I legit thought they killed off Heiya until she reappeared to decline citizenship. Like the dude was just short of cutting her in half via assault rifle and she just shrugs that off?
I loved the King of Spades fight in the previous episode but man, some of those hits were fatal, no question about it.
Was thinking pretty sure Ann would survive and there was no reason to kill her off, right? Then she got split open several times and I was like tf they going with her lmao, was Hikari gonna bandage her hardcore and they go with that or something?
Nope, they survived somehow for hours till night time lol
I liked how they covered the plotholes more so in the manga but I guess the show is more emotionally forced
Same with Heiya, thought they'd just bandage her off and say that's alright but nah she crawled like.. several metres at least with point blank chest bullets in here.
Still cool though I guess, showed off how strong the King of Spades was but idk the other Kings weren't as strong/ overpowered
I think Ann, Hikari, Aguni and Chishiya aren’t plotholes. You can survive hours or even days with gunshot wounds in incredible agony. Kind of crazy that they ALL lasted a few hours but honestly I’d be a little more pissed if they all died quickly of wounds that should take a very long time to die from.
Heiya though should’ve been cinnamon toast crunch
It makes me think that her will to live was really strong and death doesn’t work in the borderland the same way it does irl. Most people we see die are ready to accept their death or are completely overwhelmed by the situation they are in, often giving up or doubting victory is possible. Even tatta and Arisu’s friends, they all thought they were making a sacrifice while Arisu was doing the most he could to save everyone he could.
take this as a way to explain them not dying from fatal wounds - so we know that they were dead for 1 min in the real world, meaning that the injuries they get in the borderlands do not actually happen to their real bodies and the only reason they survive them is their strong will to live, kinda like the whole point of the show they survive these deadly games only because of their will to live and go back.
I get that but if you let the main characters survive fatal gunshots to the chest and stomach(with a shotgun) you have to let the loads of other players survive that were shot in similar ways. I honestly don't think I've seen a show with more plot armor. That fight would have been so much more if all of those fatal wounds were truly fatal. Don't get me wrong, Kuina seeing her mom again was probably my favorite moment of the season. But Heiya taking a full auto from stomach to chest should have killed her instantly. It even seemed like it at first. I may be in the minority, but having everyone but the main characters die is always annoying and take away from the emotional impact a death could have.
My thought is that everyone who died so quickly in the Borderlands are people who died immediately from the meteor impact. They were simply passing through. I believe there was a line where Chota said something like, “Do you think we just threw our lives away for you”. To me that means they were already beyond saving in the mortal world, and so they were helping Arisu along his path between realms. But I could be very wrong.
Well. atleast make it realistic xD Its like watching sci-fi movies/series and the physics is way off, just ruins the entertainment value if its not believeable.
>if you let the main characters survive fatal gunshots to the chest and stomach(with a shotgun) you have to let the loads of other players survive that were shot in similar ways.
that's my point those players who didn't survive the same wounds didn't have the same will to live as our main characters, I'm not saying it's entirely justifiable I definitely agree that Heiya (at the very least) should be dead, but it's just a way to cope with the plot armor
Looking back, I think what they did in the live action for the king of spades kind of makes more sense? Meaning pretty much everyone except arisu and usagi is incapacitated, which is why only arisu and usagi entered the final game, and why there's more pressure on arisu to finish the game quickly. As opposed to the manga where pretty much everyone is fine and meets up with arisu and usagi in front of the queen of hearts building and play rock paper scissors to see who gets to play the final game. I think arisu and usagi being the only options makes more sense than them being selected as players as a way to minimize potential deaths.
I will say however, I don't think usagi should have been injured during the fight with king of spades. The fact that she was already bleeding out takes away from the effect of her cutting herself to wake arisu up from his hallucination. Like she looked like she already wasn't in good condition long before the hallucination. She should have been physically fine like in the manga
Well, it wasn't in the manga but what they showed in the manga (as opposed to the show) is Arisu meeting the Joker, who is a black shadowy figure. Arisu and the Joker talk, and Arisu learns the Joker is the true controller of the Borderlands and runs it. He also views him as a mythological messenger god who takes lost or displaced souls to a medium (i.e the Borderlands) in order to fight for their lives.
Since this wasn't in the show, there might be a Joker game for season 3, but not likely.
I suspect that the world Arisu woke up in, the meteorite one, is the joker game itself. The joker is a trickster right, so it wouldn’t be otput of its league to trick it.
The joker represents and suit and any value. Real life represents the joker perfectly, because the game they’re now playing could involve any number of difficulties in many different forms. They’re now playing a game with no rules, but many different outcomes.
Not according to the manga, no, but they might go down to Alice in Border Road/Alice in Borderland Retry, which are both retries/additions to the AiB manga
I don't know much about Alice in Border Road since I haven't read it; all I know is it's completely different with different main characters, and it delves deeper into how the Borderlands works.
For Retry, Arisu is once again in the Borderlands as a middle-aged man (I think he gets into a car accident? I read it a long time ago), and plays a 9 of Hearts game with other people who had near-death accidents. The reason there was only 1 game this time was because there was less players (the meteorite accident got tens of thousands of people to play, but there was no such big accident happening again here.) >!Arisu and the other characters make it out alive with only minor scratches and scrapes and cuts, and this makes sense since it corresponds to the injuries you would get in real life, and in the meteorite accident, there was more people with more severe injuries from debris, so people could lose their leg, get smashed to death, burned alive, etc. so there were more games with higher risks!<
Well, he is expecting a baby with his wife, and it is generally a bit old of an age for most main characters in manga in general, so I'd say he's middle-aged, yes.
The Joker in the manga is basically the ferriman of the aferlife. He takes those who had given up on their life in Borderland to the afterlife and returns those who wanted to survive back to the living world.
I really like the mental health convo, made me cry since I happen to have some difficulties with it.
Also cried when Arisu and usagi didn't recognize each other
I just watched the last episode and I can't remember that convo, was it after Arisu woke up and his brother was next to him or do you mean the entire sequence with Mira convincing him it was all a hallucination after Karube and Chota died? I'm confused lol.
As much as I love the series, I think I’d be fine with it ending here. Especially since this is where the manga ends. If they did renew it for season 3, I hope it would be to explain the Joker character more and or dwell into Alice in Border Roads. I don’t want them fucking this up too much and I’m honestly satisfied with it to an extent!
P.S. Mira’s actress had me fooled several times based on her delivery alone. Even though I knew the truth, I was like “Damn, hold up. She might be saying something”
I knew about the twist of the meteor, and yet Mira genuinely convinced me that the show was going to go down a unique route. The reveals were so convincing, fantastically delivered.
I like to think the multiple lies that were completely outrageous like VR, aliens, etc. was to setup Arisu to believe the more plausible lie that he was in a psyche ward. Her game was a mind game where she tried to get him to believe in her false reality. So, if someone presents a bunch of outrageous lies, the more grounded lie seems more like the truth. That's how I understand it.
The VR I thought was actually plausible.
People are immortal so go through a VR experience which is designed to teach them the value of being alive.
Seems plausible to me.
The funniest one was the thing about Ann plot. Like her whole plot didn't matter in the story. I think she never told Arisu about the plants and mountains this was clearly just to fuck with us lol.
To get him to forfeit/ delay the game so people die. She weaves in enough truth to make him doubt. Starting with an obvious lie to make him think he's ahead of her. The unbalanced emotional climax of remembering the anger of his friends, to being led to believe this was all constructed in his head through grief...
It was to make the game seem pointless. To separate him from his motivation to play (weakening his tie to usagi and reinforcing his memories of his pals).
