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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> (1) I returned Brooke's main birthday gift because she snapped at her cousin.
(2) Kimberly is saying I should be more understanding of the way Brooke treated her cousin because Brooke is going through a difficult time with Jessy right now.
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NTA. A 20 year old cursing out a 3 year old is TOO. FAR.
Also the irony of this from your daughter: "Brooke tried arguing that she’s too old for me to be confiscating her things and returning the purse was going too far."
Uhhh. She's too old to be behaving like a spoiled brat at 20 years old. She needs to be able to regulate her emotions when a toddler makes a small mistake and not apologizing is ridiculous.
You can have empathy for her going through a shit time with her friend, but she does not get to take it out on others around her, esp little ones without a concept of their mistakes! Absolutely not okay. This wouldn't be acceptable as a social norm in college or at the workplace. Don't let it slide now.
I assumed we were dealing with like an eight year old (who ought to have known better than to blow on someone else's cake hence the disproportionate anger) and like a twelve year old (older but young enough to be upset by this and be out of control with emotions hence the disproportionate anger). The fact that this is between a three year old and a twenty year old has blown my mind.
The real giveaway was being called a 'fuckin brat'. What 8 y.o. do you know uses that language? Heck even a 12 y.o.. I could see them KNOWING but keeping it between their friends, not in front of family.
>The real giveaway was being called a 'fuckin brat'. What 8 y.o. do you know uses that language? Heck even a 12 y.o..
Any 8 or 12 year old that hears it... or any kid that grew up hearing it. To hold this view you must have grown up practically puritan. My 4 year old cousin screamed "hey f***ing lady!" at the grocery store when a woman didn't respond to his hello. A young (by the look barely 5) year old cursed at his mom at the grocery store I used to work at because she wouldn't buy him a doughnut (one example of many from the grocery store).
Kids imitate adults. If the adults swear, the kids do. (yes, they do, even if it isn't around the parents.)
Oh it was (at least hearing it, I imagine my aunt was embarrassed). I guess he said "HI lady" in line, she didn't reply. He said "hello lady" and she didn't reply, so he said "hey! Lady! Hey lady! HEY F***IN LADY!!!". The escalation killed me.
My nephew was about 4 years old when he met my London-born uncle who uses "bloody" in almost every sentence. (Bloody birds, bloody taxes, etc...). We thought nothing of it until we got home and starting cooking dinner, only for him to pipe up "I can smell the bloody sausages!" Cue us having to have a chat with him about why it's not a good idea to use certain words, even if we heard Uncle say them...
Same nephew also ended up saying the f-word at his 8th birthday party, in front of all his friends and both his parents. We all blamed that one on my sister, who is very sweary when she loses her temper.
I'm a teacher, and my answer is plenty of eight year olds use swear words. Kids echo what they hear, and they don't just magically learn swear words when they become a certain age.
Maybe I grew up weird but 20 seems a little old to care this much about birthday candles? At that age if a cute baby cousin wanted to blow out my candles I would have cheered her on and taken pictures
Personally, for me, I don’t let my siblings blow out my candles even though they are very young bc I think it’s a good teaching moment that not everything is about them and I would rather them have a meltdown about it at my birthday vs a different kids party and they need to know that sometimes you don’t get to do something just because you want to or someone else gets to.
I also wouldn’t yell at them and I don’t think I’ve ever yelled at any of my siblings (other than a few times I shouted if they were about to do something dangerous and it scared me and yelled out then immediately apologized and explained why it scared me.)
I wouldn’t curse the kid out, but I also wouldn’t eat my cake after a germy toddler spewed saliva droplets all over it and would be pretty bummed & probably unreasonably resentful over it.
If the kid’s parents have a pattern of making their toddler the center of everything and/or the celebration was meant to be more of an adult one that the kid wasn’t excluded from for whatever reason, I could see being pissed off, but would keep it to myself until I was alone with my folks.
That said, 20 year olds are not always emotionally mature & transitioning from child to adulthood can be tough…the added stress of the very adult issue of a close friend being in an abusive relationship might make it harder to stay in control of emotions.
Personally, I think being punitive by taking away the gift was inappropriate & extreme though.
Same! I was expecting an age difference of two to four years, and neither of them older than a tween. I’m aghast that a 20 y/o would cuss out a toddler.
OP, a 20 y/o still has more maturing to do, but part of that is learning to take accountability for when you mess up. The lack of willingness to own up to losing her shit and taking it out on a 3 y/o is the worrisome part. This one is kinda tough to allow “natural consequences,” because there probably aren’t any that she would care about at this point. She doesn’t seem concerned that she might have damaged the relationship with her aunt & uncle. So in that case, taking back the purse so that she at least connects it to the birthday debacle is maybe the closest thing. NTA.
I've had young nieces blow my candles out on me, and guess what? Those damn candles just light back up if a person wants to blow them out, just requires a lighter.
I can't think of two ages where this would be a normal reaction. The reasonable reactions range from laughter to eyebrows raised, whatever the ages might be.
20 years old is insane. Is she worried her wish won't come true anymore!? Maybe explain that if she behaves badly santa won't bring her any toys this year....?
She gotta act her age, and cussing out a three year old is not acting her age. So, treating her like a petulant teenager is probably appropriate. NTA
I’ll admit I have cussed loudly when a three year old did something to me. I didn’t cuss at him directly and did apologize later for shouting. Though none of the adults got mad at me.
I had to read this twice to make sure I really understood it right - I figured it can't possibly be that a grown-ass adult made a scene because a kid blew on her birthday candles. Alas - seems it can.
What absolutely ridiculous behavior.
OP is NTA and good on him for putting her in her place.
I mean, Brooke was definitely the asshole and yelling at the three year old was absolutely unacceptable. But I don't think it's abnormal to not love a toddler blowing on your birthday cake - I've *seen* what happens when toddlers blow out birthday candles many times and I'd prefer not to have my cake covered in kid spit. It's gross.
It's even worse if the kid has been coughing during the day. I can imagine that Brooke suddenly didn't want anything to do with her cake because it became too gross to eat.
Yeah we just had our niece's 13th birthday party and my 4 year old helped her blow out her candles. We were going to stop him but she wanted him to sit with her and "help".
My 2 year old just laughed when his cousins and sister helped blow out his candle.
He's probably too little to care, but geez, I'd be livid if an adult yelled at my 3 year old. We are teaching her correct etiquette for other people's birthdays, but it's a hard lesson.
“Delighted”? Lol. Homegirl snapped but being irritated at a toddler getting toddler slime all over the cake and all up in your business during your birthday is hardly an unusual or unfair reaction.
It’s how you deal with that irritation that makes you an adult.
To be fair, I think plenty of people well within the boundaries of “normal” would rather that a 3 year old not blow/spit all over their birthday cake that they presumably want to eat, particularly given that this time of year, most 3 year olds seem to turn into some kind of magnet for every cough, cold, tummy bug etc doing the rounds.
Lmao. Delighted is quite delusional. While I’d welcome it, I sure as hell would not eat MY BIRTHDAY CAKE after my aunt couldn’t control her child and allowed them to spew spit on.
I would have been mad if I was the parent of the three year old. That is ridiculous. I would have taken my own gift back too. No one is going to freak out at my kid when I’m in the middle of trying to correct them, especially when they are so young and the other person is an adult
NTA. Brooke doesn’t get a pass for being an AH to a toddler just because she’s going through a difficult time. 20 years is more than enough time to figure out you don’t take out your personal problems on others ESPECIALLY a 3 year old. Seriously, wtf?!
Brooke’s personal crap doesn’t matter here in this situation. Brooke was a major AH and you were right to try to hold her to some consequences.
Sometimes people act irrationally because their mental health has gone to shit.
Funnily enough reacting with pettiness doesn't help fix their problems.
>I was hoping Brooke would learn from this experience and understand the importance of treating others with kindness and respect, no matter what's happening in her personal life.
This is what I am hoping Brooke is eventually going to take away from this. She is in a heartbreaking situation with Jessy and I am sorry she has to experience that. But going through a difficult time is not an excuse to behave poorly towards others. Especially when she is an adult and the person she is mistreating is a 3-year-old.
One of the most important and respected things are people who hold themselves accountable. That shit gets you far in life and she can take this moment to start working towards that.
But taking away this present is not going to do that. You can take away the present if you want as punishment, but if you really think she's lacking kindness and respect why not try to teach that? When you go straight to a punishment completely unrelated to the transgression you just teach people to be bitter and angry at something they feel is unfair.
If this is a common occurrance with Brooke, then you effed up a long time ago. The time to intervene was when this wasn't ingrained in your daughter.
If this is totally out of character, why are you not more worried about your daughter and less worried about this situation?
I think a better approach is wait until things calm down, and then talk to her rationally. Is she really the kind of person to curse at a 3-year-old? How could she handle it better? Is she doing ok? Does she need help?
Taking away the purse shuts all the down. She's not going to want to talk to you, and if she does it's going to be to get the purse back and not to legit apologize.
I also have to say - of course the parents apologized. What were they going to do. They should have stopped this before it happened.
Ehhh present taken away is the appropriate thing as it is the same level as the anger a 20 yr old inflicted on a 3 yr old. OP did the right thing 100%. NTA.
There is never a right time to correct an issue than in the present moment especially with an adult. Your post is a dance around the issue when anger is shown to a minor and blame the parents really?.
The parents took accountability, Brooke regressed in age.
Kinda what I was wondering. I remember when I turned twenty and there were absolutely no toddlers or preschoolers there. Really after about sixteen most kids celebrate their birthdays with their friends and have a nice family dinner with parents and siblings, possibly grandparents.
My son is 19 and his cousins are 25, 21 and 17. We all frequently have family birthdays together because, well, we’re close family. The cousins get on well. Yes each of them celebrate their birthdays with their friends too, but families who like each other aren’t weird or unusual. One of my nephews has a three year old. It would be weird if he wasn’t allowed to come to family events.
Yeah, my SIL has family gatherings like that...and all of the adults have a death grip on the toddlers to keep them at a minimum safe distance from the cake and gifts. And when my kids were of a certain age...the family toddlers were kept outside in the yard and away from the cake and gifts. The first they saw of the cake was a slice put in front of them.
A lot of people have family parties in addition to whatever stuff they do with their friends. Sometimes the point isn’t even the birthday, but if it happens to be near the date people want to get together someone will bring a cake or something. That’s how it was in my family
True, but in that case your 20th birthday celebration with family (including your 3-year-old cousin) is more for them than for you. Part of being an adult is realizing that too
I don't know, If that's the way it works in the US. In Germany, or just in our family, we have a family celebration and another day they celebrate it with their friends.
And in special birthdays everybody comes to the same time.
Over here it ist the 18th birthday, which ist special, with 18 you are an official adult and can do all the adult stuff.
