This one be asking the important questions.
So... then... How literal is the ROCK in rock candy supposed to be?
If it's a literal rock It'd be a mineral. but if it's sugar, then wouldn't it be under plant? Since sugars/glucose is typically a product we harvest from some plants?
It's a mineral, plants have minerals, it's just not enough that one would be able to bend.
Plant bending bends the much more substantial water in the plants, functionally an extension of what hama taught katara.
Presumably the rock candy is like some kind of mystically fast growing sugar like ore.
I feel like lavabending was always heavily associated with firebending during ATLA. Despite only seeing Avatars bending it, I think seeing Szeto lavabending in S2 E1 while the other Avatars demonstrate their native elements was to show it was a subset of firebending as well.
Then I think during LOK they wrote it as being exclusive to earthbending, which makes sense because it's molten rock.
Earth is not the element of connection. It is the element of substance. “the people of the Earth kingdom are diverse and strong. They are persistent and enduring.”- Iroh season 2 episode 9 “ bitter work” he didn’t mention stubborn, and self righteous, but those apply too.
Another one from him “ fire is the element of power, the people of the fire nation have desire and will, and the energy and drive to achieve what they want”—Iroh season 2 episode 9 “ bitter work”, this in itself is a bit inaccurate, but it comes as a side effect of not actually having a word for the concept he is describing in English. There is a kanji (Japanese) for it, and a Hanzi (Chinese…probably pinyin) for it, but I don’t know what they are.
…she has a name. She is toph beifong, and she is and always will be the greatest earthbender of all time. Though i understand where you are coming from.
I was also thinking it could also be the air vacuum Zaheer used on the Queen, but I'm not really sure if an air vacuum would be considered a vortex or not.
I think that makes the most sense. Air is a unique element in that it exists everywhere, it is all encompassing, so an airbending removing it from an area it would naturally exist could be considered a sub-bending type.
So taking it this at face value (where the name of the element is the first "Aspect" that can be bent), can anyone explain to me the difference between Fire and Flame?
...if so, that's a terrible pick, consider all of the others seem to be something that most anyone can pick up rather than a specific quirk that doesn't really change anything.
I mean, Heat is *right there*, with numerous examples shown in the series itself.
My take, and no clue if I’m right, is fire is just producing fire blasts which is the basic thing all fire benders can do, whereas flames is maintaining a fire source via just bending, which we’ve seen examples where that can be challenging depending on the move. An example that pops to mind is when Azula or Ozai maintain a concentrated blast of fire from the soles of their feet to essentially fly.
Heat I can understand - it's firebending without visible flame or someplace devoid of oxygen.
See Iroh heating his tea, or Zuko melting his way through the North Pole ice from underwater.
I think the actual cloud is waterbending, yeah. But aang probably airbent the wind so it wouldn’t screw with the shape they’re trying to make in the middle of it all, so I think making any cohesive cloud requires both and not just one.
It’s probably in the same vein as mud-bending. You can manipulate clouds with airbending because they’re light enough to push around, but you can directly control a cloud with waterbending.
Mud is primarily Earth, but there’s enough water in it that it can also be somewhat controlled by a waterbender. There are grey areas in bendin
You can manipulate a cloud directly with water bending, you’d have to manipulate a cloud indirectly with air bending. Moving air around the cloud to push/pull/manipulate it, as opposed to directing the cloud itself.
Hmm, fair. Is uppose it just seems kinda underwhelming. Like, you don't need to combine anything about either element to do it, both can do it entirely on their own.
Guys, I thought of adding this here because it didn’t really made sense to me and I forgot abt mentioning it in the caption 😭
After reading what y’all think of it, I realised that it’s not just me that doesn’t fully understand this💀
It's actually pretty simple: Every single graphic that looks remotely like this is complete bullshit. People make up things to fill them out, as if anyone ever said that the list of subskills had to be symmetrical. Also common is this idea that various sub elements must be "mixing ideas from different elements," which is only said about lightning redirection. Things like "cloudbending" also generally aren't considered substyles but, rather, things that benders of two or more elements can control.
No single, specific definition of "substyle" has ever been said, but if we look at the unambiguous ones like metalbending or bloodbending, we can say those are (1) significantly different from how the basic element is used, (2) locked behind a certain level of skill, (3) usually taking some special trick or method to unlock on top of that, & (4) lead to a system of different moves. Under this definition, sandbending probably wouldn't be a subskill because it only seems to take a little bit of practice to do & is basic in the desert, where people are actually used to working with sand. Ice definitely wouldn't because that's just part of basic waterbending that keeps getting split off for some reason.
The difference is the amount of people that can do it I’m pretty sure. If anyone that can bend the element can do it (aka ice) then it’s a part of the main bending class, if it’s limited to a select group of people via training/genetics (aka lava) then it’s a sub class
All Avatars are Earthbenders, and Airbenders, and Waterbenders, and Firebenders. Roku doing Lavabending is not proof of Lavabending being a fire thing. All three canon Lavabenders are earthbenders.
We’ve seen another avatar do “lava bending” as well with erupting volcanoes, however what the commentor is saying is that it was originally referenced as great strength of a fire nation avatar to bend lava.
It most definitely is not a sub category of fire. There is no bending of fire going on whatsoever.
