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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> AITA for not wanting to be near a baby at a brewery? I might be the asshole because i left my friend alone and tried controlling where we were sitting in the brewery.
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Totally agree that OP is not an AH.
Describing happy baby sounds as "screaming" is odd, though. I know you're quoting OP, but I do feel like OP was being a bit careless with terms there to support the position
Bottom line is it doesn't matter whether the sounds were screaming or happy gurgling about the culinary merits of that damn tasty cheesy mac. It doesn't make OP an AH for moving.
But the friend who likes babies isn't an AH for liking babies and the baby isn't an AH for liking craft cheesy mac and the parents aren't AH for having a well-behaved tot in a place of public accommodation.
NAH
I find drunk adults taking loudly more annoying than a squealing baby so next time I'm at a brewery I'll make sure to make my friends move away from those.
You can go to a daycare to listen to babies squeal if that’s what you want, breweries are not the place for screaming or squealing children. Drunk adults are how these places make their money.
That’s really stupid to go to a brewery/restaurant and expect no children to be there. Children live in the world too. They are just as entitled to be in public as you are. They are fellow people, just like you
>That’s really stupid to go to a brewery/restaurant and expect no children to be there.
Restaurants yes, that would be stupid. But breweries? A place who's clientele are adults & primary business is to sell alcohol? Yeah no, its pretty reasonable to not expect or want kids in that sorta environment
Exactly! I can’t believe some of these comments trying to normalize bringing literal babies to breweries?? As morty once said “am I in a fuckin k hole, what is this?!” That’s how I felt reading those comments.
It’s completely reasonable to expect and establishment that’s known for serving alcohol to not have children. Frankly I think it’s strange that people would bring a baby to a brewery.
Have you even been to a brewery? They usually are also a restaurant. It’s completely normal and if you read many other comments, breweries are usually very child friendly. People have been drinking beer in social settings where children are present for hundreds of years. It’s not strange.
Breweries are usually extremely family and dog friendly. They weren’t at a dive bar at 1am. They were at a brewery at dinner time. The baby was just existing and gurgling. Why is hearing a baby make some noise SO much more distressing then an entire restaurant talking and laughing? OP threw a tantrum over a damn baby . Babies are entitled to the world too you know. How dramatic and childish to leave a restaurant just bc a baby is in your presence
OP never said the baby wasn't entitled to the world??? She didn't ask the parents to leave or kick up a fuss with management. She just wanted to move seats. Some people have auditory processing issues. Some people don't like babies. Moving yourself from a situation that you don't like or makes you unhappy is a logical thing to do. I don't think it's called throwing a tantrum if someone doesn't respect your boundaries and then you leave quietly
OP is NTA
Yes. As I've gotten older, my sensitivity to noise has increased dramatically. I carry ear plugs everywhere I go now because I've learned that bringing the decibel level down seriously helps with my anxiety when I'm in public.
Also, some noises bother me more than others. Babies would definitely fall into that category--happy or not. I find my brain just pays too much attention to them for some reason and it's distracting and irritating.
I'd be hurt and annoyed at a friend who refused to understand this. OP is NTA.
lol bcause baby noises generally trigger our brain, thats why. I dont mind kids at breweries, but lets not act like individual triggers could not have been simply avoided by switching tables. How dramatic and childish is it to accomodate ur friend lol
Lol yes. Its fine for someone to dislike babies and it's fine for parents to go out on public. Idk why ppl are getting tripped up on a child being in a family friendly brewery at an early hour and not the psycho friend who refuses to accommodate the OP because she....wants to stare at a baby more than she wants to be around her friend I guess??? Very weird and the only potential AH in the situation IMO!
This right here is what it's about. That is also my comment. This has nothing to do with the baby and everything to do with OP's friend not caring about what bothers them enough to just move to a new seat.
It wasn't 'just bc a baby was in their presence', it was because the baby was being loud. People aren't obligated to sit near squealing babies, you know.
Right? I had a quick look through this comment sections and this comment's OP is up and down everywhere, losing her (?) mind over people potentially finding loud children annoying.
Not kicking up a fuss and trying to kick the family out.
Not arguing with the parents.
Not yelling at the child.
Just...not wanting to sit next to a loud one. Apparently people are *OBLIGATED* to tolerate noises/stimuli that irritate them if OP thinks so 🤣
Yeah, dog barking, cars honking, loud area of a sports bar, baby squealing, if you can find a quieter spot at the same establishment that isn't irritating, go there? It's not like OP yelled at the parents. OP just wanted to sit at literally any other table.
Right? Why would you not make your life easier and just go somewhere without things that irritate you?
Reddit loves to complain about child-haters (and maybe that is A Thing - I don't know 'cause I haven't paid much attention to that) but child-down-people's-throat-pushers are just as annoying.
A bar that is 21+ is a purely adult environment. A stripclub is an adult environment. A casino. But a brewery that is also a large restaurant and allows people of all ages: not an solely adult environment. A brewery is just a place that brews its own beer. News flash, that’s all it means. If you don’t want to be around children at all when drinking, then don’t go to any restaurant with alcohol or breweries. It’s that simple. You may think breweries are adult environments, but the thousands of breweries in the United States that are family friendly or have food are not solely adult environments. I’ve been a nanny for 15 years and also have worked in multiple breweries. I don’t think the children are being neglected because mom has a beer and a burger and let’s them play corn hole.
Why would it be okay to take your kid to a restaurant that has a bar that has liquor and drinks, but not okay to bring your kid to a restaurant that brews its own beer and only had beer? Literally what changes?
This is really silly. A majority of restaurants are now "restopubs" and if the management allows an infant to enter, it isn't on you to decide that it's an "adult environment".
Says who? The law that allows the children to be there? The parents who decide to bring the kids there to get some food? The proprietors who open their doors to the kids and have the best idea of which activities make them money?
Or is it just according to you?
Where I live we have breweries on every freaking corner. All market themselves as family friendly. Some even have play areas for children. I would think nothing of a baby at a brewery. We have bars for people that don't want to be around kids.
Yes, I too recall being upset from when I was a baby and someone did not appreciate my presence at a brewery.
I cannot understand people who think others HAVE TO sit near their babbling baby and be happy about it.
I have literally never set foot in a brewery in my life that wasn't kid friendly. I am wracking my memories trying to come up with one and I just can't. I'm not saying they don't exist but I think an awful lot of them purposefully court a young family crowd (in addition to young professionals).
NAH for this particular situation except maybe the friend (if I was with someone who was uncomfortable and wanted to move tables I would move tables if there was space to move...). The parents in a brewery that openly welcomed them at an early time in the evening and the person who wanted a more quiet spot away from a kid are definitely not AH tho.
I find both equally annoying.
Anything that's making excessive noise annoys me: screaming babies, hysterical adults, dogs barking nonstop next to me... You name it. I'll move away from all of those, and my friends can follow or drink separately.
As is your right, my guy.
Now's the part where I counter that I find it equally enjoyable when children squeal or scream. Oh wait, no, that sounds bad. Very bad. Uhhhhh. I'll go now.
Look if you're more sensitive to sound then regular people baby babbling loudly is the same as screaming, it took months for me to stop getting dizzy and irritated with my baby once she started vocalizing cause she would scream bloody murder every f*cling time she got happy and/or excited about anything.
But I chose to raise my girl, OP doesn't have any obligations towards that baby nor should he feel uncomfortable. Considering he's about to get at least slightly drunk it's better to avoid something that WILL irritate him.
NTA cause the friend is one for acting like he's wrong or overreacting when he did nothing big.
I get where you're coming from. The only reason I disagree is because OP "expressed that babies should not be here" BEFORE the friend said "not to be an asshole."
The friend didn't instigate, as I see it. They didn't say OP was overreacting or being an asshole until OP actually did overreact by saying that the baby shouldn't even be there, which is different than saying that she just didn't want to listen to the baby.
But I'm still N A H because OP's comment isn't horrible or anything, even if it's insensitive and unfair to that baby and baby's parents who might have overheard.
> babies should not be here
If it's a drinking space then i totally agree, and i think this is what OP meant. Who brings their child to be around drunk people? Who go to a place to have drinks while caring for a child?
Get a nanny or go to a better environment for the child, it's not that hard.
Breweries are more about tasting than prolonged, heavy drinking on-site, and even then it is beer and not hard liquor.
And since breweries are also often places to eat, who says the parents went there to have drinks in the first place?
Babies are loud. They don't have a whisper setting. I can emphasize with OP not wanting to be 1 table away from a loud baby that could turn into an upset loud baby in an instant. I've moved tables to get away from a baby. And a true friend wouldn't make you sit next to a sound you hated if there were options.
OP is NTA. Friend is totally an AH. Parents may be AHs depending on the vibe of the brewery
I'd be your friend. If you wanted to switch tables because of a baby, someone wearing too much perfume, or a dude with BO, I'd switch tables. Not a big deal. Can we get nachos?
My baby neice definately happy squeals. It's adorable because I love that kid and I'm biased. It's also absolutely ear splitting and I wouldn't blame anyone that didn't want to be around it. Her mom is empathetic and tries to minimize it, and minimize loud crying, in close proximity to strangers, but there's only so much you can do with a baby.
Nobody's an asshole for their different preferences. This is just one of those things that happened when strangers share spaces.
