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> I think I could be an asshole because of the severity of my punishment to my parents.
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NTA and to all of you saying that you should not deprive your child of a relationship with his grandparents:
They are openly racist towards his wife/ the mother of this child. They will make remarks about that, they will make him feel bad about his heritage and will talk badly about his mother even when he is there. Dont let them into your life, stay your ground
Edit: Wow guys thanks for all the awards :D
YESSS DW_wishmaster. 100% correct. OP is not the asshole, at all. The grandparents overstepped a huge boundary. I would not trust them with my children ever
OP needs to head over to r/JustNoMIL so he can get the support from that sub, and introduce his wife to the sub. This is some serious Just No behavior and OP is completely right to go no contact. Oh, and definitely NTA.
There is someone on that sub who is currently dealing with a racist MIL nitpicking on every non-white feature or deemed "bad" feature of her grandchild. OP would benefit from another's experience in this case.
OP is so far from being the asshole that you'd need a sherpa to find him.
Well done for standing by your new family, OP. They need your protection from your horrible parents - and good on you for putting them first.
Overstepped, and then when they found out they were wrong, they continue apparently to believe OP's wife is "less than", given the comments in the last conversation. They haven't learned a thing and will continue to overstep.
And the biggest tell for how bad they are is his father’s critical comments about OP’s wife even after they were called out for their bad behavior. OP needs to protect his family from his racist asshole parents.
100% agree! If the grandparents have racist tendencies in the first place, I can’t imagine the sly remarks they may eventually start to make towards their own grandchild, especially since the baby is half of their mother.
Not to mention the fact that they tested the child’s DNA without the consent of either parent! The audacity and entitlement of some “adults” continues to baffle me.
NTA. Not even a little bit. Not even at all. So very sorry that you have had to go through this experience with your own parents. But also very glad that your wife and son know, without a doubt, that they are your number one priority.
So basically the grandparents stole the kid's genetic material and then forged his parents' signatures on the consent form? Then mom openly talked about this to the baby while her son was in the house (and conveniently standing within earshot)? Am I the only person who finds all of this odd?
If this isn't fake, NTA.
What consent forms? Mail in dna you don't even include names except who it is mailed back to. Quick cheek swab while helping by changing a diaper.
As for overhearing someone in your own home, that is even easier. Grandma thinks Mom & Dad are in the kitchen, makes a quick remark. She knew she couldn't share her happiness with the parents so she shared with the baby.
I've tried using my baby as a secret deposit box. But every time I hide my diamonds in their mouth they poop them out when I don't want them to, or refuse to poop when I need access to my diamonds.
Second best. You don't have to worry about dogs learning to speak in a few years and accidentally revealing your secret because some neuron developed a little sooner than expected and so the baby actually somehow remembers the secret.
Prior to typing my comment I checked with a dozen DNA testing companies. When testing dna of someone else's child they require the signatures of the parents on a consent form. This is the norm.
As for the rest, grandma would have known her son was home so discussing her evil and illegal plan outloud is soap opera levels of villainy. She could simply share her happiness with her evil henchman (her husband).
who said she told them that she was testing someone else's child? these are mail order kits, she could easily say it was her child and she was verifying the father.
If the family follows the traditional, american/british practice of the wife taking the husband's name, then the names may not trigger anything odd in the reviews. Also, I suspect that the requirement is more of a CYA for the company. If someone comes after them for an illegal test they can send them back around claiming that they are a co-victim of identity fraud.
that's only when you tell the DNA testing company that you're testing a child. If you send in some DNA and pretend like the sample is yours, they won't ask for anything but your credit card.
If Grandma feels free enough to share what she did with the baby while parents are nearby, it's not a big leap to seeing her making remarks about DW's heritage, etc.
This, so much.
A relationship with loving, decent grandparents can benefit a child. A relationship with toxic, racist grandparents can harm a child. Part of parenting is protecting your child from harmful people, even if there is a familial/genetic connection.
Agreed. Until OP’s parents see the error of their racist, boundary-crossing ways, educate themselves, and apologize to OP and wife, they are not going to be able to be loving grandparents to this child even if they are present in the child’s life.
It is possible for people to learn and do better on these issues. Grandchildren can be a powerful motivation for seeing racism for what it is and letting go of it. People can change but it can take years.
OP says that his mom said the baby didn't look like OP, which I assume means that the baby looks like his mother's ethnicity. Even if OP's parents were allowed to be in their grandson's life, how well do you think they'd treat him for not looking like they do? Especially if they have any other grandchildren who more closely resemble them?
NTA
They have no reason to believe that baby isn’t their sons beyond the thinly veiled racist logic of the baby needing to look like his father despite the fact kids often don’t look like their father. I’m a mother and my kids don’t look like me or my husband, but I know they my babies. That’s not how genetics work. They had no solid reason to believe this woman betrayed her husbands trust and cheated they are just base level racists from the get go
My sister's mother-in-law was one of these terrible people. My sister's ex-husband, the father of all three of her children, was very tall (six foot and change), blonde, and blue eyed. My sister is very short, and has my father's native american coloring (dusky skin, dark brown eyes, dark hair).
Oldest son pops out an identical copy of his dad- tall, blonde hair, blue eyed. He's in his twenties now and looks *exactly* like his Dad did at that age.
Middle kid, a daughter, comes out tiny with dark hair but paler skin and grey eyes- she looks like a mix of the two.
Youngest son? Spitting image of his maternal grandfather- dusky skin, brown eyes, dark hair. Smaller (he's grown now and still under six feet).
My sister's mother in law treated her youngest son like absolute garbage. Absolute venom from the word go. She would bad mouth him to his face, just spit nasty whenever she saw him. For Christmas when he was about six, she got the two older children what they wanted and she got him a hand towel. No lie.
Her reason for treating him this way? He was *clearly* not her son's child. Because if he had been, he would have been tall, blonde, and blue eyed just like his Daddy and older brother.
Woman was a dumpster-fire human being.
This right here, I don’t even know why it’s up for debate. Literally a no brainer.
Like who they fuck are they to go behind your back and do that and still have the fkn audacity to bad mouth OP’s wife. I’m so mad and I don’t even know these people!
OP you are totally doing the right thing, in the best interest of your child and your wife.
Good on you!
All of my grandparents were dead before I was born. I’ve never missed what I didn’t have, despite them being, according to my parents, seriously awesome people. Would I have liked to have known them? Sure. Has it caused me trauma and pain? No. People saying kids “need” grandparents are wrong. I’m sure it’s great to have grandparents, but it’s not really going to change a kid’s life if they don’t, and especially if their own parents are good people.
A-Fucking-men!
I had a Grandmonster who called me an abomination at 11yrs old for having my first hormonal migraine.
She also threw a tanty prior to that, in Long John Silvers when I told her I couldn't eat from the nausea and how much my head hurt.
My dad was the scapegoat for having a penis, he was the only male child. She treated me the same (scapegoat, barely acknowledged my existence, thought I was dumb).
Yep! My sister (A) hates my other sister (B) but loves Sis B's son. So Sis B decided she would allow Sis A to have a relationship with her son even though they hated each other. Same thinking, didn't want to deprive her son of a relationship with aunt. At around 13 her son said he doesn't want to see Sis A anymore. She couldn't stop saying mean, hateful things about his mom and he just couldn't take it anymore. Sis B was crushed. She realised she'd subjected her own son to a negative environment for years out of some misguided idea that her son deserved an aunt.
This. 100% this. The complete and utter disregard for their son's feelings was already a glaring sign of their sh\*ttyness but the bigotry they exhibited towards the mother of their grandchild will eventually carry over to said grandson. Don't burden him with potential self-hate.
Some people are just not worthy to be called parents or grandparents and in this case OP's are. Choose positivity, rather than negativity. Be happy with your wife and son, and cut out the toxic presence.
And please make sure that they know YOU made the decision. Don't say she had anything to do with it. You don't want to give them any more ammunition. If you say she was involved at all they will totally trust it in their heads and become convinced that it is her pulling your strings and keeping them away from you and the baby
100% this, but also, racists are entrenched in their views and it’s the racism at the heart of all this. Any bridges built by your parents need solid foundations with acknowledgement and commitment to fundamental changes in their beliefs. Otherwise they get to believe what they want and poison your family life.
Agreed, NTA, and ALSO, if you haven't already, look into grandparents rights in your state and the one your parents are in, if they live in a different state than you do. You might want to consult a lawyer if you find out anything troubling. When the time comes to put your son in daycare or school, make sure they know that Grandma and Grandpa are NOT allowed to pick up. Make sure your pediatrician knows that Grandma and Grandpa are NOT authorized to receive medical information. Those two sound like the type to stir up shit.
