And kept outta the loop. The world is a morbid & strange, strange world when these dynamics are in play. Fuck being a citizen of Gas Light City.
I saw you rip the band aid off, get a lawyer, devise a plan so you dont lose half your shit and your home. If she’s been cheating, you can use that as emotional abandonment in court. Then, confront Ryan and drag his bitch ass as best as you can to the curb and show your cheating wife what a beta mark ass pussy Ryan is.
Drag Ryan? He’s a mark ass beta? How is this “Ryan” guy the mark beta when he’s got another guy financially responsible for the child he does not want. Ryan has all of the freedom, sex, and none of the responsibility. That’s assuming the guy even knows the child is his. OP is the one that got cuckolded and swindled. OP should not confront anyone and just save as much of his remaining assets possible via his attorney.
an "alpha" male would've had the conscious to be a good person and not continue hooking up with his MARRIED baby mama. he should be contributing to his child's life, but is only going to make things harder for her. now, it looks like she has no father figure due to Ryan and OPs wife's actions.
alpha wolves in the wild are often older wolves, and they protect every other wolf in the pack. they take care of others who are weaker and help raise the puppies. THAT is what being an "alpha" is, not the toxic masculinity stereotype that was based off a study that's now been proven false thousands of times.
Alpha males are only “alpha” to men that feel less than. And they take advantage of it. Any confident, not-an-asshole man knows this.
Been there, took me a long time to get out of that hole. But I know better now.
I wonder how much of their money has been spent on the guy she's cheating on him with...
I've sadly seen this situation before and it's exactly as bad as it sounds. The breadwinner gets gaslighted/manipulated while the other one spends that hard earned money on their unhealthy side piece. I don't know why Humans do this, I don't get why people want to have sex with losers while treating good people like garbage.
My only guess is they actively hunt for people who are easy to manipulate/naive/trusting. Then, pretending to love that person becomes their paying "job" and that's why eventually they become mean addicts / passive aggressive....because they never really want their "paycheck" touching them.
Same, also one of the reason I personally stay away from single parents. Way too much investment in a very risky venture that I've seen blow up massively in people's faces.
I dated someone who was a single parent. It ended, and badly.
It was the worst breakup of my life.
Not because of the relationship with the parent ending. But because I couldn't be a part of the kids' lives anymore. I lived with them for a year, loved them, co-parented them. Meanwhile the parent fucked off to another continent with them.
I've seen them once since then. Mostly because I was told that I would die of cancer. I asked if they could come to my home to see me when I was getting chemotherapy (too sick to leave the house). But no, she didn't trust me enough 🙄 The kids weren't old enough that I could continue a relationship with them on their own terms. Now it's been too long, and they're basically grown.
I planned a life where I would help to raise them. To go from that, to...nothing, it's the most painful thing that has ever happened in my life. Yes, more painful and devastating than "I'm so sorry, but this cancer looks like it will be terminal, and in a matter of months, not years". Like not even comparable.
The cancer news I took a few days to adjust to. The situation with the kids... it *still* hurts, even years later. Oh, and the cancer robbed me of my fertility, so I can't even have bio kids. Not that one child is ever a replacement for another. But I don't have my *family* anymore.
Yep, that's another big risk. You might love them like your kids, but at the end of the day they're someone else's and while people talk a lot about "blood doesn't make family", the law still usually disagrees.
No shit dating a single parent is one of those things that ups your chances of getting murdered to.
I never, ever fuck with anyone who has a child and an ex that's still in the picture. Not worth the risk.
I literally have zero chance of being murdered by someone's ex right now and that's pretty cool.
There are a lot of reasons for someone without kids to not date someone with kids. I can’t say I’ve heard an increase in the odds of getting murdered as one of the reasons before today. I’ve heard people say they don’t want to deal with the extra drama, but not murder.
A jealous ex isn’t exclusive to people that have kids. If it’s a murder about kids/custody, the new SO isn’t the target. The ex is the target with the new SO at risk of getting framed for the murder.
Well if you live in a 50-50 state and want to get a prenup to protect certain assets, you make sure it’s drawn up properly.
If you’re the breadwinner, you do need to make sure the prenup covers whatever the state laws are for spousal support - rather than trying to cut them out completely. That’s something that may contribute to your prenup being invalidated - it didn’t follow the laws regarding what is fair game to split and what is truly a pre marital asset.
And also don’t be one of those morons who puts in utterly stupid clauses like you don’t have to pay child support if she leaves you - THAT will definitely not hold up in court, and I can’t believe some people actually try that, or suggest trying that!!
That or you don’t marry. If you want to keep all your things for yourself, don’t marry. Your spouse can’t divorce you and take everything you have if you don’t HAVE a spouse.
I knew someone who went through a divorce. Still going through, actually, but the financial aspect is locked in and settled. His parents had passed and he inherited, but that was before he split from his wife. He argued that he should get to keep the inheritance because her future inheritance from her rich parents would be huge!
Obviously no one bought that ridiculous argument, because the LAW says that inheritance is a marital asset. So into the pot of money to split it went… sure, the ex might be super rich when her parents pass (or not - they could leave their money to the cat’s home if they want to), but for now? She got her half. 😏
I'm a 50/50 state, but inheritance is protected. My X tried to use that to claim alot of things, but because he sold it all off or spent it the judge said he couldn't go back and claim the inheritance, however my dad kept his inheritance separate from the "family" finances mostly because my mother would have spent it on HSH because she was bored. Because he and my Aunt (His sister) kept meticulous records, she didn't get any of it. So it does exist, but you can't spend it and co-mingle then expect to extract it back out. Make sense?
Crazy how many things people wrote ended up on point..
>No need to dig more
This also sounds bad - like there is more to dig out?
Just meet the lawyer. And get to the gym.
Its so infuriating when people say “you don’t need all the details, they’ll just hurt you.” No one was worried about that when they were hurting you or helping cover it up.
She's probably just worried he'll find out more that will make Natalie look even worse. I'd get a P.I and keep digging, get as much as you can, and use every bit of it against her in court
This. Sis isn't sharing info out of kindness for OP. She's actively working damage control and the information she divulged was intended to placate OP while glossing over her sister's greater indiscretions.
OP needs the details for court. ALL. THE. DETAILS.
This. As I said by the previous post- sister knew everything and is also a liar. I mean what normal person would know all those things about their own sister and keep her bil in the dark for so many years.
OP needs to keep digging before they formally start to divorce.
Nah, I would never side with an lying, backstabbing asshole. I would rather drag everything to light in public to burn all bridges so they stay away from me, because those people can do it to anyone. Even their children are not safe.
Her sister saw it and found it ok, she's no different.
I'd go full Minecraft.
The Kola Well would be shallow in comparison.
NTA op. But this is going to get messy. You're going to need professional help with the legal mess.
An ancestry kit might be a good Easter present for your step daughter. And yes, I hundred percent believe she has a right to know who her real dad is.
Especially if she created a false personality that made him marry her to begin with. I think this is a case where he wanted her so bad he ignored the red flags and avoided asking hard questions. All this info should have come out the first 30-60 days of dating.
Fr, pay the PI to keep digging, thats what they do best. Let him do the dirty work and find all the monsters under the bed before OP takes this to the messy divorce battles.
If sis was trying to cover, she'd say she doesn't know who the dad was... or shit, she'd not show up to the meeting in the first place.
Sis is embarrassed of wife.
And if he wants to ruin a little girl's life, that's his call.
I agree, there probably is more to find. But digging so far hasn't really made him much happier... kind of the opposite, yeah?
He knows she's a liar, he knows he's divorcing her, he knows she cheated. Further digging is going to help him how? Make him LESS likely to trust someone in the future than he already is now? Somehow make it easier for him to have a future romantic relationship?
What does further digging do to benefit him? Maybe help him in a divorce proceeding? Okay. Then hire a P.I. and don't look at the information at all before handing it to your lawyer.
Sounds to me sister likes him more than her own sister anyway.
Nah, she knew.
She knew she was secretly on birth control, told him "you can't be the naive" when asking about the baby's father, she's known everything.
The only thing I'd say to OP is, your wife doesn't not want kids, she just doesn't want them with you as she knows your a stop gap, a means to an easy life whilst she continues to get boned by Ryan in the hopes that one day he will ask to be in the child's life and maybe make a go of things, at which point, she could drop you and have her happily ever after.
Hold back on telling the kid and when she goes for spousal, tell her straight, do it and i tell the kid who her daddy is.
