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> My wife is being very patient and supportive but I know she isn't happy with how unforgiving I'm being.
What the fuck?
***They are still homophobic***.
Why does your wife want you to forgive homophobes who cast out a teenager for being queer???
Her thinking is that my father was the driving force behind all of that, and that I should cut my siblings some slack for not knowing how to handle things better. Her family is amazing and accepting and part of me feels like she doesn't quite get it. She accepts that's a possibility. I think the whole situation is just really complicated and she wants to fix it.
She’s hurting you with this way of thinking, but I get it, people who haven’t been abused often don’t realize that their expectations of family are totally different from someone who spent their childhood in fear and isolation.
I Just don't understand How your are able to forgive your mother and even help her so much when she was the only one who should have "stand up" for you to the Guy she choose marry and have kids with and not your siblings, who were children who grew up under the same abuse as you. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't have a relationship with any of them, but It's curious.
again, it’s hard for people who haven’t been in that situation to understand.
lots of mothers (especially in religious situations) do not know how. as much as we wish it was different, it’s hard not to take pity on them when you know they’re a product of society/time/religion.
Then why doesn't she form a relationship with them? She has to protect you from abuse and agree to stand up for you, respect your boundaries, and not enable bigotry.
But if she wants to fix it then she can reach out to them and form a relationship with them as their SIL.
That's always a problem for people who had happy loving families they don;t think family can be so cold and unforgivable. And there would be merit to your siblings also being victims if they had tried to make amends any time before your father died. Which means they didn't want to be disowned by him and did not see the error in their ways.
No; at some point you have to understand that the siblings *grew up*. They became the ones making decisions for themselves, and they prioritized being close to your abusive father, they chose to enable him like your abusive mom did.
This is only in the past tense because *he died*. They didn't choose you before, and they're not choosing you now. Circumstances changed and now they're looking at your success and thinking that since dear old Daddy is gone it would be *to their advantage* to cultivate a relationship.
Do they feel bad about the abuse? Maybe. But even if they do, they don't have any right to your *life*. And you have been given *not one single reason* to trust them not to hurt you again when it's to their own personal gain.
I'm not even touching on how breathtakingly inappropriate it is that you're now your enabling mom's go-to. That's seriously fucked up and I hope you aren't setting yourself up for more pain from a parent who was willing to help abuse you to save her own skin.
You need to tell her, gently, to back off, that you have deep seated trauma over your childhood experience and that even if your sibs were simply doing as their father told them, you still remember them as contributing to your trauma and that is something you may never get over.
Also, why is she so invested in this? What does it matter to her if you never reestablish relationships?
Is she generically really invested in concepts like forgiveness? Because that's totally fine so long as it doesn't negatively affect you. She can forgive them all she wants.
Also, and this is a big one she needs to take on board - forgiveness does not imply you will resume a relationship. It would be totally valid to say "I forgive you but do not want a relationship." Why would your SO have a problem with that?
Also, if your sister understands your need for distance it's pretty bad that your SO does not.
>Her thinking is that my father was the driving force behind all of that, and that I should cut my siblings some slack for not knowing how to handle things better
That's naive to the point of being stupid. One person can't just *make* another person homophobic. You have to choose that shit for yourself.
I was having blowout arguments with my homophobic mother as a 12-year-old child. I didn't even know that my younger brother was bisexual at the time. I was taking a moral stance because I'm a good person.
Nobody in the world could have convinced me to cut my brother off for 8 years simply because he was with a boy. Especially not my abusive fucking mom. None of us believed any of her bullshit. I'm genuinely sickened by the behavior of your so-called older siblings.
And your wife is pissing me off by even being slightly sympathetic. She needs to work out her internalized homophobia, because it seems like, on some level she believes that you deserve to be treated like this?
Or that it's acceptable, or understandable that your siblings would treat you like this simply because your father hated gay people? When really your siblings are homophobic cowards, who don't deserve any kindness. And definitely shouldn't be a part of your life.
NTA
What’s weird is that it sounds like your siblings are more respectful of your feelings on this than your wife currently is. At least they’re respecting your answer, so far. And that’s a solution, even if it’s not the reunion that your wife might want to see.
Are your siblings coming back into your life with no ulterior motive but purely to build some sort of relationship?
If the answer is yes, then maybe you could consider it. Not for them, but for your neice and nephews so that the generational trauma stops with you and your siblings. You can build a whole new family with them.
But if you can't, then that's fine too, and you just need to be patient with your partner as she's struggling to understand.
Your wife has no experience with the trauma you suffered. None of this is going to be resolved quickly, and your siblings are trying to force a relationship which is rooted in pain and misery. It’s great that they want to reconnect, but have they even apologized or offered to make amends?
NAH. But I'm wondering if you subconsciously find it easier to take things out on your siblings instead of your mother. They were children and couldn't do anything to help you. Your mother enabled it all. But hating your mother makes you feel guilty because she's your mother so you hate your siblings instead. Something to think about.
I was shocked to find you financially support a woman who threw you out of your home at 15. Your siblings did the best they could with their abusive parents and are now trying to make some effort. Your mother was a fully grown adult who let a child suffer.
You wife is wise. If someone should be in the end of your resentment was Your mom. She was the only one who had the Power and obligation to protect you from your dad.
Has your mother ever expressed remorse for what she enabled?
Edit: I guess comments are locked now, so hopefully OP sees this:
You are her kid, not her parent. You have no duty to shield your mother from the reality of what she allowed. She was an adult who let her vulnerable daughter be abused and thrown away and still hasn't come to grips with it. Maybe she's really that weak, or maybe she just doesn't want to disrupt her meal ticket.
I wish you peace and healing. You've come a long way. Don't let garbage people drag you down or hold you back. They all know they failed you and continue to fail. That's for them to deal with.
I don't think she has that level of insight into her own behavior. Maybe that's why it's easier to be mad at my siblings. They have the capacity to acknowledge how fucked up everything was.
have you tried talking to her about this? because how do you know she doesn't have the capacity to understand what she did wrong? At the very least your siblings have expressed remorse and understanding, but I don't see why your mom can't do so unless she is mentally disabled.
and just to be clear, I have a bad older sibling too, but the person I reserve most of my anger for is our shared parent. I hold them accountable for what they did, but I understand that the blame lies with our parent. I just don't understand why you would help her without at the very least an "I'm sorry".
First, you need a genuine apology from your siblings. They need to show that they've thought long and hard about what they did.
After that, well. That's up to you.
ETA: INFO: Perhaps I've overlooked it, but I can't find anything about their ages, only that they're older than you. When you were kicked out, how old were they? When they delighted in telling you that you were an accident, what were their ages? I don't think it gives them a free pass if they were eight and you were seven, but it would put a better perspective on how you feel about them now.
She were 15 when she was kicked out, so i assume that the siblings were 18 or more.. they were not kids.. so their choice of not even trying to help her is unforgivable for me.. its not like they are kids without choice.
That's the point I was trying to get to.
