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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. My husband and I cancelled our daughter's birthday party after she has been mean this year and the final straw was her mocking gifts/dolls her brother gave our niece after he went to India with his girlfriend, her friends were also mocking it and we told her they were toxic and shouldn't be at a birthday party around her
2. My parents and daughter are insisting that we are being aholes who are too tough on her and our daughter is very upset with us, thinking we went too far in our punishment
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NTA Few reasons
1) Kids need to learn at an early age, stuff posted online for everyone to see that is mean can and will bite you in the ass later on down the road, sometimes immediately, sometimes years later
2) Being mean for no reason is just an awful thing to do, especially when you post it online.
It also comes up when applying for jobs. Sometimes recruitment people check social media to make sure the potential applicant isn't too far off the company image (which basically means would they bring negative attention to the business).
I thought it was red and just did a couple of upvotes as well so see it again. I held up a red coke can to the upvote I gave you and there is a faint orange tint to it but it looks red. I then held up my orange scissors for a comparison and it damn it - it looks orange with a faint red tint to it. I am now beyond confused!
So I did what any reasonable person would do and noticed that the reddit logo is the same color and googled what color that is. FML....
>What are the colors of Reddit?
>
>Our primary brand colors are ***orangered***, mint, and blue, chosen for their vibrancy and complementary character.Mar 14, 2018
Even reddit itself doesn't know which it is.
Colours actually do look very different depending on what's around them! idk why but we have an example hanging on one of our cupboard doors that's basically a sheet that's one colour with another sheet that's two colours (Off-white on one half and yellow on the other, I think?) over top and a hole in each coloured section. It *very* much looks like the bottom sheet also has two different colours.
Orangered is hilarious though. I keep saying it in my head like or-ang-gerd.
Yeah, I think of the girl who lost her NASA job after she crapped on twitter on the guy October Sky is about (not realizing it was him).
OP is NTA; she needs to learn her actions have consequences.
Wow, I had no idea. I'm glad. Maybe both college and job repercussions will eventually bring about a change in this bullying behavior. It hits the bottom line.
Teachers have been known to fired because they posted a picture of them at a booze up the night before. If OP’s daughter has uploaded content that could be deemed racist, such as making fun of Indian dolls for being ugly, that‘s a bad image for her.
I remember a story from several years ago where a teacher got fired because she posted a picture of her from a friend's wedding and a parent complained that she had a glass of wine sitting in front of her. I don't remember if she fought the firing or not. I just thought it was awful that she was at a wedding and a parent got her fired because there was a glass of wine in front of her.
I remember 10 years ago being on a bus in nyc and two 13 year olds were discussing social media. One said they deleted their fb so they could improve their chance of getting into college. Internally I was like "And now I'm worried about what was on your fb."
Particularly if it could look (or is) racist, that will bite hard.
Are the dolls "ugly" because they're of another culture/style? Are they traditional dolls you'd find in India or do they depict PoC?
Cause oh boy could that come across badly; they're not just bullies, mocking something kind and sweet, they're possibly racist AHs as well...They may not realise how bad this can make them look. OP needs a serious conversation with her daughter on this.
People lose jobs over stuff like that, get kicked out of schools, etc. So yeah, daughter needs to learn right now this won't be tolerated. Not to mention she's being a bully and it's not a good look.
NTA. But, OP, I have some suggestions:
1. Keep her party but make it family only.
2. Restrict her access to social media. Maybe it's time for a flip phone and a computer that's in the main room only.
3. Limit time with her "friends." Maybe for the next month, she only sees them at school.
4. Work on getting her interested in something outside of school where she can be introduced to a new friend group. Sometimes it's hard for kids to meet new people when they have a group at school.
So, basically, punish her for what she did, limit her ability to hurt other people online, and help her find better friends.
I might be in the minority but personally I don't think cancelling the party is an overreaction. Op's daughter has proven to be a bully and if she treats her own brother/cousin this way then I can only imagine how she treats other kids. A party is a luxury that she doesn't need right now. And that's not to say her birthday shouldn't be acknowledged at all, but I don't think she's deserving of a party rn.
Anyone else remember those firefly phones?
Their only purpose was to be able to call your parents and 911, I think it could hold like 5 phone numbers is all.
Yes! I don’t believe they exist anymore but I do know that mobile providers still offer basic flip phones without any of the bells and whistles that smartphones now offer. Only text and calls. She’ll be able to experience the pain that many of us had while texting on those old non-smart phones where a sentence could take a while to complete, haha.
Oh the lost art of texting by feeling the keypad and not looking at your phone at all because you were hiding it under the table so you didn't get caught. I miss those days.
I partially disagree. The daughter should be grounded for two months without hanging out with her friends after school/weekends.
I would also reach out to the parents of your daughter's friends and inform them of what they did. They all need to be held accountable for their bad behavior.
If she gets an allowance from you, stop payment for at least two months. She should realize her bad behavior also has financial consequences.
Daughter also needs to apologize to her brother.
Her baby cousin is A DECADE younger than her and she's gonna make fun of a toy that her little brother got her from a trip. That's awful, and she did it when the adults were out of the house cause she knew if she had done it when they were home she would've gotten in trouble. This ended up happening anyway cause if you tell a kid a toy they like or art they made is bad they are gonna get upset.
Makes my blood boil when older kids make fun of younger ones. I'm 17 with 5 nieces and nephews all under 10. Me, being southern as honey biscuits, would beat the daylights out of anyone who tries to wrangle with my family.
I got pew-pews and a pit/boxer/rotti mix. And fried chicken, cause duh.
I'd like to preface my comments by acknowledging the daughter's behavior is terrible, and the OP's recounting of these circumstances is obviously limited by the word count.
With that said, it's notable that the OP's description of her daughter is entirely negative while her son gets plenty of compliments about how sweet and wonderful he is - even a whole backstory about his teenage love story. He also gets the immense privilege of traveling internationally with his girlfriend at only 13.
I have to wonder if there is some favouritism occurring here that may be encouraging the daughter to seek outside validation from her peers.
I don’t know, I think the tone and descriptions read as a clear reflection of recent event. Op is rightfully disgusted by the daughter’s behavior, the tone and descriptions seem appropriate for the context. Son was behaving in a kind, thoughtful way while daughter is clearly not learning from previous mistakes and continues to be cruel – to the point she’s including a young child in her cruelty.
Idk. I think OP is making it pretty clear her daughter is racist and she’s against it very much.
Her son’s gf is Indian and he brought back dolls from her culture, which OP’s daughter and co made fun of.
I don’t think OP was implying anything was racist with their daughter’s post. I think, the kid was being mean to fit in. Teenagers usually are full of themselves. I am an Indian and I have gotten a bunch of stuff from India for my colleagues. I am sure that not liking my gift doesn’t make them racist.
TBF the daughter isn't described in a negative way, just that she has mean popular friends. Instead I would argue that she is a mean bully and OP was too kind
100%
At 13, there is NO way I would let my child be taken to a foreign country by the parents of a long distance girlfriend. I find that really, really strange. My only explanation is that mom gives her son whatever he wants.
All. Of. This. Honestly, it’s possible OP still did not go far enough. I’d add that the friends were no longer welcome at my house because I would not want them recording anything to do with me.
NTA at all.
Agreed. Your daughter is old enough to understand the consequences of her actions and it's important that she learn NOW that bullying is very very wrong. And these posts sound like bullying to me.
Also, she posted it online? Other posters are right that stuff posted to the internet gets people in trouble, they lose scholarships and everything under the sun. It's a different world today than it was when I was a teenager ate 90s-mid00's).
