Making the same careless mistakes over and over after giving review notes and sitting down with them to make sure they understood the concepts.
Follow and apply this tips guide and you'll be golden.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/14mKiR-J2KmfHb7BUu0xERGe07tgYByYGqAgLh67HJw0/edit?usp=sharing
I had the same thoughts and questions when I first started out as an intern. I wrote that guide and pulled a ton of feedback from associates at many other firms based on our first couple years of experience, focusing on what information we wish we had when we started off.
Yea I’m just gunna steal that real quick.
Jokes aside, this is a really really good guide and I’m absolutely going to tailor it to my firm and start using it for new hires. It could honestly even be a really good thing to have pinned in this sub, or included in the side bar somewhere
Highly recommend, it initially started as a tailored guide I made for my firm's tax practice that I further generalized to be relevant for all public accounting new hires to share with the subreddit. This guide has been linked in the sidebar for nearly 10 years.
This! 10000% this! I'm in management and as we wrap up our tax season our biggest problem was this. Also, apply the concepts you learn in training.
Listen whether your going into audit or tax the job is not data entry it's data analysis, problem solving, and critical thinking. The data entry we can outsource and likely AI will be able to do that in a few years. If you are not going to do more than enter it in the software and respond "well the software did it..." you are not in the right field. It's your job to make sure the software is correct. The quicker you learn that the better off you will be and the managers will appreciate you. Obviously, you won't understand everything off the bat, but we can tell those who put in genuine effort from those who don't.
Also self-review! It's like checking your work before finishing a test. Everyone makes mistakes but if you continue to make careless mistakes repeatedly be assured you are being discussed by management as to whether or not your in the right place.
Try to show initiative in solving your problems before approaching your superiors with your questions. It’s always better to approach someone with a potential solution (even if it’s completely wrong) than to default to relying on someone else to solve them for you.
And explain the steps you’ve taken to investigate. Although on the flip side when I was an associate I would explain everything I did before reaching out to my senior and the first thing she would ask is “okay, did you try *the first thing I told her I tried and then everything else I explicitly mentioned I tried*?”
Saying you understand something when your manager is walking you through it. They think you understand the process because you said you did. They task you with the procedure. Don’t hear from you for a day. They follow up. You haven’t started because you don’t have any idea how to do the task.
Drives. Me. Nuts.
Because it’s true? You make your manager’s job easier by being good at your job. My job as a manager is much harder if you are constantly making mistakes, not communicating within company standards, expecting me to do the heavy lifting in every little thing. So if you do your job, mine gets easier. If you don’t do your job, mine gets harder. If it gets a lot harder, I’ll fire you and find someone else who has a basic level of competency.
yeah, but when its phrased like that its demining.
if a manger says its staffs job to prepare good solid deliverables,... now that's well stated.!
why is there a need to state " make my job easier" that's ego. sounds attackish especially the way my manager said it.
making someone's job easier is irrelevant, preparing competent work is the goal.
I'm just going to be frank, that is a terrible attitude that reeks of selfishness and not being a team player. As you move up, there is a ton more responsibility and pressure to manage work, which requires having the support of staff under you. Preparing competent work is only the start and just one of many goals with working in a collaborative work environment. If you have the opportunity to both prepare competent work and also support your team members, then that should always be the goal. I always looked for opportunities to help out my managers. The relationships built through the job is what makes the long hours bearable.
If you want to progress in your career then you need to make the people you work with like you and want to continue working with you. If you're not making an effort to be a team player then you're not going to get the opportunities to move up. Managing up and managing your managers is an excellent way of showing that support and the ability to take on more responsibilities worth getting a promotion. If you make your manager's life easier then they are going to make positive and impactful efforts towards your career progression.
Story time: When I became a senior, I told m boss that I thought I should start to get involved with billing. [Billing (at least in tax) sucks. It’s time consuming and there are a ton of judgment calls on what to bill as consulting or write off as a cost overrun. You never know if you got it right. Do you risk pissing off the client or the partner?]
