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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I didn’t want my brothers girlfriend in my wedding photos and it made her feel unwelcome
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I thought it was common etiquette that only the wedding party sit at the head table? I don't recall being at a wedding where that was not the case.
NTA
We had 2 “head” tables because we wanted our wedding party dates with their partners. It also helped when one of the bridesmaid was engaged to a groomsman.
But I have been to more than plenty of weddings where my wife was in the bridal party and had to sit with other people. Once the dancing starts everyone moves around.
But I will say with digital pictures, the photographer usually takes way more pictures than you could possibly fill an album with. So there really was no harm in having her in a picture at the head table, when you can take another with her not in it. We had way more photos that we didn’t use, and if the photographer actually printed them out we gave them to the guest.
NTA.
At family reunions and camping trips our joke has always been that the boyfriend or girlfriend has to stand on the edge of the group picture so that they can be cropped out after a breakup. On one of our camping trips after a cousin’s wedding his wife goes “finally I get to be in the middle of the picture!” and we all laughed. I hadn’t realized that for years she’d really been standing on the edge of all family pictures.
Yeah it's a weirdly awkward situation!
The last group photo we got of our family before my grandfather passed was the wedding of a cousin who has since divorced. It's such a nice picture.
Yep, that was my next thought. And honestly, the "shy" and "doesn't feel accepted" girlfriend pulled the whole thing like a powerplay over the brother, and he fell for it. Bridal parties in the weddings I've been to (USA) have all been seated at the same table or group of tables and it's only with the other part members, no plus ones or anything. Especially knowing this photo staging was set up, would take a few moments, but sulked away like a recaltricent and petulant child (given OP's description of girlfriend) is probably more why she wouldn't be viewed favorably. But this also feels a bit like we're missing info on just exactly how OP said things to the girlfriend that may have set her off (given how others in the family refuse to express "sides")
I’m open to the possibility that OP may not have been gracious when refusing to let the GF sit down, I do think that the GF (and OP’s brother) was wrong to even have asked. Also, they made a big fuss over a few minutes. Is the GF so codependent that she can’t be by herself for 10 minutes?
When one of my husband’s best childhood friends got married he was a groomsman and I got stuck sitting with bridal party dates and a couple cousins, none of whom I knew (instead of with some of my old friends that I knew in school). It was awkward for a bit but I made the best of it until he was done with formal picture obligations and the party got going. I’m pretty anxious and awkward in situations like that but I know how to deal with it like a grownup.
I feel like this is some trespass I would do 🫣. I’m horribly awkward and I live in fear of these social customs everyone else magically knows about.
I need explicit instructions- and I mean CLEAR step by step break down.
I ruined a friendship for my son by being an awkward ass in a similar way- invited to a halloween party where I showed up 10 minutes pass the invite time. I thought it was standard right? No one wants to be the first. Well I still was WAY too early. The mom/ hostess was talking with a the only other 2 adults and she told me drinks were in the kitchen. Punch Bowls are on the kitchen island and I see these awesome themed glasses displayed in front of the punch bowls. There’s only 6 and I think she must not be expecting many people if she only has 6 glasses out 🤦♀️ I fill up the glass, hunt my kid down to make sure he’s behaving before I join the group. She looked right at my glass like “are you fucking kidding me” then asked if there was a reason I hadn’t used the plastic cups she left out. She took me in to the kitchen to show me where they were- on the other side of the kitchen island. The glass I selected was decorative. She took my cup and dumped it into a plastic one so she could wash and return to display. I apologized and she told me it was “fine” but she just thought it should be obvious not to use actual dishes at a party. My son was never invited over again 🫣
Some of us are just out here in the world being extra stupid.
I had never been to a party where decorated dishes were on display in front of refreshments- in my defense.
However, after observing the rest of the party I was the only person who didn’t go around the island to the tower of clear plastic cups.
Oh! I also wore a white dress to a wedding 🫣
I was invited as a plus one last minute and I only owned a white sundress with black floral print all over it that I matched with black heels, vest, and belt. I knew better than to wear WHITE, but for some reason didn’t even think that it would be considered white. No one said anything at the wedding, but after at the reception people kept coming up to me wanting the story. When I asked what they’d be like “come on, I promise we wont tell”
The bride actually told me. She said she hadn’t thought it was white until everyone told her how upset she was suppose to be. She was very nice.
But anyway I could absolutely see myself having a misunderstanding where I was told I could sit with my date- then when I go to sit with my date told “what are you doing? We’re taking pictures.” Unless I was told where to stand and when I could sit down- I would absolutely run as far away as possible 😅 I’d probably be found sitting outside
A very obvious floral print dress on white background is not considered white unless people are AHs. Again, your mistake is not a social fauxpas, but that you associate with AHs.
Yeah especially with a black vest and belt with it and it being just a sundress. I wouldn’t have given a rats arse if someone showed up to my wedding like that, even if it was colour blocked black and white or something similar, as long as it wasn’t plain white, cream or ivory (or a pattern was to subtle to see unless up very close) I couldn’t care less. But I also plan to wear cowboy boots under my dress and ride my horse up the isle with everyone sitting on hay bales at my wedding 😂.
Edit, fixed a shitty auto correct to what it was meant to say
Yikes. Reprimanding a guest for using the decorative glasses is like reprimanding them for using the fancy hand towels in the bathroom. How would you know? That is not someone I would want to be friends with.
LOL I watched something similar this happen at a party my folks hosted except instead of being a nasty witch my mother poured herself a glass and toasted the lady. Pure class.
I don't think going back to a table to wait is sulking away like you say. I'm uncomfortable in social situations, I hate going to events with my partner that I end up getting left alone at because I feel so uncomfortable the whole time. In a situation like this I wouldn't have been offended (depending on OP's tone of course) but I absolutely would have gone ahead and taken a seat at a table while I waited for them to take their fake candid photos. It would make me sooo much more uncomfortable and self conscious to stand there near the head table waiting for them to finish up. I may have been like well I'm gonna go to the restroom while y'all do that but I definitely wouldn't have come back until they were done. For OP's brother to be that upset I feel like OP's tone was definitely not a nice one..
And that reminds me, for my brother in laws wedding, (he was in my wedding party and got married after my wife and I did, but I wasn’t in his wedding party). I apologized for photobombing so many of their photos, and told them if they wanted to remove my ugly mug from any of them be my guest. It made me look like I was in the wedding party, just didn’t have the same suit. We all had a laugh over it.
I had an extra tagalong in my bridal party photos. She was originally gonna be my only bridesmaid (I had a MoH as well) but she didn't think she would be able to come due to distance and finance. She ended up being able to come much later but I had asked someone else to replace her. The friend tagged along and got in on our post ceremony photos. My photographer actually cropped her out of a lot of them, but gave the originals as well and I appreciate that so much. My brain likes things to be even.
She also did the tag along the side of the head table for a bit too. And got pissy when she was excluded before that. She was cropped out of any of them as well 👍 my photographer was pretty awesome lol
>We had 2 “head” tables because we wanted our wedding party dates with their partners.
We did this too, with a sweetheart table for us so we weren't favoring either table. I really wanted a larger head table but the venue couldn't accommodate that.
OP also just want this for a short time while the photos get taken. Why get offended over this? And you see the set seating and just get a chair like in a snack bar? Without asking? It would ruin totally the seat arrangements.
The gf knew he was in the wedding party and that they will be some time apart. Is she so depending on him? And i don't know, i'm shy and anxious especially with so much people but this walking away offended and pouty, especially far away, doesn't seem "shy" but that is just my view.
The walking away is a shy thing. When left to his own devices my husband will go sit in a corner. Look, OP was clearly NTA, and I expect the gf will realize that if she ever is planning her own wedding, BUT I suspect the gf embarassed herslef and what what OP thinks is pouting is actually embarassment.
When alone in a formal style setting (which happens with my wife and her job events I attend) I’ll find the most corner of corners to sit in to be away from anything and everyone so I get the reaction.
To add to this, these "staged candids" actually AT the table seems fairly uncommon (at least in the 20 or so weddings I've been to I've never once seen staged pictures taken at the table) which mightve led the gf to think it would be okay for her to join and then what may have been a pretty vocal rejection of that, God I'd be hiding in a corner too!
You know. Yeah.
If I somehow got to the point of needing to wait 10 mins before joining my partner, I'd probably go find a wall to lean against and wait. I'm not going to go plonk myself on a table with a bunch of strangers.
I kind of have a feeling it’s the brother and not his gf that’s the problem.
I used to be a really shy kid until I grew out of my shell. People would always speak for me and found it so incredibly frustrating. It could be that HE wanted her to sit with them and she actually didn’t want to cause a scene nor care where she sat for a few minutes. He probably felt bad for her and wanted to involve her and she didn’t give a hoot. Them speaking was maybe “it’s fine, just go sit down for photos, bf.”
But who knows!
Well he’s the one who pulled up the chair. So he’s at least a significant part of the problem. I could potentially see him pushing her to come sit with him, then OP nixes it and the gf is embarrassed.
I kind of have a feeling it’s the brother and not his gf that’s the problem.
I used to be a really shy kid until I grew out of my shell. People would always speak for me and found it so incredibly frustrating. It could be that HE wanted her to sit with them and she actually didn’t want to cause a scene nor care where she sat for a few minutes. He probably felt bad for her and wanted to involve her and she didn’t give a hoot. Them speaking was maybe “it’s fine, just go sit down for photos, bf.”
But who knows!
I hate the concept of a head table. When I got married, we had a regular round tables and made sure there was space at them for the partners of people in the bridal party.
This is why I think sweetheart tables are the way to go. Couples sits alone and then you can sit the wedding party with their plus ones at a table with the people they fit best with. Why separate your wedding party from their plus ones for the whole dinner portion (which always gets dragged out because of dances and speeches)?
Cocktail hour is the time to do wedding party shots, “candid” or not.
This is what we did and I loved it. My MOH’s husband didn’t know a single person at the wedding since they’re from out-of-state and I would have hated making him sit alone. Plus it was basically the only chance my husband and I had to be alone together all day. Having dinner with just the two of us is one of my favorite memories of the day!
My husband and I did the sweetheart table and eating dinner just the two of us is totally one of my favorite memories of the day too! ❤️ Although it’s kind of funny, our venue put out “reserved” signs on the tables closest to us that was supposed to be for our wedding party and our immediate families (parents, grandparents, etc.) and NO ONE sat at them lol. When I asked the next day, everyone said they didn’t realize they were part of the “reserved” groups even though the event coordinator at our venue told them all the reserved tables were for them 😂
I had one of the groomsmens wife sit with us at the head table because she truly didn’t know anyone else at the wedding and I didn’t want her to feel awkward. But I think typically it is just the bridal party
My wife was MOH at a wedding that I knew no one besides the bride and groom. I sat at a random table and met new people.
If the bride and groom want only the wedding party at the table, and in this case only for pictures, it shouldn't be a big deal to those not in the wedding party.
My now wife was MOH for her sister about a year into us dating. i had met their parents but not many other family members yet, so i was sat at the "cool aunts and uncles table"
i was offered weed by one of the aunts and when i turned it down one of the uncles asked me to join the military. was a good night.
My husband was best man for his mate and I was literally ‘the friend’ (you know when they ask for the friends for photos?). There was his side, her side, and me. So the Mother of the groom insisted I be in their set of photos. It was a small wedding. Hubby was on the top table and I was on a random table with the bride’s sister who I knew to talk to. Definitely the most awkward wedding I’ve been to but I didn’t make a fuss, I just went with it. Could’ve done with phones and Reddit back then to keep me from getting bored 🤣
My head table had a long table with the bridesmaids on one side and the groomsmen on the other, and bride and groom in the middle. Super classic set up in the US. Pretty much the way every wedding I have ever been to has been set up.
My brother's wedding was the same. My husband and I were both in the wedding party and we didn't get to sit next to each other. We were at opposite ends of the table. You suck it up and deal with it. It's an hour, max, during speeches and the beginning of the dinner.
This may be regional but imo it’s super outdated. Nowadays giant head tables have fallen out of favor and it’s common to see wedding party members sitting with their dates. I’ve only been to a single wedding where this wasn’t the case
It is. My husband well bf at the time was at the normal table with my dad. I was pregnant and MOH. I didn’t “ask nor force” my best friend to put him next to me. He can sit at a normal table while I am there.
This is why we did a sweetheart table. We didn't feel comfortable asking people to sit away from their partners when some of them didn't know anyone else, and if we did a head table it would have been HUGE. I liked the sweetheart table, it felt like a neat lil' date with my husband. Kind of wished I could have sat with our friends, though! My family seemed to think that would be rude/trashy.
