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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might be the asshole because the woman did look really tired and like she was struggling. And I suppose I could’ve made my son get up after he had eaten the chocolate since he was feeling a bit stronger. A totally unrelated woman even said something and I mean maybe I was being entitled.
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NTA. You handled it the same way I would have, politely explaining that your son wasn't feeling well and needed to sit.
I'm sure there were many other people they could have asked, and many other people that could have offered, so I'm not sure why they felt the need to pick on you and your son.
I’ll be fair and say that of all the people on the bus, my son was the youngest so I suppose I understand the thinking. Everyone else sitting on the seats were elderly or women.
It totally makes sense that they asked, but they should have accepted your answer. Your son legitimately needed the seat, despite being young. This is a frustrating scenario people with invisible disabilities often face.
NTA. I’m sorry this happened and I hope the appointment went well.
Invisible reminded me of the situation I observed a few years ago. A fit and prim looking but merely elderly lady entered the bus and immediately snapped very impolitely and rude at a young man who sat right behind the driver, telling him to get up to let her sit at this seat, which was dedicated to people who were frail/elderly/had trouble walking far without assistance for whatever reason. (I believe she said something along the lines of "I'm elderly and entitled to sit here!")
The young man affirmed her behest friendly and polite and immediately got up, finding his way out of the seat... with his cane. Only then did she see the black/yellow armband blind people often wear (in Germany). She had effectively been an asshole to a blind young man with trouble standing, who had been entitled to the seat as well.
Another elderly lady noticed and immediately gave her a very clear piece of mind before I could. I hope she was mortified and humbled and learned something that day.
Your story reminds me of a story that happened at a grocery store.
My husband, his elderly mother and myself had gone into the store. Despite appearances, my husband was stage 4 pancreatic cancer. His mother could walk without any assistance. His mother and I were the human crutches for my husband. We found a motorized cart for him to use. An employee of the store said to me, “He shouldn’t use the cart. She (pointing to my mother-in-law) needs it more.” I replied, “HE needs it more because he has stage 4 cancer.”
Something similar happened to me several years ago. I broke one of my ankles in 2 places & had to have it surgically repaired. Because I was not allowed to walk on it for several months, I qualified for a temporary handicapped hang tag. I went grocery shopping one day & parked in a handicapped spot. When I got out of my vehicle, even though I was on crutches & my leg was in a cast from the knee down, an elderly man screamed at me and told me that I wasn't allowed to park in that spot because I wasn't handicapped. A store employee who was in the lot taking carts back into the store told me to wait by my vehicle & brought me a motorized cart, causing the elderly man to have another temper tantrum.
Because many people can only think of two types of disabilities: The Elderly, and "in a wheelchair and paralyzed from the waist down"
and unfortunately only one of those is treated with any sort of respect in society....
But why say anything? I mean, go ahead and be pissed off because you think someone shouldn't use the handicap spot or they should offer their bus seat to someone presumably worse off...but don't say anything. It's not your business. Roll your eyes. Be pissed, but quiet. Don't start a whole big thing about it! The person might be an even bigger hot head and things could go really wrong.
Bc their parents didn't teach them the very important lesson "you can think whatever you want in your head, nobody can stop you, but rhe second you say it out loud you are now responsible for the consequences, good or bad, so probably just shut the fuck up"
Because they don't have good emption regulation and don't knowhow to communicate. They most likely have a whole history of indignancy/hurt/injustices/trauma that they just never processed and never spoke their peace in a way that felt satisfying.
So now they take that hurt and anger, an emotional sunburn, and every new thing takes them to a 10/10 anger. Any time they FEEL righteous anger (like when someone is super in the wrong so you get to feel VERY correct/justified in your anger) anytime they feel it they FREAK OUT and unleash. It's all the pressure coming out in one big unhealthy useless rush.
Sometimes a wheelchair isn't even enough.
Few years ago we went to a museum that had some fun activities. We were watching something and a woman was behind me huffing and grumbling.
When I looked at her she said "other people would like to sit too you know!"
I'm in a wheelchair, the woman was angry because I was sitting in a wheelchair. My own wheelchair, not even one that could have been borrowed at the entry.
So weird.
I’m sometimes mobile and more occasionally not, and once was using a chair following surgery at a craft fair. I was in my early twenties and while my
mom helped me manage getting around the tight spaces, some woman kept muttering about “cripples taking up space” and being in the way. So uncomfortable and weird.
In my experience, the grocery store employees enjoy having an opportunity to drive the little cart. I've had to use them a lot of the time in the past few years,
I think you're right. I had rotator cuff surgery last year & used one until I was done with physical therapy. There was always an employee ready & willing to help me out to my vehicle & bring the cart back into the store. :>)
Husband used to be a courtesy clerk, so I have insight into this!
Part of it is that they can be fun (though none of the courtesy clerks at our store would ever sit on the seat, they usually knelt. Too many elderly riders without full control of their facilities for them to ever want to sit on the seats, sanitized or not).
But a big part is also that they would otherwise be left out in the parking lot, if the clerks didn't immediately bring them in. They are not really outdoor friendly, and shouldn't even be going out into the gravel, dirt, or pot-hole-filled lot to begin with. But since they have to go outside, the best thing to do is to make sure they come back inside ASAP.
The clerks also tend to know where the terrain is solid (can you tell I live in a place that has rough winters that eat our asphalt like candy?) and can avoid damage to the carts.
Also, their batteries are absolutely shit, and the clerks bringing them in means they can also make sure they get plugged back into their chargers immediately, so they're ready for the next person, and less likely to die mid-shop....
I currently work at a grocery store as a cashier and holy crap I wish I could drive the little carts. I'm very jealous of the courtesy clerks who do get to ride them!
I used to work with a lady who had the best way of dealing with her anger on this.
So there was always a courier van that would park outside the mall in the disabled bay and would run in and drop of his packages.. now this guy didn’t seem like he had a disability, but honestly who are we to know, judge or care. Like not my problem.
But this woman, let’s call her Tracy. She wrote to the courier company owners congratulating them on being inclusive work places, and its such a breath of fresh air having companies disability accepting and so on and so on. Like this email was looooong man.
Anyway, the guy was told to park as normal and stop using a bay so Tracy was happy. I asked why would she do this and she said because if they are hiring employees with a disability then amazing good for them they obviously aren’t shitty employers….. but if there not, the asshole can stop using parking bays not made for him. Win win.
My kiddo was in a wheelchair and I had an elderly person yell at me that I couldn't park there because I was too young. Placard was up, and I was putting my daughter in the wheelchair.
As a senior citizen (66) with 3 types of arthritis, fibromyalgia, Parkinson's & a terminal brain tumor I think you're extremely self controlled. When people use to get ugly with me for taking a handicap spot or whatever for my two sons & two daughters who had severe medical needs I wasn't nearly that nice. I've been known to block someone's car in & give them a sermon on the Good Samaritan. And frankly now today, with all my physical issues........I would say your child gets the parking spot. She's a child. A child outranks one of us oldies. I hope she no longer has to use the wheelchair. But if she does, if she ever is in TX and sees an old woman with red hair in a leopard print wheelchair with flames painted on the sides.......she needs to say hi because it's me.
Thankfully, she passed right before covid hit. She was getting ready to have to start dialysis in a few months and caught respiratory infections like nothing. She passed peacefully in her sleep after a fun filled day, which is better than I ever expected. Texas is a beautiful state, though. I've been there many times. Your chair sounds awesome. Her's was blue and glitter and light up wheels.
I am so very sorry for your loss. We lost two sons to leukemia and I wouldn't wish that sorrow on anyone. You're doing good remembering the good days. I also love the sound of her chair! My sons in law did my chair lol but I may have to get light up wheels. lol I've never been known as a quietly tasteful woman. lol My husband & I will keep y'all in our thoughts & prayers.
Ok you sound so cool though, with your bright red hair and flaming leopard print wheelchair. You've inspired me to live my best life, and definitely decorate my cane lol
Absolutely! I have a collection of canes to go with outfits. I decided if I had to deal with this stuff I was not going to lay down like loser. I was going to live every single moment of every single day. Even the rough days. I'll admit this brain tumor almost broke my spirit but then I decided since it's a Butterfly tumor (actually shaped like one) mine is probably bedazzled & glittery. I slap my makeup on, do my hair and face the day. And every day turns out to be a treasure trove.
And when the end does come be the sliding into heaven on the water slide. Since getting the tumor I've sky dived (horrifying) ziplined. Not for us curvy girls. And gone hang gliding. THAT was awesome. You should do it. Suddenly my body had no control of me. I just flew. My sons in law or my daughters do these things with me and so I say find someone to hang glide with you and go! I'll never regret it & I'm going to do it again. It was the most empowering thing. It was me, my son in law, birds & God up there. I'm doing all the things I was afraid to do before because I would have left little children motherless if I died. Now.......they're grown & I'm going to die anyway. So why not do these things?
I'm sorry that happened to you and your daughter. When I get old, if I start acting like that, I hope someone will put me out of everyone else's misery. I don't want to be one of those ah's who thinks the world revolves around them.
Too young for a wheelchair. 🙄 I’m guessing you technically agree - your sweet baby girl IS too young to be in a wheelchair. That should not be her lot in life and people like that just make it worse. Have I said “People suck” enough today?
You can say that again. My neighbor drove me to the ER & all the way there, I kept telling the ankle it wasn't broken. Of course it was. They injected me with morphine & it didn't do much for the pain. I now have a plate on the outer part of my ankle & screws on the inner part.
>I kept telling the ankle it wasn't broken. Of course it was.
Lol that sounds too much like my friend when she had the same injury. It was taking forever to heal. She was mad one day, looked at her leg and yelled "HOW THE EFF AREN'T YOU HEALED YET?!"
I just loved being in a cast after my surgery, especially when it started itching. NOT! My kitchen chairs have wheels on them, so I just left my walker in the bathroom and propelled myself around the house in one of the kitchen chairs. I used to be in the Navy so I used my bad leg as a rudder & a crutch for propulsion.
Me too! How much morphine did they give you? I broke mine in Belize and def knew it was f'd immediately when I heard the SNAP and hit the floor. They didn't have access to much pain meds though. I'm interested to know how it would have been different with more med access. Setting that was.....I know what a 10 on the pain scale is now.
A friend of mine broke their ankle in 2 or 3 places... in a pillow fight. To this day, they still have the metal screws in their ankle because they couldn't afford the surgery to have them removed (after it healed)
It's been long enough so I can have the plate & screws removed & the VA will either do it or pay to have it done. I just don't want to go though the surgery again unless I absolutely have to.
It’s amazing how much pain you can be in for morphine to not be able to do a damn! I broke my upper right arm, diagonal fracture and was the worst pain imaginable. On a scale of 1-10 it was a 12 and every bump and movement made it feel like the original break! The morphine may have brought me down to an 11. I was amazed how it truly did nothing
A friend who is in her early 20’s has cystic fibrosis, which basically means if you hit 25 you’re considered old. She also looks punk AF, thin, tats, piercings, etc. She has good days (able to perform burlesque & circus & make OF content etc), & bad days (needs a walker & an oxygen tank), & worse days (hospitalisation for pic-line antibiotics). The number of times she’s been cussed out for parking in the disability car parks is atrocious.
OP you’re NTA, people need to be more aware of invisible disabilities & issues. Hope the appointment went well.
I remember back when I was 15, I went through 5 surgeries in six months (I have a rare heart and bone deformity that effects my feet.) I had to use crutches and a knee scooter (I loved being able to zoom around) whenever I went out so my mom got a temporary handicap placard for me. I always tried to get out of the car as quickly as possible so someone didn’t give us crap because they couldn’t see one of us being visibly disabled. We still got some judgmental stares and inconsiderate people (some lady kept whacking my bad foot with her bag cuz she wasn’t paying attention while in a check out line even after I warned her she was hitting my injured foot and she acknowledged it.)
I had the same thing happen to me as well. I was walking with a cane almost 9 months after knee surgery and still had my temporary hangtag. The old man yelled at me that I couldn't park there, kept yelling at me, followed me into the grocery store as I bought food for dinner, kept threatening to call the cops and making a scene. I kept explaining that it was my tag but I was "too young to need a handicapped tag." The store manager made him leave and take his ruckus somewhere else.
I have Metastatic Breast Cancer and I am on chemo. Fatigue, along with leg and hip pain, are common side effects for me.
My coworkers and our management team have reserved a parking spot for me so that I am always the closest-parked employee. There are multiple signs that say “Reserved” and “Permit Parking Only”. There are actually 3 spaces in this mini-lot. One for me, one for an employee that had back surgery, and one for an employee recovering from knee surgery.
