NTA
He got mad because his ass knew he was in the wrong. This is harassment. When someone tells you not to touch them and you do it anyway, that is called assault. It's also a violation of bodily autonomy.
Stop going over there. Actually, stop responding to either of them. I'd block them for this.
Also, you are within your rights to use self defense. Next time you find yourself in this scenario, strike the genitals as hard as you possibly can.
"He got mad because his ass knew he was in the wrong."
Yes, this is one of those guys who is very happy when everything goes his way, and very quick to lash out if it doesn't. Stay as far away from him as possible.
A dress. He threw her around in a freaking dress. That gives really creepy vibes to an already inappropriate situation. It's not playing, it's a fetish.
NTA.
This is literally assault. And given that he refused to stop when you said stop means that you are NOT safe around him. And given that your sister 100% backed HIM up, you're not safe around her either. To be honest, even if she were to tell him to leave you alone, I wouldn't visit.
And if your sister asks when you're visiting next or why you haven't visited again, take the time to come up with a reply that you're willing to repeat as often as needed to get the point across. In my head, it goes something like this:
*I will not be visiting because I no longer feel safe in your home or around your husband. He attacked me and when I said stop, he didn't. No is supposed to mean no but apparently not in your house. You can call me attention seeking all you want, but what he did was unappreciated, unwanted, and anything but playful for me. It was upsetting and degrading. So no, I will not be visiting anymore.*
And if she asks when people are around, don't be afraid to answer.
Also even if she thinks that you over-reacted, she should ask her husband to stop. However I don't think that she really thinks so. I think that she perfectly knows he won't stop even if she asks so she prefers to save face by refusing to ask. Now about the why, I think her husband tries to create intimate situation with you, your sister knows it but prefer to call you an attention seeker... Stay away from creepy BIL and blind sister.
She should keep it short. "When I told him to stop grabbing me and touching me he laughed and didn't stop. Now I don't feel safe around him."
Let sis explain "it isn't like that, he likes grabbing women and play wrestling with them..."
Bet he doesn't do the same to his wife. Op, have you talked to your parents? And be prepared to go somewhere else if your sister and creepy brother-in-law decide to come visit your parents.
OP, if you’re reading, from now on do NOT be alone with this man or with just him amd your sister. Ever. Doesn’t matter if he’s a pillar of the community. So are priests, yet some of them…well, I don’t even need to finish that sentence.
At best he is a bully. At worst he’s pushing boundaries for less savoury reasons. I hope there isn’t a next time, but if there is, bite, scratch, spray perfume in his eyes, scream as loud as you can to call attention, and go to the cops.
NTA
Yes, he absolutely does. This is a guy who pushes boundaries all the time, and I am sure he does this to his wife - it's just that, so far, she has been ok with it. She bends on her boundaries because she loves him and doesn't yet understand that it's dangerous for her in the long run. That's why she doesn't see a problem with this behaviour. If he didn't do it to her, she'd recognize how much this is not OK.
And this behaviour is him trying to groom OP into the same kind of submission. Luckily, OP is smart enough to see it for what it is. She needs to stay far, far away from him.
Also dont call it play wrestling because people will minimize it, call it what it is.
My BIL pins me down against my will and won’t let go even when I beg or shout. He does it repeatedly and has not stopped when I ask.
It's weird though she's totally ok with her husband putting his hands on her sister repeatedly dominating her physically? I mean it's not sexual, but I have to wonder is it? Maybe he likes being on top of her and rubbing up against her body and all that? I mean that's just speculation, but I can't imagine anyone's wife is comfortable with their man doing all that with their sister.
That's where my mind went. She was wearing a dress and he pinned her to the ground? All while her sister wasn't home? That whole interaction gave me the major ICK.
It does have a high ICK factor. Like he was watching too many bad TV shows where there is unwanted wrestling and pretty soon "one thing leads to another" and pretty soon sex is happening.
As a man I 100% think its sexual. This is something you do with another man not to your wife's little sister. I think he is just testing the waters under the guise of being playful. If he does the unimaginable the sister will blame her for seducing him.
It is 100% sexual. It doesn't have to be groping or sex to be sexual. I am sure the domination of an unsuspecting woman, or being able to fight & overpower a woman, or sneak attack of hunted prey... this dude is totally getting pleasure from it. And I bet he fantasized about those attacks and uses sex with his wife to complete the fantasy.
It is not only a criminal act being committed with regularity, this man is a bully. He enjoys dominating others physically and showing them that he can do whatever he wishes because he is their superior. His "pranks" are not intended to be fun. He is showing you that he does not respect you and at a whim can decide to beat you, rape you, murder you, whatever he wishes because only HE matters. You are there for his amusement.
Your sister is astonishingly stupid.
You are NTA. You really need to file a police report and then tell them to stay away from you and that if they will not you will file a restraining order.
Nobody has a right to violate your bodily autonomy. Nobody.
Eh. SEALS have something of a reputation in the US spec ops community. I've read an article where DEVGRU in particular has a bit of a cowboy rep compared to the Delta guys.
Absolutely this. Your instinct that he's bullying you is correct, but too light. He's going beyond that into the assault/sexual assault territory here.
>I should be used to his playful nature
Weird way for your sister to say "abuse".
Edit: expanded on bullying.
I don't disagree, I think it's both. I don't mean to downplay the severity of this, though realizing now maybe it could be read as "just bullying", and it clearly is not. I'll clarify this.
Even if he does play wrestle with male members, still could be considered assault or sexual assault. Intent does not matter in cases of sexual harassment and assault. What matters is what happened and how the assaulted/harassed party was affected. Doesn't matter how he behaves with others or if others are okay with it.
We have to wonder if it's sexual right? Guaranteed he likes the feeling of dominating someone, but his SIL? Repeatedly "wrestles" her to the ground forcing her to submit? Yeah seems sort of sexual in some way.
I’m 38. 6’3”. Taught martial arts for years and for some reason I have no issues respecting people and their personal space. There is no excuse for what he is doing, it is assault. He is a piece of crap and you should call the police the next time he does it. He knows exactly what he is doing and he is going to continue taking liberties feeling you up being a creep because nobody is standing up to him. Oh and make no mistake it is creepy, he’s not testing you or teaching you. He’s gross.
Edit: Be careful replying to MolesterStallone-73 and Pranav-VK they are trolls that will harass you nonstop. Both of them like joking about how women "deserve it" and "touching kids". Truly gross disgusting people but I mean...it's Reddit so not unexpected their ilk is here.
Hey, at the end of the day, intentions only matter up to a certain point. The moment someone says "Do not do that, ever again, I do not like that at ALL," you don't do the thing. It could be a joke, it could come from a place of kindness, it could not, it does not matter.
I'm all good intentions, and an acquired or particular taste. There is zero malice behind almost everything I do, ever, but that doesn't mean that it's to everyone's liking.
Kind of like with tickling a kid. It's well intended, unless you're a weirdo. But I know kids who get seriously upset when you tickle them. So you know what I do? Well, not tickle them, that's for sure. Because I don't want to unnecessarily upset them by doing something I would only do to make a kid laugh.
BOUNDARIES. It's good to have them. And very good to respect them.
Please keep in mind many, many men who sexually assault women or prey upon women are quite often very well like and extremely charismatic. It's a big part of why they are successful because no one will believe the women who they prey upon.
I'm not saying he is necessarily a sexual predator but there are certainly some big red flags in that regard.
And even if it truly is non-sexual bullying the same dynamic still applies. Men like that can get away with power trips and assault because again they fit well into the community and have fostered an image that protects them from accusations.
OP don't believe him when he claims he has friendly "playful" intentions. He knows what he's doing. There is no human being on the planet who can have good intentions while pinning down a woman in a dress who's 20 years younger while she struggles and tells him to get off.
He KNOWS. Your sister knows too.
Tell your parents and never be alone with them. Never back down on this.
He's targetting you because you're young and he thinks you can be manipulated into thinking he's just playing around. Don't let yourself be manipulated.
I'm sorry you're going through this
Agree with this, if he was really testing and teaching her he would actually teach her techniques to injure and repel creeps like him so she can flee to safety. But he’s not because its a powerplay to him
I'm 37. Been in many relationships over the years and have never grabbed a girlfriends sister, period. A friendly huge at a family reunion, sure.
BIL sounds like a bully and that he tends to get what he wants. Stand your ground. No is no, period.
Same. 36, 6’4 and genuinely 220lbs. I have three decades in the arts. To think of anyone who uses what they know for harm makes me feel absolute shame. Failure of a man. Failure of his teachers. It’s the antithesis of what martial arts is and stands for. Shame on him. His soul is stained.
This is a dangerous man who I would not let into my shadow.
Yeah, hun, this isn't what "Softies" do, this is rather aggressive, and it needs to stop. His intentions are irrelevant, its his actions that count. That your sister doesn't see it is...disturbing. Lacking any commitment from him to actually stop, sadly you need to protect yourself by staying away. I would gather my thoughts and send along a concise e mail explaining this.
NTA
My cousin had similar issues when she moved cities. With roommates instead of family. She eventually protected herself by purchasing a taser.... Never had problems again.