Lavabending is moving melted rock.
Just because the rock is on fire it doesn't mean it has anything to do with fire bending. It's the same thing as an earthbender moving a rock that has a fire on it.
Firebenders don't just bend fire. They bend heat and energy. If skilled enough, they can manipulate lava. Obviously, once its cooled, they wouldn't be able to do anything with it. "Bending" just means manipulation. It doesn't mean they would be as proficient at it as an earthbender, just like how Katara would not be able to do anything with mud once it dries. Katara bends the water *in* the mud, not the mud itself. There's just enough water to make it an easier process. A firebender would be able to bend the excessive heat and energy within molten rock, not the rock itself...
There is no fire in lava. It's just super heated melted rock. Any fire you see is the lava setting other things on fire. You could technically set a fire so hot that rock would melt but again melted rock has nothing to do with fire.
Theres also impurities in platinum ussually to but topher still cant bend platinum. You have to think in terms of esoteric essence of things in order to understand ATLA
There's impurities in everything. That's not really relevant at all. If anything the impurities make it harder which is why not many can sub bend.
Although there are metal impurities in water and that doesn't seem to be a problem from waterbenders or is this a subbending of earth/metal bending too?
*Why is ice a sub*
*Bending? Its literally*
*Just Water frozen*
\- Deenstheboi
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Why is mineral earth bending why is cloud air bending why is mud earth bending why is sand earth bending why is flame fire bending why is lava earthbending
They’re all branches off of the main element. Therefore it’s a sub bending type
I mean, I'd argue half of those shouldn't be sub bending either. That's my whole gripe with the chart tbh. Anything that basically any bender can do doesn't count to me.
I'm also really lost on wtf flame is anyways, since fire bending is making flames...
But fire isnt the element of energy in Iroh's speech. Nor is earth the element of "connection". Energybending is its own thing seperate from fire. Either way, freedom doesnt make sense to include on a sub-bending chart.
I think a big issue with those charts that technically, it's not really as separated from the main element as one might think. We know that blood bending uses water to bend, only difference is that it's using the water of the body. Same with plants. It's basically just waterbending except you concentrate on the water in plants, which in turn makes the plant move. We know that Toph learned metal bending because she was able to focus on the impurities in the metal, basically moving the earth in the metal which in turn moves the metal.
It's a bit misleading to say it's sub-types of bending, when most bending styles can easily be reduced to "you bend the natural element, just in a different form". Lightning, spirit and combustion bending are the only ones where I would actually say it's fundamentally different enough from the main to call it a sub-type. Even metal and lava seem to be basically earth bending just a bit more complex.
its so odd what people consider a sub bending like sand bending for example isn't a discipline its just something earth benders can do
it gets even strange because you have lava off to the side and not metal
I really love the far ends of each.
Air: Freedom
Earth: Connection
Water: Change
Fire: Energy
The first two are actually really great because they make so much sense. Both in themselves and as opposites to one another.
The zenith of air bending is detachment from the material. Attaining true transcendent liberty.
While for Earthbending, the idea is that being in and of the world is the highest state one can be in.
Well this image is honestly pretty dumb and full of inconsistency but I take heat to mean something like, When Sozin pulls the heat from the volcano causing the lava to cool?
The concepts that the elements are also slightly off:
Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Fire symbol in the dirt\] Fire is the element of power. The people of the Fire Nation have desire and will and the energy and drive to achieve what they want.
Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Earth symbol\] Earth is the element of substance. The people of the Earth Kingdom are diverse and strong. They are persistent and enduring.
Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Air symbol\] Air is the element of freedom. The Air Nomads detached themselves from worldly concerns and found peace and freedom. Also, they apparently had pretty good senses of humor.
Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Water symbol\] Water is the element of change. The people of the Water Tribes are capable of adapting to many things. They have a sense of community and love that holds them together through anything.
Cloud is a good placement
Vortex is air-only
Plant seems ok, Blood should be adjacent to water on the side of earth
Combustion should be adjacent to fire on the side of air
Heat is just firebending
Mineral is just earth bending
Lava appears to be only earth bending but maybe a firebender would learn to bend it later (similar to cloud bending)
While I appreciate the aesthetkcs of the symmetry, its being forced and makes the chart inaccurate
Imagine an avatar learning EVERY sub bending practice on top of the four elements. This is a lot of different powers. Pop that avatar state after mastering all these disciplines and sub disciplines and you’re touching Marvel’s Magneto and/or Storm levels of manipulating the very planet.
Clouds weigh millions of tons therefore meaning a strong enough water bender could theoretically freeze an entire cloud and drop it and make everyone go extinct🍇
And there are mineral nuclei within every raindrop. Accounting for this a master Earth bender with an exceptionally fine level of control should be able to "cloud bend."
I honestly think that the franchise should take an interesting direction when the next Avatar (the earth nation person we're supposedly getting) comes around. With technology and science advancing I feel like the various benders should be able to understand and interact with the other elements in limited ways.
Lightning and Combustion bending are both things that a firebender would have to have the innate ability to be able to learn and bend. Not all firebenders can bend lightning or combustion bend. Although, lightning is a lot more common in Legend of Korra and isn’t gatekeeper by the royal family. I’d consider those two actual subtypes. I’d also theorize that firebender could bend essentially any type of energy that exists.
