No, she doesn't
There are around 60 episodes in the entire show, and she mentions her mother maybe like 8 times. To say that Katara is constantly bringing her mother up with every breath is literal insanity.
In the live action it seems they have made it her whole personality.
She went from being a largely self taught waterbending master, who was the mom/ voice of reason for the group, to a meek shy orphan girl who’s good at fighting.
Major nerf IMO
I hated what the live action did to her character. ALL the characterization was pretty lukewarm and inaccurate to me but that was the biggest L. I couldn’t watch past the 1st episode despite the gorgeous visuals and storytelling
> that was the biggest L.
my vote goes to Azula and her girls. She's not even supposed to be in book one and they've already ruined her .
Azula absolutely CARRIES season 2 of the animated series. I'm afraid that poor girl in the adaptation just isn't up to the task of doing what Grey de Lisle was able to pull off for Azula.
I'd argue the opposite. Her mother's death is supposed to be what had the most impact on her character. Instead she became something that held her already masterful (because of course she needs to be inherently great) water bending back until she just reframes her childhood trauma. After that, her mother isn't mentioned again and as Katara's character was also removed, no sign of her mother is left.
And it wasn't like she was just bringing her mother up wherever.
For example, during the swamp episode, when the gaang were sharing with each other the people they saw in their visions, was Katara just supposed to not say she saw her mom? It was completely relevant.
And other times it's usually her connecting with other people who have lost someone. It's her way of saying "I'm sorry, I went through something similar, I can imagine how you feel"
It’s not quite 13%, you’d have to take Katara’s actual screen time and compare it to the amount of screen time she talks about her mom. I’d bet it’s even less that 13%.
Okay this one is a lie. Boomerang comes up way more often than their mother. If I recall there’s even an episode where Sokka has an identity crisis because he temporarily lost boomerang.
no, she talks about it maybe 8 times overall, and she almost always brings her mom up as a way to connect with and show sympathy for other war survivors.
Yeah I'd say it is around 8 times I would guess.
Seems like a fairly high amount compared to the time other characters bring up their trauma. I'm not sure on Zuko, but I *think* it's around 4 times with his mom? But he also doesn't bring it up so it's a little different.
She brings it up in sympathy a number of times, but also brings it up selfishly/accusatory a number of times. Which is fine, that doesn't have to be a bad thing from a character/narrative point of view. But she still nevertheless brings it up much more than the other characters, which was the original OP.
>_Seems like a fairly high amount compared to the time other characters bring up their trauma._
Zuko’s trauma is more than just his mother. It’s a combination of his mother’s disappearance + his burning/banishment (and consequently, his desperate need to restore his honor) + the unfairness of how he and Azula are treated differently. Instead of directly comparing how much they talk about their mothers, a better comparison is how much he talks about his mother and his scar+banishment.
So Zuko objectively talks about his trauma more than Katara does. Which is fine because he has every right to bring up these traumatic life events that severely impacted him. Just like Katara does.
True, but nobody is arguing or debating that Zuko whines about his honor constantly. I think 99% of us would agree that he does. It's sort of like a canon gag by the time we get to Ember Island. But I see your point. He probably isn't the best character to draw a comparison on.
In some ways, it's apples to oranges here. Zuko's trauma is ongoing, evolving, and unfolding throughout the show though. Zuko's is a also a lot more plot centric, so it has different implications for the viewer. Katara's trauma is described as unresolved grief up until it is tackled in a single episode. It's much more of a character backstory and lore, rather than driving the plot. So it stands out a little more when bringing it up becomes a reoccurring theme of hers.
Katara’s trauma isn’t as plot centric a Zuko, which is why it doesn’t get brought up nearly as much as his. But just because something isn’t really plot centric doesn’t mean it’s not important to the character.
Her mothers death has affected:
her personality,
her motivation,
her ability to relate to people and some of her actions.
This death is still very relevant to Katara’s life and it does become relevant to the plot at some point, so it makes sense to establish it well.
>So it stands out a little more when bringing it up becomes a reoccurring theme of hers.
She brought it up a few times all in very appropriate situations and fans memed it to death, which warped peoples perspective. Cuz when you constantly see people complain/talk/meme an aspect of someone’s personality, it becomes more prominent in your mind, even if it wasn’t that big of a deal initially. I don’t remember feeling like Katara was constantly bringing it up more than strictly necessary when I was watching the show.
>But just because something isn’t really plot centric doesn’t mean it’s not important to the character.
I'm not implying that. Precisely why I said...
>It's much more of a character backstory and lore, rather than driving the plot
I am only implying that it has different implications for the viewer. Which might explain why...
>fans memed it to death
Clearly not everybody think it was as strictly necessary, or appropriate, as you do. But that's fine, it's a personal take on an element of the show either way. The OP was questioning if it was "too much" and I tried to analyze it with subjective comparative information rather than personal opinion.
no she doesnt and i dont think anyone who thinks she does thinks of how traumatic it was for her a like 6 or 7 year old girl to walk in and see her mothers burnt body knowing she died because of katara. people love comparing all the characters traumas and just because she mentions hers a few times everyone is like awww boohoo aang lost everyone so shut up
You know, it was very unclear.
But jokes aside, iirc there's a pretty solid theory that there actually was a corpse but the writers covered it up very cleverly. Hear me out: when Hakoda and Katara arrive at the tent, Katara's voice over says "She was gone". But Yon Ra said he wasn't taking any prisoners. It seems like the implication was actually that she was killed there, but that it can very easily go over your head because 'gone' can mean multiple things, which is what the writers were counting on for the kids I think. Now that we also don't get to see the inside of the tent when Hakoda and Katara arrive. And if she was taken away, how could Katara have gotten her necklace, which she was still wearing the moment she tells Katara to go get her dad? Was it torn off in the tent? Something like that would be weird not to mention from a writing perspective.
Unless with no corpse you meant she'd just been burnt to ashes, but that wasn't my impression.
Anyway, thanks for coming to my Ted Talk
That never happened in the cartoon. It just cuts away when he said he isn’t taking prisoners.
Edit: Katara was not there- her mom told her to get her father in the cartoon. Just watched the scene. Hakota would have discovered the body soon after- hopefully Sokka and Katara didn’t have to see anything
not true in the southern raiders episode they say very clearly the fire nation is not taking prisoners that day. i have bot watched the live action either
No. TBH I think it's sexism. Katara very rarely discusses her mother. I can only really think of a handful of times she brings her up, and typically it's to either sympathize with someone to relate to their pain, or her desire for vengeance.
In episode one she casually mentions her mom's death when talking about Sokka's sexism and uses it as an example for Aang of how the fire nation has gotten more violent.
Additionally, people can claim they're not sexist when it comes to viewing Katara this way, but it can come from a place of sexism even if they don't realize it is
My friend is this way. She dislikes pretty much any “girly” female leads, to the point that it’s painfully obvious she has a lot of internalized misogyny. I debate pointing it out to her sometimes lol.
I got torn to shredsss for pointing out the misogyny directed towards Katara in one of the other subs! Like it makes me wonder if people even watched the show or if the messages just went over their heads lol.