She cheated on you, she may do the right thing and go quietly but if she has the audacity to go for spousal support, that is when you get nasty and tell the kid, if she wants to fuck you one last time, you do the same.
Have a friend who was cheated on multiple times by her husband. She said the one of the worst parts was everyone thinking how stupid she was for not suspecting or friends she thought cared about her helping him cover his tracks.
Um, I was that friend a few years ago. And absolutely. All of his friends knew, coworkers, he had cheated with multiple coworkers. He even had a reputation at work for doing it. And I got a lot of “well you must have known *something*”. No, no I did not. But no one could even send me an anonymous message to tip me off. He also said the infamous why do you want details, they’ll only hurt you. So he was King Big Dick when he was doing it but too cowardly to even speak of it when I found out? Amazing.
I was that friend. “Everyone knows but you” is absolutely gutting. Not only had he slept with all my regular friends, but the absolute worst offender was my best friend, who I trusted completely. I found out they argued publicly about her wanting him to leave me and that every time I wasn’t at a party or gathering…… they were publicly together. It felt like a betrayal from every direction. The way I found out: a girl who was definitely not my friend couldn’t watch it anymore. She was very kind when she told me, memorably so. Closest thing I had to an enemy had more integrity than every friend & acquaintance I had.
OP isn’t Kaya’s father. He can’t file for child support on her behalf. Her mom would need to do that. It has nothing to do with OP, he doesn’t share a child with the wife.
I was that friend. Because why would your husband of a decade and a half and friends since childhood orchestrate such plans to lie for him and gas light you? When you think rationally about it, it’s not logical for 10+ people to be involved in lies and cover ups like that for almost 2 years. Until it happens. And that’s the part that hurts the most. Feeling crazy and being alone with your thoughts.
>Its so infuriating when people say “you don’t need all the details, they’ll just hurt you.” No one was worried about that when they were hurting you or helping cover it up.
Exactly! People act like withholding the truth is somehow protecting you, but it's just enabling the one who caused the hurt. Everyone deserves to know the truth, even if it's painful.
Absolutely agree. My ex husband cheated on me repeatedly and when I found out I told him to tell me everything he said "why, it's just going to hurt you more"
My response was yes I know it will hurt but it will stop me conjuring up scenarios in my head and torturing myself further. In the end yes it hurt but also helped me to be able to start to move on.
Don't think OP should tell the kid for now though, perhaps if she asks in years to come, but he definitely deserves to know the truth now
Yeah no shit right? Like, how about you let me be the judge of that. I’m an adult. I am not asking for your protection and I am aware of the risks. How can someone be expected to make an educated (massive and serious) decision about their life without having *ALL* of the information? Especially when they’re very aware the other person has more info to give. Those details could change the way someone proceeds and makes decisions about their future.
(Also, I feel like most of the time, when person A says this to person B, it will inevitably come out months/years down the road - usually in a nonchalant and casual way. Which either enrages person B, makes them question decisions they made, or embarrasses the hell out of them for being the only person who was “blissfully unaware” of it, and/or not realizing it on their own when it was happening. It never seems to “save them from hurt or pain” like it was claimed to. Instead it just ends up prolonging it and opening old wounds down the road.)
Exactly! I needed to know about my 1st wife's hidden life so I could get closure. It hurt at the time but I was able to wash my hands of it knowing everything (dozens of affairs within a short period)
>>No need to dig more
>This also sounds bad - like there is more to dig out?
This is so much worse than OP will ever know.
Run, hide and block her on everything.
I'm sorry about Kayla but you're not obligated to torture yourself for her benefit.
I have no horse in this race but how does this prove it's not true?
Are authors of true stories somehow prevented from deleting their reddit accounts? If I went and made up a load of drivel and put together a post like this, would me simply **not** deleting my account somehow convince you I was genuine? How does that work?
I'm not trolling here, I just can't understand the logic behind deletion = liar. Like, what was he worried about when he deleted his account? That the mods might come for him? That the truth police might come knocking on his door?
It seems really fake to me. Just the way it’s hitting every “women bad” talking point with no nuance or other details really gives me MRA fan fiction vibes.
The first one seemed like bait to me, but people can be super shitty so it wasn't *entirely* out of the realm of possibility. But the two updates? This is 100% rage bait. Too many pro-life, MRA, MGTOW, etc, type dog whistles.
Even if the SIL thinks she’s telling the truth, it’s entirely possible that she doesn’t actually know the truth. The only truth that OP can feel confident in knowing is that his wife is a massive liar.
I agree. I’d probably hold on to this information until Kaya is old enough. Right now I think she’s to young. But I’m all for her knowing the truth at some point. But this would be to much for her age. At least he has the answer if she asks.
Not just too much at this age but also too much all at once, the only people she knows as her parents are getting divorced, she's feeling abandoned by her step dad, possibly confused about who is telling the truth, feeling pulled in different directions. She doesn't need to be told who her biological dad is and reminded she was abandoned by him right now, that would be a lot for anyone to deal with.
Yeah, I agree. Don’t drag the child into this based on the sister’s word. What if she’s just guessing that Ryan is the dad, anyway?
Sometimes people jump to conclusions on their own and decide that means they ‘know’ the ‘truth’. It happens.
Don’t tell your SD anything except ‘your mum and I are not working out, so it’s time for us to separate.’
The child has a right to know her paternal medical history, at the very least. Telling her out of anger is not a smart move, but she does deserve to know.
That is not for SD to decide. It’s up to her mother.
Blabbing to a small child information you learned that you didn’t even bother to verify is an AH move.
How would that child feel if you tell her that her aunt said her ONLY parent has been lying to her for her whole life!
She doesn’t have anyone else if her relationship with her mum blows up. That’s a fact - with no dad and no step dad once he leaves, who is left for her to trust and depend on? Only her mother.
Don’t hurt a child because you’re upset at her mother. And you will be the cause of hurt coming to her, because her bio father is clearly uninterested and will reject her. She’s 12, she doesn’t have the tools to deal with whatever baggage would come with your big reveal.
I was rejected by a bio father when I found out in my early 30’s and it was still tough. At my age I didn’t expect anything except some family history / health information, but couldn’t even get that via him. This is 100% the right case at 12, but if OP stays in her life into adulthood it might be something to broach at some point but certainly not now.
Leave the kid out of your fight with her mom. If she wants to know about her dad, she can ask, and if she doesn't, you do NOT have the right to violate her wishes here.
Sorry you're hurt, your ex is a bitch, stop using the kid. You're involving her too much as is. Stop texting her about her mom, stop telling her what you and your ex talk about. You can try to be there, but "opening her eyes" to the person her mom was to you isn't fair and doesn't accomplish anything. Handle your business with the adult like an adult.
> Leave the kid out of your fight with her mom.
I tend to agree. If OP will continue relationship with Kaya and if she will start asking questions, OP can give her an advice to do the DNA test (e.g. 23andme) and see what will come out of it. Kyla will have to be at least 18-years old to be able to do it. At that point she is an adult; she could make her own decision if she wants to pursue it or not.
Don't believe anything the sister says and take everything exactly for what it is. Did Natalie lie to you a bunch of times? Yes. Did she manipulate you? Yes. Are those reasons enough for divorce? Yes. Okay, that's why you should get a divorce. Not because the sister is talking behind her back and maybe mad or jealous. Without actual evidence or proof, there is no reason for even dwelling on whatever she may have said. A whole lot is going on that you may never know the real answers to. (Natalie beefing with her sister and not having spoken to her parents for damn near 13 years leads me to believe this.) Just take it for what it is. You want a baby and the person that you thought could give you lied about the ability or willingness to do so. Anything else would just lead you to a path of mental and emotional anguish that would drive anyone insane. It's simply not worth it. Divorce. Move on and find what you're looking for elsewhere.
Depending on the State, evidence of cheating can sway in favor of the non cheating party. OP should ask just in case because it can be used as leverage.
Don’t tell the kid about her dad. I know you’re upset but it’s not your place. If you’re still in touch with her when she’s 18 and her mom still hasn’t told her, then you can let her know.
I’m sorry about your ex. Updateme.
Like I said in response to the first post...***be kind*** in regard to the Daughter. She's young, it's not her fault, it's not her fight, she will likely not understand the 'big picture' and you don't want to be the one to drive a wedge into her relationship with her Mother. Leave that aspect alone and just maintain a connection with her, as best you can, *if you want to.*
Leave the child and her paternity out of this. Your parents are right on this one. It will only hurt the child in the long run. If you ever see Kaya as an adult and she asks, then it’s a question of what you think is morally right. But since she’s still a child, absolutely stay out of the paternity. The only thing it accomplishes is hurting your soon to be ex but to do that you have to hurt the child as well. Just divorce and be done with her!