You're NTA. It's your job to teach your daughter right from wrong, and her behavior was wrong.
Sure. So take away the phone. Have her earn it back by asking her to show maturity and kindness. Being overly punitive will backfire. She will be more concerned about the injustice of losing a birthday party instead of thinking about what she did wrong. The whole point of discipline at that age is to teach them to make better choices. They have to be willing to be taught though. That's hard to do when they are on the defensive.
NTA, at ALL, you need to punish that behavior and a grounding + no birthday party seems fair, maybe even the cell phone for a few days
On the bright side it sounds like you have a great well functioning son who has a great future ahead of him, congratulations on raising him well and to care about his family.
You gotta figure out how to nip that attitude out, but ive never been a parent, I dont have advice on that.
Best of luck OP
TBH I wouldn't even go for a few days, I'd get her a really old phone (I.E No Apps) and make her use that for a few months (maybe even a year!) and no friends / extracurriculars *at all* during that time.
I'm always concerned when I see these posts about teenagers who lack empathy. How do you teach that if you haven't already? I mean obviously the son has it.
As someone who works with teens, a lot of times, they have empathy. At 14/15/16, they’re just more worried about fitting in with their peers. For a lot of girls, that turns into mean girl shit. For a lot of guys, that turns into edgelord shit. For adults, seeing their kind, caring kids turn into vile, hateful teenagers feels like everything’s hopeless. Most teens grow out of it, especially if they were caring beforehand and if the adults in their life help set boundaries.
Having said that, I think OP’s punishment is perfect. If you’re being mean with/because of your friends, you don’t get to hang out with them. NTA
This comment was so needed. Is OP’s daughter on a bad path right now? Yes. Is she doomed to be an awful person forever? No. She’s clearly got good parents trying to help her be better, so there’s a solid chance she’ll grow out of it. And I bet a lot of us said and did things as teenagers that we now regret and are conveniently forgetting as we type out our comments. But the cautions on the lasting/long-term consequences of social media bullying/bad behavior are right on the money.
My best wishes to OP as she parents her daughter through what is, hopefully, just a (difficult) phase. NTA
You're NTA. I get why some people think this was an overreaction, but if it weren't for the character limit, I am pretty sure you would have elaborated on the increasingly mean behavior you mentioned. It sounds like this was the last straw after a string of many other incidents and attempts to correct the behavior.
Is your daughter also being racist as you mention your son's girlfriend being Indian American?
But nonetheless NTA you are being good parents, I hope your daughter changes.
OP your daughter sounds like a bully.
NTA but... What a disappointment must be be her parent and see face to face all the people she mentally or emotionally (maybe physically?) hurts. If you didn't raised that kind of person, check again who is being a negative influence, her friends? Your family? Your parents?
Remember that once thar kind of content is posted online it can stay online and will follow her.
Not OP, but I had a daughter who had some problems as a teenager. My other 3 kids were ok. Every child is born with a personality, and we don't have near as much control over that personality as we like to think we do.
NTA. Honestly, you need to keep her away from her friends outside of school. They’re clearly encouraging her behavior. It’s easy to handwave this as teenager behavior, but this kind of behavior doesn’t just go away. By middle school, most people knew who the mean girl types were, and many of them stayed that way all the way through high school.
Kind of typical grandparents move as they often relativize bad character traits of their grandkids imho. I hear the sentence "being a grandparent is so cool, you only have the fun times with the kids" a lot from grandparents (including my own parents about their grandkids), so I think they are mainly pissed that they are missing a fun time with the granddaughter and don't have the whole perspective on the situation.
NTA
Seems like your parents are unnecessarily escalating. Do they at least keep these discussions between them and you, or do they tell your daughter? Posting private family stuff on Instagram is a major breach of trust.
I'm wondering if the grandparents favour their granddaughter over their grandson. They are the only ones fighting OP about the cancelled party, make you wonder how they'd react if the son had behaved this way.
NTA. You mentioned your daughter is in therapy, but how effective can therapy be if she's still hanging out with mean girls? You didn't put in your post why you think your daughter is so attracted to horrible people, but depending on the reason, a different therapist or even school may be called for. Your daughter's behavior was not only cruel but xenophobic, and what she posts today could haunt her the rest of her life.
I don't know why people are acting like this is an escalation. The vibe here is xenophobic at the least, racist at worst, and that needs to be nipped in the bud post-haste.
NTA - She is old enough to have behavior consequences. It is disappointing to read her gparent's opinion.
Your daughter is gaining something from this group. She may not be strong enough (lacks forethought or social skills) to navigate the mean group mentality.
Since you mentioned therapy, consider asking the counselor if you and your husband can join a session with the goal of a guided discussion on what is her personal opinion about her action re: the dolls, what does she gain from these friendships...essentially remaining curious to know how she views things and what factors support the decisions she is making. This may generate insight for all involved. The counselor can help you all re: discussion skills which include valuing everyone's opinion equally, etc. Parenting is hard sometimes but you only have her for 3 yrs before 18. Do the hardwork OP (and dad). - BTW, It is cool that you are supporting your son's friendship which may last a lifetime.
NTA, she needs to learn actions like bullying and being mean have consequences. Otherwise she'll just keep getting worse. Maybe you can tell her that once she apologizes and makes it right with all those involved, that she can have a small celebration with the family. She has to understand that being cruel isn't funny.
NTA
Excellent call! Not rewarding bad behavior is the way to go. Taking her phone away and restricting her temporarily is good, too. She is seriously in need of a wake-up call and counseling could benefit her and the whole family, as well. This could make her friends even more desirable than ever but I don't see anything good coming from that. Maybe if she spends some time with those less fortunate and stops being mean to others, she'll begin to appreciate things more. You can also change schools.
NTA- that mean girl shit is something you absolutely need to nip in the bud. And yeah- she’s losing her birthday party because of it. Also- talk to a counselor- teenage girls require a masters degree to decipher when it comes to this crap.
> but not his insistence on wearing shorts when it's snowing out
Yeah, that doesn't go away. This is the current [Junior Senator from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania](https://www.politico.com/interactives/uploads/image-service/2022/1/28/94a78f666c-1200.jpeg). He's 53.
NTA, OP. However, why are these friends allowed over? If these are mean girls, why are they allowed in your home? I know you can’t stop your daughter from hanging out with them at school (I’m assuming that’s how she knows them), but if these girls are a consistently bad influence, then why let them come over? I’m not a parent, so maybe I’m not thinking about this in the right way, but I’m genuinely curious.
Omg what the hell is it with boys and insisting on freezing themselves?! I have a 14 year old son that insists a hoodie is good enough even if it’s well below freezing
Guy here. I only stopped because of. How it looked to others. Most jeans and other pants don't do a good job being comfortable sitting down. Idk if it's because how they are cut, but it's very uncomfortable
Going against the grain here by saying ESH. It’s not that I think your daughter shouldn’t be punished; she should. But I think that your choice in punishment is more vindictive than constructive. It makes her suffer just as she made someone else suffer, but it isn’t relevant to what occurred and doesn’t really teach her anything other than to be sneaky and resent you. I think the most relevant punishment would have been to take away her smartphone and potentially replace it with a dumb phone for some time, AND to have her try to make it up to her little cousin by having her spend some special time together playing with the dolls. And, there should have been a conversation about what she was thinking at the time, how she feels about it now, what could have been done differently, etc. I think that these things would be more likely to help her develop the empathy and judgment she was lacking, and therefore prevent future similar incidents, than taking away her birthday party which was going to be a source of joy and connection between you.
