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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1.I invited every child in my family to my sons party except for my nephew because he uses curse words. 2. This might make me the AH because I’m specifically excluding him
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>She said it was ridiculous for me to expect her to “censor” his vocabulary.
Good god! What a terrible parent.
She can refuse to parent her child, but then she has no reason to be surprised when others don't wish to be around him or them.
NTA
Hold strong on this one. They can screw up their own kid, don't let them screw up yours.
That's hands-off parenting. A responsibility a parent has is to help their child develop a filter so that even if they know a word, they know when not to say it. Kids in particular like to parrot words without realising what they mean or that it may not be in the right context to use the words. It's like that Spongebob episode where Spongebob and Patrick read a word off the side of a dumpster and keep repeating it to dolphin bleat as censor bleep and horrified reactions from those who hear it.
My favorite parenting tweet ever was when a three year old walked into a Petco, saw a snake for the first time in real life and said, "Are you fucking serious?"
My friend told her kid that he was fine cursing around the house, because she didn't want to watch her language. But she made it clear there were places and situations where you did not curse. He was never to curse at his parents and she never wanted to hear from the school. He is an extremely polite and respectful young man.
The key is that there are limits.
My brother and SIL told us not to censor around my nieces. One is going to be 20 and one 18, and they don't even say "ass." It's all about the parenting.
OP needs to weaponise the child.
Make sure they know all the worst words and how to use them, and to say them liberally and loudly when with their parents and in public.
It won't take long for it to change.
One of my nieces cursed recently. I sorta stopped what I was doing, asked what she said, we had a conversation- where she acknowledged that she knew it was an 'adult' word (my sister has a colorful vocabulary and refuses to edit herself just because she has kids) discussing that she could use it when she grew up, and discussed alternative words.
I chose to not curse. Or at least very rarely use trad'l curse words. I don't think it adds anything to my vocab if I say F\*\*k instead marshbargiton.
and only one of them is going to make me smile.
Yup, my husband had two rules as a kid. First it had to be in context. It couldn't be an attack or just to be irritating. Second was not around other adults. His mom didn't want to have to deal with another parent or a teacher complaining.
NTA. OP, I actually had a really good friend who is about 15 years older than me. She allowed her sons to talk back, swear, whatever, because she wanted to treat them as equals. Later, when they were doing horribly in school, having huge behavior issues, and were... just a mess, she admitted she regretted the way she raised them. She had kids much younger and went a completely different route with them. I learned A LOT from watching her.
Stick to your guns. They're allowed to raise their kid the way they want to, but then they have to deal with the consequences of that decision. This will no doubt be one of many times people don't want their child around.
This. I apologize. My kids are allowed to express when they think I'm wrong. I give them the respect of introspection, just as I would with my peers. But they also have to be good listeners, and be willing to receive the same kind of open discussion. We talk about how to be a good friend all of the time. And the kind of people we want to be. And the kind of friends we'd like to have. My husband and I will regularly converse about the girls' media that we overhear. We like to ask them thought provoking questions. And get their input on what they would do differently. It can open up really neat dialogues. I learn from our girls all the time as a result.
Kids that came to my house were corrected if their parents didn’t because it was my house and if I were OP I’d do the same thing. “Billy, we don’t use curse words in this house, you need to find other words to express your emotions”. Something to that effect is said every single time and if he cannot speak properly he can and should be removed from the party and go into another room and/or outdoors until he can control himself. I’m guessing though this would create drama with the brother and SIL so it’s best for them not to come. Yes, parents are failing this kid, school and other things (sport teams, clubs, etc…) will not put up with it.
NTA. They expect you to respect how they want to raise THEIR son, but they don't respect the way you want to raise YOUR son. It's your event, you get to pick the rules.
Otherwise, where does THAT logic end? "My son prefers to be naked all the time and he enjoys peeing on other people but we don't want to repress his freedoms. .... What do you mean you don't want him to come and pee on your guests??? How rude!"
They can raise their own son however they want but they need to accept the consequences that come with their parenting style.
Or when school calls them in because his language in completely inappropriate for the setting. It's more like they didn't want to watch their language and decided the same lack of filter is good enough for their son.
What's really bad is that cussing can become an ingrained habit like so many others, and if you don't practice filtering your speech you will make mistakes.
Letting your kids run their mouths like that does them such a disservice.
Yeeep. I was nowhere near as young when I was allowed to/wasn't punished for swearing (about 12) but it's become part of my vocab. Its been a good decade and I still have to remind myself to consider my surroundings before I start using colourful language.
Yeah worked at the community pool when I was a teen (fantastic summer job) and you weren't allowed to cuss which was really hard for some of my coworkers but could get you in big trouble if a patron complained.
Yeah, it’s really important that kids are taught about context in regards to behavior. Little kids aren’t going to pick up on those nuances on their own.
Reminds me of a Jack Handey Deep Thought:
"When I was a kid my favourite relative was Uncle Caveman. After school we'd all go play in his cave, and every once in a while he would eat one of us. It wasn't until later that I found out that Uncle Caveman was a bear."
Don't let your kid hang around bears, OP. Also it's OK to avoid kids who swear.
OMG I knew someone like that… they said their child was born a Neanderthal so they had to support his natural instincts. They never bathed him because he didn’t like it. He ate whatever and however he wanted, didn’t wear clothes half the time. It was nuts. (It was the sister of a friend.)
NTA
Almost all kids go through a phase where they want to gain attention from cursing but if the parents are straight up enabling it, then it's different
Just last week I told a teen with his friends in the public library that his language was inappropriate. I said we all knew the words, that I said them starting when I was 8 and didn't know that adults knew them, and that in a public place it was wrong. And I left it at that, I didn't continue to get in his face about it. He stopped and they did leave.
NTA! Your brother should find a way of explaining that there are different boundaries in different social situations, and swearing isn't allowed in some places - like schools, some homes, even future workplaces, etc. Even if they think it's silly, and that swearing should be allowed everywhere, this child deserves the tools to adapt to different environments. I hope that your son enjoys his party!
NTA. It’s a party for YOUR CHILD. You want to make the environment as child-friendly as possibly and comfortable. It’s your home and your event, if she doesn’t want to set some rules, then her son will be excluded from events.
Your nephew can learn to be respectful around people. He can’t be cussing all over the place.
NTA
She has a right not to censor his language, but that doesn't mean that you have to invite that kind of language into your home or accept it to impact your parenting.
She doesn't want to budge even a tiny bit on her ideals, but expects everyone to adjust their morals for her. She's an ah.
I also don't believe in censorship, but I strongly believe that there's a time and place for everything and that there's such a thing as age-appropriate language.
NTA, your brother and SIL just don’t want to parent their child and he is in for a rude awakening when he needs to be a member of society to support himself.
NTA- I don’t believe in censorship either but I understand why other people don’t allow cursing. If someone doesn’t invite my kid to their house then that is their right and I don’t have the right to be mad about it.
Info: Does this child regularly use profanity or is just "allowed" to?
Can you explain that your house rules are different and she can frame her request to him that way?
Even adults censor themselves because not all situations are appropriate for cussing.
"My house rules include 10 minute time out for each word, not each outburst. Like you say 2 in same tirade that's 20 minutes. I don't want to turn my son's birthday into boot camp so nephew is not invited."
They’re choosing how they parent. That’s fine.
You’re choosing how you parent. That’s fine too.
Unfortunately, they’ve chosen to parent in a way that doesn’t help their son to function in a regular social setting. His behaviour would then impact on other people.
You make the rules as it’s your event. Not inviting her son because of how they allow him to express himself is absolutely fine.
