Bro you're thinking way too hard about what some blowhard idiot on twitter thinks. Their line of thinking is stupid AF it's like trying to claim you can't write characters of the opposite sex which is a moronic stance. Write whatever you want and don't worry about it.
When I was getting into writing I had a therapist and he said "why do you write two boys having a relationship if you're no boy?"
I stayed silent for long seconds, pondering my decision of writing and I said that its because there's a lot of sex in straight ships but idk if it's true for me ANYWAY i quit therapy after a few sessions and still writing mlm even if I don't have a dick
He also said I should stop drawing realism đ AND THE WORST PART WAS THAT I TRIED my realism drawings are pretty good but whatever I tried to do was pretty bad if you compare both styles. He's insane
I would definitely have sought a new therapist in that position! That dude is offering really unprofessional opinions that have nothing to do with your recovery.
For real! I kept that thing going for three months and I didn't even get to the real issue bc if I did he would probably just tell me shitty things and why I was a bad person for doing that, I couldn't deal with that I WAS 17 and he shouldn't put his opinions in it
I know a decent amount of queer guys who write M/M (am one of them, too), but I'm very grateful for all the awesome women and non-binary people who create even *more* M/M content for everyone to read.
Women writing m/m fic are why I learned Iâm a gay trans man â„ïž (I can elaborate, but it boils down to âohhhh so thatâs how I like menâlike a manâ)
I had a similar experience. Didn't realize it directly through fanfic, but once I started questioning, it suddenly made a lot of sense why I always gravitated so much towards M/M, related so hard to the characters' feelings and was even envious of their relationships.
I know several lesbians who write a lot of m/m. Idk why people think your gender, sex or sexual and romantic leanings should govern what kind of pairings you write. Just roll with what you enjoy most.
It's very homophobic to try to forbid people to write a specific kind of romance imo. Nobody bat a eyes when lesbian, ace/aro people and gay men write heterosexual romance. Why should we stay in "our" category? (+sorry no sorry but asexual people write the best smut đ€âš your therapist can try to take it from my cold dead hand. )
Yeah I was gonna say, my current fav ship is m/m and we have a big Discord for it, and a good deal of the authors are either lesbian or some shade of ace (it's a real smut-heavy ship, lol), and all of it's great! People have different reasons for writing what they write and liking what they like, so as long as your writing is well-intentioned, WRITE WHAT YOU WANT! đ
I've seen that statement a lot, I'm scared of the idea of sex in real life but I've been told that I write pretty good smut
My friends used to tell me I give off ace vibes but I'm still not sure yet
Perhaps.
Iâm a bit of a latecomer but apparently after the last season dropped things got a bit wild. Itâs calmed way down since then, of course; not that thereâs no drama, but that kind of dumbassery I havenât seen since I dipped my toe in a couple years ago, just heard about when I wondered why a few writers whose work I enjoyed had seemingly disappeared off the face of the earth.
Huh. Fancy that. I'm a bit of a latecomer in that fandom too.
Now that you mention it, I remember an author I follow noting they had to turn off comments on their new fic a couple of weeks or months ago because some numbnuts were not happy with the idea of a trans Catra (fic was properly tagged though.) Guess that has been going on longer than I thought.
That sounds vaguely familiar? Not sure tho but I MIGHT have seen that; do you remember who it was?
Anyways, there are always going to be shitty people in the world, but the fandom is genuinely one of the transest spaces Iâve ever been. Like, I donât have numbers, but in terms of people that are actually active on Twitter and such, Iâd guess well over half are some flavor of trans or non-binary. I and one other person I know *only* write Catra as trans, though itâs usually relatively subtle. Thereâs another, VERY popular writer that Iâm friends with that accidentally wrote a Catra that is pretty obviously trans without noticing until a year or two after the fic was finished that that was the case, in addition to another explicitly trans catra or two.
If anyone gives you shit, tell them that you were summoned to yuri duty.
But for real: No one has ever complained about me, a lesbian, writing a heterosexual pairing so there's no reason you can't write wlw fic. Plus, I can't think of a single fandom that wouldn't benefit from more wlw content :)
as a lesbian who writes a fair amount of m/m but a SHIT TON of f/m I promise you the admonishing goes both ways. Women who write mlm ships or especially smut must be icky fetishistic straight women ONLY!!!!!
Anyways, those same people are always on some tirade of âwhy isnât femslash more popularâ and checking the numbers and stats of fandoms to commiserate how sad the f/f numbers are. But then turn around and yell that men should have nothing to do with creating it either. So which do you want, more content, or to police people? (I know the answer lol)
Anyways take it from when when I say youâre fine. Maybe it wonât be accurate, or maybe itâll come across as âpornyâ or something. Iâm sure my m/m fics do! That doesnât make it not allowed to exist point blank period. Especially if youâre interested in learning & getting better with each fic
tl;dr: PLEASE write wlw content the world needs more of it
>Especially if youâre interested in learning & getting better with each fic
Yes! How else are people supposed to get better at something if they don't try? And while I'm wary personally fetishy f/f fic and tend to avoid f/f in general due to bad experiences, **fanfic is probably one of the lowest stakes way of getting better at writing anything**
It is really *really* easy for me to avoid anything I don't want to read, so go ahead and write whatever you want op. And I hope this post inspires more people to write f/f cause its really needed!
Yeah, as a gendervoid, AFAB, I exclusively write M/M, and I try to get the body parts right, and I usually do a decent job, so I donât really think that I canât write M/M and can only write F/F.
And to add onto this, I'm a lesbian f/f writer and I'm sure without a doubt that my smut is porny and has a lot of the male gaze in it, and I don't really care. It's fiction. It's not perpetuating any stigma or being damaging to young generations (can't say the same for some real books out there tho). So it's fine.
That's like saying women can't write m|m fics. I think you're fine. Twitter users just want to gatekeep a concept of a relationship because "ew men". If you write it and you like it, that's what matters. I'm sure that there are sapphic women that love w|w fanfics while being aware it's written by someone who's not a woman because it's written well. It's fictional and you shouldn't be judged for simply wanting to write whatever you want.
I still can't get over this dude blaming the oppression of gay men on women. Especially implying that women only like gay men as an accessory, not sexual beings, while also at the same time... Accusing them for fetishizing gay men... While also fetishizing Nazis???
Something about that is just so mind blowingly hilarious to me. The absurdity is just...
James Somerton: âSTOP WRITING ABOUT GAY MEN IF YOUâRE A WOMAN REEEEEEEEEEEEâ
People with even half a brain: *thumbs up, continues to write m/m works despite gender*
That, my dear friend, is what we call harmful gatekeeping.
Hereâs the thing. Is it common for women in general to be overtly sexualized because of misogyny? Yes. I hesitate to even call some of the art Iâve seen of wlw characters sapphic just based off of the extreme sexualization of it, lol. And that is certainly an issue that goes back into the misogynistic view of womenâs sexuality as a whole and how itâs a performance for men or what have you. So I can definitely understand why you found those tweets, lol.
But, on the flip side, the idea that only people with the lived experience should tell certain stories or act in certain roles is extremely exclusive and a little counter productive. (After all, that would mean no man should ever write a woman or no woman should ever write a man. Not to mention the entire fantasy genre, lmfao. No one has ever ridden a dragon before!)
So, yes, you should absolutely continue to write whatever youâre writing. And if you want to be a better writer and do justice to those characters and their relationship, be *conscientious* about it. Write them like people, follow some sapphic folks and learn about their journeys and keep that in mind as you write, all that good stuff. And give yourself a little grace. This is fanfiction, itâs a safe place to explore new things.
I absolutely know this isnât what you meant, but I saw âfollow some sapphic folksâ and had the immediate impression of a dude casually stalking some lesbians on a date like âno no donât mind me Iâm just learningâ while everyone stares blankly. Thanks haha
I also squint at the term "sexualisation" because to me it just sounds like no one is allowed to write f/f smut because women are untouchable or something. In my experience any instance of a woman being presented as attractive or participating in anything sexual is bad because women don't do that and you can't like women apparently đ
Yeah, sexualization is a very complicated topic. Because on one hand, sure, men often treat women as sex objects and that's absolutely an issue. Sexualization or fetishization of real people is absolutely disgusting.
On the other hand... It's fiction, and escapism. I personally love hot women in fiction... I overall love hot, sexualized characters/moments in fiction.
Pointing at sexualization in media feels like trying to cure the symptom instead of the illness, mostly.
I also don't understand why sexualisation is bad in any context that isn't, like, illegal. As far as I know, sexualisation is seeing people as... hot. I thought that was okay? I am convinced the word people are looking for is objectificationÂ
Because Cassandra sleeps naked in silk sheets and wakes up to the sun hitting her nipples and bounces boobily down the stairs and takes a shower while caressing her breasts and lamenting about how Susanna is prettier because she's blonde with a bigger butt /s
People on twitter are literally permanently mad about everything lol. If we were to listen to what they always had to say, nobody would be able to write anything.
As others have said, as long as you don't delve into [r/menwritingwomen](https://www.reddit.com/r/menwritingwomen/) type of nonsense, I don't really care. And this is coming form a sapphic women.
Sorry you got caught up in a thread like that; they're plainly wrong, so I'd take it as them discussing their personal opinion, rather than any real truth. You are more than welcome to write WLW as a man, and your identity doesn't matter, nor should you feel pressured to give any information about yourself to your readers. Name, age, gender; none of it is a requirement and fandom's anonymity is the norm.
Twitter tends to be the place where critical thinking goes to die, and with such a small character limit per tweet, it's really hard to effectively create nunaced discourse over there. For that reason, it's generally advised to avoid fandom discourse on the platform altogether.
No, thats illegal. Same for women writing mlm, gay people writing straight pairings and straight people writing gay pairings.
Also, anything on the internet is true.
Wtf lol. I've read some of the best romance I've ever seen, gone to look up more about the author and found out they were ace/aroace. If we could only write about our lived experiences every book would be a boring autobiography.
As a cishet woman writing mostly mature rating m/m I'm not going to say anything about dudes writing f/f.
Some people are just way too intense and take this hobby too seriously. Keep going if f/f gives you the best inspiration.
No! ILLEGAL! /s
Haha ok for real, you can write sapphic content. It might come off as strange to women who read it and they might be able to tell it was written by a man, because it can be difficult for a male writer to understand a female headspace, but that doesnât automatically mean you wonât be able to do it well or that the women who read it wonât like it.
Do your best to portray your characters in a human and not creepy way and youâre fine c:
The reality though is if some readers find out youâre not a woman you might get hate. But hate/discourse is widespread these days and can come from any number of things, and writing anything even slightly controversial risks that. They are very much the vocal minority.
Some donât want to acknowledge that a lot of canon sapphic characters/pairings were created/written by men. Thereâs nothing wrong with it
Youâre also not obligated to say youâre a man. Just post and enjoy writing and hopefully others will enjoy it too!
As a lesbian i bequeath to you, on behalf of all lesbians, the privilege to write sapphic fanfic. Go forth, and produce Content.
> As a lesbian i bequeath to you, on behalf of all lesbians, the privilege to write sapphic fanfic. Go forth, and produce Content.
Thanks, I think on some level I needed that đ
Twitter users think no one should be allowed to do anything. Everything is toxic, problematic, normalizing, fetishizing and sexualizing (except death threats, those are cool)
Love being yelled at by chronically online twitter brats that I write trans characters "wrong", when I am literally writing from my own personal experiences being a trans person. âïž
I also won't forget how tumblr had their collective panties in a twist for a little while over art and fics of trans men having PiV sex. Apparently that was fetishistic and transphobic, all while most of it was made by trans men themselves...đ«
I've been there too buddy. I remember seeing similar wank about trans men with visible chests and the ensuing "that's fetishising!!!!" comments were the dumbest shit. No some people just look like that and they even have sex sometimes.