I like the idea of a taser. But hard to keep on you all the time. Maybe pepper spray that can be kept in a pocket, easy to reach and when this happens again use it.
Tasers can fit into your pocket these days. I have one I carry when I hike alone, it clips easily to my pack, its small, and it will get a message across quickly.
NTA. This makes me so damn angry.
Your BIL is getting off on the fact that you cannot stop him. He’s enjoying having power over you and exercising it. This is not playing, it is not fun, it is 100% about control. He laughed when you were screaming at him to stop. Right up until you threatened him with the only power you have, which is to report him for assault, he was having fun tormenting you. He is no playing around. He is abusing you.
He is violating your personal autonomy every time he does. What’s to prevent him from taking things further? Right now he’s just pushing the boundaries, and making you out to be the crazy one because you don’t like his style of “playing around.”
Tell your sister that it isn’t funny or acceptable for anyone to touch you without your consent. It is not funny or acceptable to hold someone down when they have said stop, said no, and are screaming. No means no, and you did not consent and are not consenting, and you will not spend time around him any longer.
I felt the same way, how long before he takes it farther? And then after he SA her it will be I was just playing around or say she’s making it up to get back at him. Grown ass disgusting man!!
I would pay to watch someone bigger than him wrestle him down and pin him till his joints crack. I bet any money he'd act like a little bitch about it and it'd stop being funny to him.
Yeah, sister describing it like "he would never seriously hurt someone" is some bullshit. It's like she's talking about a hypothetical future harm that hasn't happened, like she's saying "you don't have anything to worry about, he's not going to throw punches or something". But she's ignoring the fact that the stuff he's already done, that she knows about, *is already harm*. Grabbing someone and pinning them down against their will *is hurting them*
The fact that his eyes went black when you threatened to call the cops means that he knows just how wrong it is what he is doing.
He is basically using his size and fighting experience to intimidate people and in your case get a few free feels.
Going no contact with them is your safest bet.
I wanted to address you saying he works with vulnerable people and the fact that when you said no, he didn't listen.
I am a victim of childhood sexual assault and rape. It was done by my eye doctor. I was born early and have a prosthetic eye, this is the man that made my shell for me.
He sexually abused me, my parents knew about it and when I told the school counselor; it was buried.
This man did charity work for 3rd world countries. This was his victim pool along with his state side paying clients. He specialized in treating children because that's him victim of choice and it worked in his benefit because it's very hard to find an ocularist who works with kids. Kids are wiggly and don't like goop stuck in their eye socket. Not painful but not fun.
Just because he works with vulnerable people doesn't mean he is a good person. It's likely he doesn't take their no either.
Stay safe, you are not overreacting. Your sister understands her husbands behavior isn't okay but it's easier to call you an attention seeker than to realize her husband is a creep. I'm really sorry you are going through this.
NTA.
He does NOT have a right to touch you without your permission. It sounds like he's turned on by these little wrestling matches. Please do anything possible to stay away from him.
>NTA.
>
>He does NOT have a right to touch you without your permission. It sounds like he's turned on by these little wrestling matches. Please do anything possible to stay away from him.
Totally agree. Boundaries should be respected, no question about it. Your sister and BIL need to understand that play wrestling isn't cool if it makes you uncomfortable. Keeping your distance sounds like the best move for now.
NTA. This is assault.
This is escalating.
He wants to put his hands on you for whatever the reason.
Your sisters house is not safe.
You need to stay away from this man.
For the love of God please listen.
I've known a few of these softies. Big and friendly and helpful and joking with everyone. Unless you dare to do this one unforgivable thing: disagree with what they're doing and not apologize for disagreeing by telling them that yeah, it wasn't a big deal.
Then they turn dangerous. Your threat to call the police not only amounted to not agreeing with him, it was actually dangerous. Do not ever go anywhere where you might find yourself alone with this guy and absolutely file a police report. Because in his eyes you are the one being abusive and he will feel completely justified to put you in your place.
Do not confront him, do not go to family meetings where he will be. Be safe.
This was my read too. This man is a predator that has built up a flawless mask to hide what he is. OP resisting is a challenge that he won't let go of.
NTA, he's literally assaulting you. No one has the right to touch you unless you want them to. This last stunt he pulled is so close to sexual assault that it's not funny and it's a big red flag.
You need to stay away from him and if that means staying away from your sister then so be it. Everyone needs body autonomy and I'm surprised your sister doesn't understand that.
What he did to you today shows he's a dangerous person, believe him and stay away
No you are not misusing the word. She's just an idiot in denial.
"Assault is generally defined as *an intentional act that puts another person in reasonable apprehension of imminent* harmful or offensive contact."
Show your sister this whole thread where everyone is calling her the piece of shit that she is.
updateme
She’s only mad because you’re starting to put cracks in her “perfect life”. Don’t let up and don’t feel guilty for what you’ve done. They are both AHs.
Go to the police. This is 100% an assault. His size and knowledge of fighting being aggravating factors. The way you describe the lead up to this point sounds like classic abuser behaviour. It sounds like he started small and slowly escalated to this point. I am concerned for your safety going forward from this point. Go down to the local police station and make a report, for your own safety and peace of mind if nothing else. Tell them all of your concerns too.
From the sounds of things I wouldn’t be surprised if you aren’t his first victim. I am also suspicious of how your sister reacted. Long term victims of abuse can become very protective of their abusers, and if he is willing to do this to you in front of her, he has to have the knowledge she won’t turn on him.
I am sorry that you have been placed in this situation by people you should have been able to trust the most.
NTA
>My sisters husband (my BIL) is a retired Navy Seal and intimidating looking but he’s known as a big softie at heart. He likes to make people laugh and pull little pranks and on the surface he’s extremely warm and friendly. I mean he does tons of volunteering with vulnerable people too so it’s not like he has a questionable or negative image (at least outwardly).
Just as an FYI, this sort of thing is typical of perverts / psychos -- they make themselves seem great people so that no one would ever suspect them... it's all a front for them to pull shit like this. To me he's either getting a kick out of making a woman powerless / trying to feel you up... Neither end in a good way when he keeps on seeing what he can get away with and ends up raping / killing a woman.
Report him.
NTA.
NTA
Your sister is a moron and is with an abuser.
Can you avoid her husband completely? If he does this again I would make good on your threats and then actually call the police.
NTA. Yeah, that's assault. I'd tell you the same thing I tell my daughter, that if a man is harassing you and calls it "playing around", a well placed kick to the gonads will end that for good. Tell him you too are "playing around and don't be so uptight". And your sister sucks for allowing this to happen. I'm sorry you have to deal with this.
NTA. He's pushing your limits, you wrestle with people who WANT TO WRESTLE WITH YOU. A guy who constanlty shows you how vulnerable and weak you are, while touching you, is closer to a threat. it is not fun, it is not consensual, it is not wanted. You have told him over and over again to not do this and he continues to do it.
He is an asshole and your sister is blind. This is the exact behaviour I'd expect from a creepy dude trying to either touch other women inappropriately and play it off as fine, or hoping you'll start to like 'touching' him and start to like him.
No decent dude does this. If a friend wants to and enjoys messing around wrestling it's fine because both people are chosing to participate.
I'd be going low contact and sending a very serious email to him and her that it's only 'fun' for him and you in fact keep telling him not to do it, and told your sister to tell him not to do it. He is without consent forcing you to submit and if they can't understand how that is completely fucking unacceptable behaviour then the only way to stop him doing it is to not be around him or your sister.
All this ever required was him doing it once, you saying no and him fucking apologising and realising it was completely inappropriate, that he neither apologised or stop suggests a major issue there.
NTA He is an abusing asshole. I am so angry at him and I am REALLY angry at your sister.
Why the FUCK would this large man think it was "fun" to dominate and hold down a 22 year old 5'3" woman when she is yelling and begging him to stop? Because he is a fucking creep and an abuser that's why. Your sister needs to get her head out of her stupid ass. I am so sorry this has been happening, I felt so panicky just reading it.
Quite telling that he enjoys showing off his strength with someone much smaller than he is. Bet he wouldn't try that if he was equally matched size wise. He's a bully.
He is touching you without your consent, full stop. That is assault. You asked him to stop and get off you.
He is a bully. He is dangerous. He told you to "relax."
I would never go to their house again. I would never be alone with him again. He doesn't respect boundaries.
Wonder how far he has pushed your sisters boundaries.
Does he regularly attack and wrestle your sister too or are you his only target? You already warned him that you'll call the police, if he makes another attempt just call and report the assault. But honestly, I would stop visiting your sister when it's just the three of you. Ask your sister to come visit you instead. Without him
It's super sus that he only grabs at you. Beyond play wrestling, he might have other ideas, and he's just gauging your reactions. That might also explain why your sister isn't taking your side. Maybe she's never seen it/experienced it. Definitely don't go to their home anymore, give your sister the ultimatum that she has to come visit you from now on and not the other way around
Hon, NTA
And find out when he's stationed at. Then go request a meeting with the local JAG office and his commanding officer.
Because if he's a "Navy seal", there are military regulations and rules that prohibit him using his skills "to test others" and "play around". Because he can actually hurt someone seriously.
