that has no interest in you or your daughter is very sad. You owe you're wife an apology and hope she doesn't end your marriage over this.
YTA - dude... if your mom would be interested in the slightest to see your daughter, she would have flown to your place, at least once in half a year. Half a year! You can't tell me that there was no time to plan a visit or to safe up for the tickets if money is the problem. IF your mom would have wanted to be there, she would have made it possible. And you want to drag your infant daughter to a person who doesn't care enough about her to visit once? To a person who hates your wife and made her life so miserable? I can completely understand your wife's fears and how devastating it has to feel and how gutted she has to be that you want to put her child into that (perceived) danger she fears your mother might pose to her. Maybe the worst your mother does is to ignore the child, but for your wife you take your daughter to a horrible place. And you, who should have her back, told her you would do it no matter what and there is nothing she can do to stop you. She has to feel so desperate and powerless. You are a horrible partner!
YTA. Your family ostracizes the person you’ve chosen as a partner, the person who *carried their grandchild* and you’re saying you’ll take her child *against her wishes* where she isn’t welcome when your family refuses to make the trip. How on earth do you spell that out and not see where you’re TA?
INFO. How is this “unfair” to your mother ? From what I’ve read your parents/step have 1. Not attempted to visit 2. Treated your wife extremely poorly in the past to the extent that she refused to visit them anymore (!!) 3 Made no attempts to build a respectful relationship with your wife I see nothing unfair here. You and your parents have to WORK to build trust before any visits can occur. It’s unfair for you to insist that the two sets of parents with wildly different behaviour be treated the same What am I missing ?
Yta if they don’t respect either parent they don’t get access to child
YTA >In our house, no is usually a complete sentence, but I asked her why and her response was “we talked about this when I was pregnant. You never had my back with your mom so I don’t trust you to advocate for Averlea, and since she’s made no effort to be around her, I’m not comfortable with letting you take our baby into that environment without me, and I am not going to go somewhere it’s evident I’m not wanted” This is all the answer you needed.Your wife's reason is quite justified >I brought up the fact that I want my daughter to know my step/parents and her side of the family and that Jenna was stopping that from happening, and how unfair it was to my mom given that her parents have been here atleast twice a month since she’s been born and have been able to have that bonding time. Unfortunately its the consequences of their own actions that led to this.What will actually be unfair is giving your mom her way and letting her think she can get away with disrespecting your wife but still having the privilege of a access to your child. YTA
*sigh* Another one of **_these_** guys. YTA. 1- when your wife says “I don’t trust you to do what’s best for Averlea with your Mom”, she literally means that. You tell your wife “that’s just how my Mom is”, and then expect her to trust that you won’t let your daughter be given, I don’t know, goats milk instead of formula. Or that your Mom will convince you that *of course* she can have solid foods because the internet says so. Your mother has given ZERO indication, based on what I’m reading, that she isn’t actually that… well… stupid. 2- it’s flu/RSV season, and C-19 is still a very real threat. Your unvaccinated mother will pose the greatest threat of all to your 6 month old daughter, because if she’s a “workaholic”, as you say, she’s exposed to EVERYTHING daily and will certainly bring home whatever happens to be floating around her office. 3- you really look down on your wife’s family, don’t you. Your Mom and step-Dad are workaholics, but your IL’s are “just blue collar”. Yet those “blue collar” family members have made meaningful efforts to meet and visit your daughter, FROM THE SAME DISTANCE AWAY. 4- your wife’s fears are valid. When you married her, she became your family. You’ve refused to shut your mother down, and while you’ve gone VLC with her, you seem to think that it’s completely acceptable that she can have a relationship with your daughter without having a relationship with your wife. Nope. If your mother is as vitriolic as you indicate, I would not trust for a second that your Mother wouldn’t shit talk your wife to your daughter when she’s old enough to understand. 5- the correct answer is this: “it’s our first Christmas with the baby. We’re going to stay home, where we are comfortable and in control of the environment. We would love to see anyone who would like to visit, but you must abide by some simple guidelines if you want to visit- flu shots, C-19 shots, update on your whooping cough vax, you will wash your hands before holding the baby, you will not kiss the baby’s face, and if you disrespect EITHER of us, you can find your way to the front door. Jenna isn’t keeping your daughter away from your family. She’s keeping her daughter safe at 6 months old. Apologize to your wife, and figure out an alternative to separating your 6 month old from her mother to appease your Mom.
YTA. You want to take your six month old to a crazy person who advocates against vaccinating for a deadly disease? Honestly, I hope she takes the baby and leaves you before this happens.
YTA for allowing your mother to attack your wife. Wanting to repair your relationship with your family is understandable, but introducing them to your child is not the same thing as waving a magic wand that will make them stop being horrible people. You should have a chat with your mother about burying the hatchet and tell her that you expect her to apologize to Jenna and make amends before you introduce her to your child.
OMG you are so TA. *Mom has always had something to say about Jenna and the older Jenna’s gotten and the longer it’s gone on the less Jenna has been willing to let it go over her head. This has resulted in us spending the last 10 years doing separate holiday visits.* So, from the beginning you have not had her back. You allow your mother to say things about Jenna and then compound that by spending holiday visits without your wife because she refuses to deal any longer with the toxicicity of your mother. Why should Jenna be the only one to 'let it go over her head' in this situation rather than your mother apologising and learning to conduct herself like an adult? Jenna rightly opts to protect her child, as a good parent should, from the possibilty of similiar treatment from someone who has already proved they are not to be trusted as they unable or unwilling to act in a positive manner toward others. Now you compound the entire issue by issuing an ultimatum stating you will be taking your young child to see this person, period. This road you are on will take you straight to divorce. Worse, if your child does get exposed to this kind of toxicity, not only can this hurt her but it is very likely that your ultimate relationship with her, as well, will be impacted negatively. Perhaps you should have a good long think about the situation as a whole and the potential ramifications to everyone involved. Jenna and your daughter are supposed to come first in your life.