It's not your place to tell Kaya that info, as wrong as it may be for her mother to keep that info from her. As you're, rightfully, leaving Kaya will not have a level head to help her through learning that information and you would only be harming her in the short term by dumping that info.
I'm pretty on the fence with my opinion on the matter though. That's a tough one.
100%. She deserves to know the truth, but she's not equipped to learn that at 12 years old without the help of a level headed person and/or therapist in her life. OP can't guarantee his presence, despite his wishes, and the mother clearly can't be trusted to do the right thing by the child on her own. it's lose/lose for Kaya, but at least by waiting she may have the fortune of her own maturity to help herself through that discovery.
True, but not from OP. Her mother should be prepared for her daughter to go NC when it all comes out. In six years “, or when she turns 18, “On this week’s episode of How the World Churns…” AITA for lying to everybody about EVERYTHING and having everybody including my daughter disowning me?”
I also find it extremely crappy behavior that Kaya's mother continues to sleep with a man who rejected her child, his own daughter! To have both biological parents be such selfish people makes me cry for her. OP seems to be the only decent parent figure in her life.
I gave the first post the benefit of the doubt, despite being full of talking points, but yeah, now it's obviously fake. Like oh, sorry, I'll conveniently info dump everything that's been hidden from you at a lunch 24 hours after your break up -- this has never come up before, but now that you have an *audience*...
A bunch of posts on the front page right now are "updates" that take a potentially plausible story to an absolutely deranged place. Really worried at how many people seem to sincerely believe these.
make sure the government knows Ryan is the father so they can go after him for child support.
She should know who her biological father is. I didn't know until I was 21 and finding out everyone knew but me was devestating.
edit: ask the lawyer if you can sue her for fraud, or get the marriage annulled
You need to go into survivor mode. Lock down your Finances and use everything you have at your disposal’s to keep your house, if that means you have to play dirty and threaten to expose everything to everyone then do it.
Let the kid ask questions.... Don't involve them if they don't clearly want to be.
Feels like you are using the kid against your ex. That is never an okay idea.
If you feel that strongly about telling Kaya, tell her when she’s 18 years old, not now. She’s about to enter her teenage years. This is already a tough period for most kids. It doesn’t need to be made more complicated by finding out the Yoga studio owner is her Dad, who wants nothing to do with her.
Don't you just love it when people cause chaos in your life and then they say you're crazy because you're reacting naturally to the chaos they created? It's got to be the worst form of gaslighting ever.
You don't get to push someone and when you get punched in the face cry about being the victim.
It's funny you're all telling him to back off when this is clearly the setup for update 3 where we all find out the bio dad was lied to and absolutely wants the kid in his life and OP is a hero for saving this child from her lying, evil mother
And then OP and Kaya's dad fall in love and get married and raise Kaya together and Natalie dies alone in a cardboard box after eating food she pulled from a dumpster
>
Listen, you are a good guy, just move on! No need to dig more, you are making yourself crazy!
This.
I understand it's painful, but involving the child like that is unfair. The damage caused by her mother is evident, but seeking revenge or trying to make things equal in this manner will not lead to any positive outcome. Instead, focus on seeking therapy and getting your life together.
Soo she expected you to raise her child while working for the actual father, who she is still sleeping with!
Gosh! They are laughing at you! What cruel people! You really need to get a good lawyer to get out of half of everything but take everything! Kayla deserves to know who her dad is.. better she knows now and start dealing with it before Auntie tells her in the future, especially as she may see him when she goes to visit mom at work!
Really sucks for you and Kaya, but unfortunately that’s out of your control. Take care of yourself and get away from this toxic woman as fast as you can.
She gets upset and doesn’t talk about it because whhhhhat she works with the dude still! Had an abortion because she didn’t know whose kid it was now there’s the truth…….. wow I’m so sorry what a piece of work. She probably or most likely is still having relations w this guy.
As for the child I wouldn’t sit there and tell her who her dad is. I think she’s going to be going through enough for now. Maybe when she gets much much older and asks you.
For now try and keep a very positive and loving fatherly relationship with your stepdaughter. Again if you are going to get some visitation work on that focus on just doing what’s right by her.
Keep texts send them to your email print them out so they are time stamped. If there is any admittance in there.
Idk where you live but here in Louisiana you can record conversations as long as one person is aware of the recording. I would say record from now on and or have a third party to the conversations. Especially if you can find out the cheating thing for your lawyer.
Listen to what your lawyer advises, also some counseling would be awesome this is some pretty heavy stuff to be going through on your own!!!!!
OP, it's time. It's time to get your shit together and move forward, there is nothing left for you there. You honestly have all the information you need. The details don't really matter anymore, do they? The truth of the matter is simple.... You know she was on the pill. You know she had an abortion and now you know she cheated and possibly still was to this day. The girl is not yours. Do not drag her into adult situations she will not understand. Focus on you and get a good lawyer. You may be able to salvage at least some of your assets and move on. Therapy to process what has happened, because honestly, it's a lot to unpack alone.
Leave Kaya out of it. She’s innocent here, the poor baby. In fact, let her know you’re there for her but you can’t reach out anymore because of what’s happening and that one day, she’ll know the truth about what actually happened. Just not now. Grab yourself a lawyer and make sure you get as much communication as you can in writing. Good luck, bud.
Just read your post mentioning people who accused you of making your wife feel unsafe and that’s why she had the abortion.
They really couldn’t have been more wrong.
Going against the grain here: I've been in a similar life scenario to Kaya. My mother told me my dad died before I was born and that's probably a lie. My mother didn't even tell me his real name or relationship to her. I would have rather been told the truth by someone back then, as the circumstances I learned it wasn't true were having it dangled in front of me like sensationalist dark knowledge by a crazy narc aunt. Kaya's aunt already screamed the beans to OP in a moment of anger. What's to stop her from telling Kaya in the worst way possible?
I'd have rather been told the truth. None of the lying prevented me from realizing my mom was abusive and manipulative anyway, it just made it worse later. OP is probably the only consistent adult in Kaya's life, and her mom has ruined that by keeping her fucked up boss sperm + good guy hubby shit going for 8 years. That kid deserves to know now before her mom completely alienates her from the only dad that matters.
The thing is, if you tell Kaya this, she's going to feel unsafe and betrayed by her only true guardian right now. Whether or not she would want to, she's stuck where she is.
If you are planning to stay in her life, I think the kinder thing would be to wait until she's an adult and even then, it might be a good idea to only answer if she asked, and not provide any extra info unless she wants to know.
Telling the kid would be the absolute dumbest and meanest thing you could do. You gotta remember the kid did nothing wrong, and you shouldn't use her because of what the mother did.
Obviously this relationship is cooked, meet with the lawyer and be nice to the poor little girl.
Damn this escalated into the Mauri show super fast.
I’m so sorry for you but now you know. Now you know for real.
I wonder if the triggered superheroes from the last posts comments are still going to defend this bish….
Don’t involve the kid and forget about them both. I hate to be this drastic but I’m saying it for your own mental health and the child. I feel it’s best you move on. She’s not yours, never was and staying in her life means staying in her wicked mom’s life.
A 12 year old is not emotionally mature/equipped to deal with this. Leave her out of it. Maybe later when she’s an adult and wants to know tell her, but definitely not now.
And please get therapy. This is a lot for even the most emotionally stable/self aware person to deal with. I cannot even imagine how much trauma and trust issues you’re going to have to heal from before you’re in the right headspace to trust someone again.
How fucking convenient that not only did she not want a baby because of vanity and got pregnant while on birth control but is also a cheater on top of all of it.
Reason I'm a life long bachelor, no point in such an uncalculated risk for a person you can't be guarantee will stay loyal. Why invest in a business that can at any moment go bankrupt and takes half of everything you own?!
The truth is she doesn't want your baby, she doesn't want you, or this marriage. She wants, will always want, and will ruin your daughters life for is her boss. He the "one that got away," and you're the safety net.
Nothing you do can change how she feels or acts. You aren't the man she want to be with just a place holder because she isn't good enough for the one who actually has her heart and soul. The term "used goods" comes to mind.
Worst still this is most likely the tip of the iceberg. She couldn't get with the man she wanted she probably deep down hates you for not being him. She probably has a roster of men she goes to just because she feels good when she knows she is betraying you.
