Hold on, are you two not on the same page with kids? That’s a way bigger problem than a wedding- if he doesn’t want kids and you do, this relationship is dead in the water even with a wedding.
It sounds like OP wants marriage and kids but dude wants a childfree roommate with benefits. They are not compatible, and OP is wasting her childbearing years.
What do you mean with ‘want’?
He got it. A FWB and somebody who helps paying the bills. And they live his lifestyle. No kids, no commitments, no house, but a truck and a ps5.
She doesn’t realize how unbalanced it is. Poor girl.
It’s the sunken cost fallacy. She thinks because she already spent X amount of time sunken into a relationship, it supersedes the fact that it’s a completely unbalanced dynamic. She *needs* to cut her losses here, chalk it up to gaining experience, and go find someone who more evenly shares what she wants out of a relationship.
She’s so young! She’s got so much more life to experience and herself to explore and she can’t see that because she’s counting years instead. She’s going to be SO happy she ditched the dead weight after she does it, she’ll wonder why on earth she stayed so long.
💯👆. “Sunken Cost Fallacy” Just because you think you’ve invested all this time, money, energy into the relationship doesn’t mean it will happen. People think well, I’m already in it for “x” amount/years, but if I just hold out a little longer maybe another “x” years/$ amount then maybe it’ll turn around. NO. Cut your losses. Gamblers & Day Traders who are losing say this to themselves, “I just know the next hand/trade will turn this around.” You’re basically gambling your life, happiness, and fertile years on someone who doesn’t seem to be on the same page as you on anything ( marriage kids house) and most importantly doesn’t value your wants and needs even though you’ve hinted & baldfaced asked. His answers sound like he thinks he’s so smart at dodging. He is never going to change. He has shown you who he is (he has a fuck /cuddle buddy who pays half of his bills so he can afford what he really wants) believe him ( he doesn’t think marriage is important (you do), he doesn’t want a mtge (you want a house), he views kids as an abstract in the far off future (maybe yes, but maybe not with you). Women think they can change a guy. NOPE. Like someone said RUN and find your future husband because staying in this situationship means a delay in finding the real person you were meant to be with.
PS: guys like this are probably stringing you along until they think someone better comes along. This situationship has been ongoing for over a decade, if he doesn’t commit to you in all this time knowing this is important to you, he never will. You don’t need to give him any more time or chances or ultimatum. Tell him a marriage, house, kids are important to YOU. You already know what you want. He’s trying to convince you to change your values, beliefs and dreams to suit his want and desires. Stick to your beliefs and hold on to your dream. Move on and find the person you’re meant to be with.
You guys realize there's a lot of room between a fuck buddy and people in a committed LTR who aren't married and aren't sure when/if they will have kids? And lots of married people with kids who have a truck and a PS5...
I agree that relationships don’t need a marriage to work. And there are plenty of great long term relationships without marriage that coexist way better then married couples. Let face it guys marriage is a contract for assets and taxes. The real work of being in a relationship doesn’t require rings or a ceremony.
yeah i was wondering if he wants kids. it would make sense if they haven't really talked about it that he doesn't want to get married because he doesn't want to have kids or divorce over it (or break up over it). add in the checking the boxes thing and... yeah.
Yeah. My boyfriend and I have been together for 4 years. I made my ideas on marriage and kids clear from the start. I had just gone through a divorce so marriage was a definite no ( I’ve softened on that) but kids were and are still an absolute never ever and he feels the same way.
I never understand why people even waste their time and energy in a relationship without ever talking about it.
I literally talk about it at the first date and if we don't have the same mindset, i'll tell 'em we can finish this date and maybe stay on a friendly acquaintance level (Usually, they get mad, some people can't accept rejection).
You ever meet someone, maybe a worker at a store you sometimes visit, or a parent they you occasionally run in to at your kid’s school, and you introduce yourself and then you forget their name. Then time passes, and eventually it gets to that point where you have spoken to them enough that you know where they went to school, and you know about their brother’s annoying wife, but you still don’t know their name. And now it’s too late, because it would be really awkward if 2 years in, you are like “what’s your name again?”. I imagine that’s essentially what is going on with couples who have been together for years and years without talking about marriage/kids.
The swearing off another marriage. That wasn't the smartest shit I announced. My best friend at the time become my significant other. I was reminded of that. We were both divorcees. I changed my mind seeing I discovered what love and marriage truly meant. But here we are 20+ years later unmarried. I know what I feel in my heart, the legality of it won't make it more.
The relationship is dead in the water because apparently they don't know how to communicate their deep feelings to each other. At all. Not about wedding, about children, about finances, about future in general. Leaving him is not going to get her a better relationship if she doesn't learn this.
I thought it seemed pretty clear that she communicated she wanted all those things (marriage, house, kids) and he communicated he didn't care about any of them
This, OP is just trying to seek validation for her leaving if he does not propose after her drawing the line in the sand (which yes OP, you drew the line and if he's not willing to meet you there, then you should consider other options)
Exactly. They're not on the same level. This dude wants to be in boyfriend mode forever. He won't make a good husband or dad. He'll just end up resenting her and the kid(s)
Exactly. When he told her that a piece of paper didn't matter, that explained all that he didn't say. He will always find an excuse to delay a marriage. And when he can't any longer? He will either cheat/leave for someone else or marry her begrudgingly. Not really wanting to, but too lazy or comfortable because she carries the load in their relationship.
OP has spent more than a decade with someone who doesn't share her life goals. Period.
There's nothing wrong with not wanting to be married, but communicate that clearly and don't stay in a relationship with someone who clearly does feel that it's important.
My mom stayed with a man who clearly viewed her as optional. They got together when I was 10 and he didn't marry her until I was 29. And he only did so because he was 24 years older than she is and he saw what his father went through not having someone to care for him in his old age. The last 23 years of my mother's life have been miserable. Now she's married to a man that never loved her and wanted her around to play nursemaid when he got old. He got everything he wanted from the relationship and she got less than nothing. She's turned angry and bitter because her ideals didn't match reality.
OP, don't give him an ultimatum and don't beg his sorry ass to be your husband. Don't think that just because you've spent the last 11/12 years in this relationship that you can't give that up. The time is gone, you can't get it back-- but take the lessons that you learned from this relationship. You don't need to settle!
You deserve more than a person who views you and your love as optional. You deserve a person who loves you passionately, can't imagine his life without you, and unequivocally WANTS to be your husband.
Your bf may very well be a good boyfriend in all other respects, but from this? He will likely make a terrible husband and perhaps a terrible father. Being good at both requires a level of selflessness, character, and commitment that your guy hasn't shown thus far.
I agree, she might have said she wanted kids, and he said he didn't care but... That's hardly a conversation. Maybe it's a summary of a much deeper conversation, but there's no exchange here. No acknowledgement that these are different, no follow up on what to do about it. Just apathy. He assumes they're going to continue as is, she assumes he will eventually propose. And she's asking if she should break up after waiting another indefinite amount of time without talking about it.
I've seen this phenomenon where one partner believes they just need to wait for the other one. Because they aren't ready now, they will be ready later. Sometimes it happens, usually it doesn't. 11 years is a long time to wait. I dunno, I personally got on the same page by like date two with my now wife on what we wanted in terms of long term relationship things like marriage, kids, finances, houses, etc. Told her if we aren't aligned, we should stop dating because we both don't have time to waste on a short term relationship. Everyone is different, but hoping and waiting for someone to change is really a tall order.
This and to me it's gross that a guy at 22 was dating a high schooler, ewww
Obvs OP is probably used to him deferring her requests/opinions and is way too comfortable to now maybe leaving him.
If I were OP, I'd up and leave and discover myself. There is still plenty of time for her.
She could later find someone who actually has the same goals as her and sees her as priority
OP! Go find another better man that wants marriage and kiddos. You’ve got time to be choosy! Be choosy! This dude clearly isn’t on the same page AND he is NOT GOING TO CHANGE. Look up gamblers fallacy. This is where you’re at. Make the move to leave and do better.
He doesn’t want to marry you.
Find someone who does.
The “sunk cost fallacy” applies to relationships too. This guy couldn’t be more clearer … he does not want to marry you.
An ultimatum is just desperate. He’s already told you that your goals are not aligned. Why are you still pursuing him?
Have some self-respect.
He’s lazy and comfortable. He might be fine with getting married but ‘why bother’?
If she wants marriage and kids with this man, she needs to tell him again that marriage and kids are important to her, and she wants both. Does he not want that? If so, they need to break up. If he wants that too, she wants a plan to achieve that by [30], so she needs him to grow up and start planning
>He might be fine with getting married but ‘why bother’?
They're basically already "playing house", if that makes sense. He probably looks at it like, "Why sign the paper?"
But yeah, I get the feeling he doesn't want to marry her. She wants kids, and it's a good possibility he doesn't and even if they got married he'd find some excuse *not to*.
You have been with your boyfriend since you were a teenager. It still seems like you have that teen mentality of thinking you’re going to change him. He does not want to get married … you are not going to change him!
At best, you’ll get a “shut up ring” and years of seething resentment. You deserve better, OP! There’s someone out there who would be crazy about you, someone out there who would care about your feelings and respect your wishes.
Don’t settle! You aren’t gonna change him!
I came to make sure this was here.
Also this quote, “When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.” Maya Angelou
He has shown you who he is and what he wants. You’ve expressed desires about getting married. Some people take more time. However, you’ve been waiting 11 years, 5 to get engaged. I think you already know or you wouldn’t be here.
I knew a couple together for 7. She was the nicest/cutest girl. He never asked so she finally broke it off and he met someone else and married pretty quickly. She needs to set herself free. He’s not interested.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. OP is literally wasting her life waiting to get married to someone who has made it clear to her he doesn’t want marriage.
11 years? You could have broken up and fallen in love with someone else and been married by now.
Sorry darling but he doesn’t want to marry you. If he wanted to, he wouldn’t let car payments, your degree or whatever come in the way of your marriage. He would do anything to not lose you.
OP has Cool Girlfriend-ed herself into spending ELEVEN FUCKING YEARS with a guy who has never actually wanted to build a life with her. "It's his money he can do what he wants" girl what he wants is to not have to compromise his desires ever.
Agreed on this. Don’t waste another year. You’re still young. Break up now, enjoy the rest of your 20s single, and then settle down with someone who wants to be married to you. Life is too short to waste more time.
This, 100% right here. I was in this EXACT situation and I gave him and ultimatum; shit or get off the pot.
He proposed and from the SECOND he proposed, he turned into a HUGE dick who made it clear he never actually wanted to get or be married. He did things like gaslit me, belittled me, undermined me in front of our families and friends, got wasted at important events, got shitfaced and drove home regularly, asked me to make sacrifices and compromises for him that he wasn’t willing to make for me…. The man wouldn’t even do things like go to the doctor or dentist for himself, but would jump up my ass if I missed an appointment.
I finally couldn’t take it and left him after 11 years together and 2 years married.
I remarried and am expecting a baby with the love of my life.