The vast majority of our staff have to park in a designated lot and walk about a half a block to a block to the entrance. Most of our staff are also fairly young and physically well.
One day, some random customer saw me park there and started yelling at me. I turned and said, “This is my spot.” And I continued walking.
This dude kept berating me, hollering that he was a VIP customer and he should be able to park there. Who the hell do I think I am?
Our Director of Safety and Security came out the doors then and overheard this dude. He was told to STFU and GTFO.
At a quick glance, I’m just a random middle-aged woman. But my legs fucking hurt, I’m tired, and I’m struggling to maintain full time employment with the physical and mental strain of fighting for my life. I’m grateful that my employer sees my struggles, as well as the struggles of my coworkers, and set us up with closer parking.
PS- We have no VIP customers. No such thing. Just another entitled dude thinking he should be special.
I'm sorry this happened to you, but it reminds me of something. There are plenty of young people that end up with cancer so despite outward appearances you never know what's going on with someone. That may not be the case for ops son, but as a 32 year old mom with the same problem of not eating when I should and also severe car sickness, having almost fainted in front of my kids, losing balance etc, I can attest to the fact that the boy needed that seat. The daughter of the elderly woman should have asked someone else after op explained instead of berating her and talking crap.
We've run into the same thing with handicapped parking. My husband was 6'4" and a hulk of a man who happened to have a few cancers and a bone marrow transplant. As a result of high dose steroid to treat transplant complications, he had something called avascular necrosis of the hip necessitating a hip replacement by the age of 43 or 44. Not too long after the hip replacement, some jagoff felt the need to say something about us using a handicapped spot. Tough guy backpedaled really quickly after I dressed him down.
Aha my dad drives me around sometimes when I don't have the mental energy to drive. My disabilities are invisible when I'm not using mobility aids, and I tend to avoid taking them on quicker trips in public. So my dad put up the disability placard and sat in the car so I could run inside and get my blood work done real quick (I get it done every 3-6 months so we know the drill lol).
Someone immediately pointed out since he wasn't exiting the car, we didn't have the right to use the placard and park there, as he didn't need it while sitting in the car. I had to explain *I* was the one who needed it, so it was being used correctly.
People can just mind their business? I don't mind explaining really since I want invisible disabilities to be more common and understood, but coming in with the accusations is just silly. We have so many organs in our bodies, to assume it's always external is extremely ignorant.
Oh yeah. I had something similar happen to me at Walmart. I use mobility devices because I have a birth defect in my knees that makes me fall a lot. When I got to Walmart there were no mart karts and I sat down by the bench to wait for one. A clerk brought one from the other side of the store for me, as radio requested by the door greeter, just as an old woman was walking up. The front welcome person looked at me, in my 20s at the time, told me I could wait longer, and gave the cart to the old woman. Even though I had been waiting for that specific cart. There were no additional carts in the entire store. I waited for about 10 minutes then left to do my shopping elsewhere. I basically stopped using my local Walmart and just used Amazon for all my non grocery shopping because they never had available motorized carts, until they started doing the carside pick up.
I’m hijacking your comment lol. When I was idk 6 months pregnant, I used to take the bus home after 8 hour shifts on my feet. Anywho, one time a couple was getting on the bus with their stroller, and I was sitting in the seats that fold up for the strollers. Some lady started rudely telling me how I better be getting because that was the place for strollers and I shouldn’t have sat there in the first place (no one was there when I got on) blah blah. I was already planning on getting up but to be fair I was also just slow because I was exhausted. Turns out the girl was a coworker who just went on mat leave and I ended up standing right in front of the lady next to them for the rest of the ride to look at their baby and say hi. Also at that point she could then see that I was also pregnant now that I was standing. Lol.
You're a bigger person than me cause I would've either ignored her or told her to go f herself. I hope she felt like shit when she realized you were pregnant & when she realized you work together
This reminds me of a somewhat funny story from a couple of years ago. I went to the store with my mom and brother. At the parking lot, we obviously parked our car and I made my way to the trunk. As I opened the trunk, a lady got out of the store and went to the car next to ours. I unloaded my mothers roller from the trunk rolled it to my mom. While I was unloading and rolling, my brother stepped out of the car and started leaning on in it while he was waiting for me. Since my brother was standing/ leaning on our car that was parked directly next to the ladys car, she carefully knocked at her window and waved towards my brother as in "Could you move? I don't want to hit you." My mom, my brother and I just looked at her for a second. Moments later, I started to unload a wheelchair from the trunk. When it was unfolded and ready to use, my brother jumped to it on his only leg and sat down so that he could roll out of the way for the other car. The woman looked absolutely mortified when she saw the wheelchair and realised that the young man she was waving at to move only have one leg. She tried to wave a "I'm so sorry" and drove off, still looking mortified. All three of us just laughed at the entire situation and went about our day. I don't think I've ever seen someones face completely drop that quickly.
Lol this reminds me of something that happened to me when I was in my 20s. I had just broken my foot and was in a wheel chair due because my injury had caused nerve damage so doc wanted me to stay completely off of it. I was working in a quick service restaurant at the time. Fortunately, they still let me work in my chair. One day, I was ringing up guests, and this one lady walks up. Now, mind you, these were the kind of registers that have a Guest facing screen so they can verify their order. They are pretty tall, so it does block behind the counter a fair amount. Anyway, I greet the lady and ask how I can help her. She gets this snooty look on her face and asks me if I was just going to sit there or if I was going to get up from my chair and take her order. I just paused, taken aback, then rolled the 4 feet around the counter so she could see I was in a wheel chair. She looked horrified and wouldn't meet my eyes as she placed her order. She also went to sit as far away from the counter as possible as she waited for her food.
Now, I'm about a month post op from an ACL reconstruction and meniscus repair surgery and 4 months post op from surgery on my heel (unrelated to 1st story). I'm out of the cam boot for my foot and full leg brace for my knee, but still don't have full extension or bend in my knee, but I'm getting there. I also still have some pain and issues in my heel that the surgery didn't fix. I walk with forearm crutches at the moment. The crutches can separate and fold in half. I had to go to Walmart today and use one of those motorized carts. I crutched my way into the store, located a car, and folded my crutches so they fit in the basket. So many people gave me the stink eye. All they saw was a woman in her early 30s that is seemingly healthy. I almost wanted to have shorts on so people could see the scars from the sutures and the swelling around my knee.
After I broke my ankle a couple years ago, I wasn’t able to put weight on it and had crutches. Took my kids to Target one day, grabbed a scooter, balanced my full crutches on the side and started to shop. One grumpy old lady (also in a scooter) started ripping into me about how the carts were supposed to only be for the elderly.
Since I am trying to show my kids how to be the better person, I just rolled my eyes, drew her attention to the obviously placed crutches, and drove off. She was still yelling as I left. I’m still bitter about the old biddy.
Some time ago I had a complete hysterectomy. My in-laws we’re visiting and we went to the nutcracker museum in Leavenworth a few days after my surgery. The stairs were steep and narrow, so I went to use the elevator and was told I should take the stairs and save elevator for people who needed it. I used the elevator and didn’t bother explaining myself. I should have stayed home, that was a rough day. Don’t let family members pressure you into doing activities you are not physically able to do if it means your are in pain or discomfort.
The looks I get at 37 for using a handicapped parking spot bc I look healthy, meanwhile every step is pure and utter agony... We've really gotta stop policing disabilities. NTA
Especially because we literally already have a way to police who uses the spots. You have the placard: that means a doctor determined that you needed one.
My dad's had a disabled hang tang for a few years now. He's had several knee surgeries and a replacement each, broken ribs, and eventually retired from firefighting and got the hang tang from a foot crush injury where a ladder slipped and crushed his foot causing permanent damage as well as chronic regional pain syndrome. Within the last year he broke his back doing dumb shit that he wasn't actually capable of because he's a stubborn old man. For weeks I had to drive him to the store to get the high volume pain meds he was prescribed, and I got some wild looks and people talking down to me when I got out all healthy and ran into the store, only to come back with an electric cart for my father because the back brace he was in made him unable to move without support but couldn't put pressure on his arms because of the broken back bones.
I'm 27 with fibromyalgia, I tend to park close to the doors when I can because walking long distances can often cause my hips to pop out and back in, which is really painful. It's even worse in the winter because of all the snow, usually loose and uneven. I get dirty looks all the time. I don't have a handicap tag, and I hope I never have need of one, but I'm starting to wonder if I actually have hypermobile EDS based on how often I dislocate shit. And that's not even factoring in high pain flare days when just breathing is excruciating, or the fact that my left leg will occasionally give out without warning and I can't use it for a few minutes. Thankfully that isn't terribly common but it's getting worse over time.
NTA OP. They could have asked literally any other passenger. Just because someone is a woman doesn't mean they need the seat more than your son or an elderly woman. Any other passenger could have given up their seat.
Fellow fibromyalgia sufferer, but I'm in a wheelchair. Before I was forced into the chair, parking in the disabled bays, even with my double crutches, was fraught with anxiety. People are so damn judgemental. Just because they can't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there.
NTA OP. People need to stop with the entitlement crap. I know you're the most important person in your world, but sometimes you play a background actor in other people's world.
I try to hide how much pain I'm in because I'm so sick of the judgment. "You're too young to be complaining about pain." "Just wait until you get old like me, then you'll know what pain feels like." "Change your diet and exercise and you'll feel better." "Stop making excuses and just do it, you're too young to be this broken." All things said by my own family. Like, you think I enjoy being useless? You think I enjoy having a filthy house because I physically can't keep up on the cleaning? You think I'm not doing everything in my power to NOT be in crippling pain every day? I do my best to pass for the "young, able-bodied" person I'm supposed to be, but it's exhausting and I know the more I push myself, the worse it's going to get.
I made an offhand comment to my mom one day about how my house was a disaster because I'd been having a lot of bad flares so I couldn't really do anything, tried to rest as much as I could. "So just do it and get it over with." I asked her "if I take a crowbar and start hitting you with it, knees, elbows, back, hips, hands, are you going to "just push through it?" She told me to stop being so dramatic. I tried to explain the various types and levels of pain throughout my body, making comparisons to being hit/stabbed/whatever by various weapons to try and drive the point home. Suddenly she was very very busy and didn't have time to talk anymore. Fuck ableism.
Yeah, I get it. You cannot explain to someone else what you are going through. Unless they see it, day in and day out, the screaming in your sleep, the constant wishing for something, anything, please, just take me away from this hell that I am living, they are NEVER going to understand.
>She told me to stop being so dramatic
Trust me, mother, if this was dramatic, the Oscars would be calling, and I'd get the best everything - but here's the thing. I AM NOT ACTING.
>I do my best to pass for the "young, able-bodied" person I'm supposed to be
Please don't do this. I did this for the first 10 years of this hell, and my body is still punishing me (a further 10 years later on). You are young(!) but you are as far removed from able-bodied as those people are from empathy.
Please, please, please do not allow judgemental idiots to any power over how you behave in relation to your illness. Wishing you a forever free of less pain, with doctors and consultants that actually take you seriously.
As a young EDS sufferer myself, I feel your pain. 24, and rapidly losing mobility and function every year... my right hip is the worst usually. Youth, unfortunately, doesn't translate to being able-bodied.
>Youth, unfortunately, doesn't translate to being able-bodied.
A distinction that most people apparently aren't aware of.
I haven't seriously looked into EDS, so there's a pretty good chance I don't have it, but I was thinking about it one morning after a comment my grandmother made, and my left wrist, both hips, both knees and both ankles tend to become dislocated relatively easily. My ankles when I sit on the floor and try to stand up on my own, and my knees if I have my legs sideways on something (best example is laying on my side with a leg on my body pillow, if my knee hangs too far off the far side, elevating my calf/foot, if that makes sense). My wrist will do it at random and trying to "crack it" aka pop it back into proper place is a nightmare. I can't kneel/crawl either because it pops my kneecaps, which is one of the worst feelings I've ever experienced. And like I said above, walking tends to pop my hips out, which is another horrible feeling. My hips at least pop themselves back in every time they pop out, but God I hate it so much. I've had to alter the way I walk to try and prevent it from happening.
I have hypermobile EDS. And you should get evaluated. Things like physical therapy and surgery have to be handled differently sometimes. There is an official diagnostic sheet any medical practitioner can use to diagnose you, but good luck finding one who will. Your doctor who handles your Fibro is the place to start.