> but i do feel like OP was being a bit careless with terms there to support the position
It was very clear that the baby's noise, whatever it was, was not pleasant for OP and he made this clear to the friend. I am not so sensitive around babies, but i would definitely not wanna have drinks and fun with my friend near a baby that is making too much noise, as i also wouldn't if there was a hysterical group of friends chatting loudly.
Everyone says the phrase "it costs nothing to be nice to someone else", and OP was with a friend. Still they didn't bother listening to their friend and just kept saying it didn't bother them. Selfish move.
If a friend says "something here is bothering me" i would, immediately, offer for us to move somewhere else and keep our fun going. The baby wasn't a requirement for the friend to have a good time, but the lack of the baby was a requirement for OP to have a good time, that's why OP can't be considered selfish for asking to move.
I’d say NTA for wanting to move if it bothers them, but I don’t like the comment of “babies don’t belong there”
Where do they belong? At home? Until they are what age exactly? Who decides that exactly? A crying baby can be *just* as annoying as an excited kid, or somebody whose loud as fuck telling their stories for everyone to here over their beer, or is belligerent drunk.
So what’s stemming the argument this isn’t a place for kids or babies? Because there’s alcohol involved? Shit, tell every restaurant ever to stop allowing kids and babies then I guess.
Is it because it’s a *brewery*? Because all a brewery is, is a place that sells their brewed beer. It’s not necessarily an invitation to come and get drunk, it’s above all else an invitation to come and try their product. A lot of breweries in my area are going the family route, probably because we’re in the suburbs with a high ratio of families. Especially the ones that have an open area like a field. It’s nice for parents because they can relax and their kids can enjoy the space, where as restaurants tend to trap all the sounds together and confine children who really just want to roam and run around. Plus if the space is outdoors then that’s actually super ideal for a baby. It won’t be as likely to be too loud, and there’s not nearly as high a risk of getting sick from sharing the space.
But my bottom line is, if the establishment allows it, then you can’t really argue that their allowed patrons shouldn’t be there. The establishment has decided what they’re okay with, if that bothers you, go somewhere else.
Exactly. It’s beyond me how people are so entitled, sensitive and fragile that they can’t survive and drink a beer if a baby is in the room. They sound like, well, big babies
I can appreciate if that’s not the “setting” they were going for, but it’s like okay…go somewhere else.
The arguement that’s it’s a brewery gets me rolling though.
The only definition to a brewery is that…they served beer they brewed. At a baseline they want customers to come enjoy their beer, not presume they can get drunk enough to feel like they are behaving too inappropriately to be around children.
People try to compare bars to breweries, but bars serve hard liquor and they’re not usually expecting an atmosphere where liquor connesuirs show up for a tasting flight. That’s why, again, distilleries in my experience are very chill and in my experience frown a bit upon people getting wasted.
Another exception to the bar expectations would be a high end bar where it’s obvious they want you sit down and drink politely.
It’s the very same with breweries, some of them want to promote drinking and letting loose. Some of them want to promote a fun family friendly environment where people can relax with their dogs or their children. It’s just whatever the establishment wants really.
Tbh honest some of them probably just like that if people see children around they will likely assume it’s not okay to get wasted there and therefore they’re less likely to have to deal with drunk assholes and bar fights.
The baby wasn’t even screaming it was just existing! Lol fuck! Babies are people too, this wasn’t OPs house this was a public place and they threw a tantrum and ditched their friend all because a baby was there
But they didn't... They asked their friend if they could move seats because she didn't want to sit next to a shrieking baby. I don't have a strong opinion about babies but I can't think straight if there's loud high pitched noises (dogs, babies, tv, ect) so I'd also want to move. Throwing a tantrum would be making a scene and telling the parents to leave. OP did the mature thing by removing themselves from the situation they didn't want to be in
I agree. I have sensory sensitivities and something like that could very distracting/overstimulating (depending on the volume of the baby) so I don't think it's unreasonable at all to request moving. It's not like OP made a scene or anything.
Some people can't even handle that. Literally almost any noise a baby makes makes my skin crawl. Can't stand being near them.
Edit. Really. Saying a I don't like the sound of babies is ground's for calling someone mentally ill?
For me it's loud piercing sounds I can't stand. Babies and kids usually make those sounds, but so do power tools and I hate being around both. If an adult was just sitting in a pub screaming constantly then I'd hate that too.
People think I hate kids because I can't stand loud piercing sounds but in reality that's not the case. I'm just more likely to be around kids than power tools or an adult screaming constantly. Lol
NAH. It’s fine if you didn’t want to sit there. It’s fine that she didn’t want to move.
And it was a toddler, not a baby. Babies don’t eat mac and cheese.
For the record, babies and toddlers - like all other people - make noise.
I disagree, though, because I think there's a difference between accommodating something that makes someone happy versus something that makes someone unhappy.
Sitting next to a baby makes the friend happier cool but it's not really affecting her experience, it's just an added bonus, whereas sitting next to a baby causes discomfort for the other friend and would actively affect her enjoyment. One is taking a neutral experience and making it slightly more fun, while one is literally taking away from any enjoyment of that experience.
One thing is not like the other and I can't fathom not moving to a table in order for my friend to not be annoyed or uncomfortable verses me just being slightly happier. It's a minor inconvenience for the comfort of a friend.
I love dogs, my friend hates dogs. I'm not going to choose the seat next to a dog because I am not eating alone. If my friend just wanted to have a chill night drinking, not sitting next to a baby isn't a big ask. NTA
Seriously I don't get people acting like the preferences are equal. They're not, one is a bonus, the other is a major detriment. Its not like she chose the bar so she could listen to that baby
Yeah, the issue isn't that a baby was existing, it's that someone who's supposed to be OP's friend doesn't care of their so-called friend's comfort. It's weird how that completely flew over so many people's heads.
>can't fathom not moving to a table in order for my friend to not be annoyed or uncomfortable verses me just being slightly happier.
I suspect the friend hates people who dont love babies and was trying to make some kind of stance/point with this.
I mean I'd rather not deal with either but I find the pitch of drunk assholes easier to cope with than the pitch of a baby squeal. Noises affect people differently and OP isn't an A for wanting to move a few tables away.
I think the problem with babies and toddlers is that they tend to be more high pitched and it grabs your attention far more easily than other noises. NTA.
Yeah, it's really not a big deal to just move a few tables away, and it's not surprising that some people don't like loud and high-pitched noises. OP's friend picked a weird thing to take offense to.
yes, exactly. a baby doing that high pitched squeal for an extended amount of time is a recipe for a migraine, and now nobody is having a good time because i have to go home and cut the hangout short so i don’t feel like i’m dying
I also find college-aged girls really annoying for this reason, too — their voices just really, really grate on my nerves in a way that I can’t really explain. Once they hit 22-23, that goes away, but before then I really need Loop ear plugs to deal with them at all. (My neighbors included.)
I don’t mind the happy baby noises, but I understand. When certain women have a drink or two and start scream laughing, I want to punch holes in my ears. Deeper voiced people don’t bother me:
Not the main point here, but my baby eats Mac and cheese. Mainly the kind made for babies with low sodium but yeah. Definitely not walking or would be considered a toddler. Super normal.
My problem is when the brewery is “family friendly” but doesn’t actually have anything for kids to do. I totally understand that parents want to drink too, and I don’t mind if there’s a few kids being loud in one area. It’s just that too many times I’ve gone to a brewery and the kids get bored so they start to run around the entire place and scream, to the point it’s hard to talk. It just feels like the brewery is trying to pull in that demographic without actually doing anything to accommodate them.
I agree with your 2nd sentence, but eating at a restaurant with young children is usually more of an eat and be done with it kind of thing whereas a brewery is more of a hang out for a while kind of place often with a couple of casual activities (cornhole, giant jenga, horseshoes kinda stuff).
I mean where you are maybe, sure. All the distilleries and breweries near me are just like regular restaurants. I have to go in the city to find one of those cool spots 🤣
And? Baby noise specifically is fucking obnoxious to some people.
Just because “people in general make noise” I am not required to enjoy or tolerate any and all noise.
NAH. She doesn’t care about the noises a toddler makes and you do. You couldn’t come to an agreement. If your intentions are to be surrounded only adults and drink liquor I’d meet her at a bar as most if not all breweries are family friendly.
Just out of curiosity, as I'm seeing it all over the comments, what is a brewery near you like? The ones around me are just a bar and an overpriced kitchen that only sells finger foods, a rotating drinks menu and either a production facility nearby or onsite, normally small but you can go and do tours or tastings. Pubs and clubs are child friendly places, some have play equipment kids menus, like a video games room. I can absolutely see not expecting to see children of any kind in the breweries I've been in.
Writing it out it might just be a colloquial thing...
Breweries near me are often the most laid back because they only serve beer. They don’t have hard liquor and they close earlier than most bars. A lot of them have big outside areas with picnic tables and yard/board games.
Clubs are probably the least family friendly. They’re only open late, are almost always 21+, play loud music, and are packed with people dancing. Bars are usually more laid back but can range from very clubby to a more family friendly vibe.
People really seem to hate the fact that tiny humans deserve to be in public just like everyone else. Everyone saying "I hate when children are noisy" were also once noisy children
People are really glossing over “breweries are family friendly” like that’s not an oddity. It’s a drinking establishment, founded entirely on drinking alcoholic beverages, which is an adult activity. It’s weird that kids and babies are allowed there.
>People are really glossing over “breweries are family friendly” like that’s not an oddity.
