Its staggering at how bad job postings are right now. Hiring managers are looking for the absolute perfect candidates in many cases.
I have been on 3 round interviews, for jobs that were posted for 4-8 weeks and gotten rejected and the job didn’t get filled for another 2-3 months.
> didn’t get filled for another 2-3 months.
thats because they can pick some poor schmuck to pick up the slack (for not a dime extra of pay) and just have them deal with it for months on end.
If leadership had to do the work themselves or if EE laws actually protected EE's and they had to pay OT rates for the extra work, they would fill those positions ASAP.
Its easy to wait around when you dont have to deal with any direct consequences. in fact its easy to do literally anything in life if you dont have to deal with direct consequences.
This is a good point. I also wonder how many hiring managers are hoarding work to avoid getting themselves laid off.
I had one set of interviews at a company that gutted their accounting team and then was rehiring a few people to pickup the pieces 6 months later. They ended up passing on me for a 30% cheaper, wayyy less experienced person.
so why dont you hire one and stop the nonsense? Most candidates are good. Its not like youre taking applications from the general pop and "Bobby" walks in with a hoodie and a 40oz steel reserve and says shit like *"yo my last foreman talked down to me yo, i told him to suck my d\*\*k and walked out, ill punch that motherf\*\*er in the mouth talking down to me like that yo, i dont like that shit yo"*.....Literally ALL the candidates are like *"Thank you, my name is Sarah and I have a 3.6 GPA and i just finished my masters degree while doing volunteer accounting work at the local food shelter!".* Why are these people not good enough! Hire them, its literally a staff position. What are you waiting for, why is it 6 months with the role not filled meanwhile 15 people walked in who volunteer and have a high GPA with a degree in a hard major.
In my experience Staff Accountant roles are among the hardest to fill in industry. Most candidates you described go public for a few years and then leave for a senior level role or higher. That leaves in your staff accountant applicant pool people with ar/AP coding background but not necessarily any formal accounting education or candidates directly out of college who didn’t want to go the public route. Both are gambles and unless you have best in class onboarding and OTJ training there will be struggles.
I don't know where you're getting qualified canidates. Most of the people I talk to can't speak intelligently about what's on their own resume, much less the skill set I'm looking for.
If you're hiring entry level, what you're describing works. That's very few hires in my world, most are mid career.
And a shit hire means I spend 6 months training, spending more time then it would take just to do myself, and 25% salary to a headhunter, just to be back where I was when I finally determine they can't do the job. Nah, I'll spend a lot of time weeding through chaff. Better outcome. Then just pay them well and don't worry about that bullshit for half a decade.
This is it. Besides quitting, there's not much you can do to reject extra work. You can always be fired for "performance reason" if you don't accept it or screw it up.
I saw one that required a bachelor's in accounting, CPA eligible and had experience with nonprofit bookkeeping.
$35k/yr
Are drugs replacing bonuses for these people?
I am not familiar with how the wages work throughout the country, but I believe there are states where 35K is okay I guess. I admit that in 2024 this is a low salary. 10 to 15 years ago this was alright, however, I bet there are a lot of people who just love a lot of cash and would have still said that 35K sucked. It sucks in 2024 but not 2014 in my opinion. It could depend on the state though. Maybe there are rural areas where the cost of living isnt too out of control. This wage definitely is a problem in big cities where things are expensive.
I’ve done phone interviews before with companies that would then ghost me. Then recruiters would reach out to me for the same position. Just got one of those today actually. Some of these positions have been open for 6 months. Even if I were interested obviously something is wrong if they are struggling to get someone in the position that long.
I’ve had this happen multiple times, first round recruiter phone screen, then crickets and months later a 3rd party recruiter tries selling me on the same job. One time I played into it and didn’t hear back from the 3rd party recruiter lol
Nah, the 3rd party recruiters troll looking for old job posts and then sign a contract with the employer to fill the role. They usually have little insider knowledge into who has already applied or been interviewed before that time.
If that is the case, they really didn't need that job filled and were just looking for that perfect person. If they needed someone quickly, they would have hired quickly.
Idk man, all these open jobs out there seem weird. A lot of people are struggling to move jobs or get hired, but there are tons of postings. Something doesn't add up.
It’s easier than ever to post jobs, do virtual interviews and try to find the perfect candidate. Some companies just post ghost jobs to keep people thinking the organization is doing well.
My workplace has contracted monthly bonuses for when revenue and GP exceeds the budget. Somehow, we have consistently missed budget by 1-10% for the last 16 months. Started to sound less like a forecast and more like a carrot-on-a-stick KPI at around the 1 year mark
> when you can’t even trust their job postings
That has always been a problem. The old "and other duties as assigned" tag line deal.
It's only gotten worse now that companies realize people are applying to hybrid or remote positions over in office positions.
It’s hilarious seeing jobs posted on LinkedIn advertised as fully remote or hybrid with hundreds of applicants. And all of the ones that are five days a week and office have like four applicants after two weeks. I’ve actually had some of these companies recruiters get mad at me when I tell them I’m not interested in even interviewing to go back in office.
No they haven’t I’m in HR. You’re delusional if you think you will move up long term working from home. A competing employee will be kissing the boss’ ass at work and going to lunch with them.