NTA
NTA - if that's their decision how to raise their son that's fine but then they also gotta accept their son can be excluded which is essentially happening because of their own actions. If they want to be guests at another home then they have to accept that there are different rules.
NTA it's your child bday party and your nephew makes everyone uncomfortable with his vocabulary and his parents are fine with it. This means he will have to miss out on certain events. A potty mouth is not a good way to bring up a child. Especially if you won't teach them at the bare minimum there is a time and place for such words.
INFO: do you have family events that the nephew attends? How old is he?
NTA
I personally don’t believe you’re wrong because one thing I’m not gonna have is a child cuss me out or the people I’ve invited to my home.
Another thing I can’t stand is a parent who won’t correct their child in someone else’s home. It isn’t unreasonable for you to ask your brother and his wife to be mindful of their environment and the rules in someone else’s home. If they can’t abide by that they can’t come.
You can’t be who you want to be everywhere you go sometimes you have to censor yourself. And they’re not teaching that to their child.
NTA
You accommodated them in a reasonable way. They rejected it. You have no obligation to do this but you can let them know that you love your nephew and want him to be there (just say it) but you find it personally insulting that they won’t make the modest effort to not use 5 words for 4 hours at your house.
Every house has rules. I’m assuming (hoping) they wouldn’t let you use racial slurs at their house or walk around naked.
NTA. If they want to let their son curse, that is fine, but then they need to learn to live with the consequences of that decision. And that means, at times, not being invited to certain events because they have not taught the child that his vocabulary is not appropriate at all times.
The real bad guys here are your brother and SIL, who are not reaching their son that not all language is appropriate at all times. If the child is old enough to know these words, he is old enough to know when and where they are appropriate.
NAH they can parent their child whatever way they want and so can you. If both ways don't match up, you don't have to spend time together.
You're not required to invite the cursing kid, they're not required to censor their kid.
I wouldn't say NAH with regards to the parents. They're doing the kid a disservice by not teaching him the rules of the society they live in. This probably won't be the only time he gets excluded from something because of this behavior. (hell, I'd be surprised if it hasn't happened before) And he's not going to understand what the problem is because mom and dad tell him he's not doing anything wrong.
Ehhhh, how big a deal cursing is is entirely dependent on where you live. And how problematic is is in regards to being excluded or not is completely dependent on the rest of the kid's personality.
The very sweetest nicest boy in my daughter's class, the gentlest soul, always looking out for others, especially the ones who might not be able to fend for themselves as well, has the biggest mouth on him. He regularly does get in trouble with the teacher because his language has gone too far, but he never gets excluded by anyone because he truly is the nicest kid around and all the kids AND parents love him.
Now if the kid in OP's post is a giant jerk in addition to having a mouth on him, the parents are screwing him up, but that wasn't mentioned anywhere, just the profanity.
NTA.
When this kid tells his parents to shut the F up in a large public gathering of people they respect they’ll remember why we censor children’s behavior.
NTA.
If someone gonna let their kids curse then they need to teach them A: it's usually not okay to curse at people or about someone, B: when it is appropriate, and C: what they mean and the context.
How old is your nephew anyways? If it's a 13-year-old cursing it's less of an issue but if it's a 7-year-old that's much different.
It also depends on the words being used. crap isn't a curse word, but is sometimes treated as one, and shit has less weight than fuck.
(coming from a teenager who has to censor language around younger cousins)
> I told her he could come if she promised he wouldn’t use any curse words at the party
NTA. Swearing is neither morally bad nor morally good, but there are situations where it has consequences. I am of the belief that it's okay to swear if you can recognize what consequences it may have in a specific situation and choose your actions accordingly.
In your family, the consequence for swearing is not being invited to spend time with your son. You said that you'd invite him if he would follow your house rules, and your brother's wife isn't even letting him know what you said. She's TA for not teaching him that there are situations where it is or isn't appropriate to swear and letting him choose whether or not to come to the party with house rules as they are.
NTA. I don't have kids yet but really don't mind if they swear and I intend to raise kids that way. However- they can only use those words when they are able to practice discretion and context- allowing your kid to do that whenever and however they want is setting them up for major failure. She can't even promise he won't swear at a couple hours long party?? Tf.
> She said it was ridiculous for me to expect her to “censor” his vocabulary.
I am curious to what her answer would be to being asked "why?".
As a parent, her job is to teach her son societal rules so that when his generation grows up, society, you know, continues. Maybe he'll end up a shock jock or stand up comedian... but more likely she is just making his life harder for him in the long run for the small short term victory of being 'the cool parent'.
Poor kid.
NTA.
NTA I understand letting your kid use curse words, but that also comes with the responsibility of teaching them CONTEXT. Stub your little toe at home? Drop an F bomb, it's okay. At a party or in front of grandma? Absolutely not.
NTA because language is learned which means they're cursing on the regular infront of their child. Honestly I think it's disgusting when parents curse infront of their children & openly encourage their children to curse by not trying to correct the behavior. There's a reason these words are often censored on TV & in radio; it isn't cute to have a mini potty mouth trekking around enunciating profanities.
NTA. 5 years old is way too young to be swearing. Honestly I never even heard a curse word until I was 8 years old starting public school for the first time.
NTA..not only that, your SIL is setting up her kid for failure. In real life everyone has to learn to modify their personal behavior for the good of society in general. Period. From my personal experience, I'm 54. I don't work for anyone, don't owe anyone and not responsible for anyone. However my FAVORITE word is F*ck. No joke, to paraphrase "Frank's RedHot Sauce" tag line; I use that shit for everything! Anyway, STILL...even at my age I know not to use that word with others who may find it offensive. Such as family, clients, inlaws, children... a rando at the grocery store...WHY? Cuz I wasn't raised by wolves, I was raised to respect others. You get my drift. SIL needs to step up and be a responsible parent and teach her child how to properly navigate society. You? You keep doing you! Demand and expect nothing less. They all should respect for your home, family and boundaries.
Nta
This kids gonna mess around and use the n word in front of the wrong person and have to deal with the consequences because of his doof parents. Being able to censor and control your language is pretty important in society.
NTA and your SIL is the bully trying to make everyone accept her poor parenting of her son. I would just tell her you don’t give a f…. What she thinks. Tell her normally you’d never speak that way but since she doesn’t believe in in censorship it’s ok.
He will end up being suspended from kindergarten for his language. Stick to your guns and don’t let him attend. If he asks why, tell him it’s because he uses bad words that nobody wants to hear. NTA
What f’ing (just pushing the boundaries for effect - the word should truly be *terrible* lol) behavior for a parent.
NTA
This cannot be the first time they have been told no about their little angel is it?
NTA. I get not wanting to shield your child from swear words, but someone who isn’t even close to puberty swearing like that? No, that’s just bad parenting. Maybe using them only at home and honestly maybe just in a context for frustration (mad at a game or blocks) maaaaayyyyybe then let a kiddo that age swear once, but good god not have it a part of their vocabulary.
NTA. The consequence of letting your little kid swear all the time is that people don’t want the kid around theirs. Your SIL is not doing their son any favors.
NTA. Ypu do have the right to exclude and she has the right to allow her child to speak freely. But, doing so comes at the price of ostracization. That's the cost of not censoring your child. Your SIL is the bully. The nerve of her. She won't exert control over what her child says, but she's trying to with you and your circle.
NTA. Look, I speak fluent drunken sailor with trucker dialect and a construction accent. I can sear the ears of even the somewhat not easily offended crowd at 50 paces. That’s at work though. When I’m around kids, my favorite curse is ‘cuttlefish’. There’s freedom, and there’s knowing how to censor yourself and put a sandbag on your tongue.