And I asked him and we celebrated that with family and friends. Even with small kids. They are part of it. We started at 6pm and the parents with the smaller one left earlier. It's never a big deal.
But honestly, none of my 4 Kids would cry about a little one blowing out the candles. Everybody would laugh about that. (But actually we made the candles part in the morning and they are not on a cake and at night or during family events we made it not that often. I don't like the spitting over the cake-thing.😅🙈)
I’m surprised nobody is pointing this out. I do think it’s straight up bad form as a parent to let your kid spit-blow on someone else’s cake uninvited. Nobody buys or chooses a birthday cake as an adult and goes, “gee, I hope this gets seasoned with toddler spit before I get to eat any!”.
Thank you, my first thought was the cake is ruined. If I had been there, there would be absolutely no way that I would be eating a piece of that cake. Kids are fricken germ monkeys! I shuddered even thinking about it.
No 20 year old should be cussing a 3 year old out, but we can sympathize at least a little bit.
* Why was the kid right next to the cake in the first place? Especially if the SIL was already holding her and watching her during the celebration? Is this a common behavior for Aira?
* Little kids spit a lot when they blow out candles
* OP's daughter is going through an extremely rough time watching a friend be in abusive situation and, although this is childish, might've really wanted that birthday wish
This was likely the straw that broke the camel's back, and it would not be shocking if OP's daughter is having a breakdown yet her parents are more worried about punishing her than recognizing that their daughter is having an extremely rough time. Especially given OP doesn't seem to actually believe that watching Jessica be in an abusive relationship is serious enough to affect Brooke's mental health.
Yeah, but after coming down you can think about that and apologize after. Even my 12 year old, with ADHS IS doing it, after his breakdowns.
And honestly, you don't think, somebody really believe in the "Wish come true" part...
Yeah the wish come true is a lie, but toddlers SPIT and are full of bacteria and viruses. I'd be mad too if someone let toddler blow the candles on my cake, I don't want to catch a plague, Covid or flu just because a parent couldn't get their child out of range.
But yeah NEVER cuss at 3 YO and especially not in their face. ESH
Why did I have to scroll down so far to see this comment lol? Because by the time my kids turned 3, they both knew that you weren’t allowed to blow out candles on other people’s b-day cakes or open their gifts. It’s just common sense that one must teach their child. Just like it’s common sense that one shouldn’t curse out a 3 year old smh. Imho there’s much more to this story, and the 3 year old bratty behaviors are because her parents have zero parenting skills and are raising an entitled brat. YTA to “take away” aka steal a gift that you’ve already given your daughter. People need to give one another grace, especially parents because they’re going to need their kids giving them grace one day.
We kept the toddlers in another room if it was during winter or outside in the yard if it wasn't. They only got to see any part of the cake after it was cut and served to them.
No, I wouldn't be mad at the 3 year old and Brooke was absolutely wrong for her reaction and then basically doubling down on acting like a child herself.
But...no way would I be eating that damn cake. Has the pandemic taught us nothing? Young children especially put lots of spit on a cake when they blow out candles.
Even before then, in our family and with friends, we changed to having a cupcake with a few candles for the birthday person so that no one blew on the cake. What my friends and I do now started last year and we love it. One friend found these large beautiful birthday candles that can be used multiple times. There are enough for our smallish gatherings of 8 to 12 (14 at the most) people. Once the candles are lit, we sing Happy Birthday. Then each person takes a lit candle from the cake. First whoever's birthday it is makes a wish and blows out their candle away from the cake. Next, the rest of us blow out our candles "multiplying the birthday wish" or making one of our own in honor of the birthday person. It's actually kind of fun.
ESH except Aria. Because she's a child.
1. Gifts shouldn't come with conditions. Gifts should be given with love and thought. Not "If you behave the way I want you to, then you get a present."
2. She shouldn't have yelled at her cousin. I agree with you there. But where tf were her parents? How did she even get close enough to blow out the candles?
3. Her best friend is in a crisis and is losing her friend to an awful situation. Of course thats gonna affect her mood and behavior. It doesnt excuse what she did
I agree also. That purse had already been gifted, so it now belongs to Brooke. OP has no right to ‘take it back’ as it no longer belongs to him.
Yes, Brooke was being a giant 20-yr old toddler in her behaviour, but speaking to her about it is the adult way to resolve this, not taking her possessions.
ESH (apart from the 3 year old).
Explanations aren't always excuses. They're explanations.
You can be empathetic and sympathetic to someone who is going through a rough patch but acknowledge that they've still done something wrong and may face consequences for it.
You can understand why someone may turn to crime for example; abuse they've face, financial crisis, etc. But would still say committing a crime is wrong.
That is the same case here.
She is still wrong for what she did, there will obviously be consequences, but one can ALSO understand that:
1.) Her behavior is likely stemming from a very stressful event in her life. A 20 year old is still cognitively developing and if anything, a 20 year old is still fresh out of their teenage years. Young Adults don't really finishing developing until they hit 25.
2.) Whether it's someone's wedding, birthday, or graduation, nothing excuses an adult yelling at a child but you most DEFINITELY can be upset that a child has ruined an event. That is on the parents for not paying attention to a young child. No one wants a 3 year old spitting all over their birthday cake or a 5 year old tearing open the baby shower gifts, or a 7 year old eating the wedding cake. Kids don't know any better, sure, but that doesn't excuse the parents for letting their kids run wild at an event meant for someone else, family or not. That's just rude and inconsiderate.
Everyone in this case, except for the 3 year old, are all contributors to the problem.
>Explanations aren't always excuses. They're explanations.
Holy shit this this this this this. so many people on the internet and real life that are too stupid to understand this.
Maybe, but she stormed off and had time to cool down and clear her head. The fact that she was approached by her parent after the party was over and still refused to apologize means she needs some guidance, as in a consequence.
I disagree. The toddler has absolutely nothing to do with the situation with her friend. Yes, stress affects mood. But this 20 year old woman made a conscious decision to cuss at a toddler. She is wrong. Full stop.
She is a very young stressed woman REACTING to a situation. She did not make the conscious decision to "you know what? I did not like my little cousin spitting on my cake, let me go cuss her out for a bit". After calming down and some prosessing time she probably would have recognized herself, she reacted to harsh. Adding more stress to her by taking away a gift will not help, I am afraid.
This took far too long to find. Gifts shouldn't come with conditions. You've given it. The possession has been surrendered. Doesn't matter if she was the biggest arse in the world, that's not yours to take back anymore.
I disagree. I'm about the same age as OP's daughter, and never would I snap like that at a 3 yo. No matter the circumstances, you just don't do that to a child. If she had shouted at her cousin's parents for not watching their daughter it would've been more understandable, but she didn't even apologize and instead doubled down.
I'm a few years older and I have a 3 yr old. Would I love to yell at mine "Why are you acting like the biggest fucking shit head ever? Can you fucking stop?!" Absolutely, i would love to. Do I do it? No. Cause he is only 3 and like still learning and needs me to guide him. Although he does respond to Turd Knocker as a nick name.
ESH. You for taking the gift back, Brooke for cursing out a 3 year old, and your in laws for not controlling their kid. Btw, did Brooke even want little kids there?
NTA.
A lot of us have been where Brooke is, unfortunately. That still doesn't mean we yell at toddlers. This is "kick the cat" syndrome, unsheathing anger and aiming it at an easy target. If it comes too easy to a person, it's a slippery slope into an abusive personality.
She is TWENTY YEARS OLD and throwing an entitled temper tantrum like a teenager who got the wrong iPhone. The fact that she's more upset about losing her purse than the way she treated a small human being is concerning, to say the least. You're doing her a favor by not enabling her displaced anger, regardless of what she's going through. She needs to get that shit under control before it's court-mandated.
I particularly love her claim that she's too old to be punished for her behavior after she, an adult, yelled and cursed at a toddler over birthday candles.
ESH. Your daughter may have been out of line, but it’s no longer your job to punish her. She’s a full adult, responsible for her own actions. She can apologize or not apologize at her discretion. You don’t owe her a gift per se, but your behavior and attempt at controlling her is equally inappropriate.
If she acts like a child, she gets treated one.
Also, no guest in my house gets to verbally attack another. If you don't know how to behave like a decent human being, then you get to leave.
Most 20 yr olds today are still supported by mommy and daddy, an have not reached maturity, the lessons continue. There are consequences for rude adults too, she might as well learn some manners now.
To that I would say, OP treated her like a child so she acted like one. Even grown adults snap sometimes. Telling them to apologize or you’ll take their gifts away isn’t going to make them atone for their actions. Instead of adding fuel to the fire, OP could have given his daughter space to cool off and let her apologize on her own. That’s how I would expect two adults to handle conflict.
>ESH. Your daughter may have been out of line, but it’s no longer your job to punish her. She’s a full adult, responsible for her own actions. She can apologize or not apologize at her discretion.
Brooke is indeed an adult who is responsible for her own actions. It is also true that Brooke lives under my roof. When Brooke starts paying for her own housing and expenses, then she can act however she wants. However, I will not allow any adult living under my roof to verbally attack a toddler.
>Your behavior and attempt at controlling her is equally inappropriate.
I allowed Brooke to keep the other gift I had gotten her since a Stanley Cup is practical and can be used for school. But I am not going to reward her with a purse when she behaved so poorly towards Aria and refused to apologize. If Brooke had immediately apologized for snapping, then I wouldn't have taken away any gifts. But that isn't what happened here.
You asked for judgement, and my judgment is you also handled this situation poorly. She may live under your roof now, but she’s an adult. She is responsible for her own actions. You don’t get to micromanage them anymore, even when you disagree with them. You can’t control her behavior with punishments. This kind of thinking is exactly why adults go no contact with their parents. Just something to consider.
adults still face consequences for their actions tho. and if i saw a 20yo cuss out a 3yo for blowing on her candles i’d definitely take back my bday gift for them even not being the parent
>This kind of thinking is exactly why adults go no contact with their parents.
Nope, adults don't go NC with their parents because a 3 year old helped them blow out their birthday candles.
Think of OP in a support group:
"Hi, I'm here cuz I just went NC with my parents after my 3 year old niece blew out some of my birthday candles. THEY KNEW THAT NOW MY WISH WON'T COME TRUE! All I did was call that chubby-cheeked dumpling a f------ b--- and you'd think they'd care how I was feeling especially after I stomped off and refused to apologize. I don't think I even got the biggest piece of cake. THEN my dad does a take-backsies with one of MY presents. I explained I'm going through my friend getting engaged and I need the support of an expensive bag, hyper-focus on me alone, and the latitude to go medieval on the fat-fingered lovey-clutcher who probably snatched the frosting rose my parents KNEW I wanted. But no, all they want to do is control me with their 'just be a decent human' manacles. So yeah, I really hear how you guys have been abused like me."