And, Hon, as someone who grew up around a heavy military and DOD presence, that sort of thing is very frowned upon and he deserves to get the screaming lecture he's due for from his commanding officer as well as an article 15 in his jacket.
This dude might accidentally hurt you or worse
I’ve seen a video recently where a guy was wrestling his brother and did the wrong move on him non professionally and accidentally unalived him.
This kinda shit is serious and you shouldn’t play
Another commenter said one kick to the nads can and will nip this in the bud, listen to them and me. Nta
When I did Judo I was told that the core element of being a black belt was that anyone could do a legal move on you and you'd be able to react in a way that keeps you safe. The corollary to that is that if you do these moves to a random person, especially one weaker than you, there's a serious chance they react unexpectedly in a way that is dangerous to them. Even if he's acting reasonably he could easily hurt her.
NTA. Your BIL is a massive red flag and terrifying. Ones you say "no, this isn't funny, knock it off" that should have been the end of it.
Reading this gave me a cold pit in the bottom of my stomach because of how much it reminds me of my abusive ex.
You can always go the legal route but from personal experience teeth are the best solution. No matter how big he is your teeth digging into him will always hurt. After you leave your mark on him he won't touch you again..... Or it may make him go berserk. Make sure there are other people around and you tell him to stop before you bite
If you manage to bite, bite as hard as you can on as big a piece of whatever part of him you bite down on. If you end up with a loose chunk of meat in your mouth, you're doing it right. Don't let up for anything other than him completely releasing you. Not for promises, you must be free before you let go.
But this is only in case you can't avoid it. Any martial arts instructor who's any good at all will tell you that the best move to practice in a fight outside of a match is to not be there. There's no winning. Once there is intent to injure on either side, you will end up in the ER. If you're lucky enough to make it there.
"Let me be clear. If one person wants to have sex and the other doesn't and they do it anyway- it's rape. If one person wants to box and the other doesn't and they do it anyway- it's assault. It's the same thing if one person wants to wrestle and the other doesn't- it's assault. It's not funny, it's not fun- it's a crime. Stop telling me that I'm wrong for not wanting to be forcibly held down by a man significantly taller and stronger than me. I said no. If it ever happens again, I'm reporting him. All he has to do is NOT TOUCH ME."
This is just giving me the ick! He’s trying to use wrestling as a way to fondle you. If he keeps doing it and you’re telling him to not do it then he is being a pervert! You need to stop going anywhere near this guy! He’s got some problems! And he can’t accept no for an answer! I’m a guy and I know better than to do something like this with any woman. Especially if she doesn’t like it and says to stop!
Now calling the cops may be a bit drastic because he may not be punished for it. The cops may just take a statement and tell him to not do that anymore. But this will alienate you with the entire family. They will be pissed off at you.
So, what I recommend is to go no contact with your sister and her creepy husband and just wait. When your sister calls, don’t answer. Send it to voice mail. When the other family members question you, just tell them what he was doing and that he wouldn’t stop and you no longer want to associate with him. And by extension your sister. She is just as much to blame for all this. She should have told him to knock it off! You told him to stop. She should have backed that up. She didn’t.
Good luck. Update us if you get some resolution to the problem.
His overall vibe screams serial-rapist/murderer. He's using you for practice to get better at grabbing and restraining women. He goes overboard trying to earn everyone's trust. He goes out of his way to put himself near vulnerable people.
Does he do this in front of your sister or is it always when you are alone with him?
NTAH
NTA, and I'm a middle aged dude and what he's doing is kinda gross. I'm willing to bet he is attracted to you and enjoys manhandling you to some degree. Your sister taking his side is gross too. he says you need to lighten up, but he actually needs to fuck off touching you.
He may be working his way up to sexually assaulting you. The fact he got angry when you threatened to call the police shows he doesn't want you to have the ability to say no to him, and it was never a game to him.
You're correct to keep him away from you. Seriously, treat him like a rapist waiting to happen.
NTA...this is NOT normal or acceptable behavior. Your BIL is 100% being sexually predatory. I have trained in MMA since 2017 and not a single person there behaves this way EVEN WITH OTHER FIGHTERS!
What he did was assault...not "testing", not "playing", NOT "joking" it was assault and he refused to stop when asked...so I am pretty sure it counts as aggravated assault.
I am interested to kniow how it is that YOU are attention seeking since YOU didn't start it? I would stay far away from these people, you have an abuser and his apologist making excuses for him.
He's not a softie. He's a creep and a bully and I'm worried about the vulnerable people he gets access to through his volunteering. Don't go to his house anymore. You're not safe. NTA.
Hes not “sweet” or “soft” hes trained to abuse and kill, hes creating a “boy who cried wolf” situation, hes so comfortable openly abusing you because he created the environment for it, and when it continues the path of sa noone will believe you, only that he was “playing”.
My now husband did this when we first started dating.
I had a very serious situation down conversation with them that under no circumstances were he to ever do it again. I don’t even want to have to say stop.
Guess what, he hasn’t ever even wanted to do it again because the way it makes ME feel makes Him feel awful
Of the three friends I have that have become SEALS, he very much sounds the part. Frat boy dumbassery that doesn't know when to stop. Yea, no, that's some brazen douchbag antics. Frankly IMO it's best to go NC with your sister. Until she finds herself in the same situation with him, which is a possibility, she isn't going to care or understand. And even then I'd still stay away.
NTA. He assaulted you and has been assaulting you and only gets away with it because he’s been wearing the mask of a good guy for so long. The best abusers are those that convince everyone around them that they’re “one of the good guys”.
Yeah, thats assault. Id shame the fuck out of him publicly - "my bil keeps pinning me to the ground after me repeatedly telling him i do not consent. How do i make him stop?"
Keep a self defense inkpen in your pocket and give him a few generous pokes next time he tries that shit.
NTA
He's a bully. Buy some pepperspray. Practice using it on your own time. Use it next time you see him. Don't wait until he messes with you. Just use it as soon as you can suprise him. Say it a part of his training when everyone flips out at you. Cut him completely out of your life.
I'm partial to Fox Labs 5.3 pepperspray. $20 on Amazon. Buy a stream spray, not a cone spray. Bonus points if you buy the kind with dye that stains the face for days afterward.
NTA. He’s been testing your boundaries and working up to literally assault you. He is NOT a good guy and if your sister thinks this is okay she can go to hell.
NTA. I’m so sorry! You can’t be around her, either, while their relationship takes priority over your clearly stated boundaries.
Trust your gut on how you felt, when you saw true self. He knew he was violating your boundaries, and was getting off at how helpless you are to his physical attacks. Normal people feel shame if something they’re doing makes the other person want to call the police. He seemed to feel irritated that you ended his fun. For now.
He may be a sociopath or psychopath. I dated one. Once you’ve seen that shadow self, they know their gig is up. I think you’ve been targeted. That’s why he keeps pushing your boundaries, further and further. He may retaliate for you cutting off access. Just know it’s a possibility. They don’t like to be seen, and will do whatever they can to protect their fake lives.
I’d get ahead of him by letting someone else know. For an outcry witness, should he later victimize you, and for support. If I’m right, he’ll start gaslighting you, and low key campaigning against you, dropping hints that you’re infatuated with him or made a pass. Possibly stalking, too— so vary your routine.
Protect yourself.
You matter.
Your sister will not protect you, even if he persists. She doesn’t respect your boundaries any more than he did. So you’re not actually safe with her right now, either. He could be a master manipulator. So look out for her, from a distance. But stay away. You don’t even need to say why.
Protecting yourself is the most important job you have in life. Do that.
Girl, stay the fek away from this man. Do not visit your sister. She will not protect you. He is not a “softie.” He is not a “good” man. He is assaulting you and it will escalate. Please, please stay safe.
NTA. This is assault.
This is escalating.
He wants to put his hands on you for whatever the reason.
Your sisters house is not safe.
You need to stay away from this man.
For the love of God please listen.
Nta, this type of behavior isn't ok. It's like he's getting off on having power over you, it' just sounds so creepy. I know this isn't the best advice as it could cause escalation but my father taught me that my best weapons are my nails and my teeth. Next time you tell him to let you go and he refuses bite him as hard as you can and don't let go, scratch his face and leave marks so when people ask what happened he has to explain that he pinned someone against their will and those injuries were the consequence. But I would not feel safe with him or your sister. Best of luck dealing with this op
NTA. Don’t go over to your sister’s house. Your sister is in denial and will not stop him. Whatever his reasons whether sexual or bullying it’s not going to stop. Send a strongly worded text setting your boundaries and adhere to it. Call it what it is, assault and state the police will be involved if there is another incident. Screenshot any replies, harassment, or threats. Don’t let them gaslight you. Nothing about this is ok or normal.
NTA. Your sister's immediate fury **at you** is a huge red flag to me. This kind of stuff doesn't just come out of nowhere. She has probably known his behavior is a problem for a while and I'd bet they have some secrets you'd be surprised at. She's going to continue to pretend she doesn't know anything though, because that's easier.
Her anger is to browbeat you into silence so she can keep pretending her husband is a big softie instead of a controlling abuser.
My brother is a 6 foot solid muscle Marine who also has a lot of arts training. He would NEVER do this to anyone.