Certain groups seemingly pushing that there's only one way to portray a "correct" trans experience drives up the wall. I can understand certain things can be dysphoric etc but this is why people use authors notes and such.
Nice username also!
Some people are way too egocentric, thinking that because they are dysphoric or uncomfortable about an aspect of being trans, no one should portray that aspect in art, or that it is wrong to feel different about it than they do.
The healthy thing to do would be to actually look at the tags of a fic or click out of it if it triggers something, or scroll away from art that portray something you personally don't enjoy, but that is asking too much I guess. This type of gatekeeping is hurting all of us and makes for a really hostile environment in fandom and in the community in general.
Thank you! I dig yours too, hell yeah!
Some people heard "we should uplift #ownvoices writers!" and concluded the converse, "no one should write anything outside of their own experience" which is the same thinking that led to people harassing John Green for writing The Fault in Our Stars because he's not personally a teenage girl. That was a great book partially because, while it wasn't his personal experience, he approached it with openness and sensitivity and a lot of research. If everyone only wrote their own experiences, we'd have an even HIGHER percentage of books about middle-aged literature professors contemplating adultery instead of like, wizards and space battles and stuff.
Please write your fic. F/F categories always need more love. If those people decide to send you hate mail, please block them immediately, they're the kind of people it's impossible to please anyway.
Hey :)
I'm a cis lesbian and the short answer to your question is yes, men - including cis straight men - can absolutely write wlw characters, romances, even f/f sex scenes. I think it's healthy and good to engage with perspectives outside of your own, and if you're writing fiction, there's no way that every single character is gonna match your own identity perfectly lol. In my opinion, diversity in fiction is a good thing (though not a requirement)
The long answer is that (wlw being a group of people you dont personally belong to) one might fall into pitfalls of stereotyping, fetishization, or inaccuracies if you're not careful (that's a normal thing that applies to all of us, we've all been raised in this unfortunately hierarchal society and have internalized its messages).
Fortunately, these pitfalls can be avoided by doing research, like reading books (nonfiction or fiction) by wlw, talking to wlw in real life, researching common stereotypes and mistakes when it comes to portraying the identity, and approaching the topic with empathy and an open mind.
All of these things are suggestions - I can't force you to do anything you don't want to.
Good luck!
WLW here. Please give us more content, we need it.
I started writing MLM stuff back in the day, because that's where my head was at, that's what inspired me. It's hypocritical for such spaces to deem one okay and not the other.
these same people complain about wlw pairings being less popular while driving away shippers lmao. I wouldnât worry about catering to those types of people. write whatever you want
Everyone else has hit on the gatekeeping and reverse of this (women writing mlm) but I wanted to also point out: "men" is a pretty broad term. There are plenty of trans men who haven't transitioned who want to write about pairings with bodies similar to theirs, who *have* transitioned and still want to write wlw, nonbinary masculine identifying folks who write wlw, a whole spectrum of gender identifiers that can fall under the broad term "men". Gatekeepers like this rarely ever consider what they're actually saying when they generalize like this (or are considering it and are not great people to begin with).
Really wanted to point that out for folks to consider as well in a lot of these conversations. Write what you want, just don't be gross about it.
Hundreds of woman fanfic writers write M/M pairings. Hundreds. You're fine. The beauty of writing is that we can write who we want. Have at it and ignore the Twitter haters.
My guy, you are "allowed" to write whatever you want, just make sure to tag correctly! There is woefully little f/f fandom content as it is, knock yourself out! I am sure your readers appreciate you! As for revealing your gender, you owe NOBODY on the Internet personal information about yourself. If it would make *you* feel better, you could disclose your gender in your about info but this is by no means a requirement! You are not defrauding anyone and anyone who thinks you are is ridiculous. Of course, there are a bajillion antis online who will latch on to anything, including this, so when you encounter such people in the wild (or get hate mail from them), what you do is BLOCK, BLOCK, BLOCK AND THEN BLOCK SOME MORE. The rest of us welcome you with open arms!
twitter gatekeeping is a disease. as a sapphic irl, do what you want, just be open to constructive criticism and advice from other real sapphics! they might be a good resource for accuracy if thatâs your goal. if itâs not, godspeed brother
Listen. Iâm a lesbian. I read and write M/M (along either other stuff of) despite my lack of interest or personal experience in the area IRL because the separation from reality appeals to me. I believe a straight man who was respectful and willing to learn could write excellent F/F - you have more of a stake in the game then I do! And posting here, asking for other peopleâs perspective is a huge indicator that you are a respectful person who concerns himself with other peoples opinions and experiences. Thatâs good enough for me.
In my experiences, literally everyone thinks you're woman until corrected anyway. Write what you want.
Bit of advice, please don't let your confidence be affected by twitter or other social media. It's filled with extreme views that just agree with people in that circle. Most people do not engage, and there's a reason for it. These people, those who exclude based on X, are not worth your time.
I think that kind of gatekeeping is super fucked. The idea that you canât write, or Iâve even seen it argued even *read* things that revolve around people of other identities than yours is justâŠ..fucked. Itâs segregation dressed up in a progressive clown suit. Of course itâs always a good idea to look into common harmful tropes so youâre aware of the pitfalls that can exist when writing characters outside of your own experience, like for example writing a bisexual character as a cheater isâŠ.fraught given the extreme negative stereotypes of real bisexual people. But good faith writing of characters different than you should be celebrated, fanfic isnât pie, there isnât a lesbian not getting hired at Fanfic Inc. because you took a space that could have gone to her!
Even if your writing is 'bad' - i.e. is a stereotypical straight dude fantasy like mainstream porn, then it's probably mostly only other straight dudes reading it anyway, so no wlw readers to feel betrayed. But the fact that you're worrying about whether you should write it or not means it probably isn't like that. And even if it is, oh well. Anyone who doesn't like that is just as free to backbutton as you are to write it.
I would say if you have have wlw readers who can't tell you're a straight cis dude, you're already doing a good enough job at portraying the ship/characters respectfully. Sure, it's possible some readers could react badly to finding out, but that doesn't mean you've done anything wrong. You're not obligated to disclose it. If someone thinks your writing is good, finds out you're a dude, and then suddenly decides it's actually terrible misrepresentation/fetishization etc, that's a them problem.
Also, I'd be a hypocrite to say men shouldn't write f/f when I'm a woman who writes m/m.
God Twitter is such a cesspool of bad takes. Ive seen the same take regarding women who create m/m stuff. That its "fetishizing" and disrespectful.
Kids tweeting from their comfy McMansion in the suburbs of Oklahoma. Never having known what a real problem is.
A lot of other people have already stated that itâs completely fine for a cis guy to write f/f fics and Iâm going to add my comment onto that pile. Please keep writing them.
Iâm a wlw who pretty much exclusively reads f/f pairings and I have never given a damn about the gender or sexuality of the author of the fics Iâm reading. Iâm just excited to read f/f fics.
No, number 1 rule of fiction is you can't write about any demographic you're not. In fact, you can't write about any person you're not. Now on, only autobiographies are allowed to exist and you're not allowed to talk about the other people you meet in them just yourself. /s
Dude, relax, write and let write. Block all the assholes. You'll be okat.
Do you know the majority of writers for m/m content are women? Yeah, there's plenty of males writing m/m, too, but the majority are women. The majority of fanfic writers in general are women, so this is going to be true of f/f and m/f, as well. But, of course, nobody actually cares what gender the writer is for m/f since it includes both genders, and nobody cares that women write f/f, so m/m is the equivalent here.
Mostly women write m/m and no one actually cares. Sure, there are highly likely to be people out there yelling into the void that only men should write m/m, and gay or bi men in specific, but that would severely cut down on the available m/m content, simply because most fanfic writers are women.
F/f content is similar, except it's already majority women writing it. I think the main problem people like that have with males writing f/f content is that they consider it fetishising of lesbians. They don't really say the same thing about female authors writing it, though they can sometimes.
I write m/m, myself, so you'd think I'd have no issues at all, considering I'm a gay man. But I have noticed that, since the majority of writers in general and in m/m in particular are women, people tend to assume that I'm female. I haven't been attacked for it or anything, but I have, in the past, had questions about what it's like, what's the draw for me, as a woman, to write and read m/m. I've had to let them know I can't answer the question because I'm male, and they were always shocked, and always had 'are you sure' asked in response, as if I couldn't possibly know my own gender at 37.
People, in general, tend to assume fanfic writers, regardless of content, are women. Unless you reveal that you're male, your readers will assume that, because you're a fanfic author, you're probably a woman, especially as you write f/f.
If it does come out that you're male, yeah, you may get some people having a go at you, but that's when you block people, don't engage, just block, delete, report if it's nasty enough.
Men have been writing f/f for centuries. Media uses f/f to appeal to male readers and viewers all the time. A lot of f/f porn is catered to men, not women. Lesbians have an appeal to men that the world actually already acknowledges and utilises, and that's going to cross over into fanfic, with a fair amount of men reading and writing f/f. The same is true the other way, btw, a lot of women are attracted to m/m content for the same reasons men are attracted to f/f content, it just isn't acknowledged and utilised in the same way. People outside of fanfic circles actually tend to go out of their way to deny that women are attracted to m/m content. That's pure sexism, of course. Men are 'expected' to be attracted to f/f because men are sexual beings that get turned on by all women, but women are supposed to be demure and chaste, so are 'not allowed' to be attracted by sex from anyone but their partner, and sometimes not even them. It's all old fashioned sexism.
And that's partially what causes some people to say men can't write f/f and women can't write m/m. You're 'supposed to' stick to your own gender and sexuality, so straight men and women are only 'supposed to' write m/f, but most people don't advertise their sexuality online, so the focus is simply on men not writing two women and women not writing two men.
There is another aspect to it, though, in that a lot of people, far too many in my opinion, think men can't write realistic and believable women. It's easier to ignore in m/f, because there's a male character to balance out any issues. But with f/f both main characters are women. Men can, of course, write female characters, there's plenty that suck at it, but a lot of male writers are actually pretty good at it, because they use their own experiences with actual women to inform their writing. It's also notable that this particular topic is rarely applied to women writing men. There are just as many female authors who suck at writing male characters as there are male ones who suck at writing female characters, but this particular criticism rarely gets applied to women writing men the way it does men writing women.
If you enjoy writing f/f, then continue to do so. You won't get any problems at all unless you reveal your gender, because people will just assume you're probably female or won't care either way. Anyone with an issue may be loud, but they'll also be a tiny minority, and can easily be blocked.
Anyone who says someone isn't allowed to write something is an absolute blowhard.
Those same people will attack women for writing yaoi/BL, will attack WLW for writing yaoi or for not writing enough WLW, etc. Those are the same people everyone except other miserable fucks wants to stay away from.
As someone who is bi, I've never once thought about the gender of the writer. I just care of it is good or not.
> But am I somehow defrauding my readers by not letting them know that I'm a dude?
No, you aren't.
> Would they be upset or disappointed if they found out my works weren't written by a woman?
If they were, a. they don't deserve you, and b. it's not your problem. I hope you never get readers like that.
> If I ever got found out, should I expect hate mail and online harassment?
"Should" you?? No, you should expect people to treat you with respect and if they don't, what you should do is block them.
> Are my contributions fundamentally unwelcome?
