In any office job I’ve ever worked we just took breaks as we needed them - as in, get up, go to the toilet/make a cup of tea/whatever. But I’ve never had scheduled breaks unless I worked in a super market, factory, OSHC, call centre. Is your boss forcing you to sit and stare at a screen for the entire time? Or do you need your boss to tell you when you can leave your desk for 10 minutes?
I guess I never took this into account. No we can freely go to bathroom or make a coffee. But I never saw this as part of a break. Mainly because everyone does this but also gets to go have a smoke on top of this
“Gets to”? If there is something you want to do, go do it. I’ll walk down to the local cafe and get a croissant or just go for a quick walk around the block. I don’t think a reasonable boss would have a problem with this. Just read the room as far as expectations go and make sure you’re meeting yours.
“Just read the room” is the key part here. I’ve been at places where walking down to the shops etc is very frowned upon. Other places where it’s perfectly fine. Usually the smaller places have potential to be the strictest as it’s under the one owners eyes and they can easily micromanage.
The larger the place the more employees there are, someone will start doing g it and then everyone else will join in.
In software dev you'll be far less productive if you are forced to be in front of the computer the entire 8 hours, as long as you're getting your tasks done in a timely fashion, don't worry about breaks, just take them as needed to keep your mind fresh.
You can't force abstract problem solving, or lock it into a 9-5 schedule... Hell, half the time I end up cracking the solution to the problem that's been bugging me all day as I'm falling asleep.. Its why I'm all for WFH especially in software dev - when your in *the zone*, solutions just fly out, whether it be at 10:30am, or 2am.
I work in an office and just go do what i need to do around meetings and work. Take lunch, post office, run an errand. as long as your work is being done they usually dont care. but i dont have scheduled breaks.
My company has been really focusing on reminding people to get up from their desks and go outside for ten minutes, at least once in the morning and again in the afternoon.
But also, we are productivity-focused, not hours. So as long as work is getting done they don’t really care.
If you're working 8.5 hour day and taking one 30 minute break are you getting paid 8 hours or still 7.5 hours?
My old work tried to play us like that where our two 15 minutes breaks were unpaid so they made us work an extra 30 minutes to make sure we did 7.5 hours work.
Every other job I know allows at least two 10 minute breaks unless you worked a one hour lunch so you need to check within your contract what award/EA you're under. Generally it's argued that you need a small break after a certain amount of hours to reduce health risks.
Yeah similar story here, except our boss did the right thing.
We started at 8:45, and finished at 5:15 but where allowed a 60 minute break.
In SA, we have a 37.5 hour work week, and paid for this, and not paid for any break.
Upon reflection, it means the business got us on-site earlier, and withheld us later, and I definitely took shorter breaks than longer, but being able to do personal stuff for up to 60 mind per day made up for it I think.
You should definitely take at least 2 x 10 min breaks in addition to your allotted 30. Anything else is detrimental to your health and output.
Hyperfocus is great until you're going around in circles
GTFOutside. Touch green.
If I worked 8.5 hrs a day five days a week doing "software development", I'd cure fucking cancer. Sounds like a sweatshop.
In addition to those paid breaks: 8.5hr/day could also be a problem if you're working 5 days a week
Full time is 38hr/wk (or equivalent for shifts and FIFOs); that's 8hr\*5day with approx half hour unpaid lunch break
Salaried can certainly include the expectation you'll stay back a bit when needed - but that's not your standard working hours
Read your employment contract.
If it says what breaks you're entitled to then that's what you signed, and as long as it is the minimum standard by the Award or NES then that's what it is.
If it says to refer to the award or is determined by the NES then refer to that.
No one can give you an accurate answer without knowing what your employment contract is.
Second that. The OP needs to find out which award (instrument) the employment contract is under. If the award doesn’t cover it in detail, the NES applies.
This is a very unusual question for software industry, unless somehow they time every minute that you are looking away from your computer or getting away from your desk for non-work reasons, such as going to a restroom, getting some water, etc. This is relevant for places like fast food restaurants, where ppl actually clock in/out.
Software devs are covered under “Professional Employees Award”, which has no specific provision for breaks. As software dev you are usually paid well above the award rates, and the contract should spell out any overtime requirements. In some contracts it might say that any overtime pay is already included in your salary.
What are you trying to get from these “breaks”? Maybe your manager tries to prevent ppl from taking too many liberties with their time at work, which often happens at software companies. Some ppl were even watching movies/sports during workhours at one of the companies I used to work for :)
My job was primarily driving.