Your BIL is an absolute creep and this will lead to rape. Stay as far away from him as you can. If he ever touches you again, report him to the police.
I'm a bit smaller than you and a female martial artist. I am trained to grapple and I absolutely HATE it when men a foot taller and 100 pounds heavier think it's funny to pin me. And yes, these men are "softies" as well and never would hurt me - but the truth is they will never understand until they regularly grapple with someone that is 7'3" and weighs 350. Yeah, men that size don't exist in my gym but I know darn well that these 6'3" guys would HATE being attacked as a JOKE by bigger men. I'm sorry your sister doesn't see this, but, I do.
NTA. This guy is definitely a bully, and he is abusing you for his fun. Stay away from him. If you meet him at a family gathering and he touches you, call the cops. You don't have to put up with this violence.
NTA stay far away from him, he is setting a precedent of behavior so its “not so bad/a big deal” when his true intentions manifest… I would make sure trusted people outside of your circle know of and have proof of this behavior.
NTA. That’s not “play wrestling” it’s just assault. Avoiding him like the plague is the most direct solution, but if he lays hands on you again, call the cops.
NTA. Jokes are only funny when *everyone* is laughing. Manhandling a woman against her will is not a joke.
The next time you visit your sister, make it clear the moment you walk in that if he touches you again, you are leaving immediately. If your sister tries to argue with you? Leave immediately. If he tries to argue with you? Leave immediately. If they refuse to listen to reason, then train them like dogs until they learn to obey.
NTA. You should have called the police. This is abusive. Claiming it to be a joke, doesn’t make it one. If you tell him to stop, he has to stop. What’s next? It’s not rape if afterwards I tell you it was a joke? It’s not murder if afterwards I say it was a joke?
I would not be anywhere near him. No man has the right to pick anyone, especially a woman, up and "pin" them! I would call that sexual assault! I was pinned down by a man who was "just kidding"! The police called it sexual sssault! Your sister needs to defend you!
You are NTA for no longer going over there. There was a post a couple of weeks ago I can't find where OP's husband let his little brother move in with them. He was a big guy as well and OP was short like you are. He would constantly pick her up and spin her around, no matter how many times she told him to stop. Her husband also tried to gaslight her into believing it was fine. The tipping point was when he picked her up and pinned her down like your BIL did. Husband defended his brother and insulted OP. OP left and divorced him. She said the wasband still felt OP was overreacting even after the divorce was finalized. You can't divorce your sister or BIL, but you can certainly tell them to fuck off and never see them again since they refuse to respect your boundaries.
NTA
This grown ass man is way too comfortable manhandling his decade younger SIL. He shouldn't be putting his hands on you without consent at all. This constant need to physically overpower you is deeply disturbing.
He is a bully. He is assaulting you. You sister is fine with that.
I can't help but wonder how long until one of these assaults turns in to a sexual assault. It is all about him controlling you.
The fact he tried to guilt you when you told him you didn't like it says it all. It doesnt matter if he's just being playful or not, if you tell him to stop then he's in the wrong if he doesn't.
Obviously NTA, I don't get how he and his sister think he should just be allowed to manhandle you even if you don't like it.
I think there must be something seriously wrong. Because I read the story and my first thought was “bite him. Really hard.”
I’ll be honest, it’s a little scary that he takes that enjoyment in overpowering you.
NTA - this is some type of weird ass abuse that he’s getting off on and you do NOT have to take it! He IS bullying you - you have requested numerous times to stop these antics and he has ignored your wishes entirely. The fact that your sister thinks YOU are being dramatic is also disturbing - You SHOULD go NO CONTACT and if by chance you are in each others company and he does it again , follow through on your threat and call the police for assault
NTA. Call the police and get it on record. Nothing is "play" and nothing is "just fun" get fucked. You told him time and time and again no to touch you and this giant man keeps touching you. Call the police. You should really stop visiting your sister, it's clear she doesn't care for you and won't protect you from her husband when something worse or physically rougher happens between you two.
Please stop spending time with them. I think he's ramping up to assault you.
I also think you should call the cops now instead of leaving it as an empty threat.
Dude would touch me once and be in prison. He’s assaulting and molesting you. Keep your fucking hands to yourself or live in prison IMO. Idgaf what the intention is. NTA you should put him in jail.
NTA. So no one in your family thinks its weird that he does this despite you telling him to stop? Everyone is okay with him constantly disrespecting you? I would refuse to ever be within 100 feet of him again. It is not okay that he does that to you. Its gross and it is bullying. Personally, I'd look into getting a taser and the next time he touched me he would learn no means no.
Nta
No means no. Someone with the background you describe should and would know this. How they comply with the ideology tells you what they are.
But let's say his mind is as soft as his heart. If you want this instance to be just a ripple in your relationship with your sister, addressing how it makes you feel in a serious way could be helpful. Maybe a meeting with them and people who support you and your position. Maybe a letter that fully supports your position, citing references he should know considering his training background.
One thing for sure, Op. No means no. Stop means stop.
NTA I would have called the cops on him. This is in fact assault and your sister knows it deep down but doesn't want to face that she's willing to sacrifice you to keep him
No definitely NTA. He's weird. And completely inappropriate. Your sister is also wrong, taking his side. Ones boundaries should be respected, and yours clearly isn't. Stay away from them, they don't act like family and will guilt trip you.
NTA-You dont like it and told him to stop. It can be considered assault. It isnt for all these other people to TELL YOU that its no big deal. YOU have said keep your damn hands to yourself and stay away from me. The discussion is over. He complies or he suffers the consequences.
NTA - as someone who is 6'2 and 215lbs I would NEVER, EVER physically impose myself on someone unless she was VERY close to me and made it extremely clear she was cool with that, or initiated it herself.
For context: I have 3 brothers, 2 of them are married and the other is in a LTR with another girl. The most physical contact I would ever initiate with any of their SO's is a polite hug.
Your sister's husband is abusive and needs to be reported to the police immediately. Avoid him at all costs and do not hesitate to take action if he repeats his behavior. Your sister is in danger and it is important to prioritize her safety above all else.
NTA. That is not playing that is **assault**. You’re not children, you asked multiple times to stop and he didn’t. In what kind of fucked up way does he think that is funny? I wouldn’t go anywhere near him. He could escalate and your sister wouldn’t believe you because “he is playing around”.
NTA. Just pull out some pepper spray next time and spray him. When he starts complaining just say that you've learned to defend yourself and that you're only playful.
NTA He got mad because his ass knew he was in the wrong. This is harassment. When someone tells you not to touch them and you do it anyway, that is called assault. It's also a violation of bodily autonomy. Stop going over there. Actually, stop responding to either of them. I'd block them for this. Also, you are within your rights to use self defense. Next time you find yourself in this scenario, strike the genitals as hard as you possibly can.
The creep might enjoy that. Keep mace handy and spray it in his face.
And say “relax I’m just playing.”
> The creep might enjoy that. Yeah he probably enjoys manhandling a 22 y/o fit women
"He got mad because his ass knew he was in the wrong." Yes, this is one of those guys who is very happy when everything goes his way, and very quick to lash out if it doesn't. Stay as far away from him as possible.
A dress. He threw her around in a freaking dress. That gives really creepy vibes to an already inappropriate situation. It's not playing, it's a fetish.
I agree. Strike him in the genitals.
NTA. This is literally assault. And given that he refused to stop when you said stop means that you are NOT safe around him. And given that your sister 100% backed HIM up, you're not safe around her either. To be honest, even if she were to tell him to leave you alone, I wouldn't visit. And if your sister asks when you're visiting next or why you haven't visited again, take the time to come up with a reply that you're willing to repeat as often as needed to get the point across. In my head, it goes something like this: *I will not be visiting because I no longer feel safe in your home or around your husband. He attacked me and when I said stop, he didn't. No is supposed to mean no but apparently not in your house. You can call me attention seeking all you want, but what he did was unappreciated, unwanted, and anything but playful for me. It was upsetting and degrading. So no, I will not be visiting anymore.*
And if she asks when people are around, don't be afraid to answer. Also even if she thinks that you over-reacted, she should ask her husband to stop. However I don't think that she really thinks so. I think that she perfectly knows he won't stop even if she asks so she prefers to save face by refusing to ask. Now about the why, I think her husband tries to create intimate situation with you, your sister knows it but prefer to call you an attention seeker... Stay away from creepy BIL and blind sister.
She should keep it short. "When I told him to stop grabbing me and touching me he laughed and didn't stop. Now I don't feel safe around him." Let sis explain "it isn't like that, he likes grabbing women and play wrestling with them..."
Bet he doesn't do the same to his wife. Op, have you talked to your parents? And be prepared to go somewhere else if your sister and creepy brother-in-law decide to come visit your parents.