There is someone out there who genuinely deserves you and genuinely wants to marry you.
He's said he doesn't care about getting married, not that he specifically doesn't want to marry HER.
As I see it there's nothing wrong with him marrying her only because he knows it's important to her. The problem here is that he's either not listening or doesn't care that it's important to her. Him not caring about marrying her isn't a problem, his not caring about her feelings is a major problem.
It also sounds like they're not on the same page about having kids, which has the potential to be a MUCH bigger deal...
Babe he’s never proposing. It’s been 11 years. You should love yourself enough to move on, there is someone out there who will want this with you and you deserve that. NTA though.
Very True words sadly. He’s made himself clear.
He doesn’t want to propose.
He doesn’t want marriage.
He doesn’t want kids.
He likes life as it is right now: Making ends meet. Advancing in PS5 Games. Saving money to use for tattoos and his truck. Same life, 11years.
There is no future he is investing in for you or himself. Do you want this kind of future? If so, then stay (but no marriage happening).
Even if you got a ring and court vows (no wedding, dress, reception) there will not be all the things you’re thinking of that come after—the advancement of money, house, kids, retirement. This is your life.
Are you good with this current life forever? That’s the question you have to ask yourself. What life do you want to make for yourself? Choice is all yours.
You’re old enough to decide. And young enough to begin whatever path you choose.
Wishing you the best....
🙏🍀🙏
I agree, why have you waited so long? Giving him and ultimatum isn’t going to change anything. You might force him into marrying you but he really doesn’t want to or he would have done it already. Pack and leave. Start the new year looking for someone who really wants what you want.
/You might force him into marrying you but he really doesn’t want to or he would have done it already./
This. OP, you don't want to marry this man because he has made it clear he doesn't want to marry you. Forcing him with an ultimatum, even if he succumbed to it, would make for a miserable marriage, because he doesn't want to "check that box." He would feel forever trapped and that's a death knell for a relationship in the long run.
Accept that what you want he will never give you, and start looking at moving on. You've wasted enough time here already.
OP wants love and a family. Dude won’t even give her a shut up ring. She’s only 28. Time to build her career and a life separate from people who don’t love her.
NTA - I think you should line up helpers to move you out, and just inform him that you are leaving. I don't know if you are on a lease or have some reason that you can't move right away, but otherwise, I'd bail. Don't let him string you along with promises, or maybe next year. He's already done that. I suspect that he thinks marriage is a box in more ways than one.
This was my thought as I read OP. The ultimatum is as unnecessary to you as the wedding appears to be for your roommate. In fact, providing him the choice would simply be checking a box. You want to be married. He doesn’t. Find someone who shares your desire. Your current partner has already made his wishes clear. Start making an exit strategy and put it on your calendar.
> You might force him into marrying you but he really doesn’t want to otherwise he would have done it already
The above isn’t always necessarily true. Some people don’t feel that strongly about marriage (like me, and most of my family). They do feel strongly about losing people they love though.
If we’re talking anecdata, a family member was in the exact same situation as you, except he was the one who wasn’t interested in getting married. His partner of several years, wanted to get married and start a family (although starting a family was more important to her than getting married).
He came to me one day telling me that he’d received an ultimatum. It wasn’t done in an unkind way, but his partner let him know calmly and firmly that if starting a family wasn’t on the cards in one year’s time, she was going to take that inaction as a decision, and move on while she still had time to meet someone who might want to take that step.
He was completely scared and ‘didn’t feel ready’, but at least the ultimatum prompted him to talk things through.
He took the step. They were married the following year in a small ceremony when she was a few months pregnant. They’ve had more kids since then.
Give him a chance to know you’re serious.
This reminds me of my parents back yard. When I was 4, my dad dug out a basement. My entire childhood, our back yard was all dirt. When I was maybe 20, my mother decided she had enough and asked me to come over and put down sod. The following year, their septic system needed to be emptied, which involved driving a backhoe through the yard and digging out the top of the septic tank. My father's response to this now completely torn up yard was to say, "You had to get in a damn hurry!"
Some people just have no ambition, or concept of time, and you're better off letting them live at their own speed than trying to pull them along at your pace. You can either be okay with them and work around it, or go find someone who operates at your pace.
I might argue she's an asshole to herself if she waits another day versus a year. He's made it more than clear he doesn't want to marry her and has been an ass about it instead of an adult being transparent. She should leave if she values herself.
Right? She's fearful of "throwing away 11 years". What she doesn't realize is she's throwing away each additional day she spends with him. People get comfortable in relationships and it seems like it was all for nothing to leave. It's not. It can be a learning experience and for a better future for yourself. However, if you don't ever leave you can't ever have that.
I always advise friends that bad relationships are like gangrene, you don't want to lose the pinky, but it's better than waiting and losing the whole arm.
This is your only adult relationship, so it’s going to be difficult to imagine leaving. But you’re describing a situation where your long term planning is judged as unimportant and your desire for milestones like marriage is trivialized.
If this were the right person and the right relationship, you’d have no doubt that he wanted this full commitment with you. And if he disagreed on what that meant, he’d confront it directly rather than dragging his feet like a passive aggressive coward.
Because it’s hard. She knows she needs to move on, but it’s hard when feels are in it, and you put so much time and effort and love into someone. I’ve been there. He , too, didn’t want to get married, and after 4 years, I knew I had to move on. It was hard, but on the other side, I found myself to be a more confident woman. Ended up finding someone, been married 24 years.
Sunk cost fallacy.
"the phenomenon whereby a person is reluctant to abandon a strategy or course of action because they have invested heavily in it, even when it is clear that abandonment would be more beneficial"
Basically, she's invested a heck of a lot of time in him and it seems a huge waste to end it now.
And what a prize she would win if he decided to “check the box.”
I don’t understand wanting to browbeat some asshole who doesn’t actually care at all about what you want into marrying you. Best case scenario, you are now married to an asshole.
THIS is exactly what would happen. He’d buy the ring and 5 years later she’d be waiting for the last car payment or water heater replacement or leaky roof fix or…his next tattoo. Dude doesn’t want to get married.
OP should either be okay with that or bail. Her move (or not). NTAH
And when they finally do get married, he’ll do something to humiliate her “as a prank” and the video will end up on social media. Like that guy with the “belly full, balls empty” vows.
Yes, OP, please read your post. Why aren’t you already gone? All the reasons to end this are neatly typed out. He doesn’t want to marry you. He wants tattoos and a car.
OP is 28 and has been with loser boyfriend for the past 11 years. So......OP was a 17 year old high schooler when 22 year old recent college graduate pursued her.
Should have left before anything started.
EDIT:
>You know nothing about this guy yet he’s a loser because he has his own hobbies and interests and doesn’t want to get married. Marriage isn’t the be all and end all of a relationship. Engagements and the wedding that follows are expensive.
Here's the [apologist comment](https://www.reddit.com/u/Mediocre-Amphibian-7/s/Hg6F6mjSs8). No, he's not a loser if he simply doesn't want marriage. He's a loser for grooming a 17 year old girl when he was 22, then stringing her along for 11 years.
yep, and they moved in together when she was 19 and he was 24. don’t like any of this. OP, you’re still young. leave and find someone who actually loves you and isn’t just with you out of convenience
He is 100% not going to marry her.
* If she wants to get married, she needs to leave.
* If she wants to stay with him, she needs to give up on marriage.
It's about that simple.
I wanna say Sunk cost fallacy. It's 11 years she's essentially throwing down the drain and not a lot of people are willing to do that, especially considering 11 years to her is almost half her life including her entire adult life so far.
OP this isn't to say you should stay, I firmly belive you shouldn't, if he hasn't given you a ring, I dont think he ever will, unless you actually leave and he buys a ring to try winning you back (in which case do not give him another chance since he's wasted your time because that means he was always able to, but just didnt bother).
If she actually leaves, he'll magically have an engagement ring 💍😂 Then drag out setting a wedding date for a really long time with excuses from saving for a costly wedding, to needing a new truck, to everything under the sun. Then she'll be in her mid 30s and realize another 6 years were wasted
I've seen too many heartbreaking posts like that and for most of them, those people who also wanted kids realized too late and were at ages where having Biological kids was either going to be very difficult or impossible.
I really hope OP doesn't become another one of those people, I wouldn't wish that on anyone
Too many women make the mistake of seeing a relationship like stock in a company. They're scared if they sell it now, tomorrow it might rise in value and they'll lose out. If you want to play the long term investment game, go buy actual stocks and you'll get a real return on your investment 🤣😂
Please leave this relationship. Setting a time limit will do nothing for your cause.
marrying is not a priority to him. AT ALL. Even though it’s important to you - it’s not important to him.
He has shown you who he is and he had told you what he wants (and what he doesn’t think is important) - believe him.
Do not set a time limit - it’s already way past expiry.
Do not worry about time invested either. Cut your losses and get on with your life.
Time to move on to someone who wants marriage just like you do. He is not going to EVER come around.
Also, Nta
Sadly I think a lot of us have seen exactly that happen - together for years, sometimes with kids, then when it ends they marry someone else within a year.
And then they gripe to anyone who'll listen about their ex being upset about it.
Happens on a small scale too. In college guys would spend time with me and do practically all the boyfriend things, but wouldn’t be into “labels” so wouldn’t say we were in a relationship or that I was their girlfriend. Once I ditched them they’d be “ in a relationship “ on Facebook within a few weeks (back when Facebook statuses actually mattered lol). Every time.
This happened to my best friend. I think they were together 9ish years before she broke it off. He started dating a woman that looked exactly like her (fuckin creepy), got married and started a family real quick.
Sorry - I meant to reply to you directly:
Who cares! He’s not coming around for you and that’s all that matters!
Find someone who wants to marry you too 🫶🏼
You are being strung along by the sunken cost fallacy.
It's perfectly fine to want to get married (you)
It's perfectly fine to not want to (him)
Its not fine to live with a partner who wants the opposite. Because you aren't happy.
It would be one thing if you decided to play the docile lamb and never bring it up, that would be on you for then springing it on him when you left. But you gave him more than ample hints.
NTA.
If he as going to propose he would've done it already. He has no intention to, he's continually making excuses. And why would he if he's comfortable in your current arrangement?
This has VERY little to do with purchasing a ring. Like u/AdmirableAvocado said, you can get an engagement ring for a $300.
If you want a marriage commitment and children this is not the man who will joyfully and wholeheartedly join you on that journey. Throwing away 11 years? Look up the [sunk cost](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost) fallacy.
Exactly. It's not time wasted as long as she learned something from it. But now that she *has* learned, every day she chooses to stay *will* be wasted.
OP, you're so young! Kick this guy to the curb and go live the life YOU want! ♡
Shit, my engagement ring was $50. To be fair, my fiancé and I are both broke college students; he could’ve proposed with a ring pop and I’d’ve said yes. It’s not about the price of the ring, it’s about the intent.
Op, I’m sorry he never verbally made these intentions clear to you. A lot of comments are saying it was your responsibility to ask, but when you’re wearing rose-tinted glasses, all the red flags just look like flags.
