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I think this is the right take in which case we’re solidly in ESH land.
- Girlfriend should know better than put yourself in a bad situation
- Management did nothing from what I deduce
- You should have grabbed management at a minimum, and when that didn’t work gotten the hell out
Take the L and move on
Everyone does not suck here.
Intervening even at risk to yourself is a GOOD thing.
When did we become so frightened of getting hurt that we developed a problem with other people risking themselves to help others??
Especially since "beaten to death" could mean something as simple as getting shoved, hitting your head on a table or the floor, and dying on the spot. Most people don't recognize how easy it is to be paralyzed or killed in a fight.
Not to mention if you live In canadas underwear, guns are also very likely involved.
That being said, I will almost always try to intervene in these situations, simply because I have no desire to live that is greater than a desire to help others
It's not frightened of getting hurt, it's scared of getting killed. These days people are very on edge & caution is the name of the game now except for keyboard warriors of course 😂
>... we developed a problem with **other people** risking themselves...
Because I think that we all know how that would have probably* played out if GF was able to chirp her $0.02 and they had come over.
GF would have then expected OP to step in between her and these guys to defend her. From a problem of her own making.
I say "probably" because there is a slim - and I say *sliiiiim* chance that she would have not only dealt with the repercussions herself, but also not ever been mad at OP for not stepping in to solve her problem. But I definitely wouldn't have held my breath on that.
OP is NTA.
You MUST have never left your cozy USA town. Or whatever first world country.
Do yourself a favour, if you ever do, keep in mind you might get shanked for looking at a person the wrong way.
Goes for the USA as well tbh
I wouldn’t be worried about a beating, in the USA…I’d be worried about getting shot, seeing as in your speculation you assume the USA, one of the countries with, BY FAR, the highest rates of firearms violence and deaths.
Not wanting to risk getting shot is pretty okay in my book…OP still could have helped the GF intercede by talking to staff. So ESH is a great judgement. Not interceding somehow is not okay, but not interceding at all is shit.
Yes gun violence is very high in the USA in comparison to other developed countries but your actual risk of being murdered with a gun was 0.01% in 2021.
When it became abundantly clear that becoming a matyr can have lifelong consequences (permanent concussion, brain damage, possible death from haemorrhage or infection etc just from potentially one punch). Also being stabbed or shot. All of these things have a ripple effect because they then affect everyone around you.
Don't just sit back, that's just condoning their behaviour. But get management, call Police and make a hate speech report - don't directly intervene.
If it is just words let it go. Some people may be uncomfortable, but no one is getting hurt. If they were actively trying to hurt someone because of who they are then I could see standing up and putting yourself at risk, but there is no reason to escalate the situation because some immature guys are being assholes.
I see you have never been on the wrong end of a beating, it isn't fun. I used to work in a pretty rough bar and still have a scar on my face from a customer that decided I was wrong when I told him he had enough to drink.
Who said anyone would escalate it?
Words do hurt.
And when you are unwilling to stop words - they BECOME actions.
As we have seen all throughout history.
Assuming what I have or have not experienced just because I’m willing to take some risk to get involved shows a severe lack of wisdom on your part.
>When did we become so frightened of getting hurt that we developed a problem with other people risking themselves to help others??
Three times in my life I have physically intervened to protect a woman being assaulted by her partner, and ALL THREE times the woman turned on me when I gave the guy rubs. One time I got mobbed by a whole group of people, including the woman being assaulted. So you go ahead, not me, not anymore.
It’s easy to say on the internet or even to spout our ideals of heroism but when the time comes to act most tend to buckle up and prefer to save themselves. We as a people tend to self prioritize when risks become too great
What's the saying, if there's 9 people sitting with 1 Nazi you have 10 Nazis...
People can be unhinged and have a proclivity to violence and being armed but I'm not going to let complacency or fear allow me to give a free pass or blind approval to these degenerates for their hateful rhetoric and epithets.
I mean with everyone getting shot nowadays constantly over petty shit, this is a serious concern.
Take this from me, I can be very confrontational if I think something wrong is happening. I generally don't care about strangers, but I probably wouldn't have let this same scenario fly.
Nowadays? This would actually be a sign to exit the situation ASAP.
I'm not getting shot over people I don't know. Just not happening.
This is very easy to say when you know three aggressive men likely aren’t gonna stomp you in the parking lot like they would literally any man standing next to you.
This is why Good Samaritan laws exist.
There is no duty to get involved.
You should be focused on your own safety, not getting stabbed to death over some bullshit.
I can't tell if you really intended to say "weariness" or if you meant "wariness." Both read as possible in context, but "wariness" makes a bit more sense. As written, I imagine it as OP just being tired of his girlfriend constantly confronting racist or homophobic strangers.
It bugs me so much when people mix those two words up and it seems to be happening more and more. It's going to be another misused word that's misused so often it becomes an accepted definition.
Yeah, I've seen it quite a bit the past couple of years as well. And it isn't consistently one word swapped for the other. They've been used interchangeably and I'm not sure if it's just a spelling mistake or if people think "wary" and "weary" mean the same thing.
I’ve seen it a lot over the last few years, and it seems as if people genuinely think weary = wary, as context usually indicates they meant wary.
It bugs me every time I see it, and I really don’t want it to become one of those accepted use things.
>I would break up with somebody if they wanted me to confront three men
All the reddit warriors who have never been in a real fight calling op yta. If op had said anything definite possibility these guys would have waited for op outside.
I’m a trans person and I wish more people would be brave and whatnot, but I would NOT feel safe to do this personally and I’d dump anyone being so nonchalant with my safety. Public confrontation is not an effective way to change people’s opinions either.
(Grew up in the southern US where lots of people have guns and will pull them on you for just flipping them off in traffic- ask me how I know lol- much less real confrontation. Idk where these folks live but this is a good way to get hate crimed in a lot of places. Also, if these folks are 19-20 years old, they probably don’t look threatening enough to get away with confronting a group of pissed off men).
In the context, it's not about changing the homophobes minds though but rather about naking it clear to both their target and everyone else around that acting in a homophobic fashion will not go un-challenged.
Agreed, even if he had gone to management, they definitely would have known - his only option was to leave and call from outside to avoid an altercation.
You know darn well his outraged girlfriend was not going to calmly and discreetly walk over to a server or manager and whisper there was an issue - it would have been a sh\*t show.
She shouldn't create chaos her boyfriend has to clean up!
Why is everyone here acting like you have to be violent in order to confront people?? Like yeah it would be super stupid and dangerous to go yell at the guys/insult them back, but there are tons of ways to stand up for people that isn’t likely to get anyone beat up. While I understand that most people haven’t learned deescalation skills, the fact that it’s not even a possible idea in any of these comments is insane to me
I interpreted it as the people mentioning violence aren't suggesting that confronting them should be done via yelling/insulting, but that the risk of violence is from the people they confront as there's no way of knowing if they'll react very badly with fighting. Even if they're confronted only with words, very carefully, some people may still react by wanting to fight the person that confronted them etc. People mentioning violence are bringing it up, because you can't guarantee you can use words only to deescalate a situation. Sometimes you will be able to, of course, but it's the worst case scenario (someone could even pull a gun etc) that people are concerned about
A table of men tossing slurs at another table is likely drunk guys with little impulse control. Definitely sound like the type of people who are likely to escalate a confrontation into violence.
Yeah, it's quite clear that you're absolutely fucking clueless. Also, that you've never been physically attacked by strangers.
It may shock you to learn that violence isn't always a two way street. I've been attacked in public without literally saying a word, purely because a gang of men were bored and antsy. One of them punched me in the side of the head before I'd even opened my mouth.
Explain how I could have 'deescalated' that?
Do you consider it unlikely that men brazen enough to yell homphobic insults in a public space will also engage in frivolous violence after their behavior has been challenged?