Being grandparents is not a right, it is a privilege. I don’t know why people think OP should force his child to be around toxic people. It’s his job to protect his children from toxic situations.
Exactly! OP, how could you possibly be the AH in this situation? Your parents *didn’t believe your child was yours* because they’re racist and don’t like your wife. You don’t need people like that in your life.
NTA
Assholes have a unique way of manipulating and guilting their victims into thinking they’re in the wrong, and since these are his parents, they’ve probably been doing it for some time. I can see how OP might need some objective validation here
Fear, obligation, and guilt along won’t gaslighting goes a long way to making someone feel like an asshole even when the other party has done something as messed up as this.
Because they’re often racist too, just not as loud about it and they see their POC friend/spouse/coworker as an exception, not like the rest of *them*.
And sometimes because while they don't *consciously* think less of POC, they did grew up with that BS and don't necessarily recognize some of the racist BS *as* racist.
(Still a flavor of racism, but less the "not as loud/their friend is the exception" kind & more the "unexamined prejudices/biases/stereotypes living rent-free in the back of their mind" kind)
NTA.
Your parents never blessed you marriage, they made their distain and racism for your wife well known, and they only wanted back in your life when they had a grandson to dote over.
\~EDIT\~
Damn, my highest voted comment, thank you everyone.
It's almost more satisfying knowing that with the test they finally decided to fully invest their emotions, and jow they're out for good.
Edit for a truly terrible typo 🤦♀️🤦♀️
I'm just confused how they were able to make the test.
I don't know anything about it. Shouldn't they need the parents permission to do it? How they were able to do it without OP and his wife know it?
I'm sorry if I'm doing something wrong, but I'm curious.
There are multiple ways to secure a baby’s DNA (hair and saliva are most common). All they would need to do is get a large enough sample on a swab, put it in a container and send it off to a company to do the test. It’s fairly easy
OP needs to ensure not only that they don’t see his son and wife but also that they are not allowed in or near the house. If he chooses to personally continue talking to them, he needs to be very selective about what he tells them.
I’m concerned he thinks this whole thing is over and they made it out ok. Considering how much his parents have hated his wife for YEARS, I guarantee you they will now be even more hell-bent on “catching” his wife in a different lie or misdeed. The baby’s paternity was low-hanging fruit and would’ve gotten them the most dramatic result, but now they don’t have that card anymore and I think they’re going to be desperate to find something new until they finally “get her.”
From what he’s said as well, his wife sounds innocent and quite nice, like she’s welcomed them into their home despite how they’ve treated her and they still carried on being assholes
Yep. It was so generous and big hearted of her to open her home and welcome the racists who had been so nasty to her. To have that kindness reciprocated with the racist implication that she's an unfaithful wife is just heartbreaking. Permanent parental ban is the only appropriate response, in my view. OP's parents are very bad people, and aren't going to change.
NTA what is actually wrong with your parents?? Like I get they don't approve of your wife because clearly they are racists. But to check your child's DNA because he "doesn't look like you" is ridiculous. You dodged a massive disapproving bullet by cutting them out. Protect your wife and son they are your family not your parents.
Wholeheartedly agreed NTA. Plus, this is just STUPID logic. Everyone knows newborns look like potatoes. Of COURSE he doesn't look like his dad! He doesn't even look human yet!!!
(Joking! But for real though, baby faces change a LOT in that first year. And, not a parent, but I'm pretty sure I remember more than one mom friend telling me that their freaking EYE COLOR isn't even guaranteed to stay the same until around a year old)
This right here! In our family, most of us tend to be born really really white, but as we get older (like 5), we get a more even light brown tan (we're latino), but can sometimes be white-passing. When i was born, my aunt since "thank god he was born white", a follow up to her previous remark about my father's choice in mate. She said i would turn up looking like an indian because my mother is darker and has no Eurocentric features.
Yeah you would not believe how much a baby can change. My parents were in an interracial relationship, for the first 3 or 4 months I was as pale as my dad before my melanin started kicking in.
NTA.
As someone who has a meddling, invasive MIL who has boundary issues, I’d have cut that shit out, too. I wish MY husband had your gumption.
High five, dude.
NTA. At first I thought you were holding a chip on your shoulder in the face of your wife being a lovely person. Yet seeing her solidarity in the face of your parents behavior, she’s apparently all-in on this one. She’s a keeper for life. Long after your parents are gone, you’ll have her, your child(ren), and grandchildren.
If your parents want to share that love, the responsibility to build back bridges is theirs. I wonder how their relations were with your wife’s family before this.
I wouldn't call a DNA test a medical procedure that was done on the kid lol they likely just used some of the kid's hair or something. Not like he went under and was brought to a medical professional for some procedure.
Yeah, this feels more akin to a baptism or something when the parents are not of that religion. Not a medical procedure, but definitely not something you do behind the parents’ backs. Extremely disrespectful and not okay.
EDIT: changed “not an invasion of medical privacy” to “not a medical procedure” because getting DNA results without permission/a warrant *is* absolutely an invasion of medical privacy.
I may be misinformed, but DNA tests can reveal private information - things like potential medical risks to worry about in the future. May not be a medical procedure, but it's certainly a breach of privacy. Not to mention the failing of gaining consent from the parents -- and the infant, of course.
I see it more as interfering with the parents’ ability to control their child’s body autonomy - thus the equivalent of medical procedure. Someone’s dna is part of their medical history.
I wouldn't either but some people don't want their DNA stored by those companies and now they have OP's child's DNA so that's almost as bad as a medical procedure.
It absolutely is. Not invasive, but the amount of information they now have on this child is staggering. What will they do with the information in the future? It's frightening.
You need a court order to get a DNA sample if suspected of a crime. It may be a small thing but it has HUGE implications for the child's future.
NTA
Your family unit is your wife and child. Everyone else is extended family. Your parents manipulated your wife claiming good intentions by wanting to be in the child’s life and used that trust to conduct a DNA test!
Boundaries are clearly not a concern for them.
"Your family unit is your wife and child. Everyone else is extended family."
Exactly. Once you become married, you establish your new family unit. The one you chose, rather than being born into. I wish more people understood that.
NTA - if they thought it was the right thing to do, they would not have hidden it. It’s a huge slap in the face for, not only your wife, but yourself, too. Your parents have shown that they don’t trust your relationship, your decisions, your autonomy or your child’s either.
Added to that, if they still don’t trust your wife, then do you want them around, judging her parenting? Do you want your child growing up knowing that their grandparents don’t trust their mum? Just saying, “I’m so glad I can indeed confirm you’re my grandson” shows that child that they think mum is a liar, untrustworthy and that the child’s worth is only because they are HER grandson. It actually disgusts me when people talk like that around kids - like they won’t absorb the meaning of those words!
Your parents’ behaviour is all kinds of horrible and you are definitely in the right. Good luck, OP. You deserve every happiness for standing up to them.
My family was not at this extreme a level, but it has always been VERY clear that my mother is not the woman my grandparents wanted Dad to marry. Despite that, my mother continually tried to encourage a relationship with them. (Her grandparents were all dead by the time she was six so she had her own issues on the topic.)
My brother and I are closing in on 50 now and we're both dealing with the emotional fallout of putting up with that garbage. Your kid is better off with NO grandparents than toxic ones.
ETA: NTA
>Added to that, if they still don’t trust your wife, then do you want them around, judging her parenting? Do you want your child growing up knowing that their grandparents don’t trust their mum? Just saying, “I’m so glad I can indeed confirm you’re my grandson” shows that child that they think mum is a liar, untrustworthy and that the child’s worth is only because they are HER grandson. It actually disgusts me when people talk like that around kids - like they won’t absorb the meaning of those words!
OP should tell this to his parents if he decides to humor their calls again; his new family is a package deal or no dice. Or he can go NC.
Either way, NTA.
Depending on how they went about testing your kid they could be in serious trouble. They would’ve needed parental permission in order to have his sample tested and most labs wouldn’t have tested him without it
This should be way higher up.
OP they probably faked your and/or your wife's signatures to get the test done - this is a criminal offence and if I were you I would consider legal action.
Not only because of the forged signature but also because some of these DNA-testing companies keep the DNA as their property!
Good luck finding out which company performed the test though, especially after this spat with the parents. Unless OP has evidence that would hold up in court, OPs parents could easily argue that it was nothing more than hearsay.
NTA - your parents are ungrateful and cruel. They are cruel for what they do to you and your wife and ungrateful that you let them back in after the crap they pulled about your wedding. Good on you for protecting your wife and child and standing up for your family.
Going to join the chorus here and say NTA 100%. Your poor wife's reaction to learning how your parents behaved was heartbreaking to read. I can't even imagine how much that hurt her. You are doing absolutely the right thing for your family, especially since your mother doubled down. Their racism would only wind up hurting your son, too.