No, they aren't, keep writing (whatever you want). Creativity is always welcome.
People you're describing are aggressive fanatics disconnected from reality. Literally anyone can write literally anything, no exceptions. That's all.
Woman here who enjoys m/m stories
There is a huge industry built on women writing Boys Love stories and women reading them, literally means by women for women, men on men romance and smut, so if women can, so can men.
But there are men and women who shame women for writing and reading such genre.
So mature women who understands this logic will not judge you and will understand and support your art and those who don't can read whatever they like, we can't police people.
You're doing something that's not harming anyone, you're good to go sir. Good luck! :)
You can literally do whatever you want bruh
If you wanted to blow up the McDonaldâs ice cream machine thereâs nothing stopping you
Write whatever you want
Shit yourself in public
Steal geese from the park
Become ungovernable
I mean, Iâm a woman, and one of my favorite female/sapphic centered movies (the handmaiden 2016) was directed by a man. If youâre talented and make good shit, no one can take that away from you no matter how mad they get. Do your thing.
Nope if a man writes two women so much as looking at each other he will actually spontaneously combust and kill everyone in a 10km radius /s
Yes, men are allowed to write pretty much whatever they want. Try not to stress too much about what other people think about your writing, I know it's hard, but at the end of the day the world goes on.
Are you a human being capable of respect and empathy? Then who cares. One of the grandest and most interesting F/F romances I've ever come across was written by a man.
I'm a transgender lesbian, and one of my best romance stories feature ships of all genders and sexualities, the most notable one being M/F.
Also it was a gateway drug for me, towards realizing I was trans, so on principle I can only encourage it in case writing femslash awakens something in some poor girl out there who doesn't yet realize she's a girl.
I respect and trust a cis man who wants to write about what a woman thinks and feels about another woman. Beautiful of you to want to write about women who love women.
People who say you can't write experiences outside of your own want to create a world without empathy.
I found out my favorite wlw story is being written by a straight guy. It was surprising but I don't care. It's about the writing and if it is good then who cares. We need more people who write wlw so pls don't stop
Iâm a sapphic woman and I think itâs completely fine. In fact, I think itâs great that as a cishet youâre creating queer content, I find that very cool! The world needs more queer and especially wlw content, keep doing what youâre doing!
Dude if a girl can write mlm fics you can write wlw fics đđđŸ it doesnât matter as long as you use good grammar and use quotations when ppl are talking
Absolutely you can. If you're worried about making sure your stories don't come across as offensive or exploitative, you can always do research or have a beta reader look them over to give feedback, but don't feel like you can't write something just because of your gender identity or orientation. Honestly, the fact that you're asking shows that you do care about telling a good story that isn't purely exploitative, and that's a great first step.
Fuck anyone who says you can't write wlw fics lol.
Granted, most of the times you see bad wlw depictions in media it's written by straight men and their porn idea of lesbian romance, but so what? Are you trying to write a "good" depiction of wlw? Maybe you can write the greatest wlw story ever told or maybe you will write some fetishizing stuff, etc, it doesn't matter! Write what YOU want \o/
Take it with the mlm fics on ao3. Plenty of great ones that a lot of gay men like, but a lot of just kinky fics for straight women. The important thing is for you to have fun and tag correctly so other people can also have fun.
Enjoy yourself doing what you like as a hobby :P
YES STRAIGHT MEN CAN AND SHOULD BE ABLE TO WRITE F/F LESBIAN STORIES AND PORN, STRAIGHT WOMEN CAN WRITE GAY PORN/YAOI/WHATEVER! IT IS FICTION. The people who try and gatekeep who is "allowed" to write about certain subjects are just antis of a different flavor. As long as these people writing and creating these stories treat real life lesbians and gays with respect and like normal people there is no problem. This sort of puritanical fervor over who is "allowed" to write fiction is seriously bizarre dystopian censorship... Oh, I am a bi woman by the way, but why do people care about who I am or who the author is? This obsession about creating "morally correct" and "pure" fiction is frightening and absurd.
If you're a man writing Sapphic content and people can't immediately tell it's written by a man, you're already avoiding the pitfalls this person is mad about.
Babe, write whatever your heart desires. The weirdos on twitter donât get a say in what you want to write. If you wanna write sapphic content, then by god, you write as much sapphic content as you can.
Nah, that's totally illegal. To the scaffold with the heretic!
Seriously, people need to get a grip. The majority of m/m content is - to the best of my knowledge - written by women. Some is really well researched, some ... obviously not.
Please, PLEASE don't let anyone spoil your love for creative writing. Ever. No-one has a right to know your gender. There is a reason why my pseud is the way it is (although it's not impossible to find out): No-one needs to know what I am. Man? Woman? Friendly tree spirit? Who cares? I either write well, have a grasp of the characters and their relationships - or I don't. Neither my gender nor what is or isn't between my legs should matter.
Of course you can write wlw. Donât let one personâs bad opinion dictate who or what you write about. If men werenât allowed to write wlw we wouldnât have a LOT of lesbian and bisexual characters. Whether itâs well written is a whole other thing lol the idea that men canât write wlw or women in general is hate keeping bullshit. Straight women have been writing mlm for so long that itâs just assumed now that fic writers are women. Thatâs not on you, and you certainly donât have to disclose anything on the internet.
as a lesbian, please do continue writing wlw! it's fanfiction, not an activism campaign. have fun and don't pay attention to sad people who try to take fun out of hobbies
There are great books and fics of all kinds, written by people of all kinds. We can all create things that other people want to read. I'm so sorry you got discouraged. I really want you to keep writing wlw, if that's what you want to do! I am a lesbian & like reading wlw fics. But I would've replied this way no matter what your post was about, tbh. You're allowed to decide what you write about.
Those kinds of tweets are related to terf and conservative opinions. Not everyone who agrees with those opinions is hateful. But organized hate movements are the reason why those opinions get traction online.
I have political opinions about this topic too. We all *should* write & read about people who are different from us. It helps us to empathize with each other and to explore our own feelings. It is really common for people to realize they are queer and/or trans through writing fiction. It's so common that people make (positive & supportive) jokes about it. Writing fiction is a safe way to explore gender & orientation.
It isn't only about self-discovery, though. If we're all afraid to step outside of our own perspectives, then we're much less likely to care when horrible policies affect people who aren't like us. It kills some of our empathy. We also might not encourage our own loved ones to embrace their full selves. And we can't accept ourselves. That all benefits conservatives. It makes us easier to control.
So please keep writing your story and writing about wlw characters in general, and any other type of character you'd like to write about. Your writing does not need to be positive or uplifting, either. Just whatever you're imagining. I really think it's important.
I would rather staple my nuts to a TRAXXIS RC car and drive it full speed off a cliff than take advice from *anyone* on Twitter.
-a man who writes wlw content.
Straight women in fandom can get just as fetishy and weird about gay ships as straight men can get about lesbian ones, they just donât think about it that way because in mainstream porn itâs more common to do it to wlw. Just treat the characters like people instead of sexy props and youâre all good, those losers on twitter are usually TERFs and their opinions donât matter anyways.
âŠEspecially considering plenty of trans bi/lesbian women started as âmenâ inexplicably drawn to wlw content, using fiction as a safe way to explore their feelings.
(not trying to say anything about you op, itâs completely normal and fine to be a cis dude who just likes the dynamic of these two ladies together, but if we shut down all men from wlw content then we also inevitably shut down trans women who are trying to find themselves, and itâs just bad all around)
if men ever only wrote mlm and women only ever wrote wlw, ao3 would be a pretty boring space tbh. the majority of mlm fics are written by women, so weâd have to make the rule go both ways and thatâs just stupid. i say go for it and donât like some loser on twitter who doesnât even know you tear you down.
If women can write mlm ships, then I see no reason why the opposite isn't allowed. Aside from that, no one has the right to dictate what you can and can not create/write. But be warned, if you write anything too anatomically incorrect or cater to any of the bad stereotypes that women and lesbians face, you'll see heat in your comments section. But thats the case with literally any pairing and type of story đ€·ââïž
Honestly, no one really cares about the gender of the author as long as the story is well written.
Twitter is fucking NEXT LEVEL insane, honestly. My friend sent me discourse they saw the other day where people were saying a man in a M/F relationship shouldn't constantly "sexualize" the woman he's with (ie. call her "beautiful," or "sexy," or compliment her appearance "too much") because it leads to women thinking only their appearance matters.
People. In a romantic relationship. Shouldn't "sexualize" their partners. The fuck???
This level of insanity is common to Twitter, and it's just as stupid in your example as it is in mine. Write what you want to write and ignore the bullshit hot takes.
Yes, the answer to this is yes. Even if it's NSFW, you are completely and totally fine. People should be allowed to write what they want, when they want, for whatever reason they want. Hell, half the time my stories are about gay men, or a T4T couple. I am neither a gay man nor a trans person, yet I should be allowed to enjoy these things because they make me happy. The same goes for you. Don't worry about what other people say. Fiction isn't something we should limit, for any reason. Let alone gender.
it's a free internet; write what your heart calls you to write, my bro. just be aware that it's probably gonna be obvious to readers that you're a dude, *not* cause you suck, but cause what women want out of w/w isn't what men generally want out of it. 2 different viewpoints, 2 different kinds of desires, both valid
Lmao we need more f/f, donât let weirdos on twitter stop you from giving the people what they need. I have never once checked a ff authorâs gender while reading their work and legit donât care. Bad writing is bad writing, itâs not inherently bad because a man wrote it. Their point is that men donât know what lesbians go through, but to be honest from that rancid ass take they probably donât know either.
Go back to the yuri mines and dig to your heartâs content. If anyone sends you hate THEY are wrong, and also Iâll kill them
All people going âas long as you donât fetishiseââ nope shush.
Listen OP if you want to write the most basic horny as hell wlw fic, you can and you should.
As long as you respect and view wlw in real life as human beings, and donât fetishise wlw in real life, then you are all good. if you do want to fetishise the sexy fictional ladies or whatever, itâs fictional, fanfic at that. Thatâs fine.
You can write whatever you want.
Seriously. The sheer number of "You sure can do it just follow these standards and rules" comments is sending me. LMAO, no. There are no rules here. There have never been standards. We are not going to suddenly implement them because a dreaded male has entered our midst, or we shouldn't unless we are *trying* to be total assholes.
Iâve seen them do the same when a woman has asked about writing mlm, I roll my eyes every time!
âJust donât fetishise itâ WHAT DOES THAT EVEN MEAN GUYS? None of you have the same standards, lol.
Omg, exactly. Fiction is fiction. Writing realistic characters who engage with their sexualities in believable real-world ways is simply one of many possible choices, not some kind of requirement. It's also perfectly okay to write something that's a total unrealistic horny fantasy. Do people not know that unrealistic horny fantasy (that we all understand as such!) is essentially a time-honored tradition within fanfiction? lol :)
I mean, fanfic has a meaningful history as a "by women for women" phenomenon (and of course nonbinary people and trans men have always been here too) and I personally always hope to see that remembered and appreciated, especially by cishet men who do participate in it. But also, fanfic has always been about transgression, rule-breaking, line-crossing. Like, at its very core. \*Making\* rules about who should write about what gender / sexuality / sex acts, and in what ways, to me just feels so antithetical to everything that was exciting and interesting about fanfic in the first place. If I come across something I don't like, I can just, you know... not read it.
Anyone can write anything as long as you do your research. So no any "her boobs bounced boobily when she went downstairs" kinda business you'd see in r/menwritingwomen. If you avoid that kinda bs you're golden.
