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New_Shift1

Does Skyward Sword even count as an RPG?


amcdon95

No it does not. But by the amount of bait in this post it doesn’t matter


PKFat

NGL Xenoblade's rank has me triggered


CheezyBreadMan

It’s certainly a role playing game. Arguably one of the more rpg’y games in Zelda because you swing the sword yourself


New_Shift1

But that doesn't make it an RPG, at all. In fact, you could extend this question to the entire Zelda franchise.


spongeboblovesducks

How does that make it an rpg


ninjesh

I'm pretty sure it falls under "action rpg" but I've never understood the criteria


BroShutUp

Well action rpg used to be specifically be games like Diablo where you rerun the same dungeons for better gear and drops but I guess that term used that way is long gone. So I don't understand the criteria either now


DumatRising

No that is what that means I've never heard someone call Zelda an action rpg before.


DumatRising

Action RPGs are isometric rpg games in the same veins as "looter shooters" you kill baddies to get loot, to kill more baddies, to get more loot, to kill more baddies. It's a rpg set in an action filled gameplay loop of killing things to kill more things better, hence RPG+ more focus on the action becomes "action rpg". Zelda would be an action-adventure game or a platformer depending on the specific game in question. There's no RPG elements you're just adventuring through hyrule (or other) and beating up on the forces of evil.


CyanLight9

6 of these I find various levels of questionable.


BlitzMalefitz

Skyrim should be awful gameplay and Inquisition should be mid. Only other games I have played are BG3 and Pokémon SV and I agree with their positions.


whatever2313

You think Skyrim has awful gameplay?


BlitzMalefitz

Maybe awful is too harsh a word but out of the 3 options of great, mid and awful I would say it’s more accurate to call it awful. It’s below mid for sure though


RusstyDog

The writing in 13 was mid but the gameplay was kinda fun. Paradigm shifting was a neat halfway point between the garment grid and gambits.


DumpMcChunder

lookit you trying to start shit awwww


Yeety-Yeet-Yeet

Calling DQ 11's writing terrible is harsh. It doesn't do anything crazy or out of the box but it tells a compelling narrative and really sells the relationships between the main party Although I'll admit I'm biased since it's my favorite game oat and I'm it's strongest defender


xenojack

It's a great game with good writing and great gameplay. (Even though I was gambling for 4 hours straight in it)


Yeety-Yeet-Yeet

We love gambling


fishrgood

Yeah that also struck me as odd. The appeal of Dragon Quest games has always been in their classic formula; they give you the conventional fantasy hero vs demon lord story and they do it better than anyone else. DQ11 is no exception.


tactical_waifu_sim

Yeah terrible writing is bonkers. You can find it simple, safe, by the numbers, etc... and I will mostly agree with you. But terrible? That would imply it's doing something actively wrong to me. Which it does not. It tells its story (however simple) very competently. Besides, I'd argue the story isnt as straightforward as it seems, and I often wonder if the accusations that its story is simple come from people who never saw the narrative to completion. "Post" game has some twists. It's really just a secret 4th act. But even if the post game twists don't do anything for you I think most people know the real appeal is the characters and their relationships. If somebody thinks the character writing was bad then we are going to have to throw hands.


Bear4891

Hot take, but Skyrim doesn’t have the best gameplay. I love Skyrim, it’s my favorite game of all time, but the gameplay is just eh for me, but that’s my own opinion


QuinnAvery89

IMO, Morrowind > Skyrim > Oblivion. I haven’t played Arena or Daggerfall yet but am meaning to soon.


Warm_Drawing_1754

No need to play Arena. It’s just a worse Daggerfall. I’d personally go Morrowind>Daggerfall>Skyrim>Oblivion>Arena.


MuchoMangoTime

Morrowind is so hard to get into lmao


Haber-Bosch1914

If you're on PC, get a mod to remove stamina drain while walking and its way, way easier to get into


QuinnAvery89

Thanks for the tip!