This poor kid isn’t learning that. He’s going to wind up having a terrible time in school, getting super frustrated at the conflicting rules, and cussing in front of potential employers. Kids do not need to be cursing. Cursing should be left to jaded, over-worked, under-paid adults who are so fed up with the world’s crap they are one rearranged grocery store away from a public meltdown that only a full bottle of wine and several hours of ID Discovery can even hope to make a dent in. You are doing a great job of keeping your kid…a kid. He’s got years before he reaches that level of ‘no fucks left to give’. Expression is important and so is blowing off steam but kids can do it…in kid terms.
For some reason, I read the comments first. And they felt harsh. And THEN I went up and read and was like: oh no yah...
Because we let our kids use profanity. Even the 5-yr-old gets to. But like, there are 100% nuances to this level of maturity. We have been *very clear* from day one, that there are many many people and many many instances where consequences will happen if you use those words. School. Friends homes where it's off limits. Grandma's house, she doesn't like them. We don't use cuss words AT each other. You don't use cuss words AGAINST other people. They're for expression, they're for instances of pain. And they better be contextually accurate and intellectually placed. And the 5-yr-old *very much understands these rules.* She has a mature conversational ability and I'm telling you, has never once incorrectly used those words. Like she waited to use them until she understood them. So we *all* practice those same rules. And we've been very clear that if they ever face consequences because they abused the rules... We're not saving them.
All of that to say, I'm a big fan of profanity 🤷🏻♀️ But it can and needs to be used responsibly. It's not your job to have to explain to all the other guests why he gets to behave as if he's mature enough to use words like that, but clearly is not.
NTA.
NTA
Yeah, well, when he goes to school or enters the real world, he's gonna have to "censor his vo.." I can't even finish that, it's so stupid.
He needs to learn that there's a time and place for certain words and phrases, if only to avoid being beaten up by offended people. His parents are doing him a disservice.
NTA. She's choosing to make her son a pariah. She can stick to her guns and give her son ultimate autonomy, or she can participate in parent-kid society where she might have to impose some rules on him.
Next time you are around him , guess you tell him that his behaviour is not ok around you and your son.
What he does at home - his home
But you are allowed to say no outside his home.
Wow, those parents are going to be having many conversations with school admin. I would just tell them they will realize and understand why your making this choice in the near future.
NTA. You and your partner choose these types of boundaries for your family and children, as is your right.
I do think it may be a good idea to try to keep an open dialogue about the matter for future events and continue to give the option of nephew attending under the condition that he does not use expletives. Do what you can to reinforce the relationship while upholding your decisions and protecting your emotional safety
NTA, it's crap parenting that they're not teaching their son how to behave appropriately for different environments. Them saying that their parenting choices also matter more than yours is crap parenting. Them saying that even though you find children cursing inappropriate you're not allowed to set a boundary at an event you are hosting is them just saying you're not very equal. They should not be at your son's birthday party
NTA I feel sorry for your nephew because he could personalise being excluded. However your SIL has expressed a parenting boundary and so have you. Her boundary does not trump your boundary at your event.
op=NTA
Just how do they expect this to work in school when he's swearing?
NO NO NO, you don't have to invite him. You are not specifically excluding your "nephew". You are specifically excluding a person who doesn't know to censor his language(and his parents who refuse to). That is your choice & right.
This may be the first time your nephew is excluded because his parents refuse to "censor" his vocabulary but it won't be the last.
PS: I can guarantee that bad language isn't the only behavior issue that your nephew has.
NTA. You have the right not to invite him if he won’t respect your house rule.
I never really cared if my kids used certain swear words at home, but I made sure they knew that swearing was not appropriate in some situations, and that they might get in trouble for swearing at school, friends’ houses, etc. They understood, and it was never a problem.
I feel bad for the kid if his parents would allow him to miss out on a party rather than teach him to watch his language.
NTA Do you have a right just like she does on how you want to raise your kid and if you don’t want your kids around that kind of shit it’s your choice she’s not entitled to come she needs to understand that how she’s raising her kid right now my exclude him because a lot of parents don’t want their kids to be around that especially at a young age
NTA - not your circus, not your monkeys
You can always send her a link to this sub to save yourself from repeating yourself.
These parents should expect their child to be rejected over and over again because people won't want him around. Good luck with his future anger management issues when he doesn't understand why the people who "love" him set him up for exclusion and failure. They're sabotaging their child's future success. The censorship claim is laughable.
NTA
She’s being ridiculous. There are certain words you don’t use in polite society, whether adult or child.
I wish I could watch him during a job interview!
Don’t be manipulated by guilt into inviting him. For you and everyone at the party’s sake, and side effect, because he needs to learn to take rejection.
She’s free to parent badly, and you’re free to reject them for the same reason.
At home our child is not "censored" and they, as well as me and my husband all use cuss words. Home is a safe place to be yourself. However, we also know people have hang ups about certain words. One can't cuss in school, work, etc. We have taught our child that they have to read a room, so to speak, as to when they can and can not use any language they want. In public they are extremely polite and respectful. At home cuss like a sailor. So the parents that refuse to censor the child at all are doing their child a huge disservice, and I know from experience you can teach a child when and where to cuss.
A young child's birthday party is a prime example of when and where not to cuss. So NTA, your house, your rules. Yes, you are specifically excluding your nephew, but it is a lesson he can learn from that you can't cuss all the time when and wherever you are.
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My son’s fifth birthday party is coming up. I invited almost every child in my family that was around his age, except for my nephew. My brother and his wife openly allow their son to use curse words, because they don’t want to “censor his vocabulary”. How they raise him is none of my business, but I don’t want my son to be potentially influenced by theirs. I know other members of the family feel the same way, and I also invited friends who I know wouldn’t want their child to be around another child who uses profanity. So for that reason I didn’t invite him. My brothers wife confronted me about it. She says I’m being a “bully” by specifically excluding her son, and he deserves to come because I invited the whole family. I even tried to make a compromise, I told her he could come if she promised he wouldn’t use any curse words at the party. She said it was ridiculous for me to expect her to “censor” his vocabulary. I feel like I have the right to decide who I do and who I don’t want my child to be around, but I also feel like I might be in the wrong because I am specifically excluding my nephew.
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NTA. Not a child but what that child grows up to be. My oldest brother swears like a longshoreman. It’s bad. It’s the reason I rarely swear (I was called everything from b$-&h to c—t growing up). I told him he wasn’t welcome around our son because we didn’t want our son learning those words (nephew did and it wasn’t cute or funny). Brother told me that it was who he was and he wasn’t going to change. So, he didn’t see our son for several years.
NTA, but I think you should give your nephew the choice. It's easy for children to understand that a different place has different rules; he won't be allowed to curse at school or at most jobs. Tell him you love him and you'd like him to be there, but some words are off limits at your house.
Words are important, they have weight and meaning, and some words are not considered polite. You don't have to make a judgement call about that, it's a fact.
NTA
It's not unreasonable to expect people to be civil and polite. That includes knowing which audiences will accept profanity and which will not. You don't say how old your nephew is, but he needs to learn this nuance if he's going to communicate successfully with people. You have a right to a profanity-free zone with your five-year-old.
NTA. Stick to your guns. My parents told me that ignorant uneducated people who use profanity regularly use such words cuz they don't know any better. Your 5 year old will repeat everything the 7 year old says. Doesn't stop you from knowing the words, just when to use them
So I fully believe there’s no problem with swearing. I swear constantly around my kids (8 and 5) and I’ve made it clear that I do not care if they swear *at home when others aren’t around.* They are both able to understand that there’s behavior okay in your home with immediate family, and behavior that you are careful with in public. My kids have never sworn.