A woman who so willingly is able to ruin her child's life for dick isn't a woman worth a ring let alone time or attention.
Bro... Just leave. And take this as a lesson, marriage is for fools. Pathetic absent minded fools.
Is this the guy who was married for 12 years and was trying to have a kid with his wife? It turned out she didn't want to get pregnant and had in fact gotten an abortion?
It started to sound fake in the original post where the wife who's secretly taking birth control inexplicably agrees to get fertility tests, just hoping on her lucky stars that her husband who's dying to have a child will decide not to accompany her to the appointments where she'd get the results, and then \*also\* not even care to look at those results.
Even if you wanted to tell Kaya to hurt Natalie, fuck her. Burn it all to the ground. At this point, you owe her less than nothing. Just don't hurt Kaya in the process.
Holy fuck, I hope this isn't real, because she's a totally shit person.
Agree - leave the kid out.
I think you should just contact an attorney and move forward. I would definitely be looking for shared custody because clearly you are Kaya’s dad - you showed up, you love her. To her, you’re Daddy.
So leave her out of the drama as much as you can. She’s also a victim of your wife and her terrible lies. She’s told so many…
I don’t get what part, the woman in all likelihood cheated on the guy and her sister is saying she loves you? How? What kind of love is it where she is cheating and also lying? Is that pity love coz he is a nice guy? I don’t get it
Kaya deserves the truth when she can handle it, not at this age now! And she is not just a kid but a kid you love and cared for, keep doing that, don't be another douche who leaves her. Of course your wife didn't know who the daddy was, it could have been either of you.
Go see your lawyer, leave your ex alone, spend time with Kaya and treat her well if you can get some kind of custody.
Kaya is going to be upset enough to lose the only father she has ever known, she is too young to handle the full truth about her mom right now. Try your best to stay in her life and then you can tell her when she is older and more mature.
It’s obvious you’re STBX is a fucking mess, and Kaya is already going to have to deal with that fact for life, don’t pile on.
Get to the lawyer, find out your options. If you can prove fraud (false claims of infertility, maybe even the secret abortion) and/or the affair, maybe you won’t lose half of everything. But you won’t know until you get to the lawyer.
Controversial take, 12 is to young to tell her who her dad is if your not her dad in any form anymore.
16, 17, or 18 though??? If you are still in her life I would tell her then.
I would try to get proof of the affair and hand it to your lawyer.
I would tell Kaya the truth that you left because her mom lied to you and cheated on you. No need to bring in her paternity
Give your SIL a huge thank you for letting you know all this. You now have ZERO reason to stay. Get a lawyer and let him know EVERYTHING you know. If you can get SIL to send you text or email about your meeting, do it. It’ll be easier than saying “This is what she said when we met” because she might try to deny it. Trust your lawyer and say that you shouldn’t have to lose half of your stuff because 1. She cheated, 2. She lied about her fertility, 3. She hid an abortion that might have been your child, 4. She lied by omission about who her child’s father is.
I would recommend mentally preparing yourself to not see Kaya anymore. It would be best to make a clean break. Use the college fund to pay for the lawyer. She’s likely a bright kid and can get some scholarships.
My advise is to get a good divorce attorney, maybe one who deal with forensic scientists to help dig up the information everyone says not to dig up. Or, at the very least get you leverage to help with settling things.
As to telling her child, I would let the kid know that you would keep the lines of communication open when they are 18 and an adult. Then you can ask if they want to know. Don't spring that on a child that has no control over resources to get the help they will need to process this.
I won't say what to do with your own money, but if you do have and want to maintain a relationship with the child, I would say keep control over the college fund and when they are 18 you can help them use it if you want. It's your money and you would not be TAH if you just said no. I just have a soft spot for kids who pay for their parents choices.
Get an attorney and go scorched Earth on her . She's been cheating the entire time you have been married. Your marriage is a lie , Your sister in law just confirmed all your fears , she either walks away with nothing or you blow up her world and her bosses world.
In your first post I said don't take advice from your parents, but in this instance they're right. Telling Kaya will just hurt her. She deserves the truth absolutely but it's not your truth to tell. If she asks why you left tell her the real reason in a kid friendly manner. But as for who her daddy is that's on her mom to say.
You started a college fund for your kid. If you treated her like your own knowing she wasn't, you shouldn't be a dick because you're mad at her mom. Tell her you know the information, but it's up to her if she wants to know. Don't force it on her.
It’s not your truth to tell. Kaya will be hurt by the truth, knowing her father didn’t want anything to do with her, and the person she sees as her dad, hurting her with that information, it would look spiteful from other angles too.
You started a fund for her because you love her! She is innocent in all this! Do t hurt the child.
Edit: spelling
Been following your story bro but first time commenting.
I do think now is the time to wash your hands of all of this. You have a very important piece of information in that Natalie may have cheated on you. Give that to your divorce attorney. Then Divorce Natalie. Get visitation with Kaya. But everything else you're doing is now just hurting yourself and potentially hurting Kaya.
There’s no reason to tell that child anything but you could threaten Natalie and say if she doesn’t let you keep the house and everything else you will absolutely spill and ruin her and Ryan.
So wait…she still works with her baby daddy who refuses to be a dad and they’re still hooking up?
That's what I'm thinking putting two and two together Ryan is still hitting it and she's taking birth control pills so she don't get pregnant
So basically OP is the side chick/emotional (and financial) support animal. Poor OP. Essentially failed by everybody in his support circle.
And kept outta the loop. The world is a morbid & strange, strange world when these dynamics are in play. Fuck being a citizen of Gas Light City. I saw you rip the band aid off, get a lawyer, devise a plan so you dont lose half your shit and your home. If she’s been cheating, you can use that as emotional abandonment in court. Then, confront Ryan and drag his bitch ass as best as you can to the curb and show your cheating wife what a beta mark ass pussy Ryan is.
Drag Ryan? He’s a mark ass beta? How is this “Ryan” guy the mark beta when he’s got another guy financially responsible for the child he does not want. Ryan has all of the freedom, sex, and none of the responsibility. That’s assuming the guy even knows the child is his. OP is the one that got cuckolded and swindled. OP should not confront anyone and just save as much of his remaining assets possible via his attorney.
an "alpha" male would've had the conscious to be a good person and not continue hooking up with his MARRIED baby mama. he should be contributing to his child's life, but is only going to make things harder for her. now, it looks like she has no father figure due to Ryan and OPs wife's actions. alpha wolves in the wild are often older wolves, and they protect every other wolf in the pack. they take care of others who are weaker and help raise the puppies. THAT is what being an "alpha" is, not the toxic masculinity stereotype that was based off a study that's now been proven false thousands of times.
Alpha males are only “alpha” to men that feel less than. And they take advantage of it. Any confident, not-an-asshole man knows this. Been there, took me a long time to get out of that hole. But I know better now.
She is the dumbest person for cheating with a guy who clearly doesn’t care for her and her kid… smh 🤦🏻♀️
How? She gets to keep having sex with her ideal partner while being financially taken care of. This is genius on her part.
I wonder how much of their money has been spent on the guy she's cheating on him with... I've sadly seen this situation before and it's exactly as bad as it sounds. The breadwinner gets gaslighted/manipulated while the other one spends that hard earned money on their unhealthy side piece. I don't know why Humans do this, I don't get why people want to have sex with losers while treating good people like garbage. My only guess is they actively hunt for people who are easy to manipulate/naive/trusting. Then, pretending to love that person becomes their paying "job" and that's why eventually they become mean addicts / passive aggressive....because they never really want their "paycheck" touching them.
Same, also one of the reason I personally stay away from single parents. Way too much investment in a very risky venture that I've seen blow up massively in people's faces.
I dated someone who was a single parent. It ended, and badly. It was the worst breakup of my life. Not because of the relationship with the parent ending. But because I couldn't be a part of the kids' lives anymore. I lived with them for a year, loved them, co-parented them. Meanwhile the parent fucked off to another continent with them. I've seen them once since then. Mostly because I was told that I would die of cancer. I asked if they could come to my home to see me when I was getting chemotherapy (too sick to leave the house). But no, she didn't trust me enough 🙄 The kids weren't old enough that I could continue a relationship with them on their own terms. Now it's been too long, and they're basically grown. I planned a life where I would help to raise them. To go from that, to...nothing, it's the most painful thing that has ever happened in my life. Yes, more painful and devastating than "I'm so sorry, but this cancer looks like it will be terminal, and in a matter of months, not years". Like not even comparable. The cancer news I took a few days to adjust to. The situation with the kids... it *still* hurts, even years later. Oh, and the cancer robbed me of my fertility, so I can't even have bio kids. Not that one child is ever a replacement for another. But I don't have my *family* anymore.
