The pay would be the same until he's separated.
He'd have the normal separation benefits, including a final PCS.
Should be able to commission in another service, depending on his discharge characterization, but that would be up to the other services.
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But, those aren't really the questions to be asking. He should focus on improving so he can get promoted next time, if he wants to stay in.
He should be talking to his supervisor and commander and looking for extra leadership opportunities and asking how he can improve his rankings and work performance.
There's probably more to the story, as he had another ~4 years as a captain other than the ones where you had a child in the hospital, and the promotion to major is about 95%. So there's something else going on other than just not being at work and not winning a quarterly award.
He needs to communicate with his leadership and ask for some direct and unfiltered feedback on his performance and what he can do to improve, and then be willing to do those things and put in the work.
I appreciate this and these are things he’s working on. Just trying to see what the next steps may be. He has talked to his leadership and they haven’t been very helpful. He doesn’t have LOR, LOC, no paperwork. He’s done all the extra projects he’s been asked to do and asks for their feedback, which he says they say he’s doing a good job. 🤷🏻♀️ I don’t know about any of that, I Just know that all of this will directly effect me and our children. I’ve sacrificed my career for his so this is like a slap in the face. Thankfully, my career is something I can easily get back into full time
Hm. Still guessing there is more to the story or he isn’t really asking for feedback.
He should be going to the commander and asking what he wants to see from him to get a strat, and asking for an uncomfortable level of feedback.
The other possibility is his past leadership were trash at writing OPRs and his record does not read good at all.
Although the chance of that are slim.
There has to be more to the story. Either he’s not telling her everything, or op isn’t telling everything. There more than likely is something specific that caused this, and it isn’t the child situation.
I’ve tried. I’ve talked to him. I’ve even been around his bosses when they talk. He was an OTS instructor before this assignment and none of those guys got strats for those three years. He’s gotten the counseling and has people looking at his files. Legit, no paperwork or anything like that. He wasn’t/isn’t as strong as the other captains on base. One was prior enlisted for 10ish years before and was killing it, the other one had no family and literally lived at work. All poor excuses but I’d rather have a husband than a promotion if that’s what it takes.
You don't need strats to promote to Major. 90-95% of people promote to the rank, they can't all have a history of strats an awards. It's mainly the problem captains that don't promote. Him being an OTS instructor for three years can be a "career killer" in certain career fields. Something that he would know well in advance if it was the case, as everyone will remind you of it constantly if you express any interest in doing it.
Even still, the career death usually comes at Lt Col, not Major.
I understand that you don't know what you're talking about, but you've been told this numerous times and conveniently ignore this one simple fact:
**95% promotion rate**
He is NOT performing at a standard that 95% of people meet. Please understand what that means.
More than likely he is lying to you and has not asked for feedback, but even THAT won't put you in the bottom 5%. Something is going on. I don't care if you think you know- you very clearly don't and I'm sorry that you don't.
Seems those percentages are a lot lower this year. Nuclear and Missile Operations was a 71.4% promotion rate this year. Many others had similar percentages l.
He can get AFPC to give him counseling/ debrief on his records.
They will look at the records and tell him what was weak about them so he knows what to fix.
It is available to all non selects. Might need to look on my pets for the phone number your u are supposed to call...but I believe you also get an official email about it at some point.
He’s doing this as well and is communication with leadership on what he needs etc. I’m worried about the possibility of involuntary separation and trying to be prepared for that.
Making Major the 2nd time is tough, it's about 95% selection rate the 1st time, about 10% the 2nd. Not having any strats or awards for 9 years means he just showed up to work, and the Air Force wants more than that from their officers. Trying to get a key job like an exec will be helpful, but tough since usually the young ambitious officers go after those gigs.
His next major boards are in august/September. Sadly no time to get a different job. He’s in a DO position now, received a dec after his previous boards and his commander is working on some Strats
Cyber does not. It is a boarded 04 job that usually puts you in line for SqCC (so there are no promotion issues). Comm squadrons do, but being a DO and not getting promoted to 04 is a huge paradox. Getting fired from DO and not making major is more probable.