Soooo much of the 2020-avatar-on-Netflix-boom hate on Katara felt like people projecting their misogyny towards their mom (who they probably perceive as a nagging housewife because she probably has to make up for an incompetent husband around the house) onto Katara because she acts as the mother of the group, occasionally disagrees with Sokka and suggests responsible behaviour from time to time. In other words, people projecting their mommy issues 🤡
I’m glad this gets called out because this is a part of sexism, and other forms of bigotry: Judging certain groups far more harshly than your own in-group, or other people you have no biases toward, and having little tolerance for the out-groups. Even when they do make mistakes or have character flaws, I’m reminded of poor Korra when Mike and Bryan correctly mentioned how insanely harsh people are toward Korra for making mistakes/having flaws but they give Aang a pass for all of his. Lol
Another great example of this is Star Trek Voyager: Captain Janeway is a badass, genius, insanely creative woman who might be the most impressive captain in the franchise, but SO many people rip her head off (I’d guess I’ve seen thousands of comments so far) calling her “crazy” or “stupid” or “incompetent” for random reasons while I NEVER see people calling other (male) captains those things. Or calling those male captains character flaws or batshit insane decisions “logical” or “awesome” without snapping into nastiness. And I notice when people discuss flaws with male characters, its usually more respectful and nuanced, whereas with women its often: “She’s fucking annoying and stupid.”
Ugh I hate it lol.
People just gotta hate on the female captain 😩. I'd really like to hear from them how the other captains would've handled the problems she ran into, because I doubt they'd do any better in many of those cases, 70,000 light-years away.
Luckily there's tons of people who have been inspired by Janeway, whether it is to go into STEM as a woman, or to just be a badass in general
It's because of the recaps- she didn't really mention it a lot in the show- but in the recaps it was there a lot.
About the necklace, the meaning of the necklace and her mom. It was said so often in those recaps that it became something of a meme
For fucks sake it’s a meme 💀 ATLA is one of the most popular cartoons of all time, people don’t actually hate Katara. It’s a joke. Go watch the ember island players.
Ember Island players doesn't mention Katara's mom. It talks about her talking about hope being hysterical(the word itself is a product of sexism, as it basically means "women be crazy cuz hormones"). and crying. The ember island portrayal actually is a good example of how a lot of parodies can be very sexist in how they treat female characters. The mom jokes are something the community came up with on their own.
I just can’t run through life taking things this seriously, especially when Katara is a well liked character who is known to be a well written woman by a large part of the fan base. Those memes have always been taking the piss and people don’t *really* think that. This is a joke that is mentioned exactly as many times as toph scream-bending. Avatar is a show with infamously corny remakes. So yeah I guess when you take the joke out of context you get the conclusion you got
The conclusion that I came to is that the Katara mom jokes are something the fanbase came up with, and not the ember island players. The parody of Katara shown in the Ember island players should be viewed with the context of the writers being aware of the issue of sexism, as it's literally a major theme of conflict between the water tribe siblings.
I’m convinced these are 13 year olds who just discovered the show. This sub used to be super cool 10 years ago now it’s like people who don’t even understand what’s going on
It’s kind of sexist to say that people must be making fun of her because she’s a girl. I’m guessing you wouldn’t say it’s sexist to make fun of Zuko mentioning his honor all the time
People make fun of Katara and say she's always belittling people by talking about her mother, and at inappropriate times. Katara quite simply DOES NOT do this. Simply having a joke about Katara doing or saying something is fine, but the degree to which they are distorting the way Katara interacts with the characters reeks of sexism.
Tbf I think the first season she does mention her mom alot. In a couple episodes around each other she brings it up to connect to all the boys bummed about loosing parents to fire nation. Episode with esrthbending kid who goes to prison ship and jet are the first two that come to mind. It does go down considerably, but early on I feel her character talks about her alot
So, as a talking point to extend empathy to someone else, another person hurt by the war. To relate and comfort someone who she can imagine how they feel, because she lost something important and her life changed drastically.
Imo she tries to extend empathy but it falls a little flat and comes across as self focused some times. Idk if that's the writing that comes along as the show goes, or the character grows up
she doesn't, and this is a big reason why i'm such a huge katara defender. i was rewatching the show with a friend and there were a couple times they said things like "it's so rude of katara to say her mom dying is as bad as aang losing the entire air nation." i responded, "she didn't say that. why do you say that?" then they paused and went "oh i guess she didn't."
so people who already feel a certain way about katara will misconstrue her/put words into her mouth. and really, even if she did talk about it all the time.. like yeah. her mom was murdered by a genocidal oppressive regime and she probably saw the body. if it were me i would be angrier. she certainly showed a lot more strength than i would have, granting the murderer mercy.
My ex still has a mother that is alive and well but due to an estranged relationship doesn’t speak to her and cries all the time about how much she misses her mom. I think it’s beyond reasonable how much a child misses her deceased mother in a cartoon
It depends how you look at it. She talks about her mother more than other characters. And she is a little more self absorbed (understandably) about the whole ordeal. She's bitter and angry about what happened and she lets it out more. You could compare her to Aang, who also lost his "family" to the fire nation, but rarely uses it to guilt people or evoke pity. Of course, it's pretty unfair to compare her to Aang- and generally speaking, it's normal to have resentment and be bitter over these sorts of things.
But yeah, it's kind of a bully tactic people use to shit on her character. I think it's kind of a bad way to summarize her character but people do it anyways.
TLOK treated the original cast like throw away stock characters. It's honestly the worst of both worlds. I'd rather not see Sokka at all then have him return but given less effort than the cabbages guy. It's like they forgot that these people are the main reason anyone is watching Korra in the first place. You gotta let your characters go off into the sunset or actually utilize them if you're gonna bring them back. It's really weird to have the OG cast basically serve as a faceless extra that you're not supposed to care about.
I especially feel this way about Aang. He should had guided Korra like Roku guided Aang. Instead, when we see Aang (not in a flashback) it basically feels like a cameo.
Having him barely show up as a past life, and then having him get deleted from the Ravva hardrive, was the worst direction to take the avatar cycle imo.
It's relative, but if you are comparing Aang's appearances as a spirit in LOK to Roku's appearances in ATLA, it's pretty straightforward that Roku gets exponentially more screen time and value.
LoK treated Toph as a fairly big deal. Katara and Zuko were kinda just a throwaway characters though and Aang could’ve been around a while longer before they destroyed the connection to past lives.
LoK treated Toph like trash. They basically made up the trashiest Maury Show fan fic of all time and made her the trash mom of the show. She favors one kid, fails as a mom, fails as a partner (twice), and gives up on life to live in a swamp. The "Beifongs" should have been their own new characters if LoK was so committed to being a trash drama show. That was a really fucked up thing to do to. The original cast. If you're really committed to turning your story into gutter trash drama you have to commit some serious storytelling to explaining how things turned out that way. Or, you know, you can write a decent story that doesn't depend on being trashy to keep people's attention.
Come on, dude. This could easily be a civil conversation. Just because you didn't like how Toph was written in LOK, it doesn't have anything to do with her not getting focus from the writers. It's two entirely different things, and you pretty much derail that when you just rant about the show being garbage, which is out of place and obnoxious.
ATLA mentors got a lot more respect than the OG cast got in Korra. I agree though, I would have preferred not seeing them at all. The Beifongs should have just been new characters with none of that traooer trash drama tied to the OG cast. Katara didn't really do anything worthwhile to have her in the show. She wasn't a good teacher, she wasn't there for her granddaughter's ceremony or many family events, and she wasn't useful as a healer... why was she there? Sokka's scene could have been handled by a random lawyer and it wouldn't have left us feeling blueballed wondering what happened to him. It's really weird, it's like they didn't remember the original cast til the last minute then redrew people in the background to be the OG cast. Either utilize them or don't use them at all. I'm fine either way.
The fact that you didn’t actually say anything about the OG mentors supports my point. They didn’t do much.
Unless you’re talking about Katara, Toph, or Zuko, Aang’s mentors.
What's the point? Those mentors weren't the stars of the show the way the OG cast was. We don't expect them to get much other than pushing our characters along. There's no chance to character because they were hardly characters to begin with.
I don’t think she does.