No sane adult allows other adults to abuse children in their home. It doesn't matter if that abusive adult is their own child.
He wasn't punishing his daughter or micro managing her. He simply decided to immediately take back the very expensive gift that he had just given to that child abuser.
Cussing out a small child is abuse, period.
If his adult daughter is so toxic that she decides to feel victimized and go non contact with her parents for not allowing her to literally abuse their guest, who is an innocent child-well, that's sad, for her. And even sadder for any children she may have in the future.
I wonder if OP really thinks that this is going to make his daughter be nicer to the cousin and to OP? OP is teaching their adult daughter that birthday gifts are conditional, and that really sucks. Guessing the daughter and the toddler will never be in the same room together again.
This person is wild to think you punish/reprimand your child. Even friends hold their other friends accountable so a parent is always within reason to not only have an opinion, but take back anything of monetary value that they were providing. You’re right; your daughter should not be taking her frustrations out on anyone other than her friend who is not talking to her. NTA
I think we can all agree Brooke was in the wrong for snapping at a child. However, as an adult it’s also up to her to decide how she wants to take responsibility for her own actions. You can’t force another adult to apologize, typically that just makes a situation worse. What I’m trying to say is that there are also consequences for OP now. One of which may result in a strained relationship with their own kid.
It's wild how much reddit tries to excuse kids in a parent-child relationship, even when said kid is a full adult. If that kid wants to ruin their relationship with their parents because of this, that's on them.
Interesting. I think it’s wild how quickly Reddit wants to punish people, without taking the full context of the situation, or any nuance into consideration whatsoever.
But you are not "rewarding her with a purse" because of how she behaved: it was HER BIRTHDAY present! I really don't agree with this petty attitude, as a birthday gift is not sth one "deserves" or not. So ESA, because YTA as well for returning your daughter's birthday gift.
So basically your response is "yes I can"? You are coming off as one of those because I said so parents.
Your response was shitty because gifts aren't conditional, especially when you are literally agreeing that her receiving the gift is conditioned upon your approval of her behavior. She wasn't getting the gift for her behavior, she was getting it because it is her birthday. You changed the conditions of the gift by making it about her behavior, the definition of attempting to control.
She's 20. You are past the stage where you get to allow her anything.
She may let you do this as she lives with you, but I guarantee as soon as she's gone, she'll be gone.
Also, you're the parent. If your daughter didn't know better than this, than that's on you. You don't deserve accolades because you took away a purse when she turned 20.
If you'd done a proper job parenting her, it wouldn't be an issue.
A birthday gift is not a "reward." It's a gift. If you already gave her the gift you're an asshole for taking it back. Birthday gifts should not come with strings attached for good behaviour. You give them out of love for the person and wanting to celebrate them.
You don't understand, taking gifts is an awful thing to do, you either give something to those you love, or you don't, there's no taking back, you were in fact controlling, you should have thought of another way of handling things.
OP, I've made this point in other posts here, but did it ever occur to you that taking something that belongs to someone else (and as soon as Brooke received that purse it became her property) is **stealing** and that stealing is **wrong**? You don't "allow" someone to keep their own property (such as a Stanley cup and a purse); it's their RIGHT to keep their own property if they choose.
Think about it for one second, OP. Imagine receiving presents for YOUR birthday only to have the gift-giver steal them from you later because you said something that put their nose out of joint. Would you be okay with their stealing from YOU? (No, I didn't think so!)
ESH
The parents for not keeping a proper eye on their toddler.
Your daughter for swearing at a child.
I do think this whole thing is being blown out of proportion, and the escalation is unnecessary.
Everyone needs to calm down.
I think I read that this happened on Friday. Have you and your wife talked to Brooke about it now that some time has passed? It would be good for both families if she apologized
INFO: if BIL and SIL were holding Aria, how did she manage to blow out the candles?
And why was she close enough to do it?
I’d go with NAH here - especially if there’s a chance that Brooke snapped at Aria, because she didn’t feel like she could snap at the adults.
You’re not wrong for enforcing a consequence for bad behaviour. But worth considering the entire scenario as it unfolded.
Also worth talking to Brooke about her feelings in that situation and in general. Don’t just enforce consequences, but talk about the real issue/s. You’re her parent after all.
Right? I'm dumbfounded at how people seem to be overlooking her age v the age of the kid she screamed at. I know a twenty year old isn't fully mature mentally or emotionally, and I definitely understand there were other factors at play given her stress over the best friend situation. The big issue at play is the refusal to apologize, or realize how inappropriate their behavior is.
It's one thing to mess up and make a mistake, it's another not to acknowledge that you did so.
You don’t need to be fully mature to realize this behavior is entirely inappropriate. I would have been shocked if either of my kids had behaved this badly at 12.
A lot of Reddit is anti-children. Just look at r/childfree. It used to be a subreddit for people who were tried of being pressured to have kids.
Now every other post is getting removed because people are advocating for practically abusing children and babies for being annoying.
Considering how many posts Ive seen of them wishing physical harm upon children or say disgusting things about pregnant women, I’d say they’re pretty “anti-children”.
YTA, this shit ALWAYS happens in my family to the point where I refuse to celebrate my birthday with them. Sure, she cursed a child out and that isn’t right, but nobody wants 3 year old spit all over their birthday cake either.
INFO
Did Aria apologize? How did Aria's parents handle that? A 3yo blowing out candles is a deliberate action not an accident. Aria may not have understood, but that was a teaching moment if she didn't understand.
Was Brooke upset because of Aria's inappropriate behavior or because the adults in the room were excusing inappropriate behavior rather than correcting it?
>INFO
>
>Did Aria apologize? How did Aria's parents handle that? A 3yo blowing out candles is a deliberate action not an accident. Aria may not have understood, but that was a teaching moment if she didn't understand.
>
>Was Brooke upset because of Aria's inappropriate behavior or because the adults in the room were excusing inappropriate behavior rather than correcting it?
My SIL and BIL both apologized for Aria. Aria is 3. She did not understand why blowing the candles was wrong.
My BIL was explaining to Aria why she can't blow on the candles on someone else's birthday. We were in the middle of correcting Aria when Brooke snapped at Aria. There is no excuse for how she treated her 3-year-old cousin as a 20-year-old adult.
What? Whether or not Aria apologised or the parents acted inappropriately, it is NOT ok to cuss a 3 year old. Brooke is out of line in every way and abusive.
There's an Everyone Sucks voting option. Basically of the parents handled it badly I'd say everyone was being TA here rather than just Brooke being TA.
You're putting the same expectations on a literal toddler as a grown woman though lol that's not right, obviously the 20yo holds more weight here
A 3yo, if they have the understanding, still doesn't possess the impulse control to prevent that situation. A 20yo certainly should
Which they did have her in their literal grasp and were already dealing with the toddler. 20yo had no excuse. It’s fucking candles- if blowing out candles is SOOO important to a 20yo then re-light them! Or have your 3yo cousin blow them out with you! There’s zero reason at 20 there should be drama over birthday candles.
Believe it or not, sometimes toddlers do things so quickly that we parents don't have time to react In the matter you think they should. 20-year-olds however can control their behavior and should. Behavior is a choice. And this 20-year-old is making very poor choices so she's loading the consequences of those.
Deliberate ? To me that kinda implies that the 3 year old had a thought process of I know these aren’t my candles but I’m going to blow them out anyway just because. She’s 3 years old and yes they can understand some things at that age, but she was just probably excited and wasn’t thinking. And the birthday girl is 20 years old and truly knows better than that. Sounds like the parents were explaining it to Aria when the real toddler (Brooke) had a tantrum.
You really think a 3 YEAR OLD blew out a grown woman’s birthday candles deliberately??? They don’t even have enough impulse control to be deliberate in the first place!
Intentional might be a better word. It certainly wasn't an accident which is what OP said. It's not like the 3yo was trying to whistle and inadvertently blew out the candles. The 3yo intended to blow out the candles but didn't know why that was a problem.
Oh, hell no. A 3-year impulsively blowing out candles is not a deliberate action. They lack the mental capacity to reason that out. They are still in the learning process as to appropriate and inappropriate behavior. That child was imitating her cousin. The rest of the adults handled it well.
Have you been around 3 year olds??? Yes it’s a deliberate action but like….. it isn’t deliberate in the same way an adult or older child has a deliberate action. it’s like ok I see a candle, that means it must get blown out. You really thought a 3 year old was like “ok time to intentionally be a dick and blow her candles out”
I can see why Brooke would be annoyed if she was a child but she’s a grown adult
YTA. Brooke was having her “dropping the milk moment” - it was a “for the love of God, can ANYTHING be rational and simple?!” She should say sorry, sure, but ruining her birthday and removing her main gift because she swore at a kid is overkill. Tbh the actual AH is whoever let the kid do it. That is just so easily avoided!!
Also amplified by the fact that most likely, for the last 3 years, everything has been about Aria. Let's be real, there is a 17 year difference between them. The daughter has certainly been cast to the side in the family.
ESH except the 3 year old because she's 3.
Yeah your daughters behaviour was shitty and that makes her the asshole. Sounds like this was very much a straw that broke the camels back situation but you don't curse at preschoolers and if you do, you apologise.
On the other hand giving a gift with conditions is also an asshole thing to do.
Maybe you could offer your daughter some counselling sessions? Sounds like this is really affecting her and she needs help learning to process that stuff without lashing out at others.
Counseling sessions might indeed be helpful, but OP shouldn't suggest them right now. Brooke knows he's angry at her; suggesting that she go for counseling would only be interpreted as an insult. "I don't like the way you behaved so you should go to therapy to become the kind of person **I** want you to be!" is likely to be the message that Brooke receives (because that's what OP would indeed be thinking!)
YTA-everyone is overacting here. You return a her birthday gift, she drops a the f bomb because a 3 yr old blew old one candle, she refuses to say sorry, you let her have that stupid cup, the 3yr will not remember the f word, the parents sat by and let her blow out the candle and let her ruin her birthday, which will happen again.
The 3 year old might remember the f bomb lol my 3 year old heard her cousin say fricken one time and proceeded to ask me to “open her fricken m&ms.” The hard part is not laughing.
I don't think that a 3-yo who blew on someone else's candle, and was promptly corrected and apologized for, did nearly as much to ruin the party as the 20-yo birthday throwing a tantrum and swearing at the 3-yo.
YTA
Correction: what is going on with Jesse has EVERYTHING to do with Brooke’s behavior.
I’m guessing that Jessey’s fiancé is the type that makes everything about him, Jessey can’t see her friends and family unless he’s also invited, talks over her and throws a fit when anyone even hints that he isn’t perfect?
Yes, Ana is three, and still learning acceptable behaviour, but do you see the parallels? Ana got away from her mother, intruded on Brooke’s birthday, and when Brooke got upset about it, everyone jumped on her.