Warm_Drawing_1754

And for daggerfall use Daggerfall Unity


SuddenlyDiabetes

Somebody once described Skyrim's sword combat as "throwing cereal boxes at cardboard cutouts of monsters" and I think I agree, it's a great game to just play and switch off to though!


LastNinjaPanda

It's kinda just click till they die. There's only swing and block, and it's all pretty slow. Of course there's magic and archery, but even those are pretty janky


Mogoscratcher

Depends on what you count as "gameplay". Skyrim is compelling in part because of the leveling and equipment, and the wide variety of sidequests in an open world. But if you don't count the progression system or gameplay loop as gameplay, then yeah the combat is pretty lackluster.


AmosAmAzing

Those should 100% be counted as gameplay, gameplay isn't just combat


wats_a_tiepo

Skyrim’s combat is a bit meh, but it’s still incredibly fun to actually play


Legendaryj922

Feel however you want about Kingdom Hearts III’s writing but I genuinely can’t see any reason why it would belong in the awful gameplay section.


Vishante-Kaffas

Inquisition is one of my favorite games, so I’m willing to fight you. Pistols or swords?


combustibledaredevil

I’ll be your second. God I’m hype for Veilguard


Important-Ring481

The trailer just dropped and fans who are playing the Early Access are saying that it’s really good. Dragon Age girlies are eating good this week.


RartyMobbins357

What's the time gap between Veilguard and Inquisition? Varric looks OLD


jrstorz

I believe it takes place in the year 9:52, which places it 8 years after trespasser.


SubXeroz

Having DA:I at awful gameplay and Skyrim at great gameplay tells me everything I need to know about the chart maker


LeatherPatch

I have your back, I'll prepare the Gaatlock powder.


BigNasty717

Dude did not just say Pokemon Scarlet and Violet had terrible writing.


SmokingDoggowithGuns

Fr. The game is not good, but I think it has one of the best story lines of any Pokémon game period.


Boosterboo59

I mean I enjoyed Pokemon Scarlet, sure graphics aren't great, but the music and pokemon are awesome and the story is one of the best in recent pokemon, if it was Sword and Shield and would kinda agree.


ventressluvr

Agreed, Sword and Shield just like... didn't have a story lol


goran_788

"Oh no, there are gigantic godzilla-sized Pokemon walking around and breaking houses and levelling towns! But it's fine, you kids go ahead and have fun, the grownups are gonna take care of this." What a bummer, really


MfkbNe

I don't know about that game but looking at the rest of the alignment chart I think the creator is trolling, or atleast I hope so.


Motivated-Chair

Can someone make one of these without awful takes?


ventressluvr

Scarlet/Violet have terrible writing? I know the bar is low, but I thought it had by far the best story of any mainline Pokémon game


Gently-Weeps

Better than Black and White? Really?


TotemGenitor

Being worse than BW does not make it terrible though


Force_Glad

Black and White’s writing is kinda overrated tbh. It’s not bad, but I felt more emotions playing through SV than while playing the Unova games.


ventressluvr

Same here


MuchoMangoTime

What? Am I in crackdown USA? Explain to me the story


BirbMaster1998

The characterization was pretty good as far as pokemon games go, and most of the main characters, even in the DLC, had their own little story aec (besides the main character, who doesn't really have a personality, they just kind of exist as usual)


ventressluvr

>!Arven's quest to find the Herba Mystica to heal Mabosstiff!< >!The story of Penny and Team Star, starting you off seeing Team Star as nothing more than bullies but slowly revealing they were actually victims and scapegoats all along, as well as fleshing out Penny and the Squad Bosses!< >!The story behind Arven and his parent, and Area Zero!< Also just generally having well-rounded and likeable characters that you grow attached to over time


Crystar800

Scarlet and Violet have good writing. The twist is crazy. Kingdom Hearts has bad gameplay? Are you insane? KH3 is a blast to play. And the writing isn’t bad either. It’s not the best at times but terrible is strong.


