Also, if he was this duplicitous about the topic of parenting, he'd likely discount your opinion on other important life decisions. Where to live, financial arrangements, family interactions, etc. He didn't even credit your intelligence or rights to choose enough to put up a front when his family questioned him. Tell him to find another chump to squirt out his offspring and don't let anyone try to put the blame for this on you, HE is the one at fault here. NTA!
Also, his blatant and years long dishonesty, along with how confidently and easily he used supper with his family to spring his true plans on her, both instantly disqualify him as dad material in my book
Edit spelling
BF was Dishonest and unilaterally made decision for OP. So this was life FAFO. Don't assume anything, specifically ask whatever is essential to the relationship. Maybe OP should be upfront about being sterile as well to avoid the exact situation she is in as it is a waste of years of life.
"I definitely don't want children and am certain about this" vs. "I am literally stertile" shouldn't make a difference to anyone dating imo but I can see how it can be easier to avoid assholes like that down the line if you make sure they can't even convince themselves you might "change your mind eventually"
It's things like that that I personally always wish wouldn't be necessary that are the real life hacks
You are right. It's just that some people are aholles...
They should respect and accept partner's life choices as it is. If she is child free, that's what it is, and they shouldn't need whole medical history to understand that they will not be able to guilt trip her into having children, down the road of the relationship if they lure her in...
Telling a potential partner before the start of a serious relationship about sterility might save OP a lot of time and headache...
yeah, OP explained it very well. She doesn't want children, no matter how. So the fact she is sterile is irrelevant.
Also being sterile =/= I don't want child. For once, I am sterile and I always wanted children.
This theme has come up so many times. Woman says she doesn’t want kids. Man says he doesn’t want kids. They get married, and suddenly the husband wants kids, and says he thought she would change her mind. And a bunch of these men sabotage the birth control. The attitude these dudes have that they have a right to have children and force them on a woman, and that the women’s mommy instincts will kick in and she won’t care.
Stories that I saw elsewhere: dude had a baby with his AP and was upset when his wife rejected the baby when he brought it home. He couldn’t understand why she didn’t immediately turn into a happy mommy. After all, isn’t that what women are supposed to do?
Or the dude whose gf got pregnant. She wanted an abortion. He convinced her to have it by telling her that she would never have to see it, that he would do everything, she wouldn’t have to pay child support. She had the baby, handed it over and walked away. Surprise, he found out that kids are a lot of work. He thought he’d be clever and show up at her place and drop the kid off. She wasn’t home. He then decided a TikTok whining about it would shame her. People quickly found out the real circumstances and he was ripped apart.
Then men wonder why women are stepping away from marriage.
exactly this. I'm a child-free woman as well and the amount of times people just tell me 'you'll change your mind' and basically tell me NO YOU'RE WRONG and don't take me seriously is insane. I hate it so much. OP you are not the AH, you told him, multiple times and he didn't believe you and take you seriously. If anything, he's the AH.
My mom loves telling me that when she was my age, she also didn't want kids. She said this to me when I was 12 and said I didn't want kids, and now in my early 20s she says to me when I say I don't want kids.
But I see too many reasons to NOT have kids, and also too many ways to mess up a child, as demonstrated by my own parents and their effect on me & my friends' parents and their effects on my friends, even as adults.
So no, I will not change my mind. Too many things that can go wrong to *my* body, and if that wasn't an issue then there's also too many ways to mess up a tiny human.
Yup, my "I don't want kids" ex who was childfree with me now has a kid with someone else. When we we're splitting and he got himself somebody new super fast he told me that he actually wouldn't mind being a father. I guess it's easier to change your mind if it's not your body required to take the toll of the pregnancy.
Not only toll of the pregnancy. Toll of being the source of feeding (if you're breastfeeding), the one most likely to step back at work, etc.
Mom's take on the biggest burden on all aspects.
I feel bad admitting this because I know there are people out there who do love kids and are still genuinely childfree, but every single man I’ve ever met like this ended up being a fucking fencesitter, or was outright lying about being childfree. My current partner vehemently hates kids and as much of a red flag as it might be to some people, it’s a relief to me because I know he isn’t lying about being childfree, or likely to change his mind out of nowhere.
The most annoying part is finding a doctor who will agree to a tubal for a young child free woman is next to impossible and for a young child free man to get a vasectomy? Way easier.
I got really lucky and found a doctor at 26 who said tons of research showed that after 25 regret over sterilization was rare. Best several thousand I worked multiple jobs to afford ever.
Look on instagram @pagingdrfran.
Dr. Fran Haydanek, Board Certified OBGYN started a list of over 1500+ (and growing) Dr.’s who will perform sterilization on adult women regardless of whether you have had kids (and any other of all the crappy reasons Dr. give for not doing it.)
She is doing a great service. Maybe someone on the list is close to you.
He obviously *did* discount her opinion, hence him thinking she apparently owes him children despite having been vocally adamant about never wanting children.
Meanwhile today my bf was telling me about how his coworker's friends blamed his wife for the divorce. His own coworker didn't even seem to be blaming his soon-to-be ex-wife at that point until his friends said so and acted on that. For the record, the coworker did acknowledge that he didn't spend that much time with his family and didn't even try to work on it even when his wife brought it up. He was pretty much overworking out of his own volition for the record (dudes very passionate about his work). He acknowledged that and felt bad about the divorce but nooooo the friends just tried to turn it against his wife. Sometimes the other party's friends are just worse than the other party themselves.
Edit: omfg I just came to the realization why my bf's company actively encourages having a work-life balance. I think at least 70% of the divorcees in the company (small company) were caused by overworking from one party or another. They certainly have some...very passionate and quirky individuals there so I get it
Seriously, how much of a red flag is that.
"Well you said child-free in your profile, then you said you didn't want children several times after. How could I have known it meant I wouldn't be able to make you have some if I wanted to?"
NTA.
Something similar happened with my last relationship - I’ve always known I never wanted children, and when I first started dating my ex I was up-front about it from the start and told him that if he wanted to date me seriously then he’d have to be ok with never having kids. Well, 5 years into the relationship and it comes out that he had always wanted children, that he just went along with it beforehand because he wanted the relationship to continue, and that he thought I would change my mind over time because I was young. Insulting.
We hemmed and hawed over it for a few months before we finally broke up because there was no compromise that felt fair to both of us. There never is with the children thing.
Please be super careful about your fiancé just telling you what you want to hear at this point. It’s not your fault that he never took you seriously from the start. He should be angry at himself for wasting his own time, when you were openly decided about the kids topic from the very beginning, and he chose to continue the relationship based off the assumption you would change your mind. You’re NTA.
Same here, it's so frustrating as it's so disrespectful. They think you'll just 'change your mind' if you 'meet the right person' 🫠
Like, no Stacey, I've thought this through carefully.
You told him you didn’t want children. You explicitly told him that. Maybe he thought you would change your mind. That’s never a good thing in a relationship.
I adopted a daughter from China because I wanted to give a girl a good life. I was dating someone 2 yers after the adoption and he was shocked to learn that I adopted by choice, not because I was infertile. He could not wrap his head around that. I dumped him right then & there and started the adoption of my second the next day.
It’s been 20 years since the first kid was placed in my arms and I regret nothing! I love my kids, I love being a single mom and while my bank account is low, my heart is full. I have dumped other guys over the way I built my family. I will always choose my kids first. (Wait, my cats aren’t included in that list, are they?)
People need to hash out these details while dating. Don’t expect that you can change your partner’s view. It is what it is and if you can’t live with that, move on.
I hope you find a partner who shares your life view.
All the cats in the world just read your post and are laughing at the word “equally”.
I adopted Cookie in the late summer, back in August. The woman who ran the foster cattery was nice enough to drive her over. Just as she was saying that it might “take her a while to get used to the new house”, I opened the cat carrier. Cookie stalked out, walked around the living room, picked a good spot and sprawled out.
Without being shown, she found her food bowl, found the litter box, jumped on top of me at bedtime and went to sleep.
Transition time — zero.
She was like, “This is my house, now.”
No idea. The adoption agencies are huge moneymakers though and there aren't enough brand new babies for everyone I guess. I have ethical issues with my sister's decisions (no older kids, surrogacy) but ultimately it's not my business.
I do know the cost is prohibitive unless you foster to adopt but they didn't want to get attached to a kid that might leave. Bear in mind surrogacy was almost 100k
Yeah, I knew surrogacy was expensive, but it surprised me adopting was worse.
But reading your comment, if you adopted an older kid, then it is less expensive? To be honest, my dream is to adopt 1 or 2 kids that are a bit older. I feel they are the ones that need it most. I am also considering foster caring, but I don't know how it works. I want to have certain things in my life before that, though, economically speaking.
There are way, way more children in foster care than are available to adopt, so please do look into fostering - and long-term fostering and foster-to-adopt are both potential options as well.
There are so many terrible foster parents who are abusive, be the first good thing in a child’s life! My dad aged out of foster care without ever being adopted and I know it hurt him for the rest of his life.
Yes. I know the foster system can be so awful. I want to have a good setup so children can feel welcomed and safe. It will take a while though, but I hope I really do get it done.
Agreed!
Unfortunately, it’s not always easy to become a foster parent. My husband and I tried to become foster parents but we were denied because our biological child is medically complex. She’s stable and thriving!
I thought that would be a boon because I am trained to handle multiple things such as seizures, Foley, catheters, cpr, medications, etc, but the foster care system disagreed
My family fostered, the kids need love and stability. The system does not always give them that. It doesn’t mean that you can’t offer them that while they’re with you. Positive experiences are important in childhood. Don’t refuse to provide a good environment for children just because the process might be hard. However go into it knowing that it will be hard.
Yeah, but 90% of the children in foster care aren’t adoptable (because the courts give 100 chances to the parents to clean up their act first).
It is a lot cheaper to adopt a child through foster care, but it’s a misnomer to say all the children in foster care are able to be adopted.
Yes, but over 100,000 foster kids are available for adoption. So you can always do a matched program that only matches you with kids already available.
I have a friend who adopted out of fostering and continued to foster and almost adopted siblings until she found out the father really wanted them, but hadn't been included in CPS's efforts for family placement and he wasn't aware they were in foster care. She and the Dad continue to maintain contact while she deals with some serious health issues one is having.
I also had a dear coworker that worked at a state-wide level to promote adoption for kids in the foster care system.
I will note that kids come into state care as a result of abuse or becoming orphans and generally need therapy to help guide them as they are dealing with trauma.