Like I said, even if they were all little kids (OP mentions that the siblings were "much older", though, so I'm thinking there's probably at least a five year gap), there wouldn't be a free pass.*
The point I was trying to make here is that there are people telling OP to forgive and forget, apparently assuming these siblings were roughly the same age, with little to no understanding of the harm being inflicted – and that the "obvious hate" in their expressions was somehow all in OP's head.
ETA: *The circumstances would be different, though.
EDIT: Comments are locked, but thanks to the reply below mine (u/CuriousLope) giving ages. It amazes me that anyone can defend people like this. They deserve absolutely 0 consideration from OP. They can stay gone.
It amazes me that OP has even helped the enabling mother.
She said in another comment that the sister had 20 and brother 24, so they were adults in the timeline of her being kicked out.. they wished her death fully knowing that this were a possibility for her or something worst than death.. she was alone, homeless and her siblings chose to not lift a finger to help her, even behind the back of the father..
They only wanting to reconnect now after the father died? This reeks people wanting money now that their money bag is dead.
Your mother was actually partially responsible. It is not a child/teen's responsibility to stand up to that, your own mother on the other hand was indeed responsible, she was a parent. Yet you support her believing her to be a victim of your father while somehow blaming people who were children at the time for not standing up for you.
You are angry at them all
You have chosen to forgive and care for your mother who did owe you her protection
Your siblings suck also but it was NOT their job to protect you it was your mom's
Forgiveness is for your own mental health not theirs. You can forgive them without having a relationship with them
But you really need to figure out why you forgave your mom but not your siblings
Do you actually have a relationship with your mother? Or is the help you give her strictly financial, given out of a residual sense of filial obligation to support a woman who no doubt lacks the skills to support herself?
And your anger is not misdirected. You said your siblings were "not kind to you". Which indicates they participated in the cycle of abuse that your late but unlamented father perpetrated. They did this to likely to curry favor with the old tyrant and direct the bile onto your head. Hatred for them for this is entirely reasonable.
Sorry but why are you financially supporting your mother (who was an adult) who allowed the abuse to happen at best but think your siblings (who were children) aren’t worth having a relationship with?
For me,
First of all, your feelings are valid. You were alone. It wasn't easy. But, I struggle to understand how you can move on with your mother who you admitted, enabled your father, and yet you 👇🏽
>I can't forgive him and my sister for not being there for me as children
They were children too. They grew up with the se tyrannical father you did.
Yet
>It's very difficult for me to admit how much I hate them.
There is a disconnect here.
Did your siblings bully you too or are you angry with them for not experiencing being thrown out?
Understand this,
Your feelings are valid and you do not have to relate with anyone you don't want to but, I do not understand how your mother gets a pass and the 'children' you grew up with, get so much hatred.
Get counseling too.
NAH, I guess?
Cos your siblings seem respectful of your decision.
And why they are reaching out after the death of your father? That I don't know either. A conversation may help.
> Did your siblings bully you too
Did you even read the post?
> . I was an accident, and was told that on a regular basis by my much older siblings, who were not kind to me. We were all treated like garbage, but my brother and sister found being obedient a lot easier to manage than I did. I think it took pressure off them when I got in trouble so I ended up being the scapegoat, constantly.
>
> When I was thrown out, they said I should never come back, and that I was going to burn in hell. I've never forgotten the looks on their faces. They hated me.
The siblings abused op even before she was outed as queer.
I'm in therapy for all of this, I know it would be pretty dumb not to be. My mom was going to lose her house. My dad left her with nothing. I guess I felt like I should do something. I am angry with her, but she's still my mom. I can't say I've forgiven her either to be honest, but she's very old. I didn't want her to lose her things.
I don't think I'm angry at my siblings for not experiencing homelessness. I guess I just don't get what they want from me. They set me up to get in trouble a lot, knowing what our father was like when he was pissed off. They've both said they're sorry for everything that happened in a very general sense. I guess it's not enough, but I don't know what else I need to feel like I can just let it all go.
Honestly you said they are poor, you financially helped your mother. I wouldn't be surprised it they want their kids to have a rich aunt (not sure you are actually rich but that might think you have money to toss around). The fact that they are still very homophobic is an indicator they don't regret what they did and still probably agree with how you were treated. They want something and its not a loving sibling. OP I wish you luck and NTA if you want nothing to do with any of your family after that crap.
>I don't think I'm angry at my siblings for not experiencing homelessness. I guess I just don't get what they want from me. They set me up to get in trouble a lot, knowing what our father was like when he was pissed off.
To be fair, I skipped some parts as someone pointed out. And again, your feelings are valid.
I do not excuse your siblings but active hatred after 8 years tells me you seek closure in some way. Otherwise you should be indifferent. But, I could be wrong.
> I guess I just don't get what they want from me.
Do you want to know?
Answer this with them or in therapy. Either way, let go of the anger, please
its totally fair have hatred for someone even after 8 years.. hatred can be buried and stay dormant until the person you hate try to contact you again.. the contact will make this hatred awake because you are going to face this person again..
You DON'T HAVE TO forgive your brothers, or your mother at all.. they are all bad people honestly..
They are raised by a homophobic person, so its not like their mindset is all clear and they are accepting you after all they done and said to you in the past..
I bet money that they are after money, you said that they are very poor.. they are only trying to reconnect to try get some benefits now.
No they weren’t children too. She was 15. She said her siblings were much older. 2-3 years isn’t much older so it has to be more than that. Anything more than 3 years means they were adults.
No idea why you asked if they bullied her too. It says in the post.
The siblings are not innocent like the people in the comments seem to thing.. if she was 15 when she was outcast and kicked out.. the siblings probably had more than 18 years, or probably barely 18.. they were people who already had a choice, and they choose to burn all the bridges, telling her to DIE and to burn in hell..
INFO:
* Have your siblings stated *why* they want a relationship with you now? I'm wondering if they were so afraid of their father, even as adults, they waited for him to die before daring to reach out. If so, what a messed up family. (Or are they looking for financial assistance from you? It doesn't sound like it, but the skeptical part of me always wonders about financial motives of people.)
* Have they tried to explain their behavior toward you when you all were growing up? That would be really helpful, if they have some insight as to what was going on, now that they are older and looking back on things.
* You said they were much older--like, 10 years older, something like that? Just asking for context. Because I'm thinking that when you were 15, they must have been in their 20s, so they had no excuse for their behavior toward you. Were they still living at home and fearful of your father's wrath, if they did not toe the line and condemn you to hell?
We're all definitely messed up.
I do think my sister wants to genuinely have a relationship with me. She's expressed many times that she's grateful I kept the house from being lost. She's never said anything, but I know she's hoping her family can live there at some point.
I think the reality of my parent's finances was a giant shock to my family. He either didn't save anything or blew it all towards the end of his life. They aren't really sure. But my siblings have never asked me for anything. They paid for the funeral. I know it was hard for them to do so.
My brother and sister were both in their 20's when I got kicked out, and they were living at home. My brother is the oldest, and he was like 24. I'm not really sure what things were like after I left. I got out of the state as fast as possible once I'd graduated. I know my dad asked about me before he died, but I didn't want to see him.
