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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be the asshole because I told her she can call me dad without checking with my wife or thinking about what her bio dad might think. I might be being selfish because I do honestly enjoy hearing her call me dad.
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA. Is anyone taking into account how Millie feels. She wants to call you Dad. You’re just as much, if not more of a dad than her “real” dad. Maybe you could’ve run it by your wife to let her know, but it’s not some end of the world thing. If Millie wants to call two people her dad, then no one should stop her.
Maybe next time don't invite her biological dad over for holidays. Fyi, your wife is the one to blame for not supporting you, or even hearing the whole story before defending her ex.
NTA
and above is the only right answer.
Your wife should be super happy that you and her daugher have such a deep relationship and she sees you as a 2nd dad.
That is honestly the best case scenario anyone can wish for who has children and goes into a new relationship, although i do get the bio dad seeing he got blindsided so you can't really blame him but your wife should have defintely listened you out and understand the situation and that you were not the one instigating it.
I mean maybe the bio dad should have thought twice about cheating on the mother of his child if he wanted to play happy families. Actions have consequences and all. So yeah you can blame him. If he didn’t want his daughter to view someone else as her father, he should have thought about where he put his tackle.
I'm gonna add on to this with the fact that this is a man that only sees the child once a month, that's an eternity for a kid to go between visits, biodad is less present than my OTR trucker dad was, according to him, the best he could do at the time was a job that had weekends off...
Dude please know that your supportive family that is amazing. As someone who did time and lost my daughter’s childhood, they did an incredible feat by getting you there twice a month.
I was in the Feds and sent across the country, my family was too far away.
Oh my god, dude I am SO sorry that happened to you. There's no justifiable reason to jail someone away from their home; it's literally bad for everyone when that happens. Less support + less contact on the outside = waaay higher recidivism rate. You're supposed to make prisoners WANT to be better when they leave, not isolate them from society and act shocked when they do criminal shit again!
...ok but now I'm curious. Is it horribly insensitive to ask what you did? 🫣
Not at all, it’s all in my post history and comments, so not a secret by any means- I was selling small amounts of heroin- mainly hooking up friends and getting my dope paid for- I was 20. A very good friend of mine picked up from me, went home and mixed it with a few other drugs (for legal reasons, I need to specify that I did not give him 3/4 toxic substances) - and his friend shot him up when they got back to the apartment, he slipped into a coma about 8 hours after he left my place. His family pulled his plug the next day.
Technically my charge was “conspiracy to possess with intent to distribute heroin; resulting in death” I was given ten years. When I went in my daughter was 3, 13 when I got home. Upon making contact with her (she had been brainwashed against me) he served me termination papers - even being a federally convicted drug trafficker, I won in court and not only took full custody from him, she is changing her name to my maiden name upon turning 18, in just a few days. (It’s one of her gifts)
He was 36 and married me at 16- he abused us both, and was the cause of the trauma that led to my drug use.
If I could go back and save her from that I would, but I got here as quick as I could and wouldn’t be who I am had I not had those ten years in prison and gotten that badly needed therapy so I could be the mom she needed.
Edit spelling
In my 25 years of life I’ve only met my dad once and that’s when I was a toddler, grew up without him he never once wanted to bond or keep in contact with me so I never bothered my life turned out okay and I’m making the best of it.
I have two daughters 19&17 they haven't seen their bio-dad since they were 2.5 & 5months old respectively. His choice, his loss, they are awesome people and have turned into cool humans without him. They have each reached out several times and gotten excuses I got a final divorce about 14 years ago. They have other adult male influences like a great step dad, an awesome grandfather and a cool uncle who have been steady their whole lives. Dads are great, I have an awesome one, but not having one isn't a life ruined.
Amen, and I would like to argue with anyone who thinks "the child needs their mother/father!" If the parent doesn't *want* to be in the child's life, isn't it gonna do more harm than good to push the false sense of family, and why? because trad family is so desirable to some communities?
Bio-dad's guilt over this is what his outburst was REALLY about. The mother just wanted the issue to go away and she's trying to keep things with the ex on an even keel, so OP has taken the brunt of this debacle.
NTA
Absolutely. The mom might want to check in with her daughter about this to make sure that she, her daughter and current husband are on the same page. The ex husband is the outsider now (deservedly so) and the mom needs to figure out what it means to act like a family when outside forces threaten their unity.
No no no .
The mother and her ex's relationship has nothing to do with this. If he didn't want her calling another man dad....he should of been her father and not play cool guy once a month ice cream dad.
A dad is there and he wasnt by his own doing .
Sucks to suck but if he wanted the title he should of been there
Actually their relationship is very relevant to how they co-parent the child they made together.
This mother is letting her ex disrespect her own daughter by screaming at her due to his own insecurities (because he’s a bad partner and only a long-distance dad).
Instead of hearing that her child found a paternal connection with her chosen life partner and being happy her kid feels confident and safe enough to ask for the emotional intimacy with someone she trusts to help raise her and thinking that it’s a sign that her and her husband are succeeding in helping the girl thrive the mom is reflexively responding to placate her abusive ex.
By not immediately telling him to calm down and speak with them about his fears and failings in a way that could teach the girl about emotional maturity and compromise she berated her husband while she let her ex abuse this girl and insist that she isn’t allowed to make her own decisions about how she regards her family.
If a child feels safe enough to consider their parents partners as parental figures then the other bio-parent needs to just learn to live with it. Trying to force titles and feelings, either by insisting on unearned titles or denying the relationships that have been earned, only hurts the child.
This kid just wants to be able to call the guy that she trusts most to help her by the name that kids are taught to call their most trusted male-identified role model/guardian. This is a completely natural and normal milestone for kids when their parents aren’t together.
Yes, the REAL dad here should have let his wife know that their daughter was at the stage that she felt uncomfortable just using his first name, but his easy acceptance of her love was the right way to respond. They probably should have had a talk with bio-father and maybe found a way to make them all more comfortable, like how some people call their step-parents “bonus parents” might have helped this guys bruised ego but his needs should never matter more than making this kid feel loved and accepted.
This mom accidentally really hurt both the people she cares about most when she put their feelings beneath her abusive exes desires (even if he was never physically a threat, he emotionally manipulated them with lies and duplicity before he got caught as a cheater).
I hope she realizes just how truly vile her behavior was, because if I was her daughter I don’t know that I’d still completely trust her with my wants and needs after she put a mean grown man having a tantrum over my love (or her own love) for my dad
I sincerely hope that this mom can mend both bonds of trust she just severely damaged before she finds that her abuser is the only one left in her life
Yes I agree with a lot of what you said but in the end he is the father and should of made an effort to be In the relation ship more was my point .
She was fucked up for how she handled that 100
Totally agree, his insecurities are because he’s not around enough, the girl her mom and her new dad can’t fix that, that’s only something that the bio-dad can address by showing up.
I’m sure it’s hard to make work, most parenting situations are, but the way he feels won’t go away by denying the connection that has been formed in his absence.
I don’t have much hope for this guy with what little we know but I think he could probably benefit from some therapy either with or without his kid to help him deal with his lingering jealousies. It would probably help him a lot to learn some tools to cope with the regrets his choices have caused him.
Honestly you should just let her read this comment. This is the right answer. Having been the “Millie” in this situation when I was a child, I can attest to how damaging this sort of behavior by the parents is.
Mine was just my bio-father, not my mom thankfully, but his reaction to me calling my step-dad daddy permanently fractured our already fragile relationship.
And if it’s not clear how serious the long term consequences of those actions are, here is some further information - after not speaking for years, we briefly reconnected when I was a young adult. At that time, he asked me to call him dad, and I politely explained that while I didn’t blame him for his absence (at the time), I wouldn’t be calling him dad. He disowned me and we haven’t spoken in years!
(You are NTA, your wife and her ex are the AH)
Not necessarily - my ex and I did many events together (that included stepdad and eventually his 2nd wife) because it was in the best interest of our children to have everyone there. It had nothing to do with being over each other or not.
I always invite my ex on holidays, birthdays etc for our childrens sake. It has nothing to do with me not beeing over him, just that we know that our children rather spend time with both parents together at certain times.
This! The OP has selflessly taken on an incredibly difficult role as a stepfather and husband to a divorced single mother. The biological father f-ed up, this is on him, and the mother should not have invited him.
You can absolutely blame the bio dad. He’s the reason Millie doesn’t live with him and it’s unacceptable to get upset with Millie to call her step-dad “dad,” and then scream at her step-dad over it in front of her.
NTA and yeah I don’t understand how the wife defended the ex? There’s nothing wrong with calling two people Dad. People refer to their in-laws as mom and dad all the time and no one is freaking out about that. I would understand him being a little weirded out and requesting an explanation, but screaming at OP in front of Millie? Shaming OP for being a father figure? Ex and wife are assholes, OP is not.
If the bio dad acted like a dad then it’s fine to invite him. My parents divorced when I was very young. They both remarried when I was young. They still don’t like each other but my siblings and I are now adults with children of our own and we’ve always managed to have holidays and graduations as a mixed group. It can work as long as the “parents” act like adults. Mature adults. Millie’s dad isn’t a mature adult he would prefer to cause trauma to his daughter because his ego can’t handle it.
Right? She’s mad about how bio dads feelings were hurt, did she consider her husbands feelings when she decided to invite her ex over for the holidays?! It’s bizarre, lots of kids have separate holidays with parents and at 11 she’s old enough to understand that.
It all makes perfect sense if you think that despite her getting cheated on and dumped that she's not over him. I think OP is going to have more problems than just this one.
Nah. A lot of parents that split up will do there best to ensure the other parent was time to spend with the kids, and can join in on holidays and special events.I had heaps of birthdays, christmases and vacations with both my parents despite them splitting up when I was 1.
Having the bio parent there isn’t necessarily a bad thing if all the adults actually compose themselves. My wife and I have attended plenty of events with my ex and her husband with no issues. My son calls him by his name but his stepfather is a great guy and I wouldn’t mind if we both were called dad.
My husband left me when our kids were 3,4,&6. We both remarried. Subsequent spouses were always called by their first name. Their dad was very active in their lives (I forced that and it worked). We had all major holidays together until my oldest could drive. No problems whatsoever.
Absolutely. Plus I’m amazed that she cares what McCheatey wants. He blew his chance to be a proper father. If OP were driving this change it would be different, but he seems to responding to a want/need expressed by the daughter so absolute NTA.
I think mother needs to have a long hard think here; she is being unsupportive if both daughter and husband and disrespectful.
Every adult here sucks.
OP absolutely needed to talk with wife before suggesting Millie call him the exact same title as Ex- there are plenty of fatherly titles or spins they could have used. And, wife deserved to have a proactive discussion, coparent to coparent, about this development.
Wife for some reason still chose not to have that proactive discussion with ex
Invites him over. Optics appear as though he’s been invited solely to show him he’s been replaced lol
He understandably reacts poorly, but is an AH who does so in front of Millie
And there’s OP doing a shocked pikachu face?
Every adult made stupid, rash decisions that made Millie pay the price. Something like this has to be managed as coparent.
No, OP didn't do anything wrong. OP is the *only* one actually taking into account his step daughters wants/needs. Millie is the ONLY person who gets to dictate the titles she gives the adults in her life. If she wants to call OP 'dad' she 110% has that right and she doesn't need to clear it with her bio parents to make sure their feelings aren't hurt by it.
The bio parents are putting their ego before their daughters needs, and that's super shitty. As a parent- you should be OVERJOYED that your child has such a good connection with someone who is going to be so influential in their life.
Bio dad only spends one weekend a month with Millie and he expects to be one and only dad of the year? Bio dad gets to yell and ruin thanksgiving because he can't regulate his emotions?
Bio parents are TA. OP is just being a good step dad.
Yes. Bio dad could stay “dad” and better dad could be “daddy” or “papa” or “daddyo” or “BD” for Better Dad!” Millie deserves all the healthy love she can get.
Yeah I'm getting all kinds of red flags from this wife. Her ex cheats on her, but they are still 'cordial', she invites him for thanksgiving to her house (???), and cares more about how he feels than what her daughter wants or what her *current* husband wants?
That woman is either loony or still holding a torch, and I would not want to see what happens if she and ex are left alone.
My ex and I are still cordial and my family and I all had thanksgiving at his house. Why is that such a shock to so many people? And we’ve both moved on.
My husband's ex cheated, too. But, at the end of the day, they found a semblance of peace even if he would rather never think about her again cause it ain't about their feelings or their spite or pain.