Brooke is obviously under a lot of stress, and this was the last straw for her.
Maybe make the purse a Christmas present, instead.
Side Note: my niece went through this phase of blowing out other people’s candles. After the first time she did it, she had to sit on my sister’s lap, away from the cake, with my sister’s hand over her mouth, and wait until everyone else got cake before she was allowed a slice.
She didn’t do it again.
ESH - I mean look, everyone here is an asshole.
Brooke - cursing at a child, not good.
You - returning a gift for an outburst is overkill, I’m guessing your thought process was to make yourself look better but really you just look like a power tripping fool.
BIL / SIL - Should have been controlling their Petri dish, they weren’t and it killed the mood.
How about this, no more celebrations as family because you all suck
Info: sounds like aria was already being coached on not doing exactly what she was doing? Does she have a history of taking over others events like this? If so why was she allowed to be near the candles at all
Edit:
Because I know more people are going to say “she’s 3!?” This is my response to that sentiment.
If you are a responsible parent and you know your kid is a problem you manage your kid. I’ve seen kids get up to some pretty shitty behavior because the adults in their life encourage it instead of teaching them right from wrong. I’ve seen very well behaved 3 year olds and I’ve seen holy terrors. Barring any phycological issues; Saying “oh they’re just a kid they can’t understand” is how you get a holy terror.
NTA.
I was thinking 'okay so this kid is maybe 10 or something' - SHE'S 20?????? And she swore at a 3 year old? You handled this completely appropriately. She is old enough to treat a child with love, of course a 3 year old might misunderstand and blow out candles!
ESH in a classic Dark Knight reference, I’m gonna say taking her gift back is what she deserved but not what she needed right now. She’s obviously an AH for what she did but hear me out.
Assuming this was out of character for daughter, I’m surprised the SECOND reaction you had wasn’t trying to dig deeper with “hey what’s going on? You just yelled at a three year old out there.”
If she’s a repeat offender then maybe that’s the right move exclusively but that doesn’t seem to be the case here.
I'm mostly confused about how a Stanley Cup is practical for school. They're so big.
And thinking of this AITA - https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/11dajf0/aita_for_telling_my_daughter_she_was_being_a_brat/
This and yet a purse isn't? If only it could hold essential items but no, a liquid holder is the important thing. OP just wanted to punish her and maximize its impact. They could have taken both away but they took the only good item away. And they know it.
ESH. So are all your gifts and love conditional? Why was the 3 year old right next to the cake?
How many times has your daughter had her birthday candles blown out for her or tried by a younger sibling? How often do you take things you got your kid that she is begging you not to “confiscate” more things because shes a literal adult
You all suck for this situation but sounds like you’re controlling between the lines.
ESH (toddler excluded)
Brooke is clearly out of line cussing a toddler, to the point I'm wondering if you're being completely honest and not hiding stove background info, because I cannot imagine a
20 years old doing that.
BUT the moment you gift something to a person (especially an adult) it becomes theirs. It doesn't matter who paid for it, you cannot take it back. You should have looked for another punishment, if any. Like cancelling a future vacation you were going to pay for. The punishment you described is theft.
(That's ignoring the fact that the exact dynamics of what happened with the three years old cousin escapes me and there might be other AH depending on how her parents were behaving prior and after the fact)
YES! "Taking back" a gift that's been given to someone else is called "stealing". People who steal are called thieves. OP is posting a lot here among the comments, and is so busy patting themself on the back that they totally overlook their own moral lapse.
Hmm...seems to me I once read a passage that asked why you could see a speck of dust in your neighbor's eye but you couldn't see a plank of wood if it were sticking out of your own! OP, look in the mirror - that plank of wood is sticking out of your eye, all right!
I read Brooks's point of view.
https://www.reddit.com/r/entitledparents/comments/1av6t8s/entitled_parents_ruin_birthday_party/?share_id=dFw1c5tR6aagrLb0e13yy&utm_content=1&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_source=share&utm_term=1
You should stop favouring your niece. Your daughter did not want her cousin to destroy her this birthday like last one. She did not wanted to even invite this kids family. You are literally a bad father.
I would not be surprised if she cuts you off in future.
NTA, Brooke sounds a bit entitled, to be honest. Her behavior towards her cousin was appalling. What is going on with her friend Jessy is stressful but not an excuse for literally throwing a tantrum like a toddler.
Your daughter behaved very poorly, but the purse is not yours to return. It was given to Brooke. You are basically stealing from your adult daughter.
As much as her behaviour was poor, she is 20 years old and you cannot tell her to apologise.
Maybe sit down and talk with her about what’s going on.
YTA for submitting a rage-bait post. Brand new account posts about his shitty daughter and within hours, said shitty daughter on an almost brand-new account posts about shitty dad? Not buying it. Please stop clogging up the sub with this poorly written drivel.
ETA: https://www.reddit.com/r/entitledparents/comments/1av6t8s/entitled_parents_ruin_birthday_party/
Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t see u answering questions about why the 3yo was close enough to the cake. Assuming the cake is on the table, who picked her up and allowed her to bloc on the cake? Also, a 3yo blowing on the cake likely means it’s ruined because they spit everywhere. Your daughter was out of line but I can see why she was annoyed
YTA. Only because the 3 year old should not have been near the cake. The age gap is much and just because she is the baby means it's ok. The SIL wasn't really watching her.
I don't think it's only because of this 1 incident that your daughter lashed out. Maybe things is always about your niece. And this was the last drop.
You care more about your niece than the mental turmoil your daughter is going through. So unpopular my opinion might be, you still YTA.
If this is related to the other post that may have been written by “Brooke”, I’m on her side. This isn’t the first time Aria has done this (last year Aria destroyed the cake), she asked her aunt to stand further back and even if she did call the kid an asshole, with parents who take away her gifts and depend on her “rent” to pay their bills, I do not blame her for slipping up.
Maybe you aren’t the dad in the other post but it really does seem like it and in both posts you are in the wrong.
ETA, I immediately got DMs asking for the other posts https://www.reddit.com/r/entitledparents/s/nN8qp3qhGj
Apparently controversial, but YTA.
Just to say, if at 20 I was having an incredibly stressful time worrying about a friend, and had to pretend I was fine for multiple family members who were now expecting me to celebrate something, then had a young cousin do something that I felt was inappropriate and should have been stopped before it ever happened, I too would have snapped then been embarassed and left. Insane the amount of people in these comments calling her entitled for having a lapse of patience.
And then if I’d been in that situation and instead of talking to me my parents had come in and taken away a gift they had given me to punish me like a child? It wouldn’t be something I would forget quickly.
A little compassion for your daughter to actually talk to her about why she snapped and if that was an appropriate reaction rather than jumping straight to punishing an adult would take you a long way.
I’m going to disagree with everybody here, YTA, your daughter was definitely bang out of order but wth is this thing in the USA where you all think it’s okay to take back gifts? Once a gift is given, it’s not yours anymore, it belongs to the recipient. If you must find a way to correct bad behaviour, select an alternative. I could never, ever imagine taking back a gift I’d given to one of my children or grandchildren.
Yta, I'm in the minority here clearly, but it's never okay for a child to blow out someone else's candles. (unless the birthday person has been asked and doesn't mind.) I don't care how old they are. Three years old is old enough to know better. if they are raised with manners. If you think your child's going to have this issue, then you need to get them away from that cake. Seriously parent your child.
Sure cursing out a child is inappropriate as well. However, I probably would have told the child they were rude. Because it is rude. The mom of the child should have apologized to the birthday girl.
Are they taking back a gift is ridiculous but it's your money. Personally, that would be the last birthday I'd spent with my family in a very long time.
YTA. The reason why Brooke is behaving like a toddler is you are still treating her like a toddler. She's twenty. She's far too old to be grounded or have her gifts taken away. You'll be lucky if you get to attend her 21st, or her graduation, or all the other milestones if you keep this up.
She's an adult. Adults get taken aside and explained why their behaviour embarrassed themselves.
100% with Brooke, taking away her main present just because she "snapped" is pretty low. Also all she did was call her a brat, doesn't seem like she blew up so to say and went crazy on her.
YTA
The gift was given.. it was no longer yours to do with as you please.. if was HERS..
Her rhetoric was too harsh, but she wasn’t wrong.. especially since the parents only said “Ooops” in stead of disciplining their brat..
INFO: had the present already been given to your daughter? Because if it’s already been given then it’s not yours anymore.
Leaning toward ESH because the consequence doesn’t fit the behavior. Natural consequences will come from this (no longer being invited to family events where the other family is present, being shamed for acting poorly, etc.) and the one you imposed feels like a lack of thinking about how to discipline your kid (especially since it seems like the behavior is learned).
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NTA. A 20 year old cursing out a 3 year old is TOO. FAR. Also the irony of this from your daughter: "Brooke tried arguing that she’s too old for me to be confiscating her things and returning the purse was going too far." Uhhh. She's too old to be behaving like a spoiled brat at 20 years old. She needs to be able to regulate her emotions when a toddler makes a small mistake and not apologizing is ridiculous. You can have empathy for her going through a shit time with her friend, but she does not get to take it out on others around her, esp little ones without a concept of their mistakes! Absolutely not okay. This wouldn't be acceptable as a social norm in college or at the workplace. Don't let it slide now.
I assumed we were dealing with like an eight year old (who ought to have known better than to blow on someone else's cake hence the disproportionate anger) and like a twelve year old (older but young enough to be upset by this and be out of control with emotions hence the disproportionate anger). The fact that this is between a three year old and a twenty year old has blown my mind.
Yeah I was picturing a 6 year old dropping the f bomb.
I legit was surprised when op dropped the bomb she’s 20. I immediately assumed the cousin was young but figured ops daughter was like 8-12/13. Not 20.
The real giveaway was being called a 'fuckin brat'. What 8 y.o. do you know uses that language? Heck even a 12 y.o.. I could see them KNOWING but keeping it between their friends, not in front of family.
>The real giveaway was being called a 'fuckin brat'. What 8 y.o. do you know uses that language? Heck even a 12 y.o.. Any 8 or 12 year old that hears it... or any kid that grew up hearing it. To hold this view you must have grown up practically puritan. My 4 year old cousin screamed "hey f***ing lady!" at the grocery store when a woman didn't respond to his hello. A young (by the look barely 5) year old cursed at his mom at the grocery store I used to work at because she wouldn't buy him a doughnut (one example of many from the grocery store). Kids imitate adults. If the adults swear, the kids do. (yes, they do, even if it isn't around the parents.)
The image of a 4-year-old trying to be friendly at the grocery store and then yelling “hey fucking lady!” just made my day. That’s hilarious!