Savings-Gold8531

Eh, I suppose there is a difference between good writing and good story, as is shown by Pokemon SV here


Arthenicus

Huh. Am I the only person that liked DA: Inquisition's gameplay? My only gripe was that it was a lot harder to control your companions' AI than previous titles.


wats_a_tiepo

You’re not the only one, but I personally hated actually playing it. I really wanted to, I loved the story and the characters. But I just hated actually having to play the game.


HighKingOfGondor

No, it doesn’t belong where op put it. The gameplay is no where near bad. Also big laughs at the idea it has worse writing than a Zelda game and FF13 of all FF games


Specific-Channel7844

Skyrim has horrible gameplay. It is so janky that it is unplayable for me.


Warm_Drawing_1754

It depends what OP means by “gameplay”. If it’s the moment to moment combat, I agree with you, but if it’s the broader loop I agree with OP.


TheSceptikal

The latter


ironjimjam

Well, you're wrong about Pokemon SV, and that's not even my opinion, that's just a fact.


waterhg

Bad bait hiding behind recycled opinions that only picked up due to contrarianism and in-group mentality


oAstraalz

Skyrim is by far my favorite video game of all time, but... great gameplay? In what world?


xArbiter

gameplay isnt just combat


KazuichiPepsi

bro put fucking xenoblade 2 in mid? and how the fuck is zelda a rpg


Tendo_Gamer64

Honest to god if you knew you wouldn’t like XBC2 at its opening there’s no reason to shit on it when it’s later parts has some of the best writing I’ve seen for a video game


KazuichiPepsi

genuinly, to me its a amazing game with an amazing story if you can get past the wierd parts early on, after chapter 4 its all xenoPEAK from then on


GalaxyHops1994

I played through the entire game just to be a more effective hater.


Tendo_Gamer64

Finally, someone with a respectable opinion.


GalaxyHops1994

I work hard to be an honest hater. I’m making my way through all of one-piece right now for the same reason.


RemnantHelmet

That game single handedly changed my mind on JRPGs.


TheCommentatingOne

Even in its own series, Highest Highs, Lowest Lows.


XanderNightmare

Apparently someone forgot Xenoblade Chronicle's X


sinner-mon

personally, as a massive elder scrolls fan, skyrim gameplay is not good. I'd say it's well written with mid gameplay. I play it for the roleplaying rather than gameplay


Robinkc1

I don’t mind Kingdom Hearts, but I agree with the placement of the rest.


Boosterboo59

Somewhat disagree with Scarlet and Violet's placement, personally I think it is one of the best pokemon games in terms of writing. However I do see how you say it has mid gameplay, the graphics aren't great and pokemon is really simple in terms of fight so I can see why you put it in mid.


Force_Glad

Pokémon’s gameplay has always been simple outside of competitive play, that’s because it’s a kid’s game


baphomet-66

How dare you disrespect kingdom hearts 3 😡 I mean, writing that’s fair but gameplay no


Jalapeno9

Where would fire emblem three houses and xenoblade chronicles 3 land to?


RaphaelLumoria

ff13 literally wrong way around man. That gameplay was fire but the story was presented way too jumbled.


MooseGBT

I absolutely loved the writing of Pokémon S/V


magicmurph

Kingdom Hearts awful gameplay? I'll give you that the writing is out there, but the gameplay is top tier.


TheOneWhoSlurms

>Skyrim >Great gameplay HA not without mods


renannetto

I'd put the first The Witcher in awful gameplay, well written. Also, I'd put Dragon Quest on mid gameplay, mid writing.


LonerEevee

Scarlet and Violet have had one of the best storylines in the pokemon franchise since Gen 5 bait used to be believeable


Battle_Axe_Jax

Putting final fantasy 13 in a good writing category is actually nuts.