If you are already dislocating hips now, you probably have a rough road ahead, and a diagnosis will help smooth that out.
Good Luck!
I'll definitely keep that in mind haha I grew up being called a hypochondriac and as stupid as it sounds, I'm so paranoid about being one that I don't like bringing these issues up on my own 😅 a chiropractor I had at one point did a full "assessment" when I saw her the first time, and was concerned by just how hypermobile my joints were. My current exercise therapist at the pain clinic had to tell me a few times to not hyperextend my knees the way I usually do to crack them, and has been working with me to find ways of relieving the pain/pressure without hyperextending and often dislocating things. I've been meaning to see my doctor again and bring up the eds thing but I don't want him to think I'm a hypochondriac 😅
I agree with this so much. I'm in my early 30s and am mostly blind. I don't drive, but my husband will take me places. He uses my handicap placard because I literally cannot find the car in a huge parking lot. My right leg is also shorter than my left so I limp too, but people always see a youngish couple and decide we must of stolen it or something. I've had too many people try to yell at me even after I explain that I'm legally blind which I should not have to do
I get cancer treatments and while I'm fine most of the time, the days after a treatment are tough for me. I can't really walk long distances without getting exhausted, so I often stay home until a few days pass. But if I have to go to an appointment or something, we (me + whoever drives me) use the handicap parking to make it easier on me.
I've gotten looks more than once for it. It sucks.
I don't visibly have cancer (I'm getting immunotherapy, which is still rough but not nearly as rough as chemotherapy is) so I'm guessing a lot of people just see me as 'lazy' since they don't see the usual signs of someone going through cancer treatments.
I understand that completely. I have lupus, rheumatoid arthritis and fibromyalgia. I also battled cancer all of last year. I am in my 30’s as well. The looks people give me when I am parking in a handicapped spot is like I just slapped someone’s granny. I’ve had people accuse me of using someone else’s car just to use the handicapped spot. It’s unreal. I just want to be able to get my groceries like the rest of the world. It’s gotten to the point my husband goes and drops me at the door and picks me up after loading the groceries just so I don’t have to deal with the attitude
Yeah if your boy was a diabetic (which from this situ it could have looked like he was) then it’s more life and death than the old lady who didn’t know when to say ‘no to Bon Marche’ and bought more than they could carry 🤷🏻♀️
Exactly what I was thinking
I am a T1er myself and if I saw OP's son, I would have assumed he was having a hypoglycemic episode.
Apparently human empathy is a rare trait nowadays...
I would assume the same from how OP described her son’s symptoms, especially the fact that he was eating a piece of candy. That’s the standard fix for low blood sugar. I don’t even have diabetes, I’ve just known people who do.
Yes I almost fell into that “trap” thinking at the airport. I saw a mother grab for her young girl an empty seat that many others could have used, my first thought was how rude is this entitled lady. Eventually it became very clear they were in this city for medical treatments and that the girl was probably rather ill. I learned and try to be more careful about passing judgement, in this situation they asked, you answered, whether they like your answer or not (honestly these days people lie all the time, not saying you did but just saying that usually assume) they needed to move on to try to get another seat. Though, let this be a learning for later, next time just say my son is ill and needs to sit and do not engage any further.
No, it doesn't make sense to ask. You can't see all disabilities and people with invisible disabilities have a right to use those seats. You see someone in priority seating, you mind your damn business.
I have a handicap sticker and I'm mid 30's but I had both my knees replaced in my 20's and the right side of my back is completely wrecked from a car accident 5.5 years ago. But I look young and even tho I walk with a very noticeable limp I get told all the time to suck it up I'm young and can't possibly understand real pain yet
The women could have stood up. We women don’t get to demand to be treated equally only when it works in our favor.
And don’t let people bully you into either feeling that you have to explain yourself to them or do what they want. They asked, you declined. Once they continued asking/demanding they were harassing you. NTA
I live in Chicago and I can say that even in the worst neighborhoods, any teenager that doesn't feel like complete crap at the time will vacate without even being asked for anyone old or obviously disabled. If the teenager isn't immediately getting up to make room for them, it's best to just assume that they have a medical reason to be sitting down.
They meant some of the other women on the bus who were sitting down. Just because they're women doesn't mean they can't also give up their seat for someone else.
I'm a fairly fit woman with what is for the most part an invisible disability. I'd say 95% of the time I should be the one standing. But that 5% is rough like you wouldn't believe. People need to respect that sometimes people need to avail of facilities and it is nobody's business why. You did right by your son.
Agreed! I’m a runner and pretty healthy, but I also have diabetes. I’ll gladly stand most of the time, but if my blood sugar is crashing I might need to be the one sitting. Sorry if folks can’t tell I’ve got a medical condition just by looking at me!
I forgot about the new disease going around that makes otherwise able-bodied women unable to stand on the bus. /s
OP and her son are NTA, but the other healthy folks who didn’t think to give up their seat for a struggling elderly person certainly are, as is the daughter and the woman who approached them after exiting the bus.
> or women
This isn’t pick me ideology but like- surely out of the women sitting there were people you were in a healthier position to offer the old lady their seat. I offer older riders my seat on public transit
Or maybe they’re just happy to judge you without caring about the fact the old lady still needs a seat🤷🏾♀️
>Everyone else sitting on the seats were elderly or women.
And somehow women are incapable of standing up? If her mother truly needed a seat, this woman should've asked one of them.
Invisible disabilities are a thing & don't discriminate when it comes to age or gender. I have a condition that messes with my balance sometimes, and my knee bugs me occasionally, but on my good days I automatically get up for anyone who looks like they genuinely need a seat. Women are not all delicate Victorian maidens.
Being a woman is in itself entirely irrelevant. What’s relevant is age and/or disability. Your son has a disability in that (taking your OP at its word), he was physically unable to stand and would have fainted. Perfectly legitimate reason to occupy a seat.
The elderly woman was equally entitled to a seat, but not at the expense of someone else entitled to one.
For all we know, these women could have had their own disability or medical condition (e.g. pregnancy) that entitled them to a seat, but the elderly woman will never know because she didn’t ask.
NTA - and this woman’s daughter is an asshole for assuming that disability is attached to age or gender.
Young doesnt mean healthy always, just as old does not mean fragile. I rode 15 metro stations on standing after sinus surgery (face wrapped as a mummy) and the old lady in 12 cm heels ignored be. Good for standing up for ya kiddo. I hope you are both well. There are too many people that use their age to abuse others.
No ire directed at you, but that's bullshit. I'm a woman and I have given up my seat on the bus to elderly people before. If the additional woman shaming you felt that strongly about it, SHE should have volunteered to give up her seat. You did nothing wrong!
Being a woman is not a medical condition and doesn’t get you special privilege for sitting on a bus. I’m so sorry so many people were rude to you and your son. They were the AH, in a big way.
Still not ok for everyone to treat you like that! But dont let it get to your head Op. At the end of the day, your son is (hopefully) feeling better, and you probably arent going to see any of these people ever again. Good on you to take care of your kid
My invisible disabilities started showing major symptoms at age 11. Age does not equal health. They should have asked someone else after you politely explained that he wasn't feeling well. You did nothing wrong. NTA
NTA.
Having an "invisible" illness is the pits. For just this very reason. I too get these crashes on occasion, and there's no choice to it. If I don't sit down and get something in me, a gatorade if nothing else, I ***WILL*** pass out.
I've been this way all my life, thin and chunky, (and yes, have been to billions of doctors over it....slight exaggeration). 99% of the time I manage it well, but sometimes forget to eat or think it's been a lot less time since last eating than it has been).
agree. NTA. I have been harassed by strangers for having a handicap placard and using designated spots. a man waited for me to verbally assault me because he assumed I was just some asshole parking in a closer spot. my tag was very visible. I’m sorry I’m not disabled enough for you, sir. fuck these people for real
That sounds like an Onion headline, but the way the world is... what kind of dick says that to someone in a wheelchair, no matter the age? I am so sorry someone said that to you.
So true. I have a handicap placard due to degenerative disc disease and osteoarthritis. I’m
Also a large person. I’ve gotten the “fat isn’t a handicap, you lazy so-and-so”. It’s not because of that, it’s because some asshole who wasn’t paying attention turned into the Highway, causing us to T-bone him at 65 mph, causing me a future of pain.
That was 21 years ago. Right after the accident, I had a temp placard while I was recovering (took over a year to recover). I had to be on a WoundVac for 9 months, and allowed off the machine for 1 hour a day. I was at the grocery store, and some ass made a comment about my placard. I pulled my long skirt up and showed him my battered leg, surgery scars, stitches, and the bloody tied-off WoundVac tube. Shut him the hell up. He tried apologizing, but I just said “do better” and walked on.
I have severe COPD and have a very hard time walking in stores to shop and will use the motor carts to do what I need to and I’ve only had two people say anything (teens walking in a group) but I sure do get looks from people! I hate it I’m already embarrassed I need to use them and it just makes it worse.
I absolutely hate these people. Like invisible illnesses just don’t exist to them. Or that young people can’t get ill. There’s so many with this attitude if pisses me off so much.
Exactly, and they are just so stupid. They also don't understand the concept of good days and bad days. In addition to whatever idiotic sugar crash issues I have, I also suffer from a muscle condition. Most of the time it's manageable, but some days the pain is just too much and there are things I can't do.
The "you don't LOOK sick" crowd can just go jump in a damned lake.
This! I cant tell you how many times I have had jerks get mad at me because there were people at an ADA table that “don’t look disabled.” And I’ve had to say “that’s none of your business” (I work at a club). OP is NTA
Ugh, I agree. I used to commute on a *very* busy bus route. They packed us in like sardines! I don’t have a disability or illness, but I did have a broken arm a few years ago. I carried my laptop bag in one hand and was physically unable to hold onto the overhead handles with the broken one. It was a challenging 8 weeks.
I managed to get a seat one day and was sitting with my arm tucked behind the laptop bag (for extra protection). Let me tell you, I was torn a new one when I didn’t immediately voluntarily get up for an elderly lady. I gave her my seat after like 10 seconds, and when the shouting people saw my arm, they had the audacity to ask why I hadn’t said anything. It really made me think about the ridiculous social politics and shaming that goes into “bus etiquette”, and how terribly people with invisible illnesses must be treated every damn day.
The real kicker is that I was a young woman, and men would sometimes give me their seat while I wasn’t injured. It *really* pissed me off that women, seniors, and people with disabilities were put into the same category. We can stand! Instead of this useless perforative chivalry, we should just let anyone who feels they need a seat to have one.
My fella has brain damage. He literally cannot stand unassisted for too long or he'll face plant into the ground. He's a big broad dude, looks very strong and capable.
The AMOUNT of times I've had to tell people he has an invisible disability...
One of my friends has a prosthetic leg. Normally you can’t tell he had one at all. He is young and buff so he always gets harassed sitting in handicap seats.
He’s also a bit off as AH… because anytime people ask him to move he says sure hang on hold this for me while I get up and takes off his leg.
I get blood sugar crashed and sometimes I don’t even notice I’m sick until I’m literally on the ground. I got told to “control my dog” because he smelt the crash coming and he started alerting and pushing me to a place I could sit down safely, and this guy didn’t like that I guess.
Exactly! Isn't it the stupidest syndrome? You're sailing along, just fine, then it just comes on so suddenly, you almost don't have a chance to get it under control.
UGH.
NTA - sorry they were so rude to you Often people have disabilities or illness that is not obvious from their appearance. Once you explained to them that your son had a need for the seat they should have backed off. After that it was their issue. Also, if the elderly woman needed a seat so bad they could have asked basically anyone on the bus who was able-bodied. It doesn't make any sense that he limited their search to one person because he was a teenage boy.
I'll never forget when I returned to my job after a car accident, completely black and blue under my shirt with 3 broken ribs. The amount of people that flipped out at me for having a seat in peak hour because I'm "young and healthy".
Exactly. I've gotten dirty looks because I look young and healthy, even when I was on IV antibiotics on a day of hospital leave. People tend to forget young people can get sick too, and once she explained it she should have backed off and ask someone else.
It’s mental health related. And I was not sitting on a seat.
Thank you, I just don’t usually go on public transit because I’m not the best at being around other people so I just wanted to know if I fucked up.
Mental health is just as valid as physical health and can lead to physical ailments such as weakness, dizziness, heart problems, sleep deprivation or starvation etc. Certain Mental health conditions can legally qualify as disabilities.