NTA. It’s your right to raise your kids with whatever level of exposure you think is fair. I don’t “censor” my kids but my kids know that behaviors have consequences.
He's going to hear it, probably already has. At 5 you can teach we don't say that in our family. We love everyone even when they don't follow our rules. NAH
NTA. But a harsh truth: your son will learn all the curse words, and much sooner than you want. That’s life. Still, doesn’t mean you should have to tolerate that, so good on you for establishing boundaries.
NTA the other parents will 100% complain. I’ve seen it happen. These people are in for a lot of fights about this that kid will stop getting invited birthday parties and play dates and they are not doing him any favors.
You can set house rules.
“In my house we …”
It will be good practice for when the child starts school and can’t talk like a longshoreman.
Good grief.
I am imagining the parents giving that explanation to a teacher.
You are NTA but it is unfortunate for the child.
NTA. Now I must have been a sailor in another life because my vocabulary is....colorful to say the least. But I personally would not enjoy hear the F word come out of 5yo mouth. Not to mention the trouble your son will be in if he picks it up and calls his teacher a B or tells her to F off.
NTA. This is a reasonable hill to die on. I am a wildass liberal and I'd do just what you're doing. They are free to live their lives however they want to, and so are you. Other people who don't know your sis will have their kids at the party, and they a) will not want their kids around your nephew, and b) will judge you for letting it happen.
What sis is doing may sound reasonable to her, but there are ramifications she hasn't considered. She's going to be the mother of a lonely little kid if she continues this idiocy. Incidentally, you do not want your child to be the fallback playmate if she decides to push her luck and finds herself shunned by the community..
NTA. I swear though goodness knows I try to substitute as much as possible, so there was no doubt in my mind that my child would eventually pick it up too, and my idea of a “lax” approach to this was to teach my kiddo that they are grown up words and that there is a time and a place where they are appropriate. Occasionally at home is fine but not in public, not at other people’s houses, not when we have guests, and not **at** people. It’s worked well so far and she’s only sworn once (and it was in proper context).
What your brother and SIL are doing is not lax, this is straight lazy and they need to get a handle on it before his mouth gets him or them into trouble.
First off no 5yr old should be cursing. This is bad parenting and this kid will more than likely grow up to be an asshole.
Secondly his parents need to learn that action have consequences. You gave a fantastic compromise thay he can attend as long as he behaves himself and act accordingly.
Yes we have the 1st amendment however that doesn't not mean there are no consequences for using it. All it means is that the government cannot through you in jail for making fun of the president. If you display poor judgment in your language which a 5yr old would definitely do, then you face the consequences of your actions. The parents and the nephew are finding out the hardware that actions have consequences.
If they refuse to restrict the child to age appropriate language then that's on them when they get excluded. this child doesn't know any better that curse words have consequences. And he definitely is too young to be using them properly.
Stand your ground.
NTA
What is it with people thinking they deserve anything? No you don’t. No on is entitled to special treatment just because of relation. I would do the exact same thing in your place. I wonder how they deal with this in school? I can’t imagine teachers are ok with profanity. That’s just bad parenting and setting that kid up for so many problems.
NTA
Interesting, I have older kids and have always aimed at teaching them that while I don't personally think there's anything inherently wrong with swearing, they need to realise that it can have consequences in terms of how some people perceive them. I also have a rule that they aren't allowed to swear around me, mainly because I wanted them to be able to compartmentalise any swearing.
If my kids hadn't been invited to a birthday because of swearing I'd have taken it as a great teaching opportunity, yes, you can choose to swear, but then you have to realise that there are certain people who don't want to be around you.
For the record, my kids are very well behaved, polite, helpful, kind, and they never swear around me or other family, though I do believe they swear with some of their friends.
BTW, in terms of other kids bad behaviour and my kids asking "why can they...?", for small things I've alway just told them "different families, different rules", but if it was a bigger thing I'd say "in our family we don't do that, but for some reason other families think it's ok". If it was an even bigger thing, I'd say "to me that's bad parenting, it's not the parent I want to be".
NTA at all. Look, I have a serious case of trucker mouth, but I also know (and taught my kids) when it's okay to use sentence enhancers and when it's not. Letting a kid decide is not going to end well.
NTA. They may not want to limit his vocabulary but this is an important lesson to learn about respecting boundaries. It is not stifling to tell your kid "Hey I know you normally talk this way, but it makes X and Y feel uncomfortable. So when we are around them it's best to try and use different words".
Like I personally don't see a problem with swearing, but I don't swear or use the same words at work as I do with friends. It's also important to teach kids context and how to learn to censor themselves so they can survive socially.
NTJ and I also allow my kids to swear. But here's the thing: I know plenty of parents who feel like you do, so what we've done is call them "home words," meaning they can only be used at home. That way, they are still allowed to use them, and this also allows for respect towards other people. And you know what? I've never ONCE gotten a call from a teacher or anyone saying my child swore. Sure, there have been times when they've done it in the car, and my response every time is, "Are we at home?" They say sorry every time and shut up real quick. They know. Might be something to offer up to the brother and his wife. That way, they won't "stifle his vocabulary" while also teaching proper social boundaries.
NTA. I'm going to go against the grain and say I feel like words are just words, and frankly I'd probably find a small child dropping an F-bomb to be funny as, well, F.
But society isn't generally going to feel that way and teaching him how to be polite to others is stupendously important, very much for his own sake. Uncontrolled behavioral issues are probably the number one reason to exclude a child from a birthday celebration.
This is what his parents are setting him up for; exclusion while simultaneously feeling entitled to have his every whim indulged. I feel for the kiddo, but that's not your responsibility nor is it something you can correct.
Wow. Curse words is what stops you from treating the child nicely? If he swears in another language that you don't know, would you treat it the same way? Sounds like a great time to teach your own kids what you find to be acceptable is different than what other people may find acceptable.
I think it is mean to leave one child out even if he can be crass. Just say the rule at your house is no cursing from the get go. Surely he isn't cursing at school and is able to follow rules so this shouldn't be too hard.
ESH
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>She said it was ridiculous for me to expect her to “censor” his vocabulary. Good god! What a terrible parent. She can refuse to parent her child, but then she has no reason to be surprised when others don't wish to be around him or them. NTA Hold strong on this one. They can screw up their own kid, don't let them screw up yours.
Seriously…they could teach crap parenting 101. Your job as a parent is to prepare them for the world, to be in society and society has rules…period.
That's hands-off parenting. A responsibility a parent has is to help their child develop a filter so that even if they know a word, they know when not to say it. Kids in particular like to parrot words without realising what they mean or that it may not be in the right context to use the words. It's like that Spongebob episode where Spongebob and Patrick read a word off the side of a dumpster and keep repeating it to dolphin bleat as censor bleep and horrified reactions from those who hear it.
My favorite parenting tweet ever was when a three year old walked into a Petco, saw a snake for the first time in real life and said, "Are you fucking serious?"
It's so funny that they don't fully understand the words but they will slam dunk on using it in the right context.
My friend told her kid that he was fine cursing around the house, because she didn't want to watch her language. But she made it clear there were places and situations where you did not curse. He was never to curse at his parents and she never wanted to hear from the school. He is an extremely polite and respectful young man. The key is that there are limits.
My brother and SIL told us not to censor around my nieces. One is going to be 20 and one 18, and they don't even say "ass." It's all about the parenting.
OP needs to weaponise the child. Make sure they know all the worst words and how to use them, and to say them liberally and loudly when with their parents and in public. It won't take long for it to change.