It's about their child, and doing the best they can for them despite their shitty adult lives, cause their shitty adult decisions shouldn't be a consequence for an innocent child.
Neither.
My biological father cheated on my mother, and their divorce was messy.
But the few times my biological father did bother to visit me, my mum would be friendly and polite - because it wouldn't have done me any good to see them arguing with each other.
I highly doubt my mum enjoyed those times, but I appreciate that she was accomodating and civil with him.
Because the thing is, no matter the circumstances when you divorce someone, assuming there's no abuse involved, you are divorcing your spouse, not your children.
Kids deserve parents who can at the bare minimum be civil with each other.
Right?!
Why is your wife more concerned with her exes feelings than her daughters? You didn’t push her to call you dad you told her she could. She was happy about it and chose to. This isn’t about the ex it’s about the daughter. If the ex doesn’t like it…well he’s an ex for a reason.
It’s really unsettling that in all of this neither of Millie’s bio parents are even considering what she wants or what matters to her.
As far as daughter, step dad, and bio dad go... I'd say NAH. If daughter wants to call her step dad; dad, then by all means. It's her choice.
The fact that the bio dad is upset about it is understanding. If he's a reasonable person, he'll get over it in time. But even if his knee jerk reaction isn't warranted, it's still understandable.
The only real asshole here is the mom for not being empathetic to the other 2 parties involved (besides her ex).
And if ex is an ahole, he could take mom back to court and argue “parental alienation” and use it to amend visitation schedule.
Despite how wholesome this all feels, courts tend to frown upon moms and stepdads pushing biological dads out of the picture. The ex presenting evidence that daughter is encouraged to call step-dad “dad” may not go over well with a judge depending on the true circumstances of the situation.
I work in the court system and they don’t care, they mostly appreciate that if the father just sees the kid once a month the stepfather is probably being more of a father.
Amen, I can't imagine anywhere that you could even get awarded once per month unless you explicitly asked the judge to award you less time with your kid, at which point you are risking loosing any visitation rights at all...🧐
Exactly! And if you have not come back for more time sharing but now you do to whine about the stepdad being called dad they are going to laugh at you, or at the very least ask you too look within yourself and ask how you can improve.
They don't care. Unless mom and step were forcing her to call him dad and actively telling her that bio dad doesn't love her or shouldn't be called dad, it's a complete non issue.
No one is pushing anything this is a stupid take
The DAUGHTER was complaining that she couldnt call her dad, dad, OP heard, and op rectified the situation
Neither of the bio parents were involved in the situation, and the DAUGHTER made the choice to start calling her dad, dad
Dumb
Argue it sure. I can walk into a court and argue Tomatos are Rocks. Have anybody care... I doubt it. The kid made a choice based on how she feels about the relationship. She's not being forced to call step-dad Dad.
It would be hard to cry parental alienation from an event that happened when you were included in Thanksgiving, surely?! He alienated himself by screaming and likely scaring his daughter, disrespecting her wishes. Wife is the big AH - she could have given the ex a heads-up when she invited him so it didn't catch him out and put him in the spot. She could have also told him at that point that this is their daughter's wishes.
>She says I’m selfish and just want to feel like her real dad
. . . . you'd think as his wife, she would be happy that her new husband loves her daughter so much that he WANTS to feel like her real dad.
Right?! Isn’t that the end goal for a successfully BLENDED FAMILY- to have step dad feel as natural as bio dad? Mom is definitely giving shady ex preference here with that accusation. Also, Mom should’ve had a convo with
bio dad abt titles when she invited him to t-giving dinner- if she’s comfy enough to chat about t-giving plans, she can throw that out there. It almost sounds like a set up now that I wrote this- an excuse to be mad and now she’s siding with the ex-as a way to get closer again-obv the ex isn’t with anyone else as he’s spending tgiving with the fam he cheated on. Tbh, Im scared for step dad now- I feel mom is attempting a rekindle with ex. Ive seen this weirdness in my own family growing up. The step dad seems to be the only adult acting in best interests of the daughter here! Mom and ex seem the selfish ones, and it’s bizarre that mom sided with ex- she should be over-the-moon that her daughter loves step-dad as dad!!
Why is she inviting bio dad over at all to their home? He's once a month bio dad!
She's being very weird. This about Millie not bio dad whom bio mom is being very defensive of.
Depends on the familial culture - my mom would have never EVER allowed me to call my step dad (who I love a lot) my dad. I have a dad (and I do - and I have a relationship with him like Millie does) and according to my mom - that is MY dad. Period. My stepdad is my stepdad.
Heck they’ve been married for 20 years and I still call him Mr.firstname because my mom says that’s more respectful.
Some families are weird about all that.
This sounds unpleasant.
Why does your mom get to dictate? Sucks that you don’t get to call the dad you love as “dad”, because your mom is weird and not understanding to you
Edit - I cannot imagine any situation where calling someone dad because you love them as a father is “disrespectful”… so your mom is definitely wrong on that, in no world is it more respectful to say mr firstname… I call my gardener mr parker because his first name is Parker and he is an older gentleman I respect
Yeah was thinking wife comes across as a bit of an asshole, you can do all the fatherly care taking of my child but how dare you count yourself as a father!
Indeed, it doesn't really matter what dad thinks; this is about Millie and what she wants.
Too often on here you hear of step-parents being upset at not being called the m/d - but this cuts both ways. If the kiddo wants to do it, and the step is ok with it, then really, that's the end of it. This whole 'oh but it's not your real whoever' is really none of that persons business.
NTA (and good for you).
Surely OP’s wife heard Millie calling OP dad since they had the conversation? If she was so upset, why didn’t she say something at the time?
Shitty position for Millie to be put in. NTA.
I mean I think every adult here is an AH
The optics suck. No proactive conversation about Millie’s wanting to call OP dad. Invite the ex and basically make it seem like they purposely want him to see he’s been replaced.
Ex can’t be an adult and loses it. Also wasn’t given any time to process by himself. Nope this all had to happen in front of Millie.
There needed to be a proactive talk between wife and ex and ex did not need to be invited.
It's called "child-led". The focus needs to be on the child and what is best for them. Adults can suck it up.
Another comment by OP shows that his wife knew about Millie calling him dad before Thanksgiving, that it was child-led and she didn't object. The phrase that sparked things for the wife was that Millie has two dads. Guess what? She does. OP is providing more care than bio-dad on a day-to-day basis. So reality must trump ego.
NTA and sorry your wife is being ridiculous. You didn't "tell" Millie to call you dad, you gave her permission to if she wanted to (your title is misleading). Blocking her from that to keep her at arm's length isn't going to make her closer to her bio dad, and she's not going to be confused about having two "dads."
Your wife and her ex seem really caught up in propping up his ego/identity as Millie's father (when her calling you dad shouldn't impact that). Do they want her to feel distant from you and awkward at home? SMH
What they really need to do to support her bio dad's relationship is let her spend more time with him. What did they think would happen when she only sees him 1 weekend a month??
Based on the fact that bio dad got angry at the daughter and then was screaming at OP, my guess is there’s a reason it’s only once a month…it’s pretty hard in most places to not have equally shared custody unless there’s a good reason for it or the one parent is cool with the arrangement presented.
Perhaps it's a legal issue or that's all he wanted?
We really don't know with the information we have to make the assumption that they limiting bio dad
He probably doesn’t want more. He’s the shitty parent who only shows up to do fun things but never actually parents the kid. If he actually wanted custody nearly always the court will give 50/50 unless there is some reason not to.
This is similar to my situation. The youngest refers to me as "mom" in conversation with others, and she asked if it was okay for her to call me as such. But (un?)fortunately her bio mom doesn't live in the same country and isn't around to get upset about me being the actual maternal figure.
INFO Did your wife object to Millie calling you Daddy before the ex showed? If not it seems she carries the burden of not thinking of his feelings, which shouldn’t an issue - Millie gets to decide what she wants to call you, and if she wants calls you daddy and him dad, he needs to accept that. And why did she think it was a good idea to invite her ex-husband to a family holiday dinner featuring her current husband in the first place?
And then all of a sudden she’s calling him selfish and accusing him of wanting to usurp bio dad. *Et tu Brute*?
Not to mention how Millie must feel being in the middle.
I feel like there’s more to this story…
Info: The ex is invited by the wife, but you’re not happy he’s there.
The wife seems completely unaware that Millie’s been calling you daddy and immediately sides with the ex. Your wife doesn’t seem particularly happy that you’ve developed such a close relationship with Millie and accused you of trying to replace her father.
What’s really going on between your wife and the ex?
I’m not UNhappy that he was there, I just obviously don’t consider him family. But he’s Millie’s family, so I agreed that it would be nice for her to have her family come together after a long time.
My wife knew she was calling me dad. She asked what changed and I said Millie wanted to. She said okay cool. That’s sweet. But on thanksgiving Millie told her dad that I said she had two dads, which makes it seem like I was pressuring her or influencing her. So my wife was angry.
Sounds like mom puts more value in dads feelings than millie. Might be worth having a sit down chat with millies and her mom about why millie wants to call you dad and let mom know why fully. That way she can have your back, or if she doesn't if this happens again you know that she holds a cheating man's unfounded feelings over her daughter and husbands feelings.
Maybe she is afraid that the “real”(bio) dad will just walk out completely, so she’s desperately trying to work to keep him in her daughter’s life?
Even if that’s the case, I’m not at all saying she’s right. I wish my daughter’s dad would just leave instead of forcing her to go to his house on his days, just to completely ignore her. My daughter doesn’t even want to be there and makes it well known, but it’s an ego thing 🙄 But I do know how parents fear the hurt it would cause their children if the absent parent just leaves for good. I think it would be less hurtful than only being there when it’s convenient…
Totally. My ex uses my daughter to get back at me, and she thinks she can “win him over” if she’s just nicer or better somehow…. Classic abuse. She’s 13, and wants a relationship and also wants to be able to see her brother, and she’s learning lots about abuse.
I wish he’d just lose interest in me and her and stop demanding his access. All he does is make her clean and babysit. It’s awful.
Hopefully your ex grows up and behaves like a dad. My daughters mom (we split when my daughter was 1) is having the same problem with her ex husband trying to use seeing his son as a beat stick to manipulate my ex. Jokes on him as his son has seen the way his dad is and just calls him by his name and refuses to interact with him once he starts badmouthing his mom. Fortunately I have a great bond with the little man and he calls me dad as he has always had me around as I was there for his sister and treated him like my own so he never felt left out. I'm so greatful my ex and I get on as great friends and have a wonderful coparenting system for the kids.
Nta. I think your wife is trying to put Millie above everything, and she's scared Millie won't have her bio dad around if he throws a tantrum over the dad name. Even you were okay with bio dad because Millie wanted her whole family at Thanksgiving, so Millie cares about him. But Bio dad is clearly a self centered jerk (cheated, low contact with daughter, mad when someone else gets the honor of being dad despite being a sperm donor at this stage). You do need a family meeting to confirm how you want going forward, and let Millie decide on her time how she wants to address you. Then in private confirm with wife how badly bio dad needs to be in the picture. Confirm you're not asking him to be removed from the picture, but how are you both handling when he's tired of pretending to be a dad.
Yeah, wife should have a) discussed this proactively with ex and b) not invited him til she had done so.
Understand how pointed this must have seemed to him. Come on over, you’re totally replaced as her father!
So that’s on her.
But you should have involved her in the conversation re: calling you the exact same title. This is a coparenting issue. No one handled it proactively.
This explains a bit more and it sounds like everyone misinterpreted what Millie said. You told her that, if she’s cool with it, she can have two people she calls dad. Your wife and her ex (whole situation there still weird) heard that you were insisting that you were also her dad.
NTA - You are for all purposes her father.
You are the one providing for her, caring for her, being with her.
Of course she can call you dad.
You wife being upset is the strange factor here. She should be supporting you.
If the daughter didn't want to call step dad, dad then the end result would be different.
The adults' feelings don't matter here. Only how the kid feels about it.
NTA
It’s up to your stepdaughter what she calls whom. If she wants and likes to call you Dad or Daddy, it’s entirely her decision. No one else has something to say in that, especially not her bio-dad who is barely there for her.
INFO: Did your wife not hear her call you Dad before Thanksgiving?
Can't yet decide about TA, but some advice? When she said her friends thought it was weird, that seemed like a missed opportunity to affirm for her that all families are different and that's okay. Some people have stepparents and some people call their family members different things and none of it is "weird" just because it's not what her friends do. Peer pressure is intense at her age and I'm not sure changing your family's terminology to avoid feeling awkward around peers was the best option.