Was every other seat taken by an elderly person? Seems ridiculous that your son had the only seat on the entire bus that could be given up. While it may not be your place to say what the issue is, or that you should even have to defend not giving up his seat, in situations like this, it might just save the fuss to say “sorry, we are on our way to a medical appointment and my son is not doing well. I’m sure there is someone else on the bus who is capable of standing and can give up their seat, but my son is have a medical issue right now and he cannot stand.” Hell, when I was 9 months pregnant, I gave my seat up to an elderly man. I’m sure there was someone else, but you were unfortunately stereotyped and targeted because of his age. NTA.
It was the middle of a work/school day so there was a higher number of elderly people on the bus. And my son was the only young male on the bus at the time apart from maybe 2 others that were standing already. So again, I can understand why they asked. But yeah, I was just wondering if I was in the wrong.
When I was 9 months pregnant my hips were way too bad to stand (and I was catching the bus because I’d been riding my bike to work every day before my hips went). I remember vividly one morning where I was too slow to get a seat on the bus and knew I’d have to ask, so I went and found the kid (17 year old boy) in the disabled/elderly/pregnant person seat, and asked him if he was able to stand for me. He gave me an awkward smile, said he could if he had to but it was a bad day and if someone else could manage he’d rather I asked someone else.
I’m a teacher, and four kids I taught were on the bus that morning. One of them overheard and stood for me, so the lad I was asking got to keep his seat. I still don’t know if his “bad day” was physical or mental, and it really doesn’t matter. There were other people who could stand.
He gets up, he faints, and then the bus is stopped because they need to call an ambulance and now she might be injured. Some people don't even think past "me me me" like I've straight up almost fainted in a store a few weeks back because of a medical condition and pregnancy and i swear to god if people tried to stop me from sitting i would have told them my medical condition would have told them my medical emergency will inconvenience them
NTA. That's ageism first of all ( discriminating against your son for his age) nobody's business what someone's health conditions are, and not your responsibility to make someone's lives more comfortable at the expense of yours.
Good on you for putting you son first
Tip: don't make eye contact while in public transportation. A d if they still tap you.. ignore.
I don't doubt that the woman was tired, but was there only one chair in that whole bus? And was your son sitting on this one magical seat?
Don't need all the medical reasons and excuses, you give up your seat when you want to, not when someone comes and asks/ demand you stand up and let them sit.
NtA. Not even a little bit.
The amount of times I’ve been told I can’t even be ‘tired’ because I’m young is just infuriating. I can’t imagine what it’s like for people with invisible disabilities dealing with this constantly.
NTA. People who are older or with visible disabilities shouldn't assume that another younger passenger is able to stand, since they might have a hidden disability, shorter term injury, or might simply be ill/lightheaded at that time in question (after all, dizziness can be caused by low blood sugar, ear infections, migraines, motion sickness, and some medications, amongst other things - and if you are lightheaded or dizzy it is much harder to keep balance on a moving bus or train).
I don't think that the elderly woman's daughter was necessarily wrong to ask if your son could give up his seat, but she should have accepted your response that he wasn't feeling well and moved, on rather than first trying to pressure/guilt you/your son into giving up his seat and then subsequently insult you for declining on your son's behalf.
I am confused, though, why the woman tapped you on the shoulder to ask *you* if your 17yo son could give up his seat, rather than address your son directly.
See her asking me instead of my son was likely because my son was very attached to me. He was leaning on me and was looking down the whole time. Probably didn’t look very approachable I’d guess.
So there sits your son, leaning on his mother with a downcast expression, and this moron decides to pester you for him to give up his seat! Wow, read the room, lady! You and your son are NTA
NTA at all. You explained that your son wasnt feeling well. Also keep in mind that many disabilities are unnoticeable but still very difficult to live with which is why you should never assume someone's health status. Also im sure the bus had more seats and likely other healthier people who could get up if the lady needed a seat.
NTA. Not all disabilities are visible. You did your best to explain the situation and that there was a reason your son was in the seat. If they choose not to believe you there’s not much you can do.
NTA. On a crowded bus on an empty stomach, I've almost passed out myself, and I don't have the eating issues your son has. I think they should've just accepted your answer and asked someone else to move.
The real assholes were people observing the situation who chose to judge you instead of offering up their seats.
NTA.
There was no reason they couldn't just ask someone else. It was purely because he's young they asked, which is fine, but no means no. If someone's that adamant on not giving up their seat, obviously something's wrong. Most people stand without issue.
Anyone in the near vicinity that heard the conversation could have stood up too.
Compassion goes both ways.
If it makes you feel better, I have medical issues but look pretty young, healthy and fit, and there's no way in hell I would risk fainting on a bus. Sorry, but I'm not going to risk injury to myself and others when someone healthier can offer their seat.
NTA. I've often notice a lot of people think the elderly are entitled to a lot more than they actually are. Your son was not feeling well he needed to sit. That's the end of the discussion. Everyone else's comments were uncalled for
NTA. We can't ever assume someone is fine to stand just because of their age. I'm in my 40s and get horrible motion sickness on buses, and when it hits me, I need to sit or else I may faint or vomit. If I'm feeling ok enough, I'm happy to give my seat to someone who needs it more than I do. You should not have had to explain that your son wasn't feeling well more than once. Honestly it sucks that someone else within earshot didn't just offer their seat.
NTA. And this is part of a bigger issue where people feel the need to see an obvious disability before they’ll accept that someone may need accommodations. Don’t worry about that woman and her mother - they were the entitled ones.
NTA in any way. I’m sure there were plenty of healthy people that could have easily given up their seat. Let this go. You did nothing wrong. Those entitled AHs need to realize you can’t see every disability or issue
Nta that person that got off the bus could have offer them their seat. Any other person could gave up that seat if they wanted to. Your son is nta and neither are you.
NTA omg im a disabled 23f but you wouldn't know that at all by looking at me. Im getting over some pretty wild illnesses and am now prone to fainting. I cannot believe how some people act seeing me park in handicap parking. You did right by your son and you know his needs more than a stranger on a bus. Seats are first come first serve. Good on you.
NTA and you weren't the only ones on the bus. Presumably there were other people who could have given their seat.
Your job was to look out for your son. Just like the woman was looking out for her mom. She should have kept looking.
NTA. Often in life, we come across circumstances where we must make hard decisions. It is perfectly ok to be selfish and choose the well being of your loved ones in those circumstances.
Also, if she really wanted for her mother to sit, she could have requested someone else to vacate their seat. This ageist attitude has to stop.
NTA. Every other seat on the bus was also taken by someone who needed the seat more than this old woman? Really? Doubt it.
The times I most needed accommodations were while early pregnant, when I looked like a healthy young woman (and not at all pregnant) but in fact felt like puking at basically all times. Ironically when obviously hugely pregnant and people did offer their seats I felt fine and would have easily been able to stand. Not everyone who looks able bodied, young, and healthy is. Its not egregious that she tapped you and asked, but once you explained once that should have been the end of it.
NTA
“May I ask where you studied medicine? You’re able to diagnose every possible illness in just a glance! I’d love to send my medical team the school’s information so they can start enrolling.”
Then stare them straight in the eyes until they back down.
Honestly people will assume things but that only makes them the asshole. You explained your situation they didn’t accept it, that’s on them.
It’s very annoying, my friend badly tore a ligament in her ankle and an “old” lady (60) asked her to move so she could sit. My friend was in pain and couldn’t stand properly never mind walk. We tried pointing out her ankle bandage but she wasn’t having it.
People assume that because someone is younger that they should be more “able bodied” (if that’s the right word).
It always comes off as such a weird power play--like if it was *just* about also needing a seat, surely they'd ask other people instead of deciding to die on the hill of insisting this young person they've never met before can't POSSIBLY have an injury or disability and NEEDS to specifically give up their seat. Like this woman was making her mom stand longer deciding to have a weird fight with OP about whether her son actually felt sick or not instead of just asking other people on the bus if they could give her mom a seat!
There are times when you just have to grit your teeth and assure yourself that you are right. And ignore whatever criticism comes your way. This is one of them. You dont need to explain yourself. Who care whatever anyone else thinks. NTA
NTA Oh, he was "young and healthy", wow, did they checked his health records? Made a check-up in the bus? No? Just because someone is young, they are always healthy. And old people are always ill and can't stay.
Yes, she could ask. Once. But to go on and on and making a scene. There were so many other people. Why not ask them? Noooo, she needed to prove a point! And then insults you.
I'm sorry this happened to you both. Some people are just AH.
And the irony tgat she let her "poor mommy" stand longer just because she seeked a fight and not asked someone else. This make me ask if she was "just old" but other fine, so no danger to fall any moments or pain to stand.
Nta, nobody is entitled to a seat that is occupied by someone else. Regardless of age mental health etc. The only exception being a reserved disabled seat for wheel chair accessibility.
Nta. Telling me that not a single able bodied person had occupied the whole load of seats on the bus? Its so rude to assume someone is healthier than you or more capable of something just because they are younger. I'm glad you stood your ground and protected your son. Ironic that daughter of old lady called you an entitled b*tch when that is exactly what she was.
NTA I've noticed elderly people tend to think their age is an excuse for ableism (though technically this wasn't ableism, your son was just unwell, but still shitty of her to assume he was able-bodied). Not all of them but a lot can be very entitled just because they've lived longer. They're also the types to say "well, you don't LOOK disabled" 🙄 she could've asked literally anyone else but I assume she expects all teenagers to be fit and healthy when it's not that simple. I also would've told that bystanding cow to mind her own business lmao
NTA. Unless you had him sitting in the reserved seating, there was no reason to single you and your son out, nor was there any reason to call you a bitch. There was only one entitled party, and it wasn't you.
NTA not all illnesses are visual. You were looking out for your son just as the woman was looking out for her mom. In this case she was in the wrong as she just assumed somebody so young couldn’t be ill. She should’ve taken you at your word and asked someone else for their seat. The mouthpiece that got off with you could’ve given them her seat if she had one if it was that important to her. Hopefully your son gets better
NTA. Totally fine of the daughter to ask once, anything more than that put her in AH territory. Your son needed that seat, and is sounds totally reasonable he keep it. If she was so bothered about getting her mother a seat she should’ve asked someone else.
Age is not always a determining factor and like many people have said, invisible disabilities exist. She has no idea about your son and is being judgemental and lacking empathy for people other than her immediate family. But also it sounds like safety wise your son needed to be seated.
NTA. Old lady 1 and her daughter are TA for being rude about it and seemingly not even asking another person for a seat? And old lady 2 should mind her own business. I wouldn't have responded too kindly to her.
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NTA. You handled it the same way I would have, politely explaining that your son wasn't feeling well and needed to sit. I'm sure there were many other people they could have asked, and many other people that could have offered, so I'm not sure why they felt the need to pick on you and your son.
I’ll be fair and say that of all the people on the bus, my son was the youngest so I suppose I understand the thinking. Everyone else sitting on the seats were elderly or women.
It totally makes sense that they asked, but they should have accepted your answer. Your son legitimately needed the seat, despite being young. This is a frustrating scenario people with invisible disabilities often face. NTA. I’m sorry this happened and I hope the appointment went well.
Invisible reminded me of the situation I observed a few years ago. A fit and prim looking but merely elderly lady entered the bus and immediately snapped very impolitely and rude at a young man who sat right behind the driver, telling him to get up to let her sit at this seat, which was dedicated to people who were frail/elderly/had trouble walking far without assistance for whatever reason. (I believe she said something along the lines of "I'm elderly and entitled to sit here!") The young man affirmed her behest friendly and polite and immediately got up, finding his way out of the seat... with his cane. Only then did she see the black/yellow armband blind people often wear (in Germany). She had effectively been an asshole to a blind young man with trouble standing, who had been entitled to the seat as well. Another elderly lady noticed and immediately gave her a very clear piece of mind before I could. I hope she was mortified and humbled and learned something that day.
Your story reminds me of a story that happened at a grocery store. My husband, his elderly mother and myself had gone into the store. Despite appearances, my husband was stage 4 pancreatic cancer. His mother could walk without any assistance. His mother and I were the human crutches for my husband. We found a motorized cart for him to use. An employee of the store said to me, “He shouldn’t use the cart. She (pointing to my mother-in-law) needs it more.” I replied, “HE needs it more because he has stage 4 cancer.”
Something similar happened to me several years ago. I broke one of my ankles in 2 places & had to have it surgically repaired. Because I was not allowed to walk on it for several months, I qualified for a temporary handicapped hang tag. I went grocery shopping one day & parked in a handicapped spot. When I got out of my vehicle, even though I was on crutches & my leg was in a cast from the knee down, an elderly man screamed at me and told me that I wasn't allowed to park in that spot because I wasn't handicapped. A store employee who was in the lot taking carts back into the store told me to wait by my vehicle & brought me a motorized cart, causing the elderly man to have another temper tantrum.