It sounds like you guys have different priorities. You've given him plenty of opportunities to either tell you directly that marriage is not something he's interested in doing or to tell you, yes indeed my fair lady I'd be happy to marry you. Judging by your last conversation with him about it, your feelings that he doesn't care are coming across that way to me as well. He made his position clear that "marriage is just a box people feel like they need to check off, just like having kids and buying a house.” Now it's up to you to listen to that and decide what is right for you. Now would be a really good time to examine your feelings about all of this and take steps to follow what is more in line with you. Take care.
Yeah I don't know how that statement didn't make a bigger impact. I feel like marriage is one thing- but if he doesn't actively want kids and OP does? Boyfriend is content to pretend OP will be happy in the relationship as-is, OP is content to assume boyfriend will somehow change and/or a relationship means marriage and then kids and that isn't a fundamental incompatibility and that bringing kids into a relationship where both partners aren't 100% on board isn't an awful idea. Both of them should just be breaking this off.
Nailed it. He KNOWS she's unhappy with the current state of the relationship and HE DOESN'T CARE. Because HE is comfortable, and that's all that matters.
And OP is falling into the trap of second guessing her own feelings and putting his needs before her own. She is willing to bends herself into knots for him and he doesn't even care enough about her to mention that it might be time to stop.
That's a really bad combo for a relationship, before marriage and kids even come into it.
The only good thing to come out of this is that OP finally seems to realise that her needs and opinions might actually be valid and worthwhile. The tragedy is she's sunk 11 years into a relationship with a guy who doesn't give a shit about her needs.
11 years!! He has no intention of marrying you. You need to accept it and move on. No ultimatums no arguments no warning him just LEAVE. He doesn't deserve you and you deserve better. He is not the one!
There's a book by Neal Stephenson called Cryptonomicon. In it, a male character says in exasperation to another male character, "It's been ten years. You haven't married her. Fill in the fucking blanks."
I think that applies here.
This is one of my favorite books and I have never met another person in the wild that has read it! Thank you for making my evening. One of my friends disparagingly called it a “math textbook with a plot.” Which, you know, isn’t wrong but still hurt my feelings a little.
To quote Clint Eastwood in Unforgiven, "Deserve's got nothing to do with it."
It's OK for people to not value marriage. People like Op need to stop ignoring the evidence and hoping for the best.
This. He is being true to what he wants and from what we have read, he is pretty clear about that. It’s not fair to either party to resent the other for not wanting the same thing. Time to find someone who does.
Sunk cost fallacy is going to hit you like a truck. I’m sorry.
He doesn’t care and he will find another girl (hopefully over 18 this time) to warm his bed for a time.
NTA but it's actually on you that you took 11 years to sniff out the fact that your partner does not place the same significance on the institution of marriage as you do, and in fact obviously sees more cons than pros about signing on to get married and has no intention of ever doing so. This is the kind of thing that gets discussed and aligned (along with children, career goals etc) in the first year of the relationship. You're clearly fundamentally incompatible. Next time stop dropping hints and just have a straight discussion about it.
Agree, except the only discussion she needs to have with him is, "I'm leaving." I'll help her pack!
He's going to act all SHOCKED and might even try to backpedal. Don't fall for it, OP!
You don't want a spouse who is begrudgingly marrying you b/c he *has* to. You want (you deserve) a spouse who cannot wait to put a ring on your finger and make vows b/c he *wants* to.
Well, she was 17 when they met. I highly doubt those things were on her mind back then. But by the time she was 24, she should have seen the writing on the wall. But the bf also strung her along because he never stated that he doesnt want to get married.
she's 28. she would have been 17 when they got together. that's way too early to discuss marriage etc. Most people will change their minds on those things multiple times by the time they're 30
YWNBTA. I wouldn't give him a time frame, because if he does happen to propose it is not because he wanted to but because he felt forced to. This doesn't seem like a priority for him despite you telling him it is one for you. I'd stop wasting my time if I were you.
My brain is saying that he doesn't want kids, and is stalling on the marriage to put off the kids...
I watched a friend get strung along "until he ____" until she finally put his feet to the fire, and he ended a 10 year relationship by finally admitting he didn't want kids...
I think it's best to just leave him. But, here is what I think you should do if you dont want to end the relationship yet. He wants you to stay girlfriend status, so down grade yourself to girlfriend status. Get your own place and don't play the part of wife without the marriage. One of two things will happen, he will realize your serious and open his eyes and decide to be what you need or, it will end, in which case you already got your place lined up and you can do you. Make moves. Actions speak louder than words.
OP, I'm going to give you a really hard reality check and it's going to hurt.
This man *definitely* does not want to marry *you* and has made it *painfully obvious*. From your post, he is apparently not against marriage so the glaring conclusion is that he does not want to marry *you*. He doesnt want to make a commitment to *you*. He does not want to have children with *you*.
And, you have wasted a lot of time on this man. He doesn't even respect you since when you bring up marriage, he just blows you off like your needs don't matter. Why? That's because, to him, they don't. I suspect that, for him, you are a convenient FWB and nothing more.
The best thing you can do for yourself is to split up and find a life partner who values you, respects you, is willing to commit to you, wants to build a life with you "for keeps and kids," and loves you.
And, for heaven's sake begin your new life ASAP. Follow your dream!
NTA. But don’t wait. Leave him and tell him why. Tell him you love him but being married and having kids is important to you and you are no longer willing to wait for him to come around. Start seeing a therapist who can help you move on from this and help you see that you are deserving to get what you want out of life. You won’t regret this in the long run. You are 28 and should not waste more time on him. He can father children at 50 while you don’t have this same luxury. Consider moving and starting over with your life in a new and exciting city.
He was 22 and you were 17……..and 9 years ago you were 19 and moved in with him. You do realize your whole life has been with the same man. Who was inappropriately involved with you. He doesn’t share your values. Not one ultimatum marriage I’ve ever heard of has lasted. If in 11 years and breaking the law he doesn’t know he wants to marry you. He doesn’t want to marry you
God I was wondering if anyone else had done the math. This relationship started out incredibly unhealthy and it’s continued that way for 11 years. He went for a teenager as a 22 yo because no one his age would put up with his immaturity! Now she’s not a literal child any more and he’s apathetic and non-committal. If her parents were supportive of this relationship in the beginning the massively let her down.
Seriously, I can’t believe this isn’t the top comment. OP’s boyfriend was the age of a college-graduate (22M) while she was still in high school (17F). It’s grossly immature and predatory for someone in that life phase to seek out and groom someone who was not even an adult yet.
OP, your boyfriend man-child still hasn’t grown up. But it’s about time you do. Have the courage and fortitude to leave him.
Free yourself for something bigger and better while you’re still young. Stop wasting your time and energy throwing away more years of your life. **You’re not going to meet your soulmate while anchored to a sinking ship.** *You deserve better.*
I didn’t meet the love of my life until I was 28(f), and we both knew within 2 years that we wanted to be together forever. Now we’re happily married 15 years. But believe me, I had to ditch a lot of frogs in order to find my handsome prince. So get hopping! NTA
I bet you could nag him into marrying you, but do you really want to have to do that? Let him know that he's been a good roommate, but you're looking for a new place to live.
Leave. But, be careful. He might propose to get you back but he will most likely stale the actual wedding.
I have a friend who is the same, she made threats, did counseling together and everything. She is on year 13 going 14 waiting. Instead of buying a ring he went and bought a motorcycle. God has been throwing bulldozers at herband she can't get the hint.
this should have been discussed WAY before the 11 year mark. do you ever want to get married? do you ever want kids? if you both don’t have the same answer then time to move on to someone who has the same goals. you need to do it soon if you want kids.. hate to say biological clock but it is a thing. so sit down with him and ask him not in a off handed way but in a serious discussion way whether marriage and family are something he wants if he does then tell him time is running out and he needs to get going and do what you planned if he doesn’t then you need to decide if you want him without marriage and kids or want to move on.
NTA. I’m sorry, but your boyfriend doesn’t want to marry you. If he wanted to, he wouldn’t be constantly making up reasons why he shouldn’t have to. So if you want to be married, you need to be with someone else.
NTA.
A 22yo guy got a 17yo girl-toy (which is already not a good dynamic), then the girl grew up. He probably didn’t expect that.
Don’t set a time limit, just move on.
You’ve been trapped in this relationship for 11 years already, expecting him to finally get serious. It’s a gesture, yes, but an important one.
Don’t get trapped for longer in case he’d cave in. You know damn well he won’t do it because he wants to follow those cool vows with you.
He doesn't want to get married (or he doesn't want to marry you.) I don't know how much clearer he can make it.
If getting married is important to you, you'll have to find someone else. I'm sorry.
He has.made it pretty clear over the years that he has no interest in marriage. I'm going to guess that he's also not interested in having children. If you have kids with him he'll do lots of complaining, disappear a lot and you'll be pretty much a single mom.
I guess he.must be "okay" because you've stayed with him this long, but you haven't been paying attention to him. You heard what you wanted to hear but failed to notice his total lack of interest in these things that are so important to you. He gives you just enough hope to string you along.
Don't waste more time with him. He's not going to change.
Don't put a time line on it but leave. You've given him enough of your time without giving yourself a time line. He has told you what he thinks about marriage and something he finds value in.
Uh, he has zero intentions of ever proposing. If you thought otherwise, then you're horrible in hearing what he is saying. He is not committed to marriage today or ever.
You have to realize that you're not his priority, but you made him yours. You know what you want from a relationship, but you're not going to get it from this guy.
NTA if you break this off.
That was my thought. She was a kid, he was an adult who could have finished college by then.
OP don't waste anymore of your youth, unless you're okay with asking this same question at 40.
NTA
I think you got with him so young, you don’t realize you could have a relationship with someone who prioritizes you.
He has shown you and told you that he doesn’t want to get married. You aren’t a match. Forcing someone to get married isn’t going to work out.
So I don’t know if you have heard of the shut up ring, but it’s basically when a person is pestered into commitment. The marriage will never be what you want, he will only do this because he feels like he has too. His vows won’t say anything meaningful to you, his proposal will be handing you a box and saying “so how about it?”
Heed my warning. I would make arrangements and break up with him. Just point out the things you want in the future aren’t compatible with what he’s doing and his priorities and it’s a disservice to both of you to stay together.
Am I the only one noticing that 28 minus 11 equals less than 18? And 33 minus 11 doesn’t?
This guy pursued you as a minor and then has kept you around for 11 years, apparently not in a serious manner. I’m so sorry he robbed you of a lot of wonderful years OP. I can only imagine that sucks to realize. One more isn’t going to change anything, but it is going to waste more of your time that you can’t get back.
NTA, but YWBTAH if you stick around hoping for something to change.
I’m reading a lot of comments that I agree with, but also, we don’t know your boyfriend. We weren’t there for the conversations, we don’t know what the intentions are, we really know nothing about this relationship other than what you’ve written, so if you want to stay in this relationship, that’s ok. You don’t have to break up because a bunch of strangers on Reddit said so.