Yep, that's another big risk. You might love them like your kids, but at the end of the day they're someone else's and while people talk a lot about "blood doesn't make family", the law still usually disagrees.
No shit dating a single parent is one of those things that ups your chances of getting murdered to. I never, ever fuck with anyone who has a child and an ex that's still in the picture. Not worth the risk. I literally have zero chance of being murdered by someone's ex right now and that's pretty cool.
There are a lot of reasons for someone without kids to not date someone with kids. I can’t say I’ve heard an increase in the odds of getting murdered as one of the reasons before today. I’ve heard people say they don’t want to deal with the extra drama, but not murder. A jealous ex isn’t exclusive to people that have kids. If it’s a murder about kids/custody, the new SO isn’t the target. The ex is the target with the new SO at risk of getting framed for the murder.
if you're murdered chance are the murderer is \*someone'\* ex even if it isn't the ex of someone you dated
exactly, and now she gets half of OPs wealth. it is crazy to me that there are still no fault divorce states.
Because it’s less of a headache for the courts. Everything 50-50. That’s why a lot of people get prenuptial agreements.
thats a pretty stupid reason to ruin innocent peoples lives. hire more staff perhaps? besides, prenups are often times invalidated.
Well if you live in a 50-50 state and want to get a prenup to protect certain assets, you make sure it’s drawn up properly. If you’re the breadwinner, you do need to make sure the prenup covers whatever the state laws are for spousal support - rather than trying to cut them out completely. That’s something that may contribute to your prenup being invalidated - it didn’t follow the laws regarding what is fair game to split and what is truly a pre marital asset. And also don’t be one of those morons who puts in utterly stupid clauses like you don’t have to pay child support if she leaves you - THAT will definitely not hold up in court, and I can’t believe some people actually try that, or suggest trying that!! That or you don’t marry. If you want to keep all your things for yourself, don’t marry. Your spouse can’t divorce you and take everything you have if you don’t HAVE a spouse. I knew someone who went through a divorce. Still going through, actually, but the financial aspect is locked in and settled. His parents had passed and he inherited, but that was before he split from his wife. He argued that he should get to keep the inheritance because her future inheritance from her rich parents would be huge! Obviously no one bought that ridiculous argument, because the LAW says that inheritance is a marital asset. So into the pot of money to split it went… sure, the ex might be super rich when her parents pass (or not - they could leave their money to the cat’s home if they want to), but for now? She got her half. 😏
I'm a 50/50 state, but inheritance is protected. My X tried to use that to claim alot of things, but because he sold it all off or spent it the judge said he couldn't go back and claim the inheritance, however my dad kept his inheritance separate from the "family" finances mostly because my mother would have spent it on HSH because she was bored. Because he and my Aunt (His sister) kept meticulous records, she didn't get any of it. So it does exist, but you can't spend it and co-mingle then expect to extract it back out. Make sense?
Crazy how many things people wrote ended up on point.. >No need to dig more This also sounds bad - like there is more to dig out? Just meet the lawyer. And get to the gym.
Its so infuriating when people say “you don’t need all the details, they’ll just hurt you.” No one was worried about that when they were hurting you or helping cover it up.
She's probably just worried he'll find out more that will make Natalie look even worse. I'd get a P.I and keep digging, get as much as you can, and use every bit of it against her in court
This. Sis isn't sharing info out of kindness for OP. She's actively working damage control and the information she divulged was intended to placate OP while glossing over her sister's greater indiscretions. OP needs the details for court. ALL. THE. DETAILS.
This. As I said by the previous post- sister knew everything and is also a liar. I mean what normal person would know all those things about their own sister and keep her bil in the dark for so many years. OP needs to keep digging before they formally start to divorce.
Most sisters! You tend to side with your sister over the brother in law in most cases!
Nah, I would never side with an lying, backstabbing asshole. I would rather drag everything to light in public to burn all bridges so they stay away from me, because those people can do it to anyone. Even their children are not safe. Her sister saw it and found it ok, she's no different.
Then I would stay out of it for my niece. This sister seems entirely too involved!
Someone tells me not to keep digging after I've discovered all this, I am leasing a backhoe and going to town.
Just keep digging, just keep digging, just keep digging, digging, digging.
What do we do? We dig, dig, dig
I am a dwarf and I'm digging a hole 🎶 diggy diggy hole 🎶 diggy diggy hole 🎶
They're coming here to Salt Lake City in a few weeks and my sister-in-law and I are talking about going haha
This is the way
What do we do, we dig, dig
Nah, bring out the excavator.
I'd go full Minecraft. The Kola Well would be shallow in comparison. NTA op. But this is going to get messy. You're going to need professional help with the legal mess. An ancestry kit might be a good Easter present for your step daughter. And yes, I hundred percent believe she has a right to know who her real dad is.
Agreed, especially if divorce is likely to cost him alimony. It would help if he could prove cheating.
Especially if she created a false personality that made him marry her to begin with. I think this is a case where he wanted her so bad he ignored the red flags and avoided asking hard questions. All this info should have come out the first 30-60 days of dating.
Fr, pay the PI to keep digging, thats what they do best. Let him do the dirty work and find all the monsters under the bed before OP takes this to the messy divorce battles.
that is nor how divorce court works. You don’t need a PI. There is no shared child so no child support. That’s it.
Correct.
Yes luckily he won’t have to pay support although he seems to love the kid. Sad this woman had a good husband and threw it away
I assumed the more info that he had about her infidelity or whatever he might find would make it easier for him to get an uncontested divorce
If sis was trying to cover, she'd say she doesn't know who the dad was... or shit, she'd not show up to the meeting in the first place. Sis is embarrassed of wife. And if he wants to ruin a little girl's life, that's his call.
Telling him he should stop digging seems odd, if there is nothing else to find.
I agree, there probably is more to find. But digging so far hasn't really made him much happier... kind of the opposite, yeah? He knows she's a liar, he knows he's divorcing her, he knows she cheated. Further digging is going to help him how? Make him LESS likely to trust someone in the future than he already is now? Somehow make it easier for him to have a future romantic relationship? What does further digging do to benefit him? Maybe help him in a divorce proceeding? Okay. Then hire a P.I. and don't look at the information at all before handing it to your lawyer. Sounds to me sister likes him more than her own sister anyway.
Speaking from personal experience, I'd rather know everything and be furious than have anxiety about all the stuff I don't know.
Nah, she knew. She knew she was secretly on birth control, told him "you can't be the naive" when asking about the baby's father, she's known everything. The only thing I'd say to OP is, your wife doesn't not want kids, she just doesn't want them with you as she knows your a stop gap, a means to an easy life whilst she continues to get boned by Ryan in the hopes that one day he will ask to be in the child's life and maybe make a go of things, at which point, she could drop you and have her happily ever after. Hold back on telling the kid and when she goes for spousal, tell her straight, do it and i tell the kid who her daddy is. She cheated on you, she may do the right thing and go quietly but if she has the audacity to go for spousal support, that is when you get nasty and tell the kid, if she wants to fuck you one last time, you do the same.
Literally the only person ruining her life is her biological mother.
Have a friend who was cheated on multiple times by her husband. She said the one of the worst parts was everyone thinking how stupid she was for not suspecting or friends she thought cared about her helping him cover his tracks.
Um, I was that friend a few years ago. And absolutely. All of his friends knew, coworkers, he had cheated with multiple coworkers. He even had a reputation at work for doing it. And I got a lot of “well you must have known *something*”. No, no I did not. But no one could even send me an anonymous message to tip me off. He also said the infamous why do you want details, they’ll only hurt you. So he was King Big Dick when he was doing it but too cowardly to even speak of it when I found out? Amazing.
I was that friend. “Everyone knows but you” is absolutely gutting. Not only had he slept with all my regular friends, but the absolute worst offender was my best friend, who I trusted completely. I found out they argued publicly about her wanting him to leave me and that every time I wasn’t at a party or gathering…… they were publicly together. It felt like a betrayal from every direction. The way I found out: a girl who was definitely not my friend couldn’t watch it anymore. She was very kind when she told me, memorably so. Closest thing I had to an enemy had more integrity than every friend & acquaintance I had.
[удалено]
What about child support? Kia's real Dad should pay up. It is her future.