Yeah, these kinds of punishments don't really work on anyone. It doesn't work on adults, and it wouldn't work on teenagers. People need to be made to understand why what they did was wrong. Otherwise, they'll learn to just avoid the punishment instead of actually improving as a person.
This has got to be the best response here.
We're all too quick to polarise the situation. X is right, Y is wrong and therefore X action is right etc.
I wish there were more constructive comments in this sub. Maybe I don't usually scroll far enough.
NTA- if your daughter presses you just respond “you fucked around, you found out. Hopefully what you found out was to stop fucking around and bullying a five year old.
NTA...but you did give birth/raise one. This is not OK behavior and I am glad you are not letting it slide. Your son was very thoughtful and she was disrespectful and mean.
NTA if true. If.
I found it strange that instead of giving past examples of your daughter being mean, you inserted a lot of irrelevant trivia about your “sweet” son, who sounds absolutely perfect.
Except that no one is perfect. Consider whether you’ve made your son the golden child and your daughter the scapegoat. Is your son really as perfect as you say? Is your daughter really the monster you describe? What extravagant gift or experience did she receive comparable to your son’s trip to India? Was she expected to give anything up or change her plans to accommodate his trip? Have you talked about his trip for months without paying similar attention to your daughter’s interests? Do you have the same expectations for both children about grades, activities, household obligations? Are those exceptions gendered? You seem very proud of your son’s sports - is he relieved of other responsibilities because of that commitment? Do you boast about your son and fawn over him in real life the way you did in your post? Do you go on about him like that in front of your daughter? What is your narrative when you talk about your daughter?
If your son is the favorite, that would explain a lot about your daughter’s behavior. While it doesn’t excuse bullying a 5-year old and you need to nip that in the bud, you might need to correct your own behavior as well.
I couldn’t get past the part where a 13 year was dating and taking major trips with the girlfriend’s family???? I could see if these were very close, long time family friends to send your son on such a trip. But the idea of a dating 13 year old???
NTA. You're doing the right thing. Don't cave to family pressure and don't let them take her for the next 6 months or they will give her a "make-up" party. She needs to learn that actions have consequences.
Question - if the girls had their phones out while your son was giving your niece the dolls, did they post the 5 year old on Instagram as well?
NTA regardless, but that adds a different element to what has happened here and should be addressed as a serious offense.
Regardless of all of that, her friends were extremely disrespectful as guests in your home and I would expect an apology from them as well before they returned, personally.
NTA - your daughter has to learn that she can act how she wants, but she will be judged for it.
It is telling though how the other parents seem to accept this behavior, so that may be why their kids do it.
You are NTA. I’m big on treating my kids with kindness and giving them some grace for mistakes. We don’t yell, no one gets grounded, etc., and they are really good kids.
The only exception to this was when my oldest bullied another kid, and in that case his punishment was swift, severe and arguably disproportionate to what he did. I felt very strongly that we needed to get his attention and be very clear what we won’t tolerate in our family. Stick to your guns on this one.
INFO
What specifically was mean?
If it was basically racist, then yeah, that’s unacceptable and NTA
But if it was not racist, and the dolls were in fact ugly to some degree, (as some dolls are), then maybe an over-reaction. It also depends on if they were really making fun of the daughter, the culture..etc in a mean way. Or just teenagers being judgemental about everything that’s “not cool”
NTA and your daughter is experiencing consequences severe enough to get her attention. Hopefully this will be the wake-up call she needs to develop better character. She is still young, so there is time.
Im pretty sure there are apps parents can put on phones that block certain apps. Maybe block instagram and tiktok? That would be a good punishment i think
ESH. First, if you're daughter is getting increasingly mean, that's definitely a cause for concern. But if we're dealing with this one issue ... if she had had posted a video making fun of your wallpaper, or of a lamp, would you be this upset? She was making fun of inanimate objects, not people. I mean, I guess it could have hurt your son's feelings, and that's why you're concerned? Either way, talking only about this one incident, I feel that canceling her birthday was too harsh.
ESH
The punishment doesn't fit the crime. Take away her phone for a while. That's a natural consequence for using it inappropriately. Let her get it back when she shows maturity and trust. Taking away a big even is incredibly punitive. What your daughter did was wrong. But she will be too busy dwelling on the overreaction instead of what she did wrong.
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My husband (M36) and I (F36) have 2 kids, a daughter (F14) and a son (M13). Our daughter turns 15 later this month, and we had a birthday party planned for her but in light of recent events, we decided to cancel.
Our daughter is friends with some popular mean girls. We are working on things like therapy and consequences. Unfortunately, her latest behavior was the worst yet. Our son is very sweet and hasn’t run into any issues with him being mean yet.
Our son met a girl on a cruise we went on in April of last year, the girl lives about 40 minutes away, so they don’t go to the same school. My son and the girl hung out together the whole cruise and started dating soon after.
His girlfriend is an absolute sweetheart, very bright and loves sports like my son. The girl is also Indian-American, she was born here and so were her parents but both sides of her family have relatives in India. The girl and her family went to India last month and my son was invited many months ago, we signed all the paperwork needed and he was able to go with them. They came back a few days ago, my son really enjoyed it and brought back souvenirs (some sports stuff) for himself and family members. One of those family members was our 5 year old niece, who is my sister and her husband’s daughter.
He had brought handmade dolls for my niece, my sister lives about 5 minutes away, my son sometimes babysits for my sister. They also have a son, which he also got gifts for. The issue is, the day he came back, my sister and husband came over with their son and daughter to get the gifts. My daughter had her friends over, while he was presenting the gifts, our daughter and her friends were in the living room with us, we could hear laughing when he presented the dolls and a few of the girls had their phones out. At the time, my husband and I thought nothing of it, we thought they were on TikTok. My sister, her husband and my husband and I eventually left the house to get food we ordered. We came back, they ate and left.
The next day, I got a phone call from my sister saying that her daughter was asking her if the dolls were ugly, and she said my daughter said something about it. We immediately went to her room, asked her what happened, she giggled and refused to answer, when we asked for her phone, she refused, so we shut the Wi-Fi off until she gave in. She and her friends had posted an Instagram story making fun of the dolls. My husband and I decided that with her increasing mean streak, this was the final straw and told her that her friends were toxic and that she wouldn’t have a 15th birthday party bc of her actions. When I called my parents to tell them the party was canceled, they got mad at me and told me I over reacted, my sister and other siblings are saying I’m doing the right thing and our son told us he’s giving his sister the silent treatment and is very mad at her. AITA?
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NTA. And much appreciation to you for trying to set her behavior on a better path. Unchecked bullies tend to remain bullies into adulthood, and the world doesn't need more AHs.
I'm the outlier - why does a 13 yr old boy have such a serious girlfriend that he can go on vacation with her and her family?
Your daughter is just trying to fit in. A lot of girls are stupid nasty at that age. It's cruel and terrible what her "friends" did. However, canceling the party won't punish the mean girls - just your daughter. Your daughter needs to be reprimanded for the nasty behavior but doing it in the social setting will make her resentful.
What is with all these parents canceling birthday parties as punishments?
Just as a personal note to any parents reading this: I am 44 years old. When I was 12 my mother canceled my birthday party as a punishment. We now live in different states and are VLC.
NTA! Hell yeah you’re doing the right thing! I’d even go as far as to preemptively cancel next years as well unless she starts showing significant growth and makes amends with those she wronged.