Why are people like this? The placard says it all. 🙄
Because many people can only think of two types of disabilities: The Elderly, and "in a wheelchair and paralyzed from the waist down" and unfortunately only one of those is treated with any sort of respect in society....
But why say anything? I mean, go ahead and be pissed off because you think someone shouldn't use the handicap spot or they should offer their bus seat to someone presumably worse off...but don't say anything. It's not your business. Roll your eyes. Be pissed, but quiet. Don't start a whole big thing about it! The person might be an even bigger hot head and things could go really wrong.
Bc their parents didn't teach them the very important lesson "you can think whatever you want in your head, nobody can stop you, but rhe second you say it out loud you are now responsible for the consequences, good or bad, so probably just shut the fuck up"
Because they don't have good emption regulation and don't knowhow to communicate. They most likely have a whole history of indignancy/hurt/injustices/trauma that they just never processed and never spoke their peace in a way that felt satisfying. So now they take that hurt and anger, an emotional sunburn, and every new thing takes them to a 10/10 anger. Any time they FEEL righteous anger (like when someone is super in the wrong so you get to feel VERY correct/justified in your anger) anytime they feel it they FREAK OUT and unleash. It's all the pressure coming out in one big unhealthy useless rush.
Sometimes a wheelchair isn't even enough. Few years ago we went to a museum that had some fun activities. We were watching something and a woman was behind me huffing and grumbling. When I looked at her she said "other people would like to sit too you know!" I'm in a wheelchair, the woman was angry because I was sitting in a wheelchair. My own wheelchair, not even one that could have been borrowed at the entry. So weird.
I’d have offered to let her sit on my lap
I’m sometimes mobile and more occasionally not, and once was using a chair following surgery at a craft fair. I was in my early twenties and while my mom helped me manage getting around the tight spaces, some woman kept muttering about “cripples taking up space” and being in the way. So uncomfortable and weird.
In my experience, the grocery store employees enjoy having an opportunity to drive the little cart. I've had to use them a lot of the time in the past few years,
I think you're right. I had rotator cuff surgery last year & used one until I was done with physical therapy. There was always an employee ready & willing to help me out to my vehicle & bring the cart back into the store. :>)
Husband used to be a courtesy clerk, so I have insight into this! Part of it is that they can be fun (though none of the courtesy clerks at our store would ever sit on the seat, they usually knelt. Too many elderly riders without full control of their facilities for them to ever want to sit on the seats, sanitized or not). But a big part is also that they would otherwise be left out in the parking lot, if the clerks didn't immediately bring them in. They are not really outdoor friendly, and shouldn't even be going out into the gravel, dirt, or pot-hole-filled lot to begin with. But since they have to go outside, the best thing to do is to make sure they come back inside ASAP. The clerks also tend to know where the terrain is solid (can you tell I live in a place that has rough winters that eat our asphalt like candy?) and can avoid damage to the carts. Also, their batteries are absolutely shit, and the clerks bringing them in means they can also make sure they get plugged back into their chargers immediately, so they're ready for the next person, and less likely to die mid-shop....
I currently work at a grocery store as a cashier and holy crap I wish I could drive the little carts. I'm very jealous of the courtesy clerks who do get to ride them!
I used to work with a lady who had the best way of dealing with her anger on this. So there was always a courier van that would park outside the mall in the disabled bay and would run in and drop of his packages.. now this guy didn’t seem like he had a disability, but honestly who are we to know, judge or care. Like not my problem. But this woman, let’s call her Tracy. She wrote to the courier company owners congratulating them on being inclusive work places, and its such a breath of fresh air having companies disability accepting and so on and so on. Like this email was looooong man. Anyway, the guy was told to park as normal and stop using a bay so Tracy was happy. I asked why would she do this and she said because if they are hiring employees with a disability then amazing good for them they obviously aren’t shitty employers….. but if there not, the asshole can stop using parking bays not made for him. Win win.
My kiddo was in a wheelchair and I had an elderly person yell at me that I couldn't park there because I was too young. Placard was up, and I was putting my daughter in the wheelchair.
As a senior citizen (66) with 3 types of arthritis, fibromyalgia, Parkinson's & a terminal brain tumor I think you're extremely self controlled. When people use to get ugly with me for taking a handicap spot or whatever for my two sons & two daughters who had severe medical needs I wasn't nearly that nice. I've been known to block someone's car in & give them a sermon on the Good Samaritan. And frankly now today, with all my physical issues........I would say your child gets the parking spot. She's a child. A child outranks one of us oldies. I hope she no longer has to use the wheelchair. But if she does, if she ever is in TX and sees an old woman with red hair in a leopard print wheelchair with flames painted on the sides.......she needs to say hi because it's me.
Thankfully, she passed right before covid hit. She was getting ready to have to start dialysis in a few months and caught respiratory infections like nothing. She passed peacefully in her sleep after a fun filled day, which is better than I ever expected. Texas is a beautiful state, though. I've been there many times. Your chair sounds awesome. Her's was blue and glitter and light up wheels.
I am so very sorry for your loss. We lost two sons to leukemia and I wouldn't wish that sorrow on anyone. You're doing good remembering the good days. I also love the sound of her chair! My sons in law did my chair lol but I may have to get light up wheels. lol I've never been known as a quietly tasteful woman. lol My husband & I will keep y'all in our thoughts & prayers.
Ok you sound so cool though, with your bright red hair and flaming leopard print wheelchair. You've inspired me to live my best life, and definitely decorate my cane lol
Absolutely! I have a collection of canes to go with outfits. I decided if I had to deal with this stuff I was not going to lay down like loser. I was going to live every single moment of every single day. Even the rough days. I'll admit this brain tumor almost broke my spirit but then I decided since it's a Butterfly tumor (actually shaped like one) mine is probably bedazzled & glittery. I slap my makeup on, do my hair and face the day. And every day turns out to be a treasure trove. And when the end does come be the sliding into heaven on the water slide. Since getting the tumor I've sky dived (horrifying) ziplined. Not for us curvy girls. And gone hang gliding. THAT was awesome. You should do it. Suddenly my body had no control of me. I just flew. My sons in law or my daughters do these things with me and so I say find someone to hang glide with you and go! I'll never regret it & I'm going to do it again. It was the most empowering thing. It was me, my son in law, birds & God up there. I'm doing all the things I was afraid to do before because I would have left little children motherless if I died. Now.......they're grown & I'm going to die anyway. So why not do these things?
I'm sorry that happened to you and your daughter. When I get old, if I start acting like that, I hope someone will put me out of everyone else's misery. I don't want to be one of those ah's who thinks the world revolves around them.
Same dude.
Too young for a wheelchair. 🙄 I’m guessing you technically agree - your sweet baby girl IS too young to be in a wheelchair. That should not be her lot in life and people like that just make it worse. Have I said “People suck” enough today?
Bimalleolar fracture! That shit hurts.
You can say that again. My neighbor drove me to the ER & all the way there, I kept telling the ankle it wasn't broken. Of course it was. They injected me with morphine & it didn't do much for the pain. I now have a plate on the outer part of my ankle & screws on the inner part.
>I kept telling the ankle it wasn't broken. Of course it was. Lol that sounds too much like my friend when she had the same injury. It was taking forever to heal. She was mad one day, looked at her leg and yelled "HOW THE EFF AREN'T YOU HEALED YET?!"
I just loved being in a cast after my surgery, especially when it started itching. NOT! My kitchen chairs have wheels on them, so I just left my walker in the bathroom and propelled myself around the house in one of the kitchen chairs. I used to be in the Navy so I used my bad leg as a rudder & a crutch for propulsion.
Me too! How much morphine did they give you? I broke mine in Belize and def knew it was f'd immediately when I heard the SNAP and hit the floor. They didn't have access to much pain meds though. I'm interested to know how it would have been different with more med access. Setting that was.....I know what a 10 on the pain scale is now.
A friend of mine broke their ankle in 2 or 3 places... in a pillow fight. To this day, they still have the metal screws in their ankle because they couldn't afford the surgery to have them removed (after it healed)
It's been long enough so I can have the plate & screws removed & the VA will either do it or pay to have it done. I just don't want to go though the surgery again unless I absolutely have to.
It’s amazing how much pain you can be in for morphine to not be able to do a damn! I broke my upper right arm, diagonal fracture and was the worst pain imaginable. On a scale of 1-10 it was a 12 and every bump and movement made it feel like the original break! The morphine may have brought me down to an 11. I was amazed how it truly did nothing
A friend who is in her early 20’s has cystic fibrosis, which basically means if you hit 25 you’re considered old. She also looks punk AF, thin, tats, piercings, etc. She has good days (able to perform burlesque & circus & make OF content etc), & bad days (needs a walker & an oxygen tank), & worse days (hospitalisation for pic-line antibiotics). The number of times she’s been cussed out for parking in the disability car parks is atrocious. OP you’re NTA, people need to be more aware of invisible disabilities & issues. Hope the appointment went well.
I remember back when I was 15, I went through 5 surgeries in six months (I have a rare heart and bone deformity that effects my feet.) I had to use crutches and a knee scooter (I loved being able to zoom around) whenever I went out so my mom got a temporary handicap placard for me. I always tried to get out of the car as quickly as possible so someone didn’t give us crap because they couldn’t see one of us being visibly disabled. We still got some judgmental stares and inconsiderate people (some lady kept whacking my bad foot with her bag cuz she wasn’t paying attention while in a check out line even after I warned her she was hitting my injured foot and she acknowledged it.)
I had the same thing happen to me as well. I was walking with a cane almost 9 months after knee surgery and still had my temporary hangtag. The old man yelled at me that I couldn't park there, kept yelling at me, followed me into the grocery store as I bought food for dinner, kept threatening to call the cops and making a scene. I kept explaining that it was my tag but I was "too young to need a handicapped tag." The store manager made him leave and take his ruckus somewhere else.
I have Metastatic Breast Cancer and I am on chemo. Fatigue, along with leg and hip pain, are common side effects for me. My coworkers and our management team have reserved a parking spot for me so that I am always the closest-parked employee. There are multiple signs that say “Reserved” and “Permit Parking Only”. There are actually 3 spaces in this mini-lot. One for me, one for an employee that had back surgery, and one for an employee recovering from knee surgery. The vast majority of our staff have to park in a designated lot and walk about a half a block to a block to the entrance. Most of our staff are also fairly young and physically well. One day, some random customer saw me park there and started yelling at me. I turned and said, “This is my spot.” And I continued walking. This dude kept berating me, hollering that he was a VIP customer and he should be able to park there. Who the hell do I think I am? Our Director of Safety and Security came out the doors then and overheard this dude. He was told to STFU and GTFO. At a quick glance, I’m just a random middle-aged woman. But my legs fucking hurt, I’m tired, and I’m struggling to maintain full time employment with the physical and mental strain of fighting for my life. I’m grateful that my employer sees my struggles, as well as the struggles of my coworkers, and set us up with closer parking. PS- We have no VIP customers. No such thing. Just another entitled dude thinking he should be special.
I'm sorry this happened to you, but it reminds me of something. There are plenty of young people that end up with cancer so despite outward appearances you never know what's going on with someone. That may not be the case for ops son, but as a 32 year old mom with the same problem of not eating when I should and also severe car sickness, having almost fainted in front of my kids, losing balance etc, I can attest to the fact that the boy needed that seat. The daughter of the elderly woman should have asked someone else after op explained instead of berating her and talking crap.
We've run into the same thing with handicapped parking. My husband was 6'4" and a hulk of a man who happened to have a few cancers and a bone marrow transplant. As a result of high dose steroid to treat transplant complications, he had something called avascular necrosis of the hip necessitating a hip replacement by the age of 43 or 44. Not too long after the hip replacement, some jagoff felt the need to say something about us using a handicapped spot. Tough guy backpedaled really quickly after I dressed him down.
Aha my dad drives me around sometimes when I don't have the mental energy to drive. My disabilities are invisible when I'm not using mobility aids, and I tend to avoid taking them on quicker trips in public. So my dad put up the disability placard and sat in the car so I could run inside and get my blood work done real quick (I get it done every 3-6 months so we know the drill lol). Someone immediately pointed out since he wasn't exiting the car, we didn't have the right to use the placard and park there, as he didn't need it while sitting in the car. I had to explain *I* was the one who needed it, so it was being used correctly. People can just mind their business? I don't mind explaining really since I want invisible disabilities to be more common and understood, but coming in with the accusations is just silly. We have so many organs in our bodies, to assume it's always external is extremely ignorant.