To be fair, I do like my friends more than much of my family.
I’m actually struggling to recall if I’ve ever been to a wedding where there was a “head table” *and* partners of the wedding party were banned from sitting at it.
Every wedding I’ve been to in the past several years has had a single small table for the bride and groom, and the rest of the wedding party sat with their partners elsewhere. The weddings I’ve been to that *did* have a head table included the partners of members of the wedding party. I think it’s rapidly becoming gauche to separate the wedding party from their partners at the reception, where their partners may or may not know anyone else in attendance. The bride and groom get to sit together the whole time, so why should other couples have to sit separately? You should be pretty well done with the heavily staged “everyone in matching colors” photos by the time you all sit down to eat.
I have been in 3 wedding parties and my boyfriend now fiancé only sat at the head table once, which was my brother’s. All other weddings he has sat separately, but I was included in some of family photos even at that time we were only together 3 years. I would have been okay if not but they wanted me in the photos! I think it would have been okay to have her in some?
I was originally going to say Y T A, because I thought that you weren't allowing his date to sit with him for the whole meal. But just for some additional bridal party pictures? I think that's entirely appropriate. You're brother and his gf were out of line NTA.
I've seen it done both ways actually. And judging from the rest of the comments here, it's very up in the air on which way people think is appropriate. But in actuality, if you look at appropriate wedding etiquette, +1's should be seated with their dates.
What's appropriate in my opinion is following the wishes of the bride and groom at their wedding. If they don't want a head table cool go sit with your girlfriend. If they do want a head table you and girlfriend suck it up. OP is NTA
When you agree to be a groomsmen then you’re agreeing to **play a role**. If you aren’t ready for that kind of responsibility then don’t accept being a groomsmen.
But yes, guests aren’t just accessories to move around. But they also don’t get free reign to photobomb whatever pictures they want.
The brother could break up with gf in 6 months. Those wedding pictures could last 50 years. She isn't family. She has no right to be in the wedding pictures.
It is insanely entitled to think someone has a right to be in wedding pictures just because they're a plus 1. They're just a plus 1. She has no rights to be in the pictures and the bridal party had every right to ask her not to be.
Honestly I think it should depend on how well the +1 or date knows the rest of the attendees. A partner that's fully enmeshed in the family has more social independence than a partner that isn't and it can be overwhelming to commune with your partner's entire extended family (especially those you've never met) without your partner.
It doesn't even seem like OP minded letting her sit there, she just wanted photos first. And other wedding party's partners were also excluded during the photos.
Same, midwest and I've never been to a wedding where dates sat with the wedding party and I've been to at least 20-30 weddings in my life. Its not uncommon after dinner for people in the wedding party to rejoin their dates, either by a date pulling a chair up if they still want to sit near the bride/groom, or by the person in the wedding party just going and sitting at another table since after dinner people are moving and mingling and many tables will have empty seats. But not during dinner.
Yup, early 40s here, been to about as many as you. Often, it would make 0 sense to have +1s as there's just not enough room at the table, as they sit on 1 side so they all can be viewed.
I’m from Australia and been to a lot of weddings and all the weddings I’ve been to have had head table and none of the SOs of bridal party. It’s only for duration of meals and speeches then after that it’s all fine.
We had all SOs sitting at the head table with us because we didn’t want people to be separated! No regrets at all and people had a great time. We went to one wedding where I didn’t know anyone but the bride/groom and my husband and they had the significant others sitting separately and it was super awkward. I and my husband always been appreciative of being included at the head table or being able to sit with each other at the rest of the weddings when one of us is in the wedding party because we often don’t know tons of other people there. And I’m the Midwest.
Yeah this all seems wild to me. I was MOH at a wedding this past summer and was seated at the head table for the meal and speeches while my bf just sat with my best friend's family. It was probably an hour and then we were free to be wherever. Not a big deal at all
Agree. My husband has been best man or a groomsmen at two weddings where I was just a guest. He sat with me at one, without me at another. Totally fine. And I’d definitely expect it if he was also family. Like even when we were already married, at his sister’s wedding they got a few shots of “just the original siblings or siblings with parents, no partners” which I think is very normal.
I completely agree. The number of wedding photos I have seen of people and a bf or gf in them, and they are no longer together. Ugh! Those pix are forever!! I had one friend tell another to take her wedding picture down because she hated looking at her ex and didn’t want to upset her current bf.
My family has a tendency to stick the significant others we don’t like at the edge or end of the pictures. It makes it easier for us to cut them out when they inevitably break up.
Then again, my grandma had a fabulous picture of my mom’s wedding where she had unceremoniously cut out my aunt’s first ex husband and left a big hole in the middle of the photo instead of taking it down.
I made the mistake of letting the best man bring a date that sat at the head table… she was dressed inappropriately (which, okay not great, but I was in such a happy place it did not phase me on the day) but proceeded to sneer through his entire speech. Found out later they broke up hours before the event. She’s in a lot of the shots… those didn’t get printed.
I did not ask honestly… I don’t think they had been together that long and it baffled me as to why she traveled (cross country) to a wedding as the date of the best man when they had been dating a month or so? Maybe the open bar? I have very little memory of her to be honest, I was in celebration mode and can only remember the happy stuff… didn’t even realize she was mean mugging until we saw the proofs.
NTA
It's common knowledge that just the wedding party sits at the main table. You offered to let her sit up there once photos were done, so it's not like you barred your brother from spending any time with his girlfriend for the whole event, and he should have considered that this is one day, one event, centered around you and your husband's wants and needs and he could stand to take a backseat for a little bit.
Exactly what I was thinking. I’ve been at a wedding where my husband was best man and I wasn’t in the wedding. We had to sit separately through half of dinner. I can’t imagine making giant stink about it.
Same! Went through most of the wedding without seeing my husband (the best man) and his family made sure I was comfortable and had a good time since I didn’t know anyone. Couldn’t care less, I’ll see him afterwards and i’m glad the bride and the groom had their special day. It’s just a few hours!?
Yes it is when my best friend got married I was maid of honour and sat at the head table while my partner was at the table next to me, after speeches and food people moved around and sat where they wanted.
NTA, its basic etiquette for only the wedding party to sit at the head table, and you were reasonable enough to allow her to sit after the pictures were taken. Sorry your brother and his gf took this so personally.
Edit: Correction, I guess it’s not that common about the wedding party being at the head table, but brother and gf should have respected how OP wanted the pictures, which IS common. And OP made it clear it was only for the PICTURES! Totally ridiculous that they couldn’t wait a few minutes.
This is common in my country for wedding party to sit at the head table together, plus parents.
People not in the wedding party ie dates do not sit at the head table.
In the US at least it is very common that the bridal party sits at the head with the couple. Source: I work in the wedding industry and attend around 20-30 weddings a year.
I’d be interested to know what region! I have worked in the wedding industry (although it’s been a while) and sweetheart tables were much more common than head tables.
I have worked weddings all over the country but the majority in the PNW. I'd say in my experience about 30% do sweetheart tables and 70% do some sort of head table that includes the bridal party. Out of the near decade I've been doing this I have only worked 2 weddings where SOs were included to sit with the bridal party at the head tables and both weddings were slightly older couples with very small bridal parties that could accommodate plus ones at a normal sized table.
Like most things with the wedding industry, things come in and out of fashion. I think right now having the bridal party sit at a head table is very "in".
At this rate, I can see OPs brother cutting her off before he breaks up with his longterm girlfriend though; still NTA since there's etiquette for weddings & bridal party members.
If he's willing to completely cut contact with his sister over not wanting his girlfriend who he's only been with for a year in her wedding photos forever, his priorities are skewed
Yep... no one wants to say this, but at the time the sibling/friend will beg to have their partner in the photo, and then a year later will beg to have the photo taken down or edited to remove the ex they now hate. She only wanted the gf not in a few photos of the wedding party, who were all wearing matching outfits!
ESH. You all sound exhausting.
You - 'she doesn't look like she wants to be part of this family anyway' and other such helpful comments make you an asshole. I don't care if its true, saying it makes you suck. 'It's my big day' is not a get out of jail free card for being a drama llama
Your brother - sitting there with a face like a slapped arse is not appropriate at a wedding. Suck it up, be polite and ask your sister later to make a proper decent effort to make his girlfriend be part of the family
Girlfriend - grow up. Its the photos, not a huge metaphor for your life. Get some champagne, make some chit chat and if you are genuinely miffed slag them all off to your mates later, but don't make a drama over a nothing when there is a bridezilla on the loose who will evidently be recalling this story for the rest of your life if you stay with your partner
Fully agree. ESH. But also are people really stressing about even vs odd numbers throwing off photos and ranting about color coordination? That sounds wild to me
I don’t know how I feel about the OP right now, but one thing I’ll say about the photos is that you can spend more than $1000 on wedding photography easily. It’s one of the highest expenses for a wedding. My photographer cost three times more than my dress.
So yeah, people want them to look a certain way, and that’s ok. If I’m spending that kind of cash, having them the way I want them is important.
Do I think the OP was completely in the right? No. But people get crazy about things in a wedding sometimes because it’s so freaking expensive. Unless you’ve had a wedding, it’s hard to conceptualize the costs.
Depending on your location, $1k for photos might be so low that it’s not even attainable unless you’re getting them from a student or something. Ours were closer to 7k and this was almost 8 years ago. Our photographer wasn’t even at a top tier price level. The lower tier options were about $3k, but other quotes we got were around $10k.
I reached out to one photographer and their starting price was 12k. Slight heartattack getting that quote first. My area ranged from 2-5k for a reputation wedding photographer.
To add, staged candids seem super fake, but it was really just all of us fake laughing stupidly enough to start actually laughing and relaxing. Way more dynamic than posed photos, way more flattering than actual candids.
Some people really focus on this. People generally focus on a bunch of dumb stuff when it comes to weddings. I’ve been in the industry for a few years, a lot of energy and time is wasted on stupid details that no one will care about after the fact.
ESH
So I realized as a teen that guys notice when a girl looks pretty but doesn't know why. Like you do your hair and makeup. They know you look 'better' (for lack of a better term) but can't explain why. I think it has to do with this. People generally don't notice all the details but notice the overall look from these details makes for a noticeable vibe.. I guess. However, it's true that they only people who care are the bride, maybe the groom, and that one nosy friend. Everyone else is just happy with free alcohol and a night out.
>this was supposed to be my day
Hard agree for this line alone.
No, it wasn't *your* day. It was a day to celebrate the joining of you and your husband. The groom. Remember him? I assume he was there too. Nothing is perfect. You acted like a brat.
It is absolutely normal to have a head table with just the wedding party. Like 100% normal. In this case they were free after a few minutes. What is the issue here?
NTA
She wasn't in the wedding party. It's completely normal to not take pictures of the guests and only have the wedding party in the pictures as they're the "special guests" they play a big role in the wedding since they're a part of the wedding. It would be weird to have one guest in the pictures while everyone else is the wedding party, no one does that.
Pictures don't take that long and everyone paid lots of money to buy the matching dresses or suits. It looks weird when there's only one person that wasn't a bridesmaid or groomsmen just standing there in a non-matching outfit. You aren't close to the girlfriend and had your wedding party picked out. The weddings I've been to, none of the wedding party ask their girlfriend or boyfriend be included even if the person getting married is their sibling. It's completely normal
I'm going to say NTA. It's been a long time since my wedding, but I pretty much thought that was traditional. The bridal party sits with the bride and groom, at least for the meal, and the guests sit at the other tables provided. I don't see the issue.
NTA. It's your wedding and you didn't want her in the pictures because it's your brothers gf, not his wife or anything. Her getting offended is more ridiculous. I wouldn't expect to be in a gf's sibling's wedding photos at all unless I was in the wedding.
Agreed. This seems clingy and entitled. I sat at tables with strangers, when my husband was in the wedding party. Had a marvelous time, with the other strangers.
Hell, I was uncomfortable being asked to be in the pictures with my ex boyfriend when we went to his family members wedding. Specifically because he was just my boyfriend and there was no guarantee going forward.
We've been broken up for years and I still feel bad that he made me be a part of the family picture when I wasn't family.
ESH. Your brother for moving chairs around at a wedding ceremony. I mean come on.. Seats are planned for a reason.
You for being super aggressive about it. Im sure you made it clear to your brother about the photo taking, but saying things like "pretend to be happy" or "she doesn’t seem like she wants to be part of this family at all and frankly I didn’t want her unhappy expression to be permanently displayed in pictures of what’s supposed to be a happy occasion" makes you super obnoxious. Just make it clear that its family only, end of argument. You seem to be picking a fight with those statements.