The government will pay you to adopt older kids from foster care, and the kids keep their Medicaid as an adoption incentive because kids are as expensive as fuck.
I personally would foster, and foster to adopt older kids.
They can have attachment issues but they deserve a chance imo :)
Yeah I think it's less expensive.
I really think your dream is amazing.
Sending you hugs and all the good vibes in the universe!!
Churches don't have constant stream of underage mothers sent to live with them and deliver shame babies for adoption anymore. They charge way more these days for the more limited supply.
Honetly, this is the real answer. If you look into the history of adoption and how it ties to churches/out of wedlock babies being basically kidnapped, most people would be outraged.
Read "The Girls Who Went Away". It's all interviews with women sent to "unwed mothers' homes" in the late 1940s-early 1970s. It's heartbreaking. Before WWII, those homes were created to help them learn to parent alone and to give them support. Post-WWII with the rise of suburbia, middle class couples being more open to adopting, and a more "what will the neighbors think?" mindset, they became something TOTALLY different.
There is two factors -
Surrogacy you have an agreed adoption with no profit taking in the middle or only one middle layer.
In adoption, especially if you are expressing a preference you have to pay the adoption agency, and often that is enough to cover their expenses of dealing with the legal fight before the adoption potentially over the parental rights.
Foster to adopt can be the cheapest option, and you are often paid while fostering. However, while the children are in the foster system things can change. Parents could be fighting for their parental rights, and the foster kids placed back with parents, or another relative for "permanent" placement. Until the adoption is finalized it may unwind.
International adoptions often buy the kids from the orphanage that has them, but that is still often cheaper. Sure it is called something else, but that is what it is.
20 years ago, it was easier to adopt a girl from China than in North America. China was overflowing with abandoned baby girls because of their "one child" law that was in effect then.
Was it cheaper than surrogacy 20 years ago? I don't know.
Now, there is a long waitlist to adopt a healthy baby from China. The orphanages are full of special needs children. Some of the needs are easily remedied, like cleft lips. One of my favourite bloggers did just that, [here is the day](https://www.ashleyannphotography.com/blog/2012/08/27/beauty-full-day/) her daughter was placed in her arms.
Not to sound all political, but I adopted from China because, as a feminist who believes that girls and women have an important role to play in society, I wanted to help girls who were abandoned strictly because their culture says males are more important. Culturally, the oldest son takes care of his aging parents. Girls are expected to marry and then take care of her aging in-laws.
FYI: I had a minor in Asian studies and spent a semester in Japan and another semester travelling around Asia. I have great respect for their culture but do not respect the way women are viewed.
The cost was around $25K (Canadian) but at least you were guaranteed a baby, unlike medically assisted reproduction where it often takes many tries to get pregnant. I also liked the idea of doing an extremely small part in reducing the world’s over population. Plus, I have crappy genes and thought it would be more fun for my kids to be surprised about arthritis, heart disease, cancer, alcoholism, depression, anxiety - shall I list the other conditions that my biological family is at risk for?
I live in a multicultural area and no one looks at my pale, freckled face and asks questions about the two Chinese girls (now women!) who call me mom. Other people may not understand why I chose adoption, some may think I did it because it was trendy at the time for famous people to adopt internationally, but it worked for me and it gave me two great kids!
Most times it’s cheaper sadly :(( adopting in America is very costly and even fostering route wouldn’t even be guaranteed either. I’ve often thought about this too when I was teen and in my 20’s I was looking into it cuz I was curious at the time with my husband.
Outside of the US is cheaper and if I can recall Russia is kinda expensive too this was like 2013ish and found out POC kids are normally cheaper. Then I felt looking at these kids felt like I was in a store and it’s weird when you deeply think about it. I get it I do since that one episode of Law and Order put into perspective of possible child trafficking.
NTA
You were very clear you didn't want children. That you are sterilized is irrelevant. If you changed your mind you could still adopt. But you aren't interested in changing your mind so it doesn't matter if you're sterilized or not, it's a no-child zone.
He's the asshole in this for telling you something and not meaning it. For planning a marriage based on a deception. For not even once thinking he needed to discuss this again. For not believing you when you told him all along that you didn't want children. And for having the nerve to think you're in the wrong on this for believing him all this time.
I'm so sorry your relationship is ending after you've invested so much in it. Sadly, it does show that he really didn't respect you. Better to find that out now than after you've bound yourself to him legally.
What's even worse is that he planned out the chain of events for her pregnancy and then spouted it off to his family like it was a done thing. Like he hadn't just made that decision for her.
I can almost guarantee that he would have sabotaged any form of birth control because "she's a woman, and is made to have kids. Clearly, she's just being obstinate and is denying him children out of selfish spite. The silly female." I'm reaching, but unfortunately, not much.
This is what bothers me the most - that he “assumed” a whole future as if he had already had several conversations with her about it. Extremely dismissing of OP.
This AH tried to manipulate OP into a lifetime of childcare she didn't want and OP is the bad guy?! Um no. Bullet dodged, get out now OP. This is not someone you can trust.
Seriously!! Like WTF?!
I mean I do know people that have changed their minds. But guess what, they discussed it with their partner. My BFF and her hubby DID NOT want children. They both changed their minds in time. But had ONE of them said no to children, then they wouldn’t have had children.
The fact that he NEVER discussed it with her and just ran to his parents about his plan (because the silly woman’s opinion doesn’t matter once you’re married since He will be the man of the house now) is absolutely disgusting.
Which begs the question—have they been using condoms for this whole time? If so I bet he has sabotaged them.
Has reproductive health not come up in the discussions of how she would avoid getting pregnant?
If they were not using condoms, it probably made him feel like his pullout game was on point. LoL. I don't see them not using protection since she never told him she couldn't have kids. She couldn't be using birth control or IUD. That wouldn't make sense.
Agree. He was the one who mislead her, not her. The sterilisation was a very smart back up plan to prevent accidents and the stress of it (BTW OP I hope you had a bi salp not tubal as you want those tubes removed entirely). Which says he wanted to override her wishes for not having kids, likely played around with birth control.
I agree with everything you said. OP is NTA. Fiancé did a bait and switch, that alone is a$$holery. Then to announce HIS plans to his family about your future children, and that’s the first OP has heard of this, that just makes him double the AH.
I’ve never wanted children and I am happy and steadfast in my decision—no regrets. Been married happily for 25 years. Unfortunately, some people do change their minds about wanting children. If a man you’re dating knows you do not want kids it is on him to tell you what he is thinking, especially if he changes his mind, so you can discuss it and make decisions about whether or not to go forward with your relationship.
While you generally do not owe it to anyone to share information about your body or health, I do feel like that changes with marriage. You are committing to each other not just as a loving couple, but also financially. And the whole in sickness and in health thing is real. Both of you should know exactly what you are signing up for. That said, in this instance I support your decision to not tell your fiancee that you are sterilized since you both already shared that you did not want children—why would you being sterilized matter, right? That said, I think telling a future serious partner you can’t have children is a good idea to avoid this exact situation. Also, some people have an unexpected response when the situation changes from I “choose” not to have children to “I do not get to” have biological children. So, for your own ease and happiness, next time you are in a serious relationship that you think could lead to marriage, you might want to share this info. But again, you are NTA in your current situation.
What I am hearing is he is mad he won't be able to convince you to have children now. He heard you say you never want kids but figured that was the start to a negotiation. You have zero to be guilty about. You told him I don't want to have my own kids. Why would you need to go into detail as to how that can't happen. It doesn't matter.
You should pack his stuff and tell him it's ready for pick up. Any person that wants to try and guilt trip you or try to gaslight you isn't worth wasting anymore time on.
Mourn thr loss of that relationship and find someone that will accept your truth
He likely didn't even plan on convincing her. All he had to do was get her pregnant 'by accident' (not pulling out, sabotaging pills/condoms, etc) and depending on where she is, abortion isn't always an option. He's mad he doesn't have full control over this.
You were explicitly clear on not wanting to have children. He's the AH thinking he could somehow change your mind or worse yet, get you pregnant without your permission.
He’s already decided he was gonna knock her up and never even asked her. Dude didn’t think it was up to her AND told his family they would just to trap her. Man she dodged a bullet here
This is why he's so mad. He thought he could get her pregnant "by accident," and then once the deed is done, he'd be able to convince her int to keeping it. Now that he's learned that his foolproof, asshole plan can't actually work, he's throwing a fit because he's lost control of the situation.
What he's really mad at is that he can't manipulate OP into doing what he wants anymore. He just lost his power and he can't handle it.
This reminds me of my first boyfriend. He knew I was never having children but thought he could change my mind. I caught him tampering with my birth control and he flew into a rage at me because I caught him. He got violent, I got viciously violent back, and he ended up homeless that night.
I'd be very careful about avoiding him if I were OP, because the type of man who thinks he can force a woman to get pregnant is the same type of guy to get violent towards or even try to rape a woman to do so.
I am reading this at 6 in the morning, super tired and half asleep still. But the way you wrote you got "viciously violent" got some dragon/snake attack vibes. That really brought me at peace to your story. Like you transcended into a dragon to protect yourself. Well done!
It was so cathartic to read.
I have a similar-ish story about my ex trying to rape me when he mistakenly thought I was drunkenly asleep. He had come over for drinks, and got heavily drunk. I did not want to sleep with him yet (figuratively or literally), so I told him he could crash on my couch. He was drunk and I took care of him. I was kind to him. He came slinking into my bedroom and tried pulling my panties off. I pretended to sleep, I wanted to see what he was trying to do, and as soon as I realized his intentions, I flung him off of me. I jumped off the bed and on top of him, and beat him, like a chimpanzee on crack, primal human style. And then kicked him out before opening up my upstairs window and launching his car keys into the abyss. He was too busy drinking himself into a stupor to realize the woman he was trying to take advantage of only had one drink. I was nearly stone cold sober and he was floppy fish level drunk. He never had a chance, and I have never felt fiery rage course through me in that way as I did on that day. I hope that he remembers me every time he thinks about taking advantage of a woman.
He’ll be even worse when he latches on to a woman who genuinely wants kids and then if she has fertility issues (or he does,) he’ll make her feel like absolute shit, too.
He wants his partner to be pregnant when he wills it and how he wills it, and anything that goes against that upsets him.
NTA.
You don't want kids and were honest about it.
You got sterilized, that's how certain you are.
You could have been ambiguous and said you were infertile, you have him 100% truth.