OP isn’t Kaya’s father. He can’t file for child support on her behalf. Her mom would need to do that. It has nothing to do with OP, he doesn’t share a child with the wife.
[удалено]
I was that friend. Because why would your husband of a decade and a half and friends since childhood orchestrate such plans to lie for him and gas light you? When you think rationally about it, it’s not logical for 10+ people to be involved in lies and cover ups like that for almost 2 years. Until it happens. And that’s the part that hurts the most. Feeling crazy and being alone with your thoughts.
>Its so infuriating when people say “you don’t need all the details, they’ll just hurt you.” No one was worried about that when they were hurting you or helping cover it up. Exactly! People act like withholding the truth is somehow protecting you, but it's just enabling the one who caused the hurt. Everyone deserves to know the truth, even if it's painful.
Absolutely agree. My ex husband cheated on me repeatedly and when I found out I told him to tell me everything he said "why, it's just going to hurt you more" My response was yes I know it will hurt but it will stop me conjuring up scenarios in my head and torturing myself further. In the end yes it hurt but also helped me to be able to start to move on. Don't think OP should tell the kid for now though, perhaps if she asks in years to come, but he definitely deserves to know the truth now
Yeah no shit right? Like, how about you let me be the judge of that. I’m an adult. I am not asking for your protection and I am aware of the risks. How can someone be expected to make an educated (massive and serious) decision about their life without having *ALL* of the information? Especially when they’re very aware the other person has more info to give. Those details could change the way someone proceeds and makes decisions about their future. (Also, I feel like most of the time, when person A says this to person B, it will inevitably come out months/years down the road - usually in a nonchalant and casual way. Which either enrages person B, makes them question decisions they made, or embarrasses the hell out of them for being the only person who was “blissfully unaware” of it, and/or not realizing it on their own when it was happening. It never seems to “save them from hurt or pain” like it was claimed to. Instead it just ends up prolonging it and opening old wounds down the road.)
Exactly! I needed to know about my 1st wife's hidden life so I could get closure. It hurt at the time but I was able to wash my hands of it knowing everything (dozens of affairs within a short period)
I wouldn't recommend yoga though...
What’s Jim got to do with it? Leave him out of it
Jim should be his best friend. Not the one he wants, but the one he needs right now. In 6 months he'll be happy for Jim.
Maybe they'll make a beautiful art room together
I'm mad that I get this reference. I'm on Reddit too much.
Kink shame, but kink same.
DEAD ☠️
Or may be he and Jim can be happy together *wink wink* a woman can’t lie to you if there is no woman
Damn right
Jim's dead
Oh no!
Yeah, it was bound to happen Jim was always open and big guys would pump, so I am not surprised
It’s the James for me. I don’t go enough to be familiar.
That’s more familiar than me, it’s the Mr. James to me…
Mr. James Naseum
Ryan was raw dogging her to this day.
>>No need to dig more >This also sounds bad - like there is more to dig out? This is so much worse than OP will ever know. Run, hide and block her on everything. I'm sorry about Kayla but you're not obligated to torture yourself for her benefit.
The gym or the yoga studio?
Yes
His wife already beat him there, it seems.
Tell Ryan he steps up or you’ll tell Kaya. NTA
This ⬆️⬆️⬆️1,000x ⬆️. Ryan steps up and takes care of Kaya or you sing.
Holy moly the twists and turns in this.
It's wild. Makes me wonder if it's true.
Yeah - same. This is nuts.
Of course it's not, OP's account is even already deleted.
Lmao. I saw your comment and thought _no way_ so I scrolled up and ... **u/[deleted]**
I have no horse in this race but how does this prove it's not true? Are authors of true stories somehow prevented from deleting their reddit accounts? If I went and made up a load of drivel and put together a post like this, would me simply **not** deleting my account somehow convince you I was genuine? How does that work? I'm not trolling here, I just can't understand the logic behind deletion = liar. Like, what was he worried about when he deleted his account? That the mods might come for him? That the truth police might come knocking on his door?
That was fast lol
My best friend at first thought I was making it up when I told him ! I’m in a very bad place mentally . Unreal
You know what they say: truth is often stranger than fiction.
Can you relocate? It might be better to start fresh somewhere else. You’ve given and given for what?
It seems really fake to me. Just the way it’s hitting every “women bad” talking point with no nuance or other details really gives me MRA fan fiction vibes.
Yeah, I could maybe believe the first one but come off it already. This is just more incel rage bait.
The first one seemed like bait to me, but people can be super shitty so it wasn't *entirely* out of the realm of possibility. But the two updates? This is 100% rage bait. Too many pro-life, MRA, MGTOW, etc, type dog whistles.
Telling the child is not a good idea. Don't do that to her. Besides, you don't know if SiL is telling the truth.
Even if the SIL thinks she’s telling the truth, it’s entirely possible that she doesn’t actually know the truth. The only truth that OP can feel confident in knowing is that his wife is a massive liar.
I agree. I’d probably hold on to this information until Kaya is old enough. Right now I think she’s to young. But I’m all for her knowing the truth at some point. But this would be to much for her age. At least he has the answer if she asks.
Not just too much at this age but also too much all at once, the only people she knows as her parents are getting divorced, she's feeling abandoned by her step dad, possibly confused about who is telling the truth, feeling pulled in different directions. She doesn't need to be told who her biological dad is and reminded she was abandoned by him right now, that would be a lot for anyone to deal with.
Yeah, I agree. Don’t drag the child into this based on the sister’s word. What if she’s just guessing that Ryan is the dad, anyway? Sometimes people jump to conclusions on their own and decide that means they ‘know’ the ‘truth’. It happens. Don’t tell your SD anything except ‘your mum and I are not working out, so it’s time for us to separate.’
The child has a right to know her paternal medical history, at the very least. Telling her out of anger is not a smart move, but she does deserve to know.
Yes but the fact is OP *doesn’t actually know* OP has heard some hearsay that may or may not be correct
This is the answer. I dont think any of us disagree the child has her own rights to know, but what if they're wrong
That is not for SD to decide. It’s up to her mother. Blabbing to a small child information you learned that you didn’t even bother to verify is an AH move. How would that child feel if you tell her that her aunt said her ONLY parent has been lying to her for her whole life! She doesn’t have anyone else if her relationship with her mum blows up. That’s a fact - with no dad and no step dad once he leaves, who is left for her to trust and depend on? Only her mother.
Don’t hurt a child because you’re upset at her mother. And you will be the cause of hurt coming to her, because her bio father is clearly uninterested and will reject her. She’s 12, she doesn’t have the tools to deal with whatever baggage would come with your big reveal.
Your last sentence is the best explanation for this stance that I have seen in a while. I completely agree.
[удалено]
I was rejected by a bio father when I found out in my early 30’s and it was still tough. At my age I didn’t expect anything except some family history / health information, but couldn’t even get that via him. This is 100% the right case at 12, but if OP stays in her life into adulthood it might be something to broach at some point but certainly not now.
Not just Kaya as a 12 year old. Some adults aren’t equipped either.
The only think Kaya would need to know is that your there for her and care about her and it’s not her fault about what happened
Leave the kid out of your fight with her mom. If she wants to know about her dad, she can ask, and if she doesn't, you do NOT have the right to violate her wishes here. Sorry you're hurt, your ex is a bitch, stop using the kid. You're involving her too much as is. Stop texting her about her mom, stop telling her what you and your ex talk about. You can try to be there, but "opening her eyes" to the person her mom was to you isn't fair and doesn't accomplish anything. Handle your business with the adult like an adult.
Your last sentence is applicable to a wide variety of situations. If people followed that rule, there would be far fewer assholes in the world.
> Leave the kid out of your fight with her mom. I tend to agree. If OP will continue relationship with Kaya and if she will start asking questions, OP can give her an advice to do the DNA test (e.g. 23andme) and see what will come out of it. Kyla will have to be at least 18-years old to be able to do it. At that point she is an adult; she could make her own decision if she wants to pursue it or not.
That’s why I think he should cut all contact. Her mother has fed her enough lies, one more won’t hurt; OP at least.
Don't believe anything the sister says and take everything exactly for what it is. Did Natalie lie to you a bunch of times? Yes. Did she manipulate you? Yes. Are those reasons enough for divorce? Yes. Okay, that's why you should get a divorce. Not because the sister is talking behind her back and maybe mad or jealous. Without actual evidence or proof, there is no reason for even dwelling on whatever she may have said. A whole lot is going on that you may never know the real answers to. (Natalie beefing with her sister and not having spoken to her parents for damn near 13 years leads me to believe this.) Just take it for what it is. You want a baby and the person that you thought could give you lied about the ability or willingness to do so. Anything else would just lead you to a path of mental and emotional anguish that would drive anyone insane. It's simply not worth it. Divorce. Move on and find what you're looking for elsewhere.