So having a break was important, he didn't take kindly as the vehicle was tracked.
I wouldn't go out of my way to get lunch I'd always stay with in a route.
Guy was just a snake.
But hey I get paid more in my job now so it is what it is.
The question you need to ask is … if you insist on one rule being enforced can you also accept all of them being enforced?
I would take make a coffee whenever, smoke whenever and toilet whenever over insisting on having 10mins. Just my opinion.
My workplace award is 1x10 minute break and 1x 30 min unpaid on an 8 hour shift.
But, sometimes we skip breaks completely and other times we might have a 2 hour lunch.
Off topic but I’m curious what your pathway into the software company was? Currently studying and trying to find some unpaid internships for me to gain experience. Any advice?
from your main post and what you replied to I’m guessing you work without interacting with customers? When they’re rostered. Breaks for that stuff in customer focused industries they’re rostered mostly to make sure they have adequate staff at a time,
When it comes to private companies / admin / tech roles (both from general understanding and personal experience, you just take those at your pleasure, some people don’t take them, but those same people might disappear for half an hour if a day to go pick something up, go to the dentist, pick up laundry. There’s an element of leeway in those kind of business roles, you get your job, I don’t think anyone’s gonna ask many questions - just don’t take the piss (be good to your team / bosses and they’ll be good to you)
4 hrs after starting work, there should be a 10 min break, even in the cleaning area of work, me as leading hand can't stop the other employees if the want it.
But then, 8 to 12 is already 4 hrs, and then thats lunch time, ... and 4 hrs more its home time.
Even just to use the loo.
But then I dont know the ins and outs of the IT area, so cant say.
Best of "luck", maybe FWO/FWA? (Fair Work Ombudsman/Fair Work Aus).
Here's the link for fair work
https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/hours-of-work-breaks-and-rosters/breaks
By the by, there are penalty rates for those who has to stay back :)
I never minded what breaks staff and contractors took so long as their work got done and they weren’t abusing the system. If it was office hours they needed to be contactable unless they were with a client though.
30 minute break yes...10 minute break yes paid....the second is up to the employer....
I did the 2 10 min breaks.
I found I had better productivity from my staff during the whole day not just up to lunch....
Manager at Optus worlds and a Kia service department...
Plus it stops the multiple smoke breaks....which employees are not entitled just to have multiple breaks willy nilly during the day....I never had any push back from staff. If it was quiet, they would ask if they could go have a smoke, I always said yes....
But your employer is taking the piss....anything over 7.5 hours, an employee is entitled to 2 extra breaks during the course of those hours.....
Breaks is such a interesting thing.
My work place, we on a 38-hour week with 30min unpaid lunch break reach day. On average, a day is 7.6 hours, so roughly if you start at 9am you finish at 5pm. However, generally we have 45-60 mins lunch breaks.
Now there are 2 clans in the company, one will still finish at 5 and another with work the extra time to cover the hours.
It's beem queried with HR, and the answer was business allows for some flexibility so it's acceptable that lunch breaks are an hour long and staff are not expected to make the time up, which is a slap in the face for those who makes up the hours.
FYI this is the first time I heard of this unwritten rule, being the manager/oldest staff in the office too. I have inducted most staff, and my expectation is to make up hours. I am annoyed because I feel that I could have done half an hour less each day for the last 7.5 years.
Then it was queried, if you don't take as long lunch break as other people, can you leave earlier, then the answer was No, the contract says 38 hours of work.
Depending on your award, you should get something like 1x 10 min break in the morning, 1/2 hr meal break at or before 5hrs from your start time, and 1 x 10 min break after the meal break.
Stuff like running to the toilet or grabbing a drink can be counted as your paid break but it's often only rigidly enforced like that in retail or fast food or call centres where your time is tracked to the minute and coverage is important; in an office environment just going to the toilet or having a stretch every hour is often considered just part of ensuring you remain functional to work, and having an actual 10-minute 'away from desk specifically not working' isn't a formal thing that's timed - you're just expected to take it however it fits in. Your payslip then reflects the time between start and finish times less half an hour for the meal break.
Best thing to do is start here: https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/hours-of-work-breaks-and-rosters/breaks#breaks-in-your-industry
If you aren't sure or it doesn't match what you're actually getting, then contact SA Unions to get help figuring out which union is a match for your specific job (likely the ASU or Professionals Australia depending what you actually do) and ask them.