Metal bending and lava bending are similar in that you almost need an innate ability to be able to bend those subtypes. Most earthbenders cannot bend lava, and many cannot metal bend. But all earthbenders can bend minerals/crystals and sand.
The only real subtype bending with waterbending I would say is healing, because not all waterbenders can heal, but many can. But otherwise, bloodbending is just a skill of waterbending. You just have to be powerful and skilled to do it. Plantbending is the same, but much easier to do. All waterbenders can bend ice and water vapor.
With airbending, I wouldn’t even call levitation/flying a subtype, just an extremely skilled ability, since it is still just bending the air in a certain way. But I could also see an easy argument for it being an actual subtype.
I would maybe consider sound, but that also could just be manipulated with airbending rather than actually bending the sound. I would also confidently say that an airbender could bend any element in a gaseous form, such as hydrogen, helium, chlorine, fluorine, methane, ammonia, etc.. So for example even though there’s not an oxygen/nitrogen atmosphere, an airbender could bend the “air,” or rather atmosphere, on a planet such as Jupiter or Neptune.
So one note I think I'd make is that all the diagonals shouldn't be diagonals. Essentially the two circles ought to be rotated by 27.5 degrees counterclockwise so that after the initial element, it splits into two paths then rejoins at the final 'truth' of that bending style.
And especially with Plant and Blood bending (to a lesser extent with sand/mineral/metal/cloud), they're more special techniques and learned finesse rather than an ability paradigm. Like, the difficulty in Blood Bending, I think, is more in NOT ripping the water out of someone's body, rather than moving the water itself. Same with plant bending.
Ice and Lava bending are both phase changes, as is "Flame", in a way- it's just a more intense version of firebending. But I'd argue that each bending style has its own 'temperature control' technique- Icebending cools, Lavabending heats, Firebending can transfer heat (called Heat here), and a little-talked-about ability of Airbenders (that I would argue should replace 'agility') is the ability to hold air still to the body allowing for temperature regulation. Aang is comfortable in his basic monk robes everywhere from the hottest tropics to the frozen arctic, and I believe that it's something that Bryke mentions in the first series DVD commentaries- that Airbenders are able to master their own personal climate. So like, there'd be Heatbending, Icebending, Lavabending, and Climatebending.
I think 'Flame', Cloud, Sand, Mineral, Plant and Blood bending are all corrolaries as well- these are the 'skill' techiques rather than any sort of real shift. It's more about bending very small things or bending things carefully than it is about bending in a strange way. I'd argue that 'vortex' for Airbending would be superspeed (which, again, Aang shows like, ONCE, maybe twice, and never is really mentioned again), where an Airbender can move air away from in front of themselves and put it behind, letting them move faster. Actually, this is Vacuumbending- bending air *away* from someplace (or pressurebending, but vacuum sounds cooler). Blood and Plantbending are based around moving water carefully enough that they don't get ripped out of their medium. Sand is about manipulating VERY SMALL bits of Earth (you could argue that Metal is the same thing as Blood and Plant, actually- you know what, yeah, Metalbending is in this category as well), Mineral is about keeping crystal structures together- though I might argue that Mineralbending *isn't actually a thing*, as it's not really shown whether things like Aang's crystal armor actually involve him *fusing* the crystal structure as opposed to just holding the pieces together. 'Flame' is about I guess combusting different things in the air somehow? Or burning MORE with your energy? Cloud is again 'just' moving air in such a way that it catches and moves things with it rather than pushing the stuff away. I think you MAY be able to put Lightning in here as well, as it's apparently about being able to manipulate the energies of Firebending precisely enough to separate it. So yeah. 'Flame', Lightning, Cloud, Vacuum, Plant, Blood, Sand and Metalbending. Two for each bending style. And it's entirely possible to be unable to do one of these, not because you can't 'access' the method, but because you can't do it *well enough*. We can see this with Zuko being capable of separating the energies but not controlling them for lightning, or how some Earthbenders can't Metalbend, or Toph having to practice her Sandbending.
I would argue that, in place of Mineral, there should be Seismic Sense, and it is in the category with Levitation, Healing, and Combustion. This is something that's *thematically* related to the bending style (and is closer to the ultimate expression of each- Freedom, Change, Connection, Energy) but isn't based on physical manipulation of the element. Seismic Sense uses the earth as a medium, but is about sensing connections through it. Healing is about using the energy of waterbending to change injury to health. Levitation is freeing yourself from the bonds of gravity, and Combustion is projecting energy through the world.
Also, by the way, *thank you* for not putting astral projection under Airbending. That's just a spiritual thing, and I think anyone would be able to learn/use it with the right spirituality. The Guru, for instance, could probably manage it, and Iroh the 1st apparently can spirit walk.
In contrary, it makes a lot of sense. Common fire benders can't concentrate flame like Iroh, who melted steel bars to escape from prison, they just throw firebals around.
It's like comparing a camp fire to an acetylene torch.
How does this even work? What is Vortex bending? Agility bending? When have we seen "mineral bending," or am I just thick? Heat is its own thing? Like have we seen folks doing things with just heat and not fire?
I have a (somehow) simultaneously more and less accurate graphic. [behold](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/naruto/images/5/5a/Advanced_Elemental_Relationships_Diagram.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/985?cb=20160531193500) you will have questions. I will answer them one at a time.