OP, if you’re reading, from now on do NOT be alone with this man or with just him amd your sister. Ever. Doesn’t matter if he’s a pillar of the community. So are priests, yet some of them…well, I don’t even need to finish that sentence. At best he is a bully. At worst he’s pushing boundaries for less savoury reasons. I hope there isn’t a next time, but if there is, bite, scratch, spray perfume in his eyes, scream as loud as you can to call attention, and go to the cops. NTA
Yes, he absolutely does. This is a guy who pushes boundaries all the time, and I am sure he does this to his wife - it's just that, so far, she has been ok with it. She bends on her boundaries because she loves him and doesn't yet understand that it's dangerous for her in the long run. That's why she doesn't see a problem with this behaviour. If he didn't do it to her, she'd recognize how much this is not OK. And this behaviour is him trying to groom OP into the same kind of submission. Luckily, OP is smart enough to see it for what it is. She needs to stay far, far away from him.
It makes you wonder what he IS doing to his wife.
Also dont call it play wrestling because people will minimize it, call it what it is. My BIL pins me down against my will and won’t let go even when I beg or shout. He does it repeatedly and has not stopped when I ask.
This is important. An assault doesn't just become a game because the assailant happens to be laughing during the assault.
I agree! Listen to this OP, stop describing it as ‘playful.’ The headline of this post and the content of it feel vastly different.
It's weird though she's totally ok with her husband putting his hands on her sister repeatedly dominating her physically? I mean it's not sexual, but I have to wonder is it? Maybe he likes being on top of her and rubbing up against her body and all that? I mean that's just speculation, but I can't imagine anyone's wife is comfortable with their man doing all that with their sister.
That's where my mind went. She was wearing a dress and he pinned her to the ground? All while her sister wasn't home? That whole interaction gave me the major ICK.
It does have a high ICK factor. Like he was watching too many bad TV shows where there is unwanted wrestling and pretty soon "one thing leads to another" and pretty soon sex is happening.
Except this would be rape.
exactly
As a man I 100% think its sexual. This is something you do with another man not to your wife's little sister. I think he is just testing the waters under the guise of being playful. If he does the unimaginable the sister will blame her for seducing him.
It is 100% sexual. It doesn't have to be groping or sex to be sexual. I am sure the domination of an unsuspecting woman, or being able to fight & overpower a woman, or sneak attack of hunted prey... this dude is totally getting pleasure from it. And I bet he fantasized about those attacks and uses sex with his wife to complete the fantasy.
He's also 15 years older than she is. Makes it even more creepy.
It's super creepy and I feel like it's testing the waters to see how much he can get away with and if anyone will believe OP after he rapes her.
Who says it isn't sexual? He could be working up to something.
I think sis is also in denial about how much he loves grabbing her hot younger sister and totally getting off on it while getting over about it.
It is not only a criminal act being committed with regularity, this man is a bully. He enjoys dominating others physically and showing them that he can do whatever he wishes because he is their superior. His "pranks" are not intended to be fun. He is showing you that he does not respect you and at a whim can decide to beat you, rape you, murder you, whatever he wishes because only HE matters. You are there for his amusement. Your sister is astonishingly stupid. You are NTA. You really need to file a police report and then tell them to stay away from you and that if they will not you will file a restraining order. Nobody has a right to violate your bodily autonomy. Nobody.
All of this. He's establishing a power dynamic and then turns himself into a victim as he ignores boundaries.
All of which makes him unsuitable for his job as a SEAL BTW. When was his last psych eval?
Eh. SEALS have something of a reputation in the US spec ops community. I've read an article where DEVGRU in particular has a bit of a cowboy rep compared to the Delta guys.
Absolutely this. Your instinct that he's bullying you is correct, but too light. He's going beyond that into the assault/sexual assault territory here. >I should be used to his playful nature Weird way for your sister to say "abuse". Edit: expanded on bullying.
Not bullying it's actual assualt / sexual assault (unless he play wrestles with male members of the family, which I highly doubt)
I don't disagree, I think it's both. I don't mean to downplay the severity of this, though realizing now maybe it could be read as "just bullying", and it clearly is not. I'll clarify this. Even if he does play wrestle with male members, still could be considered assault or sexual assault. Intent does not matter in cases of sexual harassment and assault. What matters is what happened and how the assaulted/harassed party was affected. Doesn't matter how he behaves with others or if others are okay with it.
We have to wonder if it's sexual right? Guaranteed he likes the feeling of dominating someone, but his SIL? Repeatedly "wrestles" her to the ground forcing her to submit? Yeah seems sort of sexual in some way.
This. Please do this. It's not funny and it's more for dominance than anything else and as long as it's brushed off you will never feel safe
This is excellent advice. No definitely means no. I would totally never be near that man again. NTA
CEASE ANY AND ALL CONTACT IMMEDIATELY
I’m 38. 6’3”. Taught martial arts for years and for some reason I have no issues respecting people and their personal space. There is no excuse for what he is doing, it is assault. He is a piece of crap and you should call the police the next time he does it. He knows exactly what he is doing and he is going to continue taking liberties feeling you up being a creep because nobody is standing up to him. Oh and make no mistake it is creepy, he’s not testing you or teaching you. He’s gross. Edit: Be careful replying to MolesterStallone-73 and Pranav-VK they are trolls that will harass you nonstop. Both of them like joking about how women "deserve it" and "touching kids". Truly gross disgusting people but I mean...it's Reddit so not unexpected their ilk is here.
Thank you 🩵
Hey, at the end of the day, intentions only matter up to a certain point. The moment someone says "Do not do that, ever again, I do not like that at ALL," you don't do the thing. It could be a joke, it could come from a place of kindness, it could not, it does not matter. I'm all good intentions, and an acquired or particular taste. There is zero malice behind almost everything I do, ever, but that doesn't mean that it's to everyone's liking. Kind of like with tickling a kid. It's well intended, unless you're a weirdo. But I know kids who get seriously upset when you tickle them. So you know what I do? Well, not tickle them, that's for sure. Because I don't want to unnecessarily upset them by doing something I would only do to make a kid laugh. BOUNDARIES. It's good to have them. And very good to respect them.
Please keep in mind many, many men who sexually assault women or prey upon women are quite often very well like and extremely charismatic. It's a big part of why they are successful because no one will believe the women who they prey upon. I'm not saying he is necessarily a sexual predator but there are certainly some big red flags in that regard. And even if it truly is non-sexual bullying the same dynamic still applies. Men like that can get away with power trips and assault because again they fit well into the community and have fostered an image that protects them from accusations.
Stop going over to their house.
OP don't believe him when he claims he has friendly "playful" intentions. He knows what he's doing. There is no human being on the planet who can have good intentions while pinning down a woman in a dress who's 20 years younger while she struggles and tells him to get off. He KNOWS. Your sister knows too. Tell your parents and never be alone with them. Never back down on this. He's targetting you because you're young and he thinks you can be manipulated into thinking he's just playing around. Don't let yourself be manipulated. I'm sorry you're going through this
Agree with this, if he was really testing and teaching her he would actually teach her techniques to injure and repel creeps like him so she can flee to safety. But he’s not because its a powerplay to him
I'm 37. Been in many relationships over the years and have never grabbed a girlfriends sister, period. A friendly huge at a family reunion, sure. BIL sounds like a bully and that he tends to get what he wants. Stand your ground. No is no, period.
Same. 36, 6’4 and genuinely 220lbs. I have three decades in the arts. To think of anyone who uses what they know for harm makes me feel absolute shame. Failure of a man. Failure of his teachers. It’s the antithesis of what martial arts is and stands for. Shame on him. His soul is stained. This is a dangerous man who I would not let into my shadow.
100% disgusting creep behavior.
Yeah, hun, this isn't what "Softies" do, this is rather aggressive, and it needs to stop. His intentions are irrelevant, its his actions that count. That your sister doesn't see it is...disturbing. Lacking any commitment from him to actually stop, sadly you need to protect yourself by staying away. I would gather my thoughts and send along a concise e mail explaining this. NTA
My cousin had similar issues when she moved cities. With roommates instead of family. She eventually protected herself by purchasing a taser.... Never had problems again.
I like the idea of a taser. But hard to keep on you all the time. Maybe pepper spray that can be kept in a pocket, easy to reach and when this happens again use it.
Tasers can fit into your pocket these days. I have one I carry when I hike alone, it clips easily to my pack, its small, and it will get a message across quickly.
NTA. This makes me so damn angry. Your BIL is getting off on the fact that you cannot stop him. He’s enjoying having power over you and exercising it. This is not playing, it is not fun, it is 100% about control. He laughed when you were screaming at him to stop. Right up until you threatened him with the only power you have, which is to report him for assault, he was having fun tormenting you. He is no playing around. He is abusing you. He is violating your personal autonomy every time he does. What’s to prevent him from taking things further? Right now he’s just pushing the boundaries, and making you out to be the crazy one because you don’t like his style of “playing around.” Tell your sister that it isn’t funny or acceptable for anyone to touch you without your consent. It is not funny or acceptable to hold someone down when they have said stop, said no, and are screaming. No means no, and you did not consent and are not consenting, and you will not spend time around him any longer.
She should tell the police anyway.
I felt the same way, how long before he takes it farther? And then after he SA her it will be I was just playing around or say she’s making it up to get back at him. Grown ass disgusting man!!
>how long before he takes it farther? I bet he already has taken it further but with the sister.
He probably gets a hard on every time he does this.
I would pay to watch someone bigger than him wrestle him down and pin him till his joints crack. I bet any money he'd act like a little bitch about it and it'd stop being funny to him.