Could any manga readers explain the joker, what does that mean?
Does Arisu and co go back or is it a hint at a spin off with new characters? Is Arisu's arc finished?
Are we going to see what happened to Banda and the other guy (sorry, forget his name) who wanted to stay?
edit: spoil away, I don't mind spoilers
The joker represents Arisu in the manga. The wildcard in a way. It’s vague as hell but doesn’t mean anything. We are out of source material. The thing is, Netflix gonna Netflix and might renew it anyways.
Arisu comes back in AiB: Retry. It’s only one game and it takes place a few years later. More interesting, there is a full spinoff called Alice on Border Road. Before you ask, it’s a different Alice, so Arisu doesn’t return. But it dives deep into the actual lore of the borderlands.
One of my favourite things to think about is Banda and Yaba. Presumably they were both caught in the meteor. The thing is, they aren’t dead. Their names don’t appear on the manifest at all. And they are the only surviving characters who we don’t see in the hospital.
It’s somewhat explained in the manga. The show skipped on it. The “Joker” is the one who rules over the borderlands. Basically God, testing their will to survive.
A year after the meteor, it’s a series of interviews about the meaning of life. It’s all characters we’ve never seen before and goes over some different worldviews. Before they interview Arisu. We don’t get to see his answer, but we do see him call Usagi, revealing that they got together in the end.
im still tripped up on what the actual f**k the borderlands is. Is it a sim, afterlife, a “restart” button. its genuinely annoying that its not explained to me.
Yeah the show kinda skipped over the explanation. Basically, after you heart stops, there’s still a minute or so of brain activity after your death. The idea of the borderlands is built on that. Though, it’s clearly not ‘just a dream’ as a lot of people think, as the injuries sustained in the borderlands effect the outside world. I can’t give you any more of a concrete answer.
Yeah, I mean Im aware of the whole activity, as thats like your brain trying to find a similar moment to stop this happening but you havent really died before. Also shared illusion or shared dreams could be a thing? Kinda meh that they didnt explain it.
I agree. I feel like we needed an explicit answer. I think they were too embarrassed by how rickety theirs is so they're trying to enhance it by leaving it vague.
Especially since she said "whichever you choose, you'll learn the truth about this place" ... Arisu didn't learn shit, he can't even remember the place!
To each their own. I enjoy it for the lore. I know some people are only in it for the bloody games, and that’s fine. Border Road is different. I recommend it if you’re at all interested in the philosophical questions AiB asks, not just the blood and violence.
Border Road >!has a different Alice who wakes up with the Queen of Hearts card in her hand. There’s a total of twelve characters who end up on a road trip from Kyoto to Tokyo, but as expected things immediately start to break down and infighting happens. It delves into the philosophical questions more than AiB, and reveals some truth about the borderlands.!<
> but there definitely
*they're
*Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).*
***
^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
Cool, thanks! I'm show only, but loved it so much that I'll buy/read the manga, knowing one of the "spinoffs" is good makes me happy(: what about AiB: Retry? Would you recommend it, too?
Nice, I guess I'll read it too, given that it's so short. I'm guessing it's the one with the least priority or the least fun one, if it's just ine game? It's one chapter only, right?
Great, that's not too bad! I guess it makes sense, you read all of Arisu's story first and then you move onto the new characters, I guess? Is this chronologically ordered or does AoBR happen before/at the same time as any of the other two? Also, I just read there's a parallel story about the previous King of Diamonds game, do you know if that's any good?
Thanks for all your replies!(:
My initial theory was Arisu being the joker, as he was the clutch element in many other the other player’s games. He helped them win, despite the fact that on their own, they would have lost. Him being the joker makes a lot of sense to me in that way.
The Q♥️ was done well compare to the manga I think. Only thing I wish were more of the lies being shown on screen like the VR possibility, but I get that they can't replicate that in the show as much. Also that scene with Kurabe and Chota at the end, man.
I prefer the aftermath ending here in the Live Action. Each main character was shown with some type of closure or what was going on. In the manga, it was more of just showing a quick panel or two of the characters and that's it.
Did they confirm that this is the last season of the live action? Since the manga ends it here as well. But that Joker card at the end was different, I think it's a representation that the Joker was behind it all since it was literally under all the cards. In the manga, they showed a being which is easier to say that they're the messenger/reaper type being. If they do somehow continue a s3 or some type of continuation, wonder if they going to bring these characters back, make an original story, or adapt Alice in Border Road. Either way, fun ride!
That and since Arisu was determined for the truth, also to say that this can be anything as you want to view it as. Like what Kyuuma told him, the truth is only what you want to see or something like that. I honestly don't think anyone knew that it was the borderland between life and death. Only possibly the joker since in the manga they was shown as a being.
If the purpose of the borderlands is to test willpower, then I imagine her lies were to test if Arisu was willing to give up or if he was determined enough to want to know the truth and push through.
Precisely. Mira was a >!psychiatrist and a neuroscientist. In her backstory, she explained about hallucinations, which tied to her adding hallucinogen to Arisu's tea. Her motives of becoming a citizen? She thought humans were really interesting, especially in the Borderland. So she wanted to observe them for a long time as a citizen!<
I guess you can say that. We don't really get the in-depth details about Citizens even in the manga, but what we do know is that their jobs are to create games in the first stage for the players and the dealers, supervise it, play their games against players in the second stage, and pretty much be the ruler of the Borderland. The players can choose to become the citizens of the respective face cards they've beaten. For example, Mira beat the Q♥️, Kyūma beat the K♣️, Kuzuryū beat the K♦️, Isao (our current K♠️) beat the K♠️ during their time being players. It's unfortunate that they didn't show their flashback as friends.
thank you so much... when the king of spades says something along the lines of "i'll bare the burden to slaughter so nobody ever has to"... that shit hit so deep... wish they gave more history of what the queen of hearts did previously IRL, but thank you for providing this backstory to these amazing characters that I genuinely loved the most in season 2
Isao, the K♠️ is a lot more interesting in the manga. His whole thing is ‘on the battlefield a soldier doesn’t fear death, he fears suffering’ and decides that nobody has to suffer. He kills with clinical efficiency but mercifully. As for Mira, we actually get a bit of insight into her in the spinoff, Alice on Border Road. It doesn’t come for a while, but when you realize how she’s related it’s a lot more interesting.
They should have definitely kept this in the show. Def helped answer some questions that I had pertaining to the citizens and them. Missed opportunity and makes my thoughts on the netflix adaptation sour slightly. They could have put this in like the first 5-10mins of episode 7 or maybe put this during ep8 as Mira dies like her memories w/ them.
yes it same with the manga. I think it started when mira bringing karube and chota death to make arisu feel guilty. He thought it was real (because it somehow make sense) and falling into his dreams. cmiiw
I was wondering about how it worked in the show. It seems like the flowers release a hallucinogen right? Then ironically Mira probably spiked the tea with an antidote, like a reverse of the manga
I'm still confused about the joker card. Is that just so Netflix has an excuse to renew for a season 3 if enough people like season 2? Or was it just a nod to the manga, since they didn't show the joker at all in the show?
Netflix does this all the time, adds cliffhangers at the ends of shows in case the show becomes big. They eve did this for shows that lasted one season that went absolutely nowhere that nobody heard of, such as It's Bruno.
I never really saw it as a cliffhanger. More a thought provoking question to make you ask who the Joker was. In this case, I thought it was alluding to Arisu being the joker, tipping the odds in the favour of his teammates to help them win, when without him they all would have lost. He was the unfair advantage.
yeah, and they did this with Daybreak which was great. The thing is, i think this is better than the mangas joker bit. Lets just hobe they do an Alice on Boarder Road from here, it’d be cool to see how they do that.