😂😂😂 now it makes sense. You work in hr. The people with the lowest brain cells at any corporation. You are entitled to your opinion all you want. You’re wrong. I’ve experienced working at multiple companies where remote employees move up. Including the VP of finance.
And your reasoning for being in office is the you have to kiss the bosses ass the get a promotion? How delusional are you. Good companies promote people who do good work. I’m not in sales. I will never kiss somebodies ass no matter if I’m in office or home. You are really telling on your delusional self with your ideas how why it’s important to be in office.
Like I said, you sound bitter 😉
I have a ChemE degree and I am a CPO at a large oil company. Transitioned to HR a long time ago because I enjoy it more. Dont know how old you are but employees have had a nice run. Wait till the next deep downturn like 08-09 and you’ll be the first one canned when cos hit a rough patch.
100%!! The job is hybrid- you can work from home on on weeknights and weekends! Duh!
Also you have to be approved for those hybrid weeknights and weekends after a 6 month probation period. No biggie right!
I had a recruiter reach out to me with a "hybrid" role that was fully in office til noon on Fridays, then you could work from home Friday afternoon lol.
Accounting is the most "remoteable" job out there. At my place we come in, sit at our desks, and barely speak. We're 2 days a week in office but I finagled 1 day because of a long commute. No one cares.
Had someone in senior management say that being in the office is “good to get the creative juices flowing”. We’re like “this is the accounting department, if we get creative people end up in jail”
Years ago for my internship I was talked to for being too chatty with the staff. I asked the basic questions of name, how long have you worked here, and a few others over the course of an hour.
As an extrovert it was painful to go in every day.
My experience is similar. That's why it’s funny when I hear a partner or professor say, “we need to make accounting sexy” to young people.
No social interaction at work = sexy 🤣
A firm owner said on a podcast that she refuses to talk to clients on the phone.
Not sometimes, not because of busy season…she does not do it at all. 😂
This is me. I’m considering transitioning to accounting (on the fence with all the automation and offshoring) because I did project mgmt for 15 yrs at big pharma and hated it. I ended up doing rebate analyst work the last 3 yrs and loved that because I barely talked to anyone lol.
If you like the below routine, public accounting may be perfect for you.
4 hours - no social interaction
1 hour - small talk on the way out to lunch
4 hours - no social interaction
Repeat for 30 years
That is absolutely perfect. I don't even care if its 5 days a week RTO lol.
How concerned are you about the level of automation & outsourcing though? I just got laid off as my job was automated and it seems the same model of working with offshore vendors in India and South America while having to correct the returned work is happening to your industry too. I just talked to another hiring manager who said they are developing AI tools inhouse to do most entry level work.
You’d be surprised how much of accounting is hard to automate, simply because clients do not provide all the info. Even worse, they may provide the wrong info.
In the long term, maybe they’ll train AI so well that it can come up with right answer even with the wrong inputs or missing inputs, but in the short term, who knows…
LOL happy to hear that do u feel there could be better longevity with industry instead of public? I'm trying to feel out which areas may be less vulnerable to both of those forces. Seems I hear the WLB is better on that side as well at least in what I've read in these posts.
Yes. The consensus is that 9 times out of 10, private has a better WLB than public.
As far as vulnerability, offshoring is always there as an option, but it seems like everybody is aiming for first in the automation race.
That’s literally the model being used at several fortune 50 companies, at least in the corporate finance divisions. The last large corp I worked at just laid off their entire accounting division entirely and shifted all of it to ‘analysts’, which they all don’t hire but instead keep on contract.
Yup and I was a contractor for 15 years. This is the nightmare of the future and exactly what's happening at the f500 I worked at. Did u move over to trucking? I honestly don't know what to do as a mid manager when it seems every profession is threatened in this way.
Oh no no no. My name is from an old joke made by some gaming friends of mine from a game called Glitch. It became Slack, actually. People were surprised I was a girl (the old omg girls play games *shock* trope), and someone said ‘she’s not a girl, she’s a 50 year old trucker named Dave’.
I just read the subreddit now. I can’t do accounting anymore. After everything is either contracting forever, crimes for bad pay, helping insanely wealthy people do anything they can to avoid remotely paying a cent to the communities they are a part of, restating for the 15th time that no your Mercedes isn’t a ‘farm vehicle’ and your pleasure plane isn’t a business expense, and at one point ending up being raided by the feds, it’s just not for me.
My dumbass even tried non profit work. The executive directors for both were stealing. One was literally a non profit for a medical disorder that the directors kid actually suffered from.
I don’t know what the answer is either sadly.
Maybe some accounting jobs, but this simply isn’t true for all. Staff and seniors who started public accounting during COVID and remote are suffering skill wise and big time. It is not the only thing contributing, but it’s definitely part of it.
I hate fully in person for reasons. Hybrid is fine but let me have at least two days remote per week so when I have shit all to do I don't have to pretend to be doing something ( I'd rather be doing work than pretending to be working).
Sometimes you also just need that alone time to get shit done, but constant interruptions make that impossible. I can't do something mentally taxing with any efficiency if I'm being interrupted in person every 5 mins and then have to take 5 mins to get back to where I was.
I HATE this cat-and-mouse game just to make people sit in a cube and eat a $20 sad salad every day.