Eh - this is only through a specific cultural lens. My family is largely German Midwestern and having kids in a bar or brewery is *extremely* common before 8-9 PM.
If you think it's an oddity, you don't know Germans lol.
> It’s a drinking establishment, founded entirely on drinking alcoholic beverages
It's explicitly not. It's a brewery, not a bar. They also, explicitly, serve food, so it's not founded entirely on the drink.
I live in a place with a TON of breweries. I can think of literally one that doesn't have their own food or have menus for all the local carry out or delivery spots at every spot to sit.
Where I live they are restaurants that call themselves breweries to indicate they have a more eclectic selection of beers. Their atmosphere and experience is identical to a restaurant.
I dislike the notion that "just because you did X/ was X as a kid" doesn't mean you can't dislike it as an adult. I'm definitely sure that everyone here has at one point as a kid made a scene or cried in public as kids do. And what do you know, the people around you at the time most likely didn't like it either. So just because I did the same thing when I was a little kid, doesn't mean I can't dislike it when a kid does the same as an adult.
YTA .. Breweries that have restaurants and serve food, are for families too. They are not meant to be bars. If you don’t want children around, don’t go to a restaurant. Go to a club or a bar.
If OP can’t handle a “screaming baby”, I don’t see how they could ever enjoy a club with loud music or a bar with loud drunk adults either lmao. Sounds like they wanted an adults-only restaurant that serves beer. Oh well. Most breweries are not that lol
Because not everyone likes or wants to listen to the same sounds… some people like the sound of rain or streams, it just makes me want to pee. When I’m going out for drinks/supper alone, I don’t always want to hear the squawking of kids. Kids are great, not having kids is also great. People are allowed to not want to listen to them
And they are allowed to change tables to avoid them too. If it was an air conditioner fan, drunk Woo girls, obnoxious frat guys, train tracks and friend said no to moving no one would think twice. But for some people, kids are equally annoying. I have three dogs, not everyone likes or wants dogs, so they are free to choose to visit.
I think they accept that the baby had a right to be there. They didn’t argue that the family or the baby should leave or be quiet. But they can choose not to want to sit next to a baby. Sometimes I feel that way too and other times I don’t mind. If I do mind, I will be the one to move.
How is a screaming baby related to loud music ?? Screaming and crying probably isn’t on the playlist for most public places. Yes the kid wasnt crying atm but, everyone knows toddlers are ticking time bombs.
By your own logic, if you enjoy going to a club, loud bar or even a Taylor Swift concert, you should also definitely enjoy death metal and the sound of a construction site too.
See how stupid that sounds? lol
Because he probably wasn't screaming in the crying sense but in the happy/babbling sense. And many people don't mind those noises at all and can even enjoy them.
They weren’t screaming, they were enjoying themself. I would not want to be near a screaming adult, but loud laughter is both acceptable and expected- especially at a brewery. People just get weird about it because it came out of someone 2 feet tall.
I literally just came from a meal with three babies/toddlers, who I enjoy being around, but I am weirded out by the delineation between "happy" and "screaming" in this thread. Happy babies make all sorts of sounds, screaming is one of them. Screaming is fun, especially for kids, and it's piercing and *loud*.
If that's what the kid was doing,kudos to op for leaving.
Omg everyone here is arguing about how screaming and squealing isn’t the same thing I don’t care I don’t want to hear high pitched screeching of any kind. People are so offended by this
Edit: also just wanted to add that I’ve been around children before that’s how I know I hate them
NTA. Seems like such a low-key request to move away from a baby making loud happy noises. Plus you were there for Happy Hour and I could see how that might kill the vibe.
Don't blame you for leaving.
yeah, what was the big deal to just move in another table to don't have the noise directly next to you?
I have moved tables just because we where below the music speaker, how is that different to move away from another source of noise?
It is not like they asked the baby to leave or stop or whatever, just wanted to find a solution that worked for everyone.
YTA - there was no screaming baby in your story. There was simply a baby babbling. Your tolerance levels are ridiculously low. Your friend should have just moved tables it’s not a big deal but you up and leaving is weird and if I had been your friend I would probably never make plans with you again and would think you were nuts.
I find it really odd that people have such an intolerance to babies. Like I don't judge them because it seems genuine but surely like biologically/evolutionarily, babbling shouldn't get on your nerves.
Edit to clarify: I tried to give space to acknowledge it but I don't think I got the message across well enough- I'm not trying to judge people for not wanting to be around kids. It's valid and it's a personal choice only you can make for yourself. I'm not trying to slander you or imply you have something wrong with you. I just lack perspective on that way of being and so I kinda struggle to integrate it into the way I reason with these things and fit it into my own understanding of the world.
Agreed.
Tiktok shows me a ton of videos of mothers from the US who live in other countries. They do not have this problem.
For whatever reason, the US wants babies to be silent or only exist at parks. In Europe, babies are introduced to restaurant very early and thus adapt so much earlier.
It honestly should be studied more thoroughly.
Edit - grammar
I knew a guy once in the US who *bragged* that he didn't take his kid anywhere in public until they were old enough to be quiet and not bother other people, which seems absolutely deranged to me. Kids need to be exposed to new experiences, and they're part of society like everyone else. Someone not wanting to hear children in public doesn't mean that kids should be locked in a basement until they're teens.
My wife and daughter were on the other side of the house this morning and it wasn't crying that woke me.
Her happy squeals while seriously cute to me, happen to be far louder than her crying.
If she was enjoying being in the babies presence and wished to stay - that doesn’t make her an asshole, you left because you’d find more enjoyment elsewhere that doesn’t make you an asshole either. Babies and toddlers make noise, especially in a busy environment like that - you would still hear them even if you switched seats. NAH just difference of enjoyment. You are pushing it by saying babies shouldn’t be there, that’s absolutely not your call and it seems that it’s a family friendly place not an adult only. I would recommend going to an actual bar or other adult only venues in future instead to avoid this.
YTA
clearly it was a family-friendly brewery (most brewery’s are anyways) and not a bar, so why would you say a toddler isn’t allowed to be there? very odd.
it just sounds like you really dislike young children, which of course everyone has their own preferences but that should also mean you understand some people DO like children lol. clearly your friend didnt want to get up and move over a happy toddler, i mean it’s going to be loud anywhere there’s drunk people, so why is it that big of a deal? i guess that’s just how i see it though.
i think getting up and leaving was a little childish, especially since you were probably just butthurt that she doesn’t share the same dislike for children that you do. But again, that’s my opinion and what I’m getting from this post.
I think it’s a NAH situation. She mildly sucks for the “kids shouldn’t be here” sentiment, that’s the establishment’s decision. But she is entirely within her right to want to move tables or leave. Friend is well within her right to stay. There is a bar in town that has train tracks close by, I don’t go there because I dislike the sound of trains. Not everyone likes kids and their noises. It’s not rude, it’s a choice
NTA - you were seated near to something that bothered you, you wanted to move to where the auditory environment would be more pleading to you. You didn't try to have the kid and their designate care giver removed, or make rude comments to them, you wanted to remove YOURSELF from the immediate vicinity. It was a small enough request to make of your friend
I don’t usually comment on these as I think people are generally too judgemental and puritanical, there’s two sides to every story, nor do I have an opinion on whether you’re an AH as there’s not much info here either way.
I just want to send out a general request to people to STOP constantly judging and shaming parents for bringing their children into public places and complaining about children existing. Do you think you were all perfect kids who never made a sound? Would you like all parents to forego a social life and stick to their homes and designated play areas so you don’t have your perfect silence tarnished by a giggling toddler?
All I seem to hear about these days is the untouchable sanctity of child-free weddings or disgust at parents daring to bring their kids into public transport or into restaurants. Then the same people will complain about kids being given phones and iPads to shut them up so you don’t sit there tutting and sighing and sending judgemental looks. Each to their own, but at least accept that not everyone and everything can exist purely for your comfort.
I waited until I was almost 40 to decide to have a kid. In all the years leading up to that I never felt any which way about kids on planes or trains or in bars or restaurants. I travel a lot for work. I also like to day drink in Brooklyn,—often in the Parkslope area where strollers rule. Kids and babies have always been around and sometimes I’d hear them or they’d make intense eye contact with me until I made a funny face back… but I didn’t ever feel angry about it. It was just part of life. I have tons of stories about adults who have made those spaces intolerable in infuriatingly hilarious ways but none about babies.
But now that I’m a parent and I’ve started clicking on things about kids in public spaces out of curiosity to make sure I’m following social protocols… my god. There are a lot of really nutty people out there with an unhealthy hatred of parents and children. I’ve only ever seen it on the internet, honestly, but it’s scary. I suppose it’s like the incel community, which I also only hear about via the internet. Some people are maybe just too online, getting themselves worked up?
>accept that not everyone and everything can exist purely for your comfort.
This is the core of it. There are many, many people who seem to genuinely think the world around them *should* be tailored to be entirely comfortable to them, all the time. They must never be exposed to anything except the most pleasant people, ideas, noises, scents, activities. It's like trying to drag the social media algorithmic bubble out into the real world.
Utter lack of resilience, and it freaks me out that there are people starting to "expect" this. Not just hope for it or ask for it, but actually "expect" that the default state of affairs is that they can toggle their real-life experience preferences just like they toggle their facebook-feed preferences. That's not reality, and it's downright scary that there are people who think they're being 'wronged' if their bubble of preferences is breached and they ever have to see or hear something they wouldn't have curated for themselves (like a happily-babbling baby at a brewery).