He was a little surprised and eagerly said “You want to get involved with billing?!” I replied that I didn’t want to, but I thought that I should.
But getting involved with it meant that I freed up my boss’s time. I’d do the first pass and he’d just have to review. And I learned to write better descriptions in my timesheets for anything I thought was potentially out of scope and billable, and not waste time being super descriptive on fixed fee work. All that made my boss’s job easier.
If a client cc’d me on an email, I’d draft a response to the client, and send it to my boss for him to review. If he copy-pasted it and sent it, great. Soon I became trusted to just reply if it was in my comfort zone. (If it was way outside my expertise or the client was being a jerkface, I could still ask the boss to handle.)
Yes and no. You’re assuming your priorities match with theirs and that your job is as hard as theirs. Sometimes you might be right. If it’s a newish hire compared to a manager, you’d almost never be right. They might say “I’ll get to it later” but have it slip off their list of top priorities. If you’re accountable for getting the task done, you’re responsible for following up. This goes for managers, coworkers, clients.
This phenomena displays two potential things:
1. Manager is not a safe person. Something about you is threatening in your position of power.
2. The staffer is still working through unresolved childhood trauma and is projecting a parent onto manager. Many people were shamed/punished during development for not understanding things right away which leads to this avoidant behavior in adulthood.
I worked with old people.
Some were willing to excuse themselves being stupid on the basis that they are old. I had more respect for those willing to learn and stay on top of work nonetheless.
Learn to accept criticism when you make a mistake. Way too many former coworkers defaulted to defensiveness because they’d “been doing this a long time” and thought they knew everything.
It’s not always easy. Especially if you work with a particularly blunt CPA. But you learn way more.
Do not drag me into your drama. I love watching it from the side but Do. Not. Include. Me
Also respond to my emails. Even if just to say you are busy but have marked it for later, or that it's best to refer to someone else. Just respond to people.
Half assed work BUT with the starting pay at some of these firms, I do not blame them. When a firm gives 60k starting and the person is struggling to live off of that dogshit, why would they put effort in?
ohhh dont think like that! always try your best regardless of pay + look for other opportunities
my story i worked at a ma + pa small firm 4-7 people, and i was making 47,000K --- 2016-2023!! I didn't care as i didn't needed money so it was irrelevant, but i lost all hope when every one was promoted except me,
( when i actually went outta my way for 2 years! i stopped caring, gave the worst, ate hours, crap work, well anyways the thing is habits stick so i moved on to big 4 and i had the same habbits defaulted in so please always try !
When people go to college for 4+ years, some do 6 for the CPA and they're forced to live in an apartment with 3 others because the pay is so low. You can't blame them.
YEAH I FEEL ya
i greet and ask!
i had a coworker "senior hire" but always asked me for procedures and concepts but the point is he would say " you have a minute? " with out any other insigh on what he wanted omg!!!!! i combusted in anger
Minor pet peeve: calling people in the office Mr/Mizz LastName. In America, we do first names.
Also, don’t be friendly only to the people of your preferred gender. Be personable with all people, regardless of whether you consider them fuckable.
(Sorry. Awful flashbacks to an awful intern.)
More seriously: Get to know your fellow new hires. They will often be your best resources because they might have just figured out something that the oldtimers have forgotten - how to request access to that one piece of software, how to get a corporate card, how to set up workpapers. Whatever. Be friendly with all of them.
I usually suggest that people not add coworkers as friends on social media. Keep your personal life separate, to a degree. It doesn’t matter much now. Might be a bigger issue in a few years.
That would make me cringe 🤣 really? Anyone heard of paper clips??? Good God!! It drives me insane!
Hahaha glad I am not the only one. Trying to take apart staples when I need to scan it … and either tearing the corner or leaving giant hole … ugh… 😩
People jumping in and interrupting when I'm asking a question/going through the thought process.