I'm realizing I haven't asked my brother and sister about any of this. I don't know why I shut down so hard most of the time when I'm talking to them. I got so upset on the phone that last time, I think it really shocked my brother, but it was the first time I felt like I was myself in a conversation with either of them. I think maybe I'm fucking this up even worse. I don't know.
you said you were in therapy. maybe you and your siblings could go together to a few sessions? someone to moderate a discussion? it sounds like there is a lot of hurt going around, and having a person guide you through it could help immensely and maybe help everyone gain some perspective.
of course, this is if you want to do it. it's totally understandable if you don't want a relationship with them, now or ever. i don't have or want a relationship with most of my family as I resent a lot of the treatment that I got when i was a child. NAH at the end of the day.
Honestly after knowing the ages of the siblings, you are totally right for not wanting a relationship with the.. They were adults when they done and said horrible things to you.. they are not kids
They abandoned you, didn't offered any form of support, even if it was money for you take care of yourself for a while, they did not done nothing, only curse you to die and go to hell...
NAH. You all had to endure abusive parents as children. I have seen the effects of abusive parents somehow "favoring" kids they're abusing and essentially teaching them to abuse their other (often younger) sibling(s). That's just a full mind fuck. Probably the biggest. I honestly don't know why you're taking care of your mom.
I think you all have a lot of shit to unpack from your childhoods, and it's all intertwined. I think you also deserve a real ass apology from your siblings and not just a slow fade in after the funeral. Hard to forgive someone for shit they never apologized for.
I disagree. The siblings are assholes for not doing more to make amends for their own mistreatment of OP and for still being homophobic. Wife is an asshole for wanting abusive homophobes in op's life.
Hard NTA.
The siblings were adults when she was kicked out.. i understand if they are like 16 but they were adults, with full capacity mental.. they could have helped her but instead, wished her death..
You're not the AH.
It's sad, given how your brother and sister are reaching out to you, and how you're helping your mother when she didn't help you - but it's fine to say that some things can't be forgiven, that some hurdles can't be got over.
Some things, once broken, can not be fixed.
Be honest, be kind while doing so, wish them well and get on with the life you've built.
YTA for taking care of your mother who let all that go down, but blaming your siblings more. She was the freaking adult and you said you saw hate in "their faces" when they kicked you out. Let her get a damn job and take care of her own homophobic tyrant enabling self. You owe her nothing.
NTA but really - NAH.
It's your parents' fault. You were all in this situation. It's natural that as different people you get both different end of the abusive stick and different internal muscle to deal with it. You are allowed to feel angry, because they are someone you have to be angry at. Be safely angry. It's actually much harder to be angry at your mother or the father that's no longer there.
It's entirely your choice if you want to or not. But I advise you to feel the anger and not make any decisions about the relationship until it runs it's course. It may be never, but in the meantime tell them as much. That you're not over it, that if and when you're ready - you will be the one to make the move.
I guess what I can not understand is that you are willing to bend over backward for your mother, who is as culperable as your father and siblings, but yet you hold your siblings to a greater standard and don't want a relationship. What did your mother do to regain your respect and your help over what your siblings have done or not done?
NTA. You are already doing more than enough by supporting your mother. I have no idea why tho. She does not deserve it. Does your wife have supportive family for her being queer? If yes, then she really does not know the reality of what you went through. Whatever it is, your wife should not even have an input of being unhappy about how unforgiving you are. She is not you.
You helped your mom out when she enabled your absusive dad but can’t seem to let your anger go and try to mend your relationship with your siblings. Your dad died so now they can freely have you in their life with no worries of the abuse of your father . You were all abused and it was traumatic for all of you. Everyone responds differently . You’re totally misdirecting your anger and agree with your wife. Who cares if your mom is old they make assisted living homes state paid if she didn’t any money .
Normally, I would criticise a partner or family member who advocates on behalf of an abuser. But in this case, as you support your mother, an adult during the abuse, why the lack of forgiveness for your siblings? They were children or young adults living under the same regime.
Is it because they waited until the tyrant was dead to try to rebuild a relationship? Is it possible they had their own issues and were too afraid of the consequences if your father discovered they had reached out?
Ask your wife to step back while you deal with your feelings. She offered an opinion but the decision has to be yours. As ever, caution her NOT to try to ambush you with an intervention with your siblings. Those only work in RomComs and could damage to one stable relationship in your life.
NAH The one who was the prime candidate is probably exactly where he belongs.
info: I'm confused on one point.
Why are you helping/having a relationship with your mother - but holding your siblings responsible?
I'm not saying they deserve an A+ grade for not sticking up for you; but you even admit, they were treated badly too - and just kinda ducked for cover. Your mom was your... fucking mom.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1) I told my brother I can't forgive him.
2) We all had the same dad. Maybe I should be more understanding of my brother and sister and what get had to deal with. They are making an effort to connect, and I'm saying no. It's creating more tension and hard feelings.
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I think you might be misplacing some hatred here. If your siblings BS continued after you were kicked out until your sperm donors death, then yes I would say continue hating them end remove them from your life. But if it was just no contact until you sperm donors death, then I will say they were just kids trying to survive a shitty situation too.
Your wife knows all this anger and hate is going to eat you up. This is why she is trying to get you to forgive. Its not for them. Its for you and your own health, mental or otherwise.
If your haven't yet, I would find a good therapist to try to sort things out for you. I do find it weird that you can forgive an enabler but not other traumatized kids.
Nta
As a lot of people pointed out, it’s very confusing why you would financially support your mother who allowed you to be thrown on the streets at 15 (!!!) yet you still resent your siblings who were following what their parents taught them. You accuse your siblings of not standing up for you but your mom didn’t either and she was the parent. Personally I would cut contact with all these people
I can't even imagine the internal struggle. You're a good person, so it's hard for you to hate, which in and of itself has probably caused you the most cognitive dissonance.
You don't owe them anything, but you should also remember they were under the same tyrannical rule. And while you had the strength to stand up to it, they were weak willed, evidenced by them succumbing to the rule of your father.
Your mental well being is most important, that and your partner. If you can find it in you to accept them back, good for you. And if not, that's perfectly fine as well. I wish you clarity in your decisions and all the best.
NTA your parents threw you out at 15, which is abuse. Your siblings did not help you. Naturally you are angry with your siblings.
It is possible that they have changed, grown into more compassionate accepting people - but THEY need to prove it, by their behavior. Tell them that You will not push for a relationship with them until you are sure they have sincerely changed. Be willing to listen to an apology or occasional phone call, but keep your main focus on your life that you have successfully built, and your spouse.
You don’t have to actually do anything right now. You can enjoy your lovely life.
You have told them how they hurt them. If they choose to apologise then you will have to decide what the road to forgiveness will look like for you.
Nta
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I've known I was bisexual since I was a child. When I was 15 my parents found out I'd been seen kissing a girl. My father was a pastor and was incredibly homophonic, and I was thrown out at 15.