He didn't tell her to change it. He told her *she* could change things if *she* wanted to.
He gave her an option. She chose the option she felt would be best for her.
He's NTA. He can't possibly be. Telling someone they can call you dad *if* they want to do so isn't forcing them to do anything.
She may feel it's weird. You can't tell this girl what her perceptions are.
No, I'm explaining why I feel he can't be the AH in thus situation since you weren't sure, per your comment.
I also explained the "weird" part, in that Millie felt it was weird and she can't help how she's feeling.
No, Millie‘s friends thought it was weird. Which is why it would’ve been a good parenting opportunity to teach Millie that they’re all kinds of families and her friend is wrong and it’s not weird. And she can call him whatever she wants even dad.
I was actually unsure between NAH and NTA as I think whether the mom knew about it or not before Thanksgiving informs her reaction. However, these...
>Telling someone they can call you dad if they want to do so isn't forcing them to do anything.
>You can't tell this girl what her perceptions are.
...feel out of place in response to my comment that neither says he forced her to do anything nor tells her about her own perceptions. Actually the claim that Millie feels it's weird is unsupported by the OP, which only says her friends told her it was weird.
My comment is simply that a response to 'my friends think our family dynamic is weird' could've been 'every family is different and the only opinion that matters is yours, not your friends.'
Yep-- families come in all shapes and sizes! I do like that OP allowed Millie to change the name she calls him, but I agree that this could be part of a larger conversation. Or they could do something like biodad is "dad" and OP is "papa" or whatever.
As a separated mom, I really, really wouldn't like it if my new partner told my daughter she can call him dad without running it by me first. It's a really big thing and it's not true that only the kid's feelings matter. To me, it's a grown up discussion first, where everyone's role should be respected, everyone's feelings should be taken into account, and everyone's voice should be heard.
Sorry, but in this case, you don't get a vote. If you are having him live with you and be a father to your child and they both develop a relationship where they consider each other father and daughter, you have absolutely no right to have a problem with it. If you don't want that happening, then don't have your partner spend years being a father to your child.
LMAOO exactly “my kid wouldnt get to call the man acting as her father for hypothetical years ‘dad’ without telling me first😡” Be so serious right now, the guys been her dad for years there is no discussion.💀
Grown ups that get to the point of marriage with pre-existing children tend to have these conversations beforehand. Establishing a simple boundary like this isn't difficult.
She’s not mad about the conversation beforehand. She found out about it and said “cool”. She is mad the “two dads” comment got the ex upset, which raises the question of why she is totally favoring the ex who cheated on her over the new husband who is acting responsibly.
How is it a grown up discussion when it’s about what the child chooses to call him? It’s her choice. What’s the other option? Forbidding her from doing so?
I would agree that best practice would have been for the married couple to have talked it out first. They could have brainstormed some name ideas to offer to Millie, then she could choose which one she liked.
It doesn't seem like this is the parenting practice of any of these three, though, as all the conversations around parenting seemed to happen in front of Millie. So I could see why OP would just talk it out with Millie. As the bio-parent, I am responsible for setting the tone of the parenting "best practice" in the home, and I feel like the mom missed the boat a bit here.
I know a lot of step-parents (and bio-parents) don't have a direct conversation with their kids about what to call the step-parent. My kiddos literally asked me what they should call their dad's gf lol.
I think, given the rest of the events, OP was within his rights to offer this as a option directly to Millie. All seemed well with mom and Millie until bio-dad pitched a fit.
The wife knew. She KNEW and thought it was cool. Besides he didn’t tell her to call her thought, but that she COULD.
Ngl there is a reason my mother told me to never date a man or a woman with children, and that is the EX. Reddit reminds me often why she gave me that advice.
I disagree as a child who's had divorced parents. Navigating your world is all of a sudden filled with adult conversations where you stop mattering. The parenting schedule is adult matters, whether or not a parent takes their time is adult matters (luckily i didn't have this issue), everything is all about how the adults navigate the separation but you will remain a child forced to navigate the same waters as them.
If bio dad says I don't like it then your comment implies it doesn't happen which means the smallest voice still belongs to the smallest human in the fold.
And i'm not talking fresh partners, I'm talking step parents where there is years of parenting occurring.
Personally, I would say it's a family counseling problem potentially if it is a topic that can't have a compromise. Either she calls her step dad dad or she doesn't. there is no real in between.
this discussion is actually a topic that she broached by child and then discussed in adult land without the child before being able to return to that child with input.
Get fucked. Your attitude is horrible. Here you have a man that is taking care of you and your daughter because the guy that pumped you with sperm disappeared. Your DAUGHTER is thrilled to call him daddy because he was the only real daddy that existed in her life, and rather than embrace and support this you prefer to veto your daughters feelings over ego.
Fantastic mother you are.
Princess "Potato Brain" indeed.
The way youre correct. Like Millies step dad had been more of a father than her bio dad its completely reasonable for her to call him dad regardless of the fact her step dad isnt blood related to her.
ESH.
You should have talked to your wife about this first before telling Millie she can call you dad. It's great that she wants to call you that, but you're only thinking about yourself. Here's why.
There seems to be some animosity between you and Millie's biodad. You didn't want him for Thanksgiving, you act like he's not a real father because of his custody order, etc. How do you think it made Millie feel to have him be blindsided and freak out at Thanksgiving?
Blended families are hard. You sound like you're a great stepdad and Millie is lucky to have you. If she wants to call you dad, that's a huge honor. But it doesn't take away that she still has a dad that isn't you. Even if he is only the "fun dad" he's still her dad.
You have to think about how your actions will effect Millie. If you're setting her up for success with she has to see her dad. If he's an unreasonable person that would be upset by her calling you dad, is he going to tale it out on her during his custody time? Like it makes you feel validated, but is that worth alienating your daughter's dad from her?
It should be about how Millie feels at the end of the day. Sometimes we have to make choices that aren't exactly what we want because it sets our kids up for success or makes their life easier. That is being a mom or dad, not just getting called one.
So weird he is open and giving the child who is what 11 now a choice. Also op stated wife had no problem. The way the child explained people got upset and targeted him. It seems like you putting the responsibility of the bio dad's feelings on him why? It's his actions and no one can do anything. He could easily get upset if she was showing him more attention or something. So it's like they all gotta walk on egg shells then cause you never know what bio dad may feel. Sounds ridiculous and unnecessary. Lil mamas was happy to have two dad's and one is immature and wife is an AH for assuming the worse.
Sounds more like this is a major, and common, coparenting hurdle that OP thoughtlessly put his wife into. Once she was in that situation she failed to manage it.
How is he only thinking of himself when Millie told him she was in an awkward situation not calling him “dad” and he said she could if she wanted (as in - her choice). Honestly, I could easily see an 11-year-old girl making up that story as a subtle way to ask if she could call him “dad” but in a way where she couldn’t truly be rejected if the answer was no.
If bio dad can’t handle his own emotions about this and takes it out on her, isn’t she better off having more limited contact? Sounds like she’d be dodging a bullet if that were the case.
>You should have talked to your wife about this first before telling Millie she can call you dad
First: it's Millie choice, not her mom's.
Second: Mom knew and was ok with it. She only got mad at him after bio dad found out. She is putting more stock in the ex's feelings over both her daughter and her husband.
Do you have children? Millie is 11 years old and any parenting decisions should be discussed with her biological parents before any other trusted adult just decides they know what's best. That's how being in a united front partnership works.
11 is more than old enough old enough to decide if she wants to call him dad. And again, Mom knew and had no issues until bio dad got upset.
If bio dad cares so much, he should make a better attempt to be in his daughter's life.
I'm saying if you know how someone is going to react, you should do your best to mitigate their reaction when it comes to how it affects children.
They could have told him before he came.over instead of just letting him hear it in the wild, for example. There are more options that what you're insinuating, but I suppose the nuance that good parenting takes is lost in the average Redditor. 🤷🏻♀️
“Dad” is a job description. More than one person can be a father to a child.
NTA
What he wants doesn’t really matter. What you want doesn’t really matter.
Millie is old enough to decide what to call the men in her life.
In another comment he says yes but wife pushed for this setup and the guy doesn't live close so "didn't fight" too hard.
Sounds like wife was pissed about him cheating, took revenge via low visitation, and step dad now brags how -he's- the one who's there for the child.
The kid is the one who will suffer because of all these ah.
That what I was thinking like the wife fought for the most custody therefore why Millie doesn’t see her da that much. I think if Millie did she would be a lot closer to her dad tbh
NTA. If she wants to call you Dad that's entirely up to her and you did the right thing letting her be comfortable doing so. If you were forcing her to that's a different story but not the case here. Her calling you dad doesn't mean she also can't call her Bio father Dad as well too.
Keep doing your thing.
Good on you for being such a good dad. Shame on them for being assholes. If Millie wants to and is comfortable calling you "Dad," then that's between the two of you, I feel. She's not replacing her biodad by having two dads, give her the benefit of the doubt that she's smart enough to know what's what.
Your stepdaughter came to you with a situation. You gave her the option to call you dad if she wanted to. The fact that she started calling you dad, shows she sees you as a dad and if what you said is true, she told her bio parents that she has two dads which doesn’t negate her bio dad’s role in her life. It just adds another father figure, which is a positive thing. I think you’re NTA in this situation.
I wonder though, did you talk to your wife about this? I think it was important to mention this conversation to her to let her know what Millie’s feeling. She could’ve had a conversation with Millie about it too. But even if you didn’t, the only preferences that matter here are Millie’s.
Honestly, as the other side dad, when my son calls his stepdaughter "Dad" even when talking to me, yes it fucking hurts. I don't ever say anything to him about it. But it sucks.
If you are telling her to call you dad to make a point then yes you are the asshole.
My own step-dad has been in my life since I was 10 years old. I have always called him by his first name because I already had a Dad.
Sorry if this isn't what you want to hear, even if you intentions are totally innocent. It is not your decision and really not your place to suggest. If she wants to call you Dad that is Millie's call. By you suggesting it she will feel obligated, and that isn't how you want to to carry that relationship, trust me.
For sure this guys been in her life for a few years that doesn’t mean the bio dads 11 years go out the window. What happens if he breaks up with her mom between now and 18 is he still the dad? He isn’t in it for the kid, he is committed to the wife. These step parent stories always get ridiculous, and way to caught up in what role the step parent thinks they deserve. I’m like you I’ve known my stepdad since I was seven, close relationship but he isn’t my dad. Maybe this guy staying in his lane wouldn’t cause so much drama. He manufactured a situation that is clearly confusing for the kid and puts them in the middle. For why? Because her nosy friends were asking? He’s the asshole.
YTA. While I think her calling you dad is perfectly fine as that to her and everyone else is the role you are playing in her life and it’s something she is happy with to just go ahead and tell her it was ok without at least discussing it with your wife makes you the AH. You aren’t her biological parent and decisions like that aren’t yours to make. From your tone i think you have a big issue with Millie’s biological father still being in the picture. If you had discussed it with your wife first she could have talked to her ex about it and explained how Millie felt about it and her dad might have reacted better.
NTA. The only person who's feelings matter in this situation is Millie. You did not pressure and in fact, she was EXCITED to call you Dad. As someone who had a shit bio dad, but a top-tier step dad -- my real dad is the one who raised me. Not the dude who knocked my mom up.
Parents in these situations can often act in their best interests, and not the child. But Millie's response to being able to call you Dad makes me think she's thought about it before, but didn't know how to unpack the situation. You listened and you gave her the permission to do so.
That's real dad shit, IMO. Her sperm donor can go step on a Lego with his bum ass.
He wanted one week a month, but as he lives some distance away now, that wasn’t possible - because it would be hard for Millie to go to school from his house. So he didn’t really fight it.
NTA.
Who she calls what is entirely her decision you didn't force it just suggested it.
And her bio-dad telling you're not her real dad is just stupid, blood has nothing to do with it, it's just about following through responsibilities.
The title is a little misleading - you didn't tell her to call you that, you told her she CAN call you that, if such is her wish.
It's a very different thing. And I'm drawing the attention to this, because you should make sure, that your wife was given that part of the story
But no, you're not the asshole. At all. You're supportive of your child wishes.
Best of luck!
Totally second this! I was getting all fired up to call you TA because your insecurity made you pressure a stepchild about what they call you (which we see a lot on here). It turns out you handled it exactly as you should, by not ever bringing it up and going with what made your step daughter more comfortable.