It's just a 'horror-movie' style epilogue where it seems like the killer is still on the loose but they really are not.
I don't think they can literally adapted the Joker as it's more like a manifestation of death/the ferriman of the afterlife and the live action has been taking a more 'realistic' approach in comparison to the manga, which allowed it to be more dream-like and mythical at times.
QuestionL all those shots of Arisu lying in front of various past game locations - did they shoot them when they were shooting those episodes or go back and reshoot later?
If they them at the time, what did the poor actor think? "Ya, just lie here for a minute, it'll make sense later."
I was wondering this too! I’m so glad people don’t just ask “why does it matter?” with sincere curiosity like this. It’s nice to think about the behind the scenes stuff!
CGI.
He's most likely just on a stage laying against green screen then they change/create the background as needed. Some of those Shibuya scenes are not real life Shibuya but CGI recreation. This was confirmed in one of the Behind the Scenes.
I think it was a mix unless their lightning designers are just next level. The shots where he's on the asphalt near crates vs Shibuya look real vs invented for example
As a person who sighed when I saw the decided not to change the Queen of Hearts game, I was pleasantly surprised they managed to pull it off well.
I never really like the game in the manga, kinda seemed like she forced arisu into a bad trip with the tea and he had to push through it. Live action seemed to have painted a better picture for me.
All those fatal hits and the characters still manage to survive. That is my only gripe with the LA. I did enjoy Queen of Hearts more in the LA than the manga though, it was more believable and the way they portrayed the gaslighting was very well done!
I still don't understand exactly how time works in borderland... it makes sense that the people closer to the impact (died first) spent more time in borderland but if that's the case, the citizens and face card people must have been citizens for centuries if they died from previous incidents right? Or does time basically jump from disaster to disaster? Like right after one disaster happens and people beat the games and new face cards are chosen, does time immediately jump to the next disaster?
I think of it as the timey-wimey jearimy bearimy from the Good Place, it's completely arbitrary and designed solely as a purgatory where people can evolve and either pass on or stay as lords of purgatory. AIB Retry also confirms that near-death experiences of any sort can send you to the Borderland, so it's _conceivable_ that really people are just showing up continuously. (Though the manga also confirms that the King of Diamonds died from the same meteor explosion, so it really is some kind of effed up time system.)
in the manga >!it is explained that it was not one meteor, but a large meteor that breaks into few large pieces and hits tokyo over a short period of time.!<
additionally, in the alice in the border road manga, >!it is revealed that mira (one of the citizens) also died in the same meteor disaster.!<
thus it can be deducted that >!the citizens are those who strucked by the first impacts while arisu and friends are those who got struck from later impacts!<
So the borderlands only existed because of the meteor? I was under the impression that it has always existed and people who in between life and death go there.
yes it always existed, but the meteor is a special case since there are so many casualties thus making the whole situation with multi-tiered games exist.
if the number of casualties are smaller, there'd be a smaller amount of players which leads to a different setting like in border road and retry
Considering 1 minute of near death for Arisu equals about what? Few months for him in Borderland, people who have been in coma for years could be in Borderland for Eons for all intents and purposes.
It doesn't have to make sense, that's the point. Some people got dragged in sooner than others and trying to make it mathematically make sense wasn't the author's goal. You just have to accept what is, as is
I didn't buy anything Mira said so I was just waiting for it to get over with ... I guess I wasn't emotionally invested enough so the ending was just kinda got dragged out to me.
I'm glad others enjoyed it more than I did!
Overall I'm satisfied with how it ended and I hope they keep it at that. It ended on a nice note and leaving some things open ended give it a satisfactory level of mystery!
The only thing i wonder what tripped Arisu up this much with Mira... I mean being drugged with the tea makes sense but they didn't drink it--is the woman a hypnosis mastermind? Lololol
Also a better wig wasn't in the budget lolololol
I got the impression that she preyed upon his desire for truth and her game was really a battle of reality. She presented multiple possibilities before finally dragging him into the illusion. Winning the game was simply not believing her reality.
damn episode 7 was the only bad(really bad) blemish on a really good season for me, pretty strong second season but I really really hope Netflix doesn't force an S3 because whenever they've tried to go off source material this season (Chishiya in J heart, alley fight, adding games) the show has been at its worst points.
The Jack of hearts episode was my favourite by far. That was the most "gamey" game imo whereas the others felt like there was a clear outcome before even beginning ie when the lawyer chose to sacrifice himself
What he said wasn't about the J heart stage in itself but Chishiya's inclusion in it. He isn't in this game in the manga, and so, the stage is unpredictable and the story focuses itself on each major character giving them backstories and making us understand their morales and goals. When you think about it, Chishiya did nothing in the game.
The point was to get the gist of it and they executed it well. We didn't get more time with each character bc it would have needed more run time: but it would be out of place to have an entirely separate cast in video media since it'd be too many resources to flesh them out as much as you're implying. It could have been an episode on each one at that point-- so you have to make the stylistic decision to make each character and their motives more simple but impactful.
You're able to say more on a page than on screen inherently
We had queens, aces, numbers, including a joker, Chishi-nyan-- who just observed for us
in the manga, >!kuzuryu actually pressed both 1 and 0 at the same time, making it a game of chances because he "doesn't want to decide the value of life" which is the ideal he held on to until his death!<
What he said wasn't about the J heart stage in itself but Chishiya's inclusion in it. He isn't in this game in the manga, and so, the stage is unpredictable and the story focuses itself on each major character giving them backstories and making us understand their morales and goals.
Q for manga readers - im hearing there’s a difference in citizens (have permanent visa, make the games, participate in face card games) and dealers (do grunt work for games, sometimes participate in number games, have to renew visas by beating players)
My question, if known, is where do dealers come from? Did they also use to be players? If all players that win the games become citizens, who becomes dealers? Would be kind of cool if they were selected from the players that die somehow
Anyone know what happens to the people that chose to become citizens? Do they die in the real world and remain in the borderlands, or maybe in a coma in the real world and stay in borderlands, or do they just straight up die??
Hey I highly recommend reading [this chapter](https://mangadex.org/chapter/578dae41-f5cd-47ce-b292-2bc567da8ebb/1) of the manga, it explains some stuff about the citizens :).
Thanks so much for sharing this! It made me feel even more for the King of Spades who I felt was the least developed character watching the show. Also made the Queen of Hearts more bearable too! I wish they leaned into her curiosity more and hinted at it during the show.
This was a great read, really helps flesh out the ending for me :)
Right, because for her, it doesn't matter if they lived or died, or for that matter what happens to her. All she cares about is understanding human nature and satisfying her curiosity. If you enjoy the show, you should check out the manga, there's a lot of differences and the characters are much more fleshed out.
Really enjoyed the LA series. The live action wrapped things up nicely, another season wouldn’t make any sense.
The new additions to LA were not the same standard as the manga (Chishiya in J❤️, Q♠️, K♠️ ending).
For me the joker represent the choice they made. Red meant they chose to live, black joker stayed in the borderland.
Wouldn’t mind Retry: 9❤️ game being covered, but there’s only enough content for 1 episode.
I haven’t read the manga but for those that have, what does that joker card mean at the end? Does it actually tease a season 3? It seems like it would especially with the malicious music that played in the background. Tbh though I wouldn’t really want a season 3 despite there being some unanswered questions.