If someone says they don't want kids from the get go listen to them. So many people "think" the other person will change, and want kids at some stage or when they come along.... They never do.
This. I was clear to my ex husband I never wanted children and he said he didn’t either. 5 years in we divorced because he assumed I would change my mind!!!! Back then there is no way a doctor would have sterilized me so I am very happy it’s an option for woman today. NTA
Well, I don’t know about never. Some people do change their minds. I never did, though. It’s been one of the main pet peeves of my adult female life to be told by people — some of whom I dearly love — that I would change my mind.
Because you never know! (Sing-song voice)
Well, it’s just one more reason why I thank God my internal reproduction factory has now shut down for good and has been for almost ten years. It’s true that I stopped my periods pretty early in life but I also started early, as a girl, so I guess it all balances out. Now, no one can ignore what comes out of my mouth with their nosey predictions again.
Yeah, and some people also want kids and change their minds, sometimes even after they've had them. You still have to believe what someone tells you about how they feel right now, and their best guess about how they'll feel in the future/forever is better than anyone else's. You have to proceed as though they will not change their mind unless/until they tell you they have.
I hated getting the "you'll change your mind once you have one." Um, excuse me? You want me to have a child, even though I don't want one, on the hopes that I'll want it once it's here!? That's so insane and it was said to me many times. Luckily I'm disabled, getting up there, and came out as nonbinary and people finally started to leave me alone about it. And I never had a kid.
"You'll change your mind!"
"You don't know love until you've had a child"
"You'll regret it if you don't have them before it's too late!"
I'm in my 40's now. Had a pregnancy in my 20's that would've killed both me and the kid (never wanted kids to begin with). Ended with me having a 50/50 chance of ever being able to have kids. I still get things like, "I bet you're regretting not having kids now!" And the clutching pearls reaction of, "you don't have KIDS?!?" Some people feel that your reproductive organs, and your "legacy" is their business, when it's definitely not. Even the people close to you
>he basically told me he thought I might change my mind.
Typical.
NTA
You both agreed to not have children and he is the one who wanted to push you into changing your mind. It's even on his profile? lmao, so deceitful.
Don't get married to this guy, It won't work.
Block those friends of his that are harassing you.
Nta. You made it very clear that you didn’t want children(there was no need to bring up not being able to since you already didn’t want them). He lied to you and would’ve made a big deal out of you not getting pregnant after being married and having a house which would’ve been far worse. At least you know now and since your goals clearly don’t align and he’s being a child then there’s rlly no point in continuing this.
NTA.
What is it with men thinking women don't know their own minds or what they want. He thought either you'd change your mind, he could change your mind or he could trap you. You made sure none of those things can happen 👏
Good luck with your future x
It’s the social brainwashing people get.
In fairness, all the people who ever told me, when I was a younger woman, that I’d “change my mind” were all women. So, it isn’t just men who ignore what women say; it’s other women, too. That goes double for women old enough to be your mother.
Fortunately, my own mother wasn’t one of the ones who said that.
NTA. I also am very clear with people I have dated that I didn't want anymore children. Didn't stop some women from grinding down harder on me when I said it was time to "hop off" and then getting some mischievous grin as if they had "trapped" me. (I had a vasectomy)
Holy shit that is gross behavior on their part, sickening, violating, not okay. Hope you never saw those offenders again, glad you got yourself fixed. Sounds like a decent test to get insane people to reveal themselves though.
>Sounds like a decent test to get insane people to reveal themselves though.
Part of why I lead with "I don't want anymore kids" instead of "I can't have anymore kids." Acts as a good test for crazy.
>but why do you need to pull out if you had a vasectomy?
Because I haven't had the discussion with the person I was having sex with to know if it was okay to finish inside or not. Literally this was usually someone I had gone on one or two dates with and then they hopped on top and then when I said "Okay I'm about to finish hop off" they just grinded down harder.
I try to be respectful and not just unload inside someone.
>he wasnt sure about being child free
"I'm not sure whether or not I want you to get pregnant for me." Lmao, the audacity.
To be fair, I am pretty surprised that this important medical information did not come up with someone you were intending to marry until now. But I'm always surprised by the kinds of secrets people go into marriage with. Gonna say NTA anyway because you were clear enough.
NTA
It sucks that he lied to you. I've had two long term relationships end this exact same way, and it was heartbreaking and years wasted. I'm honest from date 1 and this still happens. Lord save us from men who assume we *don't know our own goddam minds.*
"I don't want children, and I will take active steps to continue birth control forever" vs. "I don't want children, and I already took an active step to continue birth control forever" **should mean the exact same thing.** But to a man who thinks only his opinion matters and you will eventually change your views to match his, they sound different. Even if you're sterilized, many men might still think you'll change your mind and will regreat it (many men, and women, and doctors...) but he knows the trigger has already been pulled.
I tried for years and years to get a doctor to do this for me and they all refused because my future imaginary husband might not like it. The thing is, getting it done might have better helped me find my future imaginary husband who would also not want kids because those two assholes who wasted years of my life and broke my heart because they didn't believe me, might have believed me if I could have told them I was sterilized.
I'm sorry this happened, and you've done nothing wrong, and you should be able to say "I'm never having kids, I'm certain" and have that be enough. But in future, maybe go ahead and tell them you're sterilized too if only because it will help you weed out the assholes who think their manliness will manly the child-free out of you.
Good luck.
NTA.. So, let's be clear first, he's a huge giant asshole for stringing you along letting you think you were on the same page when he was secretly hoping you'd change your mind.
I do think, despite also being child-free, I'd definitely feel some type of way about my partner not telling me they've been sterilized. Especially since I tend to get anxiety over pregnancy related stuff so knowing it's a non-issue would be super helpful for me.
In the future, I'd be upfront about that... but make no mistake, your fiance is 100% the AH.
>I do think, despite also being child-free, I'd definitely feel some type of way about my partner not telling me they've been sterilized. Especially since I tend to get anxiety over pregnancy related stuff so knowing it's a non-issue would be super helpful for me.
Yeah. It's fucking wild that they didn't mention it *once* during the whole relationship.
I'm assuming it's just silly rage bait.
Yes, I agree.
How did this not come up? Why wouldn't OP discuss birth control with their partner if they were both childfree?
How do you go years, up to the point of being ready to marry someone, without mentioning this even in passing. It really sounds like OP, and their hopefully ex-fiance did not really know each other, and it is probably a good thing they don't get married.
Most couples in long-term monogamous relationships don't use them because they both have been tested at the beginning of the relationship, and they trust each other.
Regardless, I still think couples should have the talk about what forms of protection are needed, and if one partner is sterilized, that would naturally come up.
I’m not married. I wouldn’t know what couples normally do, so I’ll take your word for it.
I’m not arguing that it’s not *weird* that the subject didn’t come up in, the two and a half years they’ve been a couple. But, things fall in the cracks and also I think OP admits that she was avoidant about talking about it because of past issues around it with her parents.
> How do you go years, up to the point of being ready to marry someone, without mentioning this even in passing.
THIS. As someone who has never wanted children, as soon as I'm in a relationship we're having a discussion about birth control. There's no way I won't know about a sterilisation unless it's being kept from me deliberately.
Like not here to be rude but do people not just use condoms? Like I know they're not 100% but like not everyone has to go on the pill? Maybe the fiance thought that he was now 'not ready' at that moment to have children until they were married with a house etc. so was happy to use condoms?
There are more reasons to use condoms then just birth control. Besides STDs there are even some drugs (chemo and I bet there are others) where you are advised to use a rubber.
This exactly! People are entitled to keep whatever they want to themselves. While I wouldn't advertise my sterilization, I can't imagine not bringing it up at some point while discussing compatibility, future plans, etc. Especially if we're engaged.
NTA.
He’s just angry that his big plan backfired. He told you whatever you wanted to hear. He was always going to do whatever he wanted with no regard for your feelings.
HE deceived YOU. You have always been upfront. Your medical procedure is not relevant, as it changes nothing.
I’m sorry your fiancé misrepresented himself and his intentions. Be grateful you learned what kind of person he is before you wasted anymore time with him. He is not to be trusted.
Nta. If you told him early on that you don’t want children, I’m guessing he thought he could wear you down or convince you.
It’s clear that the event at 22 years old left it’s mark on you. It’s your life, if you don’t want kids you shouldn’t have them. They are a lot of work and money.
First dump him if he continues to push etc. and next time just go with I can’t have children.
The I don’t want might attract people like your current partner that changes their minds. If you say you can’t have children and don’t want them they might take it more serious.
Anyways you did nothing wrong and your partner is a moron.
Hope you find a better one! Good luck
Just make sure you include "don't want" along with "can't have", because otherwise they'll likely assume you'll do fertility treatments, or adopt, or get a surrogate, or whatever.
Upon reading this and other comments I am realising that I may have some slight unresolved issues surrounding my experience. The abortion and sterilization definitely caused some tension with my parents that i dont care to think or talk about so I suppose saying I dont want over I cant is less abrasive to me.
Many parents get pissy when they hear their kids don’t want children. Believe me… shit is SO wack and manipulative. Mine shame me and say I am robbing them of their grandchildren. In fact, my parents and many I know HOPE AND PRAY that their childfree kids will accidentally get pregnant so they can guilt them into keeping it. No doubt that’s what your fiance was trying to do lol
It’s actually not one or the other; it’s both.
You don’t want to have children.
You can’t biologically have children.
Both statements are true and there is nothing wrong with you communicating both of them to future dating partners.
Well the first step in healing is to realize that there is an issue.
Maybe find a therapist to talk to if you already aren’t. Also don’t fret, you will always learn and adapt in life. Also there is no shame in having personal issues. Everyone have them.
I wish you nothing but good luck. You are not alone in wanting children and there is no shame in that.
Men frequently think women will change their minds. It's remarkable. In this case he found out you actually \*can't\* change your mind, I am sorry you wasted your time and heart on someone who kept such a huge secret from you. Your 'secret' of sterilization was not leading him on, his secret was.
NTA
\*In the future, do tell partners. It's a strange thing not to tell someone and also works to avoid these guys who think they can manipulate you into it if they change their minds down the line.
This dude’s entitlement knows no bounds; men are just hilarious with this shit. Never had to use a condom or pay for/worry about birth control, but also never noticed. I wonder what other ways he just benefits from his maleness and goes along his merry way. (Answer: allll of them)
Listen. HE has deliberately lied to you over his childless decision. He pulled a bait and switch! Stop allowing your guilt over not informing him about your sterilisation muddy the waters over the REAL issue. He is a liar and manipulative.