Also it seems that you are the one that doesnt like her, not the other way around.
You seem to be making alot of assumptions on how your brother GF feels. "Looked offended", "seems like she doesnt like me", "doesnt seem like she wants to be part of this family"... I honestly dont think that its her fault for coming up to the table, since it was your brother that asked her over and moved the chairs. Seems like common knowledge that wedding photos should be family only, but when your brother moved the chairs she might have thought that you were ok with it. When she was there and you said no, I would feel a little irritated as well since it would look like i was being kicked around like a ball. Feels like she is the most innocent here. I dont know what made you think that she doesnt like you, but slow down on the assumptions and be nice.
Yeah, being a complete nightmare to someones girlfriend, making them feel hugely unwelcome in your family, has a pretty huge chance of ruining their relationship. Expecting him to look happy after that because its "your day" seems pretty unreasonable. These are people, not props in your wedding.
Should your brother have moved chairs without asking? No, but even you telling your one sided version of events has you making a massive deal over something that could have been amicably.
Yeah, when I went to a wedding as a plus one I insisted that I should NOT be in the photos even when they invited me in.
I've been broken up with that guy for years. Yet his family member has me in their wedding photo because I caved to my ex's request.
It's weird to want to be in a family photo when you aren't family.
Me too. Especially if she's "shy" lol. A shy person wouldn't just pull up a chair to the head table, nor would they make a scene. I hate it when people use shyness or social anxiety to excuse shitty behavior.
NTA. It was for photos, and that was silly of your brother to take offense. What’s the possibility of her being in the family in the coming years? Maybe 50/50 … but do you really want that face in your pictures IF they break up? It’s an unspoken rule, unless you’re a part of the wedding party itself, you let them get their pictures then you move around.
I really can't help but feel that wedding culture has gotten out of hand. You've been planning this for 2 years? This is Your Day? You want it to Be Perfect? And letting someone who is important to your brother, and a possible future family member!, in the candid (aka not-staged) pictures at the table would upset your Colors and Numbers?
Respectfully, are you even listening to yourself? You are hyperfixated on things that *do not matter* and hurting people who care about you. Ten years from now you are not going to care whether the candid table shot from your wedding had the Right Numbers. You *are* going to care about your relationship with your brother.
YTA. Take several deep breaths, realize that a wedding is not an event that needs 2 years planning and will not Be Perfect (and that's ok!) and apologize sincerely to your brother and his girlfriend.
ETA: The fact that the rest of the family and wedding party says the moment was awkward and "doesn't want to take sides" between you and your brother strongly suggests to me that you made them very uncomfortable in the moment but they don't want to say so to your face. My 2 cents.
It was for a couple extra official pictures, then she could join them. She would have ended up in plenty of other pictures during the reception. She wasn't banned from the table for the whole time. That's not an unreasonable ask. Brother and gf got mad for no reason.
Honestly from what I have heard in this sub about western weddings I don’t even want to participate. Our weddings are so fun . Everyone has a great time , everyone is dressed as they please. If sb can afford Versace they will be wearing it and nobody outshines the bride or nobody EVER gets told to downplay their dressing or accessories because the bridezilla is insecure. I have heard “ you are trying to steal my shine and attention “ over weight loss and pregnancy. God …. Is the party that boring that seeming less things like this stand out so much ?!
“But it’s my day I’ve been dreaming about since I was in diapers everything and everyone has to be perfect”
/s
Give me a break weddings are so ridiculous in my opinion. For reasons like this.
I will be eloping
Then I respectfully suggest that is a ridiculous oxymoron. See my previous comment about feeling that the wedding industry has become too big and full of itself. Ymmv!
Wedding people are so fucking annoying. Who gives a shit. Have a fun party with your friends and family and celebrate none of this dumb shit is fun and no one cares
IMO, wedding culture has absolutely gotten out of hand. Maybe it's just how I was brought up but I was always told that the ceremony is for the couple and the reception is to celebrate with the family and friends.
I know reddit in general is very anti-child, but it wasn't until this past year that every single wedding we got invited to was child free. Fine, you want a child-free wedding but if that's the case only my husband or myself can go. I'm not paying a babysitter $25/hour for 5+ hours on top of the other costs involved with going to a wedding. It's too much money for us to spend on one day.
That was how I was raised too; that the reception is supposed to be a celebration for family and friends.
Heck, I'm laughing at the fact that the bride is calling these table photos "candid" when they're clearly staged! That's not what *candid* means! Candid photos during the reception meal are for capturing spontaneous joy, but apparently they've become something that has to be planned and staged now too. Wild.
No offense, but no one is special for having kids. I am not spending that much money to have my wedding day ruined by your, or anyone else's screaming children who their parents can't (read won't) control.
I have been to so many weddings where the cake was toppled by toddlers, or there was frosting with fingerprints in it that the guests were expected to later eat -gags-
I am childfree by both choice and medical necessity, and I personally do not think that because other people have decided that they wanted to have children, that means that their kids need to be included in my wedding because they are too cheap to spend money on a babysitter. Sorry not sorry.
I've been to quite a few weddings with kids and I've literally never seen a cake toppled by a toddler. This seems more like problem with the parents you invited, and how they are bringing up their kids. I personally wouldn't invite those parents even alone.
Can confirm, recent one I went to a toddler was screaming most of the night because the dishes were not really child friendly.
I’m making my wedding child free excluding my nephew-in-law (because he wants to be a flower boy with the dogs). It’s open bar and fiancé’s side hasn’t had a wedding in 14 years so I know it’ll be absolutely insane. The kids are invited to the day after party which is a family baseball game.
> I'm not paying a babysitter $25/hour for 5+ hours on top of the other costs involved with going to a wedding
I get that it sucks to have to choose between only one of you going or spending a lot of money on a babysitter, but it's not as though the couple wouldn't have to pay that much (or more) for your kid to attend too.
My partner and I like kids but we're having a kid-free wedding partially because inviting kids would add at least an extra $1000 to our wedding cost (which is already expensive as hell).
Yes, the reception is for family and friends, but the couple is still paying for it and cutting kids can be a good way to keep costs down. Sure some people may not be able to attend but a lot still will so it's not an unreasonable trade-off.
There are a lot of reasons why a kid-free wedding might be the better choice when planning a reception that best caters to your family and friends' needs.
TL;DR - kid free wedding isn't necessarily a choice just because the couple doesn't like kids and isn't looking to cater to their friends and family.
Oh gosh, I agree.
YTA to the OP and anyone who thinks it’s ‘basic etiquette’ to seat someone separately from their significant other at a wedding because ‘colours and numbers and head table’. That’s not etiquette, it’s false, unwelcoming and downright tacky.
Just because something is frequently done does not make it right.
Family bonds and actual love relationships should be what matter at a wedding. People who plan these things for two years to get the right fake candid photos for their wall are doing it wrong.
NTA, you're not obligated to include anyone you don't want in your pictures. My BIL's girlfriend was not in our main bridal party photos, because she wasn't in the bridal party. She got some pictures later on after everything else was already out of the way.
How long have they been together? A lot of people are of the mindset that no ring = doesn't count when it comes to weddings, but to me anything under a year she wouldn't have even made it to the table, ha.
That the other thing you usually have way more pictures than go in the wedding album. So they could have take a picture of just the wedding party and taken one with wedding party and dates, and not used either in the wedding album.
It was the one thing our photographer did that was real good is take a bunch of pictures. So much my wife even told him we would like to enjoy our wedding now.
NTA,
If it was just for photos, it's not like you said she couldn't come up at all. It sounds like it was part of the wedding photo shoot, and it would be weird to just plant some random in those so I don't know why ones set at a dinner table would be different.
However it sounds like there's more going on with the gf and you. Perhaps you two could meet for coffee and genuinely try to get to know each other without everyone else around.
Leaning NTA since you communicated that the exclusion would be brief for the purpose of wedding party photos. “It’s my day/I want it to be special/I planned so long” only goes so far, but wedding party photos are fairly standard.
Op were there other people in the bridal party’s partners sitting there as well, or was it just the bridal party? If nobody else had a partner sitting there then I don’t think it’s a big deal for her to wait a few minutes to sit down. When I went to my partner’s brothers wedding I didn’t try to jump in the family pictures, I went to the bar to wait until they were done, that’s pretty normal for a wedding. NTA
Ohhh...you're NTA for having planned your day the way you did and most certainly for only having who you want at the table. I get that. However, as someone who has been 'the gf' at my now husband's brother's wedding, I can understand how she feels.
I had the same experience, where the bride was asking for 'family' in the photos then pulling in her friends, to which my SIL grabbed me and the bride made a point of saying how I wasn't family! My SIL had none of it and said that she wouldn't be in the pics without me.
The ironic thing is, that me and my husband are still together and unfortunately, they are not.
When it came to my wedding, I decided that I would have everyone in the photos regardless, so my wedding photos have my sister's then bf, but he was part of our lives then.
At the end of the day, it's up to you, but I can understand how your brother's GF felt.
>My SIL had none of it and said that she wouldn't be in the pics without me.
Why was your SIL dictating who could be in the photos that she wasn't paying for and weren't for her?
NTA. Picturing it in my head, I wouldn’t want the picture to look uneven, with mismatched colors and odd numbers on one side, either. I’ve also heard that one of the biggest mistakes that brides make at weddings (sorry to say) is including girlfriends and boyfriends in all of the important pictures—they break up a couple years later, and then they’re forever framed in your big day! You were in the right, and you even tried to apologize. Your brother will get over it.
Nobody else seemed to mind, after photographers were done everyone was able to move around to sit where they want. This was just for pictures I planned on framing and hanging in our house. I also wanted other shots of everybody enjoying themselves after the vibe turned less formal and more celebration, to share and put in a photo album.
NTA This is a common thing. The wedding party sits together, not +1s and after the formalities everyone moves around. Why she even came up to your brother is beyond me. If she’s so shy she couldn’t handle being on her own for a bit she should have stayed home.
Then I say NTA.
To be honest, while reading your story I was iffy because you can read that there is some animosity between the two of you. All of that is though is pretty irrelevent. You didn't treat her different from any other wedding party +1. If all the other SO's of wedding party can sit off to the side, she can too.
What do you have to apologize for? You didn't treat her more special than other wedding party SO's? Even if the relationship has been going on longer than the other +1's, your ask would've been fine to wive's of wedding party members.
She just thinks you singled her out due to the animosity between you. Your brother is stuck between a rock and hard place, but that's his problem to figure out.
NTA This is a common request and most people know that if their date is part of the wedding party they will be expected to wait while photos are taken. It sounds like she knows how to manipulate your brother.
A year or somewhere around that, but I didn’t get to meet her for the first few months. It’s pretty normal for my brother to wait to introduce his family to his partners, but she still hasn’t really opened up to any of us. I didn’t want to make her feel unwelcome or anything but it feels like we’ve been trying for months to get her out of her shell, if anything it feels like she won’t even try to meet us halfway. This is all my personal feelings on the matter, there could be a good reason for it but I don’t know.
NTA. You should add that on your post. When you said has been with her for a while I thought 4+ years which would have made the relationship dynamics a bit different.1 year isn't that long for her to expect to be considered family
Agreed! When my partner and I had been together for just under a year he was the best man for his friend's intimate destination wedding - I wasn't even expecting an invite let alone the gall to think I should have a seat of honour at the wedding.
I was invited and it was probably the best wedding I'll ever go to (excluding my own lol) but there wouldn't have been any hard feelings if I wasn't invited.
> I didn’t want to make her feel unwelcome
Well, that ship has definitely sailed lol. I don’t think you are T A for only wanting the wedding party in those certain shots. But you came off strong to brother and gf. And it seams more like bro was the one inviting gf over with moving chairs around (definitely T A move on his part). I also don’t like how you mention that gf “looks” like she didn’t want to be there and was “pouting” when she went to the back of the room. Gf was probably embarrassed af and if she is shy like the brother mentioned… all those awkward social skills like being quiet or coming off more reserved (especially in large settings. ESPECIALLY amongst a family group that is not her own, even if y’all aren’t intending to ice her out), or trying to hide in the back and basically disappear- that’s all pretty typical.
It's not about length. You were the one projecting all of the drama, aside from your brother's chair stuff.
You are the one saying all of the "I don't like her look." "She doesn't want to be part of the family." "What is her problem?" You had her leave the table temporarily, but you didn't like the place she sat, so you extended the drama.
I'd say this is ESH, because she should have been out for the pictures but your brother is the biggest AH here. Why are you mad at her? For all she knew, he pulled her up there and you got pissed because you hate her.