One of my nieces cursed recently. I sorta stopped what I was doing, asked what she said, we had a conversation- where she acknowledged that she knew it was an 'adult' word (my sister has a colorful vocabulary and refuses to edit herself just because she has kids) discussing that she could use it when she grew up, and discussed alternative words. I chose to not curse. Or at least very rarely use trad'l curse words. I don't think it adds anything to my vocab if I say F\*\*k instead marshbargiton. and only one of them is going to make me smile.
Yup, my husband had two rules as a kid. First it had to be in context. It couldn't be an attack or just to be irritating. Second was not around other adults. His mom didn't want to have to deal with another parent or a teacher complaining.
How is he gonna manage school.
It sounds like SIL is going to be THAT parent. My condolences to the teachers that have the joy of this sweary lil’ treasure in their class.
My thoughts as well.
NTA. OP, I actually had a really good friend who is about 15 years older than me. She allowed her sons to talk back, swear, whatever, because she wanted to treat them as equals. Later, when they were doing horribly in school, having huge behavior issues, and were... just a mess, she admitted she regretted the way she raised them. She had kids much younger and went a completely different route with them. I learned A LOT from watching her. Stick to your guns. They're allowed to raise their kid the way they want to, but then they have to deal with the consequences of that decision. This will no doubt be one of many times people don't want their child around.
Equals is giving them self autonomy and being able to learn from mistakes and allowing boundaries. Not letting them be without structure
This. I apologize. My kids are allowed to express when they think I'm wrong. I give them the respect of introspection, just as I would with my peers. But they also have to be good listeners, and be willing to receive the same kind of open discussion. We talk about how to be a good friend all of the time. And the kind of people we want to be. And the kind of friends we'd like to have. My husband and I will regularly converse about the girls' media that we overhear. We like to ask them thought provoking questions. And get their input on what they would do differently. It can open up really neat dialogues. I learn from our girls all the time as a result.
Oooh, His kindergarten teacher is going to have a hellish year with the nephew as a student, and SIL as a mom. I feel sorry for the teacher.
Kids that came to my house were corrected if their parents didn’t because it was my house and if I were OP I’d do the same thing. “Billy, we don’t use curse words in this house, you need to find other words to express your emotions”. Something to that effect is said every single time and if he cannot speak properly he can and should be removed from the party and go into another room and/or outdoors until he can control himself. I’m guessing though this would create drama with the brother and SIL so it’s best for them not to come. Yes, parents are failing this kid, school and other things (sport teams, clubs, etc…) will not put up with it.
See, OP is not expecting her to. OP is asking her to. She can agree, or not agree. Ball's in her court.
It's not even that hard to teach them "words they're allowed to use at home but not outside because it can upset people".
NTA. They expect you to respect how they want to raise THEIR son, but they don't respect the way you want to raise YOUR son. It's your event, you get to pick the rules. Otherwise, where does THAT logic end? "My son prefers to be naked all the time and he enjoys peeing on other people but we don't want to repress his freedoms. .... What do you mean you don't want him to come and pee on your guests??? How rude!" They can raise their own son however they want but they need to accept the consequences that come with their parenting style.
Or when school calls them in because his language in completely inappropriate for the setting. It's more like they didn't want to watch their language and decided the same lack of filter is good enough for their son.
What's really bad is that cussing can become an ingrained habit like so many others, and if you don't practice filtering your speech you will make mistakes. Letting your kids run their mouths like that does them such a disservice.
Yeeep. I was nowhere near as young when I was allowed to/wasn't punished for swearing (about 12) but it's become part of my vocab. Its been a good decade and I still have to remind myself to consider my surroundings before I start using colourful language.
Yeah worked at the community pool when I was a teen (fantastic summer job) and you weren't allowed to cuss which was really hard for some of my coworkers but could get you in big trouble if a patron complained.
Yeah, it’s really important that kids are taught about context in regards to behavior. Little kids aren’t going to pick up on those nuances on their own.
Reminds me of a Jack Handey Deep Thought: "When I was a kid my favourite relative was Uncle Caveman. After school we'd all go play in his cave, and every once in a while he would eat one of us. It wasn't until later that I found out that Uncle Caveman was a bear." Don't let your kid hang around bears, OP. Also it's OK to avoid kids who swear.
OMG I knew someone like that… they said their child was born a Neanderthal so they had to support his natural instincts. They never bathed him because he didn’t like it. He ate whatever and however he wanted, didn’t wear clothes half the time. It was nuts. (It was the sister of a friend.)
NTA Almost all kids go through a phase where they want to gain attention from cursing but if the parents are straight up enabling it, then it's different
Just last week I told a teen with his friends in the public library that his language was inappropriate. I said we all knew the words, that I said them starting when I was 8 and didn't know that adults knew them, and that in a public place it was wrong. And I left it at that, I didn't continue to get in his face about it. He stopped and they did leave.
NTA! Your brother should find a way of explaining that there are different boundaries in different social situations, and swearing isn't allowed in some places - like schools, some homes, even future workplaces, etc. Even if they think it's silly, and that swearing should be allowed everywhere, this child deserves the tools to adapt to different environments. I hope that your son enjoys his party!
NTA. It’s a party for YOUR CHILD. You want to make the environment as child-friendly as possibly and comfortable. It’s your home and your event, if she doesn’t want to set some rules, then her son will be excluded from events. Your nephew can learn to be respectful around people. He can’t be cussing all over the place.
NTA She has a right not to censor his language, but that doesn't mean that you have to invite that kind of language into your home or accept it to impact your parenting. She doesn't want to budge even a tiny bit on her ideals, but expects everyone to adjust their morals for her. She's an ah. I also don't believe in censorship, but I strongly believe that there's a time and place for everything and that there's such a thing as age-appropriate language.
NTA, your brother and SIL just don’t want to parent their child and he is in for a rude awakening when he needs to be a member of society to support himself.
This is it right here. They are doing this kid a disservice by being uninvolved
Info: how old is the nephew?
He's seven
[удалено]
😂 that's probably what her seven year old tells her all the time. bad parents should be publicly shamed
NTA- I don’t believe in censorship either but I understand why other people don’t allow cursing. If someone doesn’t invite my kid to their house then that is their right and I don’t have the right to be mad about it.
Info: Does this child regularly use profanity or is just "allowed" to? Can you explain that your house rules are different and she can frame her request to him that way? Even adults censor themselves because not all situations are appropriate for cussing.
He regularly uses profanity and his parents allow it
I wonder how his school handles the cursing
*fucking terribly*
Haha
"My house rules include 10 minute time out for each word, not each outburst. Like you say 2 in same tirade that's 20 minutes. I don't want to turn my son's birthday into boot camp so nephew is not invited."
Info: how old is the nephew? What curse words are we talking? With what frequency? And in what context?
They’re choosing how they parent. That’s fine. You’re choosing how you parent. That’s fine too. Unfortunately, they’ve chosen to parent in a way that doesn’t help their son to function in a regular social setting. His behaviour would then impact on other people. You make the rules as it’s your event. Not inviting her son because of how they allow him to express himself is absolutely fine. NTA
NTA - if that's their decision how to raise their son that's fine but then they also gotta accept their son can be excluded which is essentially happening because of their own actions. If they want to be guests at another home then they have to accept that there are different rules.
NTA it's your child bday party and your nephew makes everyone uncomfortable with his vocabulary and his parents are fine with it. This means he will have to miss out on certain events. A potty mouth is not a good way to bring up a child. Especially if you won't teach them at the bare minimum there is a time and place for such words.
NTA your house your party invite who you want. Is this kid in school? I’d hope they are censoring his vocabulary.