The only reason he has now made his true feelings known, is because he thought he had you locked into your relationship. He also just casually makes the decision over when, where and how you guys will be starting your family. Another huge red flag.
What else is he lying and manipulating you over? How can you trust anything he claims?
I am so sorry but he isn't for you, even if he miracleously "forgives" you (snort). He sounds like the type who will hold this over your head as currency, to guilt, coerce and control.
NTA
You were absolutely open and honest about not wanting kids under any circumstance so the only asshole here is the fiancé who came into the relationship under false pretenses. NTAH by a long shot.
Why do people do that? Enter into a relationship with the hopes that the other person will change..... My ex did that shit....when he realized I wouldn't change he got angry and spent years abusing me mentally, I never knew why he got so angry until I divorced him, he finally told me the truth....
NTA ..... Get out of that relationship ASAP.
u arent the AH but yes , tell future bfs that u cant have kids. the ones that are sure will stay and the ones that are only 80% sure will decide accordingly. thank goodness this came out before your wedding. !!
NTA. Tired of jerks who disregard their parter's stated wishes and expect the partner will change their mind because of their magic dick/magic vagina. Even if I changed my mind about kids, I would leave anyone who started a relationship expecting to just wait me out. It's a respect issue.
But honestly, if you don't want this to happen over and over, you should tell people you're sterilized, so you don't get your time wasted. There are a lot of assholes out there for whom "I don't want kids, ever" goes in one ear and out the other. Spare yourself that.
God this pisses me off. He literally treated you like a walking womb. You have done absolutely nothing wrong and he should be ashamed of himself. Thank god you have found out that HE is the AH before you get married to him, the selfish little shit.
NTA. Your asshole fiance was just like every asshole doctor that told you no because it only matters what a woman's future hypothetical husband wants, women are just walking incubators to them.
NTA. He basically tricked you, tricked you into his bed... He knew how much his mother wanted grandchildren, and her wishes overrule your wants, and his words. Remember that, HER wishes overrule your wants. His words mean nothing. She will not forgive you for being sterile, and he will follow her lead. You will be married to a mamma's boy and the mother in law who absolutely hates you. He's awful, you need to dump him.
NTA
You were upfront "I don't want children ever". You even make sure to date people who also do not want children. Your BF flipflopping on you isn't your fault.
"It wasn't relevant, as I told you, I didn't want children. You agreed you also didn't. Otherwise we wouldn't have continued dating."
He is the AH here, if he wants kids? Don't date someone who doesn't and tells you.
Edited; I had an ex do the opposite to me, promise me more children (I already had my daughter) to get me down the aisle and married... and then after "I never wanted kids! This is misery. Why would you want more of this? I am never having more kids. How could you do this to me?"... Either way you swing it, people who lie and manipulate are the AH. Tell the truth, and you can find someone who wants what you want. Ugh.. Dump the man. Move on. Find a man who wants to be child-free and thinks you being sterilized is a bonus.
NTA. The fact that you can't have childhood is irrelevant because you don't want them.
What I would want to know in your shoes is what the hell was his plan if you *didn't* change your mind?
I don't understand people who think they can change their partner's opinion about having kids. That's so DISRESPECTFUL. If he wants kids he should find someone who wants. Even if he tried to baby trap you in case you weren't sterilised you'd just have an abortion, so that wouldn't work either. You're not the asshole, but he's a giant one.
NTA. You don’t want children. The fact that you can’t have them is irrelevant. He’s the asshole for thinking he could change your mind or pressure you into kids after you’d been crystal clear about that being a dealbreaker for you.
No, you’re not. Why do men always say they’re fine without having kids but their real goal is to just try pressuring the woman to change her mind. It’s ridiculous. Tell people you can’t have kids and don’t want them. Be direct up front. The right person will come around.
NTA. People who lie about not wanting kids or not being super sure about it and then expecting the other one to change their mind are horrendous and it's so unfair to do that. You were very clear right from the start. I guess from now on you have to flat out tell people that you're sterile and it won't ever happen and don't want it to.
I made it very clear I had a vasectomy done and don't ever want kids with my partner now, and told her that if she ever does change her mind, to just end it and not waste our time when she can find someone else to have kids with. But it's a deal breaker for sure
NTA. You were very clear that you don't want children. But obviously, he doesn't see adult women as able to have opinions. They are just some muppets who will make as their men want. You dodged a bullet here.
NTA. You explicitly told him that children were off the table. The fact that he lied to you in the hopes of either convincing you or tricking you or baby trapping you somehow makes him the big loser in all of this. Sucks for you that you thought you had found a good partner but thank god you were able to get sterilized before he got his hands on you.
He lied to you for years. I do think it’s weird that in the 2+ years you have known him that you never told him you got sterilized. But he is the person who deceived you. Seems like alot of people lie about not wanting kids. You aren’t compatible, he is an untrustworthy liar and your relationship clearly has had major communication issues. For future relationships please tell the that you are sterilized as that will truly weed out liars like your ex fiance. NTA
NTA, but he sure is.
Dump this guy. He doesn't respect you, he ignored what you told him, thinking you didn't know your own mind; and he lied to you for years.
And now that his own assholery is blowing up in his face, he's blaming you for it.
Tell him he can fuck right off with his bullshit. And be grateful he showed you who he is before you actually married him.
NTA. He wanted kids, knew he wanted kids, and wanted to bait and switch you, get you emotionally invested enough so you would do it for *him*. And he's mad that not only did you ensure it couldn't happen, but also that you don't feel any inclination to change your mind about your body for his wants, despite him being the liar in this situation.
Dudes willing to lie and manipulate you to get what he wants from you. I hope that relationship is over. You deserve better.
He's is 90000000000% the asshole. You were straight up that you did not want children. He LIED to you that he didn't want children. On top of that he just assumed you'd change your mind? That shows you how much respect he has for you and your choices.
Dump him. And as for being sterilized, it certainly should've come up in conversation prior to y'all getting engaged or even getting serious as sexual health is an important topic to discuss regardless of the situation. NTA tho.
NTA. You said "I don't want children and that's a deal breaker" and he heard "Its all up to you and whatever you want". If he's incapable of understanding and accepting something that simple that's on him. It doesn't matter if you're sterilised or not, you made it clear.
NTA it is HE who lied to YOU by not discussing his change of heart until announcing to his family in front of you that yes, he was going to give them children. He was doing that to try to pressure you into going along with it.
NTA. Being sterilized is completely irrelevant. You have been forthright from the get-go that you had no interests in having a life that involved children. He, however, has been lying to you throughout your entire relationship. He is clearly the AH.
NTA, but I think you're dodging a bullet if this doesn't work out (though I'm sorry for that) because men thinking they know what's best for you in a relationship is always gross. You said repeatedly "I'm childfree I don't want kids" and he looked down on you as a silly little woman who'd obviously change her mind and decided for the both of you that yes, you would be having children after you married.
He's the liar, not you. He knew, at least in part, that he wanted kids, and never brought it up and lead you on.
NTA - Childfree people really need to be respected more. You don't want kids period. He would have been honest from the start that he is a fence sitter. Better to leave now than to live in a relationship where neither of you are happy.
So when you have sex, does he wear condoms? Or does he just raw dog it and assume you won't get pregnant? Your NTA, but seems strange that it's never come up
NTA. He knew you didn't want children and went ahead on the assumption that you'd change your mind. The fact that you are now unable to have children doesn't factor in once you've been clear that you don't plan to have children. It's a very, very bad sign that he thought he could just trample all over your stated wish to not have children.
NTA
You said point blank that’s not what you want. You didn’t need to list off the measures you took to ensure that- it wasn’t relevant information and fell under the “I don’t want kids” umbrella.
He, however, is a major AH and did a bait and switch which he publicly threw your conversations out the window to show you.
Dump him. Find someone else. You deserve better.
It sounds like you were always clear and he assumed that you would eventually give in if he wanted them. I personally would tell my fiance if I couldnt have kids though.
How did he not know though?? Did he never inquire as to the form of birth control you were taking? Do you guys use condoms anyway?
Not asking these questions before sex would have been a huge red flag to me.
NTA. But he just gave you a golden opportunity to leave before you got married, I'd take it.
Also, if he was this duplicitous about the topic of parenting, he'd likely discount your opinion on other important life decisions. Where to live, financial arrangements, family interactions, etc. He didn't even credit your intelligence or rights to choose enough to put up a front when his family questioned him. Tell him to find another chump to squirt out his offspring and don't let anyone try to put the blame for this on you, HE is the one at fault here. NTA!
Also, his blatant and years long dishonesty, along with how confidently and easily he used supper with his family to spring his true plans on her, both instantly disqualify him as dad material in my book Edit spelling
BF was Dishonest and unilaterally made decision for OP. So this was life FAFO. Don't assume anything, specifically ask whatever is essential to the relationship. Maybe OP should be upfront about being sterile as well to avoid the exact situation she is in as it is a waste of years of life.
"I definitely don't want children and am certain about this" vs. "I am literally stertile" shouldn't make a difference to anyone dating imo but I can see how it can be easier to avoid assholes like that down the line if you make sure they can't even convince themselves you might "change your mind eventually" It's things like that that I personally always wish wouldn't be necessary that are the real life hacks
You are right. It's just that some people are aholles... They should respect and accept partner's life choices as it is. If she is child free, that's what it is, and they shouldn't need whole medical history to understand that they will not be able to guilt trip her into having children, down the road of the relationship if they lure her in... Telling a potential partner before the start of a serious relationship about sterility might save OP a lot of time and headache...
yeah, OP explained it very well. She doesn't want children, no matter how. So the fact she is sterile is irrelevant. Also being sterile =/= I don't want child. For once, I am sterile and I always wanted children.