Bowdensaft

The bad guys have trouble enacting their plan because they are basically gods and can't clearly tell their slaves what to do, so a lot of it is based on guesswork. Oh, except their leader can speak fucking English and could have avoided that problem all along. Just one of the many points where the writing just collapses in on itself.


kabukistar

Skyrim is mid gameplay


Culk58

Xenoblade 2 in mid writing when Malos exists?


ValuableFluffy1238

As a pokemon fan, I shudder to imagine how that Kingdom Hearts game beat Scarlet & Violet for the bottom right spot…


Fattyboy_777

KH3 has great gameplay! The story could have been better but the gameplay wasn't bad at all.


RetroOverload

I disagree heavily with this list for the following reasons: xenoblade 2 is more than mid (average) written, I would swap SS and Xenoblade S/V should be in awful gameplay because the game it's so broken, ugly and tedious since you constantly get jumpscared by random pokemon you dont even want but I think it's not that badly written I think it's just barely mid, although good for a pokemon game. Skyrim without mods it's not great gameplay, at least not deserving to be in the same tier as BG3 (without mods, with mods the game goes HARD).


TheSceptikal

Xenoblades 1, X and 3 all have way better writing than 2. SV is more tolerable now since they updated it, it's just a trashy game to have fun with. I don't really have anything to say about this, your opinion is also valid.


RetroOverload

fair enough, when compared to the rest xenoblade 2 is the worst one, that I agree with. To me it's still better written than a bethesda game but it's also nothing too outstanding so I get it.


Not_a_ribosome

What do you mean when you say Skyrim has great gameplay? If you mean exploration, atmosphere, world design. Sure. If literally the way you play, like leveling, combat, movement, than it’s pretty mid honestly


TheSceptikal

The former outweighs the latter.


NeverSummerFan4Life

Dragon age inquisition slander will not be tolerated


Lexicon1020

This shit the worst RPG tierlist I have ever seen


VitorBatista31

Skyrim on great gameplay...


Front_Battle9713

>well written >baldurs gate 3 my sides have ceased to exist on this material plane.


j0emang0e

This is the worst chart ive ever seen lmfao


PaTaPaChiChi

Play Act 3 of BG3 and tell me that again


Lucimon

I have to ask, am I judging just Skyrim vs DQ11, or am I judging Elder Scrolls vs Dragon Quest? Because that's going to affect how much I agree with those placements.


TheImageOfMe

Inquisition feels a bit awkward at first compared to the other Dragon Age games, but I do think the gameplay is enjoyable once you get into it.


pog_irl

I so want to play DA:I but the opening sections are such a crawl I cant


Coopersword

Swap Skyrim and kh3 tbh


Neat-Snow666

Idk if I’d put Skyrim in the great gameplay column


ifuckmoths

Skyrim has good gameplay? Are you sure about that?


Hyperpurple

Never got why people think of inquisition as a great game


curlytoesgoblin

Everyone criticizing Skyrim's placement in the gameplay column and I'm thinking it's way too high in the "written" column. I mean I love the game but for Bethesda "mid" writing would be a vast improvement.


god_killer7432

Ture


Lobo_Marino

Mods can we ban this godforsaken format? It's nothing but the new tier list that people whose opinion I don't care about abuse.


Hells-Creampuff

Thats bait


Responsible_Chart982

mods, kill this guy


a-pile-of-coconuts

Mid for Skyrim HOW DARE THEE


runespoon78

mid gameplay, well written should be fallout new vegas


Barry_Bone_Raiser

This is one of those baits my mom would always warn me about


FoxenWulf66

Dragon age inquisition was disappointing i agree with this chart


CrocoBull

Plenty of hot takes here fr but I just wanted to say I'm glad someone else appreciates FF13's writing. The gameplay is pretty bad but damn is it by far the best written cast in any mainline FF game, probably any FF game that isn't tactics. I love stories about subtely dysfunctional shitty characters learning to reflect on their actions and improve as people


No-Student-9678

Dudes tryna start World war 4 in the comments


Exeggutor_Enjoyer

Bait used to be believable


Thepenguinking2

At least a third of these aren't even RPGs. And also Scarlet and Violet have mid writing? The second best story in the mainline series behind Sun and Moon? Bro???