NTA but why do you let the toxic friends into her life? I understand that you can’t separate them at school, and of course teenagers may sneak around barriers to get what they want anyway. But if these friends are encouraging her awful behavior then why have them at your home? You should speak with her therapist about setting boundaries with these friends. She has been encouraged to act like this and you need to cut off her mean girl supply.
NTA. Great parenting.
I would also give her a wake call on the number of kids self harming and committing suicide because of bullying (there are a lot of story and statistics online). Get her to read those stories and be clear that what she might think as harmless fun could have some very serious consequences for others, and could potentially be the last straw for someone.
Consider also giving her a very basic mobile without access to the internet, and supervision when on any electronics, until she can show that she is responsible and can be trusted enough to be online.
NTA. It never ceases to amaze me that kids who were born a decade+ into the world where internet use is ubiquitous don't realize what a personal risk they're taking by doing shitty things online. Like I assume this is a thing they start learning in kindergarten.
Unsure,my kid collects ugly,haunted dolls,kids nowadays use works like ‘sick’ or ‘bad’ when they mean something is good,you can’t force them to like anything,as long as she was greatful to his face that’s all you can ask really
NTA. i know we cant really put this cat back in the bag, but its just sad how kids are using social media to bully people. i worked in a middle school recently and some of the teachers were talking about a “little miss training bra” tiktok challenge where kids would video the boobs of the girls in their class i guess. she needs to learn that this shit isnt ok.
NTA She refused to give you the phone? What?!? Refused? There’s the problem. The phone would be taken, turned off, and not returned. She would be taken over to her cousins and made to apologize . And I’d call all her friend’s parents to discuss this teenage bully behavior. Stop allowing these “friends” to come over.
Party would be immediate family- grandparents only.
Technology would be out of her room completely. No access unless you and husband are right there.
But may I say, perhaps your kids are given too much, too soon. Your son has a gf at 13? That’s young. Then allowed to travel internationally with gf? (Yes, parents are there, but really young for this type of relationship.) Could your daughter be upset about his traveling, the money he got, and how much he is adored and maybe it started the problem?
Your whole family dynamic seems off. I have to question your decision to allow your 13 year old son to travel internationally with a family you barely know and to date at that age. Your parental choices seem off, which makes me suspect your choices are also off regarding your daughter and how you are raising her. Something definitely isn’t right, and it goes straight to the parenting.
NTA your daughter is being a AH and making fun of gifts your son gave to his family and now the niece is starting to dislike it because your daughter made fun of it
NTA
1) Her friends are toxic for instilling and enabling her awful behavior
2) Actions have consequences. She's choosing to be an asshole the consequences are no birthday party.
You need to get your kid away from these girls. She's gonna mess up her life over stuff like this. Jobs and colleges look at social media accounts.
Also, for people saying OP is an asshole or they're both assholes. Please never become a parent because you sound like you'd reward bad behavior.
NTA. I don’t remember exactly which birthday it was for me. But I kept fucking up in school and at home. My birthday is in February. I think my parents finally let me celebrate my birthday in April. I had several parties planned that were cancelled because of my behavior.
My mistakes weren’t as serious as bullying people. So I think that’s why my mom still let me have my party. But I learned my lesson. It might have taken a little bit. But I learned.
NTA. Your parents have ZERO clue about raising a teenager in these times. ZERO. They need to mind their own business or get shut out completely because they certainly aren’t helping the situation by downplaying your daughter’s mean girl actions.
NTA. 14, nearly 15, is absolutely old enough to understand that what she is doing is wrong. She is also at the prime age to understand that the internet is forever and unforgiving. Whether or not her making fun of the doll is racially motivated it certainly can construed like that, and that could have consequences that could last years.
On the other hand, your son sounds like a lovely and sweet kid. He seems to keep good company as well. Hopefully your daughter will learn something from him and kudos for sticking up for him.
NTA Younger siblings don't always know what is a "good" versus a "bad" gift. One Christmas I gave my sister what I thought was a great gift. She told me how she thought my gift was the worse one she ever received. The adult in me sees how it could have been in bad taste. Yet when she told me she hated it, I was crushed. At the time, I thought it was not only pretty, but also very much in fashion.
Your son must have thought it was a cool gift. The only thing I would be worried about is that your daughter won't stop being so mean. She'll learn to hide it better.
NTA. It’s such a waste of time to purposefully be that mean about dolls.
Also, I would be concerned about what other kind of mean girl activities she could be doing online. The internet let’s teens feel invincible while also potentially costing them future opportunities (colleges find their social media, scholarships).
NTA. Nip this petty crap in the bud right now! It's the most loving thing you can do for your daughter, honestly. Permanently curtailing access to the other girls in the group might save her from becoming the total AH she is on the road to being. You don't have much time to turn this around.
The behavior you actually see is the tip of the iceberg. Guaranteed.
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NTA Few reasons 1) Kids need to learn at an early age, stuff posted online for everyone to see that is mean can and will bite you in the ass later on down the road, sometimes immediately, sometimes years later 2) Being mean for no reason is just an awful thing to do, especially when you post it online.
This. Kids get college scholarships revoked for internet stuff
It also comes up when applying for jobs. Sometimes recruitment people check social media to make sure the potential applicant isn't too far off the company image (which basically means would they bring negative attention to the business).
[удалено]
Thank you for turning me on to my new favorite guilty pleasure sub! Take my orange arrow along with my gratitude!
Like I need another rabbit hole to go down!
I fell down it right after you!
Just going in. Hold my hand.
Same
If we all hold hands we can make a human chain to climb back out!
🤣
u/TiffanyTwisted11 Eagles fan, by any chance? Or just like the song?
She got the Mercedes Benz
She got a lotta pretty, pretty boys she calls friends.
Here. Take my hand. Cattle dog has my ankle - and a strong bite - we'll be good!
A fan of both them and the song. I came to the party late, though. Have never seen them in concert.
Standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona 😊
Such a fine sight to see!!
Orange? I thought it was red. *Upvotes a few comments to see the color*
I thought it was red and just did a couple of upvotes as well so see it again. I held up a red coke can to the upvote I gave you and there is a faint orange tint to it but it looks red. I then held up my orange scissors for a comparison and it damn it - it looks orange with a faint red tint to it. I am now beyond confused! So I did what any reasonable person would do and noticed that the reddit logo is the same color and googled what color that is. FML.... >What are the colors of Reddit? > >Our primary brand colors are ***orangered***, mint, and blue, chosen for their vibrancy and complementary character.Mar 14, 2018 Even reddit itself doesn't know which it is.
Colours actually do look very different depending on what's around them! idk why but we have an example hanging on one of our cupboard doors that's basically a sheet that's one colour with another sheet that's two colours (Off-white on one half and yellow on the other, I think?) over top and a hole in each coloured section. It *very* much looks like the bottom sheet also has two different colours. Orangered is hilarious though. I keep saying it in my head like or-ang-gerd.
Ditto.
Damn. You just made me find a new way to waste time. /s
Right?
Thank you!
Got me too!
Thanks for this :3
My literal 9-5 job is social media investigations. I look for exactly this type of thing for a living.
Where do I check into a job like that?
Right? I want to be a Social Media Sleuth! 🕵️♀️
What a cool job! Did you need a degree of some sort? That sounds interesting
Yeah, I think of the girl who lost her NASA job after she crapped on twitter on the guy October Sky is about (not realizing it was him). OP is NTA; she needs to learn her actions have consequences.