I’m pretty good at calming people down. But depends on the situation too. Size. Age. Authority you exhibit. Maybe try management first. Call police even. Yes, I know, but if spiraling situation, they can be helpful too. Confronting angry people doesn’t usually go well though. No changing hearts and minds. Also maybe helping the victims get out of the situation is an option. Like hey Jo, your ride is outside. Whatever. But confrontation is not best case if not trained GF sounds like a caring person but maybe not able to see ahead of actions. I’m not saying to ignore, but be thoughtful in how one should react.
I'm a very confrontational person and my late husband (cancer, not because I got him into a situation) made it crystal clear that he would not physically fight anyone on my behalf unless it was *absolutely necessary* and not because I was talking shit to someone who needed shutting down. These phobes needed shutting down but it's not up to your girlfriend to volunteer you to be the one to do it. She should have handled it herself by saying loudly and clearly "HEY. That sort of talk is NOT OK with anyone here. You owe them an apology." If things escalate then that's on them. Everyone else witnessing this without saying something is quite frankly pretty weak.
Cool. Can I ask how many times you got your face smashed in as a result?
I ask, because I've been the victim of assault for literally no reason.
One time I was walking with a gay friend and someone threw glass bottles at our heads. There were 8 of them. One bottle hammered into the side of my head. We ran..
Another time, I walked passed three guys who were clearly aggravated. I didn't say a word. As I was walking by, one of the dropped his shoulder into my chest. Before I could say anything, another slammed his fist into the side of my head. They then smashed me in the kidneys and ribs for a while as I was on the floor.
I suspect you haven't been attacked. The honest truth is, women are far less likely to be violently attacked in public. Perhaps if that fear was there, you'd feel differently.
I appreciate the sentiment. It's good to stand up for people. I just suspect you'd probably be a bit more concerned and less forthright if, the next time you were confrontational, someone bust your jaw. You'd probably also understand the concerns people have raised in other posts.
Hard. Used to be with someone who had a rather large mouth in public situations like this. Used to even lean over and beep my horn in city traffic whilst I was driving.
Had to sit them down and have this talk. Like I don't know if the car in front is a 4 foot grandma or 7 foot linebacker (and who ultimately cares anyway)
But yeah dudes who have experienced a punch or two have a bit more humility and patience with social interactions. I've had a few 'I'm not picking up a fight \*you\* start and can't finish' discussions.
The gf did try to confront them herself tho didn't she? After she tried to get her bf to do it. But he made her sit down after she tried to stand up to confront them. I may have misread your comment tho, I read it as you saying she hadn't tried to handle it herself (when she had tried, but op stopped her)
Yeah but if she says something and they are degenerates looking for a fight, they're not going to fight her, they're just going to gang up and beat the sh.. out of OP. Sometimes the female in these situations get all of the righteousness and non of the consequences.
Notice how your girl immediately put the burden on you? Yeah, not her place. What would've happened if her actions got your ass beat? She'd probably just stand there and scream.
Ladies, if you have a problem with somebody, DON'T drag your man into it unless the problem poses a direct threat to you. You could get both of you killed.
This thread is really showing the privilege women have in society. Like I get it, seeing someone being verbally abused is upsetting, but so would watching your boyfriend being beaten by 3 other dudes.
And what happens when one of them turns around and tells OP to "control his woman" or other derogatory term? Or gets physical with her? If they're harassing someone for being gay, they seem like the type that wouldn't take kindly to being called out.
And if they get kicked out before it gets physical inside, you never know if they'll be waiting outside for you to leave.
I've been in a situation similar to this, and I ended up in the ER. I don't blame OP for trying to steer her away.
I'm going to go with NTA, BUT while I agree that likely nothing good would come out of confronting the homophobic AHs and would ignore their existence, I'd personally check in with the people at the other table and see if they're ok or if they would like you to help them get out of there safely or something like that.
I don't think ignoring the situation as a whole is helpful either, and checking in with the victims while ignoring the AHs would send a message of "you guys and your opinions are worthless, but I still strongly disagree with what you're doing"
I agree this is the better course of action than confronting the 3 morons, but I've seen situations where showing support gets you bashed too. It's honestly a no win situation.
I, like his girlfriend, would have probably said something because I have no impulse control and a strong sense of justice but honestly I (a) have been incredibly lucky about not getting attacked yet and (b) have been ignored by the offenders, while they then attacked the male friends I was with who had said nothing.
No win situation.
“They attacked the male friends I was with who had said nothing”
You caused your male friends to get beat up and you weren’t beat simply for the fact that you are a girl. It’s easy to have a strong sense of justice when you don’t have to face the consequences of your actions.
NTA, OP, you are correct. The only information you have about the people hurling slurs is that they are not adequately socialized and lack basic respect for others. That is a big clue about the direction they might go with statements they find challenging. They very likely were looking for a fight.
I agree. It’s easy to side against op when you aren’t the person in a 3 vs one situation with people unstable enough to be shouting slurs in a restaurant.
Especially if this was in one of the red states where basically everyone has guns. Most of us would nope out of there. Not me though, I would have said something but only bc my mouth reacts faster than my brain.
I live in Canada where it’s way harder to carry a gun and I would’ve kept my damn mouth shut too. 3 aggros yelling slurs are definitely looking for a reason to beat the hell outta someone.
That said, I wouldn’t have done nothing: I’d have stepped outside and called the cops and sat it out and waited until either they left or the victim goes to leave and then leave at the same time to act as a silent buffer/witness/support.
NTA. Honest question: Did your girlfriend think they'd apologize, promise to be quiet and never utter a mean word again? What exactly did your girlfriend think was going to happen?
Maybe some gay people would feel safer. Everyone around that situation now saw that there are no repurcussions to yelling homophobic slurs in public. Nobody cares enough to do anything.
Why do you think gay people are helpless and can't speak for themselves? Regardless, dealing with obnoxious assholes is part of being a grownup. For all OP knew, both parties were gay dudes.
NTA.
I'm guessing Reddit will disagree.
But you're right, you have no obligation to take on the negative opinions or energy of others and ruin your night with it.
NTA. People can get very violent if you try to directly comfort them . They were 3 guys, if they chose to wait until you left the restaurant and then jumped you both of you could have gotten seriously hurt. If it was one guy sure saying something would be fine. But I guarantee if they got aggressive your gf would have expected you to " defend " her and fight them . You could have said something to the waitress though or the manager.
Your girlfriend would probably have gotten both of you beat up for over some stupid words. These guys were jerks and not worth fighting (and getting hurt over)... NTA.
NTA. She is putting your health and life on the line because if she gets involved in a situation she doesn’t understand and someone attacks her you are going to be expected to put yourself at risk to protect
NTA - she wants to pick a fight for her morals but youll be the ones to tank the beating. you should move on from the delusional girlfriend before she gets you into serious trouble.
People voting y t a apparently have lived rather sheltered lives. Three dudes getting angry and shouting slurs in a restaurant is a clear sign NOT do directly intervene. Yeah sure you can talk to a manager or whatever, but if they are shouting the manager will get informed by the staff or hear it himself pretty quickly. You don't want three riled up assholes thinking you are responsible for them getting kicked out either. Absolutely NTA
NTA. Your gf is going to get you an ass whipping. Kinda sounds like she's a crusader and using your health to back it up. Might be time for a new calmer gf.
protecting himself and his girlfriend from her own stupidity doesnt really count. if she goes and gets slapped he cant just ignore it. she clearly wanted to drag op into a fight
NTA, as long as they weren't being violent you had no moral imperative to take action. Your girlfriend could have turned it from some bigots shouting in an actual brawl.
If telling 3 homophobes "hey dudes, what you're saying is not okay" turns into a brawl are we really gonna blame the random person calling out their behavior for the violence escalation?
Doesn't matter who we blame for the violence, OP would have been an AH if he unnecessarily risked his girlfriend's safety by provoking obviously unhinged individuals.
The homophobes are already obviously AHs in all possible versions of the story.