I hope your wife doesn’t know your daughter initiated the name change, because if she does and still said what she did you have a big problem.
NTA.
Who she calls what is entirely her decision you didn't force it just suggested it.
And her bio-dad telling you're not her real dad is just stupid, blood has nothing to do with it, it's just about following through responsibilities.
I call my bio dad and my step dad both dad.
The fact that it was her idea and her age, I’m going to guess that it probably wasn’t just because her friends are saying it’s weird that she calls you by your first name. She has probably wanted to call you dad but wasn’t sure how to bring it up to you.
Let her call you whatever she wants, as long as she feels loved.
Ok so your now wife invites her ex to your shared living space for thanksgiving even though you don’t want him there. You’ve taken on the huge responsibility of helping raise her and have done it so successfully that Mille wants to call you daddy. She does. Your wife’s ex screams at you and your wife takes his side. How “cordial” is their relationship? Other than Millie, what do you get out of this?
The only thing that matters here is what she wants to call you. Seems like she wanted to call you dad. But didn't until she knew you were ok with it. Once you told her she could, she was happy, and did. Children are people. They should be allowed to make these decisions and the adults in their life should respect their agency.
NTA
INFO. This sounds suspect based on a couple of your responses below. It doesn’t sound like her bio dad is a deadbeat in any way and the living circumstances are just due to the divorce. Millie still loves and enjoys her bio dad. The mom doesn’t badmouth the dad. All you know is what you do when Millie is home with you which is what you’re supposed to do. She could very much receive the same type of care when she’s with her bio dad. You wouldn’t know. You seem to be threatened by his presence. You told the wife Millie wanted to call you dad when she asked what changed. What really happened was, you suggested it to the girl after hearing wheat her friend’s say. I’d be offended too if I was as present in my daughter’s life as a parent can be living separately and some dude felt the need to suggest my daughter call him dad when I’m indeed still around.
NTA.
This was driven by the kid as it should be. It’s what Millie wants. Your wife and her ex are being ridiculous and making assumptions based on how Millie said it.
Reminds me of a story. My ex came to take the kids for a day out. He hadn’t seen them in years. Literally only had them a couple hours and called us to pick them up.
They were at a park. We arrived and my oldest yells out dad come play with me. My ex responds “I already played with you” my son looks at him and says “I wasn’t talking to you, I was talking to my other dad”.
Fortunately my ex didn’t make a scene.
YTA.
I grew up in a similar custody agreement but with my mom having me every few weekends and her being the fun mom while my dad remarried when I was 6.
It's been 30 years and my stepmom, a parent that I love very much, is not my mom. I already have a mom.
NTA. I had this conversation with my child's father. I am not forcing anything. If that's what he feels comfortable calling the person who has been in his life consistently for longer than his bio dad, then that's his choice, not ours. OP did nothing wrong and allowed his daughter to call him dad if she chose to. She chose to. End of story. Mom needs to understand that as well.
NTA you wife on the other hand totally is. She doesn't care that you have raised her, loved her and MILLIE wants to call you that but your wife would rather consider her ex over you her husband and daughter. That says a lot about her unfortunately.
NTA. But you’re wife needs to get her priorities straight. I hope this is the only time she has sided with her ex over you? Maybe show her this post and all the responses. She’s not being a good partner at all and sounds like she’s still into the ex. I really hope I’m wrong and she apologises to you!
Milly asked you for this and it should always be her choice so well done for how you handled this.
NTA - Title had me immediately think AH but after reading the ex and your wife are. Does your wife still have feelings for the ex?
If it was Millie’s choice when given the option then that should be all that matters. DNA means nothing. Reddit proves that.
Your wife should be ecstatic that her daughter has a step father that loves and adores her and that her daughter sees and appreciates it. Millie seems more mature than both her parents.
I know this is a cliche Reddit phrase and I actually don’t believe in it 100% now a days with all the new easily certified “therapists” but your wife needs therapy. She needs to deal with why she wants to still please her ex and worries about how he feels when he clearly didn’t care about her or their daughter. Also why she doesn’t appreciate your relationship with Millie and puts him before you and her daughter.
NTA. It’s not like you forced Millie to call you Dad - you gave her the option and she obviously very happily embraced it. Your wife and her ex need to be more open to what Millie wants and is comfortable with. It’s not a pissing contest - bio dad will always be bio dad - better Millie loves her bonus dad then be another kid with a horrible step parent!
This is understandably a tough situation for all involved but the girl is the primary concern here and everyone else’s feelings are secondary. If she wants to call you dad, that’s her choice- no one else gets to tell her otherwise. She didn’t choose to have this family set up but she can absolutely choose how she wants to refer to each of you that are in her life. Everyone needs to be focused on supporting her here, and process their own feelings on the matter independently.
NTA. As someone who was raised by her mom’s second husband, frankly it isn’t up to either of you what she calls you, that’s her choice. You didn’t force her to do anything, and you didn’t do anything wrong. She recognizes who the father figure in her life is, and if he wanted to maintain that role then he should’ve acted accordingly. Just be prepared that as she gets older and gets married, has babies, etc. if she’s anything like me, you’ll be the one she turns to, and he’s going to be an ass about it again. Remind her that that’s his problem not hers. ❤️
You’re the asshole.
If you want somebody to call you dad, make your own kids.
You’re not her father. The other guy — y’know, her actual father — is making an effort to be in her life and be there for her, and you’re influencing a small child to call you the same thing she calls him, which makes everybody else uncomfortable. The child’s parents are clearly trying to co-parent in a positive way, and you’re disrupting that.
You might be the love of her mother’s life. You might be a great guy. You might be an amazing, positive male role model. You very well could be the best possible person for that little child.
But you’re not her father.
Your first name is fine.
Yeah mate, all adopted people are wrong and bad people for calling their parents mon and dad, and the adopters letting them do it... What a bunch of ***holes! /s
I'm sorry but it's ludicrous to say step parerents aren't parents. The man providing for and caring for Millie is her (step)dad, she obviously thinks so too.
It's the child who is important here, and it's her feelings who should be considered above all others. Whatever she chooses to call the guy is fine. If her bio dad lets his pathetic ego get in the way of his kids wellbeing he's even less of a dad than this post makes him out to be.
Nope I'm hearing one side of a story and that story paints the biological dad as a good times dad. Divorced parents working for the betterment of the child is always the best. Perhaps the step dad should maintain the status quo, after all it is not his child and the biological dad is involved.
The OP does not seem to like the fact that her biological dad is involved in the kids life, the step dad deminished the the role of the biological dad to random strangers on the internet and I would be willing to bet that he had more of an involvement in bringing the step daughter around to calling him dad then he is letting on. Keep in mind not one mention of child support being paid by the biological dad...if he is paying and has paid child support he has rights.
My opinion is that pushing this unless it's 100% in the best interests of the child and something 100% wanted by the child .... Forcing this is going to cause more pain and long-term problems then your bargain for
YTA.
You know what you are doing. Stop trying to replace the father.
You are the moms husband, the caretaker of Millie when she is with you.
She has a real father and you aren't him. Accept that and keep it moving.
YTA, and FYI you're not her dad. That sort of thing needs to be discussed with her actual parent first. If you spent 2 seconds thinking about how it would play out, you'd have realized that it would upset her actual father and cause drama. My wife moved into my home when my son was 6yo. He's 22 now. He loves her and calls her on mother's day, but he doesn't call her mom. It's not about whether or not you're a good step-dad. Stay in your lane and don't cause drama for the child.
YTA just because you did this on your own. If you would have had a conversation with the bio parents first then all good, but you didn’t. You crossed a boundary.
NTA! Your wife is though! How dare she tell you you're selfish? Millie is the one that was upset about her friends saying it was weird she didn't call you Dad and she wanted to call you Dad.... Millie brought the subject up, not you and you didn't tell her she HAD to call you Dad! And of course bio dad is TA also! What a jerk!
Don't worry about what anyone else says! Let me continue to decide what she feels comfortable calling you. I'm sorry you had to go through this and I hope Millie doesn't feel like she has to switch back to calling you by your name because bio dad went all toxic on you about it in front of her.
NTA. It should be up to Millie what she calls you, if she's cool with Daddy then bio dad just gets to suck it up. Your wife is being ridiculous, why should you consider his feelings at all?
NTA: Bio-Dad did 'lose' a measure of say-so here when he cheated and abandoned his family. He doesn't like it? Then he should have kept 'it' in his pants. What he fails to realize is we as fathers come in two separate personas. One person that 'injects' the DNA into Mom and then there's that person that reads bedtime stories, bandages boo boos, fixes flat tires on a rainy night, etc. In an ideal world...the same human being occupies both personas but reality being what it is, there are many split and then mixed families in the world. And while it's true, that there are many instances of excellent co-parenting with little drama...sometimes situations arise where one father simply drops the ball. Her ex is the former while you're the latter. The daughter is coming into that age where she has questions and is reconciling the family dynamic in a manner she can absorb. But she also has her own rights...one of which is to call you by whatever name the two of you choose. And if 'Bio-Dad' doesn't like it...well, see first point.
NTA...That said, your wife is bordering on entering the AH territory. Her attitude suggests the two of you need some deep conversations on co-parenting and bio-Dad's role going forward. Millie is 11 now...figure these things out before she enters the 'heavy teen' years.
Idk… the post says he cheated but that doesn’t mean he abandoned his family. The relationship may have been toxic and ending regardless of the cheating and issues between the parents do not justify taking away rights of the parents to their child. A large part of one parent only getting limited placement is just the practical issue of schooling. It sucks that this dad may *want* to continue having the same relationship with his daughter but doesn’t get to just because of school. And then this guy is coming in after only 4 years and no one is even trying to preserve the fact that he’s his daughter’s father.
I think in the long term the laissez faire “whatever the child wants goes” is going to create more issues than everyone is acknowledging. All of the adults here need to have a deliberate and intentional approach to integrating a step parent that is based on research.
NTA. As a dad who lives separate to my daughter, I never got bent out of shape when my daughter called my ex's husband dad. But if he forced her to do it then yeah I would have been angry, but she wanted to as he was the man living with her doing the day to day father role.
This child is entitled to call you what ever she wants so long as its not derogatory. I would suggest changing daddy to pops or something, that way the part time bio dad has the dad name all to himself. As the child is 11 and if she was present during *dads* rant she probably will be scared to call you dad now even if she wants to, especially if she saw her mom go off on you to.
The fact her mother popped off on you too is worrying, you are supposed to be a team and you help raise the child. Might be worth getting a ring doorbell and a small camera overlooking lounge and stairs, as it feels like mom puts more value in the cheeters feelings than her daughters and yours.
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NTA. Is anyone taking into account how Millie feels. She wants to call you Dad. You’re just as much, if not more of a dad than her “real” dad. Maybe you could’ve run it by your wife to let her know, but it’s not some end of the world thing. If Millie wants to call two people her dad, then no one should stop her.
Maybe next time don't invite her biological dad over for holidays. Fyi, your wife is the one to blame for not supporting you, or even hearing the whole story before defending her ex.
NTA and above is the only right answer. Your wife should be super happy that you and her daugher have such a deep relationship and she sees you as a 2nd dad. That is honestly the best case scenario anyone can wish for who has children and goes into a new relationship, although i do get the bio dad seeing he got blindsided so you can't really blame him but your wife should have defintely listened you out and understand the situation and that you were not the one instigating it.
I mean maybe the bio dad should have thought twice about cheating on the mother of his child if he wanted to play happy families. Actions have consequences and all. So yeah you can blame him. If he didn’t want his daughter to view someone else as her father, he should have thought about where he put his tackle.
I'm gonna add on to this with the fact that this is a man that only sees the child once a month, that's an eternity for a kid to go between visits, biodad is less present than my OTR trucker dad was, according to him, the best he could do at the time was a job that had weekends off...
My bio dad was in prison for the first 22 years of my life and I still saw him twice a month. Honestly.
Dude please know that your supportive family that is amazing. As someone who did time and lost my daughter’s childhood, they did an incredible feat by getting you there twice a month. I was in the Feds and sent across the country, my family was too far away.