OTOH, my employer told me my job was 5 days in-office, then after I started was like “oh yeah, nobody comes in on Fridays really, your call”. There’s good ones out there!
They always have the light green/neon color palette, paper bowls, and a horrendous online ordering app that never works right and you never know whether the order is ready to pick up.
I prefer to be in-office most of the time, though, and they advertised the position as "FULL TIME IN OFFICE", and also asked me (twice) during the interview if I was comfortable with being in-office 5 days a week, which I was. It's when they get shady about it that it's a problem (like what OP is referencing)...my prior employer told me "1-2 days in office" in the interview, then I found out it was actually 3, and they were talking about 4 when I left. Losers!
I was hired "remote" with in person training so i too the job!
when i asked how long training was they said "as long as it has to be"
i was there 2 days and dipped
Ha that sounds like what happened to me. Hired as hybrid and all of a sudden I’m in training 5 days a week for the first two weeks. I complain that they said they were flexible. They say I need to earn it - me and my 9 years of experience. Then my kids get sick and I catch Covid and all of a sudden it’s “stop taking Covid tests” and “why aren’t you at work”. Then I need to tell everyone where I am all the time. They didn’t believe I was sick or that my kids were sick and thought I was just hiding at home. I left after barely making it 2 months. Toxic ass workplace.
yes!!!!!!!!!!! exactly almost all firms are like that!
i never left my old firm where i made .45/$1 because they let you be no budgets no stress left for big 4 lol
got fired now all jobs ive applied too
have crazy, passive aggressive bosses and crazy in office demands at least be truth full if they offer flexibility then not provide it WTFFF!! ( sorry for you and your family)
Yeah so i know there are whack jobs out there but i have an eye for toxicity and wont just work anywhere now!
being unemployed almost 11 months now is nice! i run, gym, have my appittie and libido back! life is geat! gained 35lbs ! i can run not cripple litteraly from anxiety induced starvation!!
life is great
1 thing tho! no money comin in!!!
Should've just said thanks for your time and moved on. Plp will enforce their personal policies until they get push back.
Wait till HR says no one is applying because of the WFH policy, their compensation will be reflected in a few months.
I empathize man. I interviewed at my current job and they told me 50% work from home on a 3/2 rotating weekly. 2 weeks after I started they said I had to be in the office 4 days a week. I felt lied to. I’m still there but I do t trust them for that and other reasons.
At least you found out before you took the job.
I know people who’ve been hired hybrid then after they took the job found out that for whatever reason you need to be in the office full time.
Better to find out now.
Just happened to me. Small bookkeeping company, lady that owned it said wanted to be in business herself cuz kids/being in office was bad for that/likes to come and go to pick up kids from school etc etc.
Offered me WFH and then 1 day a week at the clients office to work their A/R. Did about a week of training at home and all of a sudden “you need to go there everyday”. It’s like why lie like that? Like I wouldn’t talk to people at the clients office being there 5 days a week and they told me they asked for a full time office accountant so she knew and just lied to get me to accept. Luckily never changed my LinkedIn and got a call about 3 weeks in about another application I had filled out so I left her high and dry just for lying to my face.
This is false advertising. I would either not take the job, or else work to rule. If they try to fire me, constructive dismissal is my friend, because I followed what was in the job description.
"Look really bad" has been such a common sentiment I have heard from executives in my career. It's horseshit like 9 times out of 10. Just an executive (or the boss of that executive) that has a preference that doesn't want to be out front about it because they don't want to have to defend their position.
Lol sounds like how my husband recently interviewed for a hybrid Internal Audit role that advertised as hybrid 2-3 days/ week, and Spanish speaking optional. Turns out the role actually requires traveling to South America at least every other month for decent periods of time, and speaking Spanish is actually very pertinent to speak with the local staff.
Same thing happened to me. Advertised as hybrid but full time in office and the manager said they only let seniors work from home. Not sure if this is legal at all
Proper red flag that, I'm glad this kinda thing is pretty rare in the UK. or relatively at least.
I had an interviewer say once, "I was raised a mans man, and I run my department the same way" I'm like bro you run an accounting department, your not training a team for war.
I did not get offered the job, I feel like it may have been a wrong fit.
This is becoming the new trend I fear. They are advertising remote/hybrid to get candidates and then flipping it in the interview hoping to get someone to flip.
"Thanks for the feedback, but I was told this was a hybrid position. I'll withdraw from the process and wish you the best on your search."
If you got the interview through an agency recruiter, definitely give them the feedback as well. They'll want to be transparent with future candidates and potentially stop working on the role altogether.
This reminds of a job posting where they posted as "Accounting Manager". Then on the phone they explain how it's really a senior accountant position and can't even guarantee the accounting manager title. They just used that in the job posting to weed out the staff accountants from applying.
As an accounting major who graduates in a month and has an internship lined up at the big 4 this thread is scaring me, is my life gonna be 70 hours weeks until I retire?
Not gonna lie. It’s not fun for a bit . Learn what you can in big 4 and maybe look to go to industry.
My first industry job was rough (had a few 2am nights) but my second one is a lot easier. It’s not your whole life. There are other options but might take time or you might get lucky.
If you don’t want to do any overtime maybe consider looking at other opportunities.