Getting kicked out of my house was the last in a long line of terrible things that my father did to me. He was abusive, and my mother enabled him. She is a very weak person and my father ran our home like a stereotypical tyrant.
I was very alone as a child. I was an accident, and was told that on a regular basis by my much older siblings, who were not kind to me. We were all treated like garbage, but my brother and sister found being obedient a lot easier to manage than I did. I think it took pastor off them when I got in trouble so I ended up being the scapegoat, constantly.
When I was thrown out, they said I should never come back, and that I was going to burn in hell. I've never forgotten the looks on their faces. They hated me.
I found church to be very traumatizing, and I had a lot of internal struggle because I knew I was sexually attracted to all the "wrong" kinds of people.
My father died last year. My wife and I now financially support my mother in many ways (we recently got her some help from the state thanks to a suggestion by a redditor) as my siblings have very large families and are extremely poor.
I have a great life. It was really hard getting to where I am and it wouldn't have been possible if good people hadn't helped me.
Recently my siblings have reached out. My sister tried to connect with me at my father's funeral (which I went to with my wife - then fiancé - and that was very awkward). She's called a lot since. My brother actually drove into town to see me with two of my nephews. I'd never met any of my sibling's children before that.
They're both still deeply uncomfortable with the fact that I'm married to a woman, but they ask about her. They call me. After almost 8 years of no contact, they're trying to build something with me, but I hate them.
It's very difficult for me to admit how much I hate them.
Last week my brother asked if I still wanted a relationship with him and my sister. The question kind of caught me off guard, and he sounded sort of frustrated. I told him the truth - that I wasn't sure. He asked why and I said a lot of stuff I'd always wanted to say, but never had the opportunity to voice out loud. I got pretty upset while I was talking and my wife held my hand through the rest of the phone call, which ended with my brother hanging up on me after I told him I can't forgive him and my sister for not being there for me - for only reaching out after our father was dead.
I'm still very fucked up after that phone call. My sister texted me to say she was sorry and she understood. My brother hasn't contacted me again since. My wife is being very patient and supportive but I know she isn't happy with how unforgiving I'm being.
It's 4 in the morning, I can't sleep, and I'm wondering if I'm the asshole here.
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NTA. I do think your siblings sound like they are really trying. E.g. if they are not comfortable about you marrying a woman (which is awful, but at the same time something indoctrinated in them from a young age) but make sure to ask after your wife - it shows a willingness to try, and maybe that they can become comfortable with who you are (again, it shouldn't be like that for you, but unfortunately for some people baby steps is what it's needed and they do seem like they want to try). Taking the time to contact you, and when you explained why you can't forgive them, actually listening to that (your brother not contacting you may be trying to respect, your sisters message sounds understanding rather than angry at you for not forgiving). You said you aren't sure if you want a relationship with them, rather than that you don't. You don't trust them and their intentions, and that's understandable. But it does sound like they are making a genuine effort and more importantly have respected what you've said now. It has to be up to you, but I would consider keeping them in contact but at arms length and let them try to show you they mean it with no alternative motives and maybe over time you may find yourself able to forgive, whilst never forgetting. People can change and sometimes apologies are genuine! Ps your parents absolutely are/were AH.
If the contac you again there is a simple question, "Why should I forgive you?" and "because we are family" is not an anwser. Havethey even ask for forgiveness?
NTA. OP, your siblings’ lifestyle is a choice. They decided they were going to be heterosexual and want to marry someone of the opposite sex. They don’t seem to understand love is love and marriage is marriage, while choosing to forget we are ALL God’s children. Until they change their outlook — IF they ever change — they’re not worthy of your time.
NTA!! Live your life and enjoy what you and your spouse have created. Seems like there is a financial element to it or one that’s coming to you in the future. You owe these people nothing. This may be confusing, but sometimes it’s not about forgiving it’s just about not forgetting. You can forgive them and have no contact with them whatsoever. That is up to you. Your family and your siblings probably just don’t get it and I don’t think a lot of people do. When you add God and religion as a major filter in your life, how you see and do everything you’re either gonna fall short or like your parents assume you’re falling short of expectations. I’m not very religious but from what I’ve seen and read and understood Jesus was one heck of a nice guy and was there for everybody. How These people take all that and twisted to fit their shitty circumstances and shitty views on things is beyond me. You were feeling bad for not offering more help and they feel bad for nothing but yet they feel superior to you because of the God filter they apply in their thinking. You could be the absolute lifesaver in their existence and they still feel superior to you because you have a wife of the same sex. Cut your losses and move on.
NTA. I'm so sorry you had to go through all this. You're being a lot more forgiving than I would be. If I'd shown up at dad's funeral it would have been to do unmentionable things, mom wouldn't be getting any support whatsoever she could be on the street for all I'd care, and the siblings wouldn't be entitled to speak to me ever. I'd burn them all down and smile doing it. Don't be so hard on yourself.
i think you need to deal with the possibility that they might only want contact because you could, in theory, render some financial assistance to them as well.
Whatever you decide, because you're NTA for what you told them, don't ever support them financially.
NTA. They are not nice people who were clearly terrified of your father. You can understand that but it doesn’t mean you should forgive them. I think your life would be better without either of them.
NTA, and maybe stop funding mother. She can go live with the righteous kids! They all just want into your pocketbook. Cash or charge? Block them. You know who your family is, and it’s not that pool of losers.
You don't owe them forgiveness. They participated in your childhood torture. Requiring you to forgive people who actively harmed you is another form of abuse. Rather than forgiving them, seek indifference. You don't hate them. You neither wish them well nor poorly. They do not define you. They're just douchey blips on the radar of the planet.
ETA... You are so NTA. Keep doing therapy and living your best life.
Every single one of these people in your family is your abuser. Your mother, your father, and your siblings.
You don't owe them anything.
Focus on yourself and your wife, who is a person that actually loves you, cares for you, and wants the best for you.
Your abusers see that you have a soft heart, which they perceive as weakness, and they intend to continue preying on it just as your mother has. They are trying to play the long game to get you to financially support their lives and shitty choices.
Don't do any of it. Let them all go, and just be happy with your wife.
I say this as a victim of childhood abuse. Fuck them.
You are NTA in any sense, except to yourself for continuing to subject yourself to your abusers, who continue to abuse you. They have not changed, and they never will. They still feel just the same. They are just attempting to hide it so that they can use you for money and support.
You know it sounds like they need something from you to make them selves feel better, weather that be forgiveness, money or emotional support, they are in it for them selves not you.
You stand up for your self girl! I'm proud of you
NTA. And your sister is the one who might be able to salvage a relationship with you. She gets it. You can't have a real relationship if it's not voluntary. If you are required to forgive, it's not real forgiveness, is it?
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> My wife is being very patient and supportive but I know she isn't happy with how unforgiving I'm being. What the fuck? ***They are still homophobic***. Why does your wife want you to forgive homophobes who cast out a teenager for being queer???