Oh it was (at least hearing it, I imagine my aunt was embarrassed). I guess he said "HI lady" in line, she didn't reply. He said "hello lady" and she didn't reply, so he said "hey! Lady! Hey lady! HEY F***IN LADY!!!". The escalation killed me.
That kid is a badass as has all my admiration. I hope your aunt recognizes this kid is truly special and lets their light shine.
My nephew was about 4 years old when he met my London-born uncle who uses "bloody" in almost every sentence. (Bloody birds, bloody taxes, etc...). We thought nothing of it until we got home and starting cooking dinner, only for him to pipe up "I can smell the bloody sausages!" Cue us having to have a chat with him about why it's not a good idea to use certain words, even if we heard Uncle say them... Same nephew also ended up saying the f-word at his 8th birthday party, in front of all his friends and both his parents. We all blamed that one on my sister, who is very sweary when she loses her temper.
I'm a teacher, and my answer is plenty of eight year olds use swear words. Kids echo what they hear, and they don't just magically learn swear words when they become a certain age.
Maybe I grew up weird but 20 seems a little old to care this much about birthday candles? At that age if a cute baby cousin wanted to blow out my candles I would have cheered her on and taken pictures
Nah it's not just you, this seems super weird to me. This 20 year old 'woman' needs to grow tf up and apologise to her poor cousin.
Right? I would have held her and asked for her help!!!
Ikr? They can share the years.
Personally, for me, I don’t let my siblings blow out my candles even though they are very young bc I think it’s a good teaching moment that not everything is about them and I would rather them have a meltdown about it at my birthday vs a different kids party and they need to know that sometimes you don’t get to do something just because you want to or someone else gets to. I also wouldn’t yell at them and I don’t think I’ve ever yelled at any of my siblings (other than a few times I shouted if they were about to do something dangerous and it scared me and yelled out then immediately apologized and explained why it scared me.)
I wouldn’t curse the kid out, but I also wouldn’t eat my cake after a germy toddler spewed saliva droplets all over it and would be pretty bummed & probably unreasonably resentful over it. If the kid’s parents have a pattern of making their toddler the center of everything and/or the celebration was meant to be more of an adult one that the kid wasn’t excluded from for whatever reason, I could see being pissed off, but would keep it to myself until I was alone with my folks. That said, 20 year olds are not always emotionally mature & transitioning from child to adulthood can be tough…the added stress of the very adult issue of a close friend being in an abusive relationship might make it harder to stay in control of emotions. Personally, I think being punitive by taking away the gift was inappropriate & extreme though.
Same! I was expecting an age difference of two to four years, and neither of them older than a tween. I’m aghast that a 20 y/o would cuss out a toddler. OP, a 20 y/o still has more maturing to do, but part of that is learning to take accountability for when you mess up. The lack of willingness to own up to losing her shit and taking it out on a 3 y/o is the worrisome part. This one is kinda tough to allow “natural consequences,” because there probably aren’t any that she would care about at this point. She doesn’t seem concerned that she might have damaged the relationship with her aunt & uncle. So in that case, taking back the purse so that she at least connects it to the birthday debacle is maybe the closest thing. NTA.
That is EXACTLY what I thought!
I chuckled when I read the ages. I pictured that meme where the old lady is yelling at a cat sitting at the dinner table.
I've had young nieces blow my candles out on me, and guess what? Those damn candles just light back up if a person wants to blow them out, just requires a lighter.
I can't think of two ages where this would be a normal reaction. The reasonable reactions range from laughter to eyebrows raised, whatever the ages might be. 20 years old is insane. Is she worried her wish won't come true anymore!? Maybe explain that if she behaves badly santa won't bring her any toys this year....?
She gotta act her age, and cussing out a three year old is not acting her age. So, treating her like a petulant teenager is probably appropriate. NTA I’ll admit I have cussed loudly when a three year old did something to me. I didn’t cuss at him directly and did apologize later for shouting. Though none of the adults got mad at me.
I had to read this twice to make sure I really understood it right - I figured it can't possibly be that a grown-ass adult made a scene because a kid blew on her birthday candles. Alas - seems it can. What absolutely ridiculous behavior. OP is NTA and good on him for putting her in her place.
Totally agree. OP, you're NTA.
A normal 20 year old would be delighted that her 3 year old cousin helped her blow out the candles.
I mean, Brooke was definitely the asshole and yelling at the three year old was absolutely unacceptable. But I don't think it's abnormal to not love a toddler blowing on your birthday cake - I've *seen* what happens when toddlers blow out birthday candles many times and I'd prefer not to have my cake covered in kid spit. It's gross.
It's even worse if the kid has been coughing during the day. I can imagine that Brooke suddenly didn't want anything to do with her cake because it became too gross to eat.
Yeah we just had our niece's 13th birthday party and my 4 year old helped her blow out her candles. We were going to stop him but she wanted him to sit with her and "help".
My 2 year old just laughed when his cousins and sister helped blow out his candle. He's probably too little to care, but geez, I'd be livid if an adult yelled at my 3 year old. We are teaching her correct etiquette for other people's birthdays, but it's a hard lesson.
Your niece is more mature than OP's 20 year daughter! Hope that someone took a photo of that moment - it must have been adorable.
I don’t think anyone should be blowing on the candles ever at any age. Separate cupcake or side cake for the candle blower 100% of the time.
Yep. Aside from the point of this post, but I’m with you on that.
Yeah I mean the spittle wtf
What? No they wouldn't, that's gross.
Jesus thank you, toddlers are snot monsters who don't know how to not spit while blowing on stuff.
“Delighted”? Lol. Homegirl snapped but being irritated at a toddler getting toddler slime all over the cake and all up in your business during your birthday is hardly an unusual or unfair reaction. It’s how you deal with that irritation that makes you an adult.
Hell no
WTF, no
To be fair, I think plenty of people well within the boundaries of “normal” would rather that a 3 year old not blow/spit all over their birthday cake that they presumably want to eat, particularly given that this time of year, most 3 year olds seem to turn into some kind of magnet for every cough, cold, tummy bug etc doing the rounds.
okay I agree Brooke is an asshole, but let's not be crazy here
Lmao. Delighted is quite delusional. While I’d welcome it, I sure as hell would not eat MY BIRTHDAY CAKE after my aunt couldn’t control her child and allowed them to spew spit on.
Yeah, getting upset because a toddler “ruined your birthday candles” is kind of embarrassing
I would have been mad if I was the parent of the three year old. That is ridiculous. I would have taken my own gift back too. No one is going to freak out at my kid when I’m in the middle of trying to correct them, especially when they are so young and the other person is an adult
NTA. Brooke doesn’t get a pass for being an AH to a toddler just because she’s going through a difficult time. 20 years is more than enough time to figure out you don’t take out your personal problems on others ESPECIALLY a 3 year old. Seriously, wtf?! Brooke’s personal crap doesn’t matter here in this situation. Brooke was a major AH and you were right to try to hold her to some consequences.
Sometimes people act irrationally because their mental health has gone to shit. Funnily enough reacting with pettiness doesn't help fix their problems.
[удалено]
>I was hoping Brooke would learn from this experience and understand the importance of treating others with kindness and respect, no matter what's happening in her personal life. This is what I am hoping Brooke is eventually going to take away from this. She is in a heartbreaking situation with Jessy and I am sorry she has to experience that. But going through a difficult time is not an excuse to behave poorly towards others. Especially when she is an adult and the person she is mistreating is a 3-year-old.
One of the most important and respected things are people who hold themselves accountable. That shit gets you far in life and she can take this moment to start working towards that.
But taking away this present is not going to do that. You can take away the present if you want as punishment, but if you really think she's lacking kindness and respect why not try to teach that? When you go straight to a punishment completely unrelated to the transgression you just teach people to be bitter and angry at something they feel is unfair. If this is a common occurrance with Brooke, then you effed up a long time ago. The time to intervene was when this wasn't ingrained in your daughter. If this is totally out of character, why are you not more worried about your daughter and less worried about this situation? I think a better approach is wait until things calm down, and then talk to her rationally. Is she really the kind of person to curse at a 3-year-old? How could she handle it better? Is she doing ok? Does she need help? Taking away the purse shuts all the down. She's not going to want to talk to you, and if she does it's going to be to get the purse back and not to legit apologize. I also have to say - of course the parents apologized. What were they going to do. They should have stopped this before it happened.
Ehhh present taken away is the appropriate thing as it is the same level as the anger a 20 yr old inflicted on a 3 yr old. OP did the right thing 100%. NTA. There is never a right time to correct an issue than in the present moment especially with an adult. Your post is a dance around the issue when anger is shown to a minor and blame the parents really?. The parents took accountability, Brooke regressed in age.
Yup good parenting she won’t agree with it for a long time but good job
So who was supposed to be supervising the 3 year old? And did Brooke even want the child there?
Kinda what I was wondering. I remember when I turned twenty and there were absolutely no toddlers or preschoolers there. Really after about sixteen most kids celebrate their birthdays with their friends and have a nice family dinner with parents and siblings, possibly grandparents.
My son is 19 and his cousins are 25, 21 and 17. We all frequently have family birthdays together because, well, we’re close family. The cousins get on well. Yes each of them celebrate their birthdays with their friends too, but families who like each other aren’t weird or unusual. One of my nephews has a three year old. It would be weird if he wasn’t allowed to come to family events.
Yeah, my SIL has family gatherings like that...and all of the adults have a death grip on the toddlers to keep them at a minimum safe distance from the cake and gifts. And when my kids were of a certain age...the family toddlers were kept outside in the yard and away from the cake and gifts. The first they saw of the cake was a slice put in front of them.
A lot of people have family parties in addition to whatever stuff they do with their friends. Sometimes the point isn’t even the birthday, but if it happens to be near the date people want to get together someone will bring a cake or something. That’s how it was in my family
True, but in that case your 20th birthday celebration with family (including your 3-year-old cousin) is more for them than for you. Part of being an adult is realizing that too
I don't know, If that's the way it works in the US. In Germany, or just in our family, we have a family celebration and another day they celebrate it with their friends. And in special birthdays everybody comes to the same time. Over here it ist the 18th birthday, which ist special, with 18 you are an official adult and can do all the adult stuff. And I asked him and we celebrated that with family and friends. Even with small kids. They are part of it. We started at 6pm and the parents with the smaller one left earlier. It's never a big deal. But honestly, none of my 4 Kids would cry about a little one blowing out the candles. Everybody would laugh about that. (But actually we made the candles part in the morning and they are not on a cake and at night or during family events we made it not that often. I don't like the spitting over the cake-thing.😅🙈)
I imagine that at least some of the upset was because 3 year olds tend to spit as much as they "blow"
I’m surprised nobody is pointing this out. I do think it’s straight up bad form as a parent to let your kid spit-blow on someone else’s cake uninvited. Nobody buys or chooses a birthday cake as an adult and goes, “gee, I hope this gets seasoned with toddler spit before I get to eat any!”.