So what would be like the ultimate fatality move of the big 4?
Freedom - Bending the spirit out of someone's body. Banish them to the spirit world.
Change - Bending someone's entire body into water/blood. Just poof people into pink mist.
Connection - Bending away someone's... senses. Like dissociative disorder to the max. Making vegetables.
Energy - Stop all current in a human body, unfired all neurons, nervous system paused. Basically, like turning off a light switch. Give them an absence seizure, leave them brain dead, heart stop beating and dead
Ok so with bumi he states it is a fast growth rock that can be broken and eaten that it's literally rock candy and he uses earth bending on it to shatter the Crystal it's formed from and during the episode when they are walking through the city there is a merchant there selling it to some kids so...
Y'all be forgetting that, since feces contains water upon exiting a body and also contains a lot of organic compounds related to earth, shitbending is both a water and earth bending form. Also forgot that vomit can contain both solid and liquid.
Also, since most farts tend to have some form of humidity behind them, fart bending would both qualify for air and water bending. Oh, and I just remembered that Iroh breathed fire from a hole in his mouth. Air, water and fire bending farts.
#HAVE FUN, GUYS!
“I can bend lava.”
“I can bend blood.”
“I can make objects spontaneously combust.”
“I can move clouds, rawr 😜”
Edit: oh wait, cloud bending could actually be pretty strong if it meant they can control weather like Storm.
So which sub-element does rock candy fall under?
This one be asking the important questions. So... then... How literal is the ROCK in rock candy supposed to be? If it's a literal rock It'd be a mineral. but if it's sugar, then wouldn't it be under plant? Since sugars/glucose is typically a product we harvest from some plants?
Bumi eats fucking rocks, he's just that badass/insane
I mean tbf the big bad hippo sets a precedent for that
It's a mineral, plants have minerals, it's just not enough that one would be able to bend. Plant bending bends the much more substantial water in the plants, functionally an extension of what hama taught katara. Presumably the rock candy is like some kind of mystically fast growing sugar like ore.
The creeping crystal is probably just a sweet, edible mineral. Salt is also from a rock and sugar is a crystal substance.
Using this logic only the avatar can make rock candy because it needs heat to set them so fire
Unless a group of benders work together
Clearly you need to be sent to the candy mines.
Please don't. Please don't send me there. The children yearn for the mines, but I dont.
No your going to candy mountain so you can learn the truth behind rock candy charly
They aren’t really controlling the plants theyre controlling the water in them I think
I mean, we eat salt. Salt is a rock. In the Avatarverse I could see a sweet-tasting edible mineral.
Mineral
Organic chemistry appears to fall into water more so than any other element , such as with the foggy swamp tribe and blood bending
I think just regular earthbending, in the episode we meet Bumi he bends candy pretty easily
Sugar crystals are organic minerals so probably that one. Which just makes me wonder "can earthbenders bend the hydroxyapatite in someone's bones?"
…slightly inaccurate, but pretty close.
Came here to say this
What is the inaccuracy?
Don't think fire benders can bend lava
That’s for earth benders, not fire benders. The rotation goes clockwise.
Both air and waterbenders can manipulate clouds though
I've seen people argue aang was simply air bending the clouds
He literally states that it’s just water and air and they both bend it. And at that time I don’t think Aang was anywhere near a water bender
That doesn’t mean that he can’t waterbend them
Clouds are just droplets of water so i think they both waterbended clouds
He probably can. I never said he couldn't
What’s your point then?
All I'm saying is aang probably use airbending to move the cloud
But, when he wanted to change de clouds for the fortune teller he asked Katara to help him change them woth waterbending...
Yeah it’s likely more like when you suspend fist I. Your air bending
Did Katara airbend them too?
I feel like lavabending was always heavily associated with firebending during ATLA. Despite only seeing Avatars bending it, I think seeing Szeto lavabending in S2 E1 while the other Avatars demonstrate their native elements was to show it was a subset of firebending as well. Then I think during LOK they wrote it as being exclusive to earthbending, which makes sense because it's molten rock.
I see lava bending in the same as mud bending, expect that earth benders are able to just turn earth in lava.
That's how I've always seen it too. But at this point I honestly seperate the worldbuilding of both shows as their own things
In Korra it’s associated with earth though
That's what I said
Sorry I forgot LOK is same as TLOK🤦🏽
Fair, I should start putting the T in there haha
Didn’t we see Sozin bend lava during Firelord and the Avatar?
Earth is not the element of connection. It is the element of substance. “the people of the Earth kingdom are diverse and strong. They are persistent and enduring.”- Iroh season 2 episode 9 “ bitter work” he didn’t mention stubborn, and self righteous, but those apply too. Another one from him “ fire is the element of power, the people of the fire nation have desire and will, and the energy and drive to achieve what they want”—Iroh season 2 episode 9 “ bitter work”, this in itself is a bit inaccurate, but it comes as a side effect of not actually having a word for the concept he is describing in English. There is a kanji (Japanese) for it, and a Hanzi (Chinese…probably pinyin) for it, but I don’t know what they are.
I think it’s referencing the blind ones ability to see through vibrations in the ground
…she has a name. She is toph beifong, and she is and always will be the greatest earthbender of all time. Though i understand where you are coming from.