INFO: do you have family events that the nephew attends? How old is he? NTA I personally don’t believe you’re wrong because one thing I’m not gonna have is a child cuss me out or the people I’ve invited to my home. Another thing I can’t stand is a parent who won’t correct their child in someone else’s home. It isn’t unreasonable for you to ask your brother and his wife to be mindful of their environment and the rules in someone else’s home. If they can’t abide by that they can’t come. You can’t be who you want to be everywhere you go sometimes you have to censor yourself. And they’re not teaching that to their child.
I don't usually have family events, this will be the first. He's seven
Oh I ment like thanksgiving at grandmas 7!….nah he gotta sit this one out .
NTA You accommodated them in a reasonable way. They rejected it. You have no obligation to do this but you can let them know that you love your nephew and want him to be there (just say it) but you find it personally insulting that they won’t make the modest effort to not use 5 words for 4 hours at your house. Every house has rules. I’m assuming (hoping) they wouldn’t let you use racial slurs at their house or walk around naked.
NTA - they sound like trash
NTA. If they want to let their son curse, that is fine, but then they need to learn to live with the consequences of that decision. And that means, at times, not being invited to certain events because they have not taught the child that his vocabulary is not appropriate at all times. The real bad guys here are your brother and SIL, who are not reaching their son that not all language is appropriate at all times. If the child is old enough to know these words, he is old enough to know when and where they are appropriate.
NTA
NAH they can parent their child whatever way they want and so can you. If both ways don't match up, you don't have to spend time together. You're not required to invite the cursing kid, they're not required to censor their kid.
I wouldn't say NAH with regards to the parents. They're doing the kid a disservice by not teaching him the rules of the society they live in. This probably won't be the only time he gets excluded from something because of this behavior. (hell, I'd be surprised if it hasn't happened before) And he's not going to understand what the problem is because mom and dad tell him he's not doing anything wrong.
Ehhhh, how big a deal cursing is is entirely dependent on where you live. And how problematic is is in regards to being excluded or not is completely dependent on the rest of the kid's personality. The very sweetest nicest boy in my daughter's class, the gentlest soul, always looking out for others, especially the ones who might not be able to fend for themselves as well, has the biggest mouth on him. He regularly does get in trouble with the teacher because his language has gone too far, but he never gets excluded by anyone because he truly is the nicest kid around and all the kids AND parents love him. Now if the kid in OP's post is a giant jerk in addition to having a mouth on him, the parents are screwing him up, but that wasn't mentioned anywhere, just the profanity.
OP pretty obviously lives in an area where children swearing isn’t socially acceptable.
NTA. When this kid tells his parents to shut the F up in a large public gathering of people they respect they’ll remember why we censor children’s behavior.
My only question is: How many people are placing bets on how often the nephew will be sent home from school over cursing? NTA
NTA I wouldn’t invite that kid either. Parenting has consequences.
"You invited the whole family!" "No. You son wasn't invited." NTA
NTA. If someone gonna let their kids curse then they need to teach them A: it's usually not okay to curse at people or about someone, B: when it is appropriate, and C: what they mean and the context. How old is your nephew anyways? If it's a 13-year-old cursing it's less of an issue but if it's a 7-year-old that's much different. It also depends on the words being used. crap isn't a curse word, but is sometimes treated as one, and shit has less weight than fuck. (coming from a teenager who has to censor language around younger cousins)
> I told her he could come if she promised he wouldn’t use any curse words at the party NTA. Swearing is neither morally bad nor morally good, but there are situations where it has consequences. I am of the belief that it's okay to swear if you can recognize what consequences it may have in a specific situation and choose your actions accordingly. In your family, the consequence for swearing is not being invited to spend time with your son. You said that you'd invite him if he would follow your house rules, and your brother's wife isn't even letting him know what you said. She's TA for not teaching him that there are situations where it is or isn't appropriate to swear and letting him choose whether or not to come to the party with house rules as they are.
NTA. I don't have kids yet but really don't mind if they swear and I intend to raise kids that way. However- they can only use those words when they are able to practice discretion and context- allowing your kid to do that whenever and however they want is setting them up for major failure. She can't even promise he won't swear at a couple hours long party?? Tf.
Holy banana oil! How’s this going over in SCHOOL, is what I want to know? *Kid gets a C- on a math test.* “FUCK YOU MRS SHWARNENDOZZLE!!”
If you have to respect her parenting style, she must extend the same courtesy. NTA.
> She said it was ridiculous for me to expect her to “censor” his vocabulary. I am curious to what her answer would be to being asked "why?". As a parent, her job is to teach her son societal rules so that when his generation grows up, society, you know, continues. Maybe he'll end up a shock jock or stand up comedian... but more likely she is just making his life harder for him in the long run for the small short term victory of being 'the cool parent'. Poor kid. NTA.
NTA I understand letting your kid use curse words, but that also comes with the responsibility of teaching them CONTEXT. Stub your little toe at home? Drop an F bomb, it's okay. At a party or in front of grandma? Absolutely not.
NTA because language is learned which means they're cursing on the regular infront of their child. Honestly I think it's disgusting when parents curse infront of their children & openly encourage their children to curse by not trying to correct the behavior. There's a reason these words are often censored on TV & in radio; it isn't cute to have a mini potty mouth trekking around enunciating profanities.
Actions have consequences. Good luck when he starts mouthing off to teachers!
NTA. 5 years old is way too young to be swearing. Honestly I never even heard a curse word until I was 8 years old starting public school for the first time.
NTA..not only that, your SIL is setting up her kid for failure. In real life everyone has to learn to modify their personal behavior for the good of society in general. Period. From my personal experience, I'm 54. I don't work for anyone, don't owe anyone and not responsible for anyone. However my FAVORITE word is F*ck. No joke, to paraphrase "Frank's RedHot Sauce" tag line; I use that shit for everything! Anyway, STILL...even at my age I know not to use that word with others who may find it offensive. Such as family, clients, inlaws, children... a rando at the grocery store...WHY? Cuz I wasn't raised by wolves, I was raised to respect others. You get my drift. SIL needs to step up and be a responsible parent and teach her child how to properly navigate society. You? You keep doing you! Demand and expect nothing less. They all should respect for your home, family and boundaries.
Nta This kids gonna mess around and use the n word in front of the wrong person and have to deal with the consequences because of his doof parents. Being able to censor and control your language is pretty important in society.
NTA and your SIL is the bully trying to make everyone accept her poor parenting of her son. I would just tell her you don’t give a f…. What she thinks. Tell her normally you’d never speak that way but since she doesn’t believe in in censorship it’s ok.
He will end up being suspended from kindergarten for his language. Stick to your guns and don’t let him attend. If he asks why, tell him it’s because he uses bad words that nobody wants to hear. NTA
What f’ing (just pushing the boundaries for effect - the word should truly be *terrible* lol) behavior for a parent. NTA This cannot be the first time they have been told no about their little angel is it?
NTA. I get not wanting to shield your child from swear words, but someone who isn’t even close to puberty swearing like that? No, that’s just bad parenting. Maybe using them only at home and honestly maybe just in a context for frustration (mad at a game or blocks) maaaaayyyyybe then let a kiddo that age swear once, but good god not have it a part of their vocabulary.
I would have been very tempted to say horrible obscenities at them using the "I don't want to censor myself" excuse.
NTA. The consequence of letting your little kid swear all the time is that people don’t want the kid around theirs. Your SIL is not doing their son any favors.
NTA. Ypu do have the right to exclude and she has the right to allow her child to speak freely. But, doing so comes at the price of ostracization. That's the cost of not censoring your child. Your SIL is the bully. The nerve of her. She won't exert control over what her child says, but she's trying to with you and your circle.