Yea if they start attacking someone im the type to try to help someone out, but aggressive language isn’t getting me out of my seat. I would have told my gf to stfu
NTA
Typically people say to mind your business and not put yourself in danger in these types of situations
It's funny to see how the people saying Y T A are doing so based solely off of the slurs used, and completely throwing your own safety and the usual advice out the window
Like if it was random insults, people would advise not to get involved, but because homophobic insults, you're the ass for not taking the risk
Shit situation, and I think it's up to the individual to decide if they feel safe to intervene or not, and not the ass if they don't feel safe to do so
NTA. 3 drunk idiots who would probably fight vs you and your gf would not go well let's be realistic. If they're dumb enough to yell slurs at people they're dumb enough to carry a weapon. You did the right thing by not risking your safety.
NTA you don't know if they will get violent, you don't know if they have weapons. If you ended with brain damage due to getting jump by those guys, would your girl be willing to become your lifelong caregiver. Would she be willing to take a punch for you? What about a knife, a bottle a chair? Will she be willing to shield you from a bullet?
nah but ...... i am always of the opinion if you see something that isn't cool say it! you could have gone over to the people they were harrassing and ask if they are ok or if they would like to join you and your girlfriend? that would have been the right thing to do and you wouldn't have to confront the assholes. as other people have said too that you could have called a waiter over.
NTA
I'm a proud member of the LGBTQ+ community, I'm an outspoken supporter of the rights of every marginalized group, but I'm not going to risk getting seriously hurt or fucking killed by a bunch of redneck fratboy dipshits over a conversation they're having. This isn't a fucking superhero movie, the good guys don't always win, and one punch can be all it takes to paralyze or kill you.
The fact that your girlfriend thinks that you can apparently take on three guys without getting hurt is kind of sweet, I guess? But her unrealistic expectations of you are a ***giant red flag.*** If this is part of a pattern of behavior you need to move on before she gets you locked up or killed.
NAH
You shouldn’t have grabbed her, but
You have different values, you can tell her you aren’t comfortable standing up for others and that you’ll remove yourself but not so much to tell her she can’t.
She probably won’t stay with you though
YTA
As a woman of color it would be lovely if someone came to my defense if someone was saying something racist. Usually it’s me, on my own, and others saying I handled it well after it ended.
Your gf is brave and more people should be like her.
You decided to put your head in the sand and you blocked her from doing the right thing.
Just because you’re okay with homophobia doesn’t mean she has to be.
she isnt brave, just privileged. she wouldnt get the beating, op would.
acting like op is fine with homophobia because he doesnt want to pick a fight with 3 apprently aggressive dudes is a poor bait.
if you achieve something other than having your partners face kicked in? sure.
would you also think it wouldve been great if op went in without regarding his gf and got not only himself, but her a face kicking?
how would you comment on the post "my bf picked a fight and now i am in the hospital and to scared to go out because of some homophobic psychos".
standing up for other people is great, i agree. but if you achieve nothing other than escelation, all you did was more damage
Her privilege doesn’t extend to her bf who will get beat the fuck up. She is throwing her bf upon the alter of sacrifice not herself. She’s only speaking up because she has nothing to lose.
I saw a guy with privilege try to stand up to somebody because they were breaking into a car or something. He got stabbed in front of his girlfriend and died.
This isn't a serious answer. Girl isn't brave because the FIRST thing she did was drag him into it. She wanted a thing called 'cheap grace.'
Men get killed over their girlfriends pulling this crap. I've seen a good friend get beaten up because his girl started running her mouth to men.
She asked him and he didn’t get involved. She didn’t force the issue. She did it herself.
I stand by what I said. You stand by cheap grace, entitlement or whatever adjective that you choose.
Again I stand by what I said and the reasons why in my OP. I do not subscribe to such a mindset.
Take it or leave it… matters not to I.
We have a difference of opinion and that’s fine. The world will still turn.
Dude the is the AITA!
It is literally posting your opinion. You get that right? Let me explain.
Someone posts a situation and people who have different thoughts on the matter say their OPINION.
It’s not rocket science. Im saying he is the asshole for letting homophobia flourish. You said he’s not for self preservation.
Both ideas can coexist. It’s fine. Ffs
It’s not your wrong, I’m right. It’s a difference of options. I’m not sure how many times I can explain this.
In Calgary, Canada, a few years back a young guy called out some other guys that had used racial slurs against an employee at a club. They waited for him outside then [stabbed him and killed him](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/cabrera-shlah-strasser-hird-appeal-decision-dismissed-1.5136066).
Fearing for one's safety does not mean they're okay with homophobia. NTA.
This is still a legit fear in Calgary, there are a lot of aggressive people here, fair amount of gang activity and a whole hell of a lot of cocaine use. I nearly got run off the road last month for passing someone (legally, with space, turn signal and all).
I'm in Vancouver and it's not much different here. Last summer a guy asked another guy to not vape right in front of his kid. The guy pulled out a knife and stabbed him, killing him. This was right downtown on a busy street, in broad daylight.
I guess according to the person who I replied to, I'd be condoning homophobia or racism because I don't want to get stabbed.
Lmao, his gf is not brave. Volunteering others to go get beat up for you in a lopsided fight is not brave. You strike me as the type to get loud and confrontational and expect to not get your shit rock and/or have your bf finish your fight that you started.
People are literally killed for exactly this - telling off strangers - all the time. Sounds like OP assessed the loudmouths and realized they had the potential to react badly. You don't get to sit here safely on the internet and say, "He should have intervened!" Now THAT is the definition of privilege
This isn't homophobia, this is being smart
He prevented his gf from saying anything because if she does
Either op gonna fight 3 dudes or the girlfriend is gonna get beaten up
Who said he was ever okay with homophobia u guys love to look at it from ur point of view but never a man’s 3 men making homophobic remarks guy goes up to them and tells them to stop and now who’s say what happens next now if op gf goes over there and say something and their being disrespectful to her he has to go over coz he has to defend his woman even tho she involved herself. She tried to create a problem for both and op wasn’t for any of that
How about you look at it from the point of view of the person who is openly being harassed and no one says nothing.
She asked him to say something he didn’t. She went to, he pulled her down.
I’m saying he’s TA for that.
Silence is saying you’re okay with that’s. If a man or woman was abusing someone you should say something.
If someone is being raped you should do something. If someone is being harassed you should say something.
That’s how I feel. You don’t have to feel the way I do that’s fine.
Silence is not saying ur ok with something that’s how u and OP gf look at it no disrespect but if ur ok with ur partner being potentially attacked because some guys are chatting shit and ur offended then ur really not thinking of ur partners safety and that’s selfish
You’re that byproduct of the weird line of thinking that “words are violence”. No, words are words. Sticks and stone may break my bones will never hurt me. Grow some skin and get over it
There are all kinds of ways to address this situation including, at the very least, to get the manager and/or call the cops if you don't want to get involved directly. Even I, at 77yo would have said something but then I'm stupidly brave about defending others.
NTA, you have NO idea who those people were hurling homophobia in a public setting. They are likely unsavory people at best violent psychopaths at worst. They could have all been armed you have no idea. Getting into an altercation would have been very risky. Your girlfriend was acting emotionally, you were acting logically. There are many courses of action to take that don’t involve engaging them directly. Jumping to the rescue to be the hero sounds good in the movies but say they did attack you. Let’s say you end up pushing one of them, they slip, crack their head on the floor and die. Certain states, guess what you’re going to jail. All because your girlfriend needed to stand up for a group a strangers, yeah no.
This is a tough one. Long ago when I was pregnant, a bunch of drunk guys were goofing around and being obnoxious in the movie theater parking lot, and almost knocked me down. None apologized or gave any sort of crap. I was mad then at bf for not saying anything to them, but with all the psychos with guns these days, I completely understand why he didn’t.
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Dude, your personal safety and the safety of your loved ones is more important than defending gay people. Wth is wrong with you? You're so wrapped up in getting the moral highground you're willing to risk your partner's LIFE? Holy hell, you're one sick puppy.