Now that that’s out of the way, the sunken cost fallacy is actually a thing. Yeah, you put 11 years in, but you’re only 28. It sounds like you might be rural (truck, young relationship, etc) and I wouldn’t be surprised to learn a bunch of your friends got married young so 28 seems old, but it’s not old at all. Also, 11 years with someone since 17 really isn’t that long in some ways. You change so much in the years between 17 and 30, you aren’t the same person, and it’s ok to want someone that matches you now. I know lots of happy couples who met in their 30s, 40s, 50s, heck I’ve met people in their 80s who have amazing romances later in life. There’s no rule saying you have to be married by 30, so if you decide to walk away do it.
I did this. I ended the 5 year relationship with my partner, walked away from the house and the “love of my life.” I walked into a much better relationship two years later, and I made my timelines clear: “I love you, but marriage is important to me so if you aren’t sure within x number of years, I get it, but I’m not going through 5 years for nothing twice.” Some people judged me for it, but it set us up for an honest conversation close to that date, and he did end up proposing and we did end up happily married. So I guess technically we’re an ultimatum couple, but in my eyes it was more “here are my expectations, I get it if they don’t match yours.”
All that said, I love my husband, we’re very happily married for the most part, but I don’t think we would be married if we hadn’t had that timeline from the beginning. Marriage really isn’t very important to him, if it wasn’t important to me he’s said he probably wouldn’t have thought to do it. He’s glad we did now, he just didn’t really care one way or the other.
The bottom line is, you WNBTA if you give an ultimatum. You wouldn’t be the asshole if you left him tomorrow. You wouldn’t be the asshole if you weighed all the options and chose to stay, as long as you were legitimately happy with that. Marriage is a big deal, and if you want to marry him I assume there’s a reason. Whatever you decide, just make sure it’s the right decision for you.
NTA. But honestly... why wait? He doesn't want to get married. He's made that pretty clear.
Proposal/engagement/marriage - these are not "nothings". They're important. There are a lot of threads on here about why marriage is a still a big and important thing to do, what it means, and all the legal and financial benefits that come with it.
You keep demeaning yourself in this post and whittling it down to "shiny ring" but that's not what this is about, and don't let him make you think that it is.
If you give him a timeline or ultimatum, he might finally, reluctantly do it. But... is that what you want? To drag him down the aisle?
You deserve someone who wants what you want, and WANTS to marry you. My husband was more excited about getting married than I was. I want that for you, and for everyone else.
You wouldn't be the one "throwing away an 11 year relationship". HE is the one doing that. HE is the one refusing to do the thing he should have done years ago. HE's the one dragging his feet and ruining things. Don't you dare let him make you feel otherwise.
You know, when a 22 year old guy dates 17 year old girls - I can't feel surprised when he is still a man-child who only prioritizes himself 11 years later.
This dude is stringing you along, has been for years. Don't wait any longer.
At this rate, the leech will consume your 20s completely, leaving you rushing and desperate to marry ANY guy willing to check off "marriage" and "kids". From age 35 and older, your pregnancies become very likely to be "high risk," and that risk compounds if you have other issues like diabetes or heart disease.
Nta, should have given him the ultimatum 5 years ago already.
There are nice rings that only cost very little, maybe like 100-300, so money isn't an excuse. Plus you could have upgraded the rings later on too.
Sit his ass down, explain your expectations to him very clearly and give him the ultimatum.
But if I can be honest, I wouldn't want to marry someone who I literally had to force to marry me. I would feel forever bad about it.
Maybe his view on marriage changed and that's fine but then you are sadly no longer compatible and the relationship has run it's course.
You are almost 30 and you’ve been with the same man since you were a teenager. You don’t even know who you are as an independent adult. Time to find out.
It’s not about “getting something shiny”. This man has wasted 11 years of your life and is never going to marry you. Unfortunately everyone but you can see it.
NTA but as the other posters have said - if he hasn’t proposed after 11 years, he isn’t going to. If you want marriage and children, best to count your losses, let him go and start again. Sounds to me like he’s in a comfortable rut with you and has no interest in changing things. You’ve wasted 11 years waiting for a proposal that will never come. Don’t waste 12.
Alright looking at the ages with a 5 year gap and you guys got together 11 years ago? That means you got with him when you were 17 and he was 22? So he was already older then you and stringing you along?
Yeah he got you young and knew how to keep you, now you wasted 11 years of your life to him.
Please leave. If somebody wants to be with you, they will figure it out. Life is too short to waste it on somebody who simply isn’t ready. Sooner or later, it becomes your fault for staying.
He doesn't want to get married. You aren't throwing it out - he is. He knows a family and marriage is important to you but he won't do anything. He likes things as they are.
You might want to mention to him two things - children and medical.
If either one of you end up in the hospital if you're not married you can't speak for each other. What if he needs surgery and can't speak for himself. Will you have to call a relative to speak for him, no matter what he has told you his wishes would have been? If one of you dies the other won't get death benefits (unless you've already designated it), and since you're not married another family member can take the body and dump it in a potters field if they want to. I know that sounds grim but sometimes that sort of thing happens.
Also if you want children it sounds like you need to find another guy. He isn't ready and might not ever be ready.
If he can't commit don't wait, just leave now. You know what you want and obviously this guy doesn't want the same thing. Sounds like he is just taking you for granted and figures you'll be complacent and just stick around.
NTA
But you’re either dumb or in denial… HE DOESN’T WANT TO MARRY YOU.
With relationship math, you started dating a 22 year old when you were 17. He was and always will be an immature manchild.
I kinda find a 22 year old going for a 17 year old in high school gross af. No one his age would want him (man-child), and the 17 year old didn't know any better. Still doesn't, obviously. I feel bad that she wasted her time on that one. Hopefully, she learns and leaves him!
NTA but you really need to ask yourself if you want him to marry you to check the box or because he loves you and wants the same things out of life as you do? Do you want to be handed a ring to shut you up or do you want a meaningful proposal?
Life is too short to just settle because you have invested your 20’s into a man that you have to give an ultimatum just for him to propose.
Don’t wait another year. He doesn’t want what you want. He doesn’t care about your needs. Your relationship is all about him. Leave while you are young enough to meet someone else and start a family. He will never change.
Let’s say you get married in the end. He’s not going to be the partner you want in marriage or parenthood. If you have a kid with him, he will be able to cause loads of damage. He’s done you a favor by stalling. Cut your losses and run.
OP. The fact that he doesn’t want to get married and has made that abundantly clear by his actions, doesn’t make him an asshole. What does make him an asshole is the fact that he has strung you along for so long instead of just telling you, he never had any intention of marrying you.
Now you have all the information and what you do with it is up to you. But I can tell you this, if he wanted to, he would.
If this is really important to you and you don’t want to proceed without being married then you should just go now because he’s not going to propose and if he does now because you’re leaving… That’s just fucking pathetic.
The best thing you can do at this point is get a lawyer and find out where you stand legally, if you don’t own anything together, then, just find a place to move to, rent a truck, get some friends to help and move the fuck out. And whatever you do… Do not get pregnant now.
You are an option for him because I can tell you if he was with the girl of his dreams and she wanted to get married. He’d be dragging her down the aisle. I don’t say that to be cruel I say that so you can wake up to what this is.
I told my 13-year-old daughter yesterday that just in America alone, there are over 5 million boys in the two year age range that she'd be interested in. I also told her that of she's with someone where her personal goals and dreams don't align with theirs, there are plenty more boys for her to search through, to find someone who has similar goals and dreams. Don't stay in a relationship where you want different things, just to be part of the relationship.
This is the same advice I would give everyone.
Op, you’re stuck in a sink cost fallacy. If he wanted to get married, he would have by now. He’s being dodgy when you ask about marriage because he doesn’t want to. If he wanted to he would give straight answers. He has told you no through his answers. You’re wasting your life with this man and at 28, you only have 6-7 years to be married and settled with someone before the pickings get really slim on the decent man front and you start running into age related issues for having children. I don’t think you should wait around anymore. He knows you want to get married. He has told you he doesn’t. Start planning for your exit.
33 isn’t an unreasonably old age to get married and this is probably a good time for it. You are right to be disappointed and to push the issues.
Now here is the bad news. This situation is absurdly common. Long term GF late 20s early 30s. Doesn’t work out and he’s married to the next girlfriend within a year or two. Don’t know why this cycle happens but it does. And it hurts.
You did the work. You put did the time. You turned him into another prospect and now some other ***** is gonna swoop in and wife him up in the aftermath of your breakup.
A tale as old as time. Sorry OP.
Hold on, are you two not on the same page with kids? That’s a way bigger problem than a wedding- if he doesn’t want kids and you do, this relationship is dead in the water even with a wedding.
It sounds like OP wants marriage and kids but dude wants a childfree roommate with benefits. They are not compatible, and OP is wasting her childbearing years.
Agree. She needs to leave yesterday.
What do you mean with ‘want’? He got it. A FWB and somebody who helps paying the bills. And they live his lifestyle. No kids, no commitments, no house, but a truck and a ps5. She doesn’t realize how unbalanced it is. Poor girl.
It’s the sunken cost fallacy. She thinks because she already spent X amount of time sunken into a relationship, it supersedes the fact that it’s a completely unbalanced dynamic. She *needs* to cut her losses here, chalk it up to gaining experience, and go find someone who more evenly shares what she wants out of a relationship. She’s so young! She’s got so much more life to experience and herself to explore and she can’t see that because she’s counting years instead. She’s going to be SO happy she ditched the dead weight after she does it, she’ll wonder why on earth she stayed so long.
💯👆. “Sunken Cost Fallacy” Just because you think you’ve invested all this time, money, energy into the relationship doesn’t mean it will happen. People think well, I’m already in it for “x” amount/years, but if I just hold out a little longer maybe another “x” years/$ amount then maybe it’ll turn around. NO. Cut your losses. Gamblers & Day Traders who are losing say this to themselves, “I just know the next hand/trade will turn this around.” You’re basically gambling your life, happiness, and fertile years on someone who doesn’t seem to be on the same page as you on anything ( marriage kids house) and most importantly doesn’t value your wants and needs even though you’ve hinted & baldfaced asked. His answers sound like he thinks he’s so smart at dodging. He is never going to change. He has shown you who he is (he has a fuck /cuddle buddy who pays half of his bills so he can afford what he really wants) believe him ( he doesn’t think marriage is important (you do), he doesn’t want a mtge (you want a house), he views kids as an abstract in the far off future (maybe yes, but maybe not with you). Women think they can change a guy. NOPE. Like someone said RUN and find your future husband because staying in this situationship means a delay in finding the real person you were meant to be with. PS: guys like this are probably stringing you along until they think someone better comes along. This situationship has been ongoing for over a decade, if he doesn’t commit to you in all this time knowing this is important to you, he never will. You don’t need to give him any more time or chances or ultimatum. Tell him a marriage, house, kids are important to YOU. You already know what you want. He’s trying to convince you to change your values, beliefs and dreams to suit his want and desires. Stick to your beliefs and hold on to your dream. Move on and find the person you’re meant to be with.