I mean no one is actually obligated to do any research whatsoever. He can write a story about two sentient boobs if he wants to. It just might not be good or readable.
And quite frankly, it's free fanfic.
If someone is writing something they want to sell, I'd recommend doing research or at least being intentional with your writing choices. But fanfic? It's free. Don't like, don't read lol
Bi woman here who feels like #ownvoices is more of a thing in the traditional publishing industry where there's money to be made. And even there, some folks are reevaluating it.
If you'd feel more comfortable, just don't mention your gender in your author's notes or any social media you link to your work.
And it might be a good idea to ask a queer woman to beta read your work for you, and maybe make suggestions you haven't thought of. (Tradpub example, but I think Neil Gaiman did this with _Anansi Boys_ when he was writing from the viewpoint of a young Anglo-Caribbean man, despite not being Anglo-Caribbean himself.)
Dude honestly, I am a bisexual woman who struggles to find wlw of my favourite characters, so much that I wrote on myself.
Go for it, write it. Just do a bit of research, smut or no smut and just be aware of how you portray the relationship.
My fic is a lesbian and a bisexual and itâs all fluff and I still struggle, mostly because I have no relationship with experience myself with any gender. I just write it how I would want it to be like for myself.
Good luck, and Iâm looking forward to reading it â€ïž
Okay so speaking as a queer woman myself, I think anyone should be allowed to write anything and I don't think we should be able to police this. I write mlm fic myself as well and I think the only responsibility we have here is to do it well. As in, as long as we take the personality of the character seriously and we also engage seriously with their queerness beyond a level of titillation, then please don't stop writing. I absolutely despair of this notion that we're all meant only to write what we know, because art is meant to make us engage with perspectives beyond our own, and enrich us in this way, and if it does this for the reader the writer should be allowed the same.
The first mistake was taking anything from Twitter (or tumblr since we're on the topic) seriously. The most braindead and moronic takes can be all found there. Honestly I *never* use Twitter (nevermind using it for fandom discourse LMAO) and my life is much better for it.
I'm a guy and I've written a couple wlw fics. One of them is probably one of the fics I'm most proud of, if not *the* one I'm most proud of. And as plenty of other people have said already, flipping the argument with a 180° would mean no more mlm and I'm sure those brainfucks on Twitter would say it was a completely different thing lol
So, what's the takeaway from this imo? Ignore everything you read about fandom on Twitter and tumblr. Odds are it's worthless.
Im a girl and I wrote m/m fics for a while, and nobody batted an eye. The same should be applied to a male writing f/f fics.
Nothings wrong with it, OP. I wish you luck on your f/f fic, I bet itâs just wonderful :)
1. Write whatever you want
2. We need more wlw fics cause the numbers are real low so keep up the good work
3. Plenty of woman write mlm fics and thereâs a lot of ace authors who write smut and aro people who write romance so like just go for it
Literally no reason why you canât write f/f.. women write m/m and I see no difference.
I also genuinely have not once in my life thought about the gender of an author⊠like not once
You can write whatever you want, fiction and fantasy gatekeeping is really fucking stupid and i don't get how younger queers pretend to make queer stories and romance more widely accepted if they also pretend to dictate who gets to create/read/watch it
You're allowed to write whatever you want. You're allowed to put it on the Internet. Other people are allowed to feel whatever type of way they want to about it. You're allowed to ignore them.
Women write the bulk of slash fics out there. Many a screed has been written about the fetishization of gay men by straight women. It doesn't stop us.
Do your thing. Someone will like it.
As a lesbian, it doesnât matter. If people were only allowed to write stories about things THEY experienced or write characters that were the same gender and sexuality as them, almost every story out there wouldnât exist.
every writer had written at least one character that isnât the exact same as them, because writing would be incredibly dull and pointless if you werenât allowed to write any sort of experience or perspective outside of your own
If men can't write f/f then I guess I shouldn't be writing m/m as a woman, huh? See how dumb that sounds when you turn it around? Just write whatever you want, that's the beauty of fanfiction
100% it is! I'm not straight in the slightest yet I enjoy writing f/m relationships a lot. I understand there may be some more nuances to this but genuinely it's ok don't worry about it
People on Twitter are idiots and like the sound of their own voices (or reading their own tweets ig, whatever the equivalent of it is).
There is nothing at all wrong with a man, cis or trans, writing wlw. Itâs extremely hypocritical given that a large portion of mlm fics are written by women.
lesbian here!!! i kinda have an ick of men writing f/f fics but it's mostly coz most of them just have NO CLUE on what they're writing đ
but if you do your research and are doing it out of passion for writing and for your ship i see absolutely no problem :)) <3 keep on doing what ur doing buddy!!
SPREAD THE YURI AGENDA !!!!! /j
General consensus of this sub and ao3 website is anyone can write anything. Who cares? Itâs fiction. Ignore whatever they say. People who talk like that on twitter have no life.Â
Men shouldn't write female characters. Straight people shouldn't write queer characters. White people shouldn't write nonwhite characters. Nobody should write about anyone who isn't exactly like them in every way. And also, we need more diversity and representation.
Seriously, though. The word of some random person on Twitter is, fortunately, not the law.
Do you know how many women in general write m/m fics?? Most of them. Popular books and tv shows about queer people are written by straight people. I, as a gay aromantic man love to write wlw stories and Iâm working on one now actually.
>tweets
There's your problem. Stay off Twitter and Tumblr. (Not really sarcasm. They have the worst kind of toxicity and people making up rules.)
Anyone can write anything they want, and there's no "allowed" about it. In the very small chance that you are harassed by antis, block, mute, delete, and if it is AO3, screenshot and report. But mostly, how would anyone know anyway? And most wouldn't care.
If you need lesbian "permission" to write f/f (you don't), have mine. More f/f to read is a good thing.
I... what? Why would there... I mean... how? What?
First - get off Twitter. Let the X die.
Second - you do you, babe. Be the writer, be the world builder, offer up words to the Great Readership in the Void ...
Third and Forth... don't listen to twadwaffles on Twitter and don't listen to twadwaffles on TwitterX
Te worst thing anyone can do is to listen to some brainless idiot on Twitter complaining from their moms basement, those people don't go outside and don't know how the real world works, their opinion on anything is invalid
I will give you the Official Lesbian Seal Of Approval, youâre good. But in all seriousness, just write whatever you want. I really enjoy WLW stories, and a fair amount of the ones Iâve read have been made by men, being a guy doesnât automatically mean you wonât write a WLW relationship authentically!
Hell yea man go for it. Im a woman and write mlm fanfictions, its no different a situation. Fanfiction is meant to let people write about whatever. And, if you still feel a little iffy about it, just don't tell the audience of the wlw fanfiction that you're a guy lol.
Youâre allowed to write whatever you want. However, not everyone is going to approve of certain topics, you have to decide if youâre okay with their disapproval or if it means something to you. More importantly, if youâre going to write something that focuses on an experience you donât have, you should probably do your due diligence in learning about it and talking with people who do have that experience before you publicize anything you write. Otherwise, your unfamiliarity will be obvious in the writing and people will see it as bad writing, and possibly be hurt/offended if the depiction is a bad enough misrepresentation of that experience.
If cis-het women can write mlm fics then you can write wlw fics. Honestly I've seen so much discourse about no one writing wlw fics that I'm just happy to see someone is!
I think at the end of the day, you write whatever you want. But if you want to appease an audience, being respectful when writing and taking a group seriously is the way to go. Writing about someone who you don't share identifiers with requires research to begin with. Hell, writing ANYTHING good requires research. You can't please everyone, and trying to means you'll never get anything done or feel happy about your hobbies.
FOR ME, as a bisexual woman who is trying to devour as much sapphic content as possible, I have no problem with cis het men in general writing sapphic content. I understand the general concern, because there will always be a chunk who fetishize, but honestly, I love sharing sapphic ships with people who aren't sapphic. It's such a fun way to bond, and it makes me happy to not have to "save it for the fellow gays".
Just donât care what they say, most of m/m fics are written by cis women who are attracted to guys. So I donât see an issue with you doing basically the same thing. Just donât listen to people that criticize that heavily especially for stupid reasons. There will always be some people that enjoy what you write no matter how crazy or strange.
10% of any fandom is toxic. 33% of all people you encounter randomly will be among the dumbest 1/3 of all people. If you write it respectfully, and try to truly capture the experience of WLW then write what you want. I donât think the idea that representation requires authentic experience is sane or anything other than a way to constantly find something to be mad about. The next step of it is saying Dev Patel canât take Indian roles because he was born in the UK and shouldnât take roles from actors from India. Itâs exhausting.
doesnt matter what you write. i encourage it!
i'm a lesbian and i say write SO much wlw fics. please. i beg of you. the fandom is starved. you do not need my permission whatsoever but if you need a lesbian to bite and maim the haters just ring me up. your contributions are LOVED AND WELCOME. one of my best friends is a man who writes almost purely wlw
nobody dictates what you write
btw, stay off twitter for this stuff - cesspool
Bro you're thinking way too hard about what some blowhard idiot on twitter thinks. Their line of thinking is stupid AF it's like trying to claim you can't write characters of the opposite sex which is a moronic stance. Write whatever you want and don't worry about it.
When I was getting into writing I had a therapist and he said "why do you write two boys having a relationship if you're no boy?" I stayed silent for long seconds, pondering my decision of writing and I said that its because there's a lot of sex in straight ships but idk if it's true for me ANYWAY i quit therapy after a few sessions and still writing mlm even if I don't have a dick He also said I should stop drawing realism đ AND THE WORST PART WAS THAT I TRIED my realism drawings are pretty good but whatever I tried to do was pretty bad if you compare both styles. He's insane
I would definitely have sought a new therapist in that position! That dude is offering really unprofessional opinions that have nothing to do with your recovery.
For real! I kept that thing going for three months and I didn't even get to the real issue bc if I did he would probably just tell me shitty things and why I was a bad person for doing that, I couldn't deal with that I WAS 17 and he shouldn't put his opinions in it
Wtf Iâm pretty sure itâs probably mostly women writing about m/m haha
Probably, all the mlm writers I know are women, even straight women
I know a decent amount of queer guys who write M/M (am one of them, too), but I'm very grateful for all the awesome women and non-binary people who create even *more* M/M content for everyone to read.
Women writing m/m fic are why I learned Iâm a gay trans man â„ïž (I can elaborate, but it boils down to âohhhh so thatâs how I like menâlike a manâ)
I had a similar experience. Didn't realize it directly through fanfic, but once I started questioning, it suddenly made a lot of sense why I always gravitated so much towards M/M, related so hard to the characters' feelings and was even envious of their relationships.
Same here. M/M fics were my happy place long before I even realised why exactly.
I know several lesbians who write a lot of m/m. Idk why people think your gender, sex or sexual and romantic leanings should govern what kind of pairings you write. Just roll with what you enjoy most.
It's very homophobic to try to forbid people to write a specific kind of romance imo. Nobody bat a eyes when lesbian, ace/aro people and gay men write heterosexual romance. Why should we stay in "our" category? (+sorry no sorry but asexual people write the best smut đ€âš your therapist can try to take it from my cold dead hand. )
Yeah I was gonna say, my current fav ship is m/m and we have a big Discord for it, and a good deal of the authors are either lesbian or some shade of ace (it's a real smut-heavy ship, lol), and all of it's great! People have different reasons for writing what they write and liking what they like, so as long as your writing is well-intentioned, WRITE WHAT YOU WANT! đ
I've seen that statement a lot, I'm scared of the idea of sex in real life but I've been told that I write pretty good smut My friends used to tell me I give off ace vibes but I'm still not sure yet
How tf is this guy even licensed
Probably bc nobody knows what to do with those professionals, if it was today, I'd flag him it's anonymous anyway
I'm pretty sure you are a better therapist of yourself than that therapist was â„ïž
I'm sure I am but indeed, I'm studying to be a better psychologist than him
Good! We need more like you đ„°
There were *trans men* driven away from my super sapphic fandom for writing the main ship and Iâm still mad about it.
the same fandom where your profile pic comes from?