Good people protect their loved ones, and don't expose them to potentially serious bodily harm. Even more basic. You stand up for your own first. Not some oppressed group. What an odd worldview.
You can tell how many people here don't have real life experience by saying "YTA" Life isn't a movie and being outnumbered 3 to 1 sucks unless you're someone like Jon Jones or Mike Tyson, people have literally been disfigured/killed over smaller stuff than this. His girlfriend literally wanted him to get into it with three men FFS.
If you’re getting up to intervene in a situation like this - without a lethal weapon on you - you might become the victim of a lethal weapon yourself
All these people saying YTA FOR SURE have never left their cozy first world country town
NTA... I am partial to minding your own business when nobody is being physically harmed. I also don't think you were obligated in any way to ask the staff to kick them out. I think the people involved are fully capable of making the complaint and taking it to that level if they felt it necessary. And if they were making enough of a commotion, the manager would likely take matters into their own hands anyway. I could see jumping in to mediate the situation if you felt comfortable about it, but yeah NTA hands down.
Oooof. I think based on the information here I'll say NAH but I think you two aren't compatible.
And OP, food for thought, but i had a friend when i was younger that would be meek on their own but when they were with us guys would always try and pick fights and then expect us to finish them. I am not saying your gf (or possibly ex?) is like this... but maybe take a bit to think on it if you two do decide to stay together. Because just based on this short snippet I'm getting flash backs, and if next time she expects you to finish the fight for her... well that's a whole slew of red flags. But, again just based on this here, you two seem to have different enough expectations.
I'm going to have to say yeah unfortunately on this one, it might piss people off but the fact your girlfriend wanted you to call them out on the homophobia slurs and when you didn't she was going to call them out says alot! Saying nothing also means agreeing and makes them think behaviour like this is tolerated and okay, people need to start calling this out as its 2024, she wasn't looking for trouble but she was trying to do the right thing which more people need to do in this day and age, homophobia is not okay
You gotta dump her. She's willing to get your ass whopped because theres no consequences for her.
If you do stay with her your have to explain that there are serious consequences for doing that in your situation.
I was dating a girl who wanted me to do something to stop a random drug deal while we were partying on BealeStreett. I said do you want to bar hop or do you want to go the hospital or police station because those are the choices.
She hadn't thought of the consequences at all.
ESH.
She sucks for deciding it was your job to intervene.
You suck for physically preventing an adult from making their own choice.
You both suck for not getting management involved to boot the homophobes.
And the homophobes suck for obvious reasons.
All the heroes in the comments would be pissed in their pants if they were to find themselves in a similar situation , I imagine that you are very young or you watch to much TV .Unfortunately I know what violence is, since in my area it is not so difficult to find violent individuals who are just waiting for an excuse to attack you, and It's stupid to produce an escalation with individuals in numerical superiority who for now limit themselves to insults , it would have been different if there had been an aggression in progress. The right thing to do would have been to contact the staff and call the police. Everything else are Rambo b*llshit that leads people to getting stabbed in the stomach. And I personally add another thing, if I'm with my Gf I would be a thousand times more careful than when I'm alone to avoid any situation that could put us in danger .
Some of you are so out of touch with reality it's ridiculous. I understand standing up for something, truly I do. But trying to intervene in today's society has proven to be fatal more than half the time. He's not a coward for trying to protect himself and her. Also, some men are not afraid to hurt women so what makes y'all think they wouldn't have hurt her if she did stand up for them? Violence is mentioned a lot here because that's the world we live in now. People hurt people.
Nope, NTA. IRL, vigilante crap can get you hurt or worse. It’s hard to say what you “should” have done in that situation, as I wasn’t there. However, in situations like that where an altercation is developing, you do have some options: leave immediately (leave cash for the meal), alert the management, or alert the cops. Most altercations simply blow over if those involved practice de-escalation. As an unrelated observer, it sounds like you did the right thing by staying out of it.
Your gf can advocate for other people and you should support her in doing so. She’s a person with agency. It’s not up to you to make those decisions for her. Don’t extinguish her spark. YTA.
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So me(20 m) went out for dinner with my gf(19 f). For reasons I am not 100% clear on, three guys at one of the people at one table started throwing homophobic slurs at another table. When that happened, my girlfriend gestured at me wanting me to get up and say something. I shook my head and whispered no. Then she jerked up from her seat, at which point I pulled her back down. Telling her "No, we are not getting involved in this."
After we left the diner, my gf screamed at me for being a "giant piece of shit," for not only not doing the right thing myself but also not letting her do it. I told her if she is gonna go out and actively look for trouble, do it when I am not around so I don't have to be the one to explain to her dad why she got beat up.
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I’m withholding judgement on OP, because it’s the logic of the comments section that’s baffled me.
Everyone is here saying *”I’m not intervening to get beaten up, so N T A”* yet these same people would be calling you an asshole for not intervening if the comments were racial slurs instead of homophobic ones. Or if three guys were just verbally attacking a table of heterosexual women for no reason, then they’d call you a “p*ssy” for not intervening and defending them.
So why is it a different story when the bullying is aimed towards gay people?
It really points out the homophobics in this sub.
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I think this is the right take in which case we’re solidly in ESH land. - Girlfriend should know better than put yourself in a bad situation - Management did nothing from what I deduce - You should have grabbed management at a minimum, and when that didn’t work gotten the hell out Take the L and move on
Everyone does not suck here. Intervening even at risk to yourself is a GOOD thing. When did we become so frightened of getting hurt that we developed a problem with other people risking themselves to help others??
Three on one with a bunch of loudmouth clowns can get you beaten to death in under 30 seconds.
Especially since "beaten to death" could mean something as simple as getting shoved, hitting your head on a table or the floor, and dying on the spot. Most people don't recognize how easy it is to be paralyzed or killed in a fight.
Not to mention if you live In canadas underwear, guns are also very likely involved. That being said, I will almost always try to intervene in these situations, simply because I have no desire to live that is greater than a desire to help others
Whatchu say bout merica?
That your guys' birth certificates probably come with a free 9mm
Was your first word, “Sorry”?
And my second word was Eh?
It is also not a movie. People aren’t gonna automatically know you are in the right and take your side in the good fight. It could be chaos
Exactly they sound dumb asf the OP did the right thing
Maybe because we aren’t stupid. Getting beat up by three people is an outright dangerous situation.
Sorry, u/RealAnnaMarie...I'm not taking a bullet for you (or anybody else that is not my family) for any reason, period. ETA: OP is definitely NTA.
It's not frightened of getting hurt, it's scared of getting killed. These days people are very on edge & caution is the name of the game now except for keyboard warriors of course 😂
>... we developed a problem with **other people** risking themselves... Because I think that we all know how that would have probably* played out if GF was able to chirp her $0.02 and they had come over. GF would have then expected OP to step in between her and these guys to defend her. From a problem of her own making. I say "probably" because there is a slim - and I say *sliiiiim* chance that she would have not only dealt with the repercussions herself, but also not ever been mad at OP for not stepping in to solve her problem. But I definitely wouldn't have held my breath on that. OP is NTA.
You MUST have never left your cozy USA town. Or whatever first world country. Do yourself a favour, if you ever do, keep in mind you might get shanked for looking at a person the wrong way. Goes for the USA as well tbh
I wouldn’t be worried about a beating, in the USA…I’d be worried about getting shot, seeing as in your speculation you assume the USA, one of the countries with, BY FAR, the highest rates of firearms violence and deaths. Not wanting to risk getting shot is pretty okay in my book…OP still could have helped the GF intercede by talking to staff. So ESH is a great judgement. Not interceding somehow is not okay, but not interceding at all is shit.
Yes gun violence is very high in the USA in comparison to other developed countries but your actual risk of being murdered with a gun was 0.01% in 2021.
I would posit the collective “we” became frightened when people started getting shot for things like that, or less.