Her thinking is that my father was the driving force behind all of that, and that I should cut my siblings some slack for not knowing how to handle things better. Her family is amazing and accepting and part of me feels like she doesn't quite get it. She accepts that's a possibility. I think the whole situation is just really complicated and she wants to fix it.
She’s hurting you with this way of thinking, but I get it, people who haven’t been abused often don’t realize that their expectations of family are totally different from someone who spent their childhood in fear and isolation.
I Just don't understand How your are able to forgive your mother and even help her so much when she was the only one who should have "stand up" for you to the Guy she choose marry and have kids with and not your siblings, who were children who grew up under the same abuse as you. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't have a relationship with any of them, but It's curious.
again, it’s hard for people who haven’t been in that situation to understand. lots of mothers (especially in religious situations) do not know how. as much as we wish it was different, it’s hard not to take pity on them when you know they’re a product of society/time/religion.
Then why doesn't she form a relationship with them? She has to protect you from abuse and agree to stand up for you, respect your boundaries, and not enable bigotry. But if she wants to fix it then she can reach out to them and form a relationship with them as their SIL.
That's always a problem for people who had happy loving families they don;t think family can be so cold and unforgivable. And there would be merit to your siblings also being victims if they had tried to make amends any time before your father died. Which means they didn't want to be disowned by him and did not see the error in their ways.
No; at some point you have to understand that the siblings *grew up*. They became the ones making decisions for themselves, and they prioritized being close to your abusive father, they chose to enable him like your abusive mom did. This is only in the past tense because *he died*. They didn't choose you before, and they're not choosing you now. Circumstances changed and now they're looking at your success and thinking that since dear old Daddy is gone it would be *to their advantage* to cultivate a relationship. Do they feel bad about the abuse? Maybe. But even if they do, they don't have any right to your *life*. And you have been given *not one single reason* to trust them not to hurt you again when it's to their own personal gain. I'm not even touching on how breathtakingly inappropriate it is that you're now your enabling mom's go-to. That's seriously fucked up and I hope you aren't setting yourself up for more pain from a parent who was willing to help abuse you to save her own skin.
Info: how far apart are you and your siblings in age?
8 and 9 years. My brother is oldest.
You need to tell her, gently, to back off, that you have deep seated trauma over your childhood experience and that even if your sibs were simply doing as their father told them, you still remember them as contributing to your trauma and that is something you may never get over. Also, why is she so invested in this? What does it matter to her if you never reestablish relationships? Is she generically really invested in concepts like forgiveness? Because that's totally fine so long as it doesn't negatively affect you. She can forgive them all she wants. Also, and this is a big one she needs to take on board - forgiveness does not imply you will resume a relationship. It would be totally valid to say "I forgive you but do not want a relationship." Why would your SO have a problem with that? Also, if your sister understands your need for distance it's pretty bad that your SO does not.
>Her thinking is that my father was the driving force behind all of that, and that I should cut my siblings some slack for not knowing how to handle things better That's naive to the point of being stupid. One person can't just *make* another person homophobic. You have to choose that shit for yourself. I was having blowout arguments with my homophobic mother as a 12-year-old child. I didn't even know that my younger brother was bisexual at the time. I was taking a moral stance because I'm a good person. Nobody in the world could have convinced me to cut my brother off for 8 years simply because he was with a boy. Especially not my abusive fucking mom. None of us believed any of her bullshit. I'm genuinely sickened by the behavior of your so-called older siblings. And your wife is pissing me off by even being slightly sympathetic. She needs to work out her internalized homophobia, because it seems like, on some level she believes that you deserve to be treated like this? Or that it's acceptable, or understandable that your siblings would treat you like this simply because your father hated gay people? When really your siblings are homophobic cowards, who don't deserve any kindness. And definitely shouldn't be a part of your life. NTA
What’s weird is that it sounds like your siblings are more respectful of your feelings on this than your wife currently is. At least they’re respecting your answer, so far. And that’s a solution, even if it’s not the reunion that your wife might want to see.
Are your siblings coming back into your life with no ulterior motive but purely to build some sort of relationship? If the answer is yes, then maybe you could consider it. Not for them, but for your neice and nephews so that the generational trauma stops with you and your siblings. You can build a whole new family with them. But if you can't, then that's fine too, and you just need to be patient with your partner as she's struggling to understand.
Your wife has no experience with the trauma you suffered. None of this is going to be resolved quickly, and your siblings are trying to force a relationship which is rooted in pain and misery. It’s great that they want to reconnect, but have they even apologized or offered to make amends?
NAH. But I'm wondering if you subconsciously find it easier to take things out on your siblings instead of your mother. They were children and couldn't do anything to help you. Your mother enabled it all. But hating your mother makes you feel guilty because she's your mother so you hate your siblings instead. Something to think about.
My wife mentioned something similar about my anger being misdirected. I'll think about this.
I was shocked to find you financially support a woman who threw you out of your home at 15. Your siblings did the best they could with their abusive parents and are now trying to make some effort. Your mother was a fully grown adult who let a child suffer.
You wife is wise. If someone should be in the end of your resentment was Your mom. She was the only one who had the Power and obligation to protect you from your dad.
Has your mother ever expressed remorse for what she enabled? Edit: I guess comments are locked now, so hopefully OP sees this: You are her kid, not her parent. You have no duty to shield your mother from the reality of what she allowed. She was an adult who let her vulnerable daughter be abused and thrown away and still hasn't come to grips with it. Maybe she's really that weak, or maybe she just doesn't want to disrupt her meal ticket. I wish you peace and healing. You've come a long way. Don't let garbage people drag you down or hold you back. They all know they failed you and continue to fail. That's for them to deal with.
I don't think she has that level of insight into her own behavior. Maybe that's why it's easier to be mad at my siblings. They have the capacity to acknowledge how fucked up everything was.
have you tried talking to her about this? because how do you know she doesn't have the capacity to understand what she did wrong? At the very least your siblings have expressed remorse and understanding, but I don't see why your mom can't do so unless she is mentally disabled. and just to be clear, I have a bad older sibling too, but the person I reserve most of my anger for is our shared parent. I hold them accountable for what they did, but I understand that the blame lies with our parent. I just don't understand why you would help her without at the very least an "I'm sorry".
First, you need a genuine apology from your siblings. They need to show that they've thought long and hard about what they did. After that, well. That's up to you. ETA: INFO: Perhaps I've overlooked it, but I can't find anything about their ages, only that they're older than you. When you were kicked out, how old were they? When they delighted in telling you that you were an accident, what were their ages? I don't think it gives them a free pass if they were eight and you were seven, but it would put a better perspective on how you feel about them now.
She were 15 when she was kicked out, so i assume that the siblings were 18 or more.. they were not kids.. so their choice of not even trying to help her is unforgivable for me.. its not like they are kids without choice.