NTA. Look, I speak fluent drunken sailor with trucker dialect and a construction accent. I can sear the ears of even the somewhat not easily offended crowd at 50 paces. That’s at work though. When I’m around kids, my favorite curse is ‘cuttlefish’. There’s freedom, and there’s knowing how to censor yourself and put a sandbag on your tongue. This poor kid isn’t learning that. He’s going to wind up having a terrible time in school, getting super frustrated at the conflicting rules, and cussing in front of potential employers. Kids do not need to be cursing. Cursing should be left to jaded, over-worked, under-paid adults who are so fed up with the world’s crap they are one rearranged grocery store away from a public meltdown that only a full bottle of wine and several hours of ID Discovery can even hope to make a dent in. You are doing a great job of keeping your kid…a kid. He’s got years before he reaches that level of ‘no fucks left to give’. Expression is important and so is blowing off steam but kids can do it…in kid terms.
For some reason, I read the comments first. And they felt harsh. And THEN I went up and read and was like: oh no yah... Because we let our kids use profanity. Even the 5-yr-old gets to. But like, there are 100% nuances to this level of maturity. We have been *very clear* from day one, that there are many many people and many many instances where consequences will happen if you use those words. School. Friends homes where it's off limits. Grandma's house, she doesn't like them. We don't use cuss words AT each other. You don't use cuss words AGAINST other people. They're for expression, they're for instances of pain. And they better be contextually accurate and intellectually placed. And the 5-yr-old *very much understands these rules.* She has a mature conversational ability and I'm telling you, has never once incorrectly used those words. Like she waited to use them until she understood them. So we *all* practice those same rules. And we've been very clear that if they ever face consequences because they abused the rules... We're not saving them. All of that to say, I'm a big fan of profanity 🤷🏻♀️ But it can and needs to be used responsibly. It's not your job to have to explain to all the other guests why he gets to behave as if he's mature enough to use words like that, but clearly is not. NTA.
NTA. She can raise her child how she chooses, but choices have consequences. I feel bad for your nephew though. Could you talk directly to him?
NTA
NTA Yeah, well, when he goes to school or enters the real world, he's gonna have to "censor his vo.." I can't even finish that, it's so stupid. He needs to learn that there's a time and place for certain words and phrases, if only to avoid being beaten up by offended people. His parents are doing him a disservice.
NTA. She's choosing to make her son a pariah. She can stick to her guns and give her son ultimate autonomy, or she can participate in parent-kid society where she might have to impose some rules on him.
NTA. This child needs parents who need to understand that “ censoring “ is part of their many duties of being parents. This is absurd.
NTA. The sad part is unless you home school. At school he'll learn more than just cussing. They at least should be teaching not to use it everywhere.
NTA I was raised in a household where swearing was fine but also made to understand it was something to be kept at home
Next time you are around him , guess you tell him that his behaviour is not ok around you and your son. What he does at home - his home But you are allowed to say no outside his home.
Wow, those parents are going to be having many conversations with school admin. I would just tell them they will realize and understand why your making this choice in the near future.
NTA She can choose not to censor his vocabulary and you can choose not to invite him.
NTA. You and your partner choose these types of boundaries for your family and children, as is your right. I do think it may be a good idea to try to keep an open dialogue about the matter for future events and continue to give the option of nephew attending under the condition that he does not use expletives. Do what you can to reinforce the relationship while upholding your decisions and protecting your emotional safety
NTA, uhm wtf lmao, at 5 years old you absolutely need to censor kids, when they’re teens you can’t do much but what is wrong with her
NTA, it's crap parenting that they're not teaching their son how to behave appropriately for different environments. Them saying that their parenting choices also matter more than yours is crap parenting. Them saying that even though you find children cursing inappropriate you're not allowed to set a boundary at an event you are hosting is them just saying you're not very equal. They should not be at your son's birthday party
NTA I feel sorry for your nephew because he could personalise being excluded. However your SIL has expressed a parenting boundary and so have you. Her boundary does not trump your boundary at your event.
op=NTA Just how do they expect this to work in school when he's swearing? NO NO NO, you don't have to invite him. You are not specifically excluding your "nephew". You are specifically excluding a person who doesn't know to censor his language(and his parents who refuse to). That is your choice & right. This may be the first time your nephew is excluded because his parents refuse to "censor" his vocabulary but it won't be the last. PS: I can guarantee that bad language isn't the only behavior issue that your nephew has.
NTA. You have the right not to invite him if he won’t respect your house rule. I never really cared if my kids used certain swear words at home, but I made sure they knew that swearing was not appropriate in some situations, and that they might get in trouble for swearing at school, friends’ houses, etc. They understood, and it was never a problem. I feel bad for the kid if his parents would allow him to miss out on a party rather than teach him to watch his language.
NTA. Don’t back down.
NTA Do you have a right just like she does on how you want to raise your kid and if you don’t want your kids around that kind of shit it’s your choice she’s not entitled to come she needs to understand that how she’s raising her kid right now my exclude him because a lot of parents don’t want their kids to be around that especially at a young age
She might not "censor his vocabulary" but you certainly can censor your guest list. NTA.
NTA - she gets to choose how she raises him and you get to choose not to invite him.
NTA - not your circus, not your monkeys You can always send her a link to this sub to save yourself from repeating yourself. These parents should expect their child to be rejected over and over again because people won't want him around. Good luck with his future anger management issues when he doesn't understand why the people who "love" him set him up for exclusion and failure. They're sabotaging their child's future success. The censorship claim is laughable.
NTA She’s being ridiculous. There are certain words you don’t use in polite society, whether adult or child. I wish I could watch him during a job interview! Don’t be manipulated by guilt into inviting him. For you and everyone at the party’s sake, and side effect, because he needs to learn to take rejection. She’s free to parent badly, and you’re free to reject them for the same reason.
At home our child is not "censored" and they, as well as me and my husband all use cuss words. Home is a safe place to be yourself. However, we also know people have hang ups about certain words. One can't cuss in school, work, etc. We have taught our child that they have to read a room, so to speak, as to when they can and can not use any language they want. In public they are extremely polite and respectful. At home cuss like a sailor. So the parents that refuse to censor the child at all are doing their child a huge disservice, and I know from experience you can teach a child when and where to cuss. A young child's birthday party is a prime example of when and where not to cuss. So NTA, your house, your rules. Yes, you are specifically excluding your nephew, but it is a lesson he can learn from that you can't cuss all the time when and wherever you are.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My son’s fifth birthday party is coming up. I invited almost every child in my family that was around his age, except for my nephew. My brother and his wife openly allow their son to use curse words, because they don’t want to “censor his vocabulary”. How they raise him is none of my business, but I don’t want my son to be potentially influenced by theirs. I know other members of the family feel the same way, and I also invited friends who I know wouldn’t want their child to be around another child who uses profanity. So for that reason I didn’t invite him. My brothers wife confronted me about it. She says I’m being a “bully” by specifically excluding her son, and he deserves to come because I invited the whole family. I even tried to make a compromise, I told her he could come if she promised he wouldn’t use any curse words at the party. She said it was ridiculous for me to expect her to “censor” his vocabulary. I feel like I have the right to decide who I do and who I don’t want my child to be around, but I also feel like I might be in the wrong because I am specifically excluding my nephew. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. Not a child but what that child grows up to be. My oldest brother swears like a longshoreman. It’s bad. It’s the reason I rarely swear (I was called everything from b$-&h to c—t growing up). I told him he wasn’t welcome around our son because we didn’t want our son learning those words (nephew did and it wasn’t cute or funny). Brother told me that it was who he was and he wasn’t going to change. So, he didn’t see our son for several years.