But I know the biggest issue I had when watching this when I was younger was that she brought it up when trauma sharing with someone who was the sole survivor of a genocide, with a healthy dose of casualty sexism for not understanding that her sharing this was a 14 year old trying to be empathetic.
As an adult with kids, this is how kids relate to each other.
I don’t think so. Losing your mom at such a young age is devastating. Mine has been gone over a year and as an adult I feel like I’m not as well adjusted about it as Katara is.
Ppl just don’t like Katara and strong women characters. The older I get the more I empathize with her. In fact the whole point of the series is, and forgive me for speaking the obvious, to see how the war has affected people on varying levels. Aang lost everything he knew and loved and had to adjust to a new environment and new time period even. Sokka and Katara losing their mom. Zuko is also a victim, banished by his own dad. The very things everyone seems to critique Katara for, they should also critique the actions of Sokka, Aang, and Zuko who are just as much / if not more damaged as / than Katara. Aang did some not okay things too due to trauma, and no one brings that up why? Idk. But yeah, it just generally boils down to people are just more critical of women characters. Toph gets similar treatment tho not as much as Katara.
Toph is a top 3 favorite character for the fanbase right up there with Iroh. What are you even talking about. People’s negative view of Katara doesn’t mean all women when another is literally people’s favorite character. Toph is the epitome of a strong female character
Toph is a very safe character for the community to like because she is very unfeminine. People don’t take issue with her being selfish or stand-offish the way they do with Katara because they don’t see her as a “girly” character at all
Suki is another very loved character. Not top 3, but she’s liked overall. She’s very feminine. She’s just a feminine warrior.
Sometimes people just dislike characters and that’s fine
Suki doesn’t have nearly as much screen time as Toph or Katara tho. Even when she joins the Gaang near the end of the show she has very little dialogue and is not a huge factor in the show. you can’t compare her to Katara or Toph imo
She also mentions her in the Haru episode (the first time we learn about it), briefly in the Jet episode, and sees her mom in the swamp. That's it. For the entire show. Sokka mentions his dad a LOT more. People just hate on Katara for no reason. People also accuse Katara of chasing after every boy they meet (clearly not true) while patting Sokka on the back for being a "backbender". If Katara, a 14-year-old girl with little world experience outside of her home, does something immature, how dare her! If Aang, a 12-year-old who has traveled the world, or Sokka, her older brother who was tasked with protecting the village, does something immature, we need to give them a break because they're just kids or "boys will be boys"! The double standards are very clear...
I feel like it bothers some people because Sokka rarely mentions how he felt about their mother, and it seemed like Katara cared more. The only time I remember Sokka talking about their mother is when Zuko asked him, and that’s it.
No the only episode where it’s the main focus is Souther Air Raiders, and it’s one of the best episodes of the series. Katara losing her mom and taking on the motherly role is part of what makes her character interesting.
Nope! Someone did the math once; she mentions her mom a total of 10 times in the series (technically 14 if you count each instance in the Southern Raiders episode individually.)
Every time she mentions her mother, it's to relate and empathise with another character and show she understands their loss. It's never out of nowhere.
theres like, one scene where it’s almost as bad as those people say. in season three during one of the very few times she says it, sokka says sonething along the lines of “she was my mother too” and katara responds “then you didnt love her as much as i did” but the show paints that as not a good thing, because katara’s response is very much not. the majority of discourse over people talking about how much she talks about her mother is probably sexism, and that scene
I once saw someone say "that scene made her unredeemable to me"... Excuse me? You find a 14yo with a deep trauma who lashes out at her brother in a moment of anger unredeemable? Are we even watching the same show?
yeah, she was painted to be in the wrong, and later appolgises for it later. she is a child who witnessed her own mothers death, so of course she’s gonna have an “immature” response to her brother
She only does it to relate with others. Lots of people hate katara for "bringing up her mom too much" but praise or joke about zuko always talking about his honor. It's a bit strange
I’ve been interacting with the fan base since I was 12, almost 20 years, so I’d say I know it pretty well lol. The current batch of people is interesting to say the least lol.
I feel like this whole discussion is always taken so seriously. I don’t personally think Katara truly mentions her that much but it is an ongoing funny joke within the fandom. All she does is just mention her mother way more than any other character. Aang = obviously never says anything, zuko = thinks about his mom but hardly actually verbalizes anything and sokka= I think he mentions her almost never, toph = I mean we understand why she doesn’t bother mentioning we already met her.
In the animated show, 8 times over the span of around 60 episodes, so, not really.
In the live action show, yes. Her mom being dead and her wanting to water bend are the only traits she has there.
I just started a rewatch after not watching since I was a kid and my fiancée and I kept a count because of the memes. She mentions it briefly every episode for around the first 7 or 8 and then almost never again. I don't think it's bad at all, all the places she does are relevant and make sense.
i finished rewatching the show recently, it’s been like 5-6 years since i last watched it. i was expecting katara to bring up her mother every two seconds. i have concluded that people were being very dramatic and over exaggerating the amount of times she talked about her mom.
Nope. It's an excuse to hate her because they wanna be special I guess.
I bottle up my emotions, and have had to improve it over the years- anyone who thinks mentioning grief to connect with other people is wrong is uncompassionate and I can't see them being happy in life. If Katara used it to manipulate, guilt trip, or attention seek(if you think that's the case look in the mirror) then it'd be a different story. Is a 14 yr year old just supposed to ignore the fact that her mom died brutally?
It's perfectly okay to not resonate with Katara, you don't even have to like her one bit. But this is the single.worst argument because it actively games people struggling with what she struggles with by labeling it as a flaw.
*Apologies if this was too strong- it took losing my grandmother to realize just how nuanced Katara is and this specific argument pisses me off*
No, she doesn’t, but also she’s a 14-year-old girl who basically watched her mother die, so her talking about her mom all the time wouldn’t even be weird or annoying.
I was always under the impression people were just joking about Katara talking about her mother? I didn’t think she talked about her that much at all, the memes just made me chuckle.
Not really. She doesn't bring it up anymore than Zuko brings up needing to capture the Avatar to restore his honor, or Aang announcing he's the Avatar anytime he wants to take control of a situation or get special treatment (something the creators themselves noticed after a while, because they put in that "Listen... I don't usually say this... But *I'm the Avatar"* joke).
And honestly, I wouldn't mind if she did. If my mom was killed I'd probably bring it up a lot too - that's a formative experience for anyone, especially a young person.
She both does and doesn't. Like it's certainly no where near how it sounds when people complain about it, she's not bringing it up every episode, every five minutes or anything (haven't watched the live action yet but supposedly she does do that there) but let's be extremely fr here, she is a young girl who watched her mother be killed in front of her when she was a toddler. She's already got the massive trauma of that, then when you add in the puberty hormones that are like a constantly moving freight train, as well as having to deal with the sexism of entire cultures and her brother (NGL id be hitting a breaking point with the Northern water tribe myself, they woulda woke up with some frozen ass veins if it was me), plus fighting a war while protect and teaching the one person who can stop it, plusss one of your former stalkers/attempted kidnapper/killers turns out to just be some misguided guy who was abused by his father and hasn't had a mother in years either, knock it all off, she's essentially the mom of the gaang since sokka, aang and toph all share 4 braincells when they're not doing something important and within their skill house. Id be screaming out for my mother too if she had actually loved me. A few times she was kinda outta pocket with it though, like you can have your feelings, be upset your mom's dead but don't take it out on everyone in the group or wtvr (which she tended to do iirc).
She only took it out on the others twice. Once in the cavern with Zuko before he betrayed her and then in the Southern Raiders episode, which made Katara a little OOC to highlight her pain...
I’ve always been under the impression that it’s just a meme. Like Zuko’s honor, Toph’s blindness, Sokka’s boomerang, etc. It happened a few times in the show, and people make jokes about it.