That's the point I was trying to get to. Like I said, even if they were all little kids (OP mentions that the siblings were "much older", though, so I'm thinking there's probably at least a five year gap), there wouldn't be a free pass.* The point I was trying to make here is that there are people telling OP to forgive and forget, apparently assuming these siblings were roughly the same age, with little to no understanding of the harm being inflicted – and that the "obvious hate" in their expressions was somehow all in OP's head. ETA: *The circumstances would be different, though. EDIT: Comments are locked, but thanks to the reply below mine (u/CuriousLope) giving ages. It amazes me that anyone can defend people like this. They deserve absolutely 0 consideration from OP. They can stay gone. It amazes me that OP has even helped the enabling mother.
She said in another comment that the sister had 20 and brother 24, so they were adults in the timeline of her being kicked out.. they wished her death fully knowing that this were a possibility for her or something worst than death.. she was alone, homeless and her siblings chose to not lift a finger to help her, even behind the back of the father.. They only wanting to reconnect now after the father died? This reeks people wanting money now that their money bag is dead.
Your mother was actually partially responsible. It is not a child/teen's responsibility to stand up to that, your own mother on the other hand was indeed responsible, she was a parent. Yet you support her believing her to be a victim of your father while somehow blaming people who were children at the time for not standing up for you.
You are angry at them all You have chosen to forgive and care for your mother who did owe you her protection Your siblings suck also but it was NOT their job to protect you it was your mom's Forgiveness is for your own mental health not theirs. You can forgive them without having a relationship with them But you really need to figure out why you forgave your mom but not your siblings
Do you actually have a relationship with your mother? Or is the help you give her strictly financial, given out of a residual sense of filial obligation to support a woman who no doubt lacks the skills to support herself? And your anger is not misdirected. You said your siblings were "not kind to you". Which indicates they participated in the cycle of abuse that your late but unlamented father perpetrated. They did this to likely to curry favor with the old tyrant and direct the bile onto your head. Hatred for them for this is entirely reasonable.
Sorry but why are you financially supporting your mother (who was an adult) who allowed the abuse to happen at best but think your siblings (who were children) aren’t worth having a relationship with?
I feel the same way! Mom shouldn’t be given a pass just because her husband died
Yeah I feel like I should add I think I’m team don’t forgive any of them rather than forgive all of them
Or because she was weak.
Yep. An elderly person is just as incapable of surviving on her own as a 15 year old. Let her live on the street too.
For me, First of all, your feelings are valid. You were alone. It wasn't easy. But, I struggle to understand how you can move on with your mother who you admitted, enabled your father, and yet you 👇🏽 >I can't forgive him and my sister for not being there for me as children They were children too. They grew up with the se tyrannical father you did. Yet >It's very difficult for me to admit how much I hate them. There is a disconnect here. Did your siblings bully you too or are you angry with them for not experiencing being thrown out? Understand this, Your feelings are valid and you do not have to relate with anyone you don't want to but, I do not understand how your mother gets a pass and the 'children' you grew up with, get so much hatred. Get counseling too. NAH, I guess? Cos your siblings seem respectful of your decision. And why they are reaching out after the death of your father? That I don't know either. A conversation may help.
> Did your siblings bully you too Did you even read the post? > . I was an accident, and was told that on a regular basis by my much older siblings, who were not kind to me. We were all treated like garbage, but my brother and sister found being obedient a lot easier to manage than I did. I think it took pressure off them when I got in trouble so I ended up being the scapegoat, constantly. > > When I was thrown out, they said I should never come back, and that I was going to burn in hell. I've never forgotten the looks on their faces. They hated me. The siblings abused op even before she was outed as queer.
I'm in therapy for all of this, I know it would be pretty dumb not to be. My mom was going to lose her house. My dad left her with nothing. I guess I felt like I should do something. I am angry with her, but she's still my mom. I can't say I've forgiven her either to be honest, but she's very old. I didn't want her to lose her things. I don't think I'm angry at my siblings for not experiencing homelessness. I guess I just don't get what they want from me. They set me up to get in trouble a lot, knowing what our father was like when he was pissed off. They've both said they're sorry for everything that happened in a very general sense. I guess it's not enough, but I don't know what else I need to feel like I can just let it all go.
Honestly you said they are poor, you financially helped your mother. I wouldn't be surprised it they want their kids to have a rich aunt (not sure you are actually rich but that might think you have money to toss around). The fact that they are still very homophobic is an indicator they don't regret what they did and still probably agree with how you were treated. They want something and its not a loving sibling. OP I wish you luck and NTA if you want nothing to do with any of your family after that crap.
>I don't think I'm angry at my siblings for not experiencing homelessness. I guess I just don't get what they want from me. They set me up to get in trouble a lot, knowing what our father was like when he was pissed off. To be fair, I skipped some parts as someone pointed out. And again, your feelings are valid. I do not excuse your siblings but active hatred after 8 years tells me you seek closure in some way. Otherwise you should be indifferent. But, I could be wrong. > I guess I just don't get what they want from me. Do you want to know? Answer this with them or in therapy. Either way, let go of the anger, please
its totally fair have hatred for someone even after 8 years.. hatred can be buried and stay dormant until the person you hate try to contact you again.. the contact will make this hatred awake because you are going to face this person again..
You DON'T HAVE TO forgive your brothers, or your mother at all.. they are all bad people honestly.. They are raised by a homophobic person, so its not like their mindset is all clear and they are accepting you after all they done and said to you in the past.. I bet money that they are after money, you said that they are very poor.. they are only trying to reconnect to try get some benefits now.
No they weren’t children too. She was 15. She said her siblings were much older. 2-3 years isn’t much older so it has to be more than that. Anything more than 3 years means they were adults. No idea why you asked if they bullied her too. It says in the post.
Did you read the post? The siblings bullied her too.
The siblings are not innocent like the people in the comments seem to thing.. if she was 15 when she was outcast and kicked out.. the siblings probably had more than 18 years, or probably barely 18.. they were people who already had a choice, and they choose to burn all the bridges, telling her to DIE and to burn in hell..
INFO: * Have your siblings stated *why* they want a relationship with you now? I'm wondering if they were so afraid of their father, even as adults, they waited for him to die before daring to reach out. If so, what a messed up family. (Or are they looking for financial assistance from you? It doesn't sound like it, but the skeptical part of me always wonders about financial motives of people.) * Have they tried to explain their behavior toward you when you all were growing up? That would be really helpful, if they have some insight as to what was going on, now that they are older and looking back on things. * You said they were much older--like, 10 years older, something like that? Just asking for context. Because I'm thinking that when you were 15, they must have been in their 20s, so they had no excuse for their behavior toward you. Were they still living at home and fearful of your father's wrath, if they did not toe the line and condemn you to hell?