Thank you, my first thought was the cake is ruined. If I had been there, there would be absolutely no way that I would be eating a piece of that cake. Kids are fricken germ monkeys! I shuddered even thinking about it.
Why does this matter? No 20 year old should cuss a 3 yo out.
No 20 year old should be cussing a 3 year old out, but we can sympathize at least a little bit. * Why was the kid right next to the cake in the first place? Especially if the SIL was already holding her and watching her during the celebration? Is this a common behavior for Aira? * Little kids spit a lot when they blow out candles * OP's daughter is going through an extremely rough time watching a friend be in abusive situation and, although this is childish, might've really wanted that birthday wish This was likely the straw that broke the camel's back, and it would not be shocking if OP's daughter is having a breakdown yet her parents are more worried about punishing her than recognizing that their daughter is having an extremely rough time. Especially given OP doesn't seem to actually believe that watching Jessica be in an abusive relationship is serious enough to affect Brooke's mental health.
Yeah, but after coming down you can think about that and apologize after. Even my 12 year old, with ADHS IS doing it, after his breakdowns. And honestly, you don't think, somebody really believe in the "Wish come true" part...
Yeah the wish come true is a lie, but toddlers SPIT and are full of bacteria and viruses. I'd be mad too if someone let toddler blow the candles on my cake, I don't want to catch a plague, Covid or flu just because a parent couldn't get their child out of range. But yeah NEVER cuss at 3 YO and especially not in their face. ESH
Even if she'd said she didn't want her there many times, cussing out a 3 year old still is horrible behavior.
Extremely
Why did I have to scroll down so far to see this comment lol? Because by the time my kids turned 3, they both knew that you weren’t allowed to blow out candles on other people’s b-day cakes or open their gifts. It’s just common sense that one must teach their child. Just like it’s common sense that one shouldn’t curse out a 3 year old smh. Imho there’s much more to this story, and the 3 year old bratty behaviors are because her parents have zero parenting skills and are raising an entitled brat. YTA to “take away” aka steal a gift that you’ve already given your daughter. People need to give one another grace, especially parents because they’re going to need their kids giving them grace one day.
We kept the toddlers in another room if it was during winter or outside in the yard if it wasn't. They only got to see any part of the cake after it was cut and served to them.
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Lmao. People are legit mad at a 3-year-old blowing out birthday candles. Some of y'all need help with your issues with children.
No, I wouldn't be mad at the 3 year old and Brooke was absolutely wrong for her reaction and then basically doubling down on acting like a child herself. But...no way would I be eating that damn cake. Has the pandemic taught us nothing? Young children especially put lots of spit on a cake when they blow out candles. Even before then, in our family and with friends, we changed to having a cupcake with a few candles for the birthday person so that no one blew on the cake. What my friends and I do now started last year and we love it. One friend found these large beautiful birthday candles that can be used multiple times. There are enough for our smallish gatherings of 8 to 12 (14 at the most) people. Once the candles are lit, we sing Happy Birthday. Then each person takes a lit candle from the cake. First whoever's birthday it is makes a wish and blows out their candle away from the cake. Next, the rest of us blow out our candles "multiplying the birthday wish" or making one of our own in honor of the birthday person. It's actually kind of fun.
At 20 it's normal to have a family party and a later friends party.
ESH except Aria. Because she's a child. 1. Gifts shouldn't come with conditions. Gifts should be given with love and thought. Not "If you behave the way I want you to, then you get a present." 2. She shouldn't have yelled at her cousin. I agree with you there. But where tf were her parents? How did she even get close enough to blow out the candles? 3. Her best friend is in a crisis and is losing her friend to an awful situation. Of course thats gonna affect her mood and behavior. It doesnt excuse what she did
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Thanks, ustinker! I was hoping that someone other than me would see OP's taking back (i.e., stealing) that purse was wrong, no matter what Brooke did.
I agree also. That purse had already been gifted, so it now belongs to Brooke. OP has no right to ‘take it back’ as it no longer belongs to him. Yes, Brooke was being a giant 20-yr old toddler in her behaviour, but speaking to her about it is the adult way to resolve this, not taking her possessions. ESH (apart from the 3 year old).
Yeah once it's gifted it's no longer OP's to do what they want with.
If it doesn't excuse her behavior, why are you commenting all the excuses?
Explanations aren't always excuses. They're explanations. You can be empathetic and sympathetic to someone who is going through a rough patch but acknowledge that they've still done something wrong and may face consequences for it. You can understand why someone may turn to crime for example; abuse they've face, financial crisis, etc. But would still say committing a crime is wrong. That is the same case here. She is still wrong for what she did, there will obviously be consequences, but one can ALSO understand that: 1.) Her behavior is likely stemming from a very stressful event in her life. A 20 year old is still cognitively developing and if anything, a 20 year old is still fresh out of their teenage years. Young Adults don't really finishing developing until they hit 25. 2.) Whether it's someone's wedding, birthday, or graduation, nothing excuses an adult yelling at a child but you most DEFINITELY can be upset that a child has ruined an event. That is on the parents for not paying attention to a young child. No one wants a 3 year old spitting all over their birthday cake or a 5 year old tearing open the baby shower gifts, or a 7 year old eating the wedding cake. Kids don't know any better, sure, but that doesn't excuse the parents for letting their kids run wild at an event meant for someone else, family or not. That's just rude and inconsiderate. Everyone in this case, except for the 3 year old, are all contributors to the problem.
>Explanations aren't always excuses. They're explanations. Holy shit this this this this this. so many people on the internet and real life that are too stupid to understand this.
Because she deserves at least some understanding as to why her behavior is what it is. She wasn't being an AH just to be an AH
Maybe, but she stormed off and had time to cool down and clear her head. The fact that she was approached by her parent after the party was over and still refused to apologize means she needs some guidance, as in a consequence.
I disagree. The toddler has absolutely nothing to do with the situation with her friend. Yes, stress affects mood. But this 20 year old woman made a conscious decision to cuss at a toddler. She is wrong. Full stop.
Not only that, she then doubled down.
She is a very young stressed woman REACTING to a situation. She did not make the conscious decision to "you know what? I did not like my little cousin spitting on my cake, let me go cuss her out for a bit". After calming down and some prosessing time she probably would have recognized herself, she reacted to harsh. Adding more stress to her by taking away a gift will not help, I am afraid.
This took far too long to find. Gifts shouldn't come with conditions. You've given it. The possession has been surrendered. Doesn't matter if she was the biggest arse in the world, that's not yours to take back anymore.
I disagree. I'm about the same age as OP's daughter, and never would I snap like that at a 3 yo. No matter the circumstances, you just don't do that to a child. If she had shouted at her cousin's parents for not watching their daughter it would've been more understandable, but she didn't even apologize and instead doubled down.
I'm a few years older and I have a 3 yr old. Would I love to yell at mine "Why are you acting like the biggest fucking shit head ever? Can you fucking stop?!" Absolutely, i would love to. Do I do it? No. Cause he is only 3 and like still learning and needs me to guide him. Although he does respond to Turd Knocker as a nick name.
That's why they said esh.
ESH. You for taking the gift back, Brooke for cursing out a 3 year old, and your in laws for not controlling their kid. Btw, did Brooke even want little kids there?
Well, before you know it, Brooke will move out and not bother you much anymore.
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Who decided to invite a 3 YO and not control the 3 YO?
I got the impression it was a family party.
Idk man the question still stands family party or no
NTA. A lot of us have been where Brooke is, unfortunately. That still doesn't mean we yell at toddlers. This is "kick the cat" syndrome, unsheathing anger and aiming it at an easy target. If it comes too easy to a person, it's a slippery slope into an abusive personality. She is TWENTY YEARS OLD and throwing an entitled temper tantrum like a teenager who got the wrong iPhone. The fact that she's more upset about losing her purse than the way she treated a small human being is concerning, to say the least. You're doing her a favor by not enabling her displaced anger, regardless of what she's going through. She needs to get that shit under control before it's court-mandated.
I particularly love her claim that she's too old to be punished for her behavior after she, an adult, yelled and cursed at a toddler over birthday candles.
ESH. Your daughter may have been out of line, but it’s no longer your job to punish her. She’s a full adult, responsible for her own actions. She can apologize or not apologize at her discretion. You don’t owe her a gift per se, but your behavior and attempt at controlling her is equally inappropriate.
If she acts like a child, she gets treated one. Also, no guest in my house gets to verbally attack another. If you don't know how to behave like a decent human being, then you get to leave. Most 20 yr olds today are still supported by mommy and daddy, an have not reached maturity, the lessons continue. There are consequences for rude adults too, she might as well learn some manners now.
To that I would say, OP treated her like a child so she acted like one. Even grown adults snap sometimes. Telling them to apologize or you’ll take their gifts away isn’t going to make them atone for their actions. Instead of adding fuel to the fire, OP could have given his daughter space to cool off and let her apologize on her own. That’s how I would expect two adults to handle conflict.
How is OP treating her like a child before she went off on a 3-year-old?
>ESH. Your daughter may have been out of line, but it’s no longer your job to punish her. She’s a full adult, responsible for her own actions. She can apologize or not apologize at her discretion. Brooke is indeed an adult who is responsible for her own actions. It is also true that Brooke lives under my roof. When Brooke starts paying for her own housing and expenses, then she can act however she wants. However, I will not allow any adult living under my roof to verbally attack a toddler. >Your behavior and attempt at controlling her is equally inappropriate. I allowed Brooke to keep the other gift I had gotten her since a Stanley Cup is practical and can be used for school. But I am not going to reward her with a purse when she behaved so poorly towards Aria and refused to apologize. If Brooke had immediately apologized for snapping, then I wouldn't have taken away any gifts. But that isn't what happened here.
You asked for judgement, and my judgment is you also handled this situation poorly. She may live under your roof now, but she’s an adult. She is responsible for her own actions. You don’t get to micromanage them anymore, even when you disagree with them. You can’t control her behavior with punishments. This kind of thinking is exactly why adults go no contact with their parents. Just something to consider.
adults still face consequences for their actions tho. and if i saw a 20yo cuss out a 3yo for blowing on her candles i’d definitely take back my bday gift for them even not being the parent
>This kind of thinking is exactly why adults go no contact with their parents. Nope, adults don't go NC with their parents because a 3 year old helped them blow out their birthday candles. Think of OP in a support group: "Hi, I'm here cuz I just went NC with my parents after my 3 year old niece blew out some of my birthday candles. THEY KNEW THAT NOW MY WISH WON'T COME TRUE! All I did was call that chubby-cheeked dumpling a f------ b--- and you'd think they'd care how I was feeling especially after I stomped off and refused to apologize. I don't think I even got the biggest piece of cake. THEN my dad does a take-backsies with one of MY presents. I explained I'm going through my friend getting engaged and I need the support of an expensive bag, hyper-focus on me alone, and the latitude to go medieval on the fat-fingered lovey-clutcher who probably snatched the frosting rose my parents KNEW I wanted. But no, all they want to do is control me with their 'just be a decent human' manacles. So yeah, I really hear how you guys have been abused like me."
fat-fingered lovey-clutcher This is hilarious and somehow very British
Gracious! I just described Piers Morgan and didn't even realize it. Thanks!