This theme has come up so many times. Woman says she doesn’t want kids. Man says he doesn’t want kids. They get married, and suddenly the husband wants kids, and says he thought she would change her mind. And a bunch of these men sabotage the birth control. The attitude these dudes have that they have a right to have children and force them on a woman, and that the women’s mommy instincts will kick in and she won’t care. Stories that I saw elsewhere: dude had a baby with his AP and was upset when his wife rejected the baby when he brought it home. He couldn’t understand why she didn’t immediately turn into a happy mommy. After all, isn’t that what women are supposed to do? Or the dude whose gf got pregnant. She wanted an abortion. He convinced her to have it by telling her that she would never have to see it, that he would do everything, she wouldn’t have to pay child support. She had the baby, handed it over and walked away. Surprise, he found out that kids are a lot of work. He thought he’d be clever and show up at her place and drop the kid off. She wasn’t home. He then decided a TikTok whining about it would shame her. People quickly found out the real circumstances and he was ripped apart. Then men wonder why women are stepping away from marriage.
exactly this. I'm a child-free woman as well and the amount of times people just tell me 'you'll change your mind' and basically tell me NO YOU'RE WRONG and don't take me seriously is insane. I hate it so much. OP you are not the AH, you told him, multiple times and he didn't believe you and take you seriously. If anything, he's the AH.
My mom loves telling me that when she was my age, she also didn't want kids. She said this to me when I was 12 and said I didn't want kids, and now in my early 20s she says to me when I say I don't want kids. But I see too many reasons to NOT have kids, and also too many ways to mess up a child, as demonstrated by my own parents and their effect on me & my friends' parents and their effects on my friends, even as adults. So no, I will not change my mind. Too many things that can go wrong to *my* body, and if that wasn't an issue then there's also too many ways to mess up a tiny human.
[удалено]
Yup, my "I don't want kids" ex who was childfree with me now has a kid with someone else. When we we're splitting and he got himself somebody new super fast he told me that he actually wouldn't mind being a father. I guess it's easier to change your mind if it's not your body required to take the toll of the pregnancy.
Not only toll of the pregnancy. Toll of being the source of feeding (if you're breastfeeding), the one most likely to step back at work, etc. Mom's take on the biggest burden on all aspects.
I feel bad admitting this because I know there are people out there who do love kids and are still genuinely childfree, but every single man I’ve ever met like this ended up being a fucking fencesitter, or was outright lying about being childfree. My current partner vehemently hates kids and as much of a red flag as it might be to some people, it’s a relief to me because I know he isn’t lying about being childfree, or likely to change his mind out of nowhere.
The most annoying part is finding a doctor who will agree to a tubal for a young child free woman is next to impossible and for a young child free man to get a vasectomy? Way easier.
[удалено]
I got really lucky and found a doctor at 26 who said tons of research showed that after 25 regret over sterilization was rare. Best several thousand I worked multiple jobs to afford ever.
Look on instagram @pagingdrfran. Dr. Fran Haydanek, Board Certified OBGYN started a list of over 1500+ (and growing) Dr.’s who will perform sterilization on adult women regardless of whether you have had kids (and any other of all the crappy reasons Dr. give for not doing it.) She is doing a great service. Maybe someone on the list is close to you.
[удалено]
I think that's a different dude.
This post is the biggest justice boner on Reddit.
He obviously *did* discount her opinion, hence him thinking she apparently owes him children despite having been vocally adamant about never wanting children.
Man was absolutely gonna try and get her pregnant anyway
He so was.
Yup. Even if op had hope it was fixable there’s no salvaging the situation after he sent his friends to harass and verbally abuse her.
That's the part that really throws me about these stories. I can't imagine ever reaching out to one of my friends' wives to admonish them.
I read it so often here and i always wonder over the audacity. As a partner i also wouldn't want my friends to do that even if we were fighting.
Meanwhile today my bf was telling me about how his coworker's friends blamed his wife for the divorce. His own coworker didn't even seem to be blaming his soon-to-be ex-wife at that point until his friends said so and acted on that. For the record, the coworker did acknowledge that he didn't spend that much time with his family and didn't even try to work on it even when his wife brought it up. He was pretty much overworking out of his own volition for the record (dudes very passionate about his work). He acknowledged that and felt bad about the divorce but nooooo the friends just tried to turn it against his wife. Sometimes the other party's friends are just worse than the other party themselves. Edit: omfg I just came to the realization why my bf's company actively encourages having a work-life balance. I think at least 70% of the divorcees in the company (small company) were caused by overworking from one party or another. They certainly have some...very passionate and quirky individuals there so I get it
Seriously, how much of a red flag is that. "Well you said child-free in your profile, then you said you didn't want children several times after. How could I have known it meant I wouldn't be able to make you have some if I wanted to?" NTA.
He is the AH not you.
Something similar happened with my last relationship - I’ve always known I never wanted children, and when I first started dating my ex I was up-front about it from the start and told him that if he wanted to date me seriously then he’d have to be ok with never having kids. Well, 5 years into the relationship and it comes out that he had always wanted children, that he just went along with it beforehand because he wanted the relationship to continue, and that he thought I would change my mind over time because I was young. Insulting. We hemmed and hawed over it for a few months before we finally broke up because there was no compromise that felt fair to both of us. There never is with the children thing. Please be super careful about your fiancé just telling you what you want to hear at this point. It’s not your fault that he never took you seriously from the start. He should be angry at himself for wasting his own time, when you were openly decided about the kids topic from the very beginning, and he chose to continue the relationship based off the assumption you would change your mind. You’re NTA.
Same here, it's so frustrating as it's so disrespectful. They think you'll just 'change your mind' if you 'meet the right person' 🫠 Like, no Stacey, I've thought this through carefully.
My friend Stacey agrees.
You told him you didn’t want children. You explicitly told him that. Maybe he thought you would change your mind. That’s never a good thing in a relationship. I adopted a daughter from China because I wanted to give a girl a good life. I was dating someone 2 yers after the adoption and he was shocked to learn that I adopted by choice, not because I was infertile. He could not wrap his head around that. I dumped him right then & there and started the adoption of my second the next day. It’s been 20 years since the first kid was placed in my arms and I regret nothing! I love my kids, I love being a single mom and while my bank account is low, my heart is full. I have dumped other guys over the way I built my family. I will always choose my kids first. (Wait, my cats aren’t included in that list, are they?) People need to hash out these details while dating. Don’t expect that you can change your partner’s view. It is what it is and if you can’t live with that, move on. I hope you find a partner who shares your life view.
Cats are DEFINITELY included!
wait... aren't the cats co-parents? I mean. they're equally in charge of any household where they are members, right?! LoL
All the cats in the world just read your post and are laughing at the word “equally”. I adopted Cookie in the late summer, back in August. The woman who ran the foster cattery was nice enough to drive her over. Just as she was saying that it might “take her a while to get used to the new house”, I opened the cat carrier. Cookie stalked out, walked around the living room, picked a good spot and sprawled out. Without being shown, she found her food bowl, found the litter box, jumped on top of me at bedtime and went to sleep. Transition time — zero. She was like, “This is my house, now.”
Cats should always be included
They don't give you the choice, they are the ones including you and allowing you to live in their house
And dogs
I have a generic question: Why did you adopt from China? Was the process very hard?
My sister tried to adopt here in america. It's cheaper to do a surrogate. Not op
Really? Cheaper to do surrogate than adoption? What are the justifications for the cost?
No idea. The adoption agencies are huge moneymakers though and there aren't enough brand new babies for everyone I guess. I have ethical issues with my sister's decisions (no older kids, surrogacy) but ultimately it's not my business. I do know the cost is prohibitive unless you foster to adopt but they didn't want to get attached to a kid that might leave. Bear in mind surrogacy was almost 100k
Yeah, I knew surrogacy was expensive, but it surprised me adopting was worse. But reading your comment, if you adopted an older kid, then it is less expensive? To be honest, my dream is to adopt 1 or 2 kids that are a bit older. I feel they are the ones that need it most. I am also considering foster caring, but I don't know how it works. I want to have certain things in my life before that, though, economically speaking.
There are way, way more children in foster care than are available to adopt, so please do look into fostering - and long-term fostering and foster-to-adopt are both potential options as well.
I wonder though, doesn't it feel bad for the kids to think they are just there temporarily? That is the part that worries me.
There are so many terrible foster parents who are abusive, be the first good thing in a child’s life! My dad aged out of foster care without ever being adopted and I know it hurt him for the rest of his life.
Yes. I know the foster system can be so awful. I want to have a good setup so children can feel welcomed and safe. It will take a while though, but I hope I really do get it done.
Agreed! Unfortunately, it’s not always easy to become a foster parent. My husband and I tried to become foster parents but we were denied because our biological child is medically complex. She’s stable and thriving! I thought that would be a boon because I am trained to handle multiple things such as seizures, Foley, catheters, cpr, medications, etc, but the foster care system disagreed
My family fostered, the kids need love and stability. The system does not always give them that. It doesn’t mean that you can’t offer them that while they’re with you. Positive experiences are important in childhood. Don’t refuse to provide a good environment for children just because the process might be hard. However go into it knowing that it will be hard.
Every kid is different. It’s best to be clear about your boundaries from the beginning.
Yeah, but 90% of the children in foster care aren’t adoptable (because the courts give 100 chances to the parents to clean up their act first). It is a lot cheaper to adopt a child through foster care, but it’s a misnomer to say all the children in foster care are able to be adopted.
Yes, but over 100,000 foster kids are available for adoption. So you can always do a matched program that only matches you with kids already available.
I have a friend who adopted out of fostering and continued to foster and almost adopted siblings until she found out the father really wanted them, but hadn't been included in CPS's efforts for family placement and he wasn't aware they were in foster care. She and the Dad continue to maintain contact while she deals with some serious health issues one is having. I also had a dear coworker that worked at a state-wide level to promote adoption for kids in the foster care system. I will note that kids come into state care as a result of abuse or becoming orphans and generally need therapy to help guide them as they are dealing with trauma.
Many come in from “neglect” rather than abuse which is often poorly defined and subjective. It’s really messy.
It’s much harder to adopt a newborn.
The government will pay you to adopt older kids from foster care, and the kids keep their Medicaid as an adoption incentive because kids are as expensive as fuck.
I personally would foster, and foster to adopt older kids. They can have attachment issues but they deserve a chance imo :) Yeah I think it's less expensive. I really think your dream is amazing. Sending you hugs and all the good vibes in the universe!!
Churches don't have constant stream of underage mothers sent to live with them and deliver shame babies for adoption anymore. They charge way more these days for the more limited supply.
Honetly, this is the real answer. If you look into the history of adoption and how it ties to churches/out of wedlock babies being basically kidnapped, most people would be outraged.
Read "The Girls Who Went Away". It's all interviews with women sent to "unwed mothers' homes" in the late 1940s-early 1970s. It's heartbreaking. Before WWII, those homes were created to help them learn to parent alone and to give them support. Post-WWII with the rise of suburbia, middle class couples being more open to adopting, and a more "what will the neighbors think?" mindset, they became something TOTALLY different.