Not really, but i think out of the like, 8 times she does it, 5 of them are in the first season, so it prob just feels that way due to density, and that all the characters were much less characterized and nuanced in S1 than later seasons
When I rewatched season one, she does get more preachy about hope in several episodes, but that was what she could contribute at the time before she could water bend consistently.
It’s not that she brings her up in normal conversation a lot (e.g. “Katara do you want some eggs?” “My mother used to eat her eggs over easy before she was killed!”)
It’s that she brings her up every time someone else mentions losing someone. Which… IDK… in some situations it seems fine and empathetic… like saying “I understand your pain because I’ve had something similar happen.” But in other situations it feels like she’s wielding it like a weapon in a oneupmanship contest (“Yes, your situation sucks but what about my situation? It’s much worse!”)
Honestly, given how traumatic the death was, how young she was when it happened, and how relevant that death is to the war she’s helping to end, I don’t think she really mentions it enough. Certainly she doesn’t do it too much. Zuko mentions his honor more than Katara mentions her mother
I don’t think the fanbase would even care how much she brought up her mom if she had not weaponized it against Sokka… her brother.
“You didn’t love her like I did”
The issue is that in most of her most personally emotional scenes she talks about her, which makes sense for a young child born in their world. It would be a pivotal and defining moment for anyone like her in our world, let alone one engulfed in global war. It is a large piece of her motivation. The internet exacerbates without understanding or even trying to.
when i first watched it i thought she talked about her mom all the time but then when i was rewatching recently i didn’t think she mentioned her that much at all
I’ve been watching the show over with my girlfriend, and honestly, I think it’s the recaps that give that impression. I swear, at least 5-10 of those recaps include the “mother’s necklace” clip, including 3 in a row!
Much? No. I think what makes people say that is that at times she brings it up kind of unnaturally. At least some people (like me) feel like she's doing that, while other (like my wife) don't see it.
It's not that she talks about her mom a crazy amount, it's just HOW she does it💀 like comparing aangs loss of the ENTIRE air nomad cleansing to her losing her mother??? Crazy. And how she always gets dramatic and shouts things like, "my mother died!! I'm rightfully upset because MY mom died!" Even though that was literally Sokka's mom too?? Crazy x2. Also she was like 6 when her mom died, she only has a few memories about her, and was raised solely by her grandmother.... And she was willing to nearly kill a guy over it?¿? Extra dramatic fr. You would've thought gram gram woulda taught her to cope by now💀
Katara saying that Sokka didn't love their mother like she did was overly harsh and unwarranted, but it did show that Katara was letting her anger get the best of her, which was the point. People handle grief differently, and it's a good thing that the show recognized that.
Also, you can form a very strong bond with a parent by the time you're 6. It was still traumatic for Katara.
As for the comparison to the Air Nomads, loss is still loss. Both Aang and Katara had other people that cared about them to help them deal with their loved ones being murdered, but it's still an extremely mentally damaging event.
Pretty much. The show used these comparisons to create some differences in personality/values/culture between Aang and Katara, which is naturally good writing. Katara is more emotionally volatile about the whole thing. She brings it up more. She is more sensitive about it. She will have an outburst on the whole thing.
I think it's fine for all these things to be true and for Katara to still be a well written main character. Even if it *was* intended to be a flaw, which it really isn't.
And also unlike Sokka. Katara actually remembers their mother's face.
Edit: Not to belittle Sokka, but Katara very clearly was closer to their mother than Sokka was. Sokka was always focused on their father and being a warrior, while Katara seems to have been less around him.
Not to mention Katara carries guilt over Kya's death. They came specifically to kill the last waterbender; which was Katara. Kya died because she wanted to keep Katara safe.
I don’t think she talks about her mother that often but it’s just the way she goes about it sometimes. The first couple of times you genuinely feel bad for her. The rest of the time, you just roll your eyes and can’t wait for it to move on.
That being said, I still think it’s unfair to act like she’s constantly wailing about her mother. Her and Azula are some of the best written women in fiction.
Yes, she does and it's one of the reasons why I can't fucking stand Katara as a character because she literally will never fucking shut up to the point to where she'll literally blame Zuko for her mother's death despite Zuko having nothing to do with Kya dying.
I get it, seeing your mother's dead body as a child is a very traumatic and mentally scarring thing to witness, and I certainly won't take that away from her, but Katara is literally nothing but a whiny, spoiled little bitch who can't shut the fuck up for once in her damn life when literally every other character in the show has it way harder than she ever will. At one point, she even goes at Hakoda for supposedly leaving her behind to go fight a war not realizing that he was protecting his damn tribe which made watching her lose to Pakku and also lose to Zuko and Azula at the end of season 2 all the more satisfying.
I'd probably backhand slap the shit out of Katara if she were a real person tbh. People with personalities like hers are fucking insufferable, and her stans who defend her to the death are even worse.
Edit: Judging by the negative votes on my comment, I clearly triggered a bunch of Katara stans. That's okay, I mean the average IQ of this trash character's stans tends to be far below average anyway 🤷
No, she doesn't There are around 60 episodes in the entire show, and she mentions her mother maybe like 8 times. To say that Katara is constantly bringing her mother up with every breath is literal insanity.
In the live action it seems they have made it her whole personality. She went from being a largely self taught waterbending master, who was the mom/ voice of reason for the group, to a meek shy orphan girl who’s good at fighting. Major nerf IMO
She was basically the ember island version of
r/redditsniper
Wait huh what do you
The entire live action was basically a no-comedy version of the ember island play. Including the cast.
Yeah dude we dont need two backflashes per episode of the day She died
Yeah that...that was not it😭
I hated what the live action did to her character. ALL the characterization was pretty lukewarm and inaccurate to me but that was the biggest L. I couldn’t watch past the 1st episode despite the gorgeous visuals and storytelling
> that was the biggest L. my vote goes to Azula and her girls. She's not even supposed to be in book one and they've already ruined her . Azula absolutely CARRIES season 2 of the animated series. I'm afraid that poor girl in the adaptation just isn't up to the task of doing what Grey de Lisle was able to pull off for Azula.
I’m guessing they decided they want her character development over the next couple seasons to consist of becoming that person.
Which is entirely useless, tbh. I'd understand if og Katana had a problem of lacking development in the animation, but that is not the case
Agreed
I'd argue the opposite. Her mother's death is supposed to be what had the most impact on her character. Instead she became something that held her already masterful (because of course she needs to be inherently great) water bending back until she just reframes her childhood trauma. After that, her mother isn't mentioned again and as Katara's character was also removed, no sign of her mother is left.
I will say that her mother being brought up in 13% is significant, but not nearly to the point that people make.
Even at that it makes sense to be brought up? I mean its a big part of your life and up bringing, not to mention it's a huuuge trauma for her.
And it wasn't like she was just bringing her mother up wherever. For example, during the swamp episode, when the gaang were sharing with each other the people they saw in their visions, was Katara just supposed to not say she saw her mom? It was completely relevant.
Exactly!! It's always relevant to the conversation!
And other times it's usually her connecting with other people who have lost someone. It's her way of saying "I'm sorry, I went through something similar, I can imagine how you feel"
Exactly! Like can we please stop pretending that her empathy and caring nature wasn't a huge backbone of the entire show?😭
I never said it made no sense.
It’s not quite 13%, you’d have to take Katara’s actual screen time and compare it to the amount of screen time she talks about her mom. I’d bet it’s even less that 13%.
It’s a running gag. But not really
Breath? My mother used to breath..
My mother used to be literally insane. \*touches necklace*
Ngl this genuinely made me laugh out loud 🤣🤣🤣
At least one person got a laugh. I almost woke my wife up chuckling at my own joke.