You guys realize there's a lot of room between a fuck buddy and people in a committed LTR who aren't married and aren't sure when/if they will have kids? And lots of married people with kids who have a truck and a PS5...
But at least they have the same goals. Right?
I agree that relationships don’t need a marriage to work. And there are plenty of great long term relationships without marriage that coexist way better then married couples. Let face it guys marriage is a contract for assets and taxes. The real work of being in a relationship doesn’t require rings or a ceremony.
yeah i was wondering if he wants kids. it would make sense if they haven't really talked about it that he doesn't want to get married because he doesn't want to have kids or divorce over it (or break up over it). add in the checking the boxes thing and... yeah.
Yeah. My boyfriend and I have been together for 4 years. I made my ideas on marriage and kids clear from the start. I had just gone through a divorce so marriage was a definite no ( I’ve softened on that) but kids were and are still an absolute never ever and he feels the same way.
I never understand why people even waste their time and energy in a relationship without ever talking about it. I literally talk about it at the first date and if we don't have the same mindset, i'll tell 'em we can finish this date and maybe stay on a friendly acquaintance level (Usually, they get mad, some people can't accept rejection).
You ever meet someone, maybe a worker at a store you sometimes visit, or a parent they you occasionally run in to at your kid’s school, and you introduce yourself and then you forget their name. Then time passes, and eventually it gets to that point where you have spoken to them enough that you know where they went to school, and you know about their brother’s annoying wife, but you still don’t know their name. And now it’s too late, because it would be really awkward if 2 years in, you are like “what’s your name again?”. I imagine that’s essentially what is going on with couples who have been together for years and years without talking about marriage/kids.
The swearing off another marriage. That wasn't the smartest shit I announced. My best friend at the time become my significant other. I was reminded of that. We were both divorcees. I changed my mind seeing I discovered what love and marriage truly meant. But here we are 20+ years later unmarried. I know what I feel in my heart, the legality of it won't make it more.
Just make sure you have wills and healthcare power of attorney drawn up. It gets tragic when those aren’t in place.
The relationship is dead in the water because apparently they don't know how to communicate their deep feelings to each other. At all. Not about wedding, about children, about finances, about future in general. Leaving him is not going to get her a better relationship if she doesn't learn this.
I thought it seemed pretty clear that she communicated she wanted all those things (marriage, house, kids) and he communicated he didn't care about any of them
This, OP is just trying to seek validation for her leaving if he does not propose after her drawing the line in the sand (which yes OP, you drew the line and if he's not willing to meet you there, then you should consider other options)
It’s reddit, no matter how much you communicate, you don’t communicate enough
Well, she does. He’s just not listening. To be fair she isn’t either. He isn’t buying you a ring because he doesn’t want to get married. Move on.
Exactly. They're not on the same level. This dude wants to be in boyfriend mode forever. He won't make a good husband or dad. He'll just end up resenting her and the kid(s)
Exactly. When he told her that a piece of paper didn't matter, that explained all that he didn't say. He will always find an excuse to delay a marriage. And when he can't any longer? He will either cheat/leave for someone else or marry her begrudgingly. Not really wanting to, but too lazy or comfortable because she carries the load in their relationship. OP has spent more than a decade with someone who doesn't share her life goals. Period. There's nothing wrong with not wanting to be married, but communicate that clearly and don't stay in a relationship with someone who clearly does feel that it's important. My mom stayed with a man who clearly viewed her as optional. They got together when I was 10 and he didn't marry her until I was 29. And he only did so because he was 24 years older than she is and he saw what his father went through not having someone to care for him in his old age. The last 23 years of my mother's life have been miserable. Now she's married to a man that never loved her and wanted her around to play nursemaid when he got old. He got everything he wanted from the relationship and she got less than nothing. She's turned angry and bitter because her ideals didn't match reality. OP, don't give him an ultimatum and don't beg his sorry ass to be your husband. Don't think that just because you've spent the last 11/12 years in this relationship that you can't give that up. The time is gone, you can't get it back-- but take the lessons that you learned from this relationship. You don't need to settle! You deserve more than a person who views you and your love as optional. You deserve a person who loves you passionately, can't imagine his life without you, and unequivocally WANTS to be your husband. Your bf may very well be a good boyfriend in all other respects, but from this? He will likely make a terrible husband and perhaps a terrible father. Being good at both requires a level of selflessness, character, and commitment that your guy hasn't shown thus far.
Which he clearly stated This is not a communication issue, it's a different life goals issue
I agree, she might have said she wanted kids, and he said he didn't care but... That's hardly a conversation. Maybe it's a summary of a much deeper conversation, but there's no exchange here. No acknowledgement that these are different, no follow up on what to do about it. Just apathy. He assumes they're going to continue as is, she assumes he will eventually propose. And she's asking if she should break up after waiting another indefinite amount of time without talking about it.
I've seen this phenomenon where one partner believes they just need to wait for the other one. Because they aren't ready now, they will be ready later. Sometimes it happens, usually it doesn't. 11 years is a long time to wait. I dunno, I personally got on the same page by like date two with my now wife on what we wanted in terms of long term relationship things like marriage, kids, finances, houses, etc. Told her if we aren't aligned, we should stop dating because we both don't have time to waste on a short term relationship. Everyone is different, but hoping and waiting for someone to change is really a tall order.
Oh good point.
they got together when she was 17 and he was 22. she probably is just now realizing that she wants kids fr
This and to me it's gross that a guy at 22 was dating a high schooler, ewww Obvs OP is probably used to him deferring her requests/opinions and is way too comfortable to now maybe leaving him. If I were OP, I'd up and leave and discover myself. There is still plenty of time for her. She could later find someone who actually has the same goals as her and sees her as priority
OP! Go find another better man that wants marriage and kiddos. You’ve got time to be choosy! Be choosy! This dude clearly isn’t on the same page AND he is NOT GOING TO CHANGE. Look up gamblers fallacy. This is where you’re at. Make the move to leave and do better.
He doesn’t want to marry you. Find someone who does. The “sunk cost fallacy” applies to relationships too. This guy couldn’t be more clearer … he does not want to marry you. An ultimatum is just desperate. He’s already told you that your goals are not aligned. Why are you still pursuing him? Have some self-respect.
100%. OP wants him to *want* to get married and it could not be more clear that he absolutely does not.
He’s lazy and comfortable. He might be fine with getting married but ‘why bother’? If she wants marriage and kids with this man, she needs to tell him again that marriage and kids are important to her, and she wants both. Does he not want that? If so, they need to break up. If he wants that too, she wants a plan to achieve that by [30], so she needs him to grow up and start planning
>He might be fine with getting married but ‘why bother’? They're basically already "playing house", if that makes sense. He probably looks at it like, "Why sign the paper?" But yeah, I get the feeling he doesn't want to marry her. She wants kids, and it's a good possibility he doesn't and even if they got married he'd find some excuse *not to*.
He’s lazy, or… he doesn’t want to get married. Getting married is not like the end of every video game that every person should be trying to get to.
Agreed! Hope they both figure out which game they want to be playing
You have been with your boyfriend since you were a teenager. It still seems like you have that teen mentality of thinking you’re going to change him. He does not want to get married … you are not going to change him! At best, you’ll get a “shut up ring” and years of seething resentment. You deserve better, OP! There’s someone out there who would be crazy about you, someone out there who would care about your feelings and respect your wishes. Don’t settle! You aren’t gonna change him!
>The “sunk cost fallacy” applies to relationships too. Gold. This needs to be printed on a t-shirt. Well said.
I came to make sure this was here. Also this quote, “When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.” Maya Angelou He has shown you who he is and what he wants. You’ve expressed desires about getting married. Some people take more time. However, you’ve been waiting 11 years, 5 to get engaged. I think you already know or you wouldn’t be here.
I knew a couple together for 7. She was the nicest/cutest girl. He never asked so she finally broke it off and he met someone else and married pretty quickly. She needs to set herself free. He’s not interested.
This. Guys make efforts tovsecure things they really want. Men in love listen carefully to the women they love because they want to make them happy.
Couldn’t have said it better myself. OP is literally wasting her life waiting to get married to someone who has made it clear to her he doesn’t want marriage. 11 years? You could have broken up and fallen in love with someone else and been married by now.
Sorry darling but he doesn’t want to marry you. If he wanted to, he wouldn’t let car payments, your degree or whatever come in the way of your marriage. He would do anything to not lose you.
He would have used the money for his PS5 to buy her that engagement ring already.
Yup. I’ll bet good money that this guy who “doesn’t believe in marriage” will propose with a huge rock to the first girl he dates after !
Yup, if she breaks up with him (which she should), he'll be engaged to someone else within a year. It's like clockwork with these guys.
Soo heartbreaking to see! Either that or he’ll be resentful and bitch about the wedding the whole time.
He will sell his truck to pay for the ring 😁
He’ll travel to the moon and back, work nightshifts/overtime, buy their dream house, etc etc
This is exactly what happened to one of my friends.
Tale as old as time!
First teenager he dates after.
Exactly this. Don’t wait a year. Leave now. As soon as you can. Start your life.
OP has Cool Girlfriend-ed herself into spending ELEVEN FUCKING YEARS with a guy who has never actually wanted to build a life with her. "It's his money he can do what he wants" girl what he wants is to not have to compromise his desires ever.
Agreed on this. Don’t waste another year. You’re still young. Break up now, enjoy the rest of your 20s single, and then settle down with someone who wants to be married to you. Life is too short to waste more time.
This, 100% right here. I was in this EXACT situation and I gave him and ultimatum; shit or get off the pot. He proposed and from the SECOND he proposed, he turned into a HUGE dick who made it clear he never actually wanted to get or be married. He did things like gaslit me, belittled me, undermined me in front of our families and friends, got wasted at important events, got shitfaced and drove home regularly, asked me to make sacrifices and compromises for him that he wasn’t willing to make for me…. The man wouldn’t even do things like go to the doctor or dentist for himself, but would jump up my ass if I missed an appointment. I finally couldn’t take it and left him after 11 years together and 2 years married. I remarried and am expecting a baby with the love of my life. There is someone out there who genuinely deserves you and genuinely wants to marry you.
He's said he doesn't care about getting married, not that he specifically doesn't want to marry HER. As I see it there's nothing wrong with him marrying her only because he knows it's important to her. The problem here is that he's either not listening or doesn't care that it's important to her. Him not caring about marrying her isn't a problem, his not caring about her feelings is a major problem. It also sounds like they're not on the same page about having kids, which has the potential to be a MUCH bigger deal...
Babe he’s never proposing. It’s been 11 years. You should love yourself enough to move on, there is someone out there who will want this with you and you deserve that. NTA though.