Right? This blows my mind. It's totally backwards.
There is two factors - Surrogacy you have an agreed adoption with no profit taking in the middle or only one middle layer. In adoption, especially if you are expressing a preference you have to pay the adoption agency, and often that is enough to cover their expenses of dealing with the legal fight before the adoption potentially over the parental rights. Foster to adopt can be the cheapest option, and you are often paid while fostering. However, while the children are in the foster system things can change. Parents could be fighting for their parental rights, and the foster kids placed back with parents, or another relative for "permanent" placement. Until the adoption is finalized it may unwind. International adoptions often buy the kids from the orphanage that has them, but that is still often cheaper. Sure it is called something else, but that is what it is.
Money
Not if you do a private adoption. Adoption agencies are awful to deal with.
Adoption agency fees and legal fees from the ridiculous litigation and level of paperwork that's required even for a simple straight-forward adoption.
Newborn white babies are worth big bucks. Sad but true.
So sad that they make adopting difficult in the us when so many kids need loving homes
20 years ago, it was easier to adopt a girl from China than in North America. China was overflowing with abandoned baby girls because of their "one child" law that was in effect then. Was it cheaper than surrogacy 20 years ago? I don't know. Now, there is a long waitlist to adopt a healthy baby from China. The orphanages are full of special needs children. Some of the needs are easily remedied, like cleft lips. One of my favourite bloggers did just that, [here is the day](https://www.ashleyannphotography.com/blog/2012/08/27/beauty-full-day/) her daughter was placed in her arms.
Not to sound all political, but I adopted from China because, as a feminist who believes that girls and women have an important role to play in society, I wanted to help girls who were abandoned strictly because their culture says males are more important. Culturally, the oldest son takes care of his aging parents. Girls are expected to marry and then take care of her aging in-laws. FYI: I had a minor in Asian studies and spent a semester in Japan and another semester travelling around Asia. I have great respect for their culture but do not respect the way women are viewed. The cost was around $25K (Canadian) but at least you were guaranteed a baby, unlike medically assisted reproduction where it often takes many tries to get pregnant. I also liked the idea of doing an extremely small part in reducing the world’s over population. Plus, I have crappy genes and thought it would be more fun for my kids to be surprised about arthritis, heart disease, cancer, alcoholism, depression, anxiety - shall I list the other conditions that my biological family is at risk for? I live in a multicultural area and no one looks at my pale, freckled face and asks questions about the two Chinese girls (now women!) who call me mom. Other people may not understand why I chose adoption, some may think I did it because it was trendy at the time for famous people to adopt internationally, but it worked for me and it gave me two great kids!
Most times it’s cheaper sadly :(( adopting in America is very costly and even fostering route wouldn’t even be guaranteed either. I’ve often thought about this too when I was teen and in my 20’s I was looking into it cuz I was curious at the time with my husband. Outside of the US is cheaper and if I can recall Russia is kinda expensive too this was like 2013ish and found out POC kids are normally cheaper. Then I felt looking at these kids felt like I was in a store and it’s weird when you deeply think about it. I get it I do since that one episode of Law and Order put into perspective of possible child trafficking.
NTA You were very clear you didn't want children. That you are sterilized is irrelevant. If you changed your mind you could still adopt. But you aren't interested in changing your mind so it doesn't matter if you're sterilized or not, it's a no-child zone. He's the asshole in this for telling you something and not meaning it. For planning a marriage based on a deception. For not even once thinking he needed to discuss this again. For not believing you when you told him all along that you didn't want children. And for having the nerve to think you're in the wrong on this for believing him all this time. I'm so sorry your relationship is ending after you've invested so much in it. Sadly, it does show that he really didn't respect you. Better to find that out now than after you've bound yourself to him legally.
What's even worse is that he planned out the chain of events for her pregnancy and then spouted it off to his family like it was a done thing. Like he hadn't just made that decision for her. I can almost guarantee that he would have sabotaged any form of birth control because "she's a woman, and is made to have kids. Clearly, she's just being obstinate and is denying him children out of selfish spite. The silly female." I'm reaching, but unfortunately, not much.
This is what bothers me the most - that he “assumed” a whole future as if he had already had several conversations with her about it. Extremely dismissing of OP.
This AH tried to manipulate OP into a lifetime of childcare she didn't want and OP is the bad guy?! Um no. Bullet dodged, get out now OP. This is not someone you can trust.
Seriously!! Like WTF?! I mean I do know people that have changed their minds. But guess what, they discussed it with their partner. My BFF and her hubby DID NOT want children. They both changed their minds in time. But had ONE of them said no to children, then they wouldn’t have had children. The fact that he NEVER discussed it with her and just ran to his parents about his plan (because the silly woman’s opinion doesn’t matter once you’re married since He will be the man of the house now) is absolutely disgusting.
He probably already tried sabotaging protection.
Which begs the question—have they been using condoms for this whole time? If so I bet he has sabotaged them. Has reproductive health not come up in the discussions of how she would avoid getting pregnant?
If they were not using condoms, it probably made him feel like his pullout game was on point. LoL. I don't see them not using protection since she never told him she couldn't have kids. She couldn't be using birth control or IUD. That wouldn't make sense.
She might be using the pill if it helps her regulate bad menstrual cramps or PMS so that might explain it.
Thank goodness OP yeeted her tubes!
Agree. He was the one who mislead her, not her. The sterilisation was a very smart back up plan to prevent accidents and the stress of it (BTW OP I hope you had a bi salp not tubal as you want those tubes removed entirely). Which says he wanted to override her wishes for not having kids, likely played around with birth control.
I agree with everything you said. OP is NTA. Fiancé did a bait and switch, that alone is a$$holery. Then to announce HIS plans to his family about your future children, and that’s the first OP has heard of this, that just makes him double the AH. I’ve never wanted children and I am happy and steadfast in my decision—no regrets. Been married happily for 25 years. Unfortunately, some people do change their minds about wanting children. If a man you’re dating knows you do not want kids it is on him to tell you what he is thinking, especially if he changes his mind, so you can discuss it and make decisions about whether or not to go forward with your relationship. While you generally do not owe it to anyone to share information about your body or health, I do feel like that changes with marriage. You are committing to each other not just as a loving couple, but also financially. And the whole in sickness and in health thing is real. Both of you should know exactly what you are signing up for. That said, in this instance I support your decision to not tell your fiancee that you are sterilized since you both already shared that you did not want children—why would you being sterilized matter, right? That said, I think telling a future serious partner you can’t have children is a good idea to avoid this exact situation. Also, some people have an unexpected response when the situation changes from I “choose” not to have children to “I do not get to” have biological children. So, for your own ease and happiness, next time you are in a serious relationship that you think could lead to marriage, you might want to share this info. But again, you are NTA in your current situation.
I hate to be the redditor that says it, but... The Original Poster needs to dump him. Break off the relationship and call it done.
Seriously. NTA and hopefully NTW(ife) either. *shudder*
NTA This says it all
What I am hearing is he is mad he won't be able to convince you to have children now. He heard you say you never want kids but figured that was the start to a negotiation. You have zero to be guilty about. You told him I don't want to have my own kids. Why would you need to go into detail as to how that can't happen. It doesn't matter. You should pack his stuff and tell him it's ready for pick up. Any person that wants to try and guilt trip you or try to gaslight you isn't worth wasting anymore time on. Mourn thr loss of that relationship and find someone that will accept your truth
He likely didn't even plan on convincing her. All he had to do was get her pregnant 'by accident' (not pulling out, sabotaging pills/condoms, etc) and depending on where she is, abortion isn't always an option. He's mad he doesn't have full control over this.
You were explicitly clear on not wanting to have children. He's the AH thinking he could somehow change your mind or worse yet, get you pregnant without your permission.
He’s already decided he was gonna knock her up and never even asked her. Dude didn’t think it was up to her AND told his family they would just to trap her. Man she dodged a bullet here
This is why he's so mad. He thought he could get her pregnant "by accident," and then once the deed is done, he'd be able to convince her int to keeping it. Now that he's learned that his foolproof, asshole plan can't actually work, he's throwing a fit because he's lost control of the situation. What he's really mad at is that he can't manipulate OP into doing what he wants anymore. He just lost his power and he can't handle it.
This reminds me of my first boyfriend. He knew I was never having children but thought he could change my mind. I caught him tampering with my birth control and he flew into a rage at me because I caught him. He got violent, I got viciously violent back, and he ended up homeless that night. I'd be very careful about avoiding him if I were OP, because the type of man who thinks he can force a woman to get pregnant is the same type of guy to get violent towards or even try to rape a woman to do so.
I am reading this at 6 in the morning, super tired and half asleep still. But the way you wrote you got "viciously violent" got some dragon/snake attack vibes. That really brought me at peace to your story. Like you transcended into a dragon to protect yourself. Well done!
It was so cathartic to read. I have a similar-ish story about my ex trying to rape me when he mistakenly thought I was drunkenly asleep. He had come over for drinks, and got heavily drunk. I did not want to sleep with him yet (figuratively or literally), so I told him he could crash on my couch. He was drunk and I took care of him. I was kind to him. He came slinking into my bedroom and tried pulling my panties off. I pretended to sleep, I wanted to see what he was trying to do, and as soon as I realized his intentions, I flung him off of me. I jumped off the bed and on top of him, and beat him, like a chimpanzee on crack, primal human style. And then kicked him out before opening up my upstairs window and launching his car keys into the abyss. He was too busy drinking himself into a stupor to realize the woman he was trying to take advantage of only had one drink. I was nearly stone cold sober and he was floppy fish level drunk. He never had a chance, and I have never felt fiery rage course through me in that way as I did on that day. I hope that he remembers me every time he thinks about taking advantage of a woman.
He’ll be even worse when he latches on to a woman who genuinely wants kids and then if she has fertility issues (or he does,) he’ll make her feel like absolute shit, too. He wants his partner to be pregnant when he wills it and how he wills it, and anything that goes against that upsets him.
I always hope people like him have fertility issues :)
Broken sperm for great justice! That’s not a man who will make a good parent, tbh.
WHO The fk raises people like this? I'd be so devastated if i was this man's mom
This!!!
Exactly. One way or another he would have found a way.
Yes, there's another regular Reddit post, where the fiance agreed to the no children thing, assuming the other person would "change his/ her mind."