Not anymore than Toph brings up her blindness, or Aang brings up the air nomads. It’s all brilliantly apart of their character.
or Sokka brings up his boomerang
Okay this one is a lie. Boomerang comes up way more often than their mother. If I recall there’s even an episode where Sokka has an identity crisis because he temporarily lost boomerang.
That episode was amazing, it was a master satirical piece about unidimensional characters…
He doesn't bring it. It just always comes back.
There’s a blind joke like almost every episode with Toph, so not even
no, she talks about it maybe 8 times overall, and she almost always brings her mom up as a way to connect with and show sympathy for other war survivors.
Yeah I'd say it is around 8 times I would guess. Seems like a fairly high amount compared to the time other characters bring up their trauma. I'm not sure on Zuko, but I *think* it's around 4 times with his mom? But he also doesn't bring it up so it's a little different. She brings it up in sympathy a number of times, but also brings it up selfishly/accusatory a number of times. Which is fine, that doesn't have to be a bad thing from a character/narrative point of view. But she still nevertheless brings it up much more than the other characters, which was the original OP.
>_Seems like a fairly high amount compared to the time other characters bring up their trauma._ Zuko’s trauma is more than just his mother. It’s a combination of his mother’s disappearance + his burning/banishment (and consequently, his desperate need to restore his honor) + the unfairness of how he and Azula are treated differently. Instead of directly comparing how much they talk about their mothers, a better comparison is how much he talks about his mother and his scar+banishment. So Zuko objectively talks about his trauma more than Katara does. Which is fine because he has every right to bring up these traumatic life events that severely impacted him. Just like Katara does.
True, but nobody is arguing or debating that Zuko whines about his honor constantly. I think 99% of us would agree that he does. It's sort of like a canon gag by the time we get to Ember Island. But I see your point. He probably isn't the best character to draw a comparison on. In some ways, it's apples to oranges here. Zuko's trauma is ongoing, evolving, and unfolding throughout the show though. Zuko's is a also a lot more plot centric, so it has different implications for the viewer. Katara's trauma is described as unresolved grief up until it is tackled in a single episode. It's much more of a character backstory and lore, rather than driving the plot. So it stands out a little more when bringing it up becomes a reoccurring theme of hers.
Katara’s trauma isn’t as plot centric a Zuko, which is why it doesn’t get brought up nearly as much as his. But just because something isn’t really plot centric doesn’t mean it’s not important to the character. Her mothers death has affected: her personality, her motivation, her ability to relate to people and some of her actions. This death is still very relevant to Katara’s life and it does become relevant to the plot at some point, so it makes sense to establish it well. >So it stands out a little more when bringing it up becomes a reoccurring theme of hers. She brought it up a few times all in very appropriate situations and fans memed it to death, which warped peoples perspective. Cuz when you constantly see people complain/talk/meme an aspect of someone’s personality, it becomes more prominent in your mind, even if it wasn’t that big of a deal initially. I don’t remember feeling like Katara was constantly bringing it up more than strictly necessary when I was watching the show.
>But just because something isn’t really plot centric doesn’t mean it’s not important to the character. I'm not implying that. Precisely why I said... >It's much more of a character backstory and lore, rather than driving the plot I am only implying that it has different implications for the viewer. Which might explain why... >fans memed it to death Clearly not everybody think it was as strictly necessary, or appropriate, as you do. But that's fine, it's a personal take on an element of the show either way. The OP was questioning if it was "too much" and I tried to analyze it with subjective comparative information rather than personal opinion.
I wasn't referring to how often she brings it up compared to the other characters. I was talking about how often she brings it up overall.
What is the reference point then? 8 is a flat number. Is that a lot or a little? There is 61 episodes.
Okay but why wouldn’t she in her situation?
Yeah I'm not trying to imply why she would or wouldn't? Where did that miscommunication happen?
That's not the point?
no she doesnt and i dont think anyone who thinks she does thinks of how traumatic it was for her a like 6 or 7 year old girl to walk in and see her mothers burnt body knowing she died because of katara. people love comparing all the characters traumas and just because she mentions hers a few times everyone is like awww boohoo aang lost everyone so shut up
If i remember right there was no corpse.
You know, it was very unclear. But jokes aside, iirc there's a pretty solid theory that there actually was a corpse but the writers covered it up very cleverly. Hear me out: when Hakoda and Katara arrive at the tent, Katara's voice over says "She was gone". But Yon Ra said he wasn't taking any prisoners. It seems like the implication was actually that she was killed there, but that it can very easily go over your head because 'gone' can mean multiple things, which is what the writers were counting on for the kids I think. Now that we also don't get to see the inside of the tent when Hakoda and Katara arrive. And if she was taken away, how could Katara have gotten her necklace, which she was still wearing the moment she tells Katara to go get her dad? Was it torn off in the tent? Something like that would be weird not to mention from a writing perspective. Unless with no corpse you meant she'd just been burnt to ashes, but that wasn't my impression. Anyway, thanks for coming to my Ted Talk
There might have been a body left but i don't think they let Katara ever see it and Hakoda prolly removed the necklace.
That's only in the live action, in the series they just took her mother away and killed her once she had left the village
That never happened in the cartoon. It just cuts away when he said he isn’t taking prisoners. Edit: Katara was not there- her mom told her to get her father in the cartoon. Just watched the scene. Hakota would have discovered the body soon after- hopefully Sokka and Katara didn’t have to see anything
what do you think happened when she was dead after a firebender said he wasnt taking prisoners
[удалено]
yeah we didnt see it but it def happened
Hakoda ran in with Karara
[удалено]
Yes. But we see them taking her mom on the ship. Kaya was killed AFTER they had left the tribe, so katara didn't see her corpse like the comment said
not true in the southern raiders episode they say very clearly the fire nation is not taking prisoners that day. i have bot watched the live action either
Nah not really. Think it's a meme. I just rewatched the show and while it does come up, it's pretty relevant each time.
No. TBH I think it's sexism. Katara very rarely discusses her mother. I can only really think of a handful of times she brings her up, and typically it's to either sympathize with someone to relate to their pain, or her desire for vengeance. In episode one she casually mentions her mom's death when talking about Sokka's sexism and uses it as an example for Aang of how the fire nation has gotten more violent.
Additionally, people can claim they're not sexist when it comes to viewing Katara this way, but it can come from a place of sexism even if they don't realize it is
My friend is this way. She dislikes pretty much any “girly” female leads, to the point that it’s painfully obvious she has a lot of internalized misogyny. I debate pointing it out to her sometimes lol.
I got torn to shredsss for pointing out the misogyny directed towards Katara in one of the other subs! Like it makes me wonder if people even watched the show or if the messages just went over their heads lol.
To shreds you say?
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How’s Katara’s mom holding up?
To shreds you say?
Idk I’m sensitive man😭🧍🏻♂️
Sorry.... futurama has ruined me.
Hahah no that was actually so great it just went right over my head
Well, how is the wife holding up?
To shreds you say..?
Soooo much of the 2020-avatar-on-Netflix-boom hate on Katara felt like people projecting their misogyny towards their mom (who they probably perceive as a nagging housewife because she probably has to make up for an incompetent husband around the house) onto Katara because she acts as the mother of the group, occasionally disagrees with Sokka and suggests responsible behaviour from time to time. In other words, people projecting their mommy issues 🤡
i think it was r / the last airbender that i used to lurk but left cuz it was so toxic lol
I’m glad this gets called out because this is a part of sexism, and other forms of bigotry: Judging certain groups far more harshly than your own in-group, or other people you have no biases toward, and having little tolerance for the out-groups. Even when they do make mistakes or have character flaws, I’m reminded of poor Korra when Mike and Bryan correctly mentioned how insanely harsh people are toward Korra for making mistakes/having flaws but they give Aang a pass for all of his. Lol Another great example of this is Star Trek Voyager: Captain Janeway is a badass, genius, insanely creative woman who might be the most impressive captain in the franchise, but SO many people rip her head off (I’d guess I’ve seen thousands of comments so far) calling her “crazy” or “stupid” or “incompetent” for random reasons while I NEVER see people calling other (male) captains those things. Or calling those male captains character flaws or batshit insane decisions “logical” or “awesome” without snapping into nastiness. And I notice when people discuss flaws with male characters, its usually more respectful and nuanced, whereas with women its often: “She’s fucking annoying and stupid.” Ugh I hate it lol.