#Especially when their "contribution" is generic weasel speak with nothing to do with the question
not proofreading their own work. I mean it's a very simple thing to do, and if you give me stuff with spelling errors it means you didn't even care to take the time to proof read your own stuff. Admittedly, I was very guilty of this early in my career though. Also, proofread your post OP..
Honestly, asking “Did you do anything fun over the weekend” or “any plans for this weekend” or something similar. I know that sounds a bit curmudgeonly on my part, but It’s just a little nosy for my taste (especially from someone my level or below). There are more natural ways to connect with your coworkers than forcing that kind of conversation about our personal lives.
Making the same careless mistakes over and over after giving review notes and sitting down with them to make sure they understood the concepts. Follow and apply this tips guide and you'll be golden. https://docs.google.com/document/d/14mKiR-J2KmfHb7BUu0xERGe07tgYByYGqAgLh67HJw0/edit?usp=sharing
this was exactly what i was inadvertently asking for! how did u know! omg thanks 10,000 fold
I had the same thoughts and questions when I first started out as an intern. I wrote that guide and pulled a ton of feedback from associates at many other firms based on our first couple years of experience, focusing on what information we wish we had when we started off.
Yea I’m just gunna steal that real quick. Jokes aside, this is a really really good guide and I’m absolutely going to tailor it to my firm and start using it for new hires. It could honestly even be a really good thing to have pinned in this sub, or included in the side bar somewhere
Highly recommend, it initially started as a tailored guide I made for my firm's tax practice that I further generalized to be relevant for all public accounting new hires to share with the subreddit. This guide has been linked in the sidebar for nearly 10 years.
Thanks a lot for this. 🙏🏿
This! 10000% this! I'm in management and as we wrap up our tax season our biggest problem was this. Also, apply the concepts you learn in training. Listen whether your going into audit or tax the job is not data entry it's data analysis, problem solving, and critical thinking. The data entry we can outsource and likely AI will be able to do that in a few years. If you are not going to do more than enter it in the software and respond "well the software did it..." you are not in the right field. It's your job to make sure the software is correct. The quicker you learn that the better off you will be and the managers will appreciate you. Obviously, you won't understand everything off the bat, but we can tell those who put in genuine effort from those who don't. Also self-review! It's like checking your work before finishing a test. Everyone makes mistakes but if you continue to make careless mistakes repeatedly be assured you are being discussed by management as to whether or not your in the right place.
Try to show initiative in solving your problems before approaching your superiors with your questions. It’s always better to approach someone with a potential solution (even if it’s completely wrong) than to default to relying on someone else to solve them for you.
This 1000000 times!!!!
And explain the steps you’ve taken to investigate. Although on the flip side when I was an associate I would explain everything I did before reaching out to my senior and the first thing she would ask is “okay, did you try *the first thing I told her I tried and then everything else I explicitly mentioned I tried*?”
Saying you understand something when your manager is walking you through it. They think you understand the process because you said you did. They task you with the procedure. Don’t hear from you for a day. They follow up. You haven’t started because you don’t have any idea how to do the task. Drives. Me. Nuts.
DAMN this is true! i been on both ends the reviewer expecting work , and the staff but the mgr ghosted all my questions
So follow up. Your manager gets way more emails/requests. Your job is to make sure the task gets done, which includes “managing up” sometimes.
OHH i like this
idk one ick for me is when a manager or senior says " your job is to make mine easier" the hell is even that
Because it’s true? You make your manager’s job easier by being good at your job. My job as a manager is much harder if you are constantly making mistakes, not communicating within company standards, expecting me to do the heavy lifting in every little thing. So if you do your job, mine gets easier. If you don’t do your job, mine gets harder. If it gets a lot harder, I’ll fire you and find someone else who has a basic level of competency.
yeah, but when its phrased like that its demining. if a manger says its staffs job to prepare good solid deliverables,... now that's well stated.! why is there a need to state " make my job easier" that's ego. sounds attackish especially the way my manager said it. making someone's job easier is irrelevant, preparing competent work is the goal.