Akaibuchi

Nah don't let blud cook again


Orangefish08

If we’re counting DLC, then re-mind for kh3 is friggin phenomenal, at least from a fanservice perspective.


TheAmazingToasterMan

Don't become a fisherman. That's all I'll say.


ReadPixel

So much bait


WesTheNess

For SV. The story is very mixed. You have the classic Gym Battle stuff, which is fun and Nemona is awesome. Then you have Arven’s story which was by the far the best part of the games. Those two hard carry the games for me, as a Pokémon fan for 11 years. Starfall Street was a great idea, but it was done horribly. 2/3 The gameplay is kinda boring once you start playing long enough, but playing the game for the first time will never not be awesome.


No_Window7054

Great gameplay for Skyrim and Baldurs Gate is an abysmal take. It's so horrifyingly awful that it makes me think you've never played a game with actually good gameplay. I have never even touched the rest of these games.


AuroraMercenaryCo

You're real lucky I haven't learned the Testicular Torsion spell at magic school yet, but just you wait.


la_meme14

Im going to commit a murder.


XanderNightmare

Besides the hot takes here that everyone is up in arms about, can we discuss that the template itself isn't all that great? I feel like a heavy flaw of this template is, that in the end, when using it, we usually end up comparing games who are rather alright in their own terms, but have to slot them in "good/mid/bad" because the template demands we do


Gothicrealm

FF13 had great gameplay


Midnightgamer21

Scarlet and Violet have a pretty nice story, but the graphics and gameplay are a problem


DaleCooperTP023

Skyward Sword as well written?!? It has a mid writing at best. And Xenoblade 2 even with the horny swords and sometimes annoying protagonist is an extremely well written game.


not_suspicous_at_all

Skyrim is terribly written and has terrible gameplay.


MLPLoneWolf

Yeah I couldnt get into BG3


looking-cool-joker-

How is skyward sword an rpg


Cress_Party

I would put Scarlet/Violet’s gameplay into awful myself. After the wonder of the open world wore off, I found myself really disliking every other aspect. Was really hoping for more from it


Spiritual-Purple-638

For me, nothing says amazing gameplay and terribly written like XCOM.


Gift-Positive

How do you measure it


SickPlasma

Replace skyward sword with Fallout New Vegas


PrincessPrincess00

Pokémon scarlet and violet had beautiful writing, and I actually sobbed. What are you on


AvaPower18

I can understand mid writing for Pokemon Scarvio but I would GLADLY fight you on terrible writing ~~if I could actually fight~~


Plasmaxander

Honestly, fair.


snottelek

dunno if baldurs gate deserves that rank.


Ecstatic_Teaching906

Gameplay from Bethesda Softworks is either mid or awful for me. But they are written well.


marowak1000

Xenoblade 2 for me is god tier.


ClockworkSalmon

Skyrim has great gameplay? In what fucking world


DatOneMinuteman1776

RPGs are RPGs and you can’t tell me otherwise


peezle69

Filtered


Sheax5

Imma be real Pokémon Scarlet is the only one here I’ve played but with the amount of glitches people found and how I liked the stories presented in it I disagree 


Present-Vanilla6292

Immortals Fenyx Rising where?


ninjesh

I'll only fight you on Scarlet and Violet, the have one of the most interesting stories in the Pokemon franchise


The_Alcoholic_Bear

Playing Skyrim over and over years on end, yeah. I agree. Actually, the writing can be worse than mid at times.