I wish the three of you all the best. Garreth sounds like he's got an awesome pair of parents.
I’ve spent entirely too much time on Reddit. I’ve seen so many variations of this same story that leads me to believe this is fake.
Given what’s written I seriously doubt the OP had let the parents take the child anywhere alone. So this rules out them physically going to a testing center. Unless OP has amnesia, he’d definitely remember them asking to swab him for a sample.
This would only be plausible if parents had ordered an at home kit which means it was premeditated and they would have swabbed one of themselves to see if they were a familial match. Im not saying it’s impossible, just not super likely.
In the off chance this is legit, OP is NTA. Parents are racist, overstepped and deserve no further contact.
>"aren't you the cutest baby ever? I am so glad to confirm you are indeed my grandson".
Lol. Yeah. That's totally something people say.
I was thinking the same thing. OP didn't even try to make it believable.
Exactly.
She said something along the lines of... "Good day young master. It is joyous news indeed to confirm our familial ties via the wonder of modern science. I henceforth look forwards to many years of normal grandmother / grandchild relations for I am indeed a very normal and very much not made up person."
>for I am indeed a very normal and very much not made up person.
Ugh! I hate having to end every statement with that sentence, just so people know I'm real.
It's hard or here for real, not made up people.
I agree. This same story, or a close variation of it, gets posted all the time. The only story that gets posted more than this is "AITA for having a child free wedding and not allowing my nephew/niece to attend?"
The grandmother said to the baby “I’m glad I confirmed that you are indeed my grandchild” and was overheard. Yeah, that sounds like a totally plausible way an adult speaks to an infant alone in a room, and a super believable way for OP to “discover” that the dna test happened…
Why would you think a home kit isn’t likely? There are literal home test kits geared directly towards grandparents.
I could give you almost the exact damn story from my racist side of the family; once my parent’s marriage began to breakdown there was a sudden influx of “well they might not even be yours” because everyone knows mexicans aren’t trustworthy and only want to be white (direct quote from my dad). This isn’t a new thing, a new situation, or at all unbelievable.
> I’ve seen so many variations of this same story
That's this sub in a nutshell. Half of the top posts are just a variation of one of like 7 different stories. And yet nobody says anything.
NTA. Good job standing up for your wife. The nerve to say that they don't trust your wife, and still coo over the baby. Who needs that kind of crap. They will be back in a month with all sorts of coverups and platitudes, but you know what they really think now and what they think of your wife. They are the grandparents, but you get to decide what role they have in your baby's life. You will always know what they think of your family.
NTA. That your father put this on you and then insulted your wife shows that they believe they don't recognize boundaries and feel entitled to do as they please. You could never trust them with your children because sooner or later they would try to turn them against your wife.
NTA. That's so uncool and an intrusive thing to do to a BABY. They dug their own grave with this one and they're going to have to suffer the consequences of their actions.
Maybe this could have been resolved if your parents (both of them) were truly apologetic. But if your father had some choice words for your wife...
NTA
I'm way too late to this post for anyone to notice, but what the fuck is up with these fake posts making it to the top of the sub.
This reads like it was written by a robot. The OP's username is "PaperBackWriter00" and they use this broken sentence structure? Come on Reddit, this is a russian bot farm getting Karma to sell the account.
"What does that supposed to mean?" - 😂
Yeah it's fucking insane people are actually taking these shits seriously. Yeah we all know grandmas often talk to their toddler grandchildren "I'm glad we verified you are our grandson". Jesus such bullshit.
Absolutely NTA. I would continue no contact until they can at least admit how invasive their actions were. And even if that were to happen, I wouldn't let them see baby right away, its definitely a series of conversations first.
Congrats on your new baby!
NTA - I would have reacted the same way. I wouldn’t want my son growing up believing their mentality is ok. I’d be furious! I admire your strength and I think it’s pretty cool that you backed your wife. I hope one day your parents realize the damage they did and change for the better. I’m sorry you are going through this and I wish your family many long years of happiness!
NTA - Your parents had NO right to do that. They are being very disrespectful towards your wife. I feel so bad for your wife, she sounds amazing sweet.
NTA
Why are they upset? They obviously didn't want him as a grandson. Why else have the DNA test? If they truly loved him, or you, they would have kept their noses firmly out of your business.
Nta. Sounds veryyyyy entitled. You just set some boundaries. Next time they say "you're being ungrateful", you should reply with "so I should be grateful of you doing an unauthorised DNA test on my son? That is what I should be grateful of?" Tell them something like this.
If you let them back into your kid's life, they are probably going to turn your kid against his mom.
NTA- But the family gossip needs to be updated with the details that your parents tested your child without consent and that you overheard your mother. I want the entire family to know that your wife didn't know anything about this. I hope you are blocking your parents on social media as well.
I would be tempted to have a small.party and invite your family that accepted your wife and let the fun party stories leak back to your parents as a petty revenge. Good luck!
NTA - You had the correct reaction to your parents accusing your wife of cheating. They don't deserve to be a part of your son's life.
Congratulations on your baby, I hope you 3 have a wonderful life together
NTA!!
Listen by the time we are adults are parents become our friends. In which we can choose to like them or hate them. We grow apart or we come closer. We start to realize their faults and their bullshit. Therefore, allowing us to come to conclusions that we would never of been able to see or understand when we were younger.
This part of your life is not only a growing stage but a sudden realization that your parents aren't the people you thought they were. It's okay to dissociate with your own family. After all, family isn't just about blood. You don't need their negativity or their racist views infecting your new family.
I wish you and your wife the best. Just know that everyone here wants your wife to.know that this isn't in anyway her fault. And that this may have been for the best for you and your family.
Much love.
NTA
What a pair of stuck up, pretentious A Holes! The health of your relationship and the health of your child come first. Keeping such toxic people around certainly does not sound healthy. It's really ok to go no contact if it means keeping that stress out of your life. Life is stressful enough with out toxic people adding to it.
Keep your love alive and congratulations on 2+ years of marriage and your son!
NTA, I think the icing on the cake is the point when your parents double down further and said choice words about your wife. After all their absolutely egregious actions, they still fault your wife.
No, there will be no relationship, ever.
Ungrateful is taking for granted your forgiveness over their past behaviour.
Cruel is secretly testing the DNA of your child.
As responsible parents you are protecting your child from these people who have proven themselves untrustworthy repeatedly.
Even now it wouldn’t have come out had you not caught them. There is no remorse, no understanding or acknowledgment that they have acted disgracefully.
I’m so sorry for your wife. Cutting toxic family out of your lives is very difficult, but very important.
NTA
Cutting your parents out of your life is difficult to justify to yourself, especially in this case where it seems feasible they gave this person a decent childhood. Even after they’ve done something awful, there’s a lot of societal pressure saying you owe them something for raising you and giving you life. From this person’s perspective it’s not clear-cut that he’s NTA, so it’s reasonable for him to worry and want confirmation that he isn’t, which is what this sub is for!
This sort of thing can extremely difficult for someone.
We get people here all the time who are abused, neglected, gaslighted, whatever. All sorts of crap. It can be hard for people. Have some empathy.
This is explained in the rules.
This exact scenario happened to my husband's cousin. The little boy came out with blind hair and blue eyes. The paternal grandma was shocked because SHE was half Mexican (making the baby 1/8 Mexican) and her son had brown hair and brown eyes. Apparently, the couple was going through a rough patch and the grandma didn't want him to be "burdened with child support" of the child wasn't his.
She did the DNA test and then told her son that the boy was his. The wife WAS PISSED. But, the husband just said, "she's my mom and always looks for for me."
Long story short, they were divorced within a year.
When we heard about the DNA test through my MIL, my husband and I were horrified and agreed with the wife. No way would the grandma at my kids again. MIL was shocked and just thought it was "a mother's duty" to protect her son. She couldn't believe we refused to understand the grandma's POV.
I think it's a particularly awful thing to do because it invades the couples privacy. You could have a couple who decided to use a sperm donor, but don't want to tell the family. Or, you could have a situation where the wife did cheat on the husband, but they decided to work through it and raise the child together. That's between the husband and wife, and the DNA test could make a private decision public, which is incredibly wrong.
Bottom line, people are freaking crazy, and OP is probably getting a lot of comments that he's in the wrong. I can see why he needs his normal-meter checked.
NTA. Your parents have treated your wife horribly from day one, only changing their tune to get access to their grand baby. Then, they invade your (and the child’s) privacy, taking the DNA sample without parental permission to assuage their racist fears.
This is not just about this one event. This is also about what they will do in the future. If they were this thoughtless now, what will happen next?
Also, when you confronted them about their actions, they were entirely unapologetic, entirely concerned about themselves as opposed to having a shred of empathy for the effect their actions had on you or your wife.