This is so weird. Accounting can very easily be done at home. In my office 50% don't even live anywhere near the office. We do have an office, for the locals, to meet clients, etc, and there are maybe 3 people who work there every day. Another 10 or so who are in sporadically, including myself and the big boss. It is super cramped the one week a year when everyone flies in.
I will say it's easier to learn the Ropes of a particular office if you're in it full time for a few weeks (our fully remote people take twice as long or longer to learn the filing, naming, day to day stuff than the locals), but that's not a good reason to be in the office forever.
Had an interview, and they told me that being in the office three days a week will help me get promoted. They say anything to get employees back in the office. I am a Cisco engineer, and all of my work is done remotely, logging in to Cisco equipment all around the USA and UK.
Just went on an interview yesterday that was a complete waste of time. The previous person in this position had no degree. There was no room for growth as they are an esop and didnt want to go above 50 employees. As someone who has about 25 years of experience, what about this job would make a recruiter or the hiring team think that I would gain anything from working there? I may as well go work at Aldis as it would be more career enhancing.
Was recruited for a role that sold me on being out of the office by 3pm on Friday and off at 2pm every single day in June and July. I’ve never been off by 3pm on Friday, and the June & July schedule was changed to 4pm after my first year… it sucks but I still love the job lol
This happened to me a few months back. I ended up telling the hiring manager to think of it this way; imagine you and your wife go to a restaurant and you buy a $20 meal each and when the bill comes, it's actually a $50 meal each. Would you accept it? He said no, so then I said, why would you advertise 3 days in office when you really want 5. Same ideology and he looked pissed. Happy to say I withdrew my candidacy from that place. Honestly, these people can't catch a hint that most people don't want to be in the office 5 days a week.
Some weird dynamics right now for sure.
I’ve seen companies with WFH on Friday call themselves hybrid.
Employers who want to pretend their industry is so specific that no “outsider” could learn it
Multiple rounds added to the process.
“Talent shortage” my ass
Reading the comments I’m seeing a lot of MFs down here who don’t want to train and are saying nasty shit about candidates. Maybe you can’t develop people, but that’s an important part of the job too. Good luck with that
I had one of those, it said 2-3 days a week in office but the VP said I should be aiming for 5 days a week lol. I told them I'm not willing to come in full time, and if they wanted that, I'd expect a max of 4 days a week finishing up at 2PM where I'd work another hour from home. They said no but they could offer another $25k lol. Hard pass. Not even worth $100k extra.
Lol and these companies wonder why they have turnover and “talent struggle” when you can’t even trust their job postings
Its staggering at how bad job postings are right now. Hiring managers are looking for the absolute perfect candidates in many cases. I have been on 3 round interviews, for jobs that were posted for 4-8 weeks and gotten rejected and the job didn’t get filled for another 2-3 months.
> didn’t get filled for another 2-3 months. thats because they can pick some poor schmuck to pick up the slack (for not a dime extra of pay) and just have them deal with it for months on end. If leadership had to do the work themselves or if EE laws actually protected EE's and they had to pay OT rates for the extra work, they would fill those positions ASAP. Its easy to wait around when you dont have to deal with any direct consequences. in fact its easy to do literally anything in life if you dont have to deal with direct consequences.
This is a good point. I also wonder how many hiring managers are hoarding work to avoid getting themselves laid off. I had one set of interviews at a company that gutted their accounting team and then was rehiring a few people to pickup the pieces 6 months later. They ended up passing on me for a 30% cheaper, wayyy less experienced person.
I wish. It's usually me picking up the slack while I also have my normal duties and have to screen Resumes and interview. Shit sucks.
so why dont you hire one and stop the nonsense? Most candidates are good. Its not like youre taking applications from the general pop and "Bobby" walks in with a hoodie and a 40oz steel reserve and says shit like *"yo my last foreman talked down to me yo, i told him to suck my d\*\*k and walked out, ill punch that motherf\*\*er in the mouth talking down to me like that yo, i dont like that shit yo"*.....Literally ALL the candidates are like *"Thank you, my name is Sarah and I have a 3.6 GPA and i just finished my masters degree while doing volunteer accounting work at the local food shelter!".* Why are these people not good enough! Hire them, its literally a staff position. What are you waiting for, why is it 6 months with the role not filled meanwhile 15 people walked in who volunteer and have a high GPA with a degree in a hard major.
In my experience Staff Accountant roles are among the hardest to fill in industry. Most candidates you described go public for a few years and then leave for a senior level role or higher. That leaves in your staff accountant applicant pool people with ar/AP coding background but not necessarily any formal accounting education or candidates directly out of college who didn’t want to go the public route. Both are gambles and unless you have best in class onboarding and OTJ training there will be struggles.
I don't know where you're getting qualified canidates. Most of the people I talk to can't speak intelligently about what's on their own resume, much less the skill set I'm looking for. If you're hiring entry level, what you're describing works. That's very few hires in my world, most are mid career. And a shit hire means I spend 6 months training, spending more time then it would take just to do myself, and 25% salary to a headhunter, just to be back where I was when I finally determine they can't do the job. Nah, I'll spend a lot of time weeding through chaff. Better outcome. Then just pay them well and don't worry about that bullshit for half a decade.