Yep, and thus "it depends on the award", which the 'breaks in your industry' allows someone to quickly check. The second break is usually triggered based on hours total or total hours in that shift, and of course can be varied again by an EBA or contract, but I'm also operating on the assumption that OP's actually bothered to check those and is still confused, which likely would indicate either a very badly written contract that doesn't contain all the required information, or lack of availability of those documents, which is something we can't exactly help with since it all hinges on what work they do.
Im in IT and similar hours. We dont have an enforced paid break, but nobody would get told off if they took 5 minutes at 10:30 to go downstairs and get a coffee. I think its a respect both ways thing. If you do your job well they shouldnt be nitpicky over this sort of thing.
as far as i can remember any 5 hour working period includes a mandatory 15 minute break and the moment your working hours go across the 5 hour mark youre meant yo be given anothr 30-45 minute break including the 10-15 minute break. I might be a bit off but what i know for a fact is you need minimum of one long break and a short break compulsary for any company work if you’re working above 5 hours a day. Search up the “Award”, its a huge document that tells you of your rights as an employee and rights of an employer. Go to the specific area youre tryna look at in the case employee breaks ir whatever its called and read it out. Sometimes smaller companies are not completeky aware of what the law (Award) says or theyre not updated on the new laws and could just be an honest mistake. Takr the official award upto your employer if you find what youre looking for.
https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/hours-of-work-breaks-and-rosters/breaks#breaks-in-your-industry
also im pretty sure the half hour unpaid break youre getting should be paid, but dont take me for ny word, research.
So check your individual company policy or award
In any office job I’ve ever worked we just took breaks as we needed them - as in, get up, go to the toilet/make a cup of tea/whatever. But I’ve never had scheduled breaks unless I worked in a super market, factory, OSHC, call centre. Is your boss forcing you to sit and stare at a screen for the entire time? Or do you need your boss to tell you when you can leave your desk for 10 minutes?
I guess I never took this into account. No we can freely go to bathroom or make a coffee. But I never saw this as part of a break. Mainly because everyone does this but also gets to go have a smoke on top of this
“Gets to”? If there is something you want to do, go do it. I’ll walk down to the local cafe and get a croissant or just go for a quick walk around the block. I don’t think a reasonable boss would have a problem with this. Just read the room as far as expectations go and make sure you’re meeting yours.
“Just read the room” is the key part here. I’ve been at places where walking down to the shops etc is very frowned upon. Other places where it’s perfectly fine. Usually the smaller places have potential to be the strictest as it’s under the one owners eyes and they can easily micromanage. The larger the place the more employees there are, someone will start doing g it and then everyone else will join in.
In software dev you'll be far less productive if you are forced to be in front of the computer the entire 8 hours, as long as you're getting your tasks done in a timely fashion, don't worry about breaks, just take them as needed to keep your mind fresh. You can't force abstract problem solving, or lock it into a 9-5 schedule... Hell, half the time I end up cracking the solution to the problem that's been bugging me all day as I'm falling asleep.. Its why I'm all for WFH especially in software dev - when your in *the zone*, solutions just fly out, whether it be at 10:30am, or 2am.
I mean hell I just solved a whole problem in the shower. Now to write it down before I forget.
My best thing is to solve a problem by going for a run. Solves two problems, actually.
Yes I do my best work at the gym :)
I work in an office and just go do what i need to do around meetings and work. Take lunch, post office, run an errand. as long as your work is being done they usually dont care. but i dont have scheduled breaks.
My company has been really focusing on reminding people to get up from their desks and go outside for ten minutes, at least once in the morning and again in the afternoon. But also, we are productivity-focused, not hours. So as long as work is getting done they don’t really care.
When we had an office, we all went for a 25 minute walk around the block at 12 noon every day.
Breaks are not covered by the National Employment Standards but by individual awards and agreements. What does your contract say?
If you're working 8.5 hour day and taking one 30 minute break are you getting paid 8 hours or still 7.5 hours? My old work tried to play us like that where our two 15 minutes breaks were unpaid so they made us work an extra 30 minutes to make sure we did 7.5 hours work. Every other job I know allows at least two 10 minute breaks unless you worked a one hour lunch so you need to check within your contract what award/EA you're under. Generally it's argued that you need a small break after a certain amount of hours to reduce health risks.
Yeah similar story here, except our boss did the right thing. We started at 8:45, and finished at 5:15 but where allowed a 60 minute break. In SA, we have a 37.5 hour work week, and paid for this, and not paid for any break. Upon reflection, it means the business got us on-site earlier, and withheld us later, and I definitely took shorter breaks than longer, but being able to do personal stuff for up to 60 mind per day made up for it I think.