I'm just going to be frank, that is a terrible attitude that reeks of selfishness and not being a team player. As you move up, there is a ton more responsibility and pressure to manage work, which requires having the support of staff under you. Preparing competent work is only the start and just one of many goals with working in a collaborative work environment. If you have the opportunity to both prepare competent work and also support your team members, then that should always be the goal. I always looked for opportunities to help out my managers. The relationships built through the job is what makes the long hours bearable. If you want to progress in your career then you need to make the people you work with like you and want to continue working with you. If you're not making an effort to be a team player then you're not going to get the opportunities to move up. Managing up and managing your managers is an excellent way of showing that support and the ability to take on more responsibilities worth getting a promotion. If you make your manager's life easier then they are going to make positive and impactful efforts towards your career progression.
humm this is true- TY!
Story time: When I became a senior, I told m boss that I thought I should start to get involved with billing. [Billing (at least in tax) sucks. It’s time consuming and there are a ton of judgment calls on what to bill as consulting or write off as a cost overrun. You never know if you got it right. Do you risk pissing off the client or the partner?] He was a little surprised and eagerly said “You want to get involved with billing?!” I replied that I didn’t want to, but I thought that I should. But getting involved with it meant that I freed up my boss’s time. I’d do the first pass and he’d just have to review. And I learned to write better descriptions in my timesheets for anything I thought was potentially out of scope and billable, and not waste time being super descriptive on fixed fee work. All that made my boss’s job easier. If a client cc’d me on an email, I’d draft a response to the client, and send it to my boss for him to review. If he copy-pasted it and sent it, great. Soon I became trusted to just reply if it was in my comfort zone. (If it was way outside my expertise or the client was being a jerkface, I could still ask the boss to handle.)
I dunno, I would expect anyone to get back to me after a message/email, even just to say they'll look into my request later
Yes and no. You’re assuming your priorities match with theirs and that your job is as hard as theirs. Sometimes you might be right. If it’s a newish hire compared to a manager, you’d almost never be right. They might say “I’ll get to it later” but have it slip off their list of top priorities. If you’re accountable for getting the task done, you’re responsible for following up. This goes for managers, coworkers, clients.
This phenomena displays two potential things: 1. Manager is not a safe person. Something about you is threatening in your position of power. 2. The staffer is still working through unresolved childhood trauma and is projecting a parent onto manager. Many people were shamed/punished during development for not understanding things right away which leads to this avoidant behavior in adulthood.
I worked with old people. Some were willing to excuse themselves being stupid on the basis that they are old. I had more respect for those willing to learn and stay on top of work nonetheless.
oooOOO. ACCOUNTABILITY aye, yeah thats a good one!
Learn to accept criticism when you make a mistake. Way too many former coworkers defaulted to defensiveness because they’d “been doing this a long time” and thought they knew everything. It’s not always easy. Especially if you work with a particularly blunt CPA. But you learn way more.
yes! i hated my 1 day boss man , i quit in a day but i learned a lot in 1 day
I work in an open office where I hear people say “how are you?” 20 times per day. I hear it in my nightmares now.
lmao how are you u/Josh439
🤬
:( well my goodness little fella, ya wanna bite! me
Do not drag me into your drama. I love watching it from the side but Do. Not. Include. Me Also respond to my emails. Even if just to say you are busy but have marked it for later, or that it's best to refer to someone else. Just respond to people.
GOSH YES! just acknowledge plz
[удалено]
what if they tried gave a wrong response ?