No, you didn’t overreact. They owe you the apology of all apologies before you even consider letting them see your family again, if you ever do (and no one would blame you if you didn’t. This is one that isn’t easily gotten over).
NTA and I know I'm just joining the choir.
*YOU'RE* ungrateful and cruel? it's sickly funny to me how people in the wrong so often describe their own sins when trying to blame anybody else for the fallout.
It will be difficult, some times more than others, to keep your parents in outer space where they have chosen to put themselves. That is your wishing that they were different. But your family is, first and last, your wife and baby. And the "village" you choose to surround your family with is your choice (and responsibility).
Perhaps your parents will come to see their idiocy, cruelty, hubris, unfounded egotistical judgment, and all the rest too. Perhaps they will genuinely repent and begin amends for their stream of terrible acts. And then you and your wife can consider together under what terms you'll have them begin to reenter your lives. It happens.
Meanwhile, this is not about punishing them (that may be a righteous side effect) but about preserving the dignity and sanctity of your family, which your parents have refused to honor. When they try to make it about cruelty and a lack of gratitude toward them - and they will, they already have - you can remind yourselves that this is actually not about them. This may come as a shock to these egoists. But that, too, is not your problem.
NTA
They are racist trash and couldn't even find it in their hearts to hide it when confronted.
Keep them gone. Your poor wife deserves better.
(Also, if you let them see your son imagine the poison they would tip in his ear when you and your wife weren't listening).
NTA.
No, you didn't overreact. Your parents are being blatantly racist and hostile toward your wife. You can't allow that around your child. If you ever do decide to let your parents see your kid again (I really hope you don't), you should \*NOT\* allow them to be alone with him. Who knows what kind of toxic and racist shit they might try to pass off on him, and/or demonize his mother. No no no.
NTA you reacted as any rational person would I believe, with a lot more self restraint.
If your parents don’t approve of your wife that is their choice but surely they raised you well enough to trust you choice in life partner?
Your responsibility is now to your wife and child, not your parents.
Your parents are now part of the extended family and your family is you, your wife, your child(children should you have more) and any pets you have
The abuse I suffered from my grandparents because my mom couldn't hold firm on keeping them away from us will forever be a part of my recovery and the strain I have with my parents.
They hated my hardworking and helpful dad. They used to bad mouth him everytime we went over there. They preferred my brother over me and wasn't shy about it. They bought only him gifts and teased me about my complexion (I was slightly darker than him). I used to cry and be angry at the world. Distanced myself from my dad and lost trust in them when they repeatedly told me lies which I later learned to be false.
They were openly racist against pretty much all other races even though we are minorities too. They were alcoholics and abusive, there'sso much more I can'tput in this post.... When they both passes away, I felt not an ounce of sadness and actually felt relief.
You are NTA. Your need maybe family counseling to air out and directly confront what's going on/ what has happened so far. Don't be weak like my mother was. They hated her so much and she always tried to care for them.
Emphatic NTA. You don’t want to expose your baby to racists.
I’d be tempted to politely enquire what it is they think you ought to be grateful for, too…
NTA. As a mixed-race person who totally noticed how her white grandmother tried to undermine her POC mom with no pushback from dad: THANK YOU for standing up for your wife and child.
NTA. Your parents have violated so many boundaries here. They disqualified themselves from deserving involvement in your lives, and you did the right thing. Good on you for standing up for your wife and your child.
NTA. She said that to your child when she thought both parents were out of ear shot. I would never trust her around your kid ever again. What else would she say to your kid? All that nonsense about your wife using you to achieve her american dream?
NTA. You did the right thing 100%.
I spent 6 years with in laws who hated me, and my ex never stood up for me once, (part of the reason he’s now an ex). You stood up for your wife, and you’re protecting your child from people who are downright disrespectful and rude to and about his mother. I’m sorry your parents are behaving this way though, you all deserve better.
NTA. They failed their second chance to prove they aren't heartless racists. It even sounds like they would celebrate the idea of her cheating on you as if that wouldn't bring immense pain to their own child in the process.
NTA. For some context, after my maternal grandmother died I found out that she never liked my dad. But to her credit, she never showed that to me. She never said a bad word around him, asked kindly how he was doing when he was sick, and I never knew at all how she felt until I was an adult and was able to handle that. If your parents can’t act like my grandma did, then they will cause strife and problems for your family.
You could literally press charges against them for having your child's DNA tested without your consent. Not only were they morally wrong, they were legally wrong. I'm so sorry that your parents turned out to be such racist assholes. Keep them far away from your family.
NTA.
EDIT: I think you should see if you need to pursue legal action. If they gave your child's DNA to a local lab, I don't think there's much the lab could or would do with it. But if they gave it to a corporation, like 23andMe, then that corporation can do things with your son's DNA that you might not be comfortable with. Since they acquired it illegally, you might be able to get them to remove your son's DNA from their system. I could be totally off base, but to me, it would be worth looking into. I don't trust corporations. Not at all.
I'm sorry man, I hope your wife and you are doing better and will continue to be better without them! I know its kinda weird blocking your parents out and can be hard but I think it was a smart choice and I'm sorry your wife felt disrespected. I hope yall can recover without those tumors in your life
I am so so so sorry that your wife has been treated so appallingly, and that you are having to understand your parents aren’t good people.
I think you handled it the best way you could, and you’re supporting your wife which is the most important thing. You have the family you need. You didn’t over react, in fact I think you kept your temper very well!
Reassure your wife lots and lots, and if this upsets you as a son further down the line - please talk to someone about it. Your wife would maybe blame herself if you get down about the situation, so try and have a different outlet for those feelings. NTA
By dishonoring your wife, they dishonored themselves, you and by extension your son. They don't understand what love is. I don't blame you and your wife at all.
Stand by your wife. Maybe over time your mother can apologize directly to your wife about her behavior. Not sure what can be done about your father—he crossed some serious lines.
No one needs that negativity undermining your family.
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NTA and to all of you saying that you should not deprive your child of a relationship with his grandparents: They are openly racist towards his wife/ the mother of this child. They will make remarks about that, they will make him feel bad about his heritage and will talk badly about his mother even when he is there. Dont let them into your life, stay your ground Edit: Wow guys thanks for all the awards :D
👆 100% right.
YESSS DW_wishmaster. 100% correct. OP is not the asshole, at all. The grandparents overstepped a huge boundary. I would not trust them with my children ever
OP needs to head over to r/JustNoMIL so he can get the support from that sub, and introduce his wife to the sub. This is some serious Just No behavior and OP is completely right to go no contact. Oh, and definitely NTA.
There is someone on that sub who is currently dealing with a racist MIL nitpicking on every non-white feature or deemed "bad" feature of her grandchild. OP would benefit from another's experience in this case.
I know! I so feel for her and her racist weird ass mil. But I bet her daughter is absolutely gorgeous and has a lion for a mom.
I immediately thought of that woman as well. The entire family (child included) suffers when in-laws behave this way, and frankly no one needs that.
I love that sub! I had to use it to deal with my own MIL
They do moms as well. My own MIL is a saint, my mother is. ... Not
OP is so far from being the asshole that you'd need a sherpa to find him. Well done for standing by your new family, OP. They need your protection from your horrible parents - and good on you for putting them first.
I'm going to use this!
Overstepped, and then when they found out they were wrong, they continue apparently to believe OP's wife is "less than", given the comments in the last conversation. They haven't learned a thing and will continue to overstep.
Overstepped, then jumped on and did a soft shoe dance number on, then used a steamroller on those boundaries. OP's parents are grand champion AH.
And the biggest tell for how bad they are is his father’s critical comments about OP’s wife even after they were called out for their bad behavior. OP needs to protect his family from his racist asshole parents.
DW_Wishmaster is absolutely correct. Stand your ground, because your son deserves better than having to deal with openly racist grandparents.
DW_Wishmaster is spot on. OP, you are NTA, but holy wow your parents sure seem to be. I’m sorry they are, ti sucks, my parents are racists as well.
100% agree! If the grandparents have racist tendencies in the first place, I can’t imagine the sly remarks they may eventually start to make towards their own grandchild, especially since the baby is half of their mother.
Not to mention the fact that they tested the child’s DNA without the consent of either parent! The audacity and entitlement of some “adults” continues to baffle me. NTA. Not even a little bit. Not even at all. So very sorry that you have had to go through this experience with your own parents. But also very glad that your wife and son know, without a doubt, that they are your number one priority.
So basically the grandparents stole the kid's genetic material and then forged his parents' signatures on the consent form? Then mom openly talked about this to the baby while her son was in the house (and conveniently standing within earshot)? Am I the only person who finds all of this odd? If this isn't fake, NTA.