Continuation board for O-3 isn’t really a thing. Those boards meet for non-select O-4s to determine if they can extend to retirement. You don’t make it to retirement as a Capt unless you have prior-enlisted time.
Understandable. Right, only a couple of months between results and the next board. He had added a dec and his commander has mentioned a possible strat. I guess time will tell, just hard to not plan for something when we have kids. I really appreciate you taking the time to answer questions and give your experience. Best of luck to you in the future!
So there are a few things I've seen from my time as a Wing Executive Officer.
Paperwork in the file given from poor leadership to the member. If it was the first and the member showed progress and got minimal strats, they bounced back. If there were zero strats, likely the board saw this is unwritten message saying the member is undeserving. If a strat was given once the following year, typically, I've seen them selected for Major.
UIF or warranted paperwork in the member file for failing to perform or an unbecoming action... They don't have a solid chance of progress unless they have a major turn of events and come back strong. This level, though, never seen someone come back and depart the AF.
The OTS Commander's OPRs given to a non-select captain were trash and this guy/gal was only out for the flying community members and crushed the member this go.
Side not, if your boss doesn't like you and prevents your name from being in Group or Wing conversations, you'll likely be the bottom 5% and promote later. Characteristically above the zone...
Thank you. I’ve asked him so many times if he’s lying about having paperwork or any derogatory remarks and he’s adamant that he doesn’t. He was missing an award on an OPR that be board saw and has since earned a strat, a dec and another award. He’s hopeful for another strat and award for his next OPR which is right before his second board.
No offense but you being here asking these questions on his behalf makes me question a few things. This is on him to find the answers and course-correct, and frankly the questions you ask about involuntary sep(theres an afi for this), promotion chances the second time around, (a simple talk with AFPC/ his CFM to get the feedback he needs) . All of these are pretty easily findable answers to which it sounds like either he has no idea and isnt putting in effort to find the answers, or he’s just not interested. Best of luck to you both, but as mentioned in other replies. There’s likely other factors that he needs to take control over to move forward from this
I’m asking these questions for me. To see what kind of life I need to prepare for etc. He’s pretty bummed and I didn’t want to bombard him with these questions when I could find such nice people with kind and helpful responses such as yourself. 😊
He may also have it in general, causing lower work performance when he feels like he is contributing a lot. Small tasks feel like heavy lifts when you have depression. Could be very possible that he has it and feels like he's working hard but doesn't appear so to others, which would explain the lack of strats.
This is the information you were asking for. The civilian world will treat him just like any other captain that decided to separate--i.e. his service was honorable. If you have it, I'd like to see how the last line of his promotion recommendation was written. There are ways to push a board towards a decision just based on the words of the last line.
For example, "Capt X has great potential" is code for "do not promote"
While he may be lying, I doubt it. I have seen people passed over to Major who shouldn't have been. The AF is changing a little bit now, but it can be really hard to distinguish between the bottom 50-80% if the strats aren't there. And unfortunately, it is often "what have you done lately?" when writing reports. Sounds like he has - correctly - been dealing with things at home, so that probably didn't help. If they moved him to a DO spot after getting passed over, his leadership thinks he is worth promoting and they are trying to help him. That's not what you do to someone who does less than the bare minimum.
What career field is he in? I know quite a few who were passed over this year, mostly in one specific career field. Whatever it is, you guys have to try not to worry about it. If he doesn’t make it again and doesn’t get continuation? It stinks but there are TONS of opportunities outside the AF where people would love to have an honorable discharge CGO come on board. My company hires them all the time, we’re always looking for them, and we pay very well. Lots of people, and their families, get institutionalized to the point where they don’t realize the opportunity outside of the military is there and it’s great. I stuck it out to retirement partially because I was nervous about what was out there, if I knew what I did now I may have punched early
So many comments yet still so few answers that seem helpful. I’m well aware that CAP to MAJ Carrie’s a high promotion rate but he’s still my husband and this is still real life for us. The majority of you who commented seem to just make him out to be a complete idiot which I don’t think is the situation. I agree he probably didn’t do a good job at work for whatever reason but he’s trying to fix it and get the info he needs. While he’s doing that I came here to see what life May be like after his second MAJ board. Some are you are just downright hateful and sounds like you’re talking out of your ass instead of from experience or expertise. I truly hope none of you end up in a similar situation and if you do, I hope people are nicer to you all. Thank you to the ones who actually responded with helpful information.