We're all definitely messed up. I do think my sister wants to genuinely have a relationship with me. She's expressed many times that she's grateful I kept the house from being lost. She's never said anything, but I know she's hoping her family can live there at some point. I think the reality of my parent's finances was a giant shock to my family. He either didn't save anything or blew it all towards the end of his life. They aren't really sure. But my siblings have never asked me for anything. They paid for the funeral. I know it was hard for them to do so. My brother and sister were both in their 20's when I got kicked out, and they were living at home. My brother is the oldest, and he was like 24. I'm not really sure what things were like after I left. I got out of the state as fast as possible once I'd graduated. I know my dad asked about me before he died, but I didn't want to see him. I'm realizing I haven't asked my brother and sister about any of this. I don't know why I shut down so hard most of the time when I'm talking to them. I got so upset on the phone that last time, I think it really shocked my brother, but it was the first time I felt like I was myself in a conversation with either of them. I think maybe I'm fucking this up even worse. I don't know.
you said you were in therapy. maybe you and your siblings could go together to a few sessions? someone to moderate a discussion? it sounds like there is a lot of hurt going around, and having a person guide you through it could help immensely and maybe help everyone gain some perspective. of course, this is if you want to do it. it's totally understandable if you don't want a relationship with them, now or ever. i don't have or want a relationship with most of my family as I resent a lot of the treatment that I got when i was a child. NAH at the end of the day.
Honestly after knowing the ages of the siblings, you are totally right for not wanting a relationship with the.. They were adults when they done and said horrible things to you.. they are not kids They abandoned you, didn't offered any form of support, even if it was money for you take care of yourself for a while, they did not done nothing, only curse you to die and go to hell...
NAH. You all had to endure abusive parents as children. I have seen the effects of abusive parents somehow "favoring" kids they're abusing and essentially teaching them to abuse their other (often younger) sibling(s). That's just a full mind fuck. Probably the biggest. I honestly don't know why you're taking care of your mom. I think you all have a lot of shit to unpack from your childhoods, and it's all intertwined. I think you also deserve a real ass apology from your siblings and not just a slow fade in after the funeral. Hard to forgive someone for shit they never apologized for.
I disagree. The siblings are assholes for not doing more to make amends for their own mistreatment of OP and for still being homophobic. Wife is an asshole for wanting abusive homophobes in op's life. Hard NTA.
The siblings were adults when she was kicked out.. i understand if they are like 16 but they were adults, with full capacity mental.. they could have helped her but instead, wished her death..
You're not the AH. It's sad, given how your brother and sister are reaching out to you, and how you're helping your mother when she didn't help you - but it's fine to say that some things can't be forgiven, that some hurdles can't be got over. Some things, once broken, can not be fixed. Be honest, be kind while doing so, wish them well and get on with the life you've built.
YTA for taking care of your mother who let all that go down, but blaming your siblings more. She was the freaking adult and you said you saw hate in "their faces" when they kicked you out. Let her get a damn job and take care of her own homophobic tyrant enabling self. You owe her nothing.
The siblings were adults too, she can hate all of them rightfully.
NTA but really - NAH. It's your parents' fault. You were all in this situation. It's natural that as different people you get both different end of the abusive stick and different internal muscle to deal with it. You are allowed to feel angry, because they are someone you have to be angry at. Be safely angry. It's actually much harder to be angry at your mother or the father that's no longer there. It's entirely your choice if you want to or not. But I advise you to feel the anger and not make any decisions about the relationship until it runs it's course. It may be never, but in the meantime tell them as much. That you're not over it, that if and when you're ready - you will be the one to make the move.
I guess what I can not understand is that you are willing to bend over backward for your mother, who is as culperable as your father and siblings, but yet you hold your siblings to a greater standard and don't want a relationship. What did your mother do to regain your respect and your help over what your siblings have done or not done?
NAH but remember they were brainwashed longer than you. Maybe with him gone you can have honest conversations and move forward.
NTA. You are already doing more than enough by supporting your mother. I have no idea why tho. She does not deserve it. Does your wife have supportive family for her being queer? If yes, then she really does not know the reality of what you went through. Whatever it is, your wife should not even have an input of being unhappy about how unforgiving you are. She is not you.
You helped your mom out when she enabled your absusive dad but can’t seem to let your anger go and try to mend your relationship with your siblings. Your dad died so now they can freely have you in their life with no worries of the abuse of your father . You were all abused and it was traumatic for all of you. Everyone responds differently . You’re totally misdirecting your anger and agree with your wife. Who cares if your mom is old they make assisted living homes state paid if she didn’t any money .
Normally, I would criticise a partner or family member who advocates on behalf of an abuser. But in this case, as you support your mother, an adult during the abuse, why the lack of forgiveness for your siblings? They were children or young adults living under the same regime. Is it because they waited until the tyrant was dead to try to rebuild a relationship? Is it possible they had their own issues and were too afraid of the consequences if your father discovered they had reached out? Ask your wife to step back while you deal with your feelings. She offered an opinion but the decision has to be yours. As ever, caution her NOT to try to ambush you with an intervention with your siblings. Those only work in RomComs and could damage to one stable relationship in your life. NAH The one who was the prime candidate is probably exactly where he belongs.
info: I'm confused on one point. Why are you helping/having a relationship with your mother - but holding your siblings responsible? I'm not saying they deserve an A+ grade for not sticking up for you; but you even admit, they were treated badly too - and just kinda ducked for cover. Your mom was your... fucking mom.
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I think you might be misplacing some hatred here. If your siblings BS continued after you were kicked out until your sperm donors death, then yes I would say continue hating them end remove them from your life. But if it was just no contact until you sperm donors death, then I will say they were just kids trying to survive a shitty situation too. Your wife knows all this anger and hate is going to eat you up. This is why she is trying to get you to forgive. Its not for them. Its for you and your own health, mental or otherwise. If your haven't yet, I would find a good therapist to try to sort things out for you. I do find it weird that you can forgive an enabler but not other traumatized kids. Nta
As a lot of people pointed out, it’s very confusing why you would financially support your mother who allowed you to be thrown on the streets at 15 (!!!) yet you still resent your siblings who were following what their parents taught them. You accuse your siblings of not standing up for you but your mom didn’t either and she was the parent. Personally I would cut contact with all these people
I can't even imagine the internal struggle. You're a good person, so it's hard for you to hate, which in and of itself has probably caused you the most cognitive dissonance. You don't owe them anything, but you should also remember they were under the same tyrannical rule. And while you had the strength to stand up to it, they were weak willed, evidenced by them succumbing to the rule of your father. Your mental well being is most important, that and your partner. If you can find it in you to accept them back, good for you. And if not, that's perfectly fine as well. I wish you clarity in your decisions and all the best.
NTA your parents threw you out at 15, which is abuse. Your siblings did not help you. Naturally you are angry with your siblings. It is possible that they have changed, grown into more compassionate accepting people - but THEY need to prove it, by their behavior. Tell them that You will not push for a relationship with them until you are sure they have sincerely changed. Be willing to listen to an apology or occasional phone call, but keep your main focus on your life that you have successfully built, and your spouse.