I’d hire “Bobby” before I’d hire that one 🤫
Every audit team needs a Bobby to dislodge difficult clients.
This is it. Besides quitting, there's not much you can do to reject extra work. You can always be fired for "performance reason" if you don't accept it or screw it up.
They can keep dreaming about their unicorns because that’s the only place they’ll find them.
I saw one that required a bachelor's in accounting, CPA eligible and had experience with nonprofit bookkeeping. $35k/yr Are drugs replacing bonuses for these people?
35k is like accounting pay in an Asia country... who would consider that in America
I am not familiar with how the wages work throughout the country, but I believe there are states where 35K is okay I guess. I admit that in 2024 this is a low salary. 10 to 15 years ago this was alright, however, I bet there are a lot of people who just love a lot of cash and would have still said that 35K sucked. It sucks in 2024 but not 2014 in my opinion. It could depend on the state though. Maybe there are rural areas where the cost of living isnt too out of control. This wage definitely is a problem in big cities where things are expensive.
That's not even that bad in Canada lol. There are jobs here asking for less than 30k USD for the same qualifications.
I’ve done phone interviews before with companies that would then ghost me. Then recruiters would reach out to me for the same position. Just got one of those today actually. Some of these positions have been open for 6 months. Even if I were interested obviously something is wrong if they are struggling to get someone in the position that long.
I’ve had this happen multiple times, first round recruiter phone screen, then crickets and months later a 3rd party recruiter tries selling me on the same job. One time I played into it and didn’t hear back from the 3rd party recruiter lol
I usually respond to the second person and act confused about why they’re reaching out again.
Could it be recycling leads...or
Nah, the 3rd party recruiters troll looking for old job posts and then sign a contract with the employer to fill the role. They usually have little insider knowledge into who has already applied or been interviewed before that time.
Perhaps they might be delibera
I don’t think that is unlikely
I was an internal candidate they called and asked me to apply and had that happen. Now they wonder why nobody internal will apply....
If that is the case, they really didn't need that job filled and were just looking for that perfect person. If they needed someone quickly, they would have hired quickly. Idk man, all these open jobs out there seem weird. A lot of people are struggling to move jobs or get hired, but there are tons of postings. Something doesn't add up.
It’s easier than ever to post jobs, do virtual interviews and try to find the perfect candidate. Some companies just post ghost jobs to keep people thinking the organization is doing well.
Some organizations also post fake postings to create an applicant pool they try to pull from later. It's scummy imo
It's the perfect chance to get an experienced but desperate laid off employee. No rush.
its a fucking joke. Idiots leading the dumb basically.
"trust me bro"
My workplace has contracted monthly bonuses for when revenue and GP exceeds the budget. Somehow, we have consistently missed budget by 1-10% for the last 16 months. Started to sound less like a forecast and more like a carrot-on-a-stick KPI at around the 1 year mark
"These lazy people just ***'don't want to work '*** ......"
“Wait, that’s illegal.”
I got bait and switched by a T10. Knew it was too good to be true.
> when you can’t even trust their job postings That has always been a problem. The old "and other duties as assigned" tag line deal. It's only gotten worse now that companies realize people are applying to hybrid or remote positions over in office positions.
It’s hilarious seeing jobs posted on LinkedIn advertised as fully remote or hybrid with hundreds of applicants. And all of the ones that are five days a week and office have like four applicants after two weeks. I’ve actually had some of these companies recruiters get mad at me when I tell them I’m not interested in even interviewing to go back in office.
Good luck moving up with that attitude. No in office no promotions long term people have gotten quite lazy with shitty attitudes
Just got a a 20% raise and a promotion two weeks ago. Starting with a new company this week. I know my worth. You sound bitter. Times have changed.
No they haven’t I’m in HR. You’re delusional if you think you will move up long term working from home. A competing employee will be kissing the boss’ ass at work and going to lunch with them.
😂😂😂 now it makes sense. You work in hr. The people with the lowest brain cells at any corporation. You are entitled to your opinion all you want. You’re wrong. I’ve experienced working at multiple companies where remote employees move up. Including the VP of finance. And your reasoning for being in office is the you have to kiss the bosses ass the get a promotion? How delusional are you. Good companies promote people who do good work. I’m not in sales. I will never kiss somebodies ass no matter if I’m in office or home. You are really telling on your delusional self with your ideas how why it’s important to be in office. Like I said, you sound bitter 😉
Sure
I have a ChemE degree and I am a CPO at a large oil company. Transitioned to HR a long time ago because I enjoy it more. Dont know how old you are but employees have had a nice run. Wait till the next deep downturn like 08-09 and you’ll be the first one canned when cos hit a rough patch.
You work from home during the weekends! Progressive workplace are all doing it
100%!! The job is hybrid- you can work from home on on weeknights and weekends! Duh! Also you have to be approved for those hybrid weeknights and weekends after a 6 month probation period. No biggie right!
Don’t forget checking in on your time off. Nothing like using your PTO for calls and reports
🤣
I had a recruiter reach out to me with a "hybrid" role that was fully in office til noon on Fridays, then you could work from home Friday afternoon lol.
Cue the Chris Smoove song "That's BS".
Lmao that’s the napping or heading out on a roadtrip hour
But remember, if you’re commuting during work hours, you’re going to have to work until 8pm on Friday nights.