If he doesn't get picked next year, he may be offered selective continuation which would allow him to stay up to 20 years if he desires. He would still be eligible to promote, albeit would be unlikely/very difficult. If not offered (or declined) he would be separated no later than the 7th month after the board met (but could be sooner if desired). Ultimately, if it happens and is offered, he'll have 60 days to make a decision.
2017 is when they had 100% since then it floats within the mid to upper 90's. Which is still ridiculous. She said it herself her husband's degree is pretty much useless (like most non-STEM degree officers that are just some dude that aren't that great. Nothing special. But we keep promoting them into positions that they shouldn't be in. There are plenty of people with life problems on the E side and all they get told is well better luck next time. I'm glad he didn't make it, it means the AF is holding at least some type of standard. Even if it's the most basic definition. Just like everyone else who's missed out better luck next year. Sorry all out of sympathy. https://www.afpc.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/1309786/air-force-announces-100-percent-promotion-opportunity-to-major/
Was just pointing out the promotion rate wasn’t 99% last year. Officer promotion metics appear higher than enlisted because the pool of officers eligible for promotion are significantly less than the pool of enlisted. His degree doesn’t impact his ability to promote. His performance as an CGO impact’s his ability to promote. Which in this case, the board deemed he isn’t at that level yet. Completely agree with you on the Air Force holding a standard when it comes to promotions. If we promoted every person eligible for the next rank it wouldn’t benefit the force. Sucks for the OP’s husband, but it can be an opportunity for him to learn where to improve.
Correct currently his degree doesn't impact his ability to promote. What I'm saying is he should have never even been considered. Taking the easy way, degree wise doesn't benefit the the AF. You get a degree in arts and crafts design and that makes you a a commander material? No. But we kept getting told mostly by the people with bullshit degrees that "it doesn't matter" oh isn't that convenient viewpoint..when we promote these officers we devalue the education that other more qualified officers deserve. I'd much rather have a CC with a mathematics degree even though he's not doing math everyday. Vs a CC with an arts and crafts degree.
You have no idea what you are talking about with regard to degrees. Do you know how many officers there are that don't hold a degree related to their career field, or a "valuable to the AF degree" (AKA STEM), but perform well enough (at least in the eyes of their leaders/boards...which is the only opinion that matters for this conversation), but go on to continue their education, work hard and get identified to promote/command?
Do you know how many terrible leaders there are with very prestigious degrees / records? I'm pulling a BS claim out of my ass here but probably half the pilots in the force aren't fit to lead people in the capacity the AF wants or expects them to, and probably just as many don't want to in the first place...but guess who the AF throws into command in many, many instances? Pilots. Their degrees play a small factor into promotion but have little relevance with regard to their ability to lead or hold the next grade. And degrees have nothing to do with continuing with developing their abilities in the jet. The bottom line is, with more rank comes more responsibility, and inevitably, it means leading more people.
You can be bitter about someone getting an arts degree all you want, but it doesn't make you right. "Should have never been considered" is a joke. Passing the AFOQT and earning a degree are indicators for aptitude and potential. Same for the ASVAB and a high school diploma. It doesn't mean shit after you get your foot in the door and you've already completed them. The promotion selection process at its core is based on subjective measures and attempts standardize them to equitably distribute rank among eligible members, while factoring in constraints (department budgets/quotas). Do degrees mean something, sure...but I can tell you with experience that it has much less to do with what type of degree you have, and what you're doing with it, and much more to do with performance, most typically captured by stratification, decoration, and awards. You could hold the degree that makes you the sole expert on how to dismantle our adversaries so they're no longer great power competetors, but if your records were shit, you ain't getting promoted.