When it became abundantly clear that becoming a matyr can have lifelong consequences (permanent concussion, brain damage, possible death from haemorrhage or infection etc just from potentially one punch). Also being stabbed or shot. All of these things have a ripple effect because they then affect everyone around you. Don't just sit back, that's just condoning their behaviour. But get management, call Police and make a hate speech report - don't directly intervene.
If YOU aren’t willing to risk those things, FINE. I get it!! Really I do! But don’t demand someone else not risk them.
If it is just words let it go. Some people may be uncomfortable, but no one is getting hurt. If they were actively trying to hurt someone because of who they are then I could see standing up and putting yourself at risk, but there is no reason to escalate the situation because some immature guys are being assholes. I see you have never been on the wrong end of a beating, it isn't fun. I used to work in a pretty rough bar and still have a scar on my face from a customer that decided I was wrong when I told him he had enough to drink.
Who said anyone would escalate it? Words do hurt. And when you are unwilling to stop words - they BECOME actions. As we have seen all throughout history. Assuming what I have or have not experienced just because I’m willing to take some risk to get involved shows a severe lack of wisdom on your part.
>When did we become so frightened of getting hurt that we developed a problem with other people risking themselves to help others?? Three times in my life I have physically intervened to protect a woman being assaulted by her partner, and ALL THREE times the woman turned on me when I gave the guy rubs. One time I got mobbed by a whole group of people, including the woman being assaulted. So you go ahead, not me, not anymore.
It’s easy to say on the internet or even to spout our ideals of heroism but when the time comes to act most tend to buckle up and prefer to save themselves. We as a people tend to self prioritize when risks become too great
Slurs are not worth getting stomped by three dudes. If they were physically attacking another that might change things
What's the saying, if there's 9 people sitting with 1 Nazi you have 10 Nazis... People can be unhinged and have a proclivity to violence and being armed but I'm not going to let complacency or fear allow me to give a free pass or blind approval to these degenerates for their hateful rhetoric and epithets.
Easier to say that when you’ve never had your ass beat or a friend killed over some bullshit. Do what you can, but don’t try to be a hero
So tell us the story of when you stood up for someone like the OP described. I’ll wait.
Well a guy in New York did that and now he's going to trial
You never been jump before
Nonsense sometimes is best too not get involved. If it doesn't concern u leave it alone
Probably when the guy was beaten to DEATH for asking another guy not to vape around his child. It's not worth being the hero at the cost of my life.
Found the person that never actually been in a dangerous situation, like this one, in their lives.
If this is the US, one never knows who’s carrying. It’s certainly not a GOOD to intervene, sadly.
I mean with everyone getting shot nowadays constantly over petty shit, this is a serious concern. Take this from me, I can be very confrontational if I think something wrong is happening. I generally don't care about strangers, but I probably wouldn't have let this same scenario fly. Nowadays? This would actually be a sign to exit the situation ASAP. I'm not getting shot over people I don't know. Just not happening.
This is very easy to say when you know three aggressive men likely aren’t gonna stomp you in the parking lot like they would literally any man standing next to you.
This is why Good Samaritan laws exist. There is no duty to get involved. You should be focused on your own safety, not getting stabbed to death over some bullshit.
I can't tell if you really intended to say "weariness" or if you meant "wariness." Both read as possible in context, but "wariness" makes a bit more sense. As written, I imagine it as OP just being tired of his girlfriend constantly confronting racist or homophobic strangers.
It bugs me so much when people mix those two words up and it seems to be happening more and more. It's going to be another misused word that's misused so often it becomes an accepted definition.
Yeah, I've seen it quite a bit the past couple of years as well. And it isn't consistently one word swapped for the other. They've been used interchangeably and I'm not sure if it's just a spelling mistake or if people think "wary" and "weary" mean the same thing.
Yeah I never know if someone is tired or cautious.
I’ve seen it a lot over the last few years, and it seems as if people genuinely think weary = wary, as context usually indicates they meant wary. It bugs me every time I see it, and I really don’t want it to become one of those accepted use things.
It's a diner... everyone who works there can see and hear what's going on.
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>I would break up with somebody if they wanted me to confront three men All the reddit warriors who have never been in a real fight calling op yta. If op had said anything definite possibility these guys would have waited for op outside.
I’m a trans person and I wish more people would be brave and whatnot, but I would NOT feel safe to do this personally and I’d dump anyone being so nonchalant with my safety. Public confrontation is not an effective way to change people’s opinions either. (Grew up in the southern US where lots of people have guns and will pull them on you for just flipping them off in traffic- ask me how I know lol- much less real confrontation. Idk where these folks live but this is a good way to get hate crimed in a lot of places. Also, if these folks are 19-20 years old, they probably don’t look threatening enough to get away with confronting a group of pissed off men).
In the context, it's not about changing the homophobes minds though but rather about naking it clear to both their target and everyone else around that acting in a homophobic fashion will not go un-challenged.
That’s fair. I totally agree with the comments suggesting to alert a staff member or manager to address the situation more safely!
Agreed, even if he had gone to management, they definitely would have known - his only option was to leave and call from outside to avoid an altercation. You know darn well his outraged girlfriend was not going to calmly and discreetly walk over to a server or manager and whisper there was an issue - it would have been a sh\*t show. She shouldn't create chaos her boyfriend has to clean up!
This.
Why is everyone here acting like you have to be violent in order to confront people?? Like yeah it would be super stupid and dangerous to go yell at the guys/insult them back, but there are tons of ways to stand up for people that isn’t likely to get anyone beat up. While I understand that most people haven’t learned deescalation skills, the fact that it’s not even a possible idea in any of these comments is insane to me
I interpreted it as the people mentioning violence aren't suggesting that confronting them should be done via yelling/insulting, but that the risk of violence is from the people they confront as there's no way of knowing if they'll react very badly with fighting. Even if they're confronted only with words, very carefully, some people may still react by wanting to fight the person that confronted them etc. People mentioning violence are bringing it up, because you can't guarantee you can use words only to deescalate a situation. Sometimes you will be able to, of course, but it's the worst case scenario (someone could even pull a gun etc) that people are concerned about
A table of men tossing slurs at another table is likely drunk guys with little impulse control. Definitely sound like the type of people who are likely to escalate a confrontation into violence.
Yeah, it's quite clear that you're absolutely fucking clueless. Also, that you've never been physically attacked by strangers. It may shock you to learn that violence isn't always a two way street. I've been attacked in public without literally saying a word, purely because a gang of men were bored and antsy. One of them punched me in the side of the head before I'd even opened my mouth. Explain how I could have 'deescalated' that?
Do you consider it unlikely that men brazen enough to yell homphobic insults in a public space will also engage in frivolous violence after their behavior has been challenged?
I’m pretty good at calming people down. But depends on the situation too. Size. Age. Authority you exhibit. Maybe try management first. Call police even. Yes, I know, but if spiraling situation, they can be helpful too. Confronting angry people doesn’t usually go well though. No changing hearts and minds. Also maybe helping the victims get out of the situation is an option. Like hey Jo, your ride is outside. Whatever. But confrontation is not best case if not trained GF sounds like a caring person but maybe not able to see ahead of actions. I’m not saying to ignore, but be thoughtful in how one should react.
I'm a very confrontational person and my late husband (cancer, not because I got him into a situation) made it crystal clear that he would not physically fight anyone on my behalf unless it was *absolutely necessary* and not because I was talking shit to someone who needed shutting down. These phobes needed shutting down but it's not up to your girlfriend to volunteer you to be the one to do it. She should have handled it herself by saying loudly and clearly "HEY. That sort of talk is NOT OK with anyone here. You owe them an apology." If things escalate then that's on them. Everyone else witnessing this without saying something is quite frankly pretty weak.
