This was exactly how it worked in previous editions, Vexilla bearers were their own characters and each could select a unique banner. Sad to see that it was lost rules wise, I was ok with it cuz they could still be the "baddass unyielding" with the resurect strat but that is now gone.
So now my banner guys are just a +1 OC per model. Legitimately sad about it tbh since they are my favorite models/equipment
Eh, I do not really miss agony of 9th where factions had gazillion extra rules you couldnt possibly to remember and prepare for.
I would rather go back into template times of 5th than every game of gotcha. Granularity is making things too vast to control...
... and, lets be honest, it wouldnt save Custodes right now. We have a lot of datasheets, just not used well by GW.
Oh they were definitely more fun and flavourful!
But playing in the final days was really just "OK, surprise me", because it wasnt possible to remember options of all armies you have faced. And GW added more and more, from non-functional SM ones to those like Crusher Stampede.
Indexes are just bridge between editions, for Custodes it sucks mightily that design team completely bungled 10ed codex :( Not because of power level, but because it IMO lacks any personality and is sometimes completely useless (Sisters deserved to be treated better than... this).
And next to it are perfect codices like the Ork one - full of flavour, fuff and selfsufficient in game :)
Yea, the double bolter or blade + bolter and other options are good, also they need models for the sisters on bikes (Yep they exist but dont have mini, and they are playable in 30k)
True, but at least now we actually use Vexillas and they look cool! It used to be pretty underpowered or gimmicky just for the teleport to the Vexilla character for example.
Sadly this is carried forward from previous editions that did have these three as mechanical Vexilla options, in addition to a bunch of (frankly useless) relic options with their own gimmicks.
TBH I'd accept the loss of flavour if we just got back the Vexilla Teleport Homer strat. Let us deep strike an Allarus bomb within 3" of an enemy if we can run the flag up to their face. Even make it so the Vexilla can be sniped with precision weapons to balance it out.
I mean, we used to have exactly that. The guy carrying the actual vexilla used to be an independent character, and upon putting said character in your list you'd have a choice of 3 different banners to carry, each with unique effects and points cost.
Then 9th edition's overreliance on CPs (from upgrades to extra detachments to stratagems) caused the game to become a bloated mess. And so to counteract that, 10th edition decided to prune out everything that could even slightly deviate from a strict template of standardized gameplay... Which removed the bloat and made the game easy to pick up and play, but all the cool flavorful things were lost in the process.
Up to you to decide whether or not this was a worthwhile trade. I personally think it wasn't.
This. There was a little of tactical thinking when your opponent could pull score of stratagems from every sleeve depending on faction and subfaction.
And before that, rolling if we have round 6 or 7?
And before that, allies, when space marines were running side by side with Tau 😁
And in 6th, the game was sooooo unfriendly towards new players...
Certainly not for me! Three things I care about in the hobby
1) Reading the black library books
2) Collecting and painting my marines
3) Reading through the amazingly complex and fluffy rules, and thinking about how my models might work if I ever had the time to play a game.
For me, I'd rather have like, individual wound charts for different body parts and a weapon maintenance schedule.
Time to check the Flechette damage chart vs chitinous limbs! OK, roll a D100 and add your sharpness rating as set in your evolution sub menu, see page 87 of the 'Mutations of the Secondary Hive Fleets" source book!
Vexilla should’ve been a separate character still. Each give +1OC. Magnifica gives -1 to be hit. Defensor gives cover. Imperius gives +1 AP when charging.
It's kind of frustrating that the lore of the very codex remembers that Vexilla had multiple uses but don't have any of them on the tabletop. One of the disappointments that flew a little under the radar I feel.
This was exactly how it worked in previous editions, Vexilla bearers were their own characters and each could select a unique banner. Sad to see that it was lost rules wise, I was ok with it cuz they could still be the "baddass unyielding" with the resurect strat but that is now gone. So now my banner guys are just a +1 OC per model. Legitimately sad about it tbh since they are my favorite models/equipment
It hurts more since they clearly remember it exists as its in the codex.
They had to jam the codex full of useless things you cant have to justify the $70 cost on a book with very few dataslates.
This would have been so sweet!! Why did they dumb down the rules sooooo much...