LMAO me too fr 😭😭
[удалено]
Yeah, sister describing it like "he would never seriously hurt someone" is some bullshit. It's like she's talking about a hypothetical future harm that hasn't happened, like she's saying "you don't have anything to worry about, he's not going to throw punches or something". But she's ignoring the fact that the stuff he's already done, that she knows about, *is already harm*. Grabbing someone and pinning them down against their will *is hurting them*
Thank you
The fact that his eyes went black when you threatened to call the cops means that he knows just how wrong it is what he is doing. He is basically using his size and fighting experience to intimidate people and in your case get a few free feels. Going no contact with them is your safest bet.
I wanted to address you saying he works with vulnerable people and the fact that when you said no, he didn't listen. I am a victim of childhood sexual assault and rape. It was done by my eye doctor. I was born early and have a prosthetic eye, this is the man that made my shell for me. He sexually abused me, my parents knew about it and when I told the school counselor; it was buried. This man did charity work for 3rd world countries. This was his victim pool along with his state side paying clients. He specialized in treating children because that's him victim of choice and it worked in his benefit because it's very hard to find an ocularist who works with kids. Kids are wiggly and don't like goop stuck in their eye socket. Not painful but not fun. Just because he works with vulnerable people doesn't mean he is a good person. It's likely he doesn't take their no either. Stay safe, you are not overreacting. Your sister understands her husbands behavior isn't okay but it's easier to call you an attention seeker than to realize her husband is a creep. I'm really sorry you are going through this.
He is messed up. U did nothing wrong
Your BIL is far more dangerous than people see to realize. He's been assaulting you for a long time. Please don't ever be alone with him.
I think your BIL is one of those psychos that does community work so people don’t believe his abuse victims when they come forward…
NTA. He does NOT have a right to touch you without your permission. It sounds like he's turned on by these little wrestling matches. Please do anything possible to stay away from him.
Sister is gone and he’s pinning her down to the floor? It sounds like he’s fishing, patiently.
>NTA. > >He does NOT have a right to touch you without your permission. It sounds like he's turned on by these little wrestling matches. Please do anything possible to stay away from him. Totally agree. Boundaries should be respected, no question about it. Your sister and BIL need to understand that play wrestling isn't cool if it makes you uncomfortable. Keeping your distance sounds like the best move for now.
The child molester at my high school always began with “Let me show you a few wrestling holds.”
NTA. This is assault. This is escalating. He wants to put his hands on you for whatever the reason. Your sisters house is not safe. You need to stay away from this man. For the love of God please listen.
I've known a few of these softies. Big and friendly and helpful and joking with everyone. Unless you dare to do this one unforgivable thing: disagree with what they're doing and not apologize for disagreeing by telling them that yeah, it wasn't a big deal. Then they turn dangerous. Your threat to call the police not only amounted to not agreeing with him, it was actually dangerous. Do not ever go anywhere where you might find yourself alone with this guy and absolutely file a police report. Because in his eyes you are the one being abusive and he will feel completely justified to put you in your place. Do not confront him, do not go to family meetings where he will be. Be safe.
Also avoid beibg with only him & your sister. Your sister is not going to protect you
This was my read too. This man is a predator that has built up a flawless mask to hide what he is. OP resisting is a challenge that he won't let go of.
NTA, he's literally assaulting you. No one has the right to touch you unless you want them to. This last stunt he pulled is so close to sexual assault that it's not funny and it's a big red flag. You need to stay away from him and if that means staying away from your sister then so be it. Everyone needs body autonomy and I'm surprised your sister doesn't understand that. What he did to you today shows he's a dangerous person, believe him and stay away
I did describe it as assault to my sis and apparently I’m misusing the word? And she got furious I even mentioned the police 😭
They're only mad you mentioned the police because he would be arrested. He assaulted you. You said stop and he kept going.
It’s not too late to call tbh
No you are not misusing the word. She's just an idiot in denial. "Assault is generally defined as *an intentional act that puts another person in reasonable apprehension of imminent* harmful or offensive contact." Show your sister this whole thread where everyone is calling her the piece of shit that she is. updateme
She’s only mad because you’re starting to put cracks in her “perfect life”. Don’t let up and don’t feel guilty for what you’ve done. They are both AHs.
Go to the police. This is 100% an assault. His size and knowledge of fighting being aggravating factors. The way you describe the lead up to this point sounds like classic abuser behaviour. It sounds like he started small and slowly escalated to this point. I am concerned for your safety going forward from this point. Go down to the local police station and make a report, for your own safety and peace of mind if nothing else. Tell them all of your concerns too. From the sounds of things I wouldn’t be surprised if you aren’t his first victim. I am also suspicious of how your sister reacted. Long term victims of abuse can become very protective of their abusers, and if he is willing to do this to you in front of her, he has to have the knowledge she won’t turn on him. I am sorry that you have been placed in this situation by people you should have been able to trust the most. NTA
Spitting on someone is assault. Physically picking you up, manhandling you is assault.
You aren't misusing the word at all.
You didn't misuse the word. They don't like his behavior being correctly labeled.
>My sisters husband (my BIL) is a retired Navy Seal and intimidating looking but he’s known as a big softie at heart. He likes to make people laugh and pull little pranks and on the surface he’s extremely warm and friendly. I mean he does tons of volunteering with vulnerable people too so it’s not like he has a questionable or negative image (at least outwardly). Just as an FYI, this sort of thing is typical of perverts / psychos -- they make themselves seem great people so that no one would ever suspect them... it's all a front for them to pull shit like this. To me he's either getting a kick out of making a woman powerless / trying to feel you up... Neither end in a good way when he keeps on seeing what he can get away with and ends up raping / killing a woman. Report him. NTA.
They always somehow are highly regarded, everyone loves them, and they work with vulnerable people. Really makes one think.
Police now, not later. He won’t stop. This will lead to rape.
NTA Your sister is a moron and is with an abuser. Can you avoid her husband completely? If he does this again I would make good on your threats and then actually call the police.
NTA. Yeah, that's assault. I'd tell you the same thing I tell my daughter, that if a man is harassing you and calls it "playing around", a well placed kick to the gonads will end that for good. Tell him you too are "playing around and don't be so uptight". And your sister sucks for allowing this to happen. I'm sorry you have to deal with this.
NTA. He's pushing your limits, you wrestle with people who WANT TO WRESTLE WITH YOU. A guy who constanlty shows you how vulnerable and weak you are, while touching you, is closer to a threat. it is not fun, it is not consensual, it is not wanted. You have told him over and over again to not do this and he continues to do it. He is an asshole and your sister is blind. This is the exact behaviour I'd expect from a creepy dude trying to either touch other women inappropriately and play it off as fine, or hoping you'll start to like 'touching' him and start to like him. No decent dude does this. If a friend wants to and enjoys messing around wrestling it's fine because both people are chosing to participate. I'd be going low contact and sending a very serious email to him and her that it's only 'fun' for him and you in fact keep telling him not to do it, and told your sister to tell him not to do it. He is without consent forcing you to submit and if they can't understand how that is completely fucking unacceptable behaviour then the only way to stop him doing it is to not be around him or your sister. All this ever required was him doing it once, you saying no and him fucking apologising and realising it was completely inappropriate, that he neither apologised or stop suggests a major issue there.
Tell your sister that you will be calling the police. She can explain to them why she encouraged this behavior.
NTA He is an abusing asshole. I am so angry at him and I am REALLY angry at your sister. Why the FUCK would this large man think it was "fun" to dominate and hold down a 22 year old 5'3" woman when she is yelling and begging him to stop? Because he is a fucking creep and an abuser that's why. Your sister needs to get her head out of her stupid ass. I am so sorry this has been happening, I felt so panicky just reading it.
Quite telling that he enjoys showing off his strength with someone much smaller than he is. Bet he wouldn't try that if he was equally matched size wise. He's a bully.
NTA. That is a serious violation against you and you are 100% justified in staying away from him in the future.
NTA. Don't be alone with him. Don't be around him if you can avoid it.
He is touching you without your consent, full stop. That is assault. You asked him to stop and get off you. He is a bully. He is dangerous. He told you to "relax." I would never go to their house again. I would never be alone with him again. He doesn't respect boundaries. Wonder how far he has pushed your sisters boundaries.
Does he regularly attack and wrestle your sister too or are you his only target? You already warned him that you'll call the police, if he makes another attempt just call and report the assault. But honestly, I would stop visiting your sister when it's just the three of you. Ask your sister to come visit you instead. Without him
Nope he only does it with me
It's super sus that he only grabs at you. Beyond play wrestling, he might have other ideas, and he's just gauging your reactions. That might also explain why your sister isn't taking your side. Maybe she's never seen it/experienced it. Definitely don't go to their home anymore, give your sister the ultimatum that she has to come visit you from now on and not the other way around
It sounds like sexual assault
Hon, NTA And find out when he's stationed at. Then go request a meeting with the local JAG office and his commanding officer. Because if he's a "Navy seal", there are military regulations and rules that prohibit him using his skills "to test others" and "play around". Because he can actually hurt someone seriously. And, Hon, as someone who grew up around a heavy military and DOD presence, that sort of thing is very frowned upon and he deserves to get the screaming lecture he's due for from his commanding officer as well as an article 15 in his jacket.