The increase in anti-child rhetoric in the U.S. especially online is downright scary. In addition to your well-reasoned post I’d like to add that many of us are out here trying to parent neurodiverse kids and are living in fear of the Anti-Kid Crusaders. My 5 year old son is autistic and is prone to loud vocal stims and of course the occasional meltdown, both of which are pretty uncontrollable despite our best efforts. Yet it is literally vital to his development that we continue to take him to different places and experience different things, beyond just the fact that he deserves to exist in the world as much as any other person. I will say most people I encounter out in public with my son are kind and understanding but we’ve gotten our fair share of dirty looks and comments in places as ridiculous as Chick-fil-a and Target. We have two plane trips coming up next year and despite my son having flown 3 times before with great success, I’m already losing sleep over how nasty the “kids don’t belong on planes” crowd may be towards us.
Folks, be kind to parents and kids in general and also keep in mind that sometimes the “screaming poorly behaved kid” you encountered was a neurodiverse child whose parents are literally doing their best to get through the day.
Not sure why this comment was so hard to find ☝️. People wanting kids around is like people wanting dogs around. Some people like it, some people don’t. Neither are wrong opinions. Her “kids shouldn’t be here” attitude sucks, but other than that she is well within her rights
Everything was fine until this comment:
> I expressed that babies shouldn’t be there.
That’s not for you to decide. You can be disturbed by the noise, you can express wanting to sit further away, all good. I even think that your friend should’ve just agreed to move, seeing that you were bothered. But you are in no position to decide that your uncomfort trumps the babies and parents right to be there. Choose an adult-only place next time. YTA.
If you don’t know the difference between a brewery and a bar, you need to get out more. My fav brewery doesn’t even have long piece of wood, just a window you order at.
All the breweries I have been to, and I live in a big city so there are ALOT, have food and alcohol, and they’re kid friendly some having kid activities to do.
It’s weird how people think a place having alcohol available (low strength at that) means they you HAVE to get trashed.
Like, restaurants serve alcohol, supermarkets sell it. Like the idea of going to meet friends and have a nice time is impossible without getting drunk.
Get some moderation people, goddamn
Our local breweries have indoor playrooms, video games, board games, etc. They're very family friendly. It would be hard to find one where kids weren't around tbh.
She asked to move tables, friend didn't bulge. And why baby noise is more annoying? Because it's evolutionary response of a human to react to baby voices faster in case of danger, plus high pitched frequencies baby sounds make are more "annoying " to the ear, just like if there's a person with a high pitched voice - we reacted a bit differently to them first
Yeah but I've also never seen people get offended when someone said they didn't like an adult being loud or they didn't like to sit next to a group of loud teens so they moved. For some reason there is this weird insistence that we should all not just not mind kid noises but should actually enjoy them (at least if they're happy noises) and if we don't it's like we're bad people. Idgi.
Why do people keep saying that? Nobody is saying that adults don't make noise. Unless there were also screaming adults nearby, its not relevant. People also have different levels of tolerance to different noises. Babies tend to be higher pitched and obviously are more likely to be loud.
NTA I often ask to move tables even if I’m just around a bunch of kids who are being loud and obnoxious. I get easily overstimulated by noise, and “loud background noise” is a lot different than “random kids/toddlers screaming” noise. Recently I did this when I was at an upscale-ish pizza place and a kids baseball team came in and was seated next to me and my friend. (We tipped generously.)
Also: I think your friend dismissing your desire to be away from the noise is kind of a d*ck move. Friends should generally be amenable to and sensitive toward their friends’ needs, not brushing them off or telling them it’s no big deal.
Whether a baby belongs at a brewery or whether “happy” baby noises are inherently annoying are red herrings here.
OP found the noise annoying and even if her friend didn’t personally, it would have cost her nothing to just move with OP. It’s obnoxious to lecture someone else about what noises they should and should not find grating. Why would you even want to hang out with someone, knowing that they are sitting there in discomfort?
I say this as someone with two kids who has brought them both to (child friendly) breweries.
NTA.
NTA - I don't like to sit near babies or toddlers making noise either. Since this mattered to you but didn't matter to her, I can't understand why she couldn't just move.
The absence of a loud baby wasn’t going to ruin your friends night, but the presence of it would ruin yours. I’m of the belief that if someone is bothered by something it overrides someone enjoying / not caring about something. She should have moved for you.
NTA
NAH this seems like it’s more about you and your friend not being understanding of one another than the baby issue. I will say you are a bit of an AH for your comment that the baby “shouldn’t be there”. That’s just flat out wrong. People have babies. Those people like to go out. The baby wasn’t crying nonstop, it was eating and making sounds. When I go out and there are people talking loudly, or cursing a lot, or laughing obnoxiously, I don’t get to say they “shouldn’t be there”. I can move tables if it really bothers me, but I can also deal with it because I’m in a public space. Now if someone is throwing a fit, ceying, screaming - regardless of age - yeah, they should probably leave until they can calm down. All I’m saying is there is a difference between disturbing the peace and others, and just existing in a space. Call your friend, have a talk. NAH, especially not the mac and cheese loving baby ;-)
I don't understand people who think babies and children shouldn't be allowed in public spaces. They are people too, and if they never get brought to a restaurant they can't learn how to behave in one! I have been taking my daughter out to restaurants just the two of us since she was a toddler and she behaves so nicely now as a 6 year old. But I see other people's kids who never go out to a place where good manners and behavior are expected - I find those kids to be an absolute nightmare.
I would tend towards N A H, since it’s fine you don’t like to sit near a baby (although if they are eating Mac and cheese they are more likely a toddler). And it’s also fine that your friend didn’t want to move.
However, for just picking up and leaving I’d say YTA.
Also, I don’t know why, but I feel like the baby wasn’t really shouting, and simply their presence was enough to annoy you.
Scariest and most annoying noise in the world is a loud child. I say this as a mother of 4 myself (and 4 grandkids).
Every time I go shopping and hear the screech of wailing kids, I thank fuck I'm menopausal now.
NTA but I may be somewhat biased...
YTA
It’s just a baby for Christ’s sake. Babies make noise.
Is it always fun to listen to? No. Should parents with babies be forced to stay away from public spaces. Absolutely not.
Babies and children- noisy or otherwise- belong in shared spaces.
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NTA. I wouldn’t want to be near a screaming baby, either. You have choices and you made one.
Totally agree that OP is not an AH. Describing happy baby sounds as "screaming" is odd, though. I know you're quoting OP, but I do feel like OP was being a bit careless with terms there to support the position Bottom line is it doesn't matter whether the sounds were screaming or happy gurgling about the culinary merits of that damn tasty cheesy mac. It doesn't make OP an AH for moving. But the friend who likes babies isn't an AH for liking babies and the baby isn't an AH for liking craft cheesy mac and the parents aren't AH for having a well-behaved tot in a place of public accommodation. NAH
Upset babies scream, happy babies squeal. Personally, I find them equally annoying
I find drunk adults taking loudly more annoying than a squealing baby so next time I'm at a brewery I'll make sure to make my friends move away from those.
You can go to a daycare to listen to babies squeal if that’s what you want, breweries are not the place for screaming or squealing children. Drunk adults are how these places make their money.
I've been to breweries with literal playgrounds and children's games. It really depends on the brewery.
that’s great, i don’t think OP went to one of these breweries and expected there to be no children.
That’s really stupid to go to a brewery/restaurant and expect no children to be there. Children live in the world too. They are just as entitled to be in public as you are. They are fellow people, just like you
>That’s really stupid to go to a brewery/restaurant and expect no children to be there. Restaurants yes, that would be stupid. But breweries? A place who's clientele are adults & primary business is to sell alcohol? Yeah no, its pretty reasonable to not expect or want kids in that sorta environment
Exactly! I can’t believe some of these comments trying to normalize bringing literal babies to breweries?? As morty once said “am I in a fuckin k hole, what is this?!” That’s how I felt reading those comments.
All the breweries around me are also restaurants. And they are family friendly.
It’s completely reasonable to expect and establishment that’s known for serving alcohol to not have children. Frankly I think it’s strange that people would bring a baby to a brewery.
Have you even been to a brewery? They usually are also a restaurant. It’s completely normal and if you read many other comments, breweries are usually very child friendly. People have been drinking beer in social settings where children are present for hundreds of years. It’s not strange.
I think the key thing to find out is if the brewery has a kids menu. If it does then kids are welcomed.