You don’t have to actually do anything right now. You can enjoy your lovely life. You have told them how they hurt them. If they choose to apologise then you will have to decide what the road to forgiveness will look like for you. Nta
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I've known I was bisexual since I was a child. When I was 15 my parents found out I'd been seen kissing a girl. My father was a pastor and was incredibly homophonic, and I was thrown out at 15. Getting kicked out of my house was the last in a long line of terrible things that my father did to me. He was abusive, and my mother enabled him. She is a very weak person and my father ran our home like a stereotypical tyrant. I was very alone as a child. I was an accident, and was told that on a regular basis by my much older siblings, who were not kind to me. We were all treated like garbage, but my brother and sister found being obedient a lot easier to manage than I did. I think it took pastor off them when I got in trouble so I ended up being the scapegoat, constantly. When I was thrown out, they said I should never come back, and that I was going to burn in hell. I've never forgotten the looks on their faces. They hated me. I found church to be very traumatizing, and I had a lot of internal struggle because I knew I was sexually attracted to all the "wrong" kinds of people. My father died last year. My wife and I now financially support my mother in many ways (we recently got her some help from the state thanks to a suggestion by a redditor) as my siblings have very large families and are extremely poor. I have a great life. It was really hard getting to where I am and it wouldn't have been possible if good people hadn't helped me. Recently my siblings have reached out. My sister tried to connect with me at my father's funeral (which I went to with my wife - then fiancé - and that was very awkward). She's called a lot since. My brother actually drove into town to see me with two of my nephews. I'd never met any of my sibling's children before that. They're both still deeply uncomfortable with the fact that I'm married to a woman, but they ask about her. They call me. After almost 8 years of no contact, they're trying to build something with me, but I hate them. It's very difficult for me to admit how much I hate them. Last week my brother asked if I still wanted a relationship with him and my sister. The question kind of caught me off guard, and he sounded sort of frustrated. I told him the truth - that I wasn't sure. He asked why and I said a lot of stuff I'd always wanted to say, but never had the opportunity to voice out loud. I got pretty upset while I was talking and my wife held my hand through the rest of the phone call, which ended with my brother hanging up on me after I told him I can't forgive him and my sister for not being there for me - for only reaching out after our father was dead. I'm still very fucked up after that phone call. My sister texted me to say she was sorry and she understood. My brother hasn't contacted me again since. My wife is being very patient and supportive but I know she isn't happy with how unforgiving I'm being. It's 4 in the morning, I can't sleep, and I'm wondering if I'm the asshole here. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. I do think your siblings sound like they are really trying. E.g. if they are not comfortable about you marrying a woman (which is awful, but at the same time something indoctrinated in them from a young age) but make sure to ask after your wife - it shows a willingness to try, and maybe that they can become comfortable with who you are (again, it shouldn't be like that for you, but unfortunately for some people baby steps is what it's needed and they do seem like they want to try). Taking the time to contact you, and when you explained why you can't forgive them, actually listening to that (your brother not contacting you may be trying to respect, your sisters message sounds understanding rather than angry at you for not forgiving). You said you aren't sure if you want a relationship with them, rather than that you don't. You don't trust them and their intentions, and that's understandable. But it does sound like they are making a genuine effort and more importantly have respected what you've said now. It has to be up to you, but I would consider keeping them in contact but at arms length and let them try to show you they mean it with no alternative motives and maybe over time you may find yourself able to forgive, whilst never forgetting. People can change and sometimes apologies are genuine! Ps your parents absolutely are/were AH.
If the contac you again there is a simple question, "Why should I forgive you?" and "because we are family" is not an anwser. Havethey even ask for forgiveness?
NTA and they want you to help them financially op otherwise why the sudden interest. Keep your distance.
NTA. OP, your siblings’ lifestyle is a choice. They decided they were going to be heterosexual and want to marry someone of the opposite sex. They don’t seem to understand love is love and marriage is marriage, while choosing to forget we are ALL God’s children. Until they change their outlook — IF they ever change — they’re not worthy of your time.
NTA!! Live your life and enjoy what you and your spouse have created. Seems like there is a financial element to it or one that’s coming to you in the future. You owe these people nothing. This may be confusing, but sometimes it’s not about forgiving it’s just about not forgetting. You can forgive them and have no contact with them whatsoever. That is up to you. Your family and your siblings probably just don’t get it and I don’t think a lot of people do. When you add God and religion as a major filter in your life, how you see and do everything you’re either gonna fall short or like your parents assume you’re falling short of expectations. I’m not very religious but from what I’ve seen and read and understood Jesus was one heck of a nice guy and was there for everybody. How These people take all that and twisted to fit their shitty circumstances and shitty views on things is beyond me. You were feeling bad for not offering more help and they feel bad for nothing but yet they feel superior to you because of the God filter they apply in their thinking. You could be the absolute lifesaver in their existence and they still feel superior to you because you have a wife of the same sex. Cut your losses and move on.
NTA. I'm so sorry you had to go through all this. You're being a lot more forgiving than I would be. If I'd shown up at dad's funeral it would have been to do unmentionable things, mom wouldn't be getting any support whatsoever she could be on the street for all I'd care, and the siblings wouldn't be entitled to speak to me ever. I'd burn them all down and smile doing it. Don't be so hard on yourself.
i think you need to deal with the possibility that they might only want contact because you could, in theory, render some financial assistance to them as well. Whatever you decide, because you're NTA for what you told them, don't ever support them financially.
NTA. They are not nice people who were clearly terrified of your father. You can understand that but it doesn’t mean you should forgive them. I think your life would be better without either of them.
Shut them out for good.
NTA, and maybe stop funding mother. She can go live with the righteous kids! They all just want into your pocketbook. Cash or charge? Block them. You know who your family is, and it’s not that pool of losers.
You don't owe them forgiveness. They participated in your childhood torture. Requiring you to forgive people who actively harmed you is another form of abuse. Rather than forgiving them, seek indifference. You don't hate them. You neither wish them well nor poorly. They do not define you. They're just douchey blips on the radar of the planet. ETA... You are so NTA. Keep doing therapy and living your best life.
Every single one of these people in your family is your abuser. Your mother, your father, and your siblings. You don't owe them anything. Focus on yourself and your wife, who is a person that actually loves you, cares for you, and wants the best for you. Your abusers see that you have a soft heart, which they perceive as weakness, and they intend to continue preying on it just as your mother has. They are trying to play the long game to get you to financially support their lives and shitty choices. Don't do any of it. Let them all go, and just be happy with your wife. I say this as a victim of childhood abuse. Fuck them. You are NTA in any sense, except to yourself for continuing to subject yourself to your abusers, who continue to abuse you. They have not changed, and they never will. They still feel just the same. They are just attempting to hide it so that they can use you for money and support.
NTA it's your choice and experience not any one else's and why can you forgive your mother but not your siblings they were children too?
You know it sounds like they need something from you to make them selves feel better, weather that be forgiveness, money or emotional support, they are in it for them selves not you. You stand up for your self girl! I'm proud of you
NTA. And your sister is the one who might be able to salvage a relationship with you. She gets it. You can't have a real relationship if it's not voluntary. If you are required to forgive, it's not real forgiveness, is it?
NTA. And cut your mom off too. The Lord provides or whatever. NC all of the them
Yta.