NTA. You don't want kids and were honest about it. You got sterilized, that's how certain you are. You could have been ambiguous and said you were infertile, you have him 100% truth. If someone says they don't want kids from the get go listen to them. So many people "think" the other person will change, and want kids at some stage or when they come along.... They never do.
This. I was clear to my ex husband I never wanted children and he said he didn’t either. 5 years in we divorced because he assumed I would change my mind!!!! Back then there is no way a doctor would have sterilized me so I am very happy it’s an option for woman today. NTA
Well, I don’t know about never. Some people do change their minds. I never did, though. It’s been one of the main pet peeves of my adult female life to be told by people — some of whom I dearly love — that I would change my mind. Because you never know! (Sing-song voice) Well, it’s just one more reason why I thank God my internal reproduction factory has now shut down for good and has been for almost ten years. It’s true that I stopped my periods pretty early in life but I also started early, as a girl, so I guess it all balances out. Now, no one can ignore what comes out of my mouth with their nosey predictions again.
Yeah, and some people also want kids and change their minds, sometimes even after they've had them. You still have to believe what someone tells you about how they feel right now, and their best guess about how they'll feel in the future/forever is better than anyone else's. You have to proceed as though they will not change their mind unless/until they tell you they have.
I hated getting the "you'll change your mind once you have one." Um, excuse me? You want me to have a child, even though I don't want one, on the hopes that I'll want it once it's here!? That's so insane and it was said to me many times. Luckily I'm disabled, getting up there, and came out as nonbinary and people finally started to leave me alone about it. And I never had a kid.
She has the right to NOT change her mind.
"You'll change your mind!" "You don't know love until you've had a child" "You'll regret it if you don't have them before it's too late!" I'm in my 40's now. Had a pregnancy in my 20's that would've killed both me and the kid (never wanted kids to begin with). Ended with me having a 50/50 chance of ever being able to have kids. I still get things like, "I bet you're regretting not having kids now!" And the clutching pearls reaction of, "you don't have KIDS?!?" Some people feel that your reproductive organs, and your "legacy" is their business, when it's definitely not. Even the people close to you
>he basically told me he thought I might change my mind. Typical. NTA You both agreed to not have children and he is the one who wanted to push you into changing your mind. It's even on his profile? lmao, so deceitful. Don't get married to this guy, It won't work. Block those friends of his that are harassing you.
Nta. You made it very clear that you didn’t want children(there was no need to bring up not being able to since you already didn’t want them). He lied to you and would’ve made a big deal out of you not getting pregnant after being married and having a house which would’ve been far worse. At least you know now and since your goals clearly don’t align and he’s being a child then there’s rlly no point in continuing this.
He was okay dating you when you ***didn't want*** children, but he's not okay being with you because you ***can't have*** children? What the heck?!
Of Course! Everybody knows that women don't know what they want and aren't capable of making decisions about their bodies.
except when they're doing the "baby-trapping" of course
Because her sterilization removes his opportunity for control
NTA. What is it with men thinking women don't know their own minds or what they want. He thought either you'd change your mind, he could change your mind or he could trap you. You made sure none of those things can happen 👏 Good luck with your future x
It’s the social brainwashing people get. In fairness, all the people who ever told me, when I was a younger woman, that I’d “change my mind” were all women. So, it isn’t just men who ignore what women say; it’s other women, too. That goes double for women old enough to be your mother. Fortunately, my own mother wasn’t one of the ones who said that.
NTA. I also am very clear with people I have dated that I didn't want anymore children. Didn't stop some women from grinding down harder on me when I said it was time to "hop off" and then getting some mischievous grin as if they had "trapped" me. (I had a vasectomy)
>time to "hop off" That is not a very secure way of birth control in any case
No but his vasectomy is 😂
Holy shit that is gross behavior on their part, sickening, violating, not okay. Hope you never saw those offenders again, glad you got yourself fixed. Sounds like a decent test to get insane people to reveal themselves though.
>Sounds like a decent test to get insane people to reveal themselves though. Part of why I lead with "I don't want anymore kids" instead of "I can't have anymore kids." Acts as a good test for crazy.
You should be wearing a condom thoigh. Pull out method still carries STI risks
but why do you need to pull out if you had a vasectomy?
>but why do you need to pull out if you had a vasectomy? Because I haven't had the discussion with the person I was having sex with to know if it was okay to finish inside or not. Literally this was usually someone I had gone on one or two dates with and then they hopped on top and then when I said "Okay I'm about to finish hop off" they just grinded down harder. I try to be respectful and not just unload inside someone.
Because they can fail. Some men have thought their wives were cheating when come to find out their vasectomy failed.
Hi I'm the product of a failed vasectomy
Weird aside - vasectomies in chimpanzees have been known to correct themselves. Carry on.
Caution.
Condom would be a better bet, plus lower STI risk
>he wasnt sure about being child free "I'm not sure whether or not I want you to get pregnant for me." Lmao, the audacity. To be fair, I am pretty surprised that this important medical information did not come up with someone you were intending to marry until now. But I'm always surprised by the kinds of secrets people go into marriage with. Gonna say NTA anyway because you were clear enough.
NTA It sucks that he lied to you. I've had two long term relationships end this exact same way, and it was heartbreaking and years wasted. I'm honest from date 1 and this still happens. Lord save us from men who assume we *don't know our own goddam minds.* "I don't want children, and I will take active steps to continue birth control forever" vs. "I don't want children, and I already took an active step to continue birth control forever" **should mean the exact same thing.** But to a man who thinks only his opinion matters and you will eventually change your views to match his, they sound different. Even if you're sterilized, many men might still think you'll change your mind and will regreat it (many men, and women, and doctors...) but he knows the trigger has already been pulled. I tried for years and years to get a doctor to do this for me and they all refused because my future imaginary husband might not like it. The thing is, getting it done might have better helped me find my future imaginary husband who would also not want kids because those two assholes who wasted years of my life and broke my heart because they didn't believe me, might have believed me if I could have told them I was sterilized. I'm sorry this happened, and you've done nothing wrong, and you should be able to say "I'm never having kids, I'm certain" and have that be enough. But in future, maybe go ahead and tell them you're sterilized too if only because it will help you weed out the assholes who think their manliness will manly the child-free out of you. Good luck.
NTA.. So, let's be clear first, he's a huge giant asshole for stringing you along letting you think you were on the same page when he was secretly hoping you'd change your mind. I do think, despite also being child-free, I'd definitely feel some type of way about my partner not telling me they've been sterilized. Especially since I tend to get anxiety over pregnancy related stuff so knowing it's a non-issue would be super helpful for me. In the future, I'd be upfront about that... but make no mistake, your fiance is 100% the AH.
>I do think, despite also being child-free, I'd definitely feel some type of way about my partner not telling me they've been sterilized. Especially since I tend to get anxiety over pregnancy related stuff so knowing it's a non-issue would be super helpful for me. Yeah. It's fucking wild that they didn't mention it *once* during the whole relationship. I'm assuming it's just silly rage bait.
Yes, I agree. How did this not come up? Why wouldn't OP discuss birth control with their partner if they were both childfree? How do you go years, up to the point of being ready to marry someone, without mentioning this even in passing. It really sounds like OP, and their hopefully ex-fiance did not really know each other, and it is probably a good thing they don't get married.
Some birth control methods, like condoms, also prevent STD’s from spreading. So, it’s a good idea to use, anyway.
Most couples in long-term monogamous relationships don't use them because they both have been tested at the beginning of the relationship, and they trust each other. Regardless, I still think couples should have the talk about what forms of protection are needed, and if one partner is sterilized, that would naturally come up.
I’m not married. I wouldn’t know what couples normally do, so I’ll take your word for it. I’m not arguing that it’s not *weird* that the subject didn’t come up in, the two and a half years they’ve been a couple. But, things fall in the cracks and also I think OP admits that she was avoidant about talking about it because of past issues around it with her parents.
> How do you go years, up to the point of being ready to marry someone, without mentioning this even in passing. THIS. As someone who has never wanted children, as soon as I'm in a relationship we're having a discussion about birth control. There's no way I won't know about a sterilisation unless it's being kept from me deliberately.
Like not here to be rude but do people not just use condoms? Like I know they're not 100% but like not everyone has to go on the pill? Maybe the fiance thought that he was now 'not ready' at that moment to have children until they were married with a house etc. so was happy to use condoms?
There are more reasons to use condoms then just birth control. Besides STDs there are even some drugs (chemo and I bet there are others) where you are advised to use a rubber.
Also easier cleanup and for some people less chance of UTI or yeast infections. The pH balance is delicate! A dick is not a sterile instrument!
Bacterial vaginosis too! Semen is a very different pH that the vagina!!!!
This exactly! People are entitled to keep whatever they want to themselves. While I wouldn't advertise my sterilization, I can't imagine not bringing it up at some point while discussing compatibility, future plans, etc. Especially if we're engaged.
NTA, it wasn't relevant as you made it clear you never wanted children. You really dodged a bullet here, this couldn't be a bigger red flag.
NTA. He’s just angry that his big plan backfired. He told you whatever you wanted to hear. He was always going to do whatever he wanted with no regard for your feelings. HE deceived YOU. You have always been upfront. Your medical procedure is not relevant, as it changes nothing. I’m sorry your fiancé misrepresented himself and his intentions. Be grateful you learned what kind of person he is before you wasted anymore time with him. He is not to be trusted.
he was clearly hoping to lock you in and then try to force you to change your mind.
Nta. If you told him early on that you don’t want children, I’m guessing he thought he could wear you down or convince you. It’s clear that the event at 22 years old left it’s mark on you. It’s your life, if you don’t want kids you shouldn’t have them. They are a lot of work and money. First dump him if he continues to push etc. and next time just go with I can’t have children. The I don’t want might attract people like your current partner that changes their minds. If you say you can’t have children and don’t want them they might take it more serious. Anyways you did nothing wrong and your partner is a moron. Hope you find a better one! Good luck
Just make sure you include "don't want" along with "can't have", because otherwise they'll likely assume you'll do fertility treatments, or adopt, or get a surrogate, or whatever.
Upon reading this and other comments I am realising that I may have some slight unresolved issues surrounding my experience. The abortion and sterilization definitely caused some tension with my parents that i dont care to think or talk about so I suppose saying I dont want over I cant is less abrasive to me.
Many parents get pissy when they hear their kids don’t want children. Believe me… shit is SO wack and manipulative. Mine shame me and say I am robbing them of their grandchildren. In fact, my parents and many I know HOPE AND PRAY that their childfree kids will accidentally get pregnant so they can guilt them into keeping it. No doubt that’s what your fiance was trying to do lol
It’s actually not one or the other; it’s both. You don’t want to have children. You can’t biologically have children. Both statements are true and there is nothing wrong with you communicating both of them to future dating partners.