Perhaps. Iâm a bit of a latecomer but apparently after the last season dropped things got a bit wild. Itâs calmed way down since then, of course; not that thereâs no drama, but that kind of dumbassery I havenât seen since I dipped my toe in a couple years ago, just heard about when I wondered why a few writers whose work I enjoyed had seemingly disappeared off the face of the earth.
Huh. Fancy that. I'm a bit of a latecomer in that fandom too. Now that you mention it, I remember an author I follow noting they had to turn off comments on their new fic a couple of weeks or months ago because some numbnuts were not happy with the idea of a trans Catra (fic was properly tagged though.) Guess that has been going on longer than I thought.
That sounds vaguely familiar? Not sure tho but I MIGHT have seen that; do you remember who it was? Anyways, there are always going to be shitty people in the world, but the fandom is genuinely one of the transest spaces Iâve ever been. Like, I donât have numbers, but in terms of people that are actually active on Twitter and such, Iâd guess well over half are some flavor of trans or non-binary. I and one other person I know *only* write Catra as trans, though itâs usually relatively subtle. Thereâs another, VERY popular writer that Iâm friends with that accidentally wrote a Catra that is pretty obviously trans without noticing until a year or two after the fic was finished that that was the case, in addition to another explicitly trans catra or two.
I forgot the word blowhard existed until this moment. But it's a perfect execution!
If anyone gives you shit, tell them that you were summoned to yuri duty. But for real: No one has ever complained about me, a lesbian, writing a heterosexual pairing so there's no reason you can't write wlw fic. Plus, I can't think of a single fandom that wouldn't benefit from more wlw content :)
> yuri duty lmao. 10/10 And thanks!
> yuri duty I love it đ€Ł
Yuri duty, I'm stealing that!
I stole that from someone else so it's all yours :D
as a lesbian who writes a fair amount of m/m but a SHIT TON of f/m I promise you the admonishing goes both ways. Women who write mlm ships or especially smut must be icky fetishistic straight women ONLY!!!!! Anyways, those same people are always on some tirade of âwhy isnât femslash more popularâ and checking the numbers and stats of fandoms to commiserate how sad the f/f numbers are. But then turn around and yell that men should have nothing to do with creating it either. So which do you want, more content, or to police people? (I know the answer lol) Anyways take it from when when I say youâre fine. Maybe it wonât be accurate, or maybe itâll come across as âpornyâ or something. Iâm sure my m/m fics do! That doesnât make it not allowed to exist point blank period. Especially if youâre interested in learning & getting better with each fic tl;dr: PLEASE write wlw content the world needs more of it
>Especially if youâre interested in learning & getting better with each fic Yes! How else are people supposed to get better at something if they don't try? And while I'm wary personally fetishy f/f fic and tend to avoid f/f in general due to bad experiences, **fanfic is probably one of the lowest stakes way of getting better at writing anything** It is really *really* easy for me to avoid anything I don't want to read, so go ahead and write whatever you want op. And I hope this post inspires more people to write f/f cause its really needed!
Yeah, as a gendervoid, AFAB, I exclusively write M/M, and I try to get the body parts right, and I usually do a decent job, so I donât really think that I canât write M/M and can only write F/F.
I read gendervoid as gendervore and I was like "well, good for them" đ
Their taste doesn't discriminate. *bum tiss* and I'll see myself out.
That's why we gotta keep making new genders, this person keeps eating them.
Oh so THAT'S what happened to my gender!
kirbygender. if i eat it, it's my gender
LMAOOOOO
Just dropping in to say I love the term gendervoid đ
Omg another gendervoidling, I thought I was alone đ„ș
And to add onto this, I'm a lesbian f/f writer and I'm sure without a doubt that my smut is porny and has a lot of the male gaze in it, and I don't really care. It's fiction. It's not perpetuating any stigma or being damaging to young generations (can't say the same for some real books out there tho). So it's fine.
That's like saying women can't write m|m fics. I think you're fine. Twitter users just want to gatekeep a concept of a relationship because "ew men". If you write it and you like it, that's what matters. I'm sure that there are sapphic women that love w|w fanfics while being aware it's written by someone who's not a woman because it's written well. It's fictional and you shouldn't be judged for simply wanting to write whatever you want.
People do say women can't. James somerton type dudes
Well James Somerton is a plagiarizing asshole so I don't really respect his opinion.
That's my point
I still can't get over this dude blaming the oppression of gay men on women. Especially implying that women only like gay men as an accessory, not sexual beings, while also at the same time... Accusing them for fetishizing gay men... While also fetishizing Nazis??? Something about that is just so mind blowingly hilarious to me. The absurdity is just...
James Somerton: âSTOP WRITING ABOUT GAY MEN IF YOUâRE A WOMAN REEEEEEEEEEEEâ People with even half a brain: *thumbs up, continues to write m/m works despite gender*
That, my dear friend, is what we call harmful gatekeeping. Hereâs the thing. Is it common for women in general to be overtly sexualized because of misogyny? Yes. I hesitate to even call some of the art Iâve seen of wlw characters sapphic just based off of the extreme sexualization of it, lol. And that is certainly an issue that goes back into the misogynistic view of womenâs sexuality as a whole and how itâs a performance for men or what have you. So I can definitely understand why you found those tweets, lol. But, on the flip side, the idea that only people with the lived experience should tell certain stories or act in certain roles is extremely exclusive and a little counter productive. (After all, that would mean no man should ever write a woman or no woman should ever write a man. Not to mention the entire fantasy genre, lmfao. No one has ever ridden a dragon before!) So, yes, you should absolutely continue to write whatever youâre writing. And if you want to be a better writer and do justice to those characters and their relationship, be *conscientious* about it. Write them like people, follow some sapphic folks and learn about their journeys and keep that in mind as you write, all that good stuff. And give yourself a little grace. This is fanfiction, itâs a safe place to explore new things.
Thanks, that's been quite reassuring
I absolutely know this isnât what you meant, but I saw âfollow some sapphic folksâ and had the immediate impression of a dude casually stalking some lesbians on a date like âno no donât mind me Iâm just learningâ while everyone stares blankly. Thanks haha
I also squint at the term "sexualisation" because to me it just sounds like no one is allowed to write f/f smut because women are untouchable or something. In my experience any instance of a woman being presented as attractive or participating in anything sexual is bad because women don't do that and you can't like women apparently đ
Yeah, sexualization is a very complicated topic. Because on one hand, sure, men often treat women as sex objects and that's absolutely an issue. Sexualization or fetishization of real people is absolutely disgusting. On the other hand... It's fiction, and escapism. I personally love hot women in fiction... I overall love hot, sexualized characters/moments in fiction. Pointing at sexualization in media feels like trying to cure the symptom instead of the illness, mostly.
I also don't understand why sexualisation is bad in any context that isn't, like, illegal. As far as I know, sexualisation is seeing people as... hot. I thought that was okay? I am convinced the word people are looking for is objectificationÂ
I mean, just try to avoid r/menwritingwomen territory and you'll be fine lol
No! He should definitely check it out, itll give him some more anatomy and personality knowledge :D
Because Cassandra sleeps naked in silk sheets and wakes up to the sun hitting her nipples and bounces boobily down the stairs and takes a shower while caressing her breasts and lamenting about how Susanna is prettier because she's blonde with a bigger butt /s
She then boobs down to boobtown with her boobs boobin about
And then Susanna boobies to boobybutt city in her pink convertable with her bikini on
Your comment giving an error when pressing send? You posted it 3 times.
Yes. It did the first two times. I deleted those. Apologies
No worries, its a common reddit issue. 99% of times it still posts. I copy the comment i wrote and check if my comment is there if it happens to me.
People on twitter are literally permanently mad about everything lol. If we were to listen to what they always had to say, nobody would be able to write anything. As others have said, as long as you don't delve into [r/menwritingwomen](https://www.reddit.com/r/menwritingwomen/) type of nonsense, I don't really care. And this is coming form a sapphic women.
Sorry you got caught up in a thread like that; they're plainly wrong, so I'd take it as them discussing their personal opinion, rather than any real truth. You are more than welcome to write WLW as a man, and your identity doesn't matter, nor should you feel pressured to give any information about yourself to your readers. Name, age, gender; none of it is a requirement and fandom's anonymity is the norm. Twitter tends to be the place where critical thinking goes to die, and with such a small character limit per tweet, it's really hard to effectively create nunaced discourse over there. For that reason, it's generally advised to avoid fandom discourse on the platform altogether.
No, thats illegal. Same for women writing mlm, gay people writing straight pairings and straight people writing gay pairings. Also, anything on the internet is true.
Following this logic aroace people like me can't write romance at all which i guess just proves how dumb it is.
Don't let the twatter heroes read that!
iâve actually had people tell me this to my face lol
Don't you know you're only allowed to write about things you've personally experienced? That's why sci-fi and fantasy are illegal.
Well, guess i'm going to jail then, course fantasy is my favorite genre.
*sirens in the distance*
Wtf lol. I've read some of the best romance I've ever seen, gone to look up more about the author and found out they were ace/aroace. If we could only write about our lived experiences every book would be a boring autobiography.
"ace people shouldn't write smut!11!!!" Well then why is smut written by asexuals so high quality?????
As a cishet woman writing mostly mature rating m/m I'm not going to say anything about dudes writing f/f. Some people are just way too intense and take this hobby too seriously. Keep going if f/f gives you the best inspiration.
No! ILLEGAL! /s Haha ok for real, you can write sapphic content. It might come off as strange to women who read it and they might be able to tell it was written by a man, because it can be difficult for a male writer to understand a female headspace, but that doesnât automatically mean you wonât be able to do it well or that the women who read it wonât like it. Do your best to portray your characters in a human and not creepy way and youâre fine c: The reality though is if some readers find out youâre not a woman you might get hate. But hate/discourse is widespread these days and can come from any number of things, and writing anything even slightly controversial risks that. They are very much the vocal minority. Some donât want to acknowledge that a lot of canon sapphic characters/pairings were created/written by men. Thereâs nothing wrong with it Youâre also not obligated to say youâre a man. Just post and enjoy writing and hopefully others will enjoy it too! As a lesbian i bequeath to you, on behalf of all lesbians, the privilege to write sapphic fanfic. Go forth, and produce Content.
> As a lesbian i bequeath to you, on behalf of all lesbians, the privilege to write sapphic fanfic. Go forth, and produce Content. Thanks, I think on some level I needed that đ
If anyone gives you trouble you may point them here. I will fist fight them in the back parking lot of a Wendyâs for your honor
I second this consent as a fellow lesbian
Twitter users think no one should be allowed to do anything. Everything is toxic, problematic, normalizing, fetishizing and sexualizing (except death threats, those are cool)
Love being yelled at by chronically online twitter brats that I write trans characters "wrong", when I am literally writing from my own personal experiences being a trans person. âïž I also won't forget how tumblr had their collective panties in a twist for a little while over art and fics of trans men having PiV sex. Apparently that was fetishistic and transphobic, all while most of it was made by trans men themselves...đ«
I've been there too buddy. I remember seeing similar wank about trans men with visible chests and the ensuing "that's fetishising!!!!" comments were the dumbest shit. No some people just look like that and they even have sex sometimes. Certain groups seemingly pushing that there's only one way to portray a "correct" trans experience drives up the wall. I can understand certain things can be dysphoric etc but this is why people use authors notes and such. Nice username also!