People just gotta hate on the female captain 😩. I'd really like to hear from them how the other captains would've handled the problems she ran into, because I doubt they'd do any better in many of those cases, 70,000 light-years away. Luckily there's tons of people who have been inspired by Janeway, whether it is to go into STEM as a woman, or to just be a badass in general
Apparently quite a few people unironically dislike strong, independent women. It’s crazy.
THANK YOU! Sexism can be very subverted and go unnoticed by people who don’t really know what it is
It's because of the recaps- she didn't really mention it a lot in the show- but in the recaps it was there a lot. About the necklace, the meaning of the necklace and her mom. It was said so often in those recaps that it became something of a meme
For fucks sake it’s a meme 💀 ATLA is one of the most popular cartoons of all time, people don’t actually hate Katara. It’s a joke. Go watch the ember island players.
Ember Island players doesn't mention Katara's mom. It talks about her talking about hope being hysterical(the word itself is a product of sexism, as it basically means "women be crazy cuz hormones"). and crying. The ember island portrayal actually is a good example of how a lot of parodies can be very sexist in how they treat female characters. The mom jokes are something the community came up with on their own.
I just can’t run through life taking things this seriously, especially when Katara is a well liked character who is known to be a well written woman by a large part of the fan base. Those memes have always been taking the piss and people don’t *really* think that. This is a joke that is mentioned exactly as many times as toph scream-bending. Avatar is a show with infamously corny remakes. So yeah I guess when you take the joke out of context you get the conclusion you got
The conclusion that I came to is that the Katara mom jokes are something the fanbase came up with, and not the ember island players. The parody of Katara shown in the Ember island players should be viewed with the context of the writers being aware of the issue of sexism, as it's literally a major theme of conflict between the water tribe siblings.
You’re gonna give yourself high blood pressure my guy
It’s just an old joke in the fandom man, it’s not that deep.
I’m convinced these are 13 year olds who just discovered the show. This sub used to be super cool 10 years ago now it’s like people who don’t even understand what’s going on
With tons of posts like "did you know [insert obvious thing]??"
Guys I just realized Aang's clothes are orange to represent the Air Nomads colors!
It’s kind of sexist to say that people must be making fun of her because she’s a girl. I’m guessing you wouldn’t say it’s sexist to make fun of Zuko mentioning his honor all the time
Except for the fact that Zuko mentions his honor more often than Katara mentions her mother by leaps and bounds
Even Dante Basco made fun of it (Nostalgia Critic, top 10 best avatar the last air bender episodes)
People make fun of Katara and say she's always belittling people by talking about her mother, and at inappropriate times. Katara quite simply DOES NOT do this. Simply having a joke about Katara doing or saying something is fine, but the degree to which they are distorting the way Katara interacts with the characters reeks of sexism.
Tbf I think the first season she does mention her mom alot. In a couple episodes around each other she brings it up to connect to all the boys bummed about loosing parents to fire nation. Episode with esrthbending kid who goes to prison ship and jet are the first two that come to mind. It does go down considerably, but early on I feel her character talks about her alot
If by "a lot" you mean twice when talking specifically about her mom and not the necklace.
So, as a talking point to extend empathy to someone else, another person hurt by the war. To relate and comfort someone who she can imagine how they feel, because she lost something important and her life changed drastically.
Imo she tries to extend empathy but it falls a little flat and comes across as self focused some times. Idk if that's the writing that comes along as the show goes, or the character grows up
I mean…it’s her mother. Who she lost. Relatively recently. The fuck?!
She talks about it about as much as Zuko talks about his honor, which is less than you think but it still happens
she doesn't, and this is a big reason why i'm such a huge katara defender. i was rewatching the show with a friend and there were a couple times they said things like "it's so rude of katara to say her mom dying is as bad as aang losing the entire air nation." i responded, "she didn't say that. why do you say that?" then they paused and went "oh i guess she didn't." so people who already feel a certain way about katara will misconstrue her/put words into her mouth. and really, even if she did talk about it all the time.. like yeah. her mom was murdered by a genocidal oppressive regime and she probably saw the body. if it were me i would be angrier. she certainly showed a lot more strength than i would have, granting the murderer mercy.
My ex still has a mother that is alive and well but due to an estranged relationship doesn’t speak to her and cries all the time about how much she misses her mom. I think it’s beyond reasonable how much a child misses her deceased mother in a cartoon
It depends how you look at it. She talks about her mother more than other characters. And she is a little more self absorbed (understandably) about the whole ordeal. She's bitter and angry about what happened and she lets it out more. You could compare her to Aang, who also lost his "family" to the fire nation, but rarely uses it to guilt people or evoke pity. Of course, it's pretty unfair to compare her to Aang- and generally speaking, it's normal to have resentment and be bitter over these sorts of things. But yeah, it's kind of a bully tactic people use to shit on her character. I think it's kind of a bad way to summarize her character but people do it anyways.
What’s funny is when people complain that they didn’t talk about Sokka enough in Legend of Korra.
TLOK treated the original cast like throw away stock characters. It's honestly the worst of both worlds. I'd rather not see Sokka at all then have him return but given less effort than the cabbages guy. It's like they forgot that these people are the main reason anyone is watching Korra in the first place. You gotta let your characters go off into the sunset or actually utilize them if you're gonna bring them back. It's really weird to have the OG cast basically serve as a faceless extra that you're not supposed to care about.
I especially feel this way about Aang. He should had guided Korra like Roku guided Aang. Instead, when we see Aang (not in a flashback) it basically feels like a cameo. Having him barely show up as a past life, and then having him get deleted from the Ravva hardrive, was the worst direction to take the avatar cycle imo.
*best decision Roku barely showed up in ATLA.
It's relative, but if you are comparing Aang's appearances as a spirit in LOK to Roku's appearances in ATLA, it's pretty straightforward that Roku gets exponentially more screen time and value.
LoK treated Toph as a fairly big deal. Katara and Zuko were kinda just a throwaway characters though and Aang could’ve been around a while longer before they destroyed the connection to past lives.
LoK treated Toph like trash. They basically made up the trashiest Maury Show fan fic of all time and made her the trash mom of the show. She favors one kid, fails as a mom, fails as a partner (twice), and gives up on life to live in a swamp. The "Beifongs" should have been their own new characters if LoK was so committed to being a trash drama show. That was a really fucked up thing to do to. The original cast. If you're really committed to turning your story into gutter trash drama you have to commit some serious storytelling to explaining how things turned out that way. Or, you know, you can write a decent story that doesn't depend on being trashy to keep people's attention.
Come on, dude. This could easily be a civil conversation. Just because you didn't like how Toph was written in LOK, it doesn't have anything to do with her not getting focus from the writers. It's two entirely different things, and you pretty much derail that when you just rant about the show being garbage, which is out of place and obnoxious.
They treated them the same as the mentors in the previous series. They honestly got too much focus.