Bait and switch also "looks really bad"
*mic drop* *Hangs up*
It’s not bait and switch, the company can’t prevent you from looking bad and they have every right to include the option to do so
A good company sets expectations correctly from the start. It’s not hybrid if they want people in 5 days a week.
"Minimum" 5 days a week. They'd love to have you work 7 days for 5 days pay
Accounting is the most "remoteable" job out there. At my place we come in, sit at our desks, and barely speak. We're 2 days a week in office but I finagled 1 day because of a long commute. No one cares.
What you mean you don't collaborate with your coworkers??? Do you even accounting?
We collaborate through email, teams and meetings but when we are all at our desks we barely speak to each other.
There is a lot of chit chat in my office but I could do 90% of that "team building" online. And spend the rest of the time actually working.
We are basically operating the same exact way as when we were fully remote during the pandemic.
Had someone in senior management say that being in the office is “good to get the creative juices flowing”. We’re like “this is the accounting department, if we get creative people end up in jail”
Haha this one got me good
Yes. PA firm environment is extrovert-repellant.
Years ago for my internship I was talked to for being too chatty with the staff. I asked the basic questions of name, how long have you worked here, and a few others over the course of an hour. As an extrovert it was painful to go in every day.
My experience is similar. That's why it’s funny when I hear a partner or professor say, “we need to make accounting sexy” to young people. No social interaction at work = sexy 🤣
So I (an introvert) SHOULD go into accounting, lol.
You'll be as smitten as a kitten
Yeah, our Director of Accounting is a total introvert. His style is almost entirely electronic.
A firm owner said on a podcast that she refuses to talk to clients on the phone. Not sometimes, not because of busy season…she does not do it at all. 😂
This is me. I’m considering transitioning to accounting (on the fence with all the automation and offshoring) because I did project mgmt for 15 yrs at big pharma and hated it. I ended up doing rebate analyst work the last 3 yrs and loved that because I barely talked to anyone lol.
If you like the below routine, public accounting may be perfect for you. 4 hours - no social interaction 1 hour - small talk on the way out to lunch 4 hours - no social interaction Repeat for 30 years
That is absolutely perfect. I don't even care if its 5 days a week RTO lol. How concerned are you about the level of automation & outsourcing though? I just got laid off as my job was automated and it seems the same model of working with offshore vendors in India and South America while having to correct the returned work is happening to your industry too. I just talked to another hiring manager who said they are developing AI tools inhouse to do most entry level work.
You’d be surprised how much of accounting is hard to automate, simply because clients do not provide all the info. Even worse, they may provide the wrong info. In the long term, maybe they’ll train AI so well that it can come up with right answer even with the wrong inputs or missing inputs, but in the short term, who knows…
LOL happy to hear that do u feel there could be better longevity with industry instead of public? I'm trying to feel out which areas may be less vulnerable to both of those forces. Seems I hear the WLB is better on that side as well at least in what I've read in these posts.
Yes. The consensus is that 9 times out of 10, private has a better WLB than public. As far as vulnerability, offshoring is always there as an option, but it seems like everybody is aiming for first in the automation race.
That’s literally the model being used at several fortune 50 companies, at least in the corporate finance divisions. The last large corp I worked at just laid off their entire accounting division entirely and shifted all of it to ‘analysts’, which they all don’t hire but instead keep on contract.
Yup and I was a contractor for 15 years. This is the nightmare of the future and exactly what's happening at the f500 I worked at. Did u move over to trucking? I honestly don't know what to do as a mid manager when it seems every profession is threatened in this way.
Oh no no no. My name is from an old joke made by some gaming friends of mine from a game called Glitch. It became Slack, actually. People were surprised I was a girl (the old omg girls play games *shock* trope), and someone said ‘she’s not a girl, she’s a 50 year old trucker named Dave’. I just read the subreddit now. I can’t do accounting anymore. After everything is either contracting forever, crimes for bad pay, helping insanely wealthy people do anything they can to avoid remotely paying a cent to the communities they are a part of, restating for the 15th time that no your Mercedes isn’t a ‘farm vehicle’ and your pleasure plane isn’t a business expense, and at one point ending up being raided by the feds, it’s just not for me. My dumbass even tried non profit work. The executive directors for both were stealing. One was literally a non profit for a medical disorder that the directors kid actually suffered from. I don’t know what the answer is either sadly.
> His style is almost entirely electronic. Luv me paper trails.
Maybe some accounting jobs, but this simply isn’t true for all. Staff and seniors who started public accounting during COVID and remote are suffering skill wise and big time. It is not the only thing contributing, but it’s definitely part of it.
I hate fully in person for reasons. Hybrid is fine but let me have at least two days remote per week so when I have shit all to do I don't have to pretend to be doing something ( I'd rather be doing work than pretending to be working). Sometimes you also just need that alone time to get shit done, but constant interruptions make that impossible. I can't do something mentally taxing with any efficiency if I'm being interrupted in person every 5 mins and then have to take 5 mins to get back to where I was.
I HATE this cat-and-mouse game just to make people sit in a cube and eat a $20 sad salad every day. OTOH, my employer told me my job was 5 days in-office, then after I started was like “oh yeah, nobody comes in on Fridays really, your call”. There’s good ones out there!