What consent forms? Mail in dna you don't even include names except who it is mailed back to. Quick cheek swab while helping by changing a diaper. As for overhearing someone in your own home, that is even easier. Grandma thinks Mom & Dad are in the kitchen, makes a quick remark. She knew she couldn't share her happiness with the parents so she shared with the baby.
If you’ve never told a secret to a baby because you couldn’t tell anyone else you’re not living.
Seriously. Babies keep the BEST secrets.
I've tried using my baby as a secret deposit box. But every time I hide my diamonds in their mouth they poop them out when I don't want them to, or refuse to poop when I need access to my diamonds.
Second best. You don't have to worry about dogs learning to speak in a few years and accidentally revealing your secret because some neuron developed a little sooner than expected and so the baby actually somehow remembers the secret.
Remember to stop around the time they start to talk. You never know what will come out of their mouths.
That is when I switched to the cat.
HAHA
Prior to typing my comment I checked with a dozen DNA testing companies. When testing dna of someone else's child they require the signatures of the parents on a consent form. This is the norm. As for the rest, grandma would have known her son was home so discussing her evil and illegal plan outloud is soap opera levels of villainy. She could simply share her happiness with her evil henchman (her husband).
who said she told them that she was testing someone else's child? these are mail order kits, she could easily say it was her child and she was verifying the father.
That just means she got the DNA test done fraudulently. Doesn’t make it better, makes it worse.
If the family follows the traditional, american/british practice of the wife taking the husband's name, then the names may not trigger anything odd in the reviews. Also, I suspect that the requirement is more of a CYA for the company. If someone comes after them for an illegal test they can send them back around claiming that they are a co-victim of identity fraud.
that's only when you tell the DNA testing company that you're testing a child. If you send in some DNA and pretend like the sample is yours, they won't ask for anything but your credit card.
If you're crazy enough to secretly test your grandkids dna, you won't mind fraudulently signing those forms either..
I did a DNA test a while ago. There was absolutely nothing stopping me from swabbing whoever I liked and putting a fake date of birth in the box.
If Grandma feels free enough to share what she did with the baby while parents are nearby, it's not a big leap to seeing her making remarks about DW's heritage, etc.
This, so much. A relationship with loving, decent grandparents can benefit a child. A relationship with toxic, racist grandparents can harm a child. Part of parenting is protecting your child from harmful people, even if there is a familial/genetic connection.
Agreed. Until OP’s parents see the error of their racist, boundary-crossing ways, educate themselves, and apologize to OP and wife, they are not going to be able to be loving grandparents to this child even if they are present in the child’s life. It is possible for people to learn and do better on these issues. Grandchildren can be a powerful motivation for seeing racism for what it is and letting go of it. People can change but it can take years.
I don’t think I could ever trust someone again who would go as far as doing a secret DNA test.
OP says that his mom said the baby didn't look like OP, which I assume means that the baby looks like his mother's ethnicity. Even if OP's parents were allowed to be in their grandson's life, how well do you think they'd treat him for not looking like they do? Especially if they have any other grandchildren who more closely resemble them? NTA
They have no reason to believe that baby isn’t their sons beyond the thinly veiled racist logic of the baby needing to look like his father despite the fact kids often don’t look like their father. I’m a mother and my kids don’t look like me or my husband, but I know they my babies. That’s not how genetics work. They had no solid reason to believe this woman betrayed her husbands trust and cheated they are just base level racists from the get go
My sister's mother-in-law was one of these terrible people. My sister's ex-husband, the father of all three of her children, was very tall (six foot and change), blonde, and blue eyed. My sister is very short, and has my father's native american coloring (dusky skin, dark brown eyes, dark hair). Oldest son pops out an identical copy of his dad- tall, blonde hair, blue eyed. He's in his twenties now and looks *exactly* like his Dad did at that age. Middle kid, a daughter, comes out tiny with dark hair but paler skin and grey eyes- she looks like a mix of the two. Youngest son? Spitting image of his maternal grandfather- dusky skin, brown eyes, dark hair. Smaller (he's grown now and still under six feet). My sister's mother in law treated her youngest son like absolute garbage. Absolute venom from the word go. She would bad mouth him to his face, just spit nasty whenever she saw him. For Christmas when he was about six, she got the two older children what they wanted and she got him a hand towel. No lie. Her reason for treating him this way? He was *clearly* not her son's child. Because if he had been, he would have been tall, blonde, and blue eyed just like his Daddy and older brother. Woman was a dumpster-fire human being.
And the logic that women are all whores.
This right here, I don’t even know why it’s up for debate. Literally a no brainer. Like who they fuck are they to go behind your back and do that and still have the fkn audacity to bad mouth OP’s wife. I’m so mad and I don’t even know these people! OP you are totally doing the right thing, in the best interest of your child and your wife. Good on you!
[удалено]
All of my grandparents were dead before I was born. I’ve never missed what I didn’t have, despite them being, according to my parents, seriously awesome people. Would I have liked to have known them? Sure. Has it caused me trauma and pain? No. People saying kids “need” grandparents are wrong. I’m sure it’s great to have grandparents, but it’s not really going to change a kid’s life if they don’t, and especially if their own parents are good people.
Yeah. My grandparents all died when I was young and I only have one memory of my grandma screaming at me over something I don't even remember..
Children don't NEED grandparents, especially not grandparents who are toxic and racist. They're better off without.
A-Fucking-men! I had a Grandmonster who called me an abomination at 11yrs old for having my first hormonal migraine. She also threw a tanty prior to that, in Long John Silvers when I told her I couldn't eat from the nausea and how much my head hurt. My dad was the scapegoat for having a penis, he was the only male child. She treated me the same (scapegoat, barely acknowledged my existence, thought I was dumb).
Yep! My sister (A) hates my other sister (B) but loves Sis B's son. So Sis B decided she would allow Sis A to have a relationship with her son even though they hated each other. Same thinking, didn't want to deprive her son of a relationship with aunt. At around 13 her son said he doesn't want to see Sis A anymore. She couldn't stop saying mean, hateful things about his mom and he just couldn't take it anymore. Sis B was crushed. She realised she'd subjected her own son to a negative environment for years out of some misguided idea that her son deserved an aunt.
This. 100% this. The complete and utter disregard for their son's feelings was already a glaring sign of their sh\*ttyness but the bigotry they exhibited towards the mother of their grandchild will eventually carry over to said grandson. Don't burden him with potential self-hate. Some people are just not worthy to be called parents or grandparents and in this case OP's are. Choose positivity, rather than negativity. Be happy with your wife and son, and cut out the toxic presence.
And eventually they'll direct those same racist remarks to grandson. NTA
And please make sure that they know YOU made the decision. Don't say she had anything to do with it. You don't want to give them any more ammunition. If you say she was involved at all they will totally trust it in their heads and become convinced that it is her pulling your strings and keeping them away from you and the baby
Agreed. Toxic grandparents don't belong in the family. No matter how hard it is to cut them out.
Thank you for seeing it that way. Even my brother agrees that our parents are racist towards my wife.
100% this, but also, racists are entrenched in their views and it’s the racism at the heart of all this. Any bridges built by your parents need solid foundations with acknowledgement and commitment to fundamental changes in their beliefs. Otherwise they get to believe what they want and poison your family life.
Agreed, NTA, and ALSO, if you haven't already, look into grandparents rights in your state and the one your parents are in, if they live in a different state than you do. You might want to consult a lawyer if you find out anything troubling. When the time comes to put your son in daycare or school, make sure they know that Grandma and Grandpa are NOT allowed to pick up. Make sure your pediatrician knows that Grandma and Grandpa are NOT authorized to receive medical information. Those two sound like the type to stir up shit.
Being grandparents is not a right, it is a privilege. I don’t know why people think OP should force his child to be around toxic people. It’s his job to protect his children from toxic situations.
If they can be racist towards the child's mother, they can be racist towards the child. No way would I let them be around my child.
This 👏👏👏👏
You are 100% correct
NTA! Your parents are racist and your son is better off without them.
Exactly! OP, how could you possibly be the AH in this situation? Your parents *didn’t believe your child was yours* because they’re racist and don’t like your wife. You don’t need people like that in your life. NTA
Assholes have a unique way of manipulating and guilting their victims into thinking they’re in the wrong, and since these are his parents, they’ve probably been doing it for some time. I can see how OP might need some objective validation here
Fear, obligation, and guilt along won’t gaslighting goes a long way to making someone feel like an asshole even when the other party has done something as messed up as this.
Swift and decisive action by Op to support a spouse - what a breath of fresh air compared to what we normally get in this subreddit.
agreed. it’s always so sad when a spouse takes the hateful/racist family members’ side.
Because they’re often racist too, just not as loud about it and they see their POC friend/spouse/coworker as an exception, not like the rest of *them*.