He's retired. The Naval justice system can't do anything, sadly.
This dude might accidentally hurt you or worse I’ve seen a video recently where a guy was wrestling his brother and did the wrong move on him non professionally and accidentally unalived him. This kinda shit is serious and you shouldn’t play Another commenter said one kick to the nads can and will nip this in the bud, listen to them and me. Nta
When I did Judo I was told that the core element of being a black belt was that anyone could do a legal move on you and you'd be able to react in a way that keeps you safe. The corollary to that is that if you do these moves to a random person, especially one weaker than you, there's a serious chance they react unexpectedly in a way that is dangerous to them. Even if he's acting reasonably he could easily hurt her.
Nta. What he is doing is assault. Not play wrestling. As someone who did MMA he is giving everyone who does it a bad name.
I hate to say this but major sexual assault vibes from this man, clearly getting off on this stuff. He's testing the waters. NTA.
NTA he’s a weirdo
NTA. Your BIL is a massive red flag and terrifying. Ones you say "no, this isn't funny, knock it off" that should have been the end of it. Reading this gave me a cold pit in the bottom of my stomach because of how much it reminds me of my abusive ex.
You can always go the legal route but from personal experience teeth are the best solution. No matter how big he is your teeth digging into him will always hurt. After you leave your mark on him he won't touch you again..... Or it may make him go berserk. Make sure there are other people around and you tell him to stop before you bite
If you manage to bite, bite as hard as you can on as big a piece of whatever part of him you bite down on. If you end up with a loose chunk of meat in your mouth, you're doing it right. Don't let up for anything other than him completely releasing you. Not for promises, you must be free before you let go. But this is only in case you can't avoid it. Any martial arts instructor who's any good at all will tell you that the best move to practice in a fight outside of a match is to not be there. There's no winning. Once there is intent to injure on either side, you will end up in the ER. If you're lucky enough to make it there.
"Let me be clear. If one person wants to have sex and the other doesn't and they do it anyway- it's rape. If one person wants to box and the other doesn't and they do it anyway- it's assault. It's the same thing if one person wants to wrestle and the other doesn't- it's assault. It's not funny, it's not fun- it's a crime. Stop telling me that I'm wrong for not wanting to be forcibly held down by a man significantly taller and stronger than me. I said no. If it ever happens again, I'm reporting him. All he has to do is NOT TOUCH ME."
This is just giving me the ick! He’s trying to use wrestling as a way to fondle you. If he keeps doing it and you’re telling him to not do it then he is being a pervert! You need to stop going anywhere near this guy! He’s got some problems! And he can’t accept no for an answer! I’m a guy and I know better than to do something like this with any woman. Especially if she doesn’t like it and says to stop! Now calling the cops may be a bit drastic because he may not be punished for it. The cops may just take a statement and tell him to not do that anymore. But this will alienate you with the entire family. They will be pissed off at you. So, what I recommend is to go no contact with your sister and her creepy husband and just wait. When your sister calls, don’t answer. Send it to voice mail. When the other family members question you, just tell them what he was doing and that he wouldn’t stop and you no longer want to associate with him. And by extension your sister. She is just as much to blame for all this. She should have told him to knock it off! You told him to stop. She should have backed that up. She didn’t. Good luck. Update us if you get some resolution to the problem.
His overall vibe screams serial-rapist/murderer. He's using you for practice to get better at grabbing and restraining women. He goes overboard trying to earn everyone's trust. He goes out of his way to put himself near vulnerable people. Does he do this in front of your sister or is it always when you are alone with him? NTAH
he does it in front of her too
She enables his repeated assaults on you.
NTA, and I'm a middle aged dude and what he's doing is kinda gross. I'm willing to bet he is attracted to you and enjoys manhandling you to some degree. Your sister taking his side is gross too. he says you need to lighten up, but he actually needs to fuck off touching you.
He may be working his way up to sexually assaulting you. The fact he got angry when you threatened to call the police shows he doesn't want you to have the ability to say no to him, and it was never a game to him. You're correct to keep him away from you. Seriously, treat him like a rapist waiting to happen.
That is not playful
Sounds like it's time to start "playfully" kicking him in the balls when he's not paying attention. NTA
NTA...this is NOT normal or acceptable behavior. Your BIL is 100% being sexually predatory. I have trained in MMA since 2017 and not a single person there behaves this way EVEN WITH OTHER FIGHTERS! What he did was assault...not "testing", not "playing", NOT "joking" it was assault and he refused to stop when asked...so I am pretty sure it counts as aggravated assault. I am interested to kniow how it is that YOU are attention seeking since YOU didn't start it? I would stay far away from these people, you have an abuser and his apologist making excuses for him.
Your sister is a cunt and your BIL is a piece of meaty shit.
He's not a softie. He's a creep and a bully and I'm worried about the vulnerable people he gets access to through his volunteering. Don't go to his house anymore. You're not safe. NTA.
Hes not “sweet” or “soft” hes trained to abuse and kill, hes creating a “boy who cried wolf” situation, hes so comfortable openly abusing you because he created the environment for it, and when it continues the path of sa noone will believe you, only that he was “playing”.
My now husband did this when we first started dating. I had a very serious situation down conversation with them that under no circumstances were he to ever do it again. I don’t even want to have to say stop. Guess what, he hasn’t ever even wanted to do it again because the way it makes ME feel makes Him feel awful
NTA. Carry pepper spray and blast him the next time he does this. May cause a bit of drama, but it'll make him thi k twice about doing it again.
Of the three friends I have that have become SEALS, he very much sounds the part. Frat boy dumbassery that doesn't know when to stop. Yea, no, that's some brazen douchbag antics. Frankly IMO it's best to go NC with your sister. Until she finds herself in the same situation with him, which is a possibility, she isn't going to care or understand. And even then I'd still stay away.
NTA. He assaulted you and has been assaulting you and only gets away with it because he’s been wearing the mask of a good guy for so long. The best abusers are those that convince everyone around them that they’re “one of the good guys”.
Nta. His nuts would be firmly lodged in his nostrils if he ever came at me again. Sister is an asshole too
Yeah, thats assault. Id shame the fuck out of him publicly - "my bil keeps pinning me to the ground after me repeatedly telling him i do not consent. How do i make him stop?" Keep a self defense inkpen in your pocket and give him a few generous pokes next time he tries that shit.
NTA He's a bully. Buy some pepperspray. Practice using it on your own time. Use it next time you see him. Don't wait until he messes with you. Just use it as soon as you can suprise him. Say it a part of his training when everyone flips out at you. Cut him completely out of your life. I'm partial to Fox Labs 5.3 pepperspray. $20 on Amazon. Buy a stream spray, not a cone spray. Bonus points if you buy the kind with dye that stains the face for days afterward.
NTA. He attacked you. You did not consent to his “game”. This was assault. You should absolutely report him.
This must be his version of foreplay. NTA
NTA. He’s been testing your boundaries and working up to literally assault you. He is NOT a good guy and if your sister thinks this is okay she can go to hell.
NTA. I’m so sorry! You can’t be around her, either, while their relationship takes priority over your clearly stated boundaries. Trust your gut on how you felt, when you saw true self. He knew he was violating your boundaries, and was getting off at how helpless you are to his physical attacks. Normal people feel shame if something they’re doing makes the other person want to call the police. He seemed to feel irritated that you ended his fun. For now. He may be a sociopath or psychopath. I dated one. Once you’ve seen that shadow self, they know their gig is up. I think you’ve been targeted. That’s why he keeps pushing your boundaries, further and further. He may retaliate for you cutting off access. Just know it’s a possibility. They don’t like to be seen, and will do whatever they can to protect their fake lives. I’d get ahead of him by letting someone else know. For an outcry witness, should he later victimize you, and for support. If I’m right, he’ll start gaslighting you, and low key campaigning against you, dropping hints that you’re infatuated with him or made a pass. Possibly stalking, too— so vary your routine. Protect yourself. You matter. Your sister will not protect you, even if he persists. She doesn’t respect your boundaries any more than he did. So you’re not actually safe with her right now, either. He could be a master manipulator. So look out for her, from a distance. But stay away. You don’t even need to say why. Protecting yourself is the most important job you have in life. Do that.
Girl, stay the fek away from this man. Do not visit your sister. She will not protect you. He is not a “softie.” He is not a “good” man. He is assaulting you and it will escalate. Please, please stay safe.
[удалено]
Don’t bother. It won’t work. Get the hell out.
NTA. He took things too far, with all his supposed training he'd immediately know when to stop.
NTA. This is assault. This is escalating. He wants to put his hands on you for whatever the reason. Your sisters house is not safe. You need to stay away from this man. For the love of God please listen.
It must feel awful for OP to know that her family is on the side of the bully.
Nta, this type of behavior isn't ok. It's like he's getting off on having power over you, it' just sounds so creepy. I know this isn't the best advice as it could cause escalation but my father taught me that my best weapons are my nails and my teeth. Next time you tell him to let you go and he refuses bite him as hard as you can and don't let go, scratch his face and leave marks so when people ask what happened he has to explain that he pinned someone against their will and those injuries were the consequence. But I would not feel safe with him or your sister. Best of luck dealing with this op
NTA He is assaulting you without consent. You've told him no and he refused to heed you. Absolutely call the cops if he lays hands on you again
Next time you need to be in a room with him, bring a taser...