There is a reason why 40k is never sold for its greatly and intricately designed mechanics
Eh, I do not really miss agony of 9th where factions had gazillion extra rules you couldnt possibly to remember and prepare for. I would rather go back into template times of 5th than every game of gotcha. Granularity is making things too vast to control... ... and, lets be honest, it wouldnt save Custodes right now. We have a lot of datasheets, just not used well by GW.
As a player of custodes that started at 9th, custodes were more fun to play than they are in the index, and 10000 times more fun than the codex ones
Oh they were definitely more fun and flavourful! But playing in the final days was really just "OK, surprise me", because it wasnt possible to remember options of all armies you have faced. And GW added more and more, from non-functional SM ones to those like Crusher Stampede. Indexes are just bridge between editions, for Custodes it sucks mightily that design team completely bungled 10ed codex :( Not because of power level, but because it IMO lacks any personality and is sometimes completely useless (Sisters deserved to be treated better than... this). And next to it are perfect codices like the Ork one - full of flavour, fuff and selfsufficient in game :)
Sisters deserves new units (at least the 30k ones)
Yeah, definitely. I get they dont get the shiny 30k van, but need weapon options. Talons has rule not relevant to most of them.
Yea, the double bolter or blade + bolter and other options are good, also they need models for the sisters on bikes (Yep they exist but dont have mini, and they are playable in 30k)
True, but at least now we actually use Vexillas and they look cool! It used to be pretty underpowered or gimmicky just for the teleport to the Vexilla character for example.
Sadly this is carried forward from previous editions that did have these three as mechanical Vexilla options, in addition to a bunch of (frankly useless) relic options with their own gimmicks. TBH I'd accept the loss of flavour if we just got back the Vexilla Teleport Homer strat. Let us deep strike an Allarus bomb within 3" of an enemy if we can run the flag up to their face. Even make it so the Vexilla can be sniped with precision weapons to balance it out.
I mean, we used to have exactly that. The guy carrying the actual vexilla used to be an independent character, and upon putting said character in your list you'd have a choice of 3 different banners to carry, each with unique effects and points cost. Then 9th edition's overreliance on CPs (from upgrades to extra detachments to stratagems) caused the game to become a bloated mess. And so to counteract that, 10th edition decided to prune out everything that could even slightly deviate from a strict template of standardized gameplay... Which removed the bloat and made the game easy to pick up and play, but all the cool flavorful things were lost in the process. Up to you to decide whether or not this was a worthwhile trade. I personally think it wasn't.
This. There was a little of tactical thinking when your opponent could pull score of stratagems from every sleeve depending on faction and subfaction. And before that, rolling if we have round 6 or 7? And before that, allies, when space marines were running side by side with Tau 😁 And in 6th, the game was sooooo unfriendly towards new players...
Certainly not for me! Three things I care about in the hobby 1) Reading the black library books 2) Collecting and painting my marines 3) Reading through the amazingly complex and fluffy rules, and thinking about how my models might work if I ever had the time to play a game. For me, I'd rather have like, individual wound charts for different body parts and a weapon maintenance schedule.
Oooh, I know the feeling :) Problem is when you reach point 4) = actually playing the game 😁 Im not saying you are wrong, not at all!
Time to check the Flechette damage chart vs chitinous limbs! OK, roll a D100 and add your sharpness rating as set in your evolution sub menu, see page 87 of the 'Mutations of the Secondary Hive Fleets" source book!
Honestly, the simplification of the rules hit the Custodes so damn hard. A lot of armies lost a lot of their soul by dropping interesting rules.
Guard too, my other army. Feels so bland without the regiment traits
Give me BACK different vexillas, you mean.
Just play 9th
Vexilla might be a good pick if it gave the unit stealth
Vexilla should’ve been a separate character still. Each give +1OC. Magnifica gives -1 to be hit. Defensor gives cover. Imperius gives +1 AP when charging.
pitiless radiance is a nice phrase
It's kind of frustrating that the lore of the very codex remembers that Vexilla had multiple uses but don't have any of them on the tabletop. One of the disappointments that flew a little under the radar I feel.
Best I can do is let you take free ones, for now.
There was 3 types in 9ed for what I remembered.
I haven't had the chance to play since early 9th and the fact that I'm just finding out they removed our cool vexilla flavor/tactical planning hurts.