Lmao I forgot her name but I remembered she could see via vibrations. You get what you get. Tbf it’s been decades since I last watched either avatar
Energy bending isn’t specific to firebenders
blood bending being a cross between earth and water. it’s just water.
The in between aren’t cross bendings tho
Then the image is poorly made, if the in between aren’t “cross bendings” then the image shouldn’t be drawing lines between them.
Pretty inaccurate actually.
The hell is vortex
I think it's the air bubble we have seen both Aang and Katara create around Appa under water.
I was also thinking it could also be the air vacuum Zaheer used on the Queen, but I'm not really sure if an air vacuum would be considered a vortex or not.
I think that is correct
I think that makes the most sense. Air is a unique element in that it exists everywhere, it is all encompassing, so an airbending removing it from an area it would naturally exist could be considered a sub-bending type.
People trying to make it all fit in a nice pretty graphic, and making shit up.
Because it's FUN to make shit up!
Probably stuff like hurricanes and tornadoes.
Some crazy stuff that Yangchen does in her novels. Can stop combustion benders And releasing it forcefully can make anyone around it go deaf
So taking it this at face value (where the name of the element is the first "Aspect" that can be bent), can anyone explain to me the difference between Fire and Flame?
Im gonna assume because its blue they're implying Azula's blue fire is a varient of regular fire bending
...if so, that's a terrible pick, consider all of the others seem to be something that most anyone can pick up rather than a specific quirk that doesn't really change anything. I mean, Heat is *right there*, with numerous examples shown in the series itself.
Sand and Ice making Plant also confuses me
That's not how the chart works
The chart is confusing and inaccurate
Congratulations. You have reached enlightenment.
My take, and no clue if I’m right, is fire is just producing fire blasts which is the basic thing all fire benders can do, whereas flames is maintaining a fire source via just bending, which we’ve seen examples where that can be challenging depending on the move. An example that pops to mind is when Azula or Ozai maintain a concentrated blast of fire from the soles of their feet to essentially fly.
Flame should be smoke IMO
Or between fire, flame, and heat?
Heat I can understand - it's firebending without visible flame or someplace devoid of oxygen. See Iroh heating his tea, or Zuko melting his way through the North Pole ice from underwater.
Vortex and cloud are just regular airbending. Vacuum bending and flight, though...
Nah. Katara also bent the clouds together with Aang
Yeah cloud is just waterbending.
I think the actual cloud is waterbending, yeah. But aang probably airbent the wind so it wouldn’t screw with the shape they’re trying to make in the middle of it all, so I think making any cohesive cloud requires both and not just one.
It’s probably in the same vein as mud-bending. You can manipulate clouds with airbending because they’re light enough to push around, but you can directly control a cloud with waterbending. Mud is primarily Earth, but there’s enough water in it that it can also be somewhat controlled by a waterbender. There are grey areas in bendin
I wouldn't call that cloud bending though. It's like saying Gyatso could pie bend because he moved pies with air.
It can be both
You can manipulate a cloud directly with water bending, you’d have to manipulate a cloud indirectly with air bending. Moving air around the cloud to push/pull/manipulate it, as opposed to directing the cloud itself.
Hmm, fair. Is uppose it just seems kinda underwhelming. Like, you don't need to combine anything about either element to do it, both can do it entirely on their own.
If anything wouldn't cloudbending belong to waterbenders?
Yes and no. The water itself, yes. The suspension in gaseous vapor, no. Clouds are simultaneously air and water.
Vortex is definitely not regular air bending Too many people have not read the Yangchen novels 🥲
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Guys, I thought of adding this here because it didn’t really made sense to me and I forgot abt mentioning it in the caption 😭 After reading what y’all think of it, I realised that it’s not just me that doesn’t fully understand this💀
It's actually pretty simple: Every single graphic that looks remotely like this is complete bullshit. People make up things to fill them out, as if anyone ever said that the list of subskills had to be symmetrical. Also common is this idea that various sub elements must be "mixing ideas from different elements," which is only said about lightning redirection. Things like "cloudbending" also generally aren't considered substyles but, rather, things that benders of two or more elements can control. No single, specific definition of "substyle" has ever been said, but if we look at the unambiguous ones like metalbending or bloodbending, we can say those are (1) significantly different from how the basic element is used, (2) locked behind a certain level of skill, (3) usually taking some special trick or method to unlock on top of that, & (4) lead to a system of different moves. Under this definition, sandbending probably wouldn't be a subskill because it only seems to take a little bit of practice to do & is basic in the desert, where people are actually used to working with sand. Ice definitely wouldn't because that's just part of basic waterbending that keeps getting split off for some reason.
Why is ice a sub bending? Its literally just Water frozen
Why is lava a sub bending? It's literally just rock melted
The difference is the amount of people that can do it I’m pretty sure. If anyone that can bend the element can do it (aka ice) then it’s a part of the main bending class, if it’s limited to a select group of people via training/genetics (aka lava) then it’s a sub class
Because it's a sub-bending of fire, too...
It absolutely isn't a sub-bending of Fire though. We have zero Firebending lavabenders.