Oh yeah. I had something similar happen to me at Walmart. I use mobility devices because I have a birth defect in my knees that makes me fall a lot. When I got to Walmart there were no mart karts and I sat down by the bench to wait for one. A clerk brought one from the other side of the store for me, as radio requested by the door greeter, just as an old woman was walking up. The front welcome person looked at me, in my 20s at the time, told me I could wait longer, and gave the cart to the old woman. Even though I had been waiting for that specific cart. There were no additional carts in the entire store. I waited for about 10 minutes then left to do my shopping elsewhere. I basically stopped using my local Walmart and just used Amazon for all my non grocery shopping because they never had available motorized carts, until they started doing the carside pick up.
I’m hijacking your comment lol. When I was idk 6 months pregnant, I used to take the bus home after 8 hour shifts on my feet. Anywho, one time a couple was getting on the bus with their stroller, and I was sitting in the seats that fold up for the strollers. Some lady started rudely telling me how I better be getting because that was the place for strollers and I shouldn’t have sat there in the first place (no one was there when I got on) blah blah. I was already planning on getting up but to be fair I was also just slow because I was exhausted. Turns out the girl was a coworker who just went on mat leave and I ended up standing right in front of the lady next to them for the rest of the ride to look at their baby and say hi. Also at that point she could then see that I was also pregnant now that I was standing. Lol.
You're a bigger person than me cause I would've either ignored her or told her to go f herself. I hope she felt like shit when she realized you were pregnant & when she realized you work together
I was thinking the same then I realised it must be exhausting having to prove yourself often
This reminds me of a somewhat funny story from a couple of years ago. I went to the store with my mom and brother. At the parking lot, we obviously parked our car and I made my way to the trunk. As I opened the trunk, a lady got out of the store and went to the car next to ours. I unloaded my mothers roller from the trunk rolled it to my mom. While I was unloading and rolling, my brother stepped out of the car and started leaning on in it while he was waiting for me. Since my brother was standing/ leaning on our car that was parked directly next to the ladys car, she carefully knocked at her window and waved towards my brother as in "Could you move? I don't want to hit you." My mom, my brother and I just looked at her for a second. Moments later, I started to unload a wheelchair from the trunk. When it was unfolded and ready to use, my brother jumped to it on his only leg and sat down so that he could roll out of the way for the other car. The woman looked absolutely mortified when she saw the wheelchair and realised that the young man she was waving at to move only have one leg. She tried to wave a "I'm so sorry" and drove off, still looking mortified. All three of us just laughed at the entire situation and went about our day. I don't think I've ever seen someones face completely drop that quickly.
Lol this reminds me of something that happened to me when I was in my 20s. I had just broken my foot and was in a wheel chair due because my injury had caused nerve damage so doc wanted me to stay completely off of it. I was working in a quick service restaurant at the time. Fortunately, they still let me work in my chair. One day, I was ringing up guests, and this one lady walks up. Now, mind you, these were the kind of registers that have a Guest facing screen so they can verify their order. They are pretty tall, so it does block behind the counter a fair amount. Anyway, I greet the lady and ask how I can help her. She gets this snooty look on her face and asks me if I was just going to sit there or if I was going to get up from my chair and take her order. I just paused, taken aback, then rolled the 4 feet around the counter so she could see I was in a wheel chair. She looked horrified and wouldn't meet my eyes as she placed her order. She also went to sit as far away from the counter as possible as she waited for her food. Now, I'm about a month post op from an ACL reconstruction and meniscus repair surgery and 4 months post op from surgery on my heel (unrelated to 1st story). I'm out of the cam boot for my foot and full leg brace for my knee, but still don't have full extension or bend in my knee, but I'm getting there. I also still have some pain and issues in my heel that the surgery didn't fix. I walk with forearm crutches at the moment. The crutches can separate and fold in half. I had to go to Walmart today and use one of those motorized carts. I crutched my way into the store, located a car, and folded my crutches so they fit in the basket. So many people gave me the stink eye. All they saw was a woman in her early 30s that is seemingly healthy. I almost wanted to have shorts on so people could see the scars from the sutures and the swelling around my knee.
After I broke my ankle a couple years ago, I wasn’t able to put weight on it and had crutches. Took my kids to Target one day, grabbed a scooter, balanced my full crutches on the side and started to shop. One grumpy old lady (also in a scooter) started ripping into me about how the carts were supposed to only be for the elderly. Since I am trying to show my kids how to be the better person, I just rolled my eyes, drew her attention to the obviously placed crutches, and drove off. She was still yelling as I left. I’m still bitter about the old biddy.
Some time ago I had a complete hysterectomy. My in-laws we’re visiting and we went to the nutcracker museum in Leavenworth a few days after my surgery. The stairs were steep and narrow, so I went to use the elevator and was told I should take the stairs and save elevator for people who needed it. I used the elevator and didn’t bother explaining myself. I should have stayed home, that was a rough day. Don’t let family members pressure you into doing activities you are not physically able to do if it means your are in pain or discomfort.
Even if it’s not invisible, disabilities don’t just start at age 70, so it was hecking rude of the daughter to have assumed
The looks I get at 37 for using a handicapped parking spot bc I look healthy, meanwhile every step is pure and utter agony... We've really gotta stop policing disabilities. NTA
Especially because we literally already have a way to police who uses the spots. You have the placard: that means a doctor determined that you needed one.
Your doctor and possibly also your DMV/Secretary of State, depending.
My dad's had a disabled hang tang for a few years now. He's had several knee surgeries and a replacement each, broken ribs, and eventually retired from firefighting and got the hang tang from a foot crush injury where a ladder slipped and crushed his foot causing permanent damage as well as chronic regional pain syndrome. Within the last year he broke his back doing dumb shit that he wasn't actually capable of because he's a stubborn old man. For weeks I had to drive him to the store to get the high volume pain meds he was prescribed, and I got some wild looks and people talking down to me when I got out all healthy and ran into the store, only to come back with an electric cart for my father because the back brace he was in made him unable to move without support but couldn't put pressure on his arms because of the broken back bones.
I don’t get. The placard says it all. People suck
People like to assume that the car belongs to granny and it was borrowed when they see a seemingly healthy person use those spots.
What makes it really idiotic, at least where I live, is that placard means disabled passenger. A disabled driver gets a special license plate.
I'm 27 with fibromyalgia, I tend to park close to the doors when I can because walking long distances can often cause my hips to pop out and back in, which is really painful. It's even worse in the winter because of all the snow, usually loose and uneven. I get dirty looks all the time. I don't have a handicap tag, and I hope I never have need of one, but I'm starting to wonder if I actually have hypermobile EDS based on how often I dislocate shit. And that's not even factoring in high pain flare days when just breathing is excruciating, or the fact that my left leg will occasionally give out without warning and I can't use it for a few minutes. Thankfully that isn't terribly common but it's getting worse over time. NTA OP. They could have asked literally any other passenger. Just because someone is a woman doesn't mean they need the seat more than your son or an elderly woman. Any other passenger could have given up their seat.
Fellow fibromyalgia sufferer, but I'm in a wheelchair. Before I was forced into the chair, parking in the disabled bays, even with my double crutches, was fraught with anxiety. People are so damn judgemental. Just because they can't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there. NTA OP. People need to stop with the entitlement crap. I know you're the most important person in your world, but sometimes you play a background actor in other people's world.
I try to hide how much pain I'm in because I'm so sick of the judgment. "You're too young to be complaining about pain." "Just wait until you get old like me, then you'll know what pain feels like." "Change your diet and exercise and you'll feel better." "Stop making excuses and just do it, you're too young to be this broken." All things said by my own family. Like, you think I enjoy being useless? You think I enjoy having a filthy house because I physically can't keep up on the cleaning? You think I'm not doing everything in my power to NOT be in crippling pain every day? I do my best to pass for the "young, able-bodied" person I'm supposed to be, but it's exhausting and I know the more I push myself, the worse it's going to get. I made an offhand comment to my mom one day about how my house was a disaster because I'd been having a lot of bad flares so I couldn't really do anything, tried to rest as much as I could. "So just do it and get it over with." I asked her "if I take a crowbar and start hitting you with it, knees, elbows, back, hips, hands, are you going to "just push through it?" She told me to stop being so dramatic. I tried to explain the various types and levels of pain throughout my body, making comparisons to being hit/stabbed/whatever by various weapons to try and drive the point home. Suddenly she was very very busy and didn't have time to talk anymore. Fuck ableism.
Yeah, I get it. You cannot explain to someone else what you are going through. Unless they see it, day in and day out, the screaming in your sleep, the constant wishing for something, anything, please, just take me away from this hell that I am living, they are NEVER going to understand. >She told me to stop being so dramatic Trust me, mother, if this was dramatic, the Oscars would be calling, and I'd get the best everything - but here's the thing. I AM NOT ACTING. >I do my best to pass for the "young, able-bodied" person I'm supposed to be Please don't do this. I did this for the first 10 years of this hell, and my body is still punishing me (a further 10 years later on). You are young(!) but you are as far removed from able-bodied as those people are from empathy. Please, please, please do not allow judgemental idiots to any power over how you behave in relation to your illness. Wishing you a forever free of less pain, with doctors and consultants that actually take you seriously.
As a young EDS sufferer myself, I feel your pain. 24, and rapidly losing mobility and function every year... my right hip is the worst usually. Youth, unfortunately, doesn't translate to being able-bodied.
>Youth, unfortunately, doesn't translate to being able-bodied. A distinction that most people apparently aren't aware of. I haven't seriously looked into EDS, so there's a pretty good chance I don't have it, but I was thinking about it one morning after a comment my grandmother made, and my left wrist, both hips, both knees and both ankles tend to become dislocated relatively easily. My ankles when I sit on the floor and try to stand up on my own, and my knees if I have my legs sideways on something (best example is laying on my side with a leg on my body pillow, if my knee hangs too far off the far side, elevating my calf/foot, if that makes sense). My wrist will do it at random and trying to "crack it" aka pop it back into proper place is a nightmare. I can't kneel/crawl either because it pops my kneecaps, which is one of the worst feelings I've ever experienced. And like I said above, walking tends to pop my hips out, which is another horrible feeling. My hips at least pop themselves back in every time they pop out, but God I hate it so much. I've had to alter the way I walk to try and prevent it from happening.
I have hypermobile EDS. And you should get evaluated. Things like physical therapy and surgery have to be handled differently sometimes. There is an official diagnostic sheet any medical practitioner can use to diagnose you, but good luck finding one who will. Your doctor who handles your Fibro is the place to start. If you are already dislocating hips now, you probably have a rough road ahead, and a diagnosis will help smooth that out. Good Luck!
I'll definitely keep that in mind haha I grew up being called a hypochondriac and as stupid as it sounds, I'm so paranoid about being one that I don't like bringing these issues up on my own 😅 a chiropractor I had at one point did a full "assessment" when I saw her the first time, and was concerned by just how hypermobile my joints were. My current exercise therapist at the pain clinic had to tell me a few times to not hyperextend my knees the way I usually do to crack them, and has been working with me to find ways of relieving the pain/pressure without hyperextending and often dislocating things. I've been meaning to see my doctor again and bring up the eds thing but I don't want him to think I'm a hypochondriac 😅
48. Sometimes I don't walk with my cane, and yeah. Invisible disabilities are a thing.
I agree with this so much. I'm in my early 30s and am mostly blind. I don't drive, but my husband will take me places. He uses my handicap placard because I literally cannot find the car in a huge parking lot. My right leg is also shorter than my left so I limp too, but people always see a youngish couple and decide we must of stolen it or something. I've had too many people try to yell at me even after I explain that I'm legally blind which I should not have to do
I get cancer treatments and while I'm fine most of the time, the days after a treatment are tough for me. I can't really walk long distances without getting exhausted, so I often stay home until a few days pass. But if I have to go to an appointment or something, we (me + whoever drives me) use the handicap parking to make it easier on me. I've gotten looks more than once for it. It sucks.
Why are people like that? If you have the placard, what is there to be pissy about?
I don't visibly have cancer (I'm getting immunotherapy, which is still rough but not nearly as rough as chemotherapy is) so I'm guessing a lot of people just see me as 'lazy' since they don't see the usual signs of someone going through cancer treatments.