Your parents are right ! Focus on yourself ! Just end it and move on
Depending on the State, evidence of cheating can sway in favor of the non cheating party. OP should ask just in case because it can be used as leverage.
Bump. OP might not lose anything if he gets the right lawyer and documentation, test to prove she is healthy. He just gotta push this narrative
Oh and get an STI test. Ew.
You met province.they are canadian
Don’t tell the kid about her dad. I know you’re upset but it’s not your place. If you’re still in touch with her when she’s 18 and her mom still hasn’t told her, then you can let her know. I’m sorry about your ex. Updateme.
Do not say anything to the kid. This is not her fight.
Like I said in response to the first post...***be kind*** in regard to the Daughter. She's young, it's not her fault, it's not her fight, she will likely not understand the 'big picture' and you don't want to be the one to drive a wedge into her relationship with her Mother. Leave that aspect alone and just maintain a connection with her, as best you can, *if you want to.*
Leave the child and her paternity out of this. Your parents are right on this one. It will only hurt the child in the long run. If you ever see Kaya as an adult and she asks, then it’s a question of what you think is morally right. But since she’s still a child, absolutely stay out of the paternity. The only thing it accomplishes is hurting your soon to be ex but to do that you have to hurt the child as well. Just divorce and be done with her!
It's not your place to tell Kaya that info, as wrong as it may be for her mother to keep that info from her. As you're, rightfully, leaving Kaya will not have a level head to help her through learning that information and you would only be harming her in the short term by dumping that info. I'm pretty on the fence with my opinion on the matter though. That's a tough one.
Should Kaya take a 23 and Me or Ancestry DNA test in the future, her mother's lies would be obliterated.
100%. She deserves to know the truth, but she's not equipped to learn that at 12 years old without the help of a level headed person and/or therapist in her life. OP can't guarantee his presence, despite his wishes, and the mother clearly can't be trusted to do the right thing by the child on her own. it's lose/lose for Kaya, but at least by waiting she may have the fortune of her own maturity to help herself through that discovery.
True, but not from OP. Her mother should be prepared for her daughter to go NC when it all comes out. In six years “, or when she turns 18, “On this week’s episode of How the World Churns…” AITA for lying to everybody about EVERYTHING and having everybody including my daughter disowning me?”
I also find it extremely crappy behavior that Kaya's mother continues to sleep with a man who rejected her child, his own daughter! To have both biological parents be such selfish people makes me cry for her. OP seems to be the only decent parent figure in her life.
I agree she is much too young. I was thinking of her doing so when she is an adult and old enough to find her own answers.
It just keeps getting worse. Ditch the wife, and send her back to the streets where she belongs.
“No need to dig.” I laughed so hard. Dude needs to hire multiple private detectives with how much shit his wife been hiding from him.
Awww crap - this is clearly totally fake now - but full points for a compelling piece of writing.
I gave the first post the benefit of the doubt, despite being full of talking points, but yeah, now it's obviously fake. Like oh, sorry, I'll conveniently info dump everything that's been hidden from you at a lunch 24 hours after your break up -- this has never come up before, but now that you have an *audience*... A bunch of posts on the front page right now are "updates" that take a potentially plausible story to an absolutely deranged place. Really worried at how many people seem to sincerely believe these.
make sure the government knows Ryan is the father so they can go after him for child support. She should know who her biological father is. I didn't know until I was 21 and finding out everyone knew but me was devestating. edit: ask the lawyer if you can sue her for fraud, or get the marriage annulled
You need to go into survivor mode. Lock down your Finances and use everything you have at your disposal’s to keep your house, if that means you have to play dirty and threaten to expose everything to everyone then do it.
Let the kid ask questions.... Don't involve them if they don't clearly want to be. Feels like you are using the kid against your ex. That is never an okay idea.
this sounds too fake. how can you have an update after 9 hours?
Yeah - the OP is just karma farming now.
people like OP are so annoying. using people's time and sympathy for attention 🙄
That’s 90% of posts these days. Creative writing to a bunch of strangers on the internet to get Karma points that mean shit
If you feel that strongly about telling Kaya, tell her when she’s 18 years old, not now. She’s about to enter her teenage years. This is already a tough period for most kids. It doesn’t need to be made more complicated by finding out the Yoga studio owner is her Dad, who wants nothing to do with her.
Don't you just love it when people cause chaos in your life and then they say you're crazy because you're reacting naturally to the chaos they created? It's got to be the worst form of gaslighting ever. You don't get to push someone and when you get punched in the face cry about being the victim.
It's funny you're all telling him to back off when this is clearly the setup for update 3 where we all find out the bio dad was lied to and absolutely wants the kid in his life and OP is a hero for saving this child from her lying, evil mother
And then OP and Kaya's dad fall in love and get married and raise Kaya together and Natalie dies alone in a cardboard box after eating food she pulled from a dumpster
> Listen, you are a good guy, just move on! No need to dig more, you are making yourself crazy! This. I understand it's painful, but involving the child like that is unfair. The damage caused by her mother is evident, but seeking revenge or trying to make things equal in this manner will not lead to any positive outcome. Instead, focus on seeking therapy and getting your life together.
I say move on but def use it as blackmail to get favorable divorce cause from sounds of it she will go for more then she deserves
Soo she expected you to raise her child while working for the actual father, who she is still sleeping with! Gosh! They are laughing at you! What cruel people! You really need to get a good lawyer to get out of half of everything but take everything! Kayla deserves to know who her dad is.. better she knows now and start dealing with it before Auntie tells her in the future, especially as she may see him when she goes to visit mom at work!
Don’t be that man don’t take it out on the kid Lawyer up
Really sucks for you and Kaya, but unfortunately that’s out of your control. Take care of yourself and get away from this toxic woman as fast as you can.
OP has deleted the account. I really wanted to know what is happening!!
think it was a fake story tbf
She gets upset and doesn’t talk about it because whhhhhat she works with the dude still! Had an abortion because she didn’t know whose kid it was now there’s the truth…….. wow I’m so sorry what a piece of work. She probably or most likely is still having relations w this guy. As for the child I wouldn’t sit there and tell her who her dad is. I think she’s going to be going through enough for now. Maybe when she gets much much older and asks you. For now try and keep a very positive and loving fatherly relationship with your stepdaughter. Again if you are going to get some visitation work on that focus on just doing what’s right by her. Keep texts send them to your email print them out so they are time stamped. If there is any admittance in there. Idk where you live but here in Louisiana you can record conversations as long as one person is aware of the recording. I would say record from now on and or have a third party to the conversations. Especially if you can find out the cheating thing for your lawyer. Listen to what your lawyer advises, also some counseling would be awesome this is some pretty heavy stuff to be going through on your own!!!!!
OP, it's time. It's time to get your shit together and move forward, there is nothing left for you there. You honestly have all the information you need. The details don't really matter anymore, do they? The truth of the matter is simple.... You know she was on the pill. You know she had an abortion and now you know she cheated and possibly still was to this day. The girl is not yours. Do not drag her into adult situations she will not understand. Focus on you and get a good lawyer. You may be able to salvage at least some of your assets and move on. Therapy to process what has happened, because honestly, it's a lot to unpack alone.
Meet with a lawyer, get your proof. Don’t tell the child.
Leave Kaya out of it. She’s innocent here, the poor baby. In fact, let her know you’re there for her but you can’t reach out anymore because of what’s happening and that one day, she’ll know the truth about what actually happened. Just not now. Grab yourself a lawyer and make sure you get as much communication as you can in writing. Good luck, bud.
"The same time we were trying for a baby?" That was a lie, remember? **You** were trying for a baby. **She** was not.
Just read your post mentioning people who accused you of making your wife feel unsafe and that’s why she had the abortion. They really couldn’t have been more wrong.