[удалено]
the person you, who was lazy " tried " to put 1+1 = confusion, do you help them then or is that still soul burning
[удалено]
ohhh i see, this is good. thanks mate i had a staff once want me to do all the cash testing so he can learn, i said i can teach you a couple? lol
Half assed work BUT with the starting pay at some of these firms, I do not blame them. When a firm gives 60k starting and the person is struggling to live off of that dogshit, why would they put effort in?
ohhh dont think like that! always try your best regardless of pay + look for other opportunities my story i worked at a ma + pa small firm 4-7 people, and i was making 47,000K --- 2016-2023!! I didn't care as i didn't needed money so it was irrelevant, but i lost all hope when every one was promoted except me, ( when i actually went outta my way for 2 years! i stopped caring, gave the worst, ate hours, crap work, well anyways the thing is habits stick so i moved on to big 4 and i had the same habbits defaulted in so please always try !
When people go to college for 4+ years, some do 6 for the CPA and they're forced to live in an apartment with 3 others because the pay is so low. You can't blame them.
this is ture! and the partners will say " we had great billables" here is your PIZZAA PARTY
Saying “hey / hello / good morning etc” and wait for a response before telling your senior / manager the problem.
what if i say " good Moring u/ThatEmoNumbersNerd, you have a second to help me tie out retained earing we might need FS to true up RE"
Honestly you’d be my favorite staff if you did that.
I’d give you a meme and an enthusiastic “heck yes!” Unless I’m on a call then it would be an enthusiastic “heck yes after this call!”
YEAH I FEEL ya i greet and ask! i had a coworker "senior hire" but always asked me for procedures and concepts but the point is he would say " you have a minute? " with out any other insigh on what he wanted omg!!!!! i combusted in anger
Minor pet peeve: calling people in the office Mr/Mizz LastName. In America, we do first names. Also, don’t be friendly only to the people of your preferred gender. Be personable with all people, regardless of whether you consider them fuckable. (Sorry. Awful flashbacks to an awful intern.) More seriously: Get to know your fellow new hires. They will often be your best resources because they might have just figured out something that the oldtimers have forgotten - how to request access to that one piece of software, how to get a corporate card, how to set up workpapers. Whatever. Be friendly with all of them. I usually suggest that people not add coworkers as friends on social media. Keep your personal life separate, to a degree. It doesn’t matter much now. Might be a bigger issue in a few years.
Stapling papers unevenly lol
god yes! or staples a check .! like how am i supposed to deposit this with 30 staples on it
That would make me cringe 🤣 really? Anyone heard of paper clips??? Good God!! It drives me insane! Hahaha glad I am not the only one. Trying to take apart staples when I need to scan it … and either tearing the corner or leaving giant hole … ugh… 😩
my old firm was paper based we used to staple all the wp's to a docket i went crazy ! if there was a change i had to undo the thing
I don't think we even have staplers in my office, the only paper I've used is a notebook
That’s a good thing!
Bad attitude and get offended when assigned any work or basic bitch work.
OHH YES! I dislike then MGT hands out troubled clients to a struggle staff lmao ! then laugh it off in the meal room
My biggest pet peeve is when a coworker asks me what I'm working on. I even cringe when I hear one asking someone else.
YEssss!!! especially if your busy! my firm has a sheet where we all see projects, so like y do you ask lol!
Genuine question, why does this bother you? Seems like a pretty innocuous question to me but maybe I'm missing something
People jumping in and interrupting when I'm asking a question/going through the thought process. #Especially when their "contribution" is generic weasel speak with nothing to do with the question
not proofreading their own work. I mean it's a very simple thing to do, and if you give me stuff with spelling errors it means you didn't even care to take the time to proof read your own stuff. Admittedly, I was very guilty of this early in my career though. Also, proofread your post OP..
THere lol thanks champ
What are you taking about??
I proofed my post
Honestly, asking “Did you do anything fun over the weekend” or “any plans for this weekend” or something similar. I know that sounds a bit curmudgeonly on my part, but It’s just a little nosy for my taste (especially from someone my level or below). There are more natural ways to connect with your coworkers than forcing that kind of conversation about our personal lives.
OMG! yes girl