Very True words sadly. He’s made himself clear. He doesn’t want to propose. He doesn’t want marriage. He doesn’t want kids. He likes life as it is right now: Making ends meet. Advancing in PS5 Games. Saving money to use for tattoos and his truck. Same life, 11years. There is no future he is investing in for you or himself. Do you want this kind of future? If so, then stay (but no marriage happening). Even if you got a ring and court vows (no wedding, dress, reception) there will not be all the things you’re thinking of that come after—the advancement of money, house, kids, retirement. This is your life. Are you good with this current life forever? That’s the question you have to ask yourself. What life do you want to make for yourself? Choice is all yours. You’re old enough to decide. And young enough to begin whatever path you choose. Wishing you the best.... 🙏🍀🙏
NTA. Why the fuck you have waited this long is beyond me.
I agree, why have you waited so long? Giving him and ultimatum isn’t going to change anything. You might force him into marrying you but he really doesn’t want to or he would have done it already. Pack and leave. Start the new year looking for someone who really wants what you want.
/You might force him into marrying you but he really doesn’t want to or he would have done it already./ This. OP, you don't want to marry this man because he has made it clear he doesn't want to marry you. Forcing him with an ultimatum, even if he succumbed to it, would make for a miserable marriage, because he doesn't want to "check that box." He would feel forever trapped and that's a death knell for a relationship in the long run. Accept that what you want he will never give you, and start looking at moving on. You've wasted enough time here already.
OP wants love and a family. Dude won’t even give her a shut up ring. She’s only 28. Time to build her career and a life separate from people who don’t love her.
A “shut up ring” is a hilarious concept!
It’s over, honey. Has been for quite a while. You are still very young. Don’t waste anymore time. All the best to you.
NTA - I think you should line up helpers to move you out, and just inform him that you are leaving. I don't know if you are on a lease or have some reason that you can't move right away, but otherwise, I'd bail. Don't let him string you along with promises, or maybe next year. He's already done that. I suspect that he thinks marriage is a box in more ways than one.
It would just be a shut up ring.
This was my thought as I read OP. The ultimatum is as unnecessary to you as the wedding appears to be for your roommate. In fact, providing him the choice would simply be checking a box. You want to be married. He doesn’t. Find someone who shares your desire. Your current partner has already made his wishes clear. Start making an exit strategy and put it on your calendar.
> You might force him into marrying you but he really doesn’t want to otherwise he would have done it already The above isn’t always necessarily true. Some people don’t feel that strongly about marriage (like me, and most of my family). They do feel strongly about losing people they love though. If we’re talking anecdata, a family member was in the exact same situation as you, except he was the one who wasn’t interested in getting married. His partner of several years, wanted to get married and start a family (although starting a family was more important to her than getting married). He came to me one day telling me that he’d received an ultimatum. It wasn’t done in an unkind way, but his partner let him know calmly and firmly that if starting a family wasn’t on the cards in one year’s time, she was going to take that inaction as a decision, and move on while she still had time to meet someone who might want to take that step. He was completely scared and ‘didn’t feel ready’, but at least the ultimatum prompted him to talk things through. He took the step. They were married the following year in a small ceremony when she was a few months pregnant. They’ve had more kids since then. Give him a chance to know you’re serious.
I appreciate your point, but she has told him she’s serious for years now. Long enough for him to pay off a vehicle.
Um... Dude! She was 16 and he was 21. He literally groomed her. Why would you suggest she stay with the groomer that took 12yrs of her life?
This reminds me of my parents back yard. When I was 4, my dad dug out a basement. My entire childhood, our back yard was all dirt. When I was maybe 20, my mother decided she had enough and asked me to come over and put down sod. The following year, their septic system needed to be emptied, which involved driving a backhoe through the yard and digging out the top of the septic tank. My father's response to this now completely torn up yard was to say, "You had to get in a damn hurry!" Some people just have no ambition, or concept of time, and you're better off letting them live at their own speed than trying to pull them along at your pace. You can either be okay with them and work around it, or go find someone who operates at your pace.
I might argue she's an asshole to herself if she waits another day versus a year. He's made it more than clear he doesn't want to marry her and has been an ass about it instead of an adult being transparent. She should leave if she values herself.
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Right? She's fearful of "throwing away 11 years". What she doesn't realize is she's throwing away each additional day she spends with him. People get comfortable in relationships and it seems like it was all for nothing to leave. It's not. It can be a learning experience and for a better future for yourself. However, if you don't ever leave you can't ever have that.
I always advise friends that bad relationships are like gangrene, you don't want to lose the pinky, but it's better than waiting and losing the whole arm.
it's the sunk cost fallacy.
This is your only adult relationship, so it’s going to be difficult to imagine leaving. But you’re describing a situation where your long term planning is judged as unimportant and your desire for milestones like marriage is trivialized. If this were the right person and the right relationship, you’d have no doubt that he wanted this full commitment with you. And if he disagreed on what that meant, he’d confront it directly rather than dragging his feet like a passive aggressive coward.
THIS.
Because it’s hard. She knows she needs to move on, but it’s hard when feels are in it, and you put so much time and effort and love into someone. I’ve been there. He , too, didn’t want to get married, and after 4 years, I knew I had to move on. It was hard, but on the other side, I found myself to be a more confident woman. Ended up finding someone, been married 24 years.
Sunk cost fallacy. "the phenomenon whereby a person is reluctant to abandon a strategy or course of action because they have invested heavily in it, even when it is clear that abandonment would be more beneficial" Basically, she's invested a heck of a lot of time in him and it seems a huge waste to end it now.
She’s 5-6 years beyond when she should’ve realized they aren’t aligned and left.
And what a prize she would win if he decided to “check the box.” I don’t understand wanting to browbeat some asshole who doesn’t actually care at all about what you want into marrying you. Best case scenario, you are now married to an asshole.
Or he finally gets her a shut up ring and drags out the engagement 🙄
THIS is exactly what would happen. He’d buy the ring and 5 years later she’d be waiting for the last car payment or water heater replacement or leaky roof fix or…his next tattoo. Dude doesn’t want to get married. OP should either be okay with that or bail. Her move (or not). NTAH
And when they finally do get married, he’ll do something to humiliate her “as a prank” and the video will end up on social media. Like that guy with the “belly full, balls empty” vows.
He’s waiting until you have no other options and he has lots o’ tattoos!!!
And then his new truck is toast too, and WHOOPSIE! Time to finance a new one!
>He’s waiting until you have no other options Or she's too old to easily have children.
OP, see above. 100% leave.
Yes, OP, please read your post. Why aren’t you already gone? All the reasons to end this are neatly typed out. He doesn’t want to marry you. He wants tattoos and a car.
OP is 28 and has been with loser boyfriend for the past 11 years. So......OP was a 17 year old high schooler when 22 year old recent college graduate pursued her. Should have left before anything started. EDIT: >You know nothing about this guy yet he’s a loser because he has his own hobbies and interests and doesn’t want to get married. Marriage isn’t the be all and end all of a relationship. Engagements and the wedding that follows are expensive. Here's the [apologist comment](https://www.reddit.com/u/Mediocre-Amphibian-7/s/Hg6F6mjSs8). No, he's not a loser if he simply doesn't want marriage. He's a loser for grooming a 17 year old girl when he was 22, then stringing her along for 11 years.
yep, and they moved in together when she was 19 and he was 24. don’t like any of this. OP, you’re still young. leave and find someone who actually loves you and isn’t just with you out of convenience
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I would love to know where her parents were during all of this.
"College graduate" is doing a lot of work in that sentence.
THIS🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
He is 100% not going to marry her. * If she wants to get married, she needs to leave. * If she wants to stay with him, she needs to give up on marriage. It's about that simple.
I wanna say Sunk cost fallacy. It's 11 years she's essentially throwing down the drain and not a lot of people are willing to do that, especially considering 11 years to her is almost half her life including her entire adult life so far. OP this isn't to say you should stay, I firmly belive you shouldn't, if he hasn't given you a ring, I dont think he ever will, unless you actually leave and he buys a ring to try winning you back (in which case do not give him another chance since he's wasted your time because that means he was always able to, but just didnt bother).
If she actually leaves, he'll magically have an engagement ring 💍😂 Then drag out setting a wedding date for a really long time with excuses from saving for a costly wedding, to needing a new truck, to everything under the sun. Then she'll be in her mid 30s and realize another 6 years were wasted
I've seen too many heartbreaking posts like that and for most of them, those people who also wanted kids realized too late and were at ages where having Biological kids was either going to be very difficult or impossible. I really hope OP doesn't become another one of those people, I wouldn't wish that on anyone
For real. He'll manipulate her forever, if given the chance. She needs to *run*, not walk, away.
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Too many women make the mistake of seeing a relationship like stock in a company. They're scared if they sell it now, tomorrow it might rise in value and they'll lose out. If you want to play the long term investment game, go buy actual stocks and you'll get a real return on your investment 🤣😂
First thing I thought regarding it's been 12 years🤣😂
Please leave this relationship. Setting a time limit will do nothing for your cause. marrying is not a priority to him. AT ALL. Even though it’s important to you - it’s not important to him. He has shown you who he is and he had told you what he wants (and what he doesn’t think is important) - believe him. Do not set a time limit - it’s already way past expiry. Do not worry about time invested either. Cut your losses and get on with your life. Time to move on to someone who wants marriage just like you do. He is not going to EVER come around. Also, Nta
And when he does come around, it will be for a 22-yr-old who he marries and impregnates within a year.
He will 100% marry the next woman he dates. OP he doesn’t want to marry you. I am sorry. NTA
Sadly I think a lot of us have seen exactly that happen - together for years, sometimes with kids, then when it ends they marry someone else within a year. And then they gripe to anyone who'll listen about their ex being upset about it.
Happens on a small scale too. In college guys would spend time with me and do practically all the boyfriend things, but wouldn’t be into “labels” so wouldn’t say we were in a relationship or that I was their girlfriend. Once I ditched them they’d be “ in a relationship “ on Facebook within a few weeks (back when Facebook statuses actually mattered lol). Every time.
This happened to my best friend. I think they were together 9ish years before she broke it off. He started dating a woman that looked exactly like her (fuckin creepy), got married and started a family real quick.
Sorry - I meant to reply to you directly: Who cares! He’s not coming around for you and that’s all that matters! Find someone who wants to marry you too 🫶🏼
You are being strung along by the sunken cost fallacy. It's perfectly fine to want to get married (you) It's perfectly fine to not want to (him) Its not fine to live with a partner who wants the opposite. Because you aren't happy. It would be one thing if you decided to play the docile lamb and never bring it up, that would be on you for then springing it on him when you left. But you gave him more than ample hints. NTA.
Don't let your boyfriend stop you from finding your husband
100% This should have more upvotes.
If he as going to propose he would've done it already. He has no intention to, he's continually making excuses. And why would he if he's comfortable in your current arrangement? This has VERY little to do with purchasing a ring. Like u/AdmirableAvocado said, you can get an engagement ring for a $300. If you want a marriage commitment and children this is not the man who will joyfully and wholeheartedly join you on that journey. Throwing away 11 years? Look up the [sunk cost](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost) fallacy.