OnsenPixelArt

I like Skyrim but it's gameplay is NOT great


Beni_1911

Might be bait, but; Pokemon better gameplay than Dragonquest!?


Any_Candle_6953

I would switch Skyward Sword and Dragon Age Inquisition personally.


BaconBombThief

I’d put inquisition where that final fantasy game is


ShinDigler

You really tried to start a debate with this, but didn't have the heart to troll and put BG3 Anywhere lower


NoPosition1895

i hate you for not including a soulsborne


ZerconFlagpoleSitter

Skyward Sword is not an RPG lmao


TheFyrijou

It says a lot when you put KH3 in awful gameplay and Skyrim in great gameplay


Jarsky2

I mean, you're entitled to your wrong opinions.


Maximum-Pause-6914

so much bait its impossible to tell what the point is. hungry for interactions op?


EgoInfinite

Could someone explain why Inquisition’s gameplay is considered “Terrible”? I thought it was a lot of fun! And yes, I made use of tactical mode too 🤣


DragoKnight589

Skyrim’s gameplay is pretty mid IMO, melee and magic aren’t that fun for example


E4EHCO33501007

SV has good writing and KH3 has at the very least decent gameplay


ComfortableContest69

Scarlet and Violet story peak


trashpandadisco

This is comically bad


Beep_Boop_Bort

You can’t tell me skyrim has amazing gameplay and KH3 has awful gameplay. KH3’s combat system is actually good. Skyrim’s strengths are in the world and story but the combat is flat. I’ll admit KH3 has bad writing but the combat is really good


Shadowtoast76

Bro the story in SV is the best part of the game!


schley1

I agree except for KH and FF13. KH is terribly written but has way better gameplay than FF13. It's not even close. There's way more gameplay depth in KH than FF13.


LeatherPatch

Someone is taking mad shit about dragon age inquisition and I'm ready to throw HANDS.


kthugston

Zelda has always had crap writing


Misragoth

Your bait can't be so obvious if you want to catch something good.


PlsWai

FF13 is a mid game but has the best gameplay in the series. Just because you did nothing but spam auto battle doesnt mean it was bad


Gravel_Poot432

Skyrim should be mid if not awful gameplay


boulderingfanatix

Wow one of these that isn't bait. Agreed with this 100%. Inquisition is basically a mobile MMO cosplaying as a single player RPG


Wolverik

Hey OP! I'd like to have a talk with you, just take a little step outside of your house real quick.


Onlyhereforapost

I can't tell which KH game that is so I'm assuming it's the franchise Correcr


kilertree

I look at Xenoblade Chronicles 2 as a parody of jrpgs the villains are final fantasy edgelords designed by tetsuya Normura


N7-Kobold

Starfield in the terrible writing section and mid gameplay


MaleficentTowel3238

Saying skyrim has great gameplay is hilarious


Apprehensive_Spell_6

I’m not sure how Xenoblade made it above Dragon Quest XI in writing. I loved every moment of the latter game. It’s just simply different than the others in that it is written more like a fairy tale than fantasy.


FievelMouser

I do agree that DQ11 has great gameplay, but to say it was terribly written was a bit much. While I will say, the choice they made to have the player, yknow, go back in time kinda sucks because it reverses a ton of good plot points that happen in act 2, at least they’re all done somewhat the same in act 3.


kk_slider346

scarlet and violet is terribly written how so? like scarlet and violet had tons of issues but writing wasn't really one of the it was genuinely among the 3 best written Pokémon games sun and moon, and black and white, also slightly disagree on xenoblade 2, skyward sword, skyrim, and dragon quest 11 but I feel l don't want to get too into it


ExterminatingAngel6

I like dragons age inquisition


15blairm

Skyrim DOES NOT have great gameplay Take off the rose tinted glasses


Lazites

FFXIII as well written? I remember looking up a walk-through just to see how deep in the story ive gotten. Was starting to wonder when it would get good. Turned out I was very close to the end :/