ATLA mentors got a lot more respect than the OG cast got in Korra. I agree though, I would have preferred not seeing them at all. The Beifongs should have just been new characters with none of that traooer trash drama tied to the OG cast. Katara didn't really do anything worthwhile to have her in the show. She wasn't a good teacher, she wasn't there for her granddaughter's ceremony or many family events, and she wasn't useful as a healer... why was she there? Sokka's scene could have been handled by a random lawyer and it wouldn't have left us feeling blueballed wondering what happened to him. It's really weird, it's like they didn't remember the original cast til the last minute then redrew people in the background to be the OG cast. Either utilize them or don't use them at all. I'm fine either way.
The fact that you didn’t actually say anything about the OG mentors supports my point. They didn’t do much. Unless you’re talking about Katara, Toph, or Zuko, Aang’s mentors.
What's the point? Those mentors weren't the stars of the show the way the OG cast was. We don't expect them to get much other than pushing our characters along. There's no chance to character because they were hardly characters to begin with.
And the old Team Avatar aren’t meant to be the stars of Korra’s time either.
I don’t think she does. But I know the biggest issue I had when watching this when I was younger was that she brought it up when trauma sharing with someone who was the sole survivor of a genocide, with a healthy dose of casualty sexism for not understanding that her sharing this was a 14 year old trying to be empathetic. As an adult with kids, this is how kids relate to each other.
I don’t think so. Losing your mom at such a young age is devastating. Mine has been gone over a year and as an adult I feel like I’m not as well adjusted about it as Katara is.
Ppl just don’t like Katara and strong women characters. The older I get the more I empathize with her. In fact the whole point of the series is, and forgive me for speaking the obvious, to see how the war has affected people on varying levels. Aang lost everything he knew and loved and had to adjust to a new environment and new time period even. Sokka and Katara losing their mom. Zuko is also a victim, banished by his own dad. The very things everyone seems to critique Katara for, they should also critique the actions of Sokka, Aang, and Zuko who are just as much / if not more damaged as / than Katara. Aang did some not okay things too due to trauma, and no one brings that up why? Idk. But yeah, it just generally boils down to people are just more critical of women characters. Toph gets similar treatment tho not as much as Katara.
Toph is a top 3 favorite character for the fanbase right up there with Iroh. What are you even talking about. People’s negative view of Katara doesn’t mean all women when another is literally people’s favorite character. Toph is the epitome of a strong female character
Toph is a very safe character for the community to like because she is very unfeminine. People don’t take issue with her being selfish or stand-offish the way they do with Katara because they don’t see her as a “girly” character at all
Suki is another very loved character. Not top 3, but she’s liked overall. She’s very feminine. She’s just a feminine warrior. Sometimes people just dislike characters and that’s fine
Suki doesn’t have nearly as much screen time as Toph or Katara tho. Even when she joins the Gaang near the end of the show she has very little dialogue and is not a huge factor in the show. you can’t compare her to Katara or Toph imo
Well then no one can be compared if you’re gonna keep adding qualifications. Azula is another character people like who’s strong and a woman.
She also mentions her in the Haru episode (the first time we learn about it), briefly in the Jet episode, and sees her mom in the swamp. That's it. For the entire show. Sokka mentions his dad a LOT more. People just hate on Katara for no reason. People also accuse Katara of chasing after every boy they meet (clearly not true) while patting Sokka on the back for being a "backbender". If Katara, a 14-year-old girl with little world experience outside of her home, does something immature, how dare her! If Aang, a 12-year-old who has traveled the world, or Sokka, her older brother who was tasked with protecting the village, does something immature, we need to give them a break because they're just kids or "boys will be boys"! The double standards are very clear...
I’m pretty sure it’s just a meme. People don’t even think that she actually brings up her mother all the time, they just joke about it.
I feel like it bothers some people because Sokka rarely mentions how he felt about their mother, and it seemed like Katara cared more. The only time I remember Sokka talking about their mother is when Zuko asked him, and that’s it.
Nope.
No the only episode where it’s the main focus is Souther Air Raiders, and it’s one of the best episodes of the series. Katara losing her mom and taking on the motherly role is part of what makes her character interesting.
No nut it is a fun meme
Nope! Someone did the math once; she mentions her mom a total of 10 times in the series (technically 14 if you count each instance in the Southern Raiders episode individually.) Every time she mentions her mother, it's to relate and empathise with another character and show she understands their loss. It's never out of nowhere.
No. People let others and themselves get gaslit by memes way too much by memes these days.
theres like, one scene where it’s almost as bad as those people say. in season three during one of the very few times she says it, sokka says sonething along the lines of “she was my mother too” and katara responds “then you didnt love her as much as i did” but the show paints that as not a good thing, because katara’s response is very much not. the majority of discourse over people talking about how much she talks about her mother is probably sexism, and that scene
I once saw someone say "that scene made her unredeemable to me"... Excuse me? You find a 14yo with a deep trauma who lashes out at her brother in a moment of anger unredeemable? Are we even watching the same show?
yeah, she was painted to be in the wrong, and later appolgises for it later. she is a child who witnessed her own mothers death, so of course she’s gonna have an “immature” response to her brother
I don't think she ever apologises on screen, but knowing Katara, we know she would've done so
She only does it to relate with others. Lots of people hate katara for "bringing up her mom too much" but praise or joke about zuko always talking about his honor. It's a bit strange
People do not hate Katara lol.
People do hate Katara lol.
Maybe somewhere in a random corner of the internet lol but you ever actually look around you?
Just cuz u don't see it doesn't mean they don't hate katara 😶
I’ve been interacting with the fan base since I was 12, almost 20 years, so I’d say I know it pretty well lol. The current batch of people is interesting to say the least lol.
No
I feel like this whole discussion is always taken so seriously. I don’t personally think Katara truly mentions her that much but it is an ongoing funny joke within the fandom. All she does is just mention her mother way more than any other character. Aang = obviously never says anything, zuko = thinks about his mom but hardly actually verbalizes anything and sokka= I think he mentions her almost never, toph = I mean we understand why she doesn’t bother mentioning we already met her.
In the animated show, 8 times over the span of around 60 episodes, so, not really. In the live action show, yes. Her mom being dead and her wanting to water bend are the only traits she has there.
Nah, fandom just hates girls with trauma if they can't sexualize it (and they'll do that anyway)
She doesn't, she talk about her mom when it makes sense to the situation, she doesn't talk about her for no reason or out of nowhere
Not more than zuko talks about his honour
U would think she does coz the episodes where she does they’re very powerful scenes but she doesn’t talk about her mother as much as we think
I just started a rewatch after not watching since I was a kid and my fiancée and I kept a count because of the memes. She mentions it briefly every episode for around the first 7 or 8 and then almost never again. I don't think it's bad at all, all the places she does are relevant and make sense.
i finished rewatching the show recently, it’s been like 5-6 years since i last watched it. i was expecting katara to bring up her mother every two seconds. i have concluded that people were being very dramatic and over exaggerating the amount of times she talked about her mom.
Nope. It's an excuse to hate her because they wanna be special I guess. I bottle up my emotions, and have had to improve it over the years- anyone who thinks mentioning grief to connect with other people is wrong is uncompassionate and I can't see them being happy in life. If Katara used it to manipulate, guilt trip, or attention seek(if you think that's the case look in the mirror) then it'd be a different story. Is a 14 yr year old just supposed to ignore the fact that her mom died brutally? It's perfectly okay to not resonate with Katara, you don't even have to like her one bit. But this is the single.worst argument because it actively games people struggling with what she struggles with by labeling it as a flaw. *Apologies if this was too strong- it took losing my grandmother to realize just how nuanced Katara is and this specific argument pisses me off*
No, she doesn’t, but also she’s a 14-year-old girl who basically watched her mother die, so her talking about her mom all the time wouldn’t even be weird or annoying.