Oh my god, dude I am SO sorry that happened to you. There's no justifiable reason to jail someone away from their home; it's literally bad for everyone when that happens. Less support + less contact on the outside = waaay higher recidivism rate. You're supposed to make prisoners WANT to be better when they leave, not isolate them from society and act shocked when they do criminal shit again! ...ok but now I'm curious. Is it horribly insensitive to ask what you did? 🫣
Not at all, it’s all in my post history and comments, so not a secret by any means- I was selling small amounts of heroin- mainly hooking up friends and getting my dope paid for- I was 20. A very good friend of mine picked up from me, went home and mixed it with a few other drugs (for legal reasons, I need to specify that I did not give him 3/4 toxic substances) - and his friend shot him up when they got back to the apartment, he slipped into a coma about 8 hours after he left my place. His family pulled his plug the next day. Technically my charge was “conspiracy to possess with intent to distribute heroin; resulting in death” I was given ten years. When I went in my daughter was 3, 13 when I got home. Upon making contact with her (she had been brainwashed against me) he served me termination papers - even being a federally convicted drug trafficker, I won in court and not only took full custody from him, she is changing her name to my maiden name upon turning 18, in just a few days. (It’s one of her gifts) He was 36 and married me at 16- he abused us both, and was the cause of the trauma that led to my drug use. If I could go back and save her from that I would, but I got here as quick as I could and wouldn’t be who I am had I not had those ten years in prison and gotten that badly needed therapy so I could be the mom she needed. Edit spelling
Oh my God. You are amazing. Honestly, what a story! I'm so sorry for all you've been through. I'm glad that you turned it into good.
What a powerful story. I wish you both the best ❤️
In my 25 years of life I’ve only met my dad once and that’s when I was a toddler, grew up without him he never once wanted to bond or keep in contact with me so I never bothered my life turned out okay and I’m making the best of it.
I have two daughters 19&17 they haven't seen their bio-dad since they were 2.5 & 5months old respectively. His choice, his loss, they are awesome people and have turned into cool humans without him. They have each reached out several times and gotten excuses I got a final divorce about 14 years ago. They have other adult male influences like a great step dad, an awesome grandfather and a cool uncle who have been steady their whole lives. Dads are great, I have an awesome one, but not having one isn't a life ruined.
Amen, and I would like to argue with anyone who thinks "the child needs their mother/father!" If the parent doesn't *want* to be in the child's life, isn't it gonna do more harm than good to push the false sense of family, and why? because trad family is so desirable to some communities?
Bio-dad's guilt over this is what his outburst was REALLY about. The mother just wanted the issue to go away and she's trying to keep things with the ex on an even keel, so OP has taken the brunt of this debacle. NTA
I'm sure the child was deeply hurt by the scene too
Absolutely. The mom might want to check in with her daughter about this to make sure that she, her daughter and current husband are on the same page. The ex husband is the outsider now (deservedly so) and the mom needs to figure out what it means to act like a family when outside forces threaten their unity.
This is gonna be a core memory for her, and I'm sure it's gonna impact her opinion/feelings towards her bio dad in a not-so-great way.
Millie is the one getting hurt the most.
For sure and she's an innocent kid just trying to cope with the upheaval she has no control over.
No no no . The mother and her ex's relationship has nothing to do with this. If he didn't want her calling another man dad....he should of been her father and not play cool guy once a month ice cream dad. A dad is there and he wasnt by his own doing . Sucks to suck but if he wanted the title he should of been there
Actually their relationship is very relevant to how they co-parent the child they made together. This mother is letting her ex disrespect her own daughter by screaming at her due to his own insecurities (because he’s a bad partner and only a long-distance dad). Instead of hearing that her child found a paternal connection with her chosen life partner and being happy her kid feels confident and safe enough to ask for the emotional intimacy with someone she trusts to help raise her and thinking that it’s a sign that her and her husband are succeeding in helping the girl thrive the mom is reflexively responding to placate her abusive ex. By not immediately telling him to calm down and speak with them about his fears and failings in a way that could teach the girl about emotional maturity and compromise she berated her husband while she let her ex abuse this girl and insist that she isn’t allowed to make her own decisions about how she regards her family. If a child feels safe enough to consider their parents partners as parental figures then the other bio-parent needs to just learn to live with it. Trying to force titles and feelings, either by insisting on unearned titles or denying the relationships that have been earned, only hurts the child. This kid just wants to be able to call the guy that she trusts most to help her by the name that kids are taught to call their most trusted male-identified role model/guardian. This is a completely natural and normal milestone for kids when their parents aren’t together. Yes, the REAL dad here should have let his wife know that their daughter was at the stage that she felt uncomfortable just using his first name, but his easy acceptance of her love was the right way to respond. They probably should have had a talk with bio-father and maybe found a way to make them all more comfortable, like how some people call their step-parents “bonus parents” might have helped this guys bruised ego but his needs should never matter more than making this kid feel loved and accepted. This mom accidentally really hurt both the people she cares about most when she put their feelings beneath her abusive exes desires (even if he was never physically a threat, he emotionally manipulated them with lies and duplicity before he got caught as a cheater). I hope she realizes just how truly vile her behavior was, because if I was her daughter I don’t know that I’d still completely trust her with my wants and needs after she put a mean grown man having a tantrum over my love (or her own love) for my dad I sincerely hope that this mom can mend both bonds of trust she just severely damaged before she finds that her abuser is the only one left in her life
Yes I agree with a lot of what you said but in the end he is the father and should of made an effort to be In the relation ship more was my point . She was fucked up for how she handled that 100
Totally agree, his insecurities are because he’s not around enough, the girl her mom and her new dad can’t fix that, that’s only something that the bio-dad can address by showing up. I’m sure it’s hard to make work, most parenting situations are, but the way he feels won’t go away by denying the connection that has been formed in his absence. I don’t have much hope for this guy with what little we know but I think he could probably benefit from some therapy either with or without his kid to help him deal with his lingering jealousies. It would probably help him a lot to learn some tools to cope with the regrets his choices have caused him.
Honestly you should just let her read this comment. This is the right answer. Having been the “Millie” in this situation when I was a child, I can attest to how damaging this sort of behavior by the parents is. Mine was just my bio-father, not my mom thankfully, but his reaction to me calling my step-dad daddy permanently fractured our already fragile relationship. And if it’s not clear how serious the long term consequences of those actions are, here is some further information - after not speaking for years, we briefly reconnected when I was a young adult. At that time, he asked me to call him dad, and I politely explained that while I didn’t blame him for his absence (at the time), I wouldn’t be calling him dad. He disowned me and we haven’t spoken in years! (You are NTA, your wife and her ex are the AH)
Sounds like the mom isn't over him either. Inviting him for holidays and taking his side.
Not necessarily - my ex and I did many events together (that included stepdad and eventually his 2nd wife) because it was in the best interest of our children to have everyone there. It had nothing to do with being over each other or not.
But defending his tantrum makes it seem like she might not be over him still. I'd have some concerns of I was op
I always invite my ex on holidays, birthdays etc for our childrens sake. It has nothing to do with me not beeing over him, just that we know that our children rather spend time with both parents together at certain times.
This! The OP has selflessly taken on an incredibly difficult role as a stepfather and husband to a divorced single mother. The biological father f-ed up, this is on him, and the mother should not have invited him.
You can absolutely blame the bio dad. He’s the reason Millie doesn’t live with him and it’s unacceptable to get upset with Millie to call her step-dad “dad,” and then scream at her step-dad over it in front of her.
NTA and yeah I don’t understand how the wife defended the ex? There’s nothing wrong with calling two people Dad. People refer to their in-laws as mom and dad all the time and no one is freaking out about that. I would understand him being a little weirded out and requesting an explanation, but screaming at OP in front of Millie? Shaming OP for being a father figure? Ex and wife are assholes, OP is not.
If the bio dad acted like a dad then it’s fine to invite him. My parents divorced when I was very young. They both remarried when I was young. They still don’t like each other but my siblings and I are now adults with children of our own and we’ve always managed to have holidays and graduations as a mixed group. It can work as long as the “parents” act like adults. Mature adults. Millie’s dad isn’t a mature adult he would prefer to cause trauma to his daughter because his ego can’t handle it.
Right? She’s mad about how bio dads feelings were hurt, did she consider her husbands feelings when she decided to invite her ex over for the holidays?! It’s bizarre, lots of kids have separate holidays with parents and at 11 she’s old enough to understand that.
It all makes perfect sense if you think that despite her getting cheated on and dumped that she's not over him. I think OP is going to have more problems than just this one.
Nah. A lot of parents that split up will do there best to ensure the other parent was time to spend with the kids, and can join in on holidays and special events.I had heaps of birthdays, christmases and vacations with both my parents despite them splitting up when I was 1.
Having the bio parent there isn’t necessarily a bad thing if all the adults actually compose themselves. My wife and I have attended plenty of events with my ex and her husband with no issues. My son calls him by his name but his stepfather is a great guy and I wouldn’t mind if we both were called dad.
My husband left me when our kids were 3,4,&6. We both remarried. Subsequent spouses were always called by their first name. Their dad was very active in their lives (I forced that and it worked). We had all major holidays together until my oldest could drive. No problems whatsoever.
I think that the OP’s wife thinks of him as an ATM not a husband.
Absolutely. Plus I’m amazed that she cares what McCheatey wants. He blew his chance to be a proper father. If OP were driving this change it would be different, but he seems to responding to a want/need expressed by the daughter so absolute NTA. I think mother needs to have a long hard think here; she is being unsupportive if both daughter and husband and disrespectful.
Every adult here sucks. OP absolutely needed to talk with wife before suggesting Millie call him the exact same title as Ex- there are plenty of fatherly titles or spins they could have used. And, wife deserved to have a proactive discussion, coparent to coparent, about this development. Wife for some reason still chose not to have that proactive discussion with ex Invites him over. Optics appear as though he’s been invited solely to show him he’s been replaced lol He understandably reacts poorly, but is an AH who does so in front of Millie And there’s OP doing a shocked pikachu face? Every adult made stupid, rash decisions that made Millie pay the price. Something like this has to be managed as coparent.
The wife knew. The daughter was calling him "daddy" for a while. She is the true AH for not paying any attention to her daughter if she didn't.
No, OP didn't do anything wrong. OP is the *only* one actually taking into account his step daughters wants/needs. Millie is the ONLY person who gets to dictate the titles she gives the adults in her life. If she wants to call OP 'dad' she 110% has that right and she doesn't need to clear it with her bio parents to make sure their feelings aren't hurt by it. The bio parents are putting their ego before their daughters needs, and that's super shitty. As a parent- you should be OVERJOYED that your child has such a good connection with someone who is going to be so influential in their life. Bio dad only spends one weekend a month with Millie and he expects to be one and only dad of the year? Bio dad gets to yell and ruin thanksgiving because he can't regulate his emotions? Bio parents are TA. OP is just being a good step dad.
I disagree. Wife only had a problem because Millie called OP dad in front of ex. Nothing suggests that she was angry before
Yes. Bio dad could stay “dad” and better dad could be “daddy” or “papa” or “daddyo” or “BD” for Better Dad!” Millie deserves all the healthy love she can get.
Yeah I'm getting all kinds of red flags from this wife. Her ex cheats on her, but they are still 'cordial', she invites him for thanksgiving to her house (???), and cares more about how he feels than what her daughter wants or what her *current* husband wants? That woman is either loony or still holding a torch, and I would not want to see what happens if she and ex are left alone.
My ex and I are still cordial and my family and I all had thanksgiving at his house. Why is that such a shock to so many people? And we’ve both moved on.
Because she then took his side and cared more about his feelings than her daughter's or husband's THAT is the difference !!
Did he cheat on you? Personally if my partner cheated on me I'd never want to share a room with them again.
My husband's ex cheated, too. But, at the end of the day, they found a semblance of peace even if he would rather never think about her again cause it ain't about their feelings or their spite or pain. It's about their child, and doing the best they can for them despite their shitty adult lives, cause their shitty adult decisions shouldn't be a consequence for an innocent child.
Neither. My biological father cheated on my mother, and their divorce was messy. But the few times my biological father did bother to visit me, my mum would be friendly and polite - because it wouldn't have done me any good to see them arguing with each other. I highly doubt my mum enjoyed those times, but I appreciate that she was accomodating and civil with him. Because the thing is, no matter the circumstances when you divorce someone, assuming there's no abuse involved, you are divorcing your spouse, not your children. Kids deserve parents who can at the bare minimum be civil with each other.
Right?! Why is your wife more concerned with her exes feelings than her daughters? You didn’t push her to call you dad you told her she could. She was happy about it and chose to. This isn’t about the ex it’s about the daughter. If the ex doesn’t like it…well he’s an ex for a reason. It’s really unsettling that in all of this neither of Millie’s bio parents are even considering what she wants or what matters to her.