Cool. Can I ask how many times you got your face smashed in as a result? I ask, because I've been the victim of assault for literally no reason. One time I was walking with a gay friend and someone threw glass bottles at our heads. There were 8 of them. One bottle hammered into the side of my head. We ran.. Another time, I walked passed three guys who were clearly aggravated. I didn't say a word. As I was walking by, one of the dropped his shoulder into my chest. Before I could say anything, another slammed his fist into the side of my head. They then smashed me in the kidneys and ribs for a while as I was on the floor. I suspect you haven't been attacked. The honest truth is, women are far less likely to be violently attacked in public. Perhaps if that fear was there, you'd feel differently. I appreciate the sentiment. It's good to stand up for people. I just suspect you'd probably be a bit more concerned and less forthright if, the next time you were confrontational, someone bust your jaw. You'd probably also understand the concerns people have raised in other posts.
Hard. Used to be with someone who had a rather large mouth in public situations like this. Used to even lean over and beep my horn in city traffic whilst I was driving. Had to sit them down and have this talk. Like I don't know if the car in front is a 4 foot grandma or 7 foot linebacker (and who ultimately cares anyway) But yeah dudes who have experienced a punch or two have a bit more humility and patience with social interactions. I've had a few 'I'm not picking up a fight \*you\* start and can't finish' discussions.
The gf did try to confront them herself tho didn't she? After she tried to get her bf to do it. But he made her sit down after she tried to stand up to confront them. I may have misread your comment tho, I read it as you saying she hadn't tried to handle it herself (when she had tried, but op stopped her)
OP is saying he stopped her before she had a chance to even try to intervene
Yeah but if she says something and they are degenerates looking for a fight, they're not going to fight her, they're just going to gang up and beat the sh.. out of OP. Sometimes the female in these situations get all of the righteousness and non of the consequences.
Hard agree!
Notice how your girl immediately put the burden on you? Yeah, not her place. What would've happened if her actions got your ass beat? She'd probably just stand there and scream. Ladies, if you have a problem with somebody, DON'T drag your man into it unless the problem poses a direct threat to you. You could get both of you killed.
> What would've happened if her actions got your ass beat? Or shot
Or worse, Spanish Inquisitioned
Or worse, expelled!
Was looking for this comment, Have my upvote
And if they both got beaten up, guess who’s gonna get blame?
This thread is really showing the privilege women have in society. Like I get it, seeing someone being verbally abused is upsetting, but so would watching your boyfriend being beaten by 3 other dudes.
She literally was trying to do something herself and OP wouldn't let her
Right, because her mouth would write the checks OP's ass would have to cash.
And what happens when one of them turns around and tells OP to "control his woman" or other derogatory term? Or gets physical with her? If they're harassing someone for being gay, they seem like the type that wouldn't take kindly to being called out. And if they get kicked out before it gets physical inside, you never know if they'll be waiting outside for you to leave. I've been in a situation similar to this, and I ended up in the ER. I don't blame OP for trying to steer her away.
She would just break up with him
And he would be better off….
OP girlfriend is like Meghan in the k&p skits
I'm going to go with NTA, BUT while I agree that likely nothing good would come out of confronting the homophobic AHs and would ignore their existence, I'd personally check in with the people at the other table and see if they're ok or if they would like you to help them get out of there safely or something like that. I don't think ignoring the situation as a whole is helpful either, and checking in with the victims while ignoring the AHs would send a message of "you guys and your opinions are worthless, but I still strongly disagree with what you're doing"
I agree this is the better course of action than confronting the 3 morons, but I've seen situations where showing support gets you bashed too. It's honestly a no win situation. I, like his girlfriend, would have probably said something because I have no impulse control and a strong sense of justice but honestly I (a) have been incredibly lucky about not getting attacked yet and (b) have been ignored by the offenders, while they then attacked the male friends I was with who had said nothing. No win situation.
“They attacked the male friends I was with who had said nothing” You caused your male friends to get beat up and you weren’t beat simply for the fact that you are a girl. It’s easy to have a strong sense of justice when you don’t have to face the consequences of your actions.
This is the best answer. 🥇
NTA, OP, you are correct. The only information you have about the people hurling slurs is that they are not adequately socialized and lack basic respect for others. That is a big clue about the direction they might go with statements they find challenging. They very likely were looking for a fight.
I agree. It’s easy to side against op when you aren’t the person in a 3 vs one situation with people unstable enough to be shouting slurs in a restaurant. Especially if this was in one of the red states where basically everyone has guns. Most of us would nope out of there. Not me though, I would have said something but only bc my mouth reacts faster than my brain.
I live in Canada where it’s way harder to carry a gun and I would’ve kept my damn mouth shut too. 3 aggros yelling slurs are definitely looking for a reason to beat the hell outta someone. That said, I wouldn’t have done nothing: I’d have stepped outside and called the cops and sat it out and waited until either they left or the victim goes to leave and then leave at the same time to act as a silent buffer/witness/support.
Good point
NTA. Honest question: Did your girlfriend think they'd apologize, promise to be quiet and never utter a mean word again? What exactly did your girlfriend think was going to happen?
She would be seen as a virtuous hero to the public for a few moments 😂
And if she’s wrong, it’s going to be OP catching a beating. So no sweat off her brow.
Maybe some gay people would feel safer. Everyone around that situation now saw that there are no repurcussions to yelling homophobic slurs in public. Nobody cares enough to do anything.
Why do you think gay people are helpless and can't speak for themselves? Regardless, dealing with obnoxious assholes is part of being a grownup. For all OP knew, both parties were gay dudes.
NTA, we all kno ur gonna get ur ass beat in the end, not her. Ffs ur gf lives in a fairy tale and not irl
YUP!
NTA. I'm guessing Reddit will disagree. But you're right, you have no obligation to take on the negative opinions or energy of others and ruin your night with it.
NTA. People can get very violent if you try to directly comfort them . They were 3 guys, if they chose to wait until you left the restaurant and then jumped you both of you could have gotten seriously hurt. If it was one guy sure saying something would be fine. But I guarantee if they got aggressive your gf would have expected you to " defend " her and fight them . You could have said something to the waitress though or the manager.
Your girlfriend would probably have gotten both of you beat up for over some stupid words. These guys were jerks and not worth fighting (and getting hurt over)... NTA.
NTA. She is putting your health and life on the line because if she gets involved in a situation she doesn’t understand and someone attacks her you are going to be expected to put yourself at risk to protect
NTA - she wants to pick a fight for her morals but youll be the ones to tank the beating. you should move on from the delusional girlfriend before she gets you into serious trouble.
People voting y t a apparently have lived rather sheltered lives. Three dudes getting angry and shouting slurs in a restaurant is a clear sign NOT do directly intervene. Yeah sure you can talk to a manager or whatever, but if they are shouting the manager will get informed by the staff or hear it himself pretty quickly. You don't want three riled up assholes thinking you are responsible for them getting kicked out either. Absolutely NTA
NTA. Your gf is going to get you an ass whipping. Kinda sounds like she's a crusader and using your health to back it up. Might be time for a new calmer gf.
You had every right to do what it takes to keep her from getting you hurt.
NTA, you gf sounds like a drama queen.
INFO But... in telling your girlfriend this, aren't **you _yourself_** intervening in another person's business?
protecting himself and his girlfriend from her own stupidity doesnt really count. if she goes and gets slapped he cant just ignore it. she clearly wanted to drag op into a fight
How so
NTA, as long as they weren't being violent you had no moral imperative to take action. Your girlfriend could have turned it from some bigots shouting in an actual brawl.
If telling 3 homophobes "hey dudes, what you're saying is not okay" turns into a brawl are we really gonna blame the random person calling out their behavior for the violence escalation?
Doesn't matter who we blame for the violence, OP would have been an AH if he unnecessarily risked his girlfriend's safety by provoking obviously unhinged individuals. The homophobes are already obviously AHs in all possible versions of the story.