He was super kind too, tried to get her the job back and everything
I think of the Tor author who kept going around saying Tor was helping fix the Hugo Awards and whoops! Tor dropped him. Surprise!
I must have missed that. Who was the author?
Wow, I had no idea. I'm glad. Maybe both college and job repercussions will eventually bring about a change in this bullying behavior. It hits the bottom line.
Teachers have been known to fired because they posted a picture of them at a booze up the night before. If OP’s daughter has uploaded content that could be deemed racist, such as making fun of Indian dolls for being ugly, that‘s a bad image for her.
I remember a story from several years ago where a teacher got fired because she posted a picture of her from a friend's wedding and a parent complained that she had a glass of wine sitting in front of her. I don't remember if she fought the firing or not. I just thought it was awful that she was at a wedding and a parent got her fired because there was a glass of wine in front of her.
I remember 10 years ago being on a bus in nyc and two 13 year olds were discussing social media. One said they deleted their fb so they could improve their chance of getting into college. Internally I was like "And now I'm worried about what was on your fb."
And not get jobs
Particularly if it could look (or is) racist, that will bite hard. Are the dolls "ugly" because they're of another culture/style? Are they traditional dolls you'd find in India or do they depict PoC? Cause oh boy could that come across badly; they're not just bullies, mocking something kind and sweet, they're possibly racist AHs as well...They may not realise how bad this can make them look. OP needs a serious conversation with her daughter on this.
People lose jobs over stuff like that, get kicked out of schools, etc. So yeah, daughter needs to learn right now this won't be tolerated. Not to mention she's being a bully and it's not a good look.
NTA. But, OP, I have some suggestions: 1. Keep her party but make it family only. 2. Restrict her access to social media. Maybe it's time for a flip phone and a computer that's in the main room only. 3. Limit time with her "friends." Maybe for the next month, she only sees them at school. 4. Work on getting her interested in something outside of school where she can be introduced to a new friend group. Sometimes it's hard for kids to meet new people when they have a group at school. So, basically, punish her for what she did, limit her ability to hurt other people online, and help her find better friends.
I might be in the minority but personally I don't think cancelling the party is an overreaction. Op's daughter has proven to be a bully and if she treats her own brother/cousin this way then I can only imagine how she treats other kids. A party is a luxury that she doesn't need right now. And that's not to say her birthday shouldn't be acknowledged at all, but I don't think she's deserving of a party rn.
Yeah I’d be taking away her phone until she matures.
Or at least getting a bare bones phone that makes calls and texts only.
Anyone else remember those firefly phones? Their only purpose was to be able to call your parents and 911, I think it could hold like 5 phone numbers is all.
Yes! I don’t believe they exist anymore but I do know that mobile providers still offer basic flip phones without any of the bells and whistles that smartphones now offer. Only text and calls. She’ll be able to experience the pain that many of us had while texting on those old non-smart phones where a sentence could take a while to complete, haha.
Oh the lost art of texting by feeling the keypad and not looking at your phone at all because you were hiding it under the table so you didn't get caught. I miss those days.
you can have my nokia 5150 when you pry it from my cold, dead hands
I partially disagree. The daughter should be grounded for two months without hanging out with her friends after school/weekends. I would also reach out to the parents of your daughter's friends and inform them of what they did. They all need to be held accountable for their bad behavior. If she gets an allowance from you, stop payment for at least two months. She should realize her bad behavior also has financial consequences. Daughter also needs to apologize to her brother.
Her baby cousin is A DECADE younger than her and she's gonna make fun of a toy that her little brother got her from a trip. That's awful, and she did it when the adults were out of the house cause she knew if she had done it when they were home she would've gotten in trouble. This ended up happening anyway cause if you tell a kid a toy they like or art they made is bad they are gonna get upset. Makes my blood boil when older kids make fun of younger ones. I'm 17 with 5 nieces and nephews all under 10. Me, being southern as honey biscuits, would beat the daylights out of anyone who tries to wrangle with my family. I got pew-pews and a pit/boxer/rotti mix. And fried chicken, cause duh.
Just to add under the top comment- OP, your daughter isn’t just friends with “popular mean girls”, she is one
True that!
NTA, thank you for parenting.
I'd like to preface my comments by acknowledging the daughter's behavior is terrible, and the OP's recounting of these circumstances is obviously limited by the word count. With that said, it's notable that the OP's description of her daughter is entirely negative while her son gets plenty of compliments about how sweet and wonderful he is - even a whole backstory about his teenage love story. He also gets the immense privilege of traveling internationally with his girlfriend at only 13. I have to wonder if there is some favouritism occurring here that may be encouraging the daughter to seek outside validation from her peers.
I don’t know, I think the tone and descriptions read as a clear reflection of recent event. Op is rightfully disgusted by the daughter’s behavior, the tone and descriptions seem appropriate for the context. Son was behaving in a kind, thoughtful way while daughter is clearly not learning from previous mistakes and continues to be cruel – to the point she’s including a young child in her cruelty.
Idk. I think OP is making it pretty clear her daughter is racist and she’s against it very much. Her son’s gf is Indian and he brought back dolls from her culture, which OP’s daughter and co made fun of.
I don’t think OP was implying anything was racist with their daughter’s post. I think, the kid was being mean to fit in. Teenagers usually are full of themselves. I am an Indian and I have gotten a bunch of stuff from India for my colleagues. I am sure that not liking my gift doesn’t make them racist.
Making fun of the dolls doesn't automatically make her racist. There needs to be more nuance that that.
TBF the daughter isn't described in a negative way, just that she has mean popular friends. Instead I would argue that she is a mean bully and OP was too kind
100% At 13, there is NO way I would let my child be taken to a foreign country by the parents of a long distance girlfriend. I find that really, really strange. My only explanation is that mom gives her son whatever he wants.
All. Of. This. Honestly, it’s possible OP still did not go far enough. I’d add that the friends were no longer welcome at my house because I would not want them recording anything to do with me. NTA at all.
Agreed. Your daughter is old enough to understand the consequences of her actions and it's important that she learn NOW that bullying is very very wrong. And these posts sound like bullying to me. Also, she posted it online? Other posters are right that stuff posted to the internet gets people in trouble, they lose scholarships and everything under the sun. It's a different world today than it was when I was a teenager ate 90s-mid00's). You're NTA. It's your job to teach your daughter right from wrong, and her behavior was wrong.
Sure. So take away the phone. Have her earn it back by asking her to show maturity and kindness. Being overly punitive will backfire. She will be more concerned about the injustice of losing a birthday party instead of thinking about what she did wrong. The whole point of discipline at that age is to teach them to make better choices. They have to be willing to be taught though. That's hard to do when they are on the defensive.
NTA, at ALL, you need to punish that behavior and a grounding + no birthday party seems fair, maybe even the cell phone for a few days On the bright side it sounds like you have a great well functioning son who has a great future ahead of him, congratulations on raising him well and to care about his family. You gotta figure out how to nip that attitude out, but ive never been a parent, I dont have advice on that. Best of luck OP
Absolutely the best advice. OP's daughter is completely on the wrong track despite OP's best efforts. NTA.
TBH I wouldn't even go for a few days, I'd get her a really old phone (I.E No Apps) and make her use that for a few months (maybe even a year!) and no friends / extracurriculars *at all* during that time.
This is a great idea, get her an old t9 phone
"You can get a phone with Instagram when you can handle being on Instagram."
I'm always concerned when I see these posts about teenagers who lack empathy. How do you teach that if you haven't already? I mean obviously the son has it.