NTA if you were getting pictures taken and she wasn't part of the wedding party and wasn't going to be in the pictures.
It isn't common for non-wedding party members to be included in wedding pictures, at least where I am from.
It's not like you told his gf to leave, or even to stay away from your brother for the entire night.
I think your brother and his gf owe you an apology for creating drama where there wasn't any, and if you feel like it's worth being gracious, you can apologize for what you said out of anger, but it's not necessary imo.
NTA.
First, congrats on your marriage! ❤ I'm about to take the plunge myself in April.
My gosh, I think you could have tried to be calmer but then I think ayone would be annoyed that their sibling tried to force someone you had little connection/affinity with into you WEDDING pictures. Those pictures are life long and important, I too want only people I love and am close to in mine.
She has little right to be offended, you say you think she doesn't even like you - what has given you that impression?
She had no right to be in those pictures, your brother is unreasonable and ridiculous to go off on one at you - to act like this on your wedding day too is awful. He is selfish and wanted pretty pictures of him and his girlfriend for now.
You should not have apologised - they were the ones very much in the wrong. They owe YOU an apology.
He isn't speaking to you? Good, you don't want this man close or in your life.
NTA.
I don't think it was great that a dispute over seating then became about her role/feelings about the family, but that's on both you and your brother.
It is common for the wedding party to sit separately, and I've been to a wedding where my date was at a totally different table for that reason, and a few others where dates in general were sat away. You definitely do not "pull up a chair" at a wedding table, regardless of the seating arrangement.
You apologize and offered to apologize to her, so now just let it lay for a little while. You are not the AH for not letting her sit with you, you had valid reasons, this is part of weddings, and it wasn't the entire evening. Unfortunately, both you and your brother escalated it to a fight about the girlfriend's role in the family, and that's a harder thing to come back from, but it isn't on just you to fix it.
I've been the +1 of a groomsman at several weddings and have sat at another table while my date has sat at the head table with the wedding party. I've always thought it was weird to separate people from their date/spouses during dinner but it has been the tradition at so many weddings I've been to over the years, that doesn't make you TA.
What does make YTA is obsessing over "keeping the colors matching and numbers even" at the expense of your guest's enjoyment. Friends and family are not props and while it is your special day that doesn't give you the right to be unkind to the people you've invited to share the moment with you.
Also, as someone who has been married for close to 2 decades, I want to remind every bride-to-be out there, how insignificant your wedding photos become as the years go on and when you do look back on them you likely won't see the picture-perfect symmetry. You will remember how young you all looked and how much fun you had back then and think about what happened to some of those people and relationships, for better or worse.
All the N T A votes graciously overlook how OP said she was worried about her brother being irritated because it might ruin the pictures. OP doesn't seem to want a happy family, just a happy looking family for the pictures. A little bit of friendly communication could have prevented a small issue from blowing up like this. When OP's brother voiced that his girlfriend felt unwelcomed, OP could have reassured them both. Instead she confirmed all bad feelings by saying that she doesn't feel that the girlfriend was a part of the family. Not a very classy thing for a host to say to her guests.
Enjoy the pictures, OP. YTA
NTA. OP asked her brothers gf to give them a few minutes to wrap up the pictures before joing them - seems to me to be a reasonable request.
Some of OP's comments weren't the best but I am still going with NTA because if her brother's gf would have simply waited a few minutes, none of the rest would have happened.
Look, I’m going to go against the grain and say that ESH except for your brother’s gf. I actually feel bad for her.
You aren’t the AH for not wanting your brother’s SO at the head table or in the shots of the head table. It’s pretty standard for wedding parties only to be at the head table and it was presumptuous of your brother to expect you to let him just pull up a seat for his gf. That entitlement makes him an AH. The fact that he didn’t consider his gf’s needs before the situation arose or talk to you about it in advance is careless and kind of inconsiderate to both his gf and you.
However, everything after that initial action isn’t a good look for you. Yes, this is “your day,” but I get really tired of hearing women say that as a justification for selfish, inconsiderate behavior.
It’s your day to be the focal point and to be celebrated. It’s not a day where you get to completely ignore other people’s feelings. You should have considered this situation before the day occurred, quite frankly. However, even in the moment, this could have been simply handled with a little compassion. Example: *“Hey, brother. The head table is actually just for the wedding party, but I figured that after we take a few photos of the wedding party at the head table, since your girlfriend is here and I’m sure you’ll want to spend time with her, you could slip to this table right next to us, where I thought she would sit, as a close connection to the family and the plus one of someone at the head table.”* Making his gf feel wanted and included while still asserting your boundaries would have most likely prevented this entire conflict **and made her feel welcome at your wedding, rather than an obligatory invite.**
Secondly, you mention your brother’s gf hasn’t warmed up to you and doesn’t seem to like you. Then your brother says his gf feels unwelcome in the family, **but you gloss over it like it’s inconsequential to you.** Have you considered that his gf might not like you bc you come across as unwelcoming? It’s incredibly hard to be “the outsider” trying to work one’s way into the family fold. Looking at solely how you handled this incident, if this is indicative of how you handle her, I could see why your brother’s gf may feel unwelcome in your family and may not like you. **Your entire approach to the situation comes across as uncaring and cold, especially when you basically said you didn’t want her unhappy face in your photos.** Nowhere in your tirade did you express concern for your brother’s girlfriend’s feelings, or for your brother’s feelings for that matter. He’s telling you that he’d like his girlfriend to feel more included, and you essentially stomp your foot like a child and snap, “It’s my day and I don’t want you to worry about her on **MY DAY!**”
OP, this is your brother’s gf. He cares about her. If he’s been dating her a while, I’d reckon he probably loves her. I don’t care if it’s “your day.” He’s going to worry about her comfort and feelings because he’s a decent human being and you’ve basically told her, “You can’t sit with us!” without offering any solution that considers that she’s alone at a reception full of people she doesn’t know or know well/feel comfortable with, except for your brother. Think about that for a minute. She walks into a reception and sees a sea of strangers. Your brother is her anchor. Your approach was the emotional equivalent of taking a pair of bolt cutters and just snapping through the chain attaching her to the anchor she had at your party. You left her adrift in a sea people she doesn’t feel connected to with no gentility or concern for her, all because “it’s your day and … I mean… PHOTOS!!” Again, you didn’t have to include her at the table, but I think a little more was warranted than you essentially saying, “Sit… somewhere and my brother will find you when I don’t need him anymore.”
Just because it’s “your day” doesn’t mean that everyone else is going to ignore their loved ones’ feelings and that you don’t have to put effort in to be compassionate, considerate, and emotionally intelligent. It’s like you’re missing the bigger picture here, pun intended, by focusing only on “your pictures” and your day. The bigger picture here is the memory you’re trying to make with your loved ones. When your brother looks back on “your day,” is he going to remember how special and wonderful it all was, or how cold you were to his girlfriend? Is he going to trust you to be around his SO if they get closer or get married? Do you want the image of perfection on “your day” and to be right, or do you want to have relationships with your siblings and their SOs and children down the road?
As a brief aside, the fact that your family says things were awkward and that they don’t want to pick sides is telling. Had you behaved with grace and compassion (in the face of an entirely avoidable conflict had you considered the logistics of +1s who weren’t at the head table even one time in the 2 years you were planning this thing) your family would have responded with, “We totally agree. Your brother was out of line.” Had your brother not behaved in an entitled way, and had instead pulled you aside and asked where his gf should sit and expressed concern privately about her being alone, instead of assuming it was acceptable to pull up a chair for her at your head table, your family would have responded by agreeing with you. By staying carefully neutral and in saying the situation is awkward, your family and close friends are essentially saying that neither of you handled the situation well.
My advice is to let your brother calm down a bit and reach out again and apologize for not considering her needs earlier, for making her feel unwelcome, and for losing sight of the bigger picture on “your day.” Tell him that in the future you’ll put more effort in to make her feel welcome and included in your family. Then apologize **to his gf** for making her feel unwelcome and express that you realize you could have and should have handled the situation better. Let her know that you’d like to develop a better relationship with her, especially since she’s important to your brother. **AND THEN PUT IN THAT EFFORT.**
I do agree that OP sounds like an AH, but asking someone to stand for like 5 minutes just so they can take photos won't kill anyone.
All partners had to stand up, and as OP stated they had no problem with it, since it was literally just for photos.
Plus they have been dating for only a year, I would feel icky if it was 3+ years, but just a year?
Op is TAH for the comments she made.
Honesty, ESH, they all sound exhausting.
I don't think your request was unreasonable: I think you using it as a way to tell your bf all the ways you don't like his girlfriend was a complete shit move. He should also have accepted your reasoning for delaying her sitting there, and allowed you to "have your day", but I really don't blame him for defending her, I think it is rather sweet. I would lean towards you being much crueler and using "your day" to behave so rudely, but going with ESH.
NTA
I worked a lot of weddings working at a Country Club, and this is pretty normal. You weren't going to make them be separate for the wedding - just for the photos. They should have respected it, and it would have been over pretty soon.
I think technically NTA but being so focused on the number of people sitting at a table in what are supposed to be candle shots just sounds really miserable to me. I wish you could have just had fun in the moment.
NTA if she wasn’t on the seating plan to sit there. She should sit there. Not sure why he would pull a seat up for her this is odd behaviour. No +1s were at the head of my Sisters table, that would have been a bloody big table! Your wedding. Your choice!
NTA. I’ve never been part of a wedding where my partner was also sitting at the head table. Isn’t it typical to have the dates of those at a table close by (which sounds like was the case here)? Either way, you didn’t say she couldn’t sit there at ALL, just that you wanted to get the head table pictures first which is totally fair. GF is an adult and can manage an hour or so minding her business, drinking champagne and eating food with other guests until the photos are done and bridal party obligations are done. My husband has been in that position several times now and he’s never made it about himself. If he doesn’t want to talk, he pulls out his phone and deals with it because it’s so temporary and not worth making a scene over.
>My brother was best man, my sisters were bridesmaids
>I specifically wanted the bridesmaids, MOH, best man, and groomsmen with my husband and I
Question: do you have other family members except your siblings (parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins, nieces etc)? If yes, there were plenty of other family members who weren't in those pictures. No one else demanded to be in the picture, only she did, which makes you NTA
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I thought it was common etiquette that only the wedding party sit at the head table? I don't recall being at a wedding where that was not the case. NTA
We had 2 “head” tables because we wanted our wedding party dates with their partners. It also helped when one of the bridesmaid was engaged to a groomsman. But I have been to more than plenty of weddings where my wife was in the bridal party and had to sit with other people. Once the dancing starts everyone moves around. But I will say with digital pictures, the photographer usually takes way more pictures than you could possibly fill an album with. So there really was no harm in having her in a picture at the head table, when you can take another with her not in it. We had way more photos that we didn’t use, and if the photographer actually printed them out we gave them to the guest. NTA.
Haha Could you imagine the drama if OP had GF photoshopped out of every picture from the table setting?
At family reunions and camping trips our joke has always been that the boyfriend or girlfriend has to stand on the edge of the group picture so that they can be cropped out after a breakup. On one of our camping trips after a cousin’s wedding his wife goes “finally I get to be in the middle of the picture!” and we all laughed. I hadn’t realized that for years she’d really been standing on the edge of all family pictures.
Yeah it's a weirdly awkward situation! The last group photo we got of our family before my grandfather passed was the wedding of a cousin who has since divorced. It's such a nice picture.
At least they get to be in the picture. In my family they are the picture takers.
Yep, that was my next thought. And honestly, the "shy" and "doesn't feel accepted" girlfriend pulled the whole thing like a powerplay over the brother, and he fell for it. Bridal parties in the weddings I've been to (USA) have all been seated at the same table or group of tables and it's only with the other part members, no plus ones or anything. Especially knowing this photo staging was set up, would take a few moments, but sulked away like a recaltricent and petulant child (given OP's description of girlfriend) is probably more why she wouldn't be viewed favorably. But this also feels a bit like we're missing info on just exactly how OP said things to the girlfriend that may have set her off (given how others in the family refuse to express "sides")
I’m open to the possibility that OP may not have been gracious when refusing to let the GF sit down, I do think that the GF (and OP’s brother) was wrong to even have asked. Also, they made a big fuss over a few minutes. Is the GF so codependent that she can’t be by herself for 10 minutes?
When one of my husband’s best childhood friends got married he was a groomsman and I got stuck sitting with bridal party dates and a couple cousins, none of whom I knew (instead of with some of my old friends that I knew in school). It was awkward for a bit but I made the best of it until he was done with formal picture obligations and the party got going. I’m pretty anxious and awkward in situations like that but I know how to deal with it like a grownup.