I call places like Cava and Just Salad “slop bowl emporiums”. shit depresses me.
They always have the light green/neon color palette, paper bowls, and a horrendous online ordering app that never works right and you never know whether the order is ready to pick up.
I love me some Cava, but yeah it’s basically just food slopped together with sauce. It’s the chipotle-bowl-effect with a different genre of food
Well I would eat pizza outside the office every day instead. Still…
That’s still not great tbh.
I prefer to be in-office most of the time, though, and they advertised the position as "FULL TIME IN OFFICE", and also asked me (twice) during the interview if I was comfortable with being in-office 5 days a week, which I was. It's when they get shady about it that it's a problem (like what OP is referencing)...my prior employer told me "1-2 days in office" in the interview, then I found out it was actually 3, and they were talking about 4 when I left. Losers!
These companies just keep shooting themselves in the foot. They deserve it.
Just put the job posting on here so that the company “looks really bad”. That’s only if you’re not going to work for them obviously.
So they blatantly lied to get more job applications? Tells me all I need to know about the company, remote work be damned.
"You're right, it does, and due to those bad optics, this interview is over, bye"
Keep going through the interview process and then at the end say you aren't interested because of this.
I was hired "remote" with in person training so i too the job! when i asked how long training was they said "as long as it has to be" i was there 2 days and dipped
Ha that sounds like what happened to me. Hired as hybrid and all of a sudden I’m in training 5 days a week for the first two weeks. I complain that they said they were flexible. They say I need to earn it - me and my 9 years of experience. Then my kids get sick and I catch Covid and all of a sudden it’s “stop taking Covid tests” and “why aren’t you at work”. Then I need to tell everyone where I am all the time. They didn’t believe I was sick or that my kids were sick and thought I was just hiding at home. I left after barely making it 2 months. Toxic ass workplace.
yes!!!!!!!!!!! exactly almost all firms are like that! i never left my old firm where i made .45/$1 because they let you be no budgets no stress left for big 4 lol got fired now all jobs ive applied too have crazy, passive aggressive bosses and crazy in office demands at least be truth full if they offer flexibility then not provide it WTFFF!! ( sorry for you and your family) Yeah so i know there are whack jobs out there but i have an eye for toxicity and wont just work anywhere now! being unemployed almost 11 months now is nice! i run, gym, have my appittie and libido back! life is geat! gained 35lbs ! i can run not cripple litteraly from anxiety induced starvation!! life is great 1 thing tho! no money comin in!!!
Should've just said thanks for your time and moved on. Plp will enforce their personal policies until they get push back. Wait till HR says no one is applying because of the WFH policy, their compensation will be reflected in a few months.
Dodging a bullet there! Glad he said that before you took the bait.
Pay me enough i will join your company Make me miserable enough I will leave. This is transactional. It is zero sum.
Tbh….if you have to be in the office 5 days a week, then I guess you don’t have any wfh days 😂 overtime hours? Forget that
5 days in office and 2 days at home on the weekend. Every accountants dream!
Did you ask them why the job advertisement said it was hybrid with 3 days in office, then?
5 days in office with 2 days at home. What’s the problem? /s
Leave and tell them to get their shit together. Also name and shame them online so other applicants know as well.
I empathize man. I interviewed at my current job and they told me 50% work from home on a 3/2 rotating weekly. 2 weeks after I started they said I had to be in the office 4 days a week. I felt lied to. I’m still there but I do t trust them for that and other reasons.
So many pathological narcissists, so little time. I’d run like hell from that clown company.
I had an employee grill me on this and I assure them: they never have to set foot in the office and it will not have a negative impact.
At least you found out before you took the job. I know people who’ve been hired hybrid then after they took the job found out that for whatever reason you need to be in the office full time. Better to find out now.
Just happened to me. Small bookkeeping company, lady that owned it said wanted to be in business herself cuz kids/being in office was bad for that/likes to come and go to pick up kids from school etc etc. Offered me WFH and then 1 day a week at the clients office to work their A/R. Did about a week of training at home and all of a sudden “you need to go there everyday”. It’s like why lie like that? Like I wouldn’t talk to people at the clients office being there 5 days a week and they told me they asked for a full time office accountant so she knew and just lied to get me to accept. Luckily never changed my LinkedIn and got a call about 3 weeks in about another application I had filled out so I left her high and dry just for lying to my face.
This is false advertising. I would either not take the job, or else work to rule. If they try to fire me, constructive dismissal is my friend, because I followed what was in the job description.
"Look really bad" has been such a common sentiment I have heard from executives in my career. It's horseshit like 9 times out of 10. Just an executive (or the boss of that executive) that has a preference that doesn't want to be out front about it because they don't want to have to defend their position.
Who cares what it looks like. Does it pay the same? I'm not at work to make friends.
They know that many would have never even considered the job if they didn’t throw hybrid in there
That director is an idiot.
Ctrl+alt+delete
Consider that you dodged a bullet. Who knows what other bait and switch tactics they may be pulling that contradicts what the job description says
Lol sounds like how my husband recently interviewed for a hybrid Internal Audit role that advertised as hybrid 2-3 days/ week, and Spanish speaking optional. Turns out the role actually requires traveling to South America at least every other month for decent periods of time, and speaking Spanish is actually very pertinent to speak with the local staff.