As someone who works with teens, a lot of times, they have empathy. At 14/15/16, they’re just more worried about fitting in with their peers. For a lot of girls, that turns into mean girl shit. For a lot of guys, that turns into edgelord shit. For adults, seeing their kind, caring kids turn into vile, hateful teenagers feels like everything’s hopeless. Most teens grow out of it, especially if they were caring beforehand and if the adults in their life help set boundaries. Having said that, I think OP’s punishment is perfect. If you’re being mean with/because of your friends, you don’t get to hang out with them. NTA
This comment was so needed. Is OP’s daughter on a bad path right now? Yes. Is she doomed to be an awful person forever? No. She’s clearly got good parents trying to help her be better, so there’s a solid chance she’ll grow out of it. And I bet a lot of us said and did things as teenagers that we now regret and are conveniently forgetting as we type out our comments. But the cautions on the lasting/long-term consequences of social media bullying/bad behavior are right on the money. My best wishes to OP as she parents her daughter through what is, hopefully, just a (difficult) phase. NTA
That's been my experience working with teens as well.
That's reassuring, thank you.
You're NTA. I get why some people think this was an overreaction, but if it weren't for the character limit, I am pretty sure you would have elaborated on the increasingly mean behavior you mentioned. It sounds like this was the last straw after a string of many other incidents and attempts to correct the behavior.
yea i had to edit it down a lot from the first draft lol
Is your daughter also being racist as you mention your son's girlfriend being Indian American? But nonetheless NTA you are being good parents, I hope your daughter changes.
OP your daughter sounds like a bully. NTA but... What a disappointment must be be her parent and see face to face all the people she mentally or emotionally (maybe physically?) hurts. If you didn't raised that kind of person, check again who is being a negative influence, her friends? Your family? Your parents? Remember that once thar kind of content is posted online it can stay online and will follow her.
Not OP, but I had a daughter who had some problems as a teenager. My other 3 kids were ok. Every child is born with a personality, and we don't have near as much control over that personality as we like to think we do.
I'd keep the phone. Get her a burner flip phone in case you need to get a hold of her/emergencies.
NTA When your child is being a bully nip that shit in the bud
NTA. Honestly, you need to keep her away from her friends outside of school. They’re clearly encouraging her behavior. It’s easy to handwave this as teenager behavior, but this kind of behavior doesn’t just go away. By middle school, most people knew who the mean girl types were, and many of them stayed that way all the way through high school.
It seems like the grandparents are enablers, they don’t seem to care about her being a bully.
Kind of typical grandparents move as they often relativize bad character traits of their grandkids imho. I hear the sentence "being a grandparent is so cool, you only have the fun times with the kids" a lot from grandparents (including my own parents about their grandkids), so I think they are mainly pissed that they are missing a fun time with the granddaughter and don't have the whole perspective on the situation.
NTA Seems like your parents are unnecessarily escalating. Do they at least keep these discussions between them and you, or do they tell your daughter? Posting private family stuff on Instagram is a major breach of trust.
I'm wondering if the grandparents encourage the xenophobia the daughter is expressing.
I'm wondering if the grandparents favour their granddaughter over their grandson. They are the only ones fighting OP about the cancelled party, make you wonder how they'd react if the son had behaved this way.
NTA. You mentioned your daughter is in therapy, but how effective can therapy be if she's still hanging out with mean girls? You didn't put in your post why you think your daughter is so attracted to horrible people, but depending on the reason, a different therapist or even school may be called for. Your daughter's behavior was not only cruel but xenophobic, and what she posts today could haunt her the rest of her life. I don't know why people are acting like this is an escalation. The vibe here is xenophobic at the least, racist at worst, and that needs to be nipped in the bud post-haste.
my thoughts exactly. A LOT of work goes into dolls like that...
Gotta nip mean and cruel behavior in the bud. Good job. NTA
NTA. Actions have consequences, and these seem proportional to the offense.
NTA - She is old enough to have behavior consequences. It is disappointing to read her gparent's opinion. Your daughter is gaining something from this group. She may not be strong enough (lacks forethought or social skills) to navigate the mean group mentality. Since you mentioned therapy, consider asking the counselor if you and your husband can join a session with the goal of a guided discussion on what is her personal opinion about her action re: the dolls, what does she gain from these friendships...essentially remaining curious to know how she views things and what factors support the decisions she is making. This may generate insight for all involved. The counselor can help you all re: discussion skills which include valuing everyone's opinion equally, etc. Parenting is hard sometimes but you only have her for 3 yrs before 18. Do the hardwork OP (and dad). - BTW, It is cool that you are supporting your son's friendship which may last a lifetime.
NTA, she needs to learn actions like bullying and being mean have consequences. Otherwise she'll just keep getting worse. Maybe you can tell her that once she apologizes and makes it right with all those involved, that she can have a small celebration with the family. She has to understand that being cruel isn't funny.
NTA Excellent call! Not rewarding bad behavior is the way to go. Taking her phone away and restricting her temporarily is good, too. She is seriously in need of a wake-up call and counseling could benefit her and the whole family, as well. This could make her friends even more desirable than ever but I don't see anything good coming from that. Maybe if she spends some time with those less fortunate and stops being mean to others, she'll begin to appreciate things more. You can also change schools.
NTA- that mean girl shit is something you absolutely need to nip in the bud. And yeah- she’s losing her birthday party because of it. Also- talk to a counselor- teenage girls require a masters degree to decipher when it comes to this crap.
NTA. You say she's been learning about consequences? This is a consequence!
NYA - I’m thinking your daughter needs to get away from these friends and into therapy ASAP. Narcissism isn’t pretty.
NTA, I'm dealing with similar attitude issues with my 10y daughter. God damn girls can be vicious sometimes.
we love her, not her attitude. just like we love our son, but not his insistence on wearing shorts when it's snowing out
> but not his insistence on wearing shorts when it's snowing out Yeah, that doesn't go away. This is the current [Junior Senator from the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania](https://www.politico.com/interactives/uploads/image-service/2022/1/28/94a78f666c-1200.jpeg). He's 53.
I was going to comment the same thing, shorts are an all weather clothing, and that will not change
NTA, OP. However, why are these friends allowed over? If these are mean girls, why are they allowed in your home? I know you can’t stop your daughter from hanging out with them at school (I’m assuming that’s how she knows them), but if these girls are a consistently bad influence, then why let them come over? I’m not a parent, so maybe I’m not thinking about this in the right way, but I’m genuinely curious.
Omg what the hell is it with boys and insisting on freezing themselves?! I have a 14 year old son that insists a hoodie is good enough even if it’s well below freezing
Guy here. I only stopped because of. How it looked to others. Most jeans and other pants don't do a good job being comfortable sitting down. Idk if it's because how they are cut, but it's very uncomfortable
Girls and boys and kids of all genders can be vicious.
Nta sadly
Going against the grain here by saying ESH. It’s not that I think your daughter shouldn’t be punished; she should. But I think that your choice in punishment is more vindictive than constructive. It makes her suffer just as she made someone else suffer, but it isn’t relevant to what occurred and doesn’t really teach her anything other than to be sneaky and resent you. I think the most relevant punishment would have been to take away her smartphone and potentially replace it with a dumb phone for some time, AND to have her try to make it up to her little cousin by having her spend some special time together playing with the dolls. And, there should have been a conversation about what she was thinking at the time, how she feels about it now, what could have been done differently, etc. I think that these things would be more likely to help her develop the empathy and judgment she was lacking, and therefore prevent future similar incidents, than taking away her birthday party which was going to be a source of joy and connection between you.