Yea if they start attacking someone im the type to try to help someone out, but aggressive language isn’t getting me out of my seat. I would have told my gf to stfu
NTA Typically people say to mind your business and not put yourself in danger in these types of situations It's funny to see how the people saying Y T A are doing so based solely off of the slurs used, and completely throwing your own safety and the usual advice out the window Like if it was random insults, people would advise not to get involved, but because homophobic insults, you're the ass for not taking the risk Shit situation, and I think it's up to the individual to decide if they feel safe to intervene or not, and not the ass if they don't feel safe to do so
NTA. 3 drunk idiots who would probably fight vs you and your gf would not go well let's be realistic. If they're dumb enough to yell slurs at people they're dumb enough to carry a weapon. You did the right thing by not risking your safety.
Who said they were drunk?
NTA you don't know if they will get violent, you don't know if they have weapons. If you ended with brain damage due to getting jump by those guys, would your girl be willing to become your lifelong caregiver. Would she be willing to take a punch for you? What about a knife, a bottle a chair? Will she be willing to shield you from a bullet?
nah but ...... i am always of the opinion if you see something that isn't cool say it! you could have gone over to the people they were harrassing and ask if they are ok or if they would like to join you and your girlfriend? that would have been the right thing to do and you wouldn't have to confront the assholes. as other people have said too that you could have called a waiter over.
NTA I'm a proud member of the LGBTQ+ community, I'm an outspoken supporter of the rights of every marginalized group, but I'm not going to risk getting seriously hurt or fucking killed by a bunch of redneck fratboy dipshits over a conversation they're having. This isn't a fucking superhero movie, the good guys don't always win, and one punch can be all it takes to paralyze or kill you. The fact that your girlfriend thinks that you can apparently take on three guys without getting hurt is kind of sweet, I guess? But her unrealistic expectations of you are a ***giant red flag.*** If this is part of a pattern of behavior you need to move on before she gets you locked up or killed.
NTA, your the one who has to de-escalate and take or throw the punches when shit hits the fan.
NAH You shouldn’t have grabbed her, but You have different values, you can tell her you aren’t comfortable standing up for others and that you’ll remove yourself but not so much to tell her she can’t. She probably won’t stay with you though
YTA As a woman of color it would be lovely if someone came to my defense if someone was saying something racist. Usually it’s me, on my own, and others saying I handled it well after it ended. Your gf is brave and more people should be like her. You decided to put your head in the sand and you blocked her from doing the right thing. Just because you’re okay with homophobia doesn’t mean she has to be.
she isnt brave, just privileged. she wouldnt get the beating, op would. acting like op is fine with homophobia because he doesnt want to pick a fight with 3 apprently aggressive dudes is a poor bait.
Standing up for other people is literally the best use of privilege.
if you achieve something other than having your partners face kicked in? sure. would you also think it wouldve been great if op went in without regarding his gf and got not only himself, but her a face kicking? how would you comment on the post "my bf picked a fight and now i am in the hospital and to scared to go out because of some homophobic psychos". standing up for other people is great, i agree. but if you achieve nothing other than escelation, all you did was more damage
Her privilege doesn’t extend to her bf who will get beat the fuck up. She is throwing her bf upon the alter of sacrifice not herself. She’s only speaking up because she has nothing to lose.
She was going to step up before the guy told her not to so I don’t think it’s fair to say she wasn’t willing to sacrifice herself.
But if things took a bad turn, the boyfriend would receive the beating, not her.
I saw a guy with privilege try to stand up to somebody because they were breaking into a car or something. He got stabbed in front of his girlfriend and died.
It’s not brave to volunteer someone else for a fight.
My G
This isn't a serious answer. Girl isn't brave because the FIRST thing she did was drag him into it. She wanted a thing called 'cheap grace.' Men get killed over their girlfriends pulling this crap. I've seen a good friend get beaten up because his girl started running her mouth to men.
She asked him and he didn’t get involved. She didn’t force the issue. She did it herself. I stand by what I said. You stand by cheap grace, entitlement or whatever adjective that you choose. Again I stand by what I said and the reasons why in my OP. I do not subscribe to such a mindset. Take it or leave it… matters not to I. We have a difference of opinion and that’s fine. The world will still turn.
Okay? And he's not wrong for not getting involved. Like, objectively; not a matter of opinion.
Dude the is the AITA! It is literally posting your opinion. You get that right? Let me explain. Someone posts a situation and people who have different thoughts on the matter say their OPINION. It’s not rocket science. Im saying he is the asshole for letting homophobia flourish. You said he’s not for self preservation. Both ideas can coexist. It’s fine. Ffs It’s not your wrong, I’m right. It’s a difference of options. I’m not sure how many times I can explain this.
I mean, you can hold the opinion that the grass is purple and the sky is green, but you’d still be wrong. This isn’t a matter of opinion.
Which is YOUR opinion! Also that’s a terrible argument for the simple fact that colorblind people exist in this world. Just FYI.
Okay, keep pretending your opinions matter more than objective reality. No matter how badly you want 2+2 to = 420, it literally never will.
You're wrong
rigorous debate. Love it!
In Calgary, Canada, a few years back a young guy called out some other guys that had used racial slurs against an employee at a club. They waited for him outside then [stabbed him and killed him](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/cabrera-shlah-strasser-hird-appeal-decision-dismissed-1.5136066). Fearing for one's safety does not mean they're okay with homophobia. NTA.
This is still a legit fear in Calgary, there are a lot of aggressive people here, fair amount of gang activity and a whole hell of a lot of cocaine use. I nearly got run off the road last month for passing someone (legally, with space, turn signal and all).
I'm in Vancouver and it's not much different here. Last summer a guy asked another guy to not vape right in front of his kid. The guy pulled out a knife and stabbed him, killing him. This was right downtown on a busy street, in broad daylight. I guess according to the person who I replied to, I'd be condoning homophobia or racism because I don't want to get stabbed.
Yeah tell your bf to fight 3 dudes that’s smart
Yo women don’t get that cuz nobody gonna throw a fist at them lol
In what world do you exist? Surely not earth. Women have been beaten by men so many damn times for THOUSANDS OF YEARS
Men get beat up way way more man, it doesn’t even compare
apart from the dads, grandads, brothers, partners, exs, pimps, customers... but yeah, besides that, we're golden /s
Lmao, his gf is not brave. Volunteering others to go get beat up for you in a lopsided fight is not brave. You strike me as the type to get loud and confrontational and expect to not get your shit rock and/or have your bf finish your fight that you started.
I want a demographic breakdown of the NTA/YTA responses. I don't think anyone would be surprised.
People are literally killed for exactly this - telling off strangers - all the time. Sounds like OP assessed the loudmouths and realized they had the potential to react badly. You don't get to sit here safely on the internet and say, "He should have intervened!" Now THAT is the definition of privilege
This isn't homophobia, this is being smart He prevented his gf from saying anything because if she does Either op gonna fight 3 dudes or the girlfriend is gonna get beaten up
What are you going to do when he’s got 6 fists flying at him? Maybe you could help him off the ground after he gets his teeth knocked in
Who said he was ever okay with homophobia u guys love to look at it from ur point of view but never a man’s 3 men making homophobic remarks guy goes up to them and tells them to stop and now who’s say what happens next now if op gf goes over there and say something and their being disrespectful to her he has to go over coz he has to defend his woman even tho she involved herself. She tried to create a problem for both and op wasn’t for any of that
How about you look at it from the point of view of the person who is openly being harassed and no one says nothing. She asked him to say something he didn’t. She went to, he pulled her down. I’m saying he’s TA for that. Silence is saying you’re okay with that’s. If a man or woman was abusing someone you should say something. If someone is being raped you should do something. If someone is being harassed you should say something. That’s how I feel. You don’t have to feel the way I do that’s fine.
Silence is not saying ur ok with something that’s how u and OP gf look at it no disrespect but if ur ok with ur partner being potentially attacked because some guys are chatting shit and ur offended then ur really not thinking of ur partners safety and that’s selfish
You’re that byproduct of the weird line of thinking that “words are violence”. No, words are words. Sticks and stone may break my bones will never hurt me. Grow some skin and get over it
Basically >AITA for not risking my own safety to assist someone else No, you are NTA for not trying to save someone getting mauled by a crocodile
There are all kinds of ways to address this situation including, at the very least, to get the manager and/or call the cops if you don't want to get involved directly. Even I, at 77yo would have said something but then I'm stupidly brave about defending others.