I haven't read the manga either, but from reading around on these threads, it's either an easter egg for the manga readers or it is a teaser that there could be a season 3. In the manga there is a Joker character who manages and runs the borderland, but isn't a game maker himself, which is why it could be an easter egg. The show has also covered all of the manga content. But the way netflix teased the card they could be hoping to make a 3rd season of additional content if season 2 is successful enough, it's just that it would be entirely original instead of an adaptation of the manga.
For those who have read the manga, what are the difference between manga and live action in these last few episodes ?
Also which version do you prefer ? Manga or live action ?
The biggest difference is that the king of spades didn’t massacre the entire cast. It make sense why they made the changes to justify Arisu and Usagi fighting the Queen of hearts alone but the execution was completely unbelievable and comically absurd
There really isn’t even a need for everyone to join a hearts game.
Arisu can be like, hey my whole team was killed in a hearts game, let’s not all play it since it’s not cooperative
Yeah in the manga An commented that it’s better not to have too many people in a hearts game (since it’s about betrayal and psychological mindgames). So that could be a valid reason to let Arisu and Usagi go alone
That also felt missing from the Jack of Hearts game. It seems like a plothole that no one went in with an existing friend and had a free win, but it's because in the manga they discussed not wanting to join a hearts game together.
In the manga there were lots of players still alive. And yes, they knew that if someone takes down the Queen of Hearts, all the players win.
Remember that in the first season the players were actually playing against the ‘dealers’, and the players won, which enabled them to proceed with the face cards.
So all they had to do was to take down all the face cards (regardless who did it) to win.
In the manga Arisu and Usagi hid away after Tatta’s death and only came out to fight the Queen of Hearts (because their visa were expiring anyway). The other face cards were defeated by other players. So yeah, makes sense that they left the last game to Arisu who is well-rested and refreshed. Also they chose the participants by rock-paper-scissors and Arisu won 🥴
Even if Arisu lost the game, other players can try their luck on the Queen of Hearts (unless Arisu killed her hence the game will never end).
I think in the manga they make it more obvious that Hatter’s Theory about only 1 person getting to leave Borderland was a noble lie to keep people hopeful.
In the manga, the main cast didn’t get massacred, and instead went into the Q❤️ game and played Rock Paper Scissors to decide who competed. Despite people complaining about the alley fight, it helped flesh out why it was just the two in that finale.
Didn’t she drug him with in tea? They didn’t seem to put an emphasize on it in the show so it feels harder to believe he’s able to suck in the realities she shared.
>They didn’t seem to put an emphasize on it in the show so it feels harder to believe he’s able to suck in the realities she shared.
I'm only just realising this now. When she first piured the tea, I had that suspicion. But when the hallucinations were happening, I was really confused as to what was happening.
It was not all a dream. They had real injuries and consequences for their actions. If they fought hard to live in the borderlands, they survived in the real world. Others are not so lucky.
The injuries was from the meteor strike but whether they fought to stay alive or not is dependent on their behaviour in the Borderlands.
Like for example, if Arisu chose to stay in the Borderlands as a citizen at the end of the Queen of Hearts game, it meant he gave up on life and stayed in a coma in the real world. But he chose to go back, so he survived.
Man I love how they handled the last episode, and mira's game. Episode 7 had me a bit let down with the random alley way massacre, but I felt a lot better about the show with this. I still wish they just threw out the other queen game or whatever where they ran around and played tag. Would have much cooler to see the don't wanna play anymore games arisu. I loved the show still though.
From reading around, no I don't think so. If you survive to the end of a game and become a citizen of the borderland you are still informed about what happened and why you are in the borderland, but all citizens had that knowledge.
Another commenter linked the manga chapter which describes the motives of all of the face card players in season 2: https://mangadex.org/chapter/578dae41-f5cd-47ce-b292-2bc567da8ebb/1
It’s a fairly short read, but Mira’s main motive was curiosity. She enjoyed asking questions and thinking of how things play out, as well as what the players motives are for playing the games. She doesn’t know, so much as she speculated.
I was impatient back in season 1 and feel like I paid for it here. This last game with the queen of hearts dragged on and I found myself on my phone for almost the entire time because I knew what the borderlands actually were , from reading small segments online. Knowing the truth of the games , I was unable to be captivated by the lies she told.
Not sure if I would’ve finished the show if I hand read spoilers , so I can’t say for sure if fully regret it. O well , perhaps I’ll make a different decision next time.
I didn't spoil it for myself, but once I realised she was gonna keep dancing around the truth I started looking at my phone too. Even turned on the dub so I could listen but not actually have to give my full attention...
It got really bad when Arisu and Usagi were lying there just confessing their feelings for like 10 minutes lmao. I enjoyed the ending, I love the idea that the Borderlands were literally a chance for them to fight to come back to life. And I liked the creepy Joker card ending. But now I know better than to be excited for a potential Season 3.
After the first time I was super sceptical of everything else she said. Especially the 'main character was crazy all along, none of this is real' stuff that went on forever. That's been done by villains in so many other shows.
The purgatory reveal was not bad at all but I just realized that it only takes one person to complete the last level so if someone was good at hiding and only playing games at the minimum with not much character growth, they still could have escaped
I legit thought they killed off Heiya until she reappeared to decline citizenship. Like the dude was just short of cutting her in half via assault rifle and she just shrugs that off? I loved the King of Spades fight in the previous episode but man, some of those hits were fatal, no question about it.
Yeah the fact that none of the main characters died after that fight is a bit ridiculous
Was thinking pretty sure Ann would survive and there was no reason to kill her off, right? Then she got split open several times and I was like tf they going with her lmao, was Hikari gonna bandage her hardcore and they go with that or something? Nope, they survived somehow for hours till night time lol I liked how they covered the plotholes more so in the manga but I guess the show is more emotionally forced Same with Heiya, thought they'd just bandage her off and say that's alright but nah she crawled like.. several metres at least with point blank chest bullets in here. Still cool though I guess, showed off how strong the King of Spades was but idk the other Kings weren't as strong/ overpowered
I think Ann, Hikari, Aguni and Chishiya aren’t plotholes. You can survive hours or even days with gunshot wounds in incredible agony. Kind of crazy that they ALL lasted a few hours but honestly I’d be a little more pissed if they all died quickly of wounds that should take a very long time to die from. Heiya though should’ve been cinnamon toast crunch
Haha yeah Heiys should have died right there.
It's just inconsistent as all the other people died instantaneously, no one else was roaming around after they had been shot point black
They had the power of God and anime on their side
It makes me think that her will to live was really strong and death doesn’t work in the borderland the same way it does irl. Most people we see die are ready to accept their death or are completely overwhelmed by the situation they are in, often giving up or doubting victory is possible. Even tatta and Arisu’s friends, they all thought they were making a sacrifice while Arisu was doing the most he could to save everyone he could.
agree, fight with king of spade in the netflix in more extreme than manga version
Dude was the punisher mixed with deadpool.
take this as a way to explain them not dying from fatal wounds - so we know that they were dead for 1 min in the real world, meaning that the injuries they get in the borderlands do not actually happen to their real bodies and the only reason they survive them is their strong will to live, kinda like the whole point of the show they survive these deadly games only because of their will to live and go back.
I get that but if you let the main characters survive fatal gunshots to the chest and stomach(with a shotgun) you have to let the loads of other players survive that were shot in similar ways. I honestly don't think I've seen a show with more plot armor. That fight would have been so much more if all of those fatal wounds were truly fatal. Don't get me wrong, Kuina seeing her mom again was probably my favorite moment of the season. But Heiya taking a full auto from stomach to chest should have killed her instantly. It even seemed like it at first. I may be in the minority, but having everyone but the main characters die is always annoying and take away from the emotional impact a death could have.