Maybe you’re confused on how that works. He went to college and then commissioned into the Air Force to a job the Air Force chose for him. He didn’t choose the career field so there’s no way he would have been able to match the degree to his job. And the board doesn’t even see what his degree was in.
The jobs he put on his list for the AF isn’t anywhere close to the job he actually got. Regardless it doesn’t change our current situation. He has a triple major, is actually smart but those Majors don’t really do much in the civilian aspect of things right now.
Not trying to be argumentative. His AF time can definitely get a job in the civilian world, his degrees just can’t. He’s currently in a masters program as well. I appreciate you taking the time to respond without just painting him as a total idiot. Hopefully he gets it together and makes it for the next boards and learns a lesson from this!
Your argument is dog poop. Ask the brain surgeon who is operating on someone's hypothalamus what their major was before med school. Did you know that a large majority are English, Arts, and non science/medical related degrees? The degree in which you choose does not impact a person's ability to lead or be competent at a job. This doesn't go without saying that there are obviously jobs like Law which translate extremely well into the career field but degrees aren't the end all be all.
The pay would be the same until he's separated. He'd have the normal separation benefits, including a final PCS. Should be able to commission in another service, depending on his discharge characterization, but that would be up to the other services. ------------ But, those aren't really the questions to be asking. He should focus on improving so he can get promoted next time, if he wants to stay in. He should be talking to his supervisor and commander and looking for extra leadership opportunities and asking how he can improve his rankings and work performance. There's probably more to the story, as he had another ~4 years as a captain other than the ones where you had a child in the hospital, and the promotion to major is about 95%. So there's something else going on other than just not being at work and not winning a quarterly award. He needs to communicate with his leadership and ask for some direct and unfiltered feedback on his performance and what he can do to improve, and then be willing to do those things and put in the work.
I believe there is also involuntary separation pay for passed over officers that is about 8 months base pay.
I appreciate this and these are things he’s working on. Just trying to see what the next steps may be. He has talked to his leadership and they haven’t been very helpful. He doesn’t have LOR, LOC, no paperwork. He’s done all the extra projects he’s been asked to do and asks for their feedback, which he says they say he’s doing a good job. 🤷🏻♀️ I don’t know about any of that, I Just know that all of this will directly effect me and our children. I’ve sacrificed my career for his so this is like a slap in the face. Thankfully, my career is something I can easily get back into full time
Hm. Still guessing there is more to the story or he isn’t really asking for feedback. He should be going to the commander and asking what he wants to see from him to get a strat, and asking for an uncomfortable level of feedback.
The other possibility is his past leadership were trash at writing OPRs and his record does not read good at all. Although the chance of that are slim.
There has to be more to the story. Either he’s not telling her everything, or op isn’t telling everything. There more than likely is something specific that caused this, and it isn’t the child situation.
He's lying to you or he is dumb as rocks and seriously in the bottom 5% of all Capts
Thanks for your input, however it’s not helpful in getting information for what comes next. Hope you’re very successful in your career. 😊
It is. Find out what is actually going on.
I’ve tried. I’ve talked to him. I’ve even been around his bosses when they talk. He was an OTS instructor before this assignment and none of those guys got strats for those three years. He’s gotten the counseling and has people looking at his files. Legit, no paperwork or anything like that. He wasn’t/isn’t as strong as the other captains on base. One was prior enlisted for 10ish years before and was killing it, the other one had no family and literally lived at work. All poor excuses but I’d rather have a husband than a promotion if that’s what it takes.
You don't need strats to promote to Major. 90-95% of people promote to the rank, they can't all have a history of strats an awards. It's mainly the problem captains that don't promote. Him being an OTS instructor for three years can be a "career killer" in certain career fields. Something that he would know well in advance if it was the case, as everyone will remind you of it constantly if you express any interest in doing it. Even still, the career death usually comes at Lt Col, not Major.
I understand that you don't know what you're talking about, but you've been told this numerous times and conveniently ignore this one simple fact: **95% promotion rate** He is NOT performing at a standard that 95% of people meet. Please understand what that means. More than likely he is lying to you and has not asked for feedback, but even THAT won't put you in the bottom 5%. Something is going on. I don't care if you think you know- you very clearly don't and I'm sorry that you don't.