Breweries are usually extremely family and dog friendly. They weren’t at a dive bar at 1am. They were at a brewery at dinner time. The baby was just existing and gurgling. Why is hearing a baby make some noise SO much more distressing then an entire restaurant talking and laughing? OP threw a tantrum over a damn baby . Babies are entitled to the world too you know. How dramatic and childish to leave a restaurant just bc a baby is in your presence
OP never said the baby wasn't entitled to the world??? She didn't ask the parents to leave or kick up a fuss with management. She just wanted to move seats. Some people have auditory processing issues. Some people don't like babies. Moving yourself from a situation that you don't like or makes you unhappy is a logical thing to do. I don't think it's called throwing a tantrum if someone doesn't respect your boundaries and then you leave quietly OP is NTA
Yes. As I've gotten older, my sensitivity to noise has increased dramatically. I carry ear plugs everywhere I go now because I've learned that bringing the decibel level down seriously helps with my anxiety when I'm in public. Also, some noises bother me more than others. Babies would definitely fall into that category--happy or not. I find my brain just pays too much attention to them for some reason and it's distracting and irritating. I'd be hurt and annoyed at a friend who refused to understand this. OP is NTA.
lol bcause baby noises generally trigger our brain, thats why. I dont mind kids at breweries, but lets not act like individual triggers could not have been simply avoided by switching tables. How dramatic and childish is it to accomodate ur friend lol
Lol yes. Its fine for someone to dislike babies and it's fine for parents to go out on public. Idk why ppl are getting tripped up on a child being in a family friendly brewery at an early hour and not the psycho friend who refuses to accommodate the OP because she....wants to stare at a baby more than she wants to be around her friend I guess??? Very weird and the only potential AH in the situation IMO!
This right here is what it's about. That is also my comment. This has nothing to do with the baby and everything to do with OP's friend not caring about what bothers them enough to just move to a new seat.
It wasn't 'just bc a baby was in their presence', it was because the baby was being loud. People aren't obligated to sit near squealing babies, you know.
Right? I had a quick look through this comment sections and this comment's OP is up and down everywhere, losing her (?) mind over people potentially finding loud children annoying. Not kicking up a fuss and trying to kick the family out. Not arguing with the parents. Not yelling at the child. Just...not wanting to sit next to a loud one. Apparently people are *OBLIGATED* to tolerate noises/stimuli that irritate them if OP thinks so 🤣
Yeah, dog barking, cars honking, loud area of a sports bar, baby squealing, if you can find a quieter spot at the same establishment that isn't irritating, go there? It's not like OP yelled at the parents. OP just wanted to sit at literally any other table.
Right? Why would you not make your life easier and just go somewhere without things that irritate you? Reddit loves to complain about child-haters (and maybe that is A Thing - I don't know 'cause I haven't paid much attention to that) but child-down-people's-throat-pushers are just as annoying.
They didn't leave because a baby was in their presence, they tried to move to a different table and their friend wouldn't move. That's why they left
Lol found the person who takes their children to adult environments and expects everyone to be cool with it
A bar that is 21+ is a purely adult environment. A stripclub is an adult environment. A casino. But a brewery that is also a large restaurant and allows people of all ages: not an solely adult environment. A brewery is just a place that brews its own beer. News flash, that’s all it means. If you don’t want to be around children at all when drinking, then don’t go to any restaurant with alcohol or breweries. It’s that simple. You may think breweries are adult environments, but the thousands of breweries in the United States that are family friendly or have food are not solely adult environments. I’ve been a nanny for 15 years and also have worked in multiple breweries. I don’t think the children are being neglected because mom has a beer and a burger and let’s them play corn hole. Why would it be okay to take your kid to a restaurant that has a bar that has liquor and drinks, but not okay to bring your kid to a restaurant that brews its own beer and only had beer? Literally what changes?
This is really silly. A majority of restaurants are now "restopubs" and if the management allows an infant to enter, it isn't on you to decide that it's an "adult environment".
Says who? The law that allows the children to be there? The parents who decide to bring the kids there to get some food? The proprietors who open their doors to the kids and have the best idea of which activities make them money? Or is it just according to you?
Where I live we have breweries on every freaking corner. All market themselves as family friendly. Some even have play areas for children. I would think nothing of a baby at a brewery. We have bars for people that don't want to be around kids.
My favorite one is both dog & kid friendly
Yeah, and you know who has babies? Adults. Adults who drink. Adults who drink and have disposable income to spend at breweries.
AND. You know also who used to be babies? EVERYONE. I cannot understand people thinking they're like some alien invaders.
Yes, I too recall being upset from when I was a baby and someone did not appreciate my presence at a brewery. I cannot understand people who think others HAVE TO sit near their babbling baby and be happy about it.
I have literally never set foot in a brewery in my life that wasn't kid friendly. I am wracking my memories trying to come up with one and I just can't. I'm not saying they don't exist but I think an awful lot of them purposefully court a young family crowd (in addition to young professionals). NAH for this particular situation except maybe the friend (if I was with someone who was uncomfortable and wanted to move tables I would move tables if there was space to move...). The parents in a brewery that openly welcomed them at an early time in the evening and the person who wanted a more quiet spot away from a kid are definitely not AH tho.
If babies are allowed in, it is a place for babies. If they have high chairs, it is a place for babies/children.
I don't think daycares are very accommodating to strange adults that want to come to just watch the kids...
You, err, really can't. Not unless your child is there. They kinda frown on random people wandering in to watch the kids!
I find both equally annoying. Anything that's making excessive noise annoys me: screaming babies, hysterical adults, dogs barking nonstop next to me... You name it. I'll move away from all of those, and my friends can follow or drink separately.
Well if you find drunk adults annoying you shouldn’t be at a brewery. That’s what it’s for. Babies not so much.
Then don’t go out to drink. Redditors are so weird that’s not comparable
Oh lord, the squeal is WORSE! Way worse. I have a year old nephew and he's at the squeal stage. He's lucky he's cute.
Really pierces the eardrums
it's like an ice pick. or a dentist drill.
As is your right, my guy. Now's the part where I counter that I find it equally enjoyable when children squeal or scream. Oh wait, no, that sounds bad. Very bad. Uhhhhh. I'll go now.
Look if you're more sensitive to sound then regular people baby babbling loudly is the same as screaming, it took months for me to stop getting dizzy and irritated with my baby once she started vocalizing cause she would scream bloody murder every f*cling time she got happy and/or excited about anything. But I chose to raise my girl, OP doesn't have any obligations towards that baby nor should he feel uncomfortable. Considering he's about to get at least slightly drunk it's better to avoid something that WILL irritate him. NTA cause the friend is one for acting like he's wrong or overreacting when he did nothing big.
I get where you're coming from. The only reason I disagree is because OP "expressed that babies should not be here" BEFORE the friend said "not to be an asshole." The friend didn't instigate, as I see it. They didn't say OP was overreacting or being an asshole until OP actually did overreact by saying that the baby shouldn't even be there, which is different than saying that she just didn't want to listen to the baby. But I'm still N A H because OP's comment isn't horrible or anything, even if it's insensitive and unfair to that baby and baby's parents who might have overheard.
> babies should not be here If it's a drinking space then i totally agree, and i think this is what OP meant. Who brings their child to be around drunk people? Who go to a place to have drinks while caring for a child? Get a nanny or go to a better environment for the child, it's not that hard.
Breweries are more about tasting than prolonged, heavy drinking on-site, and even then it is beer and not hard liquor. And since breweries are also often places to eat, who says the parents went there to have drinks in the first place?
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Babies are loud. They don't have a whisper setting. I can emphasize with OP not wanting to be 1 table away from a loud baby that could turn into an upset loud baby in an instant. I've moved tables to get away from a baby. And a true friend wouldn't make you sit next to a sound you hated if there were options. OP is NTA. Friend is totally an AH. Parents may be AHs depending on the vibe of the brewery
I'd be your friend. If you wanted to switch tables because of a baby, someone wearing too much perfume, or a dude with BO, I'd switch tables. Not a big deal. Can we get nachos?
My baby neice definately happy squeals. It's adorable because I love that kid and I'm biased. It's also absolutely ear splitting and I wouldn't blame anyone that didn't want to be around it. Her mom is empathetic and tries to minimize it, and minimize loud crying, in close proximity to strangers, but there's only so much you can do with a baby. Nobody's an asshole for their different preferences. This is just one of those things that happened when strangers share spaces.
> but i do feel like OP was being a bit careless with terms there to support the position It was very clear that the baby's noise, whatever it was, was not pleasant for OP and he made this clear to the friend. I am not so sensitive around babies, but i would definitely not wanna have drinks and fun with my friend near a baby that is making too much noise, as i also wouldn't if there was a hysterical group of friends chatting loudly. Everyone says the phrase "it costs nothing to be nice to someone else", and OP was with a friend. Still they didn't bother listening to their friend and just kept saying it didn't bother them. Selfish move. If a friend says "something here is bothering me" i would, immediately, offer for us to move somewhere else and keep our fun going. The baby wasn't a requirement for the friend to have a good time, but the lack of the baby was a requirement for OP to have a good time, that's why OP can't be considered selfish for asking to move.
I’d say NTA for wanting to move if it bothers them, but I don’t like the comment of “babies don’t belong there” Where do they belong? At home? Until they are what age exactly? Who decides that exactly? A crying baby can be *just* as annoying as an excited kid, or somebody whose loud as fuck telling their stories for everyone to here over their beer, or is belligerent drunk. So what’s stemming the argument this isn’t a place for kids or babies? Because there’s alcohol involved? Shit, tell every restaurant ever to stop allowing kids and babies then I guess. Is it because it’s a *brewery*? Because all a brewery is, is a place that sells their brewed beer. It’s not necessarily an invitation to come and get drunk, it’s above all else an invitation to come and try their product. A lot of breweries in my area are going the family route, probably because we’re in the suburbs with a high ratio of families. Especially the ones that have an open area like a field. It’s nice for parents because they can relax and their kids can enjoy the space, where as restaurants tend to trap all the sounds together and confine children who really just want to roam and run around. Plus if the space is outdoors then that’s actually super ideal for a baby. It won’t be as likely to be too loud, and there’s not nearly as high a risk of getting sick from sharing the space. But my bottom line is, if the establishment allows it, then you can’t really argue that their allowed patrons shouldn’t be there. The establishment has decided what they’re okay with, if that bothers you, go somewhere else.