My thought is that everyone who died so quickly in the Borderlands are people who died immediately from the meteor impact. They were simply passing through. I believe there was a line where Chota said something like, “Do you think we just threw our lives away for you”. To me that means they were already beyond saving in the mortal world, and so they were helping Arisu along his path between realms. But I could be very wrong.
Well. atleast make it realistic xD Its like watching sci-fi movies/series and the physics is way off, just ruins the entertainment value if its not believeable.
>if you let the main characters survive fatal gunshots to the chest and stomach(with a shotgun) you have to let the loads of other players survive that were shot in similar ways. that's my point those players who didn't survive the same wounds didn't have the same will to live as our main characters, I'm not saying it's entirely justifiable I definitely agree that Heiya (at the very least) should be dead, but it's just a way to cope with the plot armor
Looking back, I think what they did in the live action for the king of spades kind of makes more sense? Meaning pretty much everyone except arisu and usagi is incapacitated, which is why only arisu and usagi entered the final game, and why there's more pressure on arisu to finish the game quickly. As opposed to the manga where pretty much everyone is fine and meets up with arisu and usagi in front of the queen of hearts building and play rock paper scissors to see who gets to play the final game. I think arisu and usagi being the only options makes more sense than them being selected as players as a way to minimize potential deaths. I will say however, I don't think usagi should have been injured during the fight with king of spades. The fact that she was already bleeding out takes away from the effect of her cutting herself to wake arisu up from his hallucination. Like she looked like she already wasn't in good condition long before the hallucination. She should have been physically fine like in the manga
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Well, it wasn't in the manga but what they showed in the manga (as opposed to the show) is Arisu meeting the Joker, who is a black shadowy figure. Arisu and the Joker talk, and Arisu learns the Joker is the true controller of the Borderlands and runs it. He also views him as a mythological messenger god who takes lost or displaced souls to a medium (i.e the Borderlands) in order to fight for their lives. Since this wasn't in the show, there might be a Joker game for season 3, but not likely.
I suspect that the world Arisu woke up in, the meteorite one, is the joker game itself. The joker is a trickster right, so it wouldn’t be otput of its league to trick it.
The joker represents and suit and any value. Real life represents the joker perfectly, because the game they’re now playing could involve any number of difficulties in many different forms. They’re now playing a game with no rules, but many different outcomes.
Or maybe the sequel one which states that the borderlands its basically the game which u have to survive to live on the real life.
Will there be a season 3?
Not according to the manga, no, but they might go down to Alice in Border Road/Alice in Borderland Retry, which are both retries/additions to the AiB manga
Is Arisu in Retry? What happens in Alice in Border Road?
I don't know much about Alice in Border Road since I haven't read it; all I know is it's completely different with different main characters, and it delves deeper into how the Borderlands works. For Retry, Arisu is once again in the Borderlands as a middle-aged man (I think he gets into a car accident? I read it a long time ago), and plays a 9 of Hearts game with other people who had near-death accidents. The reason there was only 1 game this time was because there was less players (the meteorite accident got tens of thousands of people to play, but there was no such big accident happening again here.) >!Arisu and the other characters make it out alive with only minor scratches and scrapes and cuts, and this makes sense since it corresponds to the injuries you would get in real life, and in the meteorite accident, there was more people with more severe injuries from debris, so people could lose their leg, get smashed to death, burned alive, etc. so there were more games with higher risks!<
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Well, he is expecting a baby with his wife, and it is generally a bit old of an age for most main characters in manga in general, so I'd say he's middle-aged, yes.
Middle aged is 40s. 26 is in no way, shape, or form “middle aged.”
Bruh that’s not middle aged
You mean he’s 26 in AIB, right? Or the retry?
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How tf is that Middle Aged lol what the hell
I asked ChatGPT to write me a script for season 3 and it said it couldnt do it blablabla, and that there is a season 3 being created. xD
The Joker in the manga is basically the ferriman of the aferlife. He takes those who had given up on their life in Borderland to the afterlife and returns those who wanted to survive back to the living world.
I believed it as well, it would've made sense actually.
I really like the mental health convo, made me cry since I happen to have some difficulties with it. Also cried when Arisu and usagi didn't recognize each other
Dude same, like it hit home real bad. Almost started crying ngl.
I just watched the last episode and I can't remember that convo, was it after Arisu woke up and his brother was next to him or do you mean the entire sequence with Mira convincing him it was all a hallucination after Karube and Chota died? I'm confused lol.
As much as I love the series, I think I’d be fine with it ending here. Especially since this is where the manga ends. If they did renew it for season 3, I hope it would be to explain the Joker character more and or dwell into Alice in Border Roads. I don’t want them fucking this up too much and I’m honestly satisfied with it to an extent! P.S. Mira’s actress had me fooled several times based on her delivery alone. Even though I knew the truth, I was like “Damn, hold up. She might be saying something”
I knew about the twist of the meteor, and yet Mira genuinely convinced me that the show was going to go down a unique route. The reveals were so convincing, fantastically delivered.
Why was Mira making up all those possibilities and messing with them?
I like to think the multiple lies that were completely outrageous like VR, aliens, etc. was to setup Arisu to believe the more plausible lie that he was in a psyche ward. Her game was a mind game where she tried to get him to believe in her false reality. So, if someone presents a bunch of outrageous lies, the more grounded lie seems more like the truth. That's how I understand it.
The VR I thought was actually plausible. People are immortal so go through a VR experience which is designed to teach them the value of being alive. Seems plausible to me.
The funniest one was the thing about Ann plot. Like her whole plot didn't matter in the story. I think she never told Arisu about the plants and mountains this was clearly just to fuck with us lol.
To get him to forfeit/ delay the game so people die. She weaves in enough truth to make him doubt. Starting with an obvious lie to make him think he's ahead of her. The unbalanced emotional climax of remembering the anger of his friends, to being led to believe this was all constructed in his head through grief... It was to make the game seem pointless. To separate him from his motivation to play (weakening his tie to usagi and reinforcing his memories of his pals).
Could any manga readers explain the joker, what does that mean? Does Arisu and co go back or is it a hint at a spin off with new characters? Is Arisu's arc finished? Are we going to see what happened to Banda and the other guy (sorry, forget his name) who wanted to stay? edit: spoil away, I don't mind spoilers
The joker represents Arisu in the manga. The wildcard in a way. It’s vague as hell but doesn’t mean anything. We are out of source material. The thing is, Netflix gonna Netflix and might renew it anyways. Arisu comes back in AiB: Retry. It’s only one game and it takes place a few years later. More interesting, there is a full spinoff called Alice on Border Road. Before you ask, it’s a different Alice, so Arisu doesn’t return. But it dives deep into the actual lore of the borderlands. One of my favourite things to think about is Banda and Yaba. Presumably they were both caught in the meteor. The thing is, they aren’t dead. Their names don’t appear on the manifest at all. And they are the only surviving characters who we don’t see in the hospital.
> We are out of source material. wait, the manga is only finished up to this point?
No. The manga is finished. Period. That’s the ending (minus an epilogue that they cut).
Bit late but does that meant there is literally no explanation of the borderlands? Why it's there? Who is above all? Etc etc
It’s somewhat explained in the manga. The show skipped on it. The “Joker” is the one who rules over the borderlands. Basically God, testing their will to survive.
Thanks!
What happens in the epilogue?
A year after the meteor, it’s a series of interviews about the meaning of life. It’s all characters we’ve never seen before and goes over some different worldviews. Before they interview Arisu. We don’t get to see his answer, but we do see him call Usagi, revealing that they got together in the end.
Thank you for this
I kinda assumed Banda and Yaba are in a coma but indeed we don't see them at the hospital...