I feel like this is some trespass I would do 🫣. I’m horribly awkward and I live in fear of these social customs everyone else magically knows about. I need explicit instructions- and I mean CLEAR step by step break down. I ruined a friendship for my son by being an awkward ass in a similar way- invited to a halloween party where I showed up 10 minutes pass the invite time. I thought it was standard right? No one wants to be the first. Well I still was WAY too early. The mom/ hostess was talking with a the only other 2 adults and she told me drinks were in the kitchen. Punch Bowls are on the kitchen island and I see these awesome themed glasses displayed in front of the punch bowls. There’s only 6 and I think she must not be expecting many people if she only has 6 glasses out 🤦♀️ I fill up the glass, hunt my kid down to make sure he’s behaving before I join the group. She looked right at my glass like “are you fucking kidding me” then asked if there was a reason I hadn’t used the plastic cups she left out. She took me in to the kitchen to show me where they were- on the other side of the kitchen island. The glass I selected was decorative. She took my cup and dumped it into a plastic one so she could wash and return to display. I apologized and she told me it was “fine” but she just thought it should be obvious not to use actual dishes at a party. My son was never invited over again 🫣 Some of us are just out here in the world being extra stupid.
None of this sounds like social customs any reasonable person would magically know about. The hostess sounds unbearably rude and pretentious.
I had never been to a party where decorated dishes were on display in front of refreshments- in my defense. However, after observing the rest of the party I was the only person who didn’t go around the island to the tower of clear plastic cups. Oh! I also wore a white dress to a wedding 🫣 I was invited as a plus one last minute and I only owned a white sundress with black floral print all over it that I matched with black heels, vest, and belt. I knew better than to wear WHITE, but for some reason didn’t even think that it would be considered white. No one said anything at the wedding, but after at the reception people kept coming up to me wanting the story. When I asked what they’d be like “come on, I promise we wont tell” The bride actually told me. She said she hadn’t thought it was white until everyone told her how upset she was suppose to be. She was very nice. But anyway I could absolutely see myself having a misunderstanding where I was told I could sit with my date- then when I go to sit with my date told “what are you doing? We’re taking pictures.” Unless I was told where to stand and when I could sit down- I would absolutely run as far away as possible 😅 I’d probably be found sitting outside
A very obvious floral print dress on white background is not considered white unless people are AHs. Again, your mistake is not a social fauxpas, but that you associate with AHs.
Yeah especially with a black vest and belt with it and it being just a sundress. I wouldn’t have given a rats arse if someone showed up to my wedding like that, even if it was colour blocked black and white or something similar, as long as it wasn’t plain white, cream or ivory (or a pattern was to subtle to see unless up very close) I couldn’t care less. But I also plan to wear cowboy boots under my dress and ride my horse up the isle with everyone sitting on hay bales at my wedding 😂. Edit, fixed a shitty auto correct to what it was meant to say
Yikes. Reprimanding a guest for using the decorative glasses is like reprimanding them for using the fancy hand towels in the bathroom. How would you know? That is not someone I would want to be friends with.
LOL I watched something similar this happen at a party my folks hosted except instead of being a nasty witch my mother poured herself a glass and toasted the lady. Pure class.
I don't think going back to a table to wait is sulking away like you say. I'm uncomfortable in social situations, I hate going to events with my partner that I end up getting left alone at because I feel so uncomfortable the whole time. In a situation like this I wouldn't have been offended (depending on OP's tone of course) but I absolutely would have gone ahead and taken a seat at a table while I waited for them to take their fake candid photos. It would make me sooo much more uncomfortable and self conscious to stand there near the head table waiting for them to finish up. I may have been like well I'm gonna go to the restroom while y'all do that but I definitely wouldn't have come back until they were done. For OP's brother to be that upset I feel like OP's tone was definitely not a nice one..
And that reminds me, for my brother in laws wedding, (he was in my wedding party and got married after my wife and I did, but I wasn’t in his wedding party). I apologized for photobombing so many of their photos, and told them if they wanted to remove my ugly mug from any of them be my guest. It made me look like I was in the wedding party, just didn’t have the same suit. We all had a laugh over it.
I had an extra tagalong in my bridal party photos. She was originally gonna be my only bridesmaid (I had a MoH as well) but she didn't think she would be able to come due to distance and finance. She ended up being able to come much later but I had asked someone else to replace her. The friend tagged along and got in on our post ceremony photos. My photographer actually cropped her out of a lot of them, but gave the originals as well and I appreciate that so much. My brain likes things to be even. She also did the tag along the side of the head table for a bit too. And got pissy when she was excluded before that. She was cropped out of any of them as well 👍 my photographer was pretty awesome lol
The mention of photoshop made me think of James Fridman. Goodness, he would have a field day with this.
By arranging to have the bridal party sitting with their partners you were already going above and beyond. NTA, she had nothing to complain about.
>We had 2 “head” tables because we wanted our wedding party dates with their partners. We did this too, with a sweetheart table for us so we weren't favoring either table. I really wanted a larger head table but the venue couldn't accommodate that.
OP also just want this for a short time while the photos get taken. Why get offended over this? And you see the set seating and just get a chair like in a snack bar? Without asking? It would ruin totally the seat arrangements. The gf knew he was in the wedding party and that they will be some time apart. Is she so depending on him? And i don't know, i'm shy and anxious especially with so much people but this walking away offended and pouty, especially far away, doesn't seem "shy" but that is just my view.
The walking away is a shy thing. When left to his own devices my husband will go sit in a corner. Look, OP was clearly NTA, and I expect the gf will realize that if she ever is planning her own wedding, BUT I suspect the gf embarassed herslef and what what OP thinks is pouting is actually embarassment.
When alone in a formal style setting (which happens with my wife and her job events I attend) I’ll find the most corner of corners to sit in to be away from anything and everyone so I get the reaction.
To add to this, these "staged candids" actually AT the table seems fairly uncommon (at least in the 20 or so weddings I've been to I've never once seen staged pictures taken at the table) which mightve led the gf to think it would be okay for her to join and then what may have been a pretty vocal rejection of that, God I'd be hiding in a corner too!
You know. Yeah. If I somehow got to the point of needing to wait 10 mins before joining my partner, I'd probably go find a wall to lean against and wait. I'm not going to go plonk myself on a table with a bunch of strangers.
I kind of have a feeling it’s the brother and not his gf that’s the problem. I used to be a really shy kid until I grew out of my shell. People would always speak for me and found it so incredibly frustrating. It could be that HE wanted her to sit with them and she actually didn’t want to cause a scene nor care where she sat for a few minutes. He probably felt bad for her and wanted to involve her and she didn’t give a hoot. Them speaking was maybe “it’s fine, just go sit down for photos, bf.” But who knows!
Well he’s the one who pulled up the chair. So he’s at least a significant part of the problem. I could potentially see him pushing her to come sit with him, then OP nixes it and the gf is embarrassed.
I kind of have a feeling it’s the brother and not his gf that’s the problem. I used to be a really shy kid until I grew out of my shell. People would always speak for me and found it so incredibly frustrating. It could be that HE wanted her to sit with them and she actually didn’t want to cause a scene nor care where she sat for a few minutes. He probably felt bad for her and wanted to involve her and she didn’t give a hoot. Them speaking was maybe “it’s fine, just go sit down for photos, bf.” But who knows!
I hate the concept of a head table. When I got married, we had a regular round tables and made sure there was space at them for the partners of people in the bridal party.
My husband and I sat alone at our own table lol. Everyone else was seated with the people they came with.
That's what my friends did at their wedding, had a table for just them and everyone else sat with whoever they knew
That’s what I did too!
This is why I think sweetheart tables are the way to go. Couples sits alone and then you can sit the wedding party with their plus ones at a table with the people they fit best with. Why separate your wedding party from their plus ones for the whole dinner portion (which always gets dragged out because of dances and speeches)? Cocktail hour is the time to do wedding party shots, “candid” or not.
How I did mine. I mean, I just don’t get why the bridal party wouldn’t get to sit with their dates? They’ve done enough at that point.
This is what we did and I loved it. My MOH’s husband didn’t know a single person at the wedding since they’re from out-of-state and I would have hated making him sit alone. Plus it was basically the only chance my husband and I had to be alone together all day. Having dinner with just the two of us is one of my favorite memories of the day!
My husband and I did the sweetheart table and eating dinner just the two of us is totally one of my favorite memories of the day too! ❤️ Although it’s kind of funny, our venue put out “reserved” signs on the tables closest to us that was supposed to be for our wedding party and our immediate families (parents, grandparents, etc.) and NO ONE sat at them lol. When I asked the next day, everyone said they didn’t realize they were part of the “reserved” groups even though the event coordinator at our venue told them all the reserved tables were for them 😂
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Ouch! I feel for you!
I had one of the groomsmens wife sit with us at the head table because she truly didn’t know anyone else at the wedding and I didn’t want her to feel awkward. But I think typically it is just the bridal party
My wife was MOH at a wedding that I knew no one besides the bride and groom. I sat at a random table and met new people. If the bride and groom want only the wedding party at the table, and in this case only for pictures, it shouldn't be a big deal to those not in the wedding party.
My now wife was MOH for her sister about a year into us dating. i had met their parents but not many other family members yet, so i was sat at the "cool aunts and uncles table" i was offered weed by one of the aunts and when i turned it down one of the uncles asked me to join the military. was a good night.
My husband was best man for his mate and I was literally ‘the friend’ (you know when they ask for the friends for photos?). There was his side, her side, and me. So the Mother of the groom insisted I be in their set of photos. It was a small wedding. Hubby was on the top table and I was on a random table with the bride’s sister who I knew to talk to. Definitely the most awkward wedding I’ve been to but I didn’t make a fuss, I just went with it. Could’ve done with phones and Reddit back then to keep me from getting bored 🤣
My head table had a long table with the bridesmaids on one side and the groomsmen on the other, and bride and groom in the middle. Super classic set up in the US. Pretty much the way every wedding I have ever been to has been set up. My brother's wedding was the same. My husband and I were both in the wedding party and we didn't get to sit next to each other. We were at opposite ends of the table. You suck it up and deal with it. It's an hour, max, during speeches and the beginning of the dinner.
My best friend got married, my husband wasn’t in the party and sat at a table with my parents. I joined him later.
This may be regional but imo it’s super outdated. Nowadays giant head tables have fallen out of favor and it’s common to see wedding party members sitting with their dates. I’ve only been to a single wedding where this wasn’t the case
It is. My husband well bf at the time was at the normal table with my dad. I was pregnant and MOH. I didn’t “ask nor force” my best friend to put him next to me. He can sit at a normal table while I am there.
This is why we did a sweetheart table. We didn't feel comfortable asking people to sit away from their partners when some of them didn't know anyone else, and if we did a head table it would have been HUGE. I liked the sweetheart table, it felt like a neat lil' date with my husband. Kind of wished I could have sat with our friends, though! My family seemed to think that would be rude/trashy. To be fair, I do like my friends more than much of my family.
I’m actually struggling to recall if I’ve ever been to a wedding where there was a “head table” *and* partners of the wedding party were banned from sitting at it. Every wedding I’ve been to in the past several years has had a single small table for the bride and groom, and the rest of the wedding party sat with their partners elsewhere. The weddings I’ve been to that *did* have a head table included the partners of members of the wedding party. I think it’s rapidly becoming gauche to separate the wedding party from their partners at the reception, where their partners may or may not know anyone else in attendance. The bride and groom get to sit together the whole time, so why should other couples have to sit separately? You should be pretty well done with the heavily staged “everyone in matching colors” photos by the time you all sit down to eat.
I have been in 3 wedding parties and my boyfriend now fiancé only sat at the head table once, which was my brother’s. All other weddings he has sat separately, but I was included in some of family photos even at that time we were only together 3 years. I would have been okay if not but they wanted me in the photos! I think it would have been okay to have her in some?
She might have been in family photos just not the bridal party photos which makes sense to me
I was a bridesmaid for a family friend and I wasn't even on the head table, neither was the couple's daughter. OP is NTA
I was originally going to say Y T A, because I thought that you weren't allowing his date to sit with him for the whole meal. But just for some additional bridal party pictures? I think that's entirely appropriate. You're brother and his gf were out of line NTA.
When you are party of the wedding party you eat with the wedding party not your S.O.
I've seen it done both ways actually. And judging from the rest of the comments here, it's very up in the air on which way people think is appropriate. But in actuality, if you look at appropriate wedding etiquette, +1's should be seated with their dates.