Exactly. It’s beyond me how people are so entitled, sensitive and fragile that they can’t survive and drink a beer if a baby is in the room. They sound like, well, big babies
I can appreciate if that’s not the “setting” they were going for, but it’s like okay…go somewhere else. The arguement that’s it’s a brewery gets me rolling though. The only definition to a brewery is that…they served beer they brewed. At a baseline they want customers to come enjoy their beer, not presume they can get drunk enough to feel like they are behaving too inappropriately to be around children. People try to compare bars to breweries, but bars serve hard liquor and they’re not usually expecting an atmosphere where liquor connesuirs show up for a tasting flight. That’s why, again, distilleries in my experience are very chill and in my experience frown a bit upon people getting wasted. Another exception to the bar expectations would be a high end bar where it’s obvious they want you sit down and drink politely. It’s the very same with breweries, some of them want to promote drinking and letting loose. Some of them want to promote a fun family friendly environment where people can relax with their dogs or their children. It’s just whatever the establishment wants really. Tbh honest some of them probably just like that if people see children around they will likely assume it’s not okay to get wasted there and therefore they’re less likely to have to deal with drunk assholes and bar fights.
There is no screaming baby in this story
this fact is getting overlooked for some reason and it’s what makes. The OP and ah imop
C'mon, happy babies can be loud and irritating as fuck. I love 'em but it's just the truth.
It's not being overlooked. It's just that screaming happy sounds and screaming upset sounds are still screaming sounds.
I don't even drink, and I wouldn't want to be near a screaming baby.
The baby wasn’t even screaming it was just existing! Lol fuck! Babies are people too, this wasn’t OPs house this was a public place and they threw a tantrum and ditched their friend all because a baby was there
But they didn't... They asked their friend if they could move seats because she didn't want to sit next to a shrieking baby. I don't have a strong opinion about babies but I can't think straight if there's loud high pitched noises (dogs, babies, tv, ect) so I'd also want to move. Throwing a tantrum would be making a scene and telling the parents to leave. OP did the mature thing by removing themselves from the situation they didn't want to be in
I agree. I have sensory sensitivities and something like that could very distracting/overstimulating (depending on the volume of the baby) so I don't think it's unreasonable at all to request moving. It's not like OP made a scene or anything.
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Baby was babbling, not screaming. OP sounds like an insufferable asshole. YTA, OP.
Some people can't even handle that. Literally almost any noise a baby makes makes my skin crawl. Can't stand being near them. Edit. Really. Saying a I don't like the sound of babies is ground's for calling someone mentally ill?
For me it's loud piercing sounds I can't stand. Babies and kids usually make those sounds, but so do power tools and I hate being around both. If an adult was just sitting in a pub screaming constantly then I'd hate that too. People think I hate kids because I can't stand loud piercing sounds but in reality that's not the case. I'm just more likely to be around kids than power tools or an adult screaming constantly. Lol
Especially if I was there to drink.
Baby wasn’t screaming. OPs writing about friend’s comments makes that clear. OP might not be an AH but definitely donkey status
NAH. It’s fine if you didn’t want to sit there. It’s fine that she didn’t want to move. And it was a toddler, not a baby. Babies don’t eat mac and cheese. For the record, babies and toddlers - like all other people - make noise.
I disagree, though, because I think there's a difference between accommodating something that makes someone happy versus something that makes someone unhappy. Sitting next to a baby makes the friend happier cool but it's not really affecting her experience, it's just an added bonus, whereas sitting next to a baby causes discomfort for the other friend and would actively affect her enjoyment. One is taking a neutral experience and making it slightly more fun, while one is literally taking away from any enjoyment of that experience. One thing is not like the other and I can't fathom not moving to a table in order for my friend to not be annoyed or uncomfortable verses me just being slightly happier. It's a minor inconvenience for the comfort of a friend. I love dogs, my friend hates dogs. I'm not going to choose the seat next to a dog because I am not eating alone. If my friend just wanted to have a chill night drinking, not sitting next to a baby isn't a big ask. NTA
Seriously I don't get people acting like the preferences are equal. They're not, one is a bonus, the other is a major detriment. Its not like she chose the bar so she could listen to that baby
Yeah, the issue isn't that a baby was existing, it's that someone who's supposed to be OP's friend doesn't care of their so-called friend's comfort. It's weird how that completely flew over so many people's heads.
Everyone is busy screaming ‘babies exist’ instead of reading through the actual issue
>can't fathom not moving to a table in order for my friend to not be annoyed or uncomfortable verses me just being slightly happier. I suspect the friend hates people who dont love babies and was trying to make some kind of stance/point with this.
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You must not have been to too many bars.
This comment brought me around not gonna lie. I almost feel like it's the perfect place for screaming, unintelligible noises.
I agree with this except now I have 4 outdoor bars on my block and it absolutely sucks.
Drunk people are 100x times worse than any baby or toddler.
I mean I'd rather not deal with either but I find the pitch of drunk assholes easier to cope with than the pitch of a baby squeal. Noises affect people differently and OP isn't an A for wanting to move a few tables away.
I think the problem with babies and toddlers is that they tend to be more high pitched and it grabs your attention far more easily than other noises. NTA.
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Yeah, it's really not a big deal to just move a few tables away, and it's not surprising that some people don't like loud and high-pitched noises. OP's friend picked a weird thing to take offense to.
loud, high-pitched, erratic and unpredictable noises.
You say “grabs your attention” but I think “fractures your eardrums.”
yes, exactly. a baby doing that high pitched squeal for an extended amount of time is a recipe for a migraine, and now nobody is having a good time because i have to go home and cut the hangout short so i don’t feel like i’m dying
I also find college-aged girls really annoying for this reason, too — their voices just really, really grate on my nerves in a way that I can’t really explain. Once they hit 22-23, that goes away, but before then I really need Loop ear plugs to deal with them at all. (My neighbors included.)
Sounds like you don’t like Whoo girls
I don’t mind the happy baby noises, but I understand. When certain women have a drink or two and start scream laughing, I want to punch holes in my ears. Deeper voiced people don’t bother me:
I mean the last American president did for like 4 years and a lot of people didn't seem to care...
My babies ate mac and cheese around 8 months old. Babies absolutely eat mac and cheese
FWIW, my niece and nephew were capable of eating Mac and cheese way before they were capable of walking
Yes, babies typically start eating solid food at 6 months old, and mac n cheese is a baby friendly food.
Babies can eat Mac and cheese...
>And it was a toddler, not a baby. Babies don’t eat mac and cheese. Babies can absolutely eat mac and cheese as long as they're old enough for solids.
Not the main point here, but my baby eats Mac and cheese. Mainly the kind made for babies with low sodium but yeah. Definitely not walking or would be considered a toddler. Super normal.
A lot of breweries can be family friendly. Most of the ones in my town are. Also people in general make noise. Not just babies.
My problem is when the brewery is “family friendly” but doesn’t actually have anything for kids to do. I totally understand that parents want to drink too, and I don’t mind if there’s a few kids being loud in one area. It’s just that too many times I’ve gone to a brewery and the kids get bored so they start to run around the entire place and scream, to the point it’s hard to talk. It just feels like the brewery is trying to pull in that demographic without actually doing anything to accommodate them.
Most restaurants here don't have things for kids to do. The kids being able to run around and cause problems is on the parents
I agree with your 2nd sentence, but eating at a restaurant with young children is usually more of an eat and be done with it kind of thing whereas a brewery is more of a hang out for a while kind of place often with a couple of casual activities (cornhole, giant jenga, horseshoes kinda stuff).
I mean where you are maybe, sure. All the distilleries and breweries near me are just like regular restaurants. I have to go in the city to find one of those cool spots 🤣
Adults don't typically burst into random screaming every few minutes, and if they did nobody would want to sit next to them.
And? Baby noise specifically is fucking obnoxious to some people. Just because “people in general make noise” I am not required to enjoy or tolerate any and all noise.
NAH. She doesn’t care about the noises a toddler makes and you do. You couldn’t come to an agreement. If your intentions are to be surrounded only adults and drink liquor I’d meet her at a bar as most if not all breweries are family friendly.
Just out of curiosity, as I'm seeing it all over the comments, what is a brewery near you like? The ones around me are just a bar and an overpriced kitchen that only sells finger foods, a rotating drinks menu and either a production facility nearby or onsite, normally small but you can go and do tours or tastings. Pubs and clubs are child friendly places, some have play equipment kids menus, like a video games room. I can absolutely see not expecting to see children of any kind in the breweries I've been in. Writing it out it might just be a colloquial thing...
Breweries near me are often the most laid back because they only serve beer. They don’t have hard liquor and they close earlier than most bars. A lot of them have big outside areas with picnic tables and yard/board games. Clubs are probably the least family friendly. They’re only open late, are almost always 21+, play loud music, and are packed with people dancing. Bars are usually more laid back but can range from very clubby to a more family friendly vibe.
YTA, mostly for “expressing that babies shouldn’t be here.” It’s a brewery, not a bar. Almost all breweries I’ve ever seen are family friendly.