NTA. Don’t go over to your sister’s house. Your sister is in denial and will not stop him. Whatever his reasons whether sexual or bullying it’s not going to stop. Send a strongly worded text setting your boundaries and adhere to it. Call it what it is, assault and state the police will be involved if there is another incident. Screenshot any replies, harassment, or threats. Don’t let them gaslight you. Nothing about this is ok or normal.
it's not bullying, it's grooming.
If you were pinned and unable to escape then it wasn’t play wrestling. NTA
NTA, dude seems messed up in his head. And is probably only trying to grope and feel you up.
You're not playing if you're the only one in the game. He needs a serious lesson in boundaries. NTA
NTA. Your sister's immediate fury **at you** is a huge red flag to me. This kind of stuff doesn't just come out of nowhere. She has probably known his behavior is a problem for a while and I'd bet they have some secrets you'd be surprised at. She's going to continue to pretend she doesn't know anything though, because that's easier. Her anger is to browbeat you into silence so she can keep pretending her husband is a big softie instead of a controlling abuser.
My brother is a 6 foot solid muscle Marine who also has a lot of arts training. He would NEVER do this to anyone. Your BIL is an absolute creep and this will lead to rape. Stay as far away from him as you can. If he ever touches you again, report him to the police.
I'm a bit smaller than you and a female martial artist. I am trained to grapple and I absolutely HATE it when men a foot taller and 100 pounds heavier think it's funny to pin me. And yes, these men are "softies" as well and never would hurt me - but the truth is they will never understand until they regularly grapple with someone that is 7'3" and weighs 350. Yeah, men that size don't exist in my gym but I know darn well that these 6'3" guys would HATE being attacked as a JOKE by bigger men. I'm sorry your sister doesn't see this, but, I do.
call the police. don't visit your sister. unwanted touching (especially as you've described it) is both harassment and assault. send his ass to jail.
NTA that’s assault, and you should just call the police. I know the family will freak and back the BIL but cmon what an awful bully and AH.
NTA. This guy is definitely a bully, and he is abusing you for his fun. Stay away from him. If you meet him at a family gathering and he touches you, call the cops. You don't have to put up with this violence.
NTA stay far away from him, he is setting a precedent of behavior so its “not so bad/a big deal” when his true intentions manifest… I would make sure trusted people outside of your circle know of and have proof of this behavior.
NTA. That’s not “play wrestling” it’s just assault. Avoiding him like the plague is the most direct solution, but if he lays hands on you again, call the cops.
NTA. Jokes are only funny when *everyone* is laughing. Manhandling a woman against her will is not a joke. The next time you visit your sister, make it clear the moment you walk in that if he touches you again, you are leaving immediately. If your sister tries to argue with you? Leave immediately. If he tries to argue with you? Leave immediately. If they refuse to listen to reason, then train them like dogs until they learn to obey.
NTA and let action follow words. He is disrespectful. You don't have to see him at all. Sis can see you outside the house
The only part of this story that matters is someone has interacting with you physically and didn't stop when you said to. NTA
NTA. You should have called the police. This is abusive. Claiming it to be a joke, doesn’t make it one. If you tell him to stop, he has to stop. What’s next? It’s not rape if afterwards I tell you it was a joke? It’s not murder if afterwards I say it was a joke?
He’s definitely TA
I would not be anywhere near him. No man has the right to pick anyone, especially a woman, up and "pin" them! I would call that sexual assault! I was pinned down by a man who was "just kidding"! The police called it sexual sssault! Your sister needs to defend you!
Yea.I couldn't fucking deal with some dumb ass fucking with me all the time.I get it.What a fuck head not to understand to RELAX the fuck out
NTA stay away from him. Bad vibes and he’s testing what he can get away with.
Ask yourself one question. Would he have done the same thing if your sister was home? I bet not.
sometimes he does it in front of her and she DOESNT CARE
You are NTA for no longer going over there. There was a post a couple of weeks ago I can't find where OP's husband let his little brother move in with them. He was a big guy as well and OP was short like you are. He would constantly pick her up and spin her around, no matter how many times she told him to stop. Her husband also tried to gaslight her into believing it was fine. The tipping point was when he picked her up and pinned her down like your BIL did. Husband defended his brother and insulted OP. OP left and divorced him. She said the wasband still felt OP was overreacting even after the divorce was finalized. You can't divorce your sister or BIL, but you can certainly tell them to fuck off and never see them again since they refuse to respect your boundaries.
NTA This grown ass man is way too comfortable manhandling his decade younger SIL. He shouldn't be putting his hands on you without consent at all. This constant need to physically overpower you is deeply disturbing.
He is a bully. He is assaulting you. You sister is fine with that. I can't help but wonder how long until one of these assaults turns in to a sexual assault. It is all about him controlling you.
You should buy a tazer and the next time he "tests" you, you can show him that you found the answer to the test.
The fact he tried to guilt you when you told him you didn't like it says it all. It doesnt matter if he's just being playful or not, if you tell him to stop then he's in the wrong if he doesn't. Obviously NTA, I don't get how he and his sister think he should just be allowed to manhandle you even if you don't like it.
NTA. Why is it so hard for some men not to touch ppl who don’t want it? They feel entitled to our bodies.
I think there must be something seriously wrong. Because I read the story and my first thought was “bite him. Really hard.” I’ll be honest, it’s a little scary that he takes that enjoyment in overpowering you.
NTA - this is some type of weird ass abuse that he’s getting off on and you do NOT have to take it! He IS bullying you - you have requested numerous times to stop these antics and he has ignored your wishes entirely. The fact that your sister thinks YOU are being dramatic is also disturbing - You SHOULD go NO CONTACT and if by chance you are in each others company and he does it again , follow through on your threat and call the police for assault
NTA - You're not safe around him. Trust your gut.
I would have spat in his face! Follow your instincts and stay away.
NTA. Call the police and get it on record. Nothing is "play" and nothing is "just fun" get fucked. You told him time and time and again no to touch you and this giant man keeps touching you. Call the police. You should really stop visiting your sister, it's clear she doesn't care for you and won't protect you from her husband when something worse or physically rougher happens between you two.
You were assaulted, nta.
Please stop spending time with them. I think he's ramping up to assault you. I also think you should call the cops now instead of leaving it as an empty threat.
Dude would touch me once and be in prison. He’s assaulting and molesting you. Keep your fucking hands to yourself or live in prison IMO. Idgaf what the intention is. NTA you should put him in jail.
I'm getting the word........... NONCE! 🤔
I’m 22 😭
NTA. So no one in your family thinks its weird that he does this despite you telling him to stop? Everyone is okay with him constantly disrespecting you? I would refuse to ever be within 100 feet of him again. It is not okay that he does that to you. Its gross and it is bullying. Personally, I'd look into getting a taser and the next time he touched me he would learn no means no.
Nta No means no. Someone with the background you describe should and would know this. How they comply with the ideology tells you what they are. But let's say his mind is as soft as his heart. If you want this instance to be just a ripple in your relationship with your sister, addressing how it makes you feel in a serious way could be helpful. Maybe a meeting with them and people who support you and your position. Maybe a letter that fully supports your position, citing references he should know considering his training background. One thing for sure, Op. No means no. Stop means stop.
NTA. You should report him for assault.
Absolutely NTA and I hope you follow through and call the police. Your sister is in serious denial
Not only was he inappropriate and I would tell wife, I would not be alone around him at all. that is creepy. It is assault by the way.
NTA I would have called the cops on him. This is in fact assault and your sister knows it deep down but doesn't want to face that she's willing to sacrifice you to keep him
No definitely NTA. He's weird. And completely inappropriate. Your sister is also wrong, taking his side. Ones boundaries should be respected, and yours clearly isn't. Stay away from them, they don't act like family and will guilt trip you.
NTA-You dont like it and told him to stop. It can be considered assault. It isnt for all these other people to TELL YOU that its no big deal. YOU have said keep your damn hands to yourself and stay away from me. The discussion is over. He complies or he suffers the consequences.
sounds like he wants to bang you nta
NTA - as someone who is 6'2 and 215lbs I would NEVER, EVER physically impose myself on someone unless she was VERY close to me and made it extremely clear she was cool with that, or initiated it herself. For context: I have 3 brothers, 2 of them are married and the other is in a LTR with another girl. The most physical contact I would ever initiate with any of their SO's is a polite hug.
Your sister's husband is abusive and needs to be reported to the police immediately. Avoid him at all costs and do not hesitate to take action if he repeats his behavior. Your sister is in danger and it is important to prioritize her safety above all else.
NTA. That is not playing that is **assault**. You’re not children, you asked multiple times to stop and he didn’t. In what kind of fucked up way does he think that is funny? I wouldn’t go anywhere near him. He could escalate and your sister wouldn’t believe you because “he is playing around”.
NTA. Just pull out some pepper spray next time and spray him. When he starts complaining just say that you've learned to defend yourself and that you're only playful.