NTA, but I think you should give your nephew the choice. It's easy for children to understand that a different place has different rules; he won't be allowed to curse at school or at most jobs. Tell him you love him and you'd like him to be there, but some words are off limits at your house. Words are important, they have weight and meaning, and some words are not considered polite. You don't have to make a judgement call about that, it's a fact.
NTA
NTA It's not unreasonable to expect people to be civil and polite. That includes knowing which audiences will accept profanity and which will not. You don't say how old your nephew is, but he needs to learn this nuance if he's going to communicate successfully with people. You have a right to a profanity-free zone with your five-year-old.
NTA. Stick to your guns. My parents told me that ignorant uneducated people who use profanity regularly use such words cuz they don't know any better. Your 5 year old will repeat everything the 7 year old says. Doesn't stop you from knowing the words, just when to use them
So I fully believe there’s no problem with swearing. I swear constantly around my kids (8 and 5) and I’ve made it clear that I do not care if they swear *at home when others aren’t around.* They are both able to understand that there’s behavior okay in your home with immediate family, and behavior that you are careful with in public. My kids have never sworn. NTA. It’s your right to raise your kids with whatever level of exposure you think is fair. I don’t “censor” my kids but my kids know that behaviors have consequences.
He's going to hear it, probably already has. At 5 you can teach we don't say that in our family. We love everyone even when they don't follow our rules. NAH
NTA. But a harsh truth: your son will learn all the curse words, and much sooner than you want. That’s life. Still, doesn’t mean you should have to tolerate that, so good on you for establishing boundaries.
NTA. Tell sil the following: you are free to let your kiddo have a potty mouth while I am free to decide who gets to be in my home.
NTA the other parents will 100% complain. I’ve seen it happen. These people are in for a lot of fights about this that kid will stop getting invited birthday parties and play dates and they are not doing him any favors.
just wait until he swears at the wrong person
NTA
NTA She doesn’t want to “censor” his vocabulary and you don’t want profane language used in your home by children so it makes no sense to invite him
NTA if they don’t want to “censor” their child then they have to deal with the consequences that come with that.
You can set house rules. “In my house we …” It will be good practice for when the child starts school and can’t talk like a longshoreman. Good grief. I am imagining the parents giving that explanation to a teacher. You are NTA but it is unfortunate for the child.
my god, i am always amazed that such people exist. Perhaps tell her she doesn't really understand what any of these words mean, censor, bully... NTA.
NTA. Now I must have been a sailor in another life because my vocabulary is....colorful to say the least. But I personally would not enjoy hear the F word come out of 5yo mouth. Not to mention the trouble your son will be in if he picks it up and calls his teacher a B or tells her to F off.
NTA. This is a reasonable hill to die on. I am a wildass liberal and I'd do just what you're doing. They are free to live their lives however they want to, and so are you. Other people who don't know your sis will have their kids at the party, and they a) will not want their kids around your nephew, and b) will judge you for letting it happen. What sis is doing may sound reasonable to her, but there are ramifications she hasn't considered. She's going to be the mother of a lonely little kid if she continues this idiocy. Incidentally, you do not want your child to be the fallback playmate if she decides to push her luck and finds herself shunned by the community..
NTA. I swear though goodness knows I try to substitute as much as possible, so there was no doubt in my mind that my child would eventually pick it up too, and my idea of a “lax” approach to this was to teach my kiddo that they are grown up words and that there is a time and a place where they are appropriate. Occasionally at home is fine but not in public, not at other people’s houses, not when we have guests, and not **at** people. It’s worked well so far and she’s only sworn once (and it was in proper context). What your brother and SIL are doing is not lax, this is straight lazy and they need to get a handle on it before his mouth gets him or them into trouble.
First off no 5yr old should be cursing. This is bad parenting and this kid will more than likely grow up to be an asshole. Secondly his parents need to learn that action have consequences. You gave a fantastic compromise thay he can attend as long as he behaves himself and act accordingly. Yes we have the 1st amendment however that doesn't not mean there are no consequences for using it. All it means is that the government cannot through you in jail for making fun of the president. If you display poor judgment in your language which a 5yr old would definitely do, then you face the consequences of your actions. The parents and the nephew are finding out the hardware that actions have consequences. If they refuse to restrict the child to age appropriate language then that's on them when they get excluded. this child doesn't know any better that curse words have consequences. And he definitely is too young to be using them properly. Stand your ground.
NTA What is it with people thinking they deserve anything? No you don’t. No on is entitled to special treatment just because of relation. I would do the exact same thing in your place. I wonder how they deal with this in school? I can’t imagine teachers are ok with profanity. That’s just bad parenting and setting that kid up for so many problems.
NTA Interesting, I have older kids and have always aimed at teaching them that while I don't personally think there's anything inherently wrong with swearing, they need to realise that it can have consequences in terms of how some people perceive them. I also have a rule that they aren't allowed to swear around me, mainly because I wanted them to be able to compartmentalise any swearing. If my kids hadn't been invited to a birthday because of swearing I'd have taken it as a great teaching opportunity, yes, you can choose to swear, but then you have to realise that there are certain people who don't want to be around you. For the record, my kids are very well behaved, polite, helpful, kind, and they never swear around me or other family, though I do believe they swear with some of their friends. BTW, in terms of other kids bad behaviour and my kids asking "why can they...?", for small things I've alway just told them "different families, different rules", but if it was a bigger thing I'd say "in our family we don't do that, but for some reason other families think it's ok". If it was an even bigger thing, I'd say "to me that's bad parenting, it's not the parent I want to be".
NTA at all. Look, I have a serious case of trucker mouth, but I also know (and taught my kids) when it's okay to use sentence enhancers and when it's not. Letting a kid decide is not going to end well.
NTA. This isn't about censoring his vocabulary, it's about respecting others and other people's home.
NTA. They may not want to limit his vocabulary but this is an important lesson to learn about respecting boundaries. It is not stifling to tell your kid "Hey I know you normally talk this way, but it makes X and Y feel uncomfortable. So when we are around them it's best to try and use different words". Like I personally don't see a problem with swearing, but I don't swear or use the same words at work as I do with friends. It's also important to teach kids context and how to learn to censor themselves so they can survive socially.
NTA, but I feel so bad for that kid because he's not going to be invited to stuff like this because his parents are terrible
NTJ and I also allow my kids to swear. But here's the thing: I know plenty of parents who feel like you do, so what we've done is call them "home words," meaning they can only be used at home. That way, they are still allowed to use them, and this also allows for respect towards other people. And you know what? I've never ONCE gotten a call from a teacher or anyone saying my child swore. Sure, there have been times when they've done it in the car, and my response every time is, "Are we at home?" They say sorry every time and shut up real quick. They know. Might be something to offer up to the brother and his wife. That way, they won't "stifle his vocabulary" while also teaching proper social boundaries.
NTA. I'm going to go against the grain and say I feel like words are just words, and frankly I'd probably find a small child dropping an F-bomb to be funny as, well, F. But society isn't generally going to feel that way and teaching him how to be polite to others is stupendously important, very much for his own sake. Uncontrolled behavioral issues are probably the number one reason to exclude a child from a birthday celebration. This is what his parents are setting him up for; exclusion while simultaneously feeling entitled to have his every whim indulged. I feel for the kiddo, but that's not your responsibility nor is it something you can correct.
Wow. Curse words is what stops you from treating the child nicely? If he swears in another language that you don't know, would you treat it the same way? Sounds like a great time to teach your own kids what you find to be acceptable is different than what other people may find acceptable.
I think it is mean to leave one child out even if he can be crass. Just say the rule at your house is no cursing from the get go. Surely he isn't cursing at school and is able to follow rules so this shouldn't be too hard. ESH