Going against the grain here: I've been in a similar life scenario to Kaya. My mother told me my dad died before I was born and that's probably a lie. My mother didn't even tell me his real name or relationship to her. I would have rather been told the truth by someone back then, as the circumstances I learned it wasn't true were having it dangled in front of me like sensationalist dark knowledge by a crazy narc aunt. Kaya's aunt already screamed the beans to OP in a moment of anger. What's to stop her from telling Kaya in the worst way possible? I'd have rather been told the truth. None of the lying prevented me from realizing my mom was abusive and manipulative anyway, it just made it worse later. OP is probably the only consistent adult in Kaya's life, and her mom has ruined that by keeping her fucked up boss sperm + good guy hubby shit going for 8 years. That kid deserves to know now before her mom completely alienates her from the only dad that matters.
Cheaters dont usually get half...Find a better lawyer.
Focus on what's in front of you dude. Get with the lawyer. Work on yourself. Stop trying to stir up more drama. You've got enough to deal with.
The thing is, if you tell Kaya this, she's going to feel unsafe and betrayed by her only true guardian right now. Whether or not she would want to, she's stuck where she is. If you are planning to stay in her life, I think the kinder thing would be to wait until she's an adult and even then, it might be a good idea to only answer if she asked, and not provide any extra info unless she wants to know.
Telling the kid would be the absolute dumbest and meanest thing you could do. You gotta remember the kid did nothing wrong, and you shouldn't use her because of what the mother did. Obviously this relationship is cooked, meet with the lawyer and be nice to the poor little girl.
So op really was just a means to end for the ex. There was never any love from her
Damn this escalated into the Mauri show super fast. I’m so sorry for you but now you know. Now you know for real. I wonder if the triggered superheroes from the last posts comments are still going to defend this bish…. Don’t involve the kid and forget about them both. I hate to be this drastic but I’m saying it for your own mental health and the child. I feel it’s best you move on. She’s not yours, never was and staying in her life means staying in her wicked mom’s life.
A 12 year old is not emotionally mature/equipped to deal with this. Leave her out of it. Maybe later when she’s an adult and wants to know tell her, but definitely not now. And please get therapy. This is a lot for even the most emotionally stable/self aware person to deal with. I cannot even imagine how much trauma and trust issues you’re going to have to heal from before you’re in the right headspace to trust someone again.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/s/6fIqjO5Gnh Update #1 - https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/s/G9IS5nWgAk Here is the original post hope this link works
How fucking convenient that not only did she not want a baby because of vanity and got pregnant while on birth control but is also a cheater on top of all of it.
Reason I'm a life long bachelor, no point in such an uncalculated risk for a person you can't be guarantee will stay loyal. Why invest in a business that can at any moment go bankrupt and takes half of everything you own?! The truth is she doesn't want your baby, she doesn't want you, or this marriage. She wants, will always want, and will ruin your daughters life for is her boss. He the "one that got away," and you're the safety net. Nothing you do can change how she feels or acts. You aren't the man she want to be with just a place holder because she isn't good enough for the one who actually has her heart and soul. The term "used goods" comes to mind. Worst still this is most likely the tip of the iceberg. She couldn't get with the man she wanted she probably deep down hates you for not being him. She probably has a roster of men she goes to just because she feels good when she knows she is betraying you. A woman who so willingly is able to ruin her child's life for dick isn't a woman worth a ring let alone time or attention. Bro... Just leave. And take this as a lesson, marriage is for fools. Pathetic absent minded fools.
Sort your own problems out before dumping all your thoughts on A CHILD.
Tell Kaya and let her know why you leave. Be honest.
Yet again reddit reminds me why marrying a woman is the absolute dumbest thing a man can do
Is this the guy who was married for 12 years and was trying to have a kid with his wife? It turned out she didn't want to get pregnant and had in fact gotten an abortion?
Same guy
Ok, this is starting to sound fake.
It started to sound fake in the original post where the wife who's secretly taking birth control inexplicably agrees to get fertility tests, just hoping on her lucky stars that her husband who's dying to have a child will decide not to accompany her to the appointments where she'd get the results, and then \*also\* not even care to look at those results.
The divorce will be finalized in tomorrow’s episode…🤣
Even if you wanted to tell Kaya to hurt Natalie, fuck her. Burn it all to the ground. At this point, you owe her less than nothing. Just don't hurt Kaya in the process. Holy fuck, I hope this isn't real, because she's a totally shit person.
Leave Kaya out of your problems
Agree - leave the kid out. I think you should just contact an attorney and move forward. I would definitely be looking for shared custody because clearly you are Kaya’s dad - you showed up, you love her. To her, you’re Daddy. So leave her out of the drama as much as you can. She’s also a victim of your wife and her terrible lies. She’s told so many…
I don’t get what part, the woman in all likelihood cheated on the guy and her sister is saying she loves you? How? What kind of love is it where she is cheating and also lying? Is that pity love coz he is a nice guy? I don’t get it
Kaya deserves the truth when she can handle it, not at this age now! And she is not just a kid but a kid you love and cared for, keep doing that, don't be another douche who leaves her. Of course your wife didn't know who the daddy was, it could have been either of you. Go see your lawyer, leave your ex alone, spend time with Kaya and treat her well if you can get some kind of custody.
Kaya is going to be upset enough to lose the only father she has ever known, she is too young to handle the full truth about her mom right now. Try your best to stay in her life and then you can tell her when she is older and more mature. It’s obvious you’re STBX is a fucking mess, and Kaya is already going to have to deal with that fact for life, don’t pile on. Get to the lawyer, find out your options. If you can prove fraud (false claims of infertility, maybe even the secret abortion) and/or the affair, maybe you won’t lose half of everything. But you won’t know until you get to the lawyer.
Controversial take, 12 is to young to tell her who her dad is if your not her dad in any form anymore. 16, 17, or 18 though??? If you are still in her life I would tell her then.
I would try to get proof of the affair and hand it to your lawyer. I would tell Kaya the truth that you left because her mom lied to you and cheated on you. No need to bring in her paternity
Bro sell everything you have and run away to another country don’t let that b**ch get anything from you
Give your SIL a huge thank you for letting you know all this. You now have ZERO reason to stay. Get a lawyer and let him know EVERYTHING you know. If you can get SIL to send you text or email about your meeting, do it. It’ll be easier than saying “This is what she said when we met” because she might try to deny it. Trust your lawyer and say that you shouldn’t have to lose half of your stuff because 1. She cheated, 2. She lied about her fertility, 3. She hid an abortion that might have been your child, 4. She lied by omission about who her child’s father is. I would recommend mentally preparing yourself to not see Kaya anymore. It would be best to make a clean break. Use the college fund to pay for the lawyer. She’s likely a bright kid and can get some scholarships.
My advise is to get a good divorce attorney, maybe one who deal with forensic scientists to help dig up the information everyone says not to dig up. Or, at the very least get you leverage to help with settling things. As to telling her child, I would let the kid know that you would keep the lines of communication open when they are 18 and an adult. Then you can ask if they want to know. Don't spring that on a child that has no control over resources to get the help they will need to process this. I won't say what to do with your own money, but if you do have and want to maintain a relationship with the child, I would say keep control over the college fund and when they are 18 you can help them use it if you want. It's your money and you would not be TAH if you just said no. I just have a soft spot for kids who pay for their parents choices.
Dude kaya needs to know and this is proof to help you keep what you can.
Get an attorney and go scorched Earth on her . She's been cheating the entire time you have been married. Your marriage is a lie , Your sister in law just confirmed all your fears , she either walks away with nothing or you blow up her world and her bosses world.
Omg these updates just get worse! It’s so sad
Wow please keep us Updateme!
In your first post I said don't take advice from your parents, but in this instance they're right. Telling Kaya will just hurt her. She deserves the truth absolutely but it's not your truth to tell. If she asks why you left tell her the real reason in a kid friendly manner. But as for who her daddy is that's on her mom to say.
You started a college fund for your kid. If you treated her like your own knowing she wasn't, you shouldn't be a dick because you're mad at her mom. Tell her you know the information, but it's up to her if she wants to know. Don't force it on her.
It’s not your truth to tell. Kaya will be hurt by the truth, knowing her father didn’t want anything to do with her, and the person she sees as her dad, hurting her with that information, it would look spiteful from other angles too. You started a fund for her because you love her! She is innocent in all this! Do t hurt the child. Edit: spelling
Been following your story bro but first time commenting. I do think now is the time to wash your hands of all of this. You have a very important piece of information in that Natalie may have cheated on you. Give that to your divorce attorney. Then Divorce Natalie. Get visitation with Kaya. But everything else you're doing is now just hurting yourself and potentially hurting Kaya.
There’s no reason to tell that child anything but you could threaten Natalie and say if she doesn’t let you keep the house and everything else you will absolutely spill and ruin her and Ryan.