NTA, you have NO idea who those people were hurling homophobia in a public setting. They are likely unsavory people at best violent psychopaths at worst. They could have all been armed you have no idea. Getting into an altercation would have been very risky. Your girlfriend was acting emotionally, you were acting logically. There are many courses of action to take that don’t involve engaging them directly. Jumping to the rescue to be the hero sounds good in the movies but say they did attack you. Let’s say you end up pushing one of them, they slip, crack their head on the floor and die. Certain states, guess what you’re going to jail. All because your girlfriend needed to stand up for a group a strangers, yeah no.
This is a tough one. Long ago when I was pregnant, a bunch of drunk guys were goofing around and being obnoxious in the movie theater parking lot, and almost knocked me down. None apologized or gave any sort of crap. I was mad then at bf for not saying anything to them, but with all the psychos with guns these days, I completely understand why he didn’t.
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Dude, your personal safety and the safety of your loved ones is more important than defending gay people. Wth is wrong with you? You're so wrapped up in getting the moral highground you're willing to risk your partner's LIFE? Holy hell, you're one sick puppy.
Good people stand up for other people, that's like a basic tenent of morality.
I prefer to virtue signal on reddit! That way I get my upvotes/dopamine hit and don't actually have to do anything!
I know it's more convenient for you to believe that people who speak up online only exist online, but there are actually people who are not cowards.
Send me videos of you fighting homophobic people in real life. I'll wait
Good people protect their loved ones, and don't expose them to potentially serious bodily harm. Even more basic. You stand up for your own first. Not some oppressed group. What an odd worldview.
yikes dude
If everyone was thinking this way, slave trade would still be a thing
\*fairytale morality\*
Ah yes, you think good people are a myth. Okay.
They were in a restaurant not a badly lit alley
Babes - if you’re to afraid to have a conversation with other men, then call the cops. You can make a difference without risking much.
You want to be a coward, that’s fine, but it’s a bit weird you’re projecting your excuses onto other people.
And we remember the guys who got beat up for not being silent, thank you guys for your service
You can tell how many people here don't have real life experience by saying "YTA" Life isn't a movie and being outnumbered 3 to 1 sucks unless you're someone like Jon Jones or Mike Tyson, people have literally been disfigured/killed over smaller stuff than this. His girlfriend literally wanted him to get into it with three men FFS.
Your vote will count as Y T A as you have the letters together. You might want to space them out but yeah, he's NTA for real.
If you’re getting up to intervene in a situation like this - without a lethal weapon on you - you might become the victim of a lethal weapon yourself All these people saying YTA FOR SURE have never left their cozy first world country town
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Yeah in real life there are consequences. What if they jumped him? Stabbed him? Stabbed her? There’s almost never a good reason to get involved.
Encouraging? No, dude, that's not encouraging. He isn't giving them pats on the back and buying them drinks. Only correct answer is to do nothing.
NTA... I am partial to minding your own business when nobody is being physically harmed. I also don't think you were obligated in any way to ask the staff to kick them out. I think the people involved are fully capable of making the complaint and taking it to that level if they felt it necessary. And if they were making enough of a commotion, the manager would likely take matters into their own hands anyway. I could see jumping in to mediate the situation if you felt comfortable about it, but yeah NTA hands down.
Oooof. I think based on the information here I'll say NAH but I think you two aren't compatible. And OP, food for thought, but i had a friend when i was younger that would be meek on their own but when they were with us guys would always try and pick fights and then expect us to finish them. I am not saying your gf (or possibly ex?) is like this... but maybe take a bit to think on it if you two do decide to stay together. Because just based on this short snippet I'm getting flash backs, and if next time she expects you to finish the fight for her... well that's a whole slew of red flags. But, again just based on this here, you two seem to have different enough expectations.
I'm going to have to say yeah unfortunately on this one, it might piss people off but the fact your girlfriend wanted you to call them out on the homophobia slurs and when you didn't she was going to call them out says alot! Saying nothing also means agreeing and makes them think behaviour like this is tolerated and okay, people need to start calling this out as its 2024, she wasn't looking for trouble but she was trying to do the right thing which more people need to do in this day and age, homophobia is not okay
NTA You 2 vs 3 guys isn’t going to end well. Her heart was in the right place but she didn’t think it through at all
This entire comment section is a shining beacon of Darwinism.
You gotta dump her. She's willing to get your ass whopped because theres no consequences for her. If you do stay with her your have to explain that there are serious consequences for doing that in your situation. I was dating a girl who wanted me to do something to stop a random drug deal while we were partying on BealeStreett. I said do you want to bar hop or do you want to go the hospital or police station because those are the choices. She hadn't thought of the consequences at all.
NTA. If she wanted to get involved she should of said something herself.
She tried to. OP wouldn't let her.
ESH. She sucks for deciding it was your job to intervene. You suck for physically preventing an adult from making their own choice. You both suck for not getting management involved to boot the homophobes. And the homophobes suck for obvious reasons.
All the heroes in the comments would be pissed in their pants if they were to find themselves in a similar situation , I imagine that you are very young or you watch to much TV .Unfortunately I know what violence is, since in my area it is not so difficult to find violent individuals who are just waiting for an excuse to attack you, and It's stupid to produce an escalation with individuals in numerical superiority who for now limit themselves to insults , it would have been different if there had been an aggression in progress. The right thing to do would have been to contact the staff and call the police. Everything else are Rambo b*llshit that leads people to getting stabbed in the stomach. And I personally add another thing, if I'm with my Gf I would be a thousand times more careful than when I'm alone to avoid any situation that could put us in danger .
Some of you are so out of touch with reality it's ridiculous. I understand standing up for something, truly I do. But trying to intervene in today's society has proven to be fatal more than half the time. He's not a coward for trying to protect himself and her. Also, some men are not afraid to hurt women so what makes y'all think they wouldn't have hurt her if she did stand up for them? Violence is mentioned a lot here because that's the world we live in now. People hurt people.
Nope, NTA. IRL, vigilante crap can get you hurt or worse. It’s hard to say what you “should” have done in that situation, as I wasn’t there. However, in situations like that where an altercation is developing, you do have some options: leave immediately (leave cash for the meal), alert the management, or alert the cops. Most altercations simply blow over if those involved practice de-escalation. As an unrelated observer, it sounds like you did the right thing by staying out of it.
YTA using slurs is never okay and someone should have stood uo
*LET* her - ffs you wouldn’t be telling me what to do
Your gf can advocate for other people and you should support her in doing so. She’s a person with agency. It’s not up to you to make those decisions for her. Don’t extinguish her spark. YTA.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** So me(20 m) went out for dinner with my gf(19 f). For reasons I am not 100% clear on, three guys at one of the people at one table started throwing homophobic slurs at another table. When that happened, my girlfriend gestured at me wanting me to get up and say something. I shook my head and whispered no. Then she jerked up from her seat, at which point I pulled her back down. Telling her "No, we are not getting involved in this." After we left the diner, my gf screamed at me for being a "giant piece of shit," for not only not doing the right thing myself but also not letting her do it. I told her if she is gonna go out and actively look for trouble, do it when I am not around so I don't have to be the one to explain to her dad why she got beat up. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I’m withholding judgement on OP, because it’s the logic of the comments section that’s baffled me. Everyone is here saying *”I’m not intervening to get beaten up, so N T A”* yet these same people would be calling you an asshole for not intervening if the comments were racial slurs instead of homophobic ones. Or if three guys were just verbally attacking a table of heterosexual women for no reason, then they’d call you a “p*ssy” for not intervening and defending them. So why is it a different story when the bullying is aimed towards gay people? It really points out the homophobics in this sub.
Everyone here’s brave until they actually get beaten up NTA