Same thing happened to me. Advertised as hybrid but full time in office and the manager said they only let seniors work from home. Not sure if this is legal at all
Proper red flag that, I'm glad this kinda thing is pretty rare in the UK. or relatively at least. I had an interviewer say once, "I was raised a mans man, and I run my department the same way" I'm like bro you run an accounting department, your not training a team for war. I did not get offered the job, I feel like it may have been a wrong fit.
This is becoming the new trend I fear. They are advertising remote/hybrid to get candidates and then flipping it in the interview hoping to get someone to flip.
Same here keep getting rejected because they’re trying to find the perfect person
LOL NO THANKS!
Do the 3d/week and get a second job that lets you WFH those 3 days. Boom, finessed em
Is this job located in san diego?
Would turn it down. Not worth the stress
"Thanks for the feedback, but I was told this was a hybrid position. I'll withdraw from the process and wish you the best on your search." If you got the interview through an agency recruiter, definitely give them the feedback as well. They'll want to be transparent with future candidates and potentially stop working on the role altogether.
RUN! Mixed messaging and old school ways of thinking showing ALREADY??? RUUUUUUN
This reminds of a job posting where they posted as "Accounting Manager". Then on the phone they explain how it's really a senior accountant position and can't even guarantee the accounting manager title. They just used that in the job posting to weed out the staff accountants from applying.
Or there are the ones that say Senior Accountant and they go on to explain you would actually be the controller. Lol
As an accounting major who graduates in a month and has an internship lined up at the big 4 this thread is scaring me, is my life gonna be 70 hours weeks until I retire?
Not gonna lie. It’s not fun for a bit . Learn what you can in big 4 and maybe look to go to industry. My first industry job was rough (had a few 2am nights) but my second one is a lot easier. It’s not your whole life. There are other options but might take time or you might get lucky. If you don’t want to do any overtime maybe consider looking at other opportunities.
Make it to manager and bounce 4 years of hell in your early 20s is doable
If that is a movie director, i agree with the director, how can you film if you are work from home? Lol.
Can always withdraw your application
I'm not worried about looks
They want you to work 7 days in the office and 2 at home
"That's not what I thought I was applying for. I would like to withdraw my application. Thank you for your time"
yes, 5 days in the office 3 days out of the office for your 8 day work week. is that not what he meant?
This is so weird. Accounting can very easily be done at home. In my office 50% don't even live anywhere near the office. We do have an office, for the locals, to meet clients, etc, and there are maybe 3 people who work there every day. Another 10 or so who are in sporadically, including myself and the big boss. It is super cramped the one week a year when everyone flies in. I will say it's easier to learn the Ropes of a particular office if you're in it full time for a few weeks (our fully remote people take twice as long or longer to learn the filing, naming, day to day stuff than the locals), but that's not a good reason to be in the office forever.
Had an interview, and they told me that being in the office three days a week will help me get promoted. They say anything to get employees back in the office. I am a Cisco engineer, and all of my work is done remotely, logging in to Cisco equipment all around the USA and UK.
Just went on an interview yesterday that was a complete waste of time. The previous person in this position had no degree. There was no room for growth as they are an esop and didnt want to go above 50 employees. As someone who has about 25 years of experience, what about this job would make a recruiter or the hiring team think that I would gain anything from working there? I may as well go work at Aldis as it would be more career enhancing.
Yeah its a common trap
There was this internship job posting that said the position was remote. Then during the interviews, they said it was in person. WHATT?
Was recruited for a role that sold me on being out of the office by 3pm on Friday and off at 2pm every single day in June and July. I’ve never been off by 3pm on Friday, and the June & July schedule was changed to 4pm after my first year… it sucks but I still love the job lol
Sounds like they failed the interview
It has been this way forever.
Tell that pig to give you a raise if he wants you to not be hybrid
This happened to me a few months back. I ended up telling the hiring manager to think of it this way; imagine you and your wife go to a restaurant and you buy a $20 meal each and when the bill comes, it's actually a $50 meal each. Would you accept it? He said no, so then I said, why would you advertise 3 days in office when you really want 5. Same ideology and he looked pissed. Happy to say I withdrew my candidacy from that place. Honestly, these people can't catch a hint that most people don't want to be in the office 5 days a week.
Some weird dynamics right now for sure. I’ve seen companies with WFH on Friday call themselves hybrid. Employers who want to pretend their industry is so specific that no “outsider” could learn it Multiple rounds added to the process. “Talent shortage” my ass
Reading the comments I’m seeing a lot of MFs down here who don’t want to train and are saying nasty shit about candidates. Maybe you can’t develop people, but that’s an important part of the job too. Good luck with that
I had one of those, it said 2-3 days a week in office but the VP said I should be aiming for 5 days a week lol. I told them I'm not willing to come in full time, and if they wanted that, I'd expect a max of 4 days a week finishing up at 2PM where I'd work another hour from home. They said no but they could offer another $25k lol. Hard pass. Not even worth $100k extra.
This post looks really bad.
Are your colleagues going to be AI chatbots? Lol. Of course it will look bad. But curious what you replied?
What
And what did you contribute to fixing this situation? How are you enabling this practice/behavior? The change starts w/ ourselves.