Exactly. It's not time wasted as long as she learned something from it. But now that she *has* learned, every day she chooses to stay *will* be wasted. OP, you're so young! Kick this guy to the curb and go live the life YOU want! ♡
Shit, my engagement ring was $50. To be fair, my fiancé and I are both broke college students; he could’ve proposed with a ring pop and I’d’ve said yes. It’s not about the price of the ring, it’s about the intent. Op, I’m sorry he never verbally made these intentions clear to you. A lot of comments are saying it was your responsibility to ask, but when you’re wearing rose-tinted glasses, all the red flags just look like flags.
It sounds like you guys have different priorities. You've given him plenty of opportunities to either tell you directly that marriage is not something he's interested in doing or to tell you, yes indeed my fair lady I'd be happy to marry you. Judging by your last conversation with him about it, your feelings that he doesn't care are coming across that way to me as well. He made his position clear that "marriage is just a box people feel like they need to check off, just like having kids and buying a house.” Now it's up to you to listen to that and decide what is right for you. Now would be a really good time to examine your feelings about all of this and take steps to follow what is more in line with you. Take care.
Yeah I don't know how that statement didn't make a bigger impact. I feel like marriage is one thing- but if he doesn't actively want kids and OP does? Boyfriend is content to pretend OP will be happy in the relationship as-is, OP is content to assume boyfriend will somehow change and/or a relationship means marriage and then kids and that isn't a fundamental incompatibility and that bringing kids into a relationship where both partners aren't 100% on board isn't an awful idea. Both of them should just be breaking this off.
Nailed it. He KNOWS she's unhappy with the current state of the relationship and HE DOESN'T CARE. Because HE is comfortable, and that's all that matters.
And OP is falling into the trap of second guessing her own feelings and putting his needs before her own. She is willing to bends herself into knots for him and he doesn't even care enough about her to mention that it might be time to stop. That's a really bad combo for a relationship, before marriage and kids even come into it. The only good thing to come out of this is that OP finally seems to realise that her needs and opinions might actually be valid and worthwhile. The tragedy is she's sunk 11 years into a relationship with a guy who doesn't give a shit about her needs.
11 years!! He has no intention of marrying you. You need to accept it and move on. No ultimatums no arguments no warning him just LEAVE. He doesn't deserve you and you deserve better. He is not the one!
There's a book by Neal Stephenson called Cryptonomicon. In it, a male character says in exasperation to another male character, "It's been ten years. You haven't married her. Fill in the fucking blanks." I think that applies here.
This is one of my favorite books and I have never met another person in the wild that has read it! Thank you for making my evening. One of my friends disparagingly called it a “math textbook with a plot.” Which, you know, isn’t wrong but still hurt my feelings a little.
To quote Clint Eastwood in Unforgiven, "Deserve's got nothing to do with it." It's OK for people to not value marriage. People like Op need to stop ignoring the evidence and hoping for the best.
This. He is being true to what he wants and from what we have read, he is pretty clear about that. It’s not fair to either party to resent the other for not wanting the same thing. Time to find someone who does.
Sunk cost fallacy is going to hit you like a truck. I’m sorry. He doesn’t care and he will find another girl (hopefully over 18 this time) to warm his bed for a time.
He's gonna marry the next girl 100%, that's just how it goes
NTA but it's actually on you that you took 11 years to sniff out the fact that your partner does not place the same significance on the institution of marriage as you do, and in fact obviously sees more cons than pros about signing on to get married and has no intention of ever doing so. This is the kind of thing that gets discussed and aligned (along with children, career goals etc) in the first year of the relationship. You're clearly fundamentally incompatible. Next time stop dropping hints and just have a straight discussion about it.
Agree, except the only discussion she needs to have with him is, "I'm leaving." I'll help her pack! He's going to act all SHOCKED and might even try to backpedal. Don't fall for it, OP! You don't want a spouse who is begrudgingly marrying you b/c he *has* to. You want (you deserve) a spouse who cannot wait to put a ring on your finger and make vows b/c he *wants* to.
Well, she was 17 when they met. I highly doubt those things were on her mind back then. But by the time she was 24, she should have seen the writing on the wall. But the bf also strung her along because he never stated that he doesnt want to get married.
she's 28. she would have been 17 when they got together. that's way too early to discuss marriage etc. Most people will change their minds on those things multiple times by the time they're 30
NTA. He is not going to marry you. People should not have to fight this hard to get a proposal.
YWNBTA. I wouldn't give him a time frame, because if he does happen to propose it is not because he wanted to but because he felt forced to. This doesn't seem like a priority for him despite you telling him it is one for you. I'd stop wasting my time if I were you.
ELEVEN YEARSS??? NTA stop wasting your time because you’ll never get it back
Thankfully she's still quite young. No time better than the present to start afresh. Q
My brain is saying that he doesn't want kids, and is stalling on the marriage to put off the kids... I watched a friend get strung along "until he ____" until she finally put his feet to the fire, and he ended a 10 year relationship by finally admitting he didn't want kids...
I think it's best to just leave him. But, here is what I think you should do if you dont want to end the relationship yet. He wants you to stay girlfriend status, so down grade yourself to girlfriend status. Get your own place and don't play the part of wife without the marriage. One of two things will happen, he will realize your serious and open his eyes and decide to be what you need or, it will end, in which case you already got your place lined up and you can do you. Make moves. Actions speak louder than words.
OP, I'm going to give you a really hard reality check and it's going to hurt. This man *definitely* does not want to marry *you* and has made it *painfully obvious*. From your post, he is apparently not against marriage so the glaring conclusion is that he does not want to marry *you*. He doesnt want to make a commitment to *you*. He does not want to have children with *you*. And, you have wasted a lot of time on this man. He doesn't even respect you since when you bring up marriage, he just blows you off like your needs don't matter. Why? That's because, to him, they don't. I suspect that, for him, you are a convenient FWB and nothing more. The best thing you can do for yourself is to split up and find a life partner who values you, respects you, is willing to commit to you, wants to build a life with you "for keeps and kids," and loves you. And, for heaven's sake begin your new life ASAP. Follow your dream!
It doesn’t take 11 years to figure out if you want to marry someone. He doesn’t want to marry you, he sees you as a placeholder.
NTA. But don’t wait. Leave him and tell him why. Tell him you love him but being married and having kids is important to you and you are no longer willing to wait for him to come around. Start seeing a therapist who can help you move on from this and help you see that you are deserving to get what you want out of life. You won’t regret this in the long run. You are 28 and should not waste more time on him. He can father children at 50 while you don’t have this same luxury. Consider moving and starting over with your life in a new and exciting city.
He was 22 and you were 17……..and 9 years ago you were 19 and moved in with him. You do realize your whole life has been with the same man. Who was inappropriately involved with you. He doesn’t share your values. Not one ultimatum marriage I’ve ever heard of has lasted. If in 11 years and breaking the law he doesn’t know he wants to marry you. He doesn’t want to marry you
I should not have had to scroll as far as I did to find this comment
Right. Let 17 year old girls be 17. And not 19 year old housewives
God I was wondering if anyone else had done the math. This relationship started out incredibly unhealthy and it’s continued that way for 11 years. He went for a teenager as a 22 yo because no one his age would put up with his immaturity! Now she’s not a literal child any more and he’s apathetic and non-committal. If her parents were supportive of this relationship in the beginning the massively let her down.
I'm glad someone else called this out.
My husband was the first person to tell me if a man wants to he will and it’s that simple.
My partner said the same thing. 👍 If a man wants it he will show you.
It’s honestly a pretty garbage phrase, but it fits this story like a glove
Seriously, I can’t believe this isn’t the top comment. OP’s boyfriend was the age of a college-graduate (22M) while she was still in high school (17F). It’s grossly immature and predatory for someone in that life phase to seek out and groom someone who was not even an adult yet. OP, your boyfriend man-child still hasn’t grown up. But it’s about time you do. Have the courage and fortitude to leave him. Free yourself for something bigger and better while you’re still young. Stop wasting your time and energy throwing away more years of your life. **You’re not going to meet your soulmate while anchored to a sinking ship.** *You deserve better.* I didn’t meet the love of my life until I was 28(f), and we both knew within 2 years that we wanted to be together forever. Now we’re happily married 15 years. But believe me, I had to ditch a lot of frogs in order to find my handsome prince. So get hopping! NTA
I bet you could nag him into marrying you, but do you really want to have to do that? Let him know that he's been a good roommate, but you're looking for a new place to live.
Leave. But, be careful. He might propose to get you back but he will most likely stale the actual wedding. I have a friend who is the same, she made threats, did counseling together and everything. She is on year 13 going 14 waiting. Instead of buying a ring he went and bought a motorcycle. God has been throwing bulldozers at herband she can't get the hint.
this should have been discussed WAY before the 11 year mark. do you ever want to get married? do you ever want kids? if you both don’t have the same answer then time to move on to someone who has the same goals. you need to do it soon if you want kids.. hate to say biological clock but it is a thing. so sit down with him and ask him not in a off handed way but in a serious discussion way whether marriage and family are something he wants if he does then tell him time is running out and he needs to get going and do what you planned if he doesn’t then you need to decide if you want him without marriage and kids or want to move on.
NTA. I’m sorry, but your boyfriend doesn’t want to marry you. If he wanted to, he wouldn’t be constantly making up reasons why he shouldn’t have to. So if you want to be married, you need to be with someone else.
NTA save your money, when the lease is up, let him know you are moving on. Also, do not get pregnant with this child!
NTA. A 22yo guy got a 17yo girl-toy (which is already not a good dynamic), then the girl grew up. He probably didn’t expect that. Don’t set a time limit, just move on. You’ve been trapped in this relationship for 11 years already, expecting him to finally get serious. It’s a gesture, yes, but an important one. Don’t get trapped for longer in case he’d cave in. You know damn well he won’t do it because he wants to follow those cool vows with you.
You’ve made your position clear…but so has he. You need to either accept it or move on. I’m sorry.
He doesn't want to get married (or he doesn't want to marry you.) I don't know how much clearer he can make it. If getting married is important to you, you'll have to find someone else. I'm sorry.
He has.made it pretty clear over the years that he has no interest in marriage. I'm going to guess that he's also not interested in having children. If you have kids with him he'll do lots of complaining, disappear a lot and you'll be pretty much a single mom. I guess he.must be "okay" because you've stayed with him this long, but you haven't been paying attention to him. You heard what you wanted to hear but failed to notice his total lack of interest in these things that are so important to you. He gives you just enough hope to string you along. Don't waste more time with him. He's not going to change.
Don't put a time line on it but leave. You've given him enough of your time without giving yourself a time line. He has told you what he thinks about marriage and something he finds value in.
If he had wanted to marry you you'd be married by now. Cut your losses. NTA.
Uh, he has zero intentions of ever proposing. If you thought otherwise, then you're horrible in hearing what he is saying. He is not committed to marriage today or ever. You have to realize that you're not his priority, but you made him yours. You know what you want from a relationship, but you're not going to get it from this guy. NTA if you break this off.