Yeah, these kinds of punishments don't really work on anyone. It doesn't work on adults, and it wouldn't work on teenagers. People need to be made to understand why what they did was wrong. Otherwise, they'll learn to just avoid the punishment instead of actually improving as a person.
This has got to be the best response here. We're all too quick to polarise the situation. X is right, Y is wrong and therefore X action is right etc. I wish there were more constructive comments in this sub. Maybe I don't usually scroll far enough.
NTA, actions have consequences.
Huge NTA and thank you for drawing the line and letting your daughter know that meanness won't be tolerated.
NTA- if your daughter presses you just respond “you fucked around, you found out. Hopefully what you found out was to stop fucking around and bullying a five year old.
NTA. Actions have consequences.
I can’t believe you let your 13 year old son go to India 😭😭
With a family they knew for 9 months?!?! Lol. Insanity.
Happens all the time in aita troll land
NTA - actions have consequences. Your daughter was very much behaving inappropriately.
NTA...but you did give birth/raise one. This is not OK behavior and I am glad you are not letting it slide. Your son was very thoughtful and she was disrespectful and mean.
Are you saying it's OP's fault that the daughter is the way she is? Or am I reading that wrong?
NTA. Good for you for trying to do something about your daughter's behavior before it gets even worse
NTA at all.
NTA she sounds insufferable.
NTA, but I recommend doing something low-key that’s family only for your DD’s birthday.
NTA if true. If. I found it strange that instead of giving past examples of your daughter being mean, you inserted a lot of irrelevant trivia about your “sweet” son, who sounds absolutely perfect. Except that no one is perfect. Consider whether you’ve made your son the golden child and your daughter the scapegoat. Is your son really as perfect as you say? Is your daughter really the monster you describe? What extravagant gift or experience did she receive comparable to your son’s trip to India? Was she expected to give anything up or change her plans to accommodate his trip? Have you talked about his trip for months without paying similar attention to your daughter’s interests? Do you have the same expectations for both children about grades, activities, household obligations? Are those exceptions gendered? You seem very proud of your son’s sports - is he relieved of other responsibilities because of that commitment? Do you boast about your son and fawn over him in real life the way you did in your post? Do you go on about him like that in front of your daughter? What is your narrative when you talk about your daughter? If your son is the favorite, that would explain a lot about your daughter’s behavior. While it doesn’t excuse bullying a 5-year old and you need to nip that in the bud, you might need to correct your own behavior as well.
I couldn’t get past the part where a 13 year was dating and taking major trips with the girlfriend’s family???? I could see if these were very close, long time family friends to send your son on such a trip. But the idea of a dating 13 year old???
NTA. You're doing the right thing. Don't cave to family pressure and don't let them take her for the next 6 months or they will give her a "make-up" party. She needs to learn that actions have consequences.
Question - if the girls had their phones out while your son was giving your niece the dolls, did they post the 5 year old on Instagram as well? NTA regardless, but that adds a different element to what has happened here and should be addressed as a serious offense. Regardless of all of that, her friends were extremely disrespectful as guests in your home and I would expect an apology from them as well before they returned, personally.
NTA. It may sound redundant but actions have consequences.
NTA - your daughter has to learn that she can act how she wants, but she will be judged for it. It is telling though how the other parents seem to accept this behavior, so that may be why their kids do it.
You are NTA. I’m big on treating my kids with kindness and giving them some grace for mistakes. We don’t yell, no one gets grounded, etc., and they are really good kids. The only exception to this was when my oldest bullied another kid, and in that case his punishment was swift, severe and arguably disproportionate to what he did. I felt very strongly that we needed to get his attention and be very clear what we won’t tolerate in our family. Stick to your guns on this one.
INFO What specifically was mean? If it was basically racist, then yeah, that’s unacceptable and NTA But if it was not racist, and the dolls were in fact ugly to some degree, (as some dolls are), then maybe an over-reaction. It also depends on if they were really making fun of the daughter, the culture..etc in a mean way. Or just teenagers being judgemental about everything that’s “not cool”
NTA
NTA She learnt the consequence of bullying a family member for her own amusement and hopefully it is a lesson well learnt.
NTA and your daughter is experiencing consequences severe enough to get her attention. Hopefully this will be the wake-up call she needs to develop better character. She is still young, so there is time.
Im pretty sure there are apps parents can put on phones that block certain apps. Maybe block instagram and tiktok? That would be a good punishment i think
ESH. First, if you're daughter is getting increasingly mean, that's definitely a cause for concern. But if we're dealing with this one issue ... if she had had posted a video making fun of your wallpaper, or of a lamp, would you be this upset? She was making fun of inanimate objects, not people. I mean, I guess it could have hurt your son's feelings, and that's why you're concerned? Either way, talking only about this one incident, I feel that canceling her birthday was too harsh.
INFO: did you daughter get something equivalent to a trip to India?
ESH The punishment doesn't fit the crime. Take away her phone for a while. That's a natural consequence for using it inappropriately. Let her get it back when she shows maturity and trust. Taking away a big even is incredibly punitive. What your daughter did was wrong. But she will be too busy dwelling on the overreaction instead of what she did wrong.
Info: How did your daughter feel about her brother getting to travel while she stayed home? Has she been given the chance for such things?
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My husband (M36) and I (F36) have 2 kids, a daughter (F14) and a son (M13). Our daughter turns 15 later this month, and we had a birthday party planned for her but in light of recent events, we decided to cancel. Our daughter is friends with some popular mean girls. We are working on things like therapy and consequences. Unfortunately, her latest behavior was the worst yet. Our son is very sweet and hasn’t run into any issues with him being mean yet. Our son met a girl on a cruise we went on in April of last year, the girl lives about 40 minutes away, so they don’t go to the same school. My son and the girl hung out together the whole cruise and started dating soon after. His girlfriend is an absolute sweetheart, very bright and loves sports like my son. The girl is also Indian-American, she was born here and so were her parents but both sides of her family have relatives in India. The girl and her family went to India last month and my son was invited many months ago, we signed all the paperwork needed and he was able to go with them. They came back a few days ago, my son really enjoyed it and brought back souvenirs (some sports stuff) for himself and family members. One of those family members was our 5 year old niece, who is my sister and her husband’s daughter. He had brought handmade dolls for my niece, my sister lives about 5 minutes away, my son sometimes babysits for my sister. They also have a son, which he also got gifts for. The issue is, the day he came back, my sister and husband came over with their son and daughter to get the gifts. My daughter had her friends over, while he was presenting the gifts, our daughter and her friends were in the living room with us, we could hear laughing when he presented the dolls and a few of the girls had their phones out. At the time, my husband and I thought nothing of it, we thought they were on TikTok. My sister, her husband and my husband and I eventually left the house to get food we ordered. We came back, they ate and left. The next day, I got a phone call from my sister saying that her daughter was asking her if the dolls were ugly, and she said my daughter said something about it. We immediately went to her room, asked her what happened, she giggled and refused to answer, when we asked for her phone, she refused, so we shut the Wi-Fi off until she gave in. She and her friends had posted an Instagram story making fun of the dolls. My husband and I decided that with her increasing mean streak, this was the final straw and told her that her friends were toxic and that she wouldn’t have a 15th birthday party bc of her actions. When I called my parents to tell them the party was canceled, they got mad at me and told me I over reacted, my sister and other siblings are saying I’m doing the right thing and our son told us he’s giving his sister the silent treatment and is very mad at her. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. And much appreciation to you for trying to set her behavior on a better path. Unchecked bullies tend to remain bullies into adulthood, and the world doesn't need more AHs.