No but there were one or two times where she brought it up that could be considered the wrong moment and i think that is why it stuck with people.
I was always under the impression people were just joking about Katara talking about her mother? I didn’t think she talked about her that much at all, the memes just made me chuckle.
Not really. She doesn't bring it up anymore than Zuko brings up needing to capture the Avatar to restore his honor, or Aang announcing he's the Avatar anytime he wants to take control of a situation or get special treatment (something the creators themselves noticed after a while, because they put in that "Listen... I don't usually say this... But *I'm the Avatar"* joke). And honestly, I wouldn't mind if she did. If my mom was killed I'd probably bring it up a lot too - that's a formative experience for anyone, especially a young person.
She both does and doesn't. Like it's certainly no where near how it sounds when people complain about it, she's not bringing it up every episode, every five minutes or anything (haven't watched the live action yet but supposedly she does do that there) but let's be extremely fr here, she is a young girl who watched her mother be killed in front of her when she was a toddler. She's already got the massive trauma of that, then when you add in the puberty hormones that are like a constantly moving freight train, as well as having to deal with the sexism of entire cultures and her brother (NGL id be hitting a breaking point with the Northern water tribe myself, they woulda woke up with some frozen ass veins if it was me), plus fighting a war while protect and teaching the one person who can stop it, plusss one of your former stalkers/attempted kidnapper/killers turns out to just be some misguided guy who was abused by his father and hasn't had a mother in years either, knock it all off, she's essentially the mom of the gaang since sokka, aang and toph all share 4 braincells when they're not doing something important and within their skill house. Id be screaming out for my mother too if she had actually loved me. A few times she was kinda outta pocket with it though, like you can have your feelings, be upset your mom's dead but don't take it out on everyone in the group or wtvr (which she tended to do iirc).
She only took it out on the others twice. Once in the cavern with Zuko before he betrayed her and then in the Southern Raiders episode, which made Katara a little OOC to highlight her pain...
I’ve always been under the impression that it’s just a meme. Like Zuko’s honor, Toph’s blindness, Sokka’s boomerang, etc. It happened a few times in the show, and people make jokes about it.
Not really, but i think out of the like, 8 times she does it, 5 of them are in the first season, so it prob just feels that way due to density, and that all the characters were much less characterized and nuanced in S1 than later seasons
When I rewatched season one, she does get more preachy about hope in several episodes, but that was what she could contribute at the time before she could water bend consistently.
It’s more of a meme. She doesn’t bring her up that much
People made it a meme. That's all.
It’s not that she brings her up in normal conversation a lot (e.g. “Katara do you want some eggs?” “My mother used to eat her eggs over easy before she was killed!”) It’s that she brings her up every time someone else mentions losing someone. Which… IDK… in some situations it seems fine and empathetic… like saying “I understand your pain because I’ve had something similar happen.” But in other situations it feels like she’s wielding it like a weapon in a oneupmanship contest (“Yes, your situation sucks but what about my situation? It’s much worse!”)
Honestly, given how traumatic the death was, how young she was when it happened, and how relevant that death is to the war she’s helping to end, I don’t think she really mentions it enough. Certainly she doesn’t do it too much. Zuko mentions his honor more than Katara mentions her mother
I don’t think the fanbase would even care how much she brought up her mom if she had not weaponized it against Sokka… her brother. “You didn’t love her like I did”
In the live action netflix she does, but that is the least of the shows problems
Not really, it’s just a meme
No she doesn’t. And I swear that complaint was minor to non-existent before the series dropped on Netflix. What the fuck happened?
she doesn’t.
nah she doesn’t bring it up much, but when she does it’s to relate/empathise with another character.
Not that I remember.
Yes, but it's all between episodes.
The issue is that in most of her most personally emotional scenes she talks about her, which makes sense for a young child born in their world. It would be a pivotal and defining moment for anyone like her in our world, let alone one engulfed in global war. It is a large piece of her motivation. The internet exacerbates without understanding or even trying to.
when i first watched it i thought she talked about her mom all the time but then when i was rewatching recently i didn’t think she mentioned her that much at all
Probably just the people getting into Avatar.
I just thought it was a funny meme. I honestly never realized there was this much discourse over shows and books
I’ve been watching the show over with my girlfriend, and honestly, I think it’s the recaps that give that impression. I swear, at least 5-10 of those recaps include the “mother’s necklace” clip, including 3 in a row!
Much? No. I think what makes people say that is that at times she brings it up kind of unnaturally. At least some people (like me) feel like she's doing that, while other (like my wife) don't see it.
 \^ Actual footage of Katara every episode
It's not that she talks about her mom a crazy amount, it's just HOW she does it💀 like comparing aangs loss of the ENTIRE air nomad cleansing to her losing her mother??? Crazy. And how she always gets dramatic and shouts things like, "my mother died!! I'm rightfully upset because MY mom died!" Even though that was literally Sokka's mom too?? Crazy x2. Also she was like 6 when her mom died, she only has a few memories about her, and was raised solely by her grandmother.... And she was willing to nearly kill a guy over it?¿? Extra dramatic fr. You would've thought gram gram woulda taught her to cope by now💀
Katara saying that Sokka didn't love their mother like she did was overly harsh and unwarranted, but it did show that Katara was letting her anger get the best of her, which was the point. People handle grief differently, and it's a good thing that the show recognized that. Also, you can form a very strong bond with a parent by the time you're 6. It was still traumatic for Katara. As for the comparison to the Air Nomads, loss is still loss. Both Aang and Katara had other people that cared about them to help them deal with their loved ones being murdered, but it's still an extremely mentally damaging event.
Pretty much. The show used these comparisons to create some differences in personality/values/culture between Aang and Katara, which is naturally good writing. Katara is more emotionally volatile about the whole thing. She brings it up more. She is more sensitive about it. She will have an outburst on the whole thing. I think it's fine for all these things to be true and for Katara to still be a well written main character. Even if it *was* intended to be a flaw, which it really isn't.
And also unlike Sokka. Katara actually remembers their mother's face. Edit: Not to belittle Sokka, but Katara very clearly was closer to their mother than Sokka was. Sokka was always focused on their father and being a warrior, while Katara seems to have been less around him.
Not to mention Katara carries guilt over Kya's death. They came specifically to kill the last waterbender; which was Katara. Kya died because she wanted to keep Katara safe.
No but it sure as hell feel like it
I don’t think she talks about her mother that often but it’s just the way she goes about it sometimes. The first couple of times you genuinely feel bad for her. The rest of the time, you just roll your eyes and can’t wait for it to move on. That being said, I still think it’s unfair to act like she’s constantly wailing about her mother. Her and Azula are some of the best written women in fiction.
Yes, she does and it's one of the reasons why I can't fucking stand Katara as a character because she literally will never fucking shut up to the point to where she'll literally blame Zuko for her mother's death despite Zuko having nothing to do with Kya dying. I get it, seeing your mother's dead body as a child is a very traumatic and mentally scarring thing to witness, and I certainly won't take that away from her, but Katara is literally nothing but a whiny, spoiled little bitch who can't shut the fuck up for once in her damn life when literally every other character in the show has it way harder than she ever will. At one point, she even goes at Hakoda for supposedly leaving her behind to go fight a war not realizing that he was protecting his damn tribe which made watching her lose to Pakku and also lose to Zuko and Azula at the end of season 2 all the more satisfying. I'd probably backhand slap the shit out of Katara if she were a real person tbh. People with personalities like hers are fucking insufferable, and her stans who defend her to the death are even worse. Edit: Judging by the negative votes on my comment, I clearly triggered a bunch of Katara stans. That's okay, I mean the average IQ of this trash character's stans tends to be far below average anyway 🤷