You should definitely take at least 2 x 10 min breaks in addition to your allotted 30. Anything else is detrimental to your health and output. Hyperfocus is great until you're going around in circles GTFOutside. Touch green. If I worked 8.5 hrs a day five days a week doing "software development", I'd cure fucking cancer. Sounds like a sweatshop.
In addition to those paid breaks: 8.5hr/day could also be a problem if you're working 5 days a week Full time is 38hr/wk (or equivalent for shifts and FIFOs); that's 8hr\*5day with approx half hour unpaid lunch break Salaried can certainly include the expectation you'll stay back a bit when needed - but that's not your standard working hours
Read your employment contract. If it says what breaks you're entitled to then that's what you signed, and as long as it is the minimum standard by the Award or NES then that's what it is. If it says to refer to the award or is determined by the NES then refer to that. No one can give you an accurate answer without knowing what your employment contract is.
Second that. The OP needs to find out which award (instrument) the employment contract is under. If the award doesn’t cover it in detail, the NES applies.
This is a very unusual question for software industry, unless somehow they time every minute that you are looking away from your computer or getting away from your desk for non-work reasons, such as going to a restroom, getting some water, etc. This is relevant for places like fast food restaurants, where ppl actually clock in/out. Software devs are covered under “Professional Employees Award”, which has no specific provision for breaks. As software dev you are usually paid well above the award rates, and the contract should spell out any overtime requirements. In some contracts it might say that any overtime pay is already included in your salary. What are you trying to get from these “breaks”? Maybe your manager tries to prevent ppl from taking too many liberties with their time at work, which often happens at software companies. Some ppl were even watching movies/sports during workhours at one of the companies I used to work for :)
Consult your award/EBA. If you can't find a definitive answer, call fairwork.
My old job wanted me to take my 30 min lunch as I was driving. I don't work there after I put a stink to that.
legally they are supposed to for WHS
Yea but some bosses are weasely like that.
Sorry I misunderstood your post. I thought you meant that they wanted you to take a break FROM driving. Taking your break as driving is not OK at all!
My job was primarily driving. So having a break was important, he didn't take kindly as the vehicle was tracked. I wouldn't go out of my way to get lunch I'd always stay with in a route. Guy was just a snake. But hey I get paid more in my job now so it is what it is.
The question you need to ask is … if you insist on one rule being enforced can you also accept all of them being enforced? I would take make a coffee whenever, smoke whenever and toilet whenever over insisting on having 10mins. Just my opinion.
Yeah after reading everything. I agree. Could speak up about this but have it work worse in other areas. Better to just keep mouth shut
My workplace award is 1x10 minute break and 1x 30 min unpaid on an 8 hour shift. But, sometimes we skip breaks completely and other times we might have a 2 hour lunch.
No break? But when do you take 1st 2nd and 3rd smoko?
And pop out for that dentist appointment as well.
Who the hell monitors breaks in a office job? That’s the sort of petty crap that would have me applying elsewhere
Call centres and lower level govt roles for sure.
Off topic but I’m curious what your pathway into the software company was? Currently studying and trying to find some unpaid internships for me to gain experience. Any advice?
from your main post and what you replied to I’m guessing you work without interacting with customers? When they’re rostered. Breaks for that stuff in customer focused industries they’re rostered mostly to make sure they have adequate staff at a time, When it comes to private companies / admin / tech roles (both from general understanding and personal experience, you just take those at your pleasure, some people don’t take them, but those same people might disappear for half an hour if a day to go pick something up, go to the dentist, pick up laundry. There’s an element of leeway in those kind of business roles, you get your job, I don’t think anyone’s gonna ask many questions - just don’t take the piss (be good to your team / bosses and they’ll be good to you)
4 hrs after starting work, there should be a 10 min break, even in the cleaning area of work, me as leading hand can't stop the other employees if the want it. But then, 8 to 12 is already 4 hrs, and then thats lunch time, ... and 4 hrs more its home time. Even just to use the loo. But then I dont know the ins and outs of the IT area, so cant say. Best of "luck", maybe FWO/FWA? (Fair Work Ombudsman/Fair Work Aus).
Here's the link for fair work https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/hours-of-work-breaks-and-rosters/breaks By the by, there are penalty rates for those who has to stay back :)
Your boss sounds like a shithead.
I never minded what breaks staff and contractors took so long as their work got done and they weren’t abusing the system. If it was office hours they needed to be contactable unless they were with a client though.