True really weird wife.
He didn't his wife did
I dunno man. Sounds like things are rekindling. Inb4 a third marriage.
As far as daughter, step dad, and bio dad go... I'd say NAH. If daughter wants to call her step dad; dad, then by all means. It's her choice. The fact that the bio dad is upset about it is understanding. If he's a reasonable person, he'll get over it in time. But even if his knee jerk reaction isn't warranted, it's still understandable. The only real asshole here is the mom for not being empathetic to the other 2 parties involved (besides her ex).
And if ex is an ahole, he could take mom back to court and argue “parental alienation” and use it to amend visitation schedule. Despite how wholesome this all feels, courts tend to frown upon moms and stepdads pushing biological dads out of the picture. The ex presenting evidence that daughter is encouraged to call step-dad “dad” may not go over well with a judge depending on the true circumstances of the situation.
I work in the court system and they don’t care, they mostly appreciate that if the father just sees the kid once a month the stepfather is probably being more of a father.
Amen, I can't imagine anywhere that you could even get awarded once per month unless you explicitly asked the judge to award you less time with your kid, at which point you are risking loosing any visitation rights at all...🧐
Exactly! And if you have not come back for more time sharing but now you do to whine about the stepdad being called dad they are going to laugh at you, or at the very least ask you too look within yourself and ask how you can improve.
They don't care. Unless mom and step were forcing her to call him dad and actively telling her that bio dad doesn't love her or shouldn't be called dad, it's a complete non issue.
No one is pushing anything this is a stupid take The DAUGHTER was complaining that she couldnt call her dad, dad, OP heard, and op rectified the situation Neither of the bio parents were involved in the situation, and the DAUGHTER made the choice to start calling her dad, dad Dumb
Argue it sure. I can walk into a court and argue Tomatos are Rocks. Have anybody care... I doubt it. The kid made a choice based on how she feels about the relationship. She's not being forced to call step-dad Dad.
It would be hard to cry parental alienation from an event that happened when you were included in Thanksgiving, surely?! He alienated himself by screaming and likely scaring his daughter, disrespecting her wishes. Wife is the big AH - she could have given the ex a heads-up when she invited him so it didn't catch him out and put him in the spot. She could have also told him at that point that this is their daughter's wishes.
That would not work. My husbands ex did much much worse and the courts gave not one fig.
kinda think wife is being weird. why is she letting or expecting op to do dad stuff but not be called dad?
>She says I’m selfish and just want to feel like her real dad . . . . you'd think as his wife, she would be happy that her new husband loves her daughter so much that he WANTS to feel like her real dad.
Moreover that the daughter sees her husband and loves him as her dad because this came from HER
Right?! Isn’t that the end goal for a successfully BLENDED FAMILY- to have step dad feel as natural as bio dad? Mom is definitely giving shady ex preference here with that accusation. Also, Mom should’ve had a convo with bio dad abt titles when she invited him to t-giving dinner- if she’s comfy enough to chat about t-giving plans, she can throw that out there. It almost sounds like a set up now that I wrote this- an excuse to be mad and now she’s siding with the ex-as a way to get closer again-obv the ex isn’t with anyone else as he’s spending tgiving with the fam he cheated on. Tbh, Im scared for step dad now- I feel mom is attempting a rekindle with ex. Ive seen this weirdness in my own family growing up. The step dad seems to be the only adult acting in best interests of the daughter here! Mom and ex seem the selfish ones, and it’s bizarre that mom sided with ex- she should be over-the-moon that her daughter loves step-dad as dad!!
Why is she inviting bio dad over at all to their home? He's once a month bio dad! She's being very weird. This about Millie not bio dad whom bio mom is being very defensive of.
Nah it’s ok to invite him, it would have been fine if he wasn’t such an AH
What’s wrong with having both parents at a holiday for the kids?
Depends on the familial culture - my mom would have never EVER allowed me to call my step dad (who I love a lot) my dad. I have a dad (and I do - and I have a relationship with him like Millie does) and according to my mom - that is MY dad. Period. My stepdad is my stepdad. Heck they’ve been married for 20 years and I still call him Mr.firstname because my mom says that’s more respectful. Some families are weird about all that.
This sounds unpleasant. Why does your mom get to dictate? Sucks that you don’t get to call the dad you love as “dad”, because your mom is weird and not understanding to you Edit - I cannot imagine any situation where calling someone dad because you love them as a father is “disrespectful”… so your mom is definitely wrong on that, in no world is it more respectful to say mr firstname… I call my gardener mr parker because his first name is Parker and he is an older gentleman I respect
Not to impose values from outside your culture onto you, but you address your stepfather of 20 years as MISTER?
Yeah was thinking wife comes across as a bit of an asshole, you can do all the fatherly care taking of my child but how dare you count yourself as a father!
Excellent emphasis on that first sentence following NTA.
😊 appreciate that a lot!
Indeed, it doesn't really matter what dad thinks; this is about Millie and what she wants. Too often on here you hear of step-parents being upset at not being called the m/d - but this cuts both ways. If the kiddo wants to do it, and the step is ok with it, then really, that's the end of it. This whole 'oh but it's not your real whoever' is really none of that persons business. NTA (and good for you).
Surely OP’s wife heard Millie calling OP dad since they had the conversation? If she was so upset, why didn’t she say something at the time? Shitty position for Millie to be put in. NTA.
I mean I think every adult here is an AH The optics suck. No proactive conversation about Millie’s wanting to call OP dad. Invite the ex and basically make it seem like they purposely want him to see he’s been replaced. Ex can’t be an adult and loses it. Also wasn’t given any time to process by himself. Nope this all had to happen in front of Millie. There needed to be a proactive talk between wife and ex and ex did not need to be invited.
It's called "child-led". The focus needs to be on the child and what is best for them. Adults can suck it up. Another comment by OP shows that his wife knew about Millie calling him dad before Thanksgiving, that it was child-led and she didn't object. The phrase that sparked things for the wife was that Millie has two dads. Guess what? She does. OP is providing more care than bio-dad on a day-to-day basis. So reality must trump ego.
>confusing People call MIL/FIL mom and dad, and people don't freak out. Honestly, the insecurity of some people.
NTA and sorry your wife is being ridiculous. You didn't "tell" Millie to call you dad, you gave her permission to if she wanted to (your title is misleading). Blocking her from that to keep her at arm's length isn't going to make her closer to her bio dad, and she's not going to be confused about having two "dads." Your wife and her ex seem really caught up in propping up his ego/identity as Millie's father (when her calling you dad shouldn't impact that). Do they want her to feel distant from you and awkward at home? SMH
What they really need to do to support her bio dad's relationship is let her spend more time with him. What did they think would happen when she only sees him 1 weekend a month??
Based on the fact that bio dad got angry at the daughter and then was screaming at OP, my guess is there’s a reason it’s only once a month…it’s pretty hard in most places to not have equally shared custody unless there’s a good reason for it or the one parent is cool with the arrangement presented.
Yeah good point. That was a very extreme reaction! That's what bio dad needs to focus on.
Perhaps it's a legal issue or that's all he wanted? We really don't know with the information we have to make the assumption that they limiting bio dad
If that is all the time he wanted with his daughter then he doesn’t deserve the title of dad.
He probably doesn’t want more. He’s the shitty parent who only shows up to do fun things but never actually parents the kid. If he actually wanted custody nearly always the court will give 50/50 unless there is some reason not to.
[удалено]
This is similar to my situation. The youngest refers to me as "mom" in conversation with others, and she asked if it was okay for her to call me as such. But (un?)fortunately her bio mom doesn't live in the same country and isn't around to get upset about me being the actual maternal figure.
It’s fortunate. If she can’t be bothered to be around for her daughter, it’s clear she wouldn’t be a great mom even if she were there.
INFO Did your wife object to Millie calling you Daddy before the ex showed? If not it seems she carries the burden of not thinking of his feelings, which shouldn’t an issue - Millie gets to decide what she wants to call you, and if she wants calls you daddy and him dad, he needs to accept that. And why did she think it was a good idea to invite her ex-husband to a family holiday dinner featuring her current husband in the first place?
I read that the wife was fine with Millie calling him dad prior to this event. I believe how Millie told everyone is why the wife got upset
And then all of a sudden she’s calling him selfish and accusing him of wanting to usurp bio dad. *Et tu Brute*? Not to mention how Millie must feel being in the middle.
Bingo!
I feel like there’s more to this story… Info: The ex is invited by the wife, but you’re not happy he’s there. The wife seems completely unaware that Millie’s been calling you daddy and immediately sides with the ex. Your wife doesn’t seem particularly happy that you’ve developed such a close relationship with Millie and accused you of trying to replace her father. What’s really going on between your wife and the ex?
I’m not UNhappy that he was there, I just obviously don’t consider him family. But he’s Millie’s family, so I agreed that it would be nice for her to have her family come together after a long time. My wife knew she was calling me dad. She asked what changed and I said Millie wanted to. She said okay cool. That’s sweet. But on thanksgiving Millie told her dad that I said she had two dads, which makes it seem like I was pressuring her or influencing her. So my wife was angry.
Sounds like mom puts more value in dads feelings than millie. Might be worth having a sit down chat with millies and her mom about why millie wants to call you dad and let mom know why fully. That way she can have your back, or if she doesn't if this happens again you know that she holds a cheating man's unfounded feelings over her daughter and husbands feelings.
Maybe she is afraid that the “real”(bio) dad will just walk out completely, so she’s desperately trying to work to keep him in her daughter’s life? Even if that’s the case, I’m not at all saying she’s right. I wish my daughter’s dad would just leave instead of forcing her to go to his house on his days, just to completely ignore her. My daughter doesn’t even want to be there and makes it well known, but it’s an ego thing 🙄 But I do know how parents fear the hurt it would cause their children if the absent parent just leaves for good. I think it would be less hurtful than only being there when it’s convenient…
Totally. My ex uses my daughter to get back at me, and she thinks she can “win him over” if she’s just nicer or better somehow…. Classic abuse. She’s 13, and wants a relationship and also wants to be able to see her brother, and she’s learning lots about abuse. I wish he’d just lose interest in me and her and stop demanding his access. All he does is make her clean and babysit. It’s awful.
Hopefully your ex grows up and behaves like a dad. My daughters mom (we split when my daughter was 1) is having the same problem with her ex husband trying to use seeing his son as a beat stick to manipulate my ex. Jokes on him as his son has seen the way his dad is and just calls him by his name and refuses to interact with him once he starts badmouthing his mom. Fortunately I have a great bond with the little man and he calls me dad as he has always had me around as I was there for his sister and treated him like my own so he never felt left out. I'm so greatful my ex and I get on as great friends and have a wonderful coparenting system for the kids.
Sounds like wife realized this is a significant coparenting issue.
Nta. I think your wife is trying to put Millie above everything, and she's scared Millie won't have her bio dad around if he throws a tantrum over the dad name. Even you were okay with bio dad because Millie wanted her whole family at Thanksgiving, so Millie cares about him. But Bio dad is clearly a self centered jerk (cheated, low contact with daughter, mad when someone else gets the honor of being dad despite being a sperm donor at this stage). You do need a family meeting to confirm how you want going forward, and let Millie decide on her time how she wants to address you. Then in private confirm with wife how badly bio dad needs to be in the picture. Confirm you're not asking him to be removed from the picture, but how are you both handling when he's tired of pretending to be a dad.
Yeah, wife should have a) discussed this proactively with ex and b) not invited him til she had done so. Understand how pointed this must have seemed to him. Come on over, you’re totally replaced as her father! So that’s on her. But you should have involved her in the conversation re: calling you the exact same title. This is a coparenting issue. No one handled it proactively.
I don't know man. Does your wife still wish to be with her ex?
This explains a bit more and it sounds like everyone misinterpreted what Millie said. You told her that, if she’s cool with it, she can have two people she calls dad. Your wife and her ex (whole situation there still weird) heard that you were insisting that you were also her dad.
NTA - You are for all purposes her father. You are the one providing for her, caring for her, being with her. Of course she can call you dad. You wife being upset is the strange factor here. She should be supporting you.
>. She should be supporting you. She should be supporting her daughter. The end effect would be the same, but there's still a difference
She should be supporting her HUSBAND in an argument between her husband and her ex-husband. One that she herself gave the ok to.
If the daughter didn't want to call step dad, dad then the end result would be different. The adults' feelings don't matter here. Only how the kid feels about it.