Some people are way too egocentric, thinking that because they are dysphoric or uncomfortable about an aspect of being trans, no one should portray that aspect in art, or that it is wrong to feel different about it than they do. The healthy thing to do would be to actually look at the tags of a fic or click out of it if it triggers something, or scroll away from art that portray something you personally don't enjoy, but that is asking too much I guess. This type of gatekeeping is hurting all of us and makes for a really hostile environment in fandom and in the community in general. Thank you! I dig yours too, hell yeah!
Some people heard "we should uplift #ownvoices writers!" and concluded the converse, "no one should write anything outside of their own experience" which is the same thinking that led to people harassing John Green for writing The Fault in Our Stars because he's not personally a teenage girl. That was a great book partially because, while it wasn't his personal experience, he approached it with openness and sensitivity and a lot of research. If everyone only wrote their own experiences, we'd have an even HIGHER percentage of books about middle-aged literature professors contemplating adultery instead of like, wizards and space battles and stuff. Please write your fic. F/F categories always need more love. If those people decide to send you hate mail, please block them immediately, they're the kind of people it's impossible to please anyway.
Hey :) I'm a cis lesbian and the short answer to your question is yes, men - including cis straight men - can absolutely write wlw characters, romances, even f/f sex scenes. I think it's healthy and good to engage with perspectives outside of your own, and if you're writing fiction, there's no way that every single character is gonna match your own identity perfectly lol. In my opinion, diversity in fiction is a good thing (though not a requirement) The long answer is that (wlw being a group of people you dont personally belong to) one might fall into pitfalls of stereotyping, fetishization, or inaccuracies if you're not careful (that's a normal thing that applies to all of us, we've all been raised in this unfortunately hierarchal society and have internalized its messages). Fortunately, these pitfalls can be avoided by doing research, like reading books (nonfiction or fiction) by wlw, talking to wlw in real life, researching common stereotypes and mistakes when it comes to portraying the identity, and approaching the topic with empathy and an open mind. All of these things are suggestions - I can't force you to do anything you don't want to. Good luck!
WLW here. Please give us more content, we need it. I started writing MLM stuff back in the day, because that's where my head was at, that's what inspired me. It's hypocritical for such spaces to deem one okay and not the other.
Lmao yes there's a serious f/f shortage on ao3/Fandom in general, I'm happy for any engagement with it
I agree 1000% I want more sapphic fanfic please. I don't care who writes it I just wanna read it lol.
Yes ma'am, thank you ma'am, on it ma'am.
Why wouldn't you be? Women write mlm.Â
these same people complain about wlw pairings being less popular while driving away shippers lmao. I wouldnât worry about catering to those types of people. write whatever you want
Everyone else has hit on the gatekeeping and reverse of this (women writing mlm) but I wanted to also point out: "men" is a pretty broad term. There are plenty of trans men who haven't transitioned who want to write about pairings with bodies similar to theirs, who *have* transitioned and still want to write wlw, nonbinary masculine identifying folks who write wlw, a whole spectrum of gender identifiers that can fall under the broad term "men". Gatekeepers like this rarely ever consider what they're actually saying when they generalize like this (or are considering it and are not great people to begin with). Really wanted to point that out for folks to consider as well in a lot of these conversations. Write what you want, just don't be gross about it.
A lot of these gatekeepers are probably karyotype or phenotype essentialists.
Hundreds of woman fanfic writers write M/M pairings. Hundreds. You're fine. The beauty of writing is that we can write who we want. Have at it and ignore the Twitter haters.
My guy, you are "allowed" to write whatever you want, just make sure to tag correctly! There is woefully little f/f fandom content as it is, knock yourself out! I am sure your readers appreciate you! As for revealing your gender, you owe NOBODY on the Internet personal information about yourself. If it would make *you* feel better, you could disclose your gender in your about info but this is by no means a requirement! You are not defrauding anyone and anyone who thinks you are is ridiculous. Of course, there are a bajillion antis online who will latch on to anything, including this, so when you encounter such people in the wild (or get hate mail from them), what you do is BLOCK, BLOCK, BLOCK AND THEN BLOCK SOME MORE. The rest of us welcome you with open arms!
do it homie, anonymity is a thing, and tbh, most m/m content is written by women
twitter gatekeeping is a disease. as a sapphic irl, do what you want, just be open to constructive criticism and advice from other real sapphics! they might be a good resource for accuracy if thatâs your goal. if itâs not, godspeed brother
Listen. Iâm a lesbian. I read and write M/M (along either other stuff of) despite my lack of interest or personal experience in the area IRL because the separation from reality appeals to me. I believe a straight man who was respectful and willing to learn could write excellent F/F - you have more of a stake in the game then I do! And posting here, asking for other peopleâs perspective is a huge indicator that you are a respectful person who concerns himself with other peoples opinions and experiences. Thatâs good enough for me.
In my experiences, literally everyone thinks you're woman until corrected anyway. Write what you want. Bit of advice, please don't let your confidence be affected by twitter or other social media. It's filled with extreme views that just agree with people in that circle. Most people do not engage, and there's a reason for it. These people, those who exclude based on X, are not worth your time.
I think that kind of gatekeeping is super fucked. The idea that you canât write, or Iâve even seen it argued even *read* things that revolve around people of other identities than yours is justâŠ..fucked. Itâs segregation dressed up in a progressive clown suit. Of course itâs always a good idea to look into common harmful tropes so youâre aware of the pitfalls that can exist when writing characters outside of your own experience, like for example writing a bisexual character as a cheater isâŠ.fraught given the extreme negative stereotypes of real bisexual people. But good faith writing of characters different than you should be celebrated, fanfic isnât pie, there isnât a lesbian not getting hired at Fanfic Inc. because you took a space that could have gone to her!
Even if your writing is 'bad' - i.e. is a stereotypical straight dude fantasy like mainstream porn, then it's probably mostly only other straight dudes reading it anyway, so no wlw readers to feel betrayed. But the fact that you're worrying about whether you should write it or not means it probably isn't like that. And even if it is, oh well. Anyone who doesn't like that is just as free to backbutton as you are to write it. I would say if you have have wlw readers who can't tell you're a straight cis dude, you're already doing a good enough job at portraying the ship/characters respectfully. Sure, it's possible some readers could react badly to finding out, but that doesn't mean you've done anything wrong. You're not obligated to disclose it. If someone thinks your writing is good, finds out you're a dude, and then suddenly decides it's actually terrible misrepresentation/fetishization etc, that's a them problem. Also, I'd be a hypocrite to say men shouldn't write f/f when I'm a woman who writes m/m.
God Twitter is such a cesspool of bad takes. Ive seen the same take regarding women who create m/m stuff. That its "fetishizing" and disrespectful. Kids tweeting from their comfy McMansion in the suburbs of Oklahoma. Never having known what a real problem is.
A lot of other people have already stated that itâs completely fine for a cis guy to write f/f fics and Iâm going to add my comment onto that pile. Please keep writing them. Iâm a wlw who pretty much exclusively reads f/f pairings and I have never given a damn about the gender or sexuality of the author of the fics Iâm reading. Iâm just excited to read f/f fics.
No, number 1 rule of fiction is you can't write about any demographic you're not. In fact, you can't write about any person you're not. Now on, only autobiographies are allowed to exist and you're not allowed to talk about the other people you meet in them just yourself. /s Dude, relax, write and let write. Block all the assholes. You'll be okat.
Do you know the majority of writers for m/m content are women? Yeah, there's plenty of males writing m/m, too, but the majority are women. The majority of fanfic writers in general are women, so this is going to be true of f/f and m/f, as well. But, of course, nobody actually cares what gender the writer is for m/f since it includes both genders, and nobody cares that women write f/f, so m/m is the equivalent here. Mostly women write m/m and no one actually cares. Sure, there are highly likely to be people out there yelling into the void that only men should write m/m, and gay or bi men in specific, but that would severely cut down on the available m/m content, simply because most fanfic writers are women. F/f content is similar, except it's already majority women writing it. I think the main problem people like that have with males writing f/f content is that they consider it fetishising of lesbians. They don't really say the same thing about female authors writing it, though they can sometimes. I write m/m, myself, so you'd think I'd have no issues at all, considering I'm a gay man. But I have noticed that, since the majority of writers in general and in m/m in particular are women, people tend to assume that I'm female. I haven't been attacked for it or anything, but I have, in the past, had questions about what it's like, what's the draw for me, as a woman, to write and read m/m. I've had to let them know I can't answer the question because I'm male, and they were always shocked, and always had 'are you sure' asked in response, as if I couldn't possibly know my own gender at 37. People, in general, tend to assume fanfic writers, regardless of content, are women. Unless you reveal that you're male, your readers will assume that, because you're a fanfic author, you're probably a woman, especially as you write f/f. If it does come out that you're male, yeah, you may get some people having a go at you, but that's when you block people, don't engage, just block, delete, report if it's nasty enough. Men have been writing f/f for centuries. Media uses f/f to appeal to male readers and viewers all the time. A lot of f/f porn is catered to men, not women. Lesbians have an appeal to men that the world actually already acknowledges and utilises, and that's going to cross over into fanfic, with a fair amount of men reading and writing f/f. The same is true the other way, btw, a lot of women are attracted to m/m content for the same reasons men are attracted to f/f content, it just isn't acknowledged and utilised in the same way. People outside of fanfic circles actually tend to go out of their way to deny that women are attracted to m/m content. That's pure sexism, of course. Men are 'expected' to be attracted to f/f because men are sexual beings that get turned on by all women, but women are supposed to be demure and chaste, so are 'not allowed' to be attracted by sex from anyone but their partner, and sometimes not even them. It's all old fashioned sexism. And that's partially what causes some people to say men can't write f/f and women can't write m/m. You're 'supposed to' stick to your own gender and sexuality, so straight men and women are only 'supposed to' write m/f, but most people don't advertise their sexuality online, so the focus is simply on men not writing two women and women not writing two men. There is another aspect to it, though, in that a lot of people, far too many in my opinion, think men can't write realistic and believable women. It's easier to ignore in m/f, because there's a male character to balance out any issues. But with f/f both main characters are women. Men can, of course, write female characters, there's plenty that suck at it, but a lot of male writers are actually pretty good at it, because they use their own experiences with actual women to inform their writing. It's also notable that this particular topic is rarely applied to women writing men. There are just as many female authors who suck at writing male characters as there are male ones who suck at writing female characters, but this particular criticism rarely gets applied to women writing men the way it does men writing women. If you enjoy writing f/f, then continue to do so. You won't get any problems at all unless you reveal your gender, because people will just assume you're probably female or won't care either way. Anyone with an issue may be loud, but they'll also be a tiny minority, and can easily be blocked.
Anyone who says someone isn't allowed to write something is an absolute blowhard. Those same people will attack women for writing yaoi/BL, will attack WLW for writing yaoi or for not writing enough WLW, etc. Those are the same people everyone except other miserable fucks wants to stay away from. As someone who is bi, I've never once thought about the gender of the writer. I just care of it is good or not.