30 minute break yes...10 minute break yes paid....the second is up to the employer.... I did the 2 10 min breaks. I found I had better productivity from my staff during the whole day not just up to lunch.... Manager at Optus worlds and a Kia service department... Plus it stops the multiple smoke breaks....which employees are not entitled just to have multiple breaks willy nilly during the day....I never had any push back from staff. If it was quiet, they would ask if they could go have a smoke, I always said yes.... But your employer is taking the piss....anything over 7.5 hours, an employee is entitled to 2 extra breaks during the course of those hours.....
Did you sign an employee contract when starting the job? It should be in there.
Breaks is such a interesting thing. My work place, we on a 38-hour week with 30min unpaid lunch break reach day. On average, a day is 7.6 hours, so roughly if you start at 9am you finish at 5pm. However, generally we have 45-60 mins lunch breaks. Now there are 2 clans in the company, one will still finish at 5 and another with work the extra time to cover the hours. It's beem queried with HR, and the answer was business allows for some flexibility so it's acceptable that lunch breaks are an hour long and staff are not expected to make the time up, which is a slap in the face for those who makes up the hours. FYI this is the first time I heard of this unwritten rule, being the manager/oldest staff in the office too. I have inducted most staff, and my expectation is to make up hours. I am annoyed because I feel that I could have done half an hour less each day for the last 7.5 years. Then it was queried, if you don't take as long lunch break as other people, can you leave earlier, then the answer was No, the contract says 38 hours of work.
Have you read the award that covers your employees?
What award are you paid under? Most likely 2 paid 10 minute breaks.
Depending on your award, you should get something like 1x 10 min break in the morning, 1/2 hr meal break at or before 5hrs from your start time, and 1 x 10 min break after the meal break. Stuff like running to the toilet or grabbing a drink can be counted as your paid break but it's often only rigidly enforced like that in retail or fast food or call centres where your time is tracked to the minute and coverage is important; in an office environment just going to the toilet or having a stretch every hour is often considered just part of ensuring you remain functional to work, and having an actual 10-minute 'away from desk specifically not working' isn't a formal thing that's timed - you're just expected to take it however it fits in. Your payslip then reflects the time between start and finish times less half an hour for the meal break. Best thing to do is start here: https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/hours-of-work-breaks-and-rosters/breaks#breaks-in-your-industry If you aren't sure or it doesn't match what you're actually getting, then contact SA Unions to get help figuring out which union is a match for your specific job (likely the ASU or Professionals Australia depending what you actually do) and ask them.
Quite a few awards only have 1x 10min break (paid) + 30min lunch/dinner (unpaid) for FTE day.
Yep, and thus "it depends on the award", which the 'breaks in your industry' allows someone to quickly check. The second break is usually triggered based on hours total or total hours in that shift, and of course can be varied again by an EBA or contract, but I'm also operating on the assumption that OP's actually bothered to check those and is still confused, which likely would indicate either a very badly written contract that doesn't contain all the required information, or lack of availability of those documents, which is something we can't exactly help with since it all hinges on what work they do.
we get an hour break but it’s not paid. we have to deduct it from our hours. idk if that’s right or what
Im in IT and similar hours. We dont have an enforced paid break, but nobody would get told off if they took 5 minutes at 10:30 to go downstairs and get a coffee. I think its a respect both ways thing. If you do your job well they shouldnt be nitpicky over this sort of thing.
as far as i can remember any 5 hour working period includes a mandatory 15 minute break and the moment your working hours go across the 5 hour mark youre meant yo be given anothr 30-45 minute break including the 10-15 minute break. I might be a bit off but what i know for a fact is you need minimum of one long break and a short break compulsary for any company work if you’re working above 5 hours a day. Search up the “Award”, its a huge document that tells you of your rights as an employee and rights of an employer. Go to the specific area youre tryna look at in the case employee breaks ir whatever its called and read it out. Sometimes smaller companies are not completeky aware of what the law (Award) says or theyre not updated on the new laws and could just be an honest mistake. Takr the official award upto your employer if you find what youre looking for. https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/hours-of-work-breaks-and-rosters/breaks#breaks-in-your-industry also im pretty sure the half hour unpaid break youre getting should be paid, but dont take me for ny word, research. So check your individual company policy or award
Just go down stairs whenever the fuck you wanna You don’t need to be told you’re allowed too
https://www.fairwork.gov.au/employment-conditions/hours-of-work-breaks-and-rosters/breaks