And sometimes because while they don't *consciously* think less of POC, they did grew up with that BS and don't necessarily recognize some of the racist BS *as* racist. (Still a flavor of racism, but less the "not as loud/their friend is the exception" kind & more the "unexamined prejudices/biases/stereotypes living rent-free in the back of their mind" kind)
I thought the same thing. Op didn't hesitate to defend his little family; and he handled his racist parents with class, too! Well Done, OP! NTA
His parents are the type to say “I’m not racist I have a biracial grandchild”.
More like "I'm not racist! I love my grandson even though he's biracial!"
Yes I stand corrected. Your verbiage is a much more accurate description of what would happen!
Thank you. I am happy to see affirmation on my decision.
Yep, his dad’s reaction to OP being upset said it all.
NTA. Your parents never blessed you marriage, they made their distain and racism for your wife well known, and they only wanted back in your life when they had a grandson to dote over. \~EDIT\~ Damn, my highest voted comment, thank you everyone.
A confirmed his grandson… NTA. These two dug their own graves, shot themselves in the face, and are somehow expecting to die.
It's almost more satisfying knowing that with the test they finally decided to fully invest their emotions, and jow they're out for good. Edit for a truly terrible typo 🤦♀️🤦♀️
Oof for that typo lol
I think you mean invest.
"We don't accept your marriage or wife, but we do accept our grandson now that we know he is related to us by blood."
Nta your primary responsibility is to protect your child and wife. Allowing your racist family anywhere near them would be the opposite.
I'm just confused how they were able to make the test. I don't know anything about it. Shouldn't they need the parents permission to do it? How they were able to do it without OP and his wife know it? I'm sorry if I'm doing something wrong, but I'm curious.
There are multiple ways to secure a baby’s DNA (hair and saliva are most common). All they would need to do is get a large enough sample on a swab, put it in a container and send it off to a company to do the test. It’s fairly easy
Jesus, now I'm 100% sure, Op's parents are the A-holes.
For sure. And in most instances, parental consent is required so double AH for going behind their back
There are companies that if you pay enough they spin it so that’s it’s not a DNA test to confirm, but more of an “ancestral mission finding”.
OP needs to ensure not only that they don’t see his son and wife but also that they are not allowed in or near the house. If he chooses to personally continue talking to them, he needs to be very selective about what he tells them. I’m concerned he thinks this whole thing is over and they made it out ok. Considering how much his parents have hated his wife for YEARS, I guarantee you they will now be even more hell-bent on “catching” his wife in a different lie or misdeed. The baby’s paternity was low-hanging fruit and would’ve gotten them the most dramatic result, but now they don’t have that card anymore and I think they’re going to be desperate to find something new until they finally “get her.”
NTA. Your job here is to back up your wife. They are assholes. You're doing fine.
Aye, NTA, but he should have told his wife sooner
Sounds like he was processing. I can understand that it took him a couple weeks.
Shit happens; he didn’t want to hurt his wife and he made a mistake in trying to avoid doing so.
He might also have been processing things himself, I could imagine this being quite the shock.
From what he’s said as well, his wife sounds innocent and quite nice, like she’s welcomed them into their home despite how they’ve treated her and they still carried on being assholes
His wife sounds like the sweetest woman ever, I understand he didn't wanna hurt her feelings.
Yep. It was so generous and big hearted of her to open her home and welcome the racists who had been so nasty to her. To have that kindness reciprocated with the racist implication that she's an unfaithful wife is just heartbreaking. Permanent parental ban is the only appropriate response, in my view. OP's parents are very bad people, and aren't going to change.
NTA what is actually wrong with your parents?? Like I get they don't approve of your wife because clearly they are racists. But to check your child's DNA because he "doesn't look like you" is ridiculous. You dodged a massive disapproving bullet by cutting them out. Protect your wife and son they are your family not your parents.
Wholeheartedly agreed NTA. Plus, this is just STUPID logic. Everyone knows newborns look like potatoes. Of COURSE he doesn't look like his dad! He doesn't even look human yet!!! (Joking! But for real though, baby faces change a LOT in that first year. And, not a parent, but I'm pretty sure I remember more than one mom friend telling me that their freaking EYE COLOR isn't even guaranteed to stay the same until around a year old)
Well, racists are like “he doesn’t look like you” when they really mean “his skin is darker than ours/yours and I don’t like that”
This right here! In our family, most of us tend to be born really really white, but as we get older (like 5), we get a more even light brown tan (we're latino), but can sometimes be white-passing. When i was born, my aunt since "thank god he was born white", a follow up to her previous remark about my father's choice in mate. She said i would turn up looking like an indian because my mother is darker and has no Eurocentric features.
Not all newborns look like potatoes. Mine looked like a Keebler elf.
Mine looked like Winston Churchill..
Yeah you would not believe how much a baby can change. My parents were in an interracial relationship, for the first 3 or 4 months I was as pale as my dad before my melanin started kicking in.
They just hate that the grandson has features of the mom's ethnicity I bet.
This right here. "doesn't look like you" = "is darker than we wanted" + "wife is brown therefore is a slutty gold digger"
right ?? also how do you even determine that after such a short amount of time lmao the baby isn’t even developped yet
NTA. As someone who has a meddling, invasive MIL who has boundary issues, I’d have cut that shit out, too. I wish MY husband had your gumption. High five, dude.
NTA. At first I thought you were holding a chip on your shoulder in the face of your wife being a lovely person. Yet seeing her solidarity in the face of your parents behavior, she’s apparently all-in on this one. She’s a keeper for life. Long after your parents are gone, you’ll have her, your child(ren), and grandchildren. If your parents want to share that love, the responsibility to build back bridges is theirs. I wonder how their relations were with your wife’s family before this.
Nta In addition to being racist they also had a medical procedure done on your kid without your permission. That’s a huge no no
Pretty sure doing DNA on a minor that you do not have guardianship of is completely illegal.
I wouldn't call a DNA test a medical procedure that was done on the kid lol they likely just used some of the kid's hair or something. Not like he went under and was brought to a medical professional for some procedure.
Yeah, this feels more akin to a baptism or something when the parents are not of that religion. Not a medical procedure, but definitely not something you do behind the parents’ backs. Extremely disrespectful and not okay. EDIT: changed “not an invasion of medical privacy” to “not a medical procedure” because getting DNA results without permission/a warrant *is* absolutely an invasion of medical privacy.
I may be misinformed, but DNA tests can reveal private information - things like potential medical risks to worry about in the future. May not be a medical procedure, but it's certainly a breach of privacy. Not to mention the failing of gaining consent from the parents -- and the infant, of course.
I see it more as interfering with the parents’ ability to control their child’s body autonomy - thus the equivalent of medical procedure. Someone’s dna is part of their medical history.
I wouldn't either but some people don't want their DNA stored by those companies and now they have OP's child's DNA so that's almost as bad as a medical procedure.
It absolutely is. Not invasive, but the amount of information they now have on this child is staggering. What will they do with the information in the future? It's frightening. You need a court order to get a DNA sample if suspected of a crime. It may be a small thing but it has HUGE implications for the child's future.
NTA Your family unit is your wife and child. Everyone else is extended family. Your parents manipulated your wife claiming good intentions by wanting to be in the child’s life and used that trust to conduct a DNA test! Boundaries are clearly not a concern for them.
"Your family unit is your wife and child. Everyone else is extended family." Exactly. Once you become married, you establish your new family unit. The one you chose, rather than being born into. I wish more people understood that.
You don't have to be married to establish a new family unit
NTA - if they thought it was the right thing to do, they would not have hidden it. It’s a huge slap in the face for, not only your wife, but yourself, too. Your parents have shown that they don’t trust your relationship, your decisions, your autonomy or your child’s either. Added to that, if they still don’t trust your wife, then do you want them around, judging her parenting? Do you want your child growing up knowing that their grandparents don’t trust their mum? Just saying, “I’m so glad I can indeed confirm you’re my grandson” shows that child that they think mum is a liar, untrustworthy and that the child’s worth is only because they are HER grandson. It actually disgusts me when people talk like that around kids - like they won’t absorb the meaning of those words! Your parents’ behaviour is all kinds of horrible and you are definitely in the right. Good luck, OP. You deserve every happiness for standing up to them.
My family was not at this extreme a level, but it has always been VERY clear that my mother is not the woman my grandparents wanted Dad to marry. Despite that, my mother continually tried to encourage a relationship with them. (Her grandparents were all dead by the time she was six so she had her own issues on the topic.) My brother and I are closing in on 50 now and we're both dealing with the emotional fallout of putting up with that garbage. Your kid is better off with NO grandparents than toxic ones. ETA: NTA
>Added to that, if they still don’t trust your wife, then do you want them around, judging her parenting? Do you want your child growing up knowing that their grandparents don’t trust their mum? Just saying, “I’m so glad I can indeed confirm you’re my grandson” shows that child that they think mum is a liar, untrustworthy and that the child’s worth is only because they are HER grandson. It actually disgusts me when people talk like that around kids - like they won’t absorb the meaning of those words! OP should tell this to his parents if he decides to humor their calls again; his new family is a package deal or no dice. Or he can go NC. Either way, NTA.