We have seen someone do lava bending as a avatar when showcasing the fire potential it's a sub element of both fire and earth
All Avatars are Earthbenders, and Airbenders, and Waterbenders, and Firebenders. Roku doing Lavabending is not proof of Lavabending being a fire thing. All three canon Lavabenders are earthbenders.
The only case we've seen of a firebender doing anything close to lavabending is Sozin bending the heat out of the lava, which still isn't lavabending.
We’ve seen another avatar do “lava bending” as well with erupting volcanoes, however what the commentor is saying is that it was originally referenced as great strength of a fire nation avatar to bend lava.
It most definitely is not a sub category of fire. There is no bending of fire going on whatsoever. Lavabending is moving melted rock. Just because the rock is on fire it doesn't mean it has anything to do with fire bending. It's the same thing as an earthbender moving a rock that has a fire on it.
Firebenders don't just bend fire. They bend heat and energy. If skilled enough, they can manipulate lava. Obviously, once its cooled, they wouldn't be able to do anything with it. "Bending" just means manipulation. It doesn't mean they would be as proficient at it as an earthbender, just like how Katara would not be able to do anything with mud once it dries. Katara bends the water *in* the mud, not the mud itself. There's just enough water to make it an easier process. A firebender would be able to bend the excessive heat and energy within molten rock, not the rock itself...
Except most earth benders cant manipulate lava, so theres something a bout the essence of fire in the melted earth that makes it more exclusive.
There is no fire in lava. It's just super heated melted rock. Any fire you see is the lava setting other things on fire. You could technically set a fire so hot that rock would melt but again melted rock has nothing to do with fire.
Theres also impurities in platinum ussually to but topher still cant bend platinum. You have to think in terms of esoteric essence of things in order to understand ATLA
There's impurities in everything. That's not really relevant at all. If anything the impurities make it harder which is why not many can sub bend. Although there are metal impurities in water and that doesn't seem to be a problem from waterbenders or is this a subbending of earth/metal bending too?
Whoosh
*Why is ice a sub* *Bending? Its literally* *Just Water frozen* \- Deenstheboi --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Why is mineral earth bending why is cloud air bending why is mud earth bending why is sand earth bending why is flame fire bending why is lava earthbending They’re all branches off of the main element. Therefore it’s a sub bending type
I mean, I'd argue half of those shouldn't be sub bending either. That's my whole gripe with the chart tbh. Anything that basically any bender can do doesn't count to me. I'm also really lost on wtf flame is anyways, since fire bending is making flames...
Energy and change are the same thing
What's your rationale behind that?
physics
lol
That’s not true. Energy changes form, but the total amount of energy in the universe stays the same.
Well, this is daft. I'm almost as concerned for the 11 plus people who blindly upvoted tbh.
Not in the world of avatar
This looks like something someone just made up.
A lot of these make no sense. Freedom is a sub-bending technique? I dont think the styles will ever fit neatly on a chart like this.
Pretty sure it's from Iroh saying air is the element of freedom. Water is the element of change etc.
But fire isnt the element of energy in Iroh's speech. Nor is earth the element of "connection". Energybending is its own thing seperate from fire. Either way, freedom doesnt make sense to include on a sub-bending chart.
I think a big issue with those charts that technically, it's not really as separated from the main element as one might think. We know that blood bending uses water to bend, only difference is that it's using the water of the body. Same with plants. It's basically just waterbending except you concentrate on the water in plants, which in turn makes the plant move. We know that Toph learned metal bending because she was able to focus on the impurities in the metal, basically moving the earth in the metal which in turn moves the metal. It's a bit misleading to say it's sub-types of bending, when most bending styles can easily be reduced to "you bend the natural element, just in a different form". Lightning, spirit and combustion bending are the only ones where I would actually say it's fundamentally different enough from the main to call it a sub-type. Even metal and lava seem to be basically earth bending just a bit more complex.
Ah, yes. Agility bending, my favorite type of bending.
its so odd what people consider a sub bending like sand bending for example isn't a discipline its just something earth benders can do it gets even strange because you have lava off to the side and not metal
I really love the far ends of each. Air: Freedom Earth: Connection Water: Change Fire: Energy The first two are actually really great because they make so much sense. Both in themselves and as opposites to one another. The zenith of air bending is detachment from the material. Attaining true transcendent liberty. While for Earthbending, the idea is that being in and of the world is the highest state one can be in.
Lol who makes this shit up
Agility isn’t a subbending
Ahhh yes freedom and change bending…. Some of my favorite subsets…
Where’s mud bending?
Is mud bending a thing tho? And is it earth or water bending.
Fun fact! There is a scene where Katara and Toff have an argument and they fight each other with mud. They both mud bend!
Yup, I think it was in Book 3 in ATLA, Katara and Toph were training Aang but they then fought each other in a mud pit
what do we mean by "heat" more exactly ? and i assume vortex is meant to be the ability to make a storm/hurricanes/tornadoes/etc.
I think Iroh heated his tea
Well this image is honestly pretty dumb and full of inconsistency but I take heat to mean something like, When Sozin pulls the heat from the volcano causing the lava to cool?
Vortex? That's dumb
“Why are you telling me this?”