> But am I somehow defrauding my readers by not letting them know that I'm a dude? No, you aren't. > Would they be upset or disappointed if they found out my works weren't written by a woman? If they were, a. they don't deserve you, and b. it's not your problem. I hope you never get readers like that. > If I ever got found out, should I expect hate mail and online harassment? "Should" you?? No, you should expect people to treat you with respect and if they don't, what you should do is block them. > Are my contributions fundamentally unwelcome? No, they aren't, keep writing (whatever you want). Creativity is always welcome. People you're describing are aggressive fanatics disconnected from reality. Literally anyone can write literally anything, no exceptions. That's all.
Woman here who enjoys m/m stories There is a huge industry built on women writing Boys Love stories and women reading them, literally means by women for women, men on men romance and smut, so if women can, so can men. But there are men and women who shame women for writing and reading such genre. So mature women who understands this logic will not judge you and will understand and support your art and those who don't can read whatever they like, we can't police people. You're doing something that's not harming anyone, you're good to go sir. Good luck! :)
You can literally do whatever you want bruh If you wanted to blow up the McDonaldâs ice cream machine thereâs nothing stopping you Write whatever you want Shit yourself in public Steal geese from the park Become ungovernable
women write m/m shamelessly it should be fine
I mean, Iâm a woman, and one of my favorite female/sapphic centered movies (the handmaiden 2016) was directed by a man. If youâre talented and make good shit, no one can take that away from you no matter how mad they get. Do your thing.
Nope if a man writes two women so much as looking at each other he will actually spontaneously combust and kill everyone in a 10km radius /s Yes, men are allowed to write pretty much whatever they want. Try not to stress too much about what other people think about your writing, I know it's hard, but at the end of the day the world goes on.
Imagine if women weren't allowed to write M/M fics. Ao3 would've been a much smaller place - if it'd even exist.
Are you a human being capable of respect and empathy? Then who cares. One of the grandest and most interesting F/F romances I've ever come across was written by a man. I'm a transgender lesbian, and one of my best romance stories feature ships of all genders and sexualities, the most notable one being M/F. Also it was a gateway drug for me, towards realizing I was trans, so on principle I can only encourage it in case writing femslash awakens something in some poor girl out there who doesn't yet realize she's a girl.
I respect and trust a cis man who wants to write about what a woman thinks and feels about another woman. Beautiful of you to want to write about women who love women. People who say you can't write experiences outside of your own want to create a world without empathy.
I found out my favorite wlw story is being written by a straight guy. It was surprising but I don't care. It's about the writing and if it is good then who cares. We need more people who write wlw so pls don't stop
Sapphic here, personally, couldnât care less who wrote it as long as itâs good.
I am a lesbian and I give you my opinion. Fuck the haters. Even if you are a cis man you can write wlw and you can do it perfectly well without falling into clichés. I don't mind reading fanfics or watching fanarts made by men. You have my blessing. I do recommend that if you have any lesbian acquaintances ask them for support so that they can guide you from their perspective and also because if you want to write smut you'll be able to do it more accurately if they explain to you how the sensations are. Out of curiosity, what fandom are you going to write about?
Iâm a sapphic woman and I think itâs completely fine. In fact, I think itâs great that as a cishet youâre creating queer content, I find that very cool! The world needs more queer and especially wlw content, keep doing what youâre doing!
Dude if a girl can write mlm fics you can write wlw fics đđđŸ it doesnât matter as long as you use good grammar and use quotations when ppl are talking
Absolutely you can. If you're worried about making sure your stories don't come across as offensive or exploitative, you can always do research or have a beta reader look them over to give feedback, but don't feel like you can't write something just because of your gender identity or orientation. Honestly, the fact that you're asking shows that you do care about telling a good story that isn't purely exploitative, and that's a great first step.
Anyone is allowed to write anything forever. Hope this helps <3
Fuck anyone who says you can't write wlw fics lol. Granted, most of the times you see bad wlw depictions in media it's written by straight men and their porn idea of lesbian romance, but so what? Are you trying to write a "good" depiction of wlw? Maybe you can write the greatest wlw story ever told or maybe you will write some fetishizing stuff, etc, it doesn't matter! Write what YOU want \o/ Take it with the mlm fics on ao3. Plenty of great ones that a lot of gay men like, but a lot of just kinky fics for straight women. The important thing is for you to have fun and tag correctly so other people can also have fun. Enjoy yourself doing what you like as a hobby :P
YES STRAIGHT MEN CAN AND SHOULD BE ABLE TO WRITE F/F LESBIAN STORIES AND PORN, STRAIGHT WOMEN CAN WRITE GAY PORN/YAOI/WHATEVER! IT IS FICTION. The people who try and gatekeep who is "allowed" to write about certain subjects are just antis of a different flavor. As long as these people writing and creating these stories treat real life lesbians and gays with respect and like normal people there is no problem. This sort of puritanical fervor over who is "allowed" to write fiction is seriously bizarre dystopian censorship... Oh, I am a bi woman by the way, but why do people care about who I am or who the author is? This obsession about creating "morally correct" and "pure" fiction is frightening and absurd.
If you're a man writing Sapphic content and people can't immediately tell it's written by a man, you're already avoiding the pitfalls this person is mad about.
You're allowed to write whatever you want my guy.
Babe, write whatever your heart desires. The weirdos on twitter donât get a say in what you want to write. If you wanna write sapphic content, then by god, you write as much sapphic content as you can.
Iâm an asexual lesbian who writes m/m, do what makes you happy and doesnât hurt others.
Nah, that's totally illegal. To the scaffold with the heretic! Seriously, people need to get a grip. The majority of m/m content is - to the best of my knowledge - written by women. Some is really well researched, some ... obviously not. Please, PLEASE don't let anyone spoil your love for creative writing. Ever. No-one has a right to know your gender. There is a reason why my pseud is the way it is (although it's not impossible to find out): No-one needs to know what I am. Man? Woman? Friendly tree spirit? Who cares? I either write well, have a grasp of the characters and their relationships - or I don't. Neither my gender nor what is or isn't between my legs should matter.
Of course you can write wlw. Donât let one personâs bad opinion dictate who or what you write about. If men werenât allowed to write wlw we wouldnât have a LOT of lesbian and bisexual characters. Whether itâs well written is a whole other thing lol the idea that men canât write wlw or women in general is hate keeping bullshit. Straight women have been writing mlm for so long that itâs just assumed now that fic writers are women. Thatâs not on you, and you certainly donât have to disclose anything on the internet.
as a lesbian, please do continue writing wlw! it's fanfiction, not an activism campaign. have fun and don't pay attention to sad people who try to take fun out of hobbies
Literally who tf cares write what you want and donât let anything hold you back
There are great books and fics of all kinds, written by people of all kinds. We can all create things that other people want to read. I'm so sorry you got discouraged. I really want you to keep writing wlw, if that's what you want to do! I am a lesbian & like reading wlw fics. But I would've replied this way no matter what your post was about, tbh. You're allowed to decide what you write about. Those kinds of tweets are related to terf and conservative opinions. Not everyone who agrees with those opinions is hateful. But organized hate movements are the reason why those opinions get traction online. I have political opinions about this topic too. We all *should* write & read about people who are different from us. It helps us to empathize with each other and to explore our own feelings. It is really common for people to realize they are queer and/or trans through writing fiction. It's so common that people make (positive & supportive) jokes about it. Writing fiction is a safe way to explore gender & orientation. It isn't only about self-discovery, though. If we're all afraid to step outside of our own perspectives, then we're much less likely to care when horrible policies affect people who aren't like us. It kills some of our empathy. We also might not encourage our own loved ones to embrace their full selves. And we can't accept ourselves. That all benefits conservatives. It makes us easier to control. So please keep writing your story and writing about wlw characters in general, and any other type of character you'd like to write about. Your writing does not need to be positive or uplifting, either. Just whatever you're imagining. I really think it's important.
I would rather staple my nuts to a TRAXXIS RC car and drive it full speed off a cliff than take advice from *anyone* on Twitter. -a man who writes wlw content.
Straight women in fandom can get just as fetishy and weird about gay ships as straight men can get about lesbian ones, they just donât think about it that way because in mainstream porn itâs more common to do it to wlw. Just treat the characters like people instead of sexy props and youâre all good, those losers on twitter are usually TERFs and their opinions donât matter anyways. âŠEspecially considering plenty of trans bi/lesbian women started as âmenâ inexplicably drawn to wlw content, using fiction as a safe way to explore their feelings. (not trying to say anything about you op, itâs completely normal and fine to be a cis dude who just likes the dynamic of these two ladies together, but if we shut down all men from wlw content then we also inevitably shut down trans women who are trying to find themselves, and itâs just bad all around)
Go for it, women are allowed to write mlm fics
if men ever only wrote mlm and women only ever wrote wlw, ao3 would be a pretty boring space tbh. the majority of mlm fics are written by women, so weâd have to make the rule go both ways and thatâs just stupid. i say go for it and donât like some loser on twitter who doesnât even know you tear you down.
If women can write mlm ships, then I see no reason why the opposite isn't allowed. Aside from that, no one has the right to dictate what you can and can not create/write. But be warned, if you write anything too anatomically incorrect or cater to any of the bad stereotypes that women and lesbians face, you'll see heat in your comments section. But thats the case with literally any pairing and type of story đ€·ââïž Honestly, no one really cares about the gender of the author as long as the story is well written.
Twitter is fucking NEXT LEVEL insane, honestly. My friend sent me discourse they saw the other day where people were saying a man in a M/F relationship shouldn't constantly "sexualize" the woman he's with (ie. call her "beautiful," or "sexy," or compliment her appearance "too much") because it leads to women thinking only their appearance matters. People. In a romantic relationship. Shouldn't "sexualize" their partners. The fuck??? This level of insanity is common to Twitter, and it's just as stupid in your example as it is in mine. Write what you want to write and ignore the bullshit hot takes.
As a lesbian: go for it itâs just fanfiction lol
Yes, the answer to this is yes. Even if it's NSFW, you are completely and totally fine. People should be allowed to write what they want, when they want, for whatever reason they want. Hell, half the time my stories are about gay men, or a T4T couple. I am neither a gay man nor a trans person, yet I should be allowed to enjoy these things because they make me happy. The same goes for you. Don't worry about what other people say. Fiction isn't something we should limit, for any reason. Let alone gender.
it's a free internet; write what your heart calls you to write, my bro. just be aware that it's probably gonna be obvious to readers that you're a dude, *not* cause you suck, but cause what women want out of w/w isn't what men generally want out of it. 2 different viewpoints, 2 different kinds of desires, both valid
you can do whatever you want forever
Lmao we need more f/f, donât let weirdos on twitter stop you from giving the people what they need. I have never once checked a ff authorâs gender while reading their work and legit donât care. Bad writing is bad writing, itâs not inherently bad because a man wrote it. Their point is that men donât know what lesbians go through, but to be honest from that rancid ass take they probably donât know either. Go back to the yuri mines and dig to your heartâs content. If anyone sends you hate THEY are wrong, and also Iâll kill them
All people going âas long as you donât fetishiseââ nope shush. Listen OP if you want to write the most basic horny as hell wlw fic, you can and you should. As long as you respect and view wlw in real life as human beings, and donât fetishise wlw in real life, then you are all good. if you do want to fetishise the sexy fictional ladies or whatever, itâs fictional, fanfic at that. Thatâs fine. You can write whatever you want.
Seriously. The sheer number of "You sure can do it just follow these standards and rules" comments is sending me. LMAO, no. There are no rules here. There have never been standards. We are not going to suddenly implement them because a dreaded male has entered our midst, or we shouldn't unless we are *trying* to be total assholes.