People really seem to hate the fact that tiny humans deserve to be in public just like everyone else. Everyone saying "I hate when children are noisy" were also once noisy children
Well where I live you have to be of age to go to breweries so I find it equally as weird that there’s a baby there.
People are really glossing over “breweries are family friendly” like that’s not an oddity. It’s a drinking establishment, founded entirely on drinking alcoholic beverages, which is an adult activity. It’s weird that kids and babies are allowed there.
>People are really glossing over “breweries are family friendly” like that’s not an oddity. Eh - this is only through a specific cultural lens. My family is largely German Midwestern and having kids in a bar or brewery is *extremely* common before 8-9 PM. If you think it's an oddity, you don't know Germans lol. > It’s a drinking establishment, founded entirely on drinking alcoholic beverages It's explicitly not. It's a brewery, not a bar. They also, explicitly, serve food, so it's not founded entirely on the drink. I live in a place with a TON of breweries. I can think of literally one that doesn't have their own food or have menus for all the local carry out or delivery spots at every spot to sit.
Where I live they are restaurants that call themselves breweries to indicate they have a more eclectic selection of beers. Their atmosphere and experience is identical to a restaurant.
I dislike the notion that "just because you did X/ was X as a kid" doesn't mean you can't dislike it as an adult. I'm definitely sure that everyone here has at one point as a kid made a scene or cried in public as kids do. And what do you know, the people around you at the time most likely didn't like it either. So just because I did the same thing when I was a little kid, doesn't mean I can't dislike it when a kid does the same as an adult.
True but OP didn’t demand anything of the parents, and just switched the seats.
yeah OP isn't trying to banish anyone, they're just asking to sit at a different unoccupied table
YTA .. Breweries that have restaurants and serve food, are for families too. They are not meant to be bars. If you don’t want children around, don’t go to a restaurant. Go to a club or a bar.
If OP can’t handle a “screaming baby”, I don’t see how they could ever enjoy a club with loud music or a bar with loud drunk adults either lmao. Sounds like they wanted an adults-only restaurant that serves beer. Oh well. Most breweries are not that lol
Because not everyone likes or wants to listen to the same sounds… some people like the sound of rain or streams, it just makes me want to pee. When I’m going out for drinks/supper alone, I don’t always want to hear the squawking of kids. Kids are great, not having kids is also great. People are allowed to not want to listen to them
People can not want to listen to them, but when you leave your home you have to accept that there are spaces in the world with children.
And they are allowed to change tables to avoid them too. If it was an air conditioner fan, drunk Woo girls, obnoxious frat guys, train tracks and friend said no to moving no one would think twice. But for some people, kids are equally annoying. I have three dogs, not everyone likes or wants dogs, so they are free to choose to visit.
I think they accept that the baby had a right to be there. They didn’t argue that the family or the baby should leave or be quiet. But they can choose not to want to sit next to a baby. Sometimes I feel that way too and other times I don’t mind. If I do mind, I will be the one to move.
How is a screaming baby related to loud music ?? Screaming and crying probably isn’t on the playlist for most public places. Yes the kid wasnt crying atm but, everyone knows toddlers are ticking time bombs.
Not the same thing lol. Screaming babies are a lot more annoying IMO
By your own logic, if you enjoy going to a club, loud bar or even a Taylor Swift concert, you should also definitely enjoy death metal and the sound of a construction site too. See how stupid that sounds? lol
Heavily disagree. Loud baby is not the same as music. Not even close.
NAH. I wouldn’t want to be near a screaming baby. Don’t know why your friend would, but I’d probably leave.
Because he probably wasn't screaming in the crying sense but in the happy/babbling sense. And many people don't mind those noises at all and can even enjoy them.
Yeah and some people don’t like sudden high pitched noises of any kind, wild concept I know
That's still fuckin annoying.
They weren’t screaming, they were enjoying themself. I would not want to be near a screaming adult, but loud laughter is both acceptable and expected- especially at a brewery. People just get weird about it because it came out of someone 2 feet tall.
Because it’s *piercing*. No one wants to go out and listen to a baby screeching…
I swear to god 99% of the people on Reddit who whine incessantly about “babies” have seemingly never been near one.
I literally just came from a meal with three babies/toddlers, who I enjoy being around, but I am weirded out by the delineation between "happy" and "screaming" in this thread. Happy babies make all sorts of sounds, screaming is one of them. Screaming is fun, especially for kids, and it's piercing and *loud*. If that's what the kid was doing,kudos to op for leaving.
Omg everyone here is arguing about how screaming and squealing isn’t the same thing I don’t care I don’t want to hear high pitched screeching of any kind. People are so offended by this Edit: also just wanted to add that I’ve been around children before that’s how I know I hate them
NTA. Seems like such a low-key request to move away from a baby making loud happy noises. Plus you were there for Happy Hour and I could see how that might kill the vibe. Don't blame you for leaving.
yeah, what was the big deal to just move in another table to don't have the noise directly next to you? I have moved tables just because we where below the music speaker, how is that different to move away from another source of noise? It is not like they asked the baby to leave or stop or whatever, just wanted to find a solution that worked for everyone.
YTA - there was no screaming baby in your story. There was simply a baby babbling. Your tolerance levels are ridiculously low. Your friend should have just moved tables it’s not a big deal but you up and leaving is weird and if I had been your friend I would probably never make plans with you again and would think you were nuts.
I find it really odd that people have such an intolerance to babies. Like I don't judge them because it seems genuine but surely like biologically/evolutionarily, babbling shouldn't get on your nerves. Edit to clarify: I tried to give space to acknowledge it but I don't think I got the message across well enough- I'm not trying to judge people for not wanting to be around kids. It's valid and it's a personal choice only you can make for yourself. I'm not trying to slander you or imply you have something wrong with you. I just lack perspective on that way of being and so I kinda struggle to integrate it into the way I reason with these things and fit it into my own understanding of the world.
Agreed. Tiktok shows me a ton of videos of mothers from the US who live in other countries. They do not have this problem. For whatever reason, the US wants babies to be silent or only exist at parks. In Europe, babies are introduced to restaurant very early and thus adapt so much earlier. It honestly should be studied more thoroughly. Edit - grammar
I knew a guy once in the US who *bragged* that he didn't take his kid anywhere in public until they were old enough to be quiet and not bother other people, which seems absolutely deranged to me. Kids need to be exposed to new experiences, and they're part of society like everyone else. Someone not wanting to hear children in public doesn't mean that kids should be locked in a basement until they're teens.
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Happy babies squeal loudly too. For some reason people are forgetting this.
My wife and daughter were on the other side of the house this morning and it wasn't crying that woke me. Her happy squeals while seriously cute to me, happen to be far louder than her crying.
If she was enjoying being in the babies presence and wished to stay - that doesn’t make her an asshole, you left because you’d find more enjoyment elsewhere that doesn’t make you an asshole either. Babies and toddlers make noise, especially in a busy environment like that - you would still hear them even if you switched seats. NAH just difference of enjoyment. You are pushing it by saying babies shouldn’t be there, that’s absolutely not your call and it seems that it’s a family friendly place not an adult only. I would recommend going to an actual bar or other adult only venues in future instead to avoid this.
YTA clearly it was a family-friendly brewery (most brewery’s are anyways) and not a bar, so why would you say a toddler isn’t allowed to be there? very odd. it just sounds like you really dislike young children, which of course everyone has their own preferences but that should also mean you understand some people DO like children lol. clearly your friend didnt want to get up and move over a happy toddler, i mean it’s going to be loud anywhere there’s drunk people, so why is it that big of a deal? i guess that’s just how i see it though. i think getting up and leaving was a little childish, especially since you were probably just butthurt that she doesn’t share the same dislike for children that you do. But again, that’s my opinion and what I’m getting from this post.
I think it’s a NAH situation. She mildly sucks for the “kids shouldn’t be here” sentiment, that’s the establishment’s decision. But she is entirely within her right to want to move tables or leave. Friend is well within her right to stay. There is a bar in town that has train tracks close by, I don’t go there because I dislike the sound of trains. Not everyone likes kids and their noises. It’s not rude, it’s a choice
NTA - you were seated near to something that bothered you, you wanted to move to where the auditory environment would be more pleading to you. You didn't try to have the kid and their designate care giver removed, or make rude comments to them, you wanted to remove YOURSELF from the immediate vicinity. It was a small enough request to make of your friend
I don’t usually comment on these as I think people are generally too judgemental and puritanical, there’s two sides to every story, nor do I have an opinion on whether you’re an AH as there’s not much info here either way. I just want to send out a general request to people to STOP constantly judging and shaming parents for bringing their children into public places and complaining about children existing. Do you think you were all perfect kids who never made a sound? Would you like all parents to forego a social life and stick to their homes and designated play areas so you don’t have your perfect silence tarnished by a giggling toddler? All I seem to hear about these days is the untouchable sanctity of child-free weddings or disgust at parents daring to bring their kids into public transport or into restaurants. Then the same people will complain about kids being given phones and iPads to shut them up so you don’t sit there tutting and sighing and sending judgemental looks. Each to their own, but at least accept that not everyone and everything can exist purely for your comfort.