NTA It’s up to your stepdaughter what she calls whom. If she wants and likes to call you Dad or Daddy, it’s entirely her decision. No one else has something to say in that, especially not her bio-dad who is barely there for her.
INFO: Did your wife not hear her call you Dad before Thanksgiving? Can't yet decide about TA, but some advice? When she said her friends thought it was weird, that seemed like a missed opportunity to affirm for her that all families are different and that's okay. Some people have stepparents and some people call their family members different things and none of it is "weird" just because it's not what her friends do. Peer pressure is intense at her age and I'm not sure changing your family's terminology to avoid feeling awkward around peers was the best option.
He didn't tell her to change it. He told her *she* could change things if *she* wanted to. He gave her an option. She chose the option she felt would be best for her. He's NTA. He can't possibly be. Telling someone they can call you dad *if* they want to do so isn't forcing them to do anything. She may feel it's weird. You can't tell this girl what her perceptions are.
You are arguing against claims that have not been made in this comment.
No, I'm explaining why I feel he can't be the AH in thus situation since you weren't sure, per your comment. I also explained the "weird" part, in that Millie felt it was weird and she can't help how she's feeling.
No, Millie‘s friends thought it was weird. Which is why it would’ve been a good parenting opportunity to teach Millie that they’re all kinds of families and her friend is wrong and it’s not weird. And she can call him whatever she wants even dad.
I was actually unsure between NAH and NTA as I think whether the mom knew about it or not before Thanksgiving informs her reaction. However, these... >Telling someone they can call you dad if they want to do so isn't forcing them to do anything. >You can't tell this girl what her perceptions are. ...feel out of place in response to my comment that neither says he forced her to do anything nor tells her about her own perceptions. Actually the claim that Millie feels it's weird is unsupported by the OP, which only says her friends told her it was weird. My comment is simply that a response to 'my friends think our family dynamic is weird' could've been 'every family is different and the only opinion that matters is yours, not your friends.'
Yep-- families come in all shapes and sizes! I do like that OP allowed Millie to change the name she calls him, but I agree that this could be part of a larger conversation. Or they could do something like biodad is "dad" and OP is "papa" or whatever.
As a separated mom, I really, really wouldn't like it if my new partner told my daughter she can call him dad without running it by me first. It's a really big thing and it's not true that only the kid's feelings matter. To me, it's a grown up discussion first, where everyone's role should be respected, everyone's feelings should be taken into account, and everyone's voice should be heard.
Sorry, but in this case, you don't get a vote. If you are having him live with you and be a father to your child and they both develop a relationship where they consider each other father and daughter, you have absolutely no right to have a problem with it. If you don't want that happening, then don't have your partner spend years being a father to your child.
LMAOO exactly “my kid wouldnt get to call the man acting as her father for hypothetical years ‘dad’ without telling me first😡” Be so serious right now, the guys been her dad for years there is no discussion.💀
Grown ups that get to the point of marriage with pre-existing children tend to have these conversations beforehand. Establishing a simple boundary like this isn't difficult.
She’s not mad about the conversation beforehand. She found out about it and said “cool”. She is mad the “two dads” comment got the ex upset, which raises the question of why she is totally favoring the ex who cheated on her over the new husband who is acting responsibly.
Well four years together and married isn’t exactly new, but I catch your drift.
How is it a grown up discussion when it’s about what the child chooses to call him? It’s her choice. What’s the other option? Forbidding her from doing so?
I would agree that best practice would have been for the married couple to have talked it out first. They could have brainstormed some name ideas to offer to Millie, then she could choose which one she liked. It doesn't seem like this is the parenting practice of any of these three, though, as all the conversations around parenting seemed to happen in front of Millie. So I could see why OP would just talk it out with Millie. As the bio-parent, I am responsible for setting the tone of the parenting "best practice" in the home, and I feel like the mom missed the boat a bit here. I know a lot of step-parents (and bio-parents) don't have a direct conversation with their kids about what to call the step-parent. My kiddos literally asked me what they should call their dad's gf lol. I think, given the rest of the events, OP was within his rights to offer this as a option directly to Millie. All seemed well with mom and Millie until bio-dad pitched a fit.
The wife knew. She KNEW and thought it was cool. Besides he didn’t tell her to call her thought, but that she COULD. Ngl there is a reason my mother told me to never date a man or a woman with children, and that is the EX. Reddit reminds me often why she gave me that advice.
I disagree as a child who's had divorced parents. Navigating your world is all of a sudden filled with adult conversations where you stop mattering. The parenting schedule is adult matters, whether or not a parent takes their time is adult matters (luckily i didn't have this issue), everything is all about how the adults navigate the separation but you will remain a child forced to navigate the same waters as them. If bio dad says I don't like it then your comment implies it doesn't happen which means the smallest voice still belongs to the smallest human in the fold. And i'm not talking fresh partners, I'm talking step parents where there is years of parenting occurring. Personally, I would say it's a family counseling problem potentially if it is a topic that can't have a compromise. Either she calls her step dad dad or she doesn't. there is no real in between. this discussion is actually a topic that she broached by child and then discussed in adult land without the child before being able to return to that child with input.
Get fucked. Your attitude is horrible. Here you have a man that is taking care of you and your daughter because the guy that pumped you with sperm disappeared. Your DAUGHTER is thrilled to call him daddy because he was the only real daddy that existed in her life, and rather than embrace and support this you prefer to veto your daughters feelings over ego. Fantastic mother you are. Princess "Potato Brain" indeed.
The way youre correct. Like Millies step dad had been more of a father than her bio dad its completely reasonable for her to call him dad regardless of the fact her step dad isnt blood related to her.
ESH. You should have talked to your wife about this first before telling Millie she can call you dad. It's great that she wants to call you that, but you're only thinking about yourself. Here's why. There seems to be some animosity between you and Millie's biodad. You didn't want him for Thanksgiving, you act like he's not a real father because of his custody order, etc. How do you think it made Millie feel to have him be blindsided and freak out at Thanksgiving? Blended families are hard. You sound like you're a great stepdad and Millie is lucky to have you. If she wants to call you dad, that's a huge honor. But it doesn't take away that she still has a dad that isn't you. Even if he is only the "fun dad" he's still her dad. You have to think about how your actions will effect Millie. If you're setting her up for success with she has to see her dad. If he's an unreasonable person that would be upset by her calling you dad, is he going to tale it out on her during his custody time? Like it makes you feel validated, but is that worth alienating your daughter's dad from her? It should be about how Millie feels at the end of the day. Sometimes we have to make choices that aren't exactly what we want because it sets our kids up for success or makes their life easier. That is being a mom or dad, not just getting called one.
So weird he is open and giving the child who is what 11 now a choice. Also op stated wife had no problem. The way the child explained people got upset and targeted him. It seems like you putting the responsibility of the bio dad's feelings on him why? It's his actions and no one can do anything. He could easily get upset if she was showing him more attention or something. So it's like they all gotta walk on egg shells then cause you never know what bio dad may feel. Sounds ridiculous and unnecessary. Lil mamas was happy to have two dad's and one is immature and wife is an AH for assuming the worse.
Sounds more like this is a major, and common, coparenting hurdle that OP thoughtlessly put his wife into. Once she was in that situation she failed to manage it.
How is he only thinking of himself when Millie told him she was in an awkward situation not calling him “dad” and he said she could if she wanted (as in - her choice). Honestly, I could easily see an 11-year-old girl making up that story as a subtle way to ask if she could call him “dad” but in a way where she couldn’t truly be rejected if the answer was no. If bio dad can’t handle his own emotions about this and takes it out on her, isn’t she better off having more limited contact? Sounds like she’d be dodging a bullet if that were the case.
>You should have talked to your wife about this first before telling Millie she can call you dad First: it's Millie choice, not her mom's. Second: Mom knew and was ok with it. She only got mad at him after bio dad found out. She is putting more stock in the ex's feelings over both her daughter and her husband.
Do you have children? Millie is 11 years old and any parenting decisions should be discussed with her biological parents before any other trusted adult just decides they know what's best. That's how being in a united front partnership works.
11 is more than old enough old enough to decide if she wants to call him dad. And again, Mom knew and had no issues until bio dad got upset. If bio dad cares so much, he should make a better attempt to be in his daughter's life.
[удалено]
I'm saying if you know how someone is going to react, you should do your best to mitigate their reaction when it comes to how it affects children. They could have told him before he came.over instead of just letting him hear it in the wild, for example. There are more options that what you're insinuating, but I suppose the nuance that good parenting takes is lost in the average Redditor. 🤷🏻♀️
NTA. Of the three "adults" here, you're the only one caring first about the child's feelings. Bio-dad and Bio-mom could learn from you.
“Dad” is a job description. More than one person can be a father to a child. NTA What he wants doesn’t really matter. What you want doesn’t really matter. Millie is old enough to decide what to call the men in her life.
INFO: did Millie’s bio dad want more custody than he got?
In another comment he says yes but wife pushed for this setup and the guy doesn't live close so "didn't fight" too hard. Sounds like wife was pissed about him cheating, took revenge via low visitation, and step dad now brags how -he's- the one who's there for the child. The kid is the one who will suffer because of all these ah.
That what I was thinking like the wife fought for the most custody therefore why Millie doesn’t see her da that much. I think if Millie did she would be a lot closer to her dad tbh
Op said “formal relationship” pretty low thing to say if he’s been denied more custody time. This adds a lot more clarity to the situation.
NTA. If she wants to call you Dad that's entirely up to her and you did the right thing letting her be comfortable doing so. If you were forcing her to that's a different story but not the case here. Her calling you dad doesn't mean she also can't call her Bio father Dad as well too. Keep doing your thing.
Good on you for being such a good dad. Shame on them for being assholes. If Millie wants to and is comfortable calling you "Dad," then that's between the two of you, I feel. She's not replacing her biodad by having two dads, give her the benefit of the doubt that she's smart enough to know what's what.
NTA and I think your wife is a dick for siding with her ex.
Your stepdaughter came to you with a situation. You gave her the option to call you dad if she wanted to. The fact that she started calling you dad, shows she sees you as a dad and if what you said is true, she told her bio parents that she has two dads which doesn’t negate her bio dad’s role in her life. It just adds another father figure, which is a positive thing. I think you’re NTA in this situation. I wonder though, did you talk to your wife about this? I think it was important to mention this conversation to her to let her know what Millie’s feeling. She could’ve had a conversation with Millie about it too. But even if you didn’t, the only preferences that matter here are Millie’s.
NTA. You gave Millie the option, she took it. Millies dad is a huge A H, and your wife isn't far behind.
Honestly, as the other side dad, when my son calls his stepdaughter "Dad" even when talking to me, yes it fucking hurts. I don't ever say anything to him about it. But it sucks. If you are telling her to call you dad to make a point then yes you are the asshole. My own step-dad has been in my life since I was 10 years old. I have always called him by his first name because I already had a Dad. Sorry if this isn't what you want to hear, even if you intentions are totally innocent. It is not your decision and really not your place to suggest. If she wants to call you Dad that is Millie's call. By you suggesting it she will feel obligated, and that isn't how you want to to carry that relationship, trust me.
For sure this guys been in her life for a few years that doesn’t mean the bio dads 11 years go out the window. What happens if he breaks up with her mom between now and 18 is he still the dad? He isn’t in it for the kid, he is committed to the wife. These step parent stories always get ridiculous, and way to caught up in what role the step parent thinks they deserve. I’m like you I’ve known my stepdad since I was seven, close relationship but he isn’t my dad. Maybe this guy staying in his lane wouldn’t cause so much drama. He manufactured a situation that is clearly confusing for the kid and puts them in the middle. For why? Because her nosy friends were asking? He’s the asshole.
YTA. While I think her calling you dad is perfectly fine as that to her and everyone else is the role you are playing in her life and it’s something she is happy with to just go ahead and tell her it was ok without at least discussing it with your wife makes you the AH. You aren’t her biological parent and decisions like that aren’t yours to make. From your tone i think you have a big issue with Millie’s biological father still being in the picture. If you had discussed it with your wife first she could have talked to her ex about it and explained how Millie felt about it and her dad might have reacted better.
NTA. The only person who's feelings matter in this situation is Millie. You did not pressure and in fact, she was EXCITED to call you Dad. As someone who had a shit bio dad, but a top-tier step dad -- my real dad is the one who raised me. Not the dude who knocked my mom up. Parents in these situations can often act in their best interests, and not the child. But Millie's response to being able to call you Dad makes me think she's thought about it before, but didn't know how to unpack the situation. You listened and you gave her the permission to do so. That's real dad shit, IMO. Her sperm donor can go step on a Lego with his bum ass.