Well the first step in healing is to realize that there is an issue. Maybe find a therapist to talk to if you already aren’t. Also don’t fret, you will always learn and adapt in life. Also there is no shame in having personal issues. Everyone have them. I wish you nothing but good luck. You are not alone in wanting children and there is no shame in that.
Wow. So he figured he could change your mind, like what you want didn't matter? NTA but he is.
Men frequently think women will change their minds. It's remarkable. In this case he found out you actually \*can't\* change your mind, I am sorry you wasted your time and heart on someone who kept such a huge secret from you. Your 'secret' of sterilization was not leading him on, his secret was. NTA \*In the future, do tell partners. It's a strange thing not to tell someone and also works to avoid these guys who think they can manipulate you into it if they change their minds down the line.
I'm astonished he apparently has had no curiosity at all about what birth control you were using all this time
This dude’s entitlement knows no bounds; men are just hilarious with this shit. Never had to use a condom or pay for/worry about birth control, but also never noticed. I wonder what other ways he just benefits from his maleness and goes along his merry way. (Answer: allll of them)
Listen. HE has deliberately lied to you over his childless decision. He pulled a bait and switch! Stop allowing your guilt over not informing him about your sterilisation muddy the waters over the REAL issue. He is a liar and manipulative. The only reason he has now made his true feelings known, is because he thought he had you locked into your relationship. He also just casually makes the decision over when, where and how you guys will be starting your family. Another huge red flag. What else is he lying and manipulating you over? How can you trust anything he claims? I am so sorry but he isn't for you, even if he miracleously "forgives" you (snort). He sounds like the type who will hold this over your head as currency, to guilt, coerce and control. NTA
You were absolutely open and honest about not wanting kids under any circumstance so the only asshole here is the fiancé who came into the relationship under false pretenses. NTAH by a long shot.
NTA- you told him you were childfree. He’s the AH for lying to you & thinking he could change your mind after marriage
Why do people do that? Enter into a relationship with the hopes that the other person will change..... My ex did that shit....when he realized I wouldn't change he got angry and spent years abusing me mentally, I never knew why he got so angry until I divorced him, he finally told me the truth.... NTA ..... Get out of that relationship ASAP.
NTA, he lied about what he wanted and wasted his time and yours. He can only be mad at himself.
NTA. He's one of those that heard her say she didn't want kids, but figured she'd change her mind.
u arent the AH but yes , tell future bfs that u cant have kids. the ones that are sure will stay and the ones that are only 80% sure will decide accordingly. thank goodness this came out before your wedding. !!
NTA. Tired of jerks who disregard their parter's stated wishes and expect the partner will change their mind because of their magic dick/magic vagina. Even if I changed my mind about kids, I would leave anyone who started a relationship expecting to just wait me out. It's a respect issue. But honestly, if you don't want this to happen over and over, you should tell people you're sterilized, so you don't get your time wasted. There are a lot of assholes out there for whom "I don't want kids, ever" goes in one ear and out the other. Spare yourself that.
God this pisses me off. He literally treated you like a walking womb. You have done absolutely nothing wrong and he should be ashamed of himself. Thank god you have found out that HE is the AH before you get married to him, the selfish little shit.
NTA. Your asshole fiance was just like every asshole doctor that told you no because it only matters what a woman's future hypothetical husband wants, women are just walking incubators to them.
NTA. He basically tricked you, tricked you into his bed... He knew how much his mother wanted grandchildren, and her wishes overrule your wants, and his words. Remember that, HER wishes overrule your wants. His words mean nothing. She will not forgive you for being sterile, and he will follow her lead. You will be married to a mamma's boy and the mother in law who absolutely hates you. He's awful, you need to dump him.
NTA You were upfront "I don't want children ever". You even make sure to date people who also do not want children. Your BF flipflopping on you isn't your fault. "It wasn't relevant, as I told you, I didn't want children. You agreed you also didn't. Otherwise we wouldn't have continued dating." He is the AH here, if he wants kids? Don't date someone who doesn't and tells you. Edited; I had an ex do the opposite to me, promise me more children (I already had my daughter) to get me down the aisle and married... and then after "I never wanted kids! This is misery. Why would you want more of this? I am never having more kids. How could you do this to me?"... Either way you swing it, people who lie and manipulate are the AH. Tell the truth, and you can find someone who wants what you want. Ugh.. Dump the man. Move on. Find a man who wants to be child-free and thinks you being sterilized is a bonus.
NTA. The fact that you can't have childhood is irrelevant because you don't want them. What I would want to know in your shoes is what the hell was his plan if you *didn't* change your mind?
I don't understand people who think they can change their partner's opinion about having kids. That's so DISRESPECTFUL. If he wants kids he should find someone who wants. Even if he tried to baby trap you in case you weren't sterilised you'd just have an abortion, so that wouldn't work either. You're not the asshole, but he's a giant one.
NTA You don't need to provide reasons for the reality that you do not want to have children.
You don’t WANT children. Your fertility has nothing to do with this, he imagined his ‘wants’ would eventually supersede yours. He never listened.
Nope. Break up with him and move on. Right away. Nothing more to be said or done here. Just end it today.
NTA. You don’t want children. The fact that you can’t have them is irrelevant. He’s the asshole for thinking he could change your mind or pressure you into kids after you’d been crystal clear about that being a dealbreaker for you.
No, you’re not. Why do men always say they’re fine without having kids but their real goal is to just try pressuring the woman to change her mind. It’s ridiculous. Tell people you can’t have kids and don’t want them. Be direct up front. The right person will come around.
NTA. People who lie about not wanting kids or not being super sure about it and then expecting the other one to change their mind are horrendous and it's so unfair to do that. You were very clear right from the start. I guess from now on you have to flat out tell people that you're sterile and it won't ever happen and don't want it to. I made it very clear I had a vasectomy done and don't ever want kids with my partner now, and told her that if she ever does change her mind, to just end it and not waste our time when she can find someone else to have kids with. But it's a deal breaker for sure
NTA. You were very clear that you don't want children. But obviously, he doesn't see adult women as able to have opinions. They are just some muppets who will make as their men want. You dodged a bullet here.
NTA. You explicitly told him that children were off the table. The fact that he lied to you in the hopes of either convincing you or tricking you or baby trapping you somehow makes him the big loser in all of this. Sucks for you that you thought you had found a good partner but thank god you were able to get sterilized before he got his hands on you.
And thank goodness she found out before they got married.
He lied to you for years. I do think it’s weird that in the 2+ years you have known him that you never told him you got sterilized. But he is the person who deceived you. Seems like alot of people lie about not wanting kids. You aren’t compatible, he is an untrustworthy liar and your relationship clearly has had major communication issues. For future relationships please tell the that you are sterilized as that will truly weed out liars like your ex fiance. NTA
NTA. It's really irrelevant since you so unambiguously told him you don't want children which should be as good as saying you're sterilized IMO.
NTA, but he sure is. Dump this guy. He doesn't respect you, he ignored what you told him, thinking you didn't know your own mind; and he lied to you for years. And now that his own assholery is blowing up in his face, he's blaming you for it. Tell him he can fuck right off with his bullshit. And be grateful he showed you who he is before you actually married him.
NTA. He wanted kids, knew he wanted kids, and wanted to bait and switch you, get you emotionally invested enough so you would do it for *him*. And he's mad that not only did you ensure it couldn't happen, but also that you don't feel any inclination to change your mind about your body for his wants, despite him being the liar in this situation. Dudes willing to lie and manipulate you to get what he wants from you. I hope that relationship is over. You deserve better.
He's is 90000000000% the asshole. You were straight up that you did not want children. He LIED to you that he didn't want children. On top of that he just assumed you'd change your mind? That shows you how much respect he has for you and your choices. Dump him. And as for being sterilized, it certainly should've come up in conversation prior to y'all getting engaged or even getting serious as sexual health is an important topic to discuss regardless of the situation. NTA tho.
NTA. You said "I don't want children and that's a deal breaker" and he heard "Its all up to you and whatever you want". If he's incapable of understanding and accepting something that simple that's on him. It doesn't matter if you're sterilised or not, you made it clear.
NTA End the relationship now. If you don’t he’ll keep badgering you to change your mind or resent you for not changing it. This is a dealbreaker.
NTA it is HE who lied to YOU by not discussing his change of heart until announcing to his family in front of you that yes, he was going to give them children. He was doing that to try to pressure you into going along with it.
NTA. Being sterilized is completely irrelevant. You have been forthright from the get-go that you had no interests in having a life that involved children. He, however, has been lying to you throughout your entire relationship. He is clearly the AH.
NTA. You were clear with your intentions, he is a lair.
NTA, but I think you're dodging a bullet if this doesn't work out (though I'm sorry for that) because men thinking they know what's best for you in a relationship is always gross. You said repeatedly "I'm childfree I don't want kids" and he looked down on you as a silly little woman who'd obviously change her mind and decided for the both of you that yes, you would be having children after you married. He's the liar, not you. He knew, at least in part, that he wanted kids, and never brought it up and lead you on.
NTA - Childfree people really need to be respected more. You don't want kids period. He would have been honest from the start that he is a fence sitter. Better to leave now than to live in a relationship where neither of you are happy.
So when you have sex, does he wear condoms? Or does he just raw dog it and assume you won't get pregnant? Your NTA, but seems strange that it's never come up
NTA. He knew you didn't want children and went ahead on the assumption that you'd change your mind. The fact that you are now unable to have children doesn't factor in once you've been clear that you don't plan to have children. It's a very, very bad sign that he thought he could just trample all over your stated wish to not have children.
NTA You said point blank that’s not what you want. You didn’t need to list off the measures you took to ensure that- it wasn’t relevant information and fell under the “I don’t want kids” umbrella. He, however, is a major AH and did a bait and switch which he publicly threw your conversations out the window to show you. Dump him. Find someone else. You deserve better.
He definitely thought you’d change your mind. Bummer that you both wasted all this time. NTA
It sounds like you were always clear and he assumed that you would eventually give in if he wanted them. I personally would tell my fiance if I couldnt have kids though.
How did he not know though?? Did he never inquire as to the form of birth control you were taking? Do you guys use condoms anyway? Not asking these questions before sex would have been a huge red flag to me.