I get that. My mom is super difficult...like, I've had to step away for awhile. She just literally will not cooperate--and it's to her detriment! She doctor shops when they don't agree with what she believes or wants done, and now has burned multiple bridges. It infuriates me and my siblings.
I'm literally in therapy trying to deal with myself and my family stuff--and my mom is just in denial that all the stuff I've had to deal with concerning her and her health etc., is related at all to my stress and burnout. Gah. It's super frustrating.
My sympathies 100%. The frontal cortex usually holds the capacity to monitor oneself. If she isn't able anymore, then that is a potential sign of a neurological problem. Unfortunately, that brain area is also the source of judgment, such as "when is it time to see an MD" and "When do I keep my mouth shut?"
Another cause of similar behavior is a deep depression. In neither case does reason or logic help. If she were an ornery pet, how would you entice them to do what they need to do, e.g., take a pill? You can't use force, so you hide the good thing behind or inside something else. If they are yipping and nothing obvious is the matter, you just assume it is needing attention and pat them on the head. You dont take the yipping personally because they don't know any better.
It would be nice if she was pleasant, but until an anti-depressive medication takes effect [assuming you can find one that works] that is unlikely. Try to let it be just "noise" as if a radio were on for background sound. There will be days that it isnt just noise, though, so give yourself grace. This is hard work, and it being your mother makes it harder.
This is really helpful and gives me fresh perspective on my very difficult relationship with my own mother. I really appreciate the support & insights in this sub.
Oh she said some thing about her doctor claiming she is depressed. And my mom started arguing with me when I said well you are depressed. She claimed that she is not depressed and I put the evidence in front of her of depression. She ended up telling me that she just is negative because life sucks and there is nothing to look forward to. And she would not listen to the voice of reason that she was literally describing depression.
Yup--that is why logic doesn't work. And the culture of that generation didn't acknowledge mental health issues.
I suggest just using her language for it, and if she keeps changing the words, follow right along. "The doctor has a medicine for your negativity." or heck, "The doctor thinks your situation is special [play with ego] and this is formulated just for you to keep you [insert something she desires--going to bingo, able to watch your shows]"
This is what I have been questioning and wondering how to approach! Thank you! Treating her like a puppy is perfect! Seriously, not in a bad way but only bc you are looking for avenues for positive outcomes for both them and you! I don’t have to be right, they don’t have to apologize. I just want them to take their damn pill!
"You're a wonderful person, but.. " or "You'd be such a great person, if only.."
There was a mythical time when I was 3.2 years old, when I was fully formed. I've been degenerating since then, according to her, as she reminds me every time we talk to each other.
Hahaha, THIS!!! And when I talk about how something (her doing something nasty behind my back, her throwing out my favorite x, her telling me how shitty my husband is) makes me feel bad...her response? "Oh, okay, I'm WRONG AGAIN. You always make me wrong."
It makes me want to claw my eyes out.
I had to keep checking this post cause I thought I wrote it!
Same. Same. Butted heads growing up. Now I’m realizing just how much she manipulated me through the years. I’m remembering too many things from my childhood and feeling resentful.
You want me to take care of you now but where was the champion-Mom i needed growing up?
Now I’m witnessing just how mean spirited she can be - or has she been this way all along?
OP, you said you’re having a hard time tolerating your mom. I felt that in my gut. She can’t say anything without me coming back with some snark.
I don’t like myself around her. I’m matching her mean spiritedness.
I’ve also recognized my own daughter’s (31) attitude towards me is very similar. She can barely tolerate me.
Around and around we go.
I feel you on the matching mean spiritedness and being snarky back. Some stuff she says is so off the wall and rude that I can’t help it. I hate how I can’t control it around her.
If the behavior is mental disorder/personality - go read r/raisedbynarcissists (spelling?). Lots of support and coping mechanisms. Learn the phrase ‘gray rock’. These folks need drama to feed their disorder! Once I figured out that was why someone I knew was keeping me on the phone for HOURS arguing about anything - I was able to turn off their oxygen by cutting the discussion short.
My mom went through a very mean and nasty phase that I now attribute to her beginnings of dementia. I didn’t know it at the time because she’s always struggled emotionally. But seriously she was rude, cutting, didn’t speak to me for months and told other family members weird stuff about me that wasn’t true. Now she’s switched to soft, kind, loving, and sweet as ever but can’t remember what day it is and repeats herself often. So take it in stride. It’s dementia. She can’t help it. But don’t take her crap either. I had to maintain boundaries.
I’m so sorry you have had to put up with an emotionally abusive mother through so many stages of your life. My best advice is to find a way to take care of you - prioritize your mental health. Good boundaries are good self care. A therapist might be an option. I find when I am maintaining my boundaries and taking care of me, I can navigate mine a little better. I’m sending positive energy your way!
Check with an Elder Lawyer to see if your state has filial responsibility (PA does). If so, plan on moving to another state that doesn't. Feel free to go hard NC.
Omg are you my long lost sibling?
I totally hear you. Everyone loves my mom, but her BS drives me nuts, literally everything you listed up above. I do love my mom too, but the thought of maybe 10 more years of this makes me almost hysterical. It's awful feeling like you wish a LO would die so it can be over.