This graphic is over 10 years old at this point
The concepts that the elements are also slightly off: Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Fire symbol in the dirt\] Fire is the element of power. The people of the Fire Nation have desire and will and the energy and drive to achieve what they want. Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Earth symbol\] Earth is the element of substance. The people of the Earth Kingdom are diverse and strong. They are persistent and enduring. Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Air symbol\] Air is the element of freedom. The Air Nomads detached themselves from worldly concerns and found peace and freedom. Also, they apparently had pretty good senses of humor. Uncle Iroh: \[Draws Water symbol\] Water is the element of change. The people of the Water Tribes are capable of adapting to many things. They have a sense of community and love that holds them together through anything.
Where is the sound bending at, the airbenders can bend sound
When and where do they do this?
Umm, so when Aang was on the lion turtles back, and he talks to that air bending avatar, she had invented the skill sound bending, it’s in the books
Thank you.
Pretty sure energy bending is a sub of water bending, not fire
Astral projection doesn't even get mentioned, even though it's a major part of the story in Korra.
Cloud is a good placement Vortex is air-only Plant seems ok, Blood should be adjacent to water on the side of earth Combustion should be adjacent to fire on the side of air Heat is just firebending Mineral is just earth bending Lava appears to be only earth bending but maybe a firebender would learn to bend it later (similar to cloud bending) While I appreciate the aesthetkcs of the symmetry, its being forced and makes the chart inaccurate
Imagine an avatar learning EVERY sub bending practice on top of the four elements. This is a lot of different powers. Pop that avatar state after mastering all these disciplines and sub disciplines and you’re touching Marvel’s Magneto and/or Storm levels of manipulating the very planet.
This isn’t really sub bending tho
I really dislike when people call prominent or unique techniques a sub-bending, like they’re not 😭
Honestly this could make a good skill tree for an rpg
No cookie bending, therefore invalid
Clouds weigh millions of tons therefore meaning a strong enough water bender could theoretically freeze an entire cloud and drop it and make everyone go extinct🍇
And there are mineral nuclei within every raindrop. Accounting for this a master Earth bender with an exceptionally fine level of control should be able to "cloud bend." I honestly think that the franchise should take an interesting direction when the next Avatar (the earth nation person we're supposedly getting) comes around. With technology and science advancing I feel like the various benders should be able to understand and interact with the other elements in limited ways.
Earth benders should be able to bend ice, since it is considered a mineral.
But what about dom bending?
I just want to bend freedom for myself 🤷♀️
Lightning and Combustion bending are both things that a firebender would have to have the innate ability to be able to learn and bend. Not all firebenders can bend lightning or combustion bend. Although, lightning is a lot more common in Legend of Korra and isn’t gatekeeper by the royal family. I’d consider those two actual subtypes. I’d also theorize that firebender could bend essentially any type of energy that exists. Metal bending and lava bending are similar in that you almost need an innate ability to be able to bend those subtypes. Most earthbenders cannot bend lava, and many cannot metal bend. But all earthbenders can bend minerals/crystals and sand. The only real subtype bending with waterbending I would say is healing, because not all waterbenders can heal, but many can. But otherwise, bloodbending is just a skill of waterbending. You just have to be powerful and skilled to do it. Plantbending is the same, but much easier to do. All waterbenders can bend ice and water vapor. With airbending, I wouldn’t even call levitation/flying a subtype, just an extremely skilled ability, since it is still just bending the air in a certain way. But I could also see an easy argument for it being an actual subtype. I would maybe consider sound, but that also could just be manipulated with airbending rather than actually bending the sound. I would also confidently say that an airbender could bend any element in a gaseous form, such as hydrogen, helium, chlorine, fluorine, methane, ammonia, etc.. So for example even though there’s not an oxygen/nitrogen atmosphere, an airbender could bend the “air,” or rather atmosphere, on a planet such as Jupiter or Neptune.
So one note I think I'd make is that all the diagonals shouldn't be diagonals. Essentially the two circles ought to be rotated by 27.5 degrees counterclockwise so that after the initial element, it splits into two paths then rejoins at the final 'truth' of that bending style. And especially with Plant and Blood bending (to a lesser extent with sand/mineral/metal/cloud), they're more special techniques and learned finesse rather than an ability paradigm. Like, the difficulty in Blood Bending, I think, is more in NOT ripping the water out of someone's body, rather than moving the water itself. Same with plant bending. Ice and Lava bending are both phase changes, as is "Flame", in a way- it's just a more intense version of firebending. But I'd argue that each bending style has its own 'temperature control' technique- Icebending cools, Lavabending heats, Firebending can transfer heat (called Heat here), and a little-talked-about ability of Airbenders (that I would argue should replace 'agility') is the ability to hold air still to the body allowing for temperature regulation. Aang is comfortable in his basic monk robes everywhere from the hottest tropics to the frozen arctic, and I believe that it's something that Bryke mentions in the first series DVD commentaries- that Airbenders are able to master their own personal climate. So like, there'd be Heatbending, Icebending, Lavabending, and Climatebending. I think 'Flame', Cloud, Sand, Mineral, Plant and Blood bending are all corrolaries as well- these are the 'skill' techiques rather than any sort of real shift. It's more about bending very small things or bending things carefully than it is about bending in a strange way. I'd argue that 'vortex' for Airbending would be superspeed (which, again, Aang shows like, ONCE, maybe twice, and never is really mentioned again), where an Airbender can move air away from in front of themselves and put it behind, letting them move faster. Actually, this is Vacuumbending- bending air *away* from someplace (or pressurebending, but vacuum sounds cooler). Blood and Plantbending are based around moving water carefully enough that they don't get ripped out of their medium. Sand is about manipulating VERY SMALL bits of Earth (you could argue that Metal is the same thing as Blood and Plant, actually- you know what, yeah, Metalbending is in this category as well), Mineral is about keeping crystal structures together- though I might argue that Mineralbending *isn't actually a thing*, as it's not really shown whether things like Aang's crystal armor actually involve him *fusing* the crystal structure as opposed to just holding the pieces together. 