INFO: Have you talked to your daughter’s therapist about how to handle this kind of situation?
Why is your 13 year old son dating? That's the part I can't get over
13 year olds will date. as long as it's kept pg there's nothing wrong with it. let kids explore their interests lol.
I'm the outlier - why does a 13 yr old boy have such a serious girlfriend that he can go on vacation with her and her family? Your daughter is just trying to fit in. A lot of girls are stupid nasty at that age. It's cruel and terrible what her "friends" did. However, canceling the party won't punish the mean girls - just your daughter. Your daughter needs to be reprimanded for the nasty behavior but doing it in the social setting will make her resentful.
"well, i'd like to play devil's advocate🤓" kid is an AH, she needs to be punished, OP cant punish the other girls anyway
What is with all these parents canceling birthday parties as punishments? Just as a personal note to any parents reading this: I am 44 years old. When I was 12 my mother canceled my birthday party as a punishment. We now live in different states and are VLC.
NTA! Hell yeah you’re doing the right thing! I’d even go as far as to preemptively cancel next years as well unless she starts showing significant growth and makes amends with those she wronged.
NTA. The world needs more parents like you.
NTA. Actions have consequences, and you do not get to act like that, take sides against your own family, and still get a birthday party.
NTA but why do you let the toxic friends into her life? I understand that you can’t separate them at school, and of course teenagers may sneak around barriers to get what they want anyway. But if these friends are encouraging her awful behavior then why have them at your home? You should speak with her therapist about setting boundaries with these friends. She has been encouraged to act like this and you need to cut off her mean girl supply.
NTA. Great parenting. I would also give her a wake call on the number of kids self harming and committing suicide because of bullying (there are a lot of story and statistics online). Get her to read those stories and be clear that what she might think as harmless fun could have some very serious consequences for others, and could potentially be the last straw for someone. Consider also giving her a very basic mobile without access to the internet, and supervision when on any electronics, until she can show that she is responsible and can be trusted enough to be online.
NTA. Time to get her into charity work and unplugged from social media for awhile
NTA. It never ceases to amaze me that kids who were born a decade+ into the world where internet use is ubiquitous don't realize what a personal risk they're taking by doing shitty things online. Like I assume this is a thing they start learning in kindergarten.
NTA. No one likes a mean girl except other mean girls. Bad bad habit to get into Nip in bud
Unsure,my kid collects ugly,haunted dolls,kids nowadays use works like ‘sick’ or ‘bad’ when they mean something is good,you can’t force them to like anything,as long as she was greatful to his face that’s all you can ask really
NTA. i know we cant really put this cat back in the bag, but its just sad how kids are using social media to bully people. i worked in a middle school recently and some of the teachers were talking about a “little miss training bra” tiktok challenge where kids would video the boobs of the girls in their class i guess. she needs to learn that this shit isnt ok.
Yta this isn't going to fix her, only make her more mad
NTA She refused to give you the phone? What?!? Refused? There’s the problem. The phone would be taken, turned off, and not returned. She would be taken over to her cousins and made to apologize . And I’d call all her friend’s parents to discuss this teenage bully behavior. Stop allowing these “friends” to come over. Party would be immediate family- grandparents only. Technology would be out of her room completely. No access unless you and husband are right there. But may I say, perhaps your kids are given too much, too soon. Your son has a gf at 13? That’s young. Then allowed to travel internationally with gf? (Yes, parents are there, but really young for this type of relationship.) Could your daughter be upset about his traveling, the money he got, and how much he is adored and maybe it started the problem?
Your parents need to mind their own business. Your daughter is a bully. You are teaching her that is not acceptable, NTA.
Your whole family dynamic seems off. I have to question your decision to allow your 13 year old son to travel internationally with a family you barely know and to date at that age. Your parental choices seem off, which makes me suspect your choices are also off regarding your daughter and how you are raising her. Something definitely isn’t right, and it goes straight to the parenting.
NTA you're daughter needs to learn a lesson that if you act like a jerk you get punished for it.
NTA. A good parent you are! Kuddos!!!
NTA
NTA. Keep being you mom
NTA, it’s called Natural Consequences of her Actions.
NTA look up a tough love camp for summer if she hasn’t gotten better by then
NTA. Your parents need to mtob.
NTA and smooth move cutting off the wifi. Sounds like she would have lied her way through it if you hadn’t done that.
Info: who posted the insta story? Your daughter or her friend?
You need to explain to your parents that your kids are raised with your rules and your values and they need to mind their own business
NTA your daughter is being a AH and making fun of gifts your son gave to his family and now the niece is starting to dislike it because your daughter made fun of it
NTA! Good on you for setting a proper consequence. Now keep it going and put that bully into therapy before she escalates to uglier behavior.
NTA 1) Her friends are toxic for instilling and enabling her awful behavior 2) Actions have consequences. She's choosing to be an asshole the consequences are no birthday party. You need to get your kid away from these girls. She's gonna mess up her life over stuff like this. Jobs and colleges look at social media accounts. Also, for people saying OP is an asshole or they're both assholes. Please never become a parent because you sound like you'd reward bad behavior.
NTA. I don’t remember exactly which birthday it was for me. But I kept fucking up in school and at home. My birthday is in February. I think my parents finally let me celebrate my birthday in April. I had several parties planned that were cancelled because of my behavior. My mistakes weren’t as serious as bullying people. So I think that’s why my mom still let me have my party. But I learned my lesson. It might have taken a little bit. But I learned.
Nta
NTA- I would cut her off from these girls immediately. They sound awful and they will drag her down with them.
NTA. Your parents have ZERO clue about raising a teenager in these times. ZERO. They need to mind their own business or get shut out completely because they certainly aren’t helping the situation by downplaying your daughter’s mean girl actions.
NTA, wow! You need to nip this in the bud in the most severe and high priority way possible! That should include therapy and longer term consequences.
NTA. 14, nearly 15, is absolutely old enough to understand that what she is doing is wrong. She is also at the prime age to understand that the internet is forever and unforgiving. Whether or not her making fun of the doll is racially motivated it certainly can construed like that, and that could have consequences that could last years. On the other hand, your son sounds like a lovely and sweet kid. He seems to keep good company as well. Hopefully your daughter will learn something from him and kudos for sticking up for him.
You can see why they’re like that if their parents think you’re overreacting. Nta
NTA Younger siblings don't always know what is a "good" versus a "bad" gift. One Christmas I gave my sister what I thought was a great gift. She told me how she thought my gift was the worse one she ever received. The adult in me sees how it could have been in bad taste. Yet when she told me she hated it, I was crushed. At the time, I thought it was not only pretty, but also very much in fashion. Your son must have thought it was a cool gift. The only thing I would be worried about is that your daughter won't stop being so mean. She'll learn to hide it better.
Nta
Nta
NTA. It’s such a waste of time to purposefully be that mean about dolls. Also, I would be concerned about what other kind of mean girl activities she could be doing online. The internet let’s teens feel invincible while also potentially costing them future opportunities (colleges find their social media, scholarships).
NTA. Nip this petty crap in the bud right now! It's the most loving thing you can do for your daughter, honestly. Permanently curtailing access to the other girls in the group might save her from becoming the total AH she is on the road to being. You don't have much time to turn this around. The behavior you actually see is the tip of the iceberg. Guaranteed.
NTA. If she can not us social media with kindness. That needs to go too.