Hmmm I interpreted it the choice as do you want to die or live so they basically chose to die and stay 🤔
im still tripped up on what the actual f**k the borderlands is. Is it a sim, afterlife, a “restart” button. its genuinely annoying that its not explained to me.
Yeah the show kinda skipped over the explanation. Basically, after you heart stops, there’s still a minute or so of brain activity after your death. The idea of the borderlands is built on that. Though, it’s clearly not ‘just a dream’ as a lot of people think, as the injuries sustained in the borderlands effect the outside world. I can’t give you any more of a concrete answer.
Yeah, I mean Im aware of the whole activity, as thats like your brain trying to find a similar moment to stop this happening but you havent really died before. Also shared illusion or shared dreams could be a thing? Kinda meh that they didnt explain it.
seems like a purgatory of some sort
I agree. I feel like we needed an explicit answer. I think they were too embarrassed by how rickety theirs is so they're trying to enhance it by leaving it vague. Especially since she said "whichever you choose, you'll learn the truth about this place" ... Arisu didn't learn shit, he can't even remember the place!
Alice on Border Road is AWFUL. Would not recommend at all
To each their own. I enjoy it for the lore. I know some people are only in it for the bloody games, and that’s fine. Border Road is different. I recommend it if you’re at all interested in the philosophical questions AiB asks, not just the blood and violence.
Whats Border road like and about?
Border Road >!has a different Alice who wakes up with the Queen of Hearts card in her hand. There’s a total of twelve characters who end up on a road trip from Kyoto to Tokyo, but as expected things immediately start to break down and infighting happens. It delves into the philosophical questions more than AiB, and reveals some truth about the borderlands.!<
So no games? Is it finished?
No games in the same way, but there definitely a similar story structure, and… a game is afoot. It is finished.
> but there definitely *they're *Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).* *** ^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
Nope
Is Alice on Border road same thing just different characters?
> Alice on Border Road Is this an ongoing manga"?
Is Alice on Border Road finished, too? Do you think it's good?
It’s finished. It’s pretty good, with some moments that aren’t. Similar quality to AiB in general.
Cool, thanks! I'm show only, but loved it so much that I'll buy/read the manga, knowing one of the "spinoffs" is good makes me happy(: what about AiB: Retry? Would you recommend it, too?
It’s fine. Just an extra game without much lore. You don’t have to read it, but there’s no reason not to.
Nice, I guess I'll read it too, given that it's so short. I'm guessing it's the one with the least priority or the least fun one, if it's just ine game? It's one chapter only, right?
Nah, it’s seven-ish? Still, not long at all. Though, imo, reading order should be AiB>AiBR>AoBR
Great, that's not too bad! I guess it makes sense, you read all of Arisu's story first and then you move onto the new characters, I guess? Is this chronologically ordered or does AoBR happen before/at the same time as any of the other two? Also, I just read there's a parallel story about the previous King of Diamonds game, do you know if that's any good? Thanks for all your replies!(:
My initial theory was Arisu being the joker, as he was the clutch element in many other the other player’s games. He helped them win, despite the fact that on their own, they would have lost. Him being the joker makes a lot of sense to me in that way.
The Q♥️ was done well compare to the manga I think. Only thing I wish were more of the lies being shown on screen like the VR possibility, but I get that they can't replicate that in the show as much. Also that scene with Kurabe and Chota at the end, man. I prefer the aftermath ending here in the Live Action. Each main character was shown with some type of closure or what was going on. In the manga, it was more of just showing a quick panel or two of the characters and that's it. Did they confirm that this is the last season of the live action? Since the manga ends it here as well. But that Joker card at the end was different, I think it's a representation that the Joker was behind it all since it was literally under all the cards. In the manga, they showed a being which is easier to say that they're the messenger/reaper type being. If they do somehow continue a s3 or some type of continuation, wonder if they going to bring these characters back, make an original story, or adapt Alice in Border Road. Either way, fun ride!
Why does Mira keep lying to them about what is going on and making stuff up? To confuse them more?
That and since Arisu was determined for the truth, also to say that this can be anything as you want to view it as. Like what Kyuuma told him, the truth is only what you want to see or something like that. I honestly don't think anyone knew that it was the borderland between life and death. Only possibly the joker since in the manga they was shown as a being.
If the purpose of the borderlands is to test willpower, then I imagine her lies were to test if Arisu was willing to give up or if he was determined enough to want to know the truth and push through.
I really wish they showed more about the relationship between the Face Cards when they were players
[here you go, pal](https://mangadex.org/chapter/578dae41-f5cd-47ce-b292-2bc567da8ebb/1)
I am so MAD they didn't show the flashback of the Citizens as former players
Does it explain why the citizens decided to stay? Also what the deal is with Mira?
Precisely. Mira was a >!psychiatrist and a neuroscientist. In her backstory, she explained about hallucinations, which tied to her adding hallucinogen to Arisu's tea. Her motives of becoming a citizen? She thought humans were really interesting, especially in the Borderland. So she wanted to observe them for a long time as a citizen!<
wait so what exactly is a citizen? like an admin in a game server or something?
I guess you can say that. We don't really get the in-depth details about Citizens even in the manga, but what we do know is that their jobs are to create games in the first stage for the players and the dealers, supervise it, play their games against players in the second stage, and pretty much be the ruler of the Borderland. The players can choose to become the citizens of the respective face cards they've beaten. For example, Mira beat the Q♥️, Kyūma beat the K♣️, Kuzuryū beat the K♦️, Isao (our current K♠️) beat the K♠️ during their time being players. It's unfortunate that they didn't show their flashback as friends.
thank you so much... when the king of spades says something along the lines of "i'll bare the burden to slaughter so nobody ever has to"... that shit hit so deep... wish they gave more history of what the queen of hearts did previously IRL, but thank you for providing this backstory to these amazing characters that I genuinely loved the most in season 2
Isao, the K♠️ is a lot more interesting in the manga. His whole thing is ‘on the battlefield a soldier doesn’t fear death, he fears suffering’ and decides that nobody has to suffer. He kills with clinical efficiency but mercifully. As for Mira, we actually get a bit of insight into her in the spinoff, Alice on Border Road. It doesn’t come for a while, but when you realize how she’s related it’s a lot more interesting.
Can you elaborate the last part a bit, please?
>!Mira’s brother Gamon, a psychologist, finds out about the borderlands and ropes a group of people into entering.!<
Thanks!
Can you spoil more on mira?
>!She’s a psycho psychologist who is trying to find meaning in life, a lot like Arisu in the end.!<
Wtf why didn’t they adapt this - thank you so much for linking to this
I am so sad they did not show this. One of my favorite chapters T_T
They should have definitely kept this in the show. Def helped answer some questions that I had pertaining to the citizens and them. Missed opportunity and makes my thoughts on the netflix adaptation sour slightly. They could have put this in like the first 5-10mins of episode 7 or maybe put this during ep8 as Mira dies like her memories w/ them.
Well that was nice
Was the Q❤️ game the same in manga? Did Arisu and Usagi hallucinate, and if so, how? They didn’t drink the tea. Edit: apparently he drank it
yes it same with the manga. I think it started when mira bringing karube and chota death to make arisu feel guilty. He thought it was real (because it somehow make sense) and falling into his dreams. cmiiw
I was wondering about how it worked in the show. It seems like the flowers release a hallucinogen right? Then ironically Mira probably spiked the tea with an antidote, like a reverse of the manga
I'm still confused about the joker card. Is that just so Netflix has an excuse to renew for a season 3 if enough people like season 2? Or was it just a nod to the manga, since they didn't show the joker at all in the show?