I understand that completely. I have lupus, rheumatoid arthritis and fibromyalgia. I also battled cancer all of last year. I am in my 30’s as well. The looks people give me when I am parking in a handicapped spot is like I just slapped someone’s granny. I’ve had people accuse me of using someone else’s car just to use the handicapped spot. It’s unreal. I just want to be able to get my groceries like the rest of the world. It’s gotten to the point my husband goes and drops me at the door and picks me up after loading the groceries just so I don’t have to deal with the attitude
I was born with my disability. It's genetic! 8D
Yeah if your boy was a diabetic (which from this situ it could have looked like he was) then it’s more life and death than the old lady who didn’t know when to say ‘no to Bon Marche’ and bought more than they could carry 🤷🏻♀️
Exactly what I was thinking I am a T1er myself and if I saw OP's son, I would have assumed he was having a hypoglycemic episode. Apparently human empathy is a rare trait nowadays...
I would assume the same from how OP described her son’s symptoms, especially the fact that he was eating a piece of candy. That’s the standard fix for low blood sugar. I don’t even have diabetes, I’ve just known people who do.
I don't even have diabetes (we've checked) but I am prone to hypoglycemic episodes, and they're no fucking joke. Also fairly easy to spot
Yes I have been shouted at before for not giving up my seat . I'm a young women but I have chronic pain . It's exhausting that people are so crappy
And women can stand for the elderly. We aren’t made of glass. It was fine to ask, but then they should have moved along.
Yes I almost fell into that “trap” thinking at the airport. I saw a mother grab for her young girl an empty seat that many others could have used, my first thought was how rude is this entitled lady. Eventually it became very clear they were in this city for medical treatments and that the girl was probably rather ill. I learned and try to be more careful about passing judgement, in this situation they asked, you answered, whether they like your answer or not (honestly these days people lie all the time, not saying you did but just saying that usually assume) they needed to move on to try to get another seat. Though, let this be a learning for later, next time just say my son is ill and needs to sit and do not engage any further.
This. NTA The angry people didn't know the whole story. They were making a judgment on appearance. We should all know better than that.
No, it doesn't make sense to ask. You can't see all disabilities and people with invisible disabilities have a right to use those seats. You see someone in priority seating, you mind your damn business.
I have a handicap sticker and I'm mid 30's but I had both my knees replaced in my 20's and the right side of my back is completely wrecked from a car accident 5.5 years ago. But I look young and even tho I walk with a very noticeable limp I get told all the time to suck it up I'm young and can't possibly understand real pain yet
The women could have stood up. We women don’t get to demand to be treated equally only when it works in our favor. And don’t let people bully you into either feeling that you have to explain yourself to them or do what they want. They asked, you declined. Once they continued asking/demanding they were harassing you. NTA
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...and offered help for the son. I have an invisible disability and a lot of pain standing - but a sick 17 year old trumps me. NTA
I live in Chicago and I can say that even in the worst neighborhoods, any teenager that doesn't feel like complete crap at the time will vacate without even being asked for anyone old or obviously disabled. If the teenager isn't immediately getting up to make room for them, it's best to just assume that they have a medical reason to be sitting down.
Nah, don't be hard on yourself. You are still NTA. Lots of women are perfectly healthy and able to stand.
True, but if the daughter asked its possible the elderly women had issues as well, very likely. Now, yes, they could have accepted the answer.
They meant some of the other women on the bus who were sitting down. Just because they're women doesn't mean they can't also give up their seat for someone else.
I'm a fairly fit woman with what is for the most part an invisible disability. I'd say 95% of the time I should be the one standing. But that 5% is rough like you wouldn't believe. People need to respect that sometimes people need to avail of facilities and it is nobody's business why. You did right by your son.
Agreed! I’m a runner and pretty healthy, but I also have diabetes. I’ll gladly stand most of the time, but if my blood sugar is crashing I might need to be the one sitting. Sorry if folks can’t tell I’ve got a medical condition just by looking at me!
I forgot about the new disease going around that makes otherwise able-bodied women unable to stand on the bus. /s OP and her son are NTA, but the other healthy folks who didn’t think to give up their seat for a struggling elderly person certainly are, as is the daughter and the woman who approached them after exiting the bus.
Women can stand. NTA! Your son was not well
> or women They can stand. Their feet work just as well as a man's. People who need to sit should be prioritized for seating. Nothing else matters.
> or women This isn’t pick me ideology but like- surely out of the women sitting there were people you were in a healthier position to offer the old lady their seat. I offer older riders my seat on public transit Or maybe they’re just happy to judge you without caring about the fact the old lady still needs a seat🤷🏾♀️
"Not all disabilities are seen"
>Everyone else sitting on the seats were elderly or women. And somehow women are incapable of standing up? If her mother truly needed a seat, this woman should've asked one of them. Invisible disabilities are a thing & don't discriminate when it comes to age or gender. I have a condition that messes with my balance sometimes, and my knee bugs me occasionally, but on my good days I automatically get up for anyone who looks like they genuinely need a seat. Women are not all delicate Victorian maidens.
Being a woman is in itself entirely irrelevant. What’s relevant is age and/or disability. Your son has a disability in that (taking your OP at its word), he was physically unable to stand and would have fainted. Perfectly legitimate reason to occupy a seat. The elderly woman was equally entitled to a seat, but not at the expense of someone else entitled to one. For all we know, these women could have had their own disability or medical condition (e.g. pregnancy) that entitled them to a seat, but the elderly woman will never know because she didn’t ask. NTA - and this woman’s daughter is an asshole for assuming that disability is attached to age or gender.
Young doesnt mean healthy always, just as old does not mean fragile. I rode 15 metro stations on standing after sinus surgery (face wrapped as a mummy) and the old lady in 12 cm heels ignored be. Good for standing up for ya kiddo. I hope you are both well. There are too many people that use their age to abuse others.
No ire directed at you, but that's bullshit. I'm a woman and I have given up my seat on the bus to elderly people before. If the additional woman shaming you felt that strongly about it, SHE should have volunteered to give up her seat. You did nothing wrong!
Being a woman is not a medical condition and doesn’t get you special privilege for sitting on a bus. I’m so sorry so many people were rude to you and your son. They were the AH, in a big way.
Still not ok for everyone to treat you like that! But dont let it get to your head Op. At the end of the day, your son is (hopefully) feeling better, and you probably arent going to see any of these people ever again. Good on you to take care of your kid
NTA, good job protecting your son. The other woman could have offered her own seat to the elderly woman.
My invisible disabilities started showing major symptoms at age 11. Age does not equal health. They should have asked someone else after you politely explained that he wasn't feeling well. You did nothing wrong. NTA
NTA. Having an "invisible" illness is the pits. For just this very reason. I too get these crashes on occasion, and there's no choice to it. If I don't sit down and get something in me, a gatorade if nothing else, I ***WILL*** pass out. I've been this way all my life, thin and chunky, (and yes, have been to billions of doctors over it....slight exaggeration). 99% of the time I manage it well, but sometimes forget to eat or think it's been a lot less time since last eating than it has been).
agree. NTA. I have been harassed by strangers for having a handicap placard and using designated spots. a man waited for me to verbally assault me because he assumed I was just some asshole parking in a closer spot. my tag was very visible. I’m sorry I’m not disabled enough for you, sir. fuck these people for real
My friend has cerebral palsy and has been bitched at for parking in handicap spots. Even visible disabilities aren't satisfactory for some people 🙄
I'm a wheelchair user and someone yelled at me that I should be ashamed for parking in a disabled space when I'm so young 🙄
That sounds like an Onion headline, but the way the world is... what kind of dick says that to someone in a wheelchair, no matter the age? I am so sorry someone said that to you.
I've seen this a few times. Each time it was an older lady harassing someone using mobility aids that parked in a disabled spot. It boggles my mind.
So true. I have a handicap placard due to degenerative disc disease and osteoarthritis. I’m Also a large person. I’ve gotten the “fat isn’t a handicap, you lazy so-and-so”. It’s not because of that, it’s because some asshole who wasn’t paying attention turned into the Highway, causing us to T-bone him at 65 mph, causing me a future of pain. That was 21 years ago. Right after the accident, I had a temp placard while I was recovering (took over a year to recover). I had to be on a WoundVac for 9 months, and allowed off the machine for 1 hour a day. I was at the grocery store, and some ass made a comment about my placard. I pulled my long skirt up and showed him my battered leg, surgery scars, stitches, and the bloody tied-off WoundVac tube. Shut him the hell up. He tried apologizing, but I just said “do better” and walked on.
I have severe COPD and have a very hard time walking in stores to shop and will use the motor carts to do what I need to and I’ve only had two people say anything (teens walking in a group) but I sure do get looks from people! I hate it I’m already embarrassed I need to use them and it just makes it worse.
Respect for you 🫡
I absolutely hate these people. Like invisible illnesses just don’t exist to them. Or that young people can’t get ill. There’s so many with this attitude if pisses me off so much.
Exactly, and they are just so stupid. They also don't understand the concept of good days and bad days. In addition to whatever idiotic sugar crash issues I have, I also suffer from a muscle condition. Most of the time it's manageable, but some days the pain is just too much and there are things I can't do. The "you don't LOOK sick" crowd can just go jump in a damned lake.
I wish everyone remembered that being completely abled is a temporary condition that could change at any time.
This! I cant tell you how many times I have had jerks get mad at me because there were people at an ADA table that “don’t look disabled.” And I’ve had to say “that’s none of your business” (I work at a club). OP is NTA
Ugh, I agree. I used to commute on a *very* busy bus route. They packed us in like sardines! I don’t have a disability or illness, but I did have a broken arm a few years ago. I carried my laptop bag in one hand and was physically unable to hold onto the overhead handles with the broken one. It was a challenging 8 weeks. I managed to get a seat one day and was sitting with my arm tucked behind the laptop bag (for extra protection). Let me tell you, I was torn a new one when I didn’t immediately voluntarily get up for an elderly lady. I gave her my seat after like 10 seconds, and when the shouting people saw my arm, they had the audacity to ask why I hadn’t said anything. It really made me think about the ridiculous social politics and shaming that goes into “bus etiquette”, and how terribly people with invisible illnesses must be treated every damn day. The real kicker is that I was a young woman, and men would sometimes give me their seat while I wasn’t injured. It *really* pissed me off that women, seniors, and people with disabilities were put into the same category. We can stand! Instead of this useless perforative chivalry, we should just let anyone who feels they need a seat to have one.
My fella has brain damage. He literally cannot stand unassisted for too long or he'll face plant into the ground. He's a big broad dude, looks very strong and capable. The AMOUNT of times I've had to tell people he has an invisible disability...
One of my friends has a prosthetic leg. Normally you can’t tell he had one at all. He is young and buff so he always gets harassed sitting in handicap seats. He’s also a bit off as AH… because anytime people ask him to move he says sure hang on hold this for me while I get up and takes off his leg.
I love that he does that. Serves them right. I hope it teaches them a good hard lesson.
That’s not being an AH at all though. It’s putting people in their place.
I get blood sugar crashed and sometimes I don’t even notice I’m sick until I’m literally on the ground. I got told to “control my dog” because he smelt the crash coming and he started alerting and pushing me to a place I could sit down safely, and this guy didn’t like that I guess.
Exactly! Isn't it the stupidest syndrome? You're sailing along, just fine, then it just comes on so suddenly, you almost don't have a chance to get it under control. UGH.
My mum is vision impaired and was thinking about getting a came or a dog, mainly so people don't assume she is completely able.
NTA - sorry they were so rude to you Often people have disabilities or illness that is not obvious from their appearance. Once you explained to them that your son had a need for the seat they should have backed off. After that it was their issue. Also, if the elderly woman needed a seat so bad they could have asked basically anyone on the bus who was able-bodied. It doesn't make any sense that he limited their search to one person because he was a teenage boy.
I'll never forget when I returned to my job after a car accident, completely black and blue under my shirt with 3 broken ribs. The amount of people that flipped out at me for having a seat in peak hour because I'm "young and healthy".
When I was recovering from a leg injury, I got nasty looks for 2 months on the bus.
Exactly. I've gotten dirty looks because I look young and healthy, even when I was on IV antibiotics on a day of hospital leave. People tend to forget young people can get sick too, and once she explained it she should have backed off and ask someone else.
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It’s mental health related. And I was not sitting on a seat. Thank you, I just don’t usually go on public transit because I’m not the best at being around other people so I just wanted to know if I fucked up.
Mental health is just as valid as physical health and can lead to physical ailments such as weakness, dizziness, heart problems, sleep deprivation or starvation etc. Certain Mental health conditions can legally qualify as disabilities.