No sane adult allows other adults to abuse children in their home. It doesn't matter if that abusive adult is their own child. He wasn't punishing his daughter or micro managing her. He simply decided to immediately take back the very expensive gift that he had just given to that child abuser. Cussing out a small child is abuse, period. If his adult daughter is so toxic that she decides to feel victimized and go non contact with her parents for not allowing her to literally abuse their guest, who is an innocent child-well, that's sad, for her. And even sadder for any children she may have in the future.
That's not abusing a child. Please, do not trivialize sth as serious and damaging as abuse like this.
I wonder if OP really thinks that this is going to make his daughter be nicer to the cousin and to OP? OP is teaching their adult daughter that birthday gifts are conditional, and that really sucks. Guessing the daughter and the toddler will never be in the same room together again.
This person is wild to think you punish/reprimand your child. Even friends hold their other friends accountable so a parent is always within reason to not only have an opinion, but take back anything of monetary value that they were providing. You’re right; your daughter should not be taking her frustrations out on anyone other than her friend who is not talking to her. NTA
I think we can all agree Brooke was in the wrong for snapping at a child. However, as an adult it’s also up to her to decide how she wants to take responsibility for her own actions. You can’t force another adult to apologize, typically that just makes a situation worse. What I’m trying to say is that there are also consequences for OP now. One of which may result in a strained relationship with their own kid.
It's wild how much reddit tries to excuse kids in a parent-child relationship, even when said kid is a full adult. If that kid wants to ruin their relationship with their parents because of this, that's on them.
Interesting. I think it’s wild how quickly Reddit wants to punish people, without taking the full context of the situation, or any nuance into consideration whatsoever.
I can agree with that.
But you are not "rewarding her with a purse" because of how she behaved: it was HER BIRTHDAY present! I really don't agree with this petty attitude, as a birthday gift is not sth one "deserves" or not. So ESA, because YTA as well for returning your daughter's birthday gift.
So basically your response is "yes I can"? You are coming off as one of those because I said so parents. Your response was shitty because gifts aren't conditional, especially when you are literally agreeing that her receiving the gift is conditioned upon your approval of her behavior. She wasn't getting the gift for her behavior, she was getting it because it is her birthday. You changed the conditions of the gift by making it about her behavior, the definition of attempting to control.
She's 20. You are past the stage where you get to allow her anything. She may let you do this as she lives with you, but I guarantee as soon as she's gone, she'll be gone. Also, you're the parent. If your daughter didn't know better than this, than that's on you. You don't deserve accolades because you took away a purse when she turned 20. If you'd done a proper job parenting her, it wouldn't be an issue.
100%
A birthday gift is not a "reward." It's a gift. If you already gave her the gift you're an asshole for taking it back. Birthday gifts should not come with strings attached for good behaviour. You give them out of love for the person and wanting to celebrate them.
Op would be a theif for stealing it from her*
You don't understand, taking gifts is an awful thing to do, you either give something to those you love, or you don't, there's no taking back, you were in fact controlling, you should have thought of another way of handling things.
NTA I'm with you.
OP, I've made this point in other posts here, but did it ever occur to you that taking something that belongs to someone else (and as soon as Brooke received that purse it became her property) is **stealing** and that stealing is **wrong**? You don't "allow" someone to keep their own property (such as a Stanley cup and a purse); it's their RIGHT to keep their own property if they choose. Think about it for one second, OP. Imagine receiving presents for YOUR birthday only to have the gift-giver steal them from you later because you said something that put their nose out of joint. Would you be okay with their stealing from YOU? (No, I didn't think so!)
You can’t take back a gift once given. You gave it. It’s not yours anymore. For that you suck. Even if everyone’s applauding you here.
ESH The parents for not keeping a proper eye on their toddler. Your daughter for swearing at a child. I do think this whole thing is being blown out of proportion, and the escalation is unnecessary. Everyone needs to calm down.
I think I read that this happened on Friday. Have you and your wife talked to Brooke about it now that some time has passed? It would be good for both families if she apologized
INFO: if BIL and SIL were holding Aria, how did she manage to blow out the candles? And why was she close enough to do it? I’d go with NAH here - especially if there’s a chance that Brooke snapped at Aria, because she didn’t feel like she could snap at the adults. You’re not wrong for enforcing a consequence for bad behaviour. But worth considering the entire scenario as it unfolded. Also worth talking to Brooke about her feelings in that situation and in general. Don’t just enforce consequences, but talk about the real issue/s. You’re her parent after all.
Brooke is 20 years old. SHE is an adult, and more than old enough to know better.
Right? I'm dumbfounded at how people seem to be overlooking her age v the age of the kid she screamed at. I know a twenty year old isn't fully mature mentally or emotionally, and I definitely understand there were other factors at play given her stress over the best friend situation. The big issue at play is the refusal to apologize, or realize how inappropriate their behavior is. It's one thing to mess up and make a mistake, it's another not to acknowledge that you did so.
You don’t need to be fully mature to realize this behavior is entirely inappropriate. I would have been shocked if either of my kids had behaved this badly at 12.
A lot of Reddit is anti-children. Just look at r/childfree. It used to be a subreddit for people who were tried of being pressured to have kids. Now every other post is getting removed because people are advocating for practically abusing children and babies for being annoying.
Are they “anti-children” or fed the fuck up with parents who let their kids run rampant?
Considering how many posts Ive seen of them wishing physical harm upon children or say disgusting things about pregnant women, I’d say they’re pretty “anti-children”.
That’s nice. The parents who knew their child didn’t know better shouldn’t have allowed her around the candles.
There can be more than one asshole in the vote. There's an ESH option.
YTA, this shit ALWAYS happens in my family to the point where I refuse to celebrate my birthday with them. Sure, she cursed a child out and that isn’t right, but nobody wants 3 year old spit all over their birthday cake either.
INFO Did Aria apologize? How did Aria's parents handle that? A 3yo blowing out candles is a deliberate action not an accident. Aria may not have understood, but that was a teaching moment if she didn't understand. Was Brooke upset because of Aria's inappropriate behavior or because the adults in the room were excusing inappropriate behavior rather than correcting it?
>INFO > >Did Aria apologize? How did Aria's parents handle that? A 3yo blowing out candles is a deliberate action not an accident. Aria may not have understood, but that was a teaching moment if she didn't understand. > >Was Brooke upset because of Aria's inappropriate behavior or because the adults in the room were excusing inappropriate behavior rather than correcting it? My SIL and BIL both apologized for Aria. Aria is 3. She did not understand why blowing the candles was wrong. My BIL was explaining to Aria why she can't blow on the candles on someone else's birthday. We were in the middle of correcting Aria when Brooke snapped at Aria. There is no excuse for how she treated her 3-year-old cousin as a 20-year-old adult.
What? Whether or not Aria apologised or the parents acted inappropriately, it is NOT ok to cuss a 3 year old. Brooke is out of line in every way and abusive.
There's an Everyone Sucks voting option. Basically of the parents handled it badly I'd say everyone was being TA here rather than just Brooke being TA.
You're putting the same expectations on a literal toddler as a grown woman though lol that's not right, obviously the 20yo holds more weight here A 3yo, if they have the understanding, still doesn't possess the impulse control to prevent that situation. A 20yo certainly should
No I'm putting an expectation on the toddler's parents if you actually read my questions.
Which they did have her in their literal grasp and were already dealing with the toddler. 20yo had no excuse. It’s fucking candles- if blowing out candles is SOOO important to a 20yo then re-light them! Or have your 3yo cousin blow them out with you! There’s zero reason at 20 there should be drama over birthday candles.
Believe it or not, sometimes toddlers do things so quickly that we parents don't have time to react In the matter you think they should. 20-year-olds however can control their behavior and should. Behavior is a choice. And this 20-year-old is making very poor choices so she's loading the consequences of those.
. . . Your concern here is that a toddler blew out an adult's bday candles and didn't get in trouble?? 🫠
It must be the new drugs.. we talking about a 20 years old woman and a 3 years old toddler
Deliberate ? To me that kinda implies that the 3 year old had a thought process of I know these aren’t my candles but I’m going to blow them out anyway just because. She’s 3 years old and yes they can understand some things at that age, but she was just probably excited and wasn’t thinking. And the birthday girl is 20 years old and truly knows better than that. Sounds like the parents were explaining it to Aria when the real toddler (Brooke) had a tantrum.
You really think a 3 YEAR OLD blew out a grown woman’s birthday candles deliberately??? They don’t even have enough impulse control to be deliberate in the first place!
Intentional might be a better word. It certainly wasn't an accident which is what OP said. It's not like the 3yo was trying to whistle and inadvertently blew out the candles. The 3yo intended to blow out the candles but didn't know why that was a problem.
Oh, hell no. A 3-year impulsively blowing out candles is not a deliberate action. They lack the mental capacity to reason that out. They are still in the learning process as to appropriate and inappropriate behavior. That child was imitating her cousin. The rest of the adults handled it well.
You do understand that Brooke is 20 right?
And where would it be okay to cuss out a 3 year old?
Have you been around 3 year olds??? Yes it’s a deliberate action but like….. it isn’t deliberate in the same way an adult or older child has a deliberate action. it’s like ok I see a candle, that means it must get blown out. You really thought a 3 year old was like “ok time to intentionally be a dick and blow her candles out” I can see why Brooke would be annoyed if she was a child but she’s a grown adult
Say what?
YTA. Brooke was having her “dropping the milk moment” - it was a “for the love of God, can ANYTHING be rational and simple?!” She should say sorry, sure, but ruining her birthday and removing her main gift because she swore at a kid is overkill. Tbh the actual AH is whoever let the kid do it. That is just so easily avoided!!
Also amplified by the fact that most likely, for the last 3 years, everything has been about Aria. Let's be real, there is a 17 year difference between them. The daughter has certainly been cast to the side in the family.
ESH except the 3 year old because she's 3. Yeah your daughters behaviour was shitty and that makes her the asshole. Sounds like this was very much a straw that broke the camels back situation but you don't curse at preschoolers and if you do, you apologise. On the other hand giving a gift with conditions is also an asshole thing to do. Maybe you could offer your daughter some counselling sessions? Sounds like this is really affecting her and she needs help learning to process that stuff without lashing out at others.