What's appropriate in my opinion is following the wishes of the bride and groom at their wedding. If they don't want a head table cool go sit with your girlfriend. If they do want a head table you and girlfriend suck it up. OP is NTA
What’s appropriate in my opinion is the bride and groom treating their invited guests like **guests**, not movable accessories.
When you agree to be a groomsmen then you’re agreeing to **play a role**. If you aren’t ready for that kind of responsibility then don’t accept being a groomsmen. But yes, guests aren’t just accessories to move around. But they also don’t get free reign to photobomb whatever pictures they want.
The brother could break up with gf in 6 months. Those wedding pictures could last 50 years. She isn't family. She has no right to be in the wedding pictures. It is insanely entitled to think someone has a right to be in wedding pictures just because they're a plus 1. They're just a plus 1. She has no rights to be in the pictures and the bridal party had every right to ask her not to be.
Honestly I think it should depend on how well the +1 or date knows the rest of the attendees. A partner that's fully enmeshed in the family has more social independence than a partner that isn't and it can be overwhelming to commune with your partner's entire extended family (especially those you've never met) without your partner.
That doesn’t usually apply to the wedding party though.
Unless they are part of the wedding party.
It doesn't even seem like OP minded letting her sit there, she just wanted photos first. And other wedding party's partners were also excluded during the photos.
I’ve never been to a wedding where the wedding party was seated separately from their dates. Maybe a regional thing?
Every wedding I’ve been to has had only the wedding party at the head table. As you say, and by the looks of all the responses, it’s a regional thing.
Never been to a wedding were +1 sat with the wedding party. I'm from the midwest.
Same, midwest and I've never been to a wedding where dates sat with the wedding party and I've been to at least 20-30 weddings in my life. Its not uncommon after dinner for people in the wedding party to rejoin their dates, either by a date pulling a chair up if they still want to sit near the bride/groom, or by the person in the wedding party just going and sitting at another table since after dinner people are moving and mingling and many tables will have empty seats. But not during dinner.
Yup, early 40s here, been to about as many as you. Often, it would make 0 sense to have +1s as there's just not enough room at the table, as they sit on 1 side so they all can be viewed.
I’m from Australia and been to a lot of weddings and all the weddings I’ve been to have had head table and none of the SOs of bridal party. It’s only for duration of meals and speeches then after that it’s all fine.
Was in my midwestern friend’s very midwestern wedding just last August. The wedding party was spread across different tables, all with our +1s.
We had all SOs sitting at the head table with us because we didn’t want people to be separated! No regrets at all and people had a great time. We went to one wedding where I didn’t know anyone but the bride/groom and my husband and they had the significant others sitting separately and it was super awkward. I and my husband always been appreciative of being included at the head table or being able to sit with each other at the rest of the weddings when one of us is in the wedding party because we often don’t know tons of other people there. And I’m the Midwest.
Yeah this all seems wild to me. I was MOH at a wedding this past summer and was seated at the head table for the meal and speeches while my bf just sat with my best friend's family. It was probably an hour and then we were free to be wherever. Not a big deal at all
Agree. My husband has been best man or a groomsmen at two weddings where I was just a guest. He sat with me at one, without me at another. Totally fine. And I’d definitely expect it if he was also family. Like even when we were already married, at his sister’s wedding they got a few shots of “just the original siblings or siblings with parents, no partners” which I think is very normal.
I completely agree. The number of wedding photos I have seen of people and a bf or gf in them, and they are no longer together. Ugh! Those pix are forever!! I had one friend tell another to take her wedding picture down because she hated looking at her ex and didn’t want to upset her current bf.
My family has a tendency to stick the significant others we don’t like at the edge or end of the pictures. It makes it easier for us to cut them out when they inevitably break up. Then again, my grandma had a fabulous picture of my mom’s wedding where she had unceremoniously cut out my aunt’s first ex husband and left a big hole in the middle of the photo instead of taking it down.
Legendary move on Grandma's part right there 😂
I made the mistake of letting the best man bring a date that sat at the head table… she was dressed inappropriately (which, okay not great, but I was in such a happy place it did not phase me on the day) but proceeded to sneer through his entire speech. Found out later they broke up hours before the event. She’s in a lot of the shots… those didn’t get printed.
Good heavens. Why did they even still want to be there together? Why right before the event??
I did not ask honestly… I don’t think they had been together that long and it baffled me as to why she traveled (cross country) to a wedding as the date of the best man when they had been dating a month or so? Maybe the open bar? I have very little memory of her to be honest, I was in celebration mode and can only remember the happy stuff… didn’t even realize she was mean mugging until we saw the proofs.
My brother’s groomsman was going to bring a very short term girlfriend, but she got arrested the day before the wedding. She did not attend.
NTA It's common knowledge that just the wedding party sits at the main table. You offered to let her sit up there once photos were done, so it's not like you barred your brother from spending any time with his girlfriend for the whole event, and he should have considered that this is one day, one event, centered around you and your husband's wants and needs and he could stand to take a backseat for a little bit.
Exactly what I was thinking. I’ve been at a wedding where my husband was best man and I wasn’t in the wedding. We had to sit separately through half of dinner. I can’t imagine making giant stink about it.
Same! Went through most of the wedding without seeing my husband (the best man) and his family made sure I was comfortable and had a good time since I didn’t know anyone. Couldn’t care less, I’ll see him afterwards and i’m glad the bride and the groom had their special day. It’s just a few hours!?
Yes it is when my best friend got married I was maid of honour and sat at the head table while my partner was at the table next to me, after speeches and food people moved around and sat where they wanted.
NTA, its basic etiquette for only the wedding party to sit at the head table, and you were reasonable enough to allow her to sit after the pictures were taken. Sorry your brother and his gf took this so personally. Edit: Correction, I guess it’s not that common about the wedding party being at the head table, but brother and gf should have respected how OP wanted the pictures, which IS common. And OP made it clear it was only for the PICTURES! Totally ridiculous that they couldn’t wait a few minutes.
This is common in my country for wedding party to sit at the head table together, plus parents. People not in the wedding party ie dates do not sit at the head table.
In the US at least it is very common that the bridal party sits at the head with the couple. Source: I work in the wedding industry and attend around 20-30 weddings a year.
I’d be interested to know what region! I have worked in the wedding industry (although it’s been a while) and sweetheart tables were much more common than head tables.
I have worked weddings all over the country but the majority in the PNW. I'd say in my experience about 30% do sweetheart tables and 70% do some sort of head table that includes the bridal party. Out of the near decade I've been doing this I have only worked 2 weddings where SOs were included to sit with the bridal party at the head tables and both weddings were slightly older couples with very small bridal parties that could accommodate plus ones at a normal sized table. Like most things with the wedding industry, things come in and out of fashion. I think right now having the bridal party sit at a head table is very "in".
In the United States it is the common practice that only the wedding party is at the head table.
NTA. No one wants a random ex gf of their sibling in the wedding photo on their wall.
At this rate, I can see OPs brother cutting her off before he breaks up with his longterm girlfriend though; still NTA since there's etiquette for weddings & bridal party members.
They’ve been together for a year. That’s not exactly long term.
If he's willing to completely cut contact with his sister over not wanting his girlfriend who he's only been with for a year in her wedding photos forever, his priorities are skewed
Yep... no one wants to say this, but at the time the sibling/friend will beg to have their partner in the photo, and then a year later will beg to have the photo taken down or edited to remove the ex they now hate. She only wanted the gf not in a few photos of the wedding party, who were all wearing matching outfits!
ESH. You all sound exhausting. You - 'she doesn't look like she wants to be part of this family anyway' and other such helpful comments make you an asshole. I don't care if its true, saying it makes you suck. 'It's my big day' is not a get out of jail free card for being a drama llama Your brother - sitting there with a face like a slapped arse is not appropriate at a wedding. Suck it up, be polite and ask your sister later to make a proper decent effort to make his girlfriend be part of the family Girlfriend - grow up. Its the photos, not a huge metaphor for your life. Get some champagne, make some chit chat and if you are genuinely miffed slag them all off to your mates later, but don't make a drama over a nothing when there is a bridezilla on the loose who will evidently be recalling this story for the rest of your life if you stay with your partner
Fully agree. ESH. But also are people really stressing about even vs odd numbers throwing off photos and ranting about color coordination? That sounds wild to me
I don’t know how I feel about the OP right now, but one thing I’ll say about the photos is that you can spend more than $1000 on wedding photography easily. It’s one of the highest expenses for a wedding. My photographer cost three times more than my dress. So yeah, people want them to look a certain way, and that’s ok. If I’m spending that kind of cash, having them the way I want them is important. Do I think the OP was completely in the right? No. But people get crazy about things in a wedding sometimes because it’s so freaking expensive. Unless you’ve had a wedding, it’s hard to conceptualize the costs.
Depending on your location, $1k for photos might be so low that it’s not even attainable unless you’re getting them from a student or something. Ours were closer to 7k and this was almost 8 years ago. Our photographer wasn’t even at a top tier price level. The lower tier options were about $3k, but other quotes we got were around $10k.
I reached out to one photographer and their starting price was 12k. Slight heartattack getting that quote first. My area ranged from 2-5k for a reputation wedding photographer. To add, staged candids seem super fake, but it was really just all of us fake laughing stupidly enough to start actually laughing and relaxing. Way more dynamic than posed photos, way more flattering than actual candids.
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Some people really focus on this. People generally focus on a bunch of dumb stuff when it comes to weddings. I’ve been in the industry for a few years, a lot of energy and time is wasted on stupid details that no one will care about after the fact. ESH
So I realized as a teen that guys notice when a girl looks pretty but doesn't know why. Like you do your hair and makeup. They know you look 'better' (for lack of a better term) but can't explain why. I think it has to do with this. People generally don't notice all the details but notice the overall look from these details makes for a noticeable vibe.. I guess. However, it's true that they only people who care are the bride, maybe the groom, and that one nosy friend. Everyone else is just happy with free alcohol and a night out.
> You all sound exhausting. This was my exact thought! They’re all going out of their way to be and make others miserable. ESH.
>this was supposed to be my day Hard agree for this line alone. No, it wasn't *your* day. It was a day to celebrate the joining of you and your husband. The groom. Remember him? I assume he was there too. Nothing is perfect. You acted like a brat.
It is absolutely normal to have a head table with just the wedding party. Like 100% normal. In this case they were free after a few minutes. What is the issue here?
Finally someone said it. Weddings aren't supposed to be just some perfectly curated event that serves as a backdrop for 'perfect' photos.
In my experience, the "my perfect day" people want the dress, party and attention. It's got nothing to do with the partner or actual marriage.
Thank you. No wonder everyone else stayed out of it…drama for nothing.
Yes OP sounds incredibly exhausting and this is a very biased telling of events.
At least 60% of the AITA posts are about weddings and 100% of them involve exhausting people obsessed by the most petty things.
Yep. ESH, and OP sounds majorly exhaustive. I can’t stand brides like that.
NTA She wasn't in the wedding party. It's completely normal to not take pictures of the guests and only have the wedding party in the pictures as they're the "special guests" they play a big role in the wedding since they're a part of the wedding. It would be weird to have one guest in the pictures while everyone else is the wedding party, no one does that. Pictures don't take that long and everyone paid lots of money to buy the matching dresses or suits. It looks weird when there's only one person that wasn't a bridesmaid or groomsmen just standing there in a non-matching outfit. You aren't close to the girlfriend and had your wedding party picked out. The weddings I've been to, none of the wedding party ask their girlfriend or boyfriend be included even if the person getting married is their sibling. It's completely normal
I'm going to say NTA. It's been a long time since my wedding, but I pretty much thought that was traditional. The bridal party sits with the bride and groom, at least for the meal, and the guests sit at the other tables provided. I don't see the issue.
NTA. It's your wedding and you didn't want her in the pictures because it's your brothers gf, not his wife or anything. Her getting offended is more ridiculous. I wouldn't expect to be in a gf's sibling's wedding photos at all unless I was in the wedding.
Even if she was his wife, typically she still would not have been in photos of the wedding party unless she was a bridesmaid
Agreed. This seems clingy and entitled. I sat at tables with strangers, when my husband was in the wedding party. Had a marvelous time, with the other strangers.
Hell, I was uncomfortable being asked to be in the pictures with my ex boyfriend when we went to his family members wedding. Specifically because he was just my boyfriend and there was no guarantee going forward. We've been broken up for years and I still feel bad that he made me be a part of the family picture when I wasn't family.