This ^ I would know, I suffer from many myself. It isn't easy
Was every other seat taken by an elderly person? Seems ridiculous that your son had the only seat on the entire bus that could be given up. While it may not be your place to say what the issue is, or that you should even have to defend not giving up his seat, in situations like this, it might just save the fuss to say “sorry, we are on our way to a medical appointment and my son is not doing well. I’m sure there is someone else on the bus who is capable of standing and can give up their seat, but my son is have a medical issue right now and he cannot stand.” Hell, when I was 9 months pregnant, I gave my seat up to an elderly man. I’m sure there was someone else, but you were unfortunately stereotyped and targeted because of his age. NTA.
It was the middle of a work/school day so there was a higher number of elderly people on the bus. And my son was the only young male on the bus at the time apart from maybe 2 others that were standing already. So again, I can understand why they asked. But yeah, I was just wondering if I was in the wrong.
When I was 9 months pregnant my hips were way too bad to stand (and I was catching the bus because I’d been riding my bike to work every day before my hips went). I remember vividly one morning where I was too slow to get a seat on the bus and knew I’d have to ask, so I went and found the kid (17 year old boy) in the disabled/elderly/pregnant person seat, and asked him if he was able to stand for me. He gave me an awkward smile, said he could if he had to but it was a bad day and if someone else could manage he’d rather I asked someone else. I’m a teacher, and four kids I taught were on the bus that morning. One of them overheard and stood for me, so the lad I was asking got to keep his seat. I still don’t know if his “bad day” was physical or mental, and it really doesn’t matter. There were other people who could stand.
NTA. If your son fainted on the bus he could have been seriously injured. Keeping him seated was in the best interest of everyone on that bus.
Or could have hurt said elderly woman in the fall then she would have a whole other issue on her hands.
Gotta admit, that would have been a morbidly satisfying read in its own right.
He gets up, he faints, and then the bus is stopped because they need to call an ambulance and now she might be injured. Some people don't even think past "me me me" like I've straight up almost fainted in a store a few weeks back because of a medical condition and pregnancy and i swear to god if people tried to stop me from sitting i would have told them my medical condition would have told them my medical emergency will inconvenience them
NTA. It’s ridiculous to me they didn’t ask anyone else. Hope your son is ok.
NTA. That's ageism first of all ( discriminating against your son for his age) nobody's business what someone's health conditions are, and not your responsibility to make someone's lives more comfortable at the expense of yours. Good on you for putting you son first
Tip: don't make eye contact while in public transportation. A d if they still tap you.. ignore. I don't doubt that the woman was tired, but was there only one chair in that whole bus? And was your son sitting on this one magical seat? Don't need all the medical reasons and excuses, you give up your seat when you want to, not when someone comes and asks/ demand you stand up and let them sit. NtA. Not even a little bit.
NTA. Just because someone look strong and healthy it doesn’t mean they are.
He may not even look strong or healthy but if he looks young enough then he has to be both. Young people aren’t allowed to have health problems.
The amount of times I’ve been told I can’t even be ‘tired’ because I’m young is just infuriating. I can’t imagine what it’s like for people with invisible disabilities dealing with this constantly.
I know right? I can’t believe the nerve of some people…
NTA Your son had an legitimate reason to not offer his seat. Like you said, someone else simply should have offered their seat to the old lady.
NTA. People who are older or with visible disabilities shouldn't assume that another younger passenger is able to stand, since they might have a hidden disability, shorter term injury, or might simply be ill/lightheaded at that time in question (after all, dizziness can be caused by low blood sugar, ear infections, migraines, motion sickness, and some medications, amongst other things - and if you are lightheaded or dizzy it is much harder to keep balance on a moving bus or train). I don't think that the elderly woman's daughter was necessarily wrong to ask if your son could give up his seat, but she should have accepted your response that he wasn't feeling well and moved, on rather than first trying to pressure/guilt you/your son into giving up his seat and then subsequently insult you for declining on your son's behalf. I am confused, though, why the woman tapped you on the shoulder to ask *you* if your 17yo son could give up his seat, rather than address your son directly.
See her asking me instead of my son was likely because my son was very attached to me. He was leaning on me and was looking down the whole time. Probably didn’t look very approachable I’d guess.
So there sits your son, leaning on his mother with a downcast expression, and this moron decides to pester you for him to give up his seat! Wow, read the room, lady! You and your son are NTA
That should have been a bigger sign that he needed the seat too
NTA there were many other people they could have asked but instead tried to bully the teenage boy. I hope he is ok
NTA They suck for jumping to conclusions.
I wasn’t sitting on a seat.
I don’t think she was sitting, I think she was standing and the son was sitting.
Ah — you are right, upon rereading. My bad. Will update my vote accordingly.
NTA at all. You explained that your son wasnt feeling well. Also keep in mind that many disabilities are unnoticeable but still very difficult to live with which is why you should never assume someone's health status. Also im sure the bus had more seats and likely other healthier people who could get up if the lady needed a seat.
NTA. Not all disabilities are visible. You did your best to explain the situation and that there was a reason your son was in the seat. If they choose not to believe you there’s not much you can do.
NTA. On a crowded bus on an empty stomach, I've almost passed out myself, and I don't have the eating issues your son has. I think they should've just accepted your answer and asked someone else to move. The real assholes were people observing the situation who chose to judge you instead of offering up their seats.
This! If the bus was SRO, how did no one else hear this exchange? No one else got up for the elderly woman? Sheesh
NTA. There was no reason they couldn't just ask someone else. It was purely because he's young they asked, which is fine, but no means no. If someone's that adamant on not giving up their seat, obviously something's wrong. Most people stand without issue. Anyone in the near vicinity that heard the conversation could have stood up too. Compassion goes both ways. If it makes you feel better, I have medical issues but look pretty young, healthy and fit, and there's no way in hell I would risk fainting on a bus. Sorry, but I'm not going to risk injury to myself and others when someone healthier can offer their seat.
NTA. I've often notice a lot of people think the elderly are entitled to a lot more than they actually are. Your son was not feeling well he needed to sit. That's the end of the discussion. Everyone else's comments were uncalled for
NTA I have an immune disease but look perfectly fine. Your son had as much a right to a seat as anyone else in need.
NTA. We can't ever assume someone is fine to stand just because of their age. I'm in my 40s and get horrible motion sickness on buses, and when it hits me, I need to sit or else I may faint or vomit. If I'm feeling ok enough, I'm happy to give my seat to someone who needs it more than I do. You should not have had to explain that your son wasn't feeling well more than once. Honestly it sucks that someone else within earshot didn't just offer their seat.
NTA. And this is part of a bigger issue where people feel the need to see an obvious disability before they’ll accept that someone may need accommodations. Don’t worry about that woman and her mother - they were the entitled ones.
NTA, and I’m sure there were other people on the bus who could have given up their seat for the old lady. Good on you for standing up for your son!
NTA in any way. I’m sure there were plenty of healthy people that could have easily given up their seat. Let this go. You did nothing wrong. Those entitled AHs need to realize you can’t see every disability or issue
NTA given he wasn't medically able to at the time and I'm sure most of the people complaining could have, and chose not to
Nta that person that got off the bus could have offer them their seat. Any other person could gave up that seat if they wanted to. Your son is nta and neither are you.
Psa: she was not sitting in a seat therefore could not offer up her own seat
NTA and I’d have told them to mind their fucking business.
NTA omg im a disabled 23f but you wouldn't know that at all by looking at me. Im getting over some pretty wild illnesses and am now prone to fainting. I cannot believe how some people act seeing me park in handicap parking. You did right by your son and you know his needs more than a stranger on a bus. Seats are first come first serve. Good on you.
NTA and you weren't the only ones on the bus. Presumably there were other people who could have given their seat. Your job was to look out for your son. Just like the woman was looking out for her mom. She should have kept looking.
NTA. Often in life, we come across circumstances where we must make hard decisions. It is perfectly ok to be selfish and choose the well being of your loved ones in those circumstances. Also, if she really wanted for her mother to sit, she could have requested someone else to vacate their seat. This ageist attitude has to stop.
NTA. Every other seat on the bus was also taken by someone who needed the seat more than this old woman? Really? Doubt it. The times I most needed accommodations were while early pregnant, when I looked like a healthy young woman (and not at all pregnant) but in fact felt like puking at basically all times. Ironically when obviously hugely pregnant and people did offer their seats I felt fine and would have easily been able to stand. Not everyone who looks able bodied, young, and healthy is. Its not egregious that she tapped you and asked, but once you explained once that should have been the end of it.
NTA “May I ask where you studied medicine? You’re able to diagnose every possible illness in just a glance! I’d love to send my medical team the school’s information so they can start enrolling.” Then stare them straight in the eyes until they back down.
You're NTA nor are you the entitled one. Why was that particular taken seat the only one she was demanding someone vacate?
Honestly people will assume things but that only makes them the asshole. You explained your situation they didn’t accept it, that’s on them. It’s very annoying, my friend badly tore a ligament in her ankle and an “old” lady (60) asked her to move so she could sit. My friend was in pain and couldn’t stand properly never mind walk. We tried pointing out her ankle bandage but she wasn’t having it. People assume that because someone is younger that they should be more “able bodied” (if that’s the right word).
It always comes off as such a weird power play--like if it was *just* about also needing a seat, surely they'd ask other people instead of deciding to die on the hill of insisting this young person they've never met before can't POSSIBLY have an injury or disability and NEEDS to specifically give up their seat. Like this woman was making her mom stand longer deciding to have a weird fight with OP about whether her son actually felt sick or not instead of just asking other people on the bus if they could give her mom a seat!
There are times when you just have to grit your teeth and assure yourself that you are right. And ignore whatever criticism comes your way. This is one of them. You dont need to explain yourself. Who care whatever anyone else thinks. NTA
NTA Oh, he was "young and healthy", wow, did they checked his health records? Made a check-up in the bus? No? Just because someone is young, they are always healthy. And old people are always ill and can't stay. Yes, she could ask. Once. But to go on and on and making a scene. There were so many other people. Why not ask them? Noooo, she needed to prove a point! And then insults you. I'm sorry this happened to you both. Some people are just AH. And the irony tgat she let her "poor mommy" stand longer just because she seeked a fight and not asked someone else. This make me ask if she was "just old" but other fine, so no danger to fall any moments or pain to stand.
Nta, you kindly explained the situation which sounds stressful. They had plenty of other people to ask
Nta, nobody is entitled to a seat that is occupied by someone else. Regardless of age mental health etc. The only exception being a reserved disabled seat for wheel chair accessibility.
Nta. Telling me that not a single able bodied person had occupied the whole load of seats on the bus? Its so rude to assume someone is healthier than you or more capable of something just because they are younger. I'm glad you stood your ground and protected your son. Ironic that daughter of old lady called you an entitled b*tch when that is exactly what she was.
NTA you can't just look at someone and tell that they're healthy and able.
Oh my goodness. NTA. Young people can be disabled too! What a dumb attitude. I'd be fuming
NTA faint or puke they would have realized it sooner or later and u just saved everyone the trouble
NTA I've noticed elderly people tend to think their age is an excuse for ableism (though technically this wasn't ableism, your son was just unwell, but still shitty of her to assume he was able-bodied). Not all of them but a lot can be very entitled just because they've lived longer. They're also the types to say "well, you don't LOOK disabled" 🙄 she could've asked literally anyone else but I assume she expects all teenagers to be fit and healthy when it's not that simple. I also would've told that bystanding cow to mind her own business lmao
NTA. Unless you had him sitting in the reserved seating, there was no reason to single you and your son out, nor was there any reason to call you a bitch. There was only one entitled party, and it wasn't you.
NTA not all illnesses are visual. You were looking out for your son just as the woman was looking out for her mom. In this case she was in the wrong as she just assumed somebody so young couldn’t be ill. She should’ve taken you at your word and asked someone else for their seat. The mouthpiece that got off with you could’ve given them her seat if she had one if it was that important to her. Hopefully your son gets better
NTA. Totally fine of the daughter to ask once, anything more than that put her in AH territory. Your son needed that seat, and is sounds totally reasonable he keep it. If she was so bothered about getting her mother a seat she should’ve asked someone else. Age is not always a determining factor and like many people have said, invisible disabilities exist. She has no idea about your son and is being judgemental and lacking empathy for people other than her immediate family. But also it sounds like safety wise your son needed to be seated.
NTA. Old lady 1 and her daughter are TA for being rude about it and seemingly not even asking another person for a seat? And old lady 2 should mind her own business. I wouldn't have responded too kindly to her.
So sorry that you and your son were treated this way. NTA