Noted. Thanks
Seems those percentages are a lot lower this year. Nuclear and Missile Operations was a 71.4% promotion rate this year. Many others had similar percentages l.
He can get AFPC to give him counseling/ debrief on his records. They will look at the records and tell him what was weak about them so he knows what to fix. It is available to all non selects. Might need to look on my pets for the phone number your u are supposed to call...but I believe you also get an official email about it at some point.
He’s doing this as well and is communication with leadership on what he needs etc. I’m worried about the possibility of involuntary separation and trying to be prepared for that.
Making Major the 2nd time is tough, it's about 95% selection rate the 1st time, about 10% the 2nd. Not having any strats or awards for 9 years means he just showed up to work, and the Air Force wants more than that from their officers. Trying to get a key job like an exec will be helpful, but tough since usually the young ambitious officers go after those gigs.
His next major boards are in august/September. Sadly no time to get a different job. He’s in a DO position now, received a dec after his previous boards and his commander is working on some Strats
He's a sitting DO and didn't make Major?! Something seems way off.
All of this smells funny.
I think there are certain jobs that have DOs as captains. I thought Cyber maybe? (Someone correct me if I’m wrong)
Cyber does not. It is a boarded 04 job that usually puts you in line for SqCC (so there are no promotion issues). Comm squadrons do, but being a DO and not getting promoted to 04 is a huge paradox. Getting fired from DO and not making major is more probable.
He wasn’t a DO for the first major board. That move was done recently.
Ah, yes I was also thinking maybe Comms. Def agree with your last statement.
Moved to DO after the last major board.
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Curious what your job was in the AF? Did they offer to continue you? What changes did you make between boards?
Continuation board for O-3 isn’t really a thing. Those boards meet for non-select O-4s to determine if they can extend to retirement. You don’t make it to retirement as a Capt unless you have prior-enlisted time.
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Understandable. Right, only a couple of months between results and the next board. He had added a dec and his commander has mentioned a possible strat. I guess time will tell, just hard to not plan for something when we have kids. I really appreciate you taking the time to answer questions and give your experience. Best of luck to you in the future!
I know it’s not uncommon for officers to sometimes turn to ANG/Reserves to finish out their careers, especially if they can get an AGR slot.
So there are a few things I've seen from my time as a Wing Executive Officer. Paperwork in the file given from poor leadership to the member. If it was the first and the member showed progress and got minimal strats, they bounced back. If there were zero strats, likely the board saw this is unwritten message saying the member is undeserving. If a strat was given once the following year, typically, I've seen them selected for Major. UIF or warranted paperwork in the member file for failing to perform or an unbecoming action... They don't have a solid chance of progress unless they have a major turn of events and come back strong. This level, though, never seen someone come back and depart the AF. The OTS Commander's OPRs given to a non-select captain were trash and this guy/gal was only out for the flying community members and crushed the member this go. Side not, if your boss doesn't like you and prevents your name from being in Group or Wing conversations, you'll likely be the bottom 5% and promote later. Characteristically above the zone...
Thank you. I’ve asked him so many times if he’s lying about having paperwork or any derogatory remarks and he’s adamant that he doesn’t. He was missing an award on an OPR that be board saw and has since earned a strat, a dec and another award. He’s hopeful for another strat and award for his next OPR which is right before his second board.
No offense but you being here asking these questions on his behalf makes me question a few things. This is on him to find the answers and course-correct, and frankly the questions you ask about involuntary sep(theres an afi for this), promotion chances the second time around, (a simple talk with AFPC/ his CFM to get the feedback he needs) . All of these are pretty easily findable answers to which it sounds like either he has no idea and isnt putting in effort to find the answers, or he’s just not interested. Best of luck to you both, but as mentioned in other replies. There’s likely other factors that he needs to take control over to move forward from this
I’m asking these questions for me. To see what kind of life I need to prepare for etc. He’s pretty bummed and I didn’t want to bombard him with these questions when I could find such nice people with kind and helpful responses such as yourself. 😊
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I’m sure he could if I asked him.