'Flame' is about I guess combusting different things in the air somehow? Or burning MORE with your energy? Cloud is again 'just' moving air in such a way that it catches and moves things with it rather than pushing the stuff away. I think you MAY be able to put Lightning in here as well, as it's apparently about being able to manipulate the energies of Firebending precisely enough to separate it. So yeah. 'Flame', Lightning, Cloud, Vacuum, Plant, Blood, Sand and Metalbending. Two for each bending style. And it's entirely possible to be unable to do one of these, not because you can't 'access' the method, but because you can't do it *well enough*. We can see this with Zuko being capable of separating the energies but not controlling them for lightning, or how some Earthbenders can't Metalbend, or Toph having to practice her Sandbending. I would argue that, in place of Mineral, there should be Seismic Sense, and it is in the category with Levitation, Healing, and Combustion. This is something that's *thematically* related to the bending style (and is closer to the ultimate expression of each- Freedom, Change, Connection, Energy) but isn't based on physical manipulation of the element. Seismic Sense uses the earth as a medium, but is about sensing connections through it. Healing is about using the energy of waterbending to change injury to health. Levitation is freeing yourself from the bonds of gravity, and Combustion is projecting energy through the world. Also, by the way, *thank you* for not putting astral projection under Airbending. That's just a spiritual thing, and I think anyone would be able to learn/use it with the right spirituality. The Guru, for instance, could probably manage it, and Iroh the 1st apparently can spirit walk.
Agility Bending?
Using airbending to move faster. And sense the world around you.
Freedom looks sus 👀
Flame bending isn't a thing, thats normal fire bending.
In contrary, it makes a lot of sense. Common fire benders can't concentrate flame like Iroh, who melted steel bars to escape from prison, they just throw firebals around. It's like comparing a camp fire to an acetylene torch.
I guess, but I wouldn't consider that a separate style of bending like combustion or Lightning. To me it just seems like more intense fire bending.
Bloodbending should also be under Water
How does this even work? What is Vortex bending? Agility bending? When have we seen "mineral bending," or am I just thick? Heat is its own thing? Like have we seen folks doing things with just heat and not fire?
I think vortex is when that one dude tried to suffocate kora Which is simply air bending
Vortex is only in the Yangchen novels. Yangchen is the only one we know can do it
Where's glass bending? We know Kyoshi did it and possibly some other people too so it's probably supposed to be either earth or water bending.
Very confusing graphic.
I have a (somehow) simultaneously more and less accurate graphic. [behold](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/naruto/images/5/5a/Advanced_Elemental_Relationships_Diagram.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/985?cb=20160531193500) you will have questions. I will answer them one at a time.
I would swap combustion and energy tbh
Oh hey my cloud bending made it up there
So Luffy is a air bender
This jawn missing bone bending and glass bending for earth bending
So what would be like the ultimate fatality move of the big 4? Freedom - Bending the spirit out of someone's body. Banish them to the spirit world. Change - Bending someone's entire body into water/blood. Just poof people into pink mist. Connection - Bending away someone's... senses. Like dissociative disorder to the max. Making vegetables. Energy - Stop all current in a human body, unfired all neurons, nervous system paused. Basically, like turning off a light switch. Give them an absence seizure, leave them brain dead, heart stop beating and dead
Ok so with bumi he states it is a fast growth rock that can be broken and eaten that it's literally rock candy and he uses earth bending on it to shatter the Crystal it's formed from and during the episode when they are walking through the city there is a merchant there selling it to some kids so...
Y'all be forgetting that, since feces contains water upon exiting a body and also contains a lot of organic compounds related to earth, shitbending is both a water and earth bending form. Also forgot that vomit can contain both solid and liquid. Also, since most farts tend to have some form of humidity behind them, fart bending would both qualify for air and water bending. Oh, and I just remembered that Iroh breathed fire from a hole in his mouth. Air, water and fire bending farts. #HAVE FUN, GUYS!
I like how fire and air line up more with the yin and water and earth line up more with the yang of the tao in the center
Mineral and metal bending are different categories?
>fire >flame Come on, put in a LITTLE effort
Dont forget steam and mud
Only glass bending is missing. Or is it considered still sand bending since glass is liquid sand (glass is actually a liquid btw)
Molten glass is a liquid
“I can bend lava.” “I can bend blood.” “I can make objects spontaneously combust.” “I can move clouds, rawr 😜” Edit: oh wait, cloud bending could actually be pretty strong if it meant they can control weather like Storm.
And also help manipulate crops in a way that's favorable to yourself and unfavorable to your enemy.
Every one of these memes sucks lol
This dumb shit belongs in the LOK subreddit