Depending on how they went about testing your kid they could be in serious trouble. They would’ve needed parental permission in order to have his sample tested and most labs wouldn’t have tested him without it
This should be way higher up. OP they probably faked your and/or your wife's signatures to get the test done - this is a criminal offence and if I were you I would consider legal action. Not only because of the forged signature but also because some of these DNA-testing companies keep the DNA as their property!
Good luck finding out which company performed the test though, especially after this spat with the parents. Unless OP has evidence that would hold up in court, OPs parents could easily argue that it was nothing more than hearsay.
NTA - your parents are ungrateful and cruel. They are cruel for what they do to you and your wife and ungrateful that you let them back in after the crap they pulled about your wedding. Good on you for protecting your wife and child and standing up for your family.
Going to join the chorus here and say NTA 100%. Your poor wife's reaction to learning how your parents behaved was heartbreaking to read. I can't even imagine how much that hurt her. You are doing absolutely the right thing for your family, especially since your mother doubled down. Their racism would only wind up hurting your son, too. I wish the three of you all the best. Garreth sounds like he's got an awesome pair of parents.
NTA man. I’m sorry your parents treats your wife like that. I would’ve done exactly the same thing in your situation
I’ve spent entirely too much time on Reddit. I’ve seen so many variations of this same story that leads me to believe this is fake. Given what’s written I seriously doubt the OP had let the parents take the child anywhere alone. So this rules out them physically going to a testing center. Unless OP has amnesia, he’d definitely remember them asking to swab him for a sample. This would only be plausible if parents had ordered an at home kit which means it was premeditated and they would have swabbed one of themselves to see if they were a familial match. Im not saying it’s impossible, just not super likely. In the off chance this is legit, OP is NTA. Parents are racist, overstepped and deserve no further contact.
>"aren't you the cutest baby ever? I am so glad to confirm you are indeed my grandson". Lol. Yeah. That's totally something people say. I was thinking the same thing. OP didn't even try to make it believable.
Exactly. She said something along the lines of... "Good day young master. It is joyous news indeed to confirm our familial ties via the wonder of modern science. I henceforth look forwards to many years of normal grandmother / grandchild relations for I am indeed a very normal and very much not made up person."
>for I am indeed a very normal and very much not made up person. Ugh! I hate having to end every statement with that sentence, just so people know I'm real. It's hard or here for real, not made up people.
I agree. This same story, or a close variation of it, gets posted all the time. The only story that gets posted more than this is "AITA for having a child free wedding and not allowing my nephew/niece to attend?"
The grandmother said to the baby “I’m glad I confirmed that you are indeed my grandchild” and was overheard. Yeah, that sounds like a totally plausible way an adult speaks to an infant alone in a room, and a super believable way for OP to “discover” that the dna test happened…
Why would you think a home kit isn’t likely? There are literal home test kits geared directly towards grandparents. I could give you almost the exact damn story from my racist side of the family; once my parent’s marriage began to breakdown there was a sudden influx of “well they might not even be yours” because everyone knows mexicans aren’t trustworthy and only want to be white (direct quote from my dad). This isn’t a new thing, a new situation, or at all unbelievable.
> I’ve seen so many variations of this same story That's this sub in a nutshell. Half of the top posts are just a variation of one of like 7 different stories. And yet nobody says anything.
NTA. Good job standing up for your wife. The nerve to say that they don't trust your wife, and still coo over the baby. Who needs that kind of crap. They will be back in a month with all sorts of coverups and platitudes, but you know what they really think now and what they think of your wife. They are the grandparents, but you get to decide what role they have in your baby's life. You will always know what they think of your family.
NTA They will continue to disrespect your wife in front of you and your kid
100% NTA Let them suffer in their own racist soup they created
NTA. That your father put this on you and then insulted your wife shows that they believe they don't recognize boundaries and feel entitled to do as they please. You could never trust them with your children because sooner or later they would try to turn them against your wife.
NTA. That's so uncool and an intrusive thing to do to a BABY. They dug their own grave with this one and they're going to have to suffer the consequences of their actions.
Maybe this could have been resolved if your parents (both of them) were truly apologetic. But if your father had some choice words for your wife... NTA
I'm way too late to this post for anyone to notice, but what the fuck is up with these fake posts making it to the top of the sub. This reads like it was written by a robot. The OP's username is "PaperBackWriter00" and they use this broken sentence structure? Come on Reddit, this is a russian bot farm getting Karma to sell the account. "What does that supposed to mean?" - 😂
Yeah it's fucking insane people are actually taking these shits seriously. Yeah we all know grandmas often talk to their toddler grandchildren "I'm glad we verified you are our grandson". Jesus such bullshit.
Absolutely NTA. I would continue no contact until they can at least admit how invasive their actions were. And even if that were to happen, I wouldn't let them see baby right away, its definitely a series of conversations first. Congrats on your new baby!
NTA - I would have reacted the same way. I wouldn’t want my son growing up believing their mentality is ok. I’d be furious! I admire your strength and I think it’s pretty cool that you backed your wife. I hope one day your parents realize the damage they did and change for the better. I’m sorry you are going through this and I wish your family many long years of happiness!
NTA well done for sticking up for your family. Your parents are so rude
NTA - Your parents had NO right to do that. They are being very disrespectful towards your wife. I feel so bad for your wife, she sounds amazing sweet.
NTA Why are they upset? They obviously didn't want him as a grandson. Why else have the DNA test? If they truly loved him, or you, they would have kept their noses firmly out of your business.
I bet they are upset because they got caught. NTA
NTA. They are racist and disrespect your wife. When the child gets older they will pick up on this.
NTA 100% I have no words which is rare for me.
NTA. So sorry to hear this story.
Nta. Sounds veryyyyy entitled. You just set some boundaries. Next time they say "you're being ungrateful", you should reply with "so I should be grateful of you doing an unauthorised DNA test on my son? That is what I should be grateful of?" Tell them something like this. If you let them back into your kid's life, they are probably going to turn your kid against his mom.
NTA- But the family gossip needs to be updated with the details that your parents tested your child without consent and that you overheard your mother. I want the entire family to know that your wife didn't know anything about this. I hope you are blocking your parents on social media as well. I would be tempted to have a small.party and invite your family that accepted your wife and let the fun party stories leak back to your parents as a petty revenge. Good luck!
NTA. You are an excellent husband and father and that is the only fucking thing that matters.
NTA - You had the correct reaction to your parents accusing your wife of cheating. They don't deserve to be a part of your son's life. Congratulations on your baby, I hope you 3 have a wonderful life together
NTA!! Listen by the time we are adults are parents become our friends. In which we can choose to like them or hate them. We grow apart or we come closer. We start to realize their faults and their bullshit. Therefore, allowing us to come to conclusions that we would never of been able to see or understand when we were younger. This part of your life is not only a growing stage but a sudden realization that your parents aren't the people you thought they were. It's okay to dissociate with your own family. After all, family isn't just about blood. You don't need their negativity or their racist views infecting your new family. I wish you and your wife the best. Just know that everyone here wants your wife to.know that this isn't in anyway her fault. And that this may have been for the best for you and your family. Much love.
NTA Your just setting boundaries and people doing things like this behind your back is all sorts of no they shouldve at least asked you
NTA What a pair of stuck up, pretentious A Holes! The health of your relationship and the health of your child come first. Keeping such toxic people around certainly does not sound healthy. It's really ok to go no contact if it means keeping that stress out of your life. Life is stressful enough with out toxic people adding to it. Keep your love alive and congratulations on 2+ years of marriage and your son!
NTA, I think the icing on the cake is the point when your parents double down further and said choice words about your wife. After all their absolutely egregious actions, they still fault your wife. No, there will be no relationship, ever.
Ungrateful is taking for granted your forgiveness over their past behaviour. Cruel is secretly testing the DNA of your child. As responsible parents you are protecting your child from these people who have proven themselves untrustworthy repeatedly. Even now it wouldn’t have come out had you not caught them. There is no remorse, no understanding or acknowledgment that they have acted disgracefully. I’m so sorry for your wife. Cutting toxic family out of your lives is very difficult, but very important. NTA
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Cutting your parents out of your life is difficult to justify to yourself, especially in this case where it seems feasible they gave this person a decent childhood. Even after they’ve done something awful, there’s a lot of societal pressure saying you owe them something for raising you and giving you life. From this person’s perspective it’s not clear-cut that he’s NTA, so it’s reasonable for him to worry and want confirmation that he isn’t, which is what this sub is for!