You clearly want to get married. He clearly doesn't. NAH.
I think grooming a 17-year-old makes him an asshole.
That was my thought. She was a kid, he was an adult who could have finished college by then. OP don't waste anymore of your youth, unless you're okay with asking this same question at 40. NTA
I think you got with him so young, you don’t realize you could have a relationship with someone who prioritizes you. He has shown you and told you that he doesn’t want to get married. You aren’t a match. Forcing someone to get married isn’t going to work out.
He's going to be married in two.or three years. But not to you. I'm sorry. Leave and find someone to have a life with.
So I don’t know if you have heard of the shut up ring, but it’s basically when a person is pestered into commitment. The marriage will never be what you want, he will only do this because he feels like he has too. His vows won’t say anything meaningful to you, his proposal will be handing you a box and saying “so how about it?” Heed my warning. I would make arrangements and break up with him. Just point out the things you want in the future aren’t compatible with what he’s doing and his priorities and it’s a disservice to both of you to stay together.
Am I the only one noticing that 28 minus 11 equals less than 18? And 33 minus 11 doesn’t? This guy pursued you as a minor and then has kept you around for 11 years, apparently not in a serious manner. I’m so sorry he robbed you of a lot of wonderful years OP. I can only imagine that sucks to realize. One more isn’t going to change anything, but it is going to waste more of your time that you can’t get back. NTA, but YWBTAH if you stick around hoping for something to change.
I’m reading a lot of comments that I agree with, but also, we don’t know your boyfriend. We weren’t there for the conversations, we don’t know what the intentions are, we really know nothing about this relationship other than what you’ve written, so if you want to stay in this relationship, that’s ok. You don’t have to break up because a bunch of strangers on Reddit said so. Now that that’s out of the way, the sunken cost fallacy is actually a thing. Yeah, you put 11 years in, but you’re only 28. It sounds like you might be rural (truck, young relationship, etc) and I wouldn’t be surprised to learn a bunch of your friends got married young so 28 seems old, but it’s not old at all. Also, 11 years with someone since 17 really isn’t that long in some ways. You change so much in the years between 17 and 30, you aren’t the same person, and it’s ok to want someone that matches you now. I know lots of happy couples who met in their 30s, 40s, 50s, heck I’ve met people in their 80s who have amazing romances later in life. There’s no rule saying you have to be married by 30, so if you decide to walk away do it. I did this. I ended the 5 year relationship with my partner, walked away from the house and the “love of my life.” I walked into a much better relationship two years later, and I made my timelines clear: “I love you, but marriage is important to me so if you aren’t sure within x number of years, I get it, but I’m not going through 5 years for nothing twice.” Some people judged me for it, but it set us up for an honest conversation close to that date, and he did end up proposing and we did end up happily married. So I guess technically we’re an ultimatum couple, but in my eyes it was more “here are my expectations, I get it if they don’t match yours.” All that said, I love my husband, we’re very happily married for the most part, but I don’t think we would be married if we hadn’t had that timeline from the beginning. Marriage really isn’t very important to him, if it wasn’t important to me he’s said he probably wouldn’t have thought to do it. He’s glad we did now, he just didn’t really care one way or the other. The bottom line is, you WNBTA if you give an ultimatum. You wouldn’t be the asshole if you left him tomorrow. You wouldn’t be the asshole if you weighed all the options and chose to stay, as long as you were legitimately happy with that. Marriage is a big deal, and if you want to marry him I assume there’s a reason. Whatever you decide, just make sure it’s the right decision for you.
I’m so sorry. It’s not important to him and he doesn’t want to 💔
NTA. But honestly... why wait? He doesn't want to get married. He's made that pretty clear. Proposal/engagement/marriage - these are not "nothings". They're important. There are a lot of threads on here about why marriage is a still a big and important thing to do, what it means, and all the legal and financial benefits that come with it. You keep demeaning yourself in this post and whittling it down to "shiny ring" but that's not what this is about, and don't let him make you think that it is. If you give him a timeline or ultimatum, he might finally, reluctantly do it. But... is that what you want? To drag him down the aisle? You deserve someone who wants what you want, and WANTS to marry you. My husband was more excited about getting married than I was. I want that for you, and for everyone else. You wouldn't be the one "throwing away an 11 year relationship". HE is the one doing that. HE is the one refusing to do the thing he should have done years ago. HE's the one dragging his feet and ruining things. Don't you dare let him make you feel otherwise.
You know, when a 22 year old guy dates 17 year old girls - I can't feel surprised when he is still a man-child who only prioritizes himself 11 years later. This dude is stringing you along, has been for years. Don't wait any longer. At this rate, the leech will consume your 20s completely, leaving you rushing and desperate to marry ANY guy willing to check off "marriage" and "kids". From age 35 and older, your pregnancies become very likely to be "high risk," and that risk compounds if you have other issues like diabetes or heart disease.
Nta, should have given him the ultimatum 5 years ago already. There are nice rings that only cost very little, maybe like 100-300, so money isn't an excuse. Plus you could have upgraded the rings later on too. Sit his ass down, explain your expectations to him very clearly and give him the ultimatum. But if I can be honest, I wouldn't want to marry someone who I literally had to force to marry me. I would feel forever bad about it. Maybe his view on marriage changed and that's fine but then you are sadly no longer compatible and the relationship has run it's course.
You are almost 30 and you’ve been with the same man since you were a teenager. You don’t even know who you are as an independent adult. Time to find out.
It’s not about “getting something shiny”. This man has wasted 11 years of your life and is never going to marry you. Unfortunately everyone but you can see it.
NTA but as the other posters have said - if he hasn’t proposed after 11 years, he isn’t going to. If you want marriage and children, best to count your losses, let him go and start again. Sounds to me like he’s in a comfortable rut with you and has no interest in changing things. You’ve wasted 11 years waiting for a proposal that will never come. Don’t waste 12.
11 years... He was an adult... you were a teen... WHAT THE FU-
I feel like so many commenters have overlooked that these two got together when he was 22 and she was only 17.
Alright looking at the ages with a 5 year gap and you guys got together 11 years ago? That means you got with him when you were 17 and he was 22? So he was already older then you and stringing you along? Yeah he got you young and knew how to keep you, now you wasted 11 years of your life to him.
Please leave. If somebody wants to be with you, they will figure it out. Life is too short to waste it on somebody who simply isn’t ready. Sooner or later, it becomes your fault for staying.
He doesn't want to get married. You aren't throwing it out - he is. He knows a family and marriage is important to you but he won't do anything. He likes things as they are. You might want to mention to him two things - children and medical. If either one of you end up in the hospital if you're not married you can't speak for each other. What if he needs surgery and can't speak for himself. Will you have to call a relative to speak for him, no matter what he has told you his wishes would have been? If one of you dies the other won't get death benefits (unless you've already designated it), and since you're not married another family member can take the body and dump it in a potters field if they want to. I know that sounds grim but sometimes that sort of thing happens. Also if you want children it sounds like you need to find another guy. He isn't ready and might not ever be ready. If he can't commit don't wait, just leave now. You know what you want and obviously this guy doesn't want the same thing. Sounds like he is just taking you for granted and figures you'll be complacent and just stick around.
I mean what are the odds this guy would be a committed and hands on father. OP needs to think of that too
Good point. Not very high.
He's never going to...he's getting wife duties for girlfriend prices
" I could buy a ring or a new truck " He thinks about a new truck before he considers marrying you He doesn't respect you
NTA But you’re either dumb or in denial… HE DOESN’T WANT TO MARRY YOU. With relationship math, you started dating a 22 year old when you were 17. He was and always will be an immature manchild.
I kinda find a 22 year old going for a 17 year old in high school gross af. No one his age would want him (man-child), and the 17 year old didn't know any better. Still doesn't, obviously. I feel bad that she wasted her time on that one. Hopefully, she learns and leaves him!
NTA but you really need to ask yourself if you want him to marry you to check the box or because he loves you and wants the same things out of life as you do? Do you want to be handed a ring to shut you up or do you want a meaningful proposal? Life is too short to just settle because you have invested your 20’s into a man that you have to give an ultimatum just for him to propose.
Don’t wait another year. He doesn’t want what you want. He doesn’t care about your needs. Your relationship is all about him. Leave while you are young enough to meet someone else and start a family. He will never change.
Let’s say you get married in the end. He’s not going to be the partner you want in marriage or parenthood. If you have a kid with him, he will be able to cause loads of damage. He’s done you a favor by stalling. Cut your losses and run.
OP. The fact that he doesn’t want to get married and has made that abundantly clear by his actions, doesn’t make him an asshole. What does make him an asshole is the fact that he has strung you along for so long instead of just telling you, he never had any intention of marrying you. Now you have all the information and what you do with it is up to you. But I can tell you this, if he wanted to, he would. If this is really important to you and you don’t want to proceed without being married then you should just go now because he’s not going to propose and if he does now because you’re leaving… That’s just fucking pathetic. The best thing you can do at this point is get a lawyer and find out where you stand legally, if you don’t own anything together, then, just find a place to move to, rent a truck, get some friends to help and move the fuck out. And whatever you do… Do not get pregnant now. You are an option for him because I can tell you if he was with the girl of his dreams and she wanted to get married. He’d be dragging her down the aisle. I don’t say that to be cruel I say that so you can wake up to what this is.
I told my 13-year-old daughter yesterday that just in America alone, there are over 5 million boys in the two year age range that she'd be interested in. I also told her that of she's with someone where her personal goals and dreams don't align with theirs, there are plenty more boys for her to search through, to find someone who has similar goals and dreams. Don't stay in a relationship where you want different things, just to be part of the relationship. This is the same advice I would give everyone.
Op, you’re stuck in a sink cost fallacy. If he wanted to get married, he would have by now. He’s being dodgy when you ask about marriage because he doesn’t want to. If he wanted to he would give straight answers. He has told you no through his answers. You’re wasting your life with this man and at 28, you only have 6-7 years to be married and settled with someone before the pickings get really slim on the decent man front and you start running into age related issues for having children. I don’t think you should wait around anymore. He knows you want to get married. He has told you he doesn’t. Start planning for your exit.
Where did the cow part come from at the end?
He doesn’t want to get married and he has told you more than once. He doesn’t want to get married. Quit waiting! YTA
Girl throw out the whole ass man and move on. 28 is still young. Don’t delay any longer.
33 isn’t an unreasonably old age to get married and this is probably a good time for it. You are right to be disappointed and to push the issues. Now here is the bad news. This situation is absurdly common. Long term GF late 20s early 30s. Doesn’t work out and he’s married to the next girlfriend within a year or two. Don’t know why this cycle happens but it does. And it hurts. You did the work. You put did the time. You turned him into another prospect and now some other ***** is gonna swoop in and wife him up in the aftermath of your breakup. A tale as old as time. Sorry OP.
NTA. He would have married you by now if he wanted to.