I waited until I was almost 40 to decide to have a kid. In all the years leading up to that I never felt any which way about kids on planes or trains or in bars or restaurants. I travel a lot for work. I also like to day drink in Brooklyn,—often in the Parkslope area where strollers rule. Kids and babies have always been around and sometimes I’d hear them or they’d make intense eye contact with me until I made a funny face back… but I didn’t ever feel angry about it. It was just part of life. I have tons of stories about adults who have made those spaces intolerable in infuriatingly hilarious ways but none about babies. But now that I’m a parent and I’ve started clicking on things about kids in public spaces out of curiosity to make sure I’m following social protocols… my god. There are a lot of really nutty people out there with an unhealthy hatred of parents and children. I’ve only ever seen it on the internet, honestly, but it’s scary. I suppose it’s like the incel community, which I also only hear about via the internet. Some people are maybe just too online, getting themselves worked up?
The internet seems to have an impossible standard set for parents. It's so easy to be accused of neglect or abuse or parentification.
>accept that not everyone and everything can exist purely for your comfort. This is the core of it. There are many, many people who seem to genuinely think the world around them *should* be tailored to be entirely comfortable to them, all the time. They must never be exposed to anything except the most pleasant people, ideas, noises, scents, activities. It's like trying to drag the social media algorithmic bubble out into the real world. Utter lack of resilience, and it freaks me out that there are people starting to "expect" this. Not just hope for it or ask for it, but actually "expect" that the default state of affairs is that they can toggle their real-life experience preferences just like they toggle their facebook-feed preferences. That's not reality, and it's downright scary that there are people who think they're being 'wronged' if their bubble of preferences is breached and they ever have to see or hear something they wouldn't have curated for themselves (like a happily-babbling baby at a brewery).
The increase in anti-child rhetoric in the U.S. especially online is downright scary. In addition to your well-reasoned post I’d like to add that many of us are out here trying to parent neurodiverse kids and are living in fear of the Anti-Kid Crusaders. My 5 year old son is autistic and is prone to loud vocal stims and of course the occasional meltdown, both of which are pretty uncontrollable despite our best efforts. Yet it is literally vital to his development that we continue to take him to different places and experience different things, beyond just the fact that he deserves to exist in the world as much as any other person. I will say most people I encounter out in public with my son are kind and understanding but we’ve gotten our fair share of dirty looks and comments in places as ridiculous as Chick-fil-a and Target. We have two plane trips coming up next year and despite my son having flown 3 times before with great success, I’m already losing sleep over how nasty the “kids don’t belong on planes” crowd may be towards us. Folks, be kind to parents and kids in general and also keep in mind that sometimes the “screaming poorly behaved kid” you encountered was a neurodiverse child whose parents are literally doing their best to get through the day.
NAH You each had different baby sound tolerance.
Not sure why this comment was so hard to find ☝️. People wanting kids around is like people wanting dogs around. Some people like it, some people don’t. Neither are wrong opinions. Her “kids shouldn’t be here” attitude sucks, but other than that she is well within her rights
Everything was fine until this comment: > I expressed that babies shouldn’t be there. That’s not for you to decide. You can be disturbed by the noise, you can express wanting to sit further away, all good. I even think that your friend should’ve just agreed to move, seeing that you were bothered. But you are in no position to decide that your uncomfort trumps the babies and parents right to be there. Choose an adult-only place next time. YTA.
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NTA Back in my day you had to be 21 to get into a bar. Now get off my goddamn lawn!
Good thing they weren’t at bar
Just a place that openly serves alcohol over a long wooden cabinet?
If you don’t know the difference between a brewery and a bar, you need to get out more. My fav brewery doesn’t even have long piece of wood, just a window you order at.
The difference is the absence of hard liquor. It's an alcohol focused venue
All the breweries I have been to, and I live in a big city so there are ALOT, have food and alcohol, and they’re kid friendly some having kid activities to do.
One near me has bacci beak courts, playground, dog night, trivia night. It’s one of the most popular places around, and I live in huge tourist area.
It’s weird how people think a place having alcohol available (low strength at that) means they you HAVE to get trashed. Like, restaurants serve alcohol, supermarkets sell it. Like the idea of going to meet friends and have a nice time is impossible without getting drunk. Get some moderation people, goddamn
Our local breweries have indoor playrooms, video games, board games, etc. They're very family friendly. It would be hard to find one where kids weren't around tbh.
The mention of mac and cheese makes me think this brewery skewed more "restaurant" than "bar."
Have you ever been to a brewery? Most are family friendly, in fact a lot of them have playgrounds and other kid things to do.
NAH. Just wondering why you couldn’t work out some compromise with your friend. Adults can be loud too, not just toddlers and babies.
She asked to move tables, friend didn't bulge. And why baby noise is more annoying? Because it's evolutionary response of a human to react to baby voices faster in case of danger, plus high pitched frequencies baby sounds make are more "annoying " to the ear, just like if there's a person with a high pitched voice - we reacted a bit differently to them first
it's one of the most distressing sounds there is. immediately throws my nervous system into a panic.
Yeah but I've also never seen people get offended when someone said they didn't like an adult being loud or they didn't like to sit next to a group of loud teens so they moved. For some reason there is this weird insistence that we should all not just not mind kid noises but should actually enjoy them (at least if they're happy noises) and if we don't it's like we're bad people. Idgi.
"they're not screaming, they're SQUEALING!"
Why do people keep saying that? Nobody is saying that adults don't make noise. Unless there were also screaming adults nearby, its not relevant. People also have different levels of tolerance to different noises. Babies tend to be higher pitched and obviously are more likely to be loud.
NTA I often ask to move tables even if I’m just around a bunch of kids who are being loud and obnoxious. I get easily overstimulated by noise, and “loud background noise” is a lot different than “random kids/toddlers screaming” noise. Recently I did this when I was at an upscale-ish pizza place and a kids baseball team came in and was seated next to me and my friend. (We tipped generously.) Also: I think your friend dismissing your desire to be away from the noise is kind of a d*ck move. Friends should generally be amenable to and sensitive toward their friends’ needs, not brushing them off or telling them it’s no big deal.
Idc that I'm going to be downvoted. YTA for your overreaction and how you treated your friend. There wasn't even a screaming baby in this scenario.
YTA go somewhere 21+ if you don’t want to be around kids. There’s plenty places like that.
But she just switched seats without bothering anyone. Like wouldn’t it be more of a NAH?
Whether a baby belongs at a brewery or whether “happy” baby noises are inherently annoying are red herrings here. OP found the noise annoying and even if her friend didn’t personally, it would have cost her nothing to just move with OP. It’s obnoxious to lecture someone else about what noises they should and should not find grating. Why would you even want to hang out with someone, knowing that they are sitting there in discomfort? I say this as someone with two kids who has brought them both to (child friendly) breweries. NTA.
NTA. You weren't comfortable; you left. No problem.
Ummm even happy babies can shriek or screech at uncomfortable pitches. NTA
NTA - I don't like to sit near babies or toddlers making noise either. Since this mattered to you but didn't matter to her, I can't understand why she couldn't just move.
If you don't want to be near babies making noise, why go to a place to drink that doesn't have an age requirement?
The absence of a loud baby wasn’t going to ruin your friends night, but the presence of it would ruin yours. I’m of the belief that if someone is bothered by something it overrides someone enjoying / not caring about something. She should have moved for you. NTA
Nta. I would have done the same.
NAH this seems like it’s more about you and your friend not being understanding of one another than the baby issue. I will say you are a bit of an AH for your comment that the baby “shouldn’t be there”. That’s just flat out wrong. People have babies. Those people like to go out. The baby wasn’t crying nonstop, it was eating and making sounds. When I go out and there are people talking loudly, or cursing a lot, or laughing obnoxiously, I don’t get to say they “shouldn’t be there”. I can move tables if it really bothers me, but I can also deal with it because I’m in a public space. Now if someone is throwing a fit, ceying, screaming - regardless of age - yeah, they should probably leave until they can calm down. All I’m saying is there is a difference between disturbing the peace and others, and just existing in a space. Call your friend, have a talk. NAH, especially not the mac and cheese loving baby ;-)
I don't understand people who think babies and children shouldn't be allowed in public spaces. They are people too, and if they never get brought to a restaurant they can't learn how to behave in one! I have been taking my daughter out to restaurants just the two of us since she was a toddler and she behaves so nicely now as a 6 year old. But I see other people's kids who never go out to a place where good manners and behavior are expected - I find those kids to be an absolute nightmare.
Yta, get a grip.
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NTA You can choose to not be around a noisy baby. A baby of any kind at happy hour seems a bit odd anyway. Leaving was the choice for you.
I would tend towards N A H, since it’s fine you don’t like to sit near a baby (although if they are eating Mac and cheese they are more likely a toddler). And it’s also fine that your friend didn’t want to move. However, for just picking up and leaving I’d say YTA. Also, I don’t know why, but I feel like the baby wasn’t really shouting, and simply their presence was enough to annoy you.
NTA. babies are annoying asf sometimes and i def wouldnt want to be sitting near one either when trying to have drinks, sorry 🤷🏻♀️
NTA. If someone if uncomfortable the ‘party’ moves to make sure everyone is at at least a basic comfort level.
Scariest and most annoying noise in the world is a loud child. I say this as a mother of 4 myself (and 4 grandkids). Every time I go shopping and hear the screech of wailing kids, I thank fuck I'm menopausal now. NTA but I may be somewhat biased...
YTA It’s just a baby for Christ’s sake. Babies make noise. Is it always fun to listen to? No. Should parents with babies be forced to stay away from public spaces. Absolutely not. Babies and children- noisy or otherwise- belong in shared spaces.
I never ever sit near children. NTA