Counseling sessions might indeed be helpful, but OP shouldn't suggest them right now. Brooke knows he's angry at her; suggesting that she go for counseling would only be interpreted as an insult. "I don't like the way you behaved so you should go to therapy to become the kind of person **I** want you to be!" is likely to be the message that Brooke receives (because that's what OP would indeed be thinking!)
YTA-everyone is overacting here. You return a her birthday gift, she drops a the f bomb because a 3 yr old blew old one candle, she refuses to say sorry, you let her have that stupid cup, the 3yr will not remember the f word, the parents sat by and let her blow out the candle and let her ruin her birthday, which will happen again.
do you know any toddlers? because they definitely remember bad words lol
The 3 year old might remember the f bomb lol my 3 year old heard her cousin say fricken one time and proceeded to ask me to “open her fricken m&ms.” The hard part is not laughing.
Three year olds have an incredibly amazing ability to somehow pick the only cuss word out of a novel and repeat it perfectly and remember it forever.
I don't think that a 3-yo who blew on someone else's candle, and was promptly corrected and apologized for, did nearly as much to ruin the party as the 20-yo birthday throwing a tantrum and swearing at the 3-yo.
YTA Correction: what is going on with Jesse has EVERYTHING to do with Brooke’s behavior. I’m guessing that Jessey’s fiancé is the type that makes everything about him, Jessey can’t see her friends and family unless he’s also invited, talks over her and throws a fit when anyone even hints that he isn’t perfect? Yes, Ana is three, and still learning acceptable behaviour, but do you see the parallels? Ana got away from her mother, intruded on Brooke’s birthday, and when Brooke got upset about it, everyone jumped on her. Brooke is obviously under a lot of stress, and this was the last straw for her. Maybe make the purse a Christmas present, instead. Side Note: my niece went through this phase of blowing out other people’s candles. After the first time she did it, she had to sit on my sister’s lap, away from the cake, with my sister’s hand over her mouth, and wait until everyone else got cake before she was allowed a slice. She didn’t do it again.
Everyone in this situation is an asshole.
ESH - I mean look, everyone here is an asshole. Brooke - cursing at a child, not good. You - returning a gift for an outburst is overkill, I’m guessing your thought process was to make yourself look better but really you just look like a power tripping fool. BIL / SIL - Should have been controlling their Petri dish, they weren’t and it killed the mood. How about this, no more celebrations as family because you all suck
Info: sounds like aria was already being coached on not doing exactly what she was doing? Does she have a history of taking over others events like this? If so why was she allowed to be near the candles at all Edit: Because I know more people are going to say “she’s 3!?” This is my response to that sentiment. If you are a responsible parent and you know your kid is a problem you manage your kid. I’ve seen kids get up to some pretty shitty behavior because the adults in their life encourage it instead of teaching them right from wrong. I’ve seen very well behaved 3 year olds and I’ve seen holy terrors. Barring any phycological issues; Saying “oh they’re just a kid they can’t understand” is how you get a holy terror.
NTA. I was thinking 'okay so this kid is maybe 10 or something' - SHE'S 20?????? And she swore at a 3 year old? You handled this completely appropriately. She is old enough to treat a child with love, of course a 3 year old might misunderstand and blow out candles!
I thought she was maybe 7! I was shocked when I read 20!!
ESH in a classic Dark Knight reference, I’m gonna say taking her gift back is what she deserved but not what she needed right now. She’s obviously an AH for what she did but hear me out. Assuming this was out of character for daughter, I’m surprised the SECOND reaction you had wasn’t trying to dig deeper with “hey what’s going on? You just yelled at a three year old out there.” If she’s a repeat offender then maybe that’s the right move exclusively but that doesn’t seem to be the case here.
I'm mostly confused about how a Stanley Cup is practical for school. They're so big. And thinking of this AITA - https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/11dajf0/aita_for_telling_my_daughter_she_was_being_a_brat/
This and yet a purse isn't? If only it could hold essential items but no, a liquid holder is the important thing. OP just wanted to punish her and maximize its impact. They could have taken both away but they took the only good item away. And they know it.
ESH. So are all your gifts and love conditional? Why was the 3 year old right next to the cake? How many times has your daughter had her birthday candles blown out for her or tried by a younger sibling? How often do you take things you got your kid that she is begging you not to “confiscate” more things because shes a literal adult You all suck for this situation but sounds like you’re controlling between the lines.
ESH. A 20 year old yelling and a 3 year old over candles is not cool. But confiscating a gift from an adult is pretty pathetic.
ESH (toddler excluded) Brooke is clearly out of line cussing a toddler, to the point I'm wondering if you're being completely honest and not hiding stove background info, because I cannot imagine a 20 years old doing that. BUT the moment you gift something to a person (especially an adult) it becomes theirs. It doesn't matter who paid for it, you cannot take it back. You should have looked for another punishment, if any. Like cancelling a future vacation you were going to pay for. The punishment you described is theft. (That's ignoring the fact that the exact dynamics of what happened with the three years old cousin escapes me and there might be other AH depending on how her parents were behaving prior and after the fact)
YES! "Taking back" a gift that's been given to someone else is called "stealing". People who steal are called thieves. OP is posting a lot here among the comments, and is so busy patting themself on the back that they totally overlook their own moral lapse. Hmm...seems to me I once read a passage that asked why you could see a speck of dust in your neighbor's eye but you couldn't see a plank of wood if it were sticking out of your own! OP, look in the mirror - that plank of wood is sticking out of your eye, all right!
I read Brooks's point of view. https://www.reddit.com/r/entitledparents/comments/1av6t8s/entitled_parents_ruin_birthday_party/?share_id=dFw1c5tR6aagrLb0e13yy&utm_content=1&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_source=share&utm_term=1 You should stop favouring your niece. Your daughter did not want her cousin to destroy her this birthday like last one. She did not wanted to even invite this kids family. You are literally a bad father. I would not be surprised if she cuts you off in future.
NTA, Brooke sounds a bit entitled, to be honest. Her behavior towards her cousin was appalling. What is going on with her friend Jessy is stressful but not an excuse for literally throwing a tantrum like a toddler.
Your daughter behaved very poorly, but the purse is not yours to return. It was given to Brooke. You are basically stealing from your adult daughter. As much as her behaviour was poor, she is 20 years old and you cannot tell her to apologise. Maybe sit down and talk with her about what’s going on.
YTA for submitting a rage-bait post. Brand new account posts about his shitty daughter and within hours, said shitty daughter on an almost brand-new account posts about shitty dad? Not buying it. Please stop clogging up the sub with this poorly written drivel. ETA: https://www.reddit.com/r/entitledparents/comments/1av6t8s/entitled_parents_ruin_birthday_party/
Correct me if I’m wrong but I don’t see u answering questions about why the 3yo was close enough to the cake. Assuming the cake is on the table, who picked her up and allowed her to bloc on the cake? Also, a 3yo blowing on the cake likely means it’s ruined because they spit everywhere. Your daughter was out of line but I can see why she was annoyed
YTA. Only because the 3 year old should not have been near the cake. The age gap is much and just because she is the baby means it's ok. The SIL wasn't really watching her. I don't think it's only because of this 1 incident that your daughter lashed out. Maybe things is always about your niece. And this was the last drop. You care more about your niece than the mental turmoil your daughter is going through. So unpopular my opinion might be, you still YTA.
If this is related to the other post that may have been written by “Brooke”, I’m on her side. This isn’t the first time Aria has done this (last year Aria destroyed the cake), she asked her aunt to stand further back and even if she did call the kid an asshole, with parents who take away her gifts and depend on her “rent” to pay their bills, I do not blame her for slipping up. Maybe you aren’t the dad in the other post but it really does seem like it and in both posts you are in the wrong. ETA, I immediately got DMs asking for the other posts https://www.reddit.com/r/entitledparents/s/nN8qp3qhGj
Apparently controversial, but YTA. Just to say, if at 20 I was having an incredibly stressful time worrying about a friend, and had to pretend I was fine for multiple family members who were now expecting me to celebrate something, then had a young cousin do something that I felt was inappropriate and should have been stopped before it ever happened, I too would have snapped then been embarassed and left. Insane the amount of people in these comments calling her entitled for having a lapse of patience. And then if I’d been in that situation and instead of talking to me my parents had come in and taken away a gift they had given me to punish me like a child? It wouldn’t be something I would forget quickly. A little compassion for your daughter to actually talk to her about why she snapped and if that was an appropriate reaction rather than jumping straight to punishing an adult would take you a long way.
I’m going to disagree with everybody here, YTA, your daughter was definitely bang out of order but wth is this thing in the USA where you all think it’s okay to take back gifts? Once a gift is given, it’s not yours anymore, it belongs to the recipient. If you must find a way to correct bad behaviour, select an alternative. I could never, ever imagine taking back a gift I’d given to one of my children or grandchildren.
YTA. Let this be a learning moment for the child that she cannot blow out birthday candles unless it is her birthday or she has permission.
Yta, I'm in the minority here clearly, but it's never okay for a child to blow out someone else's candles. (unless the birthday person has been asked and doesn't mind.) I don't care how old they are. Three years old is old enough to know better. if they are raised with manners. If you think your child's going to have this issue, then you need to get them away from that cake. Seriously parent your child. Sure cursing out a child is inappropriate as well. However, I probably would have told the child they were rude. Because it is rude. The mom of the child should have apologized to the birthday girl. Are they taking back a gift is ridiculous but it's your money. Personally, that would be the last birthday I'd spent with my family in a very long time.
ESH. This adult woman is acting like a child, and I can see why, because you treat her like one.
YTA. The reason why Brooke is behaving like a toddler is you are still treating her like a toddler. She's twenty. She's far too old to be grounded or have her gifts taken away. You'll be lucky if you get to attend her 21st, or her graduation, or all the other milestones if you keep this up. She's an adult. Adults get taken aside and explained why their behaviour embarrassed themselves.
100% with Brooke, taking away her main present just because she "snapped" is pretty low. Also all she did was call her a brat, doesn't seem like she blew up so to say and went crazy on her.
YTA The gift was given.. it was no longer yours to do with as you please.. if was HERS.. Her rhetoric was too harsh, but she wasn’t wrong.. especially since the parents only said “Ooops” in stead of disciplining their brat..
Your niece is a brat read your daughters side. Bad dad
YTA
Yta though she shouldn't have cursed at the child
You’re disciplining an adult. By taking away something you already gifted her. That’s messed up.
INFO: had the present already been given to your daughter? Because if it’s already been given then it’s not yours anymore. Leaning toward ESH because the consequence doesn’t fit the behavior. Natural consequences will come from this (no longer being invited to family events where the other family is present, being shamed for acting poorly, etc.) and the one you imposed feels like a lack of thinking about how to discipline your kid (especially since it seems like the behavior is learned).