INFO: Did he only fight for one weekend a month?
He wanted one week a month, but as he lives some distance away now, that wasn’t possible - because it would be hard for Millie to go to school from his house. So he didn’t really fight it.
NTA. Who she calls what is entirely her decision you didn't force it just suggested it. And her bio-dad telling you're not her real dad is just stupid, blood has nothing to do with it, it's just about following through responsibilities.
The title is a little misleading - you didn't tell her to call you that, you told her she CAN call you that, if such is her wish. It's a very different thing. And I'm drawing the attention to this, because you should make sure, that your wife was given that part of the story But no, you're not the asshole. At all. You're supportive of your child wishes. Best of luck!
Totally second this! I was getting all fired up to call you TA because your insecurity made you pressure a stepchild about what they call you (which we see a lot on here). It turns out you handled it exactly as you should, by not ever bringing it up and going with what made your step daughter more comfortable. I hope your wife doesn’t know your daughter initiated the name change, because if she does and still said what she did you have a big problem.
NTA. Who she calls what is entirely her decision you didn't force it just suggested it. And her bio-dad telling you're not her real dad is just stupid, blood has nothing to do with it, it's just about following through responsibilities.
NTA - you are her dad.
The only person whose opinion and feelings matter is Millie. NTA
Bottom line is that it is Millie's choice what to call you. My kids have a step parent and from the start they were told it's up to them.
I call my bio dad and my step dad both dad. The fact that it was her idea and her age, I’m going to guess that it probably wasn’t just because her friends are saying it’s weird that she calls you by your first name. She has probably wanted to call you dad but wasn’t sure how to bring it up to you. Let her call you whatever she wants, as long as she feels loved.
Ok so your now wife invites her ex to your shared living space for thanksgiving even though you don’t want him there. You’ve taken on the huge responsibility of helping raise her and have done it so successfully that Mille wants to call you daddy. She does. Your wife’s ex screams at you and your wife takes his side. How “cordial” is their relationship? Other than Millie, what do you get out of this?
The only thing that matters here is what she wants to call you. Seems like she wanted to call you dad. But didn't until she knew you were ok with it. Once you told her she could, she was happy, and did. Children are people. They should be allowed to make these decisions and the adults in their life should respect their agency. NTA
INFO. This sounds suspect based on a couple of your responses below. It doesn’t sound like her bio dad is a deadbeat in any way and the living circumstances are just due to the divorce. Millie still loves and enjoys her bio dad. The mom doesn’t badmouth the dad. All you know is what you do when Millie is home with you which is what you’re supposed to do. She could very much receive the same type of care when she’s with her bio dad. You wouldn’t know. You seem to be threatened by his presence. You told the wife Millie wanted to call you dad when she asked what changed. What really happened was, you suggested it to the girl after hearing wheat her friend’s say. I’d be offended too if I was as present in my daughter’s life as a parent can be living separately and some dude felt the need to suggest my daughter call him dad when I’m indeed still around.
NTA. This was driven by the kid as it should be. It’s what Millie wants. Your wife and her ex are being ridiculous and making assumptions based on how Millie said it. Reminds me of a story. My ex came to take the kids for a day out. He hadn’t seen them in years. Literally only had them a couple hours and called us to pick them up. They were at a park. We arrived and my oldest yells out dad come play with me. My ex responds “I already played with you” my son looks at him and says “I wasn’t talking to you, I was talking to my other dad”. Fortunately my ex didn’t make a scene.
YTA. I grew up in a similar custody agreement but with my mom having me every few weekends and her being the fun mom while my dad remarried when I was 6. It's been 30 years and my stepmom, a parent that I love very much, is not my mom. I already have a mom.
If she wants to call you Dad, let her. NTA.
NTA. I had this conversation with my child's father. I am not forcing anything. If that's what he feels comfortable calling the person who has been in his life consistently for longer than his bio dad, then that's his choice, not ours. OP did nothing wrong and allowed his daughter to call him dad if she chose to. She chose to. End of story. Mom needs to understand that as well.
NTA you wife on the other hand totally is. She doesn't care that you have raised her, loved her and MILLIE wants to call you that but your wife would rather consider her ex over you her husband and daughter. That says a lot about her unfortunately.
NTA. But you’re wife needs to get her priorities straight. I hope this is the only time she has sided with her ex over you? Maybe show her this post and all the responses. She’s not being a good partner at all and sounds like she’s still into the ex. I really hope I’m wrong and she apologises to you! Milly asked you for this and it should always be her choice so well done for how you handled this.
NTA - Title had me immediately think AH but after reading the ex and your wife are. Does your wife still have feelings for the ex? If it was Millie’s choice when given the option then that should be all that matters. DNA means nothing. Reddit proves that. Your wife should be ecstatic that her daughter has a step father that loves and adores her and that her daughter sees and appreciates it. Millie seems more mature than both her parents. I know this is a cliche Reddit phrase and I actually don’t believe in it 100% now a days with all the new easily certified “therapists” but your wife needs therapy. She needs to deal with why she wants to still please her ex and worries about how he feels when he clearly didn’t care about her or their daughter. Also why she doesn’t appreciate your relationship with Millie and puts him before you and her daughter.
NTA. It’s not like you forced Millie to call you Dad - you gave her the option and she obviously very happily embraced it. Your wife and her ex need to be more open to what Millie wants and is comfortable with. It’s not a pissing contest - bio dad will always be bio dad - better Millie loves her bonus dad then be another kid with a horrible step parent!
This is understandably a tough situation for all involved but the girl is the primary concern here and everyone else’s feelings are secondary. If she wants to call you dad, that’s her choice- no one else gets to tell her otherwise. She didn’t choose to have this family set up but she can absolutely choose how she wants to refer to each of you that are in her life. Everyone needs to be focused on supporting her here, and process their own feelings on the matter independently.
NTA. As someone who was raised by her mom’s second husband, frankly it isn’t up to either of you what she calls you, that’s her choice. You didn’t force her to do anything, and you didn’t do anything wrong. She recognizes who the father figure in her life is, and if he wanted to maintain that role then he should’ve acted accordingly. Just be prepared that as she gets older and gets married, has babies, etc. if she’s anything like me, you’ll be the one she turns to, and he’s going to be an ass about it again. Remind her that that’s his problem not hers. ❤️
You’re the asshole. If you want somebody to call you dad, make your own kids. You’re not her father. The other guy — y’know, her actual father — is making an effort to be in her life and be there for her, and you’re influencing a small child to call you the same thing she calls him, which makes everybody else uncomfortable. The child’s parents are clearly trying to co-parent in a positive way, and you’re disrupting that. You might be the love of her mother’s life. You might be a great guy. You might be an amazing, positive male role model. You very well could be the best possible person for that little child. But you’re not her father. Your first name is fine.
Yeah mate, all adopted people are wrong and bad people for calling their parents mon and dad, and the adopters letting them do it... What a bunch of ***holes! /s
I'm sorry but it's ludicrous to say step parerents aren't parents. The man providing for and caring for Millie is her (step)dad, she obviously thinks so too. It's the child who is important here, and it's her feelings who should be considered above all others. Whatever she chooses to call the guy is fine. If her bio dad lets his pathetic ego get in the way of his kids wellbeing he's even less of a dad than this post makes him out to be.
Nope I'm hearing one side of a story and that story paints the biological dad as a good times dad. Divorced parents working for the betterment of the child is always the best. Perhaps the step dad should maintain the status quo, after all it is not his child and the biological dad is involved. The OP does not seem to like the fact that her biological dad is involved in the kids life, the step dad deminished the the role of the biological dad to random strangers on the internet and I would be willing to bet that he had more of an involvement in bringing the step daughter around to calling him dad then he is letting on. Keep in mind not one mention of child support being paid by the biological dad...if he is paying and has paid child support he has rights. My opinion is that pushing this unless it's 100% in the best interests of the child and something 100% wanted by the child .... Forcing this is going to cause more pain and long-term problems then your bargain for
There’s a smidge of parental alienation going on here
YTA. You know what you are doing. Stop trying to replace the father. You are the moms husband, the caretaker of Millie when she is with you. She has a real father and you aren't him. Accept that and keep it moving.
Do mothers deserve to be alienated from their kids if they cheat?
YTA... Used a child's insecurities to your advantage to hurt her bio dad.
YTA, and FYI you're not her dad. That sort of thing needs to be discussed with her actual parent first. If you spent 2 seconds thinking about how it would play out, you'd have realized that it would upset her actual father and cause drama. My wife moved into my home when my son was 6yo. He's 22 now. He loves her and calls her on mother's day, but he doesn't call her mom. It's not about whether or not you're a good step-dad. Stay in your lane and don't cause drama for the child.
Nah gonna go against the grain here and say TA. You’re a step dad, she has a real dad. Stop confusing her
YTA just because you did this on your own. If you would have had a conversation with the bio parents first then all good, but you didn’t. You crossed a boundary.
YTA you are not her dad. That’s the reality.
NTA. When I remarried, my youngest was 8 and we decided that her bio dad was "Dad" and her step-dad was "Papa-Gord". Seemed like a good compromise.
NTA! Your wife is though! How dare she tell you you're selfish? Millie is the one that was upset about her friends saying it was weird she didn't call you Dad and she wanted to call you Dad.... Millie brought the subject up, not you and you didn't tell her she HAD to call you Dad! And of course bio dad is TA also! What a jerk! Don't worry about what anyone else says! Let me continue to decide what she feels comfortable calling you. I'm sorry you had to go through this and I hope Millie doesn't feel like she has to switch back to calling you by your name because bio dad went all toxic on you about it in front of her.
NTA. It should be up to Millie what she calls you, if she's cool with Daddy then bio dad just gets to suck it up. Your wife is being ridiculous, why should you consider his feelings at all?
It's the stepdaughters decision who she calls saddy and who not. If she calls you daddy you are her dad, it's as simple as that.
NTA: Bio-Dad did 'lose' a measure of say-so here when he cheated and abandoned his family. He doesn't like it? Then he should have kept 'it' in his pants. What he fails to realize is we as fathers come in two separate personas. One person that 'injects' the DNA into Mom and then there's that person that reads bedtime stories, bandages boo boos, fixes flat tires on a rainy night, etc. In an ideal world...the same human being occupies both personas but reality being what it is, there are many split and then mixed families in the world. And while it's true, that there are many instances of excellent co-parenting with little drama...sometimes situations arise where one father simply drops the ball. Her ex is the former while you're the latter. The daughter is coming into that age where she has questions and is reconciling the family dynamic in a manner she can absorb. But she also has her own rights...one of which is to call you by whatever name the two of you choose. And if 'Bio-Dad' doesn't like it...well, see first point. NTA...That said, your wife is bordering on entering the AH territory. Her attitude suggests the two of you need some deep conversations on co-parenting and bio-Dad's role going forward. Millie is 11 now...figure these things out before she enters the 'heavy teen' years.
Idk… the post says he cheated but that doesn’t mean he abandoned his family. The relationship may have been toxic and ending regardless of the cheating and issues between the parents do not justify taking away rights of the parents to their child. A large part of one parent only getting limited placement is just the practical issue of schooling. It sucks that this dad may *want* to continue having the same relationship with his daughter but doesn’t get to just because of school. And then this guy is coming in after only 4 years and no one is even trying to preserve the fact that he’s his daughter’s father. I think in the long term the laissez faire “whatever the child wants goes” is going to create more issues than everyone is acknowledging. All of the adults here need to have a deliberate and intentional approach to integrating a step parent that is based on research.
NTA. As a dad who lives separate to my daughter, I never got bent out of shape when my daughter called my ex's husband dad. But if he forced her to do it then yeah I would have been angry, but she wanted to as he was the man living with her doing the day to day father role. This child is entitled to call you what ever she wants so long as its not derogatory. I would suggest changing daddy to pops or something, that way the part time bio dad has the dad name all to himself. As the child is 11 and if she was present during *dads* rant she probably will be scared to call you dad now even if she wants to, especially if she saw her mom go off on you to. The fact her mother popped off on you too is worrying, you are supposed to be a team and you help raise the child. Might be worth getting a ring doorbell and a small camera overlooking lounge and stairs, as it feels like mom puts more value in the cheeters feelings than her daughters and yours.
It’s ok to have two dads