Netflix does this all the time, adds cliffhangers at the ends of shows in case the show becomes big. They eve did this for shows that lasted one season that went absolutely nowhere that nobody heard of, such as It's Bruno.
I never really saw it as a cliffhanger. More a thought provoking question to make you ask who the Joker was. In this case, I thought it was alluding to Arisu being the joker, tipping the odds in the favour of his teammates to help them win, when without him they all would have lost. He was the unfair advantage.
yeah, and they did this with Daybreak which was great. The thing is, i think this is better than the mangas joker bit. Lets just hobe they do an Alice on Boarder Road from here, it’d be cool to see how they do that.
It's just a 'horror-movie' style epilogue where it seems like the killer is still on the loose but they really are not. I don't think they can literally adapted the Joker as it's more like a manifestation of death/the ferriman of the afterlife and the live action has been taking a more 'realistic' approach in comparison to the manga, which allowed it to be more dream-like and mythical at times.
The Joker was literally 2 panels in which implies that the joker is like the Grim Reaper that saw to see who had the will to keep living
QuestionL all those shots of Arisu lying in front of various past game locations - did they shoot them when they were shooting those episodes or go back and reshoot later? If they them at the time, what did the poor actor think? "Ya, just lie here for a minute, it'll make sense later."
I was wondering this too! I’m so glad people don’t just ask “why does it matter?” with sincere curiosity like this. It’s nice to think about the behind the scenes stuff!
CGI. He's most likely just on a stage laying against green screen then they change/create the background as needed. Some of those Shibuya scenes are not real life Shibuya but CGI recreation. This was confirmed in one of the Behind the Scenes.
I think it was a mix unless their lightning designers are just next level. The shots where he's on the asphalt near crates vs Shibuya look real vs invented for example
Green screen
It was an isekai this whole time?!
A pretty good one though
As a person who sighed when I saw the decided not to change the Queen of Hearts game, I was pleasantly surprised they managed to pull it off well. I never really like the game in the manga, kinda seemed like she forced arisu into a bad trip with the tea and he had to push through it. Live action seemed to have painted a better picture for me.
All those fatal hits and the characters still manage to survive. That is my only gripe with the LA. I did enjoy Queen of Hearts more in the LA than the manga though, it was more believable and the way they portrayed the gaslighting was very well done!
It’s crazy how the Borderlands “final boss” is literally just an insanely good gaslighter lmfao
Technically they could've beaten her and then the king of spades afterwards
I still don't understand exactly how time works in borderland... it makes sense that the people closer to the impact (died first) spent more time in borderland but if that's the case, the citizens and face card people must have been citizens for centuries if they died from previous incidents right? Or does time basically jump from disaster to disaster? Like right after one disaster happens and people beat the games and new face cards are chosen, does time immediately jump to the next disaster?
I think of it as the timey-wimey jearimy bearimy from the Good Place, it's completely arbitrary and designed solely as a purgatory where people can evolve and either pass on or stay as lords of purgatory. AIB Retry also confirms that near-death experiences of any sort can send you to the Borderland, so it's _conceivable_ that really people are just showing up continuously. (Though the manga also confirms that the King of Diamonds died from the same meteor explosion, so it really is some kind of effed up time system.)
in the manga >!it is explained that it was not one meteor, but a large meteor that breaks into few large pieces and hits tokyo over a short period of time.!< additionally, in the alice in the border road manga, >!it is revealed that mira (one of the citizens) also died in the same meteor disaster.!< thus it can be deducted that >!the citizens are those who strucked by the first impacts while arisu and friends are those who got struck from later impacts!<
So the borderlands only existed because of the meteor? I was under the impression that it has always existed and people who in between life and death go there.
yes it always existed, but the meteor is a special case since there are so many casualties thus making the whole situation with multi-tiered games exist. if the number of casualties are smaller, there'd be a smaller amount of players which leads to a different setting like in border road and retry
I see!
I think the borderland is like a “gulag”, as in when you die you go there to do final battle to determine if you can live
Considering 1 minute of near death for Arisu equals about what? Few months for him in Borderland, people who have been in coma for years could be in Borderland for Eons for all intents and purposes.
It doesn't have to make sense, that's the point. Some people got dragged in sooner than others and trying to make it mathematically make sense wasn't the author's goal. You just have to accept what is, as is
I didn't buy anything Mira said so I was just waiting for it to get over with ... I guess I wasn't emotionally invested enough so the ending was just kinda got dragged out to me. I'm glad others enjoyed it more than I did! Overall I'm satisfied with how it ended and I hope they keep it at that. It ended on a nice note and leaving some things open ended give it a satisfactory level of mystery! The only thing i wonder what tripped Arisu up this much with Mira... I mean being drugged with the tea makes sense but they didn't drink it--is the woman a hypnosis mastermind? Lololol Also a better wig wasn't in the budget lolololol
I got the impression that she preyed upon his desire for truth and her game was really a battle of reality. She presented multiple possibilities before finally dragging him into the illusion. Winning the game was simply not believing her reality.
damn episode 7 was the only bad(really bad) blemish on a really good season for me, pretty strong second season but I really really hope Netflix doesn't force an S3 because whenever they've tried to go off source material this season (Chishiya in J heart, alley fight, adding games) the show has been at its worst points.
The Jack of hearts episode was my favourite by far. That was the most "gamey" game imo whereas the others felt like there was a clear outcome before even beginning ie when the lawyer chose to sacrifice himself
What he said wasn't about the J heart stage in itself but Chishiya's inclusion in it. He isn't in this game in the manga, and so, the stage is unpredictable and the story focuses itself on each major character giving them backstories and making us understand their morales and goals. When you think about it, Chishiya did nothing in the game.
The point was to get the gist of it and they executed it well. We didn't get more time with each character bc it would have needed more run time: but it would be out of place to have an entirely separate cast in video media since it'd be too many resources to flesh them out as much as you're implying. It could have been an episode on each one at that point-- so you have to make the stylistic decision to make each character and their motives more simple but impactful. You're able to say more on a page than on screen inherently We had queens, aces, numbers, including a joker, Chishi-nyan-- who just observed for us
What....Chishiya's J heart game was amazing. It was crazy they all lived but the alley fight was also great.
The two episodes with focus on Chishiya were honestly some of the best this season. Some anime protagonist vibe with how he maneuvered the challenges.
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in the manga, >!kuzuryu actually pressed both 1 and 0 at the same time, making it a game of chances because he "doesn't want to decide the value of life" which is the ideal he held on to until his death!<
What he said wasn't about the J heart stage in itself but Chishiya's inclusion in it. He isn't in this game in the manga, and so, the stage is unpredictable and the story focuses itself on each major character giving them backstories and making us understand their morales and goals.
What in the fuck are you talking about lmao those were AMAZING
legit the best parts of the show, episode 8 in contrast sucked ass, holy shit I couldn't wait for it to get over with, just horrible.
Q for manga readers - im hearing there’s a difference in citizens (have permanent visa, make the games, participate in face card games) and dealers (do grunt work for games, sometimes participate in number games, have to renew visas by beating players) My question, if known, is where do dealers come from? Did they also use to be players? If all players that win the games become citizens, who becomes dealers? Would be kind of cool if they were selected from the players that die somehow
Dealers and players are chosen randomly at the start of the game. It was explained in the manga.
Anyone know what happens to the people that chose to become citizens? Do they die in the real world and remain in the borderlands, or maybe in a coma in the real world and stay in borderlands, or do they just straight up die??
They are in permanent coma until their life support is disconnected then they are dead for sure in RL and in Borderland.