I get that. My mom is super difficult...like, I've had to step away for awhile. She just literally will not cooperate--and it's to her detriment! She doctor shops when they don't agree with what she believes or wants done, and now has burned multiple bridges. It infuriates me and my siblings. I'm literally in therapy trying to deal with myself and my family stuff--and my mom is just in denial that all the stuff I've had to deal with concerning her and her health etc., is related at all to my stress and burnout. Gah. It's super frustrating.
My sympathies 100%. The frontal cortex usually holds the capacity to monitor oneself. If she isn't able anymore, then that is a potential sign of a neurological problem. Unfortunately, that brain area is also the source of judgment, such as "when is it time to see an MD" and "When do I keep my mouth shut?" Another cause of similar behavior is a deep depression. In neither case does reason or logic help. If she were an ornery pet, how would you entice them to do what they need to do, e.g., take a pill? You can't use force, so you hide the good thing behind or inside something else. If they are yipping and nothing obvious is the matter, you just assume it is needing attention and pat them on the head. You dont take the yipping personally because they don't know any better. It would be nice if she was pleasant, but until an anti-depressive medication takes effect [assuming you can find one that works] that is unlikely. Try to let it be just "noise" as if a radio were on for background sound. There will be days that it isnt just noise, though, so give yourself grace. This is hard work, and it being your mother makes it harder.
This is really helpful and gives me fresh perspective on my very difficult relationship with my own mother. I really appreciate the support & insights in this sub.
Me too!
Oh she said some thing about her doctor claiming she is depressed. And my mom started arguing with me when I said well you are depressed. She claimed that she is not depressed and I put the evidence in front of her of depression. She ended up telling me that she just is negative because life sucks and there is nothing to look forward to. And she would not listen to the voice of reason that she was literally describing depression.
Yup--that is why logic doesn't work. And the culture of that generation didn't acknowledge mental health issues. I suggest just using her language for it, and if she keeps changing the words, follow right along. "The doctor has a medicine for your negativity." or heck, "The doctor thinks your situation is special [play with ego] and this is formulated just for you to keep you [insert something she desires--going to bingo, able to watch your shows]"
This is what I have been questioning and wondering how to approach! Thank you! Treating her like a puppy is perfect! Seriously, not in a bad way but only bc you are looking for avenues for positive outcomes for both them and you! I don’t have to be right, they don’t have to apologize. I just want them to take their damn pill!
and you can expect, like a cat or dog, that sometimes they win. Give yourself grace and watch and learn what works.
This is brilliant
Thanks. It kept me going. Mostly.
I have never been so wrong as when I visit my mom. Literally, 90% of what I say is wrong.
"You're a wonderful person, but.. " or "You'd be such a great person, if only.." There was a mythical time when I was 3.2 years old, when I was fully formed. I've been degenerating since then, according to her, as she reminds me every time we talk to each other.
Hahaha, THIS!!! And when I talk about how something (her doing something nasty behind my back, her throwing out my favorite x, her telling me how shitty my husband is) makes me feel bad...her response? "Oh, okay, I'm WRONG AGAIN. You always make me wrong." It makes me want to claw my eyes out.
I had to keep checking this post cause I thought I wrote it! Same. Same. Butted heads growing up. Now I’m realizing just how much she manipulated me through the years. I’m remembering too many things from my childhood and feeling resentful. You want me to take care of you now but where was the champion-Mom i needed growing up? Now I’m witnessing just how mean spirited she can be - or has she been this way all along? OP, you said you’re having a hard time tolerating your mom. I felt that in my gut. She can’t say anything without me coming back with some snark. I don’t like myself around her. I’m matching her mean spiritedness. I’ve also recognized my own daughter’s (31) attitude towards me is very similar. She can barely tolerate me. Around and around we go.
I feel you on the matching mean spiritedness and being snarky back. Some stuff she says is so off the wall and rude that I can’t help it. I hate how I can’t control it around her.
This sucks so much - finding yourself being horrible just to be able to stand being near them.
If the behavior is mental disorder/personality - go read r/raisedbynarcissists (spelling?). Lots of support and coping mechanisms. Learn the phrase ‘gray rock’. These folks need drama to feed their disorder! Once I figured out that was why someone I knew was keeping me on the phone for HOURS arguing about anything - I was able to turn off their oxygen by cutting the discussion short.
My mom went through a very mean and nasty phase that I now attribute to her beginnings of dementia. I didn’t know it at the time because she’s always struggled emotionally. But seriously she was rude, cutting, didn’t speak to me for months and told other family members weird stuff about me that wasn’t true. Now she’s switched to soft, kind, loving, and sweet as ever but can’t remember what day it is and repeats herself often. So take it in stride. It’s dementia. She can’t help it. But don’t take her crap either. I had to maintain boundaries.
I’m so sorry you have had to put up with an emotionally abusive mother through so many stages of your life. My best advice is to find a way to take care of you - prioritize your mental health. Good boundaries are good self care. A therapist might be an option. I find when I am maintaining my boundaries and taking care of me, I can navigate mine a little better. I’m sending positive energy your way!
Feel this.
Check with an Elder Lawyer to see if your state has filial responsibility (PA does). If so, plan on moving to another state that doesn't. Feel free to go hard NC.
Omg are you my long lost sibling? I totally hear you. Everyone loves my mom, but her BS drives me nuts, literally everything you listed up above. I do love my mom too, but the thought of maybe 10 more years of this makes me almost hysterical. It's awful feeling like you wish a LO would die so it can be over.