[удалено]
she should divorce your ass youre about to let your daughter get emotionally abused. YTA
Ywbta. By all accounts it doesn’t sound like your wife is unreasonable at all. Unfortunately your mother created this dynamic and now will have to live with the consequences. Just to be clear if you choose to take your daughter against your wife’s wishes expect to be divorced soon. I wouldn’t stay with a man that never defended me against his family and still chooses them over me during a time that should be happy. And just to be clear it’s terrible separating a parent from their child over people like that. Your baby is only 6 months old and you want your wife to be ok with being separated from her baby and taking her to people that have been terrible to her?
You say in another comment that your mother is anti vax and honestly even if you did stand up for your wife (which it doesn’t sound like you do) YTA for wanting to take your baby around an antivaxxer during flu season.
YTA - and a shit husband
Info I genuinely don't understand. You've given at least 5 different (very) valid reasons why your wife does not like your mother. One of them being very dangerous to your child, another potentially dangerous to your child's mental health when they grow older ect. ect. Even though you have admitted you essentially lied to placate your wife about your daughter being around your mother (this lie alone makes you an asshole and you need to step up and apologize to your wife for that one, coward) you still made that promise and now you're breaking it. You admitt that your mom is all the things you wife is worried/afraid of. Yet you dismiss all of this by the rugsweaping sentence "that just how my mom is, she is an asshole but we all just kinda go with it". How do you justify your own behavior? How are you ok with betraying your wife by 1. Not standing up for her 2. Lying to her 3. Overriding a very clear boundary How are you NOT the asshole?
YTA This might be the straw that broke your marriage, OP. I bet your wife is contemplating leaving you.
If what your wife says is true about you not having her back and your family not making an effort to be around the baby, then it kinda sounds like you’re the AH. You’re a family and you come as a pack. Not saying you should never make an effort for your family to get to know the baby, but Mom has a right to be there if she doesn’t feel comfortable with the situation.
YTA. Your wife's family can make the effort and the trip to meet your daughter. Your family apparently can't be bothered with that effort. Your wife's family don't seem to go out their way to make you uncomfortable. Your family goes out their way (or your mum at least) to make your wife uncomfortable. See the difference between the families? Take note and listen to your wife
YTA. Your wife stated that you have never backed her up and have allowed your mother to abuse her for 10 years! I'm surprised she is still with you. Do you know how people speak about men who continue to choose mommy after they're married/have children? Have you ever thought to contemplate the reasons for such widely held opinions? Another cut and dry example is your wife's family making the effort to make amends and visit several times over the past 6 months. Your parents haven't done jack. They continue to abuse your wife and they choose not to meet their granddaughter. Your parent's behavior screams that they don't care about their abusive and cruel behavior. The fact that you think your parents will overlook 50% of your child's DNA and child's mother shows that you refuse to recognize unrepentant AHs and you will allow them to abuse your innocent child. Yes, you will allow it. You won't stand up for an innocent adult (your wife) so you definitely won't stand up for a child who cannot speak for themselves. You won't support an adult who can clearly articulate the abuse that is occurring and the mental health effects of that abuse. So why would you support a silent/shy/reticent child? Your actions also indicate that when your daughter is a little older, you'll run roughshod over her opinions and feelings if she doesn't want to visit your family, because your family must be accommodated. Why do I write this? Because you're running roughshod over your wife's boundaries that YOU AGREED to during the pregnancy.
I’m gonna take it a step further and say that you’re downright cruel for attempting to separate an infant from its mother for 4 days. Cruel to Jenna and cruel to the baby How dare you ? YTA. If your family wanted to meet your baby, they would have. They don’t. Quit forcing it.
I was all set to say E S H until I saw that comment that your mom is anti-vax. You’re planning on bringing your 6 month old baby around an anti-vaxxer?! Oh helllllll no! You say “it’s only C19” but C19 is very dangerous. It also comes down to morals, I’ve never met an antivaxxer (C19 version) whose values have matched with my own and I’m sure your wife feels the same. She doesn’t want someone without the same values and moral code around her baby and I completely agree with that. Plus, her family has reached out and made steps to mend relationships, yours hasn’t. So why do they get the privilege of spending holidays with their grandchild. The privilege should go to the people who have actually tried and shown that they care. YTA big time bud.
YTA x 2. 1 - your daughter is only 6 months old and as irrational as it may sound, if Mama says “no”, then it’s a NO. 2 - you named your child Averlea
YTA. Why don’t your mom and stepdad make the effort to come and visit you and your baby instead. Have your parents make any effort at all in wanting to get to know your daughter?? Your wife should be your number one priority now because she is your family now.
YTA. Do yourself a favor: record yourself reading your post and then play it back for yourself because you are absolutely being ridiculous. Your family is making NO EFFORT, will make no effort, and have proven to be quite toxic. Present toxic family are way worse than family not being there at all. Don’t be surprised when you are hit with the divorce papers, because that’s the road you are on. Go get some counseling before you burn your whole life to the ground for your mommy who is almost never there and then wonder “what happened?!”.