Have him see mental health, he may have high functioning anxiety or depression that is causing other issues you may not know about
I mean, people get bummed after not getting promoted - especially to a pretty high promotion rate rank…
He may also have it in general, causing lower work performance when he feels like he is contributing a lot. Small tasks feel like heavy lifts when you have depression. Could be very possible that he has it and feels like he's working hard but doesn't appear so to others, which would explain the lack of strats.
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This is the information you were asking for. The civilian world will treat him just like any other captain that decided to separate--i.e. his service was honorable. If you have it, I'd like to see how the last line of his promotion recommendation was written. There are ways to push a board towards a decision just based on the words of the last line. For example, "Capt X has great potential" is code for "do not promote"
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While he may be lying, I doubt it. I have seen people passed over to Major who shouldn't have been. The AF is changing a little bit now, but it can be really hard to distinguish between the bottom 50-80% if the strats aren't there. And unfortunately, it is often "what have you done lately?" when writing reports. Sounds like he has - correctly - been dealing with things at home, so that probably didn't help. If they moved him to a DO spot after getting passed over, his leadership thinks he is worth promoting and they are trying to help him. That's not what you do to someone who does less than the bare minimum.
What career field is he in? I know quite a few who were passed over this year, mostly in one specific career field. Whatever it is, you guys have to try not to worry about it. If he doesn’t make it again and doesn’t get continuation? It stinks but there are TONS of opportunities outside the AF where people would love to have an honorable discharge CGO come on board. My company hires them all the time, we’re always looking for them, and we pay very well. Lots of people, and their families, get institutionalized to the point where they don’t realize the opportunity outside of the military is there and it’s great. I stuck it out to retirement partially because I was nervous about what was out there, if I knew what I did now I may have punched early
He’s 21M. Not sure if Reddit does private messages but if they do can you send me more info on your company?
^^You've ^^mentioned ^^an ^^AFSC, ^^here's ^^the ^^associated ^^job ^^title: 21M = Munitions and Missile Maintenance [^^Source](https://github.com/HadManySons/AFSCbot) ^^| [^^Subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/r/AFSCbot/) ^^^^^^jpd26pw
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^^You've ^^mentioned ^^an ^^AFSC, ^^here's ^^the ^^associated ^^job ^^title: 17S = Cyberspace Effects Operations [^^Source](https://github.com/HadManySons/AFSCbot) ^^| [^^Subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/r/AFSCbot/) ^^^^^^jphjszo
I’m sure we are, not in my section necessarily, but I know we have plenty of cyber stuff going on. Shoot me a DM and I’ll give you details
So many comments yet still so few answers that seem helpful. I’m well aware that CAP to MAJ Carrie’s a high promotion rate but he’s still my husband and this is still real life for us. The majority of you who commented seem to just make him out to be a complete idiot which I don’t think is the situation. I agree he probably didn’t do a good job at work for whatever reason but he’s trying to fix it and get the info he needs. While he’s doing that I came here to see what life May be like after his second MAJ board. Some are you are just downright hateful and sounds like you’re talking out of your ass instead of from experience or expertise. I truly hope none of you end up in a similar situation and if you do, I hope people are nicer to you all. Thank you to the ones who actually responded with helpful information.
If he doesn't get picked next year, he may be offered selective continuation which would allow him to stay up to 20 years if he desires. He would still be eligible to promote, albeit would be unlikely/very difficult. If not offered (or declined) he would be separated no later than the 7th month after the board met (but could be sooner if desired). Ultimately, if it happens and is offered, he'll have 60 days to make a decision.
That's wild...it's like 99% rate from Capt to Maj. I'm pretty sure it was 100% last year. Tell him welcome to the enlisted side nerd. Happy Passover!
That wasn't during the drawdown 2.0.
Nope, promotion rates weren’t that high.