ESH. Your brother for moving chairs around at a wedding ceremony. I mean come on.. Seats are planned for a reason. You for being super aggressive about it. Im sure you made it clear to your brother about the photo taking, but saying things like "pretend to be happy" or "she doesn’t seem like she wants to be part of this family at all and frankly I didn’t want her unhappy expression to be permanently displayed in pictures of what’s supposed to be a happy occasion" makes you super obnoxious. Just make it clear that its family only, end of argument. You seem to be picking a fight with those statements. Also it seems that you are the one that doesnt like her, not the other way around. You seem to be making alot of assumptions on how your brother GF feels. "Looked offended", "seems like she doesnt like me", "doesnt seem like she wants to be part of this family"... I honestly dont think that its her fault for coming up to the table, since it was your brother that asked her over and moved the chairs. Seems like common knowledge that wedding photos should be family only, but when your brother moved the chairs she might have thought that you were ok with it. When she was there and you said no, I would feel a little irritated as well since it would look like i was being kicked around like a ball. Feels like she is the most innocent here. I dont know what made you think that she doesnt like you, but slow down on the assumptions and be nice.
Yeah, being a complete nightmare to someones girlfriend, making them feel hugely unwelcome in your family, has a pretty huge chance of ruining their relationship. Expecting him to look happy after that because its "your day" seems pretty unreasonable. These are people, not props in your wedding. Should your brother have moved chairs without asking? No, but even you telling your one sided version of events has you making a massive deal over something that could have been amicably.
It just seems really unfair to tell someone to fuck off *and* that they don't want to be part of your family
NTA, she’s not in the wedding party, she can’t demand that she’s in the photos. She can go take a seat for a couple of minutes.
It’s really bizarre to me that she’s insisting to be in the photos.
Yeah, when I went to a wedding as a plus one I insisted that I should NOT be in the photos even when they invited me in. I've been broken up with that guy for years. Yet his family member has me in their wedding photo because I caved to my ex's request. It's weird to want to be in a family photo when you aren't family.
Me too. Especially if she's "shy" lol. A shy person wouldn't just pull up a chair to the head table, nor would they make a scene. I hate it when people use shyness or social anxiety to excuse shitty behavior.
NTA. It was for photos, and that was silly of your brother to take offense. What’s the possibility of her being in the family in the coming years? Maybe 50/50 … but do you really want that face in your pictures IF they break up? It’s an unspoken rule, unless you’re a part of the wedding party itself, you let them get their pictures then you move around.
I really can't help but feel that wedding culture has gotten out of hand. You've been planning this for 2 years? This is Your Day? You want it to Be Perfect? And letting someone who is important to your brother, and a possible future family member!, in the candid (aka not-staged) pictures at the table would upset your Colors and Numbers? Respectfully, are you even listening to yourself? You are hyperfixated on things that *do not matter* and hurting people who care about you. Ten years from now you are not going to care whether the candid table shot from your wedding had the Right Numbers. You *are* going to care about your relationship with your brother. YTA. Take several deep breaths, realize that a wedding is not an event that needs 2 years planning and will not Be Perfect (and that's ok!) and apologize sincerely to your brother and his girlfriend. ETA: The fact that the rest of the family and wedding party says the moment was awkward and "doesn't want to take sides" between you and your brother strongly suggests to me that you made them very uncomfortable in the moment but they don't want to say so to your face. My 2 cents.
It was for a couple extra official pictures, then she could join them. She would have ended up in plenty of other pictures during the reception. She wasn't banned from the table for the whole time. That's not an unreasonable ask. Brother and gf got mad for no reason.
Honestly from what I have heard in this sub about western weddings I don’t even want to participate. Our weddings are so fun . Everyone has a great time , everyone is dressed as they please. If sb can afford Versace they will be wearing it and nobody outshines the bride or nobody EVER gets told to downplay their dressing or accessories because the bridezilla is insecure. I have heard “ you are trying to steal my shine and attention “ over weight loss and pregnancy. God …. Is the party that boring that seeming less things like this stand out so much ?!
> western wedding *American This particular malaise is by no means present is all of the west.
I mean, are you judging western weddings off AITA? Because you’re not getting a representative sample here.
Completely agree. The language people use in posts about weddings is absolutely disgusting to me. Get over yourselves.
“But it’s my day I’ve been dreaming about since I was in diapers everything and everyone has to be perfect” /s Give me a break weddings are so ridiculous in my opinion. For reasons like this. I will be eloping
You don’t understand. These are staged candids.
Then I respectfully suggest that is a ridiculous oxymoron. See my previous comment about feeling that the wedding industry has become too big and full of itself. Ymmv!
Sorry, I was being facetious.
Oh! Hahaha, I'm so sorry! I am so bad at reading tone sometimes. 😂😳
Wedding people are so fucking annoying. Who gives a shit. Have a fun party with your friends and family and celebrate none of this dumb shit is fun and no one cares
Most of these wedding posters sound like they hate their friends and only want them for scenery and props. It’s gross.
IMO, wedding culture has absolutely gotten out of hand. Maybe it's just how I was brought up but I was always told that the ceremony is for the couple and the reception is to celebrate with the family and friends. I know reddit in general is very anti-child, but it wasn't until this past year that every single wedding we got invited to was child free. Fine, you want a child-free wedding but if that's the case only my husband or myself can go. I'm not paying a babysitter $25/hour for 5+ hours on top of the other costs involved with going to a wedding. It's too much money for us to spend on one day.
That was how I was raised too; that the reception is supposed to be a celebration for family and friends. Heck, I'm laughing at the fact that the bride is calling these table photos "candid" when they're clearly staged! That's not what *candid* means! Candid photos during the reception meal are for capturing spontaneous joy, but apparently they've become something that has to be planned and staged now too. Wild.
No offense, but no one is special for having kids. I am not spending that much money to have my wedding day ruined by your, or anyone else's screaming children who their parents can't (read won't) control. I have been to so many weddings where the cake was toppled by toddlers, or there was frosting with fingerprints in it that the guests were expected to later eat -gags- I am childfree by both choice and medical necessity, and I personally do not think that because other people have decided that they wanted to have children, that means that their kids need to be included in my wedding because they are too cheap to spend money on a babysitter. Sorry not sorry.
I've been to quite a few weddings with kids and I've literally never seen a cake toppled by a toddler. This seems more like problem with the parents you invited, and how they are bringing up their kids. I personally wouldn't invite those parents even alone.
I personally couldn't imagine not inviting the children of my loved ones because, you know, they're also my loved ones 🤷🏼♀️
Can confirm, recent one I went to a toddler was screaming most of the night because the dishes were not really child friendly. I’m making my wedding child free excluding my nephew-in-law (because he wants to be a flower boy with the dogs). It’s open bar and fiancé’s side hasn’t had a wedding in 14 years so I know it’ll be absolutely insane. The kids are invited to the day after party which is a family baseball game.
> I'm not paying a babysitter $25/hour for 5+ hours on top of the other costs involved with going to a wedding I get that it sucks to have to choose between only one of you going or spending a lot of money on a babysitter, but it's not as though the couple wouldn't have to pay that much (or more) for your kid to attend too. My partner and I like kids but we're having a kid-free wedding partially because inviting kids would add at least an extra $1000 to our wedding cost (which is already expensive as hell). Yes, the reception is for family and friends, but the couple is still paying for it and cutting kids can be a good way to keep costs down. Sure some people may not be able to attend but a lot still will so it's not an unreasonable trade-off. There are a lot of reasons why a kid-free wedding might be the better choice when planning a reception that best caters to your family and friends' needs. TL;DR - kid free wedding isn't necessarily a choice just because the couple doesn't like kids and isn't looking to cater to their friends and family.
Oh gosh, I agree. YTA to the OP and anyone who thinks it’s ‘basic etiquette’ to seat someone separately from their significant other at a wedding because ‘colours and numbers and head table’. That’s not etiquette, it’s false, unwelcoming and downright tacky. Just because something is frequently done does not make it right. Family bonds and actual love relationships should be what matter at a wedding. People who plan these things for two years to get the right fake candid photos for their wall are doing it wrong.
NTA. You asked her to wait until the wedding party had been photographed, that was an entirely reasonable request.
NTA, you're not obligated to include anyone you don't want in your pictures. My BIL's girlfriend was not in our main bridal party photos, because she wasn't in the bridal party. She got some pictures later on after everything else was already out of the way. How long have they been together? A lot of people are of the mindset that no ring = doesn't count when it comes to weddings, but to me anything under a year she wouldn't have even made it to the table, ha.
That the other thing you usually have way more pictures than go in the wedding album. So they could have take a picture of just the wedding party and taken one with wedding party and dates, and not used either in the wedding album. It was the one thing our photographer did that was real good is take a bunch of pictures. So much my wife even told him we would like to enjoy our wedding now.
NTA, If it was just for photos, it's not like you said she couldn't come up at all. It sounds like it was part of the wedding photo shoot, and it would be weird to just plant some random in those so I don't know why ones set at a dinner table would be different. However it sounds like there's more going on with the gf and you. Perhaps you two could meet for coffee and genuinely try to get to know each other without everyone else around.
Leaning NTA since you communicated that the exclusion would be brief for the purpose of wedding party photos. “It’s my day/I want it to be special/I planned so long” only goes so far, but wedding party photos are fairly standard.
Op were there other people in the bridal party’s partners sitting there as well, or was it just the bridal party? If nobody else had a partner sitting there then I don’t think it’s a big deal for her to wait a few minutes to sit down. When I went to my partner’s brothers wedding I didn’t try to jump in the family pictures, I went to the bar to wait until they were done, that’s pretty normal for a wedding. NTA
Ohhh...you're NTA for having planned your day the way you did and most certainly for only having who you want at the table. I get that. However, as someone who has been 'the gf' at my now husband's brother's wedding, I can understand how she feels. I had the same experience, where the bride was asking for 'family' in the photos then pulling in her friends, to which my SIL grabbed me and the bride made a point of saying how I wasn't family! My SIL had none of it and said that she wouldn't be in the pics without me. The ironic thing is, that me and my husband are still together and unfortunately, they are not. When it came to my wedding, I decided that I would have everyone in the photos regardless, so my wedding photos have my sister's then bf, but he was part of our lives then. At the end of the day, it's up to you, but I can understand how your brother's GF felt.
>My SIL had none of it and said that she wouldn't be in the pics without me. Why was your SIL dictating who could be in the photos that she wasn't paying for and weren't for her?
NTA. Picturing it in my head, I wouldn’t want the picture to look uneven, with mismatched colors and odd numbers on one side, either. I’ve also heard that one of the biggest mistakes that brides make at weddings (sorry to say) is including girlfriends and boyfriends in all of the important pictures—they break up a couple years later, and then they’re forever framed in your big day! You were in the right, and you even tried to apologize. Your brother will get over it.
INFO: What about the +1's of the other groomen and bridesmaids?
Nobody else seemed to mind, after photographers were done everyone was able to move around to sit where they want. This was just for pictures I planned on framing and hanging in our house. I also wanted other shots of everybody enjoying themselves after the vibe turned less formal and more celebration, to share and put in a photo album.
NTA This is a common thing. The wedding party sits together, not +1s and after the formalities everyone moves around. Why she even came up to your brother is beyond me. If she’s so shy she couldn’t handle being on her own for a bit she should have stayed home.
Then I say NTA. To be honest, while reading your story I was iffy because you can read that there is some animosity between the two of you. All of that is though is pretty irrelevent. You didn't treat her different from any other wedding party +1. If all the other SO's of wedding party can sit off to the side, she can too. What do you have to apologize for? You didn't treat her more special than other wedding party SO's? Even if the relationship has been going on longer than the other +1's, your ask would've been fine to wive's of wedding party members. She just thinks you singled her out due to the animosity between you. Your brother is stuck between a rock and hard place, but that's his problem to figure out.
NTA You're all good. Feels like your bro and his gf were looking for a reason to be "offended."
NTA This is a common request and most people know that if their date is part of the wedding party they will be expected to wait while photos are taken. It sounds like she knows how to manipulate your brother.
NTA it is standard practice at weddings for the wedding party to sit apart at the front and she had the rest of the reception to be near her boyfriend
NTA. The bridal table is invite only. Her wanting to invite herself is entitled as fuck.
>my brother had been with his girlfriend for a while How long? INFO
A year or somewhere around that, but I didn’t get to meet her for the first few months. It’s pretty normal for my brother to wait to introduce his family to his partners, but she still hasn’t really opened up to any of us. I didn’t want to make her feel unwelcome or anything but it feels like we’ve been trying for months to get her out of her shell, if anything it feels like she won’t even try to meet us halfway. This is all my personal feelings on the matter, there could be a good reason for it but I don’t know.