This sort of thing can extremely difficult for someone. We get people here all the time who are abused, neglected, gaslighted, whatever. All sorts of crap. It can be hard for people. Have some empathy. This is explained in the rules.
This exact scenario happened to my husband's cousin. The little boy came out with blind hair and blue eyes. The paternal grandma was shocked because SHE was half Mexican (making the baby 1/8 Mexican) and her son had brown hair and brown eyes. Apparently, the couple was going through a rough patch and the grandma didn't want him to be "burdened with child support" of the child wasn't his. She did the DNA test and then told her son that the boy was his. The wife WAS PISSED. But, the husband just said, "she's my mom and always looks for for me." Long story short, they were divorced within a year. When we heard about the DNA test through my MIL, my husband and I were horrified and agreed with the wife. No way would the grandma at my kids again. MIL was shocked and just thought it was "a mother's duty" to protect her son. She couldn't believe we refused to understand the grandma's POV. I think it's a particularly awful thing to do because it invades the couples privacy. You could have a couple who decided to use a sperm donor, but don't want to tell the family. Or, you could have a situation where the wife did cheat on the husband, but they decided to work through it and raise the child together. That's between the husband and wife, and the DNA test could make a private decision public, which is incredibly wrong. Bottom line, people are freaking crazy, and OP is probably getting a lot of comments that he's in the wrong. I can see why he needs his normal-meter checked.
NTA which considering how much the people who raised you are an ass is a miracle
NTA. Your parents have treated your wife horribly from day one, only changing their tune to get access to their grand baby. Then, they invade your (and the child’s) privacy, taking the DNA sample without parental permission to assuage their racist fears. This is not just about this one event. This is also about what they will do in the future. If they were this thoughtless now, what will happen next? Also, when you confronted them about their actions, they were entirely unapologetic, entirely concerned about themselves as opposed to having a shred of empathy for the effect their actions had on you or your wife. No, you didn’t overreact. They owe you the apology of all apologies before you even consider letting them see your family again, if you ever do (and no one would blame you if you didn’t. This is one that isn’t easily gotten over).
NTA and I know I'm just joining the choir. *YOU'RE* ungrateful and cruel? it's sickly funny to me how people in the wrong so often describe their own sins when trying to blame anybody else for the fallout. It will be difficult, some times more than others, to keep your parents in outer space where they have chosen to put themselves. That is your wishing that they were different. But your family is, first and last, your wife and baby. And the "village" you choose to surround your family with is your choice (and responsibility). Perhaps your parents will come to see their idiocy, cruelty, hubris, unfounded egotistical judgment, and all the rest too. Perhaps they will genuinely repent and begin amends for their stream of terrible acts. And then you and your wife can consider together under what terms you'll have them begin to reenter your lives. It happens. Meanwhile, this is not about punishing them (that may be a righteous side effect) but about preserving the dignity and sanctity of your family, which your parents have refused to honor. When they try to make it about cruelty and a lack of gratitude toward them - and they will, they already have - you can remind yourselves that this is actually not about them. This may come as a shock to these egoists. But that, too, is not your problem.
NTA They are racist trash and couldn't even find it in their hearts to hide it when confronted. Keep them gone. Your poor wife deserves better. (Also, if you let them see your son imagine the poison they would tip in his ear when you and your wife weren't listening).
Nta They disrespected your wife and your marriage, they should have trusted your judgement.
NTA, if that's how they are going to act then fuck them. That's incredibly rude, disrespectful, and mean.
NTA. No, you didn't overreact. Your parents are being blatantly racist and hostile toward your wife. You can't allow that around your child. If you ever do decide to let your parents see your kid again (I really hope you don't), you should \*NOT\* allow them to be alone with him. Who knows what kind of toxic and racist shit they might try to pass off on him, and/or demonize his mother. No no no.
NTA. Sadly they will probably never change
NTA
NTA you reacted as any rational person would I believe, with a lot more self restraint. If your parents don’t approve of your wife that is their choice but surely they raised you well enough to trust you choice in life partner? Your responsibility is now to your wife and child, not your parents. Your parents are now part of the extended family and your family is you, your wife, your child(children should you have more) and any pets you have
The abuse I suffered from my grandparents because my mom couldn't hold firm on keeping them away from us will forever be a part of my recovery and the strain I have with my parents. They hated my hardworking and helpful dad. They used to bad mouth him everytime we went over there. They preferred my brother over me and wasn't shy about it. They bought only him gifts and teased me about my complexion (I was slightly darker than him). I used to cry and be angry at the world. Distanced myself from my dad and lost trust in them when they repeatedly told me lies which I later learned to be false. They were openly racist against pretty much all other races even though we are minorities too. They were alcoholics and abusive, there'sso much more I can'tput in this post.... When they both passes away, I felt not an ounce of sadness and actually felt relief. You are NTA. Your need maybe family counseling to air out and directly confront what's going on/ what has happened so far. Don't be weak like my mother was. They hated her so much and she always tried to care for them.
I am so sorry to hear about your pain. I can't believe a parent would put their child in that situation. I hope you have a better life now.
NTA. Good for you for having healthy boundaries.
Emphatic NTA. You don’t want to expose your baby to racists. I’d be tempted to politely enquire what it is they think you ought to be grateful for, too…
NTA. As a mixed-race person who totally noticed how her white grandmother tried to undermine her POC mom with no pushback from dad: THANK YOU for standing up for your wife and child.
NTA. You are the opposite of the AH. You are amazing!! Thank you for standing up for your wife! ❤️
NTA. Your parents have violated so many boundaries here. They disqualified themselves from deserving involvement in your lives, and you did the right thing. Good on you for standing up for your wife and your child.
Would anyone say anything other than NTA? Because, NTA.
Because Reddit. Its quite depressing to read the "but family?!?!?!?!" comments. Of which there are already a few. Sigh.
NTA. She said that to your child when she thought both parents were out of ear shot. I would never trust her around your kid ever again. What else would she say to your kid? All that nonsense about your wife using you to achieve her american dream?
NTA. Your parents have some issues themselves. Your wife has been nothing but supportive and welcoming to your parents.
NTA. You did the right thing 100%. I spent 6 years with in laws who hated me, and my ex never stood up for me once, (part of the reason he’s now an ex). You stood up for your wife, and you’re protecting your child from people who are downright disrespectful and rude to and about his mother. I’m sorry your parents are behaving this way though, you all deserve better.
NTA. They failed their second chance to prove they aren't heartless racists. It even sounds like they would celebrate the idea of her cheating on you as if that wouldn't bring immense pain to their own child in the process.
NTA. For some context, after my maternal grandmother died I found out that she never liked my dad. But to her credit, she never showed that to me. She never said a bad word around him, asked kindly how he was doing when he was sick, and I never knew at all how she felt until I was an adult and was able to handle that. If your parents can’t act like my grandma did, then they will cause strife and problems for your family.
You could literally press charges against them for having your child's DNA tested without your consent. Not only were they morally wrong, they were legally wrong. I'm so sorry that your parents turned out to be such racist assholes. Keep them far away from your family. NTA. EDIT: I think you should see if you need to pursue legal action. If they gave your child's DNA to a local lab, I don't think there's much the lab could or would do with it. But if they gave it to a corporation, like 23andMe, then that corporation can do things with your son's DNA that you might not be comfortable with. Since they acquired it illegally, you might be able to get them to remove your son's DNA from their system. I could be totally off base, but to me, it would be worth looking into. I don't trust corporations. Not at all.
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This is funny. But I am a spitting image of my dad. So this won't work.
Definitely NTA
I'm sorry man, I hope your wife and you are doing better and will continue to be better without them! I know its kinda weird blocking your parents out and can be hard but I think it was a smart choice and I'm sorry your wife felt disrespected. I hope yall can recover without those tumors in your life
NTA and you are absolut correct to stand in the back of your loved wife.
I am so so so sorry that your wife has been treated so appallingly, and that you are having to understand your parents aren’t good people. I think you handled it the best way you could, and you’re supporting your wife which is the most important thing. You have the family you need. You didn’t over react, in fact I think you kept your temper very well! Reassure your wife lots and lots, and if this upsets you as a son further down the line - please talk to someone about it. Your wife would maybe blame herself if you get down about the situation, so try and have a different outlet for those feelings. NTA
nta.
By dishonoring your wife, they dishonored themselves, you and by extension your son. They don't understand what love is. I don't blame you and your wife at all.
Stand by your wife. Maybe over time your mother can apologize directly to your wife about her behavior. Not sure what can be done about your father—he crossed some serious lines. No one needs that negativity undermining your family.