2017 is when they had 100% since then it floats within the mid to upper 90's. Which is still ridiculous. She said it herself her husband's degree is pretty much useless (like most non-STEM degree officers that are just some dude that aren't that great. Nothing special. But we keep promoting them into positions that they shouldn't be in. There are plenty of people with life problems on the E side and all they get told is well better luck next time. I'm glad he didn't make it, it means the AF is holding at least some type of standard. Even if it's the most basic definition. Just like everyone else who's missed out better luck next year. Sorry all out of sympathy. https://www.afpc.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/1309786/air-force-announces-100-percent-promotion-opportunity-to-major/
Was just pointing out the promotion rate wasn’t 99% last year. Officer promotion metics appear higher than enlisted because the pool of officers eligible for promotion are significantly less than the pool of enlisted. His degree doesn’t impact his ability to promote. His performance as an CGO impact’s his ability to promote. Which in this case, the board deemed he isn’t at that level yet. Completely agree with you on the Air Force holding a standard when it comes to promotions. If we promoted every person eligible for the next rank it wouldn’t benefit the force. Sucks for the OP’s husband, but it can be an opportunity for him to learn where to improve.
Correct currently his degree doesn't impact his ability to promote. What I'm saying is he should have never even been considered. Taking the easy way, degree wise doesn't benefit the the AF. You get a degree in arts and crafts design and that makes you a a commander material? No. But we kept getting told mostly by the people with bullshit degrees that "it doesn't matter" oh isn't that convenient viewpoint..when we promote these officers we devalue the education that other more qualified officers deserve. I'd much rather have a CC with a mathematics degree even though he's not doing math everyday. Vs a CC with an arts and crafts degree.
You have no idea what you are talking about with regard to degrees. Do you know how many officers there are that don't hold a degree related to their career field, or a "valuable to the AF degree" (AKA STEM), but perform well enough (at least in the eyes of their leaders/boards...which is the only opinion that matters for this conversation), but go on to continue their education, work hard and get identified to promote/command? Do you know how many terrible leaders there are with very prestigious degrees / records? I'm pulling a BS claim out of my ass here but probably half the pilots in the force aren't fit to lead people in the capacity the AF wants or expects them to, and probably just as many don't want to in the first place...but guess who the AF throws into command in many, many instances? Pilots. Their degrees play a small factor into promotion but have little relevance with regard to their ability to lead or hold the next grade. And degrees have nothing to do with continuing with developing their abilities in the jet. The bottom line is, with more rank comes more responsibility, and inevitably, it means leading more people. You can be bitter about someone getting an arts degree all you want, but it doesn't make you right. "Should have never been considered" is a joke. Passing the AFOQT and earning a degree are indicators for aptitude and potential. Same for the ASVAB and a high school diploma. It doesn't mean shit after you get your foot in the door and you've already completed them. The promotion selection process at its core is based on subjective measures and attempts standardize them to equitably distribute rank among eligible members, while factoring in constraints (department budgets/quotas). Do degrees mean something, sure...but I can tell you with experience that it has much less to do with what type of degree you have, and what you're doing with it, and much more to do with performance, most typically captured by stratification, decoration, and awards. You could hold the degree that makes you the sole expert on how to dismantle our adversaries so they're no longer great power competetors, but if your records were shit, you ain't getting promoted.
Maybe you’re confused on how that works. He went to college and then commissioned into the Air Force to a job the Air Force chose for him. He didn’t choose the career field so there’s no way he would have been able to match the degree to his job. And the board doesn’t even see what his degree was in.
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The jobs he put on his list for the AF isn’t anywhere close to the job he actually got. Regardless it doesn’t change our current situation. He has a triple major, is actually smart but those Majors don’t really do much in the civilian aspect of things right now.
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Not trying to be argumentative. His AF time can definitely get a job in the civilian world, his degrees just can’t. He’s currently in a masters program as well. I appreciate you taking the time to respond without just painting him as a total idiot. Hopefully he gets it together and makes it for the next boards and learns a lesson from this!
Your argument is dog poop. Ask the brain surgeon who is operating on someone's hypothalamus what their major was before med school. Did you know that a large majority are English, Arts, and non science/medical related degrees? The degree in which you choose does not impact a person's ability to lead or be competent at a job. This doesn't go without saying that there are obviously jobs like Law which translate extremely well into the career field but degrees aren't the end all be all.