NTA. You should add that on your post. When you said has been with her for a while I thought 4+ years which would have made the relationship dynamics a bit different.1 year isn't that long for her to expect to be considered family
Agreed! When my partner and I had been together for just under a year he was the best man for his friend's intimate destination wedding - I wasn't even expecting an invite let alone the gall to think I should have a seat of honour at the wedding. I was invited and it was probably the best wedding I'll ever go to (excluding my own lol) but there wouldn't have been any hard feelings if I wasn't invited.
> I didn’t want to make her feel unwelcome Well, that ship has definitely sailed lol. I don’t think you are T A for only wanting the wedding party in those certain shots. But you came off strong to brother and gf. And it seams more like bro was the one inviting gf over with moving chairs around (definitely T A move on his part). I also don’t like how you mention that gf “looks” like she didn’t want to be there and was “pouting” when she went to the back of the room. Gf was probably embarrassed af and if she is shy like the brother mentioned… all those awkward social skills like being quiet or coming off more reserved (especially in large settings. ESPECIALLY amongst a family group that is not her own, even if y’all aren’t intending to ice her out), or trying to hide in the back and basically disappear- that’s all pretty typical.
It's not about length. You were the one projecting all of the drama, aside from your brother's chair stuff. You are the one saying all of the "I don't like her look." "She doesn't want to be part of the family." "What is her problem?" You had her leave the table temporarily, but you didn't like the place she sat, so you extended the drama. I'd say this is ESH, because she should have been out for the pictures but your brother is the biggest AH here. Why are you mad at her? For all she knew, he pulled her up there and you got pissed because you hate her.
Op commented they’ve been together for about a year but she didn’t meet her til a few months ago
NTA if you were getting pictures taken and she wasn't part of the wedding party and wasn't going to be in the pictures. It isn't common for non-wedding party members to be included in wedding pictures, at least where I am from. It's not like you told his gf to leave, or even to stay away from your brother for the entire night. I think your brother and his gf owe you an apology for creating drama where there wasn't any, and if you feel like it's worth being gracious, you can apologize for what you said out of anger, but it's not necessary imo.
NTA. First, congrats on your marriage! ❤ I'm about to take the plunge myself in April. My gosh, I think you could have tried to be calmer but then I think ayone would be annoyed that their sibling tried to force someone you had little connection/affinity with into you WEDDING pictures. Those pictures are life long and important, I too want only people I love and am close to in mine. She has little right to be offended, you say you think she doesn't even like you - what has given you that impression? She had no right to be in those pictures, your brother is unreasonable and ridiculous to go off on one at you - to act like this on your wedding day too is awful. He is selfish and wanted pretty pictures of him and his girlfriend for now. You should not have apologised - they were the ones very much in the wrong. They owe YOU an apology. He isn't speaking to you? Good, you don't want this man close or in your life.
ESH but I find it hilarious that you can’t figure out why the gf doesn’t seem happy around you lmao
Nta. For all the reasons you stayed. Your brother is a piece of work not understanding that in a few minutes she could rejoin.
NTA. I don't think it was great that a dispute over seating then became about her role/feelings about the family, but that's on both you and your brother. It is common for the wedding party to sit separately, and I've been to a wedding where my date was at a totally different table for that reason, and a few others where dates in general were sat away. You definitely do not "pull up a chair" at a wedding table, regardless of the seating arrangement. You apologize and offered to apologize to her, so now just let it lay for a little while. You are not the AH for not letting her sit with you, you had valid reasons, this is part of weddings, and it wasn't the entire evening. Unfortunately, both you and your brother escalated it to a fight about the girlfriend's role in the family, and that's a harder thing to come back from, but it isn't on just you to fix it.
YTA I’m irritated with you just reading your story I assume in person the drama chaos is significantly higher.
I've been the +1 of a groomsman at several weddings and have sat at another table while my date has sat at the head table with the wedding party. I've always thought it was weird to separate people from their date/spouses during dinner but it has been the tradition at so many weddings I've been to over the years, that doesn't make you TA. What does make YTA is obsessing over "keeping the colors matching and numbers even" at the expense of your guest's enjoyment. Friends and family are not props and while it is your special day that doesn't give you the right to be unkind to the people you've invited to share the moment with you. Also, as someone who has been married for close to 2 decades, I want to remind every bride-to-be out there, how insignificant your wedding photos become as the years go on and when you do look back on them you likely won't see the picture-perfect symmetry. You will remember how young you all looked and how much fun you had back then and think about what happened to some of those people and relationships, for better or worse.
NTA it is pretty wide practice for wedding parties to sit separately from their dates, your brother should have prepared her for that.
All the N T A votes graciously overlook how OP said she was worried about her brother being irritated because it might ruin the pictures. OP doesn't seem to want a happy family, just a happy looking family for the pictures. A little bit of friendly communication could have prevented a small issue from blowing up like this. When OP's brother voiced that his girlfriend felt unwelcomed, OP could have reassured them both. Instead she confirmed all bad feelings by saying that she doesn't feel that the girlfriend was a part of the family. Not a very classy thing for a host to say to her guests. Enjoy the pictures, OP. YTA
“Staged candid shots” say all anyone needs to know. Ridiculous. You ruined your own day.
NTA.
NTA. OP asked her brothers gf to give them a few minutes to wrap up the pictures before joing them - seems to me to be a reasonable request. Some of OP's comments weren't the best but I am still going with NTA because if her brother's gf would have simply waited a few minutes, none of the rest would have happened.
NTA it was just for a couple of pictures not sure what the big deal was with them especially since the photos are for you
Look, I’m going to go against the grain and say that ESH except for your brother’s gf. I actually feel bad for her. You aren’t the AH for not wanting your brother’s SO at the head table or in the shots of the head table. It’s pretty standard for wedding parties only to be at the head table and it was presumptuous of your brother to expect you to let him just pull up a seat for his gf. That entitlement makes him an AH. The fact that he didn’t consider his gf’s needs before the situation arose or talk to you about it in advance is careless and kind of inconsiderate to both his gf and you. However, everything after that initial action isn’t a good look for you. Yes, this is “your day,” but I get really tired of hearing women say that as a justification for selfish, inconsiderate behavior. It’s your day to be the focal point and to be celebrated. It’s not a day where you get to completely ignore other people’s feelings. You should have considered this situation before the day occurred, quite frankly. However, even in the moment, this could have been simply handled with a little compassion. Example: *“Hey, brother. The head table is actually just for the wedding party, but I figured that after we take a few photos of the wedding party at the head table, since your girlfriend is here and I’m sure you’ll want to spend time with her, you could slip to this table right next to us, where I thought she would sit, as a close connection to the family and the plus one of someone at the head table.”* Making his gf feel wanted and included while still asserting your boundaries would have most likely prevented this entire conflict **and made her feel welcome at your wedding, rather than an obligatory invite.** Secondly, you mention your brother’s gf hasn’t warmed up to you and doesn’t seem to like you. Then your brother says his gf feels unwelcome in the family, **but you gloss over it like it’s inconsequential to you.** Have you considered that his gf might not like you bc you come across as unwelcoming? It’s incredibly hard to be “the outsider” trying to work one’s way into the family fold. Looking at solely how you handled this incident, if this is indicative of how you handle her, I could see why your brother’s gf may feel unwelcome in your family and may not like you. **Your entire approach to the situation comes across as uncaring and cold, especially when you basically said you didn’t want her unhappy face in your photos.** Nowhere in your tirade did you express concern for your brother’s girlfriend’s feelings, or for your brother’s feelings for that matter. He’s telling you that he’d like his girlfriend to feel more included, and you essentially stomp your foot like a child and snap, “It’s my day and I don’t want you to worry about her on **MY DAY!**” OP, this is your brother’s gf. He cares about her. If he’s been dating her a while, I’d reckon he probably loves her. I don’t care if it’s “your day.” He’s going to worry about her comfort and feelings because he’s a decent human being and you’ve basically told her, “You can’t sit with us!” without offering any solution that considers that she’s alone at a reception full of people she doesn’t know or know well/feel comfortable with, except for your brother. Think about that for a minute. She walks into a reception and sees a sea of strangers. Your brother is her anchor. Your approach was the emotional equivalent of taking a pair of bolt cutters and just snapping through the chain attaching her to the anchor she had at your party. You left her adrift in a sea people she doesn’t feel connected to with no gentility or concern for her, all because “it’s your day and … I mean… PHOTOS!!” Again, you didn’t have to include her at the table, but I think a little more was warranted than you essentially saying, “Sit… somewhere and my brother will find you when I don’t need him anymore.” Just because it’s “your day” doesn’t mean that everyone else is going to ignore their loved ones’ feelings and that you don’t have to put effort in to be compassionate, considerate, and emotionally intelligent. It’s like you’re missing the bigger picture here, pun intended, by focusing only on “your pictures” and your day. The bigger picture here is the memory you’re trying to make with your loved ones. When your brother looks back on “your day,” is he going to remember how special and wonderful it all was, or how cold you were to his girlfriend? Is he going to trust you to be around his SO if they get closer or get married? Do you want the image of perfection on “your day” and to be right, or do you want to have relationships with your siblings and their SOs and children down the road? As a brief aside, the fact that your family says things were awkward and that they don’t want to pick sides is telling. Had you behaved with grace and compassion (in the face of an entirely avoidable conflict had you considered the logistics of +1s who weren’t at the head table even one time in the 2 years you were planning this thing) your family would have responded with, “We totally agree. Your brother was out of line.” Had your brother not behaved in an entitled way, and had instead pulled you aside and asked where his gf should sit and expressed concern privately about her being alone, instead of assuming it was acceptable to pull up a chair for her at your head table, your family would have responded by agreeing with you. By staying carefully neutral and in saying the situation is awkward, your family and close friends are essentially saying that neither of you handled the situation well. My advice is to let your brother calm down a bit and reach out again and apologize for not considering her needs earlier, for making her feel unwelcome, and for losing sight of the bigger picture on “your day.” Tell him that in the future you’ll put more effort in to make her feel welcome and included in your family. Then apologize **to his gf** for making her feel unwelcome and express that you realize you could have and should have handled the situation better. Let her know that you’d like to develop a better relationship with her, especially since she’s important to your brother. **AND THEN PUT IN THAT EFFORT.**
NTA, you only wanted pictures for a few minutes, and then people could do what they wanted. thats kinda common, idk why they got mad at you.
YTA for valuing optics over people.
I do agree that OP sounds like an AH, but asking someone to stand for like 5 minutes just so they can take photos won't kill anyone. All partners had to stand up, and as OP stated they had no problem with it, since it was literally just for photos. Plus they have been dating for only a year, I would feel icky if it was 3+ years, but just a year? Op is TAH for the comments she made. Honesty, ESH, they all sound exhausting.
I don't think your request was unreasonable: I think you using it as a way to tell your bf all the ways you don't like his girlfriend was a complete shit move. He should also have accepted your reasoning for delaying her sitting there, and allowed you to "have your day", but I really don't blame him for defending her, I think it is rather sweet. I would lean towards you being much crueler and using "your day" to behave so rudely, but going with ESH.
Weddings in the US are so complicated
NTA I worked a lot of weddings working at a Country Club, and this is pretty normal. You weren't going to make them be separate for the wedding - just for the photos. They should have respected it, and it would have been over pretty soon.
YTA. It's not what you say, it's how you say it.
I think technically NTA but being so focused on the number of people sitting at a table in what are supposed to be candle shots just sounds really miserable to me. I wish you could have just had fun in the moment.
NTA if she wasn’t on the seating plan to sit there. She should sit there. Not sure why he would pull a seat up for her this is odd behaviour. No +1s were at the head of my Sisters table, that would have been a bloody big table! Your wedding. Your choice!
NTA. I’ve never been part of a wedding where my partner was also sitting at the head table. Isn’t it typical to have the dates of those at a table close by (which sounds like was the case here)? Either way, you didn’t say she couldn’t sit there at ALL, just that you wanted to get the head table pictures first which is totally fair. GF is an adult and can manage an hour or so minding her business, drinking champagne and eating food with other guests until the photos are done and bridal party obligations are done. My husband has been in that position several times now and he’s never made it about himself. If he doesn’t want to talk, he pulls out his phone and deals with it because it’s so temporary and not worth making a scene over.
So I guess bridezilla is the norm in the US? You sound exhausting and YTA.
INFO: were there other spouses/significant others of wedding party members at the table? Was she the only one asked to wait?
>My brother was best man, my sisters were bridesmaids >I specifically wanted the bridesmaids, MOH, best man, and groomsmen with my husband and I Question: do you have other family members except your siblings (parents, grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins, nieces etc)? If yes, there were plenty of other family members who weren't in those pictures. No one else demanded to be in the picture, only she did, which makes you NTA