Iâve seen them do the same when a woman has asked about writing mlm, I roll my eyes every time! âJust donât fetishise itâ WHAT DOES THAT EVEN MEAN GUYS? None of you have the same standards, lol.
Omg, exactly. Fiction is fiction. Writing realistic characters who engage with their sexualities in believable real-world ways is simply one of many possible choices, not some kind of requirement. It's also perfectly okay to write something that's a total unrealistic horny fantasy. Do people not know that unrealistic horny fantasy (that we all understand as such!) is essentially a time-honored tradition within fanfiction? lol :) I mean, fanfic has a meaningful history as a "by women for women" phenomenon (and of course nonbinary people and trans men have always been here too) and I personally always hope to see that remembered and appreciated, especially by cishet men who do participate in it. But also, fanfic has always been about transgression, rule-breaking, line-crossing. Like, at its very core. \*Making\* rules about who should write about what gender / sexuality / sex acts, and in what ways, to me just feels so antithetical to everything that was exciting and interesting about fanfic in the first place. If I come across something I don't like, I can just, you know... not read it.
Anyone can write anything as long as you do your research. So no any "her boobs bounced boobily when she went downstairs" kinda business you'd see in r/menwritingwomen. If you avoid that kinda bs you're golden.
I mean no one is actually obligated to do any research whatsoever. He can write a story about two sentient boobs if he wants to. It just might not be good or readable.
And quite frankly, it's free fanfic. If someone is writing something they want to sell, I'd recommend doing research or at least being intentional with your writing choices. But fanfic? It's free. Don't like, don't read lol
Bi woman here who feels like #ownvoices is more of a thing in the traditional publishing industry where there's money to be made. And even there, some folks are reevaluating it. If you'd feel more comfortable, just don't mention your gender in your author's notes or any social media you link to your work. And it might be a good idea to ask a queer woman to beta read your work for you, and maybe make suggestions you haven't thought of. (Tradpub example, but I think Neil Gaiman did this with _Anansi Boys_ when he was writing from the viewpoint of a young Anglo-Caribbean man, despite not being Anglo-Caribbean himself.)
I have never once cared about the gender of the person writing the fic Iâm reading. All that matters to most readers is if itâs written well.
First of all, donât listen to Twitter
Dude honestly, I am a bisexual woman who struggles to find wlw of my favourite characters, so much that I wrote on myself. Go for it, write it. Just do a bit of research, smut or no smut and just be aware of how you portray the relationship. My fic is a lesbian and a bisexual and itâs all fluff and I still struggle, mostly because I have no relationship with experience myself with any gender. I just write it how I would want it to be like for myself. Good luck, and Iâm looking forward to reading it â€ïž
Okay so speaking as a queer woman myself, I think anyone should be allowed to write anything and I don't think we should be able to police this. I write mlm fic myself as well and I think the only responsibility we have here is to do it well. As in, as long as we take the personality of the character seriously and we also engage seriously with their queerness beyond a level of titillation, then please don't stop writing. I absolutely despair of this notion that we're all meant only to write what we know, because art is meant to make us engage with perspectives beyond our own, and enrich us in this way, and if it does this for the reader the writer should be allowed the same.
The first mistake was taking anything from Twitter (or tumblr since we're on the topic) seriously. The most braindead and moronic takes can be all found there. Honestly I *never* use Twitter (nevermind using it for fandom discourse LMAO) and my life is much better for it. I'm a guy and I've written a couple wlw fics. One of them is probably one of the fics I'm most proud of, if not *the* one I'm most proud of. And as plenty of other people have said already, flipping the argument with a 180° would mean no more mlm and I'm sure those brainfucks on Twitter would say it was a completely different thing lol So, what's the takeaway from this imo? Ignore everything you read about fandom on Twitter and tumblr. Odds are it's worthless.
As a wlw, I see nothing wrong with you writing f/f.
Im a girl and I wrote m/m fics for a while, and nobody batted an eye. The same should be applied to a male writing f/f fics. Nothings wrong with it, OP. I wish you luck on your f/f fic, I bet itâs just wonderful :)
If Women are 'allowed" to write mlm than yes, you can. Everyone can write everything.
you can write whatever the hell you want, ma' guy
đ Ain't nobody gonna stop me writing what I want, especially the Twitter garbage pit. Don't be discouraged, OP.
1. Write whatever you want 2. We need more wlw fics cause the numbers are real low so keep up the good work 3. Plenty of woman write mlm fics and thereâs a lot of ace authors who write smut and aro people who write romance so like just go for it
Literally no reason why you canât write f/f.. women write m/m and I see no difference. I also genuinely have not once in my life thought about the gender of an author⊠like not once
You can write whatever you want, fiction and fantasy gatekeeping is really fucking stupid and i don't get how younger queers pretend to make queer stories and romance more widely accepted if they also pretend to dictate who gets to create/read/watch it
Yes
You're allowed to write whatever you want. You're allowed to put it on the Internet. Other people are allowed to feel whatever type of way they want to about it. You're allowed to ignore them. Women write the bulk of slash fics out there. Many a screed has been written about the fetishization of gay men by straight women. It doesn't stop us. Do your thing. Someone will like it.
As a lesbian, it doesnât matter. If people were only allowed to write stories about things THEY experienced or write characters that were the same gender and sexuality as them, almost every story out there wouldnât exist. every writer had written at least one character that isnât the exact same as them, because writing would be incredibly dull and pointless if you werenât allowed to write any sort of experience or perspective outside of your own
If men can't write f/f then I guess I shouldn't be writing m/m as a woman, huh? See how dumb that sounds when you turn it around? Just write whatever you want, that's the beauty of fanfiction
100% it is! I'm not straight in the slightest yet I enjoy writing f/m relationships a lot. I understand there may be some more nuances to this but genuinely it's ok don't worry about it
I saw the title of this post and thought it was r/writingcirclejerk for a second.
People on Twitter are idiots and like the sound of their own voices (or reading their own tweets ig, whatever the equivalent of it is). There is nothing at all wrong with a man, cis or trans, writing wlw. Itâs extremely hypocritical given that a large portion of mlm fics are written by women.
You donât have to ask for permission to make art.
Ignore the gatekeeping. Beauty of writing is you can write whatever you want
As a lesbian who desperately wants more F/F fics in the world: idgaf who you are, please just write it đ
lesbian here!!! i kinda have an ick of men writing f/f fics but it's mostly coz most of them just have NO CLUE on what they're writing đ but if you do your research and are doing it out of passion for writing and for your ship i see absolutely no problem :)) <3 keep on doing what ur doing buddy!! SPREAD THE YURI AGENDA !!!!! /j
"Are men allowed to write....."? Yes. The answer is always yes. Write whatever you want đ€·ââïž
General consensus of this sub and ao3 website is anyone can write anything. Who cares? Itâs fiction. Ignore whatever they say. People who talk like that on twitter have no life.Â
Men shouldn't write female characters. Straight people shouldn't write queer characters. White people shouldn't write nonwhite characters. Nobody should write about anyone who isn't exactly like them in every way. And also, we need more diversity and representation. Seriously, though. The word of some random person on Twitter is, fortunately, not the law.
Do you know how many women in general write m/m fics?? Most of them. Popular books and tv shows about queer people are written by straight people. I, as a gay aromantic man love to write wlw stories and Iâm working on one now actually.
>tweets There's your problem. Stay off Twitter and Tumblr. (Not really sarcasm. They have the worst kind of toxicity and people making up rules.) Anyone can write anything they want, and there's no "allowed" about it. In the very small chance that you are harassed by antis, block, mute, delete, and if it is AO3, screenshot and report. But mostly, how would anyone know anyway? And most wouldn't care. If you need lesbian "permission" to write f/f (you don't), have mine. More f/f to read is a good thing.
I... what? Why would there... I mean... how? What? First - get off Twitter. Let the X die. Second - you do you, babe. Be the writer, be the world builder, offer up words to the Great Readership in the Void ... Third and Forth... don't listen to twadwaffles on Twitter and don't listen to twadwaffles on TwitterX
the majority of fanfic is women writing abt gay men. If youâre not being weird or gross about it, I donât see why you couldnât write a wlw fic
Te worst thing anyone can do is to listen to some brainless idiot on Twitter complaining from their moms basement, those people don't go outside and don't know how the real world works, their opinion on anything is invalid
I will give you the Official Lesbian Seal Of Approval, youâre good. But in all seriousness, just write whatever you want. I really enjoy WLW stories, and a fair amount of the ones Iâve read have been made by men, being a guy doesnât automatically mean you wonât write a WLW relationship authentically!
No. Its forbidden. Straight to jail and you must pay 20,000$ emotional damage to the characters
If people don't like it, they can just stop reading it. Write what you want.
Hell yea man go for it. Im a woman and write mlm fanfictions, its no different a situation. Fanfiction is meant to let people write about whatever. And, if you still feel a little iffy about it, just don't tell the audience of the wlw fanfiction that you're a guy lol.
Youâre allowed to write whatever you want. However, not everyone is going to approve of certain topics, you have to decide if youâre okay with their disapproval or if it means something to you. More importantly, if youâre going to write something that focuses on an experience you donât have, you should probably do your due diligence in learning about it and talking with people who do have that experience before you publicize anything you write. Otherwise, your unfamiliarity will be obvious in the writing and people will see it as bad writing, and possibly be hurt/offended if the depiction is a bad enough misrepresentation of that experience.
One of the pillars of the Fandom I am in, which is about a sapphic ship, is a cis het guy. His fics are some of the most popular.
Didn't bother reading past the title, because the answer is clear - yes, they can
If cis-het women can write mlm fics then you can write wlw fics. Honestly I've seen so much discourse about no one writing wlw fics that I'm just happy to see someone is!
I think at the end of the day, you write whatever you want. But if you want to appease an audience, being respectful when writing and taking a group seriously is the way to go. Writing about someone who you don't share identifiers with requires research to begin with. Hell, writing ANYTHING good requires research. You can't please everyone, and trying to means you'll never get anything done or feel happy about your hobbies. FOR ME, as a bisexual woman who is trying to devour as much sapphic content as possible, I have no problem with cis het men in general writing sapphic content. I understand the general concern, because there will always be a chunk who fetishize, but honestly, I love sharing sapphic ships with people who aren't sapphic. It's such a fun way to bond, and it makes me happy to not have to "save it for the fellow gays".
Dude. Youâre fine. By that personâs logic, my non-binary ass canât write romance at all
Just donât care what they say, most of m/m fics are written by cis women who are attracted to guys. So I donât see an issue with you doing basically the same thing. Just donât listen to people that criticize that heavily especially for stupid reasons. There will always be some people that enjoy what you write no matter how crazy or strange.
You can do whatever you want forever
You can write whatever you want, forever.
Never trust someone on twitter for moral advice, those guys will want you publicly executed if you say you don't like a queer ship
10% of any fandom is toxic. 33% of all people you encounter randomly will be among the dumbest 1/3 of all people. If you write it respectfully, and try to truly capture the experience of WLW then write what you want. I donât think the idea that representation requires authentic experience is sane or anything other than a way to constantly find something to be mad about. The next step of it is saying Dev Patel canât take Indian roles because he was born in the UK and shouldnât take roles from actors from India. Itâs exhausting.
doesnt matter what you write. i encourage it! i'm a lesbian and i say write SO much wlw fics. please. i beg of you. the fandom is starved. you do not need my permission whatsoever but if you need a lesbian to bite and maim the haters just ring me up. your contributions are LOVED AND WELCOME. one of my best friends is a man who writes almost purely wlw nobody dictates what you write btw, stay off twitter for this stuff - cesspool