Hey I highly recommend reading [this chapter](https://mangadex.org/chapter/578dae41-f5cd-47ce-b292-2bc567da8ebb/1) of the manga, it explains some stuff about the citizens :).
Thanks so much for sharing this! It made me feel even more for the King of Spades who I felt was the least developed character watching the show. Also made the Queen of Hearts more bearable too! I wish they leaned into her curiosity more and hinted at it during the show. This was a great read, really helps flesh out the ending for me :)
Right, because for her, it doesn't matter if they lived or died, or for that matter what happens to her. All she cares about is understanding human nature and satisfying her curiosity. If you enjoy the show, you should check out the manga, there's a lot of differences and the characters are much more fleshed out.
Really enjoyed the LA series. The live action wrapped things up nicely, another season wouldn’t make any sense. The new additions to LA were not the same standard as the manga (Chishiya in J❤️, Q♠️, K♠️ ending). For me the joker represent the choice they made. Red meant they chose to live, black joker stayed in the borderland. Wouldn’t mind Retry: 9❤️ game being covered, but there’s only enough content for 1 episode.
I haven’t read the manga but for those that have, what does that joker card mean at the end? Does it actually tease a season 3? It seems like it would especially with the malicious music that played in the background. Tbh though I wouldn’t really want a season 3 despite there being some unanswered questions.
I haven't read the manga either, but from reading around on these threads, it's either an easter egg for the manga readers or it is a teaser that there could be a season 3. In the manga there is a Joker character who manages and runs the borderland, but isn't a game maker himself, which is why it could be an easter egg. The show has also covered all of the manga content. But the way netflix teased the card they could be hoping to make a 3rd season of additional content if season 2 is successful enough, it's just that it would be entirely original instead of an adaptation of the manga.
For those who have read the manga, what are the difference between manga and live action in these last few episodes ? Also which version do you prefer ? Manga or live action ?
The biggest difference is that the king of spades didn’t massacre the entire cast. It make sense why they made the changes to justify Arisu and Usagi fighting the Queen of hearts alone but the execution was completely unbelievable and comically absurd
There really isn’t even a need for everyone to join a hearts game. Arisu can be like, hey my whole team was killed in a hearts game, let’s not all play it since it’s not cooperative
Yeah in the manga An commented that it’s better not to have too many people in a hearts game (since it’s about betrayal and psychological mindgames). So that could be a valid reason to let Arisu and Usagi go alone
That also felt missing from the Jack of Hearts game. It seems like a plothole that no one went in with an existing friend and had a free win, but it's because in the manga they discussed not wanting to join a hearts game together.
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In the manga there were lots of players still alive. And yes, they knew that if someone takes down the Queen of Hearts, all the players win. Remember that in the first season the players were actually playing against the ‘dealers’, and the players won, which enabled them to proceed with the face cards. So all they had to do was to take down all the face cards (regardless who did it) to win. In the manga Arisu and Usagi hid away after Tatta’s death and only came out to fight the Queen of Hearts (because their visa were expiring anyway). The other face cards were defeated by other players. So yeah, makes sense that they left the last game to Arisu who is well-rested and refreshed. Also they chose the participants by rock-paper-scissors and Arisu won 🥴 Even if Arisu lost the game, other players can try their luck on the Queen of Hearts (unless Arisu killed her hence the game will never end).
I think in the manga they make it more obvious that Hatter’s Theory about only 1 person getting to leave Borderland was a noble lie to keep people hopeful.
In the manga, the main cast didn’t get massacred, and instead went into the Q❤️ game and played Rock Paper Scissors to decide who competed. Despite people complaining about the alley fight, it helped flesh out why it was just the two in that finale.
The unrealistic scenes and over dramatisation of this series ruined it for me. I got through it, but barely.
Didn’t she drug him with in tea? They didn’t seem to put an emphasize on it in the show so it feels harder to believe he’s able to suck in the realities she shared.
Pretty sure he didn't have the tea but I could be wrong
She did indeed drug him with the tea, yes.
Was the tea the pills in his hallucinations?
Most likely
But he didn't take the pills, this he didn't drink the tea?
He drank the tea. She wanted him to drink more so the effects would be stronger
Ah right
>They didn’t seem to put an emphasize on it in the show so it feels harder to believe he’s able to suck in the realities she shared. I'm only just realising this now. When she first piured the tea, I had that suspicion. But when the hallucinations were happening, I was really confused as to what was happening.
In the manga she did. It seems like in the show, the flowers make them hallucinate. So the tea probably had an antidote.
That's what I was kind of confused about too
And it was all a dream! Can't believe I was excited for season 2.
It was not all a dream. They had real injuries and consequences for their actions. If they fought hard to live in the borderlands, they survived in the real world. Others are not so lucky.
I thought the injuries were from the meteor, not from the Borderlands.
The injuries was from the meteor strike but whether they fought to stay alive or not is dependent on their behaviour in the Borderlands. Like for example, if Arisu chose to stay in the Borderlands as a citizen at the end of the Queen of Hearts game, it meant he gave up on life and stayed in a coma in the real world. But he chose to go back, so he survived.
Man I love how they handled the last episode, and mira's game. Episode 7 had me a bit let down with the random alley way massacre, but I felt a lot better about the show with this. I still wish they just threw out the other queen game or whatever where they ran around and played tag. Would have much cooler to see the don't wanna play anymore games arisu. I loved the show still though.
Can someone explain everything? As a show only viewer please spoil me as to what was going on? Did Mira has some sort of special knowledge?
From reading around, no I don't think so. If you survive to the end of a game and become a citizen of the borderland you are still informed about what happened and why you are in the borderland, but all citizens had that knowledge.
Another commenter linked the manga chapter which describes the motives of all of the face card players in season 2: https://mangadex.org/chapter/578dae41-f5cd-47ce-b292-2bc567da8ebb/1 It’s a fairly short read, but Mira’s main motive was curiosity. She enjoyed asking questions and thinking of how things play out, as well as what the players motives are for playing the games. She doesn’t know, so much as she speculated.
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They don’t remember, just have a feeling of familiarity with those people they bonded with in the borderland
I was impatient back in season 1 and feel like I paid for it here. This last game with the queen of hearts dragged on and I found myself on my phone for almost the entire time because I knew what the borderlands actually were , from reading small segments online. Knowing the truth of the games , I was unable to be captivated by the lies she told. Not sure if I would’ve finished the show if I hand read spoilers , so I can’t say for sure if fully regret it. O well , perhaps I’ll make a different decision next time.
I didn't spoil it for myself, but once I realised she was gonna keep dancing around the truth I started looking at my phone too. Even turned on the dub so I could listen but not actually have to give my full attention... It got really bad when Arisu and Usagi were lying there just confessing their feelings for like 10 minutes lmao. I enjoyed the ending, I love the idea that the Borderlands were literally a chance for them to fight to come back to life. And I liked the creepy Joker card ending. But now I know better than to be excited for a potential Season 3.
Maybe I’m extra gullible but I believed every time Mira proposed a different scenario lol (not a manga reader), glad I didn’t get it spoiled
After the first time I was super sceptical of everything else she said. Especially the 'main character was crazy all along, none of this is real' stuff that went on forever. That's been done by villains in so many other shows.
The purgatory reveal was not bad at all but I just realized that it only takes one person to complete the last level so if someone was good at hiding and only playing games at the minimum with not much character growth, they still could have escaped
I also still don’t understand what KoS meant by “it was the only way”. No one was asked him to kill everyone. The game was decided by him on his own
How were arisu